From nick.albright at gmail.com Sun Nov 1 21:48:20 2009 From: nick.albright at gmail.com (Nick Albright) Date: Sun, 1 Nov 2009 15:48:20 -0500 Subject: [CentralOH] Oct Meeting Website Notes Message-ID: <7ec143010911011248m116cf471g36ff509311b864ff@mail.gmail.com> Hello Folks! So here are the notes from the website portion of the Oct Meeting! *Website Objectives *Connect with others who use python Increase python knowledge *Website Features* Upcoming Events (Model after "Full Year Calendar" Yahoo widget) Sponsors Sponsor for next meeting could be at the top (Reward continue doing) Previous sponsors listed next Meeting notes Meeting videos/pictures Members to submit and vote on meeting talks Website Suggestions Book List We could do a lending interface as a project here Links to other python groups User Pages List of their projects Member list Latest Updates on the website Enticements to join the website/membership benefits Interface for 'admin' users to post to twitter account Way to communicate/ask questions on code/code review Forum Wiki Blog Python Tutorials! (People love!) Example code (Should be working/complete) Monthly Top 10 Factiods (My handwriting is a bit tough here, I think that is right = ) Podcasts List of Local Companies that use python and are hiring *Website Framework *We talked about using Google Apps as the place to host, since it is so closely tied to django and is a great price. And using Bitbucket as the repository. We are shooting for at a minimum have the framework setup by the next meeting and ready for a possible sprint. And with any luck, perhaps stuff done by then and a possible sprint. Any concerns on going with Google Apps and Bitbucket? *Action Items* 1) Setup Google Apps/see how well it works - I'd be willing to get this done in the next week 2) Determine what features to implement first! I hope people have made it this far! = ) The question is, what are the top 3 features you'd like to see implemented on the website first? Thanks Everyone! :) -Nick -- P.S. Any spelling mistakes are not those of the author, as he can't spell. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From nick.albright at gmail.com Sun Nov 1 21:55:43 2009 From: nick.albright at gmail.com (Nick Albright) Date: Sun, 1 Nov 2009 15:55:43 -0500 Subject: [CentralOH] Oct Meeting Website Notes In-Reply-To: <7ec143010911011248m116cf471g36ff509311b864ff@mail.gmail.com> References: <7ec143010911011248m116cf471g36ff509311b864ff@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <7ec143010911011255x37b9b71p6613e5ba59b8aa9a@mail.gmail.com> Quick Correction, for the last bit, that should be "Google App Engine" and not "Googe Apps". = ) -Nick "has #gonegoogle" ;) On Sun, Nov 1, 2009 at 3:48 PM, Nick Albright wrote: > Hello Folks! > > So here are the notes from the website portion of the Oct Meeting! > > > *Website Objectives > *Connect with others who use python > Increase python knowledge > > > *Website Features* > Upcoming Events > (Model after "Full Year Calendar" Yahoo widget) > Sponsors > Sponsor for next meeting could be at the top (Reward continue doing) > Previous sponsors listed next > Meeting notes > Meeting videos/pictures > > Members to submit and vote on meeting talks > Website Suggestions > Book List > We could do a lending interface as a project here > > Links to other python groups > User Pages > List of their projects > Member list > Latest Updates on the website > Enticements to join the website/membership benefits > Interface for 'admin' users to post to twitter account > > Way to communicate/ask questions on code/code review > Forum > Wiki > Blog > Python Tutorials! (People love!) > Example code (Should be working/complete) > Monthly Top 10 Factiods (My handwriting is a bit tough here, I think that > is right = ) > Podcasts > List of Local Companies that use python and are hiring > > > *Website Framework > *We talked about using Google Apps as the place to host, since it is so > closely tied to django and is a great price. And using Bitbucket as the > repository. > > We are shooting for at a minimum have the framework setup by the next > meeting and ready for a possible sprint. And with any luck, perhaps stuff > done by then and a possible sprint. > > Any concerns on going with Google Apps and Bitbucket? > > > *Action Items* > 1) Setup Google Apps/see how well it works - I'd be willing to get this > done in the next week > 2) Determine what features to implement first! > > I hope people have made it this far! = ) The question is, what are the > top 3 features you'd like to see implemented on the website first? > > Thanks Everyone! :) > -Nick > > -- > > P.S. Any spelling mistakes are not those of the author, as he can't spell. -- In theory, there is no difference between theory and practice; In practice, there is. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From brian.costlow at gmail.com Mon Nov 2 15:37:03 2009 From: brian.costlow at gmail.com (Brian Costlow) Date: Mon, 2 Nov 2009 09:37:03 -0500 Subject: [CentralOH] Fwd: Re: Stackless Python In-Reply-To: <1256825341.8925.52.camel@talyn.cisco.com> References: <200910281703.30488.bryan.harris@udri.udayton.edu> <89d8b1b00910281416w4df11397o1c39bf9721047c67@mail.gmail.com> <200910281730.12506.bryan.harris@udri.udayton.edu> <1256825341.8925.52.camel@talyn.cisco.com> Message-ID: <89d8b1b00911020637g3b889d6bl12e5e053a4b5d1cc@mail.gmail.com> Just for my own education, I did a little further digging this weekend to get a better understanding of why the GIL prevents Python from running across multi-core/multi-processing systems. I had a pretty accurate, but high-level understanding about how the GIL works. I also thought that aside from the GIL, Python's thread implementation was pretty much: let the kernel/os deal with scheduling, priorities, context switches etc. So although I read a brief comment on a board from a well-known pythonista that it 'won't ' run across multi-cores, that didn't make sense to me. If it just uses the os' underlying thread model, why won't it run across multi-cores when you have I/O bound threads, or when your thread is C extension code that releases the lock while it does stuff outside the interpreter? So before I stuck my foot in my mouth again, I did some more searching and reading. As it turns out, Python does try to use more than one core/processor, but the GIL implementation can cause a terrible race condition. A quick simplified summary. The thread holding the GIL releases it every 100 ticks (a tick can be thought of loosely as 1-6 python bytecode instructions, depending on the bytecodes). The os gets the opportunity to context switch to another thread. However, the scheduler usually doesn't switch at every opportunity, so the running thread will try to reacquire the GIL. In a single processor, when the os does context switch, the running thread is stopped, and another one is woken up and given control. In a multiple core/processor system, say we have thread 1 and 2 running across different processors. Thread 1 holds the GIL and is processor-bound, while 2 is doing some I/O. Now 2 needs access to the python interpreter again, so it waits until it acquires the GIL. Thread one releases the GIL. The os starts to wake up thread 2, but thread 1 is still running and also tries to reacquire the GIL. Thread 1 usually wins, because of the overhead of waking up thread 2. (In the links below, in one case, thread 2 attempted to get the lock 1400 times before it was successful). There's all the extra work that results in the slowdown. See this great talk by David Beazley: http://blip.tv/file/2232410/ Accompanying slides (PDF): http://www.dabeaz.com/python/GIL.pdf Long but interesting thread on the python concurrency sig. Gets really interesting and overlaps/references Dave's talk when the subject line changes to "Inside the Python GIL." http://mail.python.org/pipermail/concurrency-sig/2009-June/000001.html -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From nick.albright at gmail.com Mon Nov 2 15:53:47 2009 From: nick.albright at gmail.com (Nick Albright) Date: Mon, 2 Nov 2009 09:53:47 -0500 Subject: [CentralOH] Website Logo! Message-ID: <7ec143010911020653q705fc56cv87743c75fe3a91d6@mail.gmail.com> Oh! So we also discussed that we should see if we can get ourselves a logo! So there are kinda 2 bits: 1) Any thoughts on what our logo should look like? 2) Anyone know anyone with graphic arts capabilities? :) Peace! -Nick -- "Five out of every four people have trouble with fractions." -- Unknown -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From Bryan.Harris at udri.udayton.edu Mon Nov 2 16:38:21 2009 From: Bryan.Harris at udri.udayton.edu (Harris, Bryan W.) Date: Mon, 2 Nov 2009 10:38:21 -0500 Subject: [CentralOH] Fwd: Re: Stackless Python References: <200910281703.30488.bryan.harris@udri.udayton.edu><89d8b1b00910281416w4df11397o1c39bf9721047c67@mail.gmail.com><200910281730.12506.bryan.harris@udri.udayton.edu><1256825341.8925.52.camel@talyn.cisco.com> <89d8b1b00911020637g3b889d6bl12e5e053a4b5d1cc@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: Hi Guys, I actually did some benchmarks between the threading and processing libraries. I didn't do anything rigorous and I don't want to "publish" the results because I didn't understand the results very well. However, I have some general results below for anyone who is interested. "Threading" (mt) all runs from within a single process and rarely uses more than a single core no matter what. I did notice some usage in the 120% range, indicating that it was using more than a single processor, but that's pretty pitiful compared to a theoretical max of 400%. I can't imagine why it takes 280% overhead to move number=3.14*i+number to a different core and run it there. Maybe, I'm missing something simple. "Processing" (mp) opens a new process for each thread, so if you are running top, you will see a new python instance for each process. It was kind of satisfying to see my 100 "thread" test case fill top with "pythons". It was nice to see any evidence at all that something was different. However, as above, the processor usage rarely got very much over 100%. In some cases I got something like 150% or 160% cpu usage. Here is what I got in general: I simulated a compute intensive operation by incrementing a counter and them multiplying that by a floating point number. I then printed the number, which I knw takes a really long time. I piped this output to a file to speed things up a bit, but I fear this test may be I/o bound which could be what is slowing down my benchmarks. I could get the same number of total operations by increasing the number of threads and decreasing the number of iterations. 10 threads of 10,000 ~= 20 threads of 5,000 operations. It's possible larger numbres could lead to overflows/underflows, but I don't think that should have slowed things down too much. Python mp was faster when the number of processes was <= the number of cores. I have a 4 core machine and the mp would work ~30-50% faster than mt for threads=2,3, and 4. 1 was about the same as one might expect. However, as soon as I hit 5 threads, the mp slowed down dramatically. The performance of mt would gradually decrease as I increased the number of threads, but had no such noticable drop in performance at threads=5. At threads=5, mp and mt had about the same performance. The mp drpped off a cliff after that, quickly taking 10x or 100x longer to complete than the mt program. Bryan Harris Research Engineer Structures and Materials Evaluation Group bryan.harris at udri.udayton.edu (937) 229-5561 ________________________________ From: centraloh-bounces+harrisbw=notes.udayton.edu at python.org on behalf of Brian Costlow Sent: Mon 11/2/2009 9:37 AM To: centraloh Subject: Re: [CentralOH] Fwd: Re: Stackless Python Just for my own education, I did a little further digging this weekend to get a better understanding of why the GIL prevents Python from running across multi-core/multi-processing systems. I had a pretty accurate, but high-level understanding about how the GIL works. I also thought that aside from the GIL, Python's thread implementation was pretty much: let the kernel/os deal with scheduling, priorities, context switches etc. So although I read a brief comment on a board from a well-known pythonista that it 'won't ' run across multi-cores, that didn't make sense to me. If it just uses the os' underlying thread model, why won't it run across multi-cores when you have I/O bound threads, or when your thread is C extension code that releases the lock while it does stuff outside the interpreter? So before I stuck my foot in my mouth again, I did some more searching and reading. As it turns out, Python does try to use more than one core/processor, but the GIL implementation can cause a terrible race condition. A quick simplified summary. The thread holding the GIL releases it every 100 ticks (a tick can be thought of loosely as 1-6 python bytecode instructions, depending on the bytecodes). The os gets the opportunity to context switch to another thread. However, the scheduler usually doesn't switch at every opportunity, so the running thread will try to reacquire the GIL. In a single processor, when the os does context switch, the running thread is stopped, and another one is woken up and given control. In a multiple core/processor system, say we have thread 1 and 2 running across different processors. Thread 1 holds the GIL and is processor-bound, while 2 is doing some I/O. Now 2 needs access to the python interpreter again, so it waits until it acquires the GIL. Thread one releases the GIL. The os starts to wake up thread 2, but thread 1 is still running and also tries to reacquire the GIL. Thread 1 usually wins, because of the overhead of waking up thread 2. (In the links below, in one case, thread 2 attempted to get the lock 1400 times before it was successful). There's all the extra work that results in the slowdown. See this great talk by David Beazley: http://blip.tv/file/2232410/ Accompanying slides (PDF): http://www.dabeaz.com/python/GIL.pdf Long but interesting thread on the python concurrency sig. Gets really interesting and overlaps/references Dave's talk when the subject line changes to "Inside the Python GIL." http://mail.python.org/pipermail/concurrency-sig/2009-June/000001.html -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From chris at developingchris.com Mon Nov 2 17:05:15 2009 From: chris at developingchris.com (Chris Chandler) Date: Mon, 2 Nov 2009 11:05:15 -0500 Subject: [CentralOH] Website Logo! In-Reply-To: <7ec143010911020653q705fc56cv87743c75fe3a91d6@mail.gmail.com> References: <7ec143010911020653q705fc56cv87743c75fe3a91d6@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <95f91cc30911020805o1b1d313ag1cefc84dfeb727a@mail.gmail.com> My personal preference is that its a font based logo, and not some gimicky modification to the state of ohio. Thanks, Chris Chandler 352-871-0712 On Mon, Nov 2, 2009 at 9:53 AM, Nick Albright wrote: > Oh! So we also discussed that we should see if we can get ourselves a > logo! So there are kinda 2 bits: > > 1) Any thoughts on what our logo should look like? > > 2) Anyone know anyone with graphic arts capabilities? :) > > Peace! > -Nick > > -- > > "Five out of every four people have trouble with fractions." -- Unknown > > _______________________________________________ > CentralOH mailing list > CentralOH at python.org > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/centraloh > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From brian.costlow at gmail.com Mon Nov 2 18:36:44 2009 From: brian.costlow at gmail.com (Brian Costlow) Date: Mon, 2 Nov 2009 12:36:44 -0500 Subject: [CentralOH] Fwd: Re: Stackless Python In-Reply-To: References: <200910281703.30488.bryan.harris@udri.udayton.edu> <89d8b1b00910281416w4df11397o1c39bf9721047c67@mail.gmail.com> <200910281730.12506.bryan.harris@udri.udayton.edu> <1256825341.8925.52.camel@talyn.cisco.com> <89d8b1b00911020637g3b889d6bl12e5e053a4b5d1cc@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <89d8b1b00911020936j4ffbc5c0hd82c4f77d1e7a624@mail.gmail.com> Bryan, If you have not read the links I posted yet, read the Beazley slides from slide 33 to 42, if nothing else. It's not that you are missing something simple, it's the way python does threading (or really in a sense, doesn't). In Dave's threading tests, rewriting some processor-bound code to use 2 threads on one core added over 3 million mach system calls on an OS X box. Running the same code on dual cores added over 9 million calls and slowed it down even further. There's your 280%. I haven't personally done anything with the multiprocessing module, the only code I have that coordinates multiple processes just forks children directly, is I/O (network) bound, and since it needs to play nice with other things, we set it via a config to only use 1/2 the available cores on any given box. But in general I would expect performance of a processor-bound app to fall off when you add more processes than you have cores. I don't know why it falls off a cliff though. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From brian.costlow at gmail.com Mon Nov 2 22:14:30 2009 From: brian.costlow at gmail.com (Brian Costlow) Date: Mon, 2 Nov 2009 16:14:30 -0500 Subject: [CentralOH] Website Logo! In-Reply-To: <95f91cc30911020805o1b1d313ag1cefc84dfeb727a@mail.gmail.com> References: <7ec143010911020653q705fc56cv87743c75fe3a91d6@mail.gmail.com> <95f91cc30911020805o1b1d313ag1cefc84dfeb727a@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <89d8b1b00911021314o56a36249s6bab384aa3519e4e@mail.gmail.com> Dang. Since it's CENTRAL Ohio Python Users, I was all geared up for "Snakes on a Plain". On Mon, Nov 2, 2009 at 11:05 AM, Chris Chandler wrote: > My personal preference is that its a font based logo, and not some gimicky > modification to the state of ohio. > > Thanks, > Chris Chandler > 352-871-0712 > > > On Mon, Nov 2, 2009 at 9:53 AM, Nick Albright wrote: > >> Oh! So we also discussed that we should see if we can get ourselves a >> logo! So there are kinda 2 bits: >> >> 1) Any thoughts on what our logo should look like? >> >> 2) Anyone know anyone with graphic arts capabilities? :) >> >> Peace! >> -Nick >> >> -- >> >> "Five out of every four people have trouble with fractions." -- Unknown >> >> _______________________________________________ >> CentralOH mailing list >> CentralOH at python.org >> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/centraloh >> >> > > _______________________________________________ > CentralOH mailing list > CentralOH at python.org > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/centraloh > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From nick.albright at gmail.com Mon Nov 2 22:22:21 2009 From: nick.albright at gmail.com (Nick Albright) Date: Mon, 2 Nov 2009 16:22:21 -0500 Subject: [CentralOH] Website Logo! In-Reply-To: <89d8b1b00911021314o56a36249s6bab384aa3519e4e@mail.gmail.com> References: <7ec143010911020653q705fc56cv87743c75fe3a91d6@mail.gmail.com> <95f91cc30911020805o1b1d313ag1cefc84dfeb727a@mail.gmail.com> <89d8b1b00911021314o56a36249s6bab384aa3519e4e@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <7ec143010911021322q2b05df3bw2c106fb575164333@mail.gmail.com> Someone threw out a python wrapped around a Buckeye at the meeting. = ) -Nick On Mon, Nov 2, 2009 at 4:14 PM, Brian Costlow wrote: > Dang. > > Since it's CENTRAL Ohio Python Users, I was all geared up for "Snakes on a > Plain". > > > > > On Mon, Nov 2, 2009 at 11:05 AM, Chris Chandler > wrote: > >> My personal preference is that its a font based logo, and not some gimicky >> modification to the state of ohio. >> >> Thanks, >> Chris Chandler >> 352-871-0712 >> >> >> On Mon, Nov 2, 2009 at 9:53 AM, Nick Albright wrote: >> >>> Oh! So we also discussed that we should see if we can get ourselves a >>> logo! So there are kinda 2 bits: >>> >>> 1) Any thoughts on what our logo should look like? >>> >>> 2) Anyone know anyone with graphic arts capabilities? :) >>> >>> Peace! >>> -Nick >>> >>> -- >>> >>> "Five out of every four people have trouble with fractions." -- Unknown >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> CentralOH mailing list >>> CentralOH at python.org >>> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/centraloh >>> >>> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> CentralOH mailing list >> CentralOH at python.org >> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/centraloh >> >> > -- In theory, there is no difference between theory and practice; In practice, there is. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From miles.groman at gmail.com Tue Nov 3 05:36:31 2009 From: miles.groman at gmail.com (miles groman) Date: Mon, 2 Nov 2009 23:36:31 -0500 Subject: [CentralOH] Website Logo! In-Reply-To: References: <7ec143010911020653q705fc56cv87743c75fe3a91d6@mail.gmail.com> <95f91cc30911020805o1b1d313ag1cefc84dfeb727a@mail.gmail.com> <89d8b1b00911021314o56a36249s6bab384aa3519e4e@mail.gmail.com> <7ec143010911021322q2b05df3bw2c106fb575164333@mail.gmail.com> <7ec143010911021403h7aa921b1g4fd833bd425c31f9@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: http://www.monsterlandtoys.com/video/Boa%20vs%20Python.jpg From bryan.harris at udri.udayton.edu Tue Nov 3 15:34:43 2009 From: bryan.harris at udri.udayton.edu (Bryan Harris) Date: Tue, 3 Nov 2009 09:34:43 -0500 Subject: [CentralOH] Fwd: Re: Stackless Python In-Reply-To: <45ACFD08-A04A-44CF-B7E2-978636CBC61E@osc.edu> References: <200910281703.30488.bryan.harris@udri.udayton.edu> <45ACFD08-A04A-44CF-B7E2-978636CBC61E@osc.edu> Message-ID: <200911030934.43799.bryan.harris@udri.udayton.edu> Here you go. It's dirt simple, but I attached the two scripts. Syntax: -- Bryan Harris Research Engineer Structures and Materials Evaluation Group bryan.harris at udri.udayton.edu http://www.udri.udayton.edu/ (937) 229-5561 On Monday 02 November 2009 02:26:37 pm you wrote: > On Nov 2, 2009, at 10:38 AM, Harris, Bryan W. wrote: > > Hi Guys, > > I actually did some benchmarks between the threading and processing > > libraries. I didn't do anything rigorous and I don't want to > > "publish" the results because I didn't understand the results very > > well. However, I have some general results below for anyone who is > > interested. > > Can you post your test code? I can think of a bunch of things that > could be causing problems, it would be easier to try them than to > speculate... -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: mp.py Type: text/x-python Size: 1152 bytes Desc: not available URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: mt.py Type: text/x-python Size: 1126 bytes Desc: not available URL: From ntwilcox at gmail.com Tue Nov 3 15:37:42 2009 From: ntwilcox at gmail.com (Tom Wilcox) Date: Tue, 3 Nov 2009 09:37:42 -0500 Subject: [CentralOH] CentralOH Digest, Vol 31, Issue 3 In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <1B792993-8888-4B09-AF20-29BDCB23E529@gmail.com> Okay, "Snakes on a Plain" is pretty hilarious! Too bad I'm a GFX programmer and not a GFX designer. Incidentally, is anyone on the list doing GFX programming with Python? (See how a sneaked that in? VBG.) Tom Sent from my iPhone On Nov 3, 2009, at 12:00 AM, centraloh-request at python.org wrote: > Send CentralOH mailing list submissions to > centraloh at python.org > > To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/centraloh > or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to > centraloh-request at python.org > > You can reach the person managing the list at > centraloh-owner at python.org > > When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific > than "Re: Contents of CentralOH digest..." > > > Today's Topics: > > 1. Re: Website Logo! (Chris Chandler) > 2. Re: Fwd: Re: Stackless Python (Brian Costlow) > 3. Re: Website Logo! (Brian Costlow) > 4. Re: Website Logo! (Nick Albright) > 5. Re: Website Logo! (miles groman) > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > Message: 1 > Date: Mon, 2 Nov 2009 11:05:15 -0500 > From: Chris Chandler > To: Nick Albright > Cc: centraloh > Subject: Re: [CentralOH] Website Logo! > Message-ID: > <95f91cc30911020805o1b1d313ag1cefc84dfeb727a at mail.gmail.com> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" > > My personal preference is that its a font based logo, and not some > gimicky > modification to the state of ohio. > > Thanks, > Chris Chandler > 352-871-0712 > > > On Mon, Nov 2, 2009 at 9:53 AM, Nick Albright > wrote: > >> Oh! So we also discussed that we should see if we can get >> ourselves a >> logo! So there are kinda 2 bits: >> >> 1) Any thoughts on what our logo should look like? >> >> 2) Anyone know anyone with graphic arts capabilities? :) >> >> Peace! >> -Nick >> >> -- >> >> "Five out of every four people have trouble with fractions." -- >> Unknown >> >> _______________________________________________ >> CentralOH mailing list >> CentralOH at python.org >> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/centraloh >> >> > -------------- next part -------------- > An HTML attachment was scrubbed... > URL: > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 2 > Date: Mon, 2 Nov 2009 12:36:44 -0500 > From: Brian Costlow > To: "Harris, Bryan W." , centraloh > > Subject: Re: [CentralOH] Fwd: Re: Stackless Python > Message-ID: > <89d8b1b00911020936j4ffbc5c0hd82c4f77d1e7a624 at mail.gmail.com> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" > > Bryan, > > If you have not read the links I posted yet, read the Beazley slides > from > slide 33 to 42, if nothing else. > > It's not that you are missing something simple, it's the way python > does > threading (or really in a sense, doesn't). In Dave's threading tests, > rewriting some processor-bound code to use 2 threads on one core > added over > 3 million mach system calls on an OS X box. Running the same code on > dual > cores added over 9 million calls and slowed it down even further. > There's > your 280%. > > I haven't personally done anything with the multiprocessing module, > the only > code I have that coordinates multiple processes just forks children > directly, is I/O (network) bound, and since it needs to play nice > with other > things, we set it via a config to only use 1/2 the available cores > on any > given box. But in general I would expect performance of a processor- > bound > app to fall off when you add more processes than you have cores. I > don't > know why it falls off a cliff though. > -------------- next part -------------- > An HTML attachment was scrubbed... > URL: > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 3 > Date: Mon, 2 Nov 2009 16:14:30 -0500 > From: Brian Costlow > To: Chris Chandler > Cc: centraloh > Subject: Re: [CentralOH] Website Logo! > Message-ID: > <89d8b1b00911021314o56a36249s6bab384aa3519e4e at mail.gmail.com> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" > > Dang. > > Since it's CENTRAL Ohio Python Users, I was all geared up for > "Snakes on a > Plain". > > > > On Mon, Nov 2, 2009 at 11:05 AM, Chris Chandler > wrote: > >> My personal preference is that its a font based logo, and not some >> gimicky >> modification to the state of ohio. >> >> Thanks, >> Chris Chandler >> 352-871-0712 >> >> >> On Mon, Nov 2, 2009 at 9:53 AM, Nick Albright > >wrote: >> >>> Oh! So we also discussed that we should see if we can get >>> ourselves a >>> logo! So there are kinda 2 bits: >>> >>> 1) Any thoughts on what our logo should look like? >>> >>> 2) Anyone know anyone with graphic arts capabilities? :) >>> >>> Peace! >>> -Nick >>> >>> -- >>> >>> "Five out of every four people have trouble with fractions." -- >>> Unknown >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> CentralOH mailing list >>> CentralOH at python.org >>> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/centraloh >>> >>> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> CentralOH mailing list >> CentralOH at python.org >> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/centraloh >> >> > -------------- next part -------------- > An HTML attachment was scrubbed... > URL: > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 4 > Date: Mon, 2 Nov 2009 16:22:21 -0500 > From: Nick Albright > To: Brian Costlow > Cc: centraloh > Subject: Re: [CentralOH] Website Logo! > Message-ID: > <7ec143010911021322q2b05df3bw2c106fb575164333 at mail.gmail.com> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" > > Someone threw out a python wrapped around a Buckeye at the meeting. > = ) > -Nick > > On Mon, Nov 2, 2009 at 4:14 PM, Brian Costlow > wrote: > >> Dang. >> >> Since it's CENTRAL Ohio Python Users, I was all geared up for >> "Snakes on a >> Plain". >> >> >> >> >> On Mon, Nov 2, 2009 at 11:05 AM, Chris Chandler >> wrote: >> >>> My personal preference is that its a font based logo, and not some >>> gimicky >>> modification to the state of ohio. >>> >>> Thanks, >>> Chris Chandler >>> 352-871-0712 >>> >>> >>> On Mon, Nov 2, 2009 at 9:53 AM, Nick Albright >> >wrote: >>> >>>> Oh! So we also discussed that we should see if we can get >>>> ourselves a >>>> logo! So there are kinda 2 bits: >>>> >>>> 1) Any thoughts on what our logo should look like? >>>> >>>> 2) Anyone know anyone with graphic arts capabilities? :) >>>> >>>> Peace! >>>> -Nick >>>> >>>> -- >>>> >>>> "Five out of every four people have trouble with fractions." -- >>>> Unknown >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> CentralOH mailing list >>>> CentralOH at python.org >>>> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/centraloh >>>> >>>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> CentralOH mailing list >>> CentralOH at python.org >>> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/centraloh >>> >>> >> > > > -- > > In theory, there is no difference between theory and practice; In > practice, > there is. > -------------- next part -------------- > An HTML attachment was scrubbed... > URL: > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 5 > Date: Mon, 2 Nov 2009 23:36:31 -0500 > From: miles groman > To: centraloh at python.org > Subject: Re: [CentralOH] Website Logo! > Message-ID: > > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 > > http://www.monsterlandtoys.com/video/Boa%20vs%20Python.jpg > > > ------------------------------ > > _______________________________________________ > CentralOH mailing list > CentralOH at python.org > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/centraloh > > > End of CentralOH Digest, Vol 31, Issue 3 > **************************************** From brian.costlow at gmail.com Wed Nov 4 20:50:22 2009 From: brian.costlow at gmail.com (Brian Costlow) Date: Wed, 4 Nov 2009 14:50:22 -0500 Subject: [CentralOH] Fwd: Re: Stackless Python In-Reply-To: <200911030934.43799.bryan.harris@udri.udayton.edu> References: <200910281703.30488.bryan.harris@udri.udayton.edu> <45ACFD08-A04A-44CF-B7E2-978636CBC61E@osc.edu> <200911030934.43799.bryan.harris@udri.udayton.edu> Message-ID: <89d8b1b00911041150q528423b1je89cc091d4804b7f@mail.gmail.com> Bryan, Didn't see any public responses to your post of your code, wondered if you got any private help? I took a quick look at the code, and I am certain that the GIL issues are what are slowing down your threaded version. There's nothing you can do to code around that, the GIL keeps python from running threaded code sanely in a multicore environment. It's an implementation limitation of CPython. You do need to add your lock around your 'done' print statement. The GIL is removed for I/O and without the lock, these intermix with the worker threads' print statements. e.g., 7 7.29473684211 7 7.21875 7 7.14432989691 Thread number 7 1 7.07142857143 is done7 7.0 Thread number 27 6.93 is done Thread number 3 is done for pingle in pinglist: pingle.join() with some_lock: print "Thread number ",pingle.number,"is done" I noticed from your comments in the code that this was originally doing pings. That's I/O bound and could be a case where threads would help in a single-core setup. But after looking at David Beazley's talk, probably would still behave badly on multiple cores. However, for I/O bound code, as opposed to processor-bound, Stackless might help. Other possibilities would be Eventlet, Twisted, or rolling your own asynchronous code using asyncore. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From nludban at osc.edu Wed Nov 4 21:29:26 2009 From: nludban at osc.edu (Neil Ludban) Date: Wed, 4 Nov 2009 15:29:26 -0500 Subject: [CentralOH] Fwd: Re: Stackless Python In-Reply-To: <89d8b1b00911041150q528423b1je89cc091d4804b7f@mail.gmail.com> References: <200910281703.30488.bryan.harris@udri.udayton.edu> <45ACFD08-A04A-44CF-B7E2-978636CBC61E@osc.edu> <200911030934.43799.bryan.harris@udri.udayton.edu> <89d8b1b00911041150q528423b1je89cc091d4804b7f@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <2C28464F-4EF7-40AA-8601-DFEE0E9D0504@osc.edu> On Nov 4, 2009, at 2:50 PM, Brian Costlow wrote: > Bryan, > > Didn't see any public responses to your post of your code, wondered > if you got any private help? ...nn > You do need to add your lock around your 'done' print statement. The > GIL is removed for I/O and without the lock, these intermix with the > worker threads' print statements. OK, try *removing* the with-lock and the print and replace it with something like this: s = '%i %f\n' % (me, dividend) os.write(1, s) The problem being that all threads were blocking on the one lock waiting for slow terminal output to complete. Making direct system calls with the complete string should serialize output and keep threads moving. From eric at intellovations.com Thu Nov 5 21:47:03 2009 From: eric at intellovations.com (Eric Floehr) Date: Thu, 5 Nov 2009 15:47:03 -0500 Subject: [CentralOH] WingIDE 50% discount Message-ID: <34f468870911051247m7b4ed9a1nc587efcc530a4b82@mail.gmail.com> All, I just wanted to remind everyone of the Central Ohio Python Users group discount being offered by WingWare on their awesome Python IDE WingIDE. It is for 50% off any version and it is good until November 26, 2009. If you were not at the meeting, or forgot the discount code, please email me directly and I'll get it to you. Best Regards, Eric From eric at intellovations.com Mon Nov 9 02:14:54 2009 From: eric at intellovations.com (Eric Floehr) Date: Sun, 8 Nov 2009 20:14:54 -0500 Subject: [CentralOH] MIT Open Courseware and Python Message-ID: <34f468870911081714i211cec33r907158f65a437d41@mail.gmail.com> All, For those learning Python, or who want a more grounded computer science background to Python, check out this MIT course, available for free: http://ocw.mit.edu/OcwWeb/Electrical-Engineering-and-Computer-Science/6-00Fall-2008/LectureVideos/index.htm There are 24 video lectures, with handouts. The first several cover the Python language. Then they go into computer science topics like search, object orientation, encapsulation, etc. Finally, the lectures conclude with statistics, plotting, and simulations, all in Python. You can watch any or all, and best of all its free. Best Regards, Eric From eric at intellovations.com Mon Nov 9 12:55:47 2009 From: eric at intellovations.com (Eric Floehr) Date: Mon, 9 Nov 2009 06:55:47 -0500 Subject: [CentralOH] Learning and Growing with Python Message-ID: <34f468870911090355i1c70c450s35f4dd2aad2ee3a3@mail.gmail.com> All, At the conclusion of the last meeting, we broke into two sub-groups: the COhPy.org website group and the "Learning and Growing with Python" group. The Learning group consists of those interested in learning Python, learning MORE about Python, and growing as a Python programmer. It does not just consist of those new to Python, but also anyone who wants to continue to learn and grow their Python programming prowess. At last meeting, we had a brainstorming session to list out all the things we could do in our sub-group to accomplish that mission. What I'd like for anyone interested in this sub-group is to reply to this message with your thoughts about what resonates with you and what most interests you. * Things We Could Do:* *1. Code Walkthrough* Take an existing open-source program written in Python and dissect it, understanding what it does, and why. * 2. Code review* Take a member's Python code and conduct a code review *3. Dive into the internals of Python* The standard library, the GIL, etc. The Dallas-Ft. Worth Python group ( http://www.dfwpython.org/), which is very active, does this, and Jeff Rush had a talk at PyCon about how the interpreter creates bytecode. *4. Solve a problem* Find a domain and a problem and solve it with Python. Kind of like the cohpy.org project. *5. Walk through an article in Python magazine and discuss* Python Magazine (http://pymag.phparch.com/) has great practical articles every month. We could walk through the article, get the code working on our systems, and discuss. *6. Python Cookbook walk through* The Python Cookbook book from O'Reilly is filled with how-to's and examples to solve real-world problems. We could select one or two to walk through and discuss, and put into practice in example code. *7. Python Module of the Week* Doug Hellman writes a blog post every week walking through one of Python's standard modules (http://www.doughellmann.com/PyMOTW/). We could take that as a text to walk through and put into practice with example code. *8. Take an existing project and contribute together* Find an open source Python project and find an area of need or interest, and contribute *9. Forums* Create a forum so that we can talk about things and help each other outside of the meetings *10. CodeCamp/GiveCamp* Participate as a group/team to help with CodeMash (http://www.codemash.org/) or GiveCamp (http://www.columbusgivecamp.org/GiveCamp). We also talked about areas of interest in Python that we would like to learn more about: *1. Building GUIs 2. Debugging/Profiling 3. Unit Testing 4. Parsing 5. How to take and outside feed 6. Talking to external devices (USB, serial, Ethernet, etc.) * Please reply with your ideas, thoughts, and interests. Best Regards, Eric -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From ericlake at gmail.com Mon Nov 9 14:20:21 2009 From: ericlake at gmail.com (Eric Lake) Date: Mon, 9 Nov 2009 08:20:21 -0500 Subject: [CentralOH] MIT Open Courseware and Python In-Reply-To: <34f468870911081714i211cec33r907158f65a437d41@mail.gmail.com> References: <34f468870911081714i211cec33r907158f65a437d41@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <15c903070911090520h18587913x8caa2df22748f5f6@mail.gmail.com> Awesome find. Thanks for posting this Eric. I look forward to watching them all. On Sun, Nov 8, 2009 at 8:14 PM, Eric Floehr wrote: > All, > > For those learning Python, or who want a more grounded computer > science background to Python, check out this MIT course, available for > free: > > > http://ocw.mit.edu/OcwWeb/Electrical-Engineering-and-Computer-Science/6-00Fall-2008/LectureVideos/index.htm > > There are 24 video lectures, with handouts. The first several cover > the Python language. Then they go into computer science topics like > search, object orientation, encapsulation, etc. Finally, the lectures > conclude with statistics, plotting, and simulations, all in Python. > > You can watch any or all, and best of all its free. > > Best Regards, > Eric > _______________________________________________ > CentralOH mailing list > CentralOH at python.org > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/centraloh > -- Thanks, Eric Lake -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From miles.groman at gmail.com Mon Nov 9 15:14:04 2009 From: miles.groman at gmail.com (miles groman) Date: Mon, 9 Nov 2009 09:14:04 -0500 Subject: [CentralOH] Learning and Growing with Python In-Reply-To: <34f468870911090355i1c70c450s35f4dd2aad2ee3a3@mail.gmail.com> References: <34f468870911090355i1c70c450s35f4dd2aad2ee3a3@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: Eric, I think going over "The Python way to do _______" every meeting would be beneficial. Python is simple to pick up, but doing things the "Python" way is not always as clear. Sometimes I will ask a question about some code I am working onin #python, only to find out I wasnt doing it the "pythonic" way. A bad example: my_list = [] for foo in bar: my_list.append(foo) vs. my_list = [foo for foo in bar] Things like that might not be clear to a person just starting python. I think I heard someone say something along these lines at the last meeting. Also, sorry if my formatting gets messed up in transmission. From james at atlantixeng.com Mon Nov 9 18:11:59 2009 From: james at atlantixeng.com (James - Atlantix) Date: Mon, 9 Nov 2009 12:11:59 -0500 Subject: [CentralOH] Sphinx Message-ID: <000601ca615f$c09a5e50$41cf1af0$@com> I am wondering if anyone has experience documenting a Python project with Sphinx? If so, would they be willing to do a sprint at the next meeting? Thanks, ================= James Bonanno, PE Atlantix Engineering -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From catherine.devlin at gmail.com Mon Nov 9 20:03:23 2009 From: catherine.devlin at gmail.com (Catherine Devlin) Date: Mon, 9 Nov 2009 14:03:23 -0500 Subject: [CentralOH] Sphinx In-Reply-To: <000601ca615f$c09a5e50$41cf1af0$@com> References: <000601ca615f$c09a5e50$41cf1af0$@com> Message-ID: <6523e39a0911091103v2ff10e57paec9ef070501444e@mail.gmail.com> I have - though it's the sort of Python project that really isn't intended for developer-level use (an end user uses the product overall, they don't import the module and then invoke specific functions or classes from it). But anyway, sqlpython's docs are in Sphinx: http://pypi.python.org/pypi/sqlpython Can you explain what you mean by a sprint in this context? (I only know sprints as code-writing exercises, and I assume you don't mean we should write new code for Sphinx...) On Mon, Nov 9, 2009 at 12:11 PM, James - Atlantix wrote: > I am wondering if anyone has experience documenting a Python project with > Sphinx? If so, would they be willing to do a sprint at the next meeting? > > > Thanks, > > > > ================= > > James Bonanno, PE > > Atlantix Engineering > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > CentralOH mailing list > CentralOH at python.org > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/centraloh > > -- - Catherine http://catherinedevlin.blogspot.com/ *** PyCon * Feb 17-25, 2010 * Atlanta, GA * us.pycon.org *** -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From james at atlantixeng.com Mon Nov 9 20:11:50 2009 From: james at atlantixeng.com (James - Atlantix) Date: Mon, 9 Nov 2009 14:11:50 -0500 Subject: [CentralOH] Sphinx In-Reply-To: <6523e39a0911091103v2ff10e57paec9ef070501444e@mail.gmail.com> References: <000601ca615f$c09a5e50$41cf1af0$@com> <6523e39a0911091103v2ff10e57paec9ef070501444e@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <001601ca6170$7e144710$7a3cd530$@com> I am just basically looking at how to use Sphinx to document a Python project . . . so that others at my company can use modules I develop. Perhaps I should have used something different than sprint. . . a walkthrough on using Sphinx. I have read articles, but they are a bit large on information. Thanks, James From: Catherine Devlin [mailto:catherine.devlin at gmail.com] Sent: Monday, November 09, 2009 2:03 PM To: James - Atlantix Cc: centraloh at python.org Subject: Re: [CentralOH] Sphinx I have - though it's the sort of Python project that really isn't intended for developer-level use (an end user uses the product overall, they don't import the module and then invoke specific functions or classes from it). But anyway, sqlpython's docs are in Sphinx: http://pypi.python.org/pypi/sqlpython Can you explain what you mean by a sprint in this context? (I only know sprints as code-writing exercises, and I assume you don't mean we should write new code for Sphinx...) On Mon, Nov 9, 2009 at 12:11 PM, James - Atlantix wrote: I am wondering if anyone has experience documenting a Python project with Sphinx? If so, would they be willing to do a sprint at the next meeting? Thanks, James -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From yungyuc at gmail.com Mon Nov 9 20:24:23 2009 From: yungyuc at gmail.com (Yung-Yu Chen) Date: Mon, 9 Nov 2009 14:24:23 -0500 Subject: [CentralOH] Sphinx In-Reply-To: <001601ca6170$7e144710$7a3cd530$@com> References: <000601ca615f$c09a5e50$41cf1af0$@com> <6523e39a0911091103v2ff10e57paec9ef070501444e@mail.gmail.com> <001601ca6170$7e144710$7a3cd530$@com> Message-ID: <423e92430911091124l5c8d81cegefe59c4cfafc38db@mail.gmail.com> On Mon, Nov 9, 2009 at 14:11, James - Atlantix wrote: > I am just basically looking at how to use Sphinx to document a Python > project . . . so that others at my company can use modules I develop. > Perhaps I should have used something different than sprint. . . a > walkthrough on using Sphinx. I have read articles, but they are a bit large > on information. > > > For internal projects, I usually prefer to write API doc using epydoc rather than write book-style documentation with sphinx. Full-fledged documentation is too heavy-weight to my projects, and readers are too limited. API doc is more suitable to my need. Just my 2 cents. with regards, Yung-Yu Chen > Thanks, > > > > James > > > > *From:* Catherine Devlin [mailto:catherine.devlin at gmail.com] > *Sent:* Monday, November 09, 2009 2:03 PM > *To:* James - Atlantix > *Cc:* centraloh at python.org > *Subject:* Re: [CentralOH] Sphinx > > > > I have - though it's the sort of Python project that really isn't intended > for developer-level use (an end user uses the product overall, they don't > import the module and then invoke specific functions or classes from it). > But anyway, sqlpython's docs are in Sphinx: > http://pypi.python.org/pypi/sqlpython > > Can you explain what you mean by a sprint in this context? (I only know > sprints as code-writing exercises, and I assume you don't mean we should > write new code for Sphinx...) > > On Mon, Nov 9, 2009 at 12:11 PM, James - Atlantix > wrote: > > I am wondering if anyone has experience documenting a Python project with > Sphinx? If so, would they be willing to do a sprint at the next meeting? > > > Thanks, > > James > > _______________________________________________ > CentralOH mailing list > CentralOH at python.org > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/centraloh > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From catherine.devlin at gmail.com Mon Nov 9 20:47:27 2009 From: catherine.devlin at gmail.com (Catherine Devlin) Date: Mon, 9 Nov 2009 14:47:27 -0500 Subject: [CentralOH] Sphinx In-Reply-To: <001601ca6170$7e144710$7a3cd530$@com> References: <000601ca615f$c09a5e50$41cf1af0$@com> <6523e39a0911091103v2ff10e57paec9ef070501444e@mail.gmail.com> <001601ca6170$7e144710$7a3cd530$@com> Message-ID: <6523e39a0911091147p4f36019apadd1c8908395e73a@mail.gmail.com> On Mon, Nov 9, 2009 at 2:11 PM, James - Atlantix wrote: > I am just basically looking at how to use Sphinx to document a Python > project . . . so that others at my company can use modules I develop. > Perhaps I should have used something different than sprint. . . a > walkthrough on using Sphinx. I have read articles, but they are a bit large > on information. > I'd be happy to lead something like that. Eric, when's the next empty topic slot? (Or we could plan to do something short after the evening's primary presentation.) -- - Catherine http://catherinedevlin.blogspot.com/ *** PyCon * Feb 17-25, 2010 * Atlanta, GA * us.pycon.org *** -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From james at atlantixeng.com Mon Nov 9 21:19:10 2009 From: james at atlantixeng.com (James - Atlantix) Date: Mon, 9 Nov 2009 15:19:10 -0500 Subject: [CentralOH] Sphinx In-Reply-To: <6523e39a0911091147p4f36019apadd1c8908395e73a@mail.gmail.com> References: <000601ca615f$c09a5e50$41cf1af0$@com> <6523e39a0911091103v2ff10e57paec9ef070501444e@mail.gmail.com> <001601ca6170$7e144710$7a3cd530$@com> <6523e39a0911091147p4f36019apadd1c8908395e73a@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <002701ca6179$e6511110$b2f33330$@com> That would be great. I was inspired to lean Sphinx from a recent Python magazine article. I like the structured text approach. . . . James From: Catherine Devlin [mailto:catherine.devlin at gmail.com] Sent: Monday, November 09, 2009 2:47 PM To: James - Atlantix Cc: centraloh at python.org Subject: Re: [CentralOH] Sphinx On Mon, Nov 9, 2009 at 2:11 PM, James - Atlantix wrote: I am just basically looking at how to use Sphinx to document a Python project . . . so that others at my company can use modules I develop. Perhaps I should have used something different than sprint. . . a walkthrough on using Sphinx. I have read articles, but they are a bit large on information. I'd be happy to lead something like that. Eric, when's the next empty topic slot? (Or we could plan to do something short after the evening's primary presentation.) -- - Catherine http://catherinedevlin.blogspot.com/ *** PyCon * Feb 17-25, 2010 * Atlanta, GA * us.pycon.org *** -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From bryan.harris at udri.udayton.edu Tue Nov 10 19:49:57 2009 From: bryan.harris at udri.udayton.edu (Bryan Harris) Date: Tue, 10 Nov 2009 13:49:57 -0500 Subject: [CentralOH] Python IDE Message-ID: <200911101349.58283.bryan.harris@udri.udayton.edu> Hi all, What editors do people on here prefer? I use a combination of vi and gedit, but sometimes I yearn for the intelligent auto-completion which I get in an IDE like eclipse with Java. (Eclipse pydev is so slow it's completely unusable.) Is WingIDE worth getting for this reason? Thanks, Bryan -- Bryan Harris Research Engineer Structures and Materials Evaluation Group http://www.udri.udayton.edu/ -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From steven_h at acm.org Tue Nov 10 20:28:09 2009 From: steven_h at acm.org (Steven Huwig) Date: Tue, 10 Nov 2009 14:28:09 -0500 Subject: [CentralOH] Python IDE In-Reply-To: <200911101349.58283.bryan.harris@udri.udayton.edu> References: <200911101349.58283.bryan.harris@udri.udayton.edu> Message-ID: <7505f2a60911101128k39ddf1fdya834628b2b1dac63@mail.gmail.com> On Tue, Nov 10, 2009 at 1:49 PM, Bryan Harris wrote: > > Hi all, > What editors do people on here prefer? I use a combination of vi and gedit, but sometimes I yearn for the intelligent auto-completion which I get in an IDE like eclipse with Java. (Eclipse pydev is so slow it's completely unusable.) Is WingIDE worth getting for this reason? > Thanks, > Bryan The python-mode included with Emacs 22+ handles Python completion and documentation, at least as far as module contents and docstrings go. You might also consider using ipython. -- Steve From miles.groman at gmail.com Tue Nov 10 20:28:19 2009 From: miles.groman at gmail.com (miles groman) Date: Tue, 10 Nov 2009 14:28:19 -0500 Subject: [CentralOH] Python IDE In-Reply-To: <200911101349.58283.bryan.harris@udri.udayton.edu> References: <200911101349.58283.bryan.harris@udri.udayton.edu> Message-ID: vim and a python console for me On Tue, Nov 10, 2009 at 1:49 PM, Bryan Harris wrote: > Hi all, > What editors do people on here prefer? I use a combination of vi and gedit, > but sometimes I yearn for the intelligent auto-completion which I get in an > IDE like eclipse with Java. (Eclipse pydev is so slow it's completely > unusable.) Is WingIDE worth getting for this reason? > Thanks, > Bryan > -- > Bryan Harris > Research Engineer > Structures and Materials Evaluation Group > http://www.udri.udayton.edu/ > > > _______________________________________________ > CentralOH mailing list > CentralOH at python.org > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/centraloh > > From eric at intellovations.com Tue Nov 10 20:49:52 2009 From: eric at intellovations.com (Eric Floehr) Date: Tue, 10 Nov 2009 14:49:52 -0500 Subject: [CentralOH] Python IDE In-Reply-To: <200911101349.58283.bryan.harris@udri.udayton.edu> References: <200911101349.58283.bryan.harris@udri.udayton.edu> Message-ID: <34f468870911101149n520b2f7dmc99e0aaeea970ea@mail.gmail.com> I've used full-function IDEs from MS Visual Studio to JBuilder to now Eclipse to manage large C++ and Java projects (tens to hundreds of thousands of lines of code, and hundreds of source files) over the last 10-15 years. For me, for my large Python projects, WingIDE has been very useful to me. Source code completion (even into libraries), pull up instance docs on the method, etc. and in-place debugging are all things I've just gotten used to. So for me, WingIDE is worth it for my productivity. I've used it for several years. I still use text editors for little stuff...emacs or vi, even gedit on GNOME, as needed, but for projects, I use WingIDE. (I have a 50% discount code good until the end of the month if you do go with WingIDE...Stephan of WingWare offered it to our new Python User's Group, I don't get anything from it...just email me). Best Regards, Eric On Tue, Nov 10, 2009 at 1:49 PM, Bryan Harris wrote: > Hi all, > What editors do people on here prefer? I use a combination of vi and gedit, > but sometimes I yearn for the intelligent auto-completion which I get in an > IDE like eclipse with Java. (Eclipse pydev is so slow it's completely > unusable.) Is WingIDE worth getting for this reason? > Thanks, > Bryan > -- > Bryan Harris > Research Engineer > Structures and Materials Evaluation Group > http://www.udri.udayton.edu/ > > > > _______________________________________________ > CentralOH mailing list > CentralOH at python.org > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/centraloh > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From nick.albright at gmail.com Tue Nov 10 20:50:20 2009 From: nick.albright at gmail.com (Nick Albright) Date: Tue, 10 Nov 2009 14:50:20 -0500 Subject: [CentralOH] Oct Meeting Website Notes In-Reply-To: <7ec143010911011255x37b9b71p6613e5ba59b8aa9a@mail.gmail.com> References: <7ec143010911011248m116cf471g36ff509311b864ff@mail.gmail.com> <7ec143010911011255x37b9b71p6613e5ba59b8aa9a@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <7ec143010911101150k45b7ef9awb8fcdf98a9ccfbbb@mail.gmail.com> Hey Folks! I ran into some technical problems getting started with google app engine, but fixed those last night, so should be able to continue on this side of things. This Sat I should be able to make some progress on the app engine side of things. :) Also, please speak up on what you'd like for the first 3 features for the website! = ) Thanks, -Nick On Sun, Nov 1, 2009 at 3:55 PM, Nick Albright wrote: > Quick Correction, for the last bit, that should be "Google App Engine" and > not "Googe Apps". = ) > -Nick "has #gonegoogle" ;) > > > On Sun, Nov 1, 2009 at 3:48 PM, Nick Albright wrote: > >> Hello Folks! >> >> So here are the notes from the website portion of the Oct Meeting! >> >> >> *Website Objectives >> *Connect with others who use python >> Increase python knowledge >> >> >> *Website Features* >> Upcoming Events >> (Model after "Full Year Calendar" Yahoo widget) >> Sponsors >> Sponsor for next meeting could be at the top (Reward continue doing) >> Previous sponsors listed next >> Meeting notes >> Meeting videos/pictures >> >> Members to submit and vote on meeting talks >> Website Suggestions >> Book List >> We could do a lending interface as a project here >> >> Links to other python groups >> User Pages >> List of their projects >> Member list >> Latest Updates on the website >> Enticements to join the website/membership benefits >> Interface for 'admin' users to post to twitter account >> >> Way to communicate/ask questions on code/code review >> Forum >> Wiki >> Blog >> Python Tutorials! (People love!) >> Example code (Should be working/complete) >> Monthly Top 10 Factiods (My handwriting is a bit tough here, I think that >> is right = ) >> Podcasts >> List of Local Companies that use python and are hiring >> >> >> *Website Framework >> *We talked about using Google Apps as the place to host, since it is so >> closely tied to django and is a great price. And using Bitbucket as the >> repository. >> >> We are shooting for at a minimum have the framework setup by the next >> meeting and ready for a possible sprint. And with any luck, perhaps stuff >> done by then and a possible sprint. >> >> Any concerns on going with Google Apps and Bitbucket? >> >> >> *Action Items* >> 1) Setup Google Apps/see how well it works - I'd be willing to get this >> done in the next week >> 2) Determine what features to implement first! >> >> I hope people have made it this far! = ) The question is, what are the >> top 3 features you'd like to see implemented on the website first? >> >> Thanks Everyone! :) >> -Nick >> >> -- >> >> P.S. Any spelling mistakes are not those of the author, as he can't spell. >> > > > > > -- > > In theory, there is no difference between theory and practice; In practice, > there is. -- "It is better to be kind than right." -- Unknown (Heard from my Mom :) -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From bryan.harris at udri.udayton.edu Tue Nov 10 21:10:09 2009 From: bryan.harris at udri.udayton.edu (Bryan Harris) Date: Tue, 10 Nov 2009 15:10:09 -0500 Subject: [CentralOH] Threading benchmarks - Results Message-ID: <200911101510.09789.bryan.harris@udri.udayton.edu> Hi all, I got some good feedback on my multi-threading question and was able to get some useful benchmarks. I ran these on a 2 CPU Xeon server, a quad core Phenom, and a single core Phenom. I have attached the results along with the programs so you should be able to reproduce if you wish. However, I can summarize a few points below: 1. The threading library does not help for cpu-bound applications. The threading library got slower for any number of threads >1 and then stayed pretty much constant on both the 2 core and the 4 core machine. 2. The newer processing library works the same or better than the threading library in all cases. I was able to get almost full utilization of both cores on the Xeon system. The opteron was busy transcoding my wife's soap opera, a process I dared not interrupt. However, the opteron tests confirmed that the processing library did reduce the run time despite competition from other cpu- hungry applications. Real time was reduced by almost half on the Xeon system with threads >1 and then stayed roughly constant as the number of threads increased. Interestingly, real time increased slightly with threads on the 4 core opteron. I attribute this to competition from mythcommflag and not process overhead, but will need to verify later. 3. (An obvious one I should have remembered from my ECE courses.) The print (just as with printf) function is terribly slow and masked some of the results from before. This was removed as recommended and increased performance. 4. Perhaps most interestingly, the threading library significantly hurt performance for threads > 1 on a multicore machine but not on a single core machine. Thanks for the feedback, Bryan -- Bryan Harris Research Engineer Structures and Materials Evaluation Group bryan.harris at udri.udayton.edu http://www.udri.udayton.edu/ -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- First Run: Dual Physical CPU - Intel(R) Xeon(TM) CPU 2.40GHz total=$(( 2 ** 16 ));threads=1;while [[ $threads -lt 128 ]]; do repeats=$(( total / threads )); echo threading $threads threads $repeats repeats; time ./mt.py $threads $repeats >mt$threads.log; threads=$(( $threads * 2 )); done threading 1 threads 65536 repeats real 0m9.119s user 0m8.405s sys 0m0.712s threading 2 threads 32768 repeats real 0m11.878s user 0m8.389s sys 0m3.788s threading 4 threads 16384 repeats real 0m11.485s user 0m9.701s sys 0m3.484s threading 8 threads 8192 repeats real 0m11.045s user 0m9.165s sys 0m2.828s threading 16 threads 4096 repeats real 0m10.980s user 0m9.189s sys 0m2.712s threading 32 threads 2048 repeats real 0m11.146s user 0m9.393s sys 0m2.788s threading 64 threads 1024 repeats real 0m11.230s user 0m9.321s sys 0m2.980s total=$(( 2 ** 16 ));threads=1;while [[ $threads -lt 128 ]]; do repeats=$(( total / threads )); echo -n processing $threads threads $repeats repeats; time ./mp.py $threads $repeats >mp$threads.log; threads=$(( $threads * 2 )); done processing 1 threads 65536 repeats real 0m9.088s user 0m8.553s sys 0m0.512s processing 2 threads 32768 repeats real 0m5.122s user 0m8.861s sys 0m0.940s processing 4 threads 16384 repeats real 0m5.282s user 0m9.821s sys 0m0.648s processing 8 threads 8192 repeats real 0m4.571s user 0m8.357s sys 0m0.656s processing 16 threads 4096 repeats real 0m4.592s user 0m8.357s sys 0m0.736s processing 32 threads 2048 repeats real 0m5.014s user 0m9.005s sys 0m0.892s processing 64 threads 1024 repeats real 0m4.639s user 0m8.289s sys 0m0.852s Run 2: total=$(( 2 ** 18 ));threads=1;while [[ $threads -lt 257 ]]; do repeats=$(( total / threads )); echo -n threading $threads threads $repeats repeats; time ./mt.py $threads $repeats >mt$threads.log; threads=$(( $threads * 2 )); done threading 1 threads 262144 repeats real 0m35.760s user 0m33.738s sys 0m1.980s threading 2 threads 131072 repeats real 0m47.518s user 0m38.466s sys 0m15.277s threading 4 threads 65536 repeats real 0m46.009s user 0m36.322s sys 0m14.201s threading 8 threads 32768 repeats real 0m44.785s user 0m35.706s sys 0m12.521s threading 16 threads 16384 repeats real 0m44.470s user 0m37.074s sys 0m11.521s threading 32 threads 8192 repeats real 0m44.572s user 0m36.998s sys 0m11.225s threading 64 threads 4096 repeats real 0m44.349s user 0m37.518s sys 0m11.105s threading 128 threads 2048 repeats real 0m44.861s user 0m37.558s sys 0m11.377s threading 256 threads 1024 repeats real 0m45.165s user 0m38.122s sys 0m11.381s total=$(( 2 ** 18 ));threads=1;while [[ $threads -lt 257 ]]; do repeats=$(( total / threads )); echo -n processing $threads threads $repeats repeats; time ./mp.py $threads $repeats >mp$threads.log; threads=$(( $threads * 2 )); done processing 1 threads 262144 repeats real 0m34.568s user 0m32.498s sys 0m2.064s processing 2 threads 131072 repeats real 0m18.715s user 0m33.770s sys 0m3.032s processing 4 threads 65536 repeats real 0m17.994s user 0m33.358s sys 0m2.488s processing 8 threads 32768 repeats real 0m17.991s user 0m33.298s sys 0m2.536s processing 16 threads 16384 repeats real 0m17.993s user 0m33.002s sys 0m2.844s processing 32 threads 8192 repeats real 0m19.022s user 0m34.786s sys 0m3.044s processing 64 threads 4096 repeats real 0m18.731s user 0m34.406s sys 0m2.892s processing 128 threads 2048 repeats real 0m19.346s user 0m35.202s sys 0m3.296s processing 256 threads 1024 repeats real 0m18.668s user 0m33.490s sys 0m3.624s Run 3: AMD Phenom(tm) 9600 Quad-Core Processor (Competing with 2 mythcommflag processes) total=$(( 2 ** 18 ));threads=1;while [[ $threads -lt 257 ]]; do repeats=$(( total / threads )); echo threading $threads threads $repeats repeats; time ./mt.py $threads $repeats >mt$threads.log; threads=$(( $threads * 2 )); done threading 1 threads 262144 repeats real 0m18.139s user 0m16.993s sys 0m0.796s threading 2 threads 131072 repeats real 0m46.050s user 0m36.606s sys 0m13.785s threading 4 threads 65536 repeats real 0m44.709s user 0m35.174s sys 0m9.401s threading 8 threads 32768 repeats real 0m53.652s user 0m35.378s sys 0m8.573s threading 16 threads 16384 repeats real 0m55.168s user 0m35.638s sys 0m8.041s threading 32 threads 8192 repeats real 1m1.495s user 0m35.430s sys 0m7.300s threading 64 threads 4096 repeats real 0m52.198s user 0m35.298s sys 0m7.896s threading 128 threads 2048 repeats real 1m1.661s user 0m35.478s sys 0m8.301s threading 256 threads 1024 repeats real 1m1.717s user 0m34.670s sys 0m9.041s total=$(( 2 ** 18 ));threads=1;while [[ $threads -lt 257 ]]; do repeats=$(( total / threads )); echo processing $threads threads $repeats repeats; time ./mp.py $threads $repeats >mp$threads.log; threads=$(( $threads * 2 )); done processing 1 threads 262144 repeats real 0m17.797s user 0m16.773s sys 0m0.796s processing 2 threads 131072 repeats real 0m10.568s user 0m16.973s sys 0m1.072s processing 4 threads 65536 repeats real 0m7.582s user 0m16.565s sys 0m1.516s processing 8 threads 32768 repeats real 0m9.308s user 0m20.713s sys 0m2.096s processing 16 threads 16384 repeats real 0m9.569s user 0m19.985s sys 0m2.432s processing 32 threads 8192 repeats real 0m10.586s user 0m21.785s sys 0m3.252s processing 64 threads 4096 repeats real 0m10.937s user 0m22.705s sys 0m3.136s processing 128 threads 2048 repeats real 0m11.237s user 0m23.065s sys 0m3.700s processing 256 threads 1024 repeats real 0m12.592s user 0m25.434s sys 0m5.200s Run 4: AMD Opteron(tm) Processor 148 total=$(( 2 ** 16 ));threads=1;while [[ $threads -lt 128 ]]; do repeats=$(( total / threads )); echo threading $threads threads $repeats repeats; time ./mt.py $threads $repeats >mt$threads.log; threads=$(( $threads * 2 )); done threading 1 threads 65536 repeats real 0m6.207s user 0m5.784s sys 0m0.268s threading 2 threads 32768 repeats real 0m6.252s user 0m5.852s sys 0m0.272s threading 4 threads 16384 repeats real 0m6.348s user 0m5.944s sys 0m0.276s threading 8 threads 8192 repeats real 0m6.430s user 0m6.040s sys 0m0.276s threading 16 threads 4096 repeats real 0m6.307s user 0m5.844s sys 0m0.364s threading 32 threads 2048 repeats real 0m6.618s user 0m5.852s sys 0m0.368s threading 64 threads 1024 repeats real 0m6.678s user 0m5.816s sys 0m0.428s total=$(( 2 ** 16 ));threads=1;while [[ $threads -lt 128 ]]; do repeats=$(( total / threads )); echo processing $threads threads $repeats repeats; time ./mp.py $threads $repeats >mp$threads.log; threads=$(( $threads * 2 )); done processing 1 threads 65536 repeats real 0m6.379s user 0m5.908s sys 0m0.284s processing 2 threads 32768 repeats real 0m6.358s user 0m5.960s sys 0m0.276s processing 4 threads 16384 repeats real 0m6.039s user 0m5.612s sys 0m0.328s processing 8 threads 8192 repeats real 0m6.502s user 0m6.108s sys 0m0.272s processing 16 threads 4096 repeats real 0m6.260s user 0m5.792s sys 0m0.352s processing 32 threads 2048 repeats real 0m6.693s user 0m5.964s sys 0m0.336s processing 64 threads 1024 repeats real 0m6.777s user 0m5.988s sys 0m0.340s -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: mt.py Type: text/x-python Size: 886 bytes Desc: not available URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: mp.py Type: text/x-python Size: 910 bytes Desc: not available URL: From s7plc at ttlc.net Tue Nov 10 20:44:59 2009 From: s7plc at ttlc.net (Carl Mezger) Date: Tue, 10 Nov 2009 14:44:59 -0500 Subject: [CentralOH] Python IDE In-Reply-To: <200911101349.58283.bryan.harris@udri.udayton.edu> Message-ID: <00ab01ca623e$4a55ecc0$3adc7dad@XPSNEW> I use SPE when I need to test something quickly (although you could use it for real development) and Eclipse for everything else (I program in Jython mainly, and Eclipse seems to be the best IDE for that). -----Original Message----- From: centraloh-bounces+s7plc=ttlc.net at python.org [mailto:centraloh-bounces+s7plc=ttlc.net at python.org] On Behalf Of Bryan Harris Sent: 10 November 2009 1:50 To: centraloh Subject: [CentralOH] Python IDE Hi all, What editors do people on here prefer? I use a combination of vi and gedit, but sometimes I yearn for the intelligent auto-completion which I get in an IDE like eclipse with Java. (Eclipse pydev is so slow it's completely unusable.) Is WingIDE worth getting for this reason? Thanks, Bryan -- Bryan Harris Research Engineer Structures and Materials Evaluation Group http://www.udri.udayton.edu/ -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From scott.scites at railcar88.com Wed Nov 11 00:27:29 2009 From: scott.scites at railcar88.com (Scott Scites) Date: Tue, 10 Nov 2009 18:27:29 -0500 Subject: [CentralOH] Python IDE Message-ID: <8afa282d0911101527h29189c3rba3c815b609f5ef5@mail.gmail.com> I use VIM with an assortment of VIM scripts for Python development. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From scott.scites at railcar88.com Wed Nov 11 00:34:16 2009 From: scott.scites at railcar88.com (Scott Scites) Date: Tue, 10 Nov 2009 18:34:16 -0500 Subject: [CentralOH] Oct Meeting Website Notes Message-ID: <8afa282d0911101534t422d4cc5k771029ab27ff44a0@mail.gmail.com> It's good to know you've made progress with the cohpy web site. When will the code be up on bitbucket? Let me know if you need any assistance. I vote for these three features: *Upcoming Events *>>* (Model after "Full Year Calendar" Yahoo widget) *>>* Sponsors *>>* Sponsor for next meeting could be at the top (Reward continue doing) *>>* Previous sponsors listed next **>> Enticements to join the website/membership benefits * -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From andrewwatts at gmail.com Wed Nov 11 01:36:40 2009 From: andrewwatts at gmail.com (Andrew Watts) Date: Tue, 10 Nov 2009 19:36:40 -0500 Subject: [CentralOH] Python IDE In-Reply-To: <200911101349.58283.bryan.harris@udri.udayton.edu> References: <200911101349.58283.bryan.harris@udri.udayton.edu> Message-ID: <3AAF6736-46FC-416E-8FDB-8EF3B6CBDEA9@gmail.com> For large projects I use eclipse, for small vi or TextMate, and I also do a lot with ipython and then copy/paste to an editor. I like eclipse not necessarily because of pydev, but because of all the additional plugins available in the eclipse community. Any given day I might be editing python, javascript, sql, html, c, xml, etc... and having nice (but by no means perfect) plugins for each within a single ide workspace is a benefit to me. Re: pydev, if you haven't tried pydev 1.5 (released in september), it's a very nice upgrade that now includes pydev extensions. I haven't noticed any slowness with auto-completion eclipse/pydev, but, in the past I've found eclipse is not tuned very well out of the box. I typically increase the memory allocated to the vm and in the past I've customized garbage collection, although I haven't had to do it with Eclipse 3.5 and Java 6. HTH On Nov 10, 2009, at 1:49 PM, Bryan Harris wrote: > Hi all, > What editors do people on here prefer? I use a combination of vi and gedit, but sometimes I yearn for the intelligent auto-completion which I get in an IDE like eclipse with Java. (Eclipse pydev is so slow it's completely unusable.) Is WingIDE worth getting for this reason? > Thanks, > Bryan > -- > Bryan Harris > Research Engineer > Structures and Materials Evaluation Group > http://www.udri.udayton.edu/ > > _______________________________________________ > CentralOH mailing list > CentralOH at python.org > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/centraloh From rtfm at columbus.rr.com Wed Nov 11 02:30:43 2009 From: rtfm at columbus.rr.com (Mike Schoenborn) Date: Tue, 10 Nov 2009 20:30:43 -0500 Subject: [CentralOH] MIT Open Courseware and Python In-Reply-To: <34f468870911081714i211cec33r907158f65a437d41@mail.gmail.com> References: <34f468870911081714i211cec33r907158f65a437d41@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <1257903043.17606.16.camel@egg> On Sun, 2009-11-08 at 20:14 -0500, Eric Floehr wrote: > For those learning Python... There are 24 video lectures, with handouts. For any other pack-rats out there who perfer to download such presentations for off-line consumption, let me save you 10 minutes of pointy and clicky URL grabbing: Here's a list of the MIT course content to chop up and feed to wget or curl. # Links current as of Nov 10, 2009 # http://ocw.mit.edu/OcwWeb/Electrical-Engineering-and-Computer-Science/6-00Fall-2008/LectureVideos/index.htm # 1 Goals of the course; what is computation; introduction to data types, operators, and variables # 2 Operators and operands; statements; branching, conditionals, and iteration # 3 Common code patterns: iterative programs # 4 Decomposition and abstraction through functions; introduction to recursion # 5 Floating point numbers, successive refinement, finding roots # 6 Bisection methods, Newton/Raphson, introduction to lists # 7 Lists and mutability, dictionaries, pseudocode, introduction to efficiency # 8 Complexity; log, linear, quadratic, exponential algorithms # 9 Binary search, bubble and selection sorts # 10 Divide and conquer methods, merge sort, exceptions # 11 Testing and debugging # 12 More about debugging, knapsack problem, introduction to dynamic programming # 13 Dynamic programming: overlapping subproblems, optimal substructure # 14 Analysis of knapsack problem, introduction to object-oriented programming # 15 Abstract data types, classes and methods # 16 Encapsulation, inheritance, shadowing # 17 Computational models: random walk simulation # 18 Presenting simulation results, Pylab, plotting # 19 Biased random walks, distributions # 20 Monte Carlo simulations, estimating pi # 21 Validating simulation results, curve fitting, linear regression # 22 Normal, uniform, and exponential distributions; misuse of statistics # 23 Stock market simulation # 24 Course overview; what do computer scientists do? # Videos - Generally 100+MB each. http://www.archive.org/download/MIT6.00F08/mit-6-00-f08-lec01_300k.mp4 http://www.archive.org/download/MIT6.00F08/mit-6-00-f08-lec02_300k.mp4 http://www.archive.org/download/MIT6.00F08/mit-6-00-f08-lec03_300k.mp4 http://www.archive.org/download/MIT6.00F08/mit-6-00-f08-lec04_300k.mp4 http://www.archive.org/download/MIT6.00F08/mit-6-00-f08-lec05_300k.mp4 http://www.archive.org/download/MIT6.00F08/mit-6-00-f08-lec06_300k.mp4 http://www.archive.org/download/MIT6.00F08/mit-6-00-f08-lec07_300k.mp4 http://www.archive.org/download/MIT6.00F08/mit-6-00-f08-lec08_300k.mp4 http://www.archive.org/download/MIT6.00F08/mit-6-00-f08-lec09_300k.mp4 http://www.archive.org/download/MIT6.00F08/mit-6-00-f08-lec10_300k.mp4 http://www.archive.org/download/MIT6.00F08/mit-6-00-f08-lec11_300k.mp4 http://www.archive.org/download/MIT6.00F08/mit-6-00-f08-lec12_300k.mp4 http://www.archive.org/download/MIT6.00F08/mit-6-00-f08-lec13_300k.mp4 http://www.archive.org/download/MIT6.00F08/mit-6-00-f08-lec14_300k.mp4 http://www.archive.org/download/MIT6.00F08/mit-6-00-f08-lec15_300k.mp4 http://www.archive.org/download/MIT6.00F08/mit-6-00-f08-lec16_300k.mp4 http://www.archive.org/download/MIT6.00F08/mit-6-00-f08-lec17_300k.mp4 http://www.archive.org/download/MIT6.00F08/mit-6-00-f08-lec18_300k.mp4 http://www.archive.org/download/MIT6.00F08/mit-6-00-f08-lec19_300k.mp4 http://www.archive.org/download/MIT6.00F08/mit-6-00-f08-lec20_300k.mp4 http://www.archive.org/download/MIT6.00F08/mit-6-00-f08-lec21_300k.mp4 http://www.archive.org/download/MIT6.00F08/mit-6-00-f08-lec22_300k.mp4 http://www.archive.org/download/MIT6.00F08/mit-6-00-f08-lec23_300k.mp4 http://www.archive.org/download/MIT6.00F08/mit-6-00-f08-lec24_300k.mp4 # Resources - Handouts (no handouts for lecture #1) http://ocw.mit.edu/NR/rdonlyres/Electrical-Engineering-and-Computer-Science/6-00Fall-2008/A480F462-38B1-49C8-A74A-BA58E04A70F5/0/lec2.pdf http://ocw.mit.edu/NR/rdonlyres/Electrical-Engineering-and-Computer-Science/6-00Fall-2008/C5D5F49E-CB49-4DE2-85E7-E821A97E2116/0/lec3.pdf http://ocw.mit.edu/NR/rdonlyres/Electrical-Engineering-and-Computer-Science/6-00Fall-2008/262D8F80-0AA9-4100-8D75-CC7673E18DCF/0/lec4.pdf http://ocw.mit.edu/NR/rdonlyres/Electrical-Engineering-and-Computer-Science/6-00Fall-2008/21D1F076-E598-499C-8E04-B1EF9F879FC6/0/lec5.pdf http://ocw.mit.edu/NR/rdonlyres/Electrical-Engineering-and-Computer-Science/6-00Fall-2008/0A5B6FD8-BB6E-4054-A513-BC8D694D9AD4/0/lec6.pdf http://ocw.mit.edu/NR/rdonlyres/Electrical-Engineering-and-Computer-Science/6-00Fall-2008/60A4B3EF-57EB-4D56-949F-880F77E74F63/0/lec7.pdf http://ocw.mit.edu/NR/rdonlyres/Electrical-Engineering-and-Computer-Science/6-00Fall-2008/125511D7-E06A-4D45-9596-5733AFC354A5/0/lec8.pdf http://ocw.mit.edu/NR/rdonlyres/Electrical-Engineering-and-Computer-Science/6-00Fall-2008/5D18F875-D7AE-4E9F-BE7D-4AA530ABF2D3/0/lec9.pdf http://ocw.mit.edu/NR/rdonlyres/Electrical-Engineering-and-Computer-Science/6-00Fall-2008/C0BCC687-8895-4D34-8F3D-7E556D2FEE81/0/lec10.pdf http://ocw.mit.edu/NR/rdonlyres/Electrical-Engineering-and-Computer-Science/6-00Fall-2008/1D3414AC-AA5F-4E76-8D7C-CFCBEC37313F/0/lec11.pdf http://ocw.mit.edu/NR/rdonlyres/Electrical-Engineering-and-Computer-Science/6-00Fall-2008/AB899716-0C88-49C2-88A0-4940AA9D2D06/0/lec12.pdf http://ocw.mit.edu/NR/rdonlyres/Electrical-Engineering-and-Computer-Science/6-00Fall-2008/8649CB15-EE82-444B-8DEA-BFBD51929440/0/lec13.pdf http://ocw.mit.edu/NR/rdonlyres/Electrical-Engineering-and-Computer-Science/6-00Fall-2008/F36C395F-F0E5-4844-A258-38F1FC931C2D/0/lec14.pdf http://ocw.mit.edu/NR/rdonlyres/Electrical-Engineering-and-Computer-Science/6-00Fall-2008/A943B22E-C41A-4B69-BA69-28692AEA8A18/0/lec15.pdf http://ocw.mit.edu/NR/rdonlyres/Electrical-Engineering-and-Computer-Science/6-00Fall-2008/E4B35D9A-29E1-47A3-97A1-262A5B802FDF/0/lec16.pdf http://ocw.mit.edu/NR/rdonlyres/Electrical-Engineering-and-Computer-Science/6-00Fall-2008/D0A277D1-4B89-45F9-9129-A3DD016EC2CF/0/lec17.pdf http://ocw.mit.edu/NR/rdonlyres/Electrical-Engineering-and-Computer-Science/6-00Fall-2008/9404574A-905E-4250-9041-E7CF54614173/0/lec18.pdf http://ocw.mit.edu/NR/rdonlyres/Electrical-Engineering-and-Computer-Science/6-00Fall-2008/326EEEFE-EBB0-4267-B843-C9F9B6EF9862/0/lec19.pdf http://ocw.mit.edu/NR/rdonlyres/Electrical-Engineering-and-Computer-Science/6-00Fall-2008/4BBD8904-A01A-4ED0-818B-DAFE75320DC9/0/lec20.pdf http://ocw.mit.edu/NR/rdonlyres/Electrical-Engineering-and-Computer-Science/6-00Fall-2008/D8DA2FDD-4E16-479E-8230-CCA05752AE5E/0/lec21.pdf http://ocw.mit.edu/NR/rdonlyres/Electrical-Engineering-and-Computer-Science/6-00Fall-2008/CC03C066-29D1-4A40-A7E5-D12265D7F6A8/0/lec22.pdf http://ocw.mit.edu/NR/rdonlyres/Electrical-Engineering-and-Computer-Science/6-00Fall-2008/96F42CB8-8BAA-44D6-AF75-A7451D75C3A5/0/lec23.pdf http://ocw.mit.edu/NR/rdonlyres/Electrical-Engineering-and-Computer-Science/6-00Fall-2008/AF6AB843-A647-4723-8F6D-09E69D9A80F1/0/lec24.pdf From rtfm at columbus.rr.com Wed Nov 11 02:33:41 2009 From: rtfm at columbus.rr.com (Mike Schoenborn) Date: Tue, 10 Nov 2009 20:33:41 -0500 Subject: [CentralOH] Python IDE In-Reply-To: <8afa282d0911101527h29189c3rba3c815b609f5ef5@mail.gmail.com> References: <8afa282d0911101527h29189c3rba3c815b609f5ef5@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <1257903221.17606.17.camel@egg> On Tue, 2009-11-10 at 18:27 -0500, Scott Scites wrote: > I use VIM with an assortment of VIM scripts for Python development. Care to share some of your favorites? From nick.albright at gmail.com Wed Nov 11 15:37:51 2009 From: nick.albright at gmail.com (Nick Albright) Date: Wed, 11 Nov 2009 09:37:51 -0500 Subject: [CentralOH] Oct Meeting Website Notes In-Reply-To: <8afa282d0911101534t422d4cc5k771029ab27ff44a0@mail.gmail.com> References: <8afa282d0911101534t422d4cc5k771029ab27ff44a0@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <7ec143010911110637o47b09f91j3dde334f7cd4c9df@mail.gmail.com> Hello Hello! = ) I plan on adding the files to bitbucket as soon as I have a working skeleton, which should hopefully be this weeekend! :) Thanks for the features vote! -Nick On Tue, Nov 10, 2009 at 6:34 PM, Scott Scites wrote: > It's good to know you've made progress with the cohpy web site. When will > the code be up on bitbucket? > > Let me know if you need any assistance. > > I vote for these three features: > > *Upcoming Events > *>>* (Model after "Full Year Calendar" Yahoo widget) > *>>* Sponsors > *>>* Sponsor for next meeting could be at the top (Reward continue doing) > *>>* Previous sponsors listed next > * > *>> Enticements to join the website/membership benefits > * > > > > _______________________________________________ > CentralOH mailing list > CentralOH at python.org > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/centraloh > > -- In theory, there is no difference between theory and practice; In practice, there is. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From james at atlantixeng.com Wed Nov 11 19:32:30 2009 From: james at atlantixeng.com (James - Atlantix) Date: Wed, 11 Nov 2009 13:32:30 -0500 Subject: [CentralOH] Sphinx In-Reply-To: <423e92430911091124l5c8d81cegefe59c4cfafc38db@mail.gmail.com> References: <000601ca615f$c09a5e50$41cf1af0$@com> <6523e39a0911091103v2ff10e57paec9ef070501444e@mail.gmail.com> <001601ca6170$7e144710$7a3cd530$@com> <423e92430911091124l5c8d81cegefe59c4cfafc38db@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <001301ca62fd$54669f60$fd33de20$@com> I found this nice quick comparison of Sphinx and Epydoc: http://www.mail-archive.com/freevo-devel at lists.sourceforge.net/msg17676.html From: Yung-Yu Chen [mailto:yungyuc at gmail.com] Sent: Monday, November 09, 2009 2:24 PM To: James - Atlantix Cc: Catherine Devlin; centraloh at python.org Subject: Re: [CentralOH] Sphinx On Mon, Nov 9, 2009 at 14:11, James - Atlantix wrote: I am just basically looking at how to use Sphinx to document a Python project . . . so that others at my company can use modules I develop. Perhaps I should have used something different than sprint. . . a walkthrough on using Sphinx. I have read articles, but they are a bit large on information. For internal projects, I usually prefer to write API doc using epydoc rather than write book-style documentation with sphinx. Full-fledged documentation is too heavy-weight to my projects, and readers are too limited. API doc is more suitable to my need. Just my 2 cents. with regards, Yung-Yu Chen Thanks, James From: Catherine Devlin [mailto:catherine.devlin at gmail.com] Sent: Monday, November 09, 2009 2:03 PM To: James - Atlantix Cc: centraloh at python.org Subject: Re: [CentralOH] Sphinx I have - though it's the sort of Python project that really isn't intended for developer-level use (an end user uses the product overall, they don't import the module and then invoke specific functions or classes from it). But anyway, sqlpython's docs are in Sphinx: http://pypi.python.org/pypi/sqlpython Can you explain what you mean by a sprint in this context? (I only know sprints as code-writing exercises, and I assume you don't mean we should write new code for Sphinx...) On Mon, Nov 9, 2009 at 12:11 PM, James - Atlantix wrote: I am wondering if anyone has experience documenting a Python project with Sphinx? If so, would they be willing to do a sprint at the next meeting? Thanks, James _______________________________________________ CentralOH mailing list CentralOH at python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/centraloh -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From james at atlantixeng.com Wed Nov 11 19:30:06 2009 From: james at atlantixeng.com (James - Atlantix) Date: Wed, 11 Nov 2009 13:30:06 -0500 Subject: [CentralOH] Sphinx In-Reply-To: <423e92430911091124l5c8d81cegefe59c4cfafc38db@mail.gmail.com> References: <000601ca615f$c09a5e50$41cf1af0$@com> <6523e39a0911091103v2ff10e57paec9ef070501444e@mail.gmail.com> <001601ca6170$7e144710$7a3cd530$@com> <423e92430911091124l5c8d81cegefe59c4cfafc38db@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <000e01ca62fc$fe79b470$fb6d1d50$@com> Yung-Yu; Thanks for the feedback. I looked at the website for epydoc and it seems somewhat straight forward to use. I notice the epydoc has variable docstrings delineated by ? #:? Can you comment on how ?cluttered? or ?clean? your Python source code is when you add all the docstrings? I am pretty strict not overburdening the source code with too much documentation. Thanks, James From: Yung-Yu Chen [mailto:yungyuc at gmail.com] Sent: Monday, November 09, 2009 2:24 PM To: James - Atlantix Cc: Catherine Devlin; centraloh at python.org Subject: Re: [CentralOH] Sphinx On Mon, Nov 9, 2009 at 14:11, James - Atlantix wrote: I am just basically looking at how to use Sphinx to document a Python project . . . so that others at my company can use modules I develop. Perhaps I should have used something different than sprint. . . a walkthrough on using Sphinx. I have read articles, but they are a bit large on information. For internal projects, I usually prefer to write API doc using epydoc rather than write book-style documentation with sphinx. Full-fledged documentation is too heavy-weight to my projects, and readers are too limited. API doc is more suitable to my need. Just my 2 cents. with regards, Yung-Yu Chen Thanks, James From: Catherine Devlin [mailto:catherine.devlin at gmail.com] Sent: Monday, November 09, 2009 2:03 PM To: James - Atlantix Cc: centraloh at python.org Subject: Re: [CentralOH] Sphinx I have - though it's the sort of Python project that really isn't intended for developer-level use (an end user uses the product overall, they don't import the module and then invoke specific functions or classes from it). But anyway, sqlpython's docs are in Sphinx: http://pypi.python.org/pypi/sqlpython Can you explain what you mean by a sprint in this context? (I only know sprints as code-writing exercises, and I assume you don't mean we should write new code for Sphinx...) On Mon, Nov 9, 2009 at 12:11 PM, James - Atlantix wrote: I am wondering if anyone has experience documenting a Python project with Sphinx? If so, would they be willing to do a sprint at the next meeting? Thanks, James _______________________________________________ CentralOH mailing list CentralOH at python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/centraloh -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From yyc at seety.org Wed Nov 11 22:19:21 2009 From: yyc at seety.org (Yung-Yu Chen) Date: Wed, 11 Nov 2009 16:19:21 -0500 Subject: [CentralOH] Sphinx In-Reply-To: <000e01ca62fc$fe79b470$fb6d1d50$@com> References: <000601ca615f$c09a5e50$41cf1af0$@com> <6523e39a0911091103v2ff10e57paec9ef070501444e@mail.gmail.com> <001601ca6170$7e144710$7a3cd530$@com> <423e92430911091124l5c8d81cegefe59c4cfafc38db@mail.gmail.com> <000e01ca62fc$fe79b470$fb6d1d50$@com> Message-ID: <423e92430911111319r6845234bv21bfc31589399eb1@mail.gmail.com> On Wed, Nov 11, 2009 at 13:30, James - Atlantix wrote: > Yung-Yu; > > > > Thanks for the feedback. I looked at the website for epydoc and it seems > somewhat straight forward to use. I notice the epydoc has variable > docstrings delineated by ? #:? > > I have never added docstrings for variables inside a function/method. I am sorry that I am not sure what do you mean by variable docstrings. With epytext (the default markup in epydoc), I usually put document for class and/or instance variables in the docstrings for the class definition. Docstrings for function/method arguments (param) and/or keywords are also useful to me. > > > Can you comment on how ?cluttered? or ?clean? your Python source code is > when you add all the docstrings? I am pretty strict not overburdening the > source code with too much documentation. > > > Since I've never put dosctrings "inside" the body of functions/methods, my source code is very clean. I guess I can have a good score in pylint :-) yyc > Thanks, > > > James > > > > *From:* Yung-Yu Chen [mailto:yungyuc at gmail.com] > *Sent:* Monday, November 09, 2009 2:24 PM > *To:* James - Atlantix > *Cc:* Catherine Devlin; centraloh at python.org > *Subject:* Re: [CentralOH] Sphinx > > > > On Mon, Nov 9, 2009 at 14:11, James - Atlantix > wrote: > > I am just basically looking at how to use Sphinx to document a Python > project . . . so that others at my company can use modules I develop. > Perhaps I should have used something different than sprint. . . a > walkthrough on using Sphinx. I have read articles, but they are a bit large > on information. > > > > > For internal projects, I usually prefer to write API doc using epydoc > rather than write book-style documentation with sphinx. Full-fledged > documentation is too heavy-weight to my projects, and readers are too > limited. API doc is more suitable to my need. > > Just my 2 cents. > > with regards, > Yung-Yu Chen > > > Thanks, > > > > James > > > > *From:* Catherine Devlin [mailto:catherine.devlin at gmail.com] > *Sent:* Monday, November 09, 2009 2:03 PM > *To:* James - Atlantix > *Cc:* centraloh at python.org > *Subject:* Re: [CentralOH] Sphinx > > > > I have - though it's the sort of Python project that really isn't intended > for developer-level use (an end user uses the product overall, they don't > import the module and then invoke specific functions or classes from it). > But anyway, sqlpython's docs are in Sphinx: > http://pypi.python.org/pypi/sqlpython > > Can you explain what you mean by a sprint in this context? (I only know > sprints as code-writing exercises, and I assume you don't mean we should > write new code for Sphinx...) > > On Mon, Nov 9, 2009 at 12:11 PM, James - Atlantix > wrote: > > I am wondering if anyone has experience documenting a Python project with > Sphinx? If so, would they be willing to do a sprint at the next meeting? > > > Thanks, > > James > > > _______________________________________________ > CentralOH mailing list > CentralOH at python.org > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/centraloh > > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From wam at cisco.com Wed Nov 11 22:24:42 2009 From: wam at cisco.com (William McVey) Date: Wed, 11 Nov 2009 16:24:42 -0500 Subject: [CentralOH] Python IDE In-Reply-To: <200911101349.58283.bryan.harris@udri.udayton.edu> References: <200911101349.58283.bryan.harris@udri.udayton.edu> Message-ID: <1257974682.10352.71.camel@talyn.cisco.com> On Tue, 2009-11-10 at 13:49 -0500, Bryan Harris wrote: > Hi all, > What editors do people on here prefer? I use a combination of vi and > gedit, but sometimes I yearn for the intelligent auto-completion which > I get in an IDE like eclipse with Java. (Eclipse pydev is so slow it's > completely unusable.) Is WingIDE worth getting for this reason? I personally love Wing. For close to 8 years, I did python development with vi/vim. I switched to Wing a couple of years ago. I've had issues in the past with converting from 20 years of vi muscle memory to some other editor, but Wing has some one of the best vi-binding compatibility modes I've seen among any non-vi/vim based editor. The are also *very* serious about their vi-compatibility and treat divergences with vi behavior as actual bugs. Beyond their vi compatibility (which was needed to even get me to use it), their feature list is pretty impressive. From {keyword,variable,module,syntax}-completion, interactive debugger, project navigator, revision-control integration, testcase harness (with ability to drop to interactive debugger on testcase failure), support for project-specific virtualenvs (especially important for interactive debugger as well as completion engine), and many more features I haven't even gotten around to exploring. Overall, it's a very fine product. If you're new to python or only use python for occasional tasks, it may be overkill (although you might be interested in Wing IDE 101, a stripped down option available for free for non-commercial use). If you're developing in python as part of your profession (or for your passionate hobby), I would very much recommend trying their 30day free trial, and giving it whirl. It took me about a week to really become "hooked" (and it's improved substantially since then even). -- William From james at atlantixeng.com Wed Nov 11 22:39:35 2009 From: james at atlantixeng.com (James - Atlantix) Date: Wed, 11 Nov 2009 16:39:35 -0500 Subject: [CentralOH] Sphinx In-Reply-To: <423e92430911111319r6845234bv21bfc31589399eb1@mail.gmail.com> References: <000601ca615f$c09a5e50$41cf1af0$@com> <6523e39a0911091103v2ff10e57paec9ef070501444e@mail.gmail.com> <001601ca6170$7e144710$7a3cd530$@com> <423e92430911091124l5c8d81cegefe59c4cfafc38db@mail.gmail.com> <000e01ca62fc$fe79b470$fb6d1d50$@com> <423e92430911111319r6845234bv21bfc31589399eb1@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <000c01ca6317$7767a800$6636f800$@com> ? Yung-Yu; What I mean by variable doc strings is really doc strings for variables on a single line; it is those comments documented with #: inside a python source file. This is in contrast to the triple quotes ??? ?. ??? I think we are talking about the same thing. Thanks for the feedback that the source code appears to be clean using this method. I think I will try it epydoc; and be looking forward to using Sphinx too. I have approximately 100 different Python modules/source files that I want to document. So I am trying to figure out which way to go, because the chosen documentation method will be repeatedly used. Thanks, James -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From wam at cisco.com Wed Nov 11 22:36:06 2009 From: wam at cisco.com (William McVey) Date: Wed, 11 Nov 2009 16:36:06 -0500 Subject: [CentralOH] Sphinx In-Reply-To: <423e92430911091124l5c8d81cegefe59c4cfafc38db@mail.gmail.com> References: <000601ca615f$c09a5e50$41cf1af0$@com> <6523e39a0911091103v2ff10e57paec9ef070501444e@mail.gmail.com> <001601ca6170$7e144710$7a3cd530$@com> <423e92430911091124l5c8d81cegefe59c4cfafc38db@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <1257975366.10352.78.camel@talyn.cisco.com> On Mon, 2009-11-09 at 14:24 -0500, Yung-Yu Chen wrote: > > For internal projects, I usually prefer to write API doc using epydoc > rather than write book-style documentation with sphinx. Full-fledged > documentation is too heavy-weight to my projects, and readers are too > limited. API doc is more suitable to my need. Sphinx totally allows you to build "api docs". With the sphinx.ext.autodoc (an extension that ships with Sphinx) extension enabled, it will pull documentation for your modules/class/functions from docstrings. If you're working with Django, there is also the djangodocs extension which provides easy ability to document template tags, filters, settings variables, and a variety of other django-specific project interfaces. This is for example how Django docs (http://docs.djangoproject.com/en/dev/) are built (which has both a combination of "prose style" docs as well as "api style" docs.) -- William From nick.albright at gmail.com Wed Nov 11 22:49:20 2009 From: nick.albright at gmail.com (Nick Albright) Date: Wed, 11 Nov 2009 16:49:20 -0500 Subject: [CentralOH] Python IDE In-Reply-To: <200911101349.58283.bryan.harris@udri.udayton.edu> References: <200911101349.58283.bryan.harris@udri.udayton.edu> Message-ID: <7ec143010911111349t51047d7aye5be9a21fa8ad8a0@mail.gmail.com> My regular editing tends to be remote linux boxes/ssh so I use emacs for most of my python editing. However, I did try out Wing and really quite liked it. I'd recommend trying out their 30 day trial and seeing for yourself. = ) Peace, -Nick On Tue, Nov 10, 2009 at 1:49 PM, Bryan Harris wrote: > Hi all, > What editors do people on here prefer? I use a combination of vi and gedit, > but sometimes I yearn for the intelligent auto-completion which I get in an > IDE like eclipse with Java. (Eclipse pydev is so slow it's completely > unusable.) Is WingIDE worth getting for this reason? > Thanks, > Bryan > -- > Bryan Harris > Research Engineer > Structures and Materials Evaluation Group > http://www.udri.udayton.edu/ > > > > _______________________________________________ > CentralOH mailing list > CentralOH at python.org > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/centraloh > > -- P.S. Any spelling mistakes are not those of the author, as he can't spell. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From dan at shinton.net Wed Nov 11 22:58:23 2009 From: dan at shinton.net (Dan Shinton) Date: Wed, 11 Nov 2009 16:58:23 -0500 Subject: [CentralOH] Python IDE In-Reply-To: <1257903221.17606.17.camel@egg> References: <8afa282d0911101527h29189c3rba3c815b609f5ef5@mail.gmail.com> <1257903221.17606.17.camel@egg> Message-ID: <66bb8cd90911111358u3c53cea3s9b57b356ff0e712c@mail.gmail.com> In addition to Wing, I would recommend UltraEdit. I have UltraEdit for many years and find it to be the best all around programming editor. -Dan On Tue, Nov 10, 2009 at 8:33 PM, Mike Schoenborn wrote: > On Tue, 2009-11-10 at 18:27 -0500, Scott Scites wrote: > > I use VIM with an assortment of VIM scripts for Python development. > > Care to share some of your favorites? > > > _______________________________________________ > CentralOH mailing list > CentralOH at python.org > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/centraloh > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From 03sjbrown at gmail.com Wed Nov 11 23:39:43 2009 From: 03sjbrown at gmail.com (Shawn Brown) Date: Wed, 11 Nov 2009 17:39:43 -0500 Subject: [CentralOH] Python IDE In-Reply-To: <66bb8cd90911111358u3c53cea3s9b57b356ff0e712c@mail.gmail.com> References: <8afa282d0911101527h29189c3rba3c815b609f5ef5@mail.gmail.com> <1257903221.17606.17.camel@egg> <66bb8cd90911111358u3c53cea3s9b57b356ff0e712c@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <8589ccd0911111439i40ad24fai5b5e0a7ee1ceb744@mail.gmail.com> I like to stay away from the larger IDEs -- on Windows, I eventually settled on Notepad++ (http://notepad-plus.sourceforge.net/uk/site.htm). After moving to Linux, I had trouble finding something comparable but then I found *Geany* (http://www.geany.org/Documentation/Screenshots). I now use Geany on Linux at home and on Windows at work. On Wed, Nov 11, 2009 at 4:58 PM, Dan Shinton wrote: > In addition to Wing, I would recommend UltraEdit. I have UltraEdit for many > years and find it to be the best all around programming editor. > > -Dan > > On Tue, Nov 10, 2009 at 8:33 PM, Mike Schoenborn wrote: > >> On Tue, 2009-11-10 at 18:27 -0500, Scott Scites wrote: >> > I use VIM with an assortment of VIM scripts for Python development. >> >> Care to share some of your favorites? >> > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From yungyuc at gmail.com Wed Nov 11 23:59:50 2009 From: yungyuc at gmail.com (Yung-Yu Chen) Date: Wed, 11 Nov 2009 17:59:50 -0500 Subject: [CentralOH] Sphinx In-Reply-To: <1257975366.10352.78.camel@talyn.cisco.com> References: <000601ca615f$c09a5e50$41cf1af0$@com> <6523e39a0911091103v2ff10e57paec9ef070501444e@mail.gmail.com> <001601ca6170$7e144710$7a3cd530$@com> <423e92430911091124l5c8d81cegefe59c4cfafc38db@mail.gmail.com> <1257975366.10352.78.camel@talyn.cisco.com> Message-ID: <423e92430911111459l3c7e936fye016a77879374549@mail.gmail.com> On Wed, Nov 11, 2009 at 16:36, William McVey wrote: > On Mon, 2009-11-09 at 14:24 -0500, Yung-Yu Chen wrote: > > > > For internal projects, I usually prefer to write API doc using epydoc > > rather than write book-style documentation with sphinx. Full-fledged > > documentation is too heavy-weight to my projects, and readers are too > > limited. API doc is more suitable to my need. > > Sphinx totally allows you to build "api docs". With the > sphinx.ext.autodoc (an extension that ships with Sphinx) extension > enabled, it will pull documentation for your modules/class/functions > from docstrings. If you're working with Django, there is also the > djangodocs extension which provides easy ability to document template > tags, filters, settings variables, and a variety of other > django-specific project interfaces. This is for example how Django docs > (http://docs.djangoproject.com/en/dev/) are built (which has both a > combination of "prose style" docs as well as "api style" docs.) > > It's great to know how to generate API docs with Sphinx. I knew there's definitely a way but couldn't find it. Thanks a lot, William. I think Sphinx is definitely more advanced than Epydoc. For a project with a potential large audience to its documentation, I guess Sphinx is a better choice than Epydoc. Sphinx is more versatile and more actively developed/maintained. However, from my experience, it took me more time in learning Sphinx than that in learning Epydoc. Before leaning both tools, I have been proficient in rst/docutils for a long time but knew nothing about epytext. Even with the fact, Epydoc is more straight-forward to me than Sphinx. yyc > -- William > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From yanovich at cse.ohio-state.edu Thu Nov 12 01:42:22 2009 From: yanovich at cse.ohio-state.edu (Michael S. Yanovich) Date: Wed, 11 Nov 2009 19:42:22 -0500 Subject: [CentralOH] Python IDE In-Reply-To: <8589ccd0911111439i40ad24fai5b5e0a7ee1ceb744@mail.gmail.com> References: <8afa282d0911101527h29189c3rba3c815b609f5ef5@mail.gmail.com> <1257903221.17606.17.camel@egg> <66bb8cd90911111358u3c53cea3s9b57b356ff0e712c@mail.gmail.com> <8589ccd0911111439i40ad24fai5b5e0a7ee1ceb744@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <4AFB59EE.4070003@cse.ohio-state.edu> I have to agree with Shawn, I love Geany. It has many features that I find useful not only for Python but many other languages. I have been using "gedit" on linux for a while but it seemed too much like Microsoft Notepad for me. I forget who suggested it, but the best way to find out if you should purchase it is to try it yourself, especially since there is a 30-day free trial. Michael S. Yanovich yanovich at cse.ohio-state.edu On 11/11/2009 05:39 PM, Shawn Brown wrote: > I like to stay away from the larger IDEs -- on Windows, I eventually > settled on Notepad++ (http://notepad-plus.sourceforge.net/uk/site.htm). > > After moving to Linux, I had trouble finding something comparable but > then I found *Geany* (http://www.geany.org/Documentation/Screenshots). > I now use Geany on Linux at home and on Windows at work. > > > On Wed, Nov 11, 2009 at 4:58 PM, Dan Shinton > wrote: > > In addition to Wing, I would recommend UltraEdit. I have UltraEdit > for many years and find it to be the best all around programming > editor. > > -Dan > > On Tue, Nov 10, 2009 at 8:33 PM, Mike Schoenborn > > wrote: > > On Tue, 2009-11-10 at 18:27 -0500, Scott Scites wrote: > > I use VIM with an assortment of VIM scripts for Python > development. > > Care to share some of your favorites? > > > _______________________________________________ > CentralOH mailing list > CentralOH at python.org > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/centraloh > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: smime.p7s Type: application/pkcs7-signature Size: 5162 bytes Desc: S/MIME Cryptographic Signature URL: From chris at developingchris.com Thu Nov 12 03:22:06 2009 From: chris at developingchris.com (Chris Chandler) Date: Wed, 11 Nov 2009 21:22:06 -0500 Subject: [CentralOH] Python IDE In-Reply-To: <4AFB59EE.4070003@cse.ohio-state.edu> References: <8afa282d0911101527h29189c3rba3c815b609f5ef5@mail.gmail.com> <1257903221.17606.17.camel@egg> <66bb8cd90911111358u3c53cea3s9b57b356ff0e712c@mail.gmail.com> <8589ccd0911111439i40ad24fai5b5e0a7ee1ceb744@mail.gmail.com> <4AFB59EE.4070003@cse.ohio-state.edu> Message-ID: <95f91cc30911111822w5f5f0618y48ee661577cb1928@mail.gmail.com> Just to add yet another editor into the flow, on windows I use Scite. I tend to use it as my goto open a file text editor, but the f5 runs a python script with an output tray, is nice for quick editing. It also has code folding on unified diff files, so if you need to take say a small part of a big diff and apply it to another code tree, its really nice to collapse the diff to files and pick the 2 or three, and then apply. Thanks, Chris Chandler 352-871-0712 On Wed, Nov 11, 2009 at 7:42 PM, Michael S. Yanovich < yanovich at cse.ohio-state.edu> wrote: > I have to agree with Shawn, I love Geany. It has many features that I find > useful not only for Python but many other languages. I have been using > "gedit" on linux for a while but it seemed too much like Microsoft Notepad > for me. > > I forget who suggested it, but the best way to find out if you should > purchase it is to try it yourself, especially since there is a 30-day free > trial. > > Michael S. Yanovichyanovich at cse.ohio-state.edu > > > On 11/11/2009 05:39 PM, Shawn Brown wrote: > > I like to stay away from the larger IDEs -- on Windows, I eventually > settled on Notepad++ (http://notepad-plus.sourceforge.net/uk/site.htm). > > After moving to Linux, I had trouble finding something comparable but then > I found *Geany* (http://www.geany.org/Documentation/Screenshots). I now > use Geany on Linux at home and on Windows at work. > > > On Wed, Nov 11, 2009 at 4:58 PM, Dan Shinton wrote: > >> In addition to Wing, I would recommend UltraEdit. I have UltraEdit for >> many years and find it to be the best all around programming editor. >> >> -Dan >> >> On Tue, Nov 10, 2009 at 8:33 PM, Mike Schoenborn wrote: >> >>> On Tue, 2009-11-10 at 18:27 -0500, Scott Scites wrote: >>> > I use VIM with an assortment of VIM scripts for Python development. >>> >>> Care to share some of your favorites? >>> >> > _______________________________________________ > CentralOH mailing list > CentralOH at python.orghttp://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/centraloh > > > _______________________________________________ > CentralOH mailing list > CentralOH at python.org > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/centraloh > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From douglas.m.stanley at gmail.com Thu Nov 12 04:38:27 2009 From: douglas.m.stanley at gmail.com (Douglas Stanley) Date: Wed, 11 Nov 2009 22:38:27 -0500 Subject: [CentralOH] Python IDE In-Reply-To: <95f91cc30911111822w5f5f0618y48ee661577cb1928@mail.gmail.com> References: <8afa282d0911101527h29189c3rba3c815b609f5ef5@mail.gmail.com> <1257903221.17606.17.camel@egg> <66bb8cd90911111358u3c53cea3s9b57b356ff0e712c@mail.gmail.com> <8589ccd0911111439i40ad24fai5b5e0a7ee1ceb744@mail.gmail.com> <4AFB59EE.4070003@cse.ohio-state.edu> <95f91cc30911111822w5f5f0618y48ee661577cb1928@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: Ok, I'll throw another one on the stack: Pida. Not sure if it's available on windows, but it's available for linux. Instead of trying to emulate vi, it actually embeds vi (or emacs if you swing that way). It also has alot of other fancy features common in IDE's. Doug On Wed, Nov 11, 2009 at 9:22 PM, Chris Chandler wrote: > Just to add yet another editor into the flow, on windows I use Scite. I tend > to use it as my goto open a file text editor, but the f5 runs a python > script with an output tray, is nice for quick editing. > It also has code folding on unified diff files, so if you need to take say a > small part of a big diff and apply it to another code tree, its really nice > to collapse the diff to files and pick the 2 or three, and then apply. > Thanks, > Chris Chandler > 352-871-0712 > > > On Wed, Nov 11, 2009 at 7:42 PM, Michael S. Yanovich > wrote: >> >> I have to agree with Shawn, I love Geany. It has many features that I find >> useful not only for Python but many other languages. I have been using >> "gedit" on linux for a while but it seemed too much like Microsoft Notepad >> for me. >> >> I forget who suggested it, but the best way to find out if you should >> purchase it is to try it yourself, especially since there is a 30-day free >> trial. >> >> Michael S. Yanovich >> yanovich at cse.ohio-state.edu >> >> On 11/11/2009 05:39 PM, Shawn Brown wrote: >> >> I like to stay away from the larger IDEs -- on Windows, I eventually >> settled on Notepad++ (http://notepad-plus.sourceforge.net/uk/site.htm). >> >> After moving to Linux, I had trouble finding something comparable but then >> I found Geany (http://www.geany.org/Documentation/Screenshots). I now use >> Geany on Linux at home and on Windows at work. >> >> >> On Wed, Nov 11, 2009 at 4:58 PM, Dan Shinton wrote: >>> >>> In addition to Wing, I would recommend UltraEdit. I have UltraEdit for >>> many years and find it to be the best all around programming editor. >>> >>> -Dan >>> >>> On Tue, Nov 10, 2009 at 8:33 PM, Mike Schoenborn >>> wrote: >>>> >>>> On Tue, 2009-11-10 at 18:27 -0500, Scott Scites wrote: >>>> > I use VIM with an assortment of VIM scripts for Python development. >>>> >>>> Care to share some of your favorites? >> >> _______________________________________________ >> CentralOH mailing list >> CentralOH at python.org >> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/centraloh >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> CentralOH mailing list >> CentralOH at python.org >> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/centraloh >> > > > _______________________________________________ > CentralOH mailing list > CentralOH at python.org > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/centraloh > > From catherine.devlin at gmail.com Thu Nov 12 15:41:04 2009 From: catherine.devlin at gmail.com (Catherine Devlin) Date: Thu, 12 Nov 2009 09:41:04 -0500 Subject: [CentralOH] Python IDE In-Reply-To: References: <8afa282d0911101527h29189c3rba3c815b609f5ef5@mail.gmail.com> <1257903221.17606.17.camel@egg> <66bb8cd90911111358u3c53cea3s9b57b356ff0e712c@mail.gmail.com> <8589ccd0911111439i40ad24fai5b5e0a7ee1ceb744@mail.gmail.com> <4AFB59EE.4070003@cse.ohio-state.edu> <95f91cc30911111822w5f5f0618y48ee661577cb1928@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <6523e39a0911120641p46ec5b0fo40245c9b039639fc@mail.gmail.com> Wing is definitely my favorite. I did have a surprisingly pleasant experience with NetBeans, though - it's got all the nice stuff, and great support for refactoring - I might use NetBeans in the future when I'm in a refactoring part of the cycle. One fatal flaw keeps it from being my favorite: its debugger seems to have no "ignore this exception location" option - debugging *always* stops when any exception is encountered, even one that's trapped immediately - so it's impossible to debug code that relies on EAFP (Easier to Ask Forgiveness than Permission) techniques - which I do. -- - Catherine http://catherinedevlin.blogspot.com/ *** PyCon * Feb 17-25, 2010 * Atlanta, GA * us.pycon.org *** -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From nick.albright at gmail.com Thu Nov 12 23:33:36 2009 From: nick.albright at gmail.com (Nick Albright) Date: Thu, 12 Nov 2009 17:33:36 -0500 Subject: [CentralOH] Bitbucket COhPy Repistory? Message-ID: <7ec143010911121433u290b6d87l39c3da2e47385b23@mail.gmail.com> Hello Folkses! So as I try to have something up and running over the weekend, it'd be great to put the finished product in the Bitbucket repository that I *thought* someone had already created. So I'm looking to get in contact with that person so we can have some good stuff in there by the end of the weekend! Please email me and let me know what I need to do to upload the code! = ) Thanks! -Nick -- "Laughter is the closest distance between two people." -- Victor Borge -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From scott.scites at railcar88.com Thu Nov 12 13:00:16 2009 From: scott.scites at railcar88.com (Scott Scites) Date: Thu, 12 Nov 2009 07:00:16 -0500 Subject: [CentralOH] Python IDE Message-ID: <8afa282d0911120400s76d8201ehf400cdcfac88fabf@mail.gmail.com> Mike, http://github.com/scitesy/vim_config This includes my .vimrc file. Look in the .vim/plugins directory to see the scripts. Nothing python specific just things that make programming easier. My two favorites are nerdtree and supertab If you use this you'll need to add a backup directory to the .vim directory. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From nick.albright at gmail.com Sun Nov 15 02:04:43 2009 From: nick.albright at gmail.com (Nick Albright) Date: Sat, 14 Nov 2009 20:04:43 -0500 Subject: [CentralOH] Website Progress! Message-ID: <7ec143010911141704r52c91710o7d288490d8351930@mail.gmail.com> Hello Folkses! So we got some website progress! The basic framework is setup and working (No real guts yet, but first things first :), and you can see it running on the google app engine at: http://cohpy-test.appspot.com/ The source code is hosted at BitBucket thanks to Scott! http://bitbucket.org/cohpy/cohpy/ And we've got a first pass at directions on how to download, modify and upload at the bitbucket wiki at: http://bitbucket.org/cohpy/cohpy/wiki/Home You will need to create an account on both google app engine, and bit bucket to be able to commit back any changes. (We should put that on the wiki someplace? Or how do we qualify folks on the list vs people who just find the bitbucket repository.. humm...) I'm gonna work on the events, as both the website feedback emails I got put that at #1. ;) Who wants to work on what? We are ready to go! :) And what questions do people have? Peace! -Nick -- "Common sense is the collection of prejudices acquired by age eighteen." -- Albert Einstein -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From bryan.harris at udri.udayton.edu Mon Nov 16 19:21:13 2009 From: bryan.harris at udri.udayton.edu (Bryan Harris) Date: Mon, 16 Nov 2009 13:21:13 -0500 Subject: [CentralOH] Python Visual Problem in Ubuntu 9.10 Message-ID: <200911161321.13929.bryan.harris@udri.udayton.edu> Hi all, Does anybody have visual working in ubuntu 9.10? I get a segfault when I try to import visual. It also won't build from the ubuntu source and I wonder if the problem is related. I get the same behavior on two machines so I don't think it's just this machine. It could be something I did since I administer both machines though. Could somebody else with an Ubuntu 9.10 machine check this out? python Python 2.6.4 (r264:75706, Nov 2 2009, 14:38:03) [GCC 4.4.1] on linux2 Type "help", "copyright", "credits" or "license" for more information. >>> import visual Segmentation fault https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/482294 Thanks, Bryan -- Bryan Harris Research Engineer Structures and Materials Evaluation Group bryan.harris at udri.udayton.edu http://www.udri.udayton.edu/ From eric at intellovations.com Mon Nov 16 22:11:03 2009 From: eric at intellovations.com (Eric Floehr) Date: Mon, 16 Nov 2009 16:11:03 -0500 Subject: [CentralOH] O'Reilly Learning Python Book Message-ID: <34f468870911161311w335adc8u8a5ffd0f41967d36@mail.gmail.com> All, Would anyone be interested in reviewing "Learning Python, 4th edition" on oreilly.com? You will receive a free review copy. Only a few copies are available, so please respond quickly. Thanks, Eric -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From miles.groman at gmail.com Mon Nov 16 22:44:55 2009 From: miles.groman at gmail.com (m g) Date: Mon, 16 Nov 2009 16:44:55 -0500 Subject: [CentralOH] O'Reilly Learning Python Book In-Reply-To: <34f468870911161311w335adc8u8a5ffd0f41967d36@mail.gmail.com> References: <34f468870911161311w335adc8u8a5ffd0f41967d36@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: yes. On Mon, Nov 16, 2009 at 4:11 PM, Eric Floehr wrote: > All, > > Would anyone be interested in reviewing "Learning Python, 4th edition" on > oreilly.com?? You will receive a free review copy. > > Only a few copies are available, so please respond quickly. > > Thanks, > Eric > > > _______________________________________________ > CentralOH mailing list > CentralOH at python.org > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/centraloh > > From william at bioselement.com Tue Nov 17 01:56:31 2009 From: william at bioselement.com (William Chambers) Date: Mon, 16 Nov 2009 19:56:31 -0500 Subject: [CentralOH] O'Reilly Learning Python Book In-Reply-To: <34f468870911161311w335adc8u8a5ffd0f41967d36@mail.gmail.com> References: <34f468870911161311w335adc8u8a5ffd0f41967d36@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <200911161956.39284.william@bioselement.com> I'd be interested in reviewing a copy. Since most of what I write are reviews anyway it'd be fun. -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 197 bytes Desc: This is a digitally signed message part. URL: From nick.albright at gmail.com Tue Nov 17 06:17:22 2009 From: nick.albright at gmail.com (Nick Albright) Date: Tue, 17 Nov 2009 00:17:22 -0500 Subject: [CentralOH] Website Update! 9/16 Message-ID: <7ec143010911162117i4359f9cfp7b98d9db2bce79c3@mail.gmail.com> Hello Folkses! So I updated the website: http://cohpy-test.appspot.com/ and added events and locations. = ) For those that want to play around with the website (Local testing is *very* easy! = ), you can get the directions at: http://bitbucket.org/cohpy/cohpy/wiki/Home Peace! -Nick -- "C combines the power of assembler with the portability of assembler." -- Anonymous -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From ericlake at gmail.com Tue Nov 17 17:28:44 2009 From: ericlake at gmail.com (Eric Lake) Date: Tue, 17 Nov 2009 11:28:44 -0500 Subject: [CentralOH] O'Reilly Learning Python Book In-Reply-To: <200911161956.39284.william@bioselement.com> References: <34f468870911161311w335adc8u8a5ffd0f41967d36@mail.gmail.com> <200911161956.39284.william@bioselement.com> Message-ID: <15c903070911170828m5355ec05k9b25553efa3792a7@mail.gmail.com> I would love to have one to review if you still have a copy. On Mon, Nov 16, 2009 at 7:56 PM, William Chambers wrote: > I'd be interested in reviewing a copy. Since most of what I write are > reviews > anyway it'd be fun. > > _______________________________________________ > CentralOH mailing list > CentralOH at python.org > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/centraloh > > -- Thanks, Eric Lake -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From eric at intellovations.com Mon Nov 30 19:41:57 2009 From: eric at intellovations.com (Eric Floehr) Date: Mon, 30 Nov 2009 13:41:57 -0500 Subject: [CentralOH] Monday, December 7 Python Users Group Meeting Message-ID: <34f468870911301041lbaa0493l97ba180ebaf44a72@mail.gmail.com> Don't forget our Python Users Group meeting is coming up this coming Monday, December 7! Brian Costlow will be talking about "You say Twister^Hd, I say Tornado". He has built some small web applications at his work that have 'dashboard' style components. The page displaying the dashboard runs a timer loop in JavaScript that makes 'AJAX' queries to get updated data. When people leave this open, it's polling the app server every 30 seconds for updates. Each update is actually five separate GET calls, which result in 5 queries run etc. Sometimes the underlying db can go hours without changes, and other times, it's updating/creating 100s of records a second. He wanted to rewrite the dashboards as 'Comet' apps, including replacing the server-side with an asynchronous event loop web server. He prototyped one of the dashboards with both a Twisted and Tornado back end. He will walk through both implementations, talk about the tradeoffs, and what their final decision was. In addition to Brian, Catherine Devlin will be coming in to talk about setting up Sphinx to document your code. We will also have two break-out sessions: developing the cohpy.org website and Learning More About Python. Pop and snacks will be provided by Intellovations. We also have a stack of O'Reilly provided Python books in our library that can be checked out. Please RSVP at: http://www.meetup.com/Central-Ohio-Python-Users-Group/calendar/11740308/ See you there! Best Regards, Eric -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: