<div dir="ltr"><br><div class="gmail_extra"><br><br><div class="gmail_quote">On Wed, Jul 10, 2013 at 11:16 AM, Brian Granger <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:ellisonbg@gmail.com" target="_blank">ellisonbg@gmail.com</a>></span> wrote:<br>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">Aaron,<br>
<div class="im"><br>
On Wed, Jul 10, 2013 at 7:41 AM, Aaron Meurer <<a href="mailto:asmeurer@gmail.com">asmeurer@gmail.com</a>> wrote:<br>
> Embrace the chaos.<br>
><br>
> You don't use naming conventions for your branches in git. That's because<br>
> branches are cheap and throwaway, and it would be a waste of time to<br>
> organize them. Wikis are the same way.<br>
<br>
</div>Our wiki pages are not throwaway. Our *official* development<br>
resources are there:<br></blockquote><div><br></div><div>Do you allow throwaway wiki pages? For SymPy, we encourage people to dump interesting things on the wiki. </div><div><br></div><div>There are also official things there too, like development guidelines and gsoc reports. But I guess our workflow is not as officialized as yours (we don't have peps or anything). </div>
<div> </div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
<br>
* IPEPs<br>
* Our official github workflow, description of how we use issues,<br>
coding style guide, etc.<br>
* Our roadmap<br>
<br>
All of this is highly curates and written by/maintained core<br>
developers. Some of the content is less curated (our Cookbook).<br>
<div class="im"><br>
> Take a look at the SymPy wiki pages<br>
> <a href="https://github.com/sympy/sympy/wiki/_pages" target="_blank">https://github.com/sympy/sympy/wiki/_pages</a>. The only official naming<br>
> convention we have is for GSoC pages. We use the wiki for throwaway tests,<br>
> developer guides, user written pages about uses of SymPy, little bits of<br>
> "documentation" that don't belong in our docs like comparisons to other<br>
> computer algebra systems, and prototypes and write ups for new features.<br>
<br>
</div>Most of the active parts of our wiki are not user written. They are<br>
written by core devs. Our choice was to put all of our development<br>
information on GitHub rather than Sphinx - to keep it all in the same<br>
place.<br>
<div class="im"><br>
> Our organization comes from a listing of the important pages on the main<br>
> page. That only accounts for about half the wiki pages. For the rest, there<br>
> is the list of all pages, which is what I usually use. If you want a search,<br>
> clone the git and use git grep.<br>
<br>
</div>That is exactly (in part) what I have done - we have separate index<br>
pages for different categories.<br>
<div class="im"><br>
> You probably won't embrace the chaos, so my recommendation is to create an<br>
> index page (or just use the main page) and organize the pages by there by a<br>
> list of links under headers. That's much less painful than page naming<br>
> conventions.<br>
<br>
</div>We have already done that....:)<br></blockquote><div><br></div><div>So why do you need prefixes?</div><div><br></div><div>Aaron Meurer</div><div> </div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
<br>
Cheers,<br>
<br>
Brian<br>
<div class="HOEnZb"><div class="h5"><br>
> Aaron Meurer<br>
><br>
> Sent from my iPad<br>
><br>
> On Jul 10, 2013, at 12:47 AM, Fernando Perez <<a href="mailto:fperez.net@gmail.com">fperez.net@gmail.com</a>> wrote:<br>
><br>
> One problem with prefixing all pages is that those prefixes, if I<br>
> understand how GH wikis work correctly, have to be part of the visible<br>
> page title. Which for some pages makes for pretty horrible names.<br>
> For example the gallery title is perfectly fine as<br>
><br>
> A gallery of interesting IPython Notebooks<br>
><br>
> but it would look pretty ugly if called<br>
><br>
> Cookbook: A gallery of interesting IPython Notebooks<br>
><br>
> or similar, IMO.<br>
><br>
> Since there's no actual auto-indexing machinery or other organizing<br>
> mechanism that these pseudo-namespace prefixes provide, I'm also not<br>
> convinced that it makes sense to mandate their use rigidly everywhere.<br>
> For certain categories I think they do make sense, like say cookbook<br>
> recipes or sprints lists. But I think we're inevitably bound to have<br>
> 'miscellaneous' pages that don't neatly fit in any single label. And<br>
> creating a zillion prefixes just so everything can have its own<br>
> prefix doesn't seem to be such a good idea either.<br>
><br>
> In summary, I think the problem is that wikis are inherently prone to<br>
> some of this slightly chaotic growth, which is why I've never liked<br>
> them too much. I think they fill a useful role when used in a pretty<br>
> *limited* fashion, partly so that they can be manually tended to. But<br>
> for larger-scale efforts, without a massive metadata machinery and an<br>
> army of people like what Wikipedia uses, it's kind of hopeless. For<br>
> wikipedia, pages have very rich categorical/tagging tools that the<br>
> entire wiki system understands, mines, and uses to offer management<br>
> and navigation. We don't have that at GH, just a plain wiki in its<br>
> barest form.<br>
><br>
> Sorry to be a bit of a downer, but I'm just not convinced that more<br>
> prefixing is really going to really solve anything beyond a thin<br>
> cosmetic veneer issue.<br>
><br>
> Cheers,<br>
><br>
> f<br>
><br>
> ps - I'm pretty sure, BTW, that I'm the guilty party in having created<br>
> the lab meetings page without a prefix, sorry :) Part of it is<br>
> probably that I find it so ugly to read those titles that I<br>
> unconsciously just ignored the idea... Feel free to change it if you<br>
> really think it will help.<br>
><br>
> On Tue, Jul 9, 2013 at 5:07 PM, Brian Granger <<a href="mailto:ellisonbg@gmail.com">ellisonbg@gmail.com</a>> wrote:<br>
><br>
> Hi,<br>
><br>
><br>
> A while back I spend a couple of days organizing the IPython GitHub<br>
><br>
> wiki. I know this will probably seem anal, but I think it is<br>
><br>
> important that we use a logical structure for each of our pages and<br>
><br>
> the wiki as a whole. To induce this structure on the flat GitHub wiki<br>
><br>
> namespace, we are naming our wiki pages with a prefix such as "Dev :"<br>
><br>
> or "Cookbook: " or "Install: ". This structure is also present in our<br>
><br>
> sub-indices - we have a separate index page for each of these<br>
><br>
> categories. When someone created the wiki page for the lab meetings,<br>
><br>
> it was created at the top level, rather than under the "Dev: "<br>
><br>
> category and put in the top level index rather than the "Dev: " index.<br>
><br>
> I could fix this myself in a few minutes, but I don't want to become<br>
><br>
> the "police" for our wiki organization. Instead, I would like<br>
><br>
> everyone to help keep the wiki organized. Can someone clean this up?<br>
><br>
> If we don't want to use this structure, but instead keep things<br>
><br>
> organized another way, I am completely open to that. I just want the<br>
><br>
> wiki organization to decay into chaos like it did before...<br>
><br>
><br>
> Cheers,<br>
><br>
><br>
> Brian<br>
><br>
><br>
> --<br>
><br>
> Brian E. Granger<br>
><br>
> Cal Poly State University, San Luis Obispo<br>
><br>
> <a href="mailto:bgranger@calpoly.edu">bgranger@calpoly.edu</a> and <a href="mailto:ellisonbg@gmail.com">ellisonbg@gmail.com</a><br>
><br>
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><br>
><br>
><br>
> --<br>
> Fernando Perez (@fperez_org; <a href="http://fperez.org" target="_blank">http://fperez.org</a>)<br>
> fperez.net-at-gmail: mailing lists only (I ignore this when swamped!)<br>
> fernando.perez-at-berkeley: contact me here for any direct mail<br>
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<br>
<br>
<br>
--<br>
Brian E. Granger<br>
Cal Poly State University, San Luis Obispo<br>
<a href="mailto:bgranger@calpoly.edu">bgranger@calpoly.edu</a> and <a href="mailto:ellisonbg@gmail.com">ellisonbg@gmail.com</a><br>
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</div></div></blockquote></div><br></div></div>