Hi all, as a moderator of python-ideas, I’ve asked postmaster to place python-ideas into emergency moderation. (I do not have the tools to do so myself.) I’m willing to review messages individually as needed. best, —titus

On Jun 29, 2020, at 9:24 AM, Abdur-Rahmaan Janhangeer <arj.python@gmail.com> wrote:

Threads like these are meaningless, does not provide any learning value and is nowhere near the single vs double quote thread.

It opens the gap for people who are not concerned about development jump in the game shifting the focus away while nurturing a culture of thrash I mean you tend to ignore threads from python-dev and python-ideas which is not probably why you subscribed in the first place

This is not the first time i am saying that you can fly around the world on official Python mailing lists. But it's regrettable that it's the first time i am seeing people telling that they should educate others and things like that. It can be based on the argument and circle around it but personal attacks are off limit

If this was a Github issue, i don't think you list moderators would have dragged it around that much. Worst case scenario, someone would have been pinged and the issue taken care of. A PR or closing and you are done.

I raised the issue of closing a mail thread before and the impractical nature of it was discussed but maybe warnings and continued posting after the warning results in ban can be enforced

And it's annoying that it got dragged to two mailing lists. I respect Python people and i am always eager to follow some C code discussions, deprecating this C API etc. It's a new world for me.

Maybe active list members should sign a convention or a vetting process can be setup before we can discuss it on the lists. Not ideal but might be useful.

Kind Regards,

Abdur-Rahmaan Janhangeer compileralchemy | blog github Mauritius

On Mon, Jun 29, 2020 at 8:11 PM David Mertz <mertz@gnosis.cx> wrote: The commit message is simply silly. It introduces numerous contentious and false claims that have nothing whatsoever to do with the small wording change. It misunderstands how language, culture, history, and indeed white supremacism, work.

I would recommend amending the commit message.

The underlying change itself is reasonable, and to my mind a small improvement. There was unnecessary specificity in using Strunk and White as reference, and not, say, William Zinsser's _On Writing Well_, which is almost as well known. In the concrete, it would be exceedingly rare for these to provide conflicting advice on a specific code comment.

On Mon, Jun 29, 2020 at 7:34 AM Richard Damon <Richard@damon-family.org> wrote: On 6/29/20 6:22 AM, Nathaniel Smith wrote:

...

and describes the old text as a "relic", which is another way of saying that the problems were only there by historical accident, rather than by anyone intentionally keeping it there.

I would say that say that I have seen the term "relic" being used as a 'weaponized' word to imply that the old thing WAS there intentionally as a repressive measure. I am not saying that this usage was intended to be used that way, but just as the old wording was taken as offensive to some due to implication, I can see that message as offensive to others due to implication, all because some people are easy to offend.

-- Richard Damon _______________________________________________ Python-Dev mailing list -- python-dev@python.org To unsubscribe send an email to python-dev-leave@python.org https://mail.python.org/mailman3/lists/python-dev.python.org/ Message archived at https://mail.python.org/archives/list/python-dev@python.org/message/6EN5RNF5... Code of Conduct: http://python.org/psf/codeofconduct/

-- The dead increasingly dominate and strangle both the living and the not-yet born. Vampiric capital and undead corporate persons abuse the lives and control the thoughts of homo faber. Ideas, once born, become abortifacients against new conceptions. _______________________________________________ Python-Dev mailing list -- python-dev@python.org To unsubscribe send an email to python-dev-leave@python.org https://mail.python.org/mailman3/lists/python-dev.python.org/ Message archived at https://mail.python.org/archives/list/python-dev@python.org/message/AMH7WMUO... Code of Conduct: http://python.org/psf/codeofconduct/ _______________________________________________ Python-Dev mailing list -- python-dev@python.org To unsubscribe send an email to python-dev-leave@python.org https://mail.python.org/mailman3/lists/python-dev.python.org/ Message archived at https://mail.python.org/archives/list/python-dev@python.org/message/B426T6LT... Code of Conduct: http://python.org/psf/codeofconduct/

Hi all, as a moderator of python-ideas, I’ve asked postmaster to place python-ideas into emergency moderation. (I do not have the tools to do so myself.) I’m willing to review messages individually as needed. best, —titus

On Jun 29, 2020, at 9:24 AM, Abdur-Rahmaan Janhangeer <arj.python@gmail.com> wrote:

Threads like these are meaningless, does not provide any learning value and is nowhere near the single vs double quote thread.

It opens the gap for people who are not concerned about development jump in the game shifting the focus away while nurturing a culture of thrash I mean you tend to ignore threads from python-dev and python-ideas which is not probably why you subscribed in the first place

This is not the first time i am saying that you can fly around the world on official Python mailing lists. But it's regrettable that it's the first time i am seeing people telling that they should educate others and things like that. It can be based on the argument and circle around it but personal attacks are off limit

If this was a Github issue, i don't think you list moderators would have dragged it around that much. Worst case scenario, someone would have been pinged and the issue taken care of. A PR or closing and you are done.

I raised the issue of closing a mail thread before and the impractical nature of it was discussed but maybe warnings and continued posting after the warning results in ban can be enforced

And it's annoying that it got dragged to two mailing lists. I respect Python people and i am always eager to follow some C code discussions, deprecating this C API etc. It's a new world for me.

Maybe active list members should sign a convention or a vetting process can be setup before we can discuss it on the lists. Not ideal but might be useful.

Kind Regards,

Abdur-Rahmaan Janhangeer compileralchemy | blog github Mauritius

On Mon, Jun 29, 2020 at 8:11 PM David Mertz <mertz@gnosis.cx> wrote: The commit message is simply silly. It introduces numerous contentious and false claims that have nothing whatsoever to do with the small wording change. It misunderstands how language, culture, history, and indeed white supremacism, work.

I would recommend amending the commit message.

The underlying change itself is reasonable, and to my mind a small improvement. There was unnecessary specificity in using Strunk and White as reference, and not, say, William Zinsser's _On Writing Well_, which is almost as well known. In the concrete, it would be exceedingly rare for these to provide conflicting advice on a specific code comment.

On Mon, Jun 29, 2020 at 7:34 AM Richard Damon <Richard@damon-family.org> wrote: On 6/29/20 6:22 AM, Nathaniel Smith wrote:

...

and describes the old text as a "relic", which is another way of saying that the problems were only there by historical accident, rather than by anyone intentionally keeping it there.

I would say that say that I have seen the term "relic" being used as a 'weaponized' word to imply that the old thing WAS there intentionally as a repressive measure. I am not saying that this usage was intended to be used that way, but just as the old wording was taken as offensive to some due to implication, I can see that message as offensive to others due to implication, all because some people are easy to offend.

-- Richard Damon _______________________________________________ Python-Dev mailing list -- python-dev@python.org To unsubscribe send an email to python-dev-leave@python.org https://mail.python.org/mailman3/lists/python-dev.python.org/ Message archived at https://mail.python.org/archives/list/python-dev@python.org/message/6EN5RNF5... Code of Conduct: http://python.org/psf/codeofconduct/

-- The dead increasingly dominate and strangle both the living and the not-yet born. Vampiric capital and undead corporate persons abuse the lives and control the thoughts of homo faber. Ideas, once born, become abortifacients against new conceptions. _______________________________________________ Python-Dev mailing list -- python-dev@python.org To unsubscribe send an email to python-dev-leave@python.org https://mail.python.org/mailman3/lists/python-dev.python.org/ Message archived at https://mail.python.org/archives/list/python-dev@python.org/message/AMH7WMUO... Code of Conduct: http://python.org/psf/codeofconduct/ _______________________________________________ Python-Dev mailing list -- python-dev@python.org To unsubscribe send an email to python-dev-leave@python.org https://mail.python.org/mailman3/lists/python-dev.python.org/ Message archived at https://mail.python.org/archives/list/python-dev@python.org/message/B426T6LT... Code of Conduct: http://python.org/psf/codeofconduct/