Donald's PEP 453 for explicit pip bootstrapping (by inclusion of a "getpip" module in the standard library, automatically executed during installation by the CPython binary installers) is now available on python.org. Accordingly, I am now formally rejecting the implicit bootstrapping proposal that Richard put together for PEP 439. The explicit bootstrapping proposal in PEP 453 should provide a more reliable experience, both on initial installation and when upgrading both pip and CPython. Discussions on PEP 453 will likely be split - here on distutils-sig to ensure the proposal is acceptable to the pip developers, and on python-dev to ensure it is acceptable to the CPython team. As a proposal with a direct impact on CPython, final pronouncement on PEP 453 will take place on python-dev rather than here. Cheers, Nick. -- Nick Coghlan | ncoghlan@gmail.com | Brisbane, Australia