In a message of Mon, 24 Nov 2014 11:48:45 -0400, Andre Roberge writes:
On Mon, Nov 24, 2014 at 11:41 AM, Christian Mascher < christian.mascher@gmx.de> wrote:
Hi,
I went there in a recent chrome on a laptop with a fairly small screen and
there are some rendering issues that make some of the controls unusable.
I noticed the same with Nexus 7 (android) and firefox. On the desktop Ctrl + - usually makes things smaller and thus fit onto the screen (esp. editor right next to the world, so the controls below the world are visible), but on the android tablet that didn't help.
These tablets are just to small for all the information and even firefox is different compared to its desktop version.
From the beginning, my thinking was that anyone interested in doing some programming was going to use either a deskop or laptop with proper keyboard, etc., and thus a reasonably sized screen.
Should I review this basic hypothesis? If so, does anyone have an idea as to what minimum screen size I should be aiming to support? I'm not ever planning to target tiny screens for smartphones and the like ... but if only relatively small adjustements are needed to support "typical" tablets, I could look into it.
André
Children all over Sweden are getting ipads, ruggardized from the school districts. They are 240 x 170 mm, and apple has done a very good job of convincing education officials that this is where the 'computer literacy' money should be spent. Some schools are bucking the trend and using Android tablets instead. They are typically '10 inch' screen but some '7 inch screens' as well are being used. The android market is fragmented, so what a 10-inch screen really is, width and height-wise varies, as long as 10 inches is on the diagonal, that is what they will call it. And the current trend in cellphones is to grow them like crazy, so the flagship models of a great many popular brands now support 6.5 inch screens. (Indeed, it is a bit of a chore to find a very fast phone with a smaller screen. Since I already own a 7-inch android tablet, I would like things much better if my phone could just stay a phone, and go back to the battery length times we had before we had smartphones ....) But I disgress. At any rate, for use around here ipad support would be required, and if you got things to work with a 7-inch screen a whole lot of other people would be happy. But that's just here ... Laura
On Mon, Nov 24, 2014 at 2:56 PM, Laura Creighton <lac@openend.se> wrote:
On Mon, Nov 24, 2014 at 11:41 AM, Christian Mascher < christian.mascher@gmx.de> wrote:
Hi,
I went there in a recent chrome on a laptop with a fairly small screen and
there are some rendering issues that make some of the controls unusable.
I noticed the same with Nexus 7 (android) and firefox. On the desktop Ctrl + - usually makes things smaller and thus fit onto the screen (esp. editor right next to the world, so the controls below the world are visible), but on the android tablet that didn't help.
These tablets are just to small for all the information and even firefox is different compared to its desktop version.
From the beginning, my thinking was that anyone interested in doing some programming was going to use either a deskop or laptop with proper keyboard, etc., and thus a reasonably sized screen.
Should I review this basic hypothesis? If so, does anyone have an idea as to what minimum screen size I should be aiming to support? I'm not ever planning to target tiny screens for smartphones and the like ... but if only relatively small adjustements are needed to support "typical"
In a message of Mon, 24 Nov 2014 11:48:45 -0400, Andre Roberge writes: tablets,
I could look into it.
André
Children all over Sweden are getting ipads, ruggardized from the school districts. They are 240 x 170 mm, and apple has done a very good job of convincing education officials that this is where the 'computer literacy' money should be spent. Some schools are bucking the trend and using Android tablets instead. They are typically '10 inch' screen but some '7 inch screens' as well are being used. The android market is fragmented, so what a 10-inch screen really is, width and height-wise varies, as long as 10 inches is on the diagonal, that is what they will call it.
And the current trend in cellphones is to grow them like crazy, so the flagship models of a great many popular brands now support 6.5 inch screens. (Indeed, it is a bit of a chore to find a very fast phone with a smaller screen. Since I already own a 7-inch android tablet, I would like things much better if my phone could just stay a phone, and go back to the battery length times we had before we had smartphones ....) But I disgress.
At any rate, for use around here ipad support would be required, and if you got things to work with a 7-inch screen a whole lot of other people would be happy.
But that's just here ...
Laura
Thanks for the feedback Laura. I guess I should have been a bit more explicit: what matters really is the screen resolution in order to determine how much space I have ... but, unless there is an explicit request, I probably will not tinker (much) with the design. (I just removed a bit of extra vertical space but more could be done - except that, with different browsers rendering css differently, it's a bit pointless for me to try to squeeze things more tightly together on the hope that it would work for some target device which I can't test.) André
Hi Laura,
Children all over Sweden are getting ipads, ruggardized from the school districts. They are 240 x 170 mm, and apple has done a very good job of convincing education officials that this is where the 'computer literacy' money should be spent.
I think the public attitude to computers and education (all over the world) is crazy. You don't _need_ computers for education. Computers are extremely overrated concerning school education in my personal view. It is useful to have some "computer literacy", but compared with literacy itself: many orders of magnitude difference in usefulness, so actually the word 'computer literacy' is an exaggeration in itself. In Germany they just published a study, showing that we are "far behind" Canada and many other OECD-states regarding computer-use in schools. No journalist even questioned the general assumption that this is necessarily a bad thing the public should get hysterical about. I also haven't heard about German engineers being lo-tech because they weren't allowed to look up everything in wikipedia when they went to school. But the marketing of the Big Money Firms in IT-industry will pay off some time. Hey, lets burn lots of money for more computers in school - sounds GREAT. Crazy... Christian
<< SNIP >> But the marketing of the Big Money Firms in IT-industry will pay off some
time. Hey, lets burn lots of money for more computers in school - sounds GREAT.
Crazy...
Christian
I think many students would be better served if the emphasis were on creating for them a safe personal workspace, with plenty of bandwidth to the outside world, with opportunities for 2-way interactions (so not just receiving broadcast television, as in the "mindless consumer couch potato" model of the late 1900s). In a comfortable middle class household, Johnny already has a heated bedroom with a desk, books, and computer, but has to leave this workspace to rub shoulders with peers in a daycare setting we call "school". Said school may censor Youtube and/or otherwise block access to information, so for many school-goers the experience of school is of burning an expensive fuel to frequent a less information-rich environment than their own comfortable bedrooms. However many children are doubled up with siblings, and have cold, cramped accommodations with little space for reflection, study, and private contemplation. Having the state funnel all the money to these daycare centers i.e. state-run "schools" (often similar to state-run prisons in their administrative structures and food) versus addressing these low living standards that inhibit scholarship, would seem a poor policy, one based on misguided priorities. In Alaska, where students may be too spread out to make "school" a practicality, the state reimburses home expenses for computer and musical instrument rental. Johnny in effect becomes an income-earner for the family in terms of making the household eligible for these services. Getting an education means directly investing in the quality of life at home. A teacher-mentor may visit once every week or two. I think we should tease apart "spending on connectivity devices" (such a mobile phones, tablets, laptops) from "building up an inventory of such devices in school buildings" (as in stockpiling schools with computer equipment). These are not the same thing, even if both approaches involve investing in connectivity and computation devices (a smartphone is also a scientific calculator, and a compass). Another use case: here in Portland, Free Geek tutors both minors and adults in how to disassemble and reassemble computers from donated hardware. Build five and the sixth is yours to keep (or maybe it's build four and the fifth is yours). Kids get a "Freek Box" to take home, with support classes in Ubuntu. "Schools" are not involved yet here we have an incubator for Portland's IT-minded subcultures of tomorrow (and today -- Free Geek has been around for a generation already). Also, again in Portland, although schools may have computers, chances are they don't teach mathematics and programming as a combined subject. We have another institution called Saturday Academy that pilots courses of that genre. Sure, in some of the better schools you'll find the math + programming mix, but it's still esoteric, even in 2014 with all the needed software free, and hardware quite inexpensive. So that's another reason to not throw a lot of money at putting computers in schools: the adults who staff them generally don't have enough skills to make good use of them. Better that Sally should stay home and watch instructional Youtubes about a math + programming approach to STEM. She just won't find that at her local day care center. Why waste Sally's time? Kirby
On Wed, Nov 26, 2014 at 11:17 AM, kirby urner <kirby.urner@gmail.com> wrote:
<< SNIP >>
But the marketing of the Big Money Firms in IT-industry will pay off some
time. Hey, lets burn lots of money for more computers in school - sounds GREAT.
Crazy...
Christian
I think many students would be better served if the emphasis were on creating for them a safe personal workspace, with plenty of bandwidth to the outside world, with opportunities for 2-way interactions (so not just receiving broadcast television, as in the "mindless consumer couch potato" model of the late 1900s).
This seemed an interesting thread so I continued it here: http://mathforum.org/kb/thread.jspa?threadID=2661482 (math-teach is another old haunt of mine) Kirby
participants (4)
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Andre Roberge
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Christian Mascher
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kirby urner
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Laura Creighton