franc walter wrote:

Am Fri, 9 Jul 2010 19:22:30 +0300 (IDT) schriebst du:

...

Can you post your mm_cfg.py file as it is now?

My mm_cfg.py: [...] MAILMAN_SITE_LIST = 'mailman'

DEFAULT_URL_PATTERN = 'http://%s/cgi-bin/mailman/'

PRIVATE_ARCHIVE_URL = '/cgi-bin/mailman/private'

IMAGE_LOGOS = '/images/mailman/'

DEFAULT_EMAIL_HOST = 'lists.example.org'

DEFAULT_URL_HOST = 'example.org'

add_virtualhost(DEFAULT_URL_HOST, DEFAULT_EMAIL_HOST)

DEFAULT_SERVER_LANGUAGE = 'en'

USE_ENVELOPE_SENDER = 0 # Still used?

DEFAULT_SEND_REMINDERS = 0

MTA='Postfix'

DEFAULT_SERVER_LANGUAGE = 'de'

POSTFIX_STYLE_VIRTUAL_DOMAINS = ['example.org', 'example2.de']

You have only set one host. The default host has web domain 'example.org' and email domain 'lists.example.org'.

The only lists for which Mailman will create virtual-mailman entries are those whose email domain is 'example.org' or 'example2.de'.

At a minimum, you want to put something like

add_virtualhost('www.example2.de', 'example2.de')

following the add_virtualhost() for the default domains. Then you could create a list in the example2.de domain either by going to <http://www.example2.de/mailman/cgi-bin/create> or via "bin/newlist -u www.example2.de" and the list will be created with email domain (the list's host_name attribute) example2.de and virtual mappings for the list will be created in data/virtual-mailman (because example2.de is in POSTFIX_STYLE_VIRTUAL_DOMAINS.

As it is, your lists are created with email host (host_name) = DEFAULT_EMAIL_HOST = 'lists.example.org' which is not in POSTFIX_STYLE_VIRTUAL_DOMAINS, so no virtual-mailman entries.

Do you really want the default lists to have URLs like <http://example.org/mailman/cgi-bin/...> and email addresses like list@lists.example.org? If this is the reverse of what you want, you need to reverse your settings for DEFAULT_EMAIL_HOST and DEFAULT_URL_HOST.

If you make changes, you will probably need to run fix_url to change the existing lists.

-- Mark Sapiro <mark@msapiro.net> The highway is for gamblers, San Francisco Bay Area, California better use your sense - B. Dylan

franc walter wrote:

OK, again, if I have 3 virtual domains on it:

example1.org example2.org example3.org

and i want to have for each domain a separate list:

list1 on example1.org list2 on example2.org list3 on example3.org

The emailhost of each of those lists should be like

lists.example1.org lists.example2.org lists.example3.org

So is this the right setting:

POSTFIX_STYLE_VIRTUAL_DOMAINS = ['example1.org', 'example2.org', 'example3.org']

add_virtualhost(DEFAULT_URL_HOST, DEFAULT_EMAIL_HOST) add_virtualhost('example1.org', 'lists.example1.org') add_virtualhost('example2.org', 'lists.example2.org') add_virtualhost('example3.org', 'lists.example3.org')

No. For the above situation you need

POSTFIX_STYLE_VIRTUAL_DOMAINS = ['lists.example1.org', 'lists.example2.org', 'lists.example3.org']

The POSTFIX_STYLE_VIRTUAL_DOMAINS are email domains, not web domains.

In Postfix i put:

alias_maps = hash:/etc/aliases,hash:/var/lib/mailman/data/aliases relay_domains = lists.example1.org,lists.example2.org,lists.example3.org mydestination = lists.example1.org, lists.example2.org, lists.example3.org, example1.org, example2.org, example3.org, localhost

lists.example1.org,, etc are virtual_alias_domains, not relay_domains. Also, it they are in my_destination, they ar not Postfix virtual domains at all, they are local domains to Postfix.

You need to decide which they are. Either they are in virtual_alias_domains and not in my_destination, in which case, they also need to be in POSTFIX_STYLE_VIRTUAL_DOMAINS and you need the ,hash:/var/lib/mailman/data/virtual-mailman below, or they are in my-destination and not in virtual_alias_domains, in which case, they do not need to be in POSTFIX_STYLE_VIRTUAL_DOMAINS and you do not need the ,hash:/var/lib/mailman/data/virtual-mailman below

virtual_alias_maps = mysql:/etc/postfix/mysql-virtual-alias-maps.cf,mysql:/etc/postfix/mysql-email2email.cf,hash:/var/lib/mailman/data/virtual-mailman

is this right?

I wonder if i want to add a new virtual domain, now i have to change a lot in mm_cfg.py (mailman) and also in main.cf (postfix). And only then i can run:

newlist --urlhost=example4.org --emailhost=lists.example4.org list4

This seems to me much too complicated that i think there must be still many things i didn't get or i set wrong.

It's only a bit mor complicated than necessary. You do have to add the lists.example4.org domain to virtual_alias_domains in main.cf and you do need the

add_virtualhost('example4.org', 'lists.example4.org') in mm_cfg.py as well as adding 'lists.example4.org' to POSTFIX_STYLE_VIRTUAL_DOMAINS. You also probably need to add the example4.org virtual host to the web server, or if they are local to Postfix, you just have to add lists.example4.org to my_destination and add the add_virtualhost('example4.org', 'lists.example4.org') to mm_cfg.py,

but your bin/newlist can be just

newlist --urlhost=example4.org list4

because newlist will look up the email host from the url host in the dictionary that's updated with add_virtualhost.

Also, you could create the list from the web via

http://example4.org/cgi-bin/mailman/create

I think my main problem is, that my origin language is NOT english and i probably just don't understand some important things when i read the doc. And there is NO german doc for mailman.

Perhaps you could contact the maintainers of the German translation (see <http://wiki.list.org/x/Pw>) and ask them to volunteer to create some.

-- Mark Sapiro <mark@msapiro.net> The highway is for gamblers, San Francisco Bay Area, California better use your sense - B. Dylan

franc walter wrote:

Am Sat, 10 Jul 2010 07:47:52 -0700 schriebst du:

...

...

relay_domains = lists.example1.org,lists.example2.org,lists.example3.org

...

lists.example1.org,, etc are virtual_alias_domains, not relay_domains. Also, it they are in my_destination, they ar not Postfix virtual domains at all, they are local domains to Postfix.

If i remove the lists.example1.org from relay_domains and i send a mail to the list from an email-address which is NOT on the server, i just get a bounce:

/Remote_host_said:_554_5.7.1_<test@lists.example1.org>: _Relay_access_denied/Giving_up_on_1.2.3.4./

And if i put it back, it is not bounced.

So please tell me how i can avoid this bounce without putting lists.example1.org in relay_domains in main.cf of postfix.

Put lists.example1.org in my_destination.

Or put lists.example1.org in virtual_alias_domains and do all the virtual_alias_maps stuff.

-- Mark Sapiro <mark@msapiro.net> The highway is for gamblers, San Francisco Bay Area, California better use your sense - B. Dylan

Geoff Shang wrote:

On Sat, 10 Jul 2010, franc walter wrote:

...

newlist --urlhost=example4.org --emailhost=lists.example4.org list4

If you have the add_virtual_host items in mm_cfg.py, you should be able to just do:

newlist list4@lists.example4.org

The above is not correct. In this deprecated newlist usage, the domain to the right of the '@' is the url host, not the email host so the equivalent to Franc's command is

newlist list4@example4.org

assuming the add_virtualhost('example4.org ', 'lists.example4.org ') exists to map the urlhost to the email host.

But, this usage is deprecated and shouldn't be relied on.

-- Mark Sapiro <mark@msapiro.net> The highway is for gamblers, San Francisco Bay Area, California better use your sense - B. Dylan

Geoff Shang wrote:

huh! Well how's that for counter-intuitive.

That's why it's deprecated in favor of the -u option :)

-- Mark Sapiro <mark@msapiro.net> The highway is for gamblers, San Francisco Bay Area, California better use your sense - B. Dylan

On Sat, 10 Jul 2010, franc walter wrote:

1. If i want to create a list, there is another mystery, the "List creator's password", which i never had given. If i look into the doc in:

http://www.list.org/mailman-install/node45.html

they send me to (7):

http://www.list.org/mailman-install/customizing.html#customizing

where there is no mention at all about this. So i had to set it myself with "mmsitepass".

You're right. They should have sent you to section 12 - http://www.list.org/mailman-install/node44.html

You'd have already read this if you'd read the manual in sequence.

3. When i create the new list i get:

"Bug in Mailman version 2.1.9 We're sorry, we hit a bug! Please inform the webmaster for this site of this problem. Printing of traceback and other system information has been explicitly inhibited, but the webmaster can find this information in the Mailman error logs."

But with list_lists i can see that the list was created (without notification mail).

Is this true? A "bug" in Mailman?

Not in this case.

In the error log of mailman i find:

Jul 10 12:07:37 2010 (5257) command failed: /usr/sbin/postmap /var/lib/mailman/data/virtual-mailman (status: 1, Operation not permitted)

Looks like a permissions problem.

But the rights of virtual-mailman seem ok:

ls -l /var/lib/mailman/data/virtual-mailman -rw-rw---- 1 www-data list 1,6K 2010-07-10 12:07 virtual-mailman

What about the permissions on /var/lib/mailman/data ? Postmap may not be able to write the output file.

Geoff.

franc walter wrote:

When i create a mailinglist on example2.org "test" and if i mail to this list, every member should get this mail. But without any error in the logs, this mail just gets swallowed by postfix:

This is what i read in mail.log of postfix:

Jul 10 14:20:07 example postfix/local[7899]: 62BFB6D0EC00A: to=<mailman@lists.example.org>, relay=local, delay=0.14, delays=0.01/0.01/0/0.13, dsn=2.0.0, status=sent (delivered to command: /var/lib/mailman/mail/mailman post mailman) Jul 10 14:20:07 example postfix/qmgr[32331]: 62BFB6D0EC00A: removed

Note the above says you are delivering directly to a local domain and not via virtual_alias_maps. If this mail doesn't get processed by Mailman, it is because you haven't started the Mailman service (mailmanctl which in turn starts the qrunners)

Jul 10 14:04:52 example postfix/pipe[3852]: 38D176D0EC008: to=<test@example.org>, orig_to=<test@lists.example2.de>, relay=dovecot, delay=0.02, delays=0.01/0/0/0.01, dsn=2.0.0, status=sent (delivered via dovecot service) Jul 10 14:04:52 example postfix/qmgr[32331]: 38D176D0EC008: removed

instead of given to the command it is given to <test@example.org>

This mail is originally to test@lists.example2.de and is mapped by virtual_alias_maps to the local address 'test' to which Postfix appends its cannonical hostname. Thus the mail is mapped to test@example.org which is handled by the Dovecot LDA and not by Postfix' local delivery, thus the 'test' alias in data/aliases is not used.

If you want to use the Dovecot LDA in this way, The easiest thing for you to do is to not use Postfix virtual domains at all. Just add your lists.examplen.org domains only to my_destination in main-cf and remove the ,hash:/var/lib/mailman/data/virtual-mailman from virtual_alias_maps. Then you can also remove POSTFIX_STYLE_VIRTUAL_DOMAINS from mm_cfg.py.

-- Mark Sapiro <mark@msapiro.net> The highway is for gamblers, San Francisco Bay Area, California better use your sense - B. Dylan

franc walter wrote:

Am Sat, 10 Jul 2010 08:09:45 -0700 schriebst du:

...

This mail is originally to test@lists.example2.de and is mapped by virtual_alias_maps to the local address 'test' to which Postfix appends its cannonical hostname. Thus the mail is mapped to test@example.org which is handled by the Dovecot LDA and not by Postfix' local delivery, thus the 'test' alias in data/aliases is not used.

But why???

Because in your Postfix transport maps you have an entry that says mail to the example.org domain is handled by the Dovecot LDA, and the Dovecot LDA doesn't consult Postfix' alias_maps.

I have many email-addresses with somename@exampleN.org and NONE of them is given to somename@example.org!

Because you don't have any virtual_alias_maps of the form

somename@exampleN.org somename

And i have in data/aliases INDEED an entry:

test: "|/var/lib/mailman/mail/mailman post test"

So why is "test" not given to this command like the other list-email?

Because it is delivered via Dovecot and Dovecot doesn't consult alias_maps.

There are at least three ways to fix this. I already gave you the easiest one at the end of my reply at <http://mail.python.org/pipermail/mailman-users/2010-July/069926.html>

The second way is to stop using the Dovecot LDA, and the third way is to download Mailman/MTA/Postfix.py from <http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~mailman-coders/mailman/2.1/files/head:/Mailman/MTA/> and replace yours with the downloaded one and add

VIRTUAL_MAILMAN_LOCAL_DOMAIN ='some.nondovecot.local.domain'

to mm_cfg.py and run genaliases.

-- Mark Sapiro <mark@msapiro.net> The highway is for gamblers, San Francisco Bay Area, California better use your sense - B. Dylan

franc walter wrote:

Am Sat, 10 Jul 2010 10:02:00 -0700 schriebst du:

...

and the third way is to download Mailman/MTA/Postfix.py from <http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~mailman-coders/mailman/2.1/files/head:/Mailman/MTA/> and replace yours with the downloaded one and add

...

VIRTUAL_MAILMAN_LOCAL_DOMAIN ='some.nondovecot.local.domain'

Ok, i downloaded this Postfix.py and put it to:

/usr/lib/mailman/Mailman/MTA/Postfix.py

i put in my mm_cfg.py:

VIRTUAL_MAILMAN_LOCAL_DOMAIN ='lists.example2.org'

at the end and restarted postfix and mailman.

And did you run genaliases?

Now if i send from

friend@outside.org

to:

testlist@lists.example2.org

i get the bounce from Mailer-Daemon:

... The mail system

<testlist@lists.example2.org>: unknown user: "testlist"

I hope you didn't think that i want to have any mail-address in dovecot with testlist@lists.example2.org. I just want to have an distributing tool, a mailinglist.

No. You do not want any list addresses and domains in Dovecot.

With the above, all your lists will be mapped to the lists.example2.org domain which must be local.

lists.example2.org needs to be in my_destination in main.cf and not in virtual_alias_domains or in POSTFIX_STYLE_VIRTUAL_DOMAINS. All the other list email domains need to be in both virtual_alias_domains and POSTFIX_STYLE_VIRTUAL_DOMAINS, and data/virtual-mailman needs to be referenced in virtual_alias_maps.

-- Mark Sapiro <mark@msapiro.net> The highway is for gamblers, San Francisco Bay Area, California better use your sense - B. Dylan

franc walter wrote:

Am Sat, 10 Jul 2010 10:50:59 -0700 schriebst du:

...

With the above, all your lists will be mapped to the lists.example2.org domain which must be local.

...

lists.example2.org needs to be in my_destination in main.cf and not in virtual_alias_domains or in POSTFIX_STYLE_VIRTUAL_DOMAINS. All the other list email domains need to be in both virtual_alias_domains and POSTFIX_STYLE_VIRTUAL_DOMAINS, and data/virtual-mailman needs to be referenced in virtual_alias_maps.

???

Which "all the other list email domains" ??? Why to put them to virtual_alias_domains etc. if it is not working?

virtual_alias_maps mappings map an address like some_address@some.virtual.domain to another address. Your original virtual-mailman mappings were of the form

list-address@virtual.domain list-address

This didn't work for you because Postfix assumes that a bare list-address is in the mydomain domain, but mail to mydomain is being delivered via the Dovecot LDA which doesn't consult alias_maps, so the mail to list-address was not piped to Mailman.

I suggested you could try the Mailman/MTA/Postfix.py from the head of the 2.1 development branch because it can append a domain to the right hand side of the mappings in virtual-mailman. This domain is set in mm_cfg.py as VIRTUAL_MAILMAN_LOCAL_DOMAIN. I probably should have pointed you to the documentation of POSTFIX_STYLE_VIRTUAL_DOMAINS and VIRTUAL_MAILMAN_LOCAL_DOMAIN in the branch as well, but I have attached it here as doc.txt

You chose to set VIRTUAL_MAILMAN_LOCAL_DOMAIN to lists.example2.org. Given that choice, I told you that you had to configure lists.example2.org as local in postfix. The other domains, lists.example1.org, lists.example3.org, lists.example4.org, etc. could still be Postfix virtual domains and virtual-mailman will map, e.g.

list-address@lists.example1.org list-address@lists.example2.org

for local delivery.

I would not have set

VIRTUAL_MAILMAN_LOCAL_DOMAIN = 'lists.example2.org'

I probably would have set

VIRTUAL_MAILMAN_LOCAL_DOMAIN = 'localhost'

and left all your lists.examplen.org domains virtual, but you didn't ask me, You just reported what you'd done and asked me how to fix it so I suggested the first fix that came to my mind.

Here's a simple view of how this works if properly configured.

For a list in a virtual domain in POSTFIX_STYLE_VIRTUAL_DOMAINS, Mailman generates virtual-mailman mappings from list addresses in the virtual domain to local addresses delivered by Postfix' local delivery (not Dovecot). Postfix' local delivery consults alias_maps including Mailman's aliases and these map the local addresses to the appropriate pipe to Mailman.

If this isn't clear to you, perhaps some of the documentation at <http://de.postfix.org/> will help.

-- Mark Sapiro <mark@msapiro.net> The highway is for gamblers, San Francisco Bay Area, California better use your sense - B. Dylan

Am Sat, 10 Jul 2010 08:09:45 -0700 schriebst du:

This mail is originally to test@lists.example2.de and is mapped by virtual_alias_maps to the local address 'test' to which Postfix appends its cannonical hostname. Thus the mail is mapped to test@example.org

So if i use a list called like the email-name of somebody in the example.org domain, this means HE will get the mails for the list??? Very funny.

This is so confusing and there is no light.

Since several days i try to get this to work where i initially thought it is a work of 1 or 2 hours.

Without your help i would have given up much earlier, but it seems that i have to give up anyway... I just don't understand you and you don't understand me.