Mailman 3 September 2009 - Python-Dev

help required
by waqas ahmad Sept. 25, 2009

Sept. 25, 2009

Hi, I dont know it is the right place to post this question. I need help to change one search code line . can you help me please. here is my search method code: search=re.compile("^#acl InternationalGroup.*\n", re.M).search(pagetext) if search: ret=search.group() here i am searching for "#acl InternationalGroup" in the pageText and when it true is then give me search group. I want to change this for following requirement: I want to search for "#acl InternationalGroup" and "CatInternational" in the pageText. when "#acl InternationalGroup" is not there but "CatInternational" is there. then return me search group. I shall be thankful to you for any help. Best Regards, Waqas _________________________________________________________________ Invite your mail contacts to join your friends list with Windows Live Spaces. It's easy! http://spaces.live.com/spacesapi.aspx?wx_action=create&wx_url=/friends.aspx…

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Summary of Python tracker Issues
by Python tracker Sept. 25, 2009

Sept. 25, 2009

ACTIVITY SUMMARY (09/18/09 - 09/25/09) Python tracker at http://bugs.python.org/ To view or respond to any of the issues listed below, click on the issue number. Do NOT respond to this message. 2410 open (+34) / 16406 closed (+20) / 18816 total (+54) Open issues with patches: 955 Average duration of open issues: 667 days. Median duration of open issues: 423 days. Open Issues Breakdown open 2373 (+31) pending 36 ( +3) Issues Created Or Reopened (54) _______________________________ Socket error when launching IDLE 09/18/09 http://bugs.python.org/issue6941 created 08jpurcell email.generator.Generator memory consumption 09/18/09 http://bugs.python.org/issue6942 created rpatterson setup.py fails to find headers of system libffi 09/19/09 http://bugs.python.org/issue6943 created Arfrever patch, easy socket.getnameinfo raises SystemError on bogus input 09/19/09 CLOSED http://bugs.python.org/issue6944 created marienz patch pprint.pprint does not pprint unsortable dicts in Python 3 09/19/09 CLOSED http://bugs.python.org/issue6945 created aronacher Document: Missing link to datetime.datetime 09/19/09 CLOSED http://bugs.python.org/issue6946 created ocean-city Fix distutils test on windows (SO extension) 09/19/09 CLOSED http://bugs.python.org/issue6947 created ocean-city patch list 09/19/09 CLOSED http://bugs.python.org/issue6948 created nutregina Support Berkeley DB 4.8 09/19/09 http://bugs.python.org/issue6949 created Arfrever patch online documentation error: PyObject* PyByteArray_Resize(PyObjec 09/19/09 CLOSED http://bugs.python.org/issue6950 created kaizhu OS X IDLE has two Preferences menus on 2.6.x with Tk > 8.4.7 09/20/09 CLOSED http://bugs.python.org/issue6951 created ned.deily easy deprecated conversion from string constant to char * 09/20/09 http://bugs.python.org/issue6952 created barry-scott readline documenation needs work 09/20/09 http://bugs.python.org/issue6953 created ronaldoussoren DISTUTILS_DEBUG causes stack trace, really simple fix 09/20/09 CLOSED http://bugs.python.org/issue6954 created nedbat Max() Not Working Properly 09/21/09 CLOSED http://bugs.python.org/issue6955 created lovelygoo2 Test creation in unittest.TestProgram should be done in one plac 09/21/09 http://bugs.python.org/issue6956 created michael.foord Extension modules fail to build on OS X 10.6 using python.org 2. 09/21/09 http://bugs.python.org/issue6957 created ned.deily Add Python command line flags to configure logging 09/21/09 http://bugs.python.org/issue6958 created theller patch OS X 10.6 / Snow Leopard: building 2.6 maintenance release fails 09/21/09 CLOSED http://bugs.python.org/issue6959 created cscscs test_telnetlib gives spurious output 09/21/09 http://bugs.python.org/issue6960 created pitrou test_distutils failure 09/21/09 CLOSED http://bugs.python.org/issue6961 created pitrou traceback.format_exception_only does not return SyntaxError caro 09/21/09 http://bugs.python.org/issue6962 created thewtex Add worker process lifetime to multiprocessing.Pool - patch incl 09/22/09 http://bugs.python.org/issue6963 created charlesc patch import new fails 09/22/09 CLOSED http://bugs.python.org/issue6964 created illume tmpnam should not be used if tempfile or mkstemp are available 09/22/09 http://bugs.python.org/issue6965 created djc Ability to refer to arguments in TestCase.fail* methods 09/22/09 http://bugs.python.org/issue6966 created tuben codec windows1256 should be windows windows-1256 09/22/09 CLOSED http://bugs.python.org/issue6967 created DerSascha patch numpy extensions to distutils... are a source of improvements fo 09/22/09 http://bugs.python.org/issue6968 created illume configparser 09/22/09 CLOSED http://bugs.python.org/issue6969 created exe Redundant calls made to comparison methods. 09/22/09 http://bugs.python.org/issue6970 created mark.dickinson needs review Add the SIO_KEEPALIVE_VALS option to socket.ioctl 09/22/09 CLOSED http://bugs.python.org/issue6971 created krisvale patch, patch, easy zipfile.ZipFile overwrites files outside destination path 09/22/09 http://bugs.python.org/issue6972 created schmir subprocess.Popen.send_signal doesn't check whether the process h 09/22/09 http://bugs.python.org/issue6973 created milko.krachounov test_posix getcwd test leaves tmp dir 09/23/09 http://bugs.python.org/issue6974 created iandekit symlinks incorrectly resolved on Linux 09/23/09 http://bugs.python.org/issue6975 created swarecki getcwd hangs and leaks mem on Solaris <= 9 in very long file nam 09/23/09 http://bugs.python.org/issue6976 created iandekit Getopt documentation ambiguity 09/23/09 http://bugs.python.org/issue6977 created SilentGhost compiler.transformer dict key bug d[1,] = 1 09/23/09 http://bugs.python.org/issue6978 created kees patch Passing output arguments to an ActiveX application 09/23/09 CLOSED http://bugs.python.org/issue6979 created benji13 fix ctypes build failure on armel-linux-gnueabi with -mfloat-abi 09/23/09 http://bugs.python.org/issue6980 created doko locale.getdefaultlocale() envvars default code and documentation 09/23/09 http://bugs.python.org/issue6981 created scop make clean does not remove pickle files 09/23/09 CLOSED http://bugs.python.org/issue6982 created egreen patch Add specific get_platform() for freebsd 09/24/09 http://bugs.python.org/issue6983 created stefw patch typo in Unicode HOWTO 09/24/09 CLOSED http://bugs.python.org/issue6984 created Yinon range() fails with long integers 09/24/09 CLOSED http://bugs.python.org/issue6985 created kszawala _json crash on scanner/encoder initialization error 09/24/09 http://bugs.python.org/issue6986 created haypo patch Idle not start 09/24/09 CLOSED http://bugs.python.org/issue6987 created dorina_n2005 shlex.split() converts unicode input to UCS-4 output 09/24/09 http://bugs.python.org/issue6988 created fenner Compile error for Python-2.6.2 on Solaris 09/24/09 http://bugs.python.org/issue6989 created ashish threading.local subclasses don't cleanup their state and it gets 09/25/09 http://bugs.python.org/issue6990 created pjenvey patch, needs review logging encoding failes some situation 09/25/09 http://bugs.python.org/issue6991 created naoki patch multiple authors in setup.by 09/25/09 http://bugs.python.org/issue6992 created techtonik importing of "time" module is terribly slow 09/25/09 http://bugs.python.org/issue6993 created ndyankov enumerate dosctring has a typo 09/25/09 http://bugs.python.org/issue6994 created nessita Issues Now Closed (41) ______________________ Passing 'None' if argtype is set to POINTER(...) doesn't always 283 days http://bugs.python.org/issue4606 theller patch Structure sub-subclass does not initialize with base class posit 237 days http://bugs.python.org/issue5042 theller patch urllib ctypes error on Mac OS X Server 10.5 200 days http://bugs.python.org/issue5413 ronaldoussoren patch 2.6.2 Python Manuals CHM file seems broken 159 days http://bugs.python.org/issue5764 dx617 os.popen causes illegal seek on AIX in Python 3.1rc 106 days http://bugs.python.org/issue6236 nestor patch Upgrading xml.etree to ElementTree 1.3 104 days http://bugs.python.org/issue6272 senthil.kumaran encode and decode should accept 'errors' as a keyword argument 93 days http://bugs.python.org/issue6300 benjamin.peterson patch, easy solaris/aix: Py_Initialize: can't initialize sys standard stream 87 days http://bugs.python.org/issue6348 pitrou ctypes.PyThreadState_SetAsyncExc does not work on linux 64bit ma 49 days http://bugs.python.org/issue6613 theller time.strftime does unnecessary range check 19 days http://bugs.python.org/issue6823 brett.cannon patch, easy urllib.urlopen crashes in a thread on Snow Leopard 13 days http://bugs.python.org/issue6851 ronaldoussoren patch, 26backport Support system readline on OS X 10.6 15 days http://bugs.python.org/issue6872 mark.dickinson patch enable compilation of readline module on Mac OS X 10.5 and 10.6 12 days http://bugs.python.org/issue6877 zvezdan patch, 26backport, needs review incorrect signature in doc for PyByteArray_Resize 9 days http://bugs.python.org/issue6881 ezio.melotti pdb documentation shows running as script using "python" not "py 7 days http://bugs.python.org/issue6885 georg.brandl ctypes compilation error on SnowLeopard 5 days http://bugs.python.org/issue6918 ronaldoussoren Doc for locals and vars 3 days http://bugs.python.org/issue6925 tjreedy [PATCH] PyUnicode_DecodeUTF16 docs wrong (byteorder param) 1 days http://bugs.python.org/issue6930 georg.brandl patch [PATCH] postflight.framework script (from the Mac OS X .dmg inst 3 days http://bugs.python.org/issue6934 ronaldoussoren patch multiprocessing lock on OS X Snow Leopard dumps core 2 days http://bugs.python.org/issue6937 ronaldoussoren cannot compute sizeof wchar_t on OS X 10.5.7, Python 2.6.2 0 days http://bugs.python.org/issue6940 rajarshi socket.getnameinfo raises SystemError on bogus input 0 days http://bugs.python.org/issue6944 georg.brandl patch pprint.pprint does not pprint unsortable dicts in Python 3 1 days http://bugs.python.org/issue6945 aronacher Document: Missing link to datetime.datetime 0 days http://bugs.python.org/issue6946 georg.brandl Fix distutils test on windows (SO extension) 0 days http://bugs.python.org/issue6947 tarek patch list 0 days http://bugs.python.org/issue6948 mark.dickinson online documentation error: PyObject* PyByteArray_Resize(PyObjec 0 days http://bugs.python.org/issue6950 ezio.melotti OS X IDLE has two Preferences menus on 2.6.x with Tk > 8.4.7 1 days http://bugs.python.org/issue6951 ronaldoussoren easy DISTUTILS_DEBUG causes stack trace, really simple fix 1 days http://bugs.python.org/issue6954 tarek Max() Not Working Properly 0 days http://bugs.python.org/issue6955 benjamin.peterson OS X 10.6 / Snow Leopard: building 2.6 maintenance release fails 1 days http://bugs.python.org/issue6959 cscscs test_distutils failure 1 days http://bugs.python.org/issue6961 tarek import new fails 1 days http://bugs.python.org/issue6964 georg.brandl codec windows1256 should be windows windows-1256 0 days http://bugs.python.org/issue6967 georg.brandl patch configparser 0 days http://bugs.python.org/issue6969 georg.brandl Add the SIO_KEEPALIVE_VALS option to socket.ioctl 3 days http://bugs.python.org/issue6971 krisvale patch, patch, easy Passing output arguments to an ActiveX application 0 days http://bugs.python.org/issue6979 mark.dickinson make clean does not remove pickle files 1 days http://bugs.python.org/issue6982 mark.dickinson patch typo in Unicode HOWTO 0 days http://bugs.python.org/issue6984 georg.brandl range() fails with long integers 0 days http://bugs.python.org/issue6985 brett.cannon Idle not start 0 days http://bugs.python.org/issue6987 amaury.forgeotdarc Top Issues Most Discussed (10) ______________________________ 19 Add Python command line flags to configure logging 4 days open http://bugs.python.org/issue6958 12 enable compilation of readline module on Mac OS X 10.5 and 10.6 12 days closed http://bugs.python.org/issue6877 9 improve xrange.__contains__ 785 days open http://bugs.python.org/issue1766304 8 IDLE 2.6.1 locks up on Mac OS 10.6 17 days open http://bugs.python.org/issue6864 7 shlex.split() converts unicode input to UCS-4 output 1 days open http://bugs.python.org/issue6988 7 Add specific get_platform() for freebsd 2 days open http://bugs.python.org/issue6983 7 Add gamma function, error functions and other C99 math.h functi 437 days open http://bugs.python.org/issue3366 6 make clean does not remove pickle files 1 days closed http://bugs.python.org/issue6982 5 range() fails with long integers 0 days closed http://bugs.python.org/issue6985 5 deprecated conversion from string constant to char * 5 days open http://bugs.python.org/issue6952

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surprised to "++" and "--"
by Wee Binn Sept. 25, 2009

Sept. 25, 2009

Hi, I know that there is no "++" or "--" operator in python, but if "var++" or something like that in my code(you know, most of C/C++ coders may like this),there is nothing wrong reported and program goes on just like expected!! This is obscure, maybe a bug.

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Re: [Python-Dev] Distutils ML wrap-up: setup.cfg new format
by P.J. Eby Sept. 24, 2009

Sept. 24, 2009

At 07:05 PM 9/23/2009 -0700, Guido van Rossum wrote: >On Wed, Sep 23, 2009 at 6:57 PM, P.J. Eby <pje(a)telecommunity.com> wrote: > > Once again, I'd like for the badgering to stop. Thanks. > >Tarek already agreed to that ("Fine with me. Let's move forward"). I >hope you will stop badgering him too. The only reason I said "once again" above instead of, "One last time", is because I didn't want to be misconstrued as making some sort of threat. However, I can assure you, the above is the very last time I will make that request. In any case, I hadn't yet seen the message of Tarek's you allude to above, in large part because it wasn't actually *addressed* to me. It went out only to Python-Dev, whereas the message calling me paranoid went straight to my inbox. I doubt that it was intentional on Tarek's part (checking the thread shows that Antoine's the one who first cut the cc: list), but the fact remains that I hadn't seen it when I sent my message. Otherwise, I'd have replied in *that* thread, rather than this one.

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Re: [Python-Dev] Distutils ML wrap-up: setup.cfg new format
by P.J. Eby Sept. 24, 2009

Sept. 24, 2009

At 12:40 AM 9/24/2009 +0200, Tarek Ziadé wrote: >Come on phillip, no one is "plotting" against you. Perhaps this is a language issue. When I said, "if Tarek is too busy projecting hidden plots onto everything I say and do," I meant that you were acting as if I were plotting against *you*, not the other way around. (For example, you described one of my proposals as "suspicious", in a context that made it appear you were concerned it would undermine your plans for Distribute.) However, I find it "suspicious" myself, that, rather than actually address *any* of the substantial issues I brought up, you chose to re-argue points I'm not even disputing. For example, is it really necessary to make *every* post of yours that mentions me include an essay on how long it's been since the last setuptools release? As I said below, I don't see how that's remotely relevant to the value of my contributions... but somehow you find a way to bring it up constantly. Do you feel so guilty about forking that you need to continually re-justify yourself? If you're doing it on my account, do please stop. AFAIR, I haven't said a negative thing about your fork since it got off the ground, and have in fact said many positive things about it. Indeed, the only negative thing I would currently say about it, is that your characterization of it as a "friendly" fork is not consistent with your public behavior and demeanor towards me. Once again, I'd like for the badgering to stop. Thanks. At 12:40 AM 9/24/2009 +0200, Tarek Ziadé wrote: >You didn't maintain setuptools for a year while people where begging >you to do bug fixes. You blessed Ian and Jim to take over but they >are too busy to do it . I even sent them a mail on my side to try to >convince them. > >So we asked you to bless someone else that was active (not in >particular me as your mail seem to say) but you did not. So we >forked. And people were pissed off at you. (Which I am sorry about) > >If a project is not maintained and if the maintainer does not open >it to other maintainers, that s the way to go . > >And the fact that I took the lead of that fork doesn't mean I am >offended because you did not bless me to maintain setuptools. It >just means that I want to move forward and have a working tool for python 3. > >So let me make it clear that when you say "Tarek appears" it is >something I have never said but rather something you are thinking >like being the truth. > >Now for the Distribute work , your patches are very welcome. It s a >community project. > >>On Sep 23, 2009 10:47 PM, "P.J. Eby" >><<mailto:pje@telecommunity.com>pje(a)telecommunity.com> wrote: >> >>At 07:00 PM 9/23/2009 +0200, Tarek Ziadé wrote: > > While it's >>great to have Philipp being part of o... >>Here's what actually happened, if anyone cares. Tarek and friends >>announced a fork of setuptools. I reviewed the work and saw that >>-- for the most part -- I was happy with it, and opined as how I >>might be willing to bless the the "package inquisition" team as >>official maintainers of the 0.6 branch of setuptools, so that I >>could work on the fun bits I've long planned for 0.7, but never >>felt free to start on while there was so much still needing to be done on 0.6. >> >>However, just as I mentioned this, and suggested an option for what >>I could do that would be helpful to his Distribute 0.7 project as >>well as various other tools (e.g. implementing some of Jim Fulton's >>long-requested features for better modularization of setuptools), >>Tarek accused me of somehow trying to undermine his plans. >> >>In addition, it appears Tarek was also offended by my earlier >>statement that there were only a few people in the Python community >>who had *already* earned my implicit trust to not only hack on >>setuptools unsupervised, but also to take over its *future* >>direction and BDFL-ship. (For example, Jim Fulton and Ian Bicking.) >> >>Tarek, however, appears to have taken this to mean that I >>personally thought he was an incompetent programmer or something >>(when I actually had no opinion one way or the other), and ever >>since he has taken to levelling potshots like the above at me on a >>semi-regular basis. >> >>I've tried to ignore this and play nice, because he is actually >>working on this stuff and I am not. But it's hard for me to >>actually give any help in practice, if Tarek is too busy projecting >>hidden plots onto everything I say and do. >> >>If you read Tarek's distutils-sig posts, it appears my >>already-existing trust in Ian and Jim was not only a personal >>insult to Tarek, but also a plot to ensure that nobody with any >>time to do so would ever work on setuptools, just as my excitement >>about working on setuptools again was a plot to steal thunder from his fork. >> >>All I want is for good stuff to happen for setuptools users and >>Python users in general, so I don't think all the suspicion and >>backbiting is merited. I certainly don't appreciate it, and I >>would like it to stop. It also isn't even relevant to the thread, >>since my lack of work on setuptools says exactly zero about the >>merits or lack thereof of Tarek's proposals for the distutils! >> >>Hell, I *support* the bulk of Tarek's setup.cfg proposal, and don't >>even object to him Pronouncing it or cutting off the >>discussion! My only issue on Python-Dev was his inaccurate >>implication that it was a SIG consensus rather than a pronouncement >>on it. There is and was no need for any of this to get personal, >>and I have continually strived to keep my posts here and >>distutils-sig civil, even when I didn't feel like being civil in >>response to Tarek's jabs. I have in fact bent over backwards to be >>*nice* to Tarek, because he seemed so damn sensitive about >>everything. Apparently, however, this does not actually help things. :-(

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unsubscriptable vs object does not support indexing
by Dino Viehland Sept. 24, 2009

Sept. 24, 2009

Is there a reason or a rule by which CPython reports different error message for different failures to subscript? For example: >>> set()[2] Traceback (most recent call last): File "<stdin>", line 1, in <module> TypeError: 'set' object does not support indexing >>> class c(object): pass ... >>> c()[2] Traceback (most recent call last): File "<stdin>", line 1, in <module> TypeError: 'c' object does not support indexing But compare this to: >>> [].append[42] Traceback (most recent call last): File "<stdin>", line 1, in <module> TypeError: 'builtin_function_or_method' object is unsubscriptable >>> (lambda: 42)[42] Traceback (most recent call last): File "<stdin>", line 1, in <module> TypeError: 'function' object is unsubscriptable >>> property()[42] Traceback (most recent call last): File "<stdin>", line 1, in <module> TypeError: 'property' object is unsubscriptable IronPython had a bug report that we were getting this wrong for set objects and that "does not support indexing" was also a clearer error message. I'm wondering if there's some reason why the different error messages occur which I'm missing. Otherwise I could switch to using the more clear message or start marking types which should report the unsubscriptable error. Does anyone have any insights into this?

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Re: [Python-Dev] Distutils ML wrap-up: setup.cfg new format
by Tarek Ziadé Sept. 23, 2009

Sept. 23, 2009

(Sorry if it's top posting I am on a mobile) Come on phillip, no one is "plotting" against you. You didn't maintain setuptools for a year while people where begging you to do bug fixes. You blessed Ian and Jim to take over but they are too busy to do it . I even sent them a mail on my side to try to convince them. So we asked you to bless someone else that was active (not in particular me as your mail seem to say) but you did not. So we forked. And people were pissed off at you. (Which I am sorry about) If a project is not maintained and if the maintainer does not open it to other maintainers, that s the way to go . And the fact that I took the lead of that fork doesn't mean I am offended because you did not bless me to maintain setuptools. It just means that I want to move forward and have a working tool for python 3. So let me make it clear that when you say "Tarek appears" it is something I have never said but rather something you are thinking like being the truth. Now for the Distribute work , your patches are very welcome. It s a community project. On Sep 23, 2009 10:47 PM, "P.J. Eby" <pje(a)telecommunity.com> wrote: At 07:00 PM 9/23/2009 +0200, Tarek Ziadé wrote: > > While it's great to have Philipp being part of o... Here's what actually happened, if anyone cares. Tarek and friends announced a fork of setuptools. I reviewed the work and saw that -- for the most part -- I was happy with it, and opined as how I might be willing to bless the the "package inquisition" team as official maintainers of the 0.6 branch of setuptools, so that I could work on the fun bits I've long planned for 0.7, but never felt free to start on while there was so much still needing to be done on 0.6. However, just as I mentioned this, and suggested an option for what I could do that would be helpful to his Distribute 0.7 project as well as various other tools (e.g. implementing some of Jim Fulton's long-requested features for better modularization of setuptools), Tarek accused me of somehow trying to undermine his plans. In addition, it appears Tarek was also offended by my earlier statement that there were only a few people in the Python community who had *already* earned my implicit trust to not only hack on setuptools unsupervised, but also to take over its *future* direction and BDFL-ship. (For example, Jim Fulton and Ian Bicking.) Tarek, however, appears to have taken this to mean that I personally thought he was an incompetent programmer or something (when I actually had no opinion one way or the other), and ever since he has taken to levelling potshots like the above at me on a semi-regular basis. I've tried to ignore this and play nice, because he is actually working on this stuff and I am not. But it's hard for me to actually give any help in practice, if Tarek is too busy projecting hidden plots onto everything I say and do. If you read Tarek's distutils-sig posts, it appears my already-existing trust in Ian and Jim was not only a personal insult to Tarek, but also a plot to ensure that nobody with any time to do so would ever work on setuptools, just as my excitement about working on setuptools again was a plot to steal thunder from his fork. All I want is for good stuff to happen for setuptools users and Python users in general, so I don't think all the suspicion and backbiting is merited. I certainly don't appreciate it, and I would like it to stop. It also isn't even relevant to the thread, since my lack of work on setuptools says exactly zero about the merits or lack thereof of Tarek's proposals for the distutils! Hell, I *support* the bulk of Tarek's setup.cfg proposal, and don't even object to him Pronouncing it or cutting off the discussion! My only issue on Python-Dev was his inaccurate implication that it was a SIG consensus rather than a pronouncement on it. There is and was no need for any of this to get personal, and I have continually strived to keep my posts here and distutils-sig civil, even when I didn't feel like being civil in response to Tarek's jabs. I have in fact bent over backwards to be *nice* to Tarek, because he seemed so damn sensitive about everything. Apparently, however, this does not actually help things. :-(

1 0

Re: [Python-Dev] Distutils ML wrap-up: setup.cfg new format
by P.J. Eby Sept. 23, 2009

Sept. 23, 2009

At 02:20 PM 9/23/2009 +0200, Tarek Ziadé wrote: >If you take the time to read everything you'll see that there were >no real alternative design proposed, You did not respond to repeated requests (from more than one person), for clarification regarding the requirements that your proposal was trying to fill. More than one person expressed reservations about the complexity of your candidate proposal, and wanted to know why we needed a fully conditional syntax, if the only use case for conditionals was expressing dependencies. That there was not a "complete" alternative proposal is true... but that's only because you would not answer the question that several people asked: that is, why do we *need* conditionals, for anything besides dependencies? What are the use cases? More than one person asked that question, but I never saw you answer it. (In one case, you answered with the use cases for what the conditionals needed to be able to *check*, but not *what the conditionals were conditioning* -- which was the whole point of the question.) A lack of polished alternatives to your proposal does not constitute a positive rationale for your own proposal, especially if people are asking for the rationale in order to determine whether a simpler proposal would suffice! I dropped my previous competing proposal some time ago when you presented strong use cases for static metadata. And I'd have happily dropped my support for Sridhar's proposal, too, if you'd given similarly strong use cases for the proposal you went with. But even if you *didn't* give those use cases, I'd have been fine with you saying to Python-Dev, "I got tired of the discussion and chose to Pronounce." (After all, that is what you more or less said on the distutils-sig.) But what hacked me off is that *here*, you presented your pronouncement as if it were a summary of distutils-sig discussion, when the last flurry of traffic on the distutils-sig right beforehand was a bunch of questions and requests for use cases. Not nice.

1 0

how to properly object to something (was: Distutils ML wrap-up: setup.cfg new format)
by Brett Cannon Sept. 23, 2009

Sept. 23, 2009

2009/9/22 Chris Withers <chris(a)simplistix.co.uk>: > Brett Cannon wrote: >> >> OK, stop before it gets any nastier as your email already sounds rude, >> Chris. > > Yes, apologies. Thanks. > >> Since the language summit at PyCon 2009 various committers, including >> me, have been encouraging Tarek to act as distutils dictator to get >> things finished as we all know people are prone to bikeshedding that >> would kill any forward momentum we have towards improving the >> packaging situation. > > ...except that this isn't bikeshedding. Use of that term just to stifle > productive discussion is also rude. This sounds like a differing of opinion; Tarek doesn't think it's critical, you do. Obviously that changes what the two of you view as bikeshedding on this topic. I also just checked the thread based on the link you and Sridhar sent and I didn't see anyone publicly say they preferred Sridhar's version. If people preferred Sridhar's version they should have spoken up. While Sridhar's email came in Friday and Tarek pronounced Saturday (as a reply to one of Sridhar's emails to his idea), that doesn't mean no one could have spoken up over the the past three days in support of Sridhar's idea if they preferred it regardless of what Tarek decided; no code has been committed so decisions can be changed (gods know plenty of people have said after Guido has pronounced "I disagree" and no one has ever taken offense). So I don't think it's fair to claim that Tarek is not listening considering his pronouncement was in reply to one of the proposals you said he was ignoring. In other words, Chris, you brought up objections to Tarek's decision claiming he was ignoring two full days after he made it, and used as support at least one email which no one publicly showed support for and for which Tarek indirectly replied to when he made his decision. So I see no evidence that Tarek is ignoring people's input from where I stand. If you didn't like Tarek's final decision or preferred Sridhar's idea then you should have replied to one of those emails with at least a vote of +1/+0/-0/-1 over on the distutils-SIG, not here. As of right now this feels like an end-run around Tarek using extremely weak evidence which, in my opinion, is bikeshedding. -Brett

1 0

Re: [Python-Dev] Distutils ML wrap-up: setup.cfg new format
by P.J. Eby Sept. 22, 2009

Sept. 22, 2009

At 08:12 PM 9/22/2009 +0200, Tarek Ziadé wrote: >If you are talking about another solution than using setup.cfg with >conditional >expressions, please start a new thread that demonstrates how it will work, >we all want the best solution of course. I already did that, on the distutils-sig. Or more precisely, someone else did. I only elaborated on the idea they proposed. (I believe it was Sridhar who first proposed it, but my memory may be incorrect.)

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