Ah - I had forgotten the ~mailman/bin/withlist script. Sorry, folks,
still just getting back into Mailman. If it works as advertised, then I
also vote for the changes Barry is recommending. It makes Mailman
completely compatible with the type of CMS integration I'm describing.
Joel's point about passwords being one-way "You put it in, and you
can't get it back" is perfectly true.
Cheers,
Tobias
On Feb 10, 2005, at 11:17 AM, Tobias Eigen wrote:
Hi Barry,
While you're on this subject, I was intrigued by the password
resetting script but was disappointed that there is no way to actually
configure the password on the command-line. I was thinking this would
enable integration of Mailman subscriptions into an existing user
database (i.e. via a nightly cron). If you use a commonly used
encryption, then doing this on the command line shouldn't pose any
security issues. On Kabissa this would be a key aspect to making
Mailman continue to work as our list manager of choice for e-mail
newsletters and discussions in our CMS of choice, Mambo Open Source.Then again, if you're thinking of rewriting how passwords are kept,
perhaps it might be useful to think about using a different type of
container anyway, one that works with other, more sophisticated user
management systems like those that come with CMSs. I.e. LDAP or simply
mysql.And this, plus the CAN prefix to the patch name, reminds me: correct
me if I'm wrong, but my understanding is that Mailman as it exists
does not comply with the new (unfortunately named) CAN SPAM act.
According to this act, a recipient of an email from a given site has
to be able to opt out from receiving ANY MAIL from that site. Right
now all mailman lists are treated completely separately, and nobody
(not even the subscriber) can easily find out which lists subscribers
are subscribed to. What I envision having in my Mailman/Mambo system
is a single user database with one password per username for all
services. Users can then go to a simple preferences page on Mambo and
do basic things like change their email address or password, tick a
box to opt in/out of various mailings, and in particular opt to
receive no mail at all. Other Mambo components would handle reading
forums and newsletters online and enable users to
subscribe/unsubscribe to them.If anybody's got any suggestions on how to achieve this or is
interested in working with us to develop this functionality, let me
know.Cheers,
Tobias
On Feb 10, 2005, at 10:02 AM, Barry Warsaw wrote:
I think CAN-2005-0202 gives us the opportunity to finally implement
what we have long considered an embarrassing exposure in Mailman's
config.pck databases. Member passwords are kept in this database in the clear. The obvious fix is to hash member passwords and keep only the hash in the database.We haven't changed this before now for two reasons:
We would have to regenerate all member passwords, which is an administrative burden. We might also need to implement checks to see
if the passwords were cleartext or hashed and do the password comparison accordingly.This breaks all password reminders.
To fully address CAN-2005-0202 we're recommending sites regenerate
their member passwords anyway, so this gives us an opening to fix this properly. And we have a better internal password generator now too.As for #2, well, I think most people hate those password reminders anyway, and we've decided that they are going away for MM3. I don't think many people would shed too many tears if we killed off monthly password reminders for 2.1.6. Doing that would also eliminate the requirement for the site list, since its primary purpose is to
function as the sender of the reminder messages.To do this for 2.1.6, we'd have to change the "Email My Password To
Me" feature in the options page and in the member login page. These would have to become a "create a new password for me" feature. Also, crontab.in should not call mailpasswds anymore, or that script should turn into a simple "here's the lists you are on" reminder, without the password information in it. This will require i18n updates too.The downside to doing this now is that it's more coding work for 2.1.6 and I'd like to get the new version out asap. Still, this seems like
an opportunity that we shouldn't lightly dismiss.What do you all think? Is anybody willing to take a crack at a patch for this?
-Barry
Mailman-Developers mailing list Mailman-Developers@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-developers Mailman FAQ: http://www.python.org/cgi-bin/faqw-mm.py Searchable Archives:
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http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/mailman-developers/ tobias%40kabissa.orgTobias Eigen Executive Director
Kabissa - Space for Change in Africa http://www.kabissa.org
- Kabissa's vision is for a socially, economically, politically, and
environmentally vibrant Africa, supported by a strong network of
effective civil society organizations. *
Mailman-Developers mailing list Mailman-Developers@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-developers Mailman FAQ: http://www.python.org/cgi-bin/faqw-mm.py Searchable Archives:
http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users%40python.org/ Unsubscribe:
http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/mailman-developers/ tobias%40kabissa.org
-- Tobias Eigen Executive Director
Kabissa - Space for Change in Africa http://www.kabissa.org
- Kabissa's vision is for a socially, economically, politically, and
environmentally vibrant Africa, supported by a strong network of
effective civil society organizations. *