From charles.merriam at gmail.com  Mon Sep  1 03:27:14 2008
From: charles.merriam at gmail.com (Charles Merriam)
Date: Sun, 31 Aug 2008 18:27:14 -0700
Subject: [Baypiggies] Looking for a newbie nugget presenter for Thursday,
	Sept 11th
In-Reply-To: <c41f67b90808291619n6b7e7f0bi7b828d3e5326f2fb@mail.gmail.com>
References: <8249c4ac0808281253y2d07a003h38cd077e1e14315b@mail.gmail.com>
	<ec47901a0808281614j4d68acbahccc5d49414f6445f@mail.gmail.com>
	<c41f67b90808281817p60990bb3ud9fddbce3d1e027e@mail.gmail.com>
	<47c890dc0808281830j67023214v21e833ff118bea55@mail.gmail.com>
	<1621f9fa0808291305w16770b37u5a2930592d4a25dd@mail.gmail.com>
	<c41f67b90808291619n6b7e7f0bi7b828d3e5326f2fb@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <b8c6f6c40808311827t66db9cabj3785bfbfac7809b0@mail.gmail.com>

+1 on any talk working through scoping and immutables.

I can give an introduction to Nose in 11 minutes.  I would want
someone to be the back-up laptop in case of projector problems.   I'm
getting cautious about running interactive demonstrations without a
back-up.

From max at theslimmers.net  Tue Sep  2 18:13:14 2008
From: max at theslimmers.net (Max Slimmer)
Date: Tue, 02 Sep 2008 09:13:14 -0700
Subject: [Baypiggies] translating shell environment variables
In-Reply-To: <ea8debc80808271210q47c5356ex81ade329f41df5f9@mail.gmail.com>
References: <ea8debc80808271210q47c5356ex81ade329f41df5f9@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <48BD661A.40803@theslimmers.net>

Shiqi Yang wrote:
> Hi, My python code is reading some xml files that have several shell
> style environment variables like "$_" or "$$".
> for example:
> <var name='tmp_log_file'>/tmp/$$.log</var>
> I need to extract them and translate them into real value when I read the file.
>
> Now I can only think of two ways of doing this,
> 1 is to have a big dictionary in my python code which have all the
> mappings from shell to python os module(or others as well)
> another way is to get shell involved and have it pre-process the file,
> but I'm afraid that way some of the values may not be well translated
> since the context switch (like the pids, etc).
>
> Are there any python module that could help this kind of task?
> or anyone has done similar work can share your experience?
>
> Any help will be highly appreciated.
>
> Thanks,
>
>   
you can use os.path.expandvars() on the cdata

From charles.merriam at gmail.com  Tue Sep  2 20:28:39 2008
From: charles.merriam at gmail.com (Charles Merriam)
Date: Tue, 2 Sep 2008 11:28:39 -0700
Subject: [Baypiggies] Class methods as constructors?
Message-ID: <b8c6f6c40809021128r3927cc2bu1150f12bad45098e@mail.gmail.com>

This may seem like a basic question.   Apologies if it's a known recipe.

I have a spot where I need a number of constructors for the same class
and don't want to have too complicated an __init__ function.   Using
class methods seems like the cleanest code.

x = Spam()   # Simple case
x = Spam.Pickled_Loaf(['Pimentos','Menthos'])
x = Spam.Shake('chunky')

with code in the Spam class like:

@classmethod
def Picked_Loaf(additives, extra_gelatin = False):
     assert not ('Menthos' in additives and 'Diet Coke' in additives)
     i = Spam()  # make an instance
     i.additives = additives
     i.add_to_production_queue(Process.chopping)
     return i

Is this the usual pattern?  Any gotchas?  Usually use "cls()" instead
of "Spam()"?

Charles

From aleax at google.com  Tue Sep  2 21:12:07 2008
From: aleax at google.com (Alex Martelli)
Date: Tue, 2 Sep 2008 12:12:07 -0700
Subject: [Baypiggies] Class methods as constructors?
In-Reply-To: <b8c6f6c40809021128r3927cc2bu1150f12bad45098e@mail.gmail.com>
References: <b8c6f6c40809021128r3927cc2bu1150f12bad45098e@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <55dc209b0809021212s46457101vd99e285a2064b849@mail.gmail.com>

On Tue, Sep 2, 2008 at 11:28 AM, Charles Merriam
<charles.merriam at gmail.com> wrote:
> This may seem like a basic question.   Apologies if it's a known recipe.
>
> I have a spot where I need a number of constructors for the same class
> and don't want to have too complicated an __init__ function.   Using
> class methods seems like the cleanest code.
>
> x = Spam()   # Simple case
> x = Spam.Pickled_Loaf(['Pimentos','Menthos'])
> x = Spam.Shake('chunky')
>
> with code in the Spam class like:
>
> @classmethod
> def Picked_Loaf(additives, extra_gelatin = False):

You missed the cls first argument.

>     assert not ('Menthos' in additives and 'Diet Coke' in additives)
>     i = Spam()  # make an instance
>     i.additives = additives
>     i.add_to_production_queue(Process.chopping)
>     return i
>
> Is this the usual pattern?  Any gotchas?  Usually use "cls()" instead
> of "Spam()"?

Yes, yes (you need to have cls!) AND most emphatically yes (if you
don't call cls(), inheritance will produce pretty weird results).


Alex

From aahz at pythoncraft.com  Tue Sep  2 22:47:05 2008
From: aahz at pythoncraft.com (Aahz)
Date: Tue, 2 Sep 2008 13:47:05 -0700
Subject: [Baypiggies] Class methods as constructors?
In-Reply-To: <b8c6f6c40809021128r3927cc2bu1150f12bad45098e@mail.gmail.com>
References: <b8c6f6c40809021128r3927cc2bu1150f12bad45098e@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <20080902204705.GA25851@panix.com>

On Tue, Sep 02, 2008, Charles Merriam wrote:
> 
> I have a spot where I need a number of constructors for the same class
> and don't want to have too complicated an __init__ function.   Using
> class methods seems like the cleanest code.
> 
> x = Spam()   # Simple case
> x = Spam.Pickled_Loaf(['Pimentos','Menthos'])
> x = Spam.Shake('chunky')
> 
> with code in the Spam class like:
> 
> @classmethod
> def Picked_Loaf(additives, extra_gelatin = False):
>      assert not ('Menthos' in additives and 'Diet Coke' in additives)
>      i = Spam()  # make an instance
>      i.additives = additives
>      i.add_to_production_queue(Process.chopping)
>      return i

You probably don't want to use assert -- that gets optimized away with
.pyo files.

Overall, I personally would be more inclined to use a factory function
or a slightly more complicated __init__ that dispatches, but there's
nothing wrong with what you're doing.
-- 
Aahz (aahz at pythoncraft.com)           <*>         http://www.pythoncraft.com/

Adopt A Process -- stop killing all your children!

From jjinux at gmail.com  Wed Sep  3 02:37:06 2008
From: jjinux at gmail.com (Shannon -jj Behrens)
Date: Tue, 2 Sep 2008 17:37:06 -0700
Subject: [Baypiggies] Class methods as constructors?
In-Reply-To: <20080902204705.GA25851@panix.com>
References: <b8c6f6c40809021128r3927cc2bu1150f12bad45098e@mail.gmail.com>
	<20080902204705.GA25851@panix.com>
Message-ID: <c41f67b90809021737u2e8626a3ib65db7b4ea44ddb0@mail.gmail.com>

On Tue, Sep 2, 2008 at 1:47 PM, Aahz <aahz at pythoncraft.com> wrote:
> On Tue, Sep 02, 2008, Charles Merriam wrote:
>>
>> I have a spot where I need a number of constructors for the same class
>> and don't want to have too complicated an __init__ function.   Using
>> class methods seems like the cleanest code.
>>
>> x = Spam()   # Simple case
>> x = Spam.Pickled_Loaf(['Pimentos','Menthos'])
>> x = Spam.Shake('chunky')
>>
>> with code in the Spam class like:
>>
>> @classmethod
>> def Picked_Loaf(additives, extra_gelatin = False):
>>      assert not ('Menthos' in additives and 'Diet Coke' in additives)
>>      i = Spam()  # make an instance
>>      i.additives = additives
>>      i.add_to_production_queue(Process.chopping)
>>      return i
>
> You probably don't want to use assert -- that gets optimized away with
> .pyo files.
>
> Overall, I personally would be more inclined to use a factory function
> or a slightly more complicated __init__ that dispatches, but there's
> nothing wrong with what you're doing.

Call me old school, but I still use factory functions (i.e. outside
the class) like Aahz, but what you're doing is perfectly fine.

-jj

-- 
Don't you wish you had a really clever sig like mine?
http://jjinux.blogspot.com/

From jjinux at gmail.com  Wed Sep  3 02:40:14 2008
From: jjinux at gmail.com (Shannon -jj Behrens)
Date: Tue, 2 Sep 2008 17:40:14 -0700
Subject: [Baypiggies] Looking for a newbie nugget presenter for Thursday,
	Sept 11th
In-Reply-To: <b8c6f6c40808311827t66db9cabj3785bfbfac7809b0@mail.gmail.com>
References: <8249c4ac0808281253y2d07a003h38cd077e1e14315b@mail.gmail.com>
	<ec47901a0808281614j4d68acbahccc5d49414f6445f@mail.gmail.com>
	<c41f67b90808281817p60990bb3ud9fddbce3d1e027e@mail.gmail.com>
	<47c890dc0808281830j67023214v21e833ff118bea55@mail.gmail.com>
	<1621f9fa0808291305w16770b37u5a2930592d4a25dd@mail.gmail.com>
	<c41f67b90808291619n6b7e7f0bi7b828d3e5326f2fb@mail.gmail.com>
	<b8c6f6c40808311827t66db9cabj3785bfbfac7809b0@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <c41f67b90809021740i4e2f31fdrd415499326944d7d@mail.gmail.com>

On Sun, Aug 31, 2008 at 6:27 PM, Charles Merriam
<charles.merriam at gmail.com> wrote:
> +1 on any talk working through scoping and immutables.

Let us all agree to give thanks to Guido.  We no longer need to worry
about the difference between a const pointer to an int and a pointer
to a const int ;)

-jj

-- 
Don't you wish you had a really clever sig like mine?
http://jjinux.blogspot.com/

From aleax at google.com  Wed Sep  3 04:11:00 2008
From: aleax at google.com (Alex Martelli)
Date: Tue, 2 Sep 2008 19:11:00 -0700
Subject: [Baypiggies] Class methods as constructors?
In-Reply-To: <c41f67b90809021737u2e8626a3ib65db7b4ea44ddb0@mail.gmail.com>
References: <b8c6f6c40809021128r3927cc2bu1150f12bad45098e@mail.gmail.com>
	<20080902204705.GA25851@panix.com>
	<c41f67b90809021737u2e8626a3ib65db7b4ea44ddb0@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <55dc209b0809021911t64080edfk524f5f3a59a43197@mail.gmail.com>

Problem with a factory function is that it doesn't generate "the right
subclass"; as a class gets subclassed, the subclasses' authors have to
keep adding corresponding factory functions to make instances of
_them_ instead of ones the original class.

And whenever you see names such as the_factory, subclass1_the_factory,
subclass2_the_factory, that's a very strong code smell: somebody's not
using namespaces and object orientation right.  And "Namespaces are
one honking great idea -- let's do more of those!", as the Zen of
Python says as its rousing conclusion; basically, wanting to use
factory functions instead of factory classmethods rejects this rousing
applause for namespaces, and in a sense all of the Zen of Python.

And yet, it's so *INCREDIBLY* easy...!  Consider:

>>> class mydt(datetime.datetime): " some cool added functionality here "
...
>>> mydt.fromordinal(999999)
mydt(2738, 11, 27, 0, 0)

Could it be any easier?  If the author of the datetime module had been
so silly as to define a factor function datetime_fromordinal (instead
of a class method of the datetime type) the poor author of the mydt
subclass would have had to add their own laboriously named and
boringly implemented mydt_fromordinal factory function -- presumably
using the datetime_fromordinal factory to build a temporary datetime
object, then copying the fields from those.  How much silly
boilerplate and wasted work...!

But luckily, the author of the datetime module didn't make that silly
mistake: they defined a class method, and mydt automatically takes
advantage of it, freely and easily.  Guess that module author
understands and appreciates the Zen of Python, hm?

Considering said author is Tim Peters, who also happened to *write*
the Zen of Python, maybe that's not surprising;-).

As for who's old-fashioned, well, my memory is a bit hazy after so
long, but I believe I recall that Smalltalk '76 didn't yet have class
methods, but Smalltalk '80 introduced them -- and the key use case has
always been "alternate constructors" done RIGHT, as opposed to C++'s
silly alternative of type-based overloading... who's to tell if a
large number passed to a datetime constructor is meant as an ordinal
or as a timestamp?!  Having fromordinal and fromtimestamp as
separately named class methods puts paid to that!

So, averaging the difference, I think I've been using class methods as
alternate constructors starting about 30 years ago (though I had to
forgo them for a sadly long time when using languages that just didn't
HAVE factory methods). How much longer has YOUR
so-called-old-fashioned preferred approach of "factory functions" been
around?-)


Alex

On Tue, Sep 2, 2008 at 5:37 PM, Shannon -jj Behrens <jjinux at gmail.com> wrote:
> On Tue, Sep 2, 2008 at 1:47 PM, Aahz <aahz at pythoncraft.com> wrote:
>> On Tue, Sep 02, 2008, Charles Merriam wrote:
>>>
>>> I have a spot where I need a number of constructors for the same class
>>> and don't want to have too complicated an __init__ function.   Using
>>> class methods seems like the cleanest code.
>>>
>>> x = Spam()   # Simple case
>>> x = Spam.Pickled_Loaf(['Pimentos','Menthos'])
>>> x = Spam.Shake('chunky')
>>>
>>> with code in the Spam class like:
>>>
>>> @classmethod
>>> def Picked_Loaf(additives, extra_gelatin = False):
>>>      assert not ('Menthos' in additives and 'Diet Coke' in additives)
>>>      i = Spam()  # make an instance
>>>      i.additives = additives
>>>      i.add_to_production_queue(Process.chopping)
>>>      return i
>>
>> You probably don't want to use assert -- that gets optimized away with
>> .pyo files.
>>
>> Overall, I personally would be more inclined to use a factory function
>> or a slightly more complicated __init__ that dispatches, but there's
>> nothing wrong with what you're doing.
>
> Call me old school, but I still use factory functions (i.e. outside
> the class) like Aahz, but what you're doing is perfectly fine.
>
> -jj
>
> --
> Don't you wish you had a really clever sig like mine?
> http://jjinux.blogspot.com/
> _______________________________________________
> Baypiggies mailing list
> Baypiggies at python.org
> To change your subscription options or unsubscribe:
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/baypiggies
>

From jjinux at gmail.com  Wed Sep  3 08:46:23 2008
From: jjinux at gmail.com (Shannon -jj Behrens)
Date: Tue, 2 Sep 2008 23:46:23 -0700
Subject: [Baypiggies] Class methods as constructors?
In-Reply-To: <55dc209b0809021911t64080edfk524f5f3a59a43197@mail.gmail.com>
References: <b8c6f6c40809021128r3927cc2bu1150f12bad45098e@mail.gmail.com>
	<20080902204705.GA25851@panix.com>
	<c41f67b90809021737u2e8626a3ib65db7b4ea44ddb0@mail.gmail.com>
	<55dc209b0809021911t64080edfk524f5f3a59a43197@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <c41f67b90809022346y208c96cawbef9676c555e3dec@mail.gmail.com>

Well argued.  Thanks for schoolin' me ;)

Now, if only you would have been around when I was stuck chaining
together factory methods to begin with so I wouldn't have had to make
that mistake!

-jj

On Tue, Sep 2, 2008 at 7:11 PM, Alex Martelli <aleax at google.com> wrote:
> Problem with a factory function is that it doesn't generate "the right
> subclass"; as a class gets subclassed, the subclasses' authors have to
> keep adding corresponding factory functions to make instances of
> _them_ instead of ones the original class.
>
> And whenever you see names such as the_factory, subclass1_the_factory,
> subclass2_the_factory, that's a very strong code smell: somebody's not
> using namespaces and object orientation right.  And "Namespaces are
> one honking great idea -- let's do more of those!", as the Zen of
> Python says as its rousing conclusion; basically, wanting to use
> factory functions instead of factory classmethods rejects this rousing
> applause for namespaces, and in a sense all of the Zen of Python.
>
> And yet, it's so *INCREDIBLY* easy...!  Consider:
>
>>>> class mydt(datetime.datetime): " some cool added functionality here "
> ...
>>>> mydt.fromordinal(999999)
> mydt(2738, 11, 27, 0, 0)
>
> Could it be any easier?  If the author of the datetime module had been
> so silly as to define a factor function datetime_fromordinal (instead
> of a class method of the datetime type) the poor author of the mydt
> subclass would have had to add their own laboriously named and
> boringly implemented mydt_fromordinal factory function -- presumably
> using the datetime_fromordinal factory to build a temporary datetime
> object, then copying the fields from those.  How much silly
> boilerplate and wasted work...!
>
> But luckily, the author of the datetime module didn't make that silly
> mistake: they defined a class method, and mydt automatically takes
> advantage of it, freely and easily.  Guess that module author
> understands and appreciates the Zen of Python, hm?
>
> Considering said author is Tim Peters, who also happened to *write*
> the Zen of Python, maybe that's not surprising;-).
>
> As for who's old-fashioned, well, my memory is a bit hazy after so
> long, but I believe I recall that Smalltalk '76 didn't yet have class
> methods, but Smalltalk '80 introduced them -- and the key use case has
> always been "alternate constructors" done RIGHT, as opposed to C++'s
> silly alternative of type-based overloading... who's to tell if a
> large number passed to a datetime constructor is meant as an ordinal
> or as a timestamp?!  Having fromordinal and fromtimestamp as
> separately named class methods puts paid to that!
>
> So, averaging the difference, I think I've been using class methods as
> alternate constructors starting about 30 years ago (though I had to
> forgo them for a sadly long time when using languages that just didn't
> HAVE factory methods). How much longer has YOUR
> so-called-old-fashioned preferred approach of "factory functions" been
> around?-)
>
>
> Alex
>
> On Tue, Sep 2, 2008 at 5:37 PM, Shannon -jj Behrens <jjinux at gmail.com> wrote:
>> On Tue, Sep 2, 2008 at 1:47 PM, Aahz <aahz at pythoncraft.com> wrote:
>>> On Tue, Sep 02, 2008, Charles Merriam wrote:
>>>>
>>>> I have a spot where I need a number of constructors for the same class
>>>> and don't want to have too complicated an __init__ function.   Using
>>>> class methods seems like the cleanest code.
>>>>
>>>> x = Spam()   # Simple case
>>>> x = Spam.Pickled_Loaf(['Pimentos','Menthos'])
>>>> x = Spam.Shake('chunky')
>>>>
>>>> with code in the Spam class like:
>>>>
>>>> @classmethod
>>>> def Picked_Loaf(additives, extra_gelatin = False):
>>>>      assert not ('Menthos' in additives and 'Diet Coke' in additives)
>>>>      i = Spam()  # make an instance
>>>>      i.additives = additives
>>>>      i.add_to_production_queue(Process.chopping)
>>>>      return i
>>>
>>> You probably don't want to use assert -- that gets optimized away with
>>> .pyo files.
>>>
>>> Overall, I personally would be more inclined to use a factory function
>>> or a slightly more complicated __init__ that dispatches, but there's
>>> nothing wrong with what you're doing.
>>
>> Call me old school, but I still use factory functions (i.e. outside
>> the class) like Aahz, but what you're doing is perfectly fine.
>>
>> -jj
>>
>> --
>> Don't you wish you had a really clever sig like mine?
>> http://jjinux.blogspot.com/
>> _______________________________________________
>> Baypiggies mailing list
>> Baypiggies at python.org
>> To change your subscription options or unsubscribe:
>> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/baypiggies
>>
>



-- 
Don't you wish you had a really clever sig like mine?
http://jjinux.blogspot.com/

From amax at redsymbol.net  Wed Sep  3 19:12:23 2008
From: amax at redsymbol.net (Aaron Maxwell)
Date: Wed, 3 Sep 2008 10:12:23 -0700
Subject: [Baypiggies] custom date parser
Message-ID: <200809031012.23400.amax@redsymbol.net>

Hi all,

Below is a function that parses a date string in the form "YYYY-MM-DD"
and returns a datetime.date object, or None if it's bad input and
cannot be converted.  However, it does a couple of special tricks.
The data in certain cases is known to have a value for the day or
month that is not in the valid range; e.g., it may be 2007-11-31
(November traditionally only has 30 days), or 2002-14-23.  In this
situation, I want to keep the most signficant good field(s) and set
the lessors to 1, then return the date object from that - so the
results of the above would be date(2007, 11, 1) or date(2002, 1, 1)
respectively.

The function below does this.  It uses a triply-nested try/except
block, and I can't shake the feeling that there is a shorter and
clearer implementation.  Any thoughts?

Of course, one approach would be to manually check that the month and
day field before passing them to datetime.date.  I would rather reuse
the validation code in the date class, though, for obvious reasons.

Thanks in advance,
Aaron

{{{
import datetime
def parse_datefield(raw_pubdate):
    '''
    Parse a datefield
    Takes in a date string in the format YYYY-MM-DD.
    Returns a datetime.date object.
    '''
    # ... imagine validation/error checking code here ...
    parts = map(int, raw_pubdate.split('-'))
    try:
        d = datetime.date(*parts)
    except ValueError:
        # day out of range?
        parts[-1] = 1
        try:
            d = datetime.date(*parts)
        except ValueError:
            # month out of range?
            parts[-2] = 1
            try:
                d = datetime.date(*parts)
            except ValueError:
                # give up
                d = None
    return d
}}}

-- 
Aaron Maxwell
http://redsymbol.net

From annaraven at gmail.com  Wed Sep  3 19:17:52 2008
From: annaraven at gmail.com (Anna Ravenscroft)
Date: Wed, 3 Sep 2008 10:17:52 -0700
Subject: [Baypiggies] custom date parser
In-Reply-To: <200809031012.23400.amax@redsymbol.net>
References: <200809031012.23400.amax@redsymbol.net>
Message-ID: <cb361a610809031017p57a956aeo6beb532b7e11f9b6@mail.gmail.com>

The dateutil module has a great fuzzy parser that lets you do all this.

On Wed, Sep 3, 2008 at 10:12 AM, Aaron Maxwell <amax at redsymbol.net> wrote:

> Hi all,
>
> Below is a function that parses a date string in the form "YYYY-MM-DD"
> and returns a datetime.date object, or None if it's bad input and
> cannot be converted.  However, it does a couple of special tricks.
> The data in certain cases is known to have a value for the day or
> month that is not in the valid range; e.g., it may be 2007-11-31
> (November traditionally only has 30 days), or 2002-14-23.  In this
> situation, I want to keep the most signficant good field(s) and set
> the lessors to 1, then return the date object from that - so the
> results of the above would be date(2007, 11, 1) or date(2002, 1, 1)
> respectively.
>
> The function below does this.  It uses a triply-nested try/except
> block, and I can't shake the feeling that there is a shorter and
> clearer implementation.  Any thoughts?
>
> Of course, one approach would be to manually check that the month and
> day field before passing them to datetime.date.  I would rather reuse
> the validation code in the date class, though, for obvious reasons.
>
> Thanks in advance,
> Aaron
>
> {{{
> import datetime
> def parse_datefield(raw_pubdate):
>    '''
>    Parse a datefield
>    Takes in a date string in the format YYYY-MM-DD.
>    Returns a datetime.date object.
>    '''
>    # ... imagine validation/error checking code here ...
>    parts = map(int, raw_pubdate.split('-'))
>    try:
>        d = datetime.date(*parts)
>    except ValueError:
>        # day out of range?
>        parts[-1] = 1
>        try:
>            d = datetime.date(*parts)
>        except ValueError:
>            # month out of range?
>            parts[-2] = 1
>            try:
>                d = datetime.date(*parts)
>            except ValueError:
>                # give up
>                d = None
>    return d
> }}}
>
> --
> Aaron Maxwell
> http://redsymbol.net
> _______________________________________________
> Baypiggies mailing list
> Baypiggies at python.org
> To change your subscription options or unsubscribe:
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/baypiggies
>



-- 
cordially,
Anna
--
Walking through the water. Trying to get across.
Just like everybody else.
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://mail.python.org/pipermail/baypiggies/attachments/20080903/8362ceb0/attachment.htm>

From aleax at google.com  Wed Sep  3 20:22:15 2008
From: aleax at google.com (Alex Martelli)
Date: Wed, 3 Sep 2008 11:22:15 -0700
Subject: [Baypiggies] custom date parser
In-Reply-To: <200809031012.23400.amax@redsymbol.net>
References: <200809031012.23400.amax@redsymbol.net>
Message-ID: <55dc209b0809031122s5eeb9b6dgbbfb39914538190e@mail.gmail.com>

Assuming you want exactly the functionality you've coded (as opposed
to a more general fuzzy parse as Anna suggests), the key to making it
more compact is seeing that what you're doing in your code is an
unrolled loop -- and rolling it up again.  E.g., after the initial
assignment to parts, the rest of the code could be:

for i in range(1, 4):
  try: return datetime.datetime(*parts)
  except ValueError: parts[-i] = 1
return None

On Wed, Sep 3, 2008 at 10:12 AM, Aaron Maxwell <amax at redsymbol.net> wrote:
> Hi all,
>
> Below is a function that parses a date string in the form "YYYY-MM-DD"
> and returns a datetime.date object, or None if it's bad input and
> cannot be converted.  However, it does a couple of special tricks.
> The data in certain cases is known to have a value for the day or
> month that is not in the valid range; e.g., it may be 2007-11-31
> (November traditionally only has 30 days), or 2002-14-23.  In this
> situation, I want to keep the most signficant good field(s) and set
> the lessors to 1, then return the date object from that - so the
> results of the above would be date(2007, 11, 1) or date(2002, 1, 1)
> respectively.
>
> The function below does this.  It uses a triply-nested try/except
> block, and I can't shake the feeling that there is a shorter and
> clearer implementation.  Any thoughts?
>
> Of course, one approach would be to manually check that the month and
> day field before passing them to datetime.date.  I would rather reuse
> the validation code in the date class, though, for obvious reasons.
>
> Thanks in advance,
> Aaron
>
> {{{
> import datetime
> def parse_datefield(raw_pubdate):
>    '''
>    Parse a datefield
>    Takes in a date string in the format YYYY-MM-DD.
>    Returns a datetime.date object.
>    '''
>    # ... imagine validation/error checking code here ...
>    parts = map(int, raw_pubdate.split('-'))
>    try:
>        d = datetime.date(*parts)
>    except ValueError:
>        # day out of range?
>        parts[-1] = 1
>        try:
>            d = datetime.date(*parts)
>        except ValueError:
>            # month out of range?
>            parts[-2] = 1
>            try:
>                d = datetime.date(*parts)
>            except ValueError:
>                # give up
>                d = None
>    return d
> }}}
>
> --
> Aaron Maxwell
> http://redsymbol.net
> _______________________________________________
> Baypiggies mailing list
> Baypiggies at python.org
> To change your subscription options or unsubscribe:
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/baypiggies
>

From bsergean at gmail.com  Wed Sep  3 20:57:50 2008
From: bsergean at gmail.com (Benjamin Sergeant)
Date: Wed, 3 Sep 2008 11:57:50 -0700
Subject: [Baypiggies] return value from a recursive function is None while
	it should not be ...
Message-ID: <1621f9fa0809031157w336aa389rda7c2e1f240a8cdd@mail.gmail.com>

== The background ==

I'm trying to solve problem 26 from project euler:
http://projecteuler.net/index.php?section=problems&id=26
The goal is to find digits recurring cycle in rational number fractional parts.
1 / 3 = 0.3333333 -> 3 is a recuring integer
1 / 7 = 0.142857

== The python problem ==

I have the following piece of code that try to solve that, probably
not elegant but it kind of work. You can copy paste it and you should
have the same output as I have, an assertion error: assert (
recurring_cycle(3) == '3'). find_recurring_part() returns a, that is
printed and equals 3, but when recurring_cycle get it, it has become
None !!

Does anyone know what's going on ?

Thanks !
- Benjamin.

$ cat level26_strangeness.py
#!/usr/bin/env python

from decimal import Decimal, getcontext
from re import findall

def find_recurring_part(a, found):
    '''
    >>> re.findall(r'(\d+)\1', '32323232')
    ['3232']
    '''
    result = findall(r'(\d+)\1', a)
    print a, result, found
    if len(result) == 0:
        return a if found else None # doing an old school if else does not help
    else:
        find_recurring_part(result[0], True)

def recurring_cycle(i):
    q = Decimal(1) / Decimal(i)
    q = str(q)[2:]
    return find_recurring_part(q, False)

getcontext().prec = 10 # increase for bigger numbers
assert ( recurring_cycle(2) == None)
assert ( recurring_cycle(3) == '3')

$ ./level26_strangeness.py
5 [] False
3333333333 ['33333'] False
33333 ['33'] True
33 ['3'] True
3 [] True
Traceback (most recent call last):
  File "./level26_strangeness.py", line 25, in <module>
    assert ( recurring_cycle(3) == '3')
AssertionError

From jason.lai at gmail.com  Wed Sep  3 21:18:12 2008
From: jason.lai at gmail.com (Jason Lai)
Date: Wed, 3 Sep 2008 12:18:12 -0700
Subject: [Baypiggies] return value from a recursive function is None
	while it should not be ...
In-Reply-To: <1621f9fa0809031157w336aa389rda7c2e1f240a8cdd@mail.gmail.com>
References: <1621f9fa0809031157w336aa389rda7c2e1f240a8cdd@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <351d5ed20809031218y4a888dcdr2dd978c0e68bf578@mail.gmail.com>

You need to put "return" in front of "find_recurring_part(result[0], True)"

Hope that helps,

 - Jason

On Wed, Sep 3, 2008 at 11:57 AM, Benjamin Sergeant <bsergean at gmail.com>wrote:

> == The background ==
>
> I'm trying to solve problem 26 from project euler:
> http://projecteuler.net/index.php?section=problems&id=26
> The goal is to find digits recurring cycle in rational number fractional
> parts.
> 1 / 3 = 0.3333333 -> 3 is a recuring integer
> 1 / 7 = 0.142857
>
> == The python problem ==
>
> I have the following piece of code that try to solve that, probably
> not elegant but it kind of work. You can copy paste it and you should
> have the same output as I have, an assertion error: assert (
> recurring_cycle(3) == '3'). find_recurring_part() returns a, that is
> printed and equals 3, but when recurring_cycle get it, it has become
> None !!
>
> Does anyone know what's going on ?
>
> Thanks !
> - Benjamin.
>
> $ cat level26_strangeness.py
> #!/usr/bin/env python
>
> from decimal import Decimal, getcontext
> from re import findall
>
> def find_recurring_part(a, found):
>    '''
>    >>> re.findall(r'(\d+)\1', '32323232')
>    ['3232']
>    '''
>    result = findall(r'(\d+)\1', a)
>    print a, result, found
>    if len(result) == 0:
>        return a if found else None # doing an old school if else does not
> help
>    else:
>        find_recurring_part(result[0], True)
>
> def recurring_cycle(i):
>    q = Decimal(1) / Decimal(i)
>    q = str(q)[2:]
>    return find_recurring_part(q, False)
>
> getcontext().prec = 10 # increase for bigger numbers
> assert ( recurring_cycle(2) == None)
> assert ( recurring_cycle(3) == '3')
>
> $ ./level26_strangeness.py
> 5 [] False
> 3333333333 ['33333'] False
> 33333 ['33'] True
> 33 ['3'] True
> 3 [] True
> Traceback (most recent call last):
>  File "./level26_strangeness.py", line 25, in <module>
>    assert ( recurring_cycle(3) == '3')
> AssertionError
> _______________________________________________
> Baypiggies mailing list
> Baypiggies at python.org
> To change your subscription options or unsubscribe:
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/baypiggies
>
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://mail.python.org/pipermail/baypiggies/attachments/20080903/23efce22/attachment-0001.htm>

From Chris.Clark at ingres.com  Wed Sep  3 21:29:22 2008
From: Chris.Clark at ingres.com (Chris Clark)
Date: Wed, 03 Sep 2008 12:29:22 -0700
Subject: [Baypiggies] custom date parser
In-Reply-To: <55dc209b0809031122s5eeb9b6dgbbfb39914538190e@mail.gmail.com>
References: <200809031012.23400.amax@redsymbol.net>
	<55dc209b0809031122s5eeb9b6dgbbfb39914538190e@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <48BEE592.5000203@ingres.com>

Also consider limiting the number of splits, to minimize processing, i.e.:

    From: ...raw_pubdate.split('-').....
    To: ...raw_pubdate.split('-', 3).....

I ended up using a regex for my apps:

    # yyyy-mm-dd (ISO 8601 style) but only the date (no time, and no 
week), fairly strict, e.g. expect 2 digits for month and day
    ISO_regex_str = r'(?P<year>\d{4})-(?P<month>\d{2})-(?P<day>\d{2})'

Chris

On 9/3/2008 11:22 AM, Alex Martelli wrote:
> Assuming you want exactly the functionality you've coded (as opposed
> to a more general fuzzy parse as Anna suggests), the key to making it
> more compact is seeing that what you're doing in your code is an
> unrolled loop -- and rolling it up again.  E.g., after the initial
> assignment to parts, the rest of the code could be:
>
> for i in range(1, 4):
>   try: return datetime.datetime(*parts)
>   except ValueError: parts[-i] = 1
> return None
>
> On Wed, Sep 3, 2008 at 10:12 AM, Aaron Maxwell <amax at redsymbol.net> wrote:
>   
>> Hi all,
>>
>> Below is a function that parses a date string in the form "YYYY-MM-DD"
>> and returns a datetime.date object, or None if it's bad input and
>> cannot be converted.  However, it does a couple of special tricks.
>> The data in certain cases is known to have a value for the day or
>> month that is not in the valid range; e.g., it may be 2007-11-31
>> (November traditionally only has 30 days), or 2002-14-23.  In this
>> situation, I want to keep the most signficant good field(s) and set
>> the lessors to 1, then return the date object from that - so the
>> results of the above would be date(2007, 11, 1) or date(2002, 1, 1)
>> respectively.
>>
>> The function below does this.  It uses a triply-nested try/except
>> block, and I can't shake the feeling that there is a shorter and
>> clearer implementation.  Any thoughts?
>>
>> Of course, one approach would be to manually check that the month and
>> day field before passing them to datetime.date.  I would rather reuse
>> the validation code in the date class, though, for obvious reasons.
>>
>> Thanks in advance,
>> Aaron
>>
>> {{{
>> import datetime
>> def parse_datefield(raw_pubdate):
>>    '''
>>    Parse a datefield
>>    Takes in a date string in the format YYYY-MM-DD.
>>    Returns a datetime.date object.
>>    '''
>>    # ... imagine validation/error checking code here ...
>>    parts = map(int, raw_pubdate.split('-'))
>>    try:
>>        d = datetime.date(*parts)
>>    except ValueError:
>>        # day out of range?
>>        parts[-1] = 1
>>        try:
>>            d = datetime.date(*parts)
>>        except ValueError:
>>            # month out of range?
>>            parts[-2] = 1
>>            try:
>>                d = datetime.date(*parts)
>>            except ValueError:
>>                # give up
>>                d = None
>>    return d
>> }}}
>>
>> --
>> Aaron Maxwell
>> http://redsymbol.net
>> _______________________________________________
>> Baypiggies mailing list
>> Baypiggies at python.org
>> To change your subscription options or unsubscribe:
>> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/baypiggies
>>
>>     
> _______________________________________________
> Baypiggies mailing list
> Baypiggies at python.org
> To change your subscription options or unsubscribe:
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/baypiggies
>   


From mikeyp at snaplogic.org  Wed Sep  3 21:16:07 2008
From: mikeyp at snaplogic.org (Michael Pittaro)
Date: Wed, 03 Sep 2008 12:16:07 -0700
Subject: [Baypiggies] [Job Posting] Web Developer at SnapLogic
Message-ID: <48BEE277.9000404@snaplogic.org>

We're looking for a web developer to pick up some of the ongoing maintenance and
enhancements to the SnapLogic developer site at http://www.snaplogic.org.

Details are on the baypiggies job listing page
http://baypiggies.net/new/plone/job-listings

mike

-- 
Mike Pittaro
Co-Founder                      Snaplogic, Inc.
mikeyp at snaplogic.org            http://www.snaplogic.org/developer/mikeyp

From amax at redsymbol.net  Wed Sep  3 21:53:18 2008
From: amax at redsymbol.net (Aaron Maxwell)
Date: Wed, 3 Sep 2008 12:53:18 -0700
Subject: [Baypiggies] custom date parser
Message-ID: <200809031253.18483.amax@redsymbol.net>

On Wednesday 03 September 2008 11:22:15 am you wrote:
> Assuming you want exactly the functionality you've coded 
That is correct. 

> (as opposed 
> to a more general fuzzy parse as Anna suggests), the key to making it 
> more compact is seeing that what you're doing in your code is an
> unrolled loop -- and rolling it up again.  E.g., after the initial
> assignment to parts, the rest of the code could be:
>
> for i in range(1, 4):
>   try: return datetime.datetime(*parts)
>   except ValueError: parts[-i] = 1
> return None

That is the insight I was looking for.  Thanks Alex.

Anna, thanks for suggesting dateutils - not what's needed for this particular 
problem, but I was not familiar with it.

Aaron

>
> On Wed, Sep 3, 2008 at 10:12 AM, Aaron Maxwell <amax at redsymbol.net> wrote:
> > Hi all,
> >
> > Below is a function that parses a date string in the form "YYYY-MM-DD"
> > and returns a datetime.date object, or None if it's bad input and
> > cannot be converted.  However, it does a couple of special tricks.
> > The data in certain cases is known to have a value for the day or
> > month that is not in the valid range; e.g., it may be 2007-11-31
> > (November traditionally only has 30 days), or 2002-14-23.  In this
> > situation, I want to keep the most signficant good field(s) and set
> > the lessors to 1, then return the date object from that - so the
> > results of the above would be date(2007, 11, 1) or date(2002, 1, 1)
> > respectively.
> >
> > The function below does this.  It uses a triply-nested try/except
> > block, and I can't shake the feeling that there is a shorter and
> > clearer implementation.  Any thoughts?
> >
> > Of course, one approach would be to manually check that the month and
> > day field before passing them to datetime.date.  I would rather reuse
> > the validation code in the date class, though, for obvious reasons.
> >
> > Thanks in advance,
> > Aaron
> >
> > {{{
> > import datetime
> > def parse_datefield(raw_pubdate):
> >    '''
> >    Parse a datefield
> >    Takes in a date string in the format YYYY-MM-DD.
> >    Returns a datetime.date object.
> >    '''
> >    # ... imagine validation/error checking code here ...
> >    parts = map(int, raw_pubdate.split('-'))
> >    try:
> >        d = datetime.date(*parts)
> >    except ValueError:
> >        # day out of range?
> >        parts[-1] = 1
> >        try:
> >            d = datetime.date(*parts)
> >        except ValueError:
> >            # month out of range?
> >            parts[-2] = 1
> >            try:
> >                d = datetime.date(*parts)
> >            except ValueError:
> >                # give up
> >                d = None
> >    return d
> > }}}
> >
> > --
> > Aaron Maxwell
> > http://redsymbol.net
> > _______________________________________________
> > Baypiggies mailing list
> > Baypiggies at python.org
> > To change your subscription options or unsubscribe:
> > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/baypiggies



-- 
Aaron Maxwell
http://redsymbol.net

From bsergean at gmail.com  Wed Sep  3 22:00:31 2008
From: bsergean at gmail.com (Benjamin Sergeant)
Date: Wed, 3 Sep 2008 13:00:31 -0700
Subject: [Baypiggies] return value from a recursive function is None
	while it should not be ...
In-Reply-To: <351d5ed20809031218y4a888dcdr2dd978c0e68bf578@mail.gmail.com>
References: <1621f9fa0809031157w336aa389rda7c2e1f240a8cdd@mail.gmail.com>
	<351d5ed20809031218y4a888dcdr2dd978c0e68bf578@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <1621f9fa0809031300v4081acddla15388323c879cc@mail.gmail.com>

That helped ... it looks like a missing ; level problem ... :)

Thanks !
Benjamin.

On Wed, Sep 3, 2008 at 12:18 PM, Jason Lai <jason.lai at gmail.com> wrote:
> You need to put "return" in front of "find_recurring_part(result[0], True)"
>
> Hope that helps,
>
>  - Jason
>
> On Wed, Sep 3, 2008 at 11:57 AM, Benjamin Sergeant <bsergean at gmail.com>
> wrote:
>>
>> == The background ==
>>
>> I'm trying to solve problem 26 from project euler:
>> http://projecteuler.net/index.php?section=problems&id=26
>> The goal is to find digits recurring cycle in rational number fractional
>> parts.
>> 1 / 3 = 0.3333333 -> 3 is a recuring integer
>> 1 / 7 = 0.142857
>>
>> == The python problem ==
>>
>> I have the following piece of code that try to solve that, probably
>> not elegant but it kind of work. You can copy paste it and you should
>> have the same output as I have, an assertion error: assert (
>> recurring_cycle(3) == '3'). find_recurring_part() returns a, that is
>> printed and equals 3, but when recurring_cycle get it, it has become
>> None !!
>>
>> Does anyone know what's going on ?
>>
>> Thanks !
>> - Benjamin.
>>
>> $ cat level26_strangeness.py
>> #!/usr/bin/env python
>>
>> from decimal import Decimal, getcontext
>> from re import findall
>>
>> def find_recurring_part(a, found):
>>    '''
>>    >>> re.findall(r'(\d+)\1', '32323232')
>>    ['3232']
>>    '''
>>    result = findall(r'(\d+)\1', a)
>>    print a, result, found
>>    if len(result) == 0:
>>        return a if found else None # doing an old school if else does not
>> help
>>    else:
>>        find_recurring_part(result[0], True)
>>
>> def recurring_cycle(i):
>>    q = Decimal(1) / Decimal(i)
>>    q = str(q)[2:]
>>    return find_recurring_part(q, False)
>>
>> getcontext().prec = 10 # increase for bigger numbers
>> assert ( recurring_cycle(2) == None)
>> assert ( recurring_cycle(3) == '3')
>>
>> $ ./level26_strangeness.py
>> 5 [] False
>> 3333333333 ['33333'] False
>> 33333 ['33'] True
>> 33 ['3'] True
>> 3 [] True
>> Traceback (most recent call last):
>>  File "./level26_strangeness.py", line 25, in <module>
>>    assert ( recurring_cycle(3) == '3')
>> AssertionError
>> _______________________________________________
>> Baypiggies mailing list
>> Baypiggies at python.org
>> To change your subscription options or unsubscribe:
>> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/baypiggies
>
>

From bdbaddog at gmail.com  Fri Sep  5 06:58:32 2008
From: bdbaddog at gmail.com (William Deegan)
Date: Thu, 4 Sep 2008 21:58:32 -0700
Subject: [Baypiggies] Baypiggies.net site changes.
Message-ID: <8540148a0809042158n341cf958x2f610bd46fecdd03@mail.gmail.com>

Greetings,

After reading much of the plone book, I've made a few changes.

Reverted to the plone default skin, and cropped the previous logo.

I've reworked the book review section, and working with Tony, Jim and
JJ to get the meeting schedules into Plone events.
(Which I think will be RSS'able, not sure about that)

The old skin is gone, so finally I can read the site on my blackjack phone.

At some point I'll update to latest plone, but for now, I think it's a
bit better than it was.

Enjoy,
Bill

From cappy2112 at gmail.com  Fri Sep  5 08:03:25 2008
From: cappy2112 at gmail.com (Tony Cappellini)
Date: Thu, 4 Sep 2008 23:03:25 -0700
Subject: [Baypiggies] Baypiggies.net site changes.
In-Reply-To: <8540148a0809042158n341cf958x2f610bd46fecdd03@mail.gmail.com>
References: <8540148a0809042158n341cf958x2f610bd46fecdd03@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <8249c4ac0809042303o36618808y2fb5ec8e917663b3@mail.gmail.com>

It looks great! Finally, it's readable.
Thanks bill!

On Thu, Sep 4, 2008 at 9:58 PM, William Deegan <bdbaddog at gmail.com> wrote:
> Greetings,
>
> After reading much of the plone book, I've made a few changes.
>
> Reverted to the plone default skin, and cropped the previous logo.
>
> I've reworked the book review section, and working with Tony, Jim and
> JJ to get the meeting schedules into Plone events.
> (Which I think will be RSS'able, not sure about that)
>
> The old skin is gone, so finally I can read the site on my blackjack phone.
>
> At some point I'll update to latest plone, but for now, I think it's a
> bit better than it was.
>
> Enjoy,
> Bill
> _______________________________________________
> Baypiggies mailing list
> Baypiggies at python.org
> To change your subscription options or unsubscribe:
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/baypiggies
>

From wescpy at gmail.com  Fri Sep  5 10:16:53 2008
From: wescpy at gmail.com (wesley chun)
Date: Fri, 5 Sep 2008 01:16:53 -0700
Subject: [Baypiggies] [ANN] final 2008 Python courses, San Francisco
Message-ID: <78b3a9580809050116w2cfd7a98s10b7b9d201a979d8@mail.gmail.com>

*** some of you asked me for more specific information when speaking
with me at the meeting several weeks ago, so here is the general
announcement. i will also X-post to CLP so apologies in advance for
duplicates ***


Need to get up-to-speed with Python as quickly as possible? Come join
me, Wesley Chun, author of Prentice-Hall's bestseller "Core Python
Programming," for another comprehensive intro course plus a 1-day
Internet programming course coming up in November in beautiful
Northern California! I look forward to meeting you!

(Comprehensive) Introduction to Python
Mon-Wed, 2008 Nov 10-12, 9am-5pm

Internet Programming with Python
Sat, 2008 Nov 15, 9am-5pm

courses can be taken separately or combined for a discounted price.
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
(COMPREHENSIVE) INTRODUCTION TO PYTHON

Although this course may appear to those new to Python, it is also
perfect for those who have tinkered with it and want to "fill in the
gaps" and/or want to get more in-depth formal training.  It combines
the best of both an introduction to the language as well as a "Python
Internals" training course.

We will immerse you in the world of Python in only a few days, showing
you more than just its syntax (which you don't really need a book to
learn, right?). Knowing more about how Python works under the covers,
including the relationship between data objects and memory management,
will make you a much more effective Python programmer coming out of
the gate. 3 hands-on labs each day will help hammer the concepts home.

Come find out why Google, Yahoo!, Disney, ILM/LucasFilm, VMware, NASA,
Ubuntu, YouTube, and Red Hat all use Python. Users supporting or
jumping to Plone, Zope, TurboGears, Pylons, Django, Google App Engine,
Jython, IronPython, and Mailman will also benefit!

- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
INTERNET PROGRAMMING WITH PYTHON

This is a one-day course with lecture and lab exposing attendees to
FOUR distinct areas of Internet programming:

* Network Programming using Sockets -- we introduce client/server
architecture and how to program sockets using Python.

* Internet Client Programming -- we learn how to use Python's standard
library to create FTP, NNTP, POP3, and SMTP clients

* Web Programming -- before you jump on all the web framework
bandwagons, it's a good idea to learn basics and the basis of how all
web servers deliver dynamic content back to the client browser to
prepare you better when jumping to a full-stack web framework

* Intro to Django -- a lightweight introduction to the Django web
framework including whipping up a very simple blog application in
20min!

- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -

WHERE: near the San Francisco Airport (SFO/San Bruno), CA, USA

WEB:   http://cyberwebconsulting.com (click "Python Training")

LOCALS: easy freeway (101/280/380) with lots of parking plus public
transit (BART and CalTrain) access via the San Bruno stations, easily
accessible from all parts of the Bay Area

VISITORS: free shuttle to/from the airport, free high-speed internet,
free breakfast and regular evening receptions; fully-equipped suites

See website for costs, venue info, and registration.  Discounts are
available for multiple registrations as well as for teachers/students.

Hope to see you there!
-- wesley

- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
"Core Python Programming", Prentice Hall, (c)2007,2001
 http://corepython.com

"Python Web Development with Django", Addison Wesley, (c) 2008
http://withdjango.com

wesley.j.chun :: wescpy-at-gmail.com
python training and technical consulting
cyberweb.consulting : silicon valley, ca
http://cyberwebconsulting.com

From slander at unworkable.org  Fri Sep  5 19:25:27 2008
From: slander at unworkable.org (Harry Tormey)
Date: Fri, 5 Sep 2008 10:25:27 -0700
Subject: [Baypiggies] PyGameSF meetup Tuesday September 16th 7pm @ Metreon
	San Francisco
Message-ID: <20080905172527.GB13213@unworkable.org>

Hi All,
Just writing to say that this months PyGameSF meet up is on Tuesday
September 16th from 7pm at the Metreon food court in San Francisco. This
month's presentations are:

- Amar Chaudhary "Python, OpenSound Control and Open Sound World."  

About: This talk will demonstrate Open Sound World (OSW), a dynamic, scalable
environment for audio and music processing, and the ability to control
OSW via Python and OpenSound Control.  This system can be used for building
musical instruments or effects for use in live performance, as well as 
"live coding."

PyGame SF is an informal group meet up in San Francisco for Software
engineers interested in python, OpenGL, audio, pygame, SDL, programming
and generally anything to do with multimedia development. The format of 
our meetings typically involve several people giving presentations on projects 
they are developing followed by group discussion and feedback.

If anyone else would like to give a micro presentation, show demos or
just talk about what they are doing or generally give examples of  any
relevant software they are working on please feel free to head along.

To subscribe to the pygamesf mailing list simply email
pygame-sf+subscribe at unworkable.org 

-- 
Harry Tormey

From jjinux at gmail.com  Fri Sep  5 22:56:58 2008
From: jjinux at gmail.com (Shannon -jj Behrens)
Date: Fri, 5 Sep 2008 13:56:58 -0700
Subject: [Baypiggies] Baypiggies.net site changes.
In-Reply-To: <8249c4ac0809042303o36618808y2fb5ec8e917663b3@mail.gmail.com>
References: <8540148a0809042158n341cf958x2f610bd46fecdd03@mail.gmail.com>
	<8249c4ac0809042303o36618808y2fb5ec8e917663b3@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <c41f67b90809051356r6969343cw22df5cc54b72e1c5@mail.gmail.com>

Thanks for all your hard work Bill and Jim.

-jj

On Thu, Sep 4, 2008 at 11:03 PM, Tony Cappellini <cappy2112 at gmail.com> wrote:
> It looks great! Finally, it's readable.
> Thanks bill!
>
> On Thu, Sep 4, 2008 at 9:58 PM, William Deegan <bdbaddog at gmail.com> wrote:
>> Greetings,
>>
>> After reading much of the plone book, I've made a few changes.
>>
>> Reverted to the plone default skin, and cropped the previous logo.
>>
>> I've reworked the book review section, and working with Tony, Jim and
>> JJ to get the meeting schedules into Plone events.
>> (Which I think will be RSS'able, not sure about that)
>>
>> The old skin is gone, so finally I can read the site on my blackjack phone.
>>
>> At some point I'll update to latest plone, but for now, I think it's a
>> bit better than it was.
>>
>> Enjoy,
>> Bill
>> _______________________________________________
>> Baypiggies mailing list
>> Baypiggies at python.org
>> To change your subscription options or unsubscribe:
>> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/baypiggies
>>
> _______________________________________________
> Baypiggies mailing list
> Baypiggies at python.org
> To change your subscription options or unsubscribe:
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/baypiggies
>



-- 
Don't you wish you had a really clever sig like mine?
http://jjinux.blogspot.com/

From slander at unworkable.org  Fri Sep  5 23:04:10 2008
From: slander at unworkable.org (Harry Tormey)
Date: Fri, 5 Sep 2008 14:04:10 -0700
Subject: [Baypiggies] Additional speaker for PyGameSF September 16th Meet up
In-Reply-To: <20080905172527.GB13213@unworkable.org>
References: <20080905172527.GB13213@unworkable.org>
Message-ID: <20080905210410.GB7447@unworkable.org>

Hi All,
A last minute addition to the line up for this months PyGameSF meet up:

-Keith Nemitz (http://www.mousechief.com/) 'Making PyGames That Make Money'

About: This talk will cover how to organize your production and tools,
how to exploit market opportunities, and what the near future of small game
developer business and tools look like.

-Harry

On Fri, Sep 05, 2008 at 10:25:27AM -0700, Harry Tormey wrote:
> Hi All,
> Just writing to say that this months PyGameSF meet up is on Tuesday
> September 16th from 7pm at the Metreon food court in San Francisco. This
> month's presentations are:
> 
> - Amar Chaudhary "Python, OpenSound Control and Open Sound World."  
> 
> About: This talk will demonstrate Open Sound World (OSW), a dynamic, scalable
> environment for audio and music processing, and the ability to control
> OSW via Python and OpenSound Control.  This system can be used for building
> musical instruments or effects for use in live performance, as well as 
> "live coding."
> 
> PyGame SF is an informal group meet up in San Francisco for Software
> engineers interested in python, OpenGL, audio, pygame, SDL, programming
> and generally anything to do with multimedia development. The format of 
> our meetings typically involve several people giving presentations on projects 
> they are developing followed by group discussion and feedback.
> 
> If anyone else would like to give a micro presentation, show demos or
> just talk about what they are doing or generally give examples of  any
> relevant software they are working on please feel free to head along.
> 
> To subscribe to the pygamesf mailing list simply email
> pygame-sf+subscribe at unworkable.org 
> 
> -- 
> Harry Tormey
> _______________________________________________
> Baypiggies mailing list
> Baypiggies at python.org
> To change your subscription options or unsubscribe:
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/baypiggies

-- 
Harry Tormey
P2P Research
http://p2presearch.com

From cappy2112 at gmail.com  Sun Sep  7 00:04:10 2008
From: cappy2112 at gmail.com (Tony Cappellini)
Date: Sat, 6 Sep 2008 15:04:10 -0700
Subject: [Baypiggies] Volunteer wanted to review: Pragmatic Version Control
	Using Subversion, 2nd Ed
Message-ID: <8249c4ac0809061504t67ee45bel3a90b7360ef1c1e2@mail.gmail.com>

Someone requested this book way back in 2005 but never did the review. The
book was just returned to me.

Title: Pragmatic Version Control Using Subversion
ISBN:   0-9745140-6-3
Author: Mike Mason
Publisher: Pragmatic Bookshelf

It's yours if you want to write a review on this book.


Please reply off list.

Thanks

Tony
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://mail.python.org/pipermail/baypiggies/attachments/20080906/533ea26b/attachment.htm>

From bdbaddog at gmail.com  Sun Sep  7 20:31:55 2008
From: bdbaddog at gmail.com (William Deegan)
Date: Sun, 7 Sep 2008 11:31:55 -0700
Subject: [Baypiggies] Video from baypiggies scons presentation available?
	(August 2008 baypiggies meeting)?
Message-ID: <8540148a0809071131n376d8710qc422cc9d24451a46@mail.gmail.com>

Greetings,

Anyone know if the video of the august 2008 baypiggies meeting is up
on google video somewhere yet?
If not, any ETA?

There's a bunch of bay area python + scons users who didn't make it to
the meeting who'd like to see it.

Thanks,
Bill

From lhawthorn at google.com  Sun Sep  7 22:35:17 2008
From: lhawthorn at google.com (Leslie Hawthorn)
Date: Sun, 7 Sep 2008 13:35:17 -0700
Subject: [Baypiggies] Video from baypiggies scons presentation
	available? (August 2008 baypiggies meeting)?
In-Reply-To: <8540148a0809071131n376d8710qc422cc9d24451a46@mail.gmail.com>
References: <8540148a0809071131n376d8710qc422cc9d24451a46@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <4869cee70809071335j119b63d3x57542c8baab96452@mail.gmail.com>

Hi William,

On Sun, Sep 7, 2008 at 11:31 AM, William Deegan <bdbaddog at gmail.com> wrote:

> Greetings,
>
> Anyone know if the video of the august 2008 baypiggies meeting is up
> on google video somewhere yet?
> If not, any ETA?
>

I have a mail in to check on this. This process used to be automatic but
there seem to be snags over the past few month, not sure why. I'll update
the list when I find out more.

Cheers,
LH

-- 
Leslie Hawthorn
Program Manager - Open Source
Google Inc.

http://code.google.com/opensource/

I blog here:

http://google-opensource.blogspot.com - http://www.hawthornlandings.org
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://mail.python.org/pipermail/baypiggies/attachments/20080907/b9f8e525/attachment.htm>

From lhawthorn at google.com  Sun Sep  7 22:38:23 2008
From: lhawthorn at google.com (Leslie Hawthorn)
Date: Sun, 7 Sep 2008 13:38:23 -0700
Subject: [Baypiggies] Video from baypiggies scons presentation
	available? (August 2008 baypiggies meeting)?
In-Reply-To: <4869cee70809071335j119b63d3x57542c8baab96452@mail.gmail.com>
References: <8540148a0809071131n376d8710qc422cc9d24451a46@mail.gmail.com>
	<4869cee70809071335j119b63d3x57542c8baab96452@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <4869cee70809071338v234cd9cfg1189876c5dc012f7@mail.gmail.com>

On Sun, Sep 7, 2008 at 1:35 PM, Leslie Hawthorn <lhawthorn at google.com>wrote:

> Hi William,
>
> On Sun, Sep 7, 2008 at 11:31 AM, William Deegan <bdbaddog at gmail.com>wrote:
>
>> Greetings,
>>
>> Anyone know if the video of the august 2008 baypiggies meeting is up
>> on google video somewhere yet?
>> If not, any ETA?
>>
>
> I have a mail in to check on this. This process used to be automatic but
> there seem to be snags over the past few month, not sure why. I'll update
> the list when I find out more.
>

Wait, now I am confused. This is the program information and video linked
from the baypiggies.net site:

http://baypiggies.net/new/plone/meeting-archive

Thursday, August 9, 2007

*7:30*

General hubbub, inventory end-of-meeting announcements, any first-minute
announcements.

*7:35 - 8:40pm Technical Program*

*Topic: *Newbies' Night Part Deux

*Speakers:* Alex Martelli

This mentions nothing about Scons. Are we talking about a talk for a
different month perhaps?

Cheers,
LH
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://mail.python.org/pipermail/baypiggies/attachments/20080907/046d338a/attachment.htm>

From bdbaddog at gmail.com  Sun Sep  7 22:42:26 2008
From: bdbaddog at gmail.com (William Deegan)
Date: Sun, 7 Sep 2008 13:42:26 -0700
Subject: [Baypiggies] Video from baypiggies scons presentation
	available? (August 2008 baypiggies meeting)?
In-Reply-To: <4869cee70809071338v234cd9cfg1189876c5dc012f7@mail.gmail.com>
References: <8540148a0809071131n376d8710qc422cc9d24451a46@mail.gmail.com>
	<4869cee70809071335j119b63d3x57542c8baab96452@mail.gmail.com>
	<4869cee70809071338v234cd9cfg1189876c5dc012f7@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <8540148a0809071342y13d807en5975fdbe02a8d237@mail.gmail.com>

Leslie,

Here's the meeting I'm asking about:
http://baypiggies.net/new/plone/eventfolder/baypiggies-meeting-august-14th/?searchterm=None

Looks like the baypiggies meeting archive is not corrrect.
I'll fix that.

-Bill

On Sun, Sep 7, 2008 at 1:38 PM, Leslie Hawthorn <lhawthorn at google.com> wrote:
>
>
> On Sun, Sep 7, 2008 at 1:35 PM, Leslie Hawthorn <lhawthorn at google.com>
> wrote:
>>
>> Hi William,
>>
>> On Sun, Sep 7, 2008 at 11:31 AM, William Deegan <bdbaddog at gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>>>
>>> Greetings,
>>>
>>> Anyone know if the video of the august 2008 baypiggies meeting is up
>>> on google video somewhere yet?
>>> If not, any ETA?
>>
>> I have a mail in to check on this. This process used to be automatic but
>> there seem to be snags over the past few month, not sure why. I'll update
>> the list when I find out more.
>
> Wait, now I am confused. This is the program information and video linked
> from the baypiggies.net site:
>
> http://baypiggies.net/new/plone/meeting-archive
>
> Thursday, August 9, 2007
>
> 7:30
>
> General hubbub, inventory end-of-meeting announcements, any first-minute
> announcements.
>
> 7:35 - 8:40pm Technical Program
>
> Topic: Newbies' Night Part Deux
>
> Speakers: Alex Martelli
>
> This mentions nothing about Scons. Are we talking about a talk for a
> different month perhaps?
>
> Cheers,
> LH
>
>

From cuba at well.com  Mon Sep  8 00:08:15 2008
From: cuba at well.com (Larry Cuba)
Date: Sun, 07 Sep 2008 15:08:15 -0700
Subject: [Baypiggies] Video from baypiggies scons presentation
 available? (August 2008 baypiggies meeting)?
In-Reply-To: <8540148a0809071342y13d807en5975fdbe02a8d237@mail.gmail.com
 >
References: <8540148a0809071131n376d8710qc422cc9d24451a46@mail.gmail.com>
	<4869cee70809071335j119b63d3x57542c8baab96452@mail.gmail.com>
	<4869cee70809071338v234cd9cfg1189876c5dc012f7@mail.gmail.com>
	<8540148a0809071342y13d807en5975fdbe02a8d237@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <6.2.5.6.2.20080907144257.04a52508@well.com>


Right. Something's wrong there.
The most recent meeting in that archive is the August of *2007* meeting (not '08) .

But, while we're on this subject...
That Aug.7,2007 meeting was Part 2 of Martelli's two-part Newbies' Night talks, 
"Python for Programmers"
Part 1 is listed further down on May 10, 2007.

However...
The video link under *both* talks point to the video of Part 1:
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=1135114630744003385

and the same goes for the links to the pdf of the slides:
http://www.aleax.it/goo_py4prog.pdf

So whatever happened to the video (and slides) of Part 2?
Are they online somewhere?
Or was "Part 2" just a repeat of Part 1 and not recorded?

Please let me know.
I've been looking for them. 
thanks.

        Larry C.



At 01:42 PM 9/7/2008, you wrote:
>Leslie,
>
>Here's the meeting I'm asking about:
>http://baypiggies.net/new/plone/eventfolder/baypiggies-meeting-august-14th/?searchterm=None
>
>Looks like the baypiggies meeting archive is not corrrect.
>I'll fix that.
>
>-Bill
>
>On Sun, Sep 7, 2008 at 1:38 PM, Leslie Hawthorn <lhawthorn at google.com> wrote:
>>
>>
>> On Sun, Sep 7, 2008 at 1:35 PM, Leslie Hawthorn <lhawthorn at google.com>
>> wrote:
>>>
>>> Hi William,
>>>
>>> On Sun, Sep 7, 2008 at 11:31 AM, William Deegan <bdbaddog at gmail.com>
>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> Greetings,
>>>>
>>>> Anyone know if the video of the august 2008 baypiggies meeting is up
>>>> on google video somewhere yet?
>>>> If not, any ETA?
>>>
>>> I have a mail in to check on this. This process used to be automatic but
>>> there seem to be snags over the past few month, not sure why. I'll update
>>> the list when I find out more.
>>
>> Wait, now I am confused. This is the program information and video linked
>> from the baypiggies.net site:
>>
>> http://baypiggies.net/new/plone/meeting-archive
>>
>> Thursday, August 9, 2007
>>
>> 7:30
>>
>> General hubbub, inventory end-of-meeting announcements, any first-minute
>> announcements.
>>
>> 7:35 - 8:40pm Technical Program
>>
>> Topic: Newbies' Night Part Deux
>>
>> Speakers: Alex Martelli
>>
>> This mentions nothing about Scons. Are we talking about a talk for a
>> different month perhaps?
>>
>> Cheers,
>> LH
>>
>>
>_______________________________________________
>Baypiggies mailing list
>Baypiggies at python.org
>To change your subscription options or unsubscribe:
>http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/baypiggies


From mrbmahoney at gmail.com  Tue Sep  9 05:12:49 2008
From: mrbmahoney at gmail.com (Brian Mahoney)
Date: Mon, 8 Sep 2008 20:12:49 -0700
Subject: [Baypiggies] Dinner Announcement - Thursday, September 11, 6 pm
Message-ID: <5538c19b0809082012x37ae2b13haa633e416002ae08@mail.gmail.com>

For Thursday, September 11, I can coordinate a pre-meeting
 dinner in Mountain View, before the BayPIGgies meeting
 at Google .

 Restaurant reservations may be sent to my email until
 Thursday afternoon (earlier is better). We eat family-style,
 there are vegetarian and non-vegetarian dishes.  Cost around
 $10 per person, including tax and tip. Bring cash, please.

 Start dinner at 6pm and I will keep things moving so that we
 finish and get everyone headed towards Google to
 complete sign-in before the 7:30 meeting start.

 The restaurant is Cafe Yulong in downtown Mountain View
 (650) 960-1677
 743 W Dana Street, 1/2 block from Castro where
 Books, Inc is on the corner.
 Parking lots all around, but downtown Mountain View
 parking can be difficult.

 It is a slightly out of the ordinary Chinese
 restaurant.  This link has a downtown map and
 additional information.
 http://www.mountainviewca.net/restaurants/cafeyulong.html

 I've made reservations under "Python" for 6pm
 Thursday.

 If you wish to join us for dinner please e-mail me
 by 3 pm Thursday (earlier is better) so I may confirm
 the headcount.
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://mail.python.org/pipermail/baypiggies/attachments/20080908/5f84a2ff/attachment.htm>

From cappy2112 at gmail.com  Tue Sep  9 18:33:39 2008
From: cappy2112 at gmail.com (Tony Cappellini)
Date: Tue, 9 Sep 2008 09:33:39 -0700
Subject: [Baypiggies] Fwd: [php|architect] Join Us at php|works and PyWorks
	2008!
In-Reply-To: <9D89FFBA-2A8F-4F86-94E6-F8105E29204A@phparch.com>
References: <9D89FFBA-2A8F-4F86-94E6-F8105E29204A@phparch.com>
Message-ID: <8249c4ac0809090933g25d82df9i7271ce2a4b27d11a@mail.gmail.com>

 If you are experiencing problems reading this e-mail, please click
here<http://ethreemail.com/e3ds/mail_link.php?u=http%3A%2F%2Fphparch.com%2Fc%2Fmail%2Fphpw&i=0&d=927EA163-2347-4F4B-8A9E-7BB44D1BE804&e=cappy2112 at gmail.com>.

 Join Us at php|works and PyWorks 2008!

Free training when you sign up!

Sign up for any conference + tutorial day package *before September 27* and
receive complimentary access to one of our training classes free of charge?*a
$900 value yours completely free*!

For more information, visit our Specials
Page<http://ethreemail.com/e3ds/mail_link.php?u=http%3A%2F%2Fphpworks.mtacon.com%2Fc%2Fp%2Fphpworks%2Cspecials&i=1&d=927EA163-2347-4F4B-8A9E-7BB44D1BE804&e=cappy2112 at gmail.com>

Dear tony?
The publishers of
php|architect<http://ethreemail.com/e3ds/mail_link.php?u=http%3A%2F%2Fphparch.com%2F&i=2&d=927EA163-2347-4F4B-8A9E-7BB44D1BE804&e=cappy2112 at gmail.com>and
Python
Magazine<http://ethreemail.com/e3ds/mail_link.php?u=http%3A%2F%2Fpythonmagazine.com&i=3&d=927EA163-2347-4F4B-8A9E-7BB44D1BE804&e=cappy2112 at gmail.com>,
are proud to invite you to
php|works<http://ethreemail.com/e3ds/mail_link.php?u=http%3A%2F%2Fphpworks.mtacon.com&i=4&d=927EA163-2347-4F4B-8A9E-7BB44D1BE804&e=cappy2112 at gmail.com>and
PyWorks<http://ethreemail.com/e3ds/mail_link.php?u=http%3A%2F%2Fpyworks.mtacon.com&i=5&d=927EA163-2347-4F4B-8A9E-7BB44D1BE804&e=cappy2112 at gmail.com>,
two great conferences that will take place in *Atlanta, GA, USA*, between
November 12 and November 14.

With over *65 talks in 5 tracks, 10 tutorials* and great networking events
and parties, php|works and PyWorks represent a unique opportunity to not
only hone your technical skills, but also meet and interact with members of
a vibrant community of developers from all walks of life. And remember?your
attendance fee covers access to *both conferences!*

Here's a brief, partial selection of some of the great talks that will be
presented at php|works and PyWorks:


   - Matthew Weier O'Phinney: *Rich UIs with Zend Framework and Dojo*
   - Sebastian Bergmann: *Lambdas, closures and traits in PHP*
   - Sara Golemon: *Simple scaling every developer should know*
   - Travis Swicegood: *Introduction to Git*
   - Mark Ramm: *Building Web Applications with TurboGears*
   - Michael Foord: *IronPython: Python on .NET*
   - Morgan Tocker: *Performance Tuning MySQL*
   - Chris Shiflett: *Security-Centered Design*
   - D. Keith Casey, Jr.: *Mobilizing the Web*

You can find the complete schedule for both conferences
here<http://ethreemail.com/e3ds/mail_link.php?u=http%3A%2F%2Fphpworks.mtacon.com%2Fc%2Fschedule&i=6&d=927EA163-2347-4F4B-8A9E-7BB44D1BE804&e=cappy2112 at gmail.com>.


With attendance fees starting as low as $499 per person, special hotel deals
and a location that is just minutes by one of the most accessible
international airports in the world, php|works and PyWorks are *your* chance
to be part of a unique learning experience!

Sign up today?don't miss out!


 Copyright (c) 2002-2008 Marco Tabini & Associates, Inc. ? All Rights Reserved

Contact Us<http://ethreemail.com/e3ds/mail_link.php?u=http%3A%2F%2Fphparch.com%2Fc%2Fphpa%2Fabout%2Fcontact&i=7&d=927EA163-2347-4F4B-8A9E-7BB44D1BE804&e=cappy2112 at gmail.com>?
Manage
your e-mail preferences<http://ethreemail.com/e3ds/mail_link.php?u=http%3A%2F%2Fphparch.com%2Fc%2Faccount&i=8&d=927EA163-2347-4F4B-8A9E-7BB44D1BE804&e=cappy2112 at gmail.com>
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://mail.python.org/pipermail/baypiggies/attachments/20080909/c20b6003/attachment.htm>

From jim at well.com  Wed Sep 10 07:50:23 2008
From: jim at well.com (jim)
Date: Tue, 09 Sep 2008 22:50:23 -0700
Subject: [Baypiggies] BayPIGgies meeting Thursday September 11,
	2008: Music and Lights
Message-ID: <1221025823.30326.132.camel@ubuntu>


BayPIGgies meeting Thursday September 11, 2008: 
Finger Painting with Planets 
by Speaker 

Finger Painting with Planets is an interactive installation using 
FingerWorks iGesture multitouch pads in a custom-built controller. 
The installation lets people place objects in space. Gravitational 
attraction between the objects produces graceful movements that are 
translated into visuals and sound. Knobs and buttons on the controller 
are used to adjust parameters. A musical keyboard is used to select 
notes that will be used in the music. 


Theater Lighting System 
by Drew Perttula

I'll talk about 3 major new improvements to my theater lighting 
system since the last presentation in 2005: a midi input device 
(with python driver); the use of RDF for most of the persistent 
data; and a new tool for rendering previews of lighting scenes 
with opengl.


The meeting starts with a Newbie Nugget, a short discussion of 
an essential Python feature, specially for those new to Python. 

Tonight's Newbie Nugget is... 
Micro-benchmarking with timeit, presented by Matt Good. 


Location: Google Campus 
Building 40, the Seville room 
(check in at the lobby in bldg 43)


bayPIGgies meeting information: 
http://baypiggies.net/new/plone

* Please sign up in advance to have your google access badge ready: 
http://wiki.python.org/moin/BayPiggiesGoogleMeetings
(no later than close of business on Wednesday.) 


Agenda

..... 7:30 PM ...........................
General hubbub, inventory end-of-meeting announcements, 
any first-minute announcements. 


..... 7:35 PM to 7:45 PM ................
Newbie Nugget Benchmarking with timeit 
by Matt Good 
 

..... 7:45 PM to 8:15 PM ................
Finger Painting with Planets 
by Tim Thompson 


..... 8:15 PM to 8:45 PM ................
Theater Lighting System 
by Drew Perttula 



..... 8:45 PM to 9:00 PM -- After The Talk ................
Mapping and Random Access

Mapping is a rapid-fire audience announcement of topics 
the announcers are interested in. 

Random Access follows immediately to allow follow up 
individually on the announcements and other topics of 
interest.



From ibuono at pixar.com  Wed Sep 10 22:58:43 2008
From: ibuono at pixar.com (Ian Buono)
Date: Wed, 10 Sep 2008 13:58:43 -0700
Subject: [Baypiggies] Software Engineer in Test at Pixar, Emeryville
Message-ID: <56E88BB4-CEEE-4E55-B4DF-FAB0F537D722@pixar.com>

We're looking to fill a position on the QA team responsible for  
testing an
in house tool set used to make films such as Wall-E, Ratatouille and  
Toy Story.

This is a full time position focused on extending the test framework and
test coverage.  The tools under test have a python API and the test  
harness
is written in python as well.

For a full job description see: http://tinyurl.com/yjv6he

If you're interested, either mail ibuono at pixar.com or submit your  
resume though
the above link. 

From lhawthorn at google.com  Thu Sep 11 01:15:12 2008
From: lhawthorn at google.com (Leslie Hawthorn)
Date: Wed, 10 Sep 2008 16:15:12 -0700
Subject: [Baypiggies] BayPIGgies meeting Thursday September 11,
	2008: Music and Lights
In-Reply-To: <1221025823.30326.132.camel@ubuntu>
References: <1221025823.30326.132.camel@ubuntu>
Message-ID: <4869cee70809101615n3590415eu37df4fe633eca557@mail.gmail.com>

Hi folks,

You're back with me as your Google Mountain View meetings point of contact.
Please try to sign up on the wiki to attend tomorrow's meeting no later than
12 noon. Sorry for the late reminder.

http://wiki.python.org/moin/BayPiggiesGoogleMeetings

Jim, since you are coordinating meetings on the community side can you
please send out this reminder? Apologies if you have and I have missed it in
the past.

It would also be lovely to make the "register on the wiki" note on
baypiggies.net more prominent. I was about to ask that this information be
added to the website when I happened to see the word "register" in the left
hand nav out of the corner of my eye.

Donna, are you still handling site updates?

Cheers,
LH
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://mail.python.org/pipermail/baypiggies/attachments/20080910/1de43f74/attachment.htm>

From spmcinerney at hotmail.com  Fri Sep 12 22:45:43 2008
From: spmcinerney at hotmail.com (Stephen McInerney)
Date: Fri, 12 Sep 2008 13:45:43 -0700
Subject: [Baypiggies] Reproing IDLE bug 3841
Message-ID: <BAY111-W3FD0A27EB4A6BB688F726A0510@phx.gbl>


 
Could anyone help reproing this minor IDLE bug?
http://bugs.python.org/issue3841
I found it on Windows Vista with Python 2.5 / IDLE 1.2.2.
I don't have ready access to non-Windows installs or else I would do it myself
and not bother the list with such a request.
Copy-and-paste the testcase, view it inside IDLE and see what if the issue occurs.
Should only take 1 minute.
 
Please let me know if you can/cannot repro on a combination of each of these:
OS: Windows XP (SP2?), Windows Vista (SP1?), Linux
Python version: 2.5, 2.6, 2.7, 3.0
IDLE versions: ?
 
Thanks in advance,
Stephen
_________________________________________________________________
Want to do more with Windows Live? Learn ?10 hidden secrets? from Jamie.
http://windowslive.com/connect/post/jamiethomson.spaces.live.com-Blog-cns!550F681DAD532637!5295.entry?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_domore_092008
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://mail.python.org/pipermail/baypiggies/attachments/20080912/55a7f1d8/attachment.htm>

From cvrebert at gmail.com  Fri Sep 12 22:54:47 2008
From: cvrebert at gmail.com (Chris Rebert)
Date: Fri, 12 Sep 2008 13:54:47 -0700
Subject: [Baypiggies] Reproing IDLE bug 3841
In-Reply-To: <BAY111-W3FD0A27EB4A6BB688F726A0510@phx.gbl>
References: <BAY111-W3FD0A27EB4A6BB688F726A0510@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <47c890dc0809121354i4b0fd456n9888822f5a1e969a@mail.gmail.com>

Assuming the string is supposed to be all on one line, I can't reproduce.

Python 2.5.2
IDLE 1.2.2
Mac OS X 10.5.4

Regards,
Chris

On Fri, Sep 12, 2008 at 1:45 PM, Stephen McInerney
<spmcinerney at hotmail.com> wrote:
>
> Could anyone help reproing this minor IDLE bug?
> http://bugs.python.org/issue3841
> I found it on Windows Vista with Python 2.5 / IDLE 1.2.2.
> I don't have ready access to non-Windows installs or else I would do it
> myself
> and not bother the list with such a request.
> Copy-and-paste the testcase, view it inside IDLE and see what if the issue
> occurs.
> Should only take 1 minute.
>
> Please let me know if you can/cannot repro on a combination of each
> of these:
> OS: Windows XP (SP2?), Windows Vista (SP1?), Linux
> Python version: 2.5, 2.6, 2.7, 3.0
> IDLE versions: ?
>
> Thanks in advance,
> Stephen
>
> ________________________________
> Want to do more with Windows Live? Learn "10 hidden secrets" from Jamie.
> Learn Now
> _______________________________________________
> Baypiggies mailing list
> Baypiggies at python.org
> To change your subscription options or unsubscribe:
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/baypiggies
>



-- 
Follow the path of the Iguana...
http://rebertia.com

From lavendula6654 at yahoo.com  Sat Sep 13 01:09:54 2008
From: lavendula6654 at yahoo.com (Elaine)
Date: Fri, 12 Sep 2008 16:09:54 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Baypiggies] Python course at Foothill College
Message-ID: <309480.45238.qm@web31301.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

If you would like to learn Python, Foothill College is offering a course in Palo Alto starting Wednesday evening, 24 Sept, at 6 pm. This 12-week course is designed for students who are already familiar with another structured programming language. Here is more detailed information:

CIS 68K  "INTRODUCTION TO PYTHON PROGRAMMING"  5 Units
Meets Wednesday evenings, 6 -9:40 pm, from 24 Sept. until 10 Dec. at Middlefield campus room J3.

If you would like to sign up for the class, please register beforehand by going to:
http://www.foothill.fhda.edu/reg/index.php

If you have questions, you can contact the instructor at:
haightElaine at foothill.edu




      

From AFife at untangle.com  Sat Sep 13 21:01:02 2008
From: AFife at untangle.com (Andrew Fife)
Date: Sat, 13 Sep 2008 12:01:02 -0700
Subject: [Baypiggies] BALUG = Ian Murdock (Tuesday)
In-Reply-To: <mailman.1.1221300002.16660.baypiggies@python.org>
References: <mailman.1.1221300002.16660.baypiggies@python.org>
Message-ID: <9347C2AED406124287DD2A007EB15B13BAEB5A5F@EXCHANGE.Untangle.local>

Hi Folks:
Ian Murdock will be speaking at BALUG this coming Tuesday (9/16).  Ian founded Debian in 1993 and served as project lead through 1996.  Currently Ian is the Vice President of Developer and Community Marketing at Sun Microsystems and previously was the CTO of the Linux Foundation.  (Full bio links below)

============================
VERY important changes...
============================

1)Change in venue
We are NOT meeting at the Four Seas Restaurant because they have a conflict.  However, Songbird (http://www.songbird.com/) has kindly offer the use of their office in SOMA for the meeting.  (Address below)

2)Change in food & cost
We will be ordering pizza & soda for this meeting. The cost will be $10, meat and veggie-friendly options will be available and we promise it won't be Pizza Hut or Domino's.

3)RSVPs REQUIRED
Due to the fact that Songbird can host about 75 attendees (we may well get a full house) _AND_ that BALUG volunteers are personally paying for pizza upfront, we are *requiring* an RSVP for this event.  So, if you'd like to join us *please* RSVP now (or at least as soon as you can!) to:

   rsvp at balug.org


Meeting Details...

   6:30 P.M. September 16th, 2008

   Songbird's Corporate Office
   585 Howard St. (near 2nd St.)
   San Francisco, CA 94105-3032
   Map w/ Parking Garages: http://tinyurl.com/5zbwuu

   Cost: The meetings are always free, but pizza & soda is $10

Links to Ian Murdock's full bios:

Personal:
http://ianmurdock.com/about/

Corporate:
http://www.sun.com/aboutsun/media/ceo/bio.jsp?name=Ian%20Murdock


More information, additional maps, other upcoming meetings, etc.:
http://www.balug.org/

--
publicity-feedback at balug.org

From zander at longnow.org  Tue Sep 16 18:22:04 2008
From: zander at longnow.org (Long Now)
Date: Tue, 16 Sep 2008 09:22:04 -0700
Subject: [Baypiggies] Python Programmer for The Long Now Foundation
Message-ID: <48CFDD2C.2020400@longnow.org>

Python payment processing Developer

http://www.longnow.org/jobs/

The Long Now Foundation is looking for a Python programmer, familiar 
with Paypal's Payflow Pro (recurring) billing module and both it's 
client side SDK and HTTP Interface API. We are looking to integrate 
membership functionality into our new Django-based web site; allowing 
users to signup for a recurring charge membership. Most internal 
functionality (for auth, users, profile, messaging) is written. You will 
be in charge of creating, in Python, the bits that interact with Payflow 
Pro Gateway through their HTTP Interface API. Creating, Polling, 
Updating paypal-bound profiles. You will need to write the error 
handling, retry logic and all other functionality surrounding Payflow 
Pro interaction since the HTTP Interface does not include it.

Ideally the candidate would be local to the San Francisco Bay Area, but 
we are willing to consider candidates anywhere in the PST time zone. The 
candidate should have past experience with recurring credit card 
transaction systems, and be available for ongoing support after the 
development process. We are looking to develop a long-term relationship.
Recommended Skills

   * Django web-framework
   * Python
   * PHP
   * MySQL
   * Version Control (Subversion)
   * General UNIX knowledge

Please send text resume and well considered cover letter to 
jobs at longnow.org (Resume and cover letter should be in the body of an 
email, links to past work a plus, NO ATTACHMENTS)

-- 
Alexander Rose

From careers at flowgram.com  Wed Sep 17 18:58:26 2008
From: careers at flowgram.com (Flowgram Careers)
Date: Wed, 17 Sep 2008 09:58:26 -0700
Subject: [Baypiggies] Developer Opening at Flowgram (San Francisco, CA)
Message-ID: <9bbccded0809170958h413bf543qb733d9d5d7117ff9@mail.gmail.com>

Please send your resume and cover letter to careers at flowgram.com. Visit
http://www.flowgram.com to see Flowgram in action.

*Position Details*
Flowgram is seeking passionate, versatile developers with a focus on
back-end technologies. If you enjoy constant exploration, learning, a
fast-paced environment, and believe that working with other great people is
paramount to building a great product and company, we should talk.


 Responsibilities:

   -

   Optimize and continue to develop current product offerings based on user
   feedback and analysis.
   -

   Collaborate with the team to plan and design new functionality
   -

   Do whatever it takes to translate product designs and requirements into
   launch ready web offerings.


 Command of at least several of the following...

   -

   HTML, XHTML, CSS, DOM, AJAX
   -

   Object oriented JavaScript development
   -

   Cross-browser compatibility issues and degradation strategies
   -

   Django/Python
   -

   Flex/Flash
   -

   Object oriented programming
   -

   LAMP and competing technologies
   -

   Automated build and test systems, functional, unit, and integration
   testing
   -

   Linux/FreeBSD


 Bonus points

   -

   Experience building widgets for MySpace and/or Facebook platform
   -

   Data driven product evolution expertise
   -

   Webkit development experience or deep knowledge of other browser
   technologies
   -

   Previous experience scaling consumer facing applications


*Other Details:*

Full-time/Salaried positions


*About Us*

We are building a new communications platform that lets *anyone* package and
share *anything* on the internet in ways never before possible.

A Flowgram combines the advantages of slide presentations and screencasts
with an interactive user experience that fully exploits the fact that almost
all the information we might ever need is already on the web.

Using the zero download Flowgram Maker, creators can assemble and annotate
web pages, photographs, videos etc on any topic, and add a voice narrative
which provides context, emotion and consistency. This uniquely personalized
package can be shared as an embeddable widget, email or as a link to either
a private group or with the world. Flowgram recipients can interact with any
of its pages by, for example, clicking on links, and playing and pausing
videos.

Thousands of compelling Flowgrams have already been created for education,
training, sales, photo journalism, humor, website walkthroughs, and
tutorials etc.

Our small team has backgrounds from Macromedia, Yahoo, Google and is
committed to building the most compelling and hassle free user experiences
human possible. Our founder Abhay Parekh previously co-founded Fast Forward
Networks which sold for over $1b and is also an Adjunct Professor of EECS at
UC Berkeley.

Flowgram's mission has captured the imagination of a prestigious group of
individuals with exceptional track records including Flowgram investors
include Reid Hoffman (Paypal, Linkedin), First Round Capital, Kevin Lynch
(CTO Adobe), the founders of Flickr and Half.com, the founding CEO of
Macromedia, and members of the founding team of WebEx and Tibco Software.
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://mail.python.org/pipermail/baypiggies/attachments/20080917/8c917131/attachment.htm>

From jjinux at gmail.com  Wed Sep 17 20:40:16 2008
From: jjinux at gmail.com (Shannon -jj Behrens)
Date: Wed, 17 Sep 2008 11:40:16 -0700
Subject: [Baypiggies] multithreading question
Message-ID: <c41f67b90809171140x698c9d5dhf5c46085ad9319d3@mail.gmail.com>

I know that threads are the devil and all, but I have a threading question ;)

I'm using the queue module to coordinate a bunch of threads.  Those
threads need to log a line to STDOUT.  The line is short.  Can I count
on the GIL to make sure that writing a single line to STDOUT is
atomic, or do I need to be more paranoid?

-jj

-- 
Don't you wish you had a really clever sig like mine?
http://jjinux.blogspot.com/

From adam at hupp.org  Wed Sep 17 21:01:45 2008
From: adam at hupp.org (Adam Hupp)
Date: Wed, 17 Sep 2008 12:01:45 -0700
Subject: [Baypiggies] multithreading question
In-Reply-To: <c41f67b90809171140x698c9d5dhf5c46085ad9319d3@mail.gmail.com>
References: <c41f67b90809171140x698c9d5dhf5c46085ad9319d3@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <766a29bd0809171201k6742dfbcn86436232ee8676f8@mail.gmail.com>

On Wed, Sep 17, 2008 at 11:40 AM, Shannon -jj Behrens <jjinux at gmail.com> wrote:
>
> I'm using the queue module to coordinate a bunch of threads.  Those
> threads need to log a line to STDOUT.  The line is short.  Can I count
> on the GIL to make sure that writing a single line to STDOUT is
> atomic, or do I need to be more paranoid?

Isn't the GIL dropped during any IO?  In that case I don't think you
can rely on it.

-- 
Adam Hupp | http://hupp.org/adam/

From jjinux at gmail.com  Wed Sep 17 21:06:53 2008
From: jjinux at gmail.com (Shannon -jj Behrens)
Date: Wed, 17 Sep 2008 12:06:53 -0700
Subject: [Baypiggies] multithreading question
In-Reply-To: <766a29bd0809171201k6742dfbcn86436232ee8676f8@mail.gmail.com>
References: <c41f67b90809171140x698c9d5dhf5c46085ad9319d3@mail.gmail.com>
	<766a29bd0809171201k6742dfbcn86436232ee8676f8@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <c41f67b90809171206j477e0465w46eed6b32d79454@mail.gmail.com>

On Wed, Sep 17, 2008 at 12:01 PM, Adam Hupp <adam at hupp.org> wrote:
> On Wed, Sep 17, 2008 at 11:40 AM, Shannon -jj Behrens <jjinux at gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>> I'm using the queue module to coordinate a bunch of threads.  Those
>> threads need to log a line to STDOUT.  The line is short.  Can I count
>> on the GIL to make sure that writing a single line to STDOUT is
>> atomic, or do I need to be more paranoid?
>
> Isn't the GIL dropped during any IO?  In that case I don't think you
> can rely on it.

Python gives up the GIL.  The C library goes to write the string.  It
writes out only four bytes.  A context switch occurs.  Some other
thread does the same thing.  Kaboom.

Seems plausible.  Is it really as bad as that?  Ugh.

-jj

-- 
Don't you wish you had a really clever sig like mine?
http://jjinux.blogspot.com/

From aleax at google.com  Wed Sep 17 22:07:37 2008
From: aleax at google.com (Alex Martelli)
Date: Wed, 17 Sep 2008 13:07:37 -0700
Subject: [Baypiggies] multithreading question
In-Reply-To: <c41f67b90809171206j477e0465w46eed6b32d79454@mail.gmail.com>
References: <c41f67b90809171140x698c9d5dhf5c46085ad9319d3@mail.gmail.com>
	<766a29bd0809171201k6742dfbcn86436232ee8676f8@mail.gmail.com>
	<c41f67b90809171206j477e0465w46eed6b32d79454@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <55dc209b0809171307j771bc61pe05ef4780d427bee@mail.gmail.com>

On Wed, Sep 17, 2008 at 12:06 PM, Shannon -jj Behrens <jjinux at gmail.com> wrote:
> On Wed, Sep 17, 2008 at 12:01 PM, Adam Hupp <adam at hupp.org> wrote:
>> On Wed, Sep 17, 2008 at 11:40 AM, Shannon -jj Behrens <jjinux at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>> I'm using the queue module to coordinate a bunch of threads.  Those
>>> threads need to log a line to STDOUT.  The line is short.  Can I count
>>> on the GIL to make sure that writing a single line to STDOUT is
>>> atomic, or do I need to be more paranoid?
>>
>> Isn't the GIL dropped during any IO?  In that case I don't think you
>> can rely on it.
>
> Python gives up the GIL.  The C library goes to write the string.  It
> writes out only four bytes.  A context switch occurs.  Some other
> thread does the same thing.  Kaboom.
>
> Seems plausible.  Is it really as bad as that?  Ugh.

Yep.  If you need real reliability, devote a separate thread to the
sole task of writing to stdout, listening on a Queue for such write
requests.  Or, you could use the logging module.


Alex

From donnamsnow at gmail.com  Wed Sep 17 22:15:31 2008
From: donnamsnow at gmail.com (Donna Snow)
Date: Wed, 17 Sep 2008 13:15:31 -0700
Subject: [Baypiggies] World Plone Day - November 7, 2008
Message-ID: <baf0d46b0809171315j187f5514r94ead06044efaaa3@mail.gmail.com>

Hi,

I'm coordinating an event for World Plone Day in San Jose (or somewhere in
the area)

Still looking for a location and I am lining up sessions for the day long
event.

If you'd like to present a Plone related talk (it doesn't have to be formal)
for November 7th please get a hold of me.

Anyone know of a good place to hold an all day event? It'll be a session per
hour (not multi-track) and it'll include "introductory talks" + a couple
tutorials.

(tried google, they aren't available for that time frame so looking at
central locale)

It's a world wide event and I'm just one of many people organizing these day
long sessions. If you have any questions at all (especially since Plone 3
was launched a year ago)
and just want to find out more about Plone this is a good place to be!

So still need a location..anyone wanna donate a room for a day and/or
sponsor the event?

Best Regards,
Donna M Snow, Principal
C Squared Enterprises
illuminating your path to Open Source
http://www.csquaredtech.com
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://mail.python.org/pipermail/baypiggies/attachments/20080917/f0031513/attachment-0001.htm>

From spmcinerney at hotmail.com  Wed Sep 17 22:27:38 2008
From: spmcinerney at hotmail.com (Stephen McInerney)
Date: Wed, 17 Sep 2008 13:27:38 -0700
Subject: [Baypiggies] multithreading question
In-Reply-To: <55dc209b0809171307j771bc61pe05ef4780d427bee@mail.gmail.com>
References: <c41f67b90809171140x698c9d5dhf5c46085ad9319d3@mail.gmail.com>
	<766a29bd0809171201k6742dfbcn86436232ee8676f8@mail.gmail.com>
	<c41f67b90809171206j477e0465w46eed6b32d79454@mail.gmail.com> 
	<55dc209b0809171307j771bc61pe05ef4780d427bee@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <BAY111-W365C9B56A6892B628C02E6A04C0@phx.gbl>


Alex,
 
Is there a need to more clearly document which Python modules and fns
(in the CPython implementation) are threadsafe?
This sort of information is impossible to find.
 
Stephen
_________________________________________________________________
See how Windows Mobile brings your life together?at home, work, or on the go.
http://clk.atdmt.com/MRT/go/msnnkwxp1020093182mrt/direct/01/
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://mail.python.org/pipermail/baypiggies/attachments/20080917/f81af2eb/attachment.htm>

From aahz at pythoncraft.com  Wed Sep 17 23:17:51 2008
From: aahz at pythoncraft.com (Aahz)
Date: Wed, 17 Sep 2008 14:17:51 -0700
Subject: [Baypiggies] multithreading question
In-Reply-To: <c41f67b90809171140x698c9d5dhf5c46085ad9319d3@mail.gmail.com>
References: <c41f67b90809171140x698c9d5dhf5c46085ad9319d3@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <20080917211750.GA5199@panix.com>

On Wed, Sep 17, 2008, Shannon -jj Behrens wrote:
>
> I know that threads are the devil and all, but I have a threading
> question ;)

What makes you say that threads are the devil?

> I'm using the queue module to coordinate a bunch of threads.  Those
> threads need to log a line to STDOUT.  The line is short.  Can I count
> on the GIL to make sure that writing a single line to STDOUT is
> atomic, or do I need to be more paranoid?

That depends really on the underlying OS library.  Mostly yes: a single
Python C-level call to fwrite() will be atomic.  So technically, you're
not counting on the GIL.  ;-)
-- 
Aahz (aahz at pythoncraft.com)           <*>         http://www.pythoncraft.com/

"Argue for your limitations, and sure enough they're yours."  --Richard Bach

From aleax at google.com  Wed Sep 17 23:33:35 2008
From: aleax at google.com (Alex Martelli)
Date: Wed, 17 Sep 2008 14:33:35 -0700
Subject: [Baypiggies] multithreading question
In-Reply-To: <BAY111-W365C9B56A6892B628C02E6A04C0@phx.gbl>
References: <c41f67b90809171140x698c9d5dhf5c46085ad9319d3@mail.gmail.com>
	<766a29bd0809171201k6742dfbcn86436232ee8676f8@mail.gmail.com>
	<c41f67b90809171206j477e0465w46eed6b32d79454@mail.gmail.com>
	<55dc209b0809171307j771bc61pe05ef4780d427bee@mail.gmail.com>
	<BAY111-W365C9B56A6892B628C02E6A04C0@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <55dc209b0809171433v1b164f31id310c420e212a5f@mail.gmail.com>

On Wed, Sep 17, 2008 at 1:27 PM, Stephen McInerney
<spmcinerney at hotmail.com> wrote:
> Alex,
>
> Is there a need to more clearly document which Python modules and fns
> (in the CPython implementation) are threadsafe?
> This sort of information is impossible to find.

You can safely assume that no module is thread-safe unless it claims
it is.  At http://docs.python.org/lib/node424.html for example you can
read:
"""
14.5.9 Thread Safety

The logging module is intended to be thread-safe without any special
work needing to be done by its clients. It achieves this though using
threading locks; there is one lock to serialize access to the module's
shared data, and each handler also creates a lock to serialize access
to its underlying I/O.
"""
and at http://docs.python.org/lib/module-Queue.html:
"""
especially useful in threads programming when information must be
exchanged safely between multiple threads. The Queue class in this
module implements all the required locking semantics.
"""

How is this info hard to find?


Alex

From aleax at google.com  Wed Sep 17 23:38:57 2008
From: aleax at google.com (Alex Martelli)
Date: Wed, 17 Sep 2008 14:38:57 -0700
Subject: [Baypiggies] multithreading question
In-Reply-To: <20080917211750.GA5199@panix.com>
References: <c41f67b90809171140x698c9d5dhf5c46085ad9319d3@mail.gmail.com>
	<20080917211750.GA5199@panix.com>
Message-ID: <55dc209b0809171438n48ff8a9fq2c16be8889bf2eff@mail.gmail.com>

On Wed, Sep 17, 2008 at 2:17 PM, Aahz <aahz at pythoncraft.com> wrote:
> On Wed, Sep 17, 2008, Shannon -jj Behrens wrote:
>>
>> I know that threads are the devil and all, but I have a threading
>> question ;)
>
> What makes you say that threads are the devil?
>
>> I'm using the queue module to coordinate a bunch of threads.  Those
>> threads need to log a line to STDOUT.  The line is short.  Can I count
>> on the GIL to make sure that writing a single line to STDOUT is
>> atomic, or do I need to be more paranoid?
>
> That depends really on the underlying OS library.  Mostly yes: a single
> Python C-level call to fwrite() will be atomic.  So technically, you're
> not counting on the GIL.  ;-)

I don't consider this reliable, in general: depending on the length of
data being written, writes on distributed filesystems such as NFS or
SMB are notoriously prone to NOT being atomic; how can I ensure that
stdout will never be redirected to a file living on such a filesystem,
for example?  IMHO, using the logging module or a dedicated
output-writing thread is well worth the (small) inconvenience.


Alex

From jjinux at gmail.com  Wed Sep 17 23:45:43 2008
From: jjinux at gmail.com (Shannon -jj Behrens)
Date: Wed, 17 Sep 2008 14:45:43 -0700
Subject: [Baypiggies] multithreading question
In-Reply-To: <55dc209b0809171438n48ff8a9fq2c16be8889bf2eff@mail.gmail.com>
References: <c41f67b90809171140x698c9d5dhf5c46085ad9319d3@mail.gmail.com>
	<20080917211750.GA5199@panix.com>
	<55dc209b0809171438n48ff8a9fq2c16be8889bf2eff@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <c41f67b90809171445k567d054l1931cd467abd6d02@mail.gmail.com>

> What makes you say that threads are the devil?

Threads make an otherwise deterministic program non-deterministic.
Threads that share data require locking in a way that is often hard to
get right.  This conversation is an example of that.  Last of all,
because of the GIL (as you well know), threads in Python aren't as
useful for CPU parallelization as, say, threads in C.

-jj

-- 
Don't you wish you had a really clever sig like mine?
http://jjinux.blogspot.com/

From spmcinerney at hotmail.com  Wed Sep 17 23:49:18 2008
From: spmcinerney at hotmail.com (Stephen McInerney)
Date: Wed, 17 Sep 2008 14:49:18 -0700
Subject: [Baypiggies] multithreading question
In-Reply-To: <55dc209b0809171433v1b164f31id310c420e212a5f@mail.gmail.com>
References: <c41f67b90809171140x698c9d5dhf5c46085ad9319d3@mail.gmail.com>
	<766a29bd0809171201k6742dfbcn86436232ee8676f8@mail.gmail.com>
	<c41f67b90809171206j477e0465w46eed6b32d79454@mail.gmail.com>
	<55dc209b0809171307j771bc61pe05ef4780d427bee@mail.gmail.com>
	<BAY111-W365C9B56A6892B628C02E6A04C0@phx.gbl> 
	<55dc209b0809171433v1b164f31id310c420e212a5f@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <BAY111-W2965AE883FF16C5E16CB34A04C0@phx.gbl>


 
I don't think the default assumption "You can safely assume that no module
is thread-safe unless it claims it is. " is explicitly stated anywhere in the Python
library doc? (http://docs.python.org/lib/*)
I definitely think that is worth adding?
 
Yes, I saw logging has a note saying it is thread-safe, but (for example)
popen2, Popen3 and Popen4 say nothing, I should assume they're not?
 
[I'm holding the assumption that someday eventually the GIL may go
away as the typical number of threads increases to the point where it
becomes commercially important to solve that.]
 
Stephen
_________________________________________________________________
See how Windows Mobile brings your life together?at home, work, or on the go.
http://clk.atdmt.com/MRT/go/msnnkwxp1020093182mrt/direct/01/
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://mail.python.org/pipermail/baypiggies/attachments/20080917/74c5311b/attachment.htm>

From aleax at google.com  Thu Sep 18 00:58:53 2008
From: aleax at google.com (Alex Martelli)
Date: Wed, 17 Sep 2008 15:58:53 -0700
Subject: [Baypiggies] multithreading question
In-Reply-To: <BAY111-W2965AE883FF16C5E16CB34A04C0@phx.gbl>
References: <c41f67b90809171140x698c9d5dhf5c46085ad9319d3@mail.gmail.com>
	<766a29bd0809171201k6742dfbcn86436232ee8676f8@mail.gmail.com>
	<c41f67b90809171206j477e0465w46eed6b32d79454@mail.gmail.com>
	<55dc209b0809171307j771bc61pe05ef4780d427bee@mail.gmail.com>
	<BAY111-W365C9B56A6892B628C02E6A04C0@phx.gbl>
	<55dc209b0809171433v1b164f31id310c420e212a5f@mail.gmail.com>
	<BAY111-W2965AE883FF16C5E16CB34A04C0@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <55dc209b0809171558v695db35fme4dd39b10c426431@mail.gmail.com>

On Wed, Sep 17, 2008 at 2:49 PM, Stephen McInerney
<spmcinerney at hotmail.com> wrote:
>
> I don't think the default assumption "You can safely assume that no module
> is thread-safe unless it claims it is. " is explicitly stated anywhere in
> the Python
> library doc? (http://docs.python.org/lib/*)
> I definitely think that is worth adding?

I guess you could add one more caveat about that to the longish list
at the bottom of http://docs.python.org/lib/module-thread.html .


> Yes, I saw logging has a note saying it is thread-safe, but (for example)
> popen2, Popen3 and Popen4 say nothing, I should assume they're not?

Right -- the file objects returned by popen2 &c aren't thread-safe,
just like those returned by calling the built-in function open aren't
thread-safe, &c, &c.


> [I'm holding the assumption that someday eventually the GIL may go
> away as the typical number of threads increases to the point where it
> becomes commercially important to solve that.]

Python implementations based on virtual machines developed with strong
concern for "commercial importance" (JVM and CLR) are already GIL-free
today; whether it's worth completely re-architecting yet another VM
(CPython's own) towards similar goals is far from obvious to me --
particularly if the goal of such an ambitious effort was meant to be
"commercial importance" rather than developers scratching their own
itch -- what's the commercial value-added to justify the huge
development costs, vs just using another, highly refined and optimized
open source VM such as JVM?


Alex

From jeff at drinktomi.com  Thu Sep 18 03:01:46 2008
From: jeff at drinktomi.com (Jeff Younker)
Date: Wed, 17 Sep 2008 18:01:46 -0700
Subject: [Baypiggies] multithreading question
In-Reply-To: <BAY111-W2965AE883FF16C5E16CB34A04C0@phx.gbl>
References: <c41f67b90809171140x698c9d5dhf5c46085ad9319d3@mail.gmail.com>
	<766a29bd0809171201k6742dfbcn86436232ee8676f8@mail.gmail.com>
	<c41f67b90809171206j477e0465w46eed6b32d79454@mail.gmail.com>
	<55dc209b0809171307j771bc61pe05ef4780d427bee@mail.gmail.com>
	<BAY111-W365C9B56A6892B628C02E6A04C0@phx.gbl>
	<55dc209b0809171433v1b164f31id310c420e212a5f@mail.gmail.com>
	<BAY111-W2965AE883FF16C5E16CB34A04C0@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <32266B62-10E0-445B-B224-69A898B4B417@drinktomi.com>

On Sep 17, 2008, at 2:49 PM, Stephen McInerney wrote:

> [I'm holding the assumption that someday eventually the GIL may go
> away as the typical number of threads increases to the point where it
> becomes commercially important to solve that.]

I once thought that, but as time has gone on I'm becoming less and less
sure that it's necessary.  The one language I know of that really  
focuses
on reliability and concurrancy is erlang, and it eschews threads in  
favor
of processes.

-jeff
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://mail.python.org/pipermail/baypiggies/attachments/20080917/923b4c12/attachment-0001.htm>

From jjinux at gmail.com  Thu Sep 18 08:55:11 2008
From: jjinux at gmail.com (Shannon -jj Behrens)
Date: Wed, 17 Sep 2008 23:55:11 -0700
Subject: [Baypiggies] multithreading question
In-Reply-To: <32266B62-10E0-445B-B224-69A898B4B417@drinktomi.com>
References: <c41f67b90809171140x698c9d5dhf5c46085ad9319d3@mail.gmail.com>
	<766a29bd0809171201k6742dfbcn86436232ee8676f8@mail.gmail.com>
	<c41f67b90809171206j477e0465w46eed6b32d79454@mail.gmail.com>
	<55dc209b0809171307j771bc61pe05ef4780d427bee@mail.gmail.com>
	<BAY111-W365C9B56A6892B628C02E6A04C0@phx.gbl>
	<55dc209b0809171433v1b164f31id310c420e212a5f@mail.gmail.com>
	<BAY111-W2965AE883FF16C5E16CB34A04C0@phx.gbl>
	<32266B62-10E0-445B-B224-69A898B4B417@drinktomi.com>
Message-ID: <c41f67b90809172355o5d9356dcpf0651cc51338ed9a@mail.gmail.com>

I think the easiest thing to do is:

from __future__ import with_statement
import threading

# This is to protect stdout and stderr.

output_lock = threading.Lock()


def printf(s, file=sys.stdout):
    """Print s to file and then flush it.

    This function uses output_lock so that all writes to stdout and
    stderr are synchronized.

    Note, the caller is responsible for adding the newline.

    """
    with output_lock:
        file.write(s)
        file.flush()


I looked into using the logging module, but it turns out that the one
place I write to stdout is via the csv module:

        with output_lock:
            writer.writerow(row)
            sys.stdout.flush()

Hence, I use printf instead of print, and I explicitly manage a lock
in the one place where I can't use printf.

-jj

From krnewton at gmail.com  Thu Sep 18 20:25:41 2008
From: krnewton at gmail.com (Ken Newton)
Date: Thu, 18 Sep 2008 11:25:41 -0700
Subject: [Baypiggies] Python development visualization
Message-ID: <8fd67d4b0809181125t6afe91c1ld7ec39222ed2bb31@mail.gmail.com>

I just found this video that visualizes the development of Python over most
of the history of the language. See the web page below for more info on the
project doing the visualization (no connection to me).

http://www.vimeo.com/1093745

This type of visualization has been done for a variety of open source
projects.

Ken Newton
Walnut Creek
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://mail.python.org/pipermail/baypiggies/attachments/20080918/8d27caac/attachment.htm>

From tjt at nosuch.com  Thu Sep 18 23:17:02 2008
From: tjt at nosuch.com (Tim Thompson)
Date: Thu, 18 Sep 2008 14:17:02 -0700
Subject: [Baypiggies] slides from 'finger painting with planets' talk
Message-ID: <004501c919d3$eaa1b5b0$bfe52110$@com>

The slides from my talk last week can be found here:

	
http://nosuch.com/tjt/fingerpaintingplanets/finger_painting_with_planets_bay
piggies.pdf

   ...Tim...



From carroll at tjc.com  Sat Sep 20 01:19:40 2008
From: carroll at tjc.com (Terry Carroll)
Date: Fri, 19 Sep 2008 16:19:40 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Baypiggies] Python development visualization
Message-ID: <Pine.LNX.4.44.0809191619060.11232-100000@violet.rahul.net>

On Thu, 18 Sep 2008, Ken Newton wrote:

> I just found this video that visualizes the development of Python over most
> of the history of the language. See the web page below for more info on the
> project doing the visualization (no connection to me).
> 
> http://www.vimeo.com/1093745

I've seen this before; I wonder what the catalyst was that set off that 
burst in 2000 (starting at around 2:50 in the video).  That was a few 
years before I started using Python.

If this were Ruby, I'd expect a pop like that around when Rails came out.




From aahz at pythoncraft.com  Sat Sep 20 01:41:15 2008
From: aahz at pythoncraft.com (Aahz)
Date: Fri, 19 Sep 2008 16:41:15 -0700
Subject: [Baypiggies] Python development visualization
In-Reply-To: <Pine.LNX.4.44.0809191619060.11232-100000@violet.rahul.net>
References: <Pine.LNX.4.44.0809191619060.11232-100000@violet.rahul.net>
Message-ID: <20080919234115.GA23283@panix.com>

On Fri, Sep 19, 2008, Terry Carroll wrote:
> On Thu, 18 Sep 2008, Ken Newton wrote:
>> 
>> I just found this video that visualizes the development of Python over most
>> of the history of the language. See the web page below for more info on the
>> project doing the visualization (no connection to me).
>> 
>> http://www.vimeo.com/1093745
> 
> I've seen this before; I wonder what the catalyst was that set off that 
> burst in 2000 (starting at around 2:50 in the video).  That was a few 
> years before I started using Python.

Python 2.0, which also marked the point at which Python switched the
repository to SourceForge, opening up development so that Guido was no
longer the bottleneck for checkins.
-- 
Aahz (aahz at pythoncraft.com)           <*>         http://www.pythoncraft.com/

"Argue for your limitations, and sure enough they're yours."  --Richard Bach

From rdm at cfcl.com  Mon Sep 22 20:51:31 2008
From: rdm at cfcl.com (Rich Morin)
Date: Mon, 22 Sep 2008 11:51:31 -0700
Subject: [Baypiggies] BASS Meeting (SF), Wed. September 24
Message-ID: <p06230919c4fd991bab50@[192.168.1.205]>

The Beer and Scripting SIG rides again!  If you'd like to eat good
Italian food, chat with other local scripters, and possibly take a
look at laptop-demoed scripting hacks, this is the place to do it!

For your convenience, here are the critical details:

  Date:   Wednesday, September 24, 2008 (4th. Wed.)
  Time:   8:00 pm
  Place:  Pasquales Pizzeria
          701 Irving St. (At 8th. Ave.)
          San Francisco, California, USA
          415/661-2140


See the BASS web page for more information:

  http://cfcl.com/rdm/bass/



We now have two (2) mailing lists, which you are welcome to join:

  *  http://groups.google.com/group/bass-announce

     This will be used mostly for BASS announcements, though I may
     send an occasional notice about other events that look nifty.
     Expect 1-2 messages per month.

  *  http://groups.google.com/group/bass-discuss

     This should have relatively little traffic, but no guarantees.
     The basic idea is that it gives BASS attendees (etc) a place
     to discuss scripting (and topics of interest to scripters).
     Like BASS, but more than one evening a month...

-r
-- 
http://www.cfcl.com/rdm            Rich Morin
http://www.cfcl.com/rdm/resume     rdm at cfcl.com
http://www.cfcl.com/rdm/weblog     +1 650-873-7841

Technical editing and writing, programming, and web development

From jim at well.com  Wed Sep 24 00:46:43 2008
From: jim at well.com (jim)
Date: Tue, 23 Sep 2008 15:46:43 -0700
Subject: [Baypiggies] Python Training in Cupertino 9/29 - 10/2
Message-ID: <1222210003.6651.213.camel@ubuntu>



UCSC Extension is offering a 4-day Python Retreat for people who already
know how to program with some other language. It's a lab-based class
with lots of practice and lots of fun:

http://pythontrainer.com

I hope to see you there.

Marilyn Davis
Python Instructor



From netgraviton at gmail.com  Wed Sep 24 16:44:18 2008
From: netgraviton at gmail.com (Robert Stanley)
Date: Wed, 24 Sep 2008 10:44:18 -0400
Subject: [Baypiggies] [ANNOUNCE]
Message-ID: <a45f14780809240744r2c48b6b5tc9ccb5d599e51b8e@mail.gmail.com>

Dear Python baypiggies,

Netgraviton believes the individuals in your community would be interested
in the following position:

*Sr Software engineer - Python, and Linux/Python Lead Systems Architect*

*Job Responsibilities*

The Sr. Software Developer will be responsible for the development of the
NetGraviton suite of products. Development is done primarily using Python on
the server, and with Adobe Flex or HTML/AJAX as a Rich Internet Application
(RIA) frontend. Typical day-to-day activities include implementing new
features in our products, which involve:

   - Development of processes to extract relevant data from input sources
   - Design of relational data storage models
   - Implementation of data processing algorithms
   - Development of AMF remoting methods, used for client/server
   connectivity
   - Development of graphical user interfaces

*Qualifications*

The candidate must have top-notch software development skills. Prior
experience in Python or Adobe Flex is not a strict requirement, experience
in related technologies will be accepted. Please note, only candidates with
a bachelor's degree in computer science or engineering, or, a very
substantial amount of related technical coursework and work experience in a
related field will be considered. Prior experience working on web analytics
applications, search engines, content management systems or other Web
publishing systems is a plus.

*Required Skills*: Structured Query Language (SQL), Object-Oriented
Programming

*Bonus Skills*: Python, Adobe Flex, SQLite, Open-Source software
development, Git, Object-Relational Mapping (ORM), Postgres SQL, AJAX, HTML,
Search Engine Optimization (SEO) or Search Engine Marketing (SEM)

*Type of Position*: Full-time or Contract-to-hire

*Travel Required*: None

*Location*: Worldwide (telecommunication)

*Position Title*: Sr. Software Developer

*Compensation and Benefits*: Competitive salary based on experience.
 Employees will have an opportunity to participate in the company's stock
option plan.

*How To Apply*

To apply for the Senior Software Engineer position, send a resume and cover
letter to jobs at netgraviton dot com.

*About NetGraviton*

NetGraviton is a venture-backed startup engaged in providing search engine
marketing software solutions for PPC/SEM and SEO. Our patented, innovative
software-as-a-service applications automate the manual, repetitive work
involved in search engine optimization, saving time and enabling customers
to improve ROI on search marketing objectives in a consistent and repeatable
manner.  For more information please visit: www.netgraviton.com
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://mail.python.org/pipermail/baypiggies/attachments/20080924/3572168e/attachment.htm>

From rocky at teampatent.com  Wed Sep 24 18:06:33 2008
From: rocky at teampatent.com (Rocky Kahn)
Date: Wed, 24 Sep 2008 09:06:33 -0700
Subject: [Baypiggies] Job: Backend Software Engineer for Collaborative
	Text/Image Editor
Message-ID: <5e7dca810809240906o630e24e7lb0caa32443d522bf@mail.gmail.com>

TeamPatent <http://teampatent.com/> is building a browser-based,
collaborative editor for documents which make frequent references to
features inside drawings.  We're applying this software first to draft
patent applications and later to user manuals, software wireframes, etc.
(many documents could be improved with the addition of highly-associative
drawings).


Without our software, groups working on a document typically maintain the
text and drawings separately.  All changes to the drawings are made in
Visio/Illustrator/etc by one user (a draftsperson in the case of patent
applications) because it's too hard to manipulate drawings collaboratively.
 MSWord revisions are emailed back-and-forth with exported PDFs of the
drawings.  The association between the text and drawings quickly becomes
brittle.  For example, it's difficult to coordinate changes to both the
drawings and text so callouts are only added (never removed) and figures are
changed rarely.  This reduces the effectiveness of the document and/or
increases the difficulty of maintaining the document.

With TeamPatent's software, the editor automatically recognizes new
terminology and allows users to manipulate occurrences across the document
(e.g. renumbering when terms are reordered).  An integrated Javascript
drawing annotator allows users to place callouts inside drawings which
remain associated with recognized terms in the text.  All collaborators can
make changes to the text and drawings and the association between the two is
maintained automatically.


We seek an architect / engineer who will be responsible for all aspects of
backend development while solving super-complex engineering problems no one
else in the world is working on.  Strong candidates will have previously led
architectural design and implementation of a data-driven web application,
preferably at a smaller company where you had to wear many hats. Our backend
technology stack includes Python and PostgreSQL and we're deployed on
Linux-based Amazon EC2 instances.  You must be proficient in these or
related technologies, enabling you to quickly ramp up.


As a member of TeamPatent, you'll help contribute to open source--we already
maintain two of the largest widgets in
Dojo--dijit.Editor<http://dojotoolkit.org/book/dojo-book-0-9/part-2-dijit/advanced-editing-and-display/editor-rich-text>
 & dojox.Sketch<http://dojotoolkit.org/2008/02/19/introducing-dojox-sketch-drawing-app-designed-collaboration>--and,
under your direction, we hope to contribute facets of our backend
infrastructure. There's currently just three of us so you'll have plenty of
responsibility/autonomy to be an individual contributor.  TeamPatent holds
the potential to be a career-making project with enormous market potential
and intellectual scope--the National Science Foundation (one of our
founders), describes our innovations as "game-changing".  Note, this is a
really hard project (both conceptually and implementation-wise) and you'll
be working with some really smart people who will be looking to you to
deliver.



   - Requirements:
      - Demonstrated expert at back-end implementation;
      - Produce elegant, maintainable code;
      - Experience with databases in both design and access methodology;
      - Easy to get along with,, fun, ethical, and low-maintenance; and
      - Intensely driven, proactive, and hard-working.
   - Desirable:
      - Open-source contributions; and
      - Experience planning network operations.
   - Environment and Compensation:
      - Full-time role preferred;
      - This opportunity is ground floor with competitive compensation
      including significant equity;
      - Technical leadership at an early stage startup aiming to shake up a
      valuable market;
      - Flexible work environment focused on productivity; and
      - Should want to live in or near San Francisco Bay Area (we're in
      Oakland).


Interested? Send a resume and cover letter to me at jobs at teampatent with the
usual .com
  --Rocky Kahn, CEO
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://mail.python.org/pipermail/baypiggies/attachments/20080924/a7f7aa2a/attachment.htm>

From jim at well.com  Wed Sep 24 22:18:36 2008
From: jim at well.com (jim)
Date: Wed, 24 Sep 2008 13:18:36 -0700
Subject: [Baypiggies] call for newbie nuggets
Message-ID: <1222287516.6651.244.camel@ubuntu>


Hi, all, 
   if you're interested in giving a brief (ten 
minutes or so) presentation about some feature 
or technique of Python at a BayPIGgies meeting, 
please respond. the presentation should include 
one or more code snippets. 
   the idea is to highlight one thing that helps 
newbies become more pythonic, reminds more 
experienced python programmers of something 
useful, and stirs up discussion and thought. 

   topics might include: 
decorators 
generators 
list comprehensions 
use of dictionaries 
doc strings 
abstract classes (3.0 okay or not, opinions?) 
<any PEPs under consideration> (or is this out of bounds?) 
anything to do with namespaces 
testing 
debugging 
commenting 
any elegant approach to a common problem 
...
jim 



From asheesh at asheesh.org  Fri Sep 26 00:27:46 2008
From: asheesh at asheesh.org (Asheesh Laroia)
Date: Thu, 25 Sep 2008 15:27:46 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Baypiggies] Failing at generating quoted-printable-encoded email
Message-ID: <alpine.DEB.2.00.0809251507580.22853@alchemy.localdomain>

Some quick background: I'm writing a(n open-source) app that generates 
emails.  There are (at least) two ways to encode characters not generally 
fit for email: base64 and quoted-printable.

It's easy to get proper base64-encoded output of email.mime.text:

 	>>> mt = email.mime.text.MIMEText('Ta m?re', 'plain', 'utf-8')
 	>>> 'Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64' in mt.as_string()
 	True
 	>>> mt.as_string().split('\n')[-2]
 	'VGEgbcOocmU='

There we go, all nice and base64'd.

I can *not* figure out how to get quoted-printable-encoding.  I found 
http://docs.python.org/lib/module-email.encoders.html , so I thought great 
- I'll just encode my MIMEText object:

 	>>> email.encoders.encode_quopri(mt)
 	>>> 'Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable' in mt.as_string()
 	True

Great!  Except it's actually double-encoded, and the headers admit to as 
much:

 	>>> 'Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64' in mt.as_string()
 	True
 	>>> mt.as_string().split('\n')[-2]
 	'VGEgbcOocmU=3D'

It should look like:

 	>>> quopri.encodestring('ta m?re')
 	'ta m=C3=A8re'

Um, how do I get these modules to only encode the mail *once*, as 
quoted-printable?

This seems like a bug in the module - the double-encoding - it could 
easily be me walking down the wrong path in a module I'm not an expert in 
using.  http://www.google.com/codesearch?q=encode_quopri&hl=en&btnG=Search+Code 
refers to a now-removed _encoding= parameter.

(I want to use quoted-printable because it makes writing my tests 
straightforward as mock tests with Ian Bicking's MiniMock 
<http://pypi.python.org/pypi/MiniMock/> and doctests + doctest.ELLIPSIS. 
Plus, it's friendlier to people like my friend Kragen who read their email 
in /usr/bin/less!)

-- Asheesh.

-- 
It shall be unlawful for any suspicious person to be within the municipality.
 		-- Local ordinance, Euclid Ohio

From matt at matt-good.net  Fri Sep 26 02:23:24 2008
From: matt at matt-good.net (Matt Good)
Date: Thu, 25 Sep 2008 17:23:24 -0700
Subject: [Baypiggies] Failing at generating quoted-printable-encoded
	email
In-Reply-To: <alpine.DEB.2.00.0809251507580.22853@alchemy.localdomain>
References: <alpine.DEB.2.00.0809251507580.22853@alchemy.localdomain>
Message-ID: <8B549ABC-1BEA-48EC-A736-A51821EE475E@matt-good.net>

On Sep 25, 2008, at 3:27 PM, Asheesh Laroia wrote:

> Some quick background: I'm writing a(n open-source) app that  
> generates emails.  There are (at least) two ways to encode  
> characters not generally fit for email: base64 and quoted-printable.
>
> It's easy to get proper base64-encoded output of email.mime.text:
>
> 	>>> mt = email.mime.text.MIMEText('Ta m?re', 'plain', 'utf-8')
> 	>>> 'Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64' in mt.as_string()
> 	True
> 	>>> mt.as_string().split('\n')[-2]
> 	'VGEgbcOocmU='
>
> There we go, all nice and base64'd.
>
> I can *not* figure out how to get quoted-printable-encoding.

There might be a better way, but this is the hack that Trac uses to  
get qp working:

import email.mime.text
import email.charset

charset = email.charset.Charset('utf-8')
charset.header_encoding = email.charset.QP
charset.body_encoding = email.charset.QP

msg = email.mime.text.MIMEText('foo', 'plain')
# Message class computes the wrong type from MIMEText constructor,
# which does not take a Charset object as initializer. Reset the
# encoding type to force a new, valid evaluation
del msg['Content-Transfer-Encoding']
msg.set_charset(charset)

-- Matt

From aahz at pythoncraft.com  Sat Sep 27 01:26:14 2008
From: aahz at pythoncraft.com (Aahz)
Date: Fri, 26 Sep 2008 16:26:14 -0700
Subject: [Baypiggies] PyCon 2009 Call for Proposals
Message-ID: <20080926232614.GA2384@panix.com>

Call for proposals -- PyCon 2009 -- <http://us.pycon.org/2009/>
===============================================================

Want to share your experience and expertise? PyCon 2009 is looking for
proposals to fill the formal presentation tracks. The PyCon conference
days will be March 27-29, 2009 in Chicago, Illinois, preceded by the
tutorial days (March 25-26), and followed by four days of development
sprints (March 30-April 2).

Previous PyCon conferences have had a broad range of presentations,
from reports on academic and commercial projects to tutorials and case
studies. We hope to continue that tradition this year.

Online proposal submission will open on September 29, 2008. Proposals
will be accepted through November 03, with acceptance notifications
coming out on December 15. For the detailed call for proposals,
please see:

   <http://us.pycon.org/2009/conference/proposals/>

We look forward to seeing you in Chicago!
-- 
Aahz (aahz at pythoncraft.com)           <*>         http://www.pythoncraft.com/

"Argue for your limitations, and sure enough they're yours."  --Richard Bach

From spmcinerney at hotmail.com  Sat Sep 27 02:56:36 2008
From: spmcinerney at hotmail.com (Stephen McInerney)
Date: Fri, 26 Sep 2008 17:56:36 -0700
Subject: [Baypiggies] BayPIGgies Oct-Dec meetings?
Message-ID: <BAY111-W27EA6F2B619C6D191496B7A0460@phx.gbl>


Hi Jim,
 
Can you send details of the October mtg, also the tentative calendar for Nov-Dec?
 
And can we update baypiggies.net to October mtg?
 
Thanks a lot,
Stephen
_________________________________________________________________
Get more out of the Web. Learn 10 hidden secrets of Windows Live.
http://windowslive.com/connect/post/jamiethomson.spaces.live.com-Blog-cns!550F681DAD532637!5295.entry?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_domore_092008
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://mail.python.org/pipermail/baypiggies/attachments/20080926/0026d067/attachment.htm>

From asheesh at asheesh.org  Sun Sep 28 12:50:53 2008
From: asheesh at asheesh.org (Asheesh Laroia)
Date: Sun, 28 Sep 2008 03:50:53 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Baypiggies] San Francisco-based Introduction to Programming (in
 Python; taught by me for free)
Message-ID: <alpine.DEB.2.00.0809280341140.919@grindstone.creativecommons.org>

It's pretty late, so I may not be totally coherent, but:

I've been using the "Python for Software Design: How to Think Like a 
Computer Scientist" textbook to teach an introduction to programming 
course here in San Francisco to the SF Linux Users Group.

I'd be very happy if some other people on this list, say, were interested 
in attending.  So far we will have had two meetings, Monday evenings at 6 
PM at The Grind Cafe 
<http://www.yelp.com/biz/the-grind-cafe-san-francisco>.

We're only on chapter two, at our second meeting.  The way I'm structuring 
it is that I want people to do the readings at home, and preferably do the 
exercises and email me their answers to them, so that the class time can 
be used to discuss what people have already read, and fix 
misunderstandings or address questions.  I see it as a teacher-guided 
self-learning process.

If it were a college class, it would be as if there were no real lectures, 
and only the TA sesisons.  I think that sort of maximizes dynamism.

There is still time for people to catch up, especially as the chapters are 
ten clearly-written pages (rather than long or painfully dense).  I would 
love to have some more people - you're welcome to quiz me about this on 
the list or off-list by private mail.  Feel free to take a look at the 
book and see where you would fit in; I'd also be happy if people tell me, 
"Call me when you reach chapter 7 and I'll join in" or something like 
that.  By doing a chapter a week, it's somewhat slow-paced, I admit.

-- Asheesh.

P.S. OT: Path MTU discovery problems suck.

P.P.S. I found a Python bug to conglomerate my earlier email about 
Quoted-Printable encoding onto.

-- 
Do what comes naturally.  Seethe and fume and throw a tantrum.

From asheesh at asheesh.org  Mon Sep 29 21:18:56 2008
From: asheesh at asheesh.org (Asheesh Laroia)
Date: Mon, 29 Sep 2008 12:18:56 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Baypiggies] Failing at generating quoted-printable-encoded
 email
In-Reply-To: <8B549ABC-1BEA-48EC-A736-A51821EE475E@matt-good.net>
References: <alpine.DEB.2.00.0809251507580.22853@alchemy.localdomain>
	<8B549ABC-1BEA-48EC-A736-A51821EE475E@matt-good.net>
Message-ID: <alpine.DEB.1.10.0809291218120.10971@sf.creativecommons.org>

On Thu, 25 Sep 2008, Matt Good wrote:

>> I can *not* figure out how to get quoted-printable-encoding.
>
> There might be a better way, but this is the hack that Trac uses to get 
> qp working:

[snipped]

Thanks, that worked like a charm!

If we meet, I owe you some chocolate. (-:

-- Asheesh.

-- 
Nothing is ever a total loss; it can always serve as a bad example.

From jim at well.com  Tue Sep 30 01:50:10 2008
From: jim at well.com (jim)
Date: Mon, 29 Sep 2008 16:50:10 -0700
Subject: [Baypiggies] BayPIGgies Oct-Dec meetings?
In-Reply-To: <BAY111-W27EA6F2B619C6D191496B7A0460@phx.gbl>
References: <BAY111-W27EA6F2B619C6D191496B7A0460@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <1222732210.6344.6.camel@ubuntu>


   i've learned that announcing (or leaking) future 
meeting plans can be dicey. 

   The October 9 meeting is close enough not to be 
dicey: 
* Newbie Nugget: Unit Testing with Mock, by Daryl Spitzer 
* Main Talk: Pygame, by Harry Tormey and Andrew Turlock 

   subsequent talks are probably about scipy/numpy 
followed by Nokia development. 
   soon after there's a likelihood of getting a talk on 
Django development, a talk on Google App Engine.... 
   in an email with a dedicated subject i'll put out 
a list of possible topics. 



On Fri, 2008-09-26 at 17:56 -0700, Stephen McInerney wrote:
> Hi Jim,
>  
> Can you send details of the October mtg, also the tentative calendar
> for Nov-Dec?
>  
> And can we update baypiggies.net to October mtg?
>  
> Thanks a lot,
> Stephen
> 
> 
> ______________________________________________________________________
> Get more out of the Web. Learn 10 hidden secrets of Windows Live.
> Learn Now


From spmcinerney at hotmail.com  Tue Sep 30 02:01:10 2008
From: spmcinerney at hotmail.com (Stephen McInerney)
Date: Mon, 29 Sep 2008 17:01:10 -0700
Subject: [Baypiggies] BayPIGgies Oct-Dec meetings?
In-Reply-To: <1222732210.6344.6.camel@ubuntu>
References: <BAY111-W27EA6F2B619C6D191496B7A0460@phx.gbl>
	<1222732210.6344.6.camel@ubuntu>
Message-ID: <BAY111-W8C1100A09D9AB341D98E5A0430@phx.gbl>


Thanks Jim. Can folks update the webpage and wiki with October details?
 
(What we found worked well previously was actually to send out
a tentative advance schedule a few months at a time - just
mark it 'tentative' and check in with the planned speakers to
keep it accurate.)
 
PS the Newbie Nuggets are going great and it is great to encourage
newer people to present.
 
Best,
Stephen> Subject: Re: BayPIGgies Oct-Dec meetings?> From: jim at well.com> To: spmcinerney at hotmail.com> CC: baypiggies at python.org> Date: Mon, 29 Sep 2008 16:50:10 -0700> > > i've learned that announcing (or leaking) future > meeting plans can be dicey. > > The October 9 meeting is close enough not to be > dicey: > * Newbie Nugget: Unit Testing with Mock, by Daryl Spitzer > * Main Talk: Pygame, by Harry Tormey and Andrew Turlock > > subsequent talks are probably about scipy/numpy > followed by Nokia development. > soon after there's a likelihood of getting a talk on > Django development, a talk on Google App Engine.... > in an email with a dedicated subject i'll put out > a list of possible topics. > > > > On Fri, 2008-09-26 at 17:56 -0700, Stephen McInerney wrote:> > Hi Jim,> > > > Can you send details of the October mtg, also the tentative calendar> > for Nov-Dec?> > > > And can we update baypiggies.net to October mtg?> > > > Thanks a lot,> > Stephen> > > > > > ______________________________________________________________________> > Get more out of the Web. Learn 10 hidden secrets of Windows Live.> > Learn Now> 
_________________________________________________________________
See how Windows Mobile brings your life together?at home, work, or on the go.
http://clk.atdmt.com/MRT/go/msnnkwxp1020093182mrt/direct/01/
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://mail.python.org/pipermail/baypiggies/attachments/20080929/5312ebcb/attachment.htm>

From bdbaddog at gmail.com  Tue Sep 30 02:22:47 2008
From: bdbaddog at gmail.com (William Deegan)
Date: Mon, 29 Sep 2008 17:22:47 -0700
Subject: [Baypiggies] BayPIGgies Oct-Dec meetings?
In-Reply-To: <BAY111-W8C1100A09D9AB341D98E5A0430@phx.gbl>
References: <BAY111-W27EA6F2B619C6D191496B7A0460@phx.gbl>
	<1222732210.6344.6.camel@ubuntu>
	<BAY111-W8C1100A09D9AB341D98E5A0430@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <8540148a0809291722k49430a4rd4251bbcad58f864@mail.gmail.com>

Stephen,

Yes. I'll update it later tonight.
-Bill

On Mon, Sep 29, 2008 at 5:01 PM, Stephen McInerney
<spmcinerney at hotmail.com> wrote:
> Thanks Jim. Can folks update the webpage and wiki with October details?
>
> (What we found worked well previously was actually to send out
> a tentative advance schedule a few months at a time - just
> mark it 'tentative' and check in with the planned speakers to
> keep it accurate.)
>
> PS the Newbie Nuggets are going great and it is great to encourage
> newer people to present.
>
> Best,
> Stephen
>
>> Subject: Re: BayPIGgies Oct-Dec meetings?
>> From: jim at well.com
>> To: spmcinerney at hotmail.com
>> CC: baypiggies at python.org
>> Date: Mon, 29 Sep 2008 16:50:10 -0700
>>
>>
>> i've learned that announcing (or leaking) future
>> meeting plans can be dicey.
>>
>> The October 9 meeting is close enough not to be
>> dicey:
>> * Newbie Nugget: Unit Testing with Mock, by Daryl Spitzer
>> * Main Talk: Pygame, by Harry Tormey and Andrew Turlock
>>
>> subsequent talks are probably about scipy/numpy
>> followed by Nokia development.
>> soon after there's a likelihood of getting a talk on
>> Django development, a talk on Google App Engine....
>> in an email with a dedicated subject i'll put out
>> a list of possible topics.
>>
>>
>>
>> On Fri, 2008-09-26 at 17:56 -0700, Stephen McInerney wrote:
>> > Hi Jim,
>> >
>> > Can you send details of the October mtg, also the tentative calendar
>> > for Nov-Dec?
>> >
>> > And can we update baypiggies.net to October mtg?
>> >
>> > Thanks a lot,
>> > Stephen
>> >
>> >
>> > ______________________________________________________________________
>> > Get more out of the Web. Learn 10 hidden secrets of Windows Live.
>> > Learn Now
>>
>
>
> ________________________________
> See how Windows Mobile brings your life together?at home, work, or on the
> go. See Now
> _______________________________________________
> Baypiggies mailing list
> Baypiggies at python.org
> To change your subscription options or unsubscribe:
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/baypiggies
>

From donnamsnow at gmail.com  Tue Sep 30 05:07:37 2008
From: donnamsnow at gmail.com (Donna Snow)
Date: Mon, 29 Sep 2008 20:07:37 -0700
Subject: [Baypiggies] World Plone Day - November 7, 2008 (need a venue)
Message-ID: <baf0d46b0809292007s7750e00dk2a7af5d92ba9610c@mail.gmail.com>

Hi,

On November 7, 2008 Plone consultants and companies around the world will be
hosting free presentations and training sessions for those interested in
learning more about Plone.

Potential Sessions

Introducing Plone 3 - Donna M Snow - 1 hour
A comprehensive tour through Plone 3 from front-end to back-end. What is
good about the "new Plone" and what could be improved.

Mythbusting: Dispelling the "virtual" rumors about Zope/Plone - Short
presentation and then discussion afterwards - Donna M. Snow - 1 hour
(and validating the ones that are true)

Skinning for Plone - Donna M Snow - a general overview of creating a look &
feel for Plone - 1 hour

The Future of Plone (what's in store?) - Donna M Snow

I figure a half-day of sessions will be good and then I'll be available
afterwards to answer questions (or at least point you to resources).

I really, really need a venue for this event so if anyone can "donate" some
space from about 9am - 1pm on November 7th that'd  be great. I'm not sure
what the turnout will be but I'll need a place with wifi, a white board and
ideally a projector.

I AM planning on starting Plone training sessions in the Bay Area but that
won't start until the first quarter in 2009.

email me offlist if you A) have a venue I can use for this event and/or B)
would like to attend this event (so I can plan for space) .

If we only get a few "interested" we might just meet at a coffee shop
somewhere.

Thank You!

Best Regards,
Donna M. Snow, Principal
C Squared Enterprises
illuminating your path to Open Source
http://www.csquaredtech.com
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://mail.python.org/pipermail/baypiggies/attachments/20080929/470fc044/attachment.htm>

From donnamsnow at gmail.com  Tue Sep 30 05:09:21 2008
From: donnamsnow at gmail.com (Donna Snow)
Date: Mon, 29 Sep 2008 20:09:21 -0700
Subject: [Baypiggies] World Plone Day - November 7,2008 (forgot something)
Message-ID: <baf0d46b0809292009l6d6843awbfc3e3bd5b068ea6@mail.gmail.com>

Hi,

I forgot to mention that if you are interested in presenting or
participating in World Plone Day (aka volunteering) please let me know that
as well.

Thanks!!

Donna
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://mail.python.org/pipermail/baypiggies/attachments/20080929/6f6c7974/attachment.htm>

From jim at well.com  Tue Sep 30 06:15:57 2008
From: jim at well.com (jim)
Date: Mon, 29 Sep 2008 21:15:57 -0700
Subject: [Baypiggies] What's on for BayPIGgies October 9 meeting
Message-ID: <1222748157.6344.16.camel@ubuntu>



october 9, 2008 (in the Seville room, i believe) 7:30 PM to nine-ish 


newbie nugget: Unit testing with Mock by Daryl Spitzer 

   I'll present examples using Michael Foord's Mock library to create
unit tests with mocks or stubs taking the place of module and built-in
functions. 
   As Mr. Foord writes in
http://www.voidspace.org.uk/python/mock.html#introduction 
"Most mocking libraries follow the 'record -> replay' pattern of
mocking. 
I prefer the 'action -> assertion' pattern, which is more readable and
intuitive particularly when working with the Python unittest module."


main topic: Pygame by Harry Tormey and Andrew Turlock 

PyGameSF: A story of multimedia hacking fun with Python
By Harry Tormey and Andrew Turley. 

   This talk will give an overview of the technologies available for 
creating multimedia projects with Python, how the PyGameSF meetup got 
started, what it's all about, and an overview of the wide variety of 
projects presented at this meetup. 




From asheesh at asheesh.org  Tue Sep 30 07:25:10 2008
From: asheesh at asheesh.org (Asheesh Laroia)
Date: Mon, 29 Sep 2008 22:25:10 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Baypiggies] San Francisco-based Introduction to Programming
 (in Python; taught by me for free)
In-Reply-To: <alpine.DEB.2.00.0809280341140.919@grindstone.creativecommons.org>
References: <alpine.DEB.2.00.0809280341140.919@grindstone.creativecommons.org>
Message-ID: <alpine.DEB.2.00.0809292223310.27691@alchemy.localdomain>

On Sun, 28 Sep 2008, Asheesh Laroia wrote:

> It's pretty late, so I may not be totally coherent, but:
>
> I've been using the "Python for Software Design: How to Think Like a 
> Computer Scientist" textbook to teach an introduction to programming 
> course here in San Francisco to the SF Linux Users Group.

And someone came out from Baypiggies - yay!  If you want to keep track of 
this, join the SF-LUG mailing list; I'm sending out all the announcements 
there.

http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug has the skinny.

Next week will be chapter 3 of 
http://www.greenteapress.com/thinkpython/thinkpython.html - click "Here is 
the HTML version" on that page to read it in a web browser.

-- Asheesh.

-- 
<doogie> Debian - All the power, without the silly hat.

From jim at well.com  Tue Sep 30 19:04:37 2008
From: jim at well.com (jim)
Date: Tue, 30 Sep 2008 10:04:37 -0700
Subject: [Baypiggies] What's on for BayPIGgies October 9 meeting
In-Reply-To: <1222748157.6344.16.camel@ubuntu>
References: <1222748157.6344.16.camel@ubuntu>
Message-ID: <1222794277.6344.29.camel@ubuntu>


Errata: 
Andrew's last name is Turley, not Turlock. 
My apologies. 


On Mon, 2008-09-29 at 21:15 -0700, jim wrote:
> 
> october 9, 2008 (in the Seville room, i believe) 7:30 PM to nine-ish 
> 
> 
> newbie nugget: Unit testing with Mock by Daryl Spitzer 
> 
>    I'll present examples using Michael Foord's Mock library to create
> unit tests with mocks or stubs taking the place of module and built-in
> functions. 
>    As Mr. Foord writes in
> http://www.voidspace.org.uk/python/mock.html#introduction 
> "Most mocking libraries follow the 'record -> replay' pattern of
> mocking. 
> I prefer the 'action -> assertion' pattern, which is more readable and
> intuitive particularly when working with the Python unittest module."
> 
> 
> main topic: Pygame by Harry Tormey and Andrew Turlock 
> 
> PyGameSF: A story of multimedia hacking fun with Python
> By Harry Tormey and Andrew Turley. 
> 
>    This talk will give an overview of the technologies available for 
> creating multimedia projects with Python, how the PyGameSF meetup got 
> started, what it's all about, and an overview of the wide variety of 
> projects presented at this meetup. 
> 
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Baypiggies mailing list
> Baypiggies at python.org
> To change your subscription options or unsubscribe:
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/baypiggies
> 


From eric at ericwalstad.com  Tue Sep 30 19:07:11 2008
From: eric at ericwalstad.com (Eric Walstad)
Date: Tue, 30 Sep 2008 10:07:11 -0700
Subject: [Baypiggies] Looking for a Python contractor
Message-ID: <c436fcd20809301007m63772680kc93ad4ba9dac15ce@mail.gmail.com>

We are looking for an experienced Python contractor to help us develop
a few Django applications over the next six months, or so.  The right
person will have the following attributes:
    * experience working as an independent contractor
    * be open to working in an 'agile' fashion (short release cycles,
love testing, etc...)
    * experience transferring data to and from external systems
    * be willing to visit San Francisco and/or Oakland weekly for
project meetings
    * enjoy coding to PEP8 yet not a hobgoblin
    * want to become a better programmer

We work with the following just about every day:
    * Ubuntu, Fedora and RedHat EL
    * Python, of course
    * PostgreSQL
    * Subversion
    * Django
    * BASH

You get bonus points if you know:
    * JavaScript
    * dHTML
    * CSS
    * EDI
    * SQL
    * nginx
    * lighttp
    * scaling
    * memcached
    * Energy efficiency
    * the airspeed velocity of an unladen swallow


A little about us:
We are a small team of Python developers.  We work deeply on a few
relatively large projects rather than a lot of short, small projects.
Our projects help facilitate the wide-scale adoption of energy
efficiency.

If this sounds interesting to you and you think you'll be a good fit
please contact me off-list.

Regards,

Eric Walstad
Eric Walstad Associates, LLC

From bdbaddog at gmail.com  Tue Sep 30 19:48:47 2008
From: bdbaddog at gmail.com (William Deegan)
Date: Tue, 30 Sep 2008 10:48:47 -0700
Subject: [Baypiggies] What's on for BayPIGgies October 9 meeting
In-Reply-To: <1222794277.6344.29.camel@ubuntu>
References: <1222748157.6344.16.camel@ubuntu> <1222794277.6344.29.camel@ubuntu>
Message-ID: <8540148a0809301048r4765668fn9340ae4f18e5a992@mail.gmail.com>

Updated.

-Bill

On Tue, Sep 30, 2008 at 10:04 AM, jim <jim at well.com> wrote:
>
> Errata:
> Andrew's last name is Turley, not Turlock.
> My apologies.
>
>
> On Mon, 2008-09-29 at 21:15 -0700, jim wrote:
>>
>> october 9, 2008 (in the Seville room, i believe) 7:30 PM to nine-ish
>>
>>
>> newbie nugget: Unit testing with Mock by Daryl Spitzer
>>
>>    I'll present examples using Michael Foord's Mock library to create
>> unit tests with mocks or stubs taking the place of module and built-in
>> functions.
>>    As Mr. Foord writes in
>> http://www.voidspace.org.uk/python/mock.html#introduction
>> "Most mocking libraries follow the 'record -> replay' pattern of
>> mocking.
>> I prefer the 'action -> assertion' pattern, which is more readable and
>> intuitive particularly when working with the Python unittest module."
>>
>>
>> main topic: Pygame by Harry Tormey and Andrew Turlock
>>
>> PyGameSF: A story of multimedia hacking fun with Python
>> By Harry Tormey and Andrew Turley.
>>
>>    This talk will give an overview of the technologies available for
>> creating multimedia projects with Python, how the PyGameSF meetup got
>> started, what it's all about, and an overview of the wide variety of
>> projects presented at this meetup.
>>
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Baypiggies mailing list
>> Baypiggies at python.org
>> To change your subscription options or unsubscribe:
>> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/baypiggies
>>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Baypiggies mailing list
> Baypiggies at python.org
> To change your subscription options or unsubscribe:
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/baypiggies
>