[Web-SIG] Removal of Cookie in Python 3.0 OK?
jim at zope.com
Mon Feb 4 22:15:44 CET 2008
On Feb 4, 2008, at 3:50 PM, Bill Janssen wrote:
>> I think most web frameworks use setuptools at this point. I'd rather
>> get this as a distribution, rather than from the standard library.
>> fact, I'd prefer to see all web-development libraries distributed
>> separate from the language in Python 3.
> Jim, you want to have most things separate, if I've read your recent
> posts to the dev and 3k lists correctly. Lean and mean Python
> I'd agree with you if we had the infrastructure for it,
> something which would function at least as well as apt-get does,
> pulling dependencies and doing platform and version checks
This is working now with setuptools. Overall, I think it is working
> But I don't think Python is anywhere near that level
> of infrastructure, and it's a bit of a stretch just to maintain the
> infrastructure that currently exists.
The biggest problem I have with the current infrastructure is that it
is unnecessarily dynamic and unreliable. Many of us are maintaining
static mirrors that are working quite well. This is a pretty well
understood problem at this point.
> Given that, I think that moving
> functionality out of the standard library would damage Python, not
> improve it.
OK, we disagree. I also, unfortunately, don't have a lot of time to
contribute to Python 3, so I imagine that my opinion won't cary much
weight, but I feel obliged, as a good citizen, to express it.
> Given that, I'd rather see what's in the stdlib be
> updated to best-of-breed, instead of
> the-first-thing-we-thought-of-in-1995, as all too much of it is.
Breeds are constantly evolving. I don't think it's realistic for the
standard library to try to keep up. I also don't think it's a very
good idea for language maintainers to make judgements about what's
best in various application areas.
I have the impression that there's this fairly large effort for people
to redo lots of the standard library for Python 3, without necessarily
knowing a lot about the libraries' histories, and motivation. I;m
skeptical that this is going to lead to a high-quality product.
I'd much rather see language developers put some focus on making a low-
level feature like a packaging system work as well as possible.
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