Andrew Barnert writes:
 > On Jun 26, 2019, at 21:45, Stephen J. Turnbull <turnbull.stephen.fw@u.tsukuba.ac.jp> wrote:
 > >
 > > Chris Angelico writes:
 > >
 > >> Then I completely don't understand getself. Can you give an example
 > >> of how it would be used? So far, it just seems like an utter total
 > >> mess.
 > >
 > > It's possible that __getself__ would be implemented "halfway".  That
 > > is, if __getself__ is present, it is invoked, and performs *side
 > > effects* (a simple example would be an access counter/logger for the
 > > object).  Then the compiler loads that object, discarding any return
 > > value of the method.  I think this is the semantics that the
 > > proponents are thinking of.
 >
 > The compiler has to load the object before calling __getself__, not
 > after, or it has nothing to call __getself__ on, right?

Correct.  I should have said "leaves the object alone rather than
substituting the value of the method".

 > Anyway, I don’t think this really avoids most of the problems.

Agreed.  I just thought that it was worth clarifying that __getself__
could be entirely about side effects by definition.

 > And I think everything else is an inherent consequence of trying to
 > answer “I want to hook this operation on variables”

Yeah, I really don't understand why this is desirable in Python, but
if it is,

 > “here’s an hook on values instead”

is not the way to do it.  All roads lead to "We don't need a proof of
concept implementation, we need a proof of utility application."
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