Re: [moin-devel] [moin-user] moinmoin 2.0 stable release
Hey guys! Thanks for looking into this! I'm both one of the current wiki.debian.org admins and (due to that!) the current maintainer of the moin package in Debian. So... On Mon, Feb 28, 2022 at 11:46:08AM -0600, Lukasz Szybalski wrote:
On Fri, Feb 25, 2022 at 5:01 PM Paul Boddie <paul@boddie.org.uk> wrote:
(I've added moin-devel to the recipients, and maybe moin-user can be dropped in future.)
On Wednesday, 23 February 2022 05:24:10 CET Lukasz Szybalski wrote:
- We need help from those who have worked on debian.org and can push
On Wednesday, 23 February 2022 18:30:50 CET Paul Boddie wrote: the
moinmoin2 to debian backports. Engage, ask for help, and report on progress. (They will also need migration instructions or scripts)
I've been hoping to migrate wiki.d.o to moin2, but a huge set of other tasks in Debian and elsewhere have kept me busy. -ENOTIME. :-(
Quite some time ago, I did look into Debian packaging for Moin 2.0 and quickly became bogged down in all the dependencies that weren't packaged. This is another situation where the Python developers have encouraged their own way of working largely to the detriment of the broader ecosystem. While people may enjoy virtualenvs, venvs, today's new envs, and so on, a reliance on the shifting sands of an "agile" but unstable software stack can be a hindrance to packaging for a relatively stable system.
I suppose a review of this situation is possible. Debian packaging isn't particularly enjoyable, but it is probably the most effective way of bringing the software to the right audience.
I looked into the Debian packaging requirements, and it seems to me that the following packages are needed (not being available in Debian):
Awsome. Thank you!!
emeraldtree Flask-Theme flatland XStatic-CKEditor XStatic-autosize XStatic-jQuery-File-Upload XStatic-TWikiDraw-moin XStatic-AnyWikiDraw XStatic-svg-edit-moin XStatic-JQuery.TableSorter XStatic-Pygments
There are already Flask and XStatic packages in Debian, but not those listed above. I have just been looking at the first three in this list, and it seems feasible to try and put together some quick packages for them, assuming that I can rediscover how to make Debian packages.
Cool! :-)
If you do, and have the instructions please share, we can assist in packaging the rest. I wonder if there is somone we should cc, that has in a past packaged python packages like this, that would be able to guide us through this over the next two weeks?
If you can work on the packaging needed, I'm more than happy to help with reviews etc. to get things packaged and included into Debian. It'll make my life much easier! Hell, if you're very keen to help then we can possibly even work on Debian membership for you here... :-) -- Steve McIntyre, Cambridge, UK. steve@einval.com Dance like no one's watching. Encrypt like everyone is. - @torproject
On Tuesday, 1 March 2022 19:46:35 CET Steve McIntyre wrote:
Hey guys!
Thanks for looking into this!
I'm both one of the current wiki.debian.org admins and (due to that!) the current maintainer of the moin package in Debian. So...
[...]
I've been hoping to migrate wiki.d.o to moin2, but a huge set of other tasks in Debian and elsewhere have kept me busy. -ENOTIME. :-(
That's probably the story for most of us, but thanks for following up and for the encouragement! [...]
If you can work on the packaging needed, I'm more than happy to help with reviews etc. to get things packaged and included into Debian. It'll make my life much easier! Hell, if you're very keen to help then we can possibly even work on Debian membership for you here... :-)
Currently, my efforts are posted to the repositories I mentioned earlier: https://hg.boddie.org.uk/Moin/ These are just the debian directory in each case dropped into a repository, since I know that this is (or was) the way it should be done. All I've done is to look how some other packages were made and then done things in a very similar way. There are definitely things that would need improving. Firstly, I don't build the documentation, where any would actually be built: I went for the absolute easiest, laziest approach, instead of confusing things with the likes of Sphinx. Also, tests may not be handled completely correctly, so where setuptools (or one of its tentacles) decides to run tests after building, I had to put various test-related packages into the "Build-Depends" manifest: https://hg.boddie.org.uk/Moin/flatland/file/7fb29f9b553d/debian/control I also patched the setup.py file for that package as well, because being setuptools it wanted to go off onto the Internet all by itself, and Debian sensibly forbids that when building packages: https://hg.boddie.org.uk/Moin/flatland/file/7fb29f9b553d/debian/patches/000-... Fortunately, that is for a package that can be installed in the "Build- Depends". What I probably should try and do is to build the Moin package itself, supplying these newly built packages. Once upon a time, I used pdebuild/ pbuilder and there was a recipe for populating the chroot with new packages unavailable in Debian repositories. If I can figure out the same thing with sbuild/schroot, then we might be in business. What avenues should we use for package reviews? I previously used the Debian Mentors service, but anything remotely accessible would be acceptable. Thanks once again for following up! Paul
On Tue, Mar 01, 2022 at 10:12:48PM +0100, Paul Boddie wrote:
On Tuesday, 1 March 2022 19:46:35 CET Steve McIntyre wrote:
If you can work on the packaging needed, I'm more than happy to help with reviews etc. to get things packaged and included into Debian. It'll make my life much easier! Hell, if you're very keen to help then we can possibly even work on Debian membership for you here... :-)
Currently, my efforts are posted to the repositories I mentioned earlier:
https://hg.boddie.org.uk/Moin/
These are just the debian directory in each case dropped into a repository, since I know that this is (or was) the way it should be done. All I've done is to look how some other packages were made and then done things in a very similar way.
OK. I think things have changed a bit over the years - IME it's more common to include the upstream source in the repo too, with branches to hewlp organise things. No big issue dealing with either, to be honest.
There are definitely things that would need improving. Firstly, I don't build the documentation, where any would actually be built: I went for the absolute easiest, laziest approach, instead of confusing things with the likes of Sphinx.
ACK.
Also, tests may not be handled completely correctly, so where setuptools (or one of its tentacles) decides to run tests after building, I had to put various test-related packages into the "Build-Depends" manifest:
https://hg.boddie.org.uk/Moin/flatland/file/7fb29f9b553d/debian/control
I also patched the setup.py file for that package as well, because being setuptools it wanted to go off onto the Internet all by itself, and Debian sensibly forbids that when building packages:
Yup. :-) It's ok (and encouraged!) to run build-time tests for packages in Debian. Ideally we want to find regressions ASAP, before they even make it into the archive.
https://hg.boddie.org.uk/Moin/flatland/file/7fb29f9b553d/debian/patches/000-...
Fortunately, that is for a package that can be installed in the "Build- Depends".
What I probably should try and do is to build the Moin package itself, supplying these newly built packages. Once upon a time, I used pdebuild/ pbuilder and there was a recipe for populating the chroot with new packages unavailable in Debian repositories. If I can figure out the same thing with sbuild/schroot, then we might be in business.
What avenues should we use for package reviews? I previously used the Debian Mentors service, but anything remotely accessible would be acceptable.
If we're likely to be working together on a few packages, I'd suggest that it might make sense to simply set up a moin-team group on our gitlab instance at salsa.debian.org. We can easily collaborate that way and do reviews and uploads readily. Apologies for immediately suggesting moving from your own hg server, but salsa is the place where most Debian work is done these days. Paul (and Lukasz!): let me know if you're happy to work this way and I'll get the team set up. If you don't have an account already on salsa, please go ahead and create one and then let me know the username so I can add you to the team. Finally: maybe let's move the Debian-specific bits off the moin-devel list? We can always come back here with questions and patches as we have them. -- Steve McIntyre, Cambridge, UK. steve@einval.com “Rarely is anyone thanked for the work they did to prevent the disaster that didn’t happen.” -- Mikko Hypponen (https://twitter.com/mikko/)
On Thursday, 3 March 2022 01:41:44 CET Steve McIntyre wrote:
OK. I think things have changed a bit over the years - IME it's more common to include the upstream source in the repo too, with branches to hewlp organise things. No big issue dealing with either, to be honest.
Debian (and Free Software projects generally) really has to choose one way of doing things and stick to it, but I suppose that is a topic for another time. In any case, I will happily make packaging resources available in the right form, as long as it is not overly onerous to do so. [...]
If we're likely to be working together on a few packages, I'd suggest that it might make sense to simply set up a moin-team group on our gitlab instance at salsa.debian.org. We can easily collaborate that way and do reviews and uploads readily. Apologies for immediately suggesting moving from your own hg server, but salsa is the place where most Debian work is done these days.
Yes, I only published the resources in my own repositories because I don't have a Salsa account yet, and I don't use GitHub out of choice, where some might have put them. (I also don't use Git out of choice, either, but it is sadly unavoidable in most situations now.)
Paul (and Lukasz!): let me know if you're happy to work this way and I'll get the team set up. If you don't have an account already on salsa, please go ahead and create one and then let me know the username so I can add you to the team.
Finally: maybe let's move the Debian-specific bits off the moin-devel list? We can always come back here with questions and patches as we have them.
OK, I've registered an account which now needs to be approved. The username should be "pboddie" if that goes through. Paul
participants (3)
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Paul Boddie -
Steve McIntyre -
Steve McIntyre