[Catalog-sig] pre-PEP: transition to release-file hosting at pypi site
mal at egenix.com
Mon Mar 11 10:23:03 CET 2013
On 11.03.2013 09:18, Lennart Regebro wrote:
> On Mon, Mar 11, 2013 at 9:06 AM, Ronald Oussoren <ronaldoussoren at mac.com> wrote:
>> But this isn't necessarily true, there is another solution: mirror your requirements locally.
> I do that. This is not a solution, because your requirements yesterday
> is not your requirements tomorrow.
>> Is it even clear why numerous archives aren't hosted on PyPI?
> No, the only one that has mentioned why is Marc-André, I think, whose
> eGenix packages are distributed as binary packages for loads of
> different platforms. It's unclear to me if all these binary packages
> should be uploaded to PyPI, and it is also unclear to me why they
> can't be, it seems to be mostly a case of it being too much work.
I've listed all the reasons in one of the previous emails:
Others will likely have additional reasons, like e.g.
* the PyPI uploads not being compatible to their release process
* not knowing that it's possible to host files on PyPI - after
all it's an *index*, not a repository :-)
* still believing that PyPI is an unreliable hosting provider
due the many downtimes and problems it had in the past - which
is no longer true today
* not wanting to host and maintain files in several different
* not wanting to host release files at all, i.e. have people
check out the version from a repository instead of doing
the download, unzip, install dance
* not wanting to separate associated library or product
code from the Python wrapper code (think e.g. the
Python interface for subversion)
* not being allowed to upload files to external servers
by company policy, or having to deal with a company
policy that makes this difficult/unattractive
* having issues with the added latency of PyPI downloads compared
to a simple file based index hosted on a company web server
* having a strong need to know the number of downloads per
package and associated statistics such as downloads per
country, per year/month/day/hour
* not wanting to give up access to the download log files
* having a requirement to restrict downloads on a per country
basis, e.g. for export controlled software or software which
may not be imported/used in certain countries
* having PyPI not provide the technical means to host the
release files, e.g. due to the releases using a format
which is not supported by PyPI (e.g. all the ActiveState
packages - http://code.activestate.com/pypm/)
* user experience/support issues:
if the package has external dependencies,
or needs special setup, it may provide a better user experience
to host the Python wrapper on the same page as the dependencies
and instructions on how to install them; rather than having
them on PyPI which lets people believe that a simple
"pip install something" will get them a working setup
Those are just a few things that come to mind. I'm sure there
are more issues that keep authors from uploading their
packages to PyPI.
Overall, I think we should encourage people to make their
code available through PyPI and make it attractive to them,
but keep the possibility to continue using external hosting
platforms, should they run into issues that PyPI cannot
solve for them.
> He also mentioned the big Python distributions eGenix does as being
> too large for PyPI, but I don't really see the point of uploading
> Python distributions to PyPI, they can't be installed with Python
> installers anyway.
Not sure what you mean here.
PyPI is also used to index Python projects which are not Python
packages to be installed by pip/easy_install/etc.
Some of those may also want to
>> IMHO it would be better to remove barriers than force projects to host files on PyPI.
> Nobody has really been able to point out any real barriers, so we
> don't know what they are or if they exist.
Again, please see the email where I listed the ones affecting
at least eGenix.
Most of those can be addressed in one way or another, e.g.
by having PyPI cache the files, provide access to the download
counts by country, provide a way to host separate indexes for
UCS2/UCS4 egg files, etc.
The only issues that need more investigation are the PyPI license
terms and the general issue of not being able to host export
regulated files on PyPI.
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