From amk at amk.ca  Mon May  1 23:45:12 2006
From: amk at amk.ca (A.M. Kuchling)
Date: Mon, 1 May 2006 17:45:12 -0400
Subject: [Soc2006] Student applications now open
Message-ID: <20060501214512.GA28844@rogue.amk.ca>

It sounds like the web form for applying as a student is operational
at <http://code.google.com/soc/student_signup.html>.  Where should we
announce this?  PSF weblog; c.l.py.announce; python.org; anywhere else?

--amk


From ms at cerenity.org  Tue May  2 00:30:46 2006
From: ms at cerenity.org (Michael)
Date: Mon, 1 May 2006 23:30:46 +0100
Subject: [Soc2006] Kamaelia Project Idea Pages
Message-ID: <200605012330.46899.ms@cerenity.org>

Hi,


I hope it's not inappropriate to post a link to our project ideas page here. 
The actual organisation we're mentoring under is BBC Research (there's likely 
to be some Dirac related projects as well), but all the Kamaelia related ones 
are expected to be python based, so I'm hope I'm not off base for posting 
this link here. (If I am, 1000 apologies in advance ...)

   * http://kamaelia.sourceforge.net/SummerOfCode2006.html

Anyway, I hope this wasn't really breaching etiquette for the list and is 
useful to someone :-)

Have fun,


Michael.
--
Michael Sparks, Senior Research Engineer, BBC Research, Technology Group
michael.sparks at rd.bbc.co.uk, Kamaelia Project Lead, http://kamaelia.sf.net/

From nnorwitz at gmail.com  Tue May  2 00:30:53 2006
From: nnorwitz at gmail.com (Neal Norwitz)
Date: Mon, 1 May 2006 15:30:53 -0700
Subject: [Soc2006] Welcome!
Message-ID: <ee2a432c0605011530l27d2f5e9nebb7eec9cded1e64@mail.gmail.com>

Hi everyone!  Welcome to the SoC list.

We've already got 5 project applications.  Woohoo!

We need to decide how we are going to organize and get all the
projects reviewed.  It would be great if there were a couple of people
that help things run smoothly.  We need to figure out how to pair
mentors with the projects and have mentors rate projects
appropriately.

It would be great to hear from people that worked on SoC this last
year so we can do a better job this year.

Here are the projects so far:

Integrating Verse to Soya3d
Web-based IDE, offering through-the-web editing (with version
control), execution, and testing of code
Python Module for Filesystem Virtualization and Access Standardization
Adaptive, Test-driven Signature Verifier
Improving the Python debugger

n

From nnorwitz at gmail.com  Tue May  2 00:32:23 2006
From: nnorwitz at gmail.com (Neal Norwitz)
Date: Mon, 1 May 2006 15:32:23 -0700
Subject: [Soc2006] Welcome!
In-Reply-To: <ee2a432c0605011530l27d2f5e9nebb7eec9cded1e64@mail.gmail.com>
References: <ee2a432c0605011530l27d2f5e9nebb7eec9cded1e64@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <ee2a432c0605011532o64a8735dyab1a4b80da18d2ab@mail.gmail.com>

One more thing, mentors should sign in to Google and can access their
SoC page here:

    http://code.google.com/soc/mentor_home.html

I'm not sure about students, but I presume you can replace "mentor"
with student and get to your area.

n
--

On 5/1/06, Neal Norwitz <nnorwitz at gmail.com> wrote:
> Hi everyone!  Welcome to the SoC list.
>
> We've already got 5 project applications.  Woohoo!
>
> We need to decide how we are going to organize and get all the
> projects reviewed.  It would be great if there were a couple of people
> that help things run smoothly.  We need to figure out how to pair
> mentors with the projects and have mentors rate projects
> appropriately.
>
> It would be great to hear from people that worked on SoC this last
> year so we can do a better job this year.
>
> Here are the projects so far:
>
> Integrating Verse to Soya3d
> Web-based IDE, offering through-the-web editing (with version
> control), execution, and testing of code
> Python Module for Filesystem Virtualization and Access Standardization
> Adaptive, Test-driven Signature Verifier
> Improving the Python debugger
>
> n
>

From arc at xiph.org  Tue May  2 00:47:50 2006
From: arc at xiph.org (Arc Riley)
Date: Mon, 1 May 2006 15:47:50 -0700
Subject: [Soc2006] Welcome!
In-Reply-To: <ee2a432c0605011530l27d2f5e9nebb7eec9cded1e64@mail.gmail.com>
References: <ee2a432c0605011530l27d2f5e9nebb7eec9cded1e64@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <20060501224750.GZ6289@xiph.org>

On Mon, May 01, 2006 at 03:30:53PM -0700, Neal Norwitz wrote:
> 
> Integrating Verse to Soya3d

There's also "Soya3d exporting/importing tools for Blender" now too.

Just a heads up to rest of the PSF mentor pool re: Soya3d proposals..

The Blender Foundation people felt this is more Soya related than 
Blender related.  We've been working with a few of these students for 
the last week as they've refined their apps on the soya3d.org wiki

Of the perhaps 10 proposals for Soya projects, we (PSF mentors for Soya) 
been working with 4 of the students and will likely be taking 3-4.

From brett at python.org  Tue May  2 04:45:26 2006
From: brett at python.org (Brett Cannon)
Date: Mon, 1 May 2006 19:45:26 -0700
Subject: [Soc2006] Student applications now open
In-Reply-To: <20060501214512.GA28844@rogue.amk.ca>
References: <20060501214512.GA28844@rogue.amk.ca>
Message-ID: <bbaeab100605011945p78896765pd1d4052d46f34d57@mail.gmail.com>

Do we have a link or anything to get to the submitted apps yet?  I
don't see anything at the SoC page.

-Brett

On 5/1/06, A.M. Kuchling <amk at amk.ca> wrote:
> It sounds like the web form for applying as a student is operational
> at <http://code.google.com/soc/student_signup.html>.  Where should we
> announce this?  PSF weblog; c.l.py.announce; python.org; anywhere else?
>
> --amk
>
> _______________________________________________
> Soc2006 mailing list
> Soc2006 at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/soc2006
>

From arc at xiph.org  Tue May  2 05:05:41 2006
From: arc at xiph.org (Arc Riley)
Date: Mon, 1 May 2006 20:05:41 -0700
Subject: [Soc2006] Student applications now open
In-Reply-To: <bbaeab100605011945p78896765pd1d4052d46f34d57@mail.gmail.com>
References: <20060501214512.GA28844@rogue.amk.ca>
	<bbaeab100605011945p78896765pd1d4052d46f34d57@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <20060502030541.GD6289@xiph.org>

On Mon, May 01, 2006 at 07:45:26PM -0700, Brett Cannon wrote:
> Do we have a link or anything to get to the submitted apps yet?  I
> don't see anything at the SoC page.

http://code.google.com/soc/mentor_home.html


From tague at elementalsecurity.com  Tue May  2 04:25:19 2006
From: tague at elementalsecurity.com (Tague Griffith)
Date: Mon, 01 May 2006 19:25:19 -0700
Subject: [Soc2006] Mentor List/Project Scope?
Message-ID: <4456C30F.2030603@elementalsecurity.com>

Is there a list of mentor volunteers or even better what project or 
projects fall under the scope of the PSF this year.  I started reading 
through the applications so far and on some of the applications it's 
hard to tell if some the the proposals that deal with external 
applications or projects should fall under someone else's  SOC 
mentorship or the PSF.

The Soya3d stuff is a great example, I haven't found anything until Arc 
Riley's email indicating that this was a project that the PSF was 
interested in and had mentors behind.  It would be useful to have a list 
or even a guideline from the PSF, so others of us who might not realize 
a project has a mentor behind it won't suggest the PSF is not the right 
place for it.

Just a thought.

/t




From jtauber at jtauber.com  Tue May  2 04:47:48 2006
From: jtauber at jtauber.com (James Tauber)
Date: Mon, 1 May 2006 22:47:48 -0400
Subject: [Soc2006] Student applications now open
In-Reply-To: <bbaeab100605011945p78896765pd1d4052d46f34d57@mail.gmail.com>
References: <20060501214512.GA28844@rogue.amk.ca>
	<bbaeab100605011945p78896765pd1d4052d46f34d57@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <4DC66E93-4F74-408C-983C-355CAFBB3EFE@jtauber.com>

http://code.google.com/soc/psf/open.html

James
--
James Tauber                       http://jtauber.com/
journeyman of some   http://jtauber.com/blog/


On 01/05/2006, at 10:45 PM, Brett Cannon wrote:

> Do we have a link or anything to get to the submitted apps yet?  I
> don't see anything at the SoC page.
>
> -Brett
>
> On 5/1/06, A.M. Kuchling <amk at amk.ca> wrote:
>> It sounds like the web form for applying as a student is operational
>> at <http://code.google.com/soc/student_signup.html>.  Where should we
>> announce this?  PSF weblog; c.l.py.announce; python.org; anywhere  
>> else?
>>
>> --amk
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Soc2006 mailing list
>> Soc2006 at python.org
>> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/soc2006
>>
> _______________________________________________
> Soc2006 mailing list
> Soc2006 at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/soc2006


From thomas at python.org  Tue May  2 11:05:44 2006
From: thomas at python.org (Thomas Wouters)
Date: Tue, 2 May 2006 11:05:44 +0200
Subject: [Soc2006] Mentor List/Project Scope?
In-Reply-To: <4456C30F.2030603@elementalsecurity.com>
References: <4456C30F.2030603@elementalsecurity.com>
Message-ID: <9e804ac0605020205g31f9828fu7d259e4ee718db2b@mail.gmail.com>

On 5/2/06, Tague Griffith <tague at elementalsecurity.com> wrote:
>
> Is there a list of mentor volunteers or even better what project or
> projects fall under the scope of the PSF this year.  I started reading
> through the applications so far and on some of the applications it's
> hard to tell if some the the proposals that deal with external
> applications or projects should fall under someone else's  SOC
> mentorship or the PSF.


Well, as the list-of-ideas shows, the PSF is open to pretty much anything
(as long as it's mildly Python-related.) IMHO, the only reason to refer to
another SoC organization is because the best mentor(s) for such a project
are busy there. So far, the distinction between the different organizations
is fairly clear.

The Soya3d stuff is a great example, I haven't found anything until Arc
> Riley's email indicating that this was a project that the PSF was
> interested in and had mentors behind.  It would be useful to have a list
> or even a guideline from the PSF, so others of us who might not realize
> a project has a mentor behind it won't suggest the PSF is not the right
> place for it.


I don't pretend to speak for the PSF (at least, not anymore :) but I don't
think the PSF should reject any Python-related project off-hand. Soya3D is
listed on the ideas page ( http://wiki.python.org/moin/SummerOfCode ). This
suggests (to me, at least) that one or more of the applied mentors can
mentor it (or at least that someone thought there'd be a mentor for it.)
Whether those mentors got accepted, I don't know, but I doubt we rejected
very many ;-)

--
Thomas Wouters <thomas at python.org>

Hi! I'm a .signature virus! copy me into your .signature file to help me
spread!
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From amk at amk.ca  Tue May  2 12:02:21 2006
From: amk at amk.ca (A.M. Kuchling)
Date: Tue, 2 May 2006 06:02:21 -0400
Subject: [Soc2006] Student applications now open
In-Reply-To: <bbaeab100605011945p78896765pd1d4052d46f34d57@mail.gmail.com>
References: <20060501214512.GA28844@rogue.amk.ca>
	<bbaeab100605011945p78896765pd1d4052d46f34d57@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <20060502100221.GB12239@Andrew-iBook2.local>

On 5/1/06, A.M. Kuchling <amk at amk.ca> wrote:
>It sounds like the web form for applying as a student is operational
>at <http://code.google.com/soc/student_signup.html>.  Where should we
>announce this?  PSF weblog; c.l.py.announce; python.org; anywhere else?

I've updated the weblog and python.org.  Neal, you should probably
post to c.l.py.announce (perhaps you already have) since you're
actually running things for the PSF.

--amk


From nnorwitz at gmail.com  Tue May  2 20:01:47 2006
From: nnorwitz at gmail.com (Neal Norwitz)
Date: Tue, 2 May 2006 11:01:47 -0700
Subject: [Soc2006] Student applications now open
In-Reply-To: <20060502100221.GB12239@Andrew-iBook2.local>
References: <20060501214512.GA28844@rogue.amk.ca>
	<bbaeab100605011945p78896765pd1d4052d46f34d57@mail.gmail.com>
	<20060502100221.GB12239@Andrew-iBook2.local>
Message-ID: <ee2a432c0605021101q8a258dbq214d41bf4f3b50d2@mail.gmail.com>

On 5/2/06, A.M. Kuchling <amk at amk.ca> wrote:
> On 5/1/06, A.M. Kuchling <amk at amk.ca> wrote:
> >It sounds like the web form for applying as a student is operational
> >at <http://code.google.com/soc/student_signup.html>.  Where should we
> >announce this?  PSF weblog; c.l.py.announce; python.org; anywhere else?
>
> I've updated the weblog and python.org.  Neal, you should probably
> post to c.l.py.announce (perhaps you already have) since you're
> actually running things for the PSF.

Actually, I would love some help on this.  Does anyone have time to
help communicate and organize?

n

From cschmidt at rohan.sdsu.edu  Tue May  2 20:43:40 2006
From: cschmidt at rohan.sdsu.edu (cschmidt at rohan.sdsu.edu)
Date: Tue, 2 May 2006 11:43:40 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Soc2006] STARS
Message-ID: <58812.68.8.8.69.1146595420.squirrel@www-rohan.sdsu.edu>

Hello,

I recently added Stars, Space Time Analysis of Regional Systems, to the
project Idea Wiki.  Stars is a way of looking at data that is both spatial
and temporal.  I am writing to see what kind of interest there is in this
project.

http://regal.sdsu.edu/stars

Please let me know if there is a general interest.  It would be great to
see some additional support for this project.  I'm trying to get my fellow
students to submit applications and round up some mentors as well.

Thanks,
Charlie.


From nnorwitz at gmail.com  Wed May  3 07:08:22 2006
From: nnorwitz at gmail.com (Neal Norwitz)
Date: Tue, 2 May 2006 22:08:22 -0700
Subject: [Soc2006] Mentor List/Project Scope?
In-Reply-To: <9e804ac0605020205g31f9828fu7d259e4ee718db2b@mail.gmail.com>
References: <4456C30F.2030603@elementalsecurity.com>
	<9e804ac0605020205g31f9828fu7d259e4ee718db2b@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <ee2a432c0605022208w6c1a07c4lbf1fc5505089576@mail.gmail.com>

On 5/2/06, Thomas Wouters <thomas at python.org> wrote:
>
> > The Soya3d stuff is a great example, I haven't found anything until Arc
> > Riley's email indicating that this was a project that the PSF was
> > interested in and had mentors behind.  It would be useful to have a list
> > or even a guideline from the PSF, so others of us who might not realize
> > a project has a mentor behind it won't suggest the PSF is not the right
> > place for it.
>
> I don't pretend to speak for the PSF (at least, not anymore :) but I don't
> think the PSF should reject any Python-related project off-hand. Soya3D is
> listed on the ideas page (
> http://wiki.python.org/moin/SummerOfCode ). This suggests
> (to me, at least) that one or more of the applied mentors can mentor it (or
> at least that someone thought there'd be a mentor for it.) Whether those
> mentors got accepted, I don't know, but I doubt we rejected very many ;-)

I don't pretend to speak for the PSF, Google, or SoC program--only
speaking for myself.  (Nevermind that I'm involved with all those
parts.)

We have been pretty lenient so far in accepting mentors.  The PSF is
acting somewhat as an umbrella organization in this case.  There was a
big discussion at the members meeting whether the PSF should be more
like the ASF (Apache) in this respect.  Many people were interested in
the PSF becoming such an organization in the future, even if not right
now.  For various reasons, we (the PSF) have fallen into this position
of being an umbrella.  I think it's good for the PSF, the projects,
and Google.  I wish it was good for me, but it just overloads me even
more.  So the more people can help, I appreciate it.

SoC is about experimentation and learning.  I wish every project was
incredibly successful; however unrealistic that may be.  We should
give everyone an opportunity to participate and succeed.  I don't mean
that every application should be accepted, just that we should push
all the students to do the best job possible--on the application and
on the project if accepted.

I'm not really sure where to draw the line for what projects should or
should not be accepted.  I think the people on this list should help
to define where the line is.  I hope this issue is discussed further.

n

From karol.langner at kn.pl  Wed May  3 07:43:15 2006
From: karol.langner at kn.pl (Karol Langner)
Date: Wed, 3 May 2006 07:43:15 +0200
Subject: [Soc2006] N-D array proposal idea
Message-ID: <200605030743.15940.karol.langner@kn.pl>

Dear all,

 I was reading through the list of proposals at 
http://wiki.python.org/moin/SummerOfCode
and the N-D array interface project caught my eye immediately.

 Long have I been wanting to get more involved and contribute code-wise to the 
python project (besides writing my own modules), especially for something 
like this. And SoC is perfect for me, as it would let me dedicate all the 
time I would normally spend (waste) on my summer job.

 So my question is, is this idea still open (I see it's already started), and 
who should I discuss it with before submitting my application, or should I 
submit that right away?

 For the record, I am a physics major, doing graduate work in molecular 
modelling. I would use this interface in my research, just like I use 
Numeric/NumPy now.

Sincerely,
Karol Langner

-- 
written by Karol Langner
?ro maj  3 07:32:58 CEST 2006

From nnorwitz at gmail.com  Wed May  3 08:00:54 2006
From: nnorwitz at gmail.com (Neal Norwitz)
Date: Tue, 2 May 2006 23:00:54 -0700
Subject: [Soc2006] N-D array proposal idea
In-Reply-To: <200605030743.15940.karol.langner@kn.pl>
References: <200605030743.15940.karol.langner@kn.pl>
Message-ID: <ee2a432c0605022300n5b382cc3q78032801dd30a9a0@mail.gmail.com>

My guess is that Travis Oliphant is mentoring this.  I don't know if
he's on this list.

n
--

On 5/2/06, Karol Langner <karol.langner at kn.pl> wrote:
> Dear all,
>
>  I was reading through the list of proposals at
> http://wiki.python.org/moin/SummerOfCode
> and the N-D array interface project caught my eye immediately.
>
>  Long have I been wanting to get more involved and contribute code-wise to the
> python project (besides writing my own modules), especially for something
> like this. And SoC is perfect for me, as it would let me dedicate all the
> time I would normally spend (waste) on my summer job.
>
>  So my question is, is this idea still open (I see it's already started), and
> who should I discuss it with before submitting my application, or should I
> submit that right away?
>
>  For the record, I am a physics major, doing graduate work in molecular
> modelling. I would use this interface in my research, just like I use
> Numeric/NumPy now.
>
> Sincerely,
> Karol Langner
>
> --
> written by Karol Langner
> ?ro maj  3 07:32:58 CEST 2006
> _______________________________________________
> Soc2006 mailing list
> Soc2006 at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/soc2006
>

From nnorwitz at gmail.com  Wed May  3 09:15:33 2006
From: nnorwitz at gmail.com (Neal Norwitz)
Date: Wed, 3 May 2006 00:15:33 -0700
Subject: [Soc2006] Seeking students for the Summer of Code
Message-ID: <ee2a432c0605030015x3a974b06ke2ecc3b9e23b0ffa@mail.gmail.com>

There is less than a week left before students must submit a final
application.  There are a bunch of ideas up on the wiki:

    http://wiki.python.org/moin/SummerOfCode/

The wiki has instructions for how to submit a proposal.  There are
many different areas including:  core language features, libraries,
and applications. This is a great opportunity to get real coding
experience.  Not to mention the chance to work with a nice and fun
group of people.

The earlier you submit an application, the more feedback you can get
to improve it and increase your liklihood of getting accepted.

Feel free to contact me if you have any questions.

Cheers,
n

From nnorwitz at gmail.com  Wed May  3 09:16:59 2006
From: nnorwitz at gmail.com (Neal Norwitz)
Date: Wed, 3 May 2006 00:16:59 -0700
Subject: [Soc2006] Student applications now open
In-Reply-To: <20060502100221.GB12239@Andrew-iBook2.local>
References: <20060501214512.GA28844@rogue.amk.ca>
	<bbaeab100605011945p78896765pd1d4052d46f34d57@mail.gmail.com>
	<20060502100221.GB12239@Andrew-iBook2.local>
Message-ID: <ee2a432c0605030016n5050cb6aq22d90a2383de53c0@mail.gmail.com>

I didn't see any other messages, so I sent one.  It would be great for
mentors and others to try to attract students and forward information
to teachers.

n
--

On 5/2/06, A.M. Kuchling <amk at amk.ca> wrote:
> On 5/1/06, A.M. Kuchling <amk at amk.ca> wrote:
> >It sounds like the web form for applying as a student is operational
> >at <http://code.google.com/soc/student_signup.html>.  Where should we
> >announce this?  PSF weblog; c.l.py.announce; python.org; anywhere else?
>
> I've updated the weblog and python.org.  Neal, you should probably
> post to c.l.py.announce (perhaps you already have) since you're
> actually running things for the PSF.
>
> --amk
>
> _______________________________________________
> Soc2006 mailing list
> Soc2006 at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/soc2006
>

From troll at pld-linux.org  Wed May  3 10:18:17 2006
From: troll at pld-linux.org (Michal Chruszcz)
Date: Wed, 3 May 2006 10:18:17 +0200
Subject: [Soc2006] Seeking students for the Summer of Code
In-Reply-To: <ee2a432c0605030015x3a974b06ke2ecc3b9e23b0ffa@mail.gmail.com>
References: <ee2a432c0605030015x3a974b06ke2ecc3b9e23b0ffa@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <200605031018.17343@tintia.doriath>

It seems like on Wednesday 03 May 2006 09:15, Neal Norwitz typed:
> There is less than a week left before students must submit a final
> application.  There are a bunch of ideas up on the wiki:
>
>     http://wiki.python.org/moin/SummerOfCode/
>
> The wiki has instructions for how to submit a proposal.  There are
> many different areas including:  core language features, libraries,
> and applications. This is a great opportunity to get real coding
> experience.  Not to mention the chance to work with a nice and fun
> group of people.
>
> The earlier you submit an application, the more feedback you can get
> to improve it and increase your liklihood of getting accepted.
>
> Feel free to contact me if you have any questions.

Should I send my application straight to Google or would it be better, if I 
wrote it here first?
-- 
Michal Chruszcz -=- Seen at http://1lo.sanok.pl/~troll/gallery/
Meet Jacek: http://photoblog.be/jacek

From thomas at python.org  Wed May  3 10:52:04 2006
From: thomas at python.org (Thomas Wouters)
Date: Wed, 3 May 2006 10:52:04 +0200
Subject: [Soc2006] Seeking students for the Summer of Code
In-Reply-To: <200605031018.17343@tintia.doriath>
References: <ee2a432c0605030015x3a974b06ke2ecc3b9e23b0ffa@mail.gmail.com>
	<200605031018.17343@tintia.doriath>
Message-ID: <9e804ac0605030152j280fccc8qcfe0bd33cd2ac159@mail.gmail.com>

On 5/3/06, Michal Chruszcz <troll at pld-linux.org> wrote:
>
> It seems like on Wednesday 03 May 2006 09:15, Neal Norwitz typed:
> > There is less than a week left before students must submit a final
> > application.  There are a bunch of ideas up on the wiki:
> >
> >     http://wiki.python.org/moin/SummerOfCode/
> >
> > The wiki has instructions for how to submit a proposal.  There are
> > many different areas including:  core language features, libraries,
> > and applications. This is a great opportunity to get real coding
> > experience.  Not to mention the chance to work with a nice and fun
> > group of people.
> >
> > The earlier you submit an application, the more feedback you can get
> > to improve it and increase your liklihood of getting accepted.
> >
> > Feel free to contact me if you have any questions.
>
> Should I send my application straight to Google or would it be better, if
> I
> wrote it here first?


Depends on what kind of feedback you want. The PSF has a fair number of
mentors, so you'll get decent feedback (provided your application is
detailed and concrete enough), but if you want input from python-dev, you
should definately ask for it here. The mentor feedback will be more about
how suitable a project is for the SoC timeline and setup, how well it fits
the PSF goals (which are undefined but quite broad, for the SoC project) and
whether someone can effectively mentor it. Although the mentors will likely
also discuss the feasability or desireability of a feature, it's a much more
narrow audience than python-dev.

--
Thomas Wouters <thomas at python.org>

Hi! I'm a .signature virus! copy me into your .signature file to help me
spread!
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From thomas at python.org  Wed May  3 10:53:51 2006
From: thomas at python.org (Thomas Wouters)
Date: Wed, 3 May 2006 10:53:51 +0200
Subject: [Soc2006] Seeking students for the Summer of Code
In-Reply-To: <9e804ac0605030152j280fccc8qcfe0bd33cd2ac159@mail.gmail.com>
References: <ee2a432c0605030015x3a974b06ke2ecc3b9e23b0ffa@mail.gmail.com>
	<200605031018.17343@tintia.doriath>
	<9e804ac0605030152j280fccc8qcfe0bd33cd2ac159@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <9e804ac0605030153l2a3cfb68oa12d124637e2e6b7@mail.gmail.com>

On 5/3/06, Thomas Wouters <thomas at python.org> wrote:

> but if you want input from python-dev, you should definately ask for it
> here.
>

Of course, I wrote that thinking the message was CC'ed to python-dev, not
soc2006 :-) There's no need to discuss it here, really, unless you want
feedback on how the application itself should look.

--
Thomas Wouters <thomas at python.org>

Hi! I'm a .signature virus! copy me into your .signature file to help me
spread!
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From ryan at cs.uoregon.edu  Wed May  3 18:27:08 2006
From: ryan at cs.uoregon.edu (Ryan Forsythe)
Date: Wed, 03 May 2006 09:27:08 -0700
Subject: [Soc2006] Regarding comments
Message-ID: <4458D9DC.2040307@cs.uoregon.edu>

So I've got a comment on my proposal. (Hooray! it wasn't dismissed
out-of-hand!) Are comments things I should address by editing my
proposal, or are they just to let me know there's a discussion? While
there aren't any specific questions for me in the comment, there are
some comments and questions I have about it. I'm just not sure where to
respond.

--Ryan

From ianb at colorstudy.com  Wed May  3 19:43:29 2006
From: ianb at colorstudy.com (Ian Bicking)
Date: Wed, 03 May 2006 12:43:29 -0500
Subject: [Soc2006] Regarding comments
In-Reply-To: <4458D9DC.2040307@cs.uoregon.edu>
References: <4458D9DC.2040307@cs.uoregon.edu>
Message-ID: <4458EBC1.9020902@colorstudy.com>

Ryan Forsythe wrote:
> So I've got a comment on my proposal. (Hooray! it wasn't dismissed
> out-of-hand!) Are comments things I should address by editing my
> proposal, or are they just to let me know there's a discussion? While
> there aren't any specific questions for me in the comment, there are
> some comments and questions I have about it. I'm just not sure where to
> respond.

Yes, you should respond to the comment.  There's private and public 
comments -- so any comment you see was specifically marked for you to 
see, probably so you can respond to it.

I think a good way to respond to comments is just to append your 
response to your proposal.  (If you edit your proposal reviewers are 
unlikely to notice the edits, or they will be confused by comments that 
may not make sense after your changes.)

(I got this same question from someone else, so maybe we should email 
other students who have had comments to clarify this?)

-- 
Ian Bicking  /  ianb at colorstudy.com  /  http://blog.ianbicking.org

From amk at amk.ca  Wed May  3 20:07:44 2006
From: amk at amk.ca (A.M. Kuchling)
Date: Wed, 3 May 2006 14:07:44 -0400
Subject: [Soc2006] Welcome!
In-Reply-To: <ee2a432c0605011530l27d2f5e9nebb7eec9cded1e64@mail.gmail.com>
References: <ee2a432c0605011530l27d2f5e9nebb7eec9cded1e64@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <20060503180744.GB14873@localhost.localdomain>

On Mon, May 01, 2006 at 03:30:53PM -0700, Neal Norwitz wrote:
> It would be great to hear from people that worked on SoC this last
> year so we can do a better job this year.

You could look at the archives for the pysoc-mentors mailing list for
the gory details.  Last year there were 285 proposals submitted.  The
rough plan was:

* First pass: modify every proposal's score (+1 or -1) after looking
  at it.  This ensures that every proposal gets looked at once.  Score
  of 0 = unread.

* Second pass: +1 for reasonable, -1 for duplicates, copies of the wiki suggestions,
  or otherwise clearly bad.

* Third pass: mentors begin picking projects they feel able to mentor.
  I think this drove the final selection last year; some projects looked good 
  but no one felt able to mentor them.

* Fourth pass: rank mentored projects.  Google will presumably fund N projects, so we 
  should have the N top projects ready for them.

Various brave individuals (Ian Bicking, Brett Cannon, and especially
David Ascher) made their own triage passes over the flood of
applications.

The goal was to pick applications that looked exceptional, not to
think very hard about unacceptable or marginal proposals.

--amk





From tague at minion.net  Wed May  3 19:47:20 2006
From: tague at minion.net (Tague Griffith)
Date: Wed, 03 May 2006 10:47:20 -0700
Subject: [Soc2006] Regarding comments
In-Reply-To: <4458D9DC.2040307@cs.uoregon.edu>
References: <4458D9DC.2040307@cs.uoregon.edu>
Message-ID: <4458ECA8.7070502@minion.net>

Ryan Forsythe wrote:
> So I've got a comment on my proposal. (Hooray! it wasn't dismissed
> out-of-hand!) Are comments things I should address by editing my
> proposal, or are they just to let me know there's a discussion? While
> there aren't any specific questions for me in the comment, there are
> some comments and questions I have about it. I'm just not sure where to
> respond.
> 
> --Ryan
> _______________________________________________
> Soc2006 mailing list
> Soc2006 at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/soc2006

My impression as a mentor so far,

It depends on the nature of the comments.  For many of the applications, 
the comments request the proposer to re-submit their proposal with some 
missing information or more detail so that the idea can be evaluated. 
Those comments need to get addressed otherwise the proposal will 
probably get overlooked in favor of more complete proposals.  In this 
case, I think most mentors have tried to make those comments public or 
contact the submitter to give them an opportunity to revise their 
proposal before the deadline.

Other comments are more about helpful information or ideas about your 
approach/proposal from the mentors perspective.  Those may not need to 
be addressed in the proposal proper, but are helpful suggestions to 
think about if your project gets accepted.

Usually it's pretty clear from the comment(s) which bucket they fall 
into.  I think at you as the proposer have to decide if and how you need 
to respond to the comments, but if you do, you should do it by editing 
the application.  Once a comment is published to the proposer the 
application becomes editable.

Hope that helps.



From ianb at colorstudy.com  Wed May  3 20:59:11 2006
From: ianb at colorstudy.com (Ian Bicking)
Date: Wed, 03 May 2006 13:59:11 -0500
Subject: [Soc2006] Comments to your proposal
Message-ID: <4458FD7F.2070807@colorstudy.com>

To clarify: if you've received a comment on your proposal, it means a 
reviewer specifically made the comment public to you.  If the comment is 
a question or a request for more information in your proposal, you 
should edit your proposal and append that information.  (The proposal 
becomes editable after the first public comment is made)

If you make changes to the body of your proposal, you should note those 
changes as reviewers won't otherwise know what has changed in the 
proposal.  It's probably best to just add comments and responses at the 
end of your proposal.

(I've also BCC'd this to all the students with proposals with public 
comments)

-- 
Ian Bicking  /  ianb at colorstudy.com  /  http://blog.ianbicking.org

From commandlineguy at gmail.com  Wed May  3 21:36:16 2006
From: commandlineguy at gmail.com (Timothy J. Warren)
Date: Wed, 3 May 2006 20:36:16 +0100
Subject: [Soc2006] Q: about mentoring
Message-ID: <a2e7a1d0605031236x1dbadd23w7874783c0e76575c@mail.gmail.com>

I'm preparing to submit a proposal for a PSF project, and I'm
wondering how the mentoring works.  The project I'm looking to work
for hasn't specifically applied to be a mentor, so the proposal will
be directed to the PSF.  After submitting the proposal to the
application's development list, the project administrator volunteered
to be the mentor.

How does this work?  I didn't participate in SoC last year, so I'm
pretty new to this.  It seems like he would make an ideal candidate
for a mentor, since he's (obviously) very familiar with the
application.

I don't personally know the guy (though I'm impressed with his work),
so a mentor directly from the PSF is also fine.  I'm just wondering
how this is supposed to go.


Thanks!

Timothy J. Warren

From ianb at colorstudy.com  Wed May  3 21:35:00 2006
From: ianb at colorstudy.com (Ian Bicking)
Date: Wed, 03 May 2006 14:35:00 -0500
Subject: [Soc2006] Welcome!
In-Reply-To: <20060503180744.GB14873@localhost.localdomain>
References: <ee2a432c0605011530l27d2f5e9nebb7eec9cded1e64@mail.gmail.com>
	<20060503180744.GB14873@localhost.localdomain>
Message-ID: <445905E4.8050001@colorstudy.com>

A.M. Kuchling wrote:
> On Mon, May 01, 2006 at 03:30:53PM -0700, Neal Norwitz wrote:
> 
>>It would be great to hear from people that worked on SoC this last
>>year so we can do a better job this year.
> 
> 
> You could look at the archives for the pysoc-mentors mailing list for
> the gory details.  Last year there were 285 proposals submitted.  The
> rough plan was:
> 
> * First pass: modify every proposal's score (+1 or -1) after looking
>   at it.  This ensures that every proposal gets looked at once.  Score
>   of 0 = unread.

It was quite hard that year, since there were lots of dups, no comments, 
and no opportunity for feedback.  I think it will be much more 
straight-forward this year.

I think this year it will be clear that some proposals will have floated 
to the top, and then we can discuss those more directly (anything +2 or 
better?).  Because early submitters are more likely to get higher scores 
I don't think we should put too much weight on the scores.

It would probably be good to have a private mentors list after 
everything is submitted, so we can discuss specifics.  For instance, if 
there's two submissions on the same topic and they are both unlikely to 
get accepted, it's better to just discuss the specific case than to 
comment on them each in isolation.  We also have to figure out the 
mentor assignment; the choice of projects should take into account both 
the quality of the proposal (including references and whatnot), and the 
interest of a mentor.  OTOH, it would be nice if we encounter a good 
proposal that is missing a mentor, that we try to dig a mentor up 
somewhere; not that every good proposal will get accepted, but there 
will likely be a case where there will be a proposal we'd all really 
like to accept but no one feels capable of mentoring.  We would need to 
identify those early in order to actually find a mentor, though.

After that we have to figure out mentoring itself.  There's probably 
more to talk about there, but I'd like to suggest that each project get 
a co-mentor (who might also be a mentor for another project, kind of a 
buddy system).  Then mentors will have someone on their case about doing 
mentoring; last year many mentors (including myself) didn't feel they 
were involved enough in the project and monitoring their student's work, 
and this might be a way for us to encourage each other to do better.


-- 
Ian Bicking  /  ianb at colorstudy.com  /  http://blog.ianbicking.org

From commandlineguy at gmail.com  Wed May  3 22:52:13 2006
From: commandlineguy at gmail.com (Timothy J. Warren)
Date: Wed, 3 May 2006 21:52:13 +0100
Subject: [Soc2006] Q: about mentoring
In-Reply-To: <fb6fbf560605031327q76e9cbbq77986ed1ff8db9fc@mail.gmail.com>
References: <a2e7a1d0605031236x1dbadd23w7874783c0e76575c@mail.gmail.com>
	<fb6fbf560605031327q76e9cbbq77986ed1ff8db9fc@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <a2e7a1d0605031352v46dc2cdbnf5d968e116b1bf49@mail.gmail.com>

Looking over the mentor information on the PSF moin, it looks like I
should have him contact Neal Norwitz -- is this correct?


Also, is it ok to post my proposal here to get feedback from the PSF,
or should I just go ahead and submit it?


Thanks!

Timothy J. Warren


On 5/3/06, Jim Jewett <jimjjewett at gmail.com> wrote:
> He should sign up as a PSF mentor.
>
> Go ahead and mention in your app that you've talked to him and he is interested.
>
> On 5/3/06, Timothy J. Warren <commandlineguy at gmail.com> wrote:
> > I'm preparing to submit a proposal for a PSF project, and I'm
> > wondering how the mentoring works.  The project I'm looking to work
> > for hasn't specifically applied to be a mentor, so the proposal will
> > be directed to the PSF.  After submitting the proposal to the
> > application's development list, the project administrator volunteered
> > to be the mentor.
> >
> > How does this work?  I didn't participate in SoC last year, so I'm
> > pretty new to this.  It seems like he would make an ideal candidate
> > for a mentor, since he's (obviously) very familiar with the
> > application.
> >
> > I don't personally know the guy (though I'm impressed with his work),
> > so a mentor directly from the PSF is also fine.  I'm just wondering
> > how this is supposed to go.
> >

From arc at xiph.org  Wed May  3 23:12:26 2006
From: arc at xiph.org (Arc Riley)
Date: Wed, 3 May 2006 14:12:26 -0700
Subject: [Soc2006] Welcome!
In-Reply-To: <445905E4.8050001@colorstudy.com>
References: <ee2a432c0605011530l27d2f5e9nebb7eec9cded1e64@mail.gmail.com>
	<20060503180744.GB14873@localhost.localdomain>
	<445905E4.8050001@colorstudy.com>
Message-ID: <20060503211226.GE6289@xiph.org>

Excellent suggestions Ian.  I suggest +4 or above, since its easy to get 
a +4.  

We'll have to wait to hear back from Google about how many we'll 
actually get total.  I do suggest that if there's a proposal up now that 
needs a mentor that's not currently signed up, we should sign that 
mentor up now, since the number Google will give us is based on the 
number of mentors we have.

I also suggest that since there will be at least a 1:1 student:mentor 
ratio that each mentor get to choose one student (the ratings system 
allows for this already) and that no un-adopted proposal be rated higher 
than these on the website.

The remainder (that above 1:1) should be hashed out on mentors-only list 
you proposed.


On Wed, May 03, 2006 at 02:35:00PM -0500, Ian Bicking wrote:
> 
> I think this year it will be clear that some proposals will have floated 
> to the top, and then we can discuss those more directly (anything +2 or 
> better?).  Because early submitters are more likely to get higher scores 
> I don't think we should put too much weight on the scores.
> 
> It would probably be good to have a private mentors list after 
> everything is submitted, so we can discuss specifics.  For instance, if 
> there's two submissions on the same topic and they are both unlikely to 
> get accepted, it's better to just discuss the specific case than to 
> comment on them each in isolation.  We also have to figure out the 
> mentor assignment; the choice of projects should take into account both 
> the quality of the proposal (including references and whatnot), and the 
> interest of a mentor.  OTOH, it would be nice if we encounter a good 
> proposal that is missing a mentor, that we try to dig a mentor up 
> somewhere; not that every good proposal will get accepted, but there 
> will likely be a case where there will be a proposal we'd all really 
> like to accept but no one feels capable of mentoring.  We would need to 
> identify those early in order to actually find a mentor, though.
> 
> After that we have to figure out mentoring itself.  There's probably 
> more to talk about there, but I'd like to suggest that each project get 
> a co-mentor (who might also be a mentor for another project, kind of a 
> buddy system).  Then mentors will have someone on their case about doing 
> mentoring; last year many mentors (including myself) didn't feel they 
> were involved enough in the project and monitoring their student's work, 
> and this might be a way for us to encourage each other to do better.

From ianb at colorstudy.com  Wed May  3 23:34:32 2006
From: ianb at colorstudy.com (Ian Bicking)
Date: Wed, 03 May 2006 16:34:32 -0500
Subject: [Soc2006] Welcome!
In-Reply-To: <20060503211226.GE6289@xiph.org>
References: <ee2a432c0605011530l27d2f5e9nebb7eec9cded1e64@mail.gmail.com>	<20060503180744.GB14873@localhost.localdomain>	<445905E4.8050001@colorstudy.com>
	<20060503211226.GE6289@xiph.org>
Message-ID: <445921E8.7020700@colorstudy.com>

Arc Riley wrote:
> Excellent suggestions Ian.  I suggest +4 or above, since its easy to get 
> a +4.  

Sure; as long as we give all the mentors a chance to do the initial 
review, any mentor who wants to put a project at +4 can do so to keep it 
from getting cut off.

> We'll have to wait to hear back from Google about how many we'll 
> actually get total.  I do suggest that if there's a proposal up now that 
> needs a mentor that's not currently signed up, we should sign that 
> mentor up now, since the number Google will give us is based on the 
> number of mentors we have.

Perhaps we should do a role call of mentors, to see what interests the 
current mentors have.  It would also be useful for students to see what 
mentors are available -- there's some projects listed on the wiki that 
probably won't have any mentor (and were put up there by someone who 
isn't signed up as a mentor), but the students don't know that.  (Though 
if a student comes up with a neat idea none of us thought of, that's 
okay too.)

I'm interested in mentoring web stuff (particularly WSGI-focused), and 
maybe an interesting web/education project.


-- 
Ian Bicking  /  ianb at colorstudy.com  /  http://blog.ianbicking.org

From jtauber at jtauber.com  Wed May  3 23:54:39 2006
From: jtauber at jtauber.com (James Tauber)
Date: Thu, 04 May 2006 05:54:39 +0800
Subject: [Soc2006] Welcome!
In-Reply-To: <445921E8.7020700@colorstudy.com>
References: <ee2a432c0605011530l27d2f5e9nebb7eec9cded1e64@mail.gmail.com>
	<20060503180744.GB14873@localhost.localdomain>
	<445905E4.8050001@colorstudy.com> <20060503211226.GE6289@xiph.org>
	<445921E8.7020700@colorstudy.com>
Message-ID: <1146693279.7403.260564628@webmail.messagingengine.com>


On Wed, 03 May 2006 16:34:32 -0500, "Ian Bicking" <ianb at colorstudy.com>
said:
> Perhaps we should do a role call of mentors, to see what interests the 
> current mentors have. 

I'd be interested in mentoring projects relating to the Web
(particularly relating to Atom and/or based on Leonardo or
Demokritos---I have lots of SOC-sized ideas there), education, (natural)
language / linguistics or music.

I guess that means building a learning management system on top of
Leonardo focused on language or music instruction would *really* get my
attention :-)

James
-- 
  James Tauber               http://jtauber.com/
  journeyman of some    http://jtauber.com/blog/


From arc at xiph.org  Thu May  4 06:09:32 2006
From: arc at xiph.org (Arc Riley)
Date: Wed, 3 May 2006 21:09:32 -0700
Subject: [Soc2006] Mentor Roll Call
In-Reply-To: <445921E8.7020700@colorstudy.com>
References: <ee2a432c0605011530l27d2f5e9nebb7eec9cded1e64@mail.gmail.com>
	<20060503180744.GB14873@localhost.localdomain>
	<445905E4.8050001@colorstudy.com> <20060503211226.GE6289@xiph.org>
	<445921E8.7020700@colorstudy.com>
Message-ID: <20060504040932.GF6289@xiph.org>

On Wed, May 03, 2006 at 04:34:32PM -0500, Ian Bicking wrote:
> 
> Perhaps we should do a role call of mentors, to see what interests the 
> current mentors have.

Arc Riley, I'm looking to mentor one or two Soya3d projects.

My main interest is "edutainment" software for kids ages 4-12.  Soya is 
a means to that end, allowing rapid development of beautiful games which 
hold kids attention long enough for them to learn something.



> It would also be useful for students to see what 
> mentors are available -- there's some projects listed on the wiki that 
> probably won't have any mentor (and were put up there by someone who 
> isn't signed up as a mentor), but the students don't know that.

Agreed.  I'm setting up a section on the wiki to list mentors and do 
some sorting to get projects listed by mentors + "community ideas".



From tague at minion.net  Thu May  4 08:46:35 2006
From: tague at minion.net (Tague Griffith)
Date: Wed, 03 May 2006 23:46:35 -0700
Subject: [Soc2006] Mentor Rollcall
In-Reply-To: <445921E8.7020700@colorstudy.com>
References: <ee2a432c0605011530l27d2f5e9nebb7eec9cded1e64@mail.gmail.com>	<20060503180744.GB14873@localhost.localdomain>	<445905E4.8050001@colorstudy.com>	<20060503211226.GE6289@xiph.org>
	<445921E8.7020700@colorstudy.com>
Message-ID: <4459A34B.2030200@minion.net>

Ian Bicking wrote:
> Perhaps we should do a role call of mentors, to see what interests the 
> current mentors have.  It would also be useful for students to see what 
> mentors are available -- there's some projects listed on the wiki that 
> probably won't have any mentor (and were put up there by someone who 
> isn't signed up as a mentor), but the students don't know that.  (Though 
> if a student comes up with a neat idea none of us thought of, that's 
> okay too.)
>   
Tague Griffith, I'm primarily interested in mentoring someone to spend 
some time working on the M2Crypto or other SSL toolkit, but if no 
proposals come in for those, but I may take on a well written proposal 
that doesn't have a mentor if it is something I feel I can effectively 
mentor.

From robert.kern at gmail.com  Thu May  4 08:51:52 2006
From: robert.kern at gmail.com (Robert Kern)
Date: Thu, 04 May 2006 01:51:52 -0500
Subject: [Soc2006] Mentor Rollcall
In-Reply-To: <4459A34B.2030200@minion.net>
References: <ee2a432c0605011530l27d2f5e9nebb7eec9cded1e64@mail.gmail.com>	<20060503180744.GB14873@localhost.localdomain>	<445905E4.8050001@colorstudy.com>	<20060503211226.GE6289@xiph.org>	<445921E8.7020700@colorstudy.com>
	<4459A34B.2030200@minion.net>
Message-ID: <4459A488.7020003@gmail.com>

[Apologies for piggybacking; just signed up for the list.]

Tague Griffith wrote:
> Ian Bicking wrote:
> 
>>Perhaps we should do a role call of mentors, to see what interests the 
>>current mentors have.  It would also be useful for students to see what 
>>mentors are available -- there's some projects listed on the wiki that 
>>probably won't have any mentor (and were put up there by someone who 
>>isn't signed up as a mentor), but the students don't know that.  (Though 
>>if a student comes up with a neat idea none of us thought of, that's 
>>okay too.)

I'm mostly interested in mentoring projects of use to scientists and engineers
and the like. I've added a slightly more detailed entry to the Wiki:

  http://wiki.python.org/moin/SummerOfCode/Mentors

-- 
Robert Kern

"I have come to believe that the whole world is an enigma, a harmless enigma
 that is made terrible by our own mad attempt to interpret it as though it had
 an underlying truth."
  -- Umberto Eco

From gvwilson at cs.utoronto.ca  Thu May  4 13:55:45 2006
From: gvwilson at cs.utoronto.ca (Greg Wilson)
Date: Thu, 4 May 2006 07:55:45 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: [Soc2006] Mentor Rollcall
In-Reply-To: <4459A34B.2030200@minion.net>
References: <ee2a432c0605011530l27d2f5e9nebb7eec9cded1e64@mail.gmail.com>
	<20060503180744.GB14873@localhost.localdomain>
	<445905E4.8050001@colorstudy.com>
	<20060503211226.GE6289@xiph.org> <445921E8.7020700@colorstudy.com>
	<4459A34B.2030200@minion.net>
Message-ID: <Pine.GSO.4.58.0605040753550.29633@qew.cs>

Greg Wilson

I'm the lead on DrProject (http://www.third-bit.com/drproject) and the
PSF-funded Software Carpentry course (http://www.third-bit.com/swc). I'm
primarily interested in lightweight software engineering tools that use
Python --- we use Python in several undergrad courses at U of Toronto,
with the number set to grow, so the more robust tools it comes with, the
better.

Thanks,
Greg

From gvwilson at cs.utoronto.ca  Thu May  4 13:49:36 2006
From: gvwilson at cs.utoronto.ca (Greg Wilson)
Date: Thu, 4 May 2006 07:49:36 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: [Soc2006] conflict of interest?
In-Reply-To: <445921E8.7020700@colorstudy.com>
References: <ee2a432c0605011530l27d2f5e9nebb7eec9cded1e64@mail.gmail.com>
	<20060503180744.GB14873@localhost.localdomain>
	<445905E4.8050001@colorstudy.com>
	<20060503211226.GE6289@xiph.org> <445921E8.7020700@colorstudy.com>
Message-ID: <Pine.GSO.4.58.0605040749030.29633@qew.cs>

Hi,

What's the rule on mentors ranking projects that they helped propose?

Thanks,
Greg

From arc at xiph.org  Thu May  4 15:36:26 2006
From: arc at xiph.org (Arc Riley)
Date: Thu, 4 May 2006 06:36:26 -0700
Subject: [Soc2006] conflict of interest?
In-Reply-To: <Pine.GSO.4.58.0605040749030.29633@qew.cs>
References: <ee2a432c0605011530l27d2f5e9nebb7eec9cded1e64@mail.gmail.com>
	<20060503180744.GB14873@localhost.localdomain>
	<445905E4.8050001@colorstudy.com> <20060503211226.GE6289@xiph.org>
	<445921E8.7020700@colorstudy.com>
	<Pine.GSO.4.58.0605040749030.29633@qew.cs>
Message-ID: <20060504133626.GI6289@xiph.org>

On Thu, May 04, 2006 at 07:49:36AM -0400, Greg Wilson wrote:
> Hi,
> 
> What's the rule on mentors ranking projects that they helped propose?

If there is one, it's broken all the time.  Last year there were 
apparently proposals written almost entirely by the mentor, the student 
only filling in their personal bio section.

Three of the Soya proposals were written with the students talking 
extensivly with us and getting much feedback on their drafts.  I think 
this is more than fair as any student ambitious enough could have done 
so for any project.  

Students who apply without talking to people from the mentoring 
organization first, without researching their proposals and bouncing 
questions off the developers, without showing drafts of their proposals 
and getting feedback.. yes, they're at an obvious disadvantage.  

I think that's a good thing.  This isn't a lottery...

I think the only time conflict of interest comes up is when the mentor 
is a close personal friend with the student.

From jorge.vargas at gmail.com  Thu May  4 18:02:15 2006
From: jorge.vargas at gmail.com (Jorge Vargas)
Date: Thu, 4 May 2006 12:02:15 -0400
Subject: [Soc2006] Pure Python SQL API
Message-ID: <32822fe60605040902l77564280taa37ba061e87f735@mail.gmail.com>

Hello everyone,

First of all sorry for the delay but this idea jsut came to me yesterday.

It's not 100% but i'm running short on time, if you people like it i'll
write a formal proposal asap.

Right now we have a really nice PEP 249 which tells mostly anything a python
db-interface should have.
Now the problem comes went most drivers are half C half python, and they
need to be compile (my
current nightmare is mysqldb, which under windows requires many gigs of
microsoft toolkits and/or buying their development env)

So what I'm proposing is something like the what is done in java where they
have a library and pure java connectors.
In our case my project will revolve around the pure python core api and it
will be extensible with pure-python modules for each db,
from which I'll probably write at least one as a example/test/proof of
concept.

does this sounds crazy? or is it really a good idea?
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From ianb at colorstudy.com  Thu May  4 18:47:23 2006
From: ianb at colorstudy.com (Ian Bicking)
Date: Thu, 04 May 2006 11:47:23 -0500
Subject: [Soc2006] Pure Python SQL API
In-Reply-To: <32822fe60605040902l77564280taa37ba061e87f735@mail.gmail.com>
References: <32822fe60605040902l77564280taa37ba061e87f735@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <445A301B.9080700@colorstudy.com>

Jorge Vargas wrote:
> Hello everyone,
> 
> First of all sorry for the delay but this idea jsut came to me yesterday.
> 
> It's not 100% but i'm running short on time, if you people like it i'll 
> write a formal proposal asap.
> 
> Right now we have a really nice PEP 249 which tells mostly anything a 
> python db-interface should have.
> Now the problem comes went most drivers are half C half python, and they 
> need to be compile (my
> current nightmare is mysqldb, which under windows requires many gigs of 
> microsoft toolkits and/or buying their development env)
> 
> So what I'm proposing is something like the what is done in java where 
> they have a library and pure java connectors.
> In our case my project will revolve around the pure python core api and 
> it will be extensible with pure-python modules for each db,
> from which I'll probably write at least one as a example/test/proof of 
> concept.
> 
> does this sounds crazy? or is it really a good idea?

I think it has some potential, but I don't know if there's anyone 
suitable to mentor at the moment, and I think a mentor who understands 
the problems would be very useful to the project.  There are some 
pure-Python db connectors out there; I've seen at least two Postgres ones

* http://barryp.org/software/bpgsql
* http://www.tnr.cc/pypg.html

I saw a reference to pymysql on SF, but the project is now gone.  I 
don't think there's much reason for a framework for building these; 
DB-API is simple enough that most of the work will be in the individual 
drivers.  If a framework emerges in the process, so much the better, but 
it shouldn't be a target.

There might also be some interest from people wanting to do async 
database connections, because even if you create a blocking API (DB-API 
is blocking) it would be far far easier to adapt or extend a pure-Python 
driver to be async.

Also, libraries written in C -- database libraries in particular -- can 
be a common source of instability in long-running Python processes.

All that said, I think this project would be a bit of a stretch to get 
accepted.


-- 
Ian Bicking  /  ianb at colorstudy.com  /  http://blog.ianbicking.org

From ianb at colorstudy.com  Thu May  4 18:58:39 2006
From: ianb at colorstudy.com (Ian Bicking)
Date: Thu, 04 May 2006 11:58:39 -0500
Subject: [Soc2006] conflict of interest?
In-Reply-To: <20060504133626.GI6289@xiph.org>
References: <ee2a432c0605011530l27d2f5e9nebb7eec9cded1e64@mail.gmail.com>	<20060503180744.GB14873@localhost.localdomain>	<445905E4.8050001@colorstudy.com>
	<20060503211226.GE6289@xiph.org>	<445921E8.7020700@colorstudy.com>	<Pine.GSO.4.58.0605040749030.29633@qew.cs>
	<20060504133626.GI6289@xiph.org>
Message-ID: <445A32BF.90607@colorstudy.com>

Arc Riley wrote:
> On Thu, May 04, 2006 at 07:49:36AM -0400, Greg Wilson wrote:
>>What's the rule on mentors ranking projects that they helped propose?
> 
> 
> If there is one, it's broken all the time.  Last year there were 
> apparently proposals written almost entirely by the mentor, the student 
> only filling in their personal bio section.

Yeah, *that* would be a little fishy.  There were also lots of 
submissions last year that were just lightly recycled project 
descriptions, taken off the org's website of project ideas.  These all 
got rejected.

> Three of the Soya proposals were written with the students talking 
> extensivly with us and getting much feedback on their drafts.  I think 
> this is more than fair as any student ambitious enough could have done 
> so for any project.  
> 
> Students who apply without talking to people from the mentoring 
> organization first, without researching their proposals and bouncing 
> questions off the developers, without showing drafts of their proposals 
> and getting feedback.. yes, they're at an obvious disadvantage.  
> 
> I think that's a good thing.  This isn't a lottery...

I strongly agree -- I think that process of getting feedback is 
representative of the SoC development process, so if as a student you 
get help on your proposal, that's a sign you'll be more successful later on.

That said, I think it's probably also fair for students to note when and 
where they've gotten help on their proposal; or if they do not, for the 
mentor to note that in a comment.

The original email was a little unclear -- if we are talking about 
mentors ranking a proposal based on an idea that the mentor offered up, 
of course those mentors should rank those proposals as they have the 
most interest.

If you have other conflicts of interest (e.g., the student is an actual 
student of yours) then I think if you note that in a comment we can 
discuss that later.


-- 
Ian Bicking  /  ianb at colorstudy.com  /  http://blog.ianbicking.org

From richardjones at optushome.com.au  Thu May  4 13:25:00 2006
From: richardjones at optushome.com.au (Richard Jones)
Date: Thu, 4 May 2006 21:25:00 +1000
Subject: [Soc2006] Mentor Roll Call
In-Reply-To: <20060504040932.GF6289@xiph.org>
References: <ee2a432c0605011530l27d2f5e9nebb7eec9cded1e64@mail.gmail.com>
	<445921E8.7020700@colorstudy.com> <20060504040932.GF6289@xiph.org>
Message-ID: <200605042125.00219.richardjones@optushome.com.au>

On Thursday 04 May 2006 14:09, Arc Riley wrote:
> On Wed, May 03, 2006 at 04:34:32PM -0500, Ian Bicking wrote:
> > Perhaps we should do a role call of mentors, to see what interests the
> > current mentors have.

Hey, I've been convinced to sign up by an enthusiastic student who's hopefully 
going to be doing some Roundup work.

I'm also interested in mentoring anyone keen to work on improving the Python 
Package Index.


    Richard

From mark.dufour at gmail.com  Thu May  4 13:52:29 2006
From: mark.dufour at gmail.com (Mark Dufour)
Date: Thu, 4 May 2006 13:52:29 +0200
Subject: [Soc2006] Optimizing Python-to-C++ Compiler
Message-ID: <8180ef690605040452i2c9f4c1at1750ae25432507c5@mail.gmail.com>

Hello all,

I have just added an idea for a SoC proposal to the summerofcode wiki,
namely to add memory optimizations to Shed Skin. For those of you that
do not know Shed Skin, it is an experimental Python-to-C++ compiler,
that works for pure, but implicitly statically typed Python programs.
The current speedup versus Psyco is typically 2-40, on average 12, for
16 non-trivial benchmarks up to 320 lines (see my Master's Thesis at
the given link).

As a participant in last year's SoC, I was able to greatly improve SS,
so that it works pretty well atm, for not too large programs. (See the
analysis time graph in my thesis). There are several interesting
topics that might be a nice as a SoC project. Most interestingly, I
feel, would be to add memory optimizations (I have just removed my
simplistic buggy one), to bring the performance of generated code even
closer to that of manually written C++. This would also be a great
topic for a Master's Thesis, so it might be possible to combine the
two.

Note that SS is a very simple compiler (it is only 6000 lines!) so it
relatively easy to understand and extend. Additionally, while SS is
still alpha software, many programs already work, so there are many
test programs to test additional analyses.

If you are interested, please check out the given link, and indicate
your interest to me. I am sure we can come up with a nice proposal.


Thanks,
Mark.
--
"How should I know if it works? That's what beta testers are for. I
only coded it." - Linus Torvalds

From nnorwitz at gmail.com  Thu May  4 19:32:56 2006
From: nnorwitz at gmail.com (Neal Norwitz)
Date: Thu, 4 May 2006 10:32:56 -0700
Subject: [Soc2006] Pure Python SQL API
In-Reply-To: <445A301B.9080700@colorstudy.com>
References: <32822fe60605040902l77564280taa37ba061e87f735@mail.gmail.com>
	<445A301B.9080700@colorstudy.com>
Message-ID: <ee2a432c0605041032j272bdd30u3ab1979729318652@mail.gmail.com>

On 5/4/06, Ian Bicking <ianb at colorstudy.com> wrote:
>
> > Right now we have a really nice PEP 249 which tells mostly anything a
> > python db-interface should have.
> > Now the problem comes went most drivers are half C half python, and they
> > need to be compile (my
> > current nightmare is mysqldb, which under windows requires many gigs of
> > microsoft toolkits and/or buying their development env)
>
> I think it has some potential, but I don't know if there's anyone
> suitable to mentor at the moment, and I think a mentor who understands
> the problems would be very useful to the project.  There are some

We probably have a capable mentor already.  If not, we can sign up
mentors after the applications are in, so I wouldn't worry about this
too much.

Best to work on submitting a great application that will be accepted!

Cheers,
n

From kap4020 at rit.edu  Thu May  4 18:07:01 2006
From: kap4020 at rit.edu (Karol Pietrzak)
Date: Thu, 04 May 2006 12:07:01 -0400
Subject: [Soc2006] Pure Python SQL API
In-Reply-To: <32822fe60605040902l77564280taa37ba061e87f735@mail.gmail.com>
References: <32822fe60605040902l77564280taa37ba061e87f735@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <200605041207.01206.kap4020@rit.edu>

On Thursday 04 May 2006 12:02, Jorge Vargas wrote:
> Hello everyone,
>
> First of all sorry for the delay but this idea jsut came to me yesterday.
>
> It's not 100% but i'm running short on time, if you people like it i'll
> write a formal proposal asap.
>
> Right now we have a really nice PEP 249 which tells mostly anything a
> python db-interface should have. Now the problem comes went most drivers
> are half C half python, and they need to be compile (my current nightmare
> is mysqldb, which under windows requires many gigs of microsoft toolkits
> and/or buying their development env)
>
> So what I'm proposing is something like the what is done in java where they
> have a library and pure java connectors. In our case my project will
> revolve around the pure python core api and it will be extensible with
> pure-python modules for each db, from which I'll probably write at least
> one as a example/test/proof of concept.
>
> does this sounds crazy? or is it really a good idea?

I think that's a great idea.  JDBC is considered a strong point of Java.  I 
would be all in favor of mimicking the way the Java world does this, just as 
the 'logging' module follows JUnit.

http://java.sun.com/products/jdbc/driverdesc.html

-- 
Karl Pietrzak
kap4020 at rit.edu
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From jorge.vargas at gmail.com  Thu May  4 20:59:45 2006
From: jorge.vargas at gmail.com (Jorge Vargas)
Date: Thu, 4 May 2006 14:59:45 -0400
Subject: [Soc2006] Pure Python SQL API
In-Reply-To: <445A301B.9080700@colorstudy.com>
References: <32822fe60605040902l77564280taa37ba061e87f735@mail.gmail.com>
	<445A301B.9080700@colorstudy.com>
Message-ID: <32822fe60605041159x5c3f68fq378348089c1f891e@mail.gmail.com>

In reply to Karol, really nice link I didnt had that. although I knew about
it.

In terms of http://java.sun.com/products/jdbc/driverdesc.html right now
python has type2 drivers.

My original idea will be a type3, although 4 seems more efficient.

Maybe with a little python magic a type3 could be implemented that will have
all the advantages of a type4.

On 5/4/06, Ian Bicking <ianb at colorstudy.com> wrote:
>
> Jorge Vargas wrote:
> I think it has some potential, but I don't know if there's anyone
> suitable to mentor at the moment, and I think a mentor who understands
> the problems would be very useful to the project.


Yes indeed I'm not really sure what needs to be done :)

 There are some
> pure-Python db connectors out there; I've seen at least two Postgres ones
>
> * http://barryp.org/software/bpgsql
> * http://www.tnr.cc/pypg.html


that seems like really alpha code :)

I saw a reference to pymysql on SF, but the project is now gone.


 there is one and is really up to date
http://sourceforge.net/projects/mysql-python

I don't think there's much reason for a framework for building these;
> DB-API is simple enough that most of the work will be in the individual
> drivers.  If a framework emerges in the process, so much the better, but
> it shouldn't be a target.


My goal behind it is to take out the C/C++ that must drivers have,
integrating this into the code of python or the framework, again much like
java does, that provides a default interface and all the drivers extend it,
in code not in docs which is what python has right now.

There might also be some interest from people wanting to do async
> database connections, because even if you create a blocking API (DB-API
> is blocking) it would be far far easier to adapt or extend a pure-Python
> driver to be async.


I'm not sure how will that be usefull, you can't rely on your information
being on the db, even if you send it?

Also, libraries written in C -- database libraries in particular -- can
> be a common source of instability in long-running Python processes.


well that is  exactly the point, indeed of having all that C code in
http://www.python.org/doc/topics/database/modules/ they will all be
centralized in one central core, and all the drivers will be implemented in
pure-python modules.

That is why I make reference to Java api, since it's the best example out
there.
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From ianb at colorstudy.com  Thu May  4 21:29:59 2006
From: ianb at colorstudy.com (Ian Bicking)
Date: Thu, 04 May 2006 14:29:59 -0500
Subject: [Soc2006] Pure Python SQL API
In-Reply-To: <32822fe60605041159x5c3f68fq378348089c1f891e@mail.gmail.com>
References: <32822fe60605040902l77564280taa37ba061e87f735@mail.gmail.com>	
	<445A301B.9080700@colorstudy.com>
	<32822fe60605041159x5c3f68fq378348089c1f891e@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <445A5637.30203@colorstudy.com>

Jorge Vargas wrote:
> In reply to Karol, really nice link I didnt had that. although I knew 
> about it.
> 
> In terms of http://java.sun.com/products/jdbc/driverdesc.html right now 
> python has type2 drivers.
> 
> My original idea will be a type3, although 4 seems more efficient.

Type 3 seems odd -- like some sort of transitional technique you'd use 
in an environment when it's too hard to put C code directly in the 
process (like... Java?)  I don't think it makes much sense for Python.

>      There are some
>     pure-Python db connectors out there; I've seen at least two Postgres
>     ones
> 
>     * http://barryp.org/software/bpgsql <http://barryp.org/software/bpgsql>
>     * http://www.tnr.cc/pypg.html
> 
> 
> that seems like really alpha code :)

A good sign; if there wasn't anything out there, then no one has thought 
the idea interesting enough to try.  If there was mature code out there, 
then you'd be out of a proposal.

>     There might also be some interest from people wanting to do async
>     database connections, because even if you create a blocking API (DB-API
>     is blocking) it would be far far easier to adapt or extend a pure-Python
>     driver to be async.
> 
> 
> I'm not sure how will that be usefull, you can't rely on your 
> information being on the db, even if you send it?

I don't know the details, but Twisted does have an interface for 
asynchronous database access.  I assume the queries are ordered, it's 
just that you don't block waiting for them to complete.


-- 
Ian Bicking  /  ianb at colorstudy.com  /  http://blog.ianbicking.org

From ryan at cs.uoregon.edu  Thu May  4 20:12:58 2006
From: ryan at cs.uoregon.edu (Ryan Forsythe)
Date: Thu, 04 May 2006 11:12:58 -0700
Subject: [Soc2006] Proposal revision
Message-ID: <445A442A.50300@cs.uoregon.edu>

So, the SoC webapp swallowed my proposal. Apparently this happens if it
gets sent back for revision. As I can't see the proposal, nor the
comments, I'm not sure if this applies to me. If one of the mentors did
want some revisions, could you contact me directly so I can start
revising? Thanks.

--Ryan

From ryan at cs.uoregon.edu  Thu May  4 21:34:14 2006
From: ryan at cs.uoregon.edu (Ryan Forsythe)
Date: Thu, 04 May 2006 12:34:14 -0700
Subject: [Soc2006] Proposal revision
Message-ID: <445A5736.7060005@cs.uoregon.edu>

(First time I sent this it didn't show up on the list -- sorry if anyone
gets this twice.)

So, the SoC webapp swallowed my proposal. Apparently this happens if it
gets sent back for revision. As I can't see the proposal, nor the
comments, I'm not sure if this applies to me. If one of the mentors did
want some revisions, could you contact me directly so I can start
revising? Thanks.

--Ryan



From ryanf at cs.uoregon.edu  Thu May  4 20:30:15 2006
From: ryanf at cs.uoregon.edu (Ryan Forsythe)
Date: Thu, 04 May 2006 11:30:15 -0700
Subject: [Soc2006] Proposal revision
Message-ID: <445A4837.2030902@cs.uoregon.edu>

So, the SoC webapp swallowed my proposal. Apparently this happens if it
gets sent back for revision. As I can't see the proposal, nor the
comments, I'm not sure if this applies to me. If one of the mentors did
want some revisions, could you contact me directly so I can start
revising? Thanks.

--Ryan


From kap4020 at rit.edu  Fri May  5 03:48:34 2006
From: kap4020 at rit.edu (Karol Pietrzak)
Date: Thu, 04 May 2006 21:48:34 -0400
Subject: [Soc2006] Pure Python SQL API
In-Reply-To: <32822fe60605041159x5c3f68fq378348089c1f891e@mail.gmail.com>
References: <32822fe60605040902l77564280taa37ba061e87f735@mail.gmail.com>
	<445A301B.9080700@colorstudy.com>
	<32822fe60605041159x5c3f68fq378348089c1f891e@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <200605042148.34511.kap4020@rit.edu>

On Thursday 04 May 2006 14:59, Jorge Vargas wrote:
> In reply to Karol, really nice link I didnt had that. although I knew about
> it.
>
>  In terms of http://java.sun.com/products/jdbc/driverdesc.html right now
> python has type2 drivers.
>
>  My original idea will be a type3, although 4 seems more efficient.
>
>  Maybe with a little python magic a type3 could be implemented that will
> have all the advantages of a type4.

As Ian Bicking pointed out, I think some of the types can be collapsed for 
Python use.  I'm not exactly sure how strict "types" could be used for 
labeling purposes; perhaps we will end up with only one or two "types".

I think the greatest benefit to a "Python SQL API" should be the same as for 
JDBC: provide a common API no matter what SQL database is used.

Switching databases (e.g., from MySQL to Oracle) using JDBC can be as easy as 
changing one or two lines of code.

-- 
Karl Pietrzak
kap4020 at rit.edu
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From kap4020 at rit.edu  Fri May  5 03:53:14 2006
From: kap4020 at rit.edu (Karol Pietrzak)
Date: Thu, 04 May 2006 21:53:14 -0400
Subject: [Soc2006] Pure Python SQL API
In-Reply-To: <445A5637.30203@colorstudy.com>
References: <32822fe60605040902l77564280taa37ba061e87f735@mail.gmail.com>
	<32822fe60605041159x5c3f68fq378348089c1f891e@mail.gmail.com>
	<445A5637.30203@colorstudy.com>
Message-ID: <200605042153.14745.kap4020@rit.edu>

On Thursday 04 May 2006 15:29, Ian Bicking wrote:
> I don't know the details, but Twisted does have an interface for
> asynchronous database access. ?I assume the queries are ordered, it's
> just that you don't block waiting for them to complete.

Yes, it looks Twisted has an async DB interface [1].  I think the "Pure Python 
SQL API" project should provide a simple, sync API, just like JDBC.  
Additionally, binary compatibility in Python must be of the utmost importance 
so that there are closed-source drivers for, say, Oracle DB.

[1] http://twistedmatrix.com/projects/core/documentation/howto/enterprise.html

-- 
Karl Pietrzak
kap4020 at rit.edu
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From iratsu at gmail.com  Fri May  5 15:38:24 2006
From: iratsu at gmail.com (Alex Lang)
Date: Fri, 5 May 2006 09:38:24 -0400
Subject: [Soc2006] Decision Procedure
Message-ID: <6b7b52ef0605050638p21db3be4oaa0d12f5a9ef99fa@mail.gmail.com>

Hello,

I'd like to know how will proposals get accepted within the PSF? Do
mentors simply choose which proposal they want to mentor or does the
PSF choose as a group and attributes the projects to mentors?

Yours truly,
Alex Lang

From commandlineguy at gmail.com  Fri May  5 21:38:33 2006
From: commandlineguy at gmail.com (Timothy J. Warren)
Date: Fri, 5 May 2006 20:38:33 +0100
Subject: [Soc2006] Could someone make my proposal editable?
Message-ID: <a2e7a1d0605051238pea49539s51f791457f9668fc@mail.gmail.com>

Is it possible for someone at PSF to make my proposal (Roundup Remote
Library) editable?  I've made changes to the proposal based on the
comment Armin Rigo left -- I assumed he would make another comment,
but it's been a little while and I'd like to incorporate the changes
he requested.


If you look at what I've posted on the Roundup wiki in response to Mr.
Rigo, you'll basically get a handle on what I'm looking to add.  
(http://www.mechanicalcat.net/tech/roundup/wiki/Note3ToArminRigo).



Of course, please feel free to make valid feedback or suggestions!


Thanks!

T.J.

From ianb at colorstudy.com  Fri May  5 22:27:51 2006
From: ianb at colorstudy.com (Ian Bicking)
Date: Fri, 05 May 2006 15:27:51 -0500
Subject: [Soc2006] Decision Procedure
In-Reply-To: <6b7b52ef0605050638p21db3be4oaa0d12f5a9ef99fa@mail.gmail.com>
References: <6b7b52ef0605050638p21db3be4oaa0d12f5a9ef99fa@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <445BB547.30409@colorstudy.com>

Alex Lang wrote:
> I'd like to know how will proposals get accepted within the PSF? Do
> mentors simply choose which proposal they want to mentor or does the
> PSF choose as a group and attributes the projects to mentors?

I suspect it will happen like last year -- after submissions are closed 
we'll discuss the proposals both individually and collectively, and 
through some informal process decide on several proposals, taking into 
account the mentor, proposal, and general usefulness of the project to 
the Python community.  We'll know we've got a decision when no one has 
any objections or unresolved concerns about the decision.

I doubt we'll rely on any scoring system or voting to make the final 
decision.  A mentor's preference will probably get the most priority, 
because that person is going to be investing the most amount of time in 
the resulting project.


-- 
Ian Bicking  /  ianb at colorstudy.com  /  http://blog.ianbicking.org

From ryanf at cs.uoregon.edu  Fri May  5 23:24:14 2006
From: ryanf at cs.uoregon.edu (Ryan Forsythe)
Date: Fri, 05 May 2006 14:24:14 -0700
Subject: [Soc2006] Signature Verifier & lint tools
Message-ID: <445BC27E.9040907@cs.uoregon.edu>

So I got a comment on my app asking if my proposal could be integrated
into pylint/pychecker instead of as a standalone module. I'm going to 
try responding to that here before (or while) revising:

It certainly could, but it would need to change the behavior of the lint
tool greatly. The approach to verification I'm taking here relies on
known data being fed to functions through testing, and that data used to
approximate what the signature of the function is. So, instead of merely
analyzing the code the lint tool would be running it -- I think, at that
point, it stops being lint. Semantics, maybe. Would such a modification 
be well-received?

--Ryan


From barry at python.org  Fri May  5 23:36:23 2006
From: barry at python.org (Barry Warsaw)
Date: Fri, 05 May 2006 17:36:23 -0400
Subject: [Soc2006] Mentor Roll Call
In-Reply-To: <200605042125.00219.richardjones@optushome.com.au>
References: <ee2a432c0605011530l27d2f5e9nebb7eec9cded1e64@mail.gmail.com>
	<445921E8.7020700@colorstudy.com> <20060504040932.GF6289@xiph.org>
	<200605042125.00219.richardjones@optushome.com.au>
Message-ID: <1146864983.8876.8.camel@geddy.wooz.org>

I've had some interest from people wanting to update the Mailman
interface, probably using one of the Python templating toolkits (and
still supporting i18n).  Of course, I'm happy to mentor this.

-Barry

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From cfbolz at gmx.de  Fri May  5 23:43:05 2006
From: cfbolz at gmx.de (Carl Friedrich Bolz)
Date: Fri, 05 May 2006 23:43:05 +0200
Subject: [Soc2006] Welcome!
In-Reply-To: <445921E8.7020700@colorstudy.com>
References: <ee2a432c0605011530l27d2f5e9nebb7eec9cded1e64@mail.gmail.com>	<20060503180744.GB14873@localhost.localdomain>	<445905E4.8050001@colorstudy.com>	<20060503211226.GE6289@xiph.org>
	<445921E8.7020700@colorstudy.com>
Message-ID: <445BC6E9.7070500@gmx.de>

Ian Bicking wrote:
> Perhaps we should do a role call of mentors, to see what interests the 
> current mentors have.  It would also be useful for students to see what 
> mentors are available -- there's some projects listed on the wiki that 
> probably won't have any mentor (and were put up there by someone who 
> isn't signed up as a mentor), but the students don't know that.  (Though 
> if a student comes up with a neat idea none of us thought of, that's 
> okay too.)

I am mostly interested in PyPy proposals but will also mentor more or 
less any project that interest me and that I feel I am capable of 
supporting.

Cheers,

Carl Friedrich Bolz

From python at weismueller.org  Fri May  5 20:45:12 2006
From: python at weismueller.org (Jonas Weismueller)
Date: Fri, 05 May 2006 20:45:12 +0200
Subject: [Soc2006] MHCP: Summer of Code Application
Message-ID: <445B9D38.7070208@weismueller.org>

Hi list members,
I've already sent my project proposal to Neal Norwitz. He has recommended me to send my proposal to the list, because there are more people giving advice, help and hints.
Thanks for all the feedback in advance.
Below you will find my application:



Summer of Code 2006

Application

Project Proposal
***************
Design and implementation of a completely modular hosting control
panel (MHCP) written in pure Python. MHCP should be
able to handle and configure well known services(such as web, dns,
ftp-server) and utilize a database in the backend to facilitate
plugins/modules for each service. MHCP will be a complete hosting
automation platform. MHCP should consist of an user interface (web
based GUI) and a (possibly distributed) daemon to collect and
manipulate configurations on different machines. The target audience
of MHCP are large scale hosting providers that need to control
multiple servers with different services like mail, web and ftp via an
unified and functionally extensible interface.

With MHCP you can configure your server and applications, create
user with domains using minimal point-and-click operations.

MHCP is Open Source Software and dedicated to giving users,
administrators and developers the ultimate level of control over their
servers, and their data.

In particular, the administrator should be able to switch easily
between different modules for different kind of applications.

MHCP will be developed to be multilingual, where every piece of
MHCP software can be translated into any desired natural language.

I have completed all my necessary course work in my course, and
can work full time on this project without distraction.



Experiences
***********

Academic
------------
Study at Aalen University 1 http://www.international.htw-aalen.de/
* March 2001 ? September 2004, October 2005 ? now

Study at Cork Inistitute of Technology 2 http://www.cit.ie/
* October 2004 ? September 2005


Industry
----------
Internships:

Computer Center at University of Saarbruecken 3
http://www.rz.uni-saarland.de/
Fresenuius Medical Care 4 http://www.fmc-ag.com
Suewag Energie AG 5 http://www.suewag.de


Open Source Development
************************
Years of experience in system administration without the aid of
various hosting panels, a multitude of Open-Source Operating Systems
and their associated system services and daemons.

Explanation of Development Methodology
**************************************
MHCP will not reinvent the wheel, it makes heavy usage of well known
and stable Python modules like Cheetah template engine and
Cherrypy webserver. Concrete:

GUI: Cherrypy + Cheetah Templates
Server-Engine: SSH based daemon (Paramiko)
Database: SQLAlchemy

Brief list of deliverables:
------------------------------
* Fully functional modular hosting control panel
* GUI for Administrators
* GUI for Resellers
* GUI for Customers
* Modular service system with following main Components: DNS (default:
Bind), FTP (default: proftpd), MAIL (default: Postfix and Courier),
WEBSERVER (default Apache), DATABASE (default Postgresql), etc...
* Daemon managing tasks (secure distributed daemons, if spare time)
* Automated creation of users and domains
* Control of reseller's and user's traffic.
* DNS/WEBSERVER-Component: Virtual hosts management (Name-based, IP-based)
* DNS-Component: Domains and Sub-Domain management
* FTP-Component: ftp user management
* MAIL-Component: managing mail addresses (forwarders and real
postboxes) - POP3 and IMAP accounts
* WEBSERVER-Component: CGI, PHP configuration and management, password
protection (.htaccess files), Custom error files
* DATABASE-Component: user databases
* Potential features (time permitting): Disk quotas, manage IP
addresses, Backup and restore, SSL-secured domains, Traffic accounting,
Skin-based GUI - with pre-installed skins


From brett at python.org  Sat May  6 03:44:24 2006
From: brett at python.org (Brett Cannon)
Date: Fri, 5 May 2006 18:44:24 -0700
Subject: [Soc2006] Could someone make my proposal editable?
In-Reply-To: <a2e7a1d0605051238pea49539s51f791457f9668fc@mail.gmail.com>
References: <a2e7a1d0605051238pea49539s51f791457f9668fc@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <bbaeab100605051844v1fd9804fm79b0e6e47582b4ad@mail.gmail.com>

I think there is a to resubmit your proposal without going through the whole
process again.  But I am not totally sure about this.

-Brett

On 5/5/06, Timothy J. Warren <commandlineguy at gmail.com> wrote:
>
> Is it possible for someone at PSF to make my proposal (Roundup Remote
> Library) editable?  I've made changes to the proposal based on the
> comment Armin Rigo left -- I assumed he would make another comment,
> but it's been a little while and I'd like to incorporate the changes
> he requested.
>
>
> If you look at what I've posted on the Roundup wiki in response to Mr.
> Rigo, you'll basically get a handle on what I'm looking to add.
> (http://www.mechanicalcat.net/tech/roundup/wiki/Note3ToArminRigo).
>
>
>
> Of course, please feel free to make valid feedback or suggestions!
>
>
> Thanks!
>
> T.J.
> _______________________________________________
> Soc2006 mailing list
> Soc2006 at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/soc2006
>
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From dstanek at dstanek.com  Fri May  5 23:07:58 2006
From: dstanek at dstanek.com (David Stanek)
Date: Fri, 5 May 2006 21:07:58 +0000
Subject: [Soc2006] Could someone make my proposal editable?
In-Reply-To: <a2e7a1d0605051238pea49539s51f791457f9668fc@mail.gmail.com>
References: <a2e7a1d0605051238pea49539s51f791457f9668fc@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <20060505210758.GL16899@darkbox.ip3networks.com>

On Fri, May 05, 2006 at 08:38:33PM +0100, Timothy J. Warren wrote:
> Is it possible for someone at PSF to make my proposal (Roundup Remote
> Library) editable?  I've made changes to the proposal based on the
> comment Armin Rigo left -- I assumed he would make another comment,
> but it's been a little while and I'd like to incorporate the changes
> he requested.
> 
> 
> If you look at what I've posted on the Roundup wiki in response to Mr.
> Rigo, you'll basically get a handle on what I'm looking to add.  
> (http://www.mechanicalcat.net/tech/roundup/wiki/Note3ToArminRigo).
> 

According to the FAQ[0] you can't edit proposals.

[0] http://code.google.com/soc/studentfaq.html#resubmit_app

David

-- 
http://www.traceback.org

GPG keyID #6272EDAF on http://pgp.mit.edu
Key fingerprint = 8BAA 7E11 8856 E148 6833  655A 92E2 3E00 6272 EDAF
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From walter at livinglogic.de  Sat May  6 16:10:22 2006
From: walter at livinglogic.de (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Walter_D=F6rwald?=)
Date: Sat, 06 May 2006 16:10:22 +0200
Subject: [Soc2006] Decision Procedure
In-Reply-To: <6b7b52ef0605050638p21db3be4oaa0d12f5a9ef99fa@mail.gmail.com>
References: <6b7b52ef0605050638p21db3be4oaa0d12f5a9ef99fa@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <445CAE4E.50005@livinglogic.de>

Alex Lang wrote:
> Hello,
> 
> I'd like to know how will proposals get accepted within the PSF? Do
> mentors simply choose which proposal they want to mentor or does the
> PSF choose as a group and attributes the projects to mentors?

I'd like to know that too, especially as there are two proposals for the
same project (which is a project idea from the wiki). One option would
be to accept one proposal and reject the other one (maybe based on the
quality of the proposal or the stated knowledge of the student). Another
option would be to split the project into two parts. This should work
for this project because it's basically implementing a GUI in two
different GUI toolkits, so the project results could be judged
separately. So is it allowed to do half the work for half the pay, or
should we simply extend each part of the project? (But I certainly won't
have time to mentor two students).

Servus,
   Walter


From samtygier at yahoo.co.uk  Sat May  6 16:23:28 2006
From: samtygier at yahoo.co.uk (Sam Tygier)
Date: Sat, 06 May 2006 15:23:28 +0100
Subject: [Soc2006] Simple programming app.
Message-ID: <445CB160.9080206@yahoo.co.uk>

Hello

I am interested in making a simple IDE, and set of libraries to help children and teenagers learn to program in python. I have write a specification at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/simple-prog-app. I intend to apply to Ubuntu for this project, but they have informed me that it would be low priority.

Can I also apply for python.org to mentor the project.

Thank you

Sam Tygier  

		
___________________________________________________________ 
Yahoo! Photos ? NEW, now offering a quality print service from just 7p a photo http://uk.photos.yahoo.com

From robert.kern at gmail.com  Sat May  6 21:21:36 2006
From: robert.kern at gmail.com (Robert Kern)
Date: Sat, 06 May 2006 14:21:36 -0500
Subject: [Soc2006] Decision Procedure
In-Reply-To: <445CAE4E.50005@livinglogic.de>
References: <6b7b52ef0605050638p21db3be4oaa0d12f5a9ef99fa@mail.gmail.com>
	<445CAE4E.50005@livinglogic.de>
Message-ID: <445CF740.4050408@gmail.com>

Walter D?rwald wrote:
> Alex Lang wrote:
> 
>>Hello,
>>
>>I'd like to know how will proposals get accepted within the PSF? Do
>>mentors simply choose which proposal they want to mentor or does the
>>PSF choose as a group and attributes the projects to mentors?
> 
> I'd like to know that too, especially as there are two proposals for the
> same project (which is a project idea from the wiki). One option would
> be to accept one proposal and reject the other one (maybe based on the
> quality of the proposal or the stated knowledge of the student). Another
> option would be to split the project into two parts. This should work
> for this project because it's basically implementing a GUI in two
> different GUI toolkits, so the project results could be judged
> separately. So is it allowed to do half the work for half the pay,

IANAGE, but no, that is not allowed.

> or
> should we simply extend each part of the project? (But I certainly won't
> have time to mentor two students).

If you can get another mentor, then yes, that would work. You would probably
want to contact each student to have them clarify on their applications which
aspect they would be focusing on. These would be two separate projects, and when
May 22nd comes around, it may turn out that one of them will not be selected.
The students would each be paid the full amount separately if they succeed.
Fernando P?rez and I did something similar last year.

-- 
Robert Kern

"I have come to believe that the whole world is an enigma, a harmless enigma
 that is made terrible by our own mad attempt to interpret it as though it had
 an underlying truth."
  -- Umberto Eco

From brett at python.org  Sat May  6 21:32:27 2006
From: brett at python.org (Brett Cannon)
Date: Sat, 6 May 2006 12:32:27 -0700
Subject: [Soc2006] Simple programming app.
In-Reply-To: <445CB160.9080206@yahoo.co.uk>
References: <445CB160.9080206@yahoo.co.uk>
Message-ID: <bbaeab100605061232x7f79520bte9bb6c670756ca9b@mail.gmail.com>

We are not going to prevent you from applying to having the PSF mentor, but
we cannot make any guarantees about priorities or acceptance of the
proposal.

-Brett

On 5/6/06, Sam Tygier <samtygier at yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
>
> Hello
>
> I am interested in making a simple IDE, and set of libraries to help
> children and teenagers learn to program in python. I have write a
> specification at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/simple-prog-app. I intend to
> apply to Ubuntu for this project, but they have informed me that it would be
> low priority.
>
> Can I also apply for python.org to mentor the project.
>
> Thank you
>
> Sam Tygier
>
>
> ___________________________________________________________
> Yahoo! Photos ? NEW, now offering a quality print service from just 7p a
> photo http://uk.photos.yahoo.com
> _______________________________________________
> Soc2006 mailing list
> Soc2006 at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/soc2006
>
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From jeremylujan at gmail.com  Sun May  7 09:14:27 2006
From: jeremylujan at gmail.com (J. Lujan)
Date: Sun, 7 May 2006 02:14:27 -0500
Subject: [Soc2006] WebIDE with Project Management Proposal
Message-ID: <36dc2e450605070014s159a6c99t5bc07d42754f1960@mail.gmail.com>

Hello,

My name is Jeremy Lujan and I am a 21 year old student at a community
college. I have been tinkering with a web framework built on mod_python for
a year or so but have had too many conflicts to work on it too much. A major
portion of my idea was a project management interface that included an svn
interface as well. I also tinkered around with a unit test runner that
produces XML as well as an XSL stylesheet for HTML presentation. Having said
that, I am interested in the wiki suggesting a web based IDE for python and
supplementing my original ideas. I submitted a proposal on SoC and I am
sending this email as notification and hopefully to scrounge out some
feedback.


Thank You,
Jeremy
jeremylujan at gmail.com
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From ryanf at cs.uoregon.edu  Mon May  8 22:00:22 2006
From: ryanf at cs.uoregon.edu (Ryan Forsythe)
Date: Mon, 08 May 2006 13:00:22 -0700
Subject: [Soc2006] LispNYC/PSF joint project
Message-ID: <445FA356.50103@cs.uoregon.edu>

As some of you may have read on c.l.python, Ken Tilton has proposed a 
Python port of his Cells extension to CLOS. I've applied to LispNYC for 
this project, but Ken has suggested that it might work best as a joint 
project between LispNYC and the PSF. He's offered to work with me as an 
(unofficial?) co-mentor, so I'm wondering if I should send a duplicate 
application to the PSF to see if someone's interested in (co) mentoring, 
or should I leave the one app and let the PSF and LispNYC work it out?

--Ryan

From cfbolz at gmx.de  Mon May  8 22:26:24 2006
From: cfbolz at gmx.de (Carl Friedrich Bolz)
Date: Mon, 8 May 2006 22:26:24 +0200
Subject: [Soc2006] LispNYC/PSF joint project
In-Reply-To: <445FA356.50103@cs.uoregon.edu>
References: <445FA356.50103@cs.uoregon.edu>
Message-ID: <348899050605081326t351b3f7u317f9a408ee169b9@mail.gmail.com>

2006/5/8, Ryan Forsythe <ryanf at cs.uoregon.edu>:
> As some of you may have read on c.l.python, Ken Tilton has proposed a
> Python port of his Cells extension to CLOS. I've applied to LispNYC for
> this project, but Ken has suggested that it might work best as a joint
> project between LispNYC and the PSF. He's offered to work with me as an
> (unofficial?) co-mentor, so I'm wondering if I should send a duplicate
> application to the PSF to see if someone's interested in (co) mentoring,
> or should I leave the one app and let the PSF and LispNYC work it out?

The problem is that we cannot look at the LispNYC's proposals, so
could you maybe just post it here?

Cheers,

Carl Friedrich Bolz

From ryanf at cs.uoregon.edu  Mon May  8 22:30:41 2006
From: ryanf at cs.uoregon.edu (Ryan Forsythe)
Date: Mon, 08 May 2006 13:30:41 -0700
Subject: [Soc2006] LispNYC/PSF joint project
In-Reply-To: <348899050605081326t351b3f7u317f9a408ee169b9@mail.gmail.com>
References: <445FA356.50103@cs.uoregon.edu>
	<348899050605081326t351b3f7u317f9a408ee169b9@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <445FAA71.3020000@cs.uoregon.edu>

Carl Friedrich Bolz wrote:
> The problem is that we cannot look at the LispNYC's proposals, so
> could you maybe just post it here?

Sure thing:

===========================================

Ryan Forsythe
ryanf at cs.uoregon.edu

Summer of Code Proposal: LispNYC -- PyCells
===========================================

Summary: Python port of Kenny Tilton's Cells extension to CLOS

Cells is a framework which, rather than defining a class as a set of
methods and attributes, instead defines it as a set of interdependent
slots, each of whose values are determined by formulas. It is
analogous to a spreadsheet. While it is similar to Python's idea of
properties, elements of a class which act like values but which are
generated by a method, cells build in an automemoization function so
their results are recalculated only when needed. My task for Summer of
Code would be to build a package which implemented Cells in Python,
built regression testing for the package, and translate CLOS Cell's
demo applications into PyCell.

Time Constraints: Unfortunately, I have a fairly busy class & work
schedule until June 16th, which is the last day of classes. Depending
on my workload and financial situation, I would be willing to drop my
work hours in order to devote more time to PyCells. However, after the
16th my constraints are minimal. My work is self-scheduling, and light
during the summer term (I work part-time as IT support for a
department at UO, and so work tends to drop off when most of the
students are gone). I have no scheduled vacations, nor classes I need
to take. Essentially, I'm yours.

Language Experience: I would say that my two strongest languages are
Python and Java; my preferred language is Python, but since Java 1.5 I
don't totally hate that language any more. I'm a reasonable C
programmer (though I haven't had to do it in a while), and I've worked
as a Perl programmer (though, again, I'm rusty). I learned Scheme as
part of a programming languages course last year, and so I can at
least read some Lisp; I'm confident that with a bit of study I'll can
become at least Lisp-literate. I've also had some experience with ML.

I know my way around Python's unittest module, and have done a fair
amount of research into the more exotic areas of Python's object model
(ie, metaclasses) researching my other SoC proposal, a test-driven
signature verification system for Python, submitted to the PSF.

Schooling: I'm currently in my final year at the University of
Oregon. I'll be graduating with a Bachelor of Science in Computer and
Information Science.

What I'd do: (From the PyCells project page) As this project will
require some learning on my part (that is, learning to read Lisp), and
a great deal of input from both my mentor and more experienced package
designers for the syntax design, I'm unsure about my estimates here.

  * Determine target syntax for PyCells. -- 1-2 weeks during school
  * Translate Cells regression test suite to PyCells. -- 3 weeks during
    school
  * Translate Cells from Common Lisp to Python and test. -- 7-10 weeks
  * Translate the demo applications of Cells-Gtk and Celtk (+ Cells
    Tcl/Tk) to PyGTk and Tkinter. -- 1-2 weeks
  * Test on all OSes. -- Throughout project

Why choose me: Firstly, I believe I understand the problem. Judging
from recent discussions about Cells on comp.lang.python, this is
something to be noted in itself. I believe I have the right mix of
skills -- Python, experience with a Lisp-y language, strong background
in Computer Science -- that this project requires. Finally, I think
Cells is an interesting idea which may need more exposure, in the form
of a port to a more widely-used language.


From andre.roberge at gmail.com  Mon May  8 22:40:54 2006
From: andre.roberge at gmail.com (Andre Roberge)
Date: Mon, 8 May 2006 17:40:54 -0300
Subject: [Soc2006] Mentor
Message-ID: <7528bcdd0605081340n264803adkc54cdd741c8654cf@mail.gmail.com>

Hi-

I just wanted to let people know that I would be willing/available as
a mentor or co-mentor for any project related to "Python in
education".

Qualifications available upon request ;-)

Andr?

From jimjjewett at gmail.com  Mon May  8 22:58:00 2006
From: jimjjewett at gmail.com (Jim Jewett)
Date: Mon, 8 May 2006 16:58:00 -0400
Subject: [Soc2006] LispNYC/PSF joint project
In-Reply-To: <445FAA71.3020000@cs.uoregon.edu>
References: <445FA356.50103@cs.uoregon.edu>
	<348899050605081326t351b3f7u317f9a408ee169b9@mail.gmail.com>
	<445FAA71.3020000@cs.uoregon.edu>
Message-ID: <fb6fbf560605081358x22ce7123p9095735fe9127f22@mail.gmail.com>

Disclosure:  I haven't looked at the original Lisp code yet; there is
a possibility that I would be wildly surprised about the
implementation.

On 5/8/06, Ryan Forsythe <ryanf at cs.uoregon.edu> wrote:

>   * Determine target syntax for PyCells. -- 1-2 weeks during school

Just to verify -- you do remember that python doesn't have a good
equivalent to Lisp macros?  Adding a function or class is not so hard.
 Adding syntax ... is harder.  There are projects (like Kid and Logix)
that do it, generally through import hooks, but ... this part may be a
bigger undertaking than you expected.

On the other hand, import machinery hooking has been greatly improved
-- and is still a wart; if you manage to clean it up, that is a good
and useful thing by itself.  So that part might make it into mainline
CPython, even if the specific Cells extension didn't.

>   * Translate Cells regression test suite to PyCells. -- 3 weeks during
>     school
>   * Translate Cells from Common Lisp to Python and test. -- 7-10 weeks

(repeat of above warning)

>   * Translate the demo applications of Cells-Gtk and Celtk (+ Cells
>     Tcl/Tk) to PyGTk and Tkinter. -- 1-2 weeks

Are there no non-GUI demos?  Fighting GUI library quirks is possibly open-ended.

-jJ

From troll at pld-linux.org  Mon May  8 23:23:02 2006
From: troll at pld-linux.org (Michal Chruszcz)
Date: Mon, 8 May 2006 23:23:02 +0200
Subject: [Soc2006] Mentor
In-Reply-To: <7528bcdd0605081340n264803adkc54cdd741c8654cf@mail.gmail.com>
References: <7528bcdd0605081340n264803adkc54cdd741c8654cf@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <200605082323.03013@tintia.doriath>

It seems like on Monday 08 May 2006 22:40, Andre Roberge typed:
> Hi-
>
> I just wanted to let people know that I would be willing/available as
> a mentor or co-mentor for any project related to "Python in
> education".
>
> Qualifications available upon request ;-)

I submitted an application covering up further development of GradeList 
project [1], which is mainly an electronical medium for school marks, 
albeit it has got some more miscellaneous functions (and I want to add more 
of them, as written in the proposal).

Should I consider you as possible future mentor? Of course, supposing the 
application is going to be accepted. :-D

[1] - http://sourceforge.net/projects/gradelist/
-- 
Michal Chruszcz -=- Seen at http://1lo.sanok.pl/~troll/gallery/
Meet Jacek: http://photoblog.be/jacek

From ryanf at cs.uoregon.edu  Mon May  8 23:36:51 2006
From: ryanf at cs.uoregon.edu (Ryan Forsythe)
Date: Mon, 08 May 2006 14:36:51 -0700
Subject: [Soc2006] LispNYC/PSF joint project
In-Reply-To: <fb6fbf560605081358x22ce7123p9095735fe9127f22@mail.gmail.com>
References: <445FA356.50103@cs.uoregon.edu>	
	<348899050605081326t351b3f7u317f9a408ee169b9@mail.gmail.com>	
	<445FAA71.3020000@cs.uoregon.edu>
	<fb6fbf560605081358x22ce7123p9095735fe9127f22@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <445FB9F3.4030508@cs.uoregon.edu>

Jim Jewett wrote:
> On 5/8/06, Ryan Forsythe <ryanf at cs.uoregon.edu> wrote:
> 
>>   * Determine target syntax for PyCells. -- 1-2 weeks during school
> 
> Just to verify -- you do remember that python doesn't have a good
> equivalent to Lisp macros?  Adding a function or class is not so hard.
> Adding syntax ... is harder.  

Oh yes. I suppose "determine target API" would be closer to what I'm
thinking for this. I copied it from the LispNYC proposal page, though,
so perhaps KT has other ideas...

>>   * Translate the demo applications of Cells-Gtk and Celtk (+ Cells
>>     Tcl/Tk) to PyGTk and Tkinter. -- 1-2 weeks
> 
> Are there no non-GUI demos?  Fighting GUI library quirks is possibly 
> open-ended.

True. Lisp/Cells was written in response to a problem with GUI layout,
which probably explains the GUI orientation of the demos. Perhaps
something like a web server or tiny webapp framework is more doable in
the time frame and useful as a demo of PyCells.

--Ryan


From jtauber at jtauber.com  Mon May  8 23:42:49 2006
From: jtauber at jtauber.com (James Tauber)
Date: Tue, 09 May 2006 05:42:49 +0800
Subject: [Soc2006] LispNYC/PSF joint project
In-Reply-To: <445FB9F3.4030508@cs.uoregon.edu>
References: <445FA356.50103@cs.uoregon.edu>
	<348899050605081326t351b3f7u317f9a408ee169b9@mail.gmail.com>
	<445FAA71.3020000@cs.uoregon.edu>
	<fb6fbf560605081358x22ce7123p9095735fe9127f22@mail.gmail.com>
	<445FB9F3.4030508@cs.uoregon.edu>
Message-ID: <1147124569.26070.260929005@webmail.messagingengine.com>


I am interested in being the PSF-side mentor for this but I am
interested to know what particular support you are looking for on the
Python side (or overall). In other words, what do you see as the gaps
between what you know and what you need to know to succeed that you are
looking to a mentor to help you with. General Python guidance? Specific
guidance in certain areas? If it's just general support and guidance
about running open source projects in general, that's fine too, and I'm
more than willing to provide that.

James


On Mon, 08 May 2006 14:36:51 -0700, "Ryan Forsythe"
<ryanf at cs.uoregon.edu> said:
> Jim Jewett wrote:
> > On 5/8/06, Ryan Forsythe <ryanf at cs.uoregon.edu> wrote:
> > 
> >>   * Determine target syntax for PyCells. -- 1-2 weeks during school
> > 
> > Just to verify -- you do remember that python doesn't have a good
> > equivalent to Lisp macros?  Adding a function or class is not so hard.
> > Adding syntax ... is harder.  
> 
> Oh yes. I suppose "determine target API" would be closer to what I'm
> thinking for this. I copied it from the LispNYC proposal page, though,
> so perhaps KT has other ideas...
> 
> >>   * Translate the demo applications of Cells-Gtk and Celtk (+ Cells
> >>     Tcl/Tk) to PyGTk and Tkinter. -- 1-2 weeks
> > 
> > Are there no non-GUI demos?  Fighting GUI library quirks is possibly 
> > open-ended.
> 
> True. Lisp/Cells was written in response to a problem with GUI layout,
> which probably explains the GUI orientation of the demos. Perhaps
> something like a web server or tiny webapp framework is more doable in
> the time frame and useful as a demo of PyCells.
> 
> --Ryan
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Soc2006 mailing list
> Soc2006 at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/soc2006
-- 
  James Tauber               http://jtauber.com/
  journeyman of some    http://jtauber.com/blog/


From andre.roberge at gmail.com  Mon May  8 23:57:45 2006
From: andre.roberge at gmail.com (Andre Roberge)
Date: Mon, 8 May 2006 18:57:45 -0300
Subject: [Soc2006] Mentor
In-Reply-To: <200605082323.03013@tintia.doriath>
References: <7528bcdd0605081340n264803adkc54cdd741c8654cf@mail.gmail.com>
	<200605082323.03013@tintia.doriath>
Message-ID: <7528bcdd0605081457u75f2e236pb99407f5885ff8aa@mail.gmail.com>

On 5/8/06, Michal Chruszcz <troll at pld-linux.org> wrote:
> It seems like on Monday 08 May 2006 22:40, Andre Roberge typed:
> > Hi-
> >
> > I just wanted to let people know that I would be willing/available as
> > a mentor or co-mentor for any project related to "Python in
> > education".
> >
> > Qualifications available upon request ;-)
>
> I submitted an application covering up further development of GradeList
> project [1], which is mainly an electronical medium for school marks,
> albeit it has got some more miscellaneous functions (and I want to add more
> of them, as written in the proposal).

This is not what I had in mind, nor what I feel necessarily qualified
to be involved with.  By "Python in education", I mean either using
Python for creating pedagogical tools (e.g. framework to write physics
demos, etc.) or for creating programs to learn about Python
programming (e.g. rur-ple.sf.net, gvr.sf.net, etc.).

I am not involved in deciding who gets accepted or not...

But, while your project may be worthwhile on its own, I would imagine
than simply using Python to write an "ordinary" application that could
be written in any language without making any difference to either the
end users (e.g. what difference would it make if you wrote your
application in C++?)  or to the Python community as a whole (what
would be its place in the standard distribution, or as a building
block useful for other Python programmers and/or teachers, would not
be the goal of the SoC from the PSF point of view...

Andr?

> Should I consider you as possible future mentor? Of course, supposing the
> application is going to be accepted. :-D
>
> [1] - http://sourceforge.net/projects/gradelist/
> --
> Michal Chruszcz -=- Seen at http://1lo.sanok.pl/~troll/gallery/
> Meet Jacek: http://photoblog.be/jacek
> _______________________________________________
> Soc2006 mailing list
> Soc2006 at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/soc2006
>

From ryanf at cs.uoregon.edu  Mon May  8 23:59:55 2006
From: ryanf at cs.uoregon.edu (Ryan Forsythe)
Date: Mon, 08 May 2006 14:59:55 -0700
Subject: [Soc2006] LispNYC/PSF joint project
In-Reply-To: <1147124569.26070.260929005@webmail.messagingengine.com>
References: <445FA356.50103@cs.uoregon.edu>
	<348899050605081326t351b3f7u317f9a408ee169b9@mail.gmail.com>
	<445FAA71.3020000@cs.uoregon.edu>
	<fb6fbf560605081358x22ce7123p9095735fe9127f22@mail.gmail.com>
	<445FB9F3.4030508@cs.uoregon.edu>
	<1147124569.26070.260929005@webmail.messagingengine.com>
Message-ID: <445FBF5B.7090103@cs.uoregon.edu>

James Tauber wrote:
> I am interested in being the PSF-side mentor for this but I am
> interested to know what particular support you are looking for on the
> Python side (or overall). In other words, what do you see as the gaps
> between what you know and what you need to know to succeed that you are
> looking to a mentor to help you with. General Python guidance? Specific
> guidance in certain areas? If it's just general support and guidance
> about running open source projects in general, that's fine too, and I'm
> more than willing to provide that.

On the Python side, I'd say my biggest gap is the gap between 
researching a topic (in this case, metaclasses) and practicing it. 
Playing in ipython and using them in a big package are two very 
different things. So help with the deep voodoo, if I need to get into 
it, would be good. On the general help side, I'd guess I'd need help 
with designing a good API  for this thing. And yes, this would be the 
first public, open-source project I've managed; I'm sure it'll be a bit 
different than managing 4 classmates in my software methodology class :)

Glad to hear you're interested. I'm off to class imminently, but should 
I submit a dupe of the LispNYC application to the PSF when I get back?

--Ryan

From cfbolz at gmx.de  Tue May  9 00:06:41 2006
From: cfbolz at gmx.de (Carl Friedrich Bolz)
Date: Tue, 9 May 2006 00:06:41 +0200
Subject: [Soc2006] LispNYC/PSF joint project
In-Reply-To: <445FBF5B.7090103@cs.uoregon.edu>
References: <445FA356.50103@cs.uoregon.edu>
	<348899050605081326t351b3f7u317f9a408ee169b9@mail.gmail.com>
	<445FAA71.3020000@cs.uoregon.edu>
	<fb6fbf560605081358x22ce7123p9095735fe9127f22@mail.gmail.com>
	<445FB9F3.4030508@cs.uoregon.edu>
	<1147124569.26070.260929005@webmail.messagingengine.com>
	<445FBF5B.7090103@cs.uoregon.edu>
Message-ID: <348899050605081506n506a0b78r18f0c64eedf657b5@mail.gmail.com>

2006/5/8, Ryan Forsythe <ryanf at cs.uoregon.edu>:
> James Tauber wrote:
> > I am interested in being the PSF-side mentor for this but I am
> > interested to know what particular support you are looking for on the
> > Python side (or overall). In other words, what do you see as the gaps
> > between what you know and what you need to know to succeed that you are
> > looking to a mentor to help you with. General Python guidance? Specific
> > guidance in certain areas? If it's just general support and guidance
> > about running open source projects in general, that's fine too, and I'm
> > more than willing to provide that.
>
> On the Python side, I'd say my biggest gap is the gap between
> researching a topic (in this case, metaclasses) and practicing it.
> Playing in ipython and using them in a big package are two very
> different things. So help with the deep voodoo, if I need to get into
> it, would be good. On the general help side, I'd guess I'd need help
> with designing a good API  for this thing. And yes, this would be the
> first public, open-source project I've managed; I'm sure it'll be a bit
> different than managing 4 classmates in my software methodology class :)

What I really don't see is why this has to be implemented with
metaclasses. Sure, Ken seems to have that idea, but there might be
different approaches. For example, I keep thinking that some sort of
placeholder class might be useable for this -- see the following
thread on python-dev:

http://mail.python.org/pipermail/python-dev/2006-February/060350.html

Such a placeholder class would probably also provide a sufficient
amount of introspection to determine the dependencies between the
attributes.

Cheers,

Carl Friedrich Bolz

From jtauber at jtauber.com  Tue May  9 00:19:41 2006
From: jtauber at jtauber.com (James Tauber)
Date: Tue, 09 May 2006 06:19:41 +0800
Subject: [Soc2006] LispNYC/PSF joint project
In-Reply-To: <445FBF5B.7090103@cs.uoregon.edu>
References: <445FA356.50103@cs.uoregon.edu>
	<348899050605081326t351b3f7u317f9a408ee169b9@mail.gmail.com>
	<445FAA71.3020000@cs.uoregon.edu>
	<fb6fbf560605081358x22ce7123p9095735fe9127f22@mail.gmail.com>
	<445FB9F3.4030508@cs.uoregon.edu>
	<1147124569.26070.260929005@webmail.messagingengine.com>
	<445FBF5B.7090103@cs.uoregon.edu>
Message-ID: <1147126781.30982.260931656@webmail.messagingengine.com>




On Mon, 08 May 2006 14:59:55 -0700, "Ryan Forsythe"
<ryanf at cs.uoregon.edu> said:
> Glad to hear you're interested. I'm off to class imminently, but should 
> I submit a dupe of the LispNYC application to the PSF when I get back?

Go for it.

James
-- 
  James Tauber               http://jtauber.com/
  journeyman of some    http://jtauber.com/blog/


From edin.salkovic at gmail.com  Tue May  9 14:49:29 2006
From: edin.salkovic at gmail.com (=?UTF-8?Q?Edin_Salkovi=C4=87?=)
Date: Tue, 9 May 2006 14:49:29 +0200
Subject: [Soc2006] Another SoC application
Message-ID: <63eb7fa90605090549m19c6cd37y9f9d3b406b14941@mail.gmail.com>

I announced my application for SoC on the scipy-user list, and now I'm
announcing it here :)

From the application description:

...creating a pure Python library, without external dependencies (TeX,
LaTeX, even SciPy) that can fully implement the TeX's algorithm for
typesetting mathematical formulae (described in detail in the Appendix
G of 'The TeXbook' by Donald Knuth). The project will borrow heavily
from matplotlib.mathtext (a lot of work already done)...

The idea is to pull the mathtext module out of the John Hunter's
matplotlib library, and make it a separate library so other python
projects can use it easily (i.e. docstring parsers). Mathtext
currently supports EPS/PNG/SVG output, a lot


Further info:
http://matplotlib.sourceforge.net/matplotlib.mathtext.html
Original announcement (featuring the inevitable name-of-the-project contest):
http://article.gmane.org/gmane.comp.python.scientific.user/7497
Another informative thread that span off:
http://article.gmane.org/gmane.comp.python.scientific.user/7504

From iratsu at gmail.com  Mon May 15 05:48:16 2006
From: iratsu at gmail.com (Alex Lang)
Date: Sun, 14 May 2006 23:48:16 -0400
Subject: [Soc2006] Clarifications
Message-ID: <6b7b52ef0605142048x53db1821gacbda3c12839087f@mail.gmail.com>

OK,
so it seems my app needs clarifications, but I can't edit it right
now, so I'll just comment on it here.

I might have forgotten to emphasize that the game will have some kind
of guide in it which will help the player learn about python. The
guide will start off pretty low-level teaching about various python
data types and eventually it will ask the player to complete
challenges, which it will then evaluate. Some of these challenges will
be modification challenges which will involve modifying certain high
level specifics of the game.

The game will be similar to the game Lists and Lists, which teaches scheme:

http://www.ifiction.org/games/play.phpz?cat=&game=21&mode=html

Yours truly,
Alex

From netburn at gmail.com  Tue May 16 18:26:42 2006
From: netburn at gmail.com (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Pablo_Andr=E9s_Ortega_Ch.?=)
Date: Tue, 16 May 2006 11:26:42 -0500
Subject: [Soc2006] Contact Clark Evans
Message-ID: <f8565bdd0605160926me276adj4f12150363fad441@mail.gmail.com>

Greetings everybody:


I'm trying to reach Clark Evans, but I have not found his email address. If
somebody in the list knows the email, I'd appreciate if you may let me know.

Clark, if you read this email, I'd appreciate if you may contact me.


Thanks.

-- 
Pablo Andr?s Ortega Ch?vez
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From andre.roberge at gmail.com  Tue May 16 19:04:23 2006
From: andre.roberge at gmail.com (Andre Roberge)
Date: Tue, 16 May 2006 14:04:23 -0300
Subject: [Soc2006] Contact Clark Evans
In-Reply-To: <f8565bdd0605160926me276adj4f12150363fad441@mail.gmail.com>
References: <f8565bdd0605160926me276adj4f12150363fad441@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <7528bcdd0605161004r593b36adoda1c20dfbb360e59@mail.gmail.com>

On 5/16/06, Pablo Andr?s Ortega Ch. <netburn at gmail.com> wrote:
>
> Greetings everybody:
>
>
> I'm trying to reach Clark Evans, but I have not found his email address.
> If somebody in the list knows the email, I'd appreciate if you may let me
> know.
>

I assume you are trying to reach him regarding your "teach packs" proposal.

I don't know if Clark Evans will reply to you or not.  I don't know if there
is time or not to answer satisfactorily the questions that were raised.
Assuming it is possible...

You may want to give some serious thoughts about trying to tie in your
project with other projects already existing. There exists already some
teaching material for Python; for example: the livewires package, or the How
to think like a computer scientist e-book. Your proposal does not make any
reference to any existing work in the Python community, if only to contrast
the difference - if you did not intend to build on what already exists.

A fair bit of discussion on edu-sig (the python related education special
interest group mailing list) has been centered on making educational
material available through the web.  The idea of creating a tool to
"compile" teaching package sounds very much like developing a "proprietary
format"  (I know, it is going to be open source, but it sounds very much
like something that could not be adapted easily for other projects.)

 Rather than waiting for Clark Evans to contact you, you may want to post
here your answers to the questions he raised.

Just a few thoughts...

Andr? Roberge

Clark, if you read this email, I'd appreciate if you may contact me.
>
>
> Thanks.
>
> --
> Pablo Andr?s Ortega Ch?vez
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Soc2006 mailing list
> Soc2006 at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/soc2006
>
>
>
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From jwlato at gmail.com  Wed May 17 23:24:02 2006
From: jwlato at gmail.com (John Lato)
Date: Wed, 17 May 2006 16:24:02 -0500
Subject: [Soc2006] update to my proposal
Message-ID: <9979e72e0605171424n31eb9a0ai2f29a7abdb178cc2@mail.gmail.com>

Hello,
I don't really know who to send this to, but I'm sure that someone on
this list does.  Due to recent events, I need to withdraw my proposal
for an Audio Wavelet Processing Library/Application.  Could someone
from the Python Software Foundation please contact me and tell me what
further steps, if any, I need to take?  I'd be happy to discuss this
off the list as well.

Thank you,
John W. Lato

From brett at python.org  Thu May 18 00:00:23 2006
From: brett at python.org (Brett Cannon)
Date: Wed, 17 May 2006 15:00:23 -0700
Subject: [Soc2006] update to my proposal
In-Reply-To: <9979e72e0605171424n31eb9a0ai2f29a7abdb178cc2@mail.gmail.com>
References: <9979e72e0605171424n31eb9a0ai2f29a7abdb178cc2@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <bbaeab100605171500x52022716rb898141ed9c6c60c@mail.gmail.com>

I have gone ahead and labeled your application as ineligible.  Sorry you had
to pull out, John.

-Brett

On 5/17/06, John Lato <jwlato at gmail.com> wrote:
>
> Hello,
> I don't really know who to send this to, but I'm sure that someone on
> this list does.  Due to recent events, I need to withdraw my proposal
> for an Audio Wavelet Processing Library/Application.  Could someone
> from the Python Software Foundation please contact me and tell me what
> further steps, if any, I need to take?  I'd be happy to discuss this
> off the list as well.
>
> Thank you,
> John W. Lato
> _______________________________________________
> Soc2006 mailing list
> Soc2006 at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/soc2006
>
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From dhk24 at drexel.edu  Fri May 19 06:20:46 2006
From: dhk24 at drexel.edu (Daniel Kozlowski)
Date: Fri, 19 May 2006 00:20:46 -0400
Subject: [Soc2006] Mentor Feedback for Google SOC
Message-ID: <1148012446.4585.14.camel@localhost>

Devs,  

I had submitted a application for Google SoC to work on Trac / Dr.
Project. 

I check back on my Application today with comments from Clark C. Evans
and Greg Wilson I tried to find your E-mail address of the python or SoC
site but can't (or at least one I know is not someone else with the same
name) If one of you could E-mail me off list to discuss your comments /
revision to my application I would be most appreciative 

Thanks 

Dan Kozlowski 


From commandlineguy at gmail.com  Wed May 24 17:17:07 2006
From: commandlineguy at gmail.com (Timothy J. Warren)
Date: Wed, 24 May 2006 16:17:07 +0100
Subject: [Soc2006] Suggestions, complaints,
	reasons why my SoC application wasn't accepted?
Message-ID: <a2e7a1d0605240817l726a2e2epe0f3ff3727504217@mail.gmail.com>

Greetings, all.  I received a notification from Google this morning
saying that my SoC application (Roundup Remote Library) was not
accepted.

I realize that there were many applicants, and not every project could
be approved.  I'd appreciate some feedback from the PSF members on
ways my application could have been improved: aspects they didn't
like, functionality they would have liked added.



Also, I'd like to thank Jonathan Ellis, Tague Griffith, Clark C.
Evans, and Armin Rigo for their feedback during the submission phase.
Thanks, guys!



Timothy J. Warren

From brett at python.org  Wed May 24 19:08:40 2006
From: brett at python.org (Brett Cannon)
Date: Wed, 24 May 2006 10:08:40 -0700
Subject: [Soc2006] Acceptance/rejection letters sent by Google
Message-ID: <bbaeab100605241008w36a4c756mf85ed2f951707eb1@mail.gmail.com>

Google has now sent out acceptance/rejection letters, so all students should
be hearing from Google shortly.

Just to give people an idea of how fierce the competition was, we received
208 applications, of which 186 were considered eligible for consideration.
We had roughly 50 mentors signed up, ready and very willing to take on
students (some willing to take on multiple students).  But we were only
allocated 25 slots by Google (they have about 100 organizations for 454
slots, with the PSF tying with the ASF as having the highest number of slots
so we were lucky to have even 25).

To those of you who were not accepted, please do not take it as suggesting
your application was not good.  For instance, several third-party
applications received multiple applications that were scheduled to be
accepted.  But when we got our final acceptance number from Google
priorities to projects that would benefit the application group had to be
made and their total slot allocation was capped so as to spread the
application acceptances amongst a wide range of groups.

Thus do not take a rejection as a comment that your idea was considered
bad.  If you are interested in still doing your project feel free to contact
the group that your application applies to and see if they would still be
interested in helping you sans funding from Google.

To those of you who did get accepted, congratulations!  You will be
receiving an email with more details instructions on what you need to do to
get started and should be hearing from your mentors shortly.

Thank you all for participating in SoC 2006!


-Brett
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From vpetro at gmail.com  Wed May 24 19:41:40 2006
From: vpetro at gmail.com (Petro Verkhogliad)
Date: Wed, 24 May 2006 13:41:40 -0400
Subject: [Soc2006] decision clarification
Message-ID: <2e9613570605241041p4cff6f7fsa39b6aab0c799003@mail.gmail.com>

Hi,

i submitted an application for a TurboGears project with was eventually not
accepted. While I understand the nature of the competition I would
appreciate some clarification as to the decision. My proposal was GearBox
for TurboGears. The end result of this project would have been a
self-contained python+turbogears bundle. This is similar to Locomotive in
the Ruby on Rails world.

At any rate, any comments would be appreciated.

Thank you,

PV
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From arc at xiph.org  Wed May 24 20:55:20 2006
From: arc at xiph.org (Arc Riley)
Date: Wed, 24 May 2006 11:55:20 -0700
Subject: [Soc2006] decision clarification
In-Reply-To: <2e9613570605241041p4cff6f7fsa39b6aab0c799003@mail.gmail.com>
References: <2e9613570605241041p4cff6f7fsa39b6aab0c799003@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <20060524185520.GZ6289@xiph.org>

Hi Petro

Again, we had roughly 50 proposals that we wanted to accept out of the 
roughly 200 we received.  However, only 25 could be accepted.

Just because your proposal wasn't accepted doesn't mean it wasn't 
understood or desireable.  We just couldn't accept every proposal we 
liked and had to make some really hard choice over the last 4 days.

I lost all three students I was looking to mentor in that process.  All 
three of their proposals were excellent.

Sorry you didn't make the cut either.


On Wed, May 24, 2006 at 01:41:40PM -0400, Petro Verkhogliad wrote:
> Hi,
> 
> i submitted an application for a TurboGears project with was eventually not
> accepted. While I understand the nature of the competition I would
> appreciate some clarification as to the decision. My proposal was GearBox
> for TurboGears. The end result of this project would have been a
> self-contained python+turbogears bundle. This is similar to Locomotive in
> the Ruby on Rails world.
> 
> At any rate, any comments would be appreciated.

From vpetro at gmail.com  Wed May 24 21:08:06 2006
From: vpetro at gmail.com (Petro Verkhogliad)
Date: Wed, 24 May 2006 15:08:06 -0400
Subject: [Soc2006] decision clarification
In-Reply-To: <20060524185520.GZ6289@xiph.org>
References: <2e9613570605241041p4cff6f7fsa39b6aab0c799003@mail.gmail.com>
	<20060524185520.GZ6289@xiph.org>
Message-ID: <2e9613570605241208p2891b320we707a57c763fcb75@mail.gmail.com>

On 5/24/06, Arc Riley <arc at xiph.org> wrote:
>
> Hi Petro
>
> Again, we had roughly 50 proposals that we wanted to accept out of the
> roughly 200 we received.  However, only 25 could be accepted.
>
> Just because your proposal wasn't accepted doesn't mean it wasn't
> understood or desireable.  We just couldn't accept every proposal we
> liked and had to make some really hard choice over the last 4 days.


That is what i was really trying  to get to.  I (like so many others) was
looking for some comments on the application or reasoning why some projects
were picked over others. Having said that, the fact that i was not accepted
does irk me a little, but it doesn't mean that i can't contribute to the
probject anyway.

I lost all three students I was looking to mentor in that process.  All
> three of their proposals were excellent.
>
> Sorry you didn't make the cut either.


Thank you. But such is the nature of the competition.

PV

On Wed, May 24, 2006 at 01:41:40PM -0400, Petro Verkhogliad wrote:
> > Hi,
> >
> > i submitted an application for a TurboGears project with was eventually
> not
> > accepted. While I understand the nature of the competition I would
> > appreciate some clarification as to the decision. My proposal was
> GearBox
> > for TurboGears. The end result of this project would have been a
> > self-contained python+turbogears bundle. This is similar to Locomotive
> in
> > the Ruby on Rails world.
> >
> > At any rate, any comments would be appreciated.
> _______________________________________________
> Soc2006 mailing list
> Soc2006 at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/soc2006
>
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From mattjfleming at googlemail.com  Thu May 25 13:08:18 2006
From: mattjfleming at googlemail.com (Matt Fleming)
Date: Thu, 25 May 2006 12:08:18 +0100
Subject: [Soc2006] Sandbox repository write access
Message-ID: <5ff4a1e50605250408g20030689w4159962da4b107aa@mail.gmail.com>

I'm not quite sure where to send this or who to contact.

Would it be possible to get write access to a repository perhaps in the
sandbox of Python's SVN repository for my work on the Python debugger (Pdb)?
This is just a long-shot, as it would be easier for me (and I assume for
other's) if my code was publicly viewable on python.org. If not, I'm sure I
can find some other method of source control.

Thanks, Matt

---
http://mattssanctuary.blogspot.com
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From mark.m.mcmahon at gmail.com  Thu May 25 13:22:02 2006
From: mark.m.mcmahon at gmail.com (Mark Mc Mahon)
Date: Thu, 25 May 2006 07:22:02 -0400
Subject: [Soc2006] Sandbox repository write access
In-Reply-To: <5ff4a1e50605250408g20030689w4159962da4b107aa@mail.gmail.com>
References: <5ff4a1e50605250408g20030689w4159962da4b107aa@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <71b6302c0605250422m2242fcacvebca1347e5b351b8@mail.gmail.com>

Hi Matt,

On 5/25/06, Matt Fleming <mattjfleming at googlemail.com> wrote:
> I'm not quite sure where to send this or who to contact.
>
> Would it be possible to get write access to a repository perhaps in the
> sandbox of Python's SVN repository for my work on the Python debugger (Pdb)?
> This is just a long-shot, as it would be easier for me (and I assume for
> other's) if my code was publicly viewable on python.org. If not, I'm sure I
> can find some other method of source control.
>

You could go with SourceForge or WebFaction (used to be
www.python-hosting.com) - http://www.webfaction.com/freetrac.

> Thanks, Matt
>

Mark

From amk at amk.ca  Thu May 25 13:46:58 2006
From: amk at amk.ca (A.M. Kuchling)
Date: Thu, 25 May 2006 07:46:58 -0400
Subject: [Soc2006] Sandbox repository write access
In-Reply-To: <5ff4a1e50605250408g200306