From DennisR at dair.com  Fri Nov  3 06:03:25 2006
From: DennisR at dair.com (Dennis Reinhardt)
Date: Thu, 02 Nov 2006 21:03:25 -0800
Subject: [Baypiggies] {BayPiggies] Nov. 9 Meeting Air Traffic Control
Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.0.20061102210221.00c25630@localhost>

Thursday Nov. 9, 2006

7:30-8:50 p.m.   Technical Program
------------------------------------
Title          Python for Prototyping in Air Traffic Control
Presenter      Russ Paielli (NASA Ames Research)
About the talk The talk will start with a high-level overview of the US air 
traffic control system, then it will focus on tactical (i.e., short range) 
conflict alerting and describe the prototype software that we are 
developing to replace the legacy software that currently performs that 
function. Examples of actual "operational errors" will be presented, and 
the alerting performance of our system will be tested and compared with the 
legacy system. The rationale for using Python for the prototype and its 
testing will be briefly discussed.


8:50 p.m-...    Mapping and Random Access
------------------------------------------
Mapping Moderator  Dennis Reinhardt (DAIR Computer Systems)
Mapping is a rapid-fire audience announcement open to all of topic headings 
(one speaker at a time). Random Access session (everyone breaks up into 
self-organized small-group discussion) follows immediately after Mapping.
----------------------------------
| Dennis    | DennisR at dair.com   |
| Reinhardt | http://WinAjax.com |
----------------------------------


From donnamsnow at gmail.com  Sat Nov  4 02:20:56 2006
From: donnamsnow at gmail.com (Donna M. Snow)
Date: Fri, 03 Nov 2006 17:20:56 -0800
Subject: [Baypiggies] OT: Upcoming Plone Course (A strong recommendation for
 those interested in Plone)
Message-ID: <454BEAF8.2070404@gmail.com>

Hi,

As you all know I attended (and was a guest speaker) at the Plone 
Conference in Seattle, Washington last week. As part of my activities 
there I attended a 2 day session on Plone skinning (theming of Plone 
sites) taught by Joel Burton. I also went to his 'Plone Caching' and 
'Building a Humane CMS' sessions.

I have been working with Plone sites since 2001 and had heard great 
things about Joel's courses. I've always wanted to take one of his 
sessions and I got the opportunity prior to the start of the conference.

The training session was even better than I imagined! (and I was really 
excited to be attending one of Joel's sessions).

Although I'm pretty darned knowledgeable about Plone and it's inner 
workings (Zope) I walked away with so much more in my toolbelt and 
Joel's teaching style is fantastic.

For those of you who have expressed interest in Plone or have downloaded 
with and played with Plone since my presentation in September..I'd like 
to encourage you to take one of his courses! If your organization is 
considering Plone (or already implemented it and need a little boost) 
his sessions are great.

If you'd like to learn more

 http://plonebootcamps.com/courses/sf2

The next session is December 4th - 8th. If you've been thinking about taking the training..this is an excellent opportunity! 

(I receive nothing for posting this recommendation other than the knowledge that someone else will learn Plone and share the love)

Best Regards,
Donna M. Snow, Owner
C Squared Technologies
illuminate your web
http://www.csquaredtech.com

From cappy2112 at gmail.com  Sun Nov  5 07:38:59 2006
From: cappy2112 at gmail.com (Tony Cappellini)
Date: Sat, 4 Nov 2006 22:38:59 -0800
Subject: [Baypiggies] Looking for Arien Malec
Message-ID: <8249c4ac0611042238y4145b5aajb1f486326eec002d@mail.gmail.com>

Sorry for the OT- does anyone know Arien Malec?
If so please have hime email me directly.

thanks


Tony
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From cbc at unc.edu  Mon Nov  6 17:28:43 2006
From: cbc at unc.edu (Chris Calloway)
Date: Mon, 06 Nov 2006 11:28:43 -0500
Subject: [Baypiggies] OT: Upcoming Plone Course (A strong recommendation
 for those interested in Plone)
In-Reply-To: <454BEAF8.2070404@gmail.com>
References: <454BEAF8.2070404@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <454F62BB.50103@unc.edu>

Donna M. Snow wrote:
> The training session was even better than I imagined! (and I was really 
> excited to be attending one of Joel's sessions).
 >
 > http://plonebootcamps.com/courses/sf2

<sister user group delurk mode>

My Python user group hosted Joel's Plone Boot Camps twice and I've got 
to say, it was the most awesome technical training ever, and was 
probably the best thing my user group ever did. We're definitely going 
to do it again next year:

http://trizpug.org/boot-camp/pbc2/
http://trizpug.org/boot-camp/pbc1/

</sister user group delurk mode>

Also, I thought I was going to have occasion to meet Donna Snow at 
PloneCon and regret I was so busy all week that I didn't get to meet 
everyone I'd hoped to.

-- 
Sincerely,

Chris Calloway
http://www.seacoos.org
office: 332 Chapman Hall   phone: (919) 962-4323
mail: Campus Box #3300, UNC-CH, Chapel Hill, NC 27599





From lhawthorn at google.com  Mon Nov  6 20:35:39 2006
From: lhawthorn at google.com (Leslie Hawthorn)
Date: Mon, 6 Nov 2006 11:35:39 -0800
Subject: [Baypiggies] Please Register for November 9th Meeting
Message-ID: <4869cee70611061135j7bc48180v7a1b00e93eca532f@mail.gmail.com>

Hello,

If you'll be attending the November 9th Baypiggies meeting, please don't
forget to register on the wiki by 3:00 PM on Wednesday, 11/8:
http://wiki.python.org/moin/BayPiggiesGoogleMeetings

If you're unable to register on the wiki before the deadline, please plan to
sign it at reception upon arrival.

Cheers,
LH

-- 
Leslie Hawthorn
Open Source Program Office
Google Inc.
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From carl at personnelware.com  Mon Nov  6 22:04:38 2006
From: carl at personnelware.com (Carl Karsten)
Date: Mon, 06 Nov 2006 15:04:38 -0600
Subject: [Baypiggies] google in chicago
Message-ID: <454FA366.9090705@personnelware.com>

I am in Chicago.  the Chicago Python group needs a place to meet.  there is a 
Google office in Chicago, right?   Anyone know what it would take to meet there?

To make things more fun: I am also a member of the VFP group, and this month we 
are bringing in a speaker to tell us about Dabo, which is more python than VFP. 
  So the Python group wants to join us.  So now we may have 30 people in a room 
that seats 15.  Nov 14, in the evening - 5:30 till we get kicked out - normally 
8 to 9. http://chipy.org/EdOnDabo

Carl K

From mrbmahoney at gmail.com  Mon Nov  6 23:46:22 2006
From: mrbmahoney at gmail.com (Brian Mahoney)
Date: Mon, 6 Nov 2006 14:46:22 -0800
Subject: [Baypiggies] Dinner Announcement - Thursday, Nov 9, 6 pm
Message-ID: <5538c19b0611061446g7907cc3cpcf47e34e188d110c@mail.gmail.com>

For Thursday, Nov 9, I can coordinate a pre-meeting
dinner in Mountain View, before the BayPIGgies meeting
at Google .

Restaurant RVSPs may be sent to my email until
Thursday afternoon (earlier is better). We eat family-style,
there are vegetarian and non-vegetarian dishes.  Cost around
$10 per person, including tax and tip. Bring cash, please.

Start dinner at 6pm and I will keep things moving so that we
finish and get everyone headed towards Google to
complete sign-in before the 7:30 meeting start.

The restaurant is Cafe Yulong in downtown Mountain View
(650) 960-1677
743 W Dana Street, 1/2 block from Castro where
Books, Inc is on the corner.
Parking lots all around, but downtown Mountain View
parking is still difficult.

It is a slightly out of the ordinary Chinese
restaurant.  This link has a downtown map and
additional information.
http://www.mountainviewca.net/restaurants/cafeyulong.html

I've made reservations under "Python" for 6pm
Thursday.

If you wish to join us for dinner please e-mail me
by 3 pm Thursday (earlier is better) so I may confirm
the headcount.

From ecarrera at lightforge.com  Thu Nov  9 12:50:57 2006
From: ecarrera at lightforge.com (Ero Carrera)
Date: Thu, 9 Nov 2006 12:50:57 +0100
Subject: [Baypiggies] Python + Mathematica = Pythonika
Message-ID: <0C4FEA7D-C162-4A68-B1B7-AE7DDDD66143@lightforge.com>


Hi guys,


I hope this will be of interest to some members of the list.

I have just released a free MathLink module for Mathematica that  
makes it possible to write (and run) Python code within Mathematica's  
notebooks. It handles the conversion of Python and Mathematica  
objects transparently and allows to use all of Python's modules in  
the machine (Mathematica, Numarray, NetworkX, etc. all at once :-P ).

I find the mix of Mathematica's interactivity with Python to be a  
really good combination.

Pythonika is available at:

http://dkbza.org/pythonika.html

(an example notebook is available on the previous link as well as in  
the downloaded package)


Entry in the Wolfram Information Center:

http://library.wolfram.com/infocenter/MathSource/6622/


The download includes source code and binaries for OSX/Windows/Linux.


Regards,


--
Ero Carrera


From aahz at pythoncraft.com  Thu Nov  9 15:12:29 2006
From: aahz at pythoncraft.com (Aahz)
Date: Thu, 9 Nov 2006 06:12:29 -0800
Subject: [Baypiggies] Python + Mathematica = Pythonika
In-Reply-To: <0C4FEA7D-C162-4A68-B1B7-AE7DDDD66143@lightforge.com>
References: <0C4FEA7D-C162-4A68-B1B7-AE7DDDD66143@lightforge.com>
Message-ID: <20061109141229.GA21800@panix.com>

On Thu, Nov 09, 2006, Ero Carrera wrote:
> 
> I hope this will be of interest to some members of the list.

Well, you'll get more interest posting your announcement to
comp.lang.python.announce (also available as python-announce at python.org).

I also strongly recommend that you make this a distutils package and
upload an entry to the Cheeseshop.
-- 
Aahz (aahz at pythoncraft.com)           <*>         http://www.pythoncraft.com/

"In many ways, it's a dull language, borrowing solid old concepts from
many other languages & styles:  boring syntax, unsurprising semantics,
few automatic coercions, etc etc.  But that's one of the things I like
about it."  --Tim Peters on Python, 16 Sep 1993

From aahz at pythoncraft.com  Thu Nov  9 19:34:34 2006
From: aahz at pythoncraft.com (Aahz)
Date: Thu, 9 Nov 2006 10:34:34 -0800
Subject: [Baypiggies] Job: customer-focused web developer
Message-ID: <20061109183434.GA9315@panix.com>

My company is looking for a Python programmer with experience in web
development who is comfortable in a customer-facing position.  You'll
need to be a generalist; at minimum, you'll be doing tech support, QA,
documentation, hand-written HTML, SQL, and sysadmin in addition to
Python programming.  We're busy, but we don't do death marches.  Our
servers are all Red Hat and our workstations are all Macs.  For more
info and to apply, see:

http://jobs.pagedna.com/index.cfm
-- 
Aahz (aahz at pythoncraft.com)           <*>         http://www.pythoncraft.com/

"In many ways, it's a dull language, borrowing solid old concepts from
many other languages & styles:  boring syntax, unsurprising semantics,
few automatic coercions, etc etc.  But that's one of the things I like
about it."  --Tim Peters on Python, 16 Sep 1993

From DennisR at dair.com  Fri Nov 10 23:44:44 2006
From: DennisR at dair.com (Dennis Reinhardt)
Date: Fri, 10 Nov 2006 14:44:44 -0800
Subject: [Baypiggies] Site hiccups
Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.0.20061110144225.00bf14a8@localhost>

I am in the process of transferring the registrar for BayPiggies.net to a 
new registrar.  So, if there are a few hiccups in the next few days, I 
already probably know about it and am working on a resolution.  ... and if 
all goes smoothly, well, there is always a first time for everything.

Dennis
  ---------------------------------
| Dennis    | DennisR at dair.com    |
| Reinhardt | http://www.dair.com |
  ---------------------------------


From donnamsnow at gmail.com  Fri Nov 10 23:49:56 2006
From: donnamsnow at gmail.com (Donna M. Snow)
Date: Fri, 10 Nov 2006 14:49:56 -0800
Subject: [Baypiggies] Site hiccups
In-Reply-To: <5.1.0.14.0.20061110144225.00bf14a8@localhost>
References: <5.1.0.14.0.20061110144225.00bf14a8@localhost>
Message-ID: <45550214.1030603@gmail.com>

We have a site in progress at baypiggies.net/zope/pr .. will that be 
accounted for?

Best Regards,
Donna M. Snow, Owner
C Squared Technologies
illuminate your web
http://www.csquaredtech.com

From DennisR at dair.com  Sat Nov 11 00:02:30 2006
From: DennisR at dair.com (Dennis Reinhardt)
Date: Fri, 10 Nov 2006 15:02:30 -0800
Subject: [Baypiggies] Site hiccups
In-Reply-To: <45550214.1030603@gmail.com>
References: <5.1.0.14.0.20061110144225.00bf14a8@localhost>
	<5.1.0.14.0.20061110144225.00bf14a8@localhost>
Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.0.20061110145435.00bf2808@localhost>

At 02:49 PM 11/10/2006, Donna M. Snow wrote:
>We have a site in progress at baypiggies.net/zope/pr .. will that be 
>accounted for?

Yes.

I used "site" in the subject to refer to the baypiggies.net domain 
name.  Specifically, I am registering that baypiggies.net=161.58.238.46.

Is this worth $30/year?  No, not when I am paying for it.  So, I am 
transferring to a registrar who charges $10/year.

This is a DNS registrar change only. Insofar as the IP address is not 
changing, there might be no observable changes.

Dennis

  ---------------------------------
| Dennis    | DennisR at dair.com    |
| Reinhardt | http://www.dair.com |
  ---------------------------------


From marilyn at deliberate.com  Sat Nov 11 05:52:56 2006
From: marilyn at deliberate.com (Marilyn Davis)
Date: Fri, 10 Nov 2006 20:52:56 -0800
Subject: [Baypiggies] Next  IDE demo night
Message-ID: <20061111045259.31B221E4004@bag.python.org>

Hi Python Enthusiasts,

Dennis tells me that we will have 50 minutes to spare in the December meeting and that we can use it for IDE demos if we like.

>From old mail, I think that this was our last list of volunteers:
 
 PythonWin  -- Tony C.
 Komodo -- Ken Seehart
 SPE
 PyDev -- Steve Hindle 

Tony, Ken, and Steve, are you willing for Dec?  15 minutes each fills up the time.

Marilyn






From cappy2112 at gmail.com  Sat Nov 11 06:29:12 2006
From: cappy2112 at gmail.com (Tony Cappellini)
Date: Fri, 10 Nov 2006 21:29:12 -0800
Subject: [Baypiggies] Next IDE demo night
In-Reply-To: <20061111045259.31B221E4004@bag.python.org>
References: <20061111045259.31B221E4004@bag.python.org>
Message-ID: <8249c4ac0611102129u43b63ddcxe4b4a358c794b0f1@mail.gmail.com>

AS of now- yes

On 11/10/06, Marilyn Davis <marilyn at deliberate.com> wrote:
>
> Hi Python Enthusiasts,
>
> Dennis tells me that we will have 50 minutes to spare in the December
> meeting and that we can use it for IDE demos if we like.
>
> >From old mail, I think that this was our last list of volunteers:
>
> PythonWin  -- Tony C.
> Komodo -- Ken Seehart
> SPE
> PyDev -- Steve Hindle
>
> Tony, Ken, and Steve, are you willing for Dec?  15 minutes each fills up
> the time.
>
> Marilyn
>
>
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Baypiggies mailing list
> Baypiggies at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/baypiggies
>
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From cappy2112 at gmail.com  Sat Nov 11 07:19:00 2006
From: cappy2112 at gmail.com (Tony Cappellini)
Date: Fri, 10 Nov 2006 22:19:00 -0800
Subject: [Baypiggies] Volunteer needed to write a book review of Core
	Python:Second Edition
Message-ID: <8249c4ac0611102219h2cffcafr3756d19d55021e6a@mail.gmail.com>

Hello Everyone,


Prentice Hall has allowed us to be a partner of their Users Group program,
and as such they have a wealth of books available for review
<http://www.phptr.com/bookstore/browse.asp?b=newrelease&rl=1>.
Please contact me off-list if you are interested in reviewing any of their
books. You will get to keep the book, if you successfully complete the
review.


Prentice Hall have also been gracious enough to give BayPiggies a review
copy of Wesley Chun's   Core Python
Programming".<http://www.phptr.com/bookstore/product.asp?isbn=0132269937&rl=1>
As such, I need a volunteer to review this book. The review eventually will
appear on the BayPiggies website, with the rest of the book reviews.


Contact me off-list if you are interested in writing a review for the
BayPiggies website.

Thanks


Tony
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From cappy2112 at gmail.com  Sat Nov 11 07:24:37 2006
From: cappy2112 at gmail.com (Tony Cappellini)
Date: Fri, 10 Nov 2006 22:24:37 -0800
Subject: [Baypiggies] Volunteer needed to Review Programming Python,
	Third Edition
Message-ID: <8249c4ac0611102224x1cf3e8a2r419e6ca7c97cc086@mail.gmail.com>

Hello Again,


For those of you who received a free copy of Programming Python, Third
Edition at the Sept 2006 meeting of BayPiggies,
I would like to ask one (at least) of you lucky individuals to write a
review for O'reilly. This review will be posted on the BayPiggies website.

Please contact me off-list for details.
Again, this email applies only to those people mentioned above.


Thanks


Tony
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From mech422 at gmail.com  Sat Nov 11 21:06:41 2006
From: mech422 at gmail.com (Steve Hindle)
Date: Sat, 11 Nov 2006 13:06:41 -0700
Subject: [Baypiggies] Next IDE demo night
In-Reply-To: <20061111045259.31B221E4004@bag.python.org>
References: <20061111045259.31B221E4004@bag.python.org>
Message-ID: <9a0545880611111206g54cee6bal7c0e1fe7dba5c71d@mail.gmail.com>

On 11/10/06, Marilyn Davis <marilyn at deliberate.com> wrote:
>
>  PyDev -- Steve Hindle
>

I think I'm going to have to pass :-(  With everything going on right
now, I'm not even sure I'll be able to make Dec. meeting :-(

Steve

From lavendula6654 at yahoo.com  Sun Nov 12 00:56:01 2006
From: lavendula6654 at yahoo.com (Elaine)
Date: Sat, 11 Nov 2006 15:56:01 -0800 (PST)
Subject: [Baypiggies] Critique student projects at Foothill College?
Message-ID: <228110.4550.qm@web31703.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

I am teaching an introductory Python class on Monday
evenings at Foothill College in Los Altos Hills, CA.
The students are working in groups on a "real world"
project, and they will be presenting their solutions
to the class. I am looking for someone who uses Python
professionally to come to the class, watch the
presentations, and give a critique of the students'
solutions to the class.

If you are interested, I can give you more information
about the class, the project, a parking permit and a
map that shows where the class meets. You can choose
from the following evenings, and it should take about
an hour of your time.

Monday, 20 November, 6pm     ~or~
Monday, 27 November, 6pm    ~or~
Monday, 4 December, 6pm    

Thanks for considering this!

-Elaine Haight
haightElaine at foothill.edu


 
____________________________________________________________________________________
Want to start your own business?
Learn how on Yahoo! Small Business.
http://smallbusiness.yahoo.com/r-index

From marilyn at deliberate.com  Tue Nov 14 02:12:14 2006
From: marilyn at deliberate.com (Marilyn Davis)
Date: Mon, 13 Nov 2006 17:12:14 -0800
Subject: [Baypiggies] 3-D graphics?
Message-ID: <20061114011217.71A161E4008@bag.python.org>

Hi Fellow Python Enthusiasts,

I want to make a simple 3-D image, just some donuts and pyramids linked up and arranged here and there, sort of.

There seems to be a lot of graphics packages.  Does anyone have any recommendations?  I don't need animation, just a projection of some simple stuff that's arranged in 3 dimensions.  And linux is my preferred os, although I can drag myself around on a windows box if the best tool only exists there.

Any help would be very much appreciated.

Marilyn Davis



From ds-bp at sidorof.com  Tue Nov 14 02:27:46 2006
From: ds-bp at sidorof.com (DS)
Date: Mon, 13 Nov 2006 17:27:46 -0800
Subject: [Baypiggies] 3-D graphics?
In-Reply-To: <20061114011217.71A161E4008@bag.python.org>
References: <20061114011217.71A161E4008@bag.python.org>
Message-ID: <45591B92.705@sidorof.com>

Assuming you are not talking about doing it using a python library, if
you use KDE there is Kpovmodeler, which would handle that nicely.

DS


Marilyn Davis wrote:

>Hi Fellow Python Enthusiasts,
>
>I want to make a simple 3-D image, just some donuts and pyramids linked up and arranged here and there, sort of.
>
>There seems to be a lot of graphics packages.  Does anyone have any recommendations?  I don't need animation, just a projection of some simple stuff that's arranged in 3 dimensions.  And linux is my preferred os, although I can drag myself around on a windows box if the best tool only exists there.
>
>Any help would be very much appreciated.
>
>Marilyn Davis
>
>
>_______________________________________________
>Baypiggies mailing list
>Baypiggies at python.org
>http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/baypiggies
>  
>


From spmcinerney at hotmail.com  Tue Nov 14 02:52:47 2006
From: spmcinerney at hotmail.com (Stephen McInerney)
Date: Mon, 13 Nov 2006 17:52:47 -0800
Subject: [Baypiggies] 3-D graphics?
In-Reply-To: <20061114011217.71A161E4008@bag.python.org>
Message-ID: <BAY128-F398FD956ECE0FCA2DAE171A0EB0@phx.gbl>


Visual Python handles the geometry, rendering, lighting and camera
- all you need to do is instantiate a few primitives. Very fast learn curve.
Has inbuilt (Gtk-based?) renderer.
vypthon.org (no leading "www.")
Supports all platforms.

Power users might use VTK 5.0 or wxPython 2.6.x instead.

(For Windows only), - Enthought Python ("Enthon") supplies a 
batteries-are-included
distribution of Python including SciPy, Scientific,NumPy, VTK 5.0, wxPython 
2.6.x + more
http://code.enthought.com/enthon/

Regards,
Stephen


>From: Marilyn Davis <marilyn at deliberate.com>
>To: baypiggies at python.org
>Subject: [Baypiggies] 3-D graphics?
>Date: Mon, 13 Nov 2006 17:12:14 -0800
>
>Hi Fellow Python Enthusiasts,
>
>I want to make a simple 3-D image, just some donuts and pyramids linked up 
>and arranged here and there, sort of.
>
>There seems to be a lot of graphics packages.  Does anyone have any 
>recommendations?  I don't need animation, just a projection of some simple 
>stuff that's arranged in 3 dimensions.  And linux is my preferred os, 
>although I can drag myself around on a windows box if the best tool only 
>exists there.
>
>Any help would be very much appreciated.
>
>Marilyn Davis
>
>
>_______________________________________________
>Baypiggies mailing list
>Baypiggies at python.org
>http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/baypiggies

_________________________________________________________________
Get today's hot entertainment gossip  
http://movies.msn.com/movies/hotgossip?icid=T002MSN03A07001


From dan+baypiggies at danimal.org  Tue Nov 14 03:04:17 2006
From: dan+baypiggies at danimal.org (Dan Weeks)
Date: Mon, 13 Nov 2006 18:04:17 -0800
Subject: [Baypiggies] 3-D graphics?
Message-ID: <20061114020415.GR3322@danimal.org>

using the subscribed email addy help....durrr.

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Subject: Re: [Baypiggies] 3-D graphics?
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From jjinux at gmail.com  Tue Nov 14 04:02:01 2006
From: jjinux at gmail.com (Shannon -jj Behrens)
Date: Mon, 13 Nov 2006 19:02:01 -0800
Subject: [Baypiggies] 3-D graphics?
In-Reply-To: <20061114020415.GR3322@danimal.org>
References: <20061114020415.GR3322@danimal.org>
Message-ID: <c41f67b90611131902yb0153cbwb5077bc5d52e63c7@mail.gmail.com>

It might be fun to do it inside SecondLife.

-jj

On 11/13/06, Dan Weeks <dan+baypiggies at danimal.org> wrote:
> using the subscribed email addy help....durrr.
>
>
>
>
> ---------- Forwarded message ----------
> From: Dan Weeks <dan at danimal.org>
> To: Marilyn Davis <marilyn at deliberate.com>
> Date: Mon, 13 Nov 2006 17:18:41 -0800
> Subject: Re: [Baypiggies] 3-D graphics?
> On 2006-11-13 17:12:14 -0800, Marilyn Davis threw down some bits like this:
> > Hi Fellow Python Enthusiasts,
> >
> > I want to make a simple 3-D image, just some donuts and pyramids linked up and arranged here and there, sort of.
> >
> > There seems to be a lot of graphics packages.  Does anyone have any recommendations?  I don't need animation, just a projection of some simple stuff that's arranged in 3 dimensions.  And linux is my preferred os, although I can drag myself around on a windows box if the best tool only exists there.
> >
> > Any help would be very much appreciated.
>
> If you're not trying to make stereo images (or, even if you are) check
> out Blender 3D.
>
> http://www.blender.org/
>
> I can't vouch for it as I haven't used it in a while, but I hear good
> things.
>
> Dan
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Baypiggies mailing list
> Baypiggies at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/baypiggies
>
>
>


-- 
http://jjinux.blogspot.com/

From mrbmahoney at gmail.com  Tue Nov 14 08:54:11 2006
From: mrbmahoney at gmail.com (Brian Mahoney)
Date: Mon, 13 Nov 2006 23:54:11 -0800
Subject: [Baypiggies] 3-D graphics?
In-Reply-To: <20061114011217.71A161E4008@bag.python.org>
References: <20061114011217.71A161E4008@bag.python.org>
Message-ID: <5538c19b0611132354m31056bd3o1a588003f35536fc@mail.gmail.com>

Google SketchUp runs on Windows and Mac.  Help gives directions
for creating a pyramid and a donut. You could draw something in a
few minutes. The image can be exported as bmp, jpeg, tif, or png.
It is really, really, easy.

http://sketchup.google.com/index.html

From cappy2112 at gmail.com  Tue Nov 14 08:46:48 2006
From: cappy2112 at gmail.com (Tony Cappellini)
Date: Mon, 13 Nov 2006 23:46:48 -0800
Subject: [Baypiggies] 40% Discount Coupon from Prentice Hall for Core Python
	Programming, 2nd Edition
Message-ID: <8249c4ac0611132346n45d6fd71v7920b1d69dcdb324@mail.gmail.com>

Hello Everyone,


In addition to Prentice Hall giving us a review copy of Wesley Chun's Core
Python Programming, 2nd
Edition<http://www.phptr.com/bookstore/product.asp?isbn=0132269937&rl=1>:
they have also
given BayPIGgies a coupon for a 40% discount towards the purchase price of
this new book.

***NOTE***
This is a special promotion from the publisher. The author has no
involvement with this promotion.
If you have any problems with this coupon, please contact me off list, and I
will contact the Publisher's liaison


Please use this link to download the coupon, and follow the directions on
the coupon.
http://www.baypiggies.net/zope/pr/user-group-association-program/40-discount-for-core-python-programming

If you have any problems with the link, please contact me off list.


Thanks


Tony
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From mac at Wireless.Com  Tue Nov 14 10:05:42 2006
From: mac at Wireless.Com (Mike Cheponis)
Date: Tue, 14 Nov 2006 01:05:42 -0800 (PST)
Subject: [Baypiggies] 40% Discount Coupon from Prentice Hall for Core
 Python Programming, 2nd Edition
In-Reply-To: <8249c4ac0611132346n45d6fd71v7920b1d69dcdb324@mail.gmail.com>
References: <8249c4ac0611132346n45d6fd71v7920b1d69dcdb324@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <Pine.NEB.4.64.0611140103130.3018@S.culver.net>

Just wanted to mention that if you buy this book from Amazon, with the free shipping and no tax to CA, it will cost you $32.99

Using the offer, below, ends up costing you $34.11 when tax is added, even when choosing the free ground shipping.

-Mike



On Mon, 13 Nov 2006, Tony Cappellini wrote:

> Date: Mon, 13 Nov 2006 23:46:48 -0800
> From: Tony Cappellini <cappy2112 at gmail.com>
> To: Python <baypiggies at python.org>
> Subject: [Baypiggies] 40% Discount Coupon from Prentice Hall for Core Python
>     Programming, 2nd Edition
> 
> Hello Everyone,
>
>
> In addition to Prentice Hall giving us a review copy of Wesley Chun's Core
> Python Programming, 2nd
> Edition<http://www.phptr.com/bookstore/product.asp?isbn=0132269937&rl=1>:
> they have also
> given BayPIGgies a coupon for a 40% discount towards the purchase price of
> this new book.
>
> ***NOTE***
> This is a special promotion from the publisher. The author has no
> involvement with this promotion.
> If you have any problems with this coupon, please contact me off list, and I
> will contact the Publisher's liaison
>
>
> Please use this link to download the coupon, and follow the directions on
> the coupon.
> http://www.baypiggies.net/zope/pr/user-group-association-program/40-discount-for-core-python-programming
>
> If you have any problems with the link, please contact me off list.
>
>
> Thanks
>
>
> Tony
>


From aahz at pythoncraft.com  Tue Nov 14 15:21:17 2006
From: aahz at pythoncraft.com (Aahz)
Date: Tue, 14 Nov 2006 06:21:17 -0800
Subject: [Baypiggies] 3-D graphics?
In-Reply-To: <5538c19b0611132354m31056bd3o1a588003f35536fc@mail.gmail.com>
References: <20061114011217.71A161E4008@bag.python.org>
	<5538c19b0611132354m31056bd3o1a588003f35536fc@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <20061114142117.GB27572@panix.com>

On Mon, Nov 13, 2006, Brian Mahoney wrote:
>
> http://sketchup.google.com/index.html

Does anyone have a non-secure version of ketchup?
-- 
Aahz (aahz at pythoncraft.com)           <*>         http://www.pythoncraft.com/

Sorry, couldn't resist

From wescpy at gmail.com  Tue Nov 14 17:47:08 2006
From: wescpy at gmail.com (wesley chun)
Date: Tue, 14 Nov 2006 08:47:08 -0800
Subject: [Baypiggies] 3-D graphics?
In-Reply-To: <20061114011217.71A161E4008@bag.python.org>
References: <20061114011217.71A161E4008@bag.python.org>
Message-ID: <78b3a9580611140847p745afc1en2f201bc96964920f@mail.gmail.com>

> There seems to be a lot of graphics packages.  Does anyone have any recommendations?

while i can't give any, i'll just add to your list of packages to eval:

http://www.vrplumber.com/py3d.py

good luck!
-- wesley
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
"Core Python Programming", Prentice Hall, (c)2007,2001
    http://corepython.com

wesley.j.chun :: wescpy-at-gmail.com
python training and technical consulting
cyberweb.consulting : silicon valley, ca
http://cyberwebconsulting.com

From marilyn at deliberate.com  Tue Nov 14 18:59:34 2006
From: marilyn at deliberate.com (Marilyn Davis)
Date: Tue, 14 Nov 2006 09:59:34 -0800
Subject: [Baypiggies] 3-D graphics?
Message-ID: <20061114175938.7DF3F1E4002@bag.python.org>

Wow, thank you everyone for all the suggestions.

But, would you all please give me one obviously correct way to do this?

:^)

I'm going to start with visual python ala Stephen's suggestion, just because it would be a nice thing for me to be familiar with anyway.

Thanks again.

Marilyn Davis

----- On Tuesday, November 14, 2006 wescpy at gmail.com wrote:

>> There seems to be a lot of graphics packages.  Does anyone have any
> recommendations?
> 
> while i can't give any, i'll just add to your list of packages to eval:
> 
> http://www.vrplumber.com/py3d.py
> 
> good luck!
> -- wesley
> - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
> "Core Python Programming", Prentice Hall, (c)2007,2001
> http://corepython.com
> 
> wesley.j.chun :: wescpy-at-gmail.com
> python training and technical consulting
> cyberweb.consulting : silicon valley, ca
> http://cyberwebconsulting.com



From andywiggin at gmail.com  Tue Nov 14 20:25:39 2006
From: andywiggin at gmail.com (Andy Wiggin)
Date: Tue, 14 Nov 2006 11:25:39 -0800
Subject: [Baypiggies] 3-D graphics?
In-Reply-To: <20061114175938.7DF3F1E4002@bag.python.org>
References: <20061114175938.7DF3F1E4002@bag.python.org>
Message-ID: <74e7428a0611141125l3c109a18g9d55d87e946b5413@mail.gmail.com>

If it's a pretty simple drawing, another option might be OOo's Draw
program. It has 3-D donuts and pyramids, but the shading/lighting
options are pretty limited. -Andy

From DennisR at dair.com  Wed Nov 15 02:53:39 2006
From: DennisR at dair.com (Dennis Reinhardt)
Date: Tue, 14 Nov 2006 17:53:39 -0800
Subject: [Baypiggies] Unconfirmed for December meeting
Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.0.20061114173008.00bfa460@localhost>

In looking over the lineup for the December meeting, the only private 
confirmation response for December has come from Tony Cappellini for ~15 
minute presentation (thanks).

Marilyn (for IDE portion) and I have not heard from:

	Ken Seehart -  Komodo (~15 min)
	Robert Stephenson - Laser presentation control (30 minutes)

We know Steve Hindle will not be able to present in December and so we have 
a confirmation response from him (thanks).

Donna/Tony, I see Tony has posted a book offer on the Plone development 
part of Baypiggies site.  Did he do that?  If so, I think it would be great 
to have a short "user experience" report on the Plone presentation redo 
presently scheduled for January.  If we don't get confirmation, does moving 
the Plone presentation to December work for Donna?  Would Tony be able/want 
to contribute to a Baypiggies site Plone presentation?

If anyone has a presentation they would like to give, we may shortly have 
an opening in December or a cancelled meeting.

Regards, Dennis


  ---------------------------------
| Dennis    | DennisR at dair.com    |
| Reinhardt | http://www.dair.com |
  ---------------------------------


From cappy2112 at gmail.com  Wed Nov 15 03:09:25 2006
From: cappy2112 at gmail.com (Tony Cappellini)
Date: Tue, 14 Nov 2006 18:09:25 -0800
Subject: [Baypiggies] Unconfirmed for December meeting
In-Reply-To: <5.1.0.14.0.20061114173008.00bfa460@localhost>
References: <5.1.0.14.0.20061114173008.00bfa460@localhost>
Message-ID: <8249c4ac0611141809p397727eaoab508bd34f48e05f@mail.gmail.com>

> >>Donna/Tony, I see Tony has posted a book offer on the Plone development
> >>part of Baypiggies site.  Did he do that?

Yes. I've been having a lot of problems with the site, and I want to see if
anyone else has any issues.
Although I've been editing pages, and most of the BP group can't do that
yet.
However, I want to see if anyone has any problems hitting (or even seeing)
that link.

>>Would Tony be able/want to contribute to a Baypiggies site Plone
> presentation?

I'm willing, but not really qualified. I've only edited the Book Reviews
pages thru the web interface, which doesn't require any knowledge about
Plone.

I'm not the Plone admin, we only have one at the moment- Donna.

However, when the Plone site goes fully live, I can do a presentation on how
the new book reviews pages will work.
The intent is for registered users to be able to add their own reviews. I
don't think we are too far away from that level of functionality.
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From DennisR at dair.com  Wed Nov 15 03:20:52 2006
From: DennisR at dair.com (Dennis Reinhardt)
Date: Tue, 14 Nov 2006 18:20:52 -0800
Subject: [Baypiggies] Unconfirmed for December meeting
In-Reply-To: <8249c4ac0611141809p397727eaoab508bd34f48e05f@mail.gmail.co
 m>
References: <5.1.0.14.0.20061114173008.00bfa460@localhost>
	<5.1.0.14.0.20061114173008.00bfa460@localhost>
Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.0.20061114181208.00bf6680@localhost>

At 06:09 PM 11/14/2006, Tony Cappellini wrote:

>> >>Donna/Tony, I see Tony has posted a book offer on the Plone development
>> >>part of Baypiggies site.  Did he do that?
>Yes. I've been having a lot of problems with the site, and I want to see 
>if anyone else has any issues.
>Although I've been editing pages, and most of the BP group can't do that yet.
>However, I want to see if anyone has any problems hitting (or even seeing) 
>that link.

I saw it


>> >>Would Tony be able/want to contribute to a Baypiggies site Plone 
>> presentation?
>I'm willing, but not really qualified. I've only edited the Book Reviews 
>pages thru the web interface, which doesn't require any knowledge about Plone.
>
>I'm not the Plone admin, we only have one at the moment- Donna.

I was thinking that it would be handy to have a non-admin presentation on 
what the BP site looks like from an editing user point of view.  Yes, 
clearly, Donna is the admin.  My thinking is she talk for an hour or so 
(much in line with first presentation) and then a non-admin would follow up 
with what the learning curve looks like, how the site works from non-admin 
perspective, things like that.

Thanks for being willing, let's see where Donna is ... and, sigh, the 
December meeting is also.

Regards, Dennis
  ---------------------------------
| Dennis    | DennisR at dair.com    |
| Reinhardt | http://www.dair.com |
  ---------------------------------


From cappy2112 at gmail.com  Wed Nov 15 03:45:03 2006
From: cappy2112 at gmail.com (Tony Cappellini)
Date: Tue, 14 Nov 2006 18:45:03 -0800
Subject: [Baypiggies] Unconfirmed for December meeting
In-Reply-To: <5.1.0.14.0.20061114181208.00bf6680@localhost>
References: <5.1.0.14.0.20061114173008.00bfa460@localhost>
	<5.1.0.14.0.20061114181208.00bf6680@localhost>
Message-ID: <8249c4ac0611141845y7942b26fl725d7f02bef1b739@mail.gmail.com>

> >>with what the learning curve looks like, how the site works from
> non-admin
> >>perspective, things like that.


I think December is pushing it for the Plone site presentation, especially
since all of the initial site functionality
may not be ready. So doing a presentation this soon, on what might be,
probably isn't the best way to go at this point.
However, I'll follow Donna's recommendations on when, where, what.
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From ken at seehart.com  Wed Nov 15 03:31:29 2006
From: ken at seehart.com (Ken Seehart)
Date: Tue, 14 Nov 2006 18:31:29 -0800
Subject: [Baypiggies] Unconfirmed for December meeting
In-Reply-To: <5.1.0.14.0.20061114173008.00bfa460@localhost>
References: <5.1.0.14.0.20061114173008.00bfa460@localhost>
Message-ID: <455A7C01.3070701@seehart.com>

Count me in for Komodo.
- Ken Seehart

Dennis Reinhardt wrote:
> In looking over the lineup for the December meeting, the only private 
> confirmation response for December has come from Tony Cappellini for ~15 
> minute presentation (thanks).
>
> Marilyn (for IDE portion) and I have not heard from:
>
> 	Ken Seehart -  Komodo (~15 min)
> 	Robert Stephenson - Laser presentation control (30 minutes)
>
> We know Steve Hindle will not be able to present in December and so we have 
> a confirmation response from him (thanks).
>
> Donna/Tony, I see Tony has posted a book offer on the Plone development 
> part of Baypiggies site.  Did he do that?  If so, I think it would be great 
> to have a short "user experience" report on the Plone presentation redo 
> presently scheduled for January.  If we don't get confirmation, does moving 
> the Plone presentation to December work for Donna?  Would Tony be able/want 
> to contribute to a Baypiggies site Plone presentation?
>
> If anyone has a presentation they would like to give, we may shortly have 
> an opening in December or a cancelled meeting.
>
> Regards, Dennis
>
>
>   ---------------------------------
> | Dennis    | DennisR at dair.com    |
> | Reinhardt | http://www.dair.com |
>   ---------------------------------
>
> _______________________________________________
> Baypiggies mailing list
> Baypiggies at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/baypiggies
>
>
>   



From donnamsnow at gmail.com  Wed Nov 15 05:02:30 2006
From: donnamsnow at gmail.com (Donna M. Snow)
Date: Tue, 14 Nov 2006 20:02:30 -0800
Subject: [Baypiggies] Unconfirmed for December meeting
In-Reply-To: <8249c4ac0611141845y7942b26fl725d7f02bef1b739@mail.gmail.com>
References: <5.1.0.14.0.20061114173008.00bfa460@localhost>	<5.1.0.14.0.20061114181208.00bf6680@localhost>
	<8249c4ac0611141845y7942b26fl725d7f02bef1b739@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <455A9156.9080302@gmail.com>

Hi,

I've been a bit busy last couple of days..launching a Plone site 
pre-thanksgiving.. so it's been a bit hectic.

My response on this is that we wait until January for the Plone 
presentation..for a couple of reasons. I can't guarantee I'll be ready 
by then.. and I'd really like the presentation to cover the entire 
session and give us all an opportunity to determine how we go forward 
with the new site. Tony's been having problems and I've been too busy to 
really follow up like he needs. I will follow up with Tony and get him 
back on track..

That said..if you don't mind..I'd prefer to do my Plone presentation in 
January.. I bet we can fill December with something.. why not relegate a 
bit of time for a small holiday party? to end the year? We can extend 
the mapping and random access and do some networking during the time we 
need to fill for the December meeting..

(I also wanted to upgrade the site to Plone 2.5.1 and add some modules.. 
etc before we meet to discuss how to utilize the dynamic functionality 
of the new site)

Please feel free to join the site and 
play..http://www.baypiggies.net/zope/pr ... click the join link and sign 
up. You should be able to add content in your member folder.. 
(accessible through the link in the top of the site with the icon of the 
person next to it.)

Best Regards,
Donna M. Snow, Owner
C Squared Technologies
http://www.csquaredtech.com
illuminate your web



Tony Cappellini wrote:
>
>     >>with what the learning curve looks like, how the site works from
>     non-admin
>     >>perspective, things like that.
>
>
> I think December is pushing it for the Plone site presentation, 
> especially since all of the initial site functionality
> may not be ready. So doing a presentation this soon, on what might be, 
> probably isn't the best way to go at this point.
> However, I'll follow Donna's recommendations on when, where, what.
>
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> _______________________________________________
> Baypiggies mailing list
> Baypiggies at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/baypiggies
>   


From DennisR at dair.com  Wed Nov 15 19:27:55 2006
From: DennisR at dair.com (Dennis Reinhardt)
Date: Wed, 15 Nov 2006 10:27:55 -0800
Subject: [Baypiggies] Unconfirmed for December meeting
In-Reply-To: <455A9156.9080302@gmail.com>
References: <8249c4ac0611141845y7942b26fl725d7f02bef1b739@mail.gmail.com>
	<5.1.0.14.0.20061114173008.00bfa460@localhost>
	<5.1.0.14.0.20061114181208.00bf6680@localhost>
	<8249c4ac0611141845y7942b26fl725d7f02bef1b739@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.0.20061115100911.00bf3e60@localhost>

At 08:02 PM 11/14/2006, Donna M. Snow wrote:
>I bet we can fill December with something.. why not relegate a bit of time 
>for a small holiday party? to end the year? We can extend the mapping and 
>random access and do some networking during the time we need to fill for 
>the December meeting..

We have 30 minutes confirmed out of 80 minutes.  A small holiday party 
would require a volunteer to bring refreshments.  who wants to do this?

I don't think 30 minutes is enough material for a meeting.

Perhaps we can generalize the IDE topics to cover Python development 
methodologies.  For example, I do python source editing in WordPad, which 
is as far away from an IDE as you can get.  There are some interesting 
things I could present about my development environment but the IDE part of 
it is worth at most a 30 second mention.

Are there 3 more good 15 minute development methodology presentations out 
there?  I could do one but would prefer to be a speaker of last resort.

>My response on this is that we wait until January for the Plone 
>presentation..for a couple of reasons. I can't guarantee I'll be ready by 
>then.. and I'd really like the presentation to cover the entire session 
>and give us all an opportunity to determine how we go forward with the new 
>site. Tony's been having problems and I've been too busy to really follow 
>up like he needs. I will follow up with Tony and get him back on track..

Sure.  Makes perfect sense.

Dennis
  ---------------------------------
| Dennis    | DennisR at dair.com    |
| Reinhardt | http://www.dair.com |
  ---------------------------------


From marilyn at deliberate.com  Wed Nov 15 19:46:15 2006
From: marilyn at deliberate.com (Marilyn Davis)
Date: Wed, 15 Nov 2006 10:46:15 -0800
Subject: [Baypiggies] Fw: Re:  Unconfirmed for December meeting
Message-ID: <20061115184618.C1C181E4002@bag.python.org>

----- On Wednesday, November 15, 2006 DennisR at dair.com wrote:

> At 08:02 PM 11/14/2006, Donna M. Snow wrote:
>>I bet we can fill December with something.. why not relegate a bit of time
>>for a small holiday party? to end the year? We can extend the mapping and
>>random access and do some networking during the time we need to fill for
>>the December meeting..
> 
> We have 30 minutes confirmed out of 80 minutes.  A small holiday party
> would require a volunteer to bring refreshments.  who wants to do this?

Google seems to be very generous with beverages.  Is this true or am I stealing water when I go there?

> 
> I don't think 30 minutes is enough material for a meeting.
> 
> Perhaps we can generalize the IDE topics to cover Python development
> methodologies.  For example, I do python source editing in WordPad, which
> is as far away from an IDE as you can get.  There are some interesting
> things I could present about my development environment but the IDE part of
> it is worth at most a 30 second mention.

I'm very interested in learning about the WordPad environment. 

Marilyn

> 
> Are there 3 more good 15 minute development methodology presentations out
> there?  I could do one but would prefer to be a speaker of last resort.
> 
>>My response on this is that we wait until January for the Plone
>>presentation..for a couple of reasons. I can't guarantee I'll be ready by
>>then.. and I'd really like the presentation to cover the entire session
>>and give us all an opportunity to determine how we go forward with the new
>>site. Tony's been having problems and I've been too busy to really follow
>>up like he needs. I will follow up with Tony and get him back on track..
> 
> Sure.  Makes perfect sense.
> 
> Dennis
> ---------------------------------
> | Dennis    | DennisR at dair.com    |
> | Reinhardt | http://www.dair.com |
> ---------------------------------
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Baypiggies mailing list
> Baypiggies at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/baypiggies





From jjinux at gmail.com  Wed Nov 15 19:51:33 2006
From: jjinux at gmail.com (Shannon -jj Behrens)
Date: Wed, 15 Nov 2006 10:51:33 -0800
Subject: [Baypiggies] Unconfirmed for December meeting
In-Reply-To: <5.1.0.14.0.20061115100911.00bf3e60@localhost>
References: <5.1.0.14.0.20061114173008.00bfa460@localhost>
	<5.1.0.14.0.20061114181208.00bf6680@localhost>
	<8249c4ac0611141845y7942b26fl725d7f02bef1b739@mail.gmail.com>
	<455A9156.9080302@gmail.com>
	<5.1.0.14.0.20061115100911.00bf3e60@localhost>
Message-ID: <c41f67b90611151051mc86a094t48fcb94c09fbcb6@mail.gmail.com>

On 11/15/06, Dennis Reinhardt <DennisR at dair.com> wrote:
> At 08:02 PM 11/14/2006, Donna M. Snow wrote:
> >I bet we can fill December with something.. why not relegate a bit of time
> >for a small holiday party? to end the year? We can extend the mapping and
> >random access and do some networking during the time we need to fill for
> >the December meeting..
>
> We have 30 minutes confirmed out of 80 minutes.  A small holiday party
> would require a volunteer to bring refreshments.  who wants to do this?
>
> I don't think 30 minutes is enough material for a meeting.
>
> Perhaps we can generalize the IDE topics to cover Python development
> methodologies.  For example, I do python source editing in WordPad, which
> is as far away from an IDE as you can get.  There are some interesting
> things I could present about my development environment but the IDE part of
> it is worth at most a 30 second mention.
>
> Are there 3 more good 15 minute development methodology presentations out
> there?  I could do one but would prefer to be a speaker of last resort.
>
> >My response on this is that we wait until January for the Plone
> >presentation..for a couple of reasons. I can't guarantee I'll be ready by
> >then.. and I'd really like the presentation to cover the entire session
> >and give us all an opportunity to determine how we go forward with the new
> >site. Tony's been having problems and I've been too busy to really follow
> >up like he needs. I will follow up with Tony and get him back on track..
>
> Sure.  Makes perfect sense.

Drew, do you feel like teaching us lowly Python programmers how to
conquer the world with RDF and SPARQL?

Does anyone know anything about openrecord?

Can anyone talk about Adobe Apollo?

Best Regards,
-jj

-- 
http://jjinux.blogspot.com/

From spmcinerney at hotmail.com  Wed Nov 15 19:56:41 2006
From: spmcinerney at hotmail.com (Stephen McInerney)
Date: Wed, 15 Nov 2006 10:56:41 -0800
Subject: [Baypiggies] Fw: Re: Unconfirmed for December meeting
In-Reply-To: <20061115184618.C1C181E4002@bag.python.org>
Message-ID: <BAY128-F34726B567A878571366E54A0EA0@phx.gbl>

>From: Marilyn Davis <marilyn at deliberate.com>
> > At 08:02 PM 11/14/2006, Donna M. Snow wrote:
> >>I bet we can fill December with something.. why not relegate a bit of 
>time
> >>for a small holiday party? to end the year? We can extend the mapping 
>and
> >>random access and do some networking during the time we need to fill for
> >>the December meeting..
> >
> > We have 30 minutes confirmed out of 80 minutes.  A small holiday party
> > would require a volunteer to bring refreshments.  who wants to do this?
>
>Google seems to be very generous with beverages.  Is this true or am I 
>stealing water when I go there?

There's a counter somewhere with your name on it:
unpaid_drinks['Marilyn Davis']++
Seriously, we should pay our way and not wear out our welcome.

> > I don't think 30 minutes is enough material for a meeting.

Agree. Unless someone wants to show vPython, or something.
Or we could feature newbies in say 10-minute segments to keep it moving.

> > Perhaps we can generalize the IDE topics to cover Python development
> > methodologies.  For example, I do python source editing in WordPad, 
>which
> > is as far away from an IDE as you can get.  There are some interesting
> > things I could present about my development environment but the IDE part 
>of
> > it is worth at most a 30 second mention.
>
>I'm very interested in learning about the WordPad environment.

Huh? WordPad is not at all an environment, it's a basic text-editor in 
Windows.
It doesn't even allow plugins. Similar to MacWrite I imagine.

Regards,
Stephen

_________________________________________________________________
Try the next generation of search with Windows Live Search today!  
http://imagine-windowslive.com/minisites/searchlaunch/?locale=en-us&source=hmtagline


From cappy2112 at gmail.com  Thu Nov 16 06:31:11 2006
From: cappy2112 at gmail.com (Tony Cappellini)
Date: Wed, 15 Nov 2006 21:31:11 -0800
Subject: [Baypiggies] Volunteer wanted to review Python Phrasebook
Message-ID: <8249c4ac0611152131k75220c3ex9a0fbcc406a0e20e@mail.gmail.com>

Hello Everyone,

Prentice Hall gave us another book (from Sams Publishing) for review. Python
Phrasebook<http://www.samspublishing.com/bookstore/product.asp?isbn=0672329107&rl=1>
It's pocket-sized. The next best thing to having Python.org in your pocket!

If anyone would like to review this book( it's quite short), please email me
off-list.





Thanks


Tony
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From cappy2112 at gmail.com  Sat Nov 18 06:43:08 2006
From: cappy2112 at gmail.com (Tony Cappellini)
Date: Fri, 17 Nov 2006 21:43:08 -0800
Subject: [Baypiggies] Volunteer needed to review "Rapid Web Applications
	with TurboGears"
Message-ID: <8249c4ac0611172143o276e1889y63be5898afdbdf76@mail.gmail.com>

Hello Everyone,

Prentice Hall has given us a review copy of "Rapid Web Applications with
TurboGears: Using Python to Create Ajax-Powered
Sites"<http://www.phptr.com/bookstore/product.asp?isbn=0132433885&rl=1>

I need someone to review of this book. If you are interested please contact
me off-list.

For the new people, I keep forgetting to mention that when you write a
review, you get to keep the book



Thanks


Tony
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From marilyn at deliberate.com  Sat Nov 18 18:25:06 2006
From: marilyn at deliberate.com (Marilyn Davis)
Date: Sat, 18 Nov 2006 09:25:06 -0800
Subject: [Baypiggies] "Why Python?" talk in SF
Message-ID: <20061118172509.356041E4005@bag.python.org>

Hi,

In case anyone is interested or knows someone who might be interested, Tuesday night I'm giving the "Why Python?" talk in the city:

http://www.balug.org/

It's $11 for the dinner, but that could be a good thing.

Marilyn



From cappy2112 at gmail.com  Mon Nov 20 04:36:29 2006
From: cappy2112 at gmail.com (Tony Cappellini)
Date: Sun, 19 Nov 2006 19:36:29 -0800
Subject: [Baypiggies] handling timeouts, normal completion,
	or exceptions when interacting with CVS
In-Reply-To: <8249c4ac0611191922h26942943o1a73416a1e51d912@mail.gmail.com>
References: <8249c4ac0611191922h26942943o1a73416a1e51d912@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <8249c4ac0611191936n1dd42e9cyb79e6f0d804f633b@mail.gmail.com>

Does anyone in the group have any experience with interacting with CVS from
Python?

I've written a script which will checkout files from CVS, however, I don' t
know how to check for normal completion, errors or exceptions.

There are many people using CVS for this massive project, so we can't just
switch to a source control which has better scripting abilities.  We are
stuck with CVS, so please don't reply with "Don't use CVS"


def SendCVSCommand(self)

      self.__cvsCmd = "cvs update -A -C someArchiveName" # hard-coded for
brevity

      try:
         hProcess = popen(self.__cvsCmd, "r") # will run the cvs command,
and checkout this module to the current directory
         sleep(timeToWait)

         # how to check for errors?
         hProcess.close()
      except: # bad idea, but better than nothing for now
         self.__FatalError = True
         print"\nException was encountered while processing this cvs command
line %s\n" % self.__cvsCmd




I'm using 30 seconds for the sleep time, but what I would like to do is exit
this routine early, if the CVS command finishes before 30 seconds are up.
I don't know how to check if the cvs command has finised normally, or with
errors.


Does anyone have any suggestions how to handle erros or completion in a
process like this?

thanks
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From asheesh at asheesh.org  Mon Nov 20 04:42:21 2006
From: asheesh at asheesh.org (Asheesh Laroia)
Date: Sun, 19 Nov 2006 22:42:21 -0500 (EST)
Subject: [Baypiggies] handling timeouts, normal completion,
 or exceptions when interacting with CVS
In-Reply-To: <8249c4ac0611191936n1dd42e9cyb79e6f0d804f633b@mail.gmail.com>
References: <8249c4ac0611191922h26942943o1a73416a1e51d912@mail.gmail.com>
	<8249c4ac0611191936n1dd42e9cyb79e6f0d804f633b@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <Pine.LNX.4.63.0611192240010.775@supercore.laroia.net>

On Sun, 19 Nov 2006, Tony Cappellini wrote:

> Does anyone in the group have any experience with interacting with CVS 
> from Python?

You might be able to find some wrapper that handles it in pure Python, 
which might be more convenient.  For example http://pycvs.sourceforge.net/ 
(I haven't used it, I just googled for python+cvs, and when that 
gave me too many hits, I looked for pycvs).

> I've written a script which will checkout files from CVS, however, I 
> don' t know how to check for normal completion, errors or exceptions.

[snip]

> Does anyone have any suggestions how to handle erros or completion in a 
> process like this?

In general, the subprocess module seems intended to handle this for you: 
http://docs.python.org/lib/module-subprocess.html .  It's fairly new, and 
the documentation says it's "intends to replace several other, older 
modules and functions, such as. . . popen".

Hope this helps!

-- Asheesh.

-- 
"I have to convince you, or at least snow you ..."
 		-- Prof. Romas Aleliunas, CS 435

From DennisR at dair.com  Mon Nov 20 20:55:55 2006
From: DennisR at dair.com (Dennis Reinhardt)
Date: Mon, 20 Nov 2006 11:55:55 -0800
Subject: [Baypiggies] Contingent Speakers Sought
Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.0.20061120113907.00bf4310@localhost>

For December, I forecast that our program may run anywhere from 60-80 
minutes.  If the regular program ends at 60 minutes, it would be beneficial 
to have quality material we could use to compose a full 80 minute program.

I am looking to start a list of people who could talk on a contingent basis 
if our regular program ends early and their topic areas.  These contingent 
talks would be 5-10 minutes in length, to fill possible holes in 
program.  So far, our regular program has not ended early and we have been 
able to exactly fill the time available.

If you have a topic longer than 5-10 minutes, go ahead and reply as well 
but I would much rather schedule a longer talk in a definite time slot 
(first available is Feb. 2007) as a regular part of our program.

So, the contingent speakers I am seeking here could end up not getting 
called in December ... or anytime soon at all.  Because this is contingent 
on regular program ending early, timely topics are not a good fit.  What 
would work better are tricks and tips code presentations, for example, 
where the material is just as relevant this month or next.

Regards, Dennis
  ---------------------------------
| Dennis    | DennisR at dair.com    |
| Reinhardt | http://www.dair.com |
  ---------------------------------


From nnorwitz at gmail.com  Wed Nov 22 02:27:07 2006
From: nnorwitz at gmail.com (Neal Norwitz)
Date: Tue, 21 Nov 2006 17:27:07 -0800
Subject: [Baypiggies] What Guido does for his day job
Message-ID: <ee2a432c0611211727s3ba06bffp3305cd98650fe0ff@mail.gmail.com>

Ever wonder what Guido has been doing at Google?  Now is your chance
to find out!

Guido has worked at Google for nearly a year.  He splits his time
between working on Python and working on Google projects.  He will be
giving a presentation and demo on Nov 30, 2006.  I won't spoil it, but
this talk will touch on some aspects of Google's development process
and what Guido has done to improve it.  He did such a good job,
engineers voted his project one of the top 10 accomplishments!

The talk will be at 7.00pm on Nov 30, 2006 at Google Headquarters in
Mountain View, CA in Building 43, room: Tunis.  The talk is targeted
towards anyone interested in software development. It's not Python
specific.  For updates, check http://code.google.com/
I believe the talk will be videotaped and put on Google video.

I hope to see lots of new faces!

n

From noel.yap at gmail.com  Wed Nov 22 18:28:05 2006
From: noel.yap at gmail.com (Noel Yap)
Date: Wed, 22 Nov 2006 09:28:05 -0800
Subject: [Baypiggies] What Guido does for his day job
In-Reply-To: <ee2a432c0611211727s3ba06bffp3305cd98650fe0ff@mail.gmail.com>
References: <ee2a432c0611211727s3ba06bffp3305cd98650fe0ff@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <70d0a1130611220928x20e8af24i92af65ddc032ff0d@mail.gmail.com>

Is there a Google Calendar event somewhere for this?

Thanks,
Noel

On 11/21/06, Neal Norwitz <nnorwitz at gmail.com> wrote:
> Ever wonder what Guido has been doing at Google?  Now is your chance
> to find out!
>
> Guido has worked at Google for nearly a year.  He splits his time
> between working on Python and working on Google projects.  He will be
> giving a presentation and demo on Nov 30, 2006.  I won't spoil it, but
> this talk will touch on some aspects of Google's development process
> and what Guido has done to improve it.  He did such a good job,
> engineers voted his project one of the top 10 accomplishments!
>
> The talk will be at 7.00pm on Nov 30, 2006 at Google Headquarters in
> Mountain View, CA in Building 43, room: Tunis.  The talk is targeted
> towards anyone interested in software development. It's not Python
> specific.  For updates, check http://code.google.com/
> I believe the talk will be videotaped and put on Google video.
>
> I hope to see lots of new faces!
>
> n
> _______________________________________________
> Baypiggies mailing list
> Baypiggies at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/baypiggies
>

From cvanarsdall at mvista.com  Wed Nov 22 18:32:56 2006
From: cvanarsdall at mvista.com (Carl J. Van Arsdall)
Date: Wed, 22 Nov 2006 09:32:56 -0800
Subject: [Baypiggies] What Guido does for his day job
In-Reply-To: <ee2a432c0611211727s3ba06bffp3305cd98650fe0ff@mail.gmail.com>
References: <ee2a432c0611211727s3ba06bffp3305cd98650fe0ff@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <456489C8.9020106@mvista.com>

Neal Norwitz wrote:
> Ever wonder what Guido has been doing at Google?  Now is your chance
> to find out!
>
> Guido has worked at Google for nearly a year.  He splits his time
> between working on Python and working on Google projects.  He will be
> giving a presentation and demo on Nov 30, 2006.  I won't spoil it, but
> this talk will touch on some aspects of Google's development process
> and what Guido has done to improve it.  He did such a good job,
> engineers voted his project one of the top 10 accomplishments!
>
> The talk will be at 7.00pm on Nov 30, 2006 at Google Headquarters in
> Mountain View, CA in Building 43, room: Tunis.  The talk is targeted
> towards anyone interested in software development. It's not Python
> specific.  For updates, check http://code.google.com/
> I believe the talk will be videotaped and put on Google video.
>   


Is there a place for non-google employees to sign up and attend this 
presentation?

-- 

Carl J. Van Arsdall
cvanarsdall at mvista.com
Build and Release
MontaVista Software


From nnorwitz at gmail.com  Wed Nov 22 21:25:59 2006
From: nnorwitz at gmail.com (Neal Norwitz)
Date: Wed, 22 Nov 2006 12:25:59 -0800
Subject: [Baypiggies] What Guido does for his day job
In-Reply-To: <456489C8.9020106@mvista.com>
References: <ee2a432c0611211727s3ba06bffp3305cd98650fe0ff@mail.gmail.com>
	<456489C8.9020106@mvista.com>
Message-ID: <ee2a432c0611221225i51ca4878o98faae791b562fe0@mail.gmail.com>

On 11/22/06, Carl J. Van Arsdall <cvanarsdall at mvista.com> wrote:
> Neal Norwitz wrote:
> > Ever wonder what Guido has been doing at Google?  Now is your chance
> > to find out!
> >
> > Guido has worked at Google for nearly a year.  He splits his time
> > between working on Python and working on Google projects.  He will be
> > giving a presentation and demo on Nov 30, 2006.  I won't spoil it, but
> > this talk will touch on some aspects of Google's development process
> > and what Guido has done to improve it.  He did such a good job,
> > engineers voted his project one of the top 10 accomplishments!
> >
> > The talk will be at 7.00pm on Nov 30, 2006 at Google Headquarters in
> > Mountain View, CA in Building 43, room: Tunis.  The talk is targeted
> > towards anyone interested in software development. It's not Python
> > specific.  For updates, check http://code.google.com/
> > I believe the talk will be videotaped and put on Google video.
>
> Is there a place for non-google employees to sign up and attend this
> presentation?

I suspect Leslie will setup something similar to the normal Baypiggies
meetings.  She's on vacation this week, but will be back Monday.

Setting up a public calendar for Google-sponsored Open Source events
seems like a good idea.

n

From nnorwitz at gmail.com  Wed Nov 22 02:27:07 2006
From: nnorwitz at gmail.com (Neal Norwitz)
Date: Tue, 21 Nov 2006 17:27:07 -0800
Subject: [Baypiggies] What Guido does for his day job
Message-ID: <mailman.592.1164206744.32031.python-announce-list@python.org>

Ever wonder what Guido has been doing at Google?  Now is your chance
to find out!

Guido has worked at Google for nearly a year.  He splits his time
between working on Python and working on Google projects.  He will be
giving a presentation and demo on Nov 30, 2006.  I won't spoil it, but
this talk will touch on some aspects of Google's development process
and what Guido has done to improve it.  He did such a good job,
engineers voted his project one of the top 10 accomplishments!

The talk will be at 7.00pm on Nov 30, 2006 at Google Headquarters in
Mountain View, CA in Building 43, room: Tunis.  The talk is targeted
towards anyone interested in software development. It's not Python
specific.  For updates, check http://code.google.com/
I believe the talk will be videotaped and put on Google video.

I hope to see lots of new faces!

n

From donnamsnow at gmail.com  Sun Nov 26 10:01:57 2006
From: donnamsnow at gmail.com (Donna M. Snow)
Date: Sun, 26 Nov 2006 01:01:57 -0800
Subject: [Baypiggies] Plone site (baypiggies.net/zope/pr)
Message-ID: <45695805.8080102@gmail.com>

Hi,

As those who have been following.. know.. we have a Plone site setup at 
baypiggies.net/zope/pr and Tony has been diligently adding content to 
the site but has run into some issues with the system.

I'd like to ask that adding of content be suspended for a bit... I need 
to upgrade the site from 2.1.2 to 2.5.1 .. (I'll hold on to your content 
Tony) .. once I've done that I'll test to see that the issues Tony's 
been having has been resolved.

I am also in need of a couple other someone's who know Plone well enough 
to administer it to come forward and help troubleshoot (answer 
questions) as we bring on more content providers (right now it's just 
Tony..but we may have someone adding evernts/meetings) and ideally it'd 
be nice to see the presenters uploading their content to the baypiggies 
site (presentation, video, podcasts, etc).

If you are interested in helping administer the Plone site.. contact me 
offlist donna at csquaredtech.com and I'll provide you with manager access 
on the site so you can help troubleshoot and help move content across 
from old site so we can launch the new site...

first step is upgrading to newest version of Plone and troubleshooting 
the issues Tony's been having...
(issues I've never come across.. I suspect it's a conflict in a product 
I installed.. so we'll start fresh then reload Tony's content and make 
sure that solves the problems)

(I know there a couple of you Plonista's out there.. so please...contact 
me.. hate the hold up the entire group here just because business has 
been really good :-))

Best Regards,
Donna M. Snow, Owner
C Squared Technologies
illuminate your web
http://www.csquaredtech.com





From lhawthorn at google.com  Mon Nov 27 20:58:06 2006
From: lhawthorn at google.com (Leslie Hawthorn)
Date: Mon, 27 Nov 2006 11:58:06 -0800
Subject: [Baypiggies] What Guido does for his day job
In-Reply-To: <456489C8.9020106@mvista.com>
References: <ee2a432c0611211727s3ba06bffp3305cd98650fe0ff@mail.gmail.com>
	<456489C8.9020106@mvista.com>
Message-ID: <4869cee70611271158r2c2063cdo9dbb2aa5c5045691@mail.gmail.com>

On 11/22/06, Carl J. Van Arsdall <cvanarsdall at mvista.com> wrote:
>
> Neal Norwitz wrote:
> > Ever wonder what Guido has been doing at Google?  Now is your chance
> > to find out!
> >
> > Guido has worked at Google for nearly a year.  He splits his time
> > between working on Python and working on Google projects.  He will be
> > giving a presentation and demo on Nov 30, 2006.  I won't spoil it, but
> > this talk will touch on some aspects of Google's development process
> > and what Guido has done to improve it.  He did such a good job,
> > engineers voted his project one of the top 10 accomplishments!
> >
> > The talk will be at 7.00pm on Nov 30, 2006 at Google Headquarters in
> > Mountain View, CA in Building 43, room: Tunis.  The talk is targeted
> > towards anyone interested in software development. It's not Python
> > specific.  For updates, check http://code.google.com/
> > I believe the talk will be videotaped and put on Google video.
> >
>
>
> Is there a place for non-google employees to sign up and attend this
> presentation?


There's no need to sign up in advance to attend, though all guests will need
to sign in at reception upon arrival.  We will have two lobbies open for
registration to ease congestion during sign in.

Doors will open at 6:30 PM, and we'll also be serving beverages and light
refreshments.

Best,
LH

-- 
Leslie Hawthorn
Open Source Program Office
Google Inc.
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From lhawthorn at google.com  Mon Nov 27 20:59:45 2006
From: lhawthorn at google.com (Leslie Hawthorn)
Date: Mon, 27 Nov 2006 11:59:45 -0800
Subject: [Baypiggies] What Guido does for his day job
In-Reply-To: <70d0a1130611220928x20e8af24i92af65ddc032ff0d@mail.gmail.com>
References: <ee2a432c0611211727s3ba06bffp3305cd98650fe0ff@mail.gmail.com>
	<70d0a1130611220928x20e8af24i92af65ddc032ff0d@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <4869cee70611271159n7c908a0eneb3618778ac02ceb@mail.gmail.com>

On 11/22/06, Noel Yap <noel.yap at gmail.com> wrote:
>
> Is there a Google Calendar event somewhere for this?
>
> Thanks,
> Noel


A Google Calendar of all open source events is in the works - I'll send an
announcement out to these two lists when it's available.

Cheers,
LH



-- 
Leslie Hawthorn
Open Source Program Office
Google Inc.
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From aahz at pythoncraft.com  Tue Nov 28 01:25:51 2006
From: aahz at pythoncraft.com (Aahz)
Date: Mon, 27 Nov 2006 16:25:51 -0800
Subject: [Baypiggies] FWD: Invitation to participate in The Python Papers
Message-ID: <20061128002551.GA7308@panix.com>

Forwarded with ZERO endorsement -- I encourage anyone who wants to follow
through to post to the list to avoid overlap.

----- Forwarded message from Tennessee Leeuwenburg <tennessee at tennessee.id.au> -----

> Date: Tue, 28 Nov 2006 11:10:21 +1100
> From: Tennessee Leeuwenburg <tennessee at tennessee.id.au>
> To: editor at pythonpapers.org
> Subject: Invitation to participate in The Python Papers
> 
> Greetings all,
> 
> You are recieving this message because you are a contact on one of the
> Python User Groups available from the Python homepage.
> 
> I am the Editor-In-Chief of a new Python journal, "The Python Papers"
> (http://pythonpapers.org). We (the editorial board) are trying to
> build up a valuable community resource, and would like to include as
> many different voices as possible. It would be wonderful to include
> introductions, profiles and insight into the various individuals and
> groups using Python around the world.
> 
> To this end, this message is being sent to one Python User's Group
> from each geographic region.
> 
> We invite you to contribute a brief article discussing your local
> groups. Depending on the number of responses, they will either be
> assembled into a single article for the next edition, or if the
> response is too large for this, presented as a series of in-depth
> articles over the coming year.
> 
> Some of you may not have English as a first language. The Python
> Papers is written chiefly in English. We are happy to include articles
> written in other languages, preferably including an English
> translation with the original language version.
> 
> If you would like to participate, but are unsure about what to
> include, here are some suggestions:
>  * Where the user group is based
>  * Who are the active members
>  * How long the group has existed for
>  * How frequently meetings are held
>  * Any particular programming interests held by members
>  * Upcoming events
>  * Photographs of the local area
>  * Information on local culture
>  * Comments on how Python is used in your country
> 
> We also accept academic peer-reviewed proposals, so if any of your
> members would like to publish academic research, The Python Papers is
> also an appropriate vehicle for that.
> 
> Cheers,
> -T
> (Editor-In-Chief)
> 
> (p.s., we also need to contact groups from other countries from
> time-to-time. A few groups were not contacted because we couldn't
> establish a contact email. If anyone has foreign language skills in
> Italian, Chinese (I don't know if the site is in Mandarin or Catonese)
> or Japanese, it would be great if you could provide us with a contact
> email address for an appropriate local group.

----- End forwarded message -----

-- 
Aahz (aahz at pythoncraft.com)           <*>         http://www.pythoncraft.com/

Usenet is not a democracy.  It is a weird cross between an anarchy and a
dictatorship.

From beau at open-source-staffing.com  Wed Nov 29 11:10:20 2006
From: beau at open-source-staffing.com (Beau Gould)
Date: Wed, 29 Nov 2006 04:10:20 -0600
Subject: [Baypiggies] [JOB] Sr. Zope/Python Programmer, San Mateo, CA
Message-ID: <008901c7139e$93bb88d0$0201a8c0@BEAU>

Sr. Zope/Python Programmer, San Mateo, CA 

I just heard through the grapevine that one of my client's was going to
be hiring a senior-level Zope/Python Programmer for their San Mateo
office

My client provides advanced Voice 2.0 services over mobile networks.
They are helping their customers get the most out of their mobile
experience by improving the flexibility, privacy, and security of their
mobile lives. Funded by a top tier venture capital firm.

If you are interested in this position, please submit your resume,
salary requirements, and a paragraph (or two) highlighting your
skills/experience as it pertains to this job to
beau at open-source-staffing.com 

Thank you,
Beau J. Gould
 
Open Source Staffing
www.open-source-staffing.com
beau at open-source-staffing.com


From aahz at pythoncraft.com  Wed Nov 29 16:19:18 2006
From: aahz at pythoncraft.com (Aahz)
Date: Wed, 29 Nov 2006 07:19:18 -0800
Subject: [Baypiggies] ADMIN: Job postings
In-Reply-To: <008901c7139e$93bb88d0$0201a8c0@BEAU>
References: <008901c7139e$93bb88d0$0201a8c0@BEAU>
Message-ID: <20061129151918.GB4678@panix.com>

On Wed, Nov 29, 2006, Beau Gould wrote:
> 
> I just heard through the grapevine that one of my client's was going to
> be hiring a senior-level Zope/Python Programmer for their San Mateo
> office
> 
> Beau J. Gould
> Open Source Staffing

Unless you are the actual hiring company, please do not post job ads on
BayPIGgies.  See the rules at 

http://baypiggies.net/jobs.html
-- 
Aahz (aahz at pythoncraft.com)           <*>         http://www.pythoncraft.com/

Usenet is not a democracy.  It is a weird cross between an anarchy and a
dictatorship.

From mac at Wireless.Com  Wed Nov 29 17:59:54 2006
From: mac at Wireless.Com (Mike Cheponis)
Date: Wed, 29 Nov 2006 08:59:54 -0800 (PST)
Subject: [Baypiggies] ADMIN: Job postings
In-Reply-To: <20061129151918.GB4678@panix.com>
References: <008901c7139e$93bb88d0$0201a8c0@BEAU>
	<20061129151918.GB4678@panix.com>
Message-ID: <Pine.NEB.4.64.0611290859290.1049@S.culver.net>

Who makes these rules?

I think they are not in the best interests of our membership.

Thanks, -Mike


On Wed, 29 Nov 2006, Aahz wrote:

> Date: Wed, 29 Nov 2006 07:19:18 -0800
> From: Aahz <aahz at pythoncraft.com>
> To: Beau Gould <beau at open-source-staffing.com>
> Cc: baypiggies at python.org
> Subject: Re: [Baypiggies] ADMIN: Job postings
> 
> On Wed, Nov 29, 2006, Beau Gould wrote:
>>
>> I just heard through the grapevine that one of my client's was going to
>> be hiring a senior-level Zope/Python Programmer for their San Mateo
>> office
>>
>> Beau J. Gould
>> Open Source Staffing
>
> Unless you are the actual hiring company, please do not post job ads on
> BayPIGgies.  See the rules at
>
> http://baypiggies.net/jobs.html
> -- 
> Aahz (aahz at pythoncraft.com)           <*>         http://www.pythoncraft.com/
>
> Usenet is not a democracy.  It is a weird cross between an anarchy and a
> dictatorship.
> _______________________________________________
> Baypiggies mailing list
> Baypiggies at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/baypiggies
>


From beau at open-source-staffing.com  Wed Nov 29 19:52:01 2006
From: beau at open-source-staffing.com (Beau Gould)
Date: Wed, 29 Nov 2006 12:52:01 -0600
Subject: [Baypiggies] ADMIN: Job postings
In-Reply-To: <20061129151918.GB4678@panix.com>
Message-ID: <00c201c713e7$751a9d00$0201a8c0@BEAU>

Out of curiosity, if a recruiter has a real python job located in the
San Francisco area, why aren't they allowed to post?  The direct client
may never find this list and many of you may never know the job exists.
Rules are rules, but this one is, uhm, odd. 

Thank you,
Beau J. Gould



-----Original Message-----
From: Aahz [mailto:aahz at pythoncraft.com] 
Sent: Wednesday, November 29, 2006 9:19 AM
To: Beau Gould
Cc: baypiggies at python.org
Subject: Re: [Baypiggies] ADMIN: Job postings


On Wed, Nov 29, 2006, Beau Gould wrote:
> 
> I just heard through the grapevine that one of my client's was going 
> to be hiring a senior-level Zope/Python Programmer for their San Mateo

> office
> 
> Beau J. Gould
> Open Source Staffing

Unless you are the actual hiring company, please do not post job ads on
BayPIGgies.  See the rules at 

http://baypiggies.net/jobs.html
-- 
Aahz (aahz at pythoncraft.com)           <*>
http://www.pythoncraft.com/

Usenet is not a democracy.  It is a weird cross between an anarchy and a
dictatorship.


From guido at python.org  Wed Nov 29 18:58:14 2006
From: guido at python.org (Guido van Rossum)
Date: Wed, 29 Nov 2006 09:58:14 -0800
Subject: [Baypiggies] ADMIN: Job postings
In-Reply-To: <00c201c713e7$751a9d00$0201a8c0@BEAU>
References: <20061129151918.GB4678@panix.com>
	<00c201c713e7$751a9d00$0201a8c0@BEAU>
Message-ID: <ca471dc20611290958s5073497fm6da6bb7047291f05@mail.gmail.com>

Sorry, but we hate recruiters here. We have very good reasons.

On 11/29/06, Beau Gould <beau at open-source-staffing.com> wrote:
> Out of curiosity, if a recruiter has a real python job located in the
> San Francisco area, why aren't they allowed to post?  The direct client
> may never find this list and many of you may never know the job exists.
> Rules are rules, but this one is, uhm, odd.
>
> Thank you,
> Beau J. Gould
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Aahz [mailto:aahz at pythoncraft.com]
> Sent: Wednesday, November 29, 2006 9:19 AM
> To: Beau Gould
> Cc: baypiggies at python.org
> Subject: Re: [Baypiggies] ADMIN: Job postings
>
>
> On Wed, Nov 29, 2006, Beau Gould wrote:
> >
> > I just heard through the grapevine that one of my client's was going
> > to be hiring a senior-level Zope/Python Programmer for their San Mateo
>
> > office
> >
> > Beau J. Gould
> > Open Source Staffing
>
> Unless you are the actual hiring company, please do not post job ads on
> BayPIGgies.  See the rules at
>
> http://baypiggies.net/jobs.html
> --
> Aahz (aahz at pythoncraft.com)           <*>
> http://www.pythoncraft.com/
>
> Usenet is not a democracy.  It is a weird cross between an anarchy and a
> dictatorship.
>
> _______________________________________________
> Baypiggies mailing list
> Baypiggies at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/baypiggies
>


-- 
--Guido van Rossum (home page: http://www.python.org/~guido/)

From beau at open-source-staffing.com  Wed Nov 29 20:02:09 2006
From: beau at open-source-staffing.com (Beau Gould)
Date: Wed, 29 Nov 2006 13:02:09 -0600
Subject: [Baypiggies] ADMIN: Job postings
In-Reply-To: <ca471dc20611290958s5073497fm6da6bb7047291f05@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <00c501c713e8$df5ea250$0201a8c0@BEAU>

Good answer.  Is that a unanimous "we" or just a handful?

Thank you,
Beau J. Gould



-----Original Message-----
From: gvanrossum at gmail.com [mailto:gvanrossum at gmail.com] On Behalf Of
Guido van Rossum
Sent: Wednesday, November 29, 2006 11:58 AM
To: Beau Gould
Cc: baypiggies at python.org
Subject: Re: [Baypiggies] ADMIN: Job postings


Sorry, but we hate recruiters here. We have very good reasons.

On 11/29/06, Beau Gould <beau at open-source-staffing.com> wrote:
> Out of curiosity, if a recruiter has a real python job located in the 
> San Francisco area, why aren't they allowed to post?  The direct 
> client may never find this list and many of you may never know the job

> exists. Rules are rules, but this one is, uhm, odd.
>
> Thank you,
> Beau J. Gould
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Aahz [mailto:aahz at pythoncraft.com]
> Sent: Wednesday, November 29, 2006 9:19 AM
> To: Beau Gould
> Cc: baypiggies at python.org
> Subject: Re: [Baypiggies] ADMIN: Job postings
>
>
> On Wed, Nov 29, 2006, Beau Gould wrote:
> >
> > I just heard through the grapevine that one of my client's was going

> > to be hiring a senior-level Zope/Python Programmer for their San 
> > Mateo
>
> > office
> >
> > Beau J. Gould
> > Open Source Staffing
>
> Unless you are the actual hiring company, please do not post job ads 
> on BayPIGgies.  See the rules at
>
> http://baypiggies.net/jobs.html
> --
> Aahz (aahz at pythoncraft.com)           <*>
> http://www.pythoncraft.com/
>
> Usenet is not a democracy.  It is a weird cross between an anarchy and

> a dictatorship.
>
> _______________________________________________
> Baypiggies mailing list
> Baypiggies at python.org 
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/baypiggies
>


-- 
--Guido van Rossum (home page: http://www.python.org/~guido/)


From bdbaddog at gmail.com  Wed Nov 29 19:04:29 2006
From: bdbaddog at gmail.com (William Deegan)
Date: Wed, 29 Nov 2006 10:04:29 -0800
Subject: [Baypiggies] ADMIN: Job postings
In-Reply-To: <00c501c713e8$df5ea250$0201a8c0@BEAU>
References: <ca471dc20611290958s5073497fm6da6bb7047291f05@mail.gmail.com>
	<00c501c713e8$df5ea250$0201a8c0@BEAU>
Message-ID: <8540148a0611291004n1d45a5dah7c061c3235a05512@mail.gmail.com>

I'd have to agree often they don't understand boundaries and rules..


On 11/29/06, Beau Gould <beau at open-source-staffing.com> wrote:
> Good answer.  Is that a unanimous "we" or just a handful?
>
> Thank you,
> Beau J. Gould
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: gvanrossum at gmail.com [mailto:gvanrossum at gmail.com] On Behalf Of
> Guido van Rossum
> Sent: Wednesday, November 29, 2006 11:58 AM
> To: Beau Gould
> Cc: baypiggies at python.org
> Subject: Re: [Baypiggies] ADMIN: Job postings
>
>
> Sorry, but we hate recruiters here. We have very good reasons.
>
> On 11/29/06, Beau Gould <beau at open-source-staffing.com> wrote:
> > Out of curiosity, if a recruiter has a real python job located in the
> > San Francisco area, why aren't they allowed to post?  The direct
> > client may never find this list and many of you may never know the job
>
> > exists. Rules are rules, but this one is, uhm, odd.
> >
> > Thank you,
> > Beau J. Gould
> >
> >
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: Aahz [mailto:aahz at pythoncraft.com]
> > Sent: Wednesday, November 29, 2006 9:19 AM
> > To: Beau Gould
> > Cc: baypiggies at python.org
> > Subject: Re: [Baypiggies] ADMIN: Job postings
> >
> >
> > On Wed, Nov 29, 2006, Beau Gould wrote:
> > >
> > > I just heard through the grapevine that one of my client's was going
>
> > > to be hiring a senior-level Zope/Python Programmer for their San
> > > Mateo
> >
> > > office
> > >
> > > Beau J. Gould
> > > Open Source Staffing
> >
> > Unless you are the actual hiring company, please do not post job ads
> > on BayPIGgies.  See the rules at
> >
> > http://baypiggies.net/jobs.html
> > --
> > Aahz (aahz at pythoncraft.com)           <*>
> > http://www.pythoncraft.com/
> >
> > Usenet is not a democracy.  It is a weird cross between an anarchy and
>
> > a dictatorship.
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Baypiggies mailing list
> > Baypiggies at python.org
> > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/baypiggies
> >
>
>
> --
> --Guido van Rossum (home page: http://www.python.org/~guido/)
>
> _______________________________________________
> Baypiggies mailing list
> Baypiggies at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/baypiggies
>

From russell.whitaker at gmail.com  Wed Nov 29 19:04:56 2006
From: russell.whitaker at gmail.com (Russell Whitaker)
Date: Wed, 29 Nov 2006 10:04:56 -0800
Subject: [Baypiggies] ADMIN: Job postings
In-Reply-To: <ca471dc20611290958s5073497fm6da6bb7047291f05@mail.gmail.com>
References: <20061129151918.GB4678@panix.com>
	<00c201c713e7$751a9d00$0201a8c0@BEAU>
	<ca471dc20611290958s5073497fm6da6bb7047291f05@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <8d0785d00611291004u31d9e474pb03ed1f912afeaf0@mail.gmail.com>

On 11/29/06, Guido van Rossum <guido at python.org> wrote:
> Sorry, but we hate recruiters here. We have very good reasons.
>

Unless they're Google recruiters, of course...

Russell

> On 11/29/06, Beau Gould <beau at open-source-staffing.com> wrote:
> > Out of curiosity, if a recruiter has a real python job located in the
> > San Francisco area, why aren't they allowed to post?  The direct client
> > may never find this list and many of you may never know the job exists.
> > Rules are rules, but this one is, uhm, odd.
> >
> > Thank you,
> > Beau J. Gould
> >
> >
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: Aahz [mailto:aahz at pythoncraft.com]
> > Sent: Wednesday, November 29, 2006 9:19 AM
> > To: Beau Gould
> > Cc: baypiggies at python.org
> > Subject: Re: [Baypiggies] ADMIN: Job postings
> >
> >
> > On Wed, Nov 29, 2006, Beau Gould wrote:
> > >
> > > I just heard through the grapevine that one of my client's was going
> > > to be hiring a senior-level Zope/Python Programmer for their San Mateo
> >
> > > office
> > >
> > > Beau J. Gould
> > > Open Source Staffing
> >
> > Unless you are the actual hiring company, please do not post job ads on
> > BayPIGgies.  See the rules at
> >
> > http://baypiggies.net/jobs.html
> > --
> > Aahz (aahz at pythoncraft.com)           <*>
> > http://www.pythoncraft.com/
> >
> > Usenet is not a democracy.  It is a weird cross between an anarchy and a
> > dictatorship.
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Baypiggies mailing list
> > Baypiggies at python.org
> > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/baypiggies
> >
>
>
> --
> --Guido van Rossum (home page: http://www.python.org/~guido/)
> _______________________________________________
> Baypiggies mailing list
> Baypiggies at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/baypiggies
>


-- 
Russell Whitaker
http://www.survivalarts.com/

From hasan.diwan at gmail.com  Wed Nov 29 19:04:57 2006
From: hasan.diwan at gmail.com (Hasan Diwan)
Date: Wed, 29 Nov 2006 13:04:57 -0500
Subject: [Baypiggies] ADMIN: Job postings
In-Reply-To: <00c501c713e8$df5ea250$0201a8c0@BEAU>
References: <ca471dc20611290958s5073497fm6da6bb7047291f05@mail.gmail.com>
	<00c501c713e8$df5ea250$0201a8c0@BEAU>
Message-ID: <2cda2fc90611291004s7c915390i16599054e2beb6d0@mail.gmail.com>

On 29/11/06, Beau Gould <beau at open-source-staffing.com> wrote:
>
> Good answer.  Is that a unanimous "we" or just a handful?
>
Rules are done by concensus. We (unanimous or otherwise) don't like
recruiters spamming our mailing lists.
-- 
Cheers,
Hasan Diwan <hasan.diwan at gmail.com>
-------------- next part --------------
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From marilyn at deliberate.com  Wed Nov 29 19:05:32 2006
From: marilyn at deliberate.com (Marilyn Davis)
Date: Wed, 29 Nov 2006 10:05:32 -0800
Subject: [Baypiggies] ADMIN: Job postings
Message-ID: <20061129180556.358BC1E4016@bag.python.org>


----- On Wednesday, November 29, 2006 mac at Wireless.Com wrote:

> Who makes these rules?

Yes, good question.

I am more interested in knowing how rules for us are made, than I am in this particular rule.

But, it does seem an arbitrary rule, worthy of explanation.

Marilyn

> 
> I think they are not in the best interests of our membership.
> 
> Thanks, -Mike
> 
> 
> On Wed, 29 Nov 2006, Aahz wrote:
> 
>> Date: Wed, 29 Nov 2006 07:19:18 -0800
>> From: Aahz
>> To: Beau Gould
>> Cc: baypiggies at python.org
>> Subject: Re: [Baypiggies] ADMIN: Job postings
>>
>> On Wed, Nov 29, 2006, Beau Gould wrote:
>>>
>>> I just heard through the grapevine that one of my client's was going to
>>> be hiring a senior-level Zope/Python Programmer for their San Mateo
>>> office
>>>
>>> Beau J. Gould
>>> Open Source Staffing
>>
>> Unless you are the actual hiring company, please do not post job ads on
>> BayPIGgies.  See the rules at
>>
>> http://baypiggies.net/jobs.html
>> --
>> Aahz (aahz at pythoncraft.com)                    http://www.pythoncraft.com/
>>
>> Usenet is not a democracy.  It is a weird cross between an anarchy and a
>> dictatorship.
>> _______________________________________________
>> Baypiggies mailing list
>> Baypiggies at python.org
>> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/baypiggies
>>
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Baypiggies mailing list
> Baypiggies at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/baypiggies



From cvanarsdall at mvista.com  Wed Nov 29 19:09:11 2006
From: cvanarsdall at mvista.com (Carl J. Van Arsdall)
Date: Wed, 29 Nov 2006 10:09:11 -0800
Subject: [Baypiggies] ADMIN: Job postings
In-Reply-To: <2cda2fc90611291004s7c915390i16599054e2beb6d0@mail.gmail.com>
References: <ca471dc20611290958s5073497fm6da6bb7047291f05@mail.gmail.com>	<00c501c713e8$df5ea250$0201a8c0@BEAU>
	<2cda2fc90611291004s7c915390i16599054e2beb6d0@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <456DCCC7.6060400@mvista.com>

Hasan Diwan wrote:
> Rules are done by concensus. We (unanimous or otherwise) don't like 
> recruiters spamming our mailing lists.
>
I agree, this list could get a bit messy.  Maybe those that are 
interested in job postings from recruiters should set up another mailing 
list somewhere for that purpose.  Post it here for the people who would 
like to add themselves to it as well, and then everyone can be happy.

-carl



-- 

Carl J. Van Arsdall
cvanarsdall at mvista.com
Build and Release
MontaVista Software


From beau at open-source-staffing.com  Wed Nov 29 20:12:57 2006
From: beau at open-source-staffing.com (Beau Gould)
Date: Wed, 29 Nov 2006 13:12:57 -0600
Subject: [Baypiggies] ADMIN: Job postings
In-Reply-To: <8540148a0611291004n1d45a5dah7c061c3235a05512@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <00d101c713ea$614f4b10$0201a8c0@BEAU>

Ok, I'm sold.  I shall never return; however, if anyone wants to
subscribe to my Python jobs mailing list, please feel free to do so:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/pythonzopejobs

This list is moderated, no spam, no un-related posts.  Just Python jobs
(USA only). Over 400 members. Founded: Jul 28, 2003.

Thank you,
Beau J. Gould
 
Open Source Staffing
www.open-source-staffing.com
beau at open-source-staffing.com



-----Original Message-----
From: William Deegan [mailto:bdbaddog at gmail.com] 
Sent: Wednesday, November 29, 2006 12:04 PM
To: Beau Gould
Cc: baypiggies at python.org
Subject: Re: [Baypiggies] ADMIN: Job postings


I'd have to agree often they don't understand boundaries and rules..


On 11/29/06, Beau Gould <beau at open-source-staffing.com> wrote:
> Good answer.  Is that a unanimous "we" or just a handful?
>
> Thank you,
> Beau J. Gould
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: gvanrossum at gmail.com [mailto:gvanrossum at gmail.com] On Behalf Of 
> Guido van Rossum
> Sent: Wednesday, November 29, 2006 11:58 AM
> To: Beau Gould
> Cc: baypiggies at python.org
> Subject: Re: [Baypiggies] ADMIN: Job postings
>
>
> Sorry, but we hate recruiters here. We have very good reasons.
>
> On 11/29/06, Beau Gould <beau at open-source-staffing.com> wrote:
> > Out of curiosity, if a recruiter has a real python job located in 
> > the San Francisco area, why aren't they allowed to post?  The direct

> > client may never find this list and many of you may never know the 
> > job
>
> > exists. Rules are rules, but this one is, uhm, odd.
> >
> > Thank you,
> > Beau J. Gould
> >
> >
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: Aahz [mailto:aahz at pythoncraft.com]
> > Sent: Wednesday, November 29, 2006 9:19 AM
> > To: Beau Gould
> > Cc: baypiggies at python.org
> > Subject: Re: [Baypiggies] ADMIN: Job postings
> >
> >
> > On Wed, Nov 29, 2006, Beau Gould wrote:
> > >
> > > I just heard through the grapevine that one of my client's was 
> > > going
>
> > > to be hiring a senior-level Zope/Python Programmer for their San 
> > > Mateo
> >
> > > office
> > >
> > > Beau J. Gould
> > > Open Source Staffing
> >
> > Unless you are the actual hiring company, please do not post job ads

> > on BayPIGgies.  See the rules at
> >
> > http://baypiggies.net/jobs.html
> > --
> > Aahz (aahz at pythoncraft.com)           <*>
> > http://www.pythoncraft.com/
> >
> > Usenet is not a democracy.  It is a weird cross between an anarchy 
> > and
>
> > a dictatorship.
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Baypiggies mailing list
> > Baypiggies at python.org 
> > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/baypiggies
> >
>
>
> --
> --Guido van Rossum (home page: http://www.python.org/~guido/)
>
> _______________________________________________
> Baypiggies mailing list
> Baypiggies at python.org 
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/baypiggies
>


From aahz at pythoncraft.com  Wed Nov 29 19:36:02 2006
From: aahz at pythoncraft.com (Aahz)
Date: Wed, 29 Nov 2006 10:36:02 -0800
Subject: [Baypiggies] ADMIN: Job postings
In-Reply-To: <Pine.NEB.4.64.0611290859290.1049@S.culver.net>
References: <008901c7139e$93bb88d0$0201a8c0@BEAU>
	<20061129151918.GB4678@panix.com>
	<Pine.NEB.4.64.0611290859290.1049@S.culver.net>
Message-ID: <20061129183602.GA18601@panix.com>

On Wed, Nov 29, 2006, Mike Cheponis wrote:
>
> Who makes these rules?
> 
> I think they are not in the best interests of our membership.

In the end, as the list admin, I make the rules.  However, these rules
come from long experience with the pain that results from recruiters
posting.  All too frequently, they post excessively, without caring
whether the jobs really require Python, and it often results in multiple
postings for the same job.

So unless there's a massive outcry from a substantial portion of the
list membership, the rule stands.  It is IMO the best compromise between
prohibiting job ads and the free-for-all that can result from allowing
any ads.

And *NO*, do not start a big thread on BayPIGgies.  If you support Mike's
position, send him email, and he can post a summary -- including e-mail
addresses registered to the list.

Someone asked about Google recruiters -- those are different because they
are employed by Google, it's effectively like an HR person posting.  As
the job rules say, we *prefer* technical people to post jobs, but it's
perfectly fine for in-house recruiters to post.
-- 
Aahz (aahz at pythoncraft.com)           <*>         http://www.pythoncraft.com/

Usenet is not a democracy.  It is a weird cross between an anarchy and a
dictatorship.

From russell.whitaker at gmail.com  Wed Nov 29 19:48:55 2006
From: russell.whitaker at gmail.com (Russell Whitaker)
Date: Wed, 29 Nov 2006 10:48:55 -0800
Subject: [Baypiggies] ADMIN: Job postings
In-Reply-To: <20061129183602.GA18601@panix.com>
References: <008901c7139e$93bb88d0$0201a8c0@BEAU>
	<20061129151918.GB4678@panix.com>
	<Pine.NEB.4.64.0611290859290.1049@S.culver.net>
	<20061129183602.GA18601@panix.com>
Message-ID: <8d0785d00611291048p3551b3d8i6df75a1ca7d52fb1@mail.gmail.com>

On 11/29/06, Aahz <aahz at pythoncraft.com> wrote:
>
> Someone asked about Google recruiters -- those are different because they
> are employed by Google, it's effectively like an HR person posting.  As
> the job rules say, we *prefer* technical people to post jobs, but it's
> perfectly fine for in-house recruiters to post.
> --

By the way, just in case anyone misinterpreted the intent of my _own_ mention
of Google recruiters (my reply to Guido): *I was joking*.  I, like
Guido, work at Google,
and was simply expressing my own pro-Google bias.  If you're a really
good Python
programmer, *I* want to find you first before some institutional
programmer does...

...which reminds me: I'm a team lead for a group which is looking for Python
programmers who have very strong sysadmin backgrounds.  You need to be
willing to work in Mt. View, New York City, or Beijing.  Please send
me your resume:

whitaker at google dot com

-- 
Russell Whitaker
http://www.survivalarts.com/

From beau at open-source-staffing.com  Wed Nov 29 21:19:26 2006
From: beau at open-source-staffing.com (Beau Gould)
Date: Wed, 29 Nov 2006 14:19:26 -0600
Subject: [Baypiggies] ADMIN: Job postings
In-Reply-To: <1164827676.5312.22.camel@localhost.localdomain>
Message-ID: <012e01c713f3$ab202620$0201a8c0@BEAU>

Doesn't ring a bell.  You must have me confused with someone else.
There's a lot of negative energy on this list. 


-----Original Message-----
From: Michael Bernstein [mailto:webmaven at cox.net] 
Sent: Wednesday, November 29, 2006 1:15 PM
To: Beau Gould
Cc: baypiggies at python.org
Subject: Re: [Baypiggies] ADMIN: Job postings


On Wed, 2006-11-29 at 13:12 -0600, Beau Gould wrote:
> Ok, I'm sold.  I shall never return; however, if anyone wants to 
> subscribe to my Python jobs mailing list, please feel free to do so: 
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/pythonzopejobs
> 
> This list is moderated, no spam, no un-related posts.  Just Python 
> jobs (USA only). Over 400 members. Founded: Jul 28, 2003.

No unrelated posts? Sure, except for that time last December you decided
to change the list to 'allopensourcejobs', changed the list policy to
moderated, and proceeded to spam the list with unrelated PHP/MySQL jobs.

Not to mention the the fact that when I politely insisted you needed to
actually *announce* the change to your subscribers (who, according to
you, are mostly 'recruiters and Indian dudes'), you banned me from the
list.

- Michael Bernstein



From webmaven at cox.net  Wed Nov 29 20:14:36 2006
From: webmaven at cox.net (Michael Bernstein)
Date: Wed, 29 Nov 2006 11:14:36 -0800
Subject: [Baypiggies] ADMIN: Job postings
In-Reply-To: <00d101c713ea$614f4b10$0201a8c0@BEAU>
References: <00d101c713ea$614f4b10$0201a8c0@BEAU>
Message-ID: <1164827676.5312.22.camel@localhost.localdomain>

On Wed, 2006-11-29 at 13:12 -0600, Beau Gould wrote:
> Ok, I'm sold.  I shall never return; however, if anyone wants to
> subscribe to my Python jobs mailing list, please feel free to do so:
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/pythonzopejobs
> 
> This list is moderated, no spam, no un-related posts.  Just Python jobs
> (USA only). Over 400 members. Founded: Jul 28, 2003.

No unrelated posts? Sure, except for that time last December you decided
to change the list to 'allopensourcejobs', changed the list policy to
moderated, and proceeded to spam the list with unrelated PHP/MySQL jobs.

Not to mention the the fact that when I politely insisted you needed to
actually *announce* the change to your subscribers (who, according to
you, are mostly 'recruiters and Indian dudes'), you banned me from the
list.

- Michael Bernstein


From webmaven at cox.net  Wed Nov 29 20:35:46 2006
From: webmaven at cox.net (Michael Bernstein)
Date: Wed, 29 Nov 2006 11:35:46 -0800
Subject: [Baypiggies] ADMIN: Job postings
In-Reply-To: <012e01c713f3$ab202620$0201a8c0@BEAU>
References: <012e01c713f3$ab202620$0201a8c0@BEAU>
Message-ID: <1164828946.5312.29.camel@localhost.localdomain>

On Wed, 2006-11-29 at 14:19 -0600, Beau Gould wrote:
> Doesn't ring a bell.  You must have me confused with someone else.

Really?

Here is one of your responses to me at the time:

        From: Beau Gould <beau at superiorss.com>
        To: 'Michael Bernstein' <webmaven at cox.net>
        Subject: RE: [allopensourcejobs] MySQL/PHP Engineer, Los
        Angeles, CA
        Date: Sun, 11 Dec 2005 18:42:34 -0600
        
        Unfortunately I don't make 100/hour like some people.  I have to
        feed my family.  I'm trying this.  If you don't like it unsub. 



> There's a lot of negative energy on this list. 

Only toward spamming recruiters.

- Michael Bernstein


From beau at open-source-staffing.com  Wed Nov 29 21:40:00 2006
From: beau at open-source-staffing.com (Beau Gould)
Date: Wed, 29 Nov 2006 14:40:00 -0600
Subject: [Baypiggies] ADMIN: Job postings
In-Reply-To: <1164828946.5312.29.camel@localhost.localdomain>
Message-ID: <013e01c713f6$8aaa5610$0201a8c0@BEAU>

That's not me.  Note the email address.  Sorry.


-----Original Message-----
From: Michael Bernstein [mailto:webmaven at cox.net] 
Sent: Wednesday, November 29, 2006 1:36 PM
To: Beau Gould
Cc: baypiggies at python.org
Subject: Re: [Baypiggies] ADMIN: Job postings


On Wed, 2006-11-29 at 14:19 -0600, Beau Gould wrote:
> Doesn't ring a bell.  You must have me confused with someone else.

Really?

Here is one of your responses to me at the time:

        From: Beau Gould <beau at superiorss.com>
        To: 'Michael Bernstein' <webmaven at cox.net>
        Subject: RE: [allopensourcejobs] MySQL/PHP Engineer, Los
        Angeles, CA
        Date: Sun, 11 Dec 2005 18:42:34 -0600
        
        Unfortunately I don't make 100/hour like some people.  I have to
        feed my family.  I'm trying this.  If you don't like it unsub. 



> There's a lot of negative energy on this list.

Only toward spamming recruiters.

- Michael Bernstein



From webmaven at cox.net  Wed Nov 29 21:04:03 2006
From: webmaven at cox.net (Michael Bernstein)
Date: Wed, 29 Nov 2006 12:04:03 -0800
Subject: [Baypiggies] ADMIN: Job postings
In-Reply-To: <013e01c713f6$8aaa5610$0201a8c0@BEAU>
References: <013e01c713f6$8aaa5610$0201a8c0@BEAU>
Message-ID: <1164830643.5312.38.camel@localhost.localdomain>

On Wed, 2006-11-29 at 14:40 -0600, Beau Gould wrote:
> That's not me.  Note the email address.  Sorry.

You're just digging yourself in deeper here.

Beau Gould <beau at superiorss.com> at Superior Staffing Solutions was the
admin of the pythonzopejobs list last year. Beau Gould
<beau at open-source-staffing.com> at Open Source Staffing is the admin of
the same pythonzopejobs list.

I think it's stretching our credulity too far to claim that two email
addresses associated with the same name in the same industry
administering the same darn list are actually different people.

- Michael Bernstein


From cuba at iotacenter.org  Wed Nov 29 21:51:56 2006
From: cuba at iotacenter.org (Larry Cuba)
Date: Wed, 29 Nov 2006 12:51:56 -0800
Subject: [Baypiggies] ADMIN: Job postings
In-Reply-To: <20061129183602.GA18601@panix.com>
References: <008901c7139e$93bb88d0$0201a8c0@BEAU>
	<20061129151918.GB4678@panix.com>
	<Pine.NEB.4.64.0611290859290.1049@S.culver.net>
	<20061129183602.GA18601@panix.com>
Message-ID: <6.1.1.1.2.20061129125029.02542138@localhost>



At 10:36 AM 11/29/2006, Aahz  wrote:

>And *NO*, do not start a big thread on BayPIGgies.

too late.

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From ddurham at yahoo-inc.com  Thu Nov 30 00:11:44 2006
From: ddurham at yahoo-inc.com (Doug Durham)
Date: Wed, 29 Nov 2006 15:11:44 -0800
Subject: [Baypiggies] Job at Yahoo! Search
Message-ID: <00f001c7140b$bcb1c070$fc9115ac@ds.corp.yahoo.com>

Greetings Piggies,

 

I am Doug Durham a hiring manager here at Yahoo! Search.  I manage the
Relevance Tools team where we develop tools and applications to measure and
improve web search relevance.  

 

We use Python for our core web relevance framework.  We have deployed
several applications using Cheetah templates and the Aquarium framework.

 

I am looking for someone who can develop tools in Python and has experience
managing reliable remote web applications.  Knowing an Asian language is a
plus.

 

I have already recruited two engineers on my team from Bay Piggies and have
been very impressed with the caliber of the engineers on this list.

 

If you are interested in learning everything about Web Search while
developing applications in Python this may be the position for you.  

 

The full job description is given below.

 

Regards,

 

Doug Durham

Manager, Relevance Tools Team

Yahoo! Search

ddurham at yahoo-inc.com

 

Position: Senior Software Engineer, Relevance Tools

Location: Santa Clara, Ca.

Job ID: RX1000018614

The Internet is a big, busy place, and we at Yahoo! are proud to stand out
in the crowd. As the world's number one Internet brand, servicing over a
half billion people, we're determined to maintain our commitment to
delivering news, entertainment, information and fun... each and every day. 

 

In order to maintain our position as one of the world's most trafficked
Internet destinations, we're always on the lookout for people with big ideas
and big talent to help us provide our visitors with the innovative products
and services they've come to expect from Yahoo!. We're looking for people
like you.

 

How Big Can You Think?

 

How good is Yahoo Search? In what ways is it better than the competition,
and in what ways is it worse? The Yahoo Search Technology Relevance Tools
group is seeking an experienced software engineer to design and build tools
for answering questions like these. We're passionate about building the best
search engine on the planet, and our team brings together some of the best
and brightest minds from across the search industry. Our product now powers
over 100M queries a day, and the Relevance Tools team plays a key role in
informing decisions about its direction. As part of the team, you will be
responsible for designing, implementing and deploying tools used for
evaluating web-search relevance and for creating relevance modeling data.
You will play an important role in improving and evaluating the quality of
Yahoo! web-search results.

 

Essential Responsibilities

 

Work as part of a team of engineers who build tools used for measuring
relevance and for creating relevance modeling data. Work with research,
analysis, and editorial teams, as well as other engineering teams, to
define, design, and implement relevance evaluation and modeling data
creation methodologies. Help to produce metrics of success that are
fundamental to the web-search development effort. 

 

Minimum Job Qualifications

 

* Experience in building web-based tools, using languages such as Python,
Perl, and/or Javascript.

* Experience in deploying and maintaining remote Web applications. 

* Outstanding track record of teamwork and excellent communication skills.

* Database application development experience. (MySQL).

 

Preferred Job Qualifications

 

* BS in Computer Science (or equivalent experience).

* Fluency in a South-East Asian language.

* 5+ years of software development experience.

* Search Engine/Information Retrieval experience.

* Background in statistics and/or data mining.

* C/C++ programming experience.

* Experience in user interface design.

* Experience with software internationalization.

 

Yahoo! Inc. is an equal opportunity employer. For more information or to
search all of our openings, please visit http://careers.yahoo.com.

HJIIT10 

 

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From jjinux at gmail.com  Thu Nov 30 01:17:38 2006
From: jjinux at gmail.com (Shannon -jj Behrens)
Date: Wed, 29 Nov 2006 16:17:38 -0800
Subject: [Baypiggies] ADMIN: Job postings
In-Reply-To: <1164830643.5312.38.camel@localhost.localdomain>
References: <013e01c713f6$8aaa5610$0201a8c0@BEAU>
	<1164830643.5312.38.camel@localhost.localdomain>
Message-ID: <c41f67b90611291617q15a34ebbwd21aace4d1738057@mail.gmail.com>

That's friggin' hilarious!  I'm wondering if I should just go ahead
and write an email filter to delete anything from Beau Gould! ;)

Thanks, Michael for the scoop!

hahaha

-jj

On 11/29/06, Michael Bernstein <webmaven at cox.net> wrote:
> On Wed, 2006-11-29 at 14:40 -0600, Beau Gould wrote:
> > That's not me.  Note the email address.  Sorry.
>
> You're just digging yourself in deeper here.
>
> Beau Gould <beau at superiorss.com> at Superior Staffing Solutions was the
> admin of the pythonzopejobs list last year. Beau Gould
> <beau at open-source-staffing.com> at Open Source Staffing is the admin of
> the same pythonzopejobs list.
>
> I think it's stretching our credulity too far to claim that two email
> addresses associated with the same name in the same industry
> administering the same darn list are actually different people.
>
> - Michael Bernstein
>
> _______________________________________________
> Baypiggies mailing list
> Baypiggies at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/baypiggies
>


-- 
http://jjinux.blogspot.com/

From wescpy at gmail.com  Thu Nov 30 01:30:17 2006
From: wescpy at gmail.com (wesley chun)
Date: Wed, 29 Nov 2006 16:30:17 -0800
Subject: [Baypiggies] ADMIN: Job postings
In-Reply-To: <c41f67b90611291617q15a34ebbwd21aace4d1738057@mail.gmail.com>
References: <013e01c713f6$8aaa5610$0201a8c0@BEAU>
	<1164830643.5312.38.camel@localhost.localdomain>
	<c41f67b90611291617q15a34ebbwd21aace4d1738057@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <78b3a9580611291630o7b286614j16c0d2b55a55fda2@mail.gmail.com>

> > > That's not me.  Note the email address.  Sorry.
> > You're just digging yourself in deeper here.
> >
> > Beau Gould <beau at superiorss.com> at Superior Staffing Solutions was the
> > admin of the pythonzopejobs list last year. Beau Gould
> > <beau at open-source-staffing.com> at Open Source Staffing is the admin of
> > the same pythonzopejobs list.
> >
> > I think it's stretching our credulity too far to claim that two email
> > addresses associated with the same name in the same industry
> > administering the same darn list are actually different people.
>
> That's friggin' hilarious!  I'm wondering if I should just go ahead
> and write an email filter to delete anything from Beau Gould! ;)
>
> Thanks, Michael for the scoop!
> hahaha


as much as i want to promote the use of python, python jobs, python
everywhere, etc., this e-mail thread today speaks for itself and has
confirmed *why* we don't accept 3rd party solicitations.  'nuff said.
let's move on.

From jim at well.com  Wed Nov 29 18:27:16 2006
From: jim at well.com (jim stockford)
Date: Wed, 29 Nov 2006 09:27:16 -0800
Subject: [Baypiggies] ADMIN: Job postings
In-Reply-To: <Pine.NEB.4.64.0611290859290.1049@S.culver.net>
References: <008901c7139e$93bb88d0$0201a8c0@BEAU>
	<20061129151918.GB4678@panix.com>
	<Pine.NEB.4.64.0611290859290.1049@S.culver.net>
Message-ID: <67e4bff947ad13e5df2438eb21c4c2f6@well.com>


    i agree, although SIG lists may suffer from
wanton job postings. I like the kind of rule
that permits job postings that are appropriate
to the group as well as brief and to the point.


On Nov 29, 2006, at 8:59 AM, Mike Cheponis wrote:

> Who makes these rules?
>
> I think they are not in the best interests of our membership.
>
> Thanks, -Mike
>
>
> On Wed, 29 Nov 2006, Aahz wrote:
>
>> Date: Wed, 29 Nov 2006 07:19:18 -0800
>> From: Aahz <aahz at pythoncraft.com>
>> To: Beau Gould <beau at open-source-staffing.com>
>> Cc: baypiggies at python.org
>> Subject: Re: [Baypiggies] ADMIN: Job postings
>>
>> On Wed, Nov 29, 2006, Beau Gould wrote:
>>>
>>> I just heard through the grapevine that one of my client's was going 
>>> to
>>> be hiring a senior-level Zope/Python Programmer for their San Mateo
>>> office
>>>
>>> Beau J. Gould
>>> Open Source Staffing
>>
>> Unless you are the actual hiring company, please do not post job ads 
>> on
>> BayPIGgies.  See the rules at
>>
>> http://baypiggies.net/jobs.html
>> -- 
>> Aahz (aahz at pythoncraft.com)           <*>         
>> http://www.pythoncraft.com/
>>
>> Usenet is not a democracy.  It is a weird cross between an anarchy 
>> and a
>> dictatorship.
>> _______________________________________________
>> Baypiggies mailing list
>> Baypiggies at python.org
>> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/baypiggies
>>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Baypiggies mailing list
> Baypiggies at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/baypiggies
>