Per blog, I've been huddling with M language, basis of MUMPS, given its huge installations and emerging dino language status. CS has a new challenge: whereas round one was about a scatter gun of languages "making it" into commercial use, round two is about recruiting critical numbers to a veritable dinotopia of exotic solutions that nevertheless work, and starting over would be more expensive than simply holding on to a good thing. What I think this means in practice is marketing CS to humanities majors as a way to gain an esoteric proficiency in some vintage museum quality hieroglyphics, sufficient to pay quite a few bills, if not all of them. That might be an avocation more than your core identity (you're a scuba diver for a living, not a J programmer -- but yes, you write J and it at least pays for your air). I'm afraid I'm pretty harsh in my criticisms of current CS (this is back office stuff, so I feel free to take the gloves off), for its dry-as-bones mono-lingual culture. We should be advertising the diversity of lifestyles available through this intro-level portal (CS0). As recruiters, we're hear to expand their horizons, not force 'em into cubicles (or visions thereof) before their time. On another front (closer to Plone), I'm busy trying to talk a client *out* of using a content management system (CMS) where plain old static web pages would do. The problem with pouring your content into a ZODB or some such, is your stuff has no legs, no autonomy, without this complicated wrapper. For some, that's the whole point. For others, they see a CMS as a crutch, something to save them from learning any XHTML/CSS. What they don't realize: (a) the learning curve is just as steep, at least up to the basic level in both areas (operating a CMS API as an end user is really no easier than mastering beginner-level DreamWeaver) and (b) you're hitching your star to the arc of a CMS, whereas straight HTML is pretty much guaranteed to run anywhere. In my client's case, the CMS is an open source PHP project, and looks to be capable and high caliber. As soon as you want to add eCommerce features, polling, forums, other bells and whistles, a CMS starts to look pretty good (I love Plone by the way, even if I'm not a master archetypes programmer). But if you're just wanting a "cyber business card" web site, as this client does, static HTML is likely a better solution. I recommend this party line to Zope sales by the way. Don't be afraid to turn people away on the basis of "you just need to learn some webmaster basics or hire a smart HTML jockey for your needs" i.e. don't market a CMS as "the right solution for everybody" any more than "computer programming for everybody" means we all program the same way, or all have to use Python. Kirby