Re: [Mailman-Developers] why no user disable of the monthly reminder?
On Sat, 02 Jun 2001 17:50:20 -0700 Dan Mick <dmick@utopia.West.Sun.COM> wrote:
You would go to the trouble of setting up a filter for a *monthly* message?
When I was only on a couple Mailman-run lists I didn't bother. Now I get twenty or password reminder messages a month.
-- J C Lawrence claw@kanga.nu ---------(*) http://www.kanga.nu/~claw/ The pressure to survive and rhetoric may make strange bedfellows
On Saturday, June 2, 2001, at 11:20 PM, J C Lawrence wrote:
When I was only on a couple Mailman-run lists I didn't bother. Now I get twenty or password reminder messages a month.
A good reason, by the way, to be able to set things up so these messages are spread out across the month, not everyone sending them out from every installation on the same day for every list. (I realize people can tweak the crontab. nobody does).
I'd really prefer these things be per-list, not per-site. And customizable, so I can, for instance, include pointers to the FAQ, archives, list rules, or whatever. And then be able to configure when they go out for each list.
I also really wish mailpasswd had checkpoints, so if it dies, it'd restart where it left off -- my big mailman box has been mailing out password notices since friday night, for instance, and while I expect it to finish sometime today, this is a situation just fraught with potential problems. What I'd *really* like, if we must do this on a site-wide basis is to run mailpasswd every night, and tell it, say, to send out 5,000 per night, and keep track of where it left off. Having to run it manually because on a site as big as this one it has to happen on a weekend kinda bites.
Oh, and one more thing (thanks for reminding me). the password reminders aren't really hooked into the bounce-processed setup, since they get sent back to a list admin address, and not necessarily one the user is actually subscribed to. We're losing a major opportunity to clean up the mail lists here, especially when it comes to non-standard mailers and forwarded addresses. These really ought to be sent from a special address with a special envelope, so returns can be processed for site-wide removal (IMHO, if the password reminder bounces for any reason, that qualifies as removal. I'm going to have to pull the data out of bounce files monday and manually hack something up...
-- Chuq Von Rospach, Internet Gnome <http://www.chuqui.com> [<chuqui@plaidworks.com> = <me@chuqui.com> = <chuq@apple.com>] Yes, yes, I've finally finished my home page. Lucky you.
Q: Did God really create the world in seven days? A: He did it in six days and nights while living on cola and candy bars. On the seventh day he went home and found out his girlfriend had left him.
On Sun, Jun 03, 2001 at 07:22:36AM -0700, Chuq Von Rospach wrote:
potential problems. What I'd *really* like, if we must do this on a site-wide basis is to run mailpasswd every night, and tell it, say, to send out 5,000 per night, and keep track of where it left off. Having to run it manually because on a site as big as this one it has to happen on a weekend kinda bites.
Hey, Chuq?
I asked this before, but I don't remember you weighing in, and I suspect you might have something useful to say...
I'm trying to get Mailman to behave itself as a *broadcast* list manager (rather than for discussion), and I need to throttle the *actual mail* that way (x thousand per day).
Where might be the best place to put something like that?
Cheers, -- jra
Jay R. Ashworth jra@baylink.com Member of the Technical Staff Baylink The Suncoast Freenet The Things I Think Tampa Bay, Florida http://baylink.pitas.com +1 727 804 5015
OS/X: Because making Unix user-friendly was easier than debugging Windows
On Sunday, June 3, 2001, at 07:27 AM, Jay R. Ashworth wrote:
I asked this before, but I don't remember you weighing in, and I suspect you might have something useful to say...
I'm trying to get Mailman to behave itself as a *broadcast* list manager (rather than for discussion), and I need to throttle the *actual mail* that way (x thousand per day).
Where might be the best place to put something like that?
Good question -- I don't use mailman for this, all of my broadcast work is with a custom front-end, and it usually talks to bulk_mailer on the back end, and I build the rate limiting into a custom version of bulk_mailer.
I'm not sure how I'd do this with mailman; you really need to be able to pull subsets of subscriber data out in a reproducible format, and keep track of a highwater mark so you can restart delivery from the next address. I'm sure you could do something with the cli scripting, but you end up doing most of the work outside of mailman, including delivery, so you end up with basically a custom setup.
What I'd do in this case is add a uniq id flag to the database, so I could teach mailman to "mail 4000 messages in list foo starting with id 1", and then track what the last one did, and iterate nightly until everyone's delivery. Something like that. It isn't too complicated, but it requires keeping a lot more state than mailman is set up to keep. but -- thinking about it -- if this were set up as a generalized functionality for lists, then password reminders then becomes an instance of this functionality, not a specialty mailing or a custom program like mailpasswd. you simply schedule a password reminder into this subsystem via cron then....
-- Chuq Von Rospach, Internet Gnome <http://www.chuqui.com> [<chuqui@plaidworks.com> = <me@chuqui.com> = <chuq@apple.com>] Yes, yes, I've finally finished my home page. Lucky you.
Any connection between your reality and mine is purely coincidental.
On Sun, Jun 03, 2001 at 07:39:32AM -0700, Chuq Von Rospach wrote:
I'm trying to get Mailman to behave itself as a *broadcast* list manager (rather than for discussion), and I need to throttle the *actual mail* that way (x thousand per day). Where might be the best place to put something like that?
Good question -- I don't use mailman for this, all of my broadcast work is with a custom front-end, and it usually talks to bulk_mailer on the back end, and I build the rate limiting into a custom version of bulk_mailer.
Um... should I know about that, instead? I'm not married to mailman for this...
Cheers, -- jra
Jay R. Ashworth jra@baylink.com Member of the Technical Staff Baylink The Suncoast Freenet The Things I Think Tampa Bay, Florida http://baylink.pitas.com +1 727 804 5015
OS/X: Because making Unix user-friendly was easier than debugging Windows
On Sunday, June 3, 2001, at 07:44 AM, Jay R. Ashworth wrote:
Good question -- I don't use mailman for this, all of my broadcast work is with a custom front-end, and it usually talks to bulk_mailer on the back end, and I build the rate limiting into a custom version of bulk_mailer.
Um... should I know about that, instead? I'm not married to mailman for this...
Not necessarily. Bulk_mailer is a tool written for majordomo installations that splits up deliveries into small batches. postfix can do this using the default_destination_concurrency_limit option, so if you're using postfix, you don't really need it. Once I finish migration, I'll rewrite my sending tools to take advantage of that isntead of using bulk_mailer, and phase it out (bulk_mailer also does some other stuff, like set up some headers, but my custom tools can easily do that as well)
my front ends are just custom perl scripts that take pieces of content and address lists and puts it together. Nothing fancy (and not distributable), and all really stop-gap stuff while I write a real publishing tool for this stuff, which is the project I'm designing now (we want to be able to send out fully-customized e-mail using a template system with volume up to about 500K an hour, with full versioning control of the content and automatic access of the user data from the corporate database. A fun summer project)
I have to keep reminding people in my company that want to borrow my tools that the tolls I'm currently using are very stupid; it's the person hacking them that is doing most of the work. Once I finish this new mail publishing system, the tools will be smart, but since it's designed for corporate use, they won't need to borrow the tools, just have an account on them...
-- Chuq Von Rospach, Internet Gnome <http://www.chuqui.com> [<chuqui@plaidworks.com> = <me@chuqui.com> = <chuq@apple.com>] Yes, yes, I've finally finished my home page. Lucky you.
Any connection between your reality and mine is purely coincidental.
participants (3)
-
Chuq Von Rospach -
J C Lawrence -
Jay R. Ashworth