Re: [Edu-sig] Computer science without all that "heavy math" stuff...?

What he is really lamenting is the lack of a computer engineering discipline. I disagree that this is what the author is stating.
Sorry, I dodn't mean thats what he was statiing I meant that was the underlying lack at which he was intimating. In other words he is asking CS to teach something that is inappropriate for a science. It would however be appropriate for an engineering degree.
I know people who majored in Chemical Engineering and they had to take differential equations, ...
Absolutely, and that's still approprioate for an IT/Computer engineering degree. I strongly believe that. I don't think the author undestood the inevitably mathematical nature of computer engineering (or of any form of engineering for that matter!) but leaving the math issue aside I do think he is write to highlight the fairly narrow view of computing that seems to be taken by CS courses - namely programming!
He asserts that because 95% of "IT jobs" don't require them that they should not be required of a CS major.
Yes, and that I don't agree with. I think he, like many lay people, doesn't appreciate what any scientific or engineering degree is about in that respect.
If you want to learn how to do a job in the IT field, you should go to a technical school.
Sorry, that doesn't make sense. Most programmers come from a CS degree background(at least herabouts they do) and programming is part of the IT field. The problem is that IT has moved on from a cottage industry where everyone knew everything to a huge field with many specialisms. The difficulty is that the diversity is not mirrored in CS courses which are still largely focussed on software development as if that was all computing was about.
java weenies and NT administrators
I do find this a tad offensive to the many people involved in the IT industry who are not programmers. Computing operations is a big and complex business which requires a broad and deep knowledge of computers, networks and how they operate and interact - something of which most graduate programmers are woefully ignorant and it shows up in the non-scaleable, unmaintainable code that they produce!
whined about how they didn't have a class in <insert popular language>, or they had to take "useless" classes in <insert theory>.
That happens on any course but the concern that I have here is that many CS courses are caving in to that by focussing purely on the commercial demands without providing the theory. We need both!
I think the problem is not the universities themselves, but rather the light with which universities and technical colleges are viewed.
I think thers a bit of that, but I also believe that the CS departments are too slow to broaden the range of computing subjects they teach. Alan G

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 "Alan Gauld" <agauld@crosswinds.net> writes:
The difficulty is that the diversity is not mirrored in CS courses which are still largely focussed on software development as if that was all computing was about.
I don't think I've seen this. The specializations offered at Georgia Tech include networking, computational math, operating systems (design), compiler design, database systems, and human-computer interaction. Now all of these also teach programming and basic programming tenets (including objects, concurrent programming, etc), but their higher level classes focus on things outside the area of software development.
java weenies and NT administrators
I do find this a tad offensive to the many people involved in the IT industry who are not programmers.
Yes, I apologize for that. I named these as examples (bad ones) of jobs for which most companies don't care if you have a background in math or theory and not to insinuate that non-programmers (myself included) were somehow inferior to programmers. I was intending to say that if you wanted to go into a computing job that does not require knowledge of math or underlying theory, perhaps you would be better off without a university that stresses the underlying theories of everything. Perhaps I could have paid attention more in my university writing classes. :-)
whined about how they didn't have a class in <insert popular language>, or they had to take "useless" classes in <insert theory>.
That happens on any course but the concern that I have here is that many CS courses are caving in to that by focussing purely on the commercial demands without providing the theory. We need both!
Agreed, and my beef with the author is that I think he was essentially proposing that universities do exactly that.
I think thers a bit of that, but I also believe that the CS departments are too slow to broaden the range of computing subjects they teach.
I have never thought about this before, but it certainly is a valid point. I only have experience with one university, and I thought that their curriculum was fairly well diversified, but even it did focus on programming and so I can definitely see how this could cause a problem. (though the author did a bad job describing this, if he even did describe the same problem). - -- Christopher A. Craig <com-nospam@ccraig.org> "Going to school make a person educated, any more than going to a garage makes a person a car" Slashdot -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.0.6 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Processed by Mailcrypt iEYEARECAAYFAjtYYS8ACgkQjVztv3T8pzsM9ACfQNDbDHlrn/c+XdxWpzZGPmEw SzMAoJlHNkGSs1vznb9YSEd5nGTo/ZZe =dDuX -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----
participants (2)
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Alan Gauld
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com-nospam@ccraig.org