PEP 405 (proposed): Python 2.8 Release Schedule
I think we should have an official pronouncement about Python 2.8, and PEPs are as official as it gets 'round here. Thus I propose the following. If there are no objections <wink>, I'll commit this taking the next available number. Cheers, -Barry PEP: 405 Title: Python 2.8 Release Schedule Version: $Revision$ Last-Modified: $Date$ Author: Barry Warsaw <barry@python.org> Status: Final Type: Informational Content-Type: text/x-rst Created: 2011-11-09 Python-Version: 2.8 Abstract ======== This document describes the development and release schedule for Python 2.8. Release Schedule ================ The current schedule is: - 2.8 final Never Official pronouncement ====================== There will never be an official Python 2.8 release. Upgrade path ============ The official upgrade path from Python 2.7 is to Python 3. Copyright ========= This document has been placed in the public domain. .. Local Variables: mode: indented-text indent-tabs-mode: nil sentence-end-double-space: t fill-column: 70 coding: utf-8 End:
2011/11/9 Barry Warsaw <barry@python.org>:
I think we should have an official pronouncement about Python 2.8, and PEPs are as official as it gets 'round here. Thus I propose the following. If there are no objections <wink>, I'll commit this taking the next available number.
Cheers, -Barry
PEP: 405 Title: Python 2.8 Release Schedule
I don't know why this PEP is necessary, but I think a more appropriate title would be "2.x is in maintenance only mode".
Version: $Revision$ Last-Modified: $Date$ Author: Barry Warsaw <barry@python.org> Status: Final Type: Informational Content-Type: text/x-rst Created: 2011-11-09 Python-Version: 2.8
-- Regards, Benjamin
Benjamin Peterson wrote:
2011/11/9 Barry Warsaw <barry@python.org>:
I think we should have an official pronouncement about Python 2.8, and PEPs are as official as it gets 'round here. Thus I propose the following. If there are no objections <wink>, I'll commit this taking the next available number.
Cheers, -Barry
PEP: 405 Title: Python 2.8 Release Schedule
I don't know why this PEP is necessary, but I think a more appropriate title would be "2.x is in maintenance only mode".
I think somebody searching will more easily find "Python 2.8 Release Schedule" rather than "2.x is in maintenance only mode". ~Ethan~
On Nov 09, 2011, at 11:18 AM, Benjamin Peterson wrote:
I don't know why this PEP is necessary, but I think a more appropriate title would be "2.x is in maintenance only mode".
Okay, it's a little tongue-in-cheek, but the practical reason is that I want it to be the top hit when someone searches for "Python 2.8". Cheers, -Barry
Le Mercredi 9 Novembre 2011 17:18:45 Amaury Forgeot d'Arc a écrit :
Hi,
2011/11/9 Barry Warsaw <barry@python.org>
I think we should have an official pronouncement about Python 2.8, and PEPs are as official as it gets 'round here.
Do we need to designate a release manager?
random.choice() should help in this case. Victor
On Nov 09, 2011, at 05:18 PM, Amaury Forgeot d'Arc wrote:
2011/11/9 Barry Warsaw <barry@python.org>
I think we should have an official pronouncement about Python 2.8, and PEPs are as official as it gets 'round here.
Do we need to designate a release manager?
I'd happily serve as the un-release manager. :) -Barry
On Wed, Nov 9, 2011 at 17:18, Amaury Forgeot d'Arc <amauryfa@gmail.com> wrote:
Hi, 2011/11/9 Barry Warsaw <barry@python.org>
I think we should have an official pronouncement about Python 2.8, and PEPs are as official as it gets 'round here.
Do we need to designate a release manager?
I volunteer. It's on my level of competence. //Lennart
On 11/9/2011 11:14 AM, Barry Warsaw wrote:
I think we should have an official pronouncement about Python 2.8,
http://python.org/download/releases/2.7.2/ (and similar) already say: The Python 2.7 series is scheduled to be the last major version in the 2.x series before 2.x moves into an extended maintenance period. If Guido is ready to "pound the final nail in the coffin", delete 'scheduled to be', and change "series before 2.x moves into" to "series. 2.x is in", fine with me. I am not sure a PEP is also needed, but OK, with revision.
and PEPs are as official as it gets 'round here. Thus I propose the following. If there are no objections<wink>,
There are ;-). The title is misleading, and the whole thing reads like an April Fools Joke. If I were looking for information, I would be slightly annoyed.
PEP: 405 Title: Python 2.8 Release Schedule
Title: Python 2.8 Will Never Happen tells anyone searching what they need to know immediately. They would only need to click on a link if they wanted to know 'why'.
Version: $Revision$ Last-Modified: $Date$ Author: Barry Warsaw<barry@python.org>
Guido should be the first author.
Status: Final Type: Informational
So let us be informative from the title on.
Content-Type: text/x-rst Created: 2011-11-09 Python-Version: 2.8
Abstract ========
This document describes the development and release schedule for Python 2.8.
More non-informative teasing. Instead, I suggest replacing everything with short, sweet, and informative. Rationale ========= For backward-compatibility reasons, the Python 2 series is burdened with several obsolete and duplicate features that were removed in Python 3. In addition, the primary character set was expanded from ascii to unicode. While bug fixes continue for 2.7, new developments go into Python 3.x versions. -- Terry Jan Reedy
On Wed, Nov 9, 2011 at 10:14, Barry Warsaw <barry@python.org> wrote:
I think we should have an official pronouncement about Python 2.8, and PEPs are as official as it gets 'round here. Thus I propose the following. If there are no objections <wink>, I'll commit this taking the next available number.
Cheers, -Barry
PEP: 405 Title: Python 2.8 Release Schedule Version: $Revision$ Last-Modified: $Date$ Author: Barry Warsaw <barry@python.org> Status: Final Type: Informational Content-Type: text/x-rst Created: 2011-11-09 Python-Version: 2.8
Abstract ========
This document describes the development and release schedule for Python 2.8.
Release Schedule ================
The current schedule is:
- 2.8 final Never
Official pronouncement ======================
There will never be an official Python 2.8 release.
Upgrade path ============
The official upgrade path from Python 2.7 is to Python 3.
Copyright =========
This document has been placed in the public domain.
.. Local Variables: mode: indented-text indent-tabs-mode: nil sentence-end-double-space: t fill-column: 70 coding: utf-8 End:
+1. post it as-is.
On Wed, Nov 9, 2011 at 10:14, Barry Warsaw <barry@python.org> wrote:
I think we should have an official pronouncement about Python 2.8, and PEPs are as official as it gets 'round here. Thus I propose the following. If there are no objections <wink>, I'll commit this taking the next available number.
+1 on having a PEP +0 on posting it as it stands I see why people feel that something more precise and/or formal would get the message across better, but the mildly tongue-in-cheek tone isn't really inappropriate for a language named after Monty Python :-) +1 for Cardinal Biggles as release manager. Paul
On Nov 09, 2011, at 08:58 PM, Paul Moore wrote:
I see why people feel that something more precise and/or formal would get the message across better, but the mildly tongue-in-cheek tone isn't really inappropriate for a language named after Monty Python :-)
*Thank you* :)
+1 for Cardinal Biggles as release manager.
Brilliant! -Barry
On Thu, Nov 10, 2011 at 7:55 AM, Barry Warsaw <barry@python.org> wrote:
+1 for Cardinal Biggles as release manager.
Now you need to persuade Vinay to let you trade PEP numbers with the pyvenv PEP. Having an unrelease schedule as PEP 404 is too good an opportunity to pass up :) Getting boring for a moment, I suggest including the following new section just before the copyright section: And Now For Something Completely Different ================================= Sorry, sorry, that's just being too silly. While the language may be named after a British comedy troupe (and the overall tone of this PEP reflects that), there are some serious reasons that explain why there won't be an official 2.8 release from the CPython development team. If a search for "Python 2.8" brought you to this document, you may not be aware of the underlying problems in the design of Python 2.x that led to the creation of the 3.x series. First and foremost, Python 2.x is a language with ASCII text at its core. The main text manipulation interfaces, the standard I/O stack and many other elements of the standard library are built around that assumption. While Unicode is supported, it's quite clearly an added on feature rather than something that is fundamental to the language. Python 3.x changes that core assumption, instead building the language around Unicode text. This affects the builtin ``str`` type (which is now Unicode text rather than 8-bit data), the standard I/O stack (which now supports Unicode encoding concepts directly), what identifier and module names are legal (with most Unicode alphanumeric characters being supported) and several other aspects of the language. With the text handling and associated I/O changes breaking backwards compatibility *anyway*, Guido took the opportunity to finally eliminate some other design defects in Python 2.x that had been preserved solely for backwards compatibility reasons. These changes include: - complete removal of support for "classic" (i.e. pre-2.2 style) class semantics - the separate ``int`` (machine level integer) and ``long`` (arbitrarily large) integer types have been merged into a single ``int`` type (that supports arbitrarily large values) - integer division now promotes non-integer results to binary floating values automatically - the error prone ``except Exception, exc:`` syntax has been removed (in favour of the more explicit ``except Exception as exc:``) - ``print`` and ``exec`` are now ordinary functions rather than statements - the backtick based ```x``` alternate spelling of ``repr(x)`` has been removed - the ``<>`` alternate spelling of ``!=`` has been removed - implicit relative imports have been removed - star imports (i.e. ``from x import *``) are now permitted only in module level code - implicit ordering comparisons between objects of different types have been removed - list comprehensions no longer leak their iteration variables into the surrounding scope - many APIs that previously returned lists now return iterators or lightweight views instead (e.g. ``map`` produces an iterator, ``range`` creates a virtual sequence, ``dict.keys`` a view of the original dict) - iterator advancement is now via a protocal-based builtin (``next()`` invoking ``__next__()``) rather than an ordinary method call - some rarely needed builtins have been relocated to standard library modules (``reduce`` is now ``functools.reduce``, ``reload`` is now ``imp.reload``) - some areas of the standard library have been rearranged in an attempt to make the naming schemes more intuitive More details on the backwards incompatible changes relative to the 2.x series can be found in the `Python 3.0 What's New`_ document. With the 3.x Unicode based architecture providing a significantly better foundation for a language with a global audience, all new features will appear solely in the Python 3.x series. However, as detailed elsewhere, the 2.7 release will still be supported with bug fixes and maintenance releases for several years. .. _`Python 3.0 What's New`: http://docs.python.org/py3k/whatsnew/3.0.html -- Nick Coghlan | ncoghlan@gmail.com | Brisbane, Australia
On Nov 10, 2011, at 08:58 AM, Nick Coghlan wrote:
Now you need to persuade Vinay to let you trade PEP numbers with the pyvenv PEP. Having an unrelease schedule as PEP 404 is too good an opportunity to pass up :)
Brilliant suggestion! Vinay? :)
Getting boring for a moment, I suggest including the following new section just before the copyright section:
You have a very good point. I think I'd like a shorter 'serious' section though. Let me see what I can put together. -Barry
On 10 November 2011 11:05, Barry Warsaw <barry@python.org> wrote:
On Nov 10, 2011, at 08:58 AM, Nick Coghlan wrote:
Now you need to persuade Vinay to let you trade PEP numbers with the pyvenv PEP. Having an unrelease schedule as PEP 404 is too good an opportunity to pass up :)
Brilliant suggestion! Vinay? :)
410 Gone would be more appropriate IMO. But 404 does have more mindshare. Tim Delaney
Barry Warsaw <barry <at> python.org> writes:
On Nov 10, 2011, at 08:58 AM, Nick Coghlan wrote:
Now you need to persuade Vinay to let you trade PEP numbers with the pyvenv PEP. Having an unrelease schedule as PEP 404 is too good an opportunity to pass up :)
Brilliant suggestion! Vinay? :)
Actually you need Carl Meyer's agreement, not mine - he's the one writing the PEP. But I'm in favour :-) Regards, Vinay Sajip
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 On 11/10/2011 07:17 AM, Vinay Sajip wrote:
Barry Warsaw <barry <at> python.org> writes:
On Nov 10, 2011, at 08:58 AM, Nick Coghlan wrote:
Now you need to persuade Vinay to let you trade PEP numbers with the pyvenv PEP. Having an unrelease schedule as PEP 404 is too good an opportunity to pass up :)
Brilliant suggestion! Vinay? :)
Actually you need Carl Meyer's agreement, not mine - he's the one writing the PEP. But I'm in favour :-)
No objection here. Carl -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.10 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org/ iEYEARECAAYFAk68DeYACgkQ8W4rlRKtE2c9pACgvYw22k3HQOgjmRjNk+F5AdW4 QIcAoLgzdPb8PNNHqqEdGYWGeMp0lD3I =u9HS -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----
On Thu, Nov 10, 2011 at 1:58 AM, Nick Coghlan <ncoghlan@gmail.com> wrote:
Getting boring for a moment, I suggest including the following new section just before the copyright section:
I'd also include a "roadmap" section with all 2.x wannabes that are not going to be be released with 2.8. And a special epilogue chapter listing all missing stdlib wannabes and fixes that were never implemented, because they break backward 2.x compatibility. -- anatoly t.
participants (16)
-
Amaury Forgeot d'Arc -
anatoly techtonik -
Barry Warsaw -
Benjamin Peterson -
Brian Curtin -
Carl Meyer -
Ethan Furman -
Greg Ewing -
John O'Connor -
Lennart Regebro -
Nick Coghlan -
Paul Moore -
Terry Reedy -
Tim Delaney -
Victor Stinner -
Vinay Sajip