Bruce -
I'm not sure I understand the distutils issues you're raising. Are you saying that I should be using distutils, or are you saying that you understand why I can't use this mechanism, but wish it were possible?
I am agreeing that in fact you have little choice but to go beyond disutils to accomplish the reasonable things you want to accomplish (and some of the unreasonable things, as well ;). I am expressing frustration on that point, because the things that disutils *can't* do for you seem relatively minor, but - I agree with you - are important for adequately addressing the reasonable needs of your user base. And expressing some impotence in the face of the situation - because I am not adequately configured to do much more than point to the issue. Not solve it. That can be taken as unreasonable and unnecessary assault on the people who are making concrete contributions, in code, to building a distribution system for python modules and applications. Or, as I intend it, my own best effort to contribute to the effort by bringing to the fore some use case issues. As to my other rant - the default start-up mode for IDLE. What can I say. Perhaps I shouldn't be nasty. But you seem hard to get through to. You are effecting all users for all purposes by imposing your preference on IDLE on anyone who happens to download VPython for any reason. It amazes me that you don't seem to see that it is your responsibility to instruct your users on how to change the default on their machines to the preferences you prefer. Not impose your preferences over that of the Developer of IDLE, and for all people who download software -which you didn't write, own or control (visual or IDLE) - from your site. Sorry. Seems to me you should. Art