Re: Typing Meetup
Updating the Typing Meetup date to Wednesday as there were some conflicts. Let me know if there are any major time conflicts.
Date: *Wednesday, November 03, 2021.*Time: 10 am San Francisco time (UTC-7) / 5 pm London time (UTC) Duration: 1 hour
Potential discussion topics: + Typing **kwargs using a TypedDict (Franek Magiera?, Pradeep) [1] + Remaining questions about Callable syntax (Steven) + Non-required Protocol fields (Sebastian Rittau?) [2] + Type support for sealed classes (Adrian Freund?) [3] + Safe, typed JSON validation + Type system documentation (Shannon?)
If you're working on these or any other topics and would like to start a discussion at the meetup, reach out to me.
If you have interesting topics you'd like to see discussed, share them too. Once we have topics, we can always start a discussion even if there's no proposer yet. We will probably have time for 3-4 topics in this session.
On Fri, Oct 15, 2021 at 12:55 PM S Pradeep Kumar gohanpra@gmail.com wrote:
Hello all,
We plan to hold a virtual Typing Meetup to discuss key typing-related issues in real-time. The idea is that we can make progress on important or controversial discussions, get early feedback on in-progress PEPs, and gauge interest in new proposals.
A virtual meetup will be more accessible to people in other timezones than Bay Area in-person meetups. It should also help consolidate discussions that are often spread out across mailing lists or Github repos. The tentative plan is to have a monthly meetup, but we can change that as needed.
Date: Monday, November 01, 2021. Time: 10 am San Francisco time (UTC-7) / 5 pm London time (UTC) Duration: 1 hour
Time and date are flexible. I'll share the zoom link and agenda the week before. I'll also record the meetup and share afterwards.
If you're interested in presenting a new proposal or your work on some existing proposal, please respond here. We can shoot for 15 minutes per presentation. I know there are quite a few interesting threads on typing-sig that haven't seen much activity in a while :) -- S Pradeep Kumar _______________________________________________ Typing-sig mailing list -- typing-sig@python.org To unsubscribe send an email to typing-sig-leave@python.org https://mail.python.org/mailman3/lists/typing-sig.python.org/ Member address: guido@python.org
Links: [1] Typing **kwargs using TypedDict: https://mail.python.org/archives/list/typing-sig@python.org/thread/IUCXT2IQT... [2] Non-required Protocol fields: https://mail.python.org/archives/list/typing-sig@python.org/thread/P6FCGRJUJ... [3] Sealed classes: https://mail.python.org/archives/list/typing-sig@python.org/thread/QSCT2N4RF...
Hi all,
The Typing Meetup will be on *Wednesday, November 03, 2021 at 10 am San Francisco time (UTC-7)* / 5 pm London time (UTC).
Zoom link: https://us02web.zoom.us/j/89227859828.
Agenda: + Callable syntax - Steven Troxler. We will discuss the remaining question about the Callable syntax proposal. + Precise Types for `**kwargs` - Franek Magiera. This is a highly-requested feature on both typing-sig and GitHub [1]
All are welcome! I'll share notes and recording after the meetup. [2]
Thanks, S Pradeep Kumar
[1]: https://github.com/python/mypy/issues/4441 [2]: Doc for Meetup notes: https://docs.google.com/document/d/17iqV7WWvB0IwA43EPlIqlUS6Xuvk08X3sEudAA-g...
Reminder that the Typing Meetup is today* at 10 am San Francisco time (UTC-7) / 5 pm London time (UTC)*
Zoom link: https://us02web.zoom.us/j/89227859828.
See you there!
Thanks everyone for attending! I've added the recording and meeting notes to the running doc [1]
Quick summary:
1. Callable syntax: Support for shorthand syntax remains unanimous. There was a pretty heated debate about the last remaining question: should the PEP have shorthand only or extended syntax as well? I've added details in the doc.
Takeaway: We’ve been discussing this topic for months now and there are *no* prospects of a firm consensus on extended syntax. Given that the 3.11 deadline is early May 2022 and we will probably need to iterate on the PEP based on SC feedback, the current plan is for us to go ahead and draft the PEP with shorthand syntax. Hopefully, we can implement it, submit it to the Steering Council, and get it approved (can take ~2 months) before the deadline for 3.11.
2. Precise types for **kwargs: People said this is a valuable feature. The main remaining question is about bikeshedding: **kwargs: Unpack[Movie] vs Expand[Movie] vs **Movie.
3. Better discussion forum than typing-sig: Email threads here lack code markup and syntax highlighting, don't have a convenient "like" button that people actually use, and can be hard to follow after a while. We settled on trying out GitHub Discussions for about a month to see if there are major drawbacks compared to typing-sig. I've mentioned the pros and cons in the doc.
Sebastian Rittau volunteered to clean up the python/typing GitHub repo so that we can use it. Sebastian: Could you let us know when we can start moving discussions there? (If python/typing isn't feasible due to noisy help-related questions and we can't filter it easily, we might need a separate repo for typing-sig.)
We'll have the next typing meetup about a month from now. If you would like certain topics to be discussed, shoot me an email.
[1]: https://docs.google.com/document/d/17iqV7WWvB0IwA43EPlIqlUS6Xuvk08X3sEudAA-g...
On Wed, Nov 3, 2021 at 7:00 AM S Pradeep Kumar gohanpra@gmail.com wrote:
Reminder that the Typing Meetup is today* at 10 am San Francisco time (UTC-7) / 5 pm London time (UTC)*
Zoom link: https://us02web.zoom.us/j/89227859828.
See you there!
S Pradeep Kumar
Hi all,
The next Typing Meetup will be on *Wednesday, December 01, 2021 at 10 am San Francisco time (UTC-8)* / 6 pm London time (UTC).
Let me know if there are any major conflicts at that time and I can try to reschedule.
Zoom link: https://us02web.zoom.us/j/81560123744
Agenda: + Pyanalyze: Introduction to its architecture and extensions - Jelle Zijlstra. + Dataclass-transforms: A typing framework for dataclass-like libraries - Eric Traut.
All are welcome! I'll share notes and recording after the meetup. [1] Reach out to me if you want to propose a talk for future meetups.
Thanks, S Pradeep Kumar
[1]: Doc for Meetup notes: https://docs.google.com/document/d/17iqV7WWvB0IwA43EPlIqlUS6Xuvk08X3sEudAA-g...
On Wed, Nov 3, 2021 at 3:11 PM S Pradeep Kumar gohanpra@gmail.com wrote:
Thanks everyone for attending! I've added the recording and meeting notes to the running doc [1]
Quick summary:
- Callable syntax: Support for shorthand syntax remains unanimous. There
was a pretty heated debate about the last remaining question: should the PEP have shorthand only or extended syntax as well? I've added details in the doc.
Takeaway: We’ve been discussing this topic for months now and there are *no* prospects of a firm consensus on extended syntax. Given that the 3.11 deadline is early May 2022 and we will probably need to iterate on the PEP based on SC feedback, the current plan is for us to go ahead and draft the PEP with shorthand syntax. Hopefully, we can implement it, submit it to the Steering Council, and get it approved (can take ~2 months) before the deadline for 3.11.
- Precise types for **kwargs: People said this is a valuable feature. The
main remaining question is about bikeshedding: **kwargs: Unpack[Movie] vs Expand[Movie] vs **Movie.
- Better discussion forum than typing-sig: Email threads here lack code
markup and syntax highlighting, don't have a convenient "like" button that people actually use, and can be hard to follow after a while. We settled on trying out GitHub Discussions for about a month to see if there are major drawbacks compared to typing-sig. I've mentioned the pros and cons in the doc.
Sebastian Rittau volunteered to clean up the python/typing GitHub repo so that we can use it. Sebastian: Could you let us know when we can start moving discussions there? (If python/typing isn't feasible due to noisy help-related questions and we can't filter it easily, we might need a separate repo for typing-sig.)
We'll have the next typing meetup about a month from now. If you would like certain topics to be discussed, shoot me an email.
On Wed, Nov 3, 2021 at 7:00 AM S Pradeep Kumar gohanpra@gmail.com wrote:
Reminder that the Typing Meetup is today* at 10 am San Francisco time (UTC-7) / 5 pm London time (UTC)*
Zoom link: https://us02web.zoom.us/j/89227859828.
See you there!
S Pradeep Kumar
-- S Pradeep Kumar
Gentle reminder that the next Typing Meetup is on *Wednesday, December 01, 2021 at 10 am San Francisco time (UTC-8)* / 6 pm London time (UTC).
Zoom link: https://us02web.zoom.us/j/81560123744
Agenda: + Pyanalyze: Introduction to its architecture and extensions - Jelle Zijlstra. + Dataclass-transforms: A typing framework for dataclass-like libraries - Eric Traut.
On Mon, Nov 22, 2021 at 1:14 PM S Pradeep Kumar gohanpra@gmail.com wrote:
Hi all,
The next Typing Meetup will be on *Wednesday, December 01, 2021 at 10 am San Francisco time (UTC-8)* / 6 pm London time (UTC).
Let me know if there are any major conflicts at that time and I can try to reschedule.
Zoom link: https://us02web.zoom.us/j/81560123744
Agenda:
- Pyanalyze: Introduction to its architecture and extensions - Jelle
Zijlstra.
- Dataclass-transforms: A typing framework for dataclass-like libraries -
Eric Traut.
All are welcome! I'll share notes and recording after the meetup. [1] Reach out to me if you want to propose a talk for future meetups.
Thanks, S Pradeep Kumar
[1]: Doc for Meetup notes: https://docs.google.com/document/d/17iqV7WWvB0IwA43EPlIqlUS6Xuvk08X3sEudAA-g...
On Wed, Nov 3, 2021 at 3:11 PM S Pradeep Kumar gohanpra@gmail.com wrote:
Thanks everyone for attending! I've added the recording and meeting notes to the running doc [1]
Quick summary:
- Callable syntax: Support for shorthand syntax remains unanimous. There
was a pretty heated debate about the last remaining question: should the PEP have shorthand only or extended syntax as well? I've added details in the doc.
Takeaway: We’ve been discussing this topic for months now and there are *no* prospects of a firm consensus on extended syntax. Given that the 3.11 deadline is early May 2022 and we will probably need to iterate on the PEP based on SC feedback, the current plan is for us to go ahead and draft the PEP with shorthand syntax. Hopefully, we can implement it, submit it to the Steering Council, and get it approved (can take ~2 months) before the deadline for 3.11.
- Precise types for **kwargs: People said this is a valuable feature.
The main remaining question is about bikeshedding: **kwargs: Unpack[Movie] vs Expand[Movie] vs **Movie.
- Better discussion forum than typing-sig: Email threads here lack code
markup and syntax highlighting, don't have a convenient "like" button that people actually use, and can be hard to follow after a while. We settled on trying out GitHub Discussions for about a month to see if there are major drawbacks compared to typing-sig. I've mentioned the pros and cons in the doc.
Sebastian Rittau volunteered to clean up the python/typing GitHub repo so that we can use it. Sebastian: Could you let us know when we can start moving discussions there? (If python/typing isn't feasible due to noisy help-related questions and we can't filter it easily, we might need a separate repo for typing-sig.)
We'll have the next typing meetup about a month from now. If you would like certain topics to be discussed, shoot me an email.
On Wed, Nov 3, 2021 at 7:00 AM S Pradeep Kumar gohanpra@gmail.com wrote:
Reminder that the Typing Meetup is today* at 10 am San Francisco time (UTC-7) / 5 pm London time (UTC)*
Zoom link: https://us02web.zoom.us/j/89227859828.
See you there!
S Pradeep Kumar
-- S Pradeep Kumar
-- S Pradeep Kumar
Reminder that the next Typing Meetup is *today at 10 am San Francisco time (UTC-8)* / 6 pm London time (UTC).
Zoom link: https://us02web.zoom.us/j/81560123744
See you there!
On Mon, Nov 29, 2021 at 10:09 PM S Pradeep Kumar gohanpra@gmail.com wrote:
Gentle reminder that the next Typing Meetup is on *Wednesday, December 01, 2021 at 10 am San Francisco time (UTC-8)* / 6 pm London time (UTC).
Zoom link: https://us02web.zoom.us/j/81560123744
Agenda:
- Pyanalyze: Introduction to its architecture and extensions - Jelle
Zijlstra.
- Dataclass-transforms: A typing framework for dataclass-like libraries -
Eric Traut.
On Mon, Nov 22, 2021 at 1:14 PM S Pradeep Kumar gohanpra@gmail.com wrote:
Hi all,
The next Typing Meetup will be on *Wednesday, December 01, 2021 at 10 am San Francisco time (UTC-8)* / 6 pm London time (UTC).
Let me know if there are any major conflicts at that time and I can try to reschedule.
Zoom link: https://us02web.zoom.us/j/81560123744
Agenda:
- Pyanalyze: Introduction to its architecture and extensions - Jelle
Zijlstra.
- Dataclass-transforms: A typing framework for dataclass-like libraries -
Eric Traut.
All are welcome! I'll share notes and recording after the meetup. [1] Reach out to me if you want to propose a talk for future meetups.
Thanks, S Pradeep Kumar
[1]: Doc for Meetup notes: https://docs.google.com/document/d/17iqV7WWvB0IwA43EPlIqlUS6Xuvk08X3sEudAA-g...
On Wed, Nov 3, 2021 at 3:11 PM S Pradeep Kumar gohanpra@gmail.com wrote:
Thanks everyone for attending! I've added the recording and meeting notes to the running doc [1]
Quick summary:
- Callable syntax: Support for shorthand syntax remains unanimous.
There was a pretty heated debate about the last remaining question: should the PEP have shorthand only or extended syntax as well? I've added details in the doc.
Takeaway: We’ve been discussing this topic for months now and there are *no* prospects of a firm consensus on extended syntax. Given that the 3.11 deadline is early May 2022 and we will probably need to iterate on the PEP based on SC feedback, the current plan is for us to go ahead and draft the PEP with shorthand syntax. Hopefully, we can implement it, submit it to the Steering Council, and get it approved (can take ~2 months) before the deadline for 3.11.
- Precise types for **kwargs: People said this is a valuable feature.
The main remaining question is about bikeshedding: **kwargs: Unpack[Movie] vs Expand[Movie] vs **Movie.
- Better discussion forum than typing-sig: Email threads here lack code
markup and syntax highlighting, don't have a convenient "like" button that people actually use, and can be hard to follow after a while. We settled on trying out GitHub Discussions for about a month to see if there are major drawbacks compared to typing-sig. I've mentioned the pros and cons in the doc.
Sebastian Rittau volunteered to clean up the python/typing GitHub repo so that we can use it. Sebastian: Could you let us know when we can start moving discussions there? (If python/typing isn't feasible due to noisy help-related questions and we can't filter it easily, we might need a separate repo for typing-sig.)
We'll have the next typing meetup about a month from now. If you would like certain topics to be discussed, shoot me an email.
On Wed, Nov 3, 2021 at 7:00 AM S Pradeep Kumar gohanpra@gmail.com wrote:
Reminder that the Typing Meetup is today* at 10 am San Francisco time (UTC-7) / 5 pm London time (UTC)*
Zoom link: https://us02web.zoom.us/j/89227859828.
See you there!
S Pradeep Kumar
-- S Pradeep Kumar
-- S Pradeep Kumar
-- S Pradeep Kumar
Thanks everyone for attending the meetup. The recording and chat transcript are available in the running Google Doc [1].
1. PyCon Typing Summit: PyCon 2022 is coming up soon. This year's Typing Summit [2] was pretty interesting, so we should probably have one next year too. Shannon Zhu has offered to organize it next year too, so if anyone else is interested in co-organizing, please reach out to me.
2. Dataclass-transforms: Eric, this seems like a valuable feature. I'm in favor of having it in a PEP. Does anyone have serious objections? If we can agree on a PEP soon, we could have it as part of 3.11.
3. Next meetup: If you want to propose a talk for the next meetup, please reach out! Otherwise, I'll continue to ping people about topics *I* find interesting :)
[1]: https://docs.google.com/document/d/17iqV7WWvB0IwA43EPlIqlUS6Xuvk08X3sEudAA-g... [2]: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ld9rwCvGdhc
PS: Jelle and Eric, could you add your slides to the Google Doc (in a comment)? There were also a couple of unanswered questions by Nikita and Carl, so I've added them to the doc.
On Wed, Dec 1, 2021 at 7:00 AM S Pradeep Kumar gohanpra@gmail.com wrote:
Reminder that the next Typing Meetup is *today at 10 am San Francisco time (UTC-8)* / 6 pm London time (UTC).
Zoom link: https://us02web.zoom.us/j/81560123744
See you there!
On Mon, Nov 29, 2021 at 10:09 PM S Pradeep Kumar gohanpra@gmail.com wrote:
Gentle reminder that the next Typing Meetup is on *Wednesday, December 01, 2021 at 10 am San Francisco time (UTC-8)* / 6 pm London time (UTC).
Zoom link: https://us02web.zoom.us/j/81560123744
Agenda:
- Pyanalyze: Introduction to its architecture and extensions - Jelle
Zijlstra.
- Dataclass-transforms: A typing framework for dataclass-like libraries -
Eric Traut.
On Mon, Nov 22, 2021 at 1:14 PM S Pradeep Kumar gohanpra@gmail.com wrote:
Hi all,
The next Typing Meetup will be on *Wednesday, December 01, 2021 at 10 am San Francisco time (UTC-8)* / 6 pm London time (UTC).
Let me know if there are any major conflicts at that time and I can try to reschedule.
Zoom link: https://us02web.zoom.us/j/81560123744
Agenda:
- Pyanalyze: Introduction to its architecture and extensions - Jelle
Zijlstra.
- Dataclass-transforms: A typing framework for dataclass-like libraries
- Eric Traut.
All are welcome! I'll share notes and recording after the meetup. [1] Reach out to me if you want to propose a talk for future meetups.
Thanks, S Pradeep Kumar
[1]: Doc for Meetup notes: https://docs.google.com/document/d/17iqV7WWvB0IwA43EPlIqlUS6Xuvk08X3sEudAA-g...
On Wed, Nov 3, 2021 at 3:11 PM S Pradeep Kumar gohanpra@gmail.com wrote:
Thanks everyone for attending! I've added the recording and meeting notes to the running doc [1]
Quick summary:
- Callable syntax: Support for shorthand syntax remains unanimous.
There was a pretty heated debate about the last remaining question: should the PEP have shorthand only or extended syntax as well? I've added details in the doc.
Takeaway: We’ve been discussing this topic for months now and there are *no* prospects of a firm consensus on extended syntax. Given that the 3.11 deadline is early May 2022 and we will probably need to iterate on the PEP based on SC feedback, the current plan is for us to go ahead and draft the PEP with shorthand syntax. Hopefully, we can implement it, submit it to the Steering Council, and get it approved (can take ~2 months) before the deadline for 3.11.
- Precise types for **kwargs: People said this is a valuable feature.
The main remaining question is about bikeshedding: **kwargs: Unpack[Movie] vs Expand[Movie] vs **Movie.
- Better discussion forum than typing-sig: Email threads here lack
code markup and syntax highlighting, don't have a convenient "like" button that people actually use, and can be hard to follow after a while. We settled on trying out GitHub Discussions for about a month to see if there are major drawbacks compared to typing-sig. I've mentioned the pros and cons in the doc.
Sebastian Rittau volunteered to clean up the python/typing GitHub repo so that we can use it. Sebastian: Could you let us know when we can start moving discussions there? (If python/typing isn't feasible due to noisy help-related questions and we can't filter it easily, we might need a separate repo for typing-sig.)
We'll have the next typing meetup about a month from now. If you would like certain topics to be discussed, shoot me an email.
On Wed, Nov 3, 2021 at 7:00 AM S Pradeep Kumar gohanpra@gmail.com wrote:
Reminder that the Typing Meetup is today* at 10 am San Francisco time (UTC-7) / 5 pm London time (UTC)*
Zoom link: https://us02web.zoom.us/j/89227859828.
See you there!
S Pradeep Kumar
-- S Pradeep Kumar
-- S Pradeep Kumar
-- S Pradeep Kumar
-- S Pradeep Kumar
Hello all,
Happy new year! The next Typing Meetup will be on *Wednesday, January 12, 2022 at 10 am San Francisco time (UTC-8)* / 6 pm London time (UTC).
Let me know if there are any major conflicts at that time and I can try to reschedule.
Zoom link: https://us02web.zoom.us/j/87596299889. Please note that the meeting will be automatically recorded from the time it starts.
Agenda: + dataclasses-json: Easy, type-safe decoding from JSON - Charles Li. + phantom-types: Flexible preconditions using types - Anton Agestam.
All are welcome! I'll share the recording and notes after the meetup. [1] Reach out to me if you want to propose a talk or topic for future meetups.
Thanks, S Pradeep Kumar
[1]: Doc for Meetup notes: https://docs.google.com/document/d/17iqV7WWvB0IwA43EPlIqlUS6Xuvk08X3sEudAA-g...
On Wed, Dec 1, 2021 at 9:02 PM S Pradeep Kumar gohanpra@gmail.com wrote:
Thanks everyone for attending the meetup. The recording and chat transcript are available in the running Google Doc [1].
- PyCon Typing Summit: PyCon 2022 is coming up soon. This year's Typing
Summit [2] was pretty interesting, so we should probably have one next year too. Shannon Zhu has offered to organize it next year too, so if anyone else is interested in co-organizing, please reach out to me.
- Dataclass-transforms: Eric, this seems like a valuable feature. I'm in
favor of having it in a PEP. Does anyone have serious objections? If we can agree on a PEP soon, we could have it as part of 3.11.
- Next meetup: If you want to propose a talk for the next meetup, please
reach out! Otherwise, I'll continue to ping people about topics *I* find interesting :)
PS: Jelle and Eric, could you add your slides to the Google Doc (in a comment)? There were also a couple of unanswered questions by Nikita and Carl, so I've added them to the doc.
On Wed, Dec 1, 2021 at 7:00 AM S Pradeep Kumar gohanpra@gmail.com wrote:
Reminder that the next Typing Meetup is *today at 10 am San Francisco time (UTC-8)* / 6 pm London time (UTC).
Zoom link: https://us02web.zoom.us/j/81560123744
See you there!
On Mon, Nov 29, 2021 at 10:09 PM S Pradeep Kumar gohanpra@gmail.com wrote:
Gentle reminder that the next Typing Meetup is on *Wednesday, December 01, 2021 at 10 am San Francisco time (UTC-8)* / 6 pm London time (UTC).
Zoom link: https://us02web.zoom.us/j/81560123744
Agenda:
- Pyanalyze: Introduction to its architecture and extensions - Jelle
Zijlstra.
- Dataclass-transforms: A typing framework for dataclass-like libraries
- Eric Traut.
On Mon, Nov 22, 2021 at 1:14 PM S Pradeep Kumar gohanpra@gmail.com wrote:
Hi all,
The next Typing Meetup will be on *Wednesday, December 01, 2021 at 10 am San Francisco time (UTC-8)* / 6 pm London time (UTC).
Let me know if there are any major conflicts at that time and I can try to reschedule.
Zoom link: https://us02web.zoom.us/j/81560123744
Agenda:
- Pyanalyze: Introduction to its architecture and extensions - Jelle
Zijlstra.
- Dataclass-transforms: A typing framework for dataclass-like libraries
- Eric Traut.
All are welcome! I'll share notes and recording after the meetup. [1] Reach out to me if you want to propose a talk for future meetups.
Thanks, S Pradeep Kumar
[1]: Doc for Meetup notes: https://docs.google.com/document/d/17iqV7WWvB0IwA43EPlIqlUS6Xuvk08X3sEudAA-g...
On Wed, Nov 3, 2021 at 3:11 PM S Pradeep Kumar gohanpra@gmail.com wrote:
Thanks everyone for attending! I've added the recording and meeting notes to the running doc [1]
Quick summary:
- Callable syntax: Support for shorthand syntax remains unanimous.
There was a pretty heated debate about the last remaining question: should the PEP have shorthand only or extended syntax as well? I've added details in the doc.
Takeaway: We’ve been discussing this topic for months now and there are *no* prospects of a firm consensus on extended syntax. Given that the 3.11 deadline is early May 2022 and we will probably need to iterate on the PEP based on SC feedback, the current plan is for us to go ahead and draft the PEP with shorthand syntax. Hopefully, we can implement it, submit it to the Steering Council, and get it approved (can take ~2 months) before the deadline for 3.11.
- Precise types for **kwargs: People said this is a valuable feature.
The main remaining question is about bikeshedding: **kwargs: Unpack[Movie] vs Expand[Movie] vs **Movie.
- Better discussion forum than typing-sig: Email threads here lack
code markup and syntax highlighting, don't have a convenient "like" button that people actually use, and can be hard to follow after a while. We settled on trying out GitHub Discussions for about a month to see if there are major drawbacks compared to typing-sig. I've mentioned the pros and cons in the doc.
Sebastian Rittau volunteered to clean up the python/typing GitHub repo so that we can use it. Sebastian: Could you let us know when we can start moving discussions there? (If python/typing isn't feasible due to noisy help-related questions and we can't filter it easily, we might need a separate repo for typing-sig.)
We'll have the next typing meetup about a month from now. If you would like certain topics to be discussed, shoot me an email.
On Wed, Nov 3, 2021 at 7:00 AM S Pradeep Kumar gohanpra@gmail.com wrote:
Reminder that the Typing Meetup is today* at 10 am San Francisco time (UTC-7) / 5 pm London time (UTC)*
Zoom link: https://us02web.zoom.us/j/89227859828.
See you there!
S Pradeep Kumar
-- S Pradeep Kumar
-- S Pradeep Kumar
-- S Pradeep Kumar
-- S Pradeep Kumar
-- S Pradeep Kumar
Reminder that the next Typing Meetup is today: *Wednesday, January 12, 2022 at 10 am San Francisco time (UTC-8)* / 6 pm London time (UTC).
Zoom link: https://us02web.zoom.us/j/87596299889. Please note that the meeting will be automatically recorded from the time it starts.
On Tue, Jan 4, 2022 at 1:02 PM S Pradeep Kumar gohanpra@gmail.com wrote:
Hello all,
Happy new year! The next Typing Meetup will be on *Wednesday, January 12, 2022 at 10 am San Francisco time (UTC-8)* / 6 pm London time (UTC).
Let me know if there are any major conflicts at that time and I can try to reschedule.
Zoom link: https://us02web.zoom.us/j/87596299889. Please note that the meeting will be automatically recorded from the time it starts.
Agenda:
- dataclasses-json: Easy, type-safe decoding from JSON - Charles Li.
- phantom-types: Flexible preconditions using types - Anton Agestam.
All are welcome! I'll share the recording and notes after the meetup. [1] Reach out to me if you want to propose a talk or topic for future meetups.
Thanks, S Pradeep Kumar
[1]: Doc for Meetup notes: https://docs.google.com/document/d/17iqV7WWvB0IwA43EPlIqlUS6Xuvk08X3sEudAA-g...
On Wed, Dec 1, 2021 at 9:02 PM S Pradeep Kumar gohanpra@gmail.com wrote:
Thanks everyone for attending the meetup. The recording and chat transcript are available in the running Google Doc [1].
- PyCon Typing Summit: PyCon 2022 is coming up soon. This year's Typing
Summit [2] was pretty interesting, so we should probably have one next year too. Shannon Zhu has offered to organize it next year too, so if anyone else is interested in co-organizing, please reach out to me.
- Dataclass-transforms: Eric, this seems like a valuable feature. I'm in
favor of having it in a PEP. Does anyone have serious objections? If we can agree on a PEP soon, we could have it as part of 3.11.
- Next meetup: If you want to propose a talk for the next meetup, please
reach out! Otherwise, I'll continue to ping people about topics *I* find interesting :)
PS: Jelle and Eric, could you add your slides to the Google Doc (in a comment)? There were also a couple of unanswered questions by Nikita and Carl, so I've added them to the doc.
On Wed, Dec 1, 2021 at 7:00 AM S Pradeep Kumar gohanpra@gmail.com wrote:
Reminder that the next Typing Meetup is *today at 10 am San Francisco time (UTC-8)* / 6 pm London time (UTC).
Zoom link: https://us02web.zoom.us/j/81560123744
See you there!
On Mon, Nov 29, 2021 at 10:09 PM S Pradeep Kumar gohanpra@gmail.com wrote:
Gentle reminder that the next Typing Meetup is on *Wednesday, December 01, 2021 at 10 am San Francisco time (UTC-8)* / 6 pm London time (UTC).
Zoom link: https://us02web.zoom.us/j/81560123744
Agenda:
- Pyanalyze: Introduction to its architecture and extensions - Jelle
Zijlstra.
- Dataclass-transforms: A typing framework for dataclass-like libraries
- Eric Traut.
On Mon, Nov 22, 2021 at 1:14 PM S Pradeep Kumar gohanpra@gmail.com wrote:
Hi all,
The next Typing Meetup will be on *Wednesday, December 01, 2021 at 10 am San Francisco time (UTC-8)* / 6 pm London time (UTC).
Let me know if there are any major conflicts at that time and I can try to reschedule.
Zoom link: https://us02web.zoom.us/j/81560123744
Agenda:
- Pyanalyze: Introduction to its architecture and extensions - Jelle
Zijlstra.
- Dataclass-transforms: A typing framework for
dataclass-like libraries - Eric Traut.
All are welcome! I'll share notes and recording after the meetup. [1] Reach out to me if you want to propose a talk for future meetups.
Thanks, S Pradeep Kumar
[1]: Doc for Meetup notes: https://docs.google.com/document/d/17iqV7WWvB0IwA43EPlIqlUS6Xuvk08X3sEudAA-g...
On Wed, Nov 3, 2021 at 3:11 PM S Pradeep Kumar gohanpra@gmail.com wrote:
Thanks everyone for attending! I've added the recording and meeting notes to the running doc [1]
Quick summary:
- Callable syntax: Support for shorthand syntax remains unanimous.
There was a pretty heated debate about the last remaining question: should the PEP have shorthand only or extended syntax as well? I've added details in the doc.
Takeaway: We’ve been discussing this topic for months now and there are *no* prospects of a firm consensus on extended syntax. Given that the 3.11 deadline is early May 2022 and we will probably need to iterate on the PEP based on SC feedback, the current plan is for us to go ahead and draft the PEP with shorthand syntax. Hopefully, we can implement it, submit it to the Steering Council, and get it approved (can take ~2 months) before the deadline for 3.11.
- Precise types for **kwargs: People said this is a valuable
feature. The main remaining question is about bikeshedding: **kwargs: Unpack[Movie] vs Expand[Movie] vs **Movie.
- Better discussion forum than typing-sig: Email threads here lack
code markup and syntax highlighting, don't have a convenient "like" button that people actually use, and can be hard to follow after a while. We settled on trying out GitHub Discussions for about a month to see if there are major drawbacks compared to typing-sig. I've mentioned the pros and cons in the doc.
Sebastian Rittau volunteered to clean up the python/typing GitHub repo so that we can use it. Sebastian: Could you let us know when we can start moving discussions there? (If python/typing isn't feasible due to noisy help-related questions and we can't filter it easily, we might need a separate repo for typing-sig.)
We'll have the next typing meetup about a month from now. If you would like certain topics to be discussed, shoot me an email.
On Wed, Nov 3, 2021 at 7:00 AM S Pradeep Kumar gohanpra@gmail.com wrote:
> Reminder that the Typing Meetup is today* at 10 am San Francisco > time (UTC-7) / 5 pm London time (UTC)* > > Zoom link: https://us02web.zoom.us/j/89227859828. > > See you there! > -- > S Pradeep Kumar >
-- S Pradeep Kumar
-- S Pradeep Kumar
-- S Pradeep Kumar
-- S Pradeep Kumar
-- S Pradeep Kumar
-- S Pradeep Kumar
Thanks to everyone who attended the meetup. The recording and chat transcript are available in the running Google Doc [1].
1. dataclasses-json: Easy, type-safe decoding from JSON - Charles Li. Slides [2]. We also discussed ways to make the type checker recognize the methods added to the dataclass (such as `.schema()` and `.from_dict()`).
2. phantom-types: Narrowing types using arbitrary predicates - Anton Agestam. Slides [3]. Some use cases include validating emails and phone numbers using regexes. One interesting example we discussed was `SequenceButNotStr`.
3. PyCon Typing Summit: We'll be having a Typing Summit at PyCon 2022. The date is tentatively April 28 and Shannon and Alfonso are co-organizing. More details to come soon. See you there!
4. Next meetup: If you want to nominate a topic for the next meetup, please reach out to me!
[1]: Meeting recording and notes: https://docs.google.com/document/d/17iqV7WWvB0IwA43EPlIqlUS6Xuvk08X3sEudAA-g... [2]: dataclasses-json: https://docs.google.com/presentation/d/1rVPE0DoDcQon91pqOgWiNd7So4p1qVf_aIfB...
[3]: phantom-types: https://docs.google.com/presentation/d/1wZoSaT7-hk-nBFZDpCy7SfHjKHF7cUfbIfH3...
On Wed, Jan 12, 2022 at 6:00 AM S Pradeep Kumar gohanpra@gmail.com wrote:
Reminder that the next Typing Meetup is today: *Wednesday, January 12, 2022 at 10 am San Francisco time (UTC-8)* / 6 pm London time (UTC).
Zoom link: https://us02web.zoom.us/j/87596299889. Please note that the meeting will be automatically recorded from the time it starts.
On Tue, Jan 4, 2022 at 1:02 PM S Pradeep Kumar gohanpra@gmail.com wrote:
Hello all,
Happy new year! The next Typing Meetup will be on *Wednesday, January 12, 2022 at 10 am San Francisco time (UTC-8)* / 6 pm London time (UTC).
Let me know if there are any major conflicts at that time and I can try to reschedule.
Zoom link: https://us02web.zoom.us/j/87596299889. Please note that the meeting will be automatically recorded from the time it starts.
Agenda:
- dataclasses-json: Easy, type-safe decoding from JSON - Charles Li.
- phantom-types: Flexible preconditions using types - Anton Agestam.
All are welcome! I'll share the recording and notes after the meetup. [1] Reach out to me if you want to propose a talk or topic for future meetups.
Thanks, S Pradeep Kumar
[1]: Doc for Meetup notes: https://docs.google.com/document/d/17iqV7WWvB0IwA43EPlIqlUS6Xuvk08X3sEudAA-g...
On Wed, Dec 1, 2021 at 9:02 PM S Pradeep Kumar gohanpra@gmail.com wrote:
Thanks everyone for attending the meetup. The recording and chat transcript are available in the running Google Doc [1].
- PyCon Typing Summit: PyCon 2022 is coming up soon. This year's Typing
Summit [2] was pretty interesting, so we should probably have one next year too. Shannon Zhu has offered to organize it next year too, so if anyone else is interested in co-organizing, please reach out to me.
- Dataclass-transforms: Eric, this seems like a valuable feature. I'm
in favor of having it in a PEP. Does anyone have serious objections? If we can agree on a PEP soon, we could have it as part of 3.11.
- Next meetup: If you want to propose a talk for the next meetup,
please reach out! Otherwise, I'll continue to ping people about topics *I* find interesting :)
PS: Jelle and Eric, could you add your slides to the Google Doc (in a comment)? There were also a couple of unanswered questions by Nikita and Carl, so I've added them to the doc.
On Wed, Dec 1, 2021 at 7:00 AM S Pradeep Kumar gohanpra@gmail.com wrote:
Reminder that the next Typing Meetup is *today at 10 am San Francisco time (UTC-8)* / 6 pm London time (UTC).
Zoom link: https://us02web.zoom.us/j/81560123744
See you there!
On Mon, Nov 29, 2021 at 10:09 PM S Pradeep Kumar gohanpra@gmail.com wrote:
Gentle reminder that the next Typing Meetup is on *Wednesday, December 01, 2021 at 10 am San Francisco time (UTC-8)* / 6 pm London time (UTC).
Zoom link: https://us02web.zoom.us/j/81560123744
Agenda:
- Pyanalyze: Introduction to its architecture and extensions - Jelle
Zijlstra.
- Dataclass-transforms: A typing framework for
dataclass-like libraries - Eric Traut.
On Mon, Nov 22, 2021 at 1:14 PM S Pradeep Kumar gohanpra@gmail.com wrote:
Hi all,
The next Typing Meetup will be on *Wednesday, December 01, 2021 at 10 am San Francisco time (UTC-8)* / 6 pm London time (UTC).
Let me know if there are any major conflicts at that time and I can try to reschedule.
Zoom link: https://us02web.zoom.us/j/81560123744
Agenda:
- Pyanalyze: Introduction to its architecture and extensions - Jelle
Zijlstra.
- Dataclass-transforms: A typing framework for
dataclass-like libraries - Eric Traut.
All are welcome! I'll share notes and recording after the meetup. [1] Reach out to me if you want to propose a talk for future meetups.
Thanks, S Pradeep Kumar
[1]: Doc for Meetup notes: https://docs.google.com/document/d/17iqV7WWvB0IwA43EPlIqlUS6Xuvk08X3sEudAA-g...
On Wed, Nov 3, 2021 at 3:11 PM S Pradeep Kumar gohanpra@gmail.com wrote:
> Thanks everyone for attending! I've added the recording and meeting > notes to the running doc [1] > > Quick summary: > > 1. Callable syntax: Support for shorthand syntax remains unanimous. > There was a pretty heated debate about the last remaining question: should > the PEP have shorthand only or extended syntax as well? I've added details > in the doc. > > Takeaway: We’ve been discussing this topic for months now and > there are *no* prospects of a firm consensus on extended syntax. Given that > the 3.11 deadline is early May 2022 and we will probably need to iterate on > the PEP based on SC feedback, the current plan is for us to go ahead and > draft the PEP with shorthand syntax. Hopefully, we can implement it, submit > it to the Steering Council, and get it approved (can take ~2 months) before > the deadline for 3.11. > > 2. Precise types for **kwargs: People said this is a valuable > feature. The main remaining question is about bikeshedding: **kwargs: > Unpack[Movie] vs Expand[Movie] vs **Movie. > > 3. Better discussion forum than typing-sig: Email threads here lack > code markup and syntax highlighting, don't have a convenient "like" button > that people actually use, and can be hard to follow after a while. We > settled on trying out GitHub Discussions for about a month to see if there > are major drawbacks compared to typing-sig. I've mentioned the pros and > cons in the doc. > > Sebastian Rittau volunteered to clean up the python/typing GitHub > repo so that we can use it. Sebastian: Could you let us know when we can > start moving discussions there? (If python/typing isn't feasible due to > noisy help-related questions and we can't filter it easily, we might need a > separate repo for typing-sig.) > > We'll have the next typing meetup about a month from now. If you > would like certain topics to be discussed, shoot me an email. > > [1]: > https://docs.google.com/document/d/17iqV7WWvB0IwA43EPlIqlUS6Xuvk08X3sEudAA-g... > > > On Wed, Nov 3, 2021 at 7:00 AM S Pradeep Kumar gohanpra@gmail.com > wrote: > >> Reminder that the Typing Meetup is today* at 10 am San Francisco >> time (UTC-7) / 5 pm London time (UTC)* >> >> Zoom link: https://us02web.zoom.us/j/89227859828. >> >> See you there! >> -- >> S Pradeep Kumar >> > > > -- > S Pradeep Kumar >
-- S Pradeep Kumar
-- S Pradeep Kumar
-- S Pradeep Kumar
-- S Pradeep Kumar
-- S Pradeep Kumar
-- S Pradeep Kumar
Hello all,
The next Typing Meetup will be on Wednesday, February 16, 2022 at 10 am San Francisco time (UTC-8) / 6 pm London time (UTC).
Let me know if you have any major conflicts at that time and I can reschedule.
Zoom link: https://us02web.zoom.us/j/84814892097. Please note that the meeting will be automatically recorded from the time it starts.
Agenda: + Pyright Overview and Internals - Eric Traut will discuss Pyright's design goals, architecture, and the features that make it unique among the major Python type checkers
All are welcome! I'll share the recording and notes after the meetup. [1] Reach out to me if you want to propose a talk or topic for future meetups.
Thanks, S Pradeep Kumar
[1]: Doc for Meetup notes: https://docs.google.com/document/d/17iqV7WWvB0IwA43EPlIqlUS6Xuvk08X3sEudAA-g...
On Wed, Jan 12, 2022 at 12:07 PM S Pradeep Kumar gohanpra@gmail.com wrote:
Thanks to everyone who attended the meetup. The recording and chat transcript are available in the running Google Doc [1].
- dataclasses-json: Easy, type-safe decoding from JSON - Charles Li.
Slides [2]. We also discussed ways to make the type checker recognize the methods added to the dataclass (such as `.schema()` and `.from_dict()`).
- phantom-types: Narrowing types using arbitrary predicates - Anton
Agestam. Slides [3]. Some use cases include validating emails and phone numbers using regexes. One interesting example we discussed was `SequenceButNotStr`.
- PyCon Typing Summit: We'll be having a Typing Summit at PyCon 2022. The
date is tentatively April 28 and Shannon and Alfonso are co-organizing. More details to come soon. See you there!
- Next meetup: If you want to nominate a topic for the next meetup,
please reach out to me!
[1]: Meeting recording and notes: https://docs.google.com/document/d/17iqV7WWvB0IwA43EPlIqlUS6Xuvk08X3sEudAA-g... [2]: dataclasses-json: https://docs.google.com/presentation/d/1rVPE0DoDcQon91pqOgWiNd7So4p1qVf_aIfB...
https://docs.google.com/presentation/d/1wZoSaT7-hk-nBFZDpCy7SfHjKHF7cUfbIfH3...
On Wed, Jan 12, 2022 at 6:00 AM S Pradeep Kumar gohanpra@gmail.com wrote:
Reminder that the next Typing Meetup is today: *Wednesday, January 12, 2022 at 10 am San Francisco time (UTC-8)* / 6 pm London time (UTC).
Zoom link: https://us02web.zoom.us/j/87596299889. Please note that the meeting will be automatically recorded from the time it starts.
On Tue, Jan 4, 2022 at 1:02 PM S Pradeep Kumar gohanpra@gmail.com wrote:
Hello all,
Happy new year! The next Typing Meetup will be on *Wednesday, January 12, 2022 at 10 am San Francisco time (UTC-8)* / 6 pm London time (UTC).
Let me know if there are any major conflicts at that time and I can try to reschedule.
Zoom link: https://us02web.zoom.us/j/87596299889. Please note that the meeting will be automatically recorded from the time it starts.
Agenda:
- dataclasses-json: Easy, type-safe decoding from JSON - Charles Li.
- phantom-types: Flexible preconditions using types - Anton Agestam.
All are welcome! I'll share the recording and notes after the meetup. [1] Reach out to me if you want to propose a talk or topic for future meetups.
Thanks, S Pradeep Kumar
[1]: Doc for Meetup notes: https://docs.google.com/document/d/17iqV7WWvB0IwA43EPlIqlUS6Xuvk08X3sEudAA-g...
On Wed, Dec 1, 2021 at 9:02 PM S Pradeep Kumar gohanpra@gmail.com wrote:
Thanks everyone for attending the meetup. The recording and chat transcript are available in the running Google Doc [1].
- PyCon Typing Summit: PyCon 2022 is coming up soon. This year's
Typing Summit [2] was pretty interesting, so we should probably have one next year too. Shannon Zhu has offered to organize it next year too, so if anyone else is interested in co-organizing, please reach out to me.
- Dataclass-transforms: Eric, this seems like a valuable feature. I'm
in favor of having it in a PEP. Does anyone have serious objections? If we can agree on a PEP soon, we could have it as part of 3.11.
- Next meetup: If you want to propose a talk for the next meetup,
please reach out! Otherwise, I'll continue to ping people about topics *I* find interesting :)
PS: Jelle and Eric, could you add your slides to the Google Doc (in a comment)? There were also a couple of unanswered questions by Nikita and Carl, so I've added them to the doc.
On Wed, Dec 1, 2021 at 7:00 AM S Pradeep Kumar gohanpra@gmail.com wrote:
Reminder that the next Typing Meetup is *today at 10 am San Francisco time (UTC-8)* / 6 pm London time (UTC).
Zoom link: https://us02web.zoom.us/j/81560123744
See you there!
On Mon, Nov 29, 2021 at 10:09 PM S Pradeep Kumar gohanpra@gmail.com wrote:
Gentle reminder that the next Typing Meetup is on *Wednesday, December 01, 2021 at 10 am San Francisco time (UTC-8)* / 6 pm London time (UTC).
Zoom link: https://us02web.zoom.us/j/81560123744
Agenda:
- Pyanalyze: Introduction to its architecture and extensions - Jelle
Zijlstra.
- Dataclass-transforms: A typing framework for
dataclass-like libraries - Eric Traut.
On Mon, Nov 22, 2021 at 1:14 PM S Pradeep Kumar gohanpra@gmail.com wrote:
> Hi all, > > The next Typing Meetup will be on *Wednesday, December 01, 2021 at > 10 am San Francisco time (UTC-8)* / 6 pm London time (UTC). > > Let me know if there are any major conflicts at that time and I can > try to reschedule. > > Zoom link: https://us02web.zoom.us/j/81560123744 > > Agenda: > + Pyanalyze: Introduction to its architecture and extensions - Jelle > Zijlstra. > + Dataclass-transforms: A typing framework for > dataclass-like libraries - Eric Traut. > > All are welcome! I'll share notes and recording after the meetup. > [1] Reach out to me if you want to propose a talk for future meetups. > > Thanks, > S Pradeep Kumar > > [1]: Doc for Meetup notes: > https://docs.google.com/document/d/17iqV7WWvB0IwA43EPlIqlUS6Xuvk08X3sEudAA-g... > > On Wed, Nov 3, 2021 at 3:11 PM S Pradeep Kumar gohanpra@gmail.com > wrote: > >> Thanks everyone for attending! I've added the recording and meeting >> notes to the running doc [1] >> >> Quick summary: >> >> 1. Callable syntax: Support for shorthand syntax remains unanimous. >> There was a pretty heated debate about the last remaining question: should >> the PEP have shorthand only or extended syntax as well? I've added details >> in the doc. >> >> Takeaway: We’ve been discussing this topic for months now and >> there are *no* prospects of a firm consensus on extended syntax. Given that >> the 3.11 deadline is early May 2022 and we will probably need to iterate on >> the PEP based on SC feedback, the current plan is for us to go ahead and >> draft the PEP with shorthand syntax. Hopefully, we can implement it, submit >> it to the Steering Council, and get it approved (can take ~2 months) before >> the deadline for 3.11. >> >> 2. Precise types for **kwargs: People said this is a valuable >> feature. The main remaining question is about bikeshedding: **kwargs: >> Unpack[Movie] vs Expand[Movie] vs **Movie. >> >> 3. Better discussion forum than typing-sig: Email threads here lack >> code markup and syntax highlighting, don't have a convenient "like" button >> that people actually use, and can be hard to follow after a while. We >> settled on trying out GitHub Discussions for about a month to see if there >> are major drawbacks compared to typing-sig. I've mentioned the pros and >> cons in the doc. >> >> Sebastian Rittau volunteered to clean up the python/typing GitHub >> repo so that we can use it. Sebastian: Could you let us know when we can >> start moving discussions there? (If python/typing isn't feasible due to >> noisy help-related questions and we can't filter it easily, we might need a >> separate repo for typing-sig.) >> >> We'll have the next typing meetup about a month from now. If you >> would like certain topics to be discussed, shoot me an email. >> >> [1]: >> https://docs.google.com/document/d/17iqV7WWvB0IwA43EPlIqlUS6Xuvk08X3sEudAA-g... >> >> >> On Wed, Nov 3, 2021 at 7:00 AM S Pradeep Kumar gohanpra@gmail.com >> wrote: >> >>> Reminder that the Typing Meetup is today* at 10 am San Francisco >>> time (UTC-7) / 5 pm London time (UTC)* >>> >>> Zoom link: https://us02web.zoom.us/j/89227859828. >>> >>> See you there! >>> -- >>> S Pradeep Kumar >>> >> >> >> -- >> S Pradeep Kumar >> > > > -- > S Pradeep Kumar >
-- S Pradeep Kumar
-- S Pradeep Kumar
-- S Pradeep Kumar
-- S Pradeep Kumar
-- S Pradeep Kumar
-- S Pradeep Kumar
Hello all,
Reminder that the next Typing Meetup will be this *Wednesday, February 16, 2022 at 10 am San Francisco time (UTC-8) */ 6 pm London time (UTC).
Zoom link: https://us02web.zoom.us/j/84814892097.
Best,
On Mon, Feb 7, 2022 at 4:06 PM S Pradeep Kumar gohanpra@gmail.com wrote:
Hello all,
The next Typing Meetup will be on Wednesday, February 16, 2022 at 10 am San Francisco time (UTC-8) / 6 pm London time (UTC).
Let me know if you have any major conflicts at that time and I can reschedule.
Zoom link: https://us02web.zoom.us/j/84814892097. Please note that the meeting will be automatically recorded from the time it starts.
Agenda:
- Pyright Overview and Internals - Eric Traut will discuss Pyright's
design goals, architecture, and the features that make it unique among the major Python type checkers
All are welcome! I'll share the recording and notes after the meetup. [1] Reach out to me if you want to propose a talk or topic for future meetups.
Thanks, S Pradeep Kumar
[1]: Doc for Meetup notes: https://docs.google.com/document/d/17iqV7WWvB0IwA43EPlIqlUS6Xuvk08X3sEudAA-g...
On Wed, Jan 12, 2022 at 12:07 PM S Pradeep Kumar gohanpra@gmail.com wrote:
Thanks to everyone who attended the meetup. The recording and chat transcript are available in the running Google Doc [1].
- dataclasses-json: Easy, type-safe decoding from JSON - Charles Li.
Slides [2]. We also discussed ways to make the type checker recognize the methods added to the dataclass (such as `.schema()` and `.from_dict()`).
- phantom-types: Narrowing types using arbitrary predicates - Anton
Agestam. Slides [3]. Some use cases include validating emails and phone numbers using regexes. One interesting example we discussed was `SequenceButNotStr`.
- PyCon Typing Summit: We'll be having a Typing Summit at PyCon 2022.
The date is tentatively April 28 and Shannon and Alfonso are co-organizing. More details to come soon. See you there!
- Next meetup: If you want to nominate a topic for the next meetup,
please reach out to me!
[1]: Meeting recording and notes: https://docs.google.com/document/d/17iqV7WWvB0IwA43EPlIqlUS6Xuvk08X3sEudAA-g... [2]: dataclasses-json: https://docs.google.com/presentation/d/1rVPE0DoDcQon91pqOgWiNd7So4p1qVf_aIfB...
https://docs.google.com/presentation/d/1wZoSaT7-hk-nBFZDpCy7SfHjKHF7cUfbIfH3...
On Wed, Jan 12, 2022 at 6:00 AM S Pradeep Kumar gohanpra@gmail.com wrote:
Reminder that the next Typing Meetup is today: *Wednesday, January 12, 2022 at 10 am San Francisco time (UTC-8)* / 6 pm London time (UTC).
Zoom link: https://us02web.zoom.us/j/87596299889. Please note that the meeting will be automatically recorded from the time it starts.
On Tue, Jan 4, 2022 at 1:02 PM S Pradeep Kumar gohanpra@gmail.com wrote:
Hello all,
Happy new year! The next Typing Meetup will be on *Wednesday, January 12, 2022 at 10 am San Francisco time (UTC-8)* / 6 pm London time (UTC).
Let me know if there are any major conflicts at that time and I can try to reschedule.
Zoom link: https://us02web.zoom.us/j/87596299889. Please note that the meeting will be automatically recorded from the time it starts.
Agenda:
- dataclasses-json: Easy, type-safe decoding from JSON - Charles Li.
- phantom-types: Flexible preconditions using types - Anton Agestam.
All are welcome! I'll share the recording and notes after the meetup. [1] Reach out to me if you want to propose a talk or topic for future meetups.
Thanks, S Pradeep Kumar
[1]: Doc for Meetup notes: https://docs.google.com/document/d/17iqV7WWvB0IwA43EPlIqlUS6Xuvk08X3sEudAA-g...
On Wed, Dec 1, 2021 at 9:02 PM S Pradeep Kumar gohanpra@gmail.com wrote:
Thanks everyone for attending the meetup. The recording and chat transcript are available in the running Google Doc [1].
- PyCon Typing Summit: PyCon 2022 is coming up soon. This year's
Typing Summit [2] was pretty interesting, so we should probably have one next year too. Shannon Zhu has offered to organize it next year too, so if anyone else is interested in co-organizing, please reach out to me.
- Dataclass-transforms: Eric, this seems like a valuable feature. I'm
in favor of having it in a PEP. Does anyone have serious objections? If we can agree on a PEP soon, we could have it as part of 3.11.
- Next meetup: If you want to propose a talk for the next meetup,
please reach out! Otherwise, I'll continue to ping people about topics *I* find interesting :)
PS: Jelle and Eric, could you add your slides to the Google Doc (in a comment)? There were also a couple of unanswered questions by Nikita and Carl, so I've added them to the doc.
On Wed, Dec 1, 2021 at 7:00 AM S Pradeep Kumar gohanpra@gmail.com wrote:
Reminder that the next Typing Meetup is *today at 10 am San Francisco time (UTC-8)* / 6 pm London time (UTC).
Zoom link: https://us02web.zoom.us/j/81560123744
See you there!
On Mon, Nov 29, 2021 at 10:09 PM S Pradeep Kumar gohanpra@gmail.com wrote:
> Gentle reminder that the next Typing Meetup is on *Wednesday, > December 01, 2021 at 10 am San Francisco time (UTC-8)* / 6 pm > London time (UTC). > > Zoom link: https://us02web.zoom.us/j/81560123744 > > Agenda: > + Pyanalyze: Introduction to its architecture and extensions - Jelle > Zijlstra. > + Dataclass-transforms: A typing framework for > dataclass-like libraries - Eric Traut. > > On Mon, Nov 22, 2021 at 1:14 PM S Pradeep Kumar gohanpra@gmail.com > wrote: > >> Hi all, >> >> The next Typing Meetup will be on *Wednesday, December 01, 2021 at >> 10 am San Francisco time (UTC-8)* / 6 pm London time (UTC). >> >> Let me know if there are any major conflicts at that time and I can >> try to reschedule. >> >> Zoom link: https://us02web.zoom.us/j/81560123744 >> >> Agenda: >> + Pyanalyze: Introduction to its architecture and extensions - >> Jelle Zijlstra. >> + Dataclass-transforms: A typing framework for >> dataclass-like libraries - Eric Traut. >> >> All are welcome! I'll share notes and recording after the meetup. >> [1] Reach out to me if you want to propose a talk for future meetups. >> >> Thanks, >> S Pradeep Kumar >> >> [1]: Doc for Meetup notes: >> https://docs.google.com/document/d/17iqV7WWvB0IwA43EPlIqlUS6Xuvk08X3sEudAA-g... >> >> On Wed, Nov 3, 2021 at 3:11 PM S Pradeep Kumar gohanpra@gmail.com >> wrote: >> >>> Thanks everyone for attending! I've added the recording and >>> meeting notes to the running doc [1] >>> >>> Quick summary: >>> >>> 1. Callable syntax: Support for shorthand syntax remains >>> unanimous. There was a pretty heated debate about the last remaining >>> question: should the PEP have shorthand only or extended syntax as well? >>> I've added details in the doc. >>> >>> Takeaway: We’ve been discussing this topic for months now and >>> there are *no* prospects of a firm consensus on extended syntax. Given that >>> the 3.11 deadline is early May 2022 and we will probably need to iterate on >>> the PEP based on SC feedback, the current plan is for us to go ahead and >>> draft the PEP with shorthand syntax. Hopefully, we can implement it, submit >>> it to the Steering Council, and get it approved (can take ~2 months) before >>> the deadline for 3.11. >>> >>> 2. Precise types for **kwargs: People said this is a valuable >>> feature. The main remaining question is about bikeshedding: **kwargs: >>> Unpack[Movie] vs Expand[Movie] vs **Movie. >>> >>> 3. Better discussion forum than typing-sig: Email threads >>> here lack code markup and syntax highlighting, don't have a convenient >>> "like" button that people actually use, and can be hard to follow after a >>> while. We settled on trying out GitHub Discussions for about a month to see >>> if there are major drawbacks compared to typing-sig. I've mentioned the >>> pros and cons in the doc. >>> >>> Sebastian Rittau volunteered to clean up the python/typing >>> GitHub repo so that we can use it. Sebastian: Could you let us know when we >>> can start moving discussions there? (If python/typing isn't feasible due to >>> noisy help-related questions and we can't filter it easily, we might need a >>> separate repo for typing-sig.) >>> >>> We'll have the next typing meetup about a month from now. If you >>> would like certain topics to be discussed, shoot me an email. >>> >>> [1]: >>> https://docs.google.com/document/d/17iqV7WWvB0IwA43EPlIqlUS6Xuvk08X3sEudAA-g... >>> >>> >>> On Wed, Nov 3, 2021 at 7:00 AM S Pradeep Kumar gohanpra@gmail.com >>> wrote: >>> >>>> Reminder that the Typing Meetup is today* at 10 am San Francisco >>>> time (UTC-7) / 5 pm London time (UTC)* >>>> >>>> Zoom link: https://us02web.zoom.us/j/89227859828. >>>> >>>> See you there! >>>> -- >>>> S Pradeep Kumar >>>> >>> >>> >>> -- >>> S Pradeep Kumar >>> >> >> >> -- >> S Pradeep Kumar >> > > > -- > S Pradeep Kumar >
-- S Pradeep Kumar
-- S Pradeep Kumar
-- S Pradeep Kumar
-- S Pradeep Kumar
-- S Pradeep Kumar
-- S Pradeep Kumar
Reminder that the next Typing Meetup is *today at 10 am San Francisco time (UTC-8) */ 6 pm London time (UTC).
Zoom link: https://us02web.zoom.us/j/84814892097.
On Mon, Feb 14, 2022 at 1:43 PM S Pradeep Kumar gohanpra@gmail.com wrote:
Hello all,
Reminder that the next Typing Meetup will be this *Wednesday, February 16, 2022 at 10 am San Francisco time (UTC-8) */ 6 pm London time (UTC).
Zoom link: https://us02web.zoom.us/j/84814892097.
Best,
On Mon, Feb 7, 2022 at 4:06 PM S Pradeep Kumar gohanpra@gmail.com wrote:
Hello all,
The next Typing Meetup will be on Wednesday, February 16, 2022 at 10 am San Francisco time (UTC-8) / 6 pm London time (UTC).
Let me know if you have any major conflicts at that time and I can reschedule.
Zoom link: https://us02web.zoom.us/j/84814892097. Please note that the meeting will be automatically recorded from the time it starts.
Agenda:
- Pyright Overview and Internals - Eric Traut will discuss Pyright's
design goals, architecture, and the features that make it unique among the major Python type checkers
All are welcome! I'll share the recording and notes after the meetup. [1] Reach out to me if you want to propose a talk or topic for future meetups.
Thanks, S Pradeep Kumar
[1]: Doc for Meetup notes: https://docs.google.com/document/d/17iqV7WWvB0IwA43EPlIqlUS6Xuvk08X3sEudAA-g...
On Wed, Jan 12, 2022 at 12:07 PM S Pradeep Kumar gohanpra@gmail.com wrote:
Thanks to everyone who attended the meetup. The recording and chat transcript are available in the running Google Doc [1].
- dataclasses-json: Easy, type-safe decoding from JSON - Charles Li.
Slides [2]. We also discussed ways to make the type checker recognize the methods added to the dataclass (such as `.schema()` and `.from_dict()`).
- phantom-types: Narrowing types using arbitrary predicates - Anton
Agestam. Slides [3]. Some use cases include validating emails and phone numbers using regexes. One interesting example we discussed was `SequenceButNotStr`.
- PyCon Typing Summit: We'll be having a Typing Summit at PyCon 2022.
The date is tentatively April 28 and Shannon and Alfonso are co-organizing. More details to come soon. See you there!
- Next meetup: If you want to nominate a topic for the next meetup,
please reach out to me!
[1]: Meeting recording and notes: https://docs.google.com/document/d/17iqV7WWvB0IwA43EPlIqlUS6Xuvk08X3sEudAA-g... [2]: dataclasses-json: https://docs.google.com/presentation/d/1rVPE0DoDcQon91pqOgWiNd7So4p1qVf_aIfB...
https://docs.google.com/presentation/d/1wZoSaT7-hk-nBFZDpCy7SfHjKHF7cUfbIfH3...
On Wed, Jan 12, 2022 at 6:00 AM S Pradeep Kumar gohanpra@gmail.com wrote:
Reminder that the next Typing Meetup is today: *Wednesday, January 12, 2022 at 10 am San Francisco time (UTC-8)* / 6 pm London time (UTC).
Zoom link: https://us02web.zoom.us/j/87596299889. Please note that the meeting will be automatically recorded from the time it starts.
On Tue, Jan 4, 2022 at 1:02 PM S Pradeep Kumar gohanpra@gmail.com wrote:
Hello all,
Happy new year! The next Typing Meetup will be on *Wednesday, January 12, 2022 at 10 am San Francisco time (UTC-8)* / 6 pm London time (UTC).
Let me know if there are any major conflicts at that time and I can try to reschedule.
Zoom link: https://us02web.zoom.us/j/87596299889. Please note that the meeting will be automatically recorded from the time it starts.
Agenda:
- dataclasses-json: Easy, type-safe decoding from JSON - Charles Li.
- phantom-types: Flexible preconditions using types - Anton Agestam.
All are welcome! I'll share the recording and notes after the meetup. [1] Reach out to me if you want to propose a talk or topic for future meetups.
Thanks, S Pradeep Kumar
[1]: Doc for Meetup notes: https://docs.google.com/document/d/17iqV7WWvB0IwA43EPlIqlUS6Xuvk08X3sEudAA-g...
On Wed, Dec 1, 2021 at 9:02 PM S Pradeep Kumar gohanpra@gmail.com wrote:
Thanks everyone for attending the meetup. The recording and chat transcript are available in the running Google Doc [1].
- PyCon Typing Summit: PyCon 2022 is coming up soon. This year's
Typing Summit [2] was pretty interesting, so we should probably have one next year too. Shannon Zhu has offered to organize it next year too, so if anyone else is interested in co-organizing, please reach out to me.
- Dataclass-transforms: Eric, this seems like a valuable feature.
I'm in favor of having it in a PEP. Does anyone have serious objections? If we can agree on a PEP soon, we could have it as part of 3.11.
- Next meetup: If you want to propose a talk for the next meetup,
please reach out! Otherwise, I'll continue to ping people about topics *I* find interesting :)
PS: Jelle and Eric, could you add your slides to the Google Doc (in a comment)? There were also a couple of unanswered questions by Nikita and Carl, so I've added them to the doc.
On Wed, Dec 1, 2021 at 7:00 AM S Pradeep Kumar gohanpra@gmail.com wrote:
> Reminder that the next Typing Meetup is *today at 10 am San > Francisco time (UTC-8)* / 6 pm London time (UTC). > > Zoom link: https://us02web.zoom.us/j/81560123744 > > See you there! > > On Mon, Nov 29, 2021 at 10:09 PM S Pradeep Kumar gohanpra@gmail.com > wrote: > >> Gentle reminder that the next Typing Meetup is on *Wednesday, >> December 01, 2021 at 10 am San Francisco time (UTC-8)* / 6 pm >> London time (UTC). >> >> Zoom link: https://us02web.zoom.us/j/81560123744 >> >> Agenda: >> + Pyanalyze: Introduction to its architecture and extensions - >> Jelle Zijlstra. >> + Dataclass-transforms: A typing framework for >> dataclass-like libraries - Eric Traut. >> >> On Mon, Nov 22, 2021 at 1:14 PM S Pradeep Kumar gohanpra@gmail.com >> wrote: >> >>> Hi all, >>> >>> The next Typing Meetup will be on *Wednesday, December 01, 2021 >>> at 10 am San Francisco time (UTC-8)* / 6 pm London time (UTC). >>> >>> Let me know if there are any major conflicts at that time and I >>> can try to reschedule. >>> >>> Zoom link: https://us02web.zoom.us/j/81560123744 >>> >>> Agenda: >>> + Pyanalyze: Introduction to its architecture and extensions - >>> Jelle Zijlstra. >>> + Dataclass-transforms: A typing framework for >>> dataclass-like libraries - Eric Traut. >>> >>> All are welcome! I'll share notes and recording after the meetup. >>> [1] Reach out to me if you want to propose a talk for future meetups. >>> >>> Thanks, >>> S Pradeep Kumar >>> >>> [1]: Doc for Meetup notes: >>> https://docs.google.com/document/d/17iqV7WWvB0IwA43EPlIqlUS6Xuvk08X3sEudAA-g... >>> >>> On Wed, Nov 3, 2021 at 3:11 PM S Pradeep Kumar gohanpra@gmail.com >>> wrote: >>> >>>> Thanks everyone for attending! I've added the recording and >>>> meeting notes to the running doc [1] >>>> >>>> Quick summary: >>>> >>>> 1. Callable syntax: Support for shorthand syntax remains >>>> unanimous. There was a pretty heated debate about the last remaining >>>> question: should the PEP have shorthand only or extended syntax as well? >>>> I've added details in the doc. >>>> >>>> Takeaway: We’ve been discussing this topic for months now and >>>> there are *no* prospects of a firm consensus on extended syntax. Given that >>>> the 3.11 deadline is early May 2022 and we will probably need to iterate on >>>> the PEP based on SC feedback, the current plan is for us to go ahead and >>>> draft the PEP with shorthand syntax. Hopefully, we can implement it, submit >>>> it to the Steering Council, and get it approved (can take ~2 months) before >>>> the deadline for 3.11. >>>> >>>> 2. Precise types for **kwargs: People said this is a valuable >>>> feature. The main remaining question is about bikeshedding: **kwargs: >>>> Unpack[Movie] vs Expand[Movie] vs **Movie. >>>> >>>> 3. Better discussion forum than typing-sig: Email threads >>>> here lack code markup and syntax highlighting, don't have a convenient >>>> "like" button that people actually use, and can be hard to follow after a >>>> while. We settled on trying out GitHub Discussions for about a month to see >>>> if there are major drawbacks compared to typing-sig. I've mentioned the >>>> pros and cons in the doc. >>>> >>>> Sebastian Rittau volunteered to clean up the python/typing >>>> GitHub repo so that we can use it. Sebastian: Could you let us know when we >>>> can start moving discussions there? (If python/typing isn't feasible due to >>>> noisy help-related questions and we can't filter it easily, we might need a >>>> separate repo for typing-sig.) >>>> >>>> We'll have the next typing meetup about a month from now. If you >>>> would like certain topics to be discussed, shoot me an email. >>>> >>>> [1]: >>>> https://docs.google.com/document/d/17iqV7WWvB0IwA43EPlIqlUS6Xuvk08X3sEudAA-g... >>>> >>>> >>>> On Wed, Nov 3, 2021 at 7:00 AM S Pradeep Kumar < >>>> gohanpra@gmail.com> wrote: >>>> >>>>> Reminder that the Typing Meetup is today* at 10 am San >>>>> Francisco time (UTC-7) / 5 pm London time (UTC)* >>>>> >>>>> Zoom link: https://us02web.zoom.us/j/89227859828. >>>>> >>>>> See you there! >>>>> -- >>>>> S Pradeep Kumar >>>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> -- >>>> S Pradeep Kumar >>>> >>> >>> >>> -- >>> S Pradeep Kumar >>> >> >> >> -- >> S Pradeep Kumar >> > > > -- > S Pradeep Kumar >
-- S Pradeep Kumar
-- S Pradeep Kumar
-- S Pradeep Kumar
-- S Pradeep Kumar
-- S Pradeep Kumar
-- S Pradeep Kumar
Thanks to everyone who attended the meetup. The recording and chat transcript are available in the running Google Doc [1].
Thanks to Eric Traut for an interesting talk about Pyright's architecture! (Eric: Could you add your slides to the doc?)
- *PyCon Typing Summit 2022*: Please fill out the PyCon 2022 Typing Summit Interest Form https://docs.google.com/forms/d/e/1FAIpQLSdsgrGXrKZUXv9KMBwyYJkJ6L3CL_Os4Yg0wMhDhkmA9x2XbQ/viewform if you are interested in attending! Reach out to Shannon or Alfonso if you're interested in presenting. - *Next Typing Meetup*: If you want to nominate a topic for the next meetup, please reach out to me!
[1]: Meeting recording and notes: https://docs.google.com/document/d/17iqV7WWvB0IwA43EPlIqlUS6Xuvk08X3sEudAA-g...
On Wed, Feb 16, 2022 at 7:00 AM S Pradeep Kumar gohanpra@gmail.com wrote:
Reminder that the next Typing Meetup is *today at 10 am San Francisco time (UTC-8) */ 6 pm London time (UTC).
Zoom link: https://us02web.zoom.us/j/84814892097.
On Mon, Feb 14, 2022 at 1:43 PM S Pradeep Kumar gohanpra@gmail.com wrote:
Hello all,
Reminder that the next Typing Meetup will be this *Wednesday, February 16, 2022 at 10 am San Francisco time (UTC-8) */ 6 pm London time (UTC).
Zoom link: https://us02web.zoom.us/j/84814892097.
Best,
On Mon, Feb 7, 2022 at 4:06 PM S Pradeep Kumar gohanpra@gmail.com wrote:
Hello all,
The next Typing Meetup will be on Wednesday, February 16, 2022 at 10 am San Francisco time (UTC-8) / 6 pm London time (UTC).
Let me know if you have any major conflicts at that time and I can reschedule.
Zoom link: https://us02web.zoom.us/j/84814892097. Please note that the meeting will be automatically recorded from the time it starts.
Agenda:
- Pyright Overview and Internals - Eric Traut will discuss Pyright's
design goals, architecture, and the features that make it unique among the major Python type checkers
All are welcome! I'll share the recording and notes after the meetup. [1] Reach out to me if you want to propose a talk or topic for future meetups.
Thanks, S Pradeep Kumar
[1]: Doc for Meetup notes: https://docs.google.com/document/d/17iqV7WWvB0IwA43EPlIqlUS6Xuvk08X3sEudAA-g...
On Wed, Jan 12, 2022 at 12:07 PM S Pradeep Kumar gohanpra@gmail.com wrote:
Thanks to everyone who attended the meetup. The recording and chat transcript are available in the running Google Doc [1].
- dataclasses-json: Easy, type-safe decoding from JSON - Charles Li.
Slides [2]. We also discussed ways to make the type checker recognize the methods added to the dataclass (such as `.schema()` and `.from_dict()`).
- phantom-types: Narrowing types using arbitrary predicates - Anton
Agestam. Slides [3]. Some use cases include validating emails and phone numbers using regexes. One interesting example we discussed was `SequenceButNotStr`.
- PyCon Typing Summit: We'll be having a Typing Summit at PyCon 2022.
The date is tentatively April 28 and Shannon and Alfonso are co-organizing. More details to come soon. See you there!
- Next meetup: If you want to nominate a topic for the next meetup,
please reach out to me!
[1]: Meeting recording and notes: https://docs.google.com/document/d/17iqV7WWvB0IwA43EPlIqlUS6Xuvk08X3sEudAA-g... [2]: dataclasses-json: https://docs.google.com/presentation/d/1rVPE0DoDcQon91pqOgWiNd7So4p1qVf_aIfB...
https://docs.google.com/presentation/d/1wZoSaT7-hk-nBFZDpCy7SfHjKHF7cUfbIfH3...
On Wed, Jan 12, 2022 at 6:00 AM S Pradeep Kumar gohanpra@gmail.com wrote:
Reminder that the next Typing Meetup is today: *Wednesday, January 12, 2022 at 10 am San Francisco time (UTC-8)* / 6 pm London time (UTC).
Zoom link: https://us02web.zoom.us/j/87596299889. Please note that the meeting will be automatically recorded from the time it starts.
On Tue, Jan 4, 2022 at 1:02 PM S Pradeep Kumar gohanpra@gmail.com wrote:
Hello all,
Happy new year! The next Typing Meetup will be on *Wednesday, January 12, 2022 at 10 am San Francisco time (UTC-8)* / 6 pm London time (UTC).
Let me know if there are any major conflicts at that time and I can try to reschedule.
Zoom link: https://us02web.zoom.us/j/87596299889. Please note that the meeting will be automatically recorded from the time it starts.
Agenda:
- dataclasses-json: Easy, type-safe decoding from JSON - Charles Li.
- phantom-types: Flexible preconditions using types - Anton Agestam.
All are welcome! I'll share the recording and notes after the meetup. [1] Reach out to me if you want to propose a talk or topic for future meetups.
Thanks, S Pradeep Kumar
[1]: Doc for Meetup notes: https://docs.google.com/document/d/17iqV7WWvB0IwA43EPlIqlUS6Xuvk08X3sEudAA-g...
On Wed, Dec 1, 2021 at 9:02 PM S Pradeep Kumar gohanpra@gmail.com wrote:
> Thanks everyone for attending the meetup. The recording and chat > transcript are available in the running Google Doc [1]. > > 1. PyCon Typing Summit: PyCon 2022 is coming up soon. This year's > Typing Summit [2] was pretty interesting, so we should probably have one > next year too. Shannon Zhu has offered to organize it next year too, so if > anyone else is interested in co-organizing, please reach out to me. > > 2. Dataclass-transforms: Eric, this seems like a valuable feature. > I'm in favor of having it in a PEP. Does anyone have serious objections? If > we can agree on a PEP soon, we could have it as part of 3.11. > > 3. Next meetup: If you want to propose a talk for the next meetup, > please reach out! Otherwise, I'll continue to ping people about topics *I* > find interesting :) > > [1]: > https://docs.google.com/document/d/17iqV7WWvB0IwA43EPlIqlUS6Xuvk08X3sEudAA-g... > [2]: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ld9rwCvGdhc > > PS: Jelle and Eric, could you add your slides to the Google Doc (in > a comment)? There were also a couple of unanswered questions by Nikita and > Carl, so I've added them to the doc. > > On Wed, Dec 1, 2021 at 7:00 AM S Pradeep Kumar gohanpra@gmail.com > wrote: > >> Reminder that the next Typing Meetup is *today at 10 am San >> Francisco time (UTC-8)* / 6 pm London time (UTC). >> >> Zoom link: https://us02web.zoom.us/j/81560123744 >> >> See you there! >> >> On Mon, Nov 29, 2021 at 10:09 PM S Pradeep Kumar < >> gohanpra@gmail.com> wrote: >> >>> Gentle reminder that the next Typing Meetup is on *Wednesday, >>> December 01, 2021 at 10 am San Francisco time (UTC-8)* / 6 pm >>> London time (UTC). >>> >>> Zoom link: https://us02web.zoom.us/j/81560123744 >>> >>> Agenda: >>> + Pyanalyze: Introduction to its architecture and extensions - >>> Jelle Zijlstra. >>> + Dataclass-transforms: A typing framework for >>> dataclass-like libraries - Eric Traut. >>> >>> On Mon, Nov 22, 2021 at 1:14 PM S Pradeep Kumar < >>> gohanpra@gmail.com> wrote: >>> >>>> Hi all, >>>> >>>> The next Typing Meetup will be on *Wednesday, December 01, 2021 >>>> at 10 am San Francisco time (UTC-8)* / 6 pm London time (UTC). >>>> >>>> Let me know if there are any major conflicts at that time and I >>>> can try to reschedule. >>>> >>>> Zoom link: https://us02web.zoom.us/j/81560123744 >>>> >>>> Agenda: >>>> + Pyanalyze: Introduction to its architecture and extensions - >>>> Jelle Zijlstra. >>>> + Dataclass-transforms: A typing framework for >>>> dataclass-like libraries - Eric Traut. >>>> >>>> All are welcome! I'll share notes and recording after the meetup. >>>> [1] Reach out to me if you want to propose a talk for future meetups. >>>> >>>> Thanks, >>>> S Pradeep Kumar >>>> >>>> [1]: Doc for Meetup notes: >>>> https://docs.google.com/document/d/17iqV7WWvB0IwA43EPlIqlUS6Xuvk08X3sEudAA-g... >>>> >>>> On Wed, Nov 3, 2021 at 3:11 PM S Pradeep Kumar < >>>> gohanpra@gmail.com> wrote: >>>> >>>>> Thanks everyone for attending! I've added the recording and >>>>> meeting notes to the running doc [1] >>>>> >>>>> Quick summary: >>>>> >>>>> 1. Callable syntax: Support for shorthand syntax remains >>>>> unanimous. There was a pretty heated debate about the last remaining >>>>> question: should the PEP have shorthand only or extended syntax as well? >>>>> I've added details in the doc. >>>>> >>>>> Takeaway: We’ve been discussing this topic for months now and >>>>> there are *no* prospects of a firm consensus on extended syntax. Given that >>>>> the 3.11 deadline is early May 2022 and we will probably need to iterate on >>>>> the PEP based on SC feedback, the current plan is for us to go ahead and >>>>> draft the PEP with shorthand syntax. Hopefully, we can implement it, submit >>>>> it to the Steering Council, and get it approved (can take ~2 months) before >>>>> the deadline for 3.11. >>>>> >>>>> 2. Precise types for **kwargs: People said this is a valuable >>>>> feature. The main remaining question is about bikeshedding: **kwargs: >>>>> Unpack[Movie] vs Expand[Movie] vs **Movie. >>>>> >>>>> 3. Better discussion forum than typing-sig: Email threads >>>>> here lack code markup and syntax highlighting, don't have a convenient >>>>> "like" button that people actually use, and can be hard to follow after a >>>>> while. We settled on trying out GitHub Discussions for about a month to see >>>>> if there are major drawbacks compared to typing-sig. I've mentioned the >>>>> pros and cons in the doc. >>>>> >>>>> Sebastian Rittau volunteered to clean up the python/typing >>>>> GitHub repo so that we can use it. Sebastian: Could you let us know when we >>>>> can start moving discussions there? (If python/typing isn't feasible due to >>>>> noisy help-related questions and we can't filter it easily, we might need a >>>>> separate repo for typing-sig.) >>>>> >>>>> We'll have the next typing meetup about a month from now. If you >>>>> would like certain topics to be discussed, shoot me an email. >>>>> >>>>> [1]: >>>>> https://docs.google.com/document/d/17iqV7WWvB0IwA43EPlIqlUS6Xuvk08X3sEudAA-g... >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> On Wed, Nov 3, 2021 at 7:00 AM S Pradeep Kumar < >>>>> gohanpra@gmail.com> wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> Reminder that the Typing Meetup is today* at 10 am San >>>>>> Francisco time (UTC-7) / 5 pm London time (UTC)* >>>>>> >>>>>> Zoom link: https://us02web.zoom.us/j/89227859828. >>>>>> >>>>>> See you there! >>>>>> -- >>>>>> S Pradeep Kumar >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> -- >>>>> S Pradeep Kumar >>>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> -- >>>> S Pradeep Kumar >>>> >>> >>> >>> -- >>> S Pradeep Kumar >>> >> >> >> -- >> S Pradeep Kumar >> > > > -- > S Pradeep Kumar >
-- S Pradeep Kumar
-- S Pradeep Kumar
-- S Pradeep Kumar
-- S Pradeep Kumar
-- S Pradeep Kumar
-- S Pradeep Kumar
Thanks for organizing the session Pradeep. Could you verify that the link to the Chat Transcript is correct in the doc? For me, resolves to the chat transcript for an older meetup.
I updated the doc with a link to my slides.
-Eric
It would be great if people from pyre, mypy, etc could do similar presentations in the future!
-Erik
I'm hesitant to encourage that. This meetup used to be a place where we can have frank, in-person discussions about issues that come up in the Python typing world, and that's why I attend. I would no longer attend if it became a venue for full-length presentations.
On Wed, Feb 16, 2022 at 10:33 PM Erik De Bonte via Typing-sig < typing-sig@python.org> wrote:
It would be great if people from pyre, mypy, etc could do similar presentations in the future!
-Erik _______________________________________________ Typing-sig mailing list -- typing-sig@python.org To unsubscribe send an email to typing-sig-leave@python.org https://mail.python.org/mailman3/lists/typing-sig.python.org/ Member address: guido@python.org
Good point. I guess this info would be primarily interesting to the subcommunity of people working on type checkers.
Steven Troxler and I have been talking about having a separate meetup for people implementing checkers and other type-related tools, if there's enough interest.
martin
On Thu, Feb 17, 2022 at 9:20 AM Erik De Bonte via Typing-sig < typing-sig@python.org> wrote:
Good point. I guess this info would be primarily interesting to the subcommunity of people working on type checkers. _______________________________________________ Typing-sig mailing list -- typing-sig@python.org To unsubscribe send an email to typing-sig-leave@python.org https://mail.python.org/mailman3/lists/typing-sig.python.org/ Member address: mdemello@google.com
What if we did a separated one off event for something like this? ☺️
On Thu, 17 Feb 2022 at 10:25, Guido van Rossum guido@python.org wrote:
I'm hesitant to encourage that. This meetup used to be a place where we can have frank, in-person discussions about issues that come up in the Python typing world, and that's why I attend. I would no longer attend if it became a venue for full-length presentations.
On Wed, Feb 16, 2022 at 10:33 PM Erik De Bonte via Typing-sig < typing-sig@python.org> wrote:
It would be great if people from pyre, mypy, etc could do similar presentations in the future!
-Erik _______________________________________________ Typing-sig mailing list -- typing-sig@python.org To unsubscribe send an email to typing-sig-leave@python.org https://mail.python.org/mailman3/lists/typing-sig.python.org/ Member address: guido@python.org
-- --Guido van Rossum (python.org/~guido) *Pronouns: he/him **(why is my pronoun here?)* http://feministing.com/2015/02/03/how-using-they-as-a-singular-pronoun-can-change-the-world/ _______________________________________________ Typing-sig mailing list -- typing-sig@python.org To unsubscribe send an email to typing-sig-leave@python.org https://mail.python.org/mailman3/lists/typing-sig.python.org/ Member address: patrick.arminio@gmail.com
Hello all,
The next Typing Meetup will be on *Wednesday, March 23, 2022 at 10:30 am San Francisco time (UTC-7)* / 5:30 pm London time (UTC).
Note: For this meetup alone, we'll be meeting at 10:30 am San Francisco time rather than the usual 10 am, because some participants had other conflicts. Let me know if anyone else has major conflicts at that time and I can reschedule.
Zoom link: https://us02web.zoom.us/j/89984923121. The meeting will be automatically recorded from the time it starts.
Agenda:
- Defining Inference Carve-outs: What to do when a variable or attribute is unannotated, by Shannon Zhu and Eric Traut - Open TypedDicts, by Jonathan Scholbach and Steven Troxler
All are welcome! I'll share the recording and notes after the meetup. [1]
Thanks, S Pradeep Kumar
[1]: Doc for Meetup notes: https://docs.google.com/document/d/17iqV7WWvB0IwA43EPlIqlUS6Xuvk08X3sEudAA-g...
Update: I'm moving the meetup to *Wednesday, April 06, 2022 at 10:00 am San Francisco time (UTC-7)* / 6:00 pm London time (UTC+1). There were a few conflicts this week and next week. I'll send a reminder a few days before the meeting.
Zoom link: https://us02web.zoom.us/j/89984923121
Best,
On Thu, Mar 17, 2022 at 5:10 PM S Pradeep Kumar gohanpra@gmail.com wrote:
Hello all,
The next Typing Meetup will be on *Wednesday, March 23, 2022 at 10:30 am San Francisco time (UTC-7)* / 5:30 pm London time (UTC).
Note: For this meetup alone, we'll be meeting at 10:30 am San Francisco time rather than the usual 10 am, because some participants had other conflicts. Let me know if anyone else has major conflicts at that time and I can reschedule.
Zoom link: https://us02web.zoom.us/j/89984923121. The meeting will be automatically recorded from the time it starts.
Agenda:
- Defining Inference Carve-outs: What to do when a variable or
attribute is unannotated, by Shannon Zhu and Eric Traut
- Open TypedDicts, by Jonathan Scholbach and Steven Troxler
All are welcome! I'll share the recording and notes after the meetup. [1]
Thanks, S Pradeep Kumar
[1]: Doc for Meetup notes: https://docs.google.com/document/d/17iqV7WWvB0IwA43EPlIqlUS6Xuvk08X3sEudAA-g...
Hello all,
Reminder: The next Typing Meetup is on *Wednesday, April 06, 2022 at 10:00 am San Francisco time (UTC-7)* / 6:00 pm London time (UTC+1).
Zoom link: https://us02web.zoom.us/j/89984923121. The meeting will be automatically recorded from the time it starts.
Best,
On Mon, Mar 21, 2022 at 9:24 AM S Pradeep Kumar gohanpra@gmail.com wrote:
Update: I'm moving the meetup to *Wednesday, April 06, 2022 at 10:00 am San Francisco time (UTC-7)* / 6:00 pm London time (UTC+1). There were a few conflicts this week and next week. I'll send a reminder a few days before the meeting.
Zoom link: https://us02web.zoom.us/j/89984923121
Best,
On Thu, Mar 17, 2022 at 5:10 PM S Pradeep Kumar gohanpra@gmail.com wrote:
Hello all,
The next Typing Meetup will be on *Wednesday, March 23, 2022 at 10:30 am San Francisco time (UTC-7)* / 5:30 pm London time (UTC).
Note: For this meetup alone, we'll be meeting at 10:30 am San Francisco time rather than the usual 10 am, because some participants had other conflicts. Let me know if anyone else has major conflicts at that time and I can reschedule.
Zoom link: https://us02web.zoom.us/j/89984923121. The meeting will be automatically recorded from the time it starts.
Agenda:
- Defining Inference Carve-outs: What to do when a variable or
attribute is unannotated, by Shannon Zhu and Eric Traut
- Open TypedDicts, by Jonathan Scholbach and Steven Troxler
All are welcome! I'll share the recording and notes after the meetup. [1]
Thanks, S Pradeep Kumar
[1]: Doc for Meetup notes: https://docs.google.com/document/d/17iqV7WWvB0IwA43EPlIqlUS6Xuvk08X3sEudAA-g...
-- S Pradeep Kumar
Reminder that the Typing Meetup is today* at 10:00 am San Francisco time (UTC-7)* / 6:00 pm London time (UTC+1).
Zoom link: https://us02web.zoom.us/j/89984923121.
Thanks to everyone who attended today's meetup. We had a pretty heated debate towards the end, so if you missed part of it, you can check out the recording, chat, and slides in the running Google Doc [1].
1. Inference carve-outs: Shannon Zhu and Eric Traut [2]. Type checkers differ in their behavior for many cases of unannotated variables, function parameters, or attributes. Shannon and Eric pointed out some of these cases and argued that we should standardize on the behavior for some, if not all, of them. I polled the participants and found 16 in favor of standardization, none against, and 2 saying “I don’t know”. Follow-up: We probably need to find a good way to standardize this.
2. TypedDicts and Extra Fields: Jonathan Scholbach and Steven Troxler [3].
Jonathan and Steven pointed out that, if we have a `BaseTypedDict` and a subtype `ChildTypedDict`, it is legal to assign a dictionary literal containing child-specific keys to a variable of type `ChildTypedDict` and then assign it to a TypedDict `BaseTypedDict`. But it is illegal to assign the dictionary literal directly to `BaseTypedDict`. They argued that this can be confusing for some users. Others argued that this feature prevented users from having a typo in a non-required field, which would not be caught by the type checker otherwise. We were discussing whether or not this warranted a change in the PEP and seemed to agree that we could get away with a clearer error message. We didn't actually get around to discussing whether to add a new `extra=True` flag to allow reading and writing arbitrary extra fields, as in TypeScript or Hack, and what the semantics would be (especially with subtyping).
*Note*: I'm sure people still have some points they want to make! Please continue the discussion in the OTHER, dedicated typing-sig thread [4], so that this thread is purely about Typing Meetup logistics.
3. PyCon Typing Summit: We'll be having a Typing Summit at PyCon on Thursday, April 28th from 1-5 pm: https://us.pycon.org/2022/events/typing-summit/. So, we'll have the next monthly Typing Meetup in late May.
[1]: Meeting recording and notes: https://docs.google.com/document/d/17iqV7WWvB0IwA43EPlIqlUS6Xuvk08X3sEudAA-g... [2]: https://drive.google.com/file/d/1mxP-nmqWHrLDoxgcZ1Tq54H3AXCJxJx3/view?usp=s...
[3]: https://drive.google.com/file/d/1YWNbP3-h3791YegGskPy6xomJfaUKDs6/view?usp=s...
[4]: https://mail.python.org/archives/list/typing-sig@python.org/thread/66RITIHDQ...
On Wed, Apr 6, 2022 at 6:00 AM S Pradeep Kumar gohanpra@gmail.com wrote:
Reminder that the Typing Meetup is today* at 10:00 am San Francisco time (UTC-7)* / 6:00 pm London time (UTC+1).
Zoom link: https://us02web.zoom.us/j/89984923121.
S Pradeep Kumar
More of a meta-point, and a reminder: A PEP that has been accepted should not be changed. We used to allow this in some cases, but unless it's merely to clarify wording, PEPs are change specifications, and if you want to change anything you have to either do it as a new PEP or treat it as a minor new feature in the next Python release. Not every new feature requires a PEP. But PEPs are not documentation, and if the behavior changes, the PEP has to stay behind.
On Wed, Apr 6, 2022 at 4:48 PM S Pradeep Kumar gohanpra@gmail.com wrote:
Thanks to everyone who attended today's meetup. We had a pretty heated debate towards the end, so if you missed part of it, you can check out the recording, chat, and slides in the running Google Doc [1].
- Inference carve-outs: Shannon Zhu and Eric Traut [2]. Type checkers
differ in their behavior for many cases of unannotated variables, function parameters, or attributes. Shannon and Eric pointed out some of these cases and argued that we should standardize on the behavior for some, if not all, of them. I polled the participants and found 16 in favor of standardization, none against, and 2 saying “I don’t know”. Follow-up: We probably need to find a good way to standardize this.
- TypedDicts and Extra Fields: Jonathan Scholbach and Steven Troxler [3].
Jonathan and Steven pointed out that, if we have a `BaseTypedDict` and a subtype `ChildTypedDict`, it is legal to assign a dictionary literal containing child-specific keys to a variable of type `ChildTypedDict` and then assign it to a TypedDict `BaseTypedDict`. But it is illegal to assign the dictionary literal directly to `BaseTypedDict`. They argued that this can be confusing for some users. Others argued that this feature prevented users from having a typo in a non-required field, which would not be caught by the type checker otherwise. We were discussing whether or not this warranted a change in the PEP and seemed to agree that we could get away with a clearer error message. We didn't actually get around to discussing whether to add a new `extra=True` flag to allow reading and writing arbitrary extra fields, as in TypeScript or Hack, and what the semantics would be (especially with subtyping).
*Note*: I'm sure people still have some points they want to make! Please continue the discussion in the OTHER, dedicated typing-sig thread [4], so that this thread is purely about Typing Meetup logistics.
- PyCon Typing Summit: We'll be having a Typing Summit at PyCon on
Thursday, April 28th from 1-5 pm: https://us.pycon.org/2022/events/typing-summit/. So, we'll have the next monthly Typing Meetup in late May.
[1]: Meeting recording and notes: https://docs.google.com/document/d/17iqV7WWvB0IwA43EPlIqlUS6Xuvk08X3sEudAA-g... [2]: https://drive.google.com/file/d/1mxP-nmqWHrLDoxgcZ1Tq54H3AXCJxJx3/view?usp=s...
On Wed, Apr 6, 2022 at 6:00 AM S Pradeep Kumar gohanpra@gmail.com wrote:
Reminder that the Typing Meetup is today* at 10:00 am San Francisco time (UTC-7)* / 6:00 pm London time (UTC+1).
Zoom link: https://us02web.zoom.us/j/89984923121.
S Pradeep Kumar
-- S Pradeep Kumar _______________________________________________ Typing-sig mailing list -- typing-sig@python.org To unsubscribe send an email to typing-sig-leave@python.org https://mail.python.org/mailman3/lists/typing-sig.python.org/ Member address: guido@python.org
Hello all,
The next Typing Meetup will be on *Wednesday, May 25, 2022 at 10:00 am San Francisco time (UTC-7)* / 6:00 pm London time (UTC+1).
Zoom link: https://us02web.zoom.us/j/84291194582. The meeting will be automatically recorded from the time it starts.
Agenda: Syntax for TypeVars, by Sebastian Rittau
I'll share the recording and notes after the meetup. [1]
[1]: Meeting recording and notes: https://docs.google.com/document/d/17iqV7WWvB0IwA43EPlIqlUS6Xuvk08X3sEudAA-g...
*Update*: I'm moving the meetup to* Wednesday, June 1, 11:00 am San Francisco time (UTC-7)* / 7:00 pm London time (UTC+1).
(The main reason for the change is that I want to invite some core dev folks outside of typing-sig, since we'll be discussing a syntax change. I don't want a repeat of Callable syntax :| )
*Agenda*: Syntax for TypeVars, by Sebastian Rittau
Zoom link: https://us02web.zoom.us/j/84291194582. The meeting will be automatically recorded from the time it starts.
I'll share the recording and notes after the meetup. [1] -- S Pradeep Kumar
[1]: Meeting recording and notes: https://docs.google.com/document/d/17iqV7WWvB0IwA43EPlIqlUS6Xuvk08X3sEudAA-g...
Hello all,
Gentle reminder that the next meetup is on* Wednesday, June 1, 11:00 am San Francisco time (UTC-7)* / 7:00 pm London time (UTC+1).
(We couldn't have it at the usual 10 am time this month because of conflicts. I hope to return to the 10 am slot next time.)
*Agenda*: Syntax for TypeVars, by Sebastian Rittau
Zoom link: https://us02web.zoom.us/j/84291194582. The meeting will be automatically recorded from the time it starts.
I'll share the recording and notes after the meetup. [1] -- S Pradeep Kumar
[1]: Meeting recording and notes: https://docs.google.com/document/d/17iqV7WWvB0IwA43EPlIqlUS6Xuvk08X3sEudAA-g...
Reminder that the meetup is today at* 11:00 am San Francisco time (UTC-7)* / 7:00 pm London time (UTC+1).
Zoom link: https://us02web.zoom.us/j/84291194582.
*Agenda*: Syntax for TypeVars, by Sebastian Rittau
(We couldn't have it at the usual 10 am time this month because of conflicts. I hope to return to the 10 am slot next time.)
I'll share the recording and notes after the meetup. [1]
S Pradeep Kumar
[1]: Meeting recording and notes: https://docs.google.com/document/d/17iqV7WWvB0IwA43EPlIqlUS6Xuvk08X3sEudAA-g...
Thanks to everyone who attended today's meetup. You can check out the recording, chat, and slides in the running Google doc [1]. Thanks to Sebastian for presenting about TypeVar syntax, and thanks to the core Python developers who joined this meeting.
Meeting notes:
+ Context: In the Typing Summit panel [2] during PyCon 2022, we had asked Steering Council members (Thomas Wouters and Pablo Galindo Salgado) about future syntax proposals for typing. They replied that "The more constrained the syntax is, the less resistance there will be from the community." and "We need to consider that you can put type annotation syntax into a cast as an expression and it would work, so syntax changes are not just affecting types".
So, we decided to dedicate the meetup to a discussion about TypeVar syntax, since it is a constrained syntax that will (mostly) affect the syntax of statements rather than expressions.
+ Sebastian mentioned three possible syntaxes for declaring a TypeVar: (a) angular brackets `def foo<T>(x: T) -> T:` (b) square brackets `def foo[T](x: T) -> T:` (c) new scope syntax: such as, `let T = TypeVar("T") in def foo[T](x: T) -> T:` (Jelle had proposed this earlier)
Other proposals from the audience: (d) decorator syntax (e) new delimiter for TypeVar declarations: something different from `<>` and `[]`. Maybe `{}`.
For more details, see the slides linked in the doc.
+ Sebastian also described the "mini-language" to specify variance, upper bound, etc. The main approaches here were:
(a) punctuation only (`def foo[T <= int](x: T) -> T`) (b) keyword (`def foo[T bound int](x: T) -> T`) (c) function-style syntax (`def foo[T (bound=int)](x: T) -> T`)
The most extensible option is (c). We could add new flags to the TypeVar declaration without having to change the language syntax.
+ Objections:
(a) Angular brackets could lead to ambiguity with existing `<` and `>`. (b) Square brackets could be hard to read given how much they are already used. (c) New scope syntax: This could hurt readability if generic classes and methods need to be indented. If we don't indent the statement after `let T = TypeVar("T") in `, it's unclear if T is scoped only to the next statement or to the rest of the file. Most importantly, it is pretty verbose in the current proposal - we have to write what we currently write (`T = TypeVar("T")`) plus `let ... in`. It doesn't seem to be clearly better than the existing syntax.
+ Usability improvements: Eric Traut suggested that "If a TypeVar is associated with only one scope, its variance could be inferred from its usage". That might eliminate the need for special syntax to specify variance.
+ Poll: I polled participants at the end of the meeting, to get a rough sense of where people stand. It looks like we were split on the high-level syntax and in favor of a function-style mini-language:
- high-level declaration: + Angle brackets - 5/12 respondents (Steven, Jelle, Shannon, Erik, Konstantin) + Introduce scope - 5/12 respondents (Carl, Batuhan, Sebastian, Jia, Alex) + Square brackets - 2/12 respondents (James, Jukka)
- mini-language: + Function-style syntax - 8/12 respondents (Carl, Steven, Batuhan T, Jelle Zijlstra, Sebastian Rittau, Jia Chen, Konstantin Schukraft, Jukka Lehtosalo) + Punctuation - 3/12 respondents (Shannon, James, Alex) + Keyword - 1/12 respondents (Erik)
+ Follow-ups: Guido suggested that we don't have to cover all use cases with the syntax. That might over-complicate the syntax and leave us without a feasible solution. Instead, we might want to have a concise syntax for the most common use cases, and defer to the older syntax for the remaining cases.
If you'd like to continue this discussion, please reply to the **dedicated** TypeVar syntax thread: [3], so that this thread is purely for Typing Meetup logistics.
[1]: Meeting recording and notes: https://docs.google.com/document/d/17iqV7WWvB0IwA43EPlIqlUS6Xuvk08X3sEudAA-g... [2]: Typing Summit recording and notes: https://docs.google.com/document/d/1_CBM9SeBrFTFULtwAzGmxlBRhqzpIArQ65cWa2Ww... [3]: TypeVar syntax thread: https://mail.python.org/archives/list/typing-sig@python.org/thread/GPQO2F4NH...
On Wed, Jun 1, 2022 at 7:00 AM S Pradeep Kumar gohanpra@gmail.com wrote:
Reminder that the meetup is today at* 11:00 am San Francisco time (UTC-7)* / 7:00 pm London time (UTC+1).
Zoom link: https://us02web.zoom.us/j/84291194582.
*Agenda*: Syntax for TypeVars, by Sebastian Rittau
(We couldn't have it at the usual 10 am time this month because of conflicts. I hope to return to the 10 am slot next time.)
I'll share the recording and notes after the meetup. [1]
S Pradeep Kumar
[1]: Meeting recording and notes: https://docs.google.com/document/d/17iqV7WWvB0IwA43EPlIqlUS6Xuvk08X3sEudAA-g...
-- S Pradeep Kumar
* + Angle brackets - 5/12 respondents (Steven, Jelle, Shannon, Erik, Konstantin)
For what it's worth, my vote for angle brackets really meant, "some token other than square brackets," because I thought angle brackets were off the table due to parsing ambiguities. Is that how everyone interpreted it?
-Erik
I didn't vote in the poll because the poll we had for signature types probably didn't help us, and because I felt it was premature to vote. I'd rather have more of a discussion than rule out any particular proposal. If we have to do some kind of poll I'd suggest having several more worked-out proposals, discuss particular for some time, and *then* let SIG members rate each of them from 1-5 stars. (The idea of separating the outer syntax from the mini-language was good though!)
I don't really see there are other tokens we can use besides angular or square brackets (or the 3rd, non-bracket syntax). Curly braces are different from all other languages and in Python already have very different associations (dicts and sets, and f-string interpolations).
On Wed, Jun 1, 2022 at 3:35 PM Erik De Bonte via Typing-sig < typing-sig@python.org> wrote:
+ Angle brackets - 5/12 respondents (Steven, Jelle, Shannon,Erik, Konstantin)
For what it’s worth, my vote for angle brackets really meant, “some token other than square brackets,” because I thought angle brackets were off the table due to parsing ambiguities. Is that how everyone interpreted it?
-Erik
Typing-sig mailing list -- typing-sig@python.org To unsubscribe send an email to typing-sig-leave@python.org https://mail.python.org/mailman3/lists/typing-sig.python.org/ Member address: guido@python.org
I also didn't vote in the poll. None of the options struck me as viable and sufficiently better than the status quo.
I'm still optimistic that we can come up with a solution. We just haven't found it yet. More exploration is needed.
I think we need to be careful not to over-constrain the problem. Limiting ourselves to just angular or square brackets may be too constraining given the other limitations imposed by the Python grammar. Most (all?) other programming languages clearly distinguish between type expressions and value expressions in their grammars. Python does not (for various historical reasons), and that leads to many challenges when adding type-related features. It creates a minefield of potential syntactic and semantic ambiguities. Angle brackets (less-than operators) are a good example of this.
-Eric
I think Eric's idea of curly braces is worth a close look before we reject it - curly braces handle the ambiguity caused by types being expressions *much* better. ulia uses it [1]; Julia's not a dominant language but it is widely used (largely by people who also use python!) and has syntax that feels pretty python-like, so I think it's a relevant success story for curly brackats.
I do think curly braces look weird at first but my guess is we'd get used to it quickly. I've never heard of it being a big barrier to new users in Julia, whereas I worry that a solution that applies inconsistently to statements vs expressions (like most of the options on the table) might be a permanent tax on users.
There are good arguments *against* curly brackets that didn't apply for Julia, but I'm not convinced by any of them: (1) Julia doesn't have curly-brace-based literals. But there's no ambiguity there since a name can never be directly followed by a literal expression in the existing syntax; I don't think this would be a big problem, especially if by convention there's never a space before the open `{` (2) it might be complicated to work out f-strings rules. I'm not sure about this - I don't entirely understand the *current* rules, because for example (a) f"{g({'a': 5})}" is okay (b) f"{{'a': 5}['a']}" produces `SyntaxError: f-string: single '}' is not allowed` but it seems to me that the current rules could probably be adapted to handle type expressions in roughly the same way
[1] https://docs.julialang.org/en/v1/manual/types/#man-parametric-composite-type...
I'm not sure that the example of Julia really serves as an argument for trying curly braces in Python. In Julia, you use curlies both in the class definition and in specializations (e.g. Point{Int}). In Python the latter is already spelled using square brackets (Point[int]). So to follow Julia's example we'd have to use the same brackets in class definitions.
And indeed I am not convinced yet that this is a bad plan at all. (However, I don't have a solution for generic type aliases.)
On Wed, Jun 1, 2022 at 9:29 PM Steven Troxler steven.troxler@gmail.com wrote:
I think Eric's idea of curly braces is worth a close look before we reject it - curly braces handle the ambiguity caused by types being expressions *much* better. ulia uses it [1]; Julia's not a dominant language but it is widely used (largely by people who also use python!) and has syntax that feels pretty python-like, so I think it's a relevant success story for curly brackats.
I do think curly braces look weird at first but my guess is we'd get used to it quickly. I've never heard of it being a big barrier to new users in Julia, whereas I worry that a solution that applies inconsistently to statements vs expressions (like most of the options on the table) might be a permanent tax on users.
There are good arguments *against* curly brackets that didn't apply for Julia, but I'm not convinced by any of them: (1) Julia doesn't have curly-brace-based literals. But there's no ambiguity there since a name can never be directly followed by a literal expression in the existing syntax; I don't think this would be a big problem, especially if by convention there's never a space before the open `{` (2) it might be complicated to work out f-strings rules. I'm not sure about this - I don't entirely understand the *current* rules, because for example (a) f"{g({'a': 5})}" is okay (b) f"{{'a': 5}['a']}" produces `SyntaxError: f-string: single '}' is not allowed` but it seems to me that the current rules could probably be adapted to handle type expressions in roughly the same way
[1] https://docs.julialang.org/en/v1/manual/types/#man-parametric-composite-type... _______________________________________________ Typing-sig mailing list -- typing-sig@python.org To unsubscribe send an email to typing-sig-leave@python.org https://mail.python.org/mailman3/lists/typing-sig.python.org/ Member address: guido@python.org
Hello all,
The next Typing Meetup will be on *Tuesday, June 28, 2022 at 10:00 am San Francisco time (UTC-7)* / 6:00 pm London time (UTC+1).
Zoom link: https://us02web.zoom.us/j/83547377939. The meeting will be automatically recorded from the time it starts.
(I tried creating a public Google Calendar event, in case you want to add it to your calendar: [1]. Not sure if it works :) )
Agenda: TypeVar syntax proposal, by Eric Traut
I'll share the recording and notes after the meetup. [2]
Best, Pradeep
[1]: https://calendar.google.com/event?action=TEMPLATE&tmeid=OXUzbXB2cnIxNzJr... [2]: Meeting recording and notes: https://docs.google.com/document/d/17iqV7WWvB0IwA43EPlIqlUS6Xuvk08X3sEudAA-g...
Reminder that the meetup is today: *Tuesday, June 28, 2022 at 10:00 am San Francisco time (UTC-7)* / 6:00 pm London time (UTC+1).
Zoom link: https://us02web.zoom.us/j/83547377939. The meeting will be automatically recorded from the time it starts.
Agenda: TypeVar syntax proposal, by Eric Traut
I'll share the recording and notes after the meetup. [1]
Thanks, Eric, for the talk and your work on the PEP!
As usual, the recording and slides are available in the running Typing Meetup notes doc: https://docs.google.com/document/d/17iqV7WWvB0IwA43EPlIqlUS6Xuvk08X3sEudAA-g...
For the meetup notes, see the draft PEP thread: https://mail.python.org/archives/list/typing-sig@python.org/thread/BB2BGYJY2...
On Tue, Jun 28, 2022 at 7:00 AM S Pradeep Kumar gohanpra@gmail.com wrote:
Reminder that the meetup is today: *Tuesday, June 28, 2022 at 10:00 am San Francisco time (UTC-7)* / 6:00 pm London time (UTC+1).
Zoom link: https://us02web.zoom.us/j/83547377939. The meeting will be automatically recorded from the time it starts.
Agenda: TypeVar syntax proposal, by Eric Traut
I'll share the recording and notes after the meetup. [1]
S Pradeep Kumar
[1]: Meeting recording and notes: https://docs.google.com/document/d/17iqV7WWvB0IwA43EPlIqlUS6Xuvk08X3sEudAA-g...
Hello all,
The next Typing Meetup will be on *Tuesday, August 09, 2022 at 10:00 am San Francisco time (UTC-7)* / 6:00 pm London time (UTC+1).
Zoom link: https://us02web.zoom.us/j/88114740159 [1]. The meeting will be automatically recorded from the time it starts.
Agenda: 1. Unions vs Algebraic Data Types in Enums, by David Hagen and John Hagen 2. Indicating Overridden Methods, by Steven Troxler and Joshua Xu -- Catching cases where the parent method is renamed but the child method isn't updated
I'll share the recording and notes after the meetup. [2] All are welcome, so feel free to just join the meeting.
Best, Pradeep
[1]: Public Google Calendar invite: https://calendar.google.com/event?action=TEMPLATE&tmeid=ODI0ZTUydmRxYmpp...
[2]: Meeting recording and notes: https://docs.google.com/document/d/17iqV7WWvB0IwA43EPlIqlUS6Xuvk08X3sEudAA-g...
Quick reminder that the next Typing Meetup will be on *Tuesday, August 09, 2022 at 10:00 am San Francisco time (UTC-7)* / 6:00 pm London time (UTC+1).
Zoom link: https://us02web.zoom.us/j/88114740159 [1]. The meeting will be automatically recorded from the time it starts.
Agenda: 1. Indicating Overridden Methods, by Steven Troxler and Joshua Xu -- Catching cases where the parent method is renamed but the child method isn't updated 2. Exhaustiveness-checking: Unions vs Enums + Classes, by David Hagen and John Hagen
I'll share the recording and notes after the meetup. [2] All are welcome, so feel free to just join the meeting.
Best, Pradeep
[1]: Public Google Calendar invite: https://calendar.google.com/event?action=TEMPLATE&tmeid=ODI0ZTUydmRxYmpp...
[2]: Meeting recording and notes: https://docs.google.com/document/d/17iqV7WWvB0IwA43EPlIqlUS6Xuvk08X3sEudAA-g...
Reminder that the Typing Meetup is *today at 10:00 am San Francisco time (UTC-7)* / 6:00 pm London time (UTC+1).
Zoom link: https://us02web.zoom.us/j/88114740159
Agenda: 1. Indicating Overridden Methods, by Steven Troxler and Joshua Xu -- Catching cases where the parent method is renamed but the child method isn't updated 2. Exhaustiveness-checking: Unions vs Enums + Classes, by David Hagen and John Hagen
On Fri, Aug 5, 2022 at 4:06 PM S Pradeep Kumar gohanpra@gmail.com wrote:
Quick reminder that the next Typing Meetup will be on *Tuesday, August 09, 2022 at 10:00 am San Francisco time (UTC-7)* / 6:00 pm London time (UTC+1).
Zoom link: https://us02web.zoom.us/j/88114740159 [1]. The meeting will be automatically recorded from the time it starts.
Agenda:
- Indicating Overridden Methods, by Steven Troxler and Joshua Xu --
Catching cases where the parent method is renamed but the child method isn't updated 2. Exhaustiveness-checking: Unions vs Enums + Classes, by David Hagen and John Hagen
I'll share the recording and notes after the meetup. [2] All are welcome, so feel free to just join the meeting.
Best, Pradeep
[1]: Public Google Calendar invite: https://calendar.google.com/event?action=TEMPLATE&tmeid=ODI0ZTUydmRxYmpp...
[2]: Meeting recording and notes: https://docs.google.com/document/d/17iqV7WWvB0IwA43EPlIqlUS6Xuvk08X3sEudAA-g... -- S Pradeep Kumar
Thanks to Joshua Xu, Steven Troxler, David Hagen, and John Hagen for presenting today!
The recording, slides, meeting notes, and chat transcript are in the running meetup notes doc: https://docs.google.com/document/d/17iqV7WWvB0IwA43EPlIqlUS6Xuvk08X3sEudAA-g...
If you'd like to continue the discussion on either presentation, please do so in the dedicated typing-sig threads: 1. @overrides: https://mail.python.org/archives/list/typing-sig@python.org/thread/V23I4D6DE... 2. Exhaustiveness-checking: https://mail.python.org/archives/list/typing-sig@python.org/thread/AKXUBJUUH...
Best, Pradeep
Hello all,
The next Typing Meetup will be on *Tuesday, September 13, 2022 at 10:00 am San Francisco time (UTC-7)* / 6:00 pm London time (UTC+1).
Zoom link: https://us02web.zoom.us/j/89598927123 [1]. The meeting will be automatically recorded from the time it starts.
Agenda: Next Steps for Static Analysis in attrs, Tin Tvrtković.
We will be looking at ways to bring more of attrs runtime features to the static analysis realm, and why it'd be useful, with a special focus on database libraries.
I'll share the recording and notes after the meetup. [2] All are welcome, so feel free to just join the meeting.
Best, Pradeep
[1]: Public Google Calendar invite: https://calendar.google.com/event?action=TEMPLATE&tmeid=NnM1b25ycnFhNGVk...
[2]: Meeting recording and notes: https://docs.google.com/document/d/17iqV7WWvB0IwA43EPlIqlUS6Xuvk08X3sEudAA-g...
Reminder that the meetup is *today at 10:00 am San Francisco time (UTC-7)* / 6:00 pm London time (UTC+1).
Zoom link: https://us02web.zoom.us/j/89598927123. The meeting will be automatically recorded from the time it starts.
Agenda: Next Steps for Static Analysis in attrs, Tin Tvrtković.
We will be looking at ways to project and select fields from ORM/ODM classes in a type-safe manner.
On Thu, Sep 8, 2022 at 10:47 AM S Pradeep Kumar gohanpra@gmail.com wrote:
Hello all,
The next Typing Meetup will be on *Tuesday, September 13, 2022 at 10:00 am San Francisco time (UTC-7)* / 6:00 pm London time (UTC+1).
Zoom link: https://us02web.zoom.us/j/89598927123 [1]. The meeting will be automatically recorded from the time it starts.
Agenda: Next Steps for Static Analysis in attrs, Tin Tvrtković.
We will be looking at ways to bring more of attrs runtime features to the static analysis realm, and why it'd be useful, with a special focus on database libraries.
I'll share the recording and notes after the meetup. [2] All are welcome, so feel free to just join the meeting.
Best, Pradeep
[1]: Public Google Calendar invite: https://calendar.google.com/event?action=TEMPLATE&tmeid=NnM1b25ycnFhNGVk...
[2]: Meeting recording and notes: https://docs.google.com/document/d/17iqV7WWvB0IwA43EPlIqlUS6Xuvk08X3sEudAA-g...
Thanks to Tin for presenting today!
The recording, slides, meeting notes, and chat transcript are in the running meetup notes doc: https://docs.google.com/document/d/17iqV7WWvB0IwA43EPlIqlUS6Xuvk08X3sEudAA-g...
Notes:
-
Tin talked about the problem of querying and selecting fields from an ORM/ODM class in a type-safe manner. -
Querying/Projection: The `find` function needs to return a tuple of types based on the tuple of arguments passed to it. This is something that can be addressed by the `Map` operator (proposed as a followup to PEP 646 - Variadic generics). -
Selection: If the user specifies a filter such as `id == 1`, we would like to type check that the `id` field is of type `int` (see slide 21). Doing this could be hard for an arbitrary number of fields with arbitrary filtering operations. There was no good consensus on this during the meetup. -
Slightly related: Can ClassVars wrap a TypeVar T? Mypy forbids it, whereas Pyre allows it. Afaik this is not addressed in the specification, so we probably want to standardize it.
Best, Pradeep
Slides: https://drive.google.com/file/d/1_7M6SCqx5ywXoiWCy57W6rgeWV1P2wei/view?usp=s...
* Can ClassVars wrap a TypeVar T? Mypy forbids it, whereas Pyre allows it. Afaik this is not addressed in the specification, so we probably want to standardize it.
PEP 526 [1] says, "a ClassVar parameter cannot include any type variables, regardless of the level of nesting: ClassVar[T] and ClassVar[List[Set[T]]] are both invalid if T is a type variable."
This language was introduced by peps PR 254 [2].
PR 239 [3] and mypy issue 2878 [4] have more context.
-Erik
[1] https://peps.python.org/pep-0526/#class-and-instance-variable-annotations [2] https://github.com/python/peps/pull/254 [3] https://github.com/python/peps/pull/239 [4] https://github.com/python/mypy/issues/2878
Hello all,
We'll skip the typing meetup this month, since there has not been much activity on the mailing list (and I'm a little busy :) ).
If you'd like to propose a talk for the next meetup, shoot me an email.
Best,
On Tue, Sep 13, 2022, 10:24 PM S Pradeep Kumar gohanpra@gmail.com wrote:
Thanks to Tin for presenting today!
The recording, slides, meeting notes, and chat transcript are in the running meetup notes doc: https://docs.google.com/document/d/17iqV7WWvB0IwA43EPlIqlUS6Xuvk08X3sEudAA-g...
Notes:
Tin talked about the problem of querying and selecting fields from an ORM/ODM class in a type-safe manner.
Querying/Projection: The `find` function needs to return a tuple of types based on the tuple of arguments passed to it. This is something that can be addressed by the `Map` operator (proposed as a followup to PEP 646 - Variadic generics).
Selection: If the user specifies a filter such as `id == 1`, we would like to type check that the `id` field is of type `int` (see slide 21). Doing this could be hard for an arbitrary number of fields with arbitrary filtering operations. There was no good consensus on this during the meetup.
Slightly related: Can ClassVars wrap a TypeVar T? Mypy forbids it, whereas Pyre allows it. Afaik this is not addressed in the specification, so we probably want to standardize it.
Best, Pradeep
Slides: https://drive.google.com/file/d/1_7M6SCqx5ywXoiWCy57W6rgeWV1P2wei/view?usp=s...
Hello all,
The next Typing Meetup will be on Tuesday, November 15, 10 am* San Francisco time (UTC-8)* / 6:00 pm London time (UTC).
Zoom link: https://us02web.zoom.us/j/89193699423 [1]. The meeting will be automatically recorded from the time it starts.
Agenda:
- Jelle Zijlstra, Typing support for @deprecated and @typing_error
I'll share the recording and notes after the meetup. [2] All are welcome, so feel free to just join the meeting.
Best, Pradeep
[1]: Public Google Calendar invite: https://calendar.google.com/calendar/event?action=TEMPLATE&tmeid=azlkb3A... [2]: https://docs.google.com/document/d/17iqV7WWvB0IwA43EPlIqlUS6Xuvk08X3sEudAA-g...
Quick reminder that the Typing Meetup is today (in half an hour): 10 am* San Francisco time (UTC-8)* / 6:00 pm London time (UTC).
Zoom link: https://us02web.zoom.us/j/89193699423 [1]. The meeting will be automatically recorded from the time it starts.
Agenda:
- Jelle Zijlstra, Typing support for @deprecated and @typing_error
I'll share the recording and notes after the meetup. [2] All are welcome, so feel free to just join the meeting.
[1]: Public Google Calendar invite: https://calendar.google.com/calendar/event?action=TEMPLATE&tmeid=azlkb3A... [2]: https://docs.google.com/document/d/17iqV7WWvB0IwA43EPlIqlUS6Xuvk08X3sEudAA-g...
Thanks to Jelle for presenting today!
The recording, slides, meeting notes, and chat transcript are in the running meetup notes doc: https://docs.google.com/document/d/17iqV7WWvB0IwA43EPlIqlUS6Xuvk08X3sEudAA-g...
Notes:
-
@deprecated: Jelle proposed a decorator that allows functions (and overloads?) to be considered deprecated. The type checker should report the error message mentioned in the decorator argument. -
Example:
@deprecated("Use inspect.signature instead")
def getargspec() -> None: ...
-
The overall feedback was positive.
-
@typing_error: Jelle also proposed making certain combinations of parameter types to be deprecated -
Example:
@typing_error("Using pow() with a mod of 0 will throw a runtime error")
def pow(base: int, exp: int, mod: Literal[0]) -> Never: …
-
Feedback from the audience: The above overload doesn’t help prevent pow(x, y, 1 - 1) since that won’t match the above overload. Other examples are needed to motivate this feature. -
PyCon Typing Summit 2023: We decided to have another summit at PyCon, given that the last one was well-received and the 2023 proposal deadline is coming up. Jelle and Pradeep agreed to co-organize the event. We will probably reach out to speakers early next year.
If you're interested in presenting next time, shoot me an email.
Best, Pradeep
Jelle's slides: https://docs.google.com/presentation/d/1yzAh1Tok_wIk3lYo3rq1ieQp8MciVzO7pWI_...
On Tue, Nov 15, 2022 at 9:29 AM S Pradeep Kumar gohanpra@gmail.com wrote:
Quick reminder that the Typing Meetup is today (in half an hour): 10 am* San Francisco time (UTC-8)* / 6:00 pm London time (UTC).
Zoom link: https://us02web.zoom.us/j/89193699423 [1]. The meeting will be automatically recorded from the time it starts.
Agenda:
- Jelle Zijlstra, Typing support for @deprecated and @typing_error
I'll share the recording and notes after the meetup. [2] All are welcome, so feel free to just join the meeting.
[1]: Public Google Calendar invite: https://calendar.google.com/calendar/event?action=TEMPLATE&tmeid=azlkb3A... [2]: https://docs.google.com/document/d/17iqV7WWvB0IwA43EPlIqlUS6Xuvk08X3sEudAA-g...
-- S Pradeep Kumar
participants (8)
-
Eric Traut -
Erik De Bonte -
Erik De Bonte
-
Guido van Rossum -
Martin DeMello -
Patrick Arminio -
S Pradeep Kumar -
Steven Troxler