I have a great deal of sympathy and empathy for you Andy. I teach in a large selective (read magnet) school in NSW, Australia and I FIND EXACTLY THE SAME TRAITS. Note: I have also taught some really TRULLY gifted kids at my current school - and I am constantly bedazzled at their capacity to learn, digest and DO the most amazing things. I have been really lucky with some kids where I know just enough to keep pointing them in directions which they (a). enjoy and (b). are beneficial for them and (c) continue to develop their interests. I could ramble on ... going round & round on this topic for ages. Suffice to say i have turned to Gamemaker since last year (term 4) to capitalise on the motivation of being able to make REAL games - using that as a lever to introduce higher order concepts because it is REQUIRED in order to achieve a certain outcome. I hope to be able to make a move back to Python +PyGame in future years - have to see, at present it seems our interests will be fulfilled using Gamemaker. ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------- regards Darren Payne Hurlstone Agricultural High School Ph: 9829 9222 Fax: 98292026 Send instant messages to your online friends http://au.messenger.yahoo.com