[Chicago] Chicago Digest, Vol 17, Issue 18
Andrew Harrington
aharrin at luc.edu
Thu Feb 1 20:27:24 CET 2007
On Python in education.
For having fun and learning some logical thinking and understanding of
computers,
you do not need a fancy GUI to start.
My mostly humanities students in my introductory CS class get pretty
well sucked into my Hands-on Python Tutorials,
http://cs.luc.edu/anh/python/hands-on
Python is an excellent medium. They write silly mad-lib programs. They
make pictures and animations with a very simple graphics package that
has the event handling well hidden.
As for doing things that look neat, we use Python to write CGI scripts.
I have a basic approach writing the output pages in a GUI editor like
NVu and just putting in %s where they want to substitute calculated
data, and use the whole web page file as a format string. We can start
short of Django! For the ones who get hooked, it is nice to be able to
point to Django.
The idea of a loop is power for automating boring repetitive tasks!
Andy Harrington
chicago-request at python.org wrote:
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> Today's Topics:
>
> 1. Python in local school systems? (Michael Tobis)
> 2. Re: Python in local school systems? (DiPierro, Massimo)
> 3. Re: Python in local school systems? (Cosmin Stejerean)
> 4. Re: Django frontend Interface (Adrian Holovaty)
> 5. Re: Python in local school systems? (DeanG)
> 6. Re: Python in local school systems? (Michael Tobis)
> 7. Re: Python in local school systems? (Michael Tobis)
>
>
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Message: 1
> Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2007 09:28:22 -0600
> From: "Michael Tobis" <mtobis at gmail.com>
> Subject: [Chicago] Python in local school systems?
> To: "The Chicago Python Users Group" <chicago at python.org>
> Message-ID:
> <c3aa55550701310728u5b4de22dtbb656b0ab9f473aa at mail.gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
>
> Jeff Elkner passed on a request from a Naperville teacher to put her in
> contact with anyone teaching Python as a formal course at the high school
> level.
>
> If anyone knows of anything like this currently happening in the Chicago
> Metro area or nearby, please let me know and I'll pass it along.
>
> mt
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> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 2
> Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2007 09:55:10 -0600
> From: "DiPierro, Massimo" <MDiPierro at cti.depaul.edu>
> Subject: Re: [Chicago] Python in local school systems?
> To: "The Chicago Python Users Group" <chicago at python.org>, "The
> Chicago Python Users Group" <chicago at python.org>
> Message-ID:
> <6BE417C96732934A83E4BBBB3B7FF2F40478170A at haydn.cti.depaul.edu>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
>
> I teach python at university level (ipd362 ad DePaul Institute for Professional Development).
> I would be happy to talk to him.
>
> Massimo
>
> Massimo Di Pierro
> CTI DePaul University, 243 S Wabash Ave, Chicago, IL 60604
> Tel. +1-312-362-5173, Fax. +1-312-362-6116
> Email: mdipierro at cs.depaul.edu <mailto:mdipierro at cs.depaul.edu>
> Web page: http://www.metacryption.com/mdp/
>
> ________________________________
>
> From: chicago-bounces at python.org on behalf of Michael Tobis
> Sent: Wed 1/31/2007 9:28 AM
> To: The Chicago Python Users Group
> Subject: [Chicago] Python in local school systems?
>
>
> Jeff Elkner passed on a request from a Naperville teacher to put her in contact with anyone teaching Python as a formal course at the high school level.
>
> If anyone knows of anything like this currently happening in the Chicago Metro area or nearby, please let me know and I'll pass it along.
>
> mt
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 3
> Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2007 14:54:10 -0600
> From: "Cosmin Stejerean" <cstejerean at gmail.com>
> Subject: Re: [Chicago] Python in local school systems?
> To: "The Chicago Python Users Group" <chicago at python.org>
> Message-ID:
> <276266d0701311254t45e67607p530a0d62d66e1bd0 at mail.gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed
>
> I'd be surprised if any do. Most high schools that teach Computer
> Science tend to have an AP Computer Science course, which has to be in
> Java, and potentially a regular CS course which is meant to attract a
> larger crowd and as such was traditionally restricted to VB (I would
> get C# or VB.NET would also be good candidates) so that folks can
> easily throw together pretty GUIs and write Tic-Tac-Toe.
>
> I think one of the challenges of teaching CS courses in high school to
> folks that don't want to pursue CS as a major is making the course
> interesting. With a RAD tool like VB is easy for everyone to throw
> together a nice app that can do something they like. With something
> like Python that might be harder to do (Tkinter or WxPython
> anyone???).
>
> Although I don't teach Python, I have a couple of
> suggestions/suggestions for Python course at a high school level that
> I'd like to share.
>
> Regards,
>
> Cosmin Stejerean
>
> On 1/31/07, DiPierro, Massimo <MDiPierro at cti.depaul.edu> wrote:
>
>> I teach python at university level (ipd362 ad DePaul Institute for Professional Development).
>> I would be happy to talk to him.
>>
>> Massimo
>>
>> Massimo Di Pierro
>> CTI DePaul University, 243 S Wabash Ave, Chicago, IL 60604
>> Tel. +1-312-362-5173, Fax. +1-312-362-6116
>> Email: mdipierro at cs.depaul.edu <mailto:mdipierro at cs.depaul.edu>
>> Web page: http://www.metacryption.com/mdp/
>>
>> ________________________________
>>
>> From: chicago-bounces at python.org on behalf of Michael Tobis
>> Sent: Wed 1/31/2007 9:28 AM
>> To: The Chicago Python Users Group
>> Subject: [Chicago] Python in local school systems?
>>
>>
>> Jeff Elkner passed on a request from a Naperville teacher to put her in contact with anyone teaching Python as a formal course at the high school level.
>>
>> If anyone knows of anything like this currently happening in the Chicago Metro area or nearby, please let me know and I'll pass it along.
>>
>> mt
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Chicago mailing list
>> Chicago at python.org
>> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>>
>>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 4
> Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2007 15:02:06 -0600
> From: Adrian Holovaty <chipy at holovaty.com>
> Subject: Re: [Chicago] Django frontend Interface
> To: The Chicago Python Users Group <chicago at python.org>
> Message-ID: <200701311502.06715.chipy at holovaty.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
>
> Fawad Halim wrote:
>
>> Several moons ago, Adrian demonstrated a django app he had written that
>> generated a nicely hyperlinked view of the data by reflecting on the
>> model specification. Does anyone know what happened to that and whether
>> it was released anywhere?
>>
>
> That app is called Databrowse, and it's not available to the public yet. I've
> gotten sidetracked with about a half a billion other things... :)
>
> I have no ETA in mind, and I can't share the current code just yet. Hopefully
> it'll get rolled into Django proper some time in the near future.
>
> Adrian
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 5
> Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2007 15:09:30 -0600
> From: DeanG <goodmansond at gmail.com>
> Subject: Re: [Chicago] Python in local school systems?
> To: "The Chicago Python Users Group" <chicago at python.org>
> Message-ID:
> <f5c6a5400701311309l132671d6mca4f399ad69acf6a at mail.gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed
>
>
> I think one of the challenges of teaching CS courses in high school to
> folks that don't want to pursue CS as a major is making the course
> interesting. With a RAD tool like VB is easy for everyone to throw
> together a nice app that can do something they like. With something
> like Python that might be harder to do (Tkinter or WxPython
> anyone???).
>
> Agile is straightforward in Python. Desktop RAD is straightfoward in *BASIC.
> And with the massive IT momentum of VB shops it's cinched.
>
> Poland chose REALbasic http://realsoftware.com/news/pr/2006/poland/
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 6
> Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2007 15:11:07 -0600
> From: "Michael Tobis" <mtobis at gmail.com>
> Subject: Re: [Chicago] Python in local school systems?
> To: "The Chicago Python Users Group" <chicago at python.org>
> Message-ID:
> <c3aa55550701311311h262cc80bra80986f92d073e84 at mail.gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
>
> Well, I (and at least one other person on this list) will be attending the
> education sig at PyCon, and would be happy to hear from you about this.
>
> It is definitely replacing the VB stuff that we are after. It is a
> pedagogical disaster to teach kids that, and any C/Java variant is hardly
> better. Dijkstra is rolling in his grave.
>
> We can cross the Java bridge at a later date.
>
> mt
>
> On 1/31/07, Cosmin Stejerean <cstejerean at gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> I'd be surprised if any do. Most high schools that teach Computer
>> Science tend to have an AP Computer Science course, which has to be in
>> Java, and potentially a regular CS course which is meant to attract a
>> larger crowd and as such was traditionally restricted to VB (I would
>> get C# or VB.NET would also be good candidates) so that folks can
>> easily throw together pretty GUIs and write Tic-Tac-Toe.
>>
>> I think one of the challenges of teaching CS courses in high school to
>> folks that don't want to pursue CS as a major is making the course
>> interesting. With a RAD tool like VB is easy for everyone to throw
>> together a nice app that can do something they like. With something
>> like Python that might be harder to do (Tkinter or WxPython
>> anyone???).
>>
>> Although I don't teach Python, I have a couple of
>> suggestions/suggestions for Python course at a high school level that
>> I'd like to share.
>>
>> Regards,
>>
>> Cosmin Stejerean
>>
>> On 1/31/07, DiPierro, Massimo <MDiPierro at cti.depaul.edu> wrote:
>>
>>> I teach python at university level (ipd362 ad DePaul Institute for
>>>
>> Professional Development).
>>
>>> I would be happy to talk to him.
>>>
>>> Massimo
>>>
>>> Massimo Di Pierro
>>> CTI DePaul University, 243 S Wabash Ave, Chicago, IL 60604
>>> Tel. +1-312-362-5173, Fax. +1-312-362-6116
>>> Email: mdipierro at cs.depaul.edu <mailto:mdipierro at cs.depaul.edu>
>>> Web page: http://www.metacryption.com/mdp/
>>>
>>> ________________________________
>>>
>>> From: chicago-bounces at python.org on behalf of Michael Tobis
>>> Sent: Wed 1/31/2007 9:28 AM
>>> To: The Chicago Python Users Group
>>> Subject: [Chicago] Python in local school systems?
>>>
>>>
>>> Jeff Elkner passed on a request from a Naperville teacher to put her in
>>>
>> contact with anyone teaching Python as a formal course at the high school
>> level.
>>
>>> If anyone knows of anything like this currently happening in the Chicago
>>>
>> Metro area or nearby, please let me know and I'll pass it along.
>>
>>> mt
>>>
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Chicago mailing list
>>> Chicago at python.org
>>> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>>>
>>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Chicago mailing list
>> Chicago at python.org
>> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>>
>>
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> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 7
> Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2007 16:15:56 -0600
> From: "Michael Tobis" <mtobis at gmail.com>
> Subject: Re: [Chicago] Python in local school systems?
> To: "The Chicago Python Users Group" <chicago at python.org>
> Message-ID:
> <c3aa55550701311415p354b3121q9b00e34acacec643 at mail.gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
>
> I don't see why IT momentum should have anything to do with teaching logical
> thinking to people who probably aren't going to be professional programmers.
> Pretty UIs are not computer literacy any more than Excel spreadsheets are.
>
> Skills are transient. Develop intelligence and you can acquire skills as
> needed. High school should be about education, at least as much as about
> skills.
>
> Teaching "Java" or "BASIC" or "Python" to great masses of high school
> students is silly. Most jobs require no coding. Marketable skills should be
> taught in college, not in high school.
>
> Using programming to teach ideas is not at all silly. It is the original
> idea of computer literacy. Maybe the schools never really understood this
> very well, but that is no reason to let the matter drop.
>
> You need a language to teach the sorts of ideas that constitute
> programming. Logical thinking is the goal. Python is a better platform for
> teaching the student how to think than BASIC or Java, for somewhat different
> reasons. In both cases comes down to the fact that ultimately there is a lot
> less distraction. In Python you start thinking about the ideas immediately.
> You aren't constantly distracted by the language.
>
> mt
>
> On 1/31/07, DeanG <goodmansond at gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> I think one of the challenges of teaching CS courses in high school to
>> folks that don't want to pursue CS as a major is making the course
>> interesting. With a RAD tool like VB is easy for everyone to throw
>> together a nice app that can do something they like. With something
>> like Python that might be harder to do (Tkinter or WxPython
>> anyone???).
>>
>> Agile is straightforward in Python. Desktop RAD is straightfoward in
>> *BASIC.
>> And with the massive IT momentum of VB shops it's cinched.
>>
>> Poland chose REALbasic http://realsoftware.com/news/pr/2006/poland/
>> _______________________________________________
>> Chicago mailing list
>> Chicago at python.org
>> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>>
>>
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>
> End of Chicago Digest, Vol 17, Issue 18
> ***************************************
>
--
Andrew N. Harrington
Computer Science Department Director of Academic Programs
Loyola University Chicago http://www.cs.luc.edu/~anh
512B Lewis Towers (office) Office Phone: 312-915-7982
Snail mail to Lewis Towers 416 Dept. Fax: 312-915-7998
820 North Michigan Avenue aharrin at luc.edu
Chicago, Illinois 60611
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