Why is Anatoly posting to python-dev? I thought he was banned when he was banned from the tracker.
I refuse to waste my time trying to reason with him, and I consider the "just ignore him" approach to be unacceptable, as it leaves him free to waste everyone *else's* time trying to break through his parochial lack of empathy.
Regards, Nick.
On 10/06/2014 02:56 PM, Nick Coghlan wrote:
Why is Anatoly posting to python-dev? I thought he was banned when he was banned from the tracker.
I refuse to waste my time trying to reason with him, and I consider the "just ignore him" approach to be unacceptable, as it leaves him free to waste everyone *else's* time trying to break through his parochial lack of empathy.
IIRC he's being moderated?
Georg
On Mon, Oct 6, 2014 at 6:51 AM, Georg Brandl <g.brandl@gmx.net> wrote:
On 10/06/2014 02:56 PM, Nick Coghlan wrote:
Why is Anatoly posting to python-dev? I thought he was banned when he was banned from the tracker.
I refuse to waste my time trying to reason with him, and I consider the "just ignore him" approach to be unacceptable, as it leaves him free to waste everyone *else's* time trying to break through his parochial lack of empathy.
IIRC he's being moderated?
Yes. When I have some time to do pydev moderation, I usually only let Anatoly's emails through if they are strictly content-oriented and carry information. This isn't always easy to discern though, and I imagine other moderators may be burdened by him imposing extra work.
Eli
On 10/15/2014 01:25 PM, Eli Bendersky wrote:
On Mon, Oct 6, 2014 at 6:51 AM, Georg Brandl wrote:
On 10/06/2014 02:56 PM, Nick Coghlan wrote:
Why is Anatoly posting to python-dev? I thought he was banned when he was banned from the tracker.
I refuse to waste my time trying to reason with him, and I consider the "just ignore him" approach to be unacceptable, as it leaves him free to waste everyone *else's* time trying to break through his parochial lack of empathy.
IIRC he's being moderated?
Yes. When I have some time to do pydev moderation, I usually only let Anatoly's emails through if they are strictly content-oriented and carry information. This isn't always easy to discern though, and I imagine other moderators may be burdened by him imposing extra work.
I've been promoted to list-moderator for two other Python lists to help deal with Anatoly's posts -- one more would not be a burden.
-- ~Ethan~
Le 15/10/2014 22:49, Ethan Furman a écrit :
On 10/15/2014 01:25 PM, Eli Bendersky wrote:
On Mon, Oct 6, 2014 at 6:51 AM, Georg Brandl wrote:
On 10/06/2014 02:56 PM, Nick Coghlan wrote:
Why is Anatoly posting to python-dev? I thought he was banned when he was banned from the tracker.
I refuse to waste my time trying to reason with him, and I consider the "just ignore him" approach to be unacceptable, as it leaves him free to waste everyone *else's* time trying to break through his parochial lack of empathy.
IIRC he's being moderated?
Yes. When I have some time to do pydev moderation, I usually only let Anatoly's emails through if they are strictly content-oriented and carry information. This isn't always easy to discern though, and I imagine other moderators may be burdened by him imposing extra work.
I've been promoted to list-moderator for two other Python lists to help deal with Anatoly's posts -- one more would not be a burden.
If the burden is mostly handling Anatoly's email, perhaps we should stop bothering and ban him for good? It doesn't sound right for someone so little constructive to eat up so much of our resources.
What do you think?
Regards
Antoine.
On 10/15/2014 01:54 PM, Antoine Pitrou wrote:
Le 15/10/2014 22:49, Ethan Furman a écrit :
I've been promoted to list-moderator for two other Python lists to help deal with Anatoly's posts -- one more would not be a burden.
If the burden is mostly handling Anatoly's email, perhaps we should stop bothering and ban him for good? It doesn't sound right for someone so little constructive to eat up so much of our resources.
What do you think?
If our infrastructure can handle an outright ban I think that would be the best course of action. If the infrastructure requires a live body to click on Discard... well, my talents are up to that task. ;)
-- ~Ethan~
On 16 October 2014 06:54, Antoine Pitrou <antoine@python.org> wrote:
Le 15/10/2014 22:49, Ethan Furman a écrit :
On 10/15/2014 01:25 PM, Eli Bendersky wrote:
On Mon, Oct 6, 2014 at 6:51 AM, Georg Brandl wrote:
On 10/06/2014 02:56 PM, Nick Coghlan wrote:
Why is Anatoly posting to python-dev? I thought he was banned when he was banned from the tracker.
I refuse to waste my time trying to reason with him, and I consider the "just ignore him" approach to be unacceptable, as it leaves him free to waste everyone *else's* time trying to break through his parochial lack of empathy.
IIRC he's being moderated?
Yes. When I have some time to do pydev moderation, I usually only let Anatoly's emails through if they are strictly content-oriented and carry information. This isn't always easy to discern though, and I imagine other moderators may be burdened by him imposing extra work.
I've been promoted to list-moderator for two other Python lists to help deal with Anatoly's posts -- one more would not be a burden.
If the burden is mostly handling Anatoly's email, perhaps we should stop bothering and ban him for good? It doesn't sound right for someone so little constructive to eat up so much of our resources.
What do you think?
I know at least in my case, even if the posts get through the mailing list moderation, they'll just hit my personal delete filter (it's generally the replies that get my attention, not his own messages).
I only brought it up this time because his initial "yay, well done" message congratulating David on completing the migration to using "bytes like object" in error messages was then entirely undone by a pointless screed complaining that the formal *definition* of a bytes like object is somewhat complicated (which, while an accurate complaint, is also not something that can realistically be changed any time soon).
It's that fundamental inability to do a meaningful cost/benefit analysis that earned Anatoly a place in my delete filter in the first place, and I haven't seen any change in that respect over the past several years. Anatoly can behave reasonably if you're doing what he asks (or just something he agrees with), but he goes off the deep end as soon as you tell him "no, that's not worth the hassle", or even "that might be interesting, how do you plan to make it happen?".
"Those that do the work, make the rules" is one of the fundamental precepts of the open source development model, and interacting with him over a long period of time (including a few years where I was actively attempting to coach him towards contributing productively) has convinced me that Anatoly doesn't accept that as a legitimate constraint on his suggestions.
The long history of conflict between him and both the PSF and the CPython core development team then follows from that as he continues to try to give orders without providing any incentive or clear rationale for anyone else to voluntarily contribute the time needed to do what he suggests.
Continuing to expose contributors (and potential contributors) to an individual that clearly doesn't place any value whatsoever on their contributions is something I've objected to for a long time, so it shouldn't come as any surprise that I'm in favour of just allowing the list moderators to set his posts to auto-discard, without even reading them first :)
Regards, Nick.
-- Nick Coghlan | ncoghlan@gmail.com | Brisbane, Australia
participants (5)
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Antoine Pitrou -
Eli Bendersky -
Ethan Furman -
Georg Brandl -
Nick Coghlan