On 01/25/2015 02:52 PM, Chris Jerdonek wrote:

Just to clarify, PyPA doesn't have a Twitter account yet, right? --Chris

They do: https://twitter.com/thepypa *Randy Syring* Husband | Father | Redeemed Sinner /"For what does it profit a man to gain the whole world and forfeit his soul?" (Mark 8:36 ESV)/

Actually, they do: https://twitter.com/ThePyPA But I don't know if they are in the habit of thinking to use it every time something worthy happens. On Sun, Jan 25, 2015 at 11:52 AM, Chris Jerdonek wrote:

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I'd like to pick up a conversation that was happening on another thread:

I've only been on this list for about a year. This PEP (and others like it) has been in motion for quite a while. I think the blog would miss far more people than the mailing list would and I'm not sure I agree with "how quickly things change". There doesn't seem to be much content for the blog and it seems like something that would just become neglected. What topics do you really think would be better suited for a blog post than a message to here and related announcement lists?

The blog posts could automatically get copied over to Twitter and mailing lists using e.g. IFTTT, and it would be possible to subscribe using RSS/Atom feeds.

The advantage of a blog is having news entries persist and be easy to find, while at the same time simplifying the whole publishing process.

Anyway, just a suggestion.

pypa.io also says:

They host projects on github and bitbucket, and discuss issues on the pypa-dev and distutils-sig mailing lists.

I think the issue with the current mailing lists is one of signal-to-noise ratio. Let me give you a little background:

I maintain a small number of pypi published packages. I'm very interested in using best practices and keeping up with the more significant changes in the Python packaging ecosystem. I joined the distutils-sig list to stay informed.

However, the more detailed discussions that happen on the distutils-sig

On Sun, Jan 25, 2015 at 11:45 AM, Randy Syring wrote: list

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are not of much value to me. I know they are important and I very much appreciate those who are pushing things forward, it's just too much detail for my context.

So, I'm on the distituls-sig list, but there is a lot of "noise" for me and not much "signal." I would rather be a part of some channel for receiving announcements that relate to the broader community of those who maintain & release packages and need to stay abreast of python packing ecosystem & best practice changes.

Therefore, I'd like to propose something like a packaging-announce mailing list. This could be linked to the PyPA Twitter account.

Just to clarify, PyPA doesn't have a Twitter account yet, right?

--Chris _______________________________________________ Distutils-SIG maillist - Distutils-SIG@python.org https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/distutils-sig

On 01/26/2015 01:27 PM, Jannis Leidel wrote:

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On 25 Jan 2015, at 21:03, Marc Abramowitz wrote:

Actually, they do:

https://twitter.com/ThePyPA

But I don't know if they are in the habit of thinking to use it every time something worthy happens. Currently this is a one man operation that could probably be hooked up with a RSS feed to be honest. So not something that you should rely on for anything important.

But I'm +1 on pypa-announce, so I just created it over here: https://groups.google.com/forum/#!forum/pypa-announce

Jannis

I think it's important that the twitter account be used for to promote announcements on pypa-announce. Twitter can be shared/retweeted much easier and you are going to see a better spreading of messages that way. That was why I suggested we figure out a way to link the list to the twitter account automatically. Who "owns" the twitter account? Are they ok with having pypa announcements show up there? *Randy Syring* Husband | Father | Redeemed Sinner /"For what does it profit a man to gain the whole world and forfeit his soul?" (Mark 8:36 ESV)/

On 01/26/2015 02:12 PM, Jannis Leidel wrote:

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On 26 Jan 2015, at 20:08, Randy Syring wrote:

On 01/26/2015 01:27 PM, Jannis Leidel wrote:

...

...

On 25 Jan 2015, at 21:03, Marc Abramowitz wrote:

Actually, they do:

https://twitter.com/ThePyPA

But I don't know if they are in the habit of thinking to use it every time something worthy happens.

Currently this is a one man operation that could probably be hooked up with a RSS feed to be honest. So not something that you should rely on for anything important.

But I'm +1 on pypa-announce, so I just created it over here: https://groups.google.com/forum/#!forum/pypa-announce

Jannis

I think it's important that the twitter account be used for to promote announcements on pypa-announce. Twitter can be shared/retweeted much easier and you are going to see a better spreading of messages that way. That was why I suggested we figure out a way to link the list to the twitter account automatically.

Who "owns" the twitter account? Are they ok with having pypa announcements show up there? I do, and yeah, I'm okay for it to show up there. I'll set up a feed2twitter thing. I asked around a few months ago when I registered it if others in the PyPA team want access to it for the occasional manual announcement, but I agree that having a mailing list may be less controversial for the receiving parties. I didn't get many positive responses from the others anyway :)

Jannis

It seems this discussion might now be more appropriate on the pypa-dev list. I'll pick it up with you there. *Randy Syring* Husband | Father | Redeemed Sinner /"For what does it profit a man to gain the whole world and forfeit his soul?" (Mark 8:36 ESV)/

On Mon Jan 26 2015 at 1:29:50 PM Jannis Leidel wrote:

...

On 25 Jan 2015, at 21:03, Marc Abramowitz wrote:

Actually, they do:

https://twitter.com/ThePyPA

But I don't know if they are in the habit of thinking to use it every time something worthy happens.

Currently this is a one man operation that could probably be hooked up with a RSS feed to be honest. So not something that you should rely on for anything important.

But I'm +1 on pypa-announce, so I just created it over here: https://groups.google.com/forum/#!forum/pypa-announce

So is that it then and this is where it's going to live and I just go and subscribe, or is more of a discussion gong to happen on pypa-dev and there will be some announcement email over here when this is official? -Brett

Jannis

...

...

I'd like to pick up a conversation that was happening on another

On Sun, Jan 25, 2015 at 11:52 AM, Chris Jerdonek < chris.jerdonek@gmail.com> wrote: On Sun, Jan 25, 2015 at 11:45 AM, Randy Syring wrote: thread:

...

I've only been on this list for about a year. This PEP (and others like it) has been in motion for quite a while. I think the blog would miss far more people than the mailing list would and I'm not sure I agree with "how quickly things change". There doesn't seem to be much content for the blog and it seems like something that would just become neglected. What topics do you really think would be better suited for a blog post than a message to here and related announcement lists?

The blog posts could automatically get copied over to Twitter and mailing lists using e.g. IFTTT, and it would be possible to subscribe using RSS/Atom feeds.

The advantage of a blog is having news entries persist and be easy to find, while at the same time simplifying the whole publishing process.

Anyway, just a suggestion.

pypa.io also says:

They host projects on github and bitbucket, and discuss issues on the pypa-dev and distutils-sig mailing lists.

I think the issue with the current mailing lists is one of

...

ratio. Let me give you a little background:

I maintain a small number of pypi published packages. I'm very interested in using best practices and keeping up with the more significant changes in the Python packaging ecosystem. I joined the distutils-sig list to stay informed.

However, the more detailed discussions that happen on the distutils-sig list are not of much value to me. I know they are important and I very much appreciate those who are pushing things forward, it's just too much detail for my context.

So, I'm on the distituls-sig list, but there is a lot of "noise" for me and not much "signal." I would rather be a part of some channel for receiving announcements that relate to the broader community of those who

signal-to-noise maintain &

...

release packages and need to stay abreast of python packing ecosystem & best practice changes.

Therefore, I'd like to propose something like a packaging-announce mailing list. This could be linked to the PyPA Twitter account.

Just to clarify, PyPA doesn't have a Twitter account yet, right?

--Chris _______________________________________________ Distutils-SIG maillist - Distutils-SIG@python.org https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/distutils-sig

_______________________________________________ Distutils-SIG maillist - Distutils-SIG@python.org https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/distutils-sig

_______________________________________________ Distutils-SIG maillist - Distutils-SIG@python.org https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/distutils-sig

On 26 January 2015 at 06:33, Marc Abramowitz wrote:

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On Jan 25, 2015, at 11:45 AM, Randy Syring wrote:

Therefore, I'd like to propose something like a packaging-announce mailing list. This could be linked to the PyPA Twitter account. Then, announcements that pertain to the broader Python community would be cross posted to the distutils-sig and packaging-announce (and therefore twitter).

+1 to this.

I think the key observation here is that there are two audiences when it comes to packaging:

1. A large audience of folks who are package authors and maintainers, who want to know about the latest developments and best practices.

2. The smaller audience of folks who know packaging well and are working hard to improve it and having discussions among themselves on how to best move things forward.

I don't know of an information channel that serves #1 well. The ones I know of try to handle both. I think having different channels for each group will improve the experience for both groups.

I also had a look at the current contents of the python-announce list, and I suspect even that would be a bit high volume if we had significant PyPI and core packaging toolchain announcements intermingled with the other existing announcements related to conferences and various popular Python packages. So a packaging toolchain specific changelog/announcement channel likely makes sense. Regards, Nick. -- Nick Coghlan | ncoghlan@gmail.com | Brisbane, Australia

+1 to a pypa-announce list. I personally care more about the list than twitter. at this point, probably need to post the idea to pypa-dev, and get a few +1's there, and get someone to agree to execute on the idea. there's a few people there that don't monitor distutils-sig Marcus On Sun, Jan 25, 2015 at 12:33 PM, Marc Abramowitz wrote:

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On Jan 25, 2015, at 11:45 AM, Randy Syring wrote:

Therefore, I'd like to propose something like a packaging-announce mailing list. This could be linked to the PyPA Twitter account. Then, announcements that pertain to the broader Python community would be cross posted to the distutils-sig and packaging-announce (and therefore twitter).

+1 to this.

I think the key observation here is that there are two audiences when it comes to packaging:

1. A large audience of folks who are package authors and maintainers, who want to know about the latest developments and best practices.

2. The smaller audience of folks who know packaging well and are working hard to improve it and having discussions among themselves on how to best move things forward.

I don't know of an information channel that serves #1 well. The ones I know of try to handle both. I think having different channels for each group will improve the experience for both groups.

Randy, I'm willing to help if you want.

Marc _______________________________________________ Distutils-SIG maillist - Distutils-SIG@python.org https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/distutils-sig