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<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'>Does Wing now work w/ IronPython for debugging now that we added
sys.settrace in 2.6?<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
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<p class=MsoNormal><b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'>From:</span></b><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'>
users-bounces@lists.ironpython.com [mailto:users-bounces@lists.ironpython.com] <b>On
Behalf Of </b>Vernon Cole<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Tuesday, January 19, 2010 1:17 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> Discussion of IronPython<br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [IronPython] IronPython in Visual Studio 2008<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'>Vincent:<br>
<br>
I will try the first part of an answer to your question. It is a long
question, so you will probably get lots of different answers...<br>
<br>
There are several different implementations of Python. I will talk about the
two which are most common on Windows systems. I use both.<br>
<br>
CPython is implemented in the C++ language and uses the traditional (or OLD,
depending on your point of view) method of operating a Windows program.
It is much more mature, starts up much faster, and has lots of available
modules, including numpy, scipy and countless others. You find it at <a
href="http://python.org%20">http://python.org.</a> To do Windows specific
things with it, you also need <a href="http://sourceforge.net/projects/pywin32">pywin32</a>
. It can be used on a web server, and several web engines such as django,
are written using it. It cannot be used as a client script on a web page.<br>
<br>
IronPython is new, written by Microsoft in the C# language, and uses the new
.NET way of hooking things together. It is a VERY good implementation of
standard Python, but since many of the add-on libraries were written in C++,
not C#, you cannot link to them. There is a package called IronClad which seeks
to make this happen, often successfully. ( <a
href="http://www.resolversystems.com/products/ironclad/">http://www.resolversystems.com/products/ironclad/</a>
.) IronPython also suffers from the frustrating habit of ALL .NET
implementations of taking several seconds (which at times feels like several
minutes) to start a new process running. So while it may often be FASTER than
CPython after it finally gets going, don't even THINK about using it for a
quick command-line script. On the other hand, if you are trying to
interface with a new .NET project, it is only reasonable way to go. It
also runs on the Silverlight platform, so can be used as a scripting language for
a web client page, not only a server page.<br>
<br>
I have heard nothing but BAD reports about using Iron Python Studio. However,
there are several Integrated Development Environments which work with CPython,
IronPython, or both. I, personally, use Wing for debugging, and the IDE
which is built in to pywin32 for rough work.<br>
<br>
Will Python code run as fast as C, or C++, or C# code? No. (or
almost never.) Will it run fast enough that a human user will never
notice the difference? Almost always. So what you do is prototype
in Python, where you are most productive, then if you find that some part of
your system actually needs the performance boost, you recode that piece in C++
(or C#). I find that design changes usually do much more to boost
perceived speed than compiler changes do. Python excels at that.<br>
<br>
So welcome aboard. You have discovered a great tool.<br>
--<br>
Vernon Cole<br>
<br>
<o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal>On Tue, Jan 19, 2010 at 10:22 AM, Vicent <<a
href="mailto:vginer@gmail.com">vginer@gmail.com</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Hello to all.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>This is my first
message to the list. I would like to ask you some basic questions about
IronPython. First of all, sorry for my English.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>I've just
discovered IronPython, and I am actually a new-by in Python, not an
expert programmer. So maybe you'll find my questions quite simple or naive.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>I read the
first chapter of the classic book for IronPython (</span><a
href="http://www.manning.com/foord/SampleChapter1.pdf" target="_blank"><span
style='font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:#7799BB'>http://www.manning.com/foord/SampleChapter1.pdf</span></a><span
style='font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>), and in pages 7-8 the author says:</span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>"Visual
Studio 2008 integration exists in the form of IronPython Studio, which
is implemented through the Visual Studio Shell extensibility framework.
IronPython Studio can either be run standalone (without requiring Visual
Studio to be installed) or integrated into Visual Studio. It includes
Windows Forms and WPF designers and is capable of producing binary
executables from Python projects."</span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>I am very
interested in fully understanding this sentence above, because I currently use
C++ in MS Visual Studio 2008, but I like Python more.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>So, with
IronPython + Visual Studio 2008:</span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>(1) Can I
obtain compiled code from Python source, as efficient/fast/etc. as if it was
made from C++?</span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>(2) Can
I obtain executables (programs that people can install and use, in the
"normal user" language) as good/fast/efficient as I would obtain
using Visual C++?</span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>(3) Can
I easily link my Python code with existing external C/C++ libraries?</span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>(4) (Similar
to the previous one) Can I easily link my Python code with
some C/C++ source code (I mean, mixing up Python and C in the same
project, in a transparent way)?</span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>(5) Can I use
NumPy, SciPy and other key (scientific) Python libraries in a transparent way?</span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>(or am I just
dreaming??)</span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Any answer
will be appreciated. Thank you in advance.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>--</span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Vicent Giner</span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><br>
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