New submission from Fred L. Drake, Jr. <fdrake@acm.org>: Some portions of the documentation are using the term "member" to mean "data attribute". This appears to be an aberration at this time, but occurrences should be identified and corrected, and "Documenting Python" updated to note correct usage. Example use: http://docs.python.org/dev/py3k/library/xmlrpc.client.html#fault-objects http://docs.python.org/dev/py3k/library/urllib.request.html#basehandler-obje... (paragraph starting "The following members and methods should") "Members and methods" should just be "attributes". ---------- assignee: docs@python components: Documentation messages: 121110 nosy: docs@python, fdrake priority: normal severity: normal status: open title: Use "member" consistently _______________________________________ Python tracker <report@bugs.python.org> <http://bugs.python.org/issue10403> _______________________________________
Changes by Fred L. Drake, Jr. <fdrake@acm.org>: ---------- keywords: +easy _______________________________________ Python tracker <report@bugs.python.org> <http://bugs.python.org/issue10403> _______________________________________
Raymond Hettinger <rhettinger@users.sourceforge.net> added the comment:
"Members and methods" should just be "attributes".
+1 That substitution should be made almost everywhere. Individual slot variable are still called members though and their type is a member_descriptor. And the C API still has a tp_members entry. Otherwise, it looks like the term member is out-of-date. ---------- nosy: +rhettinger _______________________________________ Python tracker <report@bugs.python.org> <http://bugs.python.org/issue10403> _______________________________________
Senthil Kumaran <orsenthil@gmail.com> added the comment: It is 'attributes' instead of term 'members'. The term 'method' when it denotes methods can be left as such. ---------- assignee: docs@python -> orsenthil nosy: +orsenthil _______________________________________ Python tracker <report@bugs.python.org> <http://bugs.python.org/issue10403> _______________________________________
Changes by Senthil Kumaran <orsenthil@gmail.com>: ---------- stage: -> needs patch type: -> behavior versions: +Python 2.7, Python 3.1, Python 3.2 _______________________________________ Python tracker <report@bugs.python.org> <http://bugs.python.org/issue10403> _______________________________________
Changes by Adam Woodbeck <adam.woodbeck@gmail.com>: ---------- nosy: +adam.woodbeck _______________________________________ Python tracker <report@bugs.python.org> <http://bugs.python.org/issue10403> _______________________________________
Adam Woodbeck <adam.woodbeck@gmail.com> added the comment: I grepped the documentation in the cpython repository and replaced all mentions of "member(s)" with "attribute(s)" where I felt appropriate. I left mentions of "members" related to structs or any C documentation alone as I'm less confident of their terminology (I'm new around here). I used "methods and attribute" in io.rst because BufferedIOBase included one attribute and several methods. My terminology may be off, but I felt this was the correct replacement of "members." Please review the patch and critique it as necessary. ---------- keywords: +patch Added file: http://bugs.python.org/file22422/issue10403.patch _______________________________________ Python tracker <report@bugs.python.org> <http://bugs.python.org/issue10403> _______________________________________
Éric Araujo <merwok@netwok.org> added the comment:
I used "methods and attribute" in io.rst because BufferedIOBase included one attribute and several methods. My terminology may be off, but I felt this was the correct replacement of "members."
Nearly :) See in the first message:
"Members and methods" should just be "attributes".
---------- nosy: +eric.araujo _______________________________________ Python tracker <report@bugs.python.org> <http://bugs.python.org/issue10403> _______________________________________
Adam Woodbeck <adam.woodbeck@gmail.com> added the comment: I was always under the impression attributes and methods were mutually exclusive. I've corrected the patch as requested. ---------- Added file: http://bugs.python.org/file22436/issue10403_v2.patch _______________________________________ Python tracker <report@bugs.python.org> <http://bugs.python.org/issue10403> _______________________________________
Changes by Adam Woodbeck <adam.woodbeck@gmail.com>: Added file: http://bugs.python.org/file22438/issue10403_v3.patch _______________________________________ Python tracker <report@bugs.python.org> <http://bugs.python.org/issue10403> _______________________________________
Éric Araujo <merwok@netwok.org> added the comment: Alexander, could you comment on the review page about datetime.rst changes? ---------- nosy: +belopolsky _______________________________________ Python tracker <report@bugs.python.org> <http://bugs.python.org/issue10403> _______________________________________
Antoine Pitrou <pitrou@free.fr> added the comment: So I'm -1 on using "attributes" to denote methods. It will actively confuse non-expert users. If you want to ditch "members", please consider using the more explicit phrase "attributes and methods". ---------- nosy: +pitrou _______________________________________ Python tracker <report@bugs.python.org> <http://bugs.python.org/issue10403> _______________________________________
Senthil Kumaran <senthil@uthcode.com> added the comment: Yes, I agree with you. Good Suggestion. Thanks! ---------- _______________________________________ Python tracker <report@bugs.python.org> <http://bugs.python.org/issue10403> _______________________________________
Éric Araujo <merwok@netwok.org> added the comment: I’m not -1 on using “attributes” to denote methods, since they *are* and it’s not difficult to understand, and I’m not opposed either to using “attributes” to replace “members” (i.e. attributes that are not methods.) For those wanting to see the raging debate: http://mail.python.org/pipermail/python-dev/2011-June/112020.html :) ---------- _______________________________________ Python tracker <report@bugs.python.org> <http://bugs.python.org/issue10403> _______________________________________
Roundup Robot <devnull@devnull> added the comment: New changeset d442c313536b by Senthil Kumaran in branch '3.2': issue10403 - Let's not use members anymore. Use 'attribute' where it denotes attribute and 'methods' where it denotes methods. Context should clarify usage. http://hg.python.org/cpython/rev/d442c313536b ---------- nosy: +python-dev _______________________________________ Python tracker <report@bugs.python.org> <http://bugs.python.org/issue10403> _______________________________________
Roundup Robot <devnull@devnull> added the comment: New changeset d442c313536b by Senthil Kumaran in branch '3.2': issue10403 - Let's not use members anymore. Use 'attribute' where it denotes attribute and 'methods' where it denotes methods. Context should clarify usage. http://hg.python.org/cpython/rev/d442c313536b ---------- _______________________________________ Python tracker <report@bugs.python.org> <http://bugs.python.org/issue10403> _______________________________________
Roundup Robot <devnull@devnull> added the comment: New changeset b8f5da066782 by Senthil Kumaran in branch '2.7': Fix closes issue10403 - Let's not use members anymore. http://hg.python.org/cpython/rev/b8f5da066782 ---------- resolution: -> fixed stage: needs patch -> committed/rejected status: open -> closed _______________________________________ Python tracker <report@bugs.python.org> <http://bugs.python.org/issue10403> _______________________________________
Éric Araujo <merwok@netwok.org> added the comment: Senthil, I’m not sure you read Alexander’s reply on Rietveld before committing. ---------- _______________________________________ Python tracker <report@bugs.python.org> <http://bugs.python.org/issue10403> _______________________________________
Changes by Eric Snow <ericsnowcurrently@gmail.com>: ---------- nosy: +ericsnow _______________________________________ Python tracker <report@bugs.python.org> <http://bugs.python.org/issue10403> _______________________________________
Changes by Éric Araujo <merwok@netwok.org>: ---------- status: closed -> open _______________________________________ Python tracker <report@bugs.python.org> <http://bugs.python.org/issue10403> _______________________________________
Changes by Ezio Melotti <ezio.melotti@gmail.com>: ---------- nosy: +ezio.melotti _______________________________________ Python tracker <report@bugs.python.org> <http://bugs.python.org/issue10403> _______________________________________
Senthil Kumaran <senthil@uthcode.com> added the comment: Hello Eric, I missed noticing Alexander's comments in the reitveld, I looked only at tracker then. I see that some of them can be addressed. Like using members (components) of the field, instead of attributes when it is not an attribute. Shall correct it. Thanks. ---------- _______________________________________ Python tracker <report@bugs.python.org> <http://bugs.python.org/issue10403> _______________________________________
Roundup Robot <devnull@psf.upfronthosting.co.za> added the comment: New changeset 05f0ffe4e0b3 by Senthil Kumaran in branch '3.2': Fix Issue10403 - datetime documentation clarification based on review in the reitveld by Alexendar belopolsky. http://hg.python.org/cpython/rev/05f0ffe4e0b3 ---------- _______________________________________ Python tracker <report@bugs.python.org> <http://bugs.python.org/issue10403> _______________________________________
Roundup Robot <devnull@psf.upfronthosting.co.za> added the comment: New changeset 3935a1fb1db2 by Senthil Kumaran in branch '2.7': merge from 3.2 - Issue10403 - datetime module documentation changes based on review. http://hg.python.org/cpython/rev/3935a1fb1db2 ---------- _______________________________________ Python tracker <report@bugs.python.org> <http://bugs.python.org/issue10403> _______________________________________
Changes by Senthil Kumaran <senthil@uthcode.com>: ---------- status: open -> closed _______________________________________ Python tracker <report@bugs.python.org> <http://bugs.python.org/issue10403> _______________________________________
participants (9)
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Adam Woodbeck -
Antoine Pitrou
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Eric Snow
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Ezio Melotti
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Fred L. Drake, Jr.
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Raymond Hettinger
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Roundup Robot
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Senthil Kumaran
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Éric Araujo