Mailman 3 October 2000 - Mailman-Developers

Re: [Mailman-Developers] Mailman password and administrative reminders
by Dan Mick 13 Aug '03

13 Aug '03

? This very message came to me with the following header: Errors-To: mailman-developers-admin(a)python.org All my bounces come to the list admin address, set in the admin webpage, in the second field of General Options. Do you have that set to something, and bounces still come to root? > 2. Bounces are sent to the poor postmaster instead of a -admin address. > I'm not entirely certain, but I think an Errors-To: header or something > like that in all Mailman messages might allow one to distribute that load > somewhat.

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[Mailman-Users] forwarded message from Guido van Rossum (fwd)
by Thomas Wouters 31 Oct '00

31 Oct '00

Anyone else notice something weird about the mail below ? It was sent by Guido to python-dev, where Barry picked it up from and sent it to both mailman-developers and mailman-users. I am only subscribed to mailman-developers, and I got it twice. What's more, the second mail seems to have gone to mailman-developers *through* mailman-users. Notice the extra list-sig at the obttom of the mail, and extra [listname] in the subject. Bug in Mailman ? ;-P ----- Forwarded message from "Barry A. Warsaw" <barry(a)wooz.org> ----- Date: Mon, 30 Oct 2000 11:24:57 -0500 (EST) From: barry(a)wooz.org (Barry A. Warsaw) Sender: mailman-developers-admin(a)python.org To: catholic.org(a)catholicnet.org.uk Cc: mailman-developers(a)python.org Cc: mailman-users(a)python.org Subject: [Mailman-Developers] [Mailman-Users] forwarded message from Guido van Rossum Date: Fri, 27 Oct 2000 20:42:42 -0500 From: Guido van Rossum <guido(a)python.org> Sender: python-dev-admin(a)python.org To: python-list(a)python.org (Python mailing list), python-announce-list(a)python.org, python-dev(a)python.org Subject: [Python-Dev] PythonLabs Team Moves to Digital Creations To all Python users and developers: [[ .. snip .. ]] _______________________________________________ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev(a)python.org http://www.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev ------------------------------------------------------ Mailman-Users maillist - Mailman-Users(a)python.org http://www.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users _______________________________________________ Mailman-Developers mailing list Mailman-Developers(a)python.org http://www.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-developers ----- End forwarded message ----- -- Thomas Wouters <thomas(a)xs4all.net> Hi! I'm a .signature virus! copy me into your .signature file to help me spread!

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Re: [Mailman-Developers] My admins speak out...
by Dan Mick 31 Oct '00

31 Oct '00

> if getattr(mlist, 'auto_reject', 0): > raise DiscardMessage Very nice; had no idea that one little exception is all it takes. Is there anything similarly-simple to generate a generic bounce message and discard, or is that all "call some reply method and then raise DiscardMessage"?

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My admins speak out...
by Chuq Von Rospach 31 Oct '00

31 Oct '00

Okay, my admins on www.lists.apple.com have had a chance ot dig out from the upgrade, and are starting to speak out... And they ALL want an option to auto-reject mail sent from unsubscribed users. Barry, can we squeeze something like this into 2.0? (he says, doubting it...) technically, it shouldn't be too tough, from a quick glance. -- Chuq Von Rospach - Plaidworks Consulting (mailto:chuqui@plaidworks.com) Apple Mail List Gnome (mailto:chuq@apple.com) Be just, and fear not.

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FYI -- problems with my new install...
by Chuq Von Rospach 31 Oct '00

31 Oct '00

This is more a cautionary tale then a real problem, but it brings up a couple of issues to chew on. I started having major problems with mailman when I brought lists.apple.com live (I'll have more to say about this site later, since there are a couple of things I need to look into more fully before I core-dump on that install...) The main problem was that I was getting huge numbers of messages to the -admin addresses that were blank. Zero. First, I thought it was a corrupted list database. then I thought it was a corrupted request database. Then I thought it was a corrupted message in the qfile dir that was causing corrupted messages to multiply. Then I didn't know what to think, so I just started taking the syste apart piece by piece and running qfile messages through ONE AT A TIME to see where the probelm came from. My favorite way ot spend a weekend, that's for sure... (grin) End result -- one minor configuration error in the mailer. One of the hostnames I use wasn't set up as a local name, so sendmail kept erroring out trying to talk to itself in one special case. But the bigger issue was -- the system was doing exactly what I told it to do. I use demime to strip incoming e-mail to the text part. this works really pretty well. At some point, however, instead of just attaching demime to the posting and -request address, I also added it to the admin address. Most incoming bounces now are in MIME format. End result: they come to the -admin address, the mime gets stripped, and an empty message results. Since it's no longer a bounce message, it gets sent to the admin. load in a fairly dirty subscriber list and start sending messages -- and you get 10K blank message in your mailbox in the morning. Cautionary note: after you double-check all your configuration files for problems, make syure you double-check all the custom stuff you did that you did it right. The "good" thing about this particular problem is that while I was busy mailbombing myself and my admins all weekend fighting this beast, to the end user, the site worked fine... If you HAVE to have problems, problems that arne't visible to the end user are preferable... But it brings up a couple of issues I see with qrunner. first, it seems like qrunner re-stats the qfiles dir and reloads its idea of what needs to be run. This creates a problem when you have lots of messages, since it's not processing things FIFO -- I found that some older messages were simply NEVER being run, because however qrunner was choosing messages out of qfiles, it wasn't choosing them. On a busy system, this can be a problem. I suggest instead that qrunner start up, grab the list of messages to run, and run them, oldest first, then exit. Let the next Qrunner handle what comes in in the meantime. That way, things are run more of a FIFO, and you don't get into the lost-stepchild queue file problem. second, qrunner isn't good at letting me know what it's doing. If I'm trying to figure out what it's processing, it's not telling me. When trying to debug a possible corrupted file, that's a real hassle. It'd be nice if it put something in qfiles that told me what fileset it was working on, just so I can whack at it if I need to. all in all, it's been a, um, fun weekend. But I now have demime doing what it's supposed to be doing, and it is working a LOT better. And it explains (in retrospeect) why, knowing the subscriber lists were dirty, I wasn't seeing very many bounces... (grumble. That should have been a hint. Hindsight is fun...) *now* it's stable... (I think) -- Chuq Von Rospach - Plaidworks Consulting (mailto:chuqui@plaidworks.com) Apple Mail List Gnome (mailto:chuq@apple.com) Be just, and fear not.

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Bug in Mailman Beta 6?
by Steffen Bardolatzi 31 Oct '00

31 Oct '00

We got the following error log: Oct 25 16:31:00 2000 (4885) Bouncer exception: body Oct 25 16:31:00 2000 (4885) Traceback (innermost last): File "/var/mailman/Mailman/Bouncers/BouncerAPI.py", line 65, in ScanMessages mlist.RegisterBounce(addr, msg) File "/var/mailman/Mailman/Bouncer.py", line 141, in RegisterBounce self.HandleBouncingAddress(addr, msg) File "/var/mailman/Mailman/Bouncer.py", line 236, in HandleBouncingAddress text = text + \ AttributeError: body ... in combination with: Oct 25 16:31:00 2000 (4885) unknownlist: - unknownuser(a)domain.ext exceeded limits Oct 25 16:31:00 2000 (4885) Alleasr: disabled unknownuser(a)domian.ext [hosts and e-mail address anonymized] Obviously, disabling of an adress due to more than the allowed number of bounces causes this error message. Does this bug is going to be fixed in mailman 2.0 final? Thanks in advance.

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Adding elements to config.db
by Joe Hewitt 30 Oct '00

30 Oct '00

I've been moving a number of our lists to mailman in recent days and the question about additional data to qualify subscribers has come up. Some listowners want to know who the subscriber is and what their role is. All are working the legal community and more sensitive about such matters than the normal human. So the question is: can I or should I add new elements like username or userrole to config.db? What are the ramifications? And can I define new variables in the needed programs of Mailman? I must confess that I'm still using Mailman 1.1. Could I address my problem with Mailman 2.x? Any insights are appreciated. Joe Hewitt joe(a)apollo.wuacc.edu

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glitch in new bumpdigests tool
by Chuq Von Rospach 30 Oct '00

30 Oct '00

Barry: lists.apple.com 249# ~chuq/bumpdigests Traceback (innermost last): File "/export/home/chuq/bumpdigests", line 35, in ? import paths ImportError: No module named paths -- Chuq Von Rospach - Plaidworks Consulting (mailto:chuqui@plaidworks.com) Apple Mail List Gnome (mailto:chuq@apple.com) Be just, and fear not.

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User feedback on www.lists.apple.com (round one)
by Chuq Von Rospach 30 Oct '00

30 Oct '00

it's monday, so users are starting to weigh in on the ugpraded server. For the most part, it's pretty positive. with one exception. they hate the text digest format. And in fact, one user pointed out (correctly, it seems) that it's not conformant with the digest RFC: <http://www.rfc-editor.org/rfc/rfc1153.txt> Looks like mailman as it's set up doesn't use a conformant separator, and doesn't order header lines properly to the RFC. Also, I've had a number of requests to bump the volume number. That one is pretty badly hidden (it seems to be in Mailman/MailList.py). That really needs to be made configurable through Defaults.PY, as should (IMHO) the separator (which is hidden in Handers/ToDigest.py as MIME_NONSEPARATOR. it'd be Really Nice, also, if there were some programmatic way to bump the volume, so it could be stuffed into cron and run at 0:00 1/1/*. And, to be honest, volume numbers need to (eventually) be per-list... These are primarily cosmetic issues, but I really think most of them need to be looked at before 2.0 ships. Per-list volumes is beyond the scope of this release, but the rest need to be looked at, especally since the Mailman digest format breaks everyone's digest-auto-processors (and yes, MIME digests are the real answer, but not everyone is ready for them yet, and there's no reason to arbitrarily break things...0 -- Chuq Von Rospach - Plaidworks Consulting (mailto:chuqui@plaidworks.com) Apple Mail List Gnome (mailto:chuq@apple.com) Be just, and fear not.

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Feature request - open list with non-member posts marked
by Nigel Metheringham 30 Oct '00

30 Oct '00

This came up on the reiserfs list:- hans(a)reiser.to said: > One other thing we could consider doing is tagging all emails from > nonsubscribers specially so that people can choose whether to filter > them out. Its an interesting idea - an open list but with an additional tag (ideally an optional subject munging - except that would tend to propagate into future postings from members too - and a header added or changed so that filters could recognise it) [I'm not necessarily hugely keen on this, but its an interesting idea which merits further discussion and maybe adding to a future features list. Nigel. -- [ - Opinions expressed are personal and may not be shared by VData - ] [ Nigel Metheringham Nigel.Metheringham(a)VData.co.uk ] [ Phone: +44 1423 850000 Fax +44 1423 858866 ]

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forwarded message from Guido van Rossum
by barry＠wooz.org 30 Oct '00

30 Oct '00

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Re: [Mailman-Developers] FYI -- problems with my new install...
by J C Lawrence 29 Oct '00

29 Oct '00

On Sun, 29 Oct 2000 16:22:57 -0800 Chuq Von Rospach <chuqui(a)plaidworks.com> wrote: > Be just, and fear not. Sheesh, you're having more fun than I am. (Very nice job on the site there BTW) Latest status from me on the security stuff -- which happily points away from Mailman and Python: I started out by installing a firmware-based watchdog that would auto-reboot the system when it locked (these are the references to IPMI and EMP (Intel-specific things) -- basically the mainboard firmware, running out of ASICs and not off the CPU, will hit the power reset line if it doesn't get touched every 30 seconds). I have been driving myself silly trying to figure out what is causing the instability with Kanga.Nu, and getting nowhere. There's 36Gig of disk on that box and I've near bit-walked thru every byte in there. A few minutes ago I opened a dozen plus terms on the box, all tailing various logfiles or spinning on displaying various system stats (mostly /proc stuff), plus an extra term on the localhost pinging the target to see (nearly) exactly it went down (if it did). I then approved two posts for posting on a ~1K member list. The posts went thru Mailman, hit the MTA, were fully received by the MTA, everything was looking normal and the queue runners were busy delivering copies and every stat and logfile on the system looked happy. Then the ping stopped. Every system stat I was reporting on (memory, everything) looked good -- but the machine was down. Reading thru the dozen or so terms and what they were reporting as of the instant the box died revealed, well, nothing. Everything looked very very good -- except for the fact that it was now dead. A few minutes later, after some time for the EMP watchdog to kick in (30 seconds), and the longest POST in recorded history (Intel Nightshade MB has a multi-minute-long POST that cannot be shortened), back up it popped. I'm now thinking that I may have bad memory in the box. Certainly physical RAM failure on one of the upper sticks could account for such seemingly spontaneous locks. Oh joy. I just love hardware problems. -- J C Lawrence Home: claw(a)kanga.nu ---------(*) Other: coder(a)kanga.nu http://www.kanga.nu/~claw/ Keys etc: finger claw(a)kanga.nu --=| A man is as sane as he is dangerous to his environment |=--

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Fwd: Mailman-Developers -- confirmation of subscription -- request 321634
by craig tamboury 29 Oct '00

29 Oct '00

confirm 321634 _________________________________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com. Share information about yourself, create your own public profile at http://profiles.msn.com.

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Feature/Forum
by craig tamboury 28 Oct '00

28 Oct '00

Hi. I'm looking for a Feature/Forum for the following topic that I can be directed to or find out if one can be created. "Rights VS Regulation", "Do we really write the Law?" "Beyond Politics" "Just what is Radical Reform?" something along those lines. Also this 3,172 word doc. is too long for most newspaper sections. I think it qualifies as being "newsworthy" in a part the "Fourth Estate" and I can't find anyone to "Mail" it to. Any feedback or re-direction would be greatly appreciated. My kid's soccer listserver turned out to be very helpful in directing Field Sriping/Score Card/etc. info but I'm not entirely sure what role the Developers at python play. Thanks Able adamz, leader of The Civil-American War, understands The Rule of Law and swears to uphold & defend the facts in the Declaration of Independence and the process of the Constitution. 1600 Pennsylvania Ave. Thirteen years ago in April, this announcement was not allowed to run in the Argus Courier Newspaper in Petaluma under the Announcement section in the Classified ads. Previous paid announcement were: 2-27-1985: Able adamz is running for President this next election. 3-18-1987: Able adams is now acting President of these 50 United States, Leader of The Civil-American War. 3-30 1987: Able adamz, Leader of the Civil American War, pledges allegiance to the Democracy of these 50 United States of America and to the Republic for which it stands, one Nation, Indivisible with Liberty and Justice for all. They had a policy not to run anything containing an address at which the person did not live. Two letters were then mailed. One addressed "Able adamz/1600 Pennsylvania Ave." & one labeled "1600 Pennsylvania Ave." They were both returned stamped "Returned for Better Address". After telling the Editor there was no address contained in the announcement and it was a "Right" to have it run, he said he wasn't going to debate about freedom of the press. He said it was his newspaper and suggested to have it carried in an UNDERGROUND newspaper. After a few non-productive calls to the ACLU it became apparent there was no interest to pursue the issue. At that time the most common definition of the word "Politician" had all ready changed from its original meaning "Politico/Legislative Representative" to "Someone who misused words for political gain". Today it is synonymous with "Scumbag; A person who knowingly misrepresents issues for personal/political gain/power and self-esteem". We are legislating/programming the limits of our legal behavior in the form of what we call law. We humans have been doing this legislating/proclaiming/mandating for THOUSANDS of years. Democracy is over 1,000 years old. Working Republics are older than that. Over two hundred years ago when equality and individual rights were written into the foundation of our American Government, we changed forever the idea that Aristocracies or Armies were the only way to protect the people of a Nation. Protecting the Rights/Property/Liberty etc. of the individual through the enforcement of law protects the borders in which that individual lives as well. 50 States, 50 sets of laws, 1 Nation? The American Revolution was fought mostly just NOT to be ruled by someone else. Specifically King George/England. What kind of "Rule" we would win for ourselves was a dream containing bits and parts of other governments that painted a picture of something different to everyone. The world changing concepts of our now: Check and Balance System, Separation of Church and State, Rights, Equality, Liberty etc. all rolled into one, are argueably due to sheer luck, trying to meet a deadline, mental exhaustion after a War and the right people being at the right place at the right time. The latter through their own determination. The American Civil War was fought on a narrower focus: "There is no backing out!". The protections our forefathers gave us will ALWAYS apply to the people and soil for which it was intended. A Nation called America. I personally still get goosebumps thinking about what these events have meant to mankind. WWII, without argument, was defending against world domination. Due to the arrival of mass communication and the formation of Political alliances, there was no ignoring the procession of War Machines that were changing the sovereignty of countries so fast and indiscriminately that sides formed as a matter of default. Neutrality was as ineffective as the League of Nations. Good ideas, but unrealistic to rely on to defend your borders under the circumstances. The United States was not fighting for independence from an unjust Ruler nor to stop Secession nor to come to the aid of Countries that couldn't defend themselves (Korean /Viet Nam Conflict). We were fighting for our very survival in a World without an all powerful referee or "Rule Book". History tells us that Empires of the past have controlled vast areas of what we call "Civilization" for considerable amounts of time but it is obvious that none could meet the needs of controlling different cultures of people. "Civilized", is how the people of a Nation/Society/Empire/Tribe act toward one another. Possessions, wealth, table manners, technology, advanced education are irrelevant factors when gauging the "Peacefulness" of a society. This is where "The Law" comes in. Written Law may not be necessary in today's "Tribal" (Rural/Low technology) societies where oral tradition and living off the land are the way of life but it has been a part of almost every society bigger than "A handful" for over 3,000 years. Since the end of WWII, the United State along with the rest of the world has been working on the Rule Book (International Law) through the United Nations. The clear-cut intent is to reduce the chance of War between Nations through education, co-operation & The Rule of Law (A determination of the applicable rule as distinguished from the finding of fact). Like our Check & Balance System, the U.N. has a World Court, Peace Keeping Troops and a Legislative Body. This is as much as we can do outside America, but what about inside? American Law (of our own making) which is mandating the legal limits of our behavior is based on our Rights to pursue our liberties in society VS. our responsibility to respect (not infringe upon) the Rights of others. This appears to be the first premise of our program. The "Source Code" from which we can see the difference between Right (our Rights) and Wrong (Legal infringements upon others). [NOTE- if this program/software can be proprietary in nature, I hereby claim it in the name of Able adamz lest some claim jumper beats me to the Patent/Copyright office. Amen]. At this level of the program it appears you have the Right to Pursue your way in life (Work/Leisure/Interests) until one of your actions result in the infringement of the Rights of another (Victim). Example: Driving down the road with the right of way you get hit by a car not having the right of way. Some of the" Applicable Rules" that come into play now are Vehicle Code & Insurance Code. If more facts emerge (Injury or Death to passengers, Under the influence, Drag racing) more "Applicable Rules" apply (Criminal Codes, Manslaughter, etc). That is how simple the use of the "Rule of Law" is to understand. Regardless of how many facts are involved, it just tells you to match them up with the "Applicable Rules" broken. Even though we know they are still developing, children as young/old as 5 or 6 are expected to know certain things that are "Wrong" to do. Taking, hitting, saying mean untrue things about someone, scratching paint off the neighbor's car with a nail they found, throwing their candy wrapper on the ground or peeing in somebody's pool. By 12 to 14 years young/old, we have explained, iterated and re-iterated these "Wrong" things at home & school. "I didn't know that" becomes a response un-believed. Possibly a lie? When they hit 18/Adulthood these "Wrongs" described become Theft, Battery, Slander, Littering and Polluting, all punishable by "Fines" and or "Jail time". "I didn't know that" becomes "Ignorance of the Law is no excuse". What happened to the formal Training & Testing we give for "Every Other" subject we teach in school? Without argument, learning to "Be a Good Citizen", is implied as a part of the "Educational Process". Raising/lowering the "American/State" flags, saying the "Pledge of Allegiance", playing "The Star Spangled Banner" & "Mandatory Attendance" are reminders. "Learning" to be a good citizen is just that. Taking a Subject/Life Skill that is "Now and always will be" necessary to be understood in the course of your everyday life and "Teaching" it in a way so we can gauge the level of comprehension. To the best of my knowledge, there is no "Curriculum" or "Standard of Comprehension" in this Subject/Life Skill called "Citizenship/The Law". "How a Bill Becomes a Law" and any of the other "Processes" of how Government works is a more "Specialized" subject matter. "Voting" is a more "Practical" subject. A Candidate/Initiative is proposed. Voters inform themselves of their choices. Voters vote. Majority (Highest Percentage, Over 2/3's, etc.) Rules win. Simple. This may happen 2 or 3 times a year. Knowing the "Electoral College" is what really elects the President and the "Popular Vote" is virtually useless/worthless, is a trivial Game Show question. It only comes up once every 4 years. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------ Now is the time to explain how the text of this Article/Document ties in to "The Civil-American War" (As opposed to the American Civil War of 1864) & the proposed "Take Over of America". ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- "The Civil-American War" is the "Un-Declared" War that is most closely associated with the "Peace Movement" & the "Human Rights" cause. It is a battle to incorporate the "Apparent" "First Premise/Source Code/Liberty Within Responsibility" into the real "Rule Book" of America. The limits by which we can proceed in a "Civilized" society are: RULES OF ENGAGEMENT: Rule #1. - No Littering No Fighting No Theft or Destruction of Property As "Littering/Polluting" on a large scale comes full circle & ties into "Destruction of Property", this is a "Closed Set" of "Rules" that represents infringements upon others. The general range of "Fighting" starts with Accosting (Speaking to someone/stranger on the street first/impeding the progress of) to "Battery" (Grabbing someone when you speak to them/Striking), Assault, Rape, Manslaughter & ending at the ultimate; Murder. "Theft" includes: Stealing/Burglary/Robbery & Fraud/ Embezzlement/White Collar Crime; "Taking something that is not yours to take". "Destruction of Property" is "Causing the need of repair/replacement to the property of another, either Personal, Shared or Public. These "Rules" appear to be "The Law" in a nutshell. Rule # 2. -Recognize Law as it is written. Change/Amend/Reform as needed. The choices one makes within the legal limits of the "Rules/Law" are "Moral & Ethical" standards. "Morals" associated with Religious convictions & "Ethics" associated with Business/Fair Play". ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- ISSUES: 3 issues that "The Civil-American War" represents are easy to understand & are based on "Non-Compliance" to the "First Premise & the "Rule of Law"". Corporate Responsibility. The Business Vehicle called a "Corporation" has been granted the "Rights" of an "Individual" to facilitate its function as Manufacturer/Producer/Employer of goods and services that used to be done by "Government" in areas regarding the publics "Right of Use". Transportation & Communication are 2 examples. The "Limited Responsibility" afforded to the CEO/Administrators of the "Corporation" acts to "Distance" the "Direct Responsibility" of the CEO/Administrators from having to appear every time a Grievance/Lawsuit against them is brought before a "Court of Law". This is akin to the "President of the United States" having to appear in "Court" every time the "Government" is sued. In both cases, it "Obviously Could" lead to the disruption of "Services Provided" in the "Publics Right of Use" by disrupting managements Communication/Decision Making process. In "No Way" does it relieve the "Corporation" from "Any Liability" that it may cause. "Fine & or imprisonment". The "Corporation" in today's society can be viewed as a "Juggernaut War Machine" indiscriminately gobbling up "Sovereign" businesses through "Hostile Take Over" with "Monopolistic" intent causing sides to be formed by default. "Neutrality" and the "Better Business Bureau" are good ideas, but unrealistic under the circumstances. What people want spelled out in "Legal Language" is: If a "Corporation" is found to "Know About" and then "Cover Up" safety issues in the "Products or Services" they provide and "Death" results due to those safety issues, a "REAL HUMAN(s)" will be "FACING THE FAMILY & FRIENDS in a "Court of Law" while being tried as an alleged "Criminal" for Negligence/Manslaughter/etc. just like an owner/operator or individual would be. The too often, "MONETARY COMPENSATION ONLY WITH NO ADMISSION OF GUILT" settlement scenario does not satisfy the demands of the "First Premise & the "Rule of Law"" The Leader of a Country can be tried for "War Crimes" even though "Protecting the interests of my citizens" is his defense. Corporation. Stockholders? VICTIMLESS CRIME: States can't control "Rights" granted a citizen through "Prohibition" (by prohibiting them). Personal Drug use, Trading for Sex & Gambling are 3 common areas. Regulating (Not in the view of the Public, Operating a Motorized Vehicle, Under the age of 18/21, Zoning, etc.) is the Maximum Limitation allowed. (See American Civil War). DEATH PENALTY/SPECIAL CIRCUMSTANCES/DETERRENT: If you litter, you can go back & pick-up. If you pollute, you can go back & clean up. If you steal, you can give back & when you destroy you can repair/replace. Some injuries can heal & medical expenses can be paid. Killing is the taking of a life. Life is non replaceable. Even if we clone that individual, the original "Heart" & "Soul" is gone forever. The "Death Penalty" is "NOT" on the books to be a "Deterrent". When we sentence someone to "Death", it is for the "PERSON(s)" they "MURDERED". We even say something like "For the crime of murder in the first degree, the State sentences you to Death by Lethal Injection/electrocution/Firing Squad/etc. We do not say "If it were up to me I'd sentence you to "Life Imprisonment Without the Possibility of Parole" but we are making a sacrifice/example out of you. Sorry for the heavy-handedness" "Special Circumstances" is a "Recent" condition to consider for "Sentencing Purposes". Even if we agree that "By taking someone else's life you must give up yours in return", the problem with the "Death Penalty" is, we have killed "INNOCENT" citizens. We have proven this. And we can't take it back. "Beyond a Reasonable Doubt" may be enough to take away someone's "Liberty" for "Years" to "Life", but the 100% accuracy needed to "Justify" Killing in "My" name or "Your" name simply does not exist. A "Civilized" society does not gamble with "Non Replaceable" lives. --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- THE TAKE OVER OF AMERICA The Declaration of "The Civil-American War" is not "Against" the "Current Administration". It is about "Officially Recognizing" the line that has been drawn in the sand that represents the differences in the "United States" over what our "Basic Rights" are. "Rights" are an "Either/Or" proposition. It is about "Legislating" those "Rights" through our only "Official" " Congress & Senate" to be enforced by our "Executive Branch" and "IF" need be, decided by our "Judicial Branch". The "Battle" is the understanding that by accepting (opting in) to the "Rules of Engagement" we have limited our "Course of Action", but we "ARE" no less, trying to oust from a "Position of Power", "Anyone" (Politician/Moron) who is "Against" the successful accomplishment of this goal. Rhetorical Debate is the "Only" way to "Prove" the pen is mightier than the sword. A "Bloodless Coup" (A sudden shift in Power without disruption) is more along the "Gist" of what it means. The outcome of "Life & Death" decisions being made on a daily basis in this Country would "Substantially" be different. The shift of time/money spent NOT violating (Arresting/Prosecuting under current Law) our "Rights" would be "Substantial". ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------ "SUPPORTING THE WAR EFFORT/SALES PITCH" To say your vote doesn't "Directly Elect" the President is a "Fact". The tally of the "Electoral Votes" does. Frankly, it seems pretty useless/worthless to make people even count that check/ box/line except: "Worth" has a monetary value. If the "Average American" made $30,000 year for a 50-week, 40hr, 8hr a day job, it comes out to roughly 3 cents a minute. A minute is more than enough time to check or write-in a vote for the "Presidency"(most choices usually have a "vice" attached to them). "Use" has a value. While your "Ballot" vote doesn't "Directly Elect" the President, it shows who you "Supported". This "Support" can be gauged on a percentage scale in relation to all the "Candidates". Your "Ballot" vote is also "Done in Secret". Nobody knows if you "Really" voted for whom you said you would. You can write-in A-b-l-e/a-d-a-m-z to show your "Support", no one need ever know & "It can't affect the outcome of the election", especially if you've voted for some "Crazy Nut/Politician". In this age of "The Billionaire", isn't it amazing the "Real" power and value "3 Lincoln Head Pennies" still hold? They may not buy you a pack of "Life Savers" anymore but they certainly can go a long way toward "Buying" the "Forum" for a more level "Playing Field" under the "Rules/Law". If you were to give 3 cents to your "Political Party", they wouldn't spend the time or effort to hold their hand out for it. If you give 3 cents to Able adamz, you would be told, "Save your money, it isn't needed. (Campaign Reform?) If you give the "Value", "in 3 cents/sense of your time", by writing in "Able adamz", on your "American Ballot", "This next Election", you have "Officially Recognized" the "Civil-American War" by showing your "Support". "Using" your Useless, Worthless, Popular, Throw Away Ballot vote in this fashion will bring a "Focus" to "Issues" which admittedly, shouldn't be expected to "Shut Down" the daily Administrative Responsibilities in carrying out the functions of "Enforcing the Law" the way it is written, but The "Urgency" of this Article/Document could be viewed as "Timeless" since "This Next Election" is always "Just around the Corner"' but "Timeless" it is not. "When", not "If", the "Electoral College" process of selecting the President is abandoned in favor of "Direct Vote", you will "Never Again" have the opportunity to "Use" your vote (For a Leader selected from Political Party choice through Proxy- see Politician) to "Focus" on unresolved "Issues" that lie in the "Source Code" of our "American Program". ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- PERSPECTIVE The above "Grievances" seem to come with a "Resolution" included or implied. It is "Disjointed at times. All loose ends have not been tied together. Forward-looking statements are minimal. The "forum" for "Issues" means "Web Site" for information and stricter "Moderators" in T.V./College Rhetorical Debate. Some sentences could be better understood if they were supported by a paragraph and that paragraph by a full chapter. The use of "Without Argument", "Fact", "Prove", "Program", "Definition", "History tells us", etc. can all be argued. The reference to "Law" as a "Software Program was conveyed, but the difference between "First Premise" and "Source Code" need more clarity. Over all it could be understood by your average 12 year old with little help. One person can only "Paint a Picture" with words to try and make him understood. ----------------------------------------------------------------- SIGNED: Able adamz Leader of the Civil-American War-By Default 1600 Pennsylvania Ave. _________________________________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com. Share information about yourself, create your own public profile at http://profiles.msn.com.

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fyi -- possible problem with mailman
by Chuq Von Rospach 28 Oct '00

28 Oct '00

haven't had a chance to debug this, but.. It looks like mailman (b6) has a problem if it's processing the queue and it can't connect to it's SMTP host. On the system I just upgraded, my SMTP would start rejecting messages because of load. And I'm seeing lots of zero length files come in because of it. They seem to be related. I'll sniff more details when I get a chance, but I'm definitely seeing a rash of zero length files being sent to (as far as I can tell) the admin of the list, and it seems to be tied to this. I think... -- Chuq Von Rospach - Plaidworks Consulting (mailto:chuqui@plaidworks.com) Apple Mail List Gnome (mailto:chuq@apple.com) Be just, and fear not.

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b6, postfix/qrunner super disaster
by Christopher Kolar 27 Oct '00

27 Oct '00

Hi all. I know that one man's disaster is another man's chuckle at an incompetent amateur system administrator, but here goes. I am running 2b6 under Mandrake 7.1 using postfix as an MTA. Last Thursday I posted a note to a small mail list but the note never showed up. I posted to the users list on that matter. First off I addressed the locking problem and deleted the locks/ files. That did not solve the problem, so I then looked at the smtp log and saw that Mm was trying to send the message, but was getting a return of: host not found when trying to send the 20 copies of the message. I messed around with it, and saw qrunner trying to resend the message every minute, and figured that it must be a temporary DNS problem with my ISP and left it alone. During this process I monitored both the normal qrunner cron operations and also tried to manually push the queue by evoking the qrunner command line that is found in the cron file. Then I left for four days in San Francisco. When I got back I discovered that I had 20 new sworn enemies. Sunday morning, as if by magic, the mail actually got delivered, 1400 copies of it. Now I realize that I may have done something really stupid along the way, but I also think that it may be worthwhile to figure out what happened. I am wondering if qrunner got the error message and kept the item in qfiles, but postfix also deferred delivery of the message and kept it in the MTA mqueue -- growing by one copy a minute until the server was able to successfully find the recipients' hosts. If anyone would like to do some forensics on this I would be happy to share log file data, both from Mailman and the regular mail log. Thanks in advance for thinking about this problem and what the cause of it may have been. --chris -- /////\\\\\/////\\\\\ Christopher G. Kolar Director, Department of Instructional Technology Aurora University, Aurora, Illinois ckolar(a)admin.aurora.edu -- www.aurora.edu/~ckolar [PGP Public Key ID: 0xC6492C72]

2 1

bug in confirmation mesaage headers
by Fil 27 Oct '00

27 Oct '00

A bug : the confirmation message (aka verify.txt) headers are bad in 2.0b6 List-Subscribe: <../listinfo/listname>, ... List-Unsubscribe: <../listinfo/listname>, ...

2 2

(no subject)
by Moneymaker67＠aol.com 27 Oct '00

27 Oct '00

HI,WHAT'S UP ? WITH JON ? THINK FUZZY NAVELS ARE ROYALTIES THEY ARE SO GOOD LIKE LYRICS THEY ARE SO EASY .IT BRINGS LOTS OF LUCK , LOTS OF GOOD AND IT DON'T MATTER TO ME ANYMORE WHAT GOES ON I'M WELL KNOWN NOW ,GUESS I'LL BE SOMEBODY BECAUSE I NEVER GAVE UP , I'VE COME TO FAR TO GIVE UP NOW . WELL YOU TAKE CARE I'M BETTER THAN I'VE EVER BEEN , I FEEL NOTHING ANYMORE. GUESS WRITTING HAS THAT EFFECT ON SOMEONE. SEFFNERPLUM JON LORD HELLO

1 0

htdig indexing
by Nigel Metheringham 26 Oct '00

26 Oct '00

I've been playing with Richard's htdig indexing patches for mailman (they are in the patches set for 2.0beta6 on sourceforge). I've finally got it working to my satisfaction just as I'm about to be away for a bit so I am rushing this out now.... I have not looked at 2.0rc1 so I don't know whether the indexer patches went into that. The enclosed patch makes the following changes:- 1. Turns off the index/noindex additions to the TOC files since they are already marked with the META tags as noindex and the combination appeared to be confusing htdig and making the indexes less useful. 2. Changes the URLs used to match the web urls for the list (previously tended to use the machine hostname instead). You can see the effect at http://www.exim.org/pipermail/exim-users/ [which is an invitation for it to stop working] Patch attached is relative to Richard's 2 patches - ie apply both of his ones *first*. Nigel. [ - Opinions expressed are personal and may not be shared by VData - ] [ Nigel Metheringham Nigel.Metheringham(a)VData.co.uk ] [ Phone: +44 1423 850000 Fax +44 1423 858866 ]

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Posts by "Posters" not archived
by Jason Richey 25 Oct '00

25 Oct '00

Is this the regular (desired) behaviour? When someone who is listed as a "Poster" posts to a list, it is not archived. I am running 2.0beta2. I apologize if this has already been addressed. -- "Jason C. Richey" <jasonr(a)aristotle.bomis.com>

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Re: [Mailman-Developers] Re: Security
by J C Lawrence 25 Oct '00

25 Oct '00

On Tue, 24 Oct 2000 09:38:56 +0200 (CEST) Dan Ohnesorg <dan(a)feld.cvut.cz> wrote: > On Mon, 23 Oct 2000, J C Lawrence wrote: >> I'm certain the bug is not in Apache as it also occurs on post >> passing straight to the list without going thru moderation. It >> is possible it is in Exim, tho I'd be extremely surprised. For >> one I've reinstalled all binaries from known good sources, and >> have MD5ed all Exim files against both known good sources and the >> copies installed on other happily running machines. It is also >> unlikely that the bug is in the kernel as I've reproduced the >> problem with kernels built on other (untouched) machines and then >> installed on the offending machine, and on kernels built locally >> from cryptographically verified source balls. > I am running mailman from the beginning of mailman developing > (John Viegas version, Im not sure if the name is correct, but > cheers John). As have I. > It runs on SMP machine and I have never such a problem. Ditto. I currently have various versions of Mailman running on three SMP systems without problems. The fact that this particular (other) SMP system is having Mailman problems does not seem related to SMP. > I have seen problems with forking of sendmail into 1000 processes > while delivering messages in big (500 members) lists after > comminting pending request. This is a common MTA configuration issue, most often seen with QMail FWLIW. MTA tuning, especially as mail volumes grow, is a bit of an art. There was some interesting discussion on this area between Me and Chug on this list a couple months back you might want to look at. > But my kernel was never confused from this like Yours. I would > say, Your memory chips are wrong. User space program can never > corupt filesystem. It is possible I have bad RAM. It seems rather unlikely however (see below), You are missing data from the beginning of the thread. I had a disk die (it held various mail archives). In dieing it not only took down the system, but also succeeded in trashing various bits of other filesystems on other devices. Among the files trashed were the tripwire database and its backups. This was not apparent when I replaced the drive and restored all relevant files from known-good/secure backups. Given the new drive, the system remained unstable, crashing frequently (uptime measured in single digit hours). This is as compared to a previous uptime of near 200 days. I then replaced every binary on the system from original verified packages, encluding the kernel (built a new kernel locally from cryptographicslly signed and checked sources, using a new hand-checked .config). Crashes continued and seemed to be coincident with mail travelling thru Mailman, either thru the weba approval process, or direct through to the exploder (no approval) The MTA at this point appeared to be happy. Several tens of thousands of messages a day travel through that system, and were successfully passing through the system between crashes (my secondary MXes were dumping mail onto the system at a rate of well over 2K messages per minute upon rebooting from an extended crash -- which the system took quite happily). All crashes were observed to be time coincident with Mailman mail activities. Suspecting bad disk blocks and potentially other hidden filesystem troubles I then replaced all filesystems (except / and /boot) on the system with journalling filesystems (ReiserFS), doing a surface check on all partitions before putting the new filesystems on. I again replaced every binary on the system from confirmed correct packages, and built a new kernel on a known secure machine from crypographically signed and checked sources. Additionally I double checked by doing MD5Sum signature comparisons of key binaries on the target system, with specific attention paid the the mail system, against a known secure system. They matched perfectly. Finally I ran a semi-burn-in on the system: leaving it over night continuously building kernels AND using SCP to send those kernels to and from a remote box (to hit the network stack) with MD5 checks on each end AND sending an average of 25K mail messages per minute to a another system on the local net (100base-T connected). The next morning there was not a single error in any file, all SCP copies had compleated without error, all MD5 checks were passed, and neither MTA listed any problems (the messages themselves were bit-bucketted). I then rolled the box back into production. Crashes continued. They also continued after building a new kernel on the target machine -- from similarly verified sources (needed a slight tweak). I then replaced mailman from known good sources. Crashes continued. I've now removed all bytecoded files in the Mailman installation. Additionally I've hand unrolled and re-rolled the config.db for one of the lists that appears to be creating troubles. The unrolled DB looked good. Additionally, as I had in excess of 30K messages in my MTA spool pending delivery to assorted unresponsive remote systems and I suspected that a corrupted queue file might have been causing problems with Exim (which does briefly run as a privileged user), I hand moved all spool entries from the target system to another known-stable/secure system. We'll see what happens now. -- J C Lawrence Home: claw(a)kanga.nu ---------(*) Other: coder(a)kanga.nu http://www.kanga.nu/~claw/ Keys etc: finger claw(a)kanga.nu --=| A man is as sane as he is dangerous to his environment |=--

1 0

Security
by J C Lawrence 24 Oct '00

24 Oct '00

Barry, A week or so ago (right about the time I dissappeared) I had a drive die on the system I run Mailman from. I thought replacing the drive and restoring its contents from backups would be enough. It wasn't. It turns out that in dieing several other filesystems were corrupted in various odd and inelegant fashions (encluding both my tripwire DB and its backup sod it). This has left me in an odd position: If I post to a specific list, or approve a held post for that list, there is an 80% chance that this will crash the machine (compleat lock, no interrupts, no useful log entries. This is reproducable. I've done it a great many times -- enough to wish I had a watchdog card in that machine. Its also rather scary -- Mailman is running as a non-privileged user after all. As part of the recovery I've re-installed every single binary on the entire system (encluding Python et al). The one thing I haven't reinstalled is Mailman (v1.1). I also haven't dissembled or rebuilt the config.db's for the crashing lists. Interested in the relevant files? I'll be saving everything off (of course), but I doubt I'll have time in the near future to disect this. -- J C Lawrence Home: claw(a)kanga.nu ---------(*) Other: coder(a)kanga.nu http://www.kanga.nu/~claw/ Keys etc: finger claw(a)kanga.nu --=| A man is as sane as he is dangerous to his environment |=--

4 7

Re: [Mailman-Developers] Re: Security
by J C Lawrence 23 Oct '00

23 Oct '00

On Mon, 23 Oct 2000 20:44:45 -0700 Chuq Von Rospach <chuqui(a)plaidworks.com> wrote: > I sincerely doubt Barry would see it, because I'd be willing to > bet dinner it's a bad block on the disk, and it's lodged in one of > the files (probably the .db file) attached to that list. This was one of my early thoughts as well, but the fact that the behaviour continues after I've the partitions on the system and reformatted them with new filesystems (ReiserFS as versus Ext2FS) rather suggests this isn't it. > i'd do a surface test of that disk and see if it finds > problems. I'd give it 90% chance it will. This just screams "bad > block!" at me. <nod> That, and the frequent crash rate was one of the things that prompted me to put ReiserFS on. Before I'd figured that quite a bit had been messed up by the dieing drive I'd been seeing signs that several filesystems were unhealthy at the filesystem level. So I did surface checks, restored all the files, got crashes, did new surface checks and went to a new filesystem, rolled everything back and go crashes... -- J C Lawrence Home: claw(a)kanga.nu ---------(*) Other: coder(a)kanga.nu http://www.kanga.nu/~claw/ Keys etc: finger claw(a)kanga.nu --=| A man is as sane as he is dangerous to his environment |=--

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Re: [Mailman-Developers] Security
by J C Lawrence 23 Oct '00

23 Oct '00

On Mon, 23 Oct 2000 20:09:01 -0700 (PDT) Dan Mick <Dan.Mick(a)West.Sun.COM> wrote: >> If I post to a specific list, or approve a held post for that >> list, there is an 80% chance that this will crash the machine >> (compleat lock, no interrupts, no useful log entries). > What do you mean "crash the system"? Panic and coredump? Hang? > Crash mailman/python and everything else is still up? As stated: compleat lock, no interrupts being serviced, no log entries. Basically: utterly indistinguishable from a powered off machine other than by power consumption. No KB, no met, no stack, no video (well, a slight grayish diffuse glow actually), nuttin'. > If panic/coredump, some time spent in cursory kernel coredump > analysis is warranted to point a finger at a culprit. Being a > kernel developer, I'm biased, but when people say "crash the > machine" that's what I think of. Is that what you mean? Nope. No panics, no cores, just one big wedgie. These are among the reasons this whole thing fits the description of "odd". -- J C Lawrence Home: claw(a)kanga.nu ---------(*) Other: coder(a)kanga.nu http://www.kanga.nu/~claw/ Keys etc: finger claw(a)kanga.nu --=| A man is as sane as he is dangerous to his environment |=--

2 2

Announcing Mailman 2.0 release candidate 1
by barry＠wooz.org 23 Oct '00

23 Oct '00

Hello folks, Okay, we're really close now! I've put together Mailman 2.0 release candidate 1 and uploaded it to SourceForge. You can grab the tarball from the file release page at http://sourceforge.net/project/shownotes.php?release_id=14446 www.list.org and www.gnu.org should be updated soon. This release contains a bunch of bug fixes and a few local security patches. The source code is essentially frozen, modulo any last minute show stopper bugs. I will probably make a pass at the documentation before the final release. Expect 2.0 final hopefully by the weekend. Enjoy, -Barry

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Re: [Mailman-Developers] Security
by Dan Mick 23 Oct '00

23 Oct '00

> If I post to a specific list, or approve a held post for that > list, there is an 80% chance that this will crash the machine > (compleat lock, no interrupts, no useful log entries. What do you mean "crash the system"? Panic and coredump? Hang? Crash mailman/python and everything else is still up? If panic/coredump, some time spent in cursory kernel coredump analysis is warranted to point a finger at a culprit. Being a kernel developer, I'm biased, but when people say "crash the machine" that's what I think of. Is that what you mean?

1 0

CVS
by Phil Barnett 23 Oct '00

23 Oct '00

I asked on mailman-users and got no definative answer, and I have searched the mailman home page and everything it leads me to, but I can't find any place where the CVS is tarballed and ready to ftp. Is there such a place? Does anyone have any objection to my creating a CVS tarball on a daily basis and providing this service (assuming it is not already being done somewhere...)? -- Phil Barnett mailto:midnight@the-oasis.net WWW http://www.the-oasis.net/ FTP Site ftp://ftp.the-oasis.net

2 4

Re: [Mailman-Developers] Mailman-Bug with faked spam headers and some suggestions new features
by barry＠wooz.org 20 Oct '00

20 Oct '00

>>>>> "SB" == Steffen Bardolatzi <steffen(a)asta.uni-wuppertal.de> writes: SB> This looks like a nasty bug ... SB> Oct 08 23:53:01 2000 (25258) Delivery exception: read-only SB> character buffer, None Oct 08 23:53:01 2000 (25258) Traceback SB> (innermost last): File SB> "/var/mailman/Mailman/Handlers/HandlerAPI.py", line 82, in SB> do_pipeline SB> func(mlist, msg, msgdata) File SB> "/var/mailman/Mailman/Handlers/Hold.py", line 173, in process SB> if mlist.require_explicit_destination and \ File SB> "/var/mailman/Mailman/MailList.py", line 1208, in SB> HasExplicitDest addr = string.lower(addr) SB> TypeError: read-only character buffer, None This will be fixed in rc1. -Barry

1 0

QMail patches submitted to sourceforge
by Sean Reifschneider 20 Oct '00

20 Oct '00

Since SourceForge doesn't allow any lengthy descriptions of patches, let me describe them here. Patch ID 101660: Fixing some information in the README.QMAIL file. Patch ID 101845: Changed calling line in qmail-to-mailman.py program to include "preline" call. Added an entry in FAQ on why archiving doesn't work for QMail. Patch ID 101846: Added a default entry "MTA_TYPE", which can be used to trigger MTA-specific actions in other code. This is a port forward of the patch I submitted last year, which I believe was dropped. Defaults.py.in auto-detects QMail and sets MTA_TYPE accordingly. Changes "newlist" to output QMail specific text. Patch ID 101847: A contrib program which does log rotation and mails any messages in "errors" or "smtp-failures" to mailman owner. This is another patch I submitted last year which I believe was dropped. Enjoy, Sean -- Hell hath no fury, like a file-system scorned. -- Sean Reifschneider, 1998 Sean Reifschneider, Inimitably Superfluous <jafo(a)tummy.com> tummy.com - Linux Consulting since 1995. Qmail, KRUD, Firewalls, Python

3 2

X-Mailman-Version: header field
by John A. Martin 20 Oct '00

20 Oct '00

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 Will there be an option or an easy edit to not use the "X-Mailman-Version:" header field? It might be nice to have a ./configure option something like "--paranoid-advertiser" for those whose policy is to not advertise the specific version of daemons and the like. --paranoid-advertiser would not use the X-Mailman-Version header field , would not have the version number in the logo on the web pages, and would not otherwise advertise the version number. Presumably anybody smart enough to be paranoid would also be thoughtful enough to mention the version where appropriate when seeking help and so forth. :-) jam -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.0.3 (GNU/Linux) Comment: OpenPGP encrypted mail preferred. See <http://www.gnupg.org/> iEYEARECAAYFAjnhvcoACgkQUEvv1b/iXy9ukACfUfCP2nsoxa5UEtL7YSndpFld gV8AnjFJzJUacNqeInEONJfyjDmVo0Wm =mJty -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----

2 1

Using mailman with the secure-linux kernel patch
by Marc MERLIN 19 Oct '00

19 Oct '00

[mailman-developers(a)python.org Cced in case they want to add my shell script to the tree, but followup set to mailman-users(a)python.org] I wanted to have mailman run on my servers that have the secure-linux kernel patch. I ended up writing a small shell script that changed permissions so that scripts ran as UID mailman (by making sure that scripts that lock config.db do so with UID mailman). I later realized that python doesn't seem to have a suidpython wrapper like perl does, so I scrapped the shell script and attempted to put a few lines of python together to modify some scripts in mailman/bin so that they change their uid to mailman if root runs them or complain that they can't run unless their uid is mailman. Please let me know if I forgot to chmod or modify other files that lock config.db: binfilestopatch= ( 'add_members', 'check_db', 'clone_member', 'config_list', 'move_list', 'newlist', 'remove_members', 'rmlist', 'sync_members', 'update', 'withlist' ) It'd be nice if that script were included as unsupported with the mailman tree so that people who really want to have the protections from secure-linux, can still run mailman. If someone needs to make minor modifications to the script before including it, I'm cool with that. Thanks, Marc ~mailman/bin/fix_perms.securelinux ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- #! /usr/bin/env python # # Copyright (C) 1998,1999,2000 by the Free Software Foundation, Inc. # # This program is free software; you can redistribute it and/or # modify it under the terms of the GNU General Public License # as published by the Free Software Foundation; either version 2 # of the License, or (at your option) any later version. # # This program is distributed in the hope that it will be useful, # but WITHOUT ANY WARRANTY; without even the implied warranty of # MERCHANTABILITY or FITNESS FOR A PARTICULAR PURPOSE. See the # GNU General Public License for more details. # # You should have received a copy of the GNU General Public License # along with this program; if not, write to the Free Software # Foundation, Inc., 59 Temple Place - Suite 330, Boston, MA 02111-1307, USA. """If you use Solar Designer's secure-linux patch, it prevents a process from linking (hard link) to a file it doesn't own. As a result mailman has to be changed so that the whole tree is owned by mailman, and the CGIs and some of the programs in the bin tree (the ones that lock config.db files) are SUID mailman. The idea is that config.db files have to be owned by the mailman UID and only touched by programs that are UID mailman. If you have to run check_perms -f, make sure to also run %(PROGRAM) -f, which applies the necessary permission fixes As a result, to prevent anyone from running priviledged mailman commands (since the scripts are suid), binary commands that are changed to be SUID are also unreadable and unrunable by people who aren't in the mailman group. This shouldn't affect much since most of those commands would fail work if you weren't part of the mailman group anyway. Marc <marcsoft(a)merlins.org>/<marc_bts(a)valinux.com> 2000/10/04 """ import sys import os import paths import re # Those are the programs that we patch so that they insist being run under the # mailman uid or as root. binfilestopatch= ( 'add_members', 'check_db', 'clone_member', 'config_list', 'move_list', 'newlist', 'remove_members', 'rmlist', 'sync_members', 'update', 'withlist' ) def main(): binpath=paths.prefix+'/bin/' droplib=binpath+'CheckFixUid.py' if len(argv)<2 or argv[1] != "-f": print __doc__ sys.exit(1) if not os.path.exists(droplib): print "Creating "+droplib fp=open(droplib, 'w', 0644) fp.write("""import sys import pwd import os class CheckFixUid: mailmanuid=pwd.getpwnam("mailman")[2] if os.geteuid() == 0: os.setuid(mailmanuid) if os.geteuid() != mailmanuid: print "You need to run this script as root or mailman because it was configured to run\non a linux system with the secure-linux patch which restricts hard links" sys.exit() """) fp.close else: print "Skipping creation of "+droplib print "Making cgis setuid mailman" os.system('chmod 6755 '+paths.prefix+'/cgi-bin/*') print "Making mail wrapper setuid mailman" os.system('chmod 6755 '+paths.prefix+'/mail/wrapper') print "Ensuring that all config.db fiels are owned by Mailman" os.system('chown mailman.mailman '+paths.prefix+'/lists/*/config.db*') print "Patching mailman scripts to change the uid to mailman" for script in binfilestopatch: filefd=open(script, "r") file=filefd.readlines() filefd.close() patched=0 try: file.index("import CheckFixUid\n") print "Not patching "+script+", already patched" except ValueError: file.insert(file.index("import paths\n")+1, "import CheckFixUid\n") for i in range(len(file)-1, 0, -1): object=re.compile("^([ ]*)main\(").search(file[i]) if object: print "Patching "+script file.insert(i, object.group(1)+"CheckFixUid.CheckFixUid()\n") patched=1 break if patched==0: print "Warning, file "+script+" couldn't be patched.\nIf you use it, mailman may not function properly" else: filefd=open(script, "w") filefd.writelines(file) main(sys.argv) ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- -- Microsoft is to software what McDonalds is to gourmet cooking Home page: http://marc.merlins.org/ (friendly to non IE browsers) Finger marc_f(a)merlins.org for PGP key and other contact information

1 1

a patch to get the subscriber's email address in subscribeack.txt
by Fil 19 Oct '00

19 Oct '00

I'm sorry I can't get to sourceforge. Here's a small but useful patch to be able to use %(name)s in subscribeack.txt so as to write an answer looking like "Welcome to the YYYY mailin list. Your address <%(name)s> has been added succesfully...." where %(name)s is the email of the subscriber. I hope you can retain this patch in the official distrib. btw, why write 'name' when it's actually an email ;) *** Mailman/Deliverer.py.old Mon Oct 16 19:14:43 2000 --- Mailman/Deliverer.py Thu Oct 19 11:30:30 2000 *************** your membership administrative address, *** 55,60 **** --- 55,61 ---- 'listinfo_url': self.GetScriptURL('listinfo', absolute=1), 'optionsurl' : self.GetOptionsURL(name, absolute=1), 'password' : password, + 'name' : name, }) if digest: digmode = ' (Digest mode)'

1 0

Help with mailman installation
by mike tran 18 Oct '00

18 Oct '00

I followed the instruction on INSTALL mailman, but i still have problem with making it work. When I point my browser to http://localhost/mailman/ I get a message "you do not have permission to view mailman on this server" When i ran ./configure i used the --with-cgi-gid=nobody --with-mail-gid=nobody . We use Apache as our Web Server. Any suggestion is appreciated. Mike

1 0

mailman-cmd
by Cristian Prevedello 18 Oct '00

18 Oct '00

I've written few lines of python to manage from the command line some aspects of mailman. You can find these scripts at ftp://ftp.prosa.it/pub/people/plasma/mailman-cmd-0.1.tar.gz This is the first release. They are ugly, very very few userfriendly, but they their work. Suggestions and contributions are welcome. -- Cristian Prevedello, System Administrator, Linuxcare Italia spa +39.049.804.3.411 tel, +39.049.803.6.484 fax plasma(a)linuxcare.it, http://www.linuxcare.com/ Linuxcare. Support for the revolution.

1 0

website
by Global786＠aol.com 17 Oct '00

17 Oct '00

I wonder if you could help me in the following matters. 1. can you or someone help improve my websight which I could edit/add/delete- items myself. please go to my site below to know my business. www.globalcatering.co.uk 2. I wish to enter into e-commerce- can you or someone help me to achieve this. 3. is there a way to obtain e-mailing lists to create a database on my computer to enable me to inform people re special offers. thank you, I await your reply. best regards altaf shaikh.

1 0

mail commands help text
by Michael Forster 17 Oct '00

17 Oct '00

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 Hi, 2.0beta6: When I send a "help" to xylist-request I get a help message containing the following: subscribe [password] [digest-option] [address=<address>] Subscribe to the mailing list. Your password must be given to unsubscribe or change your options. When you subscribe to the - --> list, you'll be reminded of your password periodically. 'digest-option' may be either: 'nodigest' or 'digest' (no quotes!) If you wish to subscribe an address other than the address you send this request from, you may specify "address=<email address>" (no brackets around the email address, no quotes!) even if I set the "Send monthly password reminders" option to "No". This is wrong, isn't it? Mike -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: PGPfreeware 6.5.8 for non-commercial use <http://www.pgp.com> iQA/AwUBOewFfceYjj0YYPBiEQLacgCfeemhWP98YzP3wuf73uquedHcpEoAnjEV F33FsqCC7ZqjVnn4lJ93PvF3 =A+5d -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----

1 0

choose options that appear on the roster
by Fil 17 Oct '00

17 Oct '00

Would it be possible to make this list of roster options a DEFAULT by LIST (or by SERVER) so as to simplify the admin interface ? Mailman/Cgi/admin.py: for opt in ("hide", "nomail", "ack", "notmetoo", "plain"):

1 0

default privacy settings
by Fil 17 Oct '00

17 Oct '00

We live in a very privacy-reduced world, isn't it? Wouldn't it help if GNU/Mailman was by default shipped with DEFAULT_PRIVATE_ROSTER = 2 ...and let administrators reverse that if they wish ?

1 0

UI glitch in templates/listinfo.html
by Chuq Von Rospach 16 Oct '00

16 Oct '00

Found a UI glitch in templates/listinfo.html: <tr><td>Would you like to receive list mail batched in a daily digest? </td><td><MM-Undigest-Radio-Button> No <MM-Digest-Radio-Button> Yes </TD></tr> which is the section that prints out digest selections. If you turn off digests (for instance, an announce lists), you get the question, followed by No Yes and no buttons. Very confusing for the end user, and tripped me up for about ten minutes before I figured it out. The best way (I guess) to handle this is to not print the message at all if digests are disabled for a list, but the quick and dirty hack would be to have those button variables return a string of N/A or something -- ugly, but at least the user would know it's not broken.... -- Chuq Von Rospach - Plaidworks Consulting (mailto:chuqui@plaidworks.com) Apple Mail List Gnome (mailto:chuq@apple.com) Be just, and fear not.

1 0

snews note and nntp configuration suggestion
by Bret Mogilefsky 11 Oct '00

11 Oct '00

Hello. I'm trying to set up Mailman 2.0b4 to gateway our secure newsgroups to a mailing list per group. The first thing I notice is that there's no support for snews (NNTP over SSL), presumably because SSL is a whole new can of worms. The second thing I notice is that there's no way way to specify the port that should be used on the news host. The third thing I notice is that the same news username/password are used for all mailing lists. Consider the following information/suggestions. The first problem should be easy to solve using stunnel (http://www.stunnel.org). I can set up a wrapper on the Mailman host that forwards NNTP over SSL to the remote server. Assuming I can specify the port I'm using to forward, everything should work. This should probably be documented somewhere in case people are tempted to complain about the lack of SSL support as I was about to. Second problem, no port. Well, open_newsgroup() in gate_news passes parameters to nntplib.NNTP() for the username and password; why not pass the port as well? I set this up as NNTP_PORT in Defaults.py and overrode it in my mmcfg.py, then hacked open_newsgroup() to use it. Simple enough, BUT... Third problem, the same username/password are used for all gated lists. This seems an oversight in my opinion. Consider for example SourceForge, where there are thousands of lists associated with various projects, each under the administration of that project. It's really not useful for the list admin to be able to specify the news host and group, but not the port, username, and password. All of these parameters should be configurable per list. Great, so I should add those fields to the mlist structure... But at this point I burst out in tears and hide my face in shame because I'm really unfamiliar with Python and I don't know anything about how the web interface is being generated and I'm afraid to do any more hacks than what I've already described without seriously mucking things up. Can someone help? Is it too late to get this change into 2.0? Thanks for your patience, Bret mogul at playstation.sony.com

1 0

Mailman-Bug with faked spam headers and some suggestions new features
by Steffen Bardolatzi 10 Oct '00

10 Oct '00

This looks like a nasty bug ... We are running Mailman for some time now - one of the liste is a "half-open" one with these settings: - everyone can post - bccs to the list are not permitted (to avoid spams, works fine) - some alias-names for some users who regulary post to a different adress but bcc to our's Recently a spam message with a visible to-entry in the mail header arrived here: "To: <>" in the fields displayed by mail clients. This caused to log Mailman Beta 6 the following files into the error- logfile: Oct 08 23:53:01 2000 (25258) Delivery exception: read-only character buffer, None Oct 08 23:53:01 2000 (25258) Traceback (innermost last): File "/var/mailman/Mailman/Handlers/HandlerAPI.py", line 82, in do_pipeline func(mlist, msg, msgdata) File "/var/mailman/Mailman/Handlers/Hold.py", line 173, in process if mlist.require_explicit_destination and \ File "/var/mailman/Mailman/MailList.py", line 1208, in HasExplicitDest addr = string.lower(addr) TypeError: read-only character buffer, None ... these lines were repeated each *2* minutes for more than 10 hours (until I deleted the db-, and msg-file in the qfiles directory). The original msg-file time was exactly the one of the first log in the log file. In this *first* log I could read something like "implicit header..." followed by the endlessly repeated actual error-log above. ------------------------------- In addition to this here are some more minior bugs: - In case some e-mails are sent with qp-7bit-code the archiver does *not* covert them back into the acutal 8 bit characters - which makes it more diffucult to read the postings in the archive unless you are get used to qp-coding. As for 8 bit characters it works fine. Some of the affected mail clients are Pegasus und Outlook Express (according to some header analyses on an unregular bases). E-Mails are send just fine with no problems. - In case some people send M$-attachments the archive does not interpret this mime code and displays if just as if it was plain text. A nice *new* feature was if there was displayed a link for non-text-files like: download this file. - It would be fine if the archive would *not* display both the text and html code (in source code) if some people send a message with html *and* txt - the default might be *only* to render the html part readable (as e.g. done my pine). In general it would be fine if the archive was mime-aware ... there are too many users out there who have not yet learnt to send e-mails in plain text. - In case there are packet losses and timeouts during processing some admin-(mail)-requests Mailman does recognize the changes but does endlessly attempt to load the updated admin-requests site. ------------------------------------------- - sugestion for a new feature: I was told to disable the unsubscribe-funktion for a special list: I edited the list option's site *and* disabled the request e-mail adress (else I had to filter out unsubscribe in the subject and body with procmail or so). So far this works fine *but* has been some work. Therefore a switch like: "unsubscribe yes no" would be a good idea - maybe on a per-list bases in the mydefauls.py-file. Thanks in advance and thaks for such a great mailing list manager! PS.: I hope it's ok if I send it to mailman-users and mailman-developers and sorry about the length. Anyway Mailman seems to get better with each Beta version.

1 0

software
by Kleniksky Artiom 10 Oct '00

10 Oct '00

Dear sirs, My name is Artiom Kleniksky, i am private businessman and work in sphere of telecommunications in Belarus. Presently I revise the direction of its activity and begin to work of software development! On given moment I have the big interest in reception of order on software production, any level to difficulties. At reception of order for 5 days I am ready to give answer about possibility of its realization. I am ready to guarantee the quality and periods of performances order. The Payment expect the transfer of cheque on my name on fact of performance of order. For first time a downpayment for performance work is not required. I certain that we with can find the general interests and shall cooperation to future! I wait any offers from you! My e-mail:minsk_mobile@mail.ru GSM: +375-296-500-950 With best regards Artiom Kleniksky

1 0

Bug in CookHeaders.py
by Jerzy Hodor 08 Oct '00

08 Oct '00

Hello, I have just discovered a bug in Mailman 2.0beta6. When you set up a list to post replies to list, and user receives confirmation note about subsciption, the CookHandlers module trashes content of 'Reply-To' field. Accordingly to comments in this code there is wrong written condition in it.You should change it from: if not fasttrack or msg.get('reply-to'): to: if not fasttrack or not msg.get('reply-to'): or even to cleaner form: if not (fasttrack and msg.get('reply-to')): Here is diff -uNr of CookHeaders.py.orig CookHeaders.py <---------cut here --- CookHeaders.py.orig Sun Oct 8 12:53:40 2000 +++ CookHeaders.py Sun Oct 8 12:54:30 2000 @@ -79,7 +79,7 @@ # or if there is already a reply-to set. If the user has set # one we assume they have a good reason for it, and we don't # second guess them. - if not fasttrack or msg.get('reply-to'): + if not fasttrack or not msg.get('reply-to'): # Set Reply-To: header to point back to this list if mlist.reply_goes_to_list == 1: msg['Reply-To'] = mlist.GetListEmail() <---------cut here Hope this helps developing your great program! Sincerely yours, -- Jerzy Hodor PS. Yes, I have posted this bug and patch on sourceforge :-)

1 0

2.0b6 & approval page forward function
by Ricardo Kustner 07 Oct '00

07 Oct '00

Hi, I noticed some odd behaviour of the forward function on the held-for-approval page. It used to work in earlier betas, but it doesn't seem to work the same in 2.0b6. When I approve a message and use the forward option, the message gets send only once. There's no Subject prefix in the message I receive, so I _think_ it doesn't get delivered to the rest of the list (which is probably true cause the entry in logs/smtp talks about 1 recips). But the msg['Send-To'] header is nowhere to be found in the message. Unfortunately, it looks like the message doesn't get delivered to the list, even though i "approved" it too... but I have to test that some more to me 100% positive it doesn't get delivered. I'll look into it some more tonight, and if I have more details I'll submit a bugreport on sourceforge... Ricardo.l -- http://rixhq.nu "You think that's air you're breathing?" -- Morpheus

1 1

Virtual Host handling in listinfo.py
by Richard Barrett 06 Oct '00

06 Oct '00

In what follows I am referring to code in the file Mailman/Cgi/listinfo.py in the 2.0beta6 release of Mailman. I'm working with Apache/1.3.12 (Unix) which may influence your judgement about my arguments. Sorry if what follows is too long but I found it useful to fully analyse my own thinking on the topic. Red face for me if the issue is well known to you all. The code I'm concerned with is in the function FormatListinfoOverview. It deals with the situation when mm_cfg.VIRTUAL_HOST_OVERVIEW is true and computation is done to detemine which advertised mail lists should be returned when the URI /mailman/listinfo/ is being responded to. The relevant bits of the code are as follows: def FormatListinfoOverview(error=None): ... <snip> ... http_host = os.environ.get('HTTP_HOST', os.environ.get('SERVER_NAME')) port = os.environ.get('SERVER_PORT') # strip off the port if there is one if port and http_host[-len(port)-1:] == ':'+port: http_host = http_host[:-len(port)-1] if mm_cfg.VIRTUAL_HOST_OVERVIEW and http_host: host_name = http_host else: host_name = mm_cfg.DEFAULT_HOST_NAME ... <snip> ... for n in names: if mlist.advertised: if mm_cfg.VIRTUAL_HOST_OVERVIEW and \ http_host and \ string.find(http_host, mlist.web_page_url) == -1 and \ string.find(mlist.web_page_url, http_host) == -1: # List is for different identity of this host - skip it. continue else: advertised.append(mlist) ... <snip> There is a flaw in this code in the way that it strips the port number from the http_host variable but I'll come on to that below. As best I can judge the purpose of considering the value of the environment variable HTTP_HOST (if available) instead of just using the SERVER_NAME value is to try and deduce a virtual host's server name in cirumstances when the web server has not. For instance: 1. Typically VirtualHost directives in httpd.conf will have been defined using FQDN, for example: NameVirtualHost 192.168.1.1 <VirtualHost bert.my.co.uk> ServerName bert.my.co.uk </VirutalHost> <VirtualHost fred.my.co.uk> ServerName fred.my.co.uk </VirutalHost> 2. The virtual hosts will have associated ServerName directives whose values are used to set SERVER_NAME. 3. If a user on the local network uses a URL which does not fully quality the servers domain name, e.g. http://fred/mailman/listinfo/, then the VirtualHost directive is not correlated by the web server and the SERVER_NAME will not be set to fred.my.co.uk but to some other value depending on type and order of the VirtualHost directives in httpd.conf, bert.my.co.uk in this example. 4. In these circumstances, the cunning code above will ignore the SERVER_NAME value and match the fred value in HTTP_HOST. I do not think this trick in the FormatListinfoOverview function is the right way to overcome this problem. If you want to match both partial and fully qualified domain names to a virtual host then two VirtualHost directives should be used in httpd.conf, for example: NameVirtualHost 192.168.1.1 <VirtualHost bert.my.co.uk> ServerName bert.my.co.uk </VirutalHost> <VirtualHost fred.my.co.uk> ServerName fred.my.co.uk </VirutalHost> <VirtualHost fred> ServerName fred.my.co.uk </VirutalHost> By doing this both web server and listinfo.py reach the same conclusion by the same route. I am saying that, in principle, the problem, which is generic to the way the web server is operating, should be solved by setting up the correct virtual host definitions in httpd.conf not by second guessing the virtual host setup in listinfo.py. listinfo.py should only consider the value of SERVER_NAME and not even look at HTTP_HOST. My proposed changes to the FormatListinfoOverview function are: cut here-vvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvv diff -r -c2 mailman-2.0beta6.stock/Mailman/Cgi/listinfo.py mailman-2.0beta6.listinfo1/Mailman/Cgi/listinfo.py *** mailman-2.0beta6.stock/Mailman/Cgi/listinfo.py Wed Aug 2 00:10:41 2000 --- mailman-2.0beta6.listinfo1/Mailman/Cgi/listinfo.py Fri Oct 6 14:22:44 2000 *************** *** 59,73 **** "Present a general welcome and itemize the (public) lists for this host." ! # XXX We need a portable way to determine the host by which we are being ! # visited! An absolute URL would do... ! http_host = os.environ.get('HTTP_HOST', os.environ.get('SERVER_NAME')) ! port = os.environ.get('SERVER_PORT') ! # strip off the port if there is one ! if port and http_host[-len(port)-1:] == ':'+port: ! http_host = http_host[:-len(port)-1] ! if mm_cfg.VIRTUAL_HOST_OVERVIEW and http_host: ! host_name = http_host ! else: ! host_name = mm_cfg.DEFAULT_HOST_NAME doc = Document() --- 59,63 ---- "Present a general welcome and itemize the (public) lists for this host." ! http_host = host_name = os.environ.get('SERVER_NAME') doc = Document() cut here-^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ [Even if you do not agree with my first conclusion, please read on.] Which brings me on to the problem that started me looking at this whole issue; what happens when SSH's port forwarding is used to make the browser/web connection? For example: 1. I'm dialling in to my favorite ISP from home using my laptop. In order to then connect to our internal-access-only Mailman web server through our corporate firewall, I have to use SSH's port forwarding. 2. I set up port forwarding so that any connection to local port 8081 on my laptop is forwarded to fred.my.co.uk:80 by the firewall machine. 3. I give my browser the URL http://localhost:8081/mailman/listinfo/. 4. The HTTP request is forwarded satisfactorily to fred.my.co.uk:80 with the URI being /mailman/listinfo/. 5. Because mm_cfg.VIRTUAL_HOST_OVERVIEW is true, listinfo.py proceeds to tell me there are no advertised mail lists on host localhost:8081. Well, I knew that. This is because of two flaws in the FormatListinfoOverview function: 1. In trying to remove the port number from the end of the string value of HTTP_HOST, the code assumes that the length of the port number is equal to the length of the SERVER_PORT environment variable's value. In the case of my example this is assumption is wrong: the port number at the end of HTTP_HOST is 4 characters ('8081') and the SERVER_PORT is 2 characters long ('80'). 2. Even with this first flaw corrected, the code still fails to recognise the circumstances because it is analysing HTTP_HOST and extracting the value 'localhost'. But the ip number of this value does not even match the SERVER_ADDR environment variable's value, which is a dead giveaway. This problem disappears if virtual host definition in httpd.conf is used instead of trickery involving HTTP_HOST in listinfo.py. So also does a similar problem which occurs if the explicit ip number of the server is used in the URL given to the browser, instead of the server's domain name, assuming no ip-based virtual host has been defined in httpd.conf to map the ip number to an acceptable ServerName. OK, so you do not agree with my contention that listinfo.py should not consider HTTP_HOST because it might break a bunch of existing Mailman installations. In that case, the following changes to the FormatListinfoOverview function avoid my problems. The position here is that if: either - The ip number of the HTTP_HOST doesn't match the SERVER_ADDR. or - The URL contains the server's ip number rather than its name. then the code behaves as if the browser didn't supply an HTTP Host header: cut here-vvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvv diff -r -c2 mailman-2.0beta6.stock/Mailman/Cgi/listinfo.py mailman-2.0beta6.listinfo2/Mailman/Cgi/listinfo.py *** mailman-2.0beta6.stock/Mailman/Cgi/listinfo.py Wed Aug 2 00:10:41 2000 --- mailman-2.0beta6.listinfo2/Mailman/Cgi/listinfo.py Fri Oct 6 15:06:31 2000 *************** *** 22,25 **** --- 22,26 ---- import os import string + import socket from Mailman import mm_cfg *************** *** 62,72 **** # visited! An absolute URL would do... http_host = os.environ.get('HTTP_HOST', os.environ.get('SERVER_NAME')) - port = os.environ.get('SERVER_PORT') # strip off the port if there is one ! if port and http_host[-len(port)-1:] == ':'+port: ! http_host = http_host[:-len(port)-1] ! if mm_cfg.VIRTUAL_HOST_OVERVIEW and http_host: host_name = http_host else: host_name = mm_cfg.DEFAULT_HOST_NAME --- 63,77 ---- # visited! An absolute URL would do... http_host = os.environ.get('HTTP_HOST', os.environ.get('SERVER_NAME')) # strip off the port if there is one ! if http_host: ! http_host = string.split(http_host, ':')[0] ! host_ip = socket.gethostbyname(http_host) ! server_ip = os.environ.get('SERVER_ADDR') ! if mm_cfg.VIRTUAL_HOST_OVERVIEW and http_host and \ ! host_ip == server_ip and \ ! host_ip != http_host: host_name = http_host else: + http_host = None host_name = mm_cfg.DEFAULT_HOST_NAME cut here-^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ I have yet to post either of these above patches to sourceforge. I would appreciate a sanity check on my thinking and any rebuttal of my arguments or constructive comments. RSVP ------------------------------------------------------------------ Richard Barrett, PostPoint 30, e-mail:r.barrett@ftel.co.uk Fujitsu Telecommunications Europe Ltd, tel: (44) 121 717 6337 Solihull Parkway, Birmingham Business Park, B37 7YU, England "Democracy is two wolves and a lamb voting on what to have for lunch. Liberty is a well armed lamb contesting the vote." Benjamin Franklin, 1759 ------------------------------------------------------------------

1 0

"download the full raw archive"
by Mentor Cana 05 Oct '00

05 Oct '00

Doesn't this link run contrary to the "obscure_addresses" Option? Even if I have the obscure_addresses Option set to YES, the e-mail addresses of public archives can be still harvested by various robots out there. later, Mentor

4 3

List-* header suggestion
by John A. Martin 05 Oct '00

05 Oct '00

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 Would the long List-* header fields be more attractive and easier to read if they were folded something like the following? List-Subscribe: <http://www.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-developers>, <mailto:mailman-developers-request@python.org?subject=subscribe> List-Unsubscribe: <http://www.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-developers>, <mailto:mailman-developers-request@python.org?subject=unsubscribe> Perhaps folding after the comma would be OK unless the whole field is not greater than, say, 78 characters? jam -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.0.3 (GNU/Linux) Comment: OpenPGP encrypted mail preferred. See <http://www.gnupg.org/> iEYEARECAAYFAjnUnu8ACgkQUEvv1b/iXy9sBQCdEyGhXrxIs/9Vkpcc31wOPn7e iE8AoJPTJaw6bTSBHD1+TU5KNZVcs/ij =jNfW -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----

5 6

another weird mailman problem.
by Chuq Von Rospach 05 Oct '00

05 Oct '00

This just showed up in my logs... --- Sep 26 13:07:01 2000 (6974) Bhawks-l: lvymay(a)worldnet.fr - exceeded limits Sep 26 13:07:01 2000 (6974) Bhawks-l: disabled lvymay(a)worldnet.fr Sep 26 13:07:01 2000 (6974) Bouncer exception: body Sep 26 13:07:01 2000 (6974) Traceback (innermost last): File "/home/mailman/Mailman/Bouncers/BouncerAPI.py", line 65, in ScanMessages mlist.RegisterBounce(addr, msg) File "/home/mailman/Mailman/Bouncer.py", line 141, in RegisterBounce self.HandleBouncingAddress(addr, msg) File "/home/mailman/Mailman/Bouncer.py", line 236, in HandleBouncingAddress text = text + \ AttributeError: body ---- I don't remember seeing this one before. -- Chuq Von Rospach - Plaidworks Consulting (mailto:chuqui@plaidworks.com) Apple Mail List Gnome (mailto:chuq@apple.com) And they sit at the bar and put bread in my jar and say 'Man, what are you doing here?'"

3 2

Re: [Mailman-Developers] broken CVS!
by Dan Mick 04 Oct '00

04 Oct '00

> >>>>> "CVR" == Chuq Von Rospach <chuqui(a)plaidworks.com> writes: > > CVR> I just updated to the current CVS, and it's broken: > > CVR> Traceback (innermost last): > CVR> File "/home/mailman/cron/qrunner", line 85, in ? from > CVR> Mailman import MailList File > CVR> "/home/mailman/Mailman/MailList.py", line 45, in ? from > CVR> Mailman.Archiver import Archiver File > CVR> "/home/mailman/Mailman/Archiver/__init__.py", line 17, in ? > CVR> from Archiver import * File > CVR> "/home/mailman/Mailman/Archiver/Archiver.py", line 33, in ? > CVR> from Mailman import Mailbox File > CVR> "/home/mailman/Mailman/Mailbox.py", line 43 <<<<<<< > CVR> Mailbox.py ^ > CVR> SyntaxError: invalid syntax > > When you updated, did you see a file that got checked out with a `C' > status letter? That means that something in your local version > conflicts with some changes in the master copy, and CVS can't resolve > it. You have to resolve the conflicts manually. Yeah, I hate that CVS is so silent about that. I've taken to doing "find . -type f | xargs grep '<<<<<'" every time I do "cvs update" (in a script). The stuff it leaves behind is *clearly* not usable, so I think there should be a big huge warning when it happens, and even an "invoke $EDITOR on the manual-merge-needy". But that's me.

4 3

broken CVS!
by Chuq Von Rospach 04 Oct '00

04 Oct '00

I just updated to the current CVS, and it's broken: Traceback (innermost last): File "/home/mailman/cron/qrunner", line 85, in ? from Mailman import MailList File "/home/mailman/Mailman/MailList.py", line 45, in ? from Mailman.Archiver import Archiver File "/home/mailman/Mailman/Archiver/__init__.py", line 17, in ? from Archiver import * File "/home/mailman/Mailman/Archiver/Archiver.py", line 33, in ? from Mailman import Mailbox File "/home/mailman/Mailman/Mailbox.py", line 43 <<<<<<< Mailbox.py ^ SyntaxError: invalid syntax -- Chuq Von Rospach - Plaidworks Consulting (mailto:chuqui@plaidworks.com) Apple Mail List Gnome (mailto:chuq@apple.com) You seem a decent fellow. I hate to die.

2 3

Re: Cron <mailman@plaidworks> /usr/bin/python -S /home/mailman/cron/qrunner
by Chuq Von Rospach 03 Oct '00

03 Oct '00

Okay, I've tracked this down. Mailman had a probelm with the temporary patch I installed to fix the empty-archive thing, so it didn't patch in cleanly. when I updated to the CVS, the merge botched. it's not a problem, if you installed the SECOND patch barry released, or didn't patch it at all. At 3:01 PM -0700 10/3/00, Cron Daemon wrote: >Traceback (innermost last): > File "/home/mailman/cron/qrunner", line 85, in ? > from Mailman import MailList > File "/home/mailman/Mailman/MailList.py", line 45, in ? > from Mailman.Archiver import Archiver > File "/home/mailman/Mailman/Archiver/__init__.py", line 17, in ? > from Archiver import * > File "/home/mailman/Mailman/Archiver/Archiver.py", line 33, in ? > from Mailman import Mailbox > File "/home/mailman/Mailman/Mailbox.py", line 43 > <<<<<<< Mailbox.py > ^ >SyntaxError: invalid syntax -- Chuq Von Rospach - Plaidworks Consulting (mailto:chuqui@plaidworks.com) Apple Mail List Gnome (mailto:chuq@apple.com) You seem a decent fellow. I hate to die.

1 0

Itchy, and thus subscribing
by Jeff Waugh 02 Oct '00

02 Oct '00

Hi all, I'm just kicking in with Python, having had an insane Python devotee whispering it in my ear for the past six months, so I've been looking for code to peruse, and hopefully contribute to. Given that I use mailman on a daily basis (actively and passively), and I have a couple of itches, I thought I should join up, and read up. One thing I'd like to do, that doesn't seem to appear on the TODO list, is provide an extra option for moderators: bouncing to another address. Dealing with a few lists, I find that some useful emails are sent to inappropriate addresses, and it would be cool to just bounce 'em out instead of cutting them off. Anyhow, I have to go read the code before I get all ambitious, don't I? Of course, I ought to thank you all for a kickarse piece of software too. :) - Jeff -- jdub(a)aphid.net ----------------------------------- http://slug.org.au/ -- Ye shall be cursed to fall in love so easily, and yet be so cold of heart as never to express it.

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Great Job!
by Roy Harvey 01 Oct '00

01 Oct '00

Dearest Cabal -- I just want to say that Mailman is a fantastic peice of engineering. Easy to setup, clean documentation, awesome feature set -- WOW! Sincerely, Roy Harvey roy(a)lamrim.com http://www.lamrim.com/ Tibetan Buddhist Internet Radio

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Re: [Mailman-Developers] List-* header suggestion
by Nigel Metheringham 30 Sep '00

30 Sep '00

jarrell(a)vt.edu said: > Umm, the headers *are* folded.. In the very note that arrived from > you, they were folded that way. Unless a friendly MTA on the way to > me folded them for me, or unfolded them for you... chuqui(a)plaidworks.com said: > they aren't on my site, ron -- it' spossible you have an MTA that > *is* folding them for you. Does it do laundry, too? > Folding them would be a good idea, IMHO. I see the ones on the mailman-* lists as folded. I see the ones from the exim lists (again Mailman 2.0beta6) as unfolded. An MTA is playing silly games with the headers which is normally the sort of gratuitous fiddling that sendmail does... except the system that is playing games appears to be a postfix one (I expected better from Wietse). I do agree that they *should* be folded by mailman when generated. BTW Ron, any chance you could get rid of the gratuitous HTML multiparts. [They bugger the archives apart from anything else] Nigel. -- [ - Opinions expressed are personal and may not be shared by VData - ] [ Nigel Metheringham Nigel.Metheringham(a)VData.co.uk ] [ Phone: +44 1423 850000 Fax +44 1423 858866 ]

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bug report
by Gunther Stammwitz 30 Sep '00

30 Sep '00

Bug in Mailman version 1.1 We're sorry, we hit a bug! If you would like to help us identify the problem, please email a copy of this page to the webmaster for this site with a description of what happened. Thanks! Traceback: Traceback (innermost last): File "/home/mailman/scripts/driver", line 112, in run_main main() File "/home/mailman/Mailman/Cgi/admindb.py", line 83, in main is_auth = list.WebAuthenticate(password=adminpw, File "/home/mailman/Mailman/SecurityManager.py", line 83, in WebAuthenticate return self.CheckCookie(cookie_key) File "/home/mailman/Mailman/SecurityManager.py", line 117, in CheckCookie if cookiedata[keylen+1] <> '"' and cookiedata[-1] <> '"': IndexError: string index out of range -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Environment variables: Variable Value DOCUMENT_ROOT /usr/local/httpd/htdocs SERVER_ADDR 195.94.87.243 HTTP_ACCEPT_ENCODING gzip, deflate REMOTE_HOST pd9017f5b.dip.t-dialin.net SERVER_PORT 80 PATH_TRANSLATED /usr/local/httpd/htdocs/hvgg-abi2001 REMOTE_ADDR 217.1.127.91 UNIQUE_ID OdZpCcNeV-IAACOrLQs HTTP_ACCEPT_LANGUAGE de GATEWAY_INTERFACE CGI/1.1 SERVER_NAME www.edu-search.de HTTP_CONNECTION Keep-Alive HTTP_USER_AGENT Mozilla/4.0 (compatible; MSIE 5.5; Windows 98; QXW03304) HTTP_ACCEPT image/gif, image/x-xbitmap, image/jpeg, image/pjpeg, application/vnd.ms-excel, application/msword, application/vnd.ms-powerpoint, */* REQUEST_URI /mailman/admindb/hvgg-abi2001 PATH /sbin:/bin:/usr/sbin:/usr/bin QUERY_STRING SCRIPT_FILENAME /home/mailman/cgi-bin/admindb PATH_INFO /hvgg-abi2001 HTTP_HOST www.edu-search.de REQUEST_METHOD GET SERVER_SIGNATURE SCRIPT_NAME /mailman/admindb SERVER_ADMIN root(a)edu-search.de SERVER_SOFTWARE Apache/1.3.12 (SuSE/Linux) PYTHONPATH /home/mailman HTTP_COOKIE sid=1033263952 SERVER_PROTOCOL HTTP/1.1 REMOTE_PORT 1614

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