Fw: [Mailman-Users] Re: The Password Feature.
----- Original Message ----- From: "Gary Wilson" <wilsong@sergievsky.cpmc.columbia.edu> To: "Jeme A Brelin" <jeme@brelin.net> Sent: Monday, October 02, 2000 6:24 PM Subject: Re: [Mailman-Users] Re: The Password Feature.
Well, this isn't commercial software and threatening to leave the user-base doesn't exactly carry any weight with the developers. If you think you'd like to turn off passwords, turn them off. Go into the code and kill the authentication routines and let anybody do anything to anyone's account. Then see what happens when a listmember gets hostile. And how many more admin requests you get from users to fix problems they could've otherwise fixed themselves (or were created by a lack of security on the admin pages).
I am not threatening. The developers may want to know why users are leaving. They probably care.
Most open source software developers I've worked with like to get feedback.
Your comments are not helpful and they don't offer any solution.
There was a very elegent solution just suggested by Chuq, a solution that would work for everyone.
Your comments indicate to me that at best your experience with mail lists is limited. All the features you are talking about are available on other list servers without the limiting password required by Mailman. Most use a confirm/password option for changes that is sent to the mail address. This is a much better solution and I have never heard anyone explain why Mailman rejected the industry-standard for what to me is a quirky solution.
Gary
At 6:25 PM -0400 10/2/00, Gary Wilson wrote:
I am not threatening. The developers may want to know why users are leaving. They probably care.
they care, but look at it from the other side. People who work as volunteers on ANY project get a lot of "I want this fixed, and you have to do it" stuff. It's not just open source, it's not programming, it's any volunteer organization. Lots of chiefs, few indians.
So anyone involved in these things tends to both get a thick skin, and also a little sensitive, when they run into things that can be interpreted that way. Whether or not it's intended that way.
it's easy to be misinterpreted on the net, since so many communication cues are missing or muddled (that's been a long, long research area of mine, trying to understand how to deal with the limitations of the online world). You need to be careful to frame what you say properly, and understanding when it's not....
And... We're *all* developers of mailman, really. Some are just more active than others.
Most open source software developers I've worked with like to get feedback.
Yes, but not all feedback is created equal. It helps to frame things in constructive ways, and whether it's intended or not, "do this or I'm leaving" isn't really constructive. It *does* come across as threatening, although to be honest, my response was "and I care for what reason?" -- because the other nice thing about open source is that a given software package doesn't have to pretend to be everything for everyone. Rather than try to solve every problem with mediocrity, mailman can solve a certain set of problems exceptionally well, and if it doesn't solve your set of problems, there are other options. Or you can write one! The joys of no monopolies, no?
Your comments indicate to me that at best your experience with mail lists is limited.
well, mine goes back 20 years, and I currently have a number of MLM's that are 100% my code in production. And I reacted the same way, Gary. I just dealt with it differently. I think what you said probably wasn't what you intended, but I don't think the interpretation was too out of line.
-- Chuq Von Rospach - Plaidworks Consulting (mailto:chuqui@plaidworks.com) Apple Mail List Gnome (mailto:chuq@apple.com)
You seem a decent fellow. I hate to die.
participants (2)
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Chuq Von Rospach
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Gary Wilson