Hi All, Just joined this list, and am intersted in adding Hebrew support. Where can I find all the information I need to add the support? Dov Zamir.
Dov Zamir wrote:
Just joined this list, and am intersted in adding Hebrew support. Where can I find all the information I need to add the support?
You can start at <http://wiki.list.org/display/DEV/Internationalization>. -- Mark Sapiro <msapiro@value.net> The highway is for gamblers, San Francisco Bay Area, California better use your sense - B. Dylan
Dov Zamir wrote:
Just joined this list, and am intersted in adding Hebrew support. Where can I find all the information I need to add the support?
You can start at <http://wiki.list.org/display/DEV/Internationalization>.
Hi Mark, I have now finished translating the Mailman package to Hebrew, although I am certain that there are still many errors. In any case, I understand that I should send the translation on to you. Do I do this on or off list? Also, is there a way I can see the results of my translation? Can I compile Mailman with Hebrew support enabled? I tried to compile the package that I downloaded, but it complianed that it was unable to import Korean:-( TIA Dov Zamir
-- Mark Sapiro <msapiro@value.net> The highway is for gamblers, San Francisco Bay Area, California better use your sense - B. Dylan
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-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 Hi Dov, On Mar 20, 2007, at 10:54 AM, Dov Zamir wrote:
I have now finished translating the Mailman package to Hebrew, although I am certain that there are still many errors. In any case, I understand that I should send the translation on to you. Do I do this on or off list?
It's probably best to open a patch issue on SourceForge and attach your .po file to the patch. Then send a link to that issue here. One of us will pull it into svn from there.
Also, is there a way I can see the results of my translation? Can I compile Mailman with Hebrew support enabled?
You can. There's a few things you'll need to do to make your translations available to you (we should really make this much easier). You'll have to add an entry for it in Defaults.py.in -- just cargo cult it in from one of the other languages, changing the language code and charset as appropriate. You'll need to add the directory structure until messages (and possibly templates too, if you've translated them) and then update the Makefile.in's to include Hebrew's language code. Put your .po file in the right place, then re-run ./configure; make; make install. Let us know if you get stuck anywhere. I can probably try to pay attention to the #mailman channel on irc.freenode.net to walk you through it if you want.
I tried to compile the package that I downloaded, but it complianed that it was unable to import Korean:-(
Blech. What version of Python are you using? I would suggest 2.4.4 and then you won't need those add-on codecs. Cheers, - -Barry -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.5 (Darwin) iQCVAwUBRgFqNHEjvBPtnXfVAQIuJAP+OkqT9/I3UjK1iS0+JayTEm6R6B+tYbsp ozvhXQ978OR+xrxUouOqMiIqA3h6EHVK5SfeLuZpYdsw0Ln/bdukjxDcQMopMRJN lEqfijLs9XhiqkMjYDJjlhjysTxdr55NrtsuGm54eRWezna19YgaYybAYAIefHL/ JAn43Nm9ssk= =KEEb -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----
????? Barry Warsaw:
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Hi Dov,
On Mar 20, 2007, at 10:54 AM, Dov Zamir wrote:
I have now finished translating the Mailman package to Hebrew, although I am certain that there are still many errors. In any case, I understand that I should send the translation on to you. Do I do this on or off list?
It's probably best to open a patch issue on SourceForge and attach your .po file to the patch. Then send a link to that issue here. One of us will pull it into svn from there. OK, Will do. I just want to see how it looks first, and get rid of any obvious bads.
Also, is there a way I can see the results of my translation? Can I compile Mailman with Hebrew support enabled?
You can. There's a few things you'll need to do to make your translations available to you (we should really make this much easier). You'll have to add an entry for it in Defaults.py.in -- just cargo cult it in from one of the other languages, changing the language code and charset as appropriate.
You'll need to add the directory structure until messages (and possibly templates too, if you've translated them) and then update the Makefile.in's to include Hebrew's language code. Put your .po file in the right place, then re-run ./configure; make; make install.
Let us know if you get stuck anywhere. I can probably try to pay attention to the #mailman channel on irc.freenode.net to walk you through it if you want.
OK, thanks. I missed the makefiles part myself. Fixed now.
I tried to compile the package that I downloaded, but it complianed that it was unable to import Korean:-(
Blech. What version of Python are you using? I would suggest 2.4.4 and then you won't need those add-on codecs.
I do have Python 2.4.4 - but it still complains. Can I just import the Korean? If so, how?
Cheers, - -Barry
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Hi Barry, ????? Barry Warsaw:
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Hi Dov,
On Mar 20, 2007, at 10:54 AM, Dov Zamir wrote:
I have now finished translating the Mailman package to Hebrew, although I am certain that there are still many errors. In any case, I understand that I should send the translation on to you. Do I do this on or off list?
It's probably best to open a patch issue on SourceForge and attach your .po file to the patch. Then send a link to that issue here. One of us will pull it into svn from there.
Also, is there a way I can see the results of my translation? Can I compile Mailman with Hebrew support enabled?
You can. There's a few things you'll need to do to make your translations available to you (we should really make this much easier). You'll have to add an entry for it in Defaults.py.in -- just cargo cult it in from one of the other languages, changing the language code and charset as appropriate.
You'll need to add the directory structure until messages (and possibly templates too, if you've translated them) and then update the Makefile.in's to include Hebrew's language code. Put your .po file in the right place, then re-run ./configure; make; make install.
Let us know if you get stuck anywhere. I can probably try to pay attention to the #mailman channel on irc.freenode.net to walk you through it if you want.
I tried to compile the package that I downloaded, but it complianed that it was unable to import Korean:-(
Blech. What version of Python are you using? I would suggest 2.4.4 and then you won't need those add-on codecs. A little more investigation shows that there is script under .../mailman/bin called paths.py, which explicitly imports Korean and Japanese. Here's the error message:
Compiling /usr/local/mailman/Mailman/versions.py ... Traceback (most recent call last): File "bin/update", line 46, in ? import paths File "/usr/local/mailman/bin/paths.py", line 60, in ? import korean ImportError: No module named korean make: *** [update] 1 ???? (Sorry for the Hebrew)
Cheers, - -Barry
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-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 Hi Dov, On Mar 21, 2007, at 4:27 PM, Dov Zamir wrote:
A little more investigation shows that there is script under .../ mailman/bin called paths.py, which explicitly imports Korean and Japanese. Here's the error message:
Compiling /usr/local/mailman/Mailman/versions.py ... Traceback (most recent call last): File "bin/update", line 46, in ? import paths File "/usr/local/mailman/bin/paths.py", line 60, in ? import korean ImportError: No module named korean make: *** [update] 1 ????
Look carefully higher up in your build output. Did you get errors while trying to build those codecs? You could always just disable those (comment them out) from paths.py.in, since you probably won't need them. Be sure to re-run configure; make; make install if you do though.
(Sorry for the Hebrew)
Unfortunately, Mail.app apparently can't show the Hebrew to me, which is too bad 'cause I'd love to see it! - -Barry -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.5 (Darwin) iQCVAwUBRgGX8nEjvBPtnXfVAQIocAQAmWKBjm/JaQhZhd35PeV8KsXpxFuZ7d+R sD9uOKgVlBbAUTOJ2GSb8JbE7aaGBYMxxf7d0D6gX9z9Sd5P2/McORU2FWh+JmRT u4m4UwtgXeQ9xaI121Hq+pDKoZVXNDT2GwRV6WggMKndJUnGYM6kk9VpcdWc6CYx sZDRqluoFsw= =J6AC -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----
ציטוט Barry Warsaw:
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Hi Dov,
On Mar 21, 2007, at 4:27 PM, Dov Zamir wrote:
A little more investigation shows that there is script under .../mailman/bin called paths.py, which explicitly imports Korean and Japanese. Here's the error message:
Compiling /usr/local/mailman/Mailman/versions.py ... Traceback (most recent call last): File "bin/update", line 46, in ? import paths File "/usr/local/mailman/bin/paths.py", line 60, in ? import korean ImportError: No module named korean make: *** [update] 1 ????
Look carefully higher up in your build output. Did you get errors while trying to build those codecs? You could always just disable those (comment them out) from paths.py.in, since you probably won't need them. Be sure to re-run configure; make; make install if you do though. Yes, that's exactly what I did. I got it compiled. Will continue tommorow (it's getting too late to start something like this). Thanks for your help.
(Sorry for the Hebrew)
Unfortunately, Mail.app apparently can't show the Hebrew to me, which is too bad 'cause I'd love to see it!
- -Barry
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-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 On Mar 21, 2007, at 4:51 PM, Dov Zamir wrote:
ציטוט Barry Warsaw:
Yes, that's exactly what I did. I got it compiled. Will continue tommorow (it's getting too late to start something like this). Thanks for your help.
Cool. And I see the Hebrew this time! :) What's pretty interesting though is that Mail.app displayed that first line with the Hebrew text to the right of my name, but when it included the quote, it switched those two. I'm not actually sure which one is correct. - -Barryh -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.5 (Darwin) iQCVAwUBRgGk1nEjvBPtnXfVAQJljQP/VDwUkmgRxJtcf9hn4qU8y6Uwgmg5QNk7 gb1ShV0OxOz/EOWlBpkhaxWe2ruuCw/wIIzD24dHlzykgb0j2QK/SY7luv9VT5ft LBJi1kFTkImMOCt6R5/qeQeuIVkM22FGxiwZFgUBWvhOiJUh3SeOKZRn3lRWcPMd FgG7pKJ2AG0= =LM8w -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----
ציטוט Barry Warsaw:
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On Mar 21, 2007, at 4:51 PM, Dov Zamir wrote:
ציטוט Barry Warsaw:
Yes, that's exactly what I did. I got it compiled. Will continue tommorow (it's getting too late to start something like this). Thanks for your help.
Cool. And I see the Hebrew this time! :) What's pretty interesting though is that Mail.app displayed that first line with the Hebrew text to the right of my name, but when it included the quote, it switched those two. I'm not actually sure which one is correct.
- -Barryh Correct would be to the left of your name. It came back to me displayed correctly.
Dov.
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-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 On Mar 22, 2007, at 1:24 AM, Dov Zamir wrote:
ציטוט Barry Warsaw:
Cool. And I see the Hebrew this time! :) What's pretty interesting though is that Mail.app displayed that first line with the Hebrew text to the right of my name, but when it included the quote, it switched those two. I'm not actually sure which one is correct.
Correct would be to the left of your name. It came back to me displayed correctly.
Very interesting. I guess that's a bug in Mail.app. - -Barry -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.5 (Darwin) iQCVAwUBRgKd6HEjvBPtnXfVAQLEuwQAmW/QFMxnRC91R/0PS9XI/VDb71GCRrZc hLNfwPCezsG7O2aZqKzeYE7oMibEpqdfJdL2Zs9893S/QkverPMES0HYdd4CDcde pLkDsBsaj2pAuR5hQB+62KYBuDSC7VZE+McO2B6ZvfmpRH4aSjdyYUn7l50BAhcx AmNqntyY+dM= =LCYw -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----
Hi Barry, Here are the bads: 1) There is no "natural" way to get web pages that do not have an explicit <BODY...> directive to display RTL without changing some code. 2) Command line scripts show up backwards and LTR. To slove 1), I can add a piece of code to htmlformat.py to either read a new variable called dir from the .po file, and default to dir="ltr" if it isn't defined, or explicitly change it to dir="rtl" if language is "he". How did they solve this in Arabic? One workaround that I used is to add WEB_BG_COLOR = 'white\" dir=\"rtl' in mm_cfg.py, but it works globally, and changes the direction of pages in any language. Solving 2) is much more complicated. I may have to either leave the scripts in English, or enter the text backwards. Seems that entering text backwards will be painstaking to enter extremely dificult to maintain, but not impossible. Again, how did they solve this in Arabic? Does anybody listening have a suggestion? -Dov- _________________________________________________________________________ This message has been scanned by Kibbutz Beit Kama's Anti Virus software, and is believed to be clean of any viruses. _________________________________________________________________________
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 Hi Dov, On Mar 23, 2007, at 9:32 AM, Dov Zamir wrote:
1) There is no "natural" way to get web pages that do not have an explicit <BODY...> directive to display RTL without changing some code. 2) Command line scripts show up backwards and LTR.
To slove 1), I can add a piece of code to htmlformat.py to either read a new variable called dir from the .po file, and default to dir="ltr" if it isn't defined, or explicitly change it to dir="rtl" if language is "he". How did they solve this in Arabic?
'dir' is a variable in the .po file? I like the former solution better because it is more general. I don't know which other languages than Hebrew and Arabic are rtl, but if the standard approach is to define this in the .po file, then I think that's where we should be reading that out of. I don't want to have to special case any languages if possible. A clean patch to fix this should be accepted into Mailman 2.1 (the svn trunk probably will generate web pages in a totally different way, so only patch that if you feel like it).
One workaround that I used is to add WEB_BG_COLOR = 'white\" dir= \"rtl' in mm_cfg.py, but it works globally, and changes the direction of pages in any language.
Solving 2) is much more complicated. I may have to either leave the scripts in English, or enter the text backwards. Seems that entering text backwards will be painstaking to enter extremely dificult to maintain, but not impossible. Again, how did they solve this in Arabic?
Neither of those solutions seems very good. Unfortunately, I don't have any good suggestions. Perhaps if no one here can help you can contact the Python i18n-sig to see if anyone there has better suggestions. I can also ask around on the Canonical lists to see if any Rosetta experts have suggestions. Can you provide a few standalone examples? - -Barry -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.5 (Darwin) iQCVAwUBRgPdu3EjvBPtnXfVAQKEXQQAgodAf8anTi8BugKIziE4ZzYzkF1grD8A lbB88vJ2NUccziqoSp5LrF7eyfnGXZK6Z6egerNtjM/8qalkNeCK6a33+I+JnnNr kHCA+p/3HZ2YNozSyMZiWSW30UDf7PXlSxdYELWu+0Dw6oKRsomJq+ExDjC+C1as sWpr5F7Usa8= =Sawo -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----
ציטוט Barry Warsaw:
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Hi Dov,
On Mar 23, 2007, at 9:32 AM, Dov Zamir wrote:
1) There is no "natural" way to get web pages that do not have an explicit <BODY...> directive to display RTL without changing some code. 2) Command line scripts show up backwards and LTR.
To slove 1), I can add a piece of code to htmlformat.py to either read a new variable called dir from the .po file, and default to dir="ltr" if it isn't defined, or explicitly change it to dir="rtl" if language is "he". How did they solve this in Arabic?
'dir' is a variable in the .po file? I like the former solution better because it is more general. I don't know which other languages than Hebrew and Arabic are rtl, but if the standard approach is to define this in the .po file, then I think that's where we should be reading that out of. I don't want to have to special case any languages if possible.
A clean patch to fix this should be accepted into Mailman 2.1 (the svn trunk probably will generate web pages in a totally different way, so only patch that if you feel like it). 'dir' is not, at the moment there. I was asking if we could add it. I can do the coding and send in a diff. It's a general solution, and has been done before. Thai is also RTL. I beleive these three are the only RTL languages.
One workaround that I used is to add WEB_BG_COLOR = 'white\" dir=\"rtl' in mm_cfg.py, but it works globally, and changes the direction of pages in any language.
Solving 2) is much more complicated. I may have to either leave the scripts in English, or enter the text backwards. Seems that entering text backwards will be painstaking to enter extremely dificult to maintain, but not impossible. Again, how did they solve this in Arabic?
Neither of those solutions seems very good. Unfortunately, I don't have any good suggestions. Perhaps if no one here can help you can contact the Python i18n-sig to see if anyone there has better suggestions. I can also ask around on the Canonical lists to see if any Rosetta experts have suggestions. Can you provide a few standalone examples? What kind of examples do you need? Every script I run is an example. Do you want a screenshot?
- -Barry
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?????Barry Warsaw:
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It's probably best to open a patch issue on SourceForge and attach your .po file to the patch. Then send a link to that issue here. One of us will pull it into svn from there.
I have just uploaded the Hebrew translation files to Sourceforge as issue number 1696053. Here is the attached description: Attached are the Hebrew files for Mailman 2.1.9 I added a parameter to the LC_DESCRIPTION function, and these are the files that are affected by the addition of 'direction' to the 'LC_DESCRIPTION' function. They have been changed, and diffs are attached... ./Mailman/Cgi/create.py ./Mailman/Defaults.py.in ./Mailman/Defaults.py ./Mailman/Utils.py ./messages/es/README.es ./messages/ja/README.ja ./messages/ja/doc/Defaults.py.in ./messages/eu/README.eu Likewise, all translation files are attached. There is still a problem displaying command line output in the correct direction. Still looking for a solution...
Hi all, I am resending this email, as well as to the other mailing lists, since I have received zero feedback since sending the original over two weeks ago. Should I assume there is no interest in this translation, and just keep it for my own sites? ציטוט Dov Zamir:
ציטוט Barry Warsaw:
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It's probably best to open a patch issue on SourceForge and attach your .po file to the patch. Then send a link to that issue here. One of us will pull it into svn from there.
I have just uploaded the Hebrew translation files to Sourceforge as issue number 1696053. Here is the attached description:
Attached are the Hebrew files for Mailman 2.1.9 I added a parameter to the LC_DESCRIPTION function, and these are the files that are affected by the addition of 'direction' to the 'LC_DESCRIPTION' function. They have been changed, and diffs are attached...
./Mailman/Cgi/create.py ./Mailman/Defaults.py.in ./Mailman/Defaults.py ./Mailman/Utils.py ./messages/es/README.es ./messages/ja/README.ja ./messages/ja/doc/Defaults.py.in ./messages/eu/README.eu
Likewise, all translation files are attached.
There is still a problem displaying command line output in the correct direction. Still looking for a solution... !DSPAM:506,4617aaa384346205613798! ------------------------------------------------------------------------
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-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 On Apr 23, 2007, at 11:04 AM, Dov Zamir wrote:
I am resending this email, as well as to the other mailing lists, since I have received zero feedback since sending the original over two weeks ago.
Should I assume there is no interest in this translation, and just keep it for my own sites?
Dov, I'm sorry. It's definitely been on my list of things to do, but I just haven't had time yet. We will definitely get it in for a Mailman 2.1.10 release. Thanks, - -Barry -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.5 (Darwin) iQCVAwUBRizjT3EjvBPtnXfVAQJ1BQP/akGQ0hxsT3Kl9p+xfuhOtQV7HUSnXQdr boA4uvfGtB1mN/yRC3YQklDPaklSgLowx+WMKxNcloxWkVgWoT8ywi/8a4uLm5II 2OdHIBUT6iqagO3H+qeGQVmaK/MNCZWBRklzcbPyfD5+GDp2aG0arbTVvBJcSzGI 6kugxxXSg4o= =nGX/ -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----
participants (3)
-
Barry Warsaw -
Dov Zamir -
Mark Sapiro