[Baypiggies] [JOB] Software Engineer, Cloud Fabric Team, Nimbula Inc.

jim jim at well.com
Fri Jul 2 19:12:57 CEST 2010

   probably good to bear in mind that every company 
is a combination of people, each with a particular 
mindset, and all with the problem of communication 
and coordination. 
   the political structure of the company may have 
someone controlling hiring messages using some well-
intentioned but unwise criteria; it seems likely 
that the hiring managers would have a variety of 
"takes" on who'd be acceptable--weighted toward 
practical, get-it-done values. 
   from an applicant's point of view, does an 
application really get screened with respect to 
the criteria of the writer and is there a way to 
end-run directly to the hiring managers. 
   i'm particularly interested in the latter idea. 

On Thu, 2010-07-01 at 23:40 -0700, Jeff Enderwick wrote:
> Maybe it was a carefully crafted test to see if job seekers without CS
> degrees were sharp enough to surmise that equivalent knowledge would
> be likely acceptable. Very smart; effectively implementing a filter by
> *not* adding Aahz' missing text (I smell a business process patent for
> that HR manager!)  ;-).
> In my very limited experience, hiring managers don't spend the time to
> engineer these requirements to such a degree. If you see a job posting
> that you like then you just go for it. If they're smart, then they
> hire you anyway. If they're stiff, then you are likely better off not
> being there.
> I may have a skewed sample set, but it seems that every (non-goog?)
> job solicitation posted to this list gets the crap beat out of it,
> with the biggest magnet being that series of Chomp postings (okay, I
> admit it - I took part in those :-). In all seriousness, these may be
> good companies/people trying to hire? $.02...
> On Thu, Jul 1, 2010 at 9:49 PM, Alex Martelli <aleax at google.com>
> wrote:
>         On Thu, Jul 1, 2010 at 9:03 PM, Jeff Enderwick
>         <jeff.enderwick at gmail.com> wrote:
>         > Aahz,
>         > I wouldn't make the leap from not being lawyerly about the
>         job requirements
>         > to not being able to write correct code! I think all of us
>         who read it (even
>         > those who don't have CS sheepskin) realized that equivalent
>         knowledge would
>         > likely be gladly accepted in lieu. Finding great people is
>         so hard! Anyone
>         > who is overly strict on that sort of requirement is sure to
>         suffer.
>         If they're serious about this hiring and its importance, and
>         if you're
>         right that what they say is A MUST (*VERY* strong wording!) is
>         not
>         indeed a must, they're pretty weird people -- why did they
>         deliberately choose that (you assume incorrect) wording?!.  By
>         far the
>         most common wording includes, as Aahz mentioned, "or
>         equivalent
>         experience", after all -- IF, that is, one IS willing to
>         evaluate
>         candidates with a different degree but lots of experience.
>         I'm saying they "deliberately chose" that
>         odious-to-all-other-degree-holders wording, because of the
>         assumption
>         that they ARE serious about the importance of this hire, and
>         therefore
>         must have given it all due care and attention.  If they
>         *accidentally*
>         pick wrong (and odious;-) wording DESPITE paying very careful
>         attention to what they're saying (because they consider this
>         hire
>         important), then they're even weirder than I hypothesized
>         above.
>         All in all, I think that your assumption that they don't
>         really mean
>         what they say (despite saying it with so precise and forceful
>         a choice
>         of words), one way or another, has to be extremely insulting
>         to them
>         -- even more than I would like to be, and that's saying
>         something;-).
>         Alex
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