Mailman 3 February 2019 - python-committers

Hello!
by Cheryl Sabella 20 Feb '19

20 Feb '19

Hello everyone! Thank you for allowing me to join you. All of your kind and encouraging words on my nomination is quite overwhelming. My goal when I started contributing was to learn and to try to help out and that's what I hope to continue to do. Being recognized and appreciated for my contributions is icing on the cake. :-) And thank you to Victor and Terry for mentoring and guiding me! I hope you both know how much I appreciate it. Cheryl

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Cheryl Sabella promoted as core dev
by Victor Stinner 19 Feb '19

19 Feb '19

Hi, I opened a vote during 1 week to promote Cheryl Sabella. She got the excellent score of 21 “+1” vs 0 “-1” with very encouraging comments. Moreover, the Steering Council accepted the vote. https://discuss.python.org/t/vote-to-promote-cheryl-sabella-as-a-core-devel… Welcome aboard Cheryl! I offered to mentor her for one month to guide her in her new responsibilities. For example, I asked her to ask me before merging a pull request. Cheryl: Would you like to introduce yourself shortly? -- I sent an email to GitHub admins to add her to the GitHub python-core team and to subscribe her to the python-committers mailing list. In the meanwhile, I added her in copy of this email. Ah, I already added her to https://discuss.python.org/groups/committers and switcher the "committer" bit in her https://bugs.python.org/user25861 account :-) Victor -- Night gathers, and now my watch begins. It shall not end until my death.

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Paul Ganssle got the bug triage permission
by Victor Stinner 15 Feb '19

15 Feb '19

Hi, Paul Ganssle just asked me to close a bug which he fixed. Instead, I just gave him the bug triage permission :-) Paul is the author of dateutil: https://github.com/dateutil/dateutil He is fixing more and more datetime issues for longer than 1 year, including some tricky and very old issues: https://github.com/python/cpython/commits?author=pganssle For example, he implemented .fromisoformat() which was a long awaited feature: https://docs.python.org/dev/library/datetime.html#datetime.date.fromisoform… Recently, he got the approval to change how datetime subclasses are handled, feature very useful for third-party libraries written on top of datetime: https://github.com/python/cpython/commit/89427cd0feae25bbc8693abdccfa6a8c81… I'm happy to see him helping Alexander Belopopsky (current datetime maintainer), on maintaining datime, who is more busy these days. By the way, they met each other ;-) I sent Paul instructions how to triage bug and links into the devguide. I asked him to ask me before closing a bug. Congrats Paul ;-) Victor -- Night gathers, and now my watch begins. It shall not end until my death.

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Can we choose between mailing list and discuss.python.org?
by Victor Stinner 14 Feb '19

14 Feb '19

Hi, tl; dr How can we decide if we should stop using mailing list or if we should stop using discuss.python.org? https://discuss.python.org/ is getting more and more categories: packaging, users, ideas, committers, core workflow, etc. Slowly, more and more existing mailing lists get their category on discuss.python.org. Problem: Nobody decided if a topic should always be started on discuss.python.org or the "related" mailing list. I just started "Vote to promote Cheryl Sabella as a core developer" thread on the Committers category of discuss.python.org. I'm not sure that everybody "migrated" to discuss.python.org, so sometimes I like to send an email "hey, by the way, have a look at this thread on discuss.python.org: (...)" to ensure that everybody will see my message. For a vote to promote a contributor it's important that everybody is aware that a vote is open (but everyone is free to decide to vote or to abstain). There is also a high risk of having a topic discussed twice on mailing list and discuss.python.org. I will happen on controversal changes (PEPs), trust me :-) More generally, I dislike having too many communication channels for the same thing :-( (I'm not talking about Zulip/IRC vs mail/Discourse, Zulip/IRC is a different way to discuss, and ways are useful/needed.) "PEP 8100 -- January 2019 steering council election" says "Of the 96 eligible voters, 69 cast ballots." The Python core developers group of GitHub has currently 96 members: https://github.com/orgs/python/teams/python-core/members But I only count 72 members on discuss.python.org: https://discuss.python.org/groups/committers I count 27 core devs who didn't vote for PEP 8100 and 24 who are not on discuss.python.org yet. I see the following options: (A) Close the mailing list: make it read-only, but keep archives. Ask all mailing of the mailing list to move to discuss.python.org. (B) Close discuss.python.org. Ok, it was nice, but it's time to move back to mailing list. discuss.python.org becomes read-only. (C) Do nothing: keep mailing list and discuss.python.org We can make the same choice for all "categories" / "mailing lists", or we can have a different choice (ML vs Discourse) per category / mailing list. Please, don't start a long serie of "+1" or "-1". My question here is: how can we take a decision? Should we ask the fresh Steering Committee to take a definitive decision? Please don't start a thread about the advantages and disavantages of mailing lists and Discourse. It has been discussed multiple times. There is a dedicated section on discuss.python.org! https://discuss.python.org/c/site-feedback IMHO we had enough time to "experiment" Discourse. The 10 governance PEPs have been mostly discussed there: PEP 8000, 8001, 8010, 8011, 8012, 8013, 8014, 8015, 8016, 8100. We saw many threads with more than 50 messages. Search for threads about voting methods for example :-) We had enough time to see advantages and drawbacks of Discourse. We started to see "real" moderation (handle trolls / CoC incidents). I also saw the nice Discourse feature "start a new thread": move some messages into a new topic. Right now, I mostly care about python-committers mailing list vs Committers category on discuss.python.org. But we will quickly have a similar question for python-dev mailing list vs <whatever on discuss.python.org> (I asked to create a new category, it's not created yet). It's not easy for me to not give my opinion on the topic :-) But again, my only question here is: how can we take a decision? Who will take the decision? Victor -- Night gathers, and now my watch begins. It shall not end until my death.

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"Vote to promote Cheryl Sabella as a core developer" on discuss.python.org
by Victor Stinner 11 Feb '19

11 Feb '19

Hi, The PEP 13 doesn't specify when the vote to promote a contributor as a core developer should happen nor how the vote is organized, so I chose to organize the vote at: https://discuss.python.org/t/vote-to-promote-cheryl-sabella-as-a-core-devel… Victor -- Night gathers, and now my watch begins. It shall not end until my death.

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[RELEASE] Python 3.8.0a1 is now available for testing
by Łukasz Langa 04 Feb '19

04 Feb '19

I packaged my first release. *wipes sweat off of face* Go get it here: https://www.python.org/downloads/release/python-380a1/ Python 3.8.0a1 is the first of four planned alpha releases of Python 3.8, the next feature release of Python. During the alpha phase, Python 3.8 remains under heavy development: additional features will be added and existing features may be modified or deleted. Please keep in mind that this is a preview release and its use is not recommended for production environments. The next preview release, 3.8.0a2, is planned for 2019-02-24. Apart from building the Mac installers, Ned helped me a lot with the process, thank you! Ernest was super quick providing me with all required access and fixing a Unicode problem I found in Salt, thank you! Finally, this release was made on a train to Düsseldorf. There's a PyPy sprint there. The train is pretty cool, makes this "Wasm! Wasm!" sound. - Ł

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Learning from PostgreSQL community: How to address the review bottleneck
by M.-A. Lemburg 04 Feb '19

04 Feb '19

I've attended FOSDEM over the weekend, where Jon Conway (one of the PostgreSQL committers) gave a talk about, among other things, the PG community and how it is structured: https://fosdem.org/2019/schedule/event/postgresql11/ (the community part starts at around 8 min into the video) What struck me as interesting is that they have seen and addressed the review bottleneck problem we're having in Python development years ago. They have a core team, which pretty much resembles the steering committee we've just voted on, with 5 members, and a group of 28 committers. Things are much less formalized than in Python land, but they are making great progress. Here's their approach to solve the review bottleneck: https://wiki.postgresql.org/wiki/PostgreSQL_8.4_Development_Plan (they started this in 2008) with what they call "commit fests". This is a process where people submit patches using timed slots, each author is requested to do at least one review of another patch of similar complexity and the authors can fix their patches as part of the review process to get them to a level where a core dev can than take a look. Other people can sign up as reviewers as well. That way the initial load of making sure the patch quality is appropriate is scaled up a lot and their core devs only have to deal with patches which already have passed reviews by a few people. The process is described in more detail in this blog post: https://blog.2ndquadrant.com/managing-a-postgresql-commitfest/ (with the experience after doing this for 8 years) To help them with the commit fests, they have a system in place to manage the patches: https://commitfest.postgresql.org/ See e.g. https://commitfest.postgresql.org/22/ for the next upcoming commit fest. Commit fests are done for one month each, and then leave one month for things to settle in, get core dev responses. Patches can be pushed back to the next commit fest in case a core dev finds them lacking or the author doesn't respond in time. I also talked to Magnus Hagander, one of the PG core team members, about their core team. They have had this since the early 2000s and interestingly, they are mostly dealing with non-developer questions. Their approach to decisions such as the PEP process we have is mostly based on consensus and trust among the committers, not formalized and thus the core team does not play into this a lot. https://www.postgresql.eu/events/pgdayparis2018/schedule/speaker/1-magnus-h… Now, all that said, while there are many similarities between PostgreSQL and Python in how the communities work, PG does take a more conservative approach to things - most committers and core team members have had that status for at least 10 years, it typically takes several years to gain committer status and they rarely take on new people. Still, I think there's a lot we can learn from them and their experience with solving the review problem. Thanks, -- Marc-Andre Lemburg eGenix.com Professional Python Services directly from the Experts (#1, Feb 04 2019) >>> Python Projects, Coaching and Consulting ... http://www.egenix.com/ >>> Python Database Interfaces ... http://products.egenix.com/ >>> Plone/Zope Database Interfaces ... http://zope.egenix.com/ ________________________________________________________________________ ::: We implement business ideas - efficiently in both time and costs ::: eGenix.com Software, Skills and Services GmbH Pastor-Loeh-Str.48 D-40764 Langenfeld, Germany. CEO Dipl.-Math. Marc-Andre Lemburg Registered at Amtsgericht Duesseldorf: HRB 46611 http://www.egenix.com/company/contact/ http://www.malemburg.com/

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Fwd: EPS: Announcing the Guido van Rossum Core Developer Grant
by M.-A. Lemburg 04 Feb '19

04 Feb '19

FYI... perhaps you now understand why I was keen to get the committers listed somewhere :-) -------- Forwarded Message -------- Subject: EPS: Announcing the Guido van Rossum Core Developer Grant Date: Thu, 31 Jan 2019 10:25:52 +0100 From: M.-A. Lemburg <mal(a)europython.eu> Organization: EuroPython Society (EPS) To: EuroPython Announcement List <europython-announce(a)python.org> At the last General Assembly of the EuroPython Society (EPS) at EuroPython 2018 in Edinburgh, we voted on a new grant program we want to put in place for future EuroPython conferences. We all love Python and this is one of the main reasons we are putting on EuroPython year after year, serving the "cast of thousands" which support Python. But we also believe it is important to give something back to the main team of developers who have contributed lots of their time and energy to make Python happen: the Python Core Developers. This group is small, works countless hours, often in their free time and often close to burnout due to not enough new core developers joining the team. Free Tickets for Python Core Developers --------------------------------------- To help with growing the team, putting it more into the spotlight and give them a place to meet, demonstrate their work and a stage to invite new developers, we decided to give Python Core Developers free entry to future EuroPython conferences, starting with EuroPython 2019 in Basel, Switzerland In recognition of Guido’s almost 20 years of leading this team, and with his permission, we have named the grant “Guido van Rossum Core Developer Grant”. Details of the grant program are available on our core grant page: https://www.europython-society.org/core-grant PS: If you are a core developer and want to organize a workshop, language summit or similar event at EuroPython 2019, please get in touch with our program workgroup (program(a)europython.eu) soon, so that we can arrange rooms, slots, etc. PPS: If you want to become a core developer, please have a look at the Python Dev Guide: https://devguide.python.org/coredev/ Help spread the word -------------------- Please help us spread this message by sharing it on your social networks as widely as possible. Thank you ! Link to the blog post: https://www.europython-society.org/post/182445627020/announcing-the-guido-v… Tweet: https://twitter.com/europythons/status/1090901995635073024 Enjoy, -- EuroPython Society https://ep2019.europython.eu/ https://www.europython-society.org/

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2019 Steering Council Election Voting
by Ernest W. Durbin III 03 Feb '19

03 Feb '19

Ballots have been distributed per PEP 8100 and voting is open. This election is scheduled to end at Feb. 4, 2019, noon (UTC). If you expected to receive a ballot but did not, please contact me at ernest(a)python.org.

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Re: [python-committers] Duplicate ("triplicate"?) Github notifications on Roundup
by Mariatta Wijaya 03 Feb '19

03 Feb '19

Know issue: https://github.com/python/bugs.python.org/issues/12#issuecomment-450681871 On Sun, Feb 3, 2019, 6:47 AM Antoine Pitrou <antoine(a)python.org wrote: > > Hello, > > For some time now, Github notifications on Roundup when a PR is open > arrive three times instead of one. Is this a known issue? > > Regards > > Antoine. > _______________________________________________ > python-committers mailing list > python-committers(a)python.org > https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-committers > Code of Conduct: https://www.python.org/psf/codeofconduct/ >

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