Good morning
I have several unmoderated lists on Mailman 2.1.38 running on cPanel (106.0.8).
The messages sent to the lists are almost immediately visible in the list archives, but are sent to the subscribers with a - sometimes huge - delay. Mostly it is 20 - 40 minutes, but sometimes it is more than one hour.
This makes replying difficult for the users because they might give an answer which is already given by someone else, or they miss a clarification.
Is this normal to Mailman 2 on cPanel, or is there any possibility to speed up the message delivery?
Thank you, Christian
--
Christian Buser, Hohle Gasse 6, CH-5507 Mellingen (Switzerland)
Hilfe fuer Strassenkinder in Ghana: https://www.chance-for-children.org
What sorts of e-mail addresses are delayed. Are *all* users seeing delays or only some (eg only people with @yahoo.com or @hotmail.com addresses?).
Do you have access to your server's mail queue? Do you have command-line access to your server?
Sometimes what happens is a mail provider like Yahoo (@yahoo.com, @aol.com, @verizon.net, and some others) or Microsoft (@hotmail.com, @outlook.com, others) and will greylist you and delay / defer E-Mail. You MTA will re-try every so often (every hour, 1/2 hour, etc.) for up to 5 days. Generally, eventually the mail gets through, but it could takes hours or days. There is not much you can do about this.
Sometimes what is happening is that you have set Mailman to be too "aggressive" about sending mail, and some E-Mail providers don't like that. There are some Mailman settings for this -- this will add some delay, but things will generally flow better overall. Other times, it is that some of *your* subscribers are marking the message they are getting from your list as spam and their E-Mail provider(s) are "learning" that your list is a spam source and the provider's spam filter is marking messages from your list as spam and either rejecting or quarentining the messages from your list.
At Sat, 8 Oct 2022 10:41:04 +0200 Christian <luscheina@yahoo.de> wrote:
-- Robert Heller -- Cell: 413-658-7953 GV: 978-633-5364 Deepwoods Software -- Custom Software Services http://www.deepsoft.com/ -- Linux Administration Services heller@deepsoft.com -- Webhosting Services
Hello Robert Heller. On Sat, 8 Oct 2022 09:28:50 -0400 (EDT), you wrote:
It concerns all addresses - even those who are on the same server / same domain.
Do you have access to your server's mail queue? Do you have command-line access to your server?
No, unfortunately not. It is a cPanel installation on a virtual server.
Christian
Christian Buser, Hohle Gasse 6, CH-5507 Mellingen (Switzerland)
Hilfe fuer Strassenkinder in Ghana: https://www.chance-for-children.org
On 2022-10-08 at 09:32:52 UTC-0400 (Sat, 8 Oct 2022 15:32:52 +0200) Christian via Mailman-Users <luscheina@yahoo.de> is rumored to have said:
It is my understanding that Mailman only puts a message in the archive after it has handed off deliveries to the local MTA. cPanel historically (circa 2018) had queue run timings for Exim (the MTA) that were unfit for mailing lists. I know cPanel was made aware of the issue but I do not recall whether they pushed out a fix or just documented a configuration fix. You may not be able to change or even see the Exim config, since I believe cPanel manages Exim at the host-wide level (using WHM) which customers don't generally have access to. You should talk to your provider about how Exim is configured.
-- Bill Cole bill@scconsult.com or billcole@apache.org (AKA @grumpybozo and many *@billmail.scconsult.com addresses) Not Currently Available For Hire
On 10/8/22 07:06, Bill Cole wrote:
It is my understanding that Mailman only puts a message in the archive after it has handed off deliveries to the local MTA.
This is not correct. Mailman processes messages through a pipeline of
handlers (see
<https://bazaar.launchpad.net/~mailman-coders/mailman/2.1/view/head:/Mailman/...>).
Towards the end of the pipeline are handlers ToArchive and
ToOutgoing. These handlers simply queue the message for the respective
ArchiveRunner and OutgoingRunner processes which process their queues
asynchronously from each other.
-- Mark Sapiro <mark@msapiro.net> The highway is for gamblers, San Francisco Bay Area, California better use your sense - B. Dylan
On 10/8/22 06:28, Robert Heller wrote:
This is not the issue here. Here, the issue is in delivery from Mailman to the outgoing MTA (probably exim in the case of cPanel) and not in delivery from the MTA to the recipients.
-- Mark Sapiro <mark@msapiro.net> The highway is for gamblers, San Francisco Bay Area, California better use your sense - B. Dylan
On 10/8/22 01:41, Christian via Mailman-Users wrote:
Mailman's out queue is backlogged. See
https://mail.python.org/archives/list/mailman-users@python.org/message/CAKZU...
and perhaps other hits from searching the archive for backlogged out queue. Also see <https://wiki.list.org/x/17892002>.
Unfortunately you are at the mercy of your cPanel host to fix this.
-- Mark Sapiro <mark@msapiro.net> The highway is for gamblers, San Francisco Bay Area, California better use your sense - B. Dylan
What sorts of e-mail addresses are delayed. Are *all* users seeing delays or only some (eg only people with @yahoo.com or @hotmail.com addresses?).
Do you have access to your server's mail queue? Do you have command-line access to your server?
Sometimes what happens is a mail provider like Yahoo (@yahoo.com, @aol.com, @verizon.net, and some others) or Microsoft (@hotmail.com, @outlook.com, others) and will greylist you and delay / defer E-Mail. You MTA will re-try every so often (every hour, 1/2 hour, etc.) for up to 5 days. Generally, eventually the mail gets through, but it could takes hours or days. There is not much you can do about this.
Sometimes what is happening is that you have set Mailman to be too "aggressive" about sending mail, and some E-Mail providers don't like that. There are some Mailman settings for this -- this will add some delay, but things will generally flow better overall. Other times, it is that some of *your* subscribers are marking the message they are getting from your list as spam and their E-Mail provider(s) are "learning" that your list is a spam source and the provider's spam filter is marking messages from your list as spam and either rejecting or quarentining the messages from your list.
At Sat, 8 Oct 2022 10:41:04 +0200 Christian <luscheina@yahoo.de> wrote:
-- Robert Heller -- Cell: 413-658-7953 GV: 978-633-5364 Deepwoods Software -- Custom Software Services http://www.deepsoft.com/ -- Linux Administration Services heller@deepsoft.com -- Webhosting Services
Hello Robert Heller. On Sat, 8 Oct 2022 09:28:50 -0400 (EDT), you wrote:
It concerns all addresses - even those who are on the same server / same domain.
Do you have access to your server's mail queue? Do you have command-line access to your server?
No, unfortunately not. It is a cPanel installation on a virtual server.
Christian
Christian Buser, Hohle Gasse 6, CH-5507 Mellingen (Switzerland)
Hilfe fuer Strassenkinder in Ghana: https://www.chance-for-children.org
On 2022-10-08 at 09:32:52 UTC-0400 (Sat, 8 Oct 2022 15:32:52 +0200) Christian via Mailman-Users <luscheina@yahoo.de> is rumored to have said:
It is my understanding that Mailman only puts a message in the archive after it has handed off deliveries to the local MTA. cPanel historically (circa 2018) had queue run timings for Exim (the MTA) that were unfit for mailing lists. I know cPanel was made aware of the issue but I do not recall whether they pushed out a fix or just documented a configuration fix. You may not be able to change or even see the Exim config, since I believe cPanel manages Exim at the host-wide level (using WHM) which customers don't generally have access to. You should talk to your provider about how Exim is configured.
-- Bill Cole bill@scconsult.com or billcole@apache.org (AKA @grumpybozo and many *@billmail.scconsult.com addresses) Not Currently Available For Hire
On 10/8/22 07:06, Bill Cole wrote:
It is my understanding that Mailman only puts a message in the archive after it has handed off deliveries to the local MTA.
This is not correct. Mailman processes messages through a pipeline of
handlers (see
<https://bazaar.launchpad.net/~mailman-coders/mailman/2.1/view/head:/Mailman/...>).
Towards the end of the pipeline are handlers ToArchive and
ToOutgoing. These handlers simply queue the message for the respective
ArchiveRunner and OutgoingRunner processes which process their queues
asynchronously from each other.
-- Mark Sapiro <mark@msapiro.net> The highway is for gamblers, San Francisco Bay Area, California better use your sense - B. Dylan
On 10/8/22 06:28, Robert Heller wrote:
This is not the issue here. Here, the issue is in delivery from Mailman to the outgoing MTA (probably exim in the case of cPanel) and not in delivery from the MTA to the recipients.
-- Mark Sapiro <mark@msapiro.net> The highway is for gamblers, San Francisco Bay Area, California better use your sense - B. Dylan
On 10/8/22 01:41, Christian via Mailman-Users wrote:
Mailman's out queue is backlogged. See
https://mail.python.org/archives/list/mailman-users@python.org/message/CAKZU...
and perhaps other hits from searching the archive for backlogged out queue. Also see <https://wiki.list.org/x/17892002>.
Unfortunately you are at the mercy of your cPanel host to fix this.
-- Mark Sapiro <mark@msapiro.net> The highway is for gamblers, San Francisco Bay Area, California better use your sense - B. Dylan
participants (4)
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Bill Cole -
Christian -
Mark Sapiro -
Robert Heller