From carl at personnelware.com  Sat Dec  1 00:16:52 2007
From: carl at personnelware.com (Carl Karsten)
Date: Fri, 30 Nov 2007 17:16:52 -0600
Subject: [Chicago] is there really no built-in file/iter split() thing?
In-Reply-To: <c3aa55550711301459p5e0aeaaka44b646f171a3c8c@mail.gmail.com>
References: <b571660a0711301349s1a6aef24m995673ac0e5743d0@mail.gmail.com>	<9A51D890-1510-42FC-AA3F-DBB20405E19E@gmail.com>
	<c3aa55550711301459p5e0aeaaka44b646f171a3c8c@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <475099E4.5060704@personnelware.com>

Michael Tobis wrote:
> def chunker(file,splitter=";"):
>    r = c = ""
>    while (c or not r) and (not c == splitter)
>       c = file.read(1)
>       r.append(c)
>    return r
> 
> I suspect I'm missing something to make this prettier, but
> file.read(1) seems to be the way to go through a file bytewise.

Aren't lines terminated with \n ?

Carl K

From jdh2358 at gmail.com  Sat Dec  1 00:56:02 2007
From: jdh2358 at gmail.com (=?utf-8?B?Sm9obiBIdW50ZXI=?=)
Date: Fri, 30 Nov 2007 23:56:02 +0000
Subject: [Chicago] is there really no built-in file/iter split() thing?
In-Reply-To: <c3aa55550711301459p5e0aeaaka44b646f171a3c8c@mail.gmail.com>
References: <b571660a0711301349s1a6aef24m995673ac0e5743d0@mail.gmail.com><9A51D890-1510-42FC-AA3F-DBB20405E19E@gmail.com><c3aa55550711301459p5e0aeaaka44b646f171a3c8c@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <1345073711-1196466996-cardhu_decombobulator_blackberry.rim.net-1874253661-@bxe116.bisx.prod.on.blackberry>

Could you describe in words what you are trying to do?

Sent via BlackBerry from T-Mobile

-----Original Message-----
From: "Michael Tobis" <mtobis at gmail.com>

Date: Fri, 30 Nov 2007 16:59:53 
To:"The Chicago Python Users Group" <chicago at python.org>
Subject: Re: [Chicago] is there really no built-in file/iter split() thing?


def chunker(file,splitter=";"):
   r = c = ""
   while (c or not r) and (not c == splitter)
      c = file.read(1)
      r.append(c)
   return r

I suspect I'm missing something to make this prettier, but
file.read(1) seems to be the way to go through a file bytewise.

mt
_______________________________________________
Chicago mailing list
Chicago at python.org
http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago



From kumar.mcmillan at gmail.com  Sat Dec  1 01:12:36 2007
From: kumar.mcmillan at gmail.com (Kumar McMillan)
Date: Fri, 30 Nov 2007 18:12:36 -0600
Subject: [Chicago] is there really no built-in file/iter split() thing?
In-Reply-To: <1345073711-1196466996-cardhu_decombobulator_blackberry.rim.net-1874253661-@bxe116.bisx.prod.on.blackberry>
References: <b571660a0711301349s1a6aef24m995673ac0e5743d0@mail.gmail.com>
	<9A51D890-1510-42FC-AA3F-DBB20405E19E@gmail.com>
	<c3aa55550711301459p5e0aeaaka44b646f171a3c8c@mail.gmail.com>
	<1345073711-1196466996-cardhu_decombobulator_blackberry.rim.net-1874253661-@bxe116.bisx.prod.on.blackberry>
Message-ID: <b571660a0711301612q6c0f1bb5n39a29bff2a13bedb@mail.gmail.com>

On Nov 30, 2007 5:56 PM, John Hunter <jdh2358 at gmail.com> wrote:
> Could you describe in words what you are trying to do?

I was just curious if anyone knew of a builtin object that accepted a
file and a token (i.e. ';') and yielded each part of that file split
by tokens.  In code:
open('big.sql').read().split(';')
...but instead of reading the whole file at once, streamed for
efficiency.  I posted my implementation then everyone posted
variations on that but I didn't see one using a builtin module or
method designed specifically for this.  So I guess that answers it.

>
> Sent via BlackBerry from T-Mobile
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: "Michael Tobis" <mtobis at gmail.com>
>
> Date: Fri, 30 Nov 2007 16:59:53
> To:"The Chicago Python Users Group" <chicago at python.org>
> Subject: Re: [Chicago] is there really no built-in file/iter split() thing?
>
>
> def chunker(file,splitter=";"):
>    r = c = ""
>    while (c or not r) and (not c == splitter)
>       c = file.read(1)
>       r.append(c)
>    return r
>
> I suspect I'm missing something to make this prettier, but
> file.read(1) seems to be the way to go through a file bytewise.
>
> mt
> _______________________________________________
> Chicago mailing list
> Chicago at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Chicago mailing list
> Chicago at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>

From mtobis at gmail.com  Sat Dec  1 01:25:27 2007
From: mtobis at gmail.com (Michael Tobis)
Date: Fri, 30 Nov 2007 18:25:27 -0600
Subject: [Chicago] is there really no built-in file/iter split() thing?
In-Reply-To: <c3aa55550711301459p5e0aeaaka44b646f171a3c8c@mail.gmail.com>
References: <b571660a0711301349s1a6aef24m995673ac0e5743d0@mail.gmail.com>
	<9A51D890-1510-42FC-AA3F-DBB20405E19E@gmail.com>
	<c3aa55550711301459p5e0aeaaka44b646f171a3c8c@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <c3aa55550711301625t4b789074r334a4137c07c72a8@mail.gmail.com>

Ooh, sloppy, shouldn't have called it file... fie...

mt

On Nov 30, 2007 4:59 PM, Michael Tobis <mtobis at gmail.com> wrote:
> def chunker(file,splitter=";"):
>    r = c = ""
>    while (c or not r) and (not c == splitter)
>       c = file.read(1)
>       r.append(c)
>    return r
>
> I suspect I'm missing something to make this prettier, but
> file.read(1) seems to be the way to go through a file bytewise.
>
> mt
>

From skip at pobox.com  Sat Dec  1 02:28:27 2007
From: skip at pobox.com (skip at pobox.com)
Date: Fri, 30 Nov 2007 19:28:27 -0600
Subject: [Chicago] is there really no built-in file/iter split() thing?
In-Reply-To: <c3aa55550711301459p5e0aeaaka44b646f171a3c8c@mail.gmail.com>
References: <b571660a0711301349s1a6aef24m995673ac0e5743d0@mail.gmail.com>
	<9A51D890-1510-42FC-AA3F-DBB20405E19E@gmail.com>
	<c3aa55550711301459p5e0aeaaka44b646f171a3c8c@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <18256.47291.629454.485429@montanaro.dyndns.org>


My candidate:

    def chunker(f, splitter=";"):
        rest = ""
        for line in f:
            line = rest + line
            if splitter in line:
                first, rest = line.split(splitter, 1)
                yield first
            else:
                rest = line
        if rest:
            yield rest

    if __name__ == "__main__":
        import sys
        for chunk in chunker(open(sys.argv[1]), ';'):
            print repr(chunk)

Skip

From jeffh at dundeemt.com  Sat Dec  1 05:58:42 2007
From: jeffh at dundeemt.com (Jeff Hinrichs - DM&T)
Date: Fri, 30 Nov 2007 22:58:42 -0600
Subject: [Chicago] constant length string manipulation
In-Reply-To: <3096c19d0711300752i6a2b7bb6o68925dae2a3d191a@mail.gmail.com>
References: <804e5c70711291306rb3faf64wdb6a6ae521abf133@mail.gmail.com>
	<804e5c70711291321s489888dbj9415b4411300643d@mail.gmail.com>
	<3096c19d0711300752i6a2b7bb6o68925dae2a3d191a@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <5aaed53f0711302058y30f93774u92226d67ae1b377e@mail.gmail.com>

On Nov 30, 2007 9:52 AM, Chris McAvoy <chris.mcavoy at gmail.com> wrote:
> On Nov 29, 2007 3:21 PM, Lukasz Szybalski <szybalski at gmail.com> wrote:
> > On Nov 29, 2007 3:06 PM, Lukasz Szybalski <szybalski at gmail.com> wrote:
> > > Hello,
> > > Is there a string function in python that does the following:
> > > I need a string of length 5 char, and I will pass a longer and shorter
> > > string but I always need to get string of length 5.
> > > If my string is longer its easy:
>
> This task is stupid.
>
> You should only address the "string is longer" issue, use cut (see
> 'man cut' if you need help), and then tell whomever is asking you to
> do this that it can't be done.
>
> (wipes hands, beams triumphantly)
>
> I win.
>
> Otherwise, if they insist that the "edge case" of a string shorter
> than five characters needs to be lengthened (do those even exist???)
> insist that their inflexibility is hurting the agility of your team,
> and demand that they find budget to hire an intern.  Also, pad your
> estimate with acronyms, like TDD and BUTT.
>
> If they continue to give you flak, cough and say "anassholesayswhat."
> When they say, "what?"  Laugh.
>
> Maybe try writing this in Rails.  I'm pretty sure they have a template
> tag that says ""some string of unfathomable
> length".shorten_this_if_its_greater_than_five_characters_but_if_its_less_make_it_longer
>  Notice that you don't have to import that (agile!) and you don't have
> to use parens (agile!).
>
> If they won't let you write it in Rails, quit.
>
> Maybe Erlang can handle this?  I'm pretty sure conditional lengthening
> / shortening of strings is something that Functional languages do
> better than procedural languages.  Paul Graham wrote an article about
> it in 1992, right before he created Ebay in Lisp.
>
> Do you use a Mac?  You should.  Because the Mac takes care of Strings.
>  Automagically.
>
> Chris
>

This thread is the closest thing to a monty python skit I've read in a
while, I would have responded earlier but I had to clean the tea off
my desk, which got there when I attempted to take a drink while
reading the last line of Chris' response.  Jolly good.



-- 
Jeff Hinrichs
Dundee Media & Technology, Inc
jeffh at dundeemt.com
402.218.1473

From dbt at meat.net  Sat Dec  1 13:59:18 2007
From: dbt at meat.net (David Terrell)
Date: Sat, 1 Dec 2007 06:59:18 -0600
Subject: [Chicago] is there really no built-in file/iter split() thing?
In-Reply-To: <18256.47291.629454.485429@montanaro.dyndns.org>
References: <b571660a0711301349s1a6aef24m995673ac0e5743d0@mail.gmail.com>
	<9A51D890-1510-42FC-AA3F-DBB20405E19E@gmail.com>
	<c3aa55550711301459p5e0aeaaka44b646f171a3c8c@mail.gmail.com>
	<18256.47291.629454.485429@montanaro.dyndns.org>
Message-ID: <20071201125918.GJ2371@sphinx.chicagopeoplez.org>

On Fri, Nov 30, 2007 at 07:28:27PM -0600, skip at pobox.com wrote:
> 
> My candidate:
> 
>     deft chunker(f, splitter=";"):
>         rest = ""
>         for line in f:
>             line = rest + line
>             if splitter in line:
>                 first, rest = line.split(splitter, 1)

scanning the string twice?

>                 yield first

Bug: doesn't work if there are multiple statements on one line.

>             else:
>                 rest = line
>         if rest:
>             yield rest
> 
>     if __name__ == "__main__":
>         import sys
>         for chunk in chunker(open(sys.argv[1]), ';'):
>             print repr(chunk)

-- 
David Terrell
dbt at meat.net
((meatspace)) http://meat.net/

From skip at pobox.com  Sat Dec  1 22:04:02 2007
From: skip at pobox.com (skip at pobox.com)
Date: Sat, 1 Dec 2007 15:04:02 -0600
Subject: [Chicago] is there really no built-in file/iter split() thing?
In-Reply-To: <20071201125918.GJ2371@sphinx.chicagopeoplez.org>
References: <b571660a0711301349s1a6aef24m995673ac0e5743d0@mail.gmail.com>
	<9A51D890-1510-42FC-AA3F-DBB20405E19E@gmail.com>
	<c3aa55550711301459p5e0aeaaka44b646f171a3c8c@mail.gmail.com>
	<18256.47291.629454.485429@montanaro.dyndns.org>
	<20071201125918.GJ2371@sphinx.chicagopeoplez.org>
Message-ID: <18257.52290.126542.308553@montanaro.dyndns.org>


    me> My candidate:
    ...
    David> scanning the string twice?
    ...
    David> Bug: doesn't work if there are multiple statements on one line.

That's what I get for tossing off something quickly while I'm mostly paying
attention to other things.  Here's a second attempt.  The empty string
output for an empty input is debatable.

Skip

"""
>>> for chunk in chunker(iter(['abc ; def ; ghi;\\n'])):
...   print repr(chunk)
...
'abc '
' def '
' ghi'
'\\n'
>>> for chunk in chunker(iter(['abc;\\n', 'def\\n', 'ghi;\\n'])):
...   print repr(chunk)
...
'abc'
'\\ndef\\nghi'
'\\n'
>>> for chunk in chunker(iter([])):
...   print repr(chunk)
...
''
>>> for chunk in chunker(iter([';', ';;\\n'])):
...   print repr(chunk)
...
''
''
''
'\\n'
"""

def chunker(f, splitter=";"):
    chunks = [""]
    while True:
        for chunk in chunks[:-1]:
            yield chunk
        chunks = chunks[-1:]
        try:
            line = f.next()
        except StopIteration:
            break
        chunks = (chunks[-1] + line).split(splitter)
    for chunk in chunks:
        yield chunk

if __name__ == "__main__":
    import doctest
    doctest.testmod()

From damien at grassart.com  Sat Dec  1 22:19:28 2007
From: damien at grassart.com (Damien Grassart)
Date: Sat, 1 Dec 2007 22:19:28 +0100
Subject: [Chicago] is there really no built-in file/iter split() thing?
In-Reply-To: <18257.52290.126542.308553@montanaro.dyndns.org>
References: <b571660a0711301349s1a6aef24m995673ac0e5743d0@mail.gmail.com>
	<9A51D890-1510-42FC-AA3F-DBB20405E19E@gmail.com>
	<c3aa55550711301459p5e0aeaaka44b646f171a3c8c@mail.gmail.com>
	<18256.47291.629454.485429@montanaro.dyndns.org>
	<20071201125918.GJ2371@sphinx.chicagopeoplez.org>
	<18257.52290.126542.308553@montanaro.dyndns.org>
Message-ID: <dfe3933e0712011319m67d9b34fre80a4e4cb9780621@mail.gmail.com>

On 12/1/07, skip at pobox.com <skip at pobox.com> wrote:
>
>         try:
>             line = f.next()
>         except StopIteration:
>             break


Bug: Eqivalent to f.read() if all your statements are on one line. ;)

I'd probably do something like this:

def chunker(f, sep=";", readsize=100):
    rest = ''
    while True:
        buf = f.read(readsize)
        if buf:
            chunks = (rest + buf).split(sep)
            for chunk in chunks[:-1]:
                yield chunk
            rest = chunks[-1]
        else:
            yield rest
            break

-Damien
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From ianb at colorstudy.com  Sat Dec  1 23:06:36 2007
From: ianb at colorstudy.com (Ian Bicking)
Date: Sat, 01 Dec 2007 16:06:36 -0600
Subject: [Chicago] is there really no built-in file/iter split() thing?
In-Reply-To: <b571660a0711301349s1a6aef24m995673ac0e5743d0@mail.gmail.com>
References: <b571660a0711301349s1a6aef24m995673ac0e5743d0@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <4751DAEC.1010306@colorstudy.com>

Not particularly apropos of the discussion, but I thought about split, 
and whether it is advantageous to do:

   if ';' in line:
       parts = line.split(';')

Assuming that most lines won't have ; in them.  "';' in line" is fairly 
fast.

One thing I've noticed is that some string operations are fairly 
efficient in this case, because they notice when they wouldn't do 
anything and don't create a new string.

First, to make sure it's a string that doesn't get intern'd or anything 
(I think, maybe, some small strings get reused):

   >>> x = 'x'*1000

Now, .replace() works nicely:

   >>> x.replace('&', '&amp;') is x
   True
   >>> x.replace('x', 'y') is x
   False

Concatenation also works:

   >>> x + '' is x
   True

But not split:

   >>> x.split()[0] is x
   False

-- 
Ian Bicking : ianb at colorstudy.com : http://blog.ianbicking.org

From carl at personnelware.com  Sat Dec  1 23:59:13 2007
From: carl at personnelware.com (Carl Karsten)
Date: Sat, 01 Dec 2007 16:59:13 -0600
Subject: [Chicago] is there really no built-in file/iter split() thing?
In-Reply-To: <4751DAEC.1010306@colorstudy.com>
References: <b571660a0711301349s1a6aef24m995673ac0e5743d0@mail.gmail.com>
	<4751DAEC.1010306@colorstudy.com>
Message-ID: <4751E741.6070002@personnelware.com>

 > Assuming open('big.sql').read().split(';') would be a dumb idea,

How about we just not assume that?  If it is, lets see the proof so we have a 
good idea how bad it is, which will help gauge how elaborate of a work around is 
justified.

Carl K

From kumar.mcmillan at gmail.com  Sun Dec  2 00:08:35 2007
From: kumar.mcmillan at gmail.com (Kumar McMillan)
Date: Sat, 1 Dec 2007 17:08:35 -0600
Subject: [Chicago] is there really no built-in file/iter split() thing?
In-Reply-To: <4751E741.6070002@personnelware.com>
References: <b571660a0711301349s1a6aef24m995673ac0e5743d0@mail.gmail.com>
	<4751DAEC.1010306@colorstudy.com> <4751E741.6070002@personnelware.com>
Message-ID: <b571660a0712011508g20ae1509o4e059fbc46b3ea54@mail.gmail.com>

On Dec 1, 2007 4:59 PM, Carl Karsten <carl at personnelware.com> wrote:
>  > Assuming open('big.sql').read().split(';') would be a dumb idea,
>
> How about we just not assume that?  If it is, lets see the proof so we have a
> good idea how bad it is, which will help gauge how elaborate of a work around is
> justified.

the file I was parsing was 45M.  If you want to test it on *your*
machine, go ahead and post back the results :)  It would be nice to
see, actually.  My assumption is that it will try to allocate at least
90M of memory but, yes, it is still just an assumption.

>
> Carl K
>
> _______________________________________________
> Chicago mailing list
> Chicago at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>

From damien at grassart.com  Sun Dec  2 01:55:48 2007
From: damien at grassart.com (Damien Grassart)
Date: Sun, 2 Dec 2007 01:55:48 +0100
Subject: [Chicago] is there really no built-in file/iter split() thing?
In-Reply-To: <4751DAEC.1010306@colorstudy.com>
References: <b571660a0711301349s1a6aef24m995673ac0e5743d0@mail.gmail.com>
	<4751DAEC.1010306@colorstudy.com>
Message-ID: <dfe3933e0712011655y741c3b7eq15ca5a919286ed58@mail.gmail.com>

On 12/1/07, Ian Bicking <ianb at colorstudy.com> wrote:
>
> Not particularly apropos of the discussion, but I thought about split,
> and whether it is advantageous to do:
>
>    if ';' in line:
>        parts = line.split(';')
>
> Assuming that most lines won't have ; in them.  "';' in line" is fairly
> fast.


Good point. Running a quick test on a 10 million line file, that check added
about a 10% overhead when every single line performed a split, but it made
it nearly twice as fast when only 1 in 3 lines needed it.


>    >>> x.split()[0] is x
>    False


I assume it was done that way because split() returns a different type than
it's object, so it's not as easy as "if (no_work_needed) return self;".
Granted it shouldn't be that much harder either, but I I'm just guessing
anyways. ;)

-Damien
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From maney at two14.net  Sun Dec  2 02:58:21 2007
From: maney at two14.net (Martin Maney)
Date: Sat, 1 Dec 2007 19:58:21 -0600
Subject: [Chicago] constant length string manipulation
In-Reply-To: <eb9a21ad0711301128p7bd9d463s6e65e911d4037fd2@mail.gmail.com>
References: <804e5c70711291306rb3faf64wdb6a6ae521abf133@mail.gmail.com>
	<804e5c70711291321s489888dbj9415b4411300643d@mail.gmail.com>
	<3096c19d0711300752i6a2b7bb6o68925dae2a3d191a@mail.gmail.com>
	<eb9a21ad0711301128p7bd9d463s6e65e911d4037fd2@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <20071202015821.GA26452@furrr.two14.net>

On Fri, Nov 30, 2007 at 01:28:37PM -0600, Jon Sudlow wrote:
> I really enjoyed Chris's Response.

Yeah.  Waiter, we want some of what he's on.  Unless it's addictive.

-- 
C makes an art of confusing pointers with arrays and strings, which
leads to lotsa neat pointer tricks; APL mistakes everything for an array,
leading to neat one-liners; and Perl confuses everything period,
making each line a joyous adventure <wink>.  -- Tim Peters


From maney at two14.net  Sun Dec  2 03:07:44 2007
From: maney at two14.net (Martin Maney)
Date: Sat, 1 Dec 2007 20:07:44 -0600
Subject: [Chicago] constant length string manipulation
In-Reply-To: <474F3301.6000806@colorstudy.com>
References: <804e5c70711291306rb3faf64wdb6a6ae521abf133@mail.gmail.com>
	<474F3301.6000806@colorstudy.com>
Message-ID: <20071202020744.GB26452@furrr.two14.net>

On Thu, Nov 29, 2007 at 03:45:37PM -0600, Ian Bicking wrote:
> def fivespaces(s):
>      while len(s) < 5:
>          s += ' '
>      while len(s) > 5:
>          s = s[:-1]
>      return s

Hey!  That's like a Monty Python kit, but in code.  Waiter, forget
about that earlier order.  Oh, and tell the operator she can keep the
dime, too.

-- 
Now people have pondered this time and again (Who dies? Everyone dies)
We suspect that we're more than mere mortal remains (Oh, everyone dies)
Wise men and prophets they've all had their say
  on the nature of our afterlives
But in case there's no beer there we'll have one more round (Oh everyone dies)
 -- James Keelaghan in "Who Dies?", an upbeat song about mortality


From carl at personnelware.com  Sun Dec  2 03:17:25 2007
From: carl at personnelware.com (Carl Karsten)
Date: Sat, 01 Dec 2007 20:17:25 -0600
Subject: [Chicago] is there really no built-in file/iter split() thing?
In-Reply-To: <b571660a0712011508g20ae1509o4e059fbc46b3ea54@mail.gmail.com>
References: <b571660a0711301349s1a6aef24m995673ac0e5743d0@mail.gmail.com>	<4751DAEC.1010306@colorstudy.com>
	<4751E741.6070002@personnelware.com>
	<b571660a0712011508g20ae1509o4e059fbc46b3ea54@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <475215B5.4000307@personnelware.com>

Kumar McMillan wrote:
> On Dec 1, 2007 4:59 PM, Carl Karsten <carl at personnelware.com> wrote:
>>  > Assuming open('big.sql').read().split(';') would be a dumb idea,
>>
>> How about we just not assume that?  If it is, lets see the proof so we have a
>> good idea how bad it is, which will help gauge how elaborate of a work around is
>> justified.
> 
> the file I was parsing was 45M.  If you want to test it on *your*
> machine, go ahead and post back the results :)  It would be nice to
> see, actually.  My assumption is that it will try to allocate at least
> 90M of memory but, yes, it is still just an assumption.

carl at vaio:~$ free -m
              total       used       free     shared    buffers     cached
Mem:           376         26        349          0          0          4
-/+ buffers/cache:         21        354
Swap:          627         56        570
carl at vaio:~$ time python
Python 2.5.1 (r251:54863, Oct  5 2007, 13:36:32)
[GCC 4.1.3 20070929 (prerelease) (Ubuntu 4.1.2-16ubuntu2)] on linux2
Type "help", "copyright", "credits" or "license" for more information.
 >>> import datetime
 >>> s=datetime.datetime.now()
 >>> x='abc;'*(45000000/4)
 >>> datetime.datetime.now() - s
datetime.timedelta(0, 9, 131028)
 >>> len(x)
45000000
 >>> s=datetime.datetime.now()
 >>> y=x.split(';')
datetime.datetime.now() - s
 >>> datetime.datetime.now() - s
datetime.timedelta(0, 23, 222340)
 >>> len(y)
11250001
 >>>

real    2m48.391s
user    0m4.016s
sys     0m2.320s

in a 2nd shell, after doing y=...
carl at vaio:~$ ps vp 7191
   PID TTY      STAT   TIME  MAJFL   TRS   DRS   RSS %MEM COMMAND
  7191 pts/2    S+     0:03    283   985 461442 340092 88.1 python

Anyone know what that means?

Most of the 2m48s was after I hit ^D to exit python.  Not really sure why that 
would take so much longer than creating y.  I got too much stuff open on my box 
with 1gb.

Carl K

From mdipierro at cs.depaul.edu  Sun Dec  2 04:05:03 2007
From: mdipierro at cs.depaul.edu (Massimo Di Pierro)
Date: Sat, 1 Dec 2007 21:05:03 -0600
Subject: [Chicago] how python can save you money
In-Reply-To: <20071202020744.GB26452@furrr.two14.net>
References: <804e5c70711291306rb3faf64wdb6a6ae521abf133@mail.gmail.com>
	<474F3301.6000806@colorstudy.com>
	<20071202020744.GB26452@furrr.two14.net>
Message-ID: <DCEEE487-A862-4C0F-983D-1933317BF744@cs.depaul.edu>

Dear fellow chicagoans,

here is a new web site made 100% with python (with Gluon).

     http://www.appealmypropertytaxes.com/

It can help you save money on property taxes. Mind that it is still  
under testing.

Massimo


From mdipierro at cs.depaul.edu  Sun Dec  2 04:05:55 2007
From: mdipierro at cs.depaul.edu (Massimo Di Pierro)
Date: Sat, 1 Dec 2007 21:05:55 -0600
Subject: [Chicago] how python can save you money
In-Reply-To: <20071202020744.GB26452@furrr.two14.net>
References: <804e5c70711291306rb3faf64wdb6a6ae521abf133@mail.gmail.com>
	<474F3301.6000806@colorstudy.com>
	<20071202020744.GB26452@furrr.two14.net>
Message-ID: <D3E91010-99B5-4780-B73E-851A6FB20883@cs.depaul.edu>

Dear fellow chicagoans,

here is a new web site made 100% with python (with Gluon).

     http://www.appealmypropertytaxes.com/

It can help you save money on property taxes. Mind that it is still  
under testing.

Massimo


From kumar.mcmillan at gmail.com  Sun Dec  2 04:58:50 2007
From: kumar.mcmillan at gmail.com (Kumar McMillan)
Date: Sat, 1 Dec 2007 21:58:50 -0600
Subject: [Chicago] is there really no built-in file/iter split() thing?
In-Reply-To: <475215B5.4000307@personnelware.com>
References: <b571660a0711301349s1a6aef24m995673ac0e5743d0@mail.gmail.com>
	<4751DAEC.1010306@colorstudy.com> <4751E741.6070002@personnelware.com>
	<b571660a0712011508g20ae1509o4e059fbc46b3ea54@mail.gmail.com>
	<475215B5.4000307@personnelware.com>
Message-ID: <b571660a0712011958p2cfad83cg403987abaf5acee@mail.gmail.com>

On Dec 1, 2007 8:17 PM, Carl Karsten <carl at personnelware.com> wrote:
> Kumar McMillan wrote:
> > On Dec 1, 2007 4:59 PM, Carl Karsten <carl at personnelware.com> wrote:
> >>  > Assuming open('big.sql').read().split(';') would be a dumb idea,
> >>
> >> How about we just not assume that?  If it is, lets see the proof so we have a
> >> good idea how bad it is, which will help gauge how elaborate of a work around is
> >> justified.
> >
> > the file I was parsing was 45M.  If you want to test it on *your*
> > machine, go ahead and post back the results :)  It would be nice to
> > see, actually.  My assumption is that it will try to allocate at least
> > 90M of memory but, yes, it is still just an assumption.
>
> carl at vaio:~$ free -m
>               total       used       free     shared    buffers     cached
> Mem:           376         26        349          0          0          4
> -/+ buffers/cache:         21        354
> Swap:          627         56        570
> carl at vaio:~$ time python
> Python 2.5.1 (r251:54863, Oct  5 2007, 13:36:32)
> [GCC 4.1.3 20070929 (prerelease) (Ubuntu 4.1.2-16ubuntu2)] on linux2
> Type "help", "copyright", "credits" or "license" for more information.
>  >>> import datetime
>  >>> s=datetime.datetime.now()
>  >>> x='abc;'*(45000000/4)
>  >>> datetime.datetime.now() - s
> datetime.timedelta(0, 9, 131028)
>  >>> len(x)
> 45000000
>  >>> s=datetime.datetime.now()
>  >>> y=x.split(';')
> datetime.datetime.now() - s
>  >>> datetime.datetime.now() - s
> datetime.timedelta(0, 23, 222340)
>  >>> len(y)
> 11250001
>  >>>
>
> real    2m48.391s
> user    0m4.016s
> sys     0m2.320s
>
> in a 2nd shell, after doing y=...
> carl at vaio:~$ ps vp 7191
>    PID TTY      STAT   TIME  MAJFL   TRS   DRS   RSS %MEM COMMAND
>   7191 pts/2    S+     0:03    283   985 461442 340092 88.1 python
>
> Anyone know what that means?

you could try using pysizer instead:
http://pysizer.8325.org/
http://pysizer.8325.org/doc/tutorial.html

"PySizer is a memory usage profiler for Python code."

I've never tried using it myself.

>
> Most of the 2m48s was after I hit ^D to exit python.  Not really sure why that
> would take so much longer than creating y.  I got too much stuff open on my box
> with 1gb.
>
>
> Carl K
> _______________________________________________
> Chicago mailing list
> Chicago at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>

From tcp at mac.com  Sun Dec  2 05:54:57 2007
From: tcp at mac.com (Ted Pollari)
Date: Sat, 1 Dec 2007 20:54:57 -0800
Subject: [Chicago] constant length string manipulation
In-Reply-To: <20071202015821.GA26452@furrr.two14.net>
References: <804e5c70711291306rb3faf64wdb6a6ae521abf133@mail.gmail.com>
	<804e5c70711291321s489888dbj9415b4411300643d@mail.gmail.com>
	<3096c19d0711300752i6a2b7bb6o68925dae2a3d191a@mail.gmail.com>
	<eb9a21ad0711301128p7bd9d463s6e65e911d4037fd2@mail.gmail.com>
	<20071202015821.GA26452@furrr.two14.net>
Message-ID: <83C770D4-695F-47F4-B8C1-2CD42BA17E42@mac.com>


On Dec 1, 2007, at 5:58 PM, Martin Maney wrote:

> On Fri, Nov 30, 2007 at 01:28:37PM -0600, Jon Sudlow wrote:
>> I really enjoyed Chris's Response.
>
> Yeah.  Waiter, we want some of what he's on.  Unless it's addictive.

Then we want ALL of it.

From mdipierro at cs.depaul.edu  Sun Dec  2 06:13:13 2007
From: mdipierro at cs.depaul.edu (Massimo Di Pierro)
Date: Sat, 1 Dec 2007 23:13:13 -0600
Subject: [Chicago] constant length string manipulation
In-Reply-To: <804e5c70711300725h16ed75f1o8b910362cbe19465@mail.gmail.com>
References: <804e5c70711291306rb3faf64wdb6a6ae521abf133@mail.gmail.com>
	<804e5c70711291321s489888dbj9415b4411300643d@mail.gmail.com>
	<276266d0711291329h778749bdya13099c42736b839@mail.gmail.com>
	<804e5c70711300725h16ed75f1o8b910362cbe19465@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <C7C492B9-BA11-49C4-BF60-B5A0A5D553E8@cs.depaul.edu>


what's wrong with

b=(a[:5]+'     ')[:5]

Massimo

On Nov 30, 2007, at 9:25 AM, Lukasz Szybalski wrote:

> On Nov 29, 2007 3:29 PM, Cosmin Stejerean <cstejerean at gmail.com>  
> wrote:
>> b.ljust(5)[:5]
>
> a='1234567890' or a='123'
> b=a.ljust(5)[:5]
>
> so I guess ljust will do.
> Thanks.
> Lucas
> _______________________________________________
> Chicago mailing list
> Chicago at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago


From carl at personnelware.com  Sun Dec  2 06:29:45 2007
From: carl at personnelware.com (Carl Karsten)
Date: Sat, 01 Dec 2007 23:29:45 -0600
Subject: [Chicago] constant length string manipulation
In-Reply-To: <C7C492B9-BA11-49C4-BF60-B5A0A5D553E8@cs.depaul.edu>
References: <804e5c70711291306rb3faf64wdb6a6ae521abf133@mail.gmail.com>	<804e5c70711291321s489888dbj9415b4411300643d@mail.gmail.com>	<276266d0711291329h778749bdya13099c42736b839@mail.gmail.com>	<804e5c70711300725h16ed75f1o8b910362cbe19465@mail.gmail.com>
	<C7C492B9-BA11-49C4-BF60-B5A0A5D553E8@cs.depaul.edu>
Message-ID: <475242C9.8020309@personnelware.com>

string concatenation is icky.

you have too many 5s.

the line is too long.

your variables are too short.

there are no comments.

and it isn't OOP.

Carl K

Massimo Di Pierro wrote:
> what's wrong with
> 
> b=(a[:5]+'     ')[:5]
> 
> Massimo
> 
> On Nov 30, 2007, at 9:25 AM, Lukasz Szybalski wrote:
> 
>> On Nov 29, 2007 3:29 PM, Cosmin Stejerean <cstejerean at gmail.com>  
>> wrote:
>>> b.ljust(5)[:5]
>> a='1234567890' or a='123'
>> b=a.ljust(5)[:5]
>>
>> so I guess ljust will do.
>> Thanks.
>> Lucas
>> _______________________________________________
>> Chicago mailing list
>> Chicago at python.org
>> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Chicago mailing list
> Chicago at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
> 
> 

From mdipierro at cs.depaul.edu  Sun Dec  2 06:50:44 2007
From: mdipierro at cs.depaul.edu (Massimo Di Pierro)
Date: Sat, 1 Dec 2007 23:50:44 -0600
Subject: [Chicago] is there really no built-in file/iter split() thing?
In-Reply-To: <b571660a0711301349s1a6aef24m995673ac0e5743d0@mail.gmail.com>
References: <b571660a0711301349s1a6aef24m995673ac0e5743d0@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <6CF4E080-F7DE-4977-A3E1-2E0A8B44D283@cs.depaul.edu>

Try this

import re, mmap
file=open(filename,'r')
mfile=mmap.mmap(file.fileno(),0,prot=mmap.PROT_READ)
items=re.compile('[^;]+').finditer(mfile)
for item in items: print item.group()

Massimo

On Nov 30, 2007, at 3:49 PM, Kumar McMillan wrote:

> [In the hope that Chris has another awesome response...]
>
> Here is another: I have a big sql file (45M) and need to iter through
> the statements---no fancy sql parsing, I just want the statements.
> Assuming open('big.sql').read().split(';') would be a dumb idea, I
> couldn't find anything in stdlib to do this.  What am I missing?  I
> thought the tokenize module would but I couldn't see how at first
> glance.
>
> def readsplit(filelike, token):
>     """yields each chunk between tokens in contents of filelike  
> object.
>
>     For example::
>
>>>> [c for c in readsplit(StringIO('''bad; ass; elf in
>         ... the forest;'''), ';')]
>         ...
>         ['bad', ' ass', ' elf in \\nthe forest', '']
>>>> [c for c in readsplit(StringIO(''';
>         ... 1,2,3;
>         ...    and 4; and
>         ... even 5'''), ';')]
>         ...
>         ['', '\\n1,2,3', '\\n   and 4', ' and\\neven 5']
>>>>
>
>     """
>     buf = []
>     for line in filelike:
>         buf.append(line)
>         line = ''.join(buf)
>         buf[:] = []
>         chunks = line.split(';')
>         for chunk in chunks[:-1]:
>             yield chunk
>         buf.append(chunks[-1])
>     if len(buf):
>         yield ''.join(buf)<readsplit.py><ATT00001>


From cstejerean at gmail.com  Sun Dec  2 07:14:06 2007
From: cstejerean at gmail.com (Cosmin Stejerean)
Date: Sat, 1 Dec 2007 22:14:06 -0800
Subject: [Chicago] constant length string manipulation
In-Reply-To: <475242C9.8020309@personnelware.com>
References: <804e5c70711291306rb3faf64wdb6a6ae521abf133@mail.gmail.com>
	<804e5c70711291321s489888dbj9415b4411300643d@mail.gmail.com>
	<276266d0711291329h778749bdya13099c42736b839@mail.gmail.com>
	<804e5c70711300725h16ed75f1o8b910362cbe19465@mail.gmail.com>
	<C7C492B9-BA11-49C4-BF60-B5A0A5D553E8@cs.depaul.edu>
	<475242C9.8020309@personnelware.com>
Message-ID: <93AD5301-3B24-430B-A801-6DA40E02E03D@gmail.com>

It's cheating. What if he wanted 10 instead of 5? Hardcoding spaces is  
a bad idea.

Cosmin Stejerean (m)


On Dec 1, 2007, at 9:29 PM, Carl Karsten <carl at personnelware.com> wrote:

> string concatenation is icky.
>
> you have too many 5s.
>
> the line is too long.
>
> your variables are too short.
>
> there are no comments.
>
> and it isn't OOP.
>
> Carl K
>
> Massimo Di Pierro wrote:
>> what's wrong with
>>
>> b=(a[:5]+'     ')[:5]
>>
>> Massimo
>>
>> On Nov 30, 2007, at 9:25 AM, Lukasz Szybalski wrote:
>>
>>> On Nov 29, 2007 3:29 PM, Cosmin Stejerean <cstejerean at gmail.com>
>>> wrote:
>>>> b.ljust(5)[:5]
>>> a='1234567890' or a='123'
>>> b=a.ljust(5)[:5]
>>>
>>> so I guess ljust will do.
>>> Thanks.
>>> Lucas
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Chicago mailing list
>>> Chicago at python.org
>>> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Chicago mailing list
>> Chicago at python.org
>> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>>
>>
> _______________________________________________
> Chicago mailing list
> Chicago at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago

From kumar.mcmillan at gmail.com  Sun Dec  2 07:23:30 2007
From: kumar.mcmillan at gmail.com (Kumar McMillan)
Date: Sun, 2 Dec 2007 00:23:30 -0600
Subject: [Chicago] is there really no built-in file/iter split() thing?
In-Reply-To: <6CF4E080-F7DE-4977-A3E1-2E0A8B44D283@cs.depaul.edu>
References: <b571660a0711301349s1a6aef24m995673ac0e5743d0@mail.gmail.com>
	<6CF4E080-F7DE-4977-A3E1-2E0A8B44D283@cs.depaul.edu>
Message-ID: <b571660a0712012223h6d32abcl43bf887ada391647@mail.gmail.com>

On Dec 1, 2007 11:50 PM, Massimo Di Pierro <mdipierro at cs.depaul.edu> wrote:
> Try this
>
> import re, mmap
> file=open(filename,'r')
> mfile=mmap.mmap(file.fileno(),0,prot=mmap.PROT_READ)
> items=re.compile('[^;]+').finditer(mfile)
> for item in items: print item.group()

nice!  I didn't know about mmap.

>
> Massimo
>
> On Nov 30, 2007, at 3:49 PM, Kumar McMillan wrote:
>
>
> > [In the hope that Chris has another awesome response...]
> >
> > Here is another: I have a big sql file (45M) and need to iter through
> > the statements---no fancy sql parsing, I just want the statements.
> > Assuming open('big.sql').read().split(';') would be a dumb idea, I
> > couldn't find anything in stdlib to do this.  What am I missing?  I
> > thought the tokenize module would but I couldn't see how at first
> > glance.
> >
> > def readsplit(filelike, token):
> >     """yields each chunk between tokens in contents of filelike
> > object.
> >
> >     For example::
> >
> >>>> [c for c in readsplit(StringIO('''bad; ass; elf in
> >         ... the forest;'''), ';')]
> >         ...
> >         ['bad', ' ass', ' elf in \\nthe forest', '']
> >>>> [c for c in readsplit(StringIO(''';
> >         ... 1,2,3;
> >         ...    and 4; and
> >         ... even 5'''), ';')]
> >         ...
> >         ['', '\\n1,2,3', '\\n   and 4', ' and\\neven 5']
> >>>>
> >
> >     """
> >     buf = []
> >     for line in filelike:
> >         buf.append(line)
> >         line = ''.join(buf)
> >         buf[:] = []
> >         chunks = line.split(';')
> >         for chunk in chunks[:-1]:
> >             yield chunk
> >         buf.append(chunks[-1])
> >     if len(buf):
> >         yield ''.join(buf)<readsplit.py><ATT00001>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Chicago mailing list
> Chicago at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>

From mdipierro at cs.depaul.edu  Sun Dec  2 07:26:25 2007
From: mdipierro at cs.depaul.edu (Massimo Di Pierro)
Date: Sun, 2 Dec 2007 00:26:25 -0600
Subject: [Chicago] constant length string manipulation
In-Reply-To: <93AD5301-3B24-430B-A801-6DA40E02E03D@gmail.com>
References: <804e5c70711291306rb3faf64wdb6a6ae521abf133@mail.gmail.com>
	<804e5c70711291321s489888dbj9415b4411300643d@mail.gmail.com>
	<276266d0711291329h778749bdya13099c42736b839@mail.gmail.com>
	<804e5c70711300725h16ed75f1o8b910362cbe19465@mail.gmail.com>
	<C7C492B9-BA11-49C4-BF60-B5A0A5D553E8@cs.depaul.edu>
	<475242C9.8020309@personnelware.com>
	<93AD5301-3B24-430B-A801-6DA40E02E03D@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <11CF27B7-3143-47FB-82C6-E864157810FB@cs.depaul.edu>

f=lambda a,n: (a[:n]+' '*n)[:n] # theta(n) for every a
f('hello world',5)

On Dec 2, 2007, at 12:14 AM, Cosmin Stejerean wrote:

> It's cheating. What if he wanted 10 instead of 5? Hardcoding spaces is
> a bad idea.
>
> Cosmin Stejerean (m)
>
>
> On Dec 1, 2007, at 9:29 PM, Carl Karsten <carl at personnelware.com>  
> wrote:
>
>> string concatenation is icky.
>>
>> you have too many 5s.
>>
>> the line is too long.
>>
>> your variables are too short.
>>
>> there are no comments.
>>
>> and it isn't OOP.
>>
>> Carl K
>>
>> Massimo Di Pierro wrote:
>>> what's wrong with
>>>
>>> b=(a[:5]+'     ')[:5]
>>>
>>> Massimo
>>>
>>> On Nov 30, 2007, at 9:25 AM, Lukasz Szybalski wrote:
>>>
>>>> On Nov 29, 2007 3:29 PM, Cosmin Stejerean <cstejerean at gmail.com>
>>>> wrote:
>>>>> b.ljust(5)[:5]
>>>> a='1234567890' or a='123'
>>>> b=a.ljust(5)[:5]
>>>>
>>>> so I guess ljust will do.
>>>> Thanks.
>>>> Lucas
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> Chicago mailing list
>>>> Chicago at python.org
>>>> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Chicago mailing list
>>> Chicago at python.org
>>> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>>>
>>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Chicago mailing list
>> Chicago at python.org
>> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
> _______________________________________________
> Chicago mailing list
> Chicago at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago


From skip at pobox.com  Sun Dec  2 08:52:01 2007
From: skip at pobox.com (skip at pobox.com)
Date: Sun, 2 Dec 2007 01:52:01 -0600
Subject: [Chicago] is there really no built-in file/iter split() thing?
In-Reply-To: <4751DAEC.1010306@colorstudy.com>
References: <b571660a0711301349s1a6aef24m995673ac0e5743d0@mail.gmail.com>
	<4751DAEC.1010306@colorstudy.com>
Message-ID: <18258.25633.137508.252881@montanaro.dyndns.org>


    Ian> One thing I've noticed is that some string operations are fairly
    Ian> efficient in this case, because they notice when they wouldn't do
    Ian> anything and don't create a new string.

    ...

    >>> x.split()[0] is x
    False

Patch here:

    http://bugs.python.org/issue1538

Skip

From jeffh at dundeemt.com  Sun Dec  2 15:29:53 2007
From: jeffh at dundeemt.com (Jeff Hinrichs - DM&T)
Date: Sun, 2 Dec 2007 08:29:53 -0600
Subject: [Chicago] constant length string manipulation
In-Reply-To: <11CF27B7-3143-47FB-82C6-E864157810FB@cs.depaul.edu>
References: <804e5c70711291306rb3faf64wdb6a6ae521abf133@mail.gmail.com>
	<804e5c70711291321s489888dbj9415b4411300643d@mail.gmail.com>
	<276266d0711291329h778749bdya13099c42736b839@mail.gmail.com>
	<804e5c70711300725h16ed75f1o8b910362cbe19465@mail.gmail.com>
	<C7C492B9-BA11-49C4-BF60-B5A0A5D553E8@cs.depaul.edu>
	<475242C9.8020309@personnelware.com>
	<93AD5301-3B24-430B-A801-6DA40E02E03D@gmail.com>
	<11CF27B7-3143-47FB-82C6-E864157810FB@cs.depaul.edu>
Message-ID: <5aaed53f0712020629u5c0c1dc8h88fdc9164919f03b@mail.gmail.com>

Actually, this kind of problem just screams recursion

def s5(s):
	if len(s) < 5: s=s5(s+' ')
	if len(s) > 5: s=s5(s[:-1])
	return s

print s5('Hello Worlds')


On Dec 2, 2007 12:26 AM, Massimo Di Pierro <mdipierro at cs.depaul.edu> wrote:
> f=lambda a,n: (a[:n]+' '*n)[:n] # theta(n) for every a
> f('hello world',5)
>
>
> On Dec 2, 2007, at 12:14 AM, Cosmin Stejerean wrote:
>
> > It's cheating. What if he wanted 10 instead of 5? Hardcoding spaces is
> > a bad idea.
> >
> > Cosmin Stejerean (m)
> >
> >
> > On Dec 1, 2007, at 9:29 PM, Carl Karsten <carl at personnelware.com>
> > wrote:
> >
> >> string concatenation is icky.
> >>
> >> you have too many 5s.
> >>
> >> the line is too long.
> >>
> >> your variables are too short.
> >>
> >> there are no comments.
> >>
> >> and it isn't OOP.
> >>
> >> Carl K
> >>
> >> Massimo Di Pierro wrote:
> >>> what's wrong with
> >>>
> >>> b=(a[:5]+'     ')[:5]
> >>>
> >>> Massimo
> >>>
> >>> On Nov 30, 2007, at 9:25 AM, Lukasz Szybalski wrote:
> >>>
> >>>> On Nov 29, 2007 3:29 PM, Cosmin Stejerean <cstejerean at gmail.com>
> >>>> wrote:
> >>>>> b.ljust(5)[:5]
> >>>> a='1234567890' or a='123'
> >>>> b=a.ljust(5)[:5]
> >>>>
> >>>> so I guess ljust will do.
> >>>> Thanks.
> >>>> Lucas
> >>>> _______________________________________________
> >>>> Chicago mailing list
> >>>> Chicago at python.org
> >>>> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
> >>>
> >>> _______________________________________________
> >>> Chicago mailing list
> >>> Chicago at python.org
> >>> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
> >>>
> >>>
> >> _______________________________________________
> >> Chicago mailing list
> >> Chicago at python.org
> >> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
> > _______________________________________________
> > Chicago mailing list
> > Chicago at python.org
> > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>
> _______________________________________________
> Chicago mailing list
> Chicago at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>



-- 
Jeff Hinrichs
Dundee Media & Technology, Inc
jeffh at dundeemt.com
402.218.1473

From carl at personnelware.com  Sun Dec  2 16:42:36 2007
From: carl at personnelware.com (Carl Karsten)
Date: Sun, 02 Dec 2007 09:42:36 -0600
Subject: [Chicago] constant length string manipulation
In-Reply-To: <5aaed53f0712020629u5c0c1dc8h88fdc9164919f03b@mail.gmail.com>
References: <804e5c70711291306rb3faf64wdb6a6ae521abf133@mail.gmail.com>	<804e5c70711291321s489888dbj9415b4411300643d@mail.gmail.com>	<276266d0711291329h778749bdya13099c42736b839@mail.gmail.com>	<804e5c70711300725h16ed75f1o8b910362cbe19465@mail.gmail.com>	<C7C492B9-BA11-49C4-BF60-B5A0A5D553E8@cs.depaul.edu>	<475242C9.8020309@personnelware.com>	<93AD5301-3B24-430B-A801-6DA40E02E03D@gmail.com>	<11CF27B7-3143-47FB-82C6-E864157810FB@cs.depaul.edu>
	<5aaed53f0712020629u5c0c1dc8h88fdc9164919f03b@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <4752D26C.6070801@personnelware.com>

def s5(s):
   if len(s)<>5:
     s=s5((s+' ')[:5])
   return s

print s5('Hello Worlds').__repr__()
print s5('He').__repr__()

The :5 blows the elegance.

I thought I could +1 and -1 at the same time and have it converge on 5, but that 
didn't work.

Carl K



Jeff Hinrichs - DM&T wrote:
> Actually, this kind of problem just screams recursion
> 
> def s5(s):
> 	if len(s) < 5: s=s5(s+' ')
> 	if len(s) > 5: s=s5(s[:-1])
> 	return s
> 
> print s5('Hello Worlds')
> 
> 
> On Dec 2, 2007 12:26 AM, Massimo Di Pierro <mdipierro at cs.depaul.edu> wrote:
>> f=lambda a,n: (a[:n]+' '*n)[:n] # theta(n) for every a
>> f('hello world',5)
>>
>>
>> On Dec 2, 2007, at 12:14 AM, Cosmin Stejerean wrote:
>>
>>> It's cheating. What if he wanted 10 instead of 5? Hardcoding spaces is
>>> a bad idea.
>>>
>>> Cosmin Stejerean (m)
>>>
>>>
>>> On Dec 1, 2007, at 9:29 PM, Carl Karsten <carl at personnelware.com>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>> string concatenation is icky.
>>>>
>>>> you have too many 5s.
>>>>
>>>> the line is too long.
>>>>
>>>> your variables are too short.
>>>>
>>>> there are no comments.
>>>>
>>>> and it isn't OOP.
>>>>
>>>> Carl K
>>>>
>>>> Massimo Di Pierro wrote:
>>>>> what's wrong with
>>>>>
>>>>> b=(a[:5]+'     ')[:5]
>>>>>
>>>>> Massimo
>>>>>
>>>>> On Nov 30, 2007, at 9:25 AM, Lukasz Szybalski wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> On Nov 29, 2007 3:29 PM, Cosmin Stejerean <cstejerean at gmail.com>
>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>> b.ljust(5)[:5]
>>>>>> a='1234567890' or a='123'
>>>>>> b=a.ljust(5)[:5]
>>>>>>
>>>>>> so I guess ljust will do.
>>>>>> Thanks.
>>>>>> Lucas
>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>> Chicago mailing list
>>>>>> Chicago at python.org
>>>>>> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>> Chicago mailing list
>>>>> Chicago at python.org
>>>>> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> Chicago mailing list
>>>> Chicago at python.org
>>>> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Chicago mailing list
>>> Chicago at python.org
>>> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>> _______________________________________________
>> Chicago mailing list
>> Chicago at python.org
>> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>>
> 
> 
> 

From mdipierro at cs.depaul.edu  Sun Dec  2 16:48:49 2007
From: mdipierro at cs.depaul.edu (Massimo Di Pierro)
Date: Sun, 2 Dec 2007 09:48:49 -0600
Subject: [Chicago] constant length string manipulation
In-Reply-To: <4752D26C.6070801@personnelware.com>
References: <804e5c70711291306rb3faf64wdb6a6ae521abf133@mail.gmail.com>
	<804e5c70711291321s489888dbj9415b4411300643d@mail.gmail.com>
	<276266d0711291329h778749bdya13099c42736b839@mail.gmail.com>
	<804e5c70711300725h16ed75f1o8b910362cbe19465@mail.gmail.com>
	<C7C492B9-BA11-49C4-BF60-B5A0A5D553E8@cs.depaul.edu>
	<475242C9.8020309@personnelware.com>
	<93AD5301-3B24-430B-A801-6DA40E02E03D@gmail.com>
	<11CF27B7-3143-47FB-82C6-E864157810FB@cs.depaul.edu>
	<5aaed53f0712020629u5c0c1dc8h88fdc9164919f03b@mail.gmail.com>
	<4752D26C.6070801@personnelware.com>
Message-ID: <A62D6534-6B34-4A3D-BC5D-5FFE3D1BECD7@cs.depaul.edu>

c'mon. No loops... and why limit to ' ' padding?

import re
f=lambda a,n,c=' ': re.compile('.{%i}'%n).findall(a+c*n)[0]
f('hello world',5)

Massimo

On Dec 2, 2007, at 9:42 AM, Carl Karsten wrote:

> def s5(s):
>    if len(s)<>5:
>      s=s5((s+' ')[:5])
>    return s
>
> print s5('Hello Worlds').__repr__()
> print s5('He').__repr__()
>
> The :5 blows the elegance.
>
> I thought I could +1 and -1 at the same time and have it converge  
> on 5, but that
> didn't work.
>
> Carl K
>
>
>
> Jeff Hinrichs - DM&T wrote:
>> Actually, this kind of problem just screams recursion
>>
>> def s5(s):
>>       if len(s) < 5: s=s5(s+' ')
>>       if len(s) > 5: s=s5(s[:-1])
>>       return s
>>
>> print s5('Hello Worlds')
>>
>>
>> On Dec 2, 2007 12:26 AM, Massimo Di Pierro  
>> <mdipierro at cs.depaul.edu> wrote:
>>> f=lambda a,n: (a[:n]+' '*n)[:n] # theta(n) for every a
>>> f('hello world',5)
>>>
>>>
>>> On Dec 2, 2007, at 12:14 AM, Cosmin Stejerean wrote:
>>>
>>>> It's cheating. What if he wanted 10 instead of 5? Hardcoding  
>>>> spaces is
>>>> a bad idea.
>>>>
>>>> Cosmin Stejerean (m)
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On Dec 1, 2007, at 9:29 PM, Carl Karsten <carl at personnelware.com>
>>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> string concatenation is icky.
>>>>>
>>>>> you have too many 5s.
>>>>>
>>>>> the line is too long.
>>>>>
>>>>> your variables are too short.
>>>>>
>>>>> there are no comments.
>>>>>
>>>>> and it isn't OOP.
>>>>>
>>>>> Carl K
>>>>>
>>>>> Massimo Di Pierro wrote:
>>>>>> what's wrong with
>>>>>>
>>>>>> b=(a[:5]+'     ')[:5]
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Massimo
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On Nov 30, 2007, at 9:25 AM, Lukasz Szybalski wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On Nov 29, 2007 3:29 PM, Cosmin Stejerean <cstejerean at gmail.com>
>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>> b.ljust(5)[:5]
>>>>>>> a='1234567890' or a='123'
>>>>>>> b=a.ljust(5)[:5]
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> so I guess ljust will do.
>>>>>>> Thanks.
>>>>>>> Lucas
>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>> Chicago mailing list
>>>>>>> Chicago at python.org
>>>>>>> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>> Chicago mailing list
>>>>>> Chicago at python.org
>>>>>> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>> Chicago mailing list
>>>>> Chicago at python.org
>>>>> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> Chicago mailing list
>>>> Chicago at python.org
>>>> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Chicago mailing list
>>> Chicago at python.org
>>> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>>>
>>
>>
>>
> _______________________________________________
> Chicago mailing list
> Chicago at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago


From tprinty at mail.edisonave.net  Sun Dec  2 17:32:33 2007
From: tprinty at mail.edisonave.net (Tom Printy)
Date: Sun, 02 Dec 2007 10:32:33 -0600
Subject: [Chicago] how python can save you money
In-Reply-To: <DCEEE487-A862-4C0F-983D-1933317BF744@cs.depaul.edu>
References: <804e5c70711291306rb3faf64wdb6a6ae521abf133@mail.gmail.com>
	<474F3301.6000806@colorstudy.com>
	<20071202020744.GB26452@furrr.two14.net>
	<DCEEE487-A862-4C0F-983D-1933317BF744@cs.depaul.edu>
Message-ID: <1196613153.19617.0.camel@dresser>

Can you make this for Kane county ?


On Sat, 2007-12-01 at 21:05 -0600, Massimo Di Pierro wrote:
> Dear fellow chicagoans,
> 
> here is a new web site made 100% with python (with Gluon).
> 
>      http://www.appealmypropertytaxes.com/
> 
> It can help you save money on property taxes. Mind that it is still  
> under testing.
> 
> Massimo
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Chicago mailing list
> Chicago at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago


From cstejerean at gmail.com  Sun Dec  2 18:02:52 2007
From: cstejerean at gmail.com (Cosmin Stejerean)
Date: Sun, 2 Dec 2007 09:02:52 -0800
Subject: [Chicago] constant length string manipulation
In-Reply-To: <A62D6534-6B34-4A3D-BC5D-5FFE3D1BECD7@cs.depaul.edu>
References: <804e5c70711291306rb3faf64wdb6a6ae521abf133@mail.gmail.com>
	<804e5c70711291321s489888dbj9415b4411300643d@mail.gmail.com>
	<276266d0711291329h778749bdya13099c42736b839@mail.gmail.com>
	<804e5c70711300725h16ed75f1o8b910362cbe19465@mail.gmail.com>
	<C7C492B9-BA11-49C4-BF60-B5A0A5D553E8@cs.depaul.edu>
	<475242C9.8020309@personnelware.com>
	<93AD5301-3B24-430B-A801-6DA40E02E03D@gmail.com>
	<11CF27B7-3143-47FB-82C6-E864157810FB@cs.depaul.edu>
	<5aaed53f0712020629u5c0c1dc8h88fdc9164919f03b@mail.gmail.com>
	<4752D26C.6070801@personnelware.com>
	<A62D6534-6B34-4A3D-BC5D-5FFE3D1BECD7@cs.depaul.edu>
Message-ID: <EF66695F-30F3-4BB3-8BB7-F999A1D5A60A@gmail.com>

In case everyone forgot, this is Python not perl: there is only one  
way to do it (it just so happens to be my way)

This is turning into an exercise of writing obfuscated code.

Cosmin Stejerean (m)


On Dec 2, 2007, at 7:48 AM, Massimo Di Pierro  
<mdipierro at cs.depaul.edu> wrote:

> c'mon. No loops... and why limit to ' ' padding?
>
> import re
> f=lambda a,n,c=' ': re.compile('.{%i}'%n).findall(a+c*n)[0]
> f('hello world',5)
>
> Massimo
>
> On Dec 2, 2007, at 9:42 AM, Carl Karsten wrote:
>
>> def s5(s):
>>   if len(s)<>5:
>>     s=s5((s+' ')[:5])
>>   return s
>>
>> print s5('Hello Worlds').__repr__()
>> print s5('He').__repr__()
>>
>> The :5 blows the elegance.
>>
>> I thought I could +1 and -1 at the same time and have it converge
>> on 5, but that
>> didn't work.
>>
>> Carl K
>>
>>
>>
>> Jeff Hinrichs - DM&T wrote:
>>> Actually, this kind of problem just screams recursion
>>>
>>> def s5(s):
>>>      if len(s) < 5: s=s5(s+' ')
>>>      if len(s) > 5: s=s5(s[:-1])
>>>      return s
>>>
>>> print s5('Hello Worlds')
>>>
>>>
>>> On Dec 2, 2007 12:26 AM, Massimo Di Pierro
>>> <mdipierro at cs.depaul.edu> wrote:
>>>> f=lambda a,n: (a[:n]+' '*n)[:n] # theta(n) for every a
>>>> f('hello world',5)
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On Dec 2, 2007, at 12:14 AM, Cosmin Stejerean wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> It's cheating. What if he wanted 10 instead of 5? Hardcoding
>>>>> spaces is
>>>>> a bad idea.
>>>>>
>>>>> Cosmin Stejerean (m)
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> On Dec 1, 2007, at 9:29 PM, Carl Karsten <carl at personnelware.com>
>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> string concatenation is icky.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> you have too many 5s.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> the line is too long.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> your variables are too short.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> there are no comments.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> and it isn't OOP.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Carl K
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Massimo Di Pierro wrote:
>>>>>>> what's wrong with
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> b=(a[:5]+'     ')[:5]
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Massimo
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On Nov 30, 2007, at 9:25 AM, Lukasz Szybalski wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> On Nov 29, 2007 3:29 PM, Cosmin Stejerean  
>>>>>>>> <cstejerean at gmail.com>
>>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>>> b.ljust(5)[:5]
>>>>>>>> a='1234567890' or a='123'
>>>>>>>> b=a.ljust(5)[:5]
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> so I guess ljust will do.
>>>>>>>> Thanks.
>>>>>>>> Lucas
>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>> Chicago mailing list
>>>>>>>> Chicago at python.org
>>>>>>>> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>> Chicago mailing list
>>>>>>> Chicago at python.org
>>>>>>> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>> Chicago mailing list
>>>>>> Chicago at python.org
>>>>>> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>> Chicago mailing list
>>>>> Chicago at python.org
>>>>> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> Chicago mailing list
>>>> Chicago at python.org
>>>> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Chicago mailing list
>> Chicago at python.org
>> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>
> _______________________________________________
> Chicago mailing list
> Chicago at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago

From carl at personnelware.com  Sun Dec  2 19:07:18 2007
From: carl at personnelware.com (Carl Karsten)
Date: Sun, 02 Dec 2007 12:07:18 -0600
Subject: [Chicago] constant length string manipulation
In-Reply-To: <EF66695F-30F3-4BB3-8BB7-F999A1D5A60A@gmail.com>
References: <804e5c70711291306rb3faf64wdb6a6ae521abf133@mail.gmail.com>	<804e5c70711291321s489888dbj9415b4411300643d@mail.gmail.com>	<276266d0711291329h778749bdya13099c42736b839@mail.gmail.com>	<804e5c70711300725h16ed75f1o8b910362cbe19465@mail.gmail.com>	<C7C492B9-BA11-49C4-BF60-B5A0A5D553E8@cs.depaul.edu>	<475242C9.8020309@personnelware.com>	<93AD5301-3B24-430B-A801-6DA40E02E03D@gmail.com>	<11CF27B7-3143-47FB-82C6-E864157810FB@cs.depaul.edu>	<5aaed53f0712020629u5c0c1dc8h88fdc9164919f03b@mail.gmail.com>	<4752D26C.6070801@personnelware.com>	<A62D6534-6B34-4A3D-BC5D-5FFE3D1BECD7@cs.depaul.edu>
	<EF66695F-30F3-4BB3-8BB7-F999A1D5A60A@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <4752F456.6030802@personnelware.com>

Cosmin Stejerean wrote:
> In case everyone forgot, this is Python not perl: there is only one  
> way to do it (it just so happens to be my way)

you way is... let me check... "stupid!"

> 
> This is turning into an exercise of writing obfuscated code.

turning into?  you mean we aren't their yet?  I can hardly wait till the real 
obfuscation starts happening.

> 
> Cosmin Stejerean (m)
> 
> 
> On Dec 2, 2007, at 7:48 AM, Massimo Di Pierro  
> <mdipierro at cs.depaul.edu> wrote:
> 
>> c'mon. No loops... and why limit to ' ' padding?
>>
>> import re
>> f=lambda a,n,c=' ': re.compile('.{%i}'%n).findall(a+c*n)[0]
>> f('hello world',5)
>>
>> Massimo
>>
>> On Dec 2, 2007, at 9:42 AM, Carl Karsten wrote:
>>
>>> def s5(s):
>>>   if len(s)<>5:
>>>     s=s5((s+' ')[:5])
>>>   return s
>>>
>>> print s5('Hello Worlds').__repr__()
>>> print s5('He').__repr__()
>>>
>>> The :5 blows the elegance.
>>>
>>> I thought I could +1 and -1 at the same time and have it converge
>>> on 5, but that
>>> didn't work.
>>>
>>> Carl K
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Jeff Hinrichs - DM&T wrote:
>>>> Actually, this kind of problem just screams recursion
>>>>
>>>> def s5(s):
>>>>      if len(s) < 5: s=s5(s+' ')
>>>>      if len(s) > 5: s=s5(s[:-1])
>>>>      return s
>>>>
>>>> print s5('Hello Worlds')
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On Dec 2, 2007 12:26 AM, Massimo Di Pierro
>>>> <mdipierro at cs.depaul.edu> wrote:
>>>>> f=lambda a,n: (a[:n]+' '*n)[:n] # theta(n) for every a
>>>>> f('hello world',5)
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> On Dec 2, 2007, at 12:14 AM, Cosmin Stejerean wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> It's cheating. What if he wanted 10 instead of 5? Hardcoding
>>>>>> spaces is
>>>>>> a bad idea.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Cosmin Stejerean (m)
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On Dec 1, 2007, at 9:29 PM, Carl Karsten <carl at personnelware.com>
>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> string concatenation is icky.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> you have too many 5s.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> the line is too long.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> your variables are too short.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> there are no comments.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> and it isn't OOP.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Carl K
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Massimo Di Pierro wrote:
>>>>>>>> what's wrong with
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> b=(a[:5]+'     ')[:5]
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Massimo
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> On Nov 30, 2007, at 9:25 AM, Lukasz Szybalski wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> On Nov 29, 2007 3:29 PM, Cosmin Stejerean  
>>>>>>>>> <cstejerean at gmail.com>
>>>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>> b.ljust(5)[:5]
>>>>>>>>> a='1234567890' or a='123'
>>>>>>>>> b=a.ljust(5)[:5]
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> so I guess ljust will do.
>>>>>>>>> Thanks.
>>>>>>>>> Lucas
>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>>> Chicago mailing list
>>>>>>>>> Chicago at python.org
>>>>>>>>> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>> Chicago mailing list
>>>>>>>> Chicago at python.org
>>>>>>>> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>> Chicago mailing list
>>>>>>> Chicago at python.org
>>>>>>> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>> Chicago mailing list
>>>>>> Chicago at python.org
>>>>>> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>> Chicago mailing list
>>>>> Chicago at python.org
>>>>> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Chicago mailing list
>>> Chicago at python.org
>>> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>> _______________________________________________
>> Chicago mailing list
>> Chicago at python.org
>> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
> _______________________________________________
> Chicago mailing list
> Chicago at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
> 
> 

From jason at hostedlabs.com  Sun Dec  2 19:44:01 2007
From: jason at hostedlabs.com (Jason Rexilius)
Date: Sun, 02 Dec 2007 12:44:01 -0600
Subject: [Chicago] BARcamp Updates - Events,  Jobs
Message-ID: <4752FCF1.9000304@hostedlabs.com>

Hi Everyone!

   Another update about upcoming events and some other good stuff!

###################

This Thursday 12/6/07, 6pm @ Debonair Social Club  1575 N Milwaukee Ave 
in Wicker Park...  Ignite-Chicago!

Sean Harper is putting together a great winter-time event, a little more 
organized than BARcamp ;-)

Ignite Chicago is a small conference, free and open to the community, 
built around 5 minute presentations that include 20 slides each 
(allowing for 15 seconds / slide).
http://ignite-chicago.org/
RSVP at
http://upcoming.yahoo.com/event/309951


###################

Also wanted to tell everyone about some great jobs out there:

HostedLABS (my company) is hiring a CTO, Software Engineers, and PHP 
developers.  Will be at Ignite, would love to chat with people there!

Tribune is hiring some SA's, DBA's and QA folk (work on Metromix)

Harvest Trading is looking for a Unix SA.

Ludorum is looking for a Director of Technology.

Take a look at the Job Board (and feel free to post yours, its free for 
everyone):

http://barcampbeta.jobcoin.com/


###################

Last tid-bit..


Seems most people who replied wanted (2) BARcamps per year..  I am 
thinking seriously about that but think that perhaps doing Winter and 
Summer would be good timing for not conflicting with other BARcamps. 
Also winter is kinda dead ;-)

Any one have any last opinions on the 1 or 2 BARcamps per year questions?


Take care and see you all at Ignite this Thursday!

-jason



From kumar.mcmillan at gmail.com  Sun Dec  2 19:49:45 2007
From: kumar.mcmillan at gmail.com (Kumar McMillan)
Date: Sun, 2 Dec 2007 12:49:45 -0600
Subject: [Chicago] how python can save you money
In-Reply-To: <DCEEE487-A862-4C0F-983D-1933317BF744@cs.depaul.edu>
References: <804e5c70711291306rb3faf64wdb6a6ae521abf133@mail.gmail.com>
	<474F3301.6000806@colorstudy.com>
	<20071202020744.GB26452@furrr.two14.net>
	<DCEEE487-A862-4C0F-983D-1933317BF744@cs.depaul.edu>
Message-ID: <b571660a0712021049yc8b3669nbdd80cb8ec4568fd@mail.gmail.com>

On Dec 1, 2007 9:05 PM, Massimo Di Pierro <mdipierro at cs.depaul.edu> wrote:
> Dear fellow chicagoans,
>
> here is a new web site made 100% with python (with Gluon).
>
>      http://www.appealmypropertytaxes.com/
>
> It can help you save money on property taxes. Mind that it is still
> under testing.

why the frameset?  you are creating Bookmark Hell for your users and
some strange side effects in google page rank.


>
> Massimo
>
> _______________________________________________
> Chicago mailing list
> Chicago at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>

From cstejerean at gmail.com  Sun Dec  2 20:36:56 2007
From: cstejerean at gmail.com (Cosmin Stejerean)
Date: Sun, 2 Dec 2007 11:36:56 -0800
Subject: [Chicago] constant length string manipulation
In-Reply-To: <4752F456.6030802@personnelware.com>
References: <804e5c70711291306rb3faf64wdb6a6ae521abf133@mail.gmail.com>
	<804e5c70711291321s489888dbj9415b4411300643d@mail.gmail.com>
	<276266d0711291329h778749bdya13099c42736b839@mail.gmail.com>
	<804e5c70711300725h16ed75f1o8b910362cbe19465@mail.gmail.com>
	<C7C492B9-BA11-49C4-BF60-B5A0A5D553E8@cs.depaul.edu>
	<475242C9.8020309@personnelware.com>
	<93AD5301-3B24-430B-A801-6DA40E02E03D@gmail.com>
	<11CF27B7-3143-47FB-82C6-E864157810FB@cs.depaul.edu>
	<5aaed53f0712020629u5c0c1dc8h88fdc9164919f03b@mail.gmail.com>
	<4752D26C.6070801@personnelware.com>
	<A62D6534-6B34-4A3D-BC5D-5FFE3D1BECD7@cs.depaul.edu>
	<EF66695F-30F3-4BB3-8BB7-F999A1D5A60A@gmail.com>
	<4752F456.6030802@personnelware.com>
Message-ID: <4178DC0F-F753-4E2D-A0B8-A0E396205BB5@gmail.com>

You are correct, I meant to say "has turned". Although I bet it could  
get worse (or better depending on your point of view).

Cosmin Stejerean (m)


On Dec 2, 2007, at 10:07 AM, Carl Karsten <carl at personnelware.com>  
wrote:

> Cosmin Stejerean wrote:
>> In case everyone forgot, this is Python not perl: there is only one
>> way to do it (it just so happens to be my way)
>
> you way is... let me check... "stupid!"
>
>>
>> This is turning into an exercise of writing obfuscated code.
>
> turning into?  you mean we aren't their yet?  I can hardly wait till  
> the real
> obfuscation starts happening.
>
>>
>> Cosmin Stejerean (m)
>>
>>
>> On Dec 2, 2007, at 7:48 AM, Massimo Di Pierro
>> <mdipierro at cs.depaul.edu> wrote:
>>
>>> c'mon. No loops... and why limit to ' ' padding?
>>>
>>> import re
>>> f=lambda a,n,c=' ': re.compile('.{%i}'%n).findall(a+c*n)[0]
>>> f('hello world',5)
>>>
>>> Massimo
>>>
>>> On Dec 2, 2007, at 9:42 AM, Carl Karsten wrote:
>>>
>>>> def s5(s):
>>>>  if len(s)<>5:
>>>>    s=s5((s+' ')[:5])
>>>>  return s
>>>>
>>>> print s5('Hello Worlds').__repr__()
>>>> print s5('He').__repr__()
>>>>
>>>> The :5 blows the elegance.
>>>>
>>>> I thought I could +1 and -1 at the same time and have it converge
>>>> on 5, but that
>>>> didn't work.
>>>>
>>>> Carl K
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Jeff Hinrichs - DM&T wrote:
>>>>> Actually, this kind of problem just screams recursion
>>>>>
>>>>> def s5(s):
>>>>>     if len(s) < 5: s=s5(s+' ')
>>>>>     if len(s) > 5: s=s5(s[:-1])
>>>>>     return s
>>>>>
>>>>> print s5('Hello Worlds')
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> On Dec 2, 2007 12:26 AM, Massimo Di Pierro
>>>>> <mdipierro at cs.depaul.edu> wrote:
>>>>>> f=lambda a,n: (a[:n]+' '*n)[:n] # theta(n) for every a
>>>>>> f('hello world',5)
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On Dec 2, 2007, at 12:14 AM, Cosmin Stejerean wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> It's cheating. What if he wanted 10 instead of 5? Hardcoding
>>>>>>> spaces is
>>>>>>> a bad idea.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Cosmin Stejerean (m)
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On Dec 1, 2007, at 9:29 PM, Carl Karsten  
>>>>>>> <carl at personnelware.com>
>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> string concatenation is icky.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> you have too many 5s.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> the line is too long.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> your variables are too short.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> there are no comments.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> and it isn't OOP.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Carl K
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Massimo Di Pierro wrote:
>>>>>>>>> what's wrong with
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> b=(a[:5]+'     ')[:5]
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Massimo
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> On Nov 30, 2007, at 9:25 AM, Lukasz Szybalski wrote:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> On Nov 29, 2007 3:29 PM, Cosmin Stejerean
>>>>>>>>>> <cstejerean at gmail.com>
>>>>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>> b.ljust(5)[:5]
>>>>>>>>>> a='1234567890' or a='123'
>>>>>>>>>> b=a.ljust(5)[:5]
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> so I guess ljust will do.
>>>>>>>>>> Thanks.
>>>>>>>>>> Lucas
>>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>>>> Chicago mailing list
>>>>>>>>>> Chicago at python.org
>>>>>>>>>> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>>> Chicago mailing list
>>>>>>>>> Chicago at python.org
>>>>>>>>> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>> Chicago mailing list
>>>>>>>> Chicago at python.org
>>>>>>>> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>> Chicago mailing list
>>>>>>> Chicago at python.org
>>>>>>> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>> Chicago mailing list
>>>>>> Chicago at python.org
>>>>>> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> Chicago mailing list
>>>> Chicago at python.org
>>>> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Chicago mailing list
>>> Chicago at python.org
>>> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>> _______________________________________________
>> Chicago mailing list
>> Chicago at python.org
>> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>>
>>
> _______________________________________________
> Chicago mailing list
> Chicago at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago

From carl at personnelware.com  Sun Dec  2 21:00:32 2007
From: carl at personnelware.com (Carl Karsten)
Date: Sun, 02 Dec 2007 14:00:32 -0600
Subject: [Chicago] constant length string manipulation
In-Reply-To: <4178DC0F-F753-4E2D-A0B8-A0E396205BB5@gmail.com>
References: <804e5c70711291306rb3faf64wdb6a6ae521abf133@mail.gmail.com>	<804e5c70711291321s489888dbj9415b4411300643d@mail.gmail.com>	<276266d0711291329h778749bdya13099c42736b839@mail.gmail.com>	<804e5c70711300725h16ed75f1o8b910362cbe19465@mail.gmail.com>	<C7C492B9-BA11-49C4-BF60-B5A0A5D553E8@cs.depaul.edu>	<475242C9.8020309@personnelware.com>	<93AD5301-3B24-430B-A801-6DA40E02E03D@gmail.com>	<11CF27B7-3143-47FB-82C6-E864157810FB@cs.depaul.edu>	<5aaed53f0712020629u5c0c1dc8h88fdc9164919f03b@mail.gmail.com>	<4752D26C.6070801@personnelware.com>	<A62D6534-6B34-4A3D-BC5D-5FFE3D1BECD7@cs.depaul.edu>	<EF66695F-30F3-4BB3-8BB7-F999A1D5A60A@gmail.com>	<4752F456.6030802@personnelware.com>
	<4178DC0F-F753-4E2D-A0B8-A0E396205BB5@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <47530EE0.2040904@personnelware.com>

You set fire to the town!
But I put the fires out.
Out?!  you made them worse!
Worse, or better?

Cosmin Stejerean wrote:
> You are correct, I meant to say "has turned". Although I bet it could  
> get worse (or better depending on your point of view).
> 
> Cosmin Stejerean (m)
> 
> 
> On Dec 2, 2007, at 10:07 AM, Carl Karsten <carl at personnelware.com>  
> wrote:
> 
>> Cosmin Stejerean wrote:
>>> In case everyone forgot, this is Python not perl: there is only one
>>> way to do it (it just so happens to be my way)
>> you way is... let me check... "stupid!"
>>
>>> This is turning into an exercise of writing obfuscated code.
>> turning into?  you mean we aren't their yet?  I can hardly wait till  
>> the real
>> obfuscation starts happening.
>>
>>> Cosmin Stejerean (m)
>>>
>>>
>>> On Dec 2, 2007, at 7:48 AM, Massimo Di Pierro
>>> <mdipierro at cs.depaul.edu> wrote:
>>>
>>>> c'mon. No loops... and why limit to ' ' padding?
>>>>
>>>> import re
>>>> f=lambda a,n,c=' ': re.compile('.{%i}'%n).findall(a+c*n)[0]
>>>> f('hello world',5)
>>>>
>>>> Massimo
>>>>
>>>> On Dec 2, 2007, at 9:42 AM, Carl Karsten wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> def s5(s):
>>>>>  if len(s)<>5:
>>>>>    s=s5((s+' ')[:5])
>>>>>  return s
>>>>>
>>>>> print s5('Hello Worlds').__repr__()
>>>>> print s5('He').__repr__()
>>>>>
>>>>> The :5 blows the elegance.
>>>>>
>>>>> I thought I could +1 and -1 at the same time and have it converge
>>>>> on 5, but that
>>>>> didn't work.
>>>>>
>>>>> Carl K
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Jeff Hinrichs - DM&T wrote:
>>>>>> Actually, this kind of problem just screams recursion
>>>>>>
>>>>>> def s5(s):
>>>>>>     if len(s) < 5: s=s5(s+' ')
>>>>>>     if len(s) > 5: s=s5(s[:-1])
>>>>>>     return s
>>>>>>
>>>>>> print s5('Hello Worlds')
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On Dec 2, 2007 12:26 AM, Massimo Di Pierro
>>>>>> <mdipierro at cs.depaul.edu> wrote:
>>>>>>> f=lambda a,n: (a[:n]+' '*n)[:n] # theta(n) for every a
>>>>>>> f('hello world',5)
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On Dec 2, 2007, at 12:14 AM, Cosmin Stejerean wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> It's cheating. What if he wanted 10 instead of 5? Hardcoding
>>>>>>>> spaces is
>>>>>>>> a bad idea.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Cosmin Stejerean (m)
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> On Dec 1, 2007, at 9:29 PM, Carl Karsten  
>>>>>>>> <carl at personnelware.com>
>>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> string concatenation is icky.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> you have too many 5s.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> the line is too long.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> your variables are too short.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> there are no comments.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> and it isn't OOP.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Carl K
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Massimo Di Pierro wrote:
>>>>>>>>>> what's wrong with
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> b=(a[:5]+'     ')[:5]
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Massimo
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> On Nov 30, 2007, at 9:25 AM, Lukasz Szybalski wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> On Nov 29, 2007 3:29 PM, Cosmin Stejerean
>>>>>>>>>>> <cstejerean at gmail.com>
>>>>>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>> b.ljust(5)[:5]
>>>>>>>>>>> a='1234567890' or a='123'
>>>>>>>>>>> b=a.ljust(5)[:5]
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> so I guess ljust will do.
>>>>>>>>>>> Thanks.
>>>>>>>>>>> Lucas
>>>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>>>>> Chicago mailing list
>>>>>>>>>>> Chicago at python.org
>>>>>>>>>>> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>>>> Chicago mailing list
>>>>>>>>>> Chicago at python.org
>>>>>>>>>> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>>> Chicago mailing list
>>>>>>>>> Chicago at python.org
>>>>>>>>> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>> Chicago mailing list
>>>>>>>> Chicago at python.org
>>>>>>>> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>> Chicago mailing list
>>>>>>> Chicago at python.org
>>>>>>> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>> Chicago mailing list
>>>>> Chicago at python.org
>>>>> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> Chicago mailing list
>>>> Chicago at python.org
>>>> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Chicago mailing list
>>> Chicago at python.org
>>> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>>>
>>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Chicago mailing list
>> Chicago at python.org
>> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
> _______________________________________________
> Chicago mailing list
> Chicago at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
> 
> 

From mtemkin at speakeasy.net  Sun Dec  2 23:48:13 2007
From: mtemkin at speakeasy.net (Marc Temkin)
Date: Sun, 2 Dec 2007 16:48:13 -0600
Subject: [Chicago] ACM Chicago December Presentation on Neural - Computer
	interfaces: The Bionic Arm
Message-ID: <000701c83535$6bb65770$6501a8c0@DREAMCATCHER232>

This information is also on the Chapter website at: 
http://www.acm.org/chapters/chicago
 
  The next meeting of the Chicago Chapter is: 
 
         Neural - Computer interfaces:
              "The Bionic Arm"
    
  Presented by: Dr. He (Helen) Huang
    of the Neural Engineering Center for Artificial Limbs (NECAL), a
    research program at the Rehabilitation Institute of Chicago 
 
       Wednesday, December 12, 2007
 
  5:30 p.m. Social Hour, Dinner Buffet & Refreshments
  6:30 p.m. Presentation  
 
  Hosted by: Roosevelt University
  18 South Michigan Ave, Gage Gallery - located on the first floor
 
Cost:  
  $10 Chapter members
  $12 Non-members
  $ 5 Students 
 
TOPIC ABSTRACT:
  The Neural Engineering Center for Artificial Limbs (NECAL) is a
  research program at the Rehabilitation Institute of Chicago based
  on over 20 years of research.  The goal of the NECAL is to improve
  function and quality of life for people who have suffered limb
  loss. Currently, individuals who have undergone amputation are
  only able to operate one motion at a time with myoelectric
  prostheses.   
 
  The NECAL laboratory is currently experimenting with the use of
  "targeted muscle reinnervation" to improve myoelectric prosthesis
  function.  With this technique, amputated nerves are transferred
  to spare muscle and skin in an amputee's residual limb.  The
  nerves grow into the muscle to provide additional control signals
  for the operation of a prosthesis.  This allows patients to
  control multiple functions in their prosthesis at the same time in
  an easier, more natural manner.  "Sensory reinnervation" also
  takes place following the targeted reinnervation procedure; the
  patient feels touch to the reinnervated skin as being applied to
  their missing limb.  This may allow the amputee to actually "feel"
  what they are touching with a prosthetic hand.  
 
  Through these studies, NECAL is working to develop a
  state-of-the-art prosthesis that includes shoulder, elbow, wrist
  and hand components, as well as haptic interfaces to provide the
  sense of touch.  
 
  These current Bionic Arms are highly dependent on microprocessor
  controllers and advanced control algorithms. Computer Scientists
  have played key roles in the research and development of the
  underlying systems that control and run the arms. Advancements in
  our field keep changing the mechanics, in turn, means the embedded
  systems, firmware, and software of the arms will always need
  special attention.  
 
ABOUT THE SPEAKER: 
  He (Helen) Huang was born in Beijing, China. She received a B.S.
  from the School of Electronic and Information Engineering at Xi?an
  Jiao-Tong University, China in 2000 and a M.S. and Ph.D. degree
  from the Harrington Department of Bioengineering, Arizona State
  University in 2002 and 2006, respectively. She is currently a
  research associate in the Neural Engineering Center for Artificial
  Limbs at the Rehabilitation Institute of Chicago. He Huang?s
  primary research interests include design of neuroprostheses,
  modeling and analysis of neuromuscular control of movement in
  normal and neurologically disordered humans, development of
  intelligent and adaptive control systems for therapeutic robots
  and prostheses, and understanding the neurophysiologic mechanisms
  of spinal cord stimulation on restoring the ambulation of spinal
  cord injured patients. Her specialties lie in signal and image
  processing, machine learning, adaptive control, biomechanical
  modeling, and motion analysis.   
 
  He Huang has been awarded the Globe Foundation fellowship,
  outstanding research assistant (ASU), XEROX fellowship (XEROX
  Corp, Shenzhen, China), and fellowship from Chief Justice of Hong
  Kong. She is a member of the IEEE Medicine and Biology Society,
  the Biomedical Engineering Society, and the Society for
  Neuroscience.  
 

RESERVATIONS
  Note: Please make your reservation as soon as you know you are
  coming. We need a headcount for the food, as we order it in
  advance.  Even if it is last-minute, reserve anyway. Thanks. 
 
  Make your meeting reservation by replying to this e-mail
  ( greg at neumarke.net ) You may also call Greg at (work) 773-907-3308 
 
 
 
 
 

 
-------------- next part --------------
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From MDiPierro at cti.depaul.edu  Mon Dec  3 01:16:25 2007
From: MDiPierro at cti.depaul.edu (DiPierro, Massimo)
Date: Sun, 2 Dec 2007 18:16:25 -0600
Subject: [Chicago] how python can save you money
In-Reply-To: <1196613153.19617.0.camel@dresser>
References: <804e5c70711291306rb3faf64wdb6a6ae521abf133@mail.gmail.com>
	<474F3301.6000806@colorstudy.com>	<20071202020744.GB26452@furrr.two14.net>
	<DCEEE487-A862-4C0F-983D-1933317BF744@cs.depaul.edu>,
	<1196613153.19617.0.camel@dresser>
Message-ID: <C1AA20CAC1E41647BFF1D41215EDD4755C50D1E952@wagner.cti.depaul.edu>

As soon as I get the data...

Massimo
________________________________________
From: chicago-bounces at python.org [chicago-bounces at python.org] On Behalf Of Tom Printy [tprinty at mail.edisonave.net]
Sent: Sunday, December 02, 2007 10:32 AM
To: The Chicago Python Users Group
Subject: Re: [Chicago] how python can save you money

Can you make this for Kane county ?


On Sat, 2007-12-01 at 21:05 -0600, Massimo Di Pierro wrote:
> Dear fellow chicagoans,
>
> here is a new web site made 100% with python (with Gluon).
>
>      http://www.appealmypropertytaxes.com/
>
> It can help you save money on property taxes. Mind that it is still
> under testing.
>
> Massimo
>
> _______________________________________________
> Chicago mailing list
> Chicago at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago

_______________________________________________
Chicago mailing list
Chicago at python.org
http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago

From mdipierro at cs.depaul.edu  Mon Dec  3 04:13:53 2007
From: mdipierro at cs.depaul.edu (Massimo Di Pierro)
Date: Sun, 2 Dec 2007 21:13:53 -0600
Subject: [Chicago] how python can save you money
In-Reply-To: <b571660a0712021049yc8b3669nbdd80cb8ec4568fd@mail.gmail.com>
References: <804e5c70711291306rb3faf64wdb6a6ae521abf133@mail.gmail.com>
	<474F3301.6000806@colorstudy.com>	<20071202020744.GB26452@furrr.two14.net>
	<DCEEE487-A862-4C0F-983D-1933317BF744@cs.depaul.edu>
	<b571660a0712021049yc8b3669nbdd80cb8ec4568fd@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <7CBA6245-38A2-403A-9F57-02CC53BD9FB8@cs.depaul.edu>

Sorry. Fixed. I had forgotten to turn off parking.
If you notice anything else odd please let me know. Thanks.

Massimo

On Dec 2, 2007, at 12:49 PM, Kumar McMillan wrote:

> On Dec 1, 2007 9:05 PM, Massimo Di Pierro <mdipierro at cs.depaul.edu>  
> wrote:
>> Dear fellow chicagoans,
>>
>> here is a new web site made 100% with python (with Gluon).
>>
>>      http://www.appealmypropertytaxes.com/
>>
>> It can help you save money on property taxes. Mind that it is still
>> under testing.
>
> why the frameset?  you are creating Bookmark Hell for your users and
> some strange side effects in google page rank.
>
>
>>
>> Massimo
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Chicago mailing list
>> Chicago at python.org
>> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>>
> _______________________________________________
> Chicago mailing list
> Chicago at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago


From maney at two14.net  Mon Dec  3 06:26:51 2007
From: maney at two14.net (Martin Maney)
Date: Sun, 2 Dec 2007 23:26:51 -0600
Subject: [Chicago] constant length string manipulation
In-Reply-To: <EF66695F-30F3-4BB3-8BB7-F999A1D5A60A@gmail.com>
References: <276266d0711291329h778749bdya13099c42736b839@mail.gmail.com>
	<804e5c70711300725h16ed75f1o8b910362cbe19465@mail.gmail.com>
	<C7C492B9-BA11-49C4-BF60-B5A0A5D553E8@cs.depaul.edu>
	<475242C9.8020309@personnelware.com>
	<93AD5301-3B24-430B-A801-6DA40E02E03D@gmail.com>
	<11CF27B7-3143-47FB-82C6-E864157810FB@cs.depaul.edu>
	<5aaed53f0712020629u5c0c1dc8h88fdc9164919f03b@mail.gmail.com>
	<4752D26C.6070801@personnelware.com>
	<A62D6534-6B34-4A3D-BC5D-5FFE3D1BECD7@cs.depaul.edu>
	<EF66695F-30F3-4BB3-8BB7-F999A1D5A60A@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <20071203052651.GC27456@furrr.two14.net>

On Sun, Dec 02, 2007 at 09:02:52AM -0800, Cosmin Stejerean wrote:
> This is turning into an exercise of writing obfuscated code.

Right, but notice that the reasons are different.  In Perl (1),
obscurity is easy and natural, so the challenge is to be briefer; in
Python, achieving obscurity is hard enough to be the goal itself.  :)

(1) or any of a number of other languages, of course

-- 
He that questioneth much shall learn much, and content much; but
especially if he apply his questions to the skill of the persons whom
he asketh; for he shall give them the occasion to please themselves
in speaking, and himself shall continually gather knowledge.  But let
his questions not be troublesome, for that is fit for a poser; and
let him be sure to leave other men their turns to speak.  - Francis Bacon


From dbt at meat.net  Mon Dec  3 16:24:36 2007
From: dbt at meat.net (David Terrell)
Date: Mon, 3 Dec 2007 09:24:36 -0600
Subject: [Chicago] is there really no built-in file/iter split() thing?
In-Reply-To: <18258.25633.137508.252881@montanaro.dyndns.org>
References: <b571660a0711301349s1a6aef24m995673ac0e5743d0@mail.gmail.com>
	<4751DAEC.1010306@colorstudy.com>
	<18258.25633.137508.252881@montanaro.dyndns.org>
Message-ID: <20071203152436.GM2371@sphinx.chicagopeoplez.org>

On Sun, Dec 02, 2007 at 01:52:01AM -0600, skip at pobox.com wrote:
> 
>     Ian> One thing I've noticed is that some string operations are fairly
>     Ian> efficient in this case, because they notice when they wouldn't do
>     Ian> anything and don't create a new string.
> 
>     ...
> 
>     >>> x.split()[0] is x
>     False
> 
> Patch here:
> 
>     http://bugs.python.org/issue1538

And who says these micro-optimization threads don't lead to useful
output?

*Applause.*

-- 
David Terrell
dbt at meat.net
((meatspace)) http://meat.net/

From skip at pobox.com  Mon Dec  3 16:47:04 2007
From: skip at pobox.com (skip at pobox.com)
Date: Mon, 3 Dec 2007 09:47:04 -0600
Subject: [Chicago] is there really no built-in file/iter split() thing?
In-Reply-To: <20071203152436.GM2371@sphinx.chicagopeoplez.org>
References: <b571660a0711301349s1a6aef24m995673ac0e5743d0@mail.gmail.com>
	<4751DAEC.1010306@colorstudy.com>
	<18258.25633.137508.252881@montanaro.dyndns.org>
	<20071203152436.GM2371@sphinx.chicagopeoplez.org>
Message-ID: <18260.9464.118319.109114@montanaro.dyndns.org>


    Skip> Patch here:
    Skip> http://bugs.python.org/issue1538

    David> And who says these micro-optimization threads don't lead to
    David> useful output?

Note that this particular optimization (avoiding the copy when r?split
matches nothing) is a very micro optimization itself.  It may well get
rejected as not worth the extra complexity.

Skip

From tottinge at gmail.com  Mon Dec  3 18:51:23 2007
From: tottinge at gmail.com (Tim Ottinger)
Date: Mon, 03 Dec 2007 11:51:23 -0600
Subject: [Chicago] constant length string manipulation
In-Reply-To: <804e5c70711300725h16ed75f1o8b910362cbe19465@mail.gmail.com>
References: <804e5c70711291306rb3faf64wdb6a6ae521abf133@mail.gmail.com>	<804e5c70711291321s489888dbj9415b4411300643d@mail.gmail.com>	<276266d0711291329h778749bdya13099c42736b839@mail.gmail.com>
	<804e5c70711300725h16ed75f1o8b910362cbe19465@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <4754421B.3010405@gmail.com>

def padWithTruncate(value, width, fillchar=" "):
    truncated = str(value)[:width]
    return truncated.ljust(width,fillchar)

And of course, I echo the concern about truncating *values*.  It's a 
very dangerous thing to do.
Truncating strings, of course, has different but similar concerns. 

cheers.


Lukasz Szybalski wrote:
> On Nov 29, 2007 3:29 PM, Cosmin Stejerean <cstejerean at gmail.com> wrote:
>   
>> b.ljust(5)[:5]
>>     
>
> a='1234567890' or a='123'
> b=a.ljust(5)[:5]
>
> so I guess ljust will do.
> Thanks.
> Lucas
> _______________________________________________
> Chicago mailing list
> Chicago at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>   


From tottinge at gmail.com  Mon Dec  3 18:55:54 2007
From: tottinge at gmail.com (Tim Ottinger)
Date: Mon, 03 Dec 2007 11:55:54 -0600
Subject: [Chicago] is there really no built-in file/iter split() thing?
In-Reply-To: <b571660a0712012223h6d32abcl43bf887ada391647@mail.gmail.com>
References: <b571660a0711301349s1a6aef24m995673ac0e5743d0@mail.gmail.com>	<6CF4E080-F7DE-4977-A3E1-2E0A8B44D283@cs.depaul.edu>
	<b571660a0712012223h6d32abcl43bf887ada391647@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <4754432A.5060701@gmail.com>

Kumar McMillan wrote:
> On Dec 1, 2007 11:50 PM, Massimo Di Pierro <mdipierro at cs.depaul.edu> wrote:
>   
>> Try this
>>
>> import re, mmap
>> file=open(filename,'r')
>> mfile=mmap.mmap(file.fileno(),0,prot=mmap.PROT_READ)
>> items=re.compile('[^;]+').finditer(mfile)
>> for item in items: print item.group()
>>     
>
> nice!  I didn't know about mmap.
>
>   
Nicer yet! I knew about mmap, but didn't know about finditer!

From ianb at colorstudy.com  Mon Dec  3 19:01:39 2007
From: ianb at colorstudy.com (Ian Bicking)
Date: Mon, 03 Dec 2007 12:01:39 -0600
Subject: [Chicago] is there really no built-in file/iter split() thing?
In-Reply-To: <18260.9464.118319.109114@montanaro.dyndns.org>
References: <b571660a0711301349s1a6aef24m995673ac0e5743d0@mail.gmail.com>	<4751DAEC.1010306@colorstudy.com>	<18258.25633.137508.252881@montanaro.dyndns.org>	<20071203152436.GM2371@sphinx.chicagopeoplez.org>
	<18260.9464.118319.109114@montanaro.dyndns.org>
Message-ID: <47544483.3040903@colorstudy.com>

skip at pobox.com wrote:
>     Skip> Patch here:
>     Skip> http://bugs.python.org/issue1538
> 
>     David> And who says these micro-optimization threads don't lead to
>     David> useful output?
> 
> Note that this particular optimization (avoiding the copy when r?split
> matches nothing) is a very micro optimization itself.  It may well get
> rejected as not worth the extra complexity.

Thanks for the patch.  FWIW, I only noticed that str.replace didn't 
create copies after seeing the results in a benchmark; I was testing 
different ways of doing html quoting, and noticed that str.replace was 
pretty fast when it didn't have to do any work.  So in a small way these 
things can be noticeable.

-- 
Ian Bicking : ianb at colorstudy.com : http://blog.ianbicking.org

From shekay at pobox.com  Mon Dec  3 19:26:50 2007
From: shekay at pobox.com (sheila miguez)
Date: Mon, 3 Dec 2007 12:26:50 -0600
Subject: [Chicago] Restaurant recommendations for PyCon...
In-Reply-To: <fccecd3a0711252037p22dd488atff0e239329c9f5c5@mail.gmail.com>
References: <18244.23889.270114.490402@montanaro.dyndns.org>
	<fccecd3a0711232218g34957787raf83277311522c69@mail.gmail.com>
	<a68ced640711241141p151c64dfw2a8cd0806f909bcb@mail.gmail.com>
	<fccecd3a0711252037p22dd488atff0e239329c9f5c5@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <a68ced640712031026m75b68ce1h55bc4be86dd19609@mail.gmail.com>

On Nov 25, 2007 10:37 PM, Brian W. Fitzpatrick <fitz at red-bean.com> wrote:
> On Nov 24, 2007 1:41 PM, sheila miguez <shekay at pobox.com> wrote:
> > I didn't add Northside restaurants because I wasn't sure that anyone
> > would take the trouble to go there, but to amend fitz's list--I would
> > remove Pizza D.O.C. and perhaps add Spacca Napoli.
> > http://www.yelp.com/biz/0fFLUKl71vv3eNV2xhikEw
> >
> > I've only been to it a few times, so I cannot whole heartedly
> > recommend it, but the neopolitan style I had at Pizza DOC was drowned
> > in gooey cheese.
>
> Weird, I've never had the Neapolitan, but every pizza I've ever had at
> Pizza DOC was almost identical to the pizza  I used to get in Rome (I
> lived there for 3 years).

Sorry for the non pythonic thread continuation but I wanted to give a
report on Pizza DOC.

I decided to give it another change and dragged Carl along. The pizza
was much better this time. If they can maintain consistent quality I
would recommend them highly.

I +1 the idea of offering car pools to neighborhoods in the city (or
in the suburbs if you can find interesting places people might like to
visit) for food or other runs.

Suggestions:

Food outings to Chicago

Chinatown
The Vietnamese neighborhood
Lincoln Square/Ravenswood/Andersonville
Albany Park for Middle Eastern or Korean food
Devon
One of the many good chicago bbq places check gwivs comments in
lthforum or his bbq page
One of the many good hotdog places such as Hot Dougs

Food runs with bringing back stuff informally lest hotel gets pissed:
Go to Devon and get sweets from Royal Sweets

Dessert run to chocolate places
Dessert run to Sweet Occasions in various locations


Food runs to suburbs

Schaumburg area for Szechuan House, Indian food (two South Indian
restaurants available from last I was in the area), Japanese food (if
Bowl House has maintained its quality), Japanese fast food (Todai in
Woodfield then Apple Store).

Tech runs to

Fry's or Microcenter


-- 
sheila

From shekay at pobox.com  Mon Dec  3 19:28:49 2007
From: shekay at pobox.com (sheila miguez)
Date: Mon, 3 Dec 2007 12:28:49 -0600
Subject: [Chicago] Restaurant recommendations for PyCon...
In-Reply-To: <a68ced640712031026m75b68ce1h55bc4be86dd19609@mail.gmail.com>
References: <18244.23889.270114.490402@montanaro.dyndns.org>
	<fccecd3a0711232218g34957787raf83277311522c69@mail.gmail.com>
	<a68ced640711241141p151c64dfw2a8cd0806f909bcb@mail.gmail.com>
	<fccecd3a0711252037p22dd488atff0e239329c9f5c5@mail.gmail.com>
	<a68ced640712031026m75b68ce1h55bc4be86dd19609@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <a68ced640712031028k61edfc60l20fd477411288fc1@mail.gmail.com>

On Dec 3, 2007 12:26 PM, sheila miguez <shekay at pobox.com> wrote:
> On Nov 25, 2007 10:37 PM, Brian W. Fitzpatrick <fitz at red-bean.com> wrote:

> Sorry for the non pythonic thread continuation but I wanted to give a
> report on Pizza DOC.
>
> I decided to give it another change and dragged Carl along. The pizza
> was much better this time. If they can maintain consistent quality I
> would recommend them highly.

Ps. house chianti was awful, but it tasted kind of interesting when I
put a few drops of Carl's beer in it.

Which gives me another idea, maybe we could arrange a wine tasting or
have a wine & cheese BOF (have been to wine/tech BOFs at a conference
before, not bad).


-- 
sheila

From tcp at mac.com  Mon Dec  3 19:38:23 2007
From: tcp at mac.com (Ted Pollari)
Date: Mon, 3 Dec 2007 10:38:23 -0800
Subject: [Chicago] Restaurant recommendations for PyCon...
In-Reply-To: <a68ced640712031028k61edfc60l20fd477411288fc1@mail.gmail.com>
References: <18244.23889.270114.490402@montanaro.dyndns.org>
	<fccecd3a0711232218g34957787raf83277311522c69@mail.gmail.com>
	<a68ced640711241141p151c64dfw2a8cd0806f909bcb@mail.gmail.com>
	<fccecd3a0711252037p22dd488atff0e239329c9f5c5@mail.gmail.com>
	<a68ced640712031026m75b68ce1h55bc4be86dd19609@mail.gmail.com>
	<a68ced640712031028k61edfc60l20fd477411288fc1@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <52CD4C35-983D-4981-A83B-3786FF622627@mac.com>


On Dec 3, 2007, at 10:28 AM, sheila miguez wrote:

> Which gives me another idea, maybe we could arrange a wine tasting or
> have a wine & cheese BOF (have been to wine/tech BOFs at a conference
> before, not bad).


You willing to organize it?  I'd love to see it happen...

-t

From shekay at pobox.com  Mon Dec  3 19:56:38 2007
From: shekay at pobox.com (sheila miguez)
Date: Mon, 3 Dec 2007 12:56:38 -0600
Subject: [Chicago] Restaurant recommendations for PyCon...
In-Reply-To: <52CD4C35-983D-4981-A83B-3786FF622627@mac.com>
References: <18244.23889.270114.490402@montanaro.dyndns.org>
	<fccecd3a0711232218g34957787raf83277311522c69@mail.gmail.com>
	<a68ced640711241141p151c64dfw2a8cd0806f909bcb@mail.gmail.com>
	<fccecd3a0711252037p22dd488atff0e239329c9f5c5@mail.gmail.com>
	<a68ced640712031026m75b68ce1h55bc4be86dd19609@mail.gmail.com>
	<a68ced640712031028k61edfc60l20fd477411288fc1@mail.gmail.com>
	<52CD4C35-983D-4981-A83B-3786FF622627@mac.com>
Message-ID: <a68ced640712031056q38fb3633u8212cf8386167324@mail.gmail.com>

On Dec 3, 2007 12:38 PM, Ted Pollari <tcp at mac.com> wrote:
>
> On Dec 3, 2007, at 10:28 AM, sheila miguez wrote:
>
> > Which gives me another idea, maybe we could arrange a wine tasting or
> > have a wine & cheese BOF (have been to wine/tech BOFs at a conference
> > before, not bad).
>
>
> You willing to organize it?  I'd love to see it happen...
>
> -t

How many people would show up? if not too many I would be willing to
foot the bill. I think there is some hotel policy that might affect
our ability to officially bring in outside food.

This means that we'd have to have an unofficial party, right? If so,
if too many people show up, I can't afford it.



-- 
sheila

From ianb at colorstudy.com  Mon Dec  3 20:10:42 2007
From: ianb at colorstudy.com (Ian Bicking)
Date: Mon, 03 Dec 2007 13:10:42 -0600
Subject: [Chicago] Restaurant recommendations for PyCon...
In-Reply-To: <a68ced640712031056q38fb3633u8212cf8386167324@mail.gmail.com>
References: <18244.23889.270114.490402@montanaro.dyndns.org>	<fccecd3a0711232218g34957787raf83277311522c69@mail.gmail.com>	<a68ced640711241141p151c64dfw2a8cd0806f909bcb@mail.gmail.com>	<fccecd3a0711252037p22dd488atff0e239329c9f5c5@mail.gmail.com>	<a68ced640712031026m75b68ce1h55bc4be86dd19609@mail.gmail.com>	<a68ced640712031028k61edfc60l20fd477411288fc1@mail.gmail.com>	<52CD4C35-983D-4981-A83B-3786FF622627@mac.com>
	<a68ced640712031056q38fb3633u8212cf8386167324@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <475454B2.9020402@colorstudy.com>

sheila miguez wrote:
> On Dec 3, 2007 12:38 PM, Ted Pollari <tcp at mac.com> wrote:
>> On Dec 3, 2007, at 10:28 AM, sheila miguez wrote:
>>
>>> Which gives me another idea, maybe we could arrange a wine tasting or
>>> have a wine & cheese BOF (have been to wine/tech BOFs at a conference
>>> before, not bad).
>>
>> You willing to organize it?  I'd love to see it happen...
>>
>> -t
> 
> How many people would show up? if not too many I would be willing to
> foot the bill. I think there is some hotel policy that might affect
> our ability to officially bring in outside food.
> 
> This means that we'd have to have an unofficial party, right? If so,
> if too many people show up, I can't afford it.

If you give people directions to a nearby liquor store I'm sure a 
natural alcohol/person balance can be acquired.

Last year Tummy.com hosted a party during the sprints.  I think they 
arranged something with the hotel.  They might be willing to do that 
again.  Maybe EWT also hosted something last year?  I think they got a 
hotel room and just did it there.

I have no idea how cool the hotel is with people hanging around late and 
whatnot.  As long as PyCon isn't providing the drinks or food, and it's 
just individuals, I doubt they will care about that part.

If we looked for sponsors, maybe we could actually arrange a real party 
at a real venue.  It's not cheap, but I'm sure there are companies 
willing to sponsor something like that.

We could also setup a bar hop or something.

At the last Plone conference a nearby hotel had a roof deck and we all 
hung out up there.  They didn't even blink when someone borrowed a 
luggage carrier to bring up a hundred or so bottles of beer.  But they 
were an exceptionally relaxed hotel, I doubt that's the vibe we'll get 
at this place ;)  They even let the German guys borrow the conference 
room off the entrance to hang out and sing drinking songs.

-- 
Ian Bicking : ianb at colorstudy.com : http://blog.ianbicking.org

From tcp at mac.com  Mon Dec  3 20:12:51 2007
From: tcp at mac.com (Ted Pollari)
Date: Mon, 3 Dec 2007 11:12:51 -0800
Subject: [Chicago] Restaurant recommendations for PyCon...
In-Reply-To: <a68ced640712031056q38fb3633u8212cf8386167324@mail.gmail.com>
References: <18244.23889.270114.490402@montanaro.dyndns.org>
	<fccecd3a0711232218g34957787raf83277311522c69@mail.gmail.com>
	<a68ced640711241141p151c64dfw2a8cd0806f909bcb@mail.gmail.com>
	<fccecd3a0711252037p22dd488atff0e239329c9f5c5@mail.gmail.com>
	<a68ced640712031026m75b68ce1h55bc4be86dd19609@mail.gmail.com>
	<a68ced640712031028k61edfc60l20fd477411288fc1@mail.gmail.com>
	<52CD4C35-983D-4981-A83B-3786FF622627@mac.com>
	<a68ced640712031056q38fb3633u8212cf8386167324@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <027D6CCC-52BE-4013-8C65-6E8886E51BCB@mac.com>


On Dec 3, 2007, at 10:56 AM, sheila miguez wrote:

> How many people would show up? if not too many I would be willing to
> foot the bill. I think there is some hotel policy that might affect
> our ability to officially bring in outside food.
>
> This means that we'd have to have an unofficial party, right? If so,
> if too many people show up, I can't afford it.


Or we go somewhere else to hold it -- there are wine bars and the like  
that might host, if we pay...

-t

From shekay at pobox.com  Mon Dec  3 20:15:11 2007
From: shekay at pobox.com (sheila miguez)
Date: Mon, 3 Dec 2007 13:15:11 -0600
Subject: [Chicago] Help plan our best meeting ever!
Message-ID: <a68ced640712031115w14be0690w1b98bd83303de386@mail.gmail.com>

Time: Thursday, December 13th

Topics so far

Sterling will give a short demonstration on EasyGUI

I want more topics. I have pinged people I know and Dave Shemenski
said he could give a talk on Heisenbug, the automated regression test
framework system written in jython that we use here at Orbitz.

Location

This will be a good opportunity to encourage people from the suburbs
to join us, since the meeting room is in the same building as the
Ogilvy stop, and very close walking distance to the Madison exit of
Union Station.

Orbitz
Ogilvy Transportation Center
500 W Madison
Chicago, IL 60661

Please RSVP to shekay at pobox com

    I will need a list of attendees to give to building
    security. Please send me a note with chipy in the
    subject line to let me know that you'll be attending.

This also helps us to know how much food to order.


-- 
sheila

From cwebber at imagescape.com  Mon Dec  3 20:44:08 2007
From: cwebber at imagescape.com (Christopher Allan Webber)
Date: Mon, 03 Dec 2007 13:44:08 -0600
Subject: [Chicago] Help plan our best meeting ever!
In-Reply-To: <a68ced640712031115w14be0690w1b98bd83303de386@mail.gmail.com>
	(sheila miguez's message of "Mon, 3 Dec 2007 13:15:11 -0600")
References: <a68ced640712031115w14be0690w1b98bd83303de386@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <6yfxyjwol3.fsf@imagepc03.rd.imagescape.com>

I have an animation system I've been working on that I'd like to talk
about.  It's pretty generic, in pretty early stages, but I think the
concept is kinda neat.

"sheila miguez" <shekay at pobox.com> writes:

> Time: Thursday, December 13th
>
> Topics so far
>
> Sterling will give a short demonstration on EasyGUI
>
> I want more topics. I have pinged people I know and Dave Shemenski
> said he could give a talk on Heisenbug, the automated regression test
> framework system written in jython that we use here at Orbitz.
>
> Location
>
> This will be a good opportunity to encourage people from the suburbs
> to join us, since the meeting room is in the same building as the
> Ogilvy stop, and very close walking distance to the Madison exit of
> Union Station.
>
> Orbitz
> Ogilvy Transportation Center
> 500 W Madison
> Chicago, IL 60661
>
> Please RSVP to shekay at pobox com
>
>     I will need a list of attendees to give to building
>     security. Please send me a note with chipy in the
>     subject line to let me know that you'll be attending.
>
> This also helps us to know how much food to order.
>
>
> -- 
> sheila
> _______________________________________________
> Chicago mailing list
> Chicago at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago

From hsu.feihong at yahoo.com  Mon Dec  3 21:07:38 2007
From: hsu.feihong at yahoo.com (Feihong Hsu)
Date: Mon, 3 Dec 2007 12:07:38 -0800 (PST)
Subject: [Chicago] Restaurant recommendations for PyCon...
In-Reply-To: <a68ced640712031026m75b68ce1h55bc4be86dd19609@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <236013.65155.qm@web34813.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

If it's a run to Schaumburg, I can highly recommend Yu's Mandarin. It's a Chinese restaurant that has a focus on Shanghainese cuisine. If you only stick to the normal stuff like Orange Chicken and Sweet & Sour Chicken, it's not that great, but more specialty items like Peapod Tips are excellent. And foodies can enjoy the sight of the chefs actually preparing the food (their main room is separated from their kitchen by a huge window).

- Feihong

sheila miguez <shekay at pobox.com> wrote: On Nov 25, 2007 10:37 PM, Brian W. Fitzpatrick  wrote:
> On Nov 24, 2007 1:41 PM, sheila miguez  wrote:
> > I didn't add Northside restaurants because I wasn't sure that anyone
> > would take the trouble to go there, but to amend fitz's list--I would
> > remove Pizza D.O.C. and perhaps add Spacca Napoli.
> > http://www.yelp.com/biz/0fFLUKl71vv3eNV2xhikEw
> >
> > I've only been to it a few times, so I cannot whole heartedly
> > recommend it, but the neopolitan style I had at Pizza DOC was drowned
> > in gooey cheese.
>
> Weird, I've never had the Neapolitan, but every pizza I've ever had at
> Pizza DOC was almost identical to the pizza  I used to get in Rome (I
> lived there for 3 years).

Sorry for the non pythonic thread continuation but I wanted to give a
report on Pizza DOC.

I decided to give it another change and dragged Carl along. The pizza
was much better this time. If they can maintain consistent quality I
would recommend them highly.

I +1 the idea of offering car pools to neighborhoods in the city (or
in the suburbs if you can find interesting places people might like to
visit) for food or other runs.

Suggestions:

Food outings to Chicago

Chinatown
The Vietnamese neighborhood
Lincoln Square/Ravenswood/Andersonville
Albany Park for Middle Eastern or Korean food
Devon
One of the many good chicago bbq places check gwivs comments in
lthforum or his bbq page
One of the many good hotdog places such as Hot Dougs

Food runs with bringing back stuff informally lest hotel gets pissed:
Go to Devon and get sweets from Royal Sweets

Dessert run to chocolate places
Dessert run to Sweet Occasions in various locations


Food runs to suburbs

Schaumburg area for Szechuan House, Indian food (two South Indian
restaurants available from last I was in the area), Japanese food (if
Bowl House has maintained its quality), Japanese fast food (Todai in
Woodfield then Apple Store).

Tech runs to

Fry's or Microcenter


-- 
sheila
_______________________________________________
Chicago mailing list
Chicago at python.org
http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago


       
---------------------------------
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From hsu.feihong at yahoo.com  Mon Dec  3 21:15:16 2007
From: hsu.feihong at yahoo.com (Feihong Hsu)
Date: Mon, 3 Dec 2007 12:15:16 -0800 (PST)
Subject: [Chicago] Help plan our best meeting ever!
In-Reply-To: <a68ced640712031115w14be0690w1b98bd83303de386@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <214037.62033.qm@web34807.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

I don't know if two GUI talks will be too much, but I've been working on GUI wrapper libraries for both WinForms and wxPython. At this point I don't know which one I want to present on, I guess whichever one is less crappy at the time of the meeting.

- Feihong

sheila miguez <shekay at pobox.com> wrote: Time: Thursday, December 13th

Topics so far

Sterling will give a short demonstration on EasyGUI

I want more topics. I have pinged people I know and Dave Shemenski
said he could give a talk on Heisenbug, the automated regression test
framework system written in jython that we use here at Orbitz.

Location

This will be a good opportunity to encourage people from the suburbs
to join us, since the meeting room is in the same building as the
Ogilvy stop, and very close walking distance to the Madison exit of
Union Station.

Orbitz
Ogilvy Transportation Center
500 W Madison
Chicago, IL 60661

Please RSVP to shekay at pobox com

    I will need a list of attendees to give to building
    security. Please send me a note with chipy in the
    subject line to let me know that you'll be attending.

This also helps us to know how much food to order.


-- 
sheila
_______________________________________________
Chicago mailing list
Chicago at python.org
http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago


       
---------------------------------
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From hamcferron at yahoo.com  Mon Dec  3 21:18:19 2007
From: hamcferron at yahoo.com (Alex McFerron)
Date: Mon, 3 Dec 2007 12:18:19 -0800 (PST)
Subject: [Chicago] PyCon 2008 conf.
Message-ID: <230330.51751.qm@web81103.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

Does anyone have any idea how much money I should expect to pay to attend the PyCon 2008 conference friday to sunday? 
   
  Just an estimate is fine.  
   
  Thanks,
  alex 
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From tcp at mac.com  Mon Dec  3 21:25:13 2007
From: tcp at mac.com (Ted Pollari)
Date: Mon, 3 Dec 2007 12:25:13 -0800
Subject: [Chicago] PyCon 2008 conf.
In-Reply-To: <230330.51751.qm@web81103.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
References: <230330.51751.qm@web81103.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <AC575621-B559-4909-8C5B-50735F78F82C@mac.com>


On Dec 3, 2007, at 12:18 PM, Alex McFerron wrote:

> Does anyone have any idea how much money I should expect to pay to  
> attend the PyCon 2008 conference friday to sunday?
>
> Just an estimate is fine.


If you're a regular (non-student) attendee and you register early?   
$220, give/take.

-t



From cbc at unc.edu  Mon Dec  3 21:06:43 2007
From: cbc at unc.edu (Chris Calloway)
Date: Mon, 03 Dec 2007 15:06:43 -0500
Subject: [Chicago] Restaurant recommendations for PyCon...
In-Reply-To: <475454B2.9020402@colorstudy.com>
References: <18244.23889.270114.490402@montanaro.dyndns.org>	<fccecd3a0711232218g34957787raf83277311522c69@mail.gmail.com>	<a68ced640711241141p151c64dfw2a8cd0806f909bcb@mail.gmail.com>	<fccecd3a0711252037p22dd488atff0e239329c9f5c5@mail.gmail.com>	<a68ced640712031026m75b68ce1h55bc4be86dd19609@mail.gmail.com>	<a68ced640712031028k61edfc60l20fd477411288fc1@mail.gmail.com>	<52CD4C35-983D-4981-A83B-3786FF622627@mac.com>	<a68ced640712031056q38fb3633u8212cf8386167324@mail.gmail.com>
	<475454B2.9020402@colorstudy.com>
Message-ID: <475461D3.2000107@unc.edu>

Ian Bicking wrote:
> If we looked for sponsors, maybe we could actually arrange a real party 
> at a real venue.

I was completely surprised not to see any hospitality suites at the last 
PyCon. Missed opportunity for sponsors.

> At the last Plone conference a nearby hotel had a roof deck and we all 
> hung out up there.  They didn't even blink when someone borrowed a 
> luggage carrier to bring up a hundred or so bottles of beer.  But they 
> were an exceptionally relaxed hotel, I doubt that's the vibe we'll get 
> at this place ;)  They even let the German guys borrow the conference 
> room off the entrance to hang out and sing drinking songs.

That hotel was so off the hook.

All my pictures of the roof top parties came out completely blurry. The 
only one even slightly usable was a tourist shot which didn't get any of 
the throngs of party people or the Hungarian plum brandy in the frame:

http://trizpug.org/gallery/plonecon2006/photoalbum_photo_view?b_start:int=0

PyCon is cool because, unlike PlonCon where everybody is spread out in 
hotels all over town, PyCon is all in one place. There's a huge 
opportunity in that for big community-building social events.

Although with PloneCon being spread out all over town, great efforts are 
made for everyone to have dinner and drinks each night at the same 
place, resulting in cheers whenever a new group arrives at the 
designated spot, and many cab/subway/bus/hovercraft/walk home mishap 
stories.

-- 
Sincerely,

Chris Calloway
http://www.seacoos.org
office: 332 Chapman Hall   phone: (919) 962-4323
mail: Campus Box #3300, UNC-CH, Chapel Hill, NC 27599



From hsu.feihong at yahoo.com  Mon Dec  3 21:41:38 2007
From: hsu.feihong at yahoo.com (Feihong Hsu)
Date: Mon, 3 Dec 2007 12:41:38 -0800 (PST)
Subject: [Chicago] PyCon 2008 conf.
In-Reply-To: <230330.51751.qm@web81103.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <933126.12560.qm@web34802.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

I heard that the registration fees will not change much from last year. That means  US $195 for regular attendees, and $125 for students. But those figures are for early bird registration (if you register before Jan 15).

For more details, see http://us.pycon.org/TX2007/Registration.

- Feihong

Alex McFerron <hamcferron at yahoo.com> wrote: Does anyone have any idea how much money I should expect to pay to attend the PyCon 2008 conference friday to sunday? 
   
  Just an estimate is fine.  
   
  Thanks,
  alex 
_______________________________________________
Chicago mailing list
Chicago at python.org
http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago


       
---------------------------------
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From hamcferron at yahoo.com  Mon Dec  3 22:03:41 2007
From: hamcferron at yahoo.com (Alex McFerron)
Date: Mon, 3 Dec 2007 13:03:41 -0800 (PST)
Subject: [Chicago] PyCon 2008 conf.
In-Reply-To: <933126.12560.qm@web34802.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <340655.43787.qm@web81106.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

i think i can handle that.  Thanks so much!

Feihong Hsu <hsu.feihong at yahoo.com> wrote:  I heard that the registration fees will not change much from last year. That means US $195 for regular attendees, and $125 for students. But those figures are for early bird registration (if you register before Jan 15).

For more details, see http://us.pycon.org/TX2007/Registration.

- Feihong

Alex McFerron <hamcferron at yahoo.com> wrote:    Does anyone have any idea how much money I should expect to pay to attend the PyCon 2008 conference friday to sunday? 
   
  Just an estimate is fine.  
   
  Thanks,
  alex 
_______________________________________________
Chicago mailing list
Chicago at python.org
http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago

    
---------------------------------
  Looking for last minute shopping deals? Find them fast with Yahoo! Search._______________________________________________
Chicago mailing list
Chicago at python.org
http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago

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From tcp at mac.com  Mon Dec  3 22:09:18 2007
From: tcp at mac.com (Ted Pollari)
Date: Mon, 3 Dec 2007 13:09:18 -0800
Subject: [Chicago] PyCon 2008 conf.
In-Reply-To: <933126.12560.qm@web34802.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
References: <933126.12560.qm@web34802.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <B0E47431-E0CB-407A-AE2F-1B76796F905E@mac.com>


On Dec 3, 2007, at 12:41 PM, Feihong Hsu wrote:

> I heard that the registration fees will not change much from last  
> year. That means US $195 for regular attendees, and $125 for  
> students. But those figures are for early bird registration (if you  
> register before Jan 15).


My information is the most current that is available to any of us as  
we haven't finalized registration costs.  Also, it looks like I'll be  
chairing financial aid, so if cost is an issue, especially for  
students, look into the financial aid info on the PyCon website.

-t


From ianb at colorstudy.com  Mon Dec  3 23:26:54 2007
From: ianb at colorstudy.com (Ian Bicking)
Date: Mon, 03 Dec 2007 16:26:54 -0600
Subject: [Chicago] Help plan our best meeting ever!
In-Reply-To: <a68ced640712031115w14be0690w1b98bd83303de386@mail.gmail.com>
References: <a68ced640712031115w14be0690w1b98bd83303de386@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <475482AE.7050407@colorstudy.com>

I could do a presentation on WebTest, a functional testing tool for WSGI 
applications.

sheila miguez wrote:
> Time: Thursday, December 13th
> 
> Topics so far
> 
> Sterling will give a short demonstration on EasyGUI
> 
> I want more topics. I have pinged people I know and Dave Shemenski
> said he could give a talk on Heisenbug, the automated regression test
> framework system written in jython that we use here at Orbitz.
> 
> Location
> 
> This will be a good opportunity to encourage people from the suburbs
> to join us, since the meeting room is in the same building as the
> Ogilvy stop, and very close walking distance to the Madison exit of
> Union Station.
> 
> Orbitz
> Ogilvy Transportation Center
> 500 W Madison
> Chicago, IL 60661
> 
> Please RSVP to shekay at pobox com
> 
>     I will need a list of attendees to give to building
>     security. Please send me a note with chipy in the
>     subject line to let me know that you'll be attending.
> 
> This also helps us to know how much food to order.
> 
> 


-- 
Ian Bicking : ianb at colorstudy.com : http://blog.ianbicking.org

From tottinge at gmail.com  Mon Dec  3 23:43:42 2007
From: tottinge at gmail.com (Tim Ottinger)
Date: Mon, 03 Dec 2007 16:43:42 -0600
Subject: [Chicago] Full time Python Developer positions
In-Reply-To: <470D4A0D.6010403@cognizo.com>
References: <470D23E4.1010601@cognizo.com>
	<200710101621.04289.pfein@pobox.com>	<20071010214232.GA29439@wdfs>
	<470D4A0D.6010403@cognizo.com>
Message-ID: <4754869E.4070500@gmail.com>

Did you find all that you were looking for?


From fitz at red-bean.com  Tue Dec  4 00:20:16 2007
From: fitz at red-bean.com (Brian W. Fitzpatrick)
Date: Mon, 3 Dec 2007 17:20:16 -0600
Subject: [Chicago] Restaurant recommendations for PyCon...
In-Reply-To: <a68ced640712031028k61edfc60l20fd477411288fc1@mail.gmail.com>
References: <18244.23889.270114.490402@montanaro.dyndns.org>
	<fccecd3a0711232218g34957787raf83277311522c69@mail.gmail.com>
	<a68ced640711241141p151c64dfw2a8cd0806f909bcb@mail.gmail.com>
	<fccecd3a0711252037p22dd488atff0e239329c9f5c5@mail.gmail.com>
	<a68ced640712031026m75b68ce1h55bc4be86dd19609@mail.gmail.com>
	<a68ced640712031028k61edfc60l20fd477411288fc1@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <fccecd3a0712031520t1b1b2e9cr77cb485244359c0d@mail.gmail.com>

On Dec 3, 2007 12:28 PM, sheila miguez <shekay at pobox.com> wrote:
> On Dec 3, 2007 12:26 PM, sheila miguez <shekay at pobox.com> wrote:
> > On Nov 25, 2007 10:37 PM, Brian W. Fitzpatrick <fitz at red-bean.com> wrote:
>
> > Sorry for the non pythonic thread continuation but I wanted to give a
> > report on Pizza DOC.
> >
> > I decided to give it another change and dragged Carl along. The pizza
> > was much better this time. If they can maintain consistent quality I
> > would recommend them highly.
>
> Ps. house chianti was awful, but it tasted kind of interesting when I
> put a few drops of Carl's beer in it.

"house" and "chianti" should never be in the same sentence.

-Fitz

From shekay at pobox.com  Tue Dec  4 01:18:47 2007
From: shekay at pobox.com (sheila miguez)
Date: Mon, 3 Dec 2007 18:18:47 -0600
Subject: [Chicago] Restaurant recommendations for PyCon...
In-Reply-To: <fccecd3a0712031520t1b1b2e9cr77cb485244359c0d@mail.gmail.com>
References: <18244.23889.270114.490402@montanaro.dyndns.org>
	<fccecd3a0711232218g34957787raf83277311522c69@mail.gmail.com>
	<a68ced640711241141p151c64dfw2a8cd0806f909bcb@mail.gmail.com>
	<fccecd3a0711252037p22dd488atff0e239329c9f5c5@mail.gmail.com>
	<a68ced640712031026m75b68ce1h55bc4be86dd19609@mail.gmail.com>
	<a68ced640712031028k61edfc60l20fd477411288fc1@mail.gmail.com>
	<fccecd3a0712031520t1b1b2e9cr77cb485244359c0d@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <a68ced640712031618mbc47398lad34f3cfc8e2124e@mail.gmail.com>

On Dec 3, 2007 5:20 PM, Brian W. Fitzpatrick <fitz at red-bean.com> wrote:
> On Dec 3, 2007 12:28 PM, sheila miguez <shekay at pobox.com> wrote:
> > On Dec 3, 2007 12:26 PM, sheila miguez <shekay at pobox.com> wrote:
> > > On Nov 25, 2007 10:37 PM, Brian W. Fitzpatrick <fitz at red-bean.com> wrote:
> >
> > > Sorry for the non pythonic thread continuation but I wanted to give a
> > > report on Pizza DOC.
> > >
> > > I decided to give it another change and dragged Carl along. The pizza
> > > was much better this time. If they can maintain consistent quality I
> > > would recommend them highly.
> >
> > Ps. house chianti was awful, but it tasted kind of interesting when I
> > put a few drops of Carl's beer in it.
>
> "house" and "chianti" should never be in the same sentence.

I stayed near Geneve for a little bit with my ex while he was doing
work at CERN. The house chianti at this one place in Geneve we'd go to
was not bad at all.

If any of you have had wine in the nude at a station in Antarctica,
please speak up.

-- 
sheila

From garrett at mojave-corp.com  Tue Dec  4 04:44:43 2007
From: garrett at mojave-corp.com (Garrett Smith)
Date: Mon, 3 Dec 2007 21:44:43 -0600 (CST)
Subject: [Chicago] Help plan our best meeting ever!
In-Reply-To: <475482AE.7050407@colorstudy.com>
Message-ID: <10661584.4335911196739883437.JavaMail.root@noc-106.smedia.info>

+1

----- "Ian Bicking" <ianb at colorstudy.com> wrote:
> I could do a presentation on WebTest, a functional testing tool for
> WSGI 
> applications.
> 
> sheila miguez wrote:
> > Time: Thursday, December 13th
> > 
> > Topics so far
> > 
> > Sterling will give a short demonstration on EasyGUI
> > 
> > I want more topics. I have pinged people I know and Dave Shemenski
> > said he could give a talk on Heisenbug, the automated regression
> test
> > framework system written in jython that we use here at Orbitz.
> > 
> > Location
> > 
> > This will be a good opportunity to encourage people from the
> suburbs
> > to join us, since the meeting room is in the same building as the
> > Ogilvy stop, and very close walking distance to the Madison exit of
> > Union Station.
> > 
> > Orbitz
> > Ogilvy Transportation Center
> > 500 W Madison
> > Chicago, IL 60661
> > 
> > Please RSVP to shekay at pobox com
> > 
> >     I will need a list of attendees to give to building
> >     security. Please send me a note with chipy in the
> >     subject line to let me know that you'll be attending.
> > 
> > This also helps us to know how much food to order.
> > 
> > 
> 
> 
> -- 
> Ian Bicking : ianb at colorstudy.com : http://blog.ianbicking.org
> _______________________________________________
> Chicago mailing list
> Chicago at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago


From garrett at mojave-corp.com  Tue Dec  4 04:49:11 2007
From: garrett at mojave-corp.com (Garrett Smith)
Date: Mon, 3 Dec 2007 21:49:11 -0600 (CST)
Subject: [Chicago] Help plan our best meeting ever!
In-Reply-To: <a68ced640712031115w14be0690w1b98bd83303de386@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <26776197.4336001196740151695.JavaMail.root@noc-106.smedia.info>

I can present on Python and CouchDB:

  http://couchdb.org

>From their wiki on what it is:

 *  A document database server, accessible via a RESTful JSON API.

 * Ad-hoc and schema-free with a flat address space.

 * Distributed, featuring robust, incremental replication with bi-directional conflict detection and management.

 * Query-able and index-able, featuring a table oriented reporting engine that uses Javascript as a query language. 


----- "sheila miguez" <shekay at pobox.com> wrote:
> Time: Thursday, December 13th
> 
> Topics so far
> 
> Sterling will give a short demonstration on EasyGUI
> 
> I want more topics. I have pinged people I know and Dave Shemenski
> said he could give a talk on Heisenbug, the automated regression test
> framework system written in jython that we use here at Orbitz.
> 
> Location
> 
> This will be a good opportunity to encourage people from the suburbs
> to join us, since the meeting room is in the same building as the
> Ogilvy stop, and very close walking distance to the Madison exit of
> Union Station.
> 
> Orbitz
> Ogilvy Transportation Center
> 500 W Madison
> Chicago, IL 60661
> 
> Please RSVP to shekay at pobox com
> 
>     I will need a list of attendees to give to building
>     security. Please send me a note with chipy in the
>     subject line to let me know that you'll be attending.
> 
> This also helps us to know how much food to order.
> 
> 
> -- 
> sheila
> _______________________________________________
> Chicago mailing list
> Chicago at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago


From ianb at colorstudy.com  Tue Dec  4 05:53:41 2007
From: ianb at colorstudy.com (Ian Bicking)
Date: Mon, 03 Dec 2007 22:53:41 -0600
Subject: [Chicago] Help plan our best meeting ever!
In-Reply-To: <a68ced640712031115w14be0690w1b98bd83303de386@mail.gmail.com>
References: <a68ced640712031115w14be0690w1b98bd83303de386@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <4754DD55.40605@colorstudy.com>

We appear to have an embarrassment of riches in possible presentation 
topics this month.  We can't all present.

* Sterling, a short demonstration on EasyGUI
* Dave Shemenski, Heisenbug (not sure)
* Chris Webber, an automation system
* Feihong Hsu, a GUI wrapper
* Ian Bicking, WebTest
* Garrett Smith, CouchDB

I think we could do two short presentations and a long one, but that's 
about it.  And that's only 8 hours after Sheila's email.

So... how long do people think their presentations will be?  I'm 
probably in the 30 minute range, but I could do it in less.

Also, for people who think they will attend, what talk(s) interest you most?

-- 
Ian Bicking : ianb at colorstudy.com : http://blog.ianbicking.org

From zibble at gmail.com  Tue Dec  4 06:43:39 2007
From: zibble at gmail.com (Scott Zibble)
Date: Mon, 3 Dec 2007 23:43:39 -0600
Subject: [Chicago] Help plan our best meeting ever!
In-Reply-To: <4754DD55.40605@colorstudy.com>
References: <a68ced640712031115w14be0690w1b98bd83303de386@mail.gmail.com>
	<4754DD55.40605@colorstudy.com>
Message-ID: <d5f4f5590712032143l1b342a81rc09b65d82982b39@mail.gmail.com>

I'm definitely interested in the talk about Heisenbug and would love to see
that one happen...

On Dec 3, 2007 10:53 PM, Ian Bicking <ianb at colorstudy.com> wrote:

> We appear to have an embarrassment of riches in possible presentation
> topics this month.  We can't all present.
>
> * Sterling, a short demonstration on EasyGUI
> * Dave Shemenski, Heisenbug (not sure)
> * Chris Webber, an automation system
> * Feihong Hsu, a GUI wrapper
> * Ian Bicking, WebTest
> * Garrett Smith, CouchDB
>
> I think we could do two short presentations and a long one, but that's
> about it.  And that's only 8 hours after Sheila's email.
>
> So... how long do people think their presentations will be?  I'm
> probably in the 30 minute range, but I could do it in less.
>
> Also, for people who think they will attend, what talk(s) interest you
> most?
>
> --
> Ian Bicking : ianb at colorstudy.com : http://blog.ianbicking.org
> _______________________________________________
> Chicago mailing list
> Chicago at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>
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From carl at personnelware.com  Tue Dec  4 07:17:23 2007
From: carl at personnelware.com (Carl Karsten)
Date: Tue, 04 Dec 2007 00:17:23 -0600
Subject: [Chicago] Help plan our best meeting ever!
In-Reply-To: <214037.62033.qm@web34807.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
References: <214037.62033.qm@web34807.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <4754F0F3.1090201@personnelware.com>

Is EasyGUI just dialogs?  That is what I came up with from skimming the site and 
watched the 2 demos.

If so, I would like to see some wx.  I'll take crappy wx over less crappy 
winforms :)

Carl K

Feihong Hsu wrote:
> I don't know if two GUI talks will be too much, but I've been working on GUI
> wrapper libraries for both WinForms and wxPython. At this point I don't know
> which one I want to present on, I guess whichever one is less crappy at the
> time of the meeting.
> 
> - Feihong
> 
> sheila miguez <shekay at pobox.com> wrote: Time: Thursday, December 13th
> 
> Topics so far
> 
> Sterling will give a short demonstration on EasyGUI
> 
> I want more topics. I have pinged people I know and Dave Shemenski said he
> could give a talk on Heisenbug, the automated regression test framework
> system written in jython that we use here at Orbitz.
> 
> Location
> 
> This will be a good opportunity to encourage people from the suburbs to join
> us, since the meeting room is in the same building as the Ogilvy stop, and
> very close walking distance to the Madison exit of Union Station.
> 
> Orbitz Ogilvy Transportation Center 500 W Madison Chicago, IL 60661
> 
> Please RSVP to shekay at pobox com
> 
> I will need a list of attendees to give to building security. Please send me
> a note with chipy in the subject line to let me know that you'll be
> attending.
> 
> This also helps us to know how much food to order.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> 
> _______________________________________________ Chicago mailing list 
> Chicago at python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago

From skip at pobox.com  Tue Dec  4 06:10:11 2007
From: skip at pobox.com (skip at pobox.com)
Date: Mon, 3 Dec 2007 23:10:11 -0600
Subject: [Chicago] Help plan our best meeting ever!
In-Reply-To: <4754DD55.40605@colorstudy.com>
References: <a68ced640712031115w14be0690w1b98bd83303de386@mail.gmail.com>
	<4754DD55.40605@colorstudy.com>
Message-ID: <18260.57651.348242.990299@montanaro.dyndns.org>


    Ian> We appear to have an embarrassment of riches in possible
    Ian> presentation topics this month.  We can't all present.

If you have a surfeit of potential speakers you might try slotting them for
the next few meetings, not just the next one.

Skip

From skip at pobox.com  Tue Dec  4 01:43:55 2007
From: skip at pobox.com (skip at pobox.com)
Date: Mon, 3 Dec 2007 18:43:55 -0600
Subject: [Chicago] Full time Python Developer positions
In-Reply-To: <4754869E.4070500@gmail.com>
References: <470D23E4.1010601@cognizo.com> <200710101621.04289.pfein@pobox.com>
	<20071010214232.GA29439@wdfs> <470D4A0D.6010403@cognizo.com>
	<4754869E.4070500@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <18260.41675.465199.594246@montanaro.dyndns.org>


    Tim> Did you find all that you were looking for?

Who is 'you' in this context?  Note that the mailing list is set up so that
replies go to the list, so unless you address your email to a specific
person or provide a little context, few people (if anyone) will know what
you were referring to.

-- 
Skip Montanaro - skip at pobox.com - http://www.webfast.com/~skip/

From garrett at mojave-corp.com  Tue Dec  4 14:35:22 2007
From: garrett at mojave-corp.com (Garrett Smith)
Date: Tue, 4 Dec 2007 07:35:22 -0600 (CST)
Subject: [Chicago] Help plan our best meeting ever!
In-Reply-To: <4754DD55.40605@colorstudy.com>
Message-ID: <5908276.4352841196775322301.JavaMail.root@noc-106.smedia.info>

I can move the CouchDB talk to another meeting.

I'd like to hear about the wsgi testing framework.


----- "Ian Bicking" <ianb at colorstudy.com> wrote:
> We appear to have an embarrassment of riches in possible presentation
> 
> topics this month.  We can't all present.
> 
> * Sterling, a short demonstration on EasyGUI
> * Dave Shemenski, Heisenbug (not sure)
> * Chris Webber, an automation system
> * Feihong Hsu, a GUI wrapper
> * Ian Bicking, WebTest
> * Garrett Smith, CouchDB
> 
> I think we could do two short presentations and a long one, but that's
> 
> about it.  And that's only 8 hours after Sheila's email.
> 
> So... how long do people think their presentations will be?  I'm 
> probably in the 30 minute range, but I could do it in less.
> 
> Also, for people who think they will attend, what talk(s) interest you
> most?
> 
> -- 
> Ian Bicking : ianb at colorstudy.com : http://blog.ianbicking.org
> _______________________________________________
> Chicago mailing list
> Chicago at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago


From tottinge at gmail.com  Tue Dec  4 14:55:07 2007
From: tottinge at gmail.com (Tim Ottinger)
Date: Tue, 04 Dec 2007 07:55:07 -0600
Subject: [Chicago] Full time Python Developer positions
In-Reply-To: <18260.41675.465199.594246@montanaro.dyndns.org>
References: <470D23E4.1010601@cognizo.com>
	<200710101621.04289.pfein@pobox.com>	<20071010214232.GA29439@wdfs>
	<470D4A0D.6010403@cognizo.com>	<4754869E.4070500@gmail.com>
	<18260.41675.465199.594246@montanaro.dyndns.org>
Message-ID: <47555C3B.5010204@gmail.com>

skip at pobox.com wrote:
>     Tim> Did you find all that you were looking for?
>
> Who is 'you' in this context?  Note that the mailing list is set up so that
> replies go to the list, so unless you address your email to a specific
> person or provide a little context, few people (if anyone) will know what
> you were referring to.
>
>   
Thanks for the reminder.  Luckily, one of the ones I was trying to reach
contacted me based on the reminder.  The rest: please disregard.

From hsu.feihong at yahoo.com  Tue Dec  4 16:08:37 2007
From: hsu.feihong at yahoo.com (Feihong Hsu)
Date: Tue, 4 Dec 2007 07:08:37 -0800 (PST)
Subject: [Chicago] Help plan our best meeting ever!
In-Reply-To: <26776197.4336001196740151695.JavaMail.root@noc-106.smedia.info>
Message-ID: <998164.99929.qm@web34802.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

+1

Garrett Smith <garrett at mojave-corp.com> wrote: I can present on Python and CouchDB:

  http://couchdb.org

>From their wiki on what it is:

 *  A document database server, accessible via a RESTful JSON API.

 * Ad-hoc and schema-free with a flat address space.

 * Distributed, featuring robust, incremental replication with bi-directional conflict detection and management.

 * Query-able and index-able, featuring a table oriented reporting engine that uses Javascript as a query language. 


----- "sheila miguez"  wrote:
> Time: Thursday, December 13th
> 
> Topics so far
> 
> Sterling will give a short demonstration on EasyGUI
> 
> I want more topics. I have pinged people I know and Dave Shemenski
> said he could give a talk on Heisenbug, the automated regression test
> framework system written in jython that we use here at Orbitz.
> 
> Location
> 
> This will be a good opportunity to encourage people from the suburbs
> to join us, since the meeting room is in the same building as the
> Ogilvy stop, and very close walking distance to the Madison exit of
> Union Station.
> 
> Orbitz
> Ogilvy Transportation Center
> 500 W Madison
> Chicago, IL 60661
> 
> Please RSVP to shekay at pobox com
> 
>     I will need a list of attendees to give to building
>     security. Please send me a note with chipy in the
>     subject line to let me know that you'll be attending.
> 
> This also helps us to know how much food to order.
> 
> 
> -- 
> sheila
> _______________________________________________
> Chicago mailing list
> Chicago at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago

_______________________________________________
Chicago mailing list
Chicago at python.org
http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago


       
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From kumar.mcmillan at gmail.com  Tue Dec  4 16:13:32 2007
From: kumar.mcmillan at gmail.com (Kumar McMillan)
Date: Tue, 4 Dec 2007 09:13:32 -0600
Subject: [Chicago] Help plan our best meeting ever!
In-Reply-To: <4754DD55.40605@colorstudy.com>
References: <a68ced640712031115w14be0690w1b98bd83303de386@mail.gmail.com>
	<4754DD55.40605@colorstudy.com>
Message-ID: <b571660a0712040713k6a701f6r8ce3170900cb3bb4@mail.gmail.com>

> * Ian Bicking, WebTest

+1.2

> * Garrett Smith, CouchDB

+1.1

> * Chris Webber, an automation system

+1

...those are my votes, FWIW

From shekay at pobox.com  Tue Dec  4 16:39:39 2007
From: shekay at pobox.com (sheila miguez)
Date: Tue, 4 Dec 2007 09:39:39 -0600
Subject: [Chicago] Help plan our best meeting ever!
In-Reply-To: <d5f4f5590712032143l1b342a81rc09b65d82982b39@mail.gmail.com>
References: <a68ced640712031115w14be0690w1b98bd83303de386@mail.gmail.com>
	<4754DD55.40605@colorstudy.com>
	<d5f4f5590712032143l1b342a81rc09b65d82982b39@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <a68ced640712040739p104d77d8k9534560ea4be2846@mail.gmail.com>

On Dec 3, 2007 11:43 PM, Scott Zibble <zibble at gmail.com> wrote:
> I'm definitely interested in the talk about Heisenbug and would love to see
> that one happen...

Not sure it can happen this time around. He said that his schedule is
getting wacky for that day and he may not be able to present.

-- 
sheila

From shekay at pobox.com  Tue Dec  4 16:44:56 2007
From: shekay at pobox.com (sheila miguez)
Date: Tue, 4 Dec 2007 09:44:56 -0600
Subject: [Chicago] Help plan our best meeting ever!
In-Reply-To: <4754DD55.40605@colorstudy.com>
References: <a68ced640712031115w14be0690w1b98bd83303de386@mail.gmail.com>
	<4754DD55.40605@colorstudy.com>
Message-ID: <a68ced640712040744g464bc7baxec5fce15febf220f@mail.gmail.com>

On Dec 3, 2007 10:53 PM, Ian Bicking <ianb at colorstudy.com> wrote:

> Also, for people who think they will attend, what talk(s) interest you most?

Can we nominate you to be the picker of talks with deadline of
sometime next week in time for us to send out the customary meeting
announcement?


-- 
sheila

From cwebber at imagescape.com  Tue Dec  4 16:46:16 2007
From: cwebber at imagescape.com (Christopher Allan Webber)
Date: Tue, 04 Dec 2007 09:46:16 -0600
Subject: [Chicago] Help plan our best meeting ever!
In-Reply-To: <b571660a0712040713k6a701f6r8ce3170900cb3bb4@mail.gmail.com>
	(Kumar McMillan's message of "Tue, 4 Dec 2007 09:13:32 -0600")
References: <a68ced640712031115w14be0690w1b98bd83303de386@mail.gmail.com>
	<4754DD55.40605@colorstudy.com>
	<b571660a0712040713k6a701f6r8ce3170900cb3bb4@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <6y7ijuwjhz.fsf@imagepc03.rd.imagescape.com>

"Kumar McMillan" <kumar.mcmillan at gmail.com> writes:

>> * Ian Bicking, WebTest
>
> +1.2
>
>> * Garrett Smith, CouchDB
>
> +1.1
>
>> * Chris Webber, an automation system
>
> +1
>

... well, it's an animation system, not an automation system... don't
know if that changes things..

> ...those are my votes, FWIW
> _______________________________________________
> Chicago mailing list
> Chicago at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago

From hsu.feihong at yahoo.com  Tue Dec  4 16:49:56 2007
From: hsu.feihong at yahoo.com (Feihong Hsu)
Date: Tue, 4 Dec 2007 07:49:56 -0800 (PST)
Subject: [Chicago] Help plan our best meeting ever!
In-Reply-To: <4754DD55.40605@colorstudy.com>
Message-ID: <787702.872.qm@web34805.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

I would really like to hear about WebTest and CouchDb.

As for my GUI wrapper, I'll probably stick to the wxPython wrapper. The primary purpose of the library is to simplify layout and event binding. A short example:

<code>

f = Frame(title='Example', size='400, 500') [
    SizedPanel(sizertype='vertical') [
        Button(name='btn1', label='Button1', proportion=1),
        Button(name='btn2', label='Button2', proportion=1),
       ListBox(name='lbox', label='Button3', proportion=3, expand=True),
    ]
]

@f.btn1.Bind('button')
def onclick(evt):
    print 'You clicked on', evt.EventObject.GetLabel()

@f.lbox.Bind('listbox')
def onchange(evt):
    print 'You selected', evt.EventObject.GetStringSelection()

f.Show()

</code>

Secondary goals of the library are:
- Make it trivial to create wrappers for third-party widgets
- Support XML and YAML declaration
- Simplify the process of creating custom widget classes
- Integrate well with existing wxPython applications

I'm not very far along with the secondary goals, though.

- Feihong

Ian Bicking <ianb at colorstudy.com> wrote: We appear to have an embarrassment of riches in possible presentation 
topics this month.  We can't all present.

* Sterling, a short demonstration on EasyGUI
* Dave Shemenski, Heisenbug (not sure)
* Chris Webber, an automation system
* Feihong Hsu, a GUI wrapper
* Ian Bicking, WebTest
* Garrett Smith, CouchDB

I think we could do two short presentations and a long one, but that's 
about it.  And that's only 8 hours after Sheila's email.

So... how long do people think their presentations will be?  I'm 
probably in the 30 minute range, but I could do it in less.

Also, for people who think they will attend, what talk(s) interest you most?

-- 
Ian Bicking : ianb at colorstudy.com : http://blog.ianbicking.org
_______________________________________________
Chicago mailing list
Chicago at python.org
http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago


       
---------------------------------
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From cwebber at imagescape.com  Tue Dec  4 17:09:09 2007
From: cwebber at imagescape.com (Christopher Allan Webber)
Date: Tue, 04 Dec 2007 10:09:09 -0600
Subject: [Chicago] Help plan our best meeting ever!
In-Reply-To: <6y7ijuwjhz.fsf@imagepc03.rd.imagescape.com> (Christopher Allan
	Webber's message of "Tue, 04 Dec 2007 09:46:16 -0600")
References: <a68ced640712031115w14be0690w1b98bd83303de386@mail.gmail.com>
	<4754DD55.40605@colorstudy.com>
	<b571660a0712040713k6a701f6r8ce3170900cb3bb4@mail.gmail.com>
	<6y7ijuwjhz.fsf@imagepc03.rd.imagescape.com>
Message-ID: <6y1wa2wifu.fsf@imagepc03.rd.imagescape.com>

BTW, I'm happy to delay my presentation till next month.  I have an
actual "use" of it coming up soon, and this will allow me to wait till
after that test case.  It'll probaly also give me some time to clean
up the code a bit.  But I seriously seriously want to claim dibs on
presenting next month then, since I posted to the list about
presenting before our last meeting even happened ;)

Christopher Allan Webber <cwebber at imagescape.com> writes:

> "Kumar McMillan" <kumar.mcmillan at gmail.com> writes:
>
>>> * Ian Bicking, WebTest
>>
>> +1.2
>>
>>> * Garrett Smith, CouchDB
>>
>> +1.1
>>
>>> * Chris Webber, an automation system
>>
>> +1
>>
>
> ... well, it's an animation system, not an automation system... don't
> know if that changes things..
>
>> ...those are my votes, FWIW
>> _______________________________________________
>> Chicago mailing list
>> Chicago at python.org
>> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
> _______________________________________________
> Chicago mailing list
> Chicago at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago

From mdipierro at cs.depaul.edu  Wed Dec  5 04:27:56 2007
From: mdipierro at cs.depaul.edu (Massimo Di Pierro)
Date: Tue, 4 Dec 2007 21:27:56 -0600
Subject: [Chicago] doctest to string/file?
In-Reply-To: <47555C3B.5010204@gmail.com>
References: <470D23E4.1010601@cognizo.com>
	<200710101621.04289.pfein@pobox.com>	<20071010214232.GA29439@wdfs>
	<470D4A0D.6010403@cognizo.com>	<4754869E.4070500@gmail.com>
	<18260.41675.465199.594246@montanaro.dyndns.org>
	<47555C3B.5010204@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <4D9A78DA-6C6D-4A33-A3CF-3B60DCC525CE@cs.depaul.edu>

Does everybody know if there is a way to redirect the output of  
doctest.testmod to a string or file?

Massimo

From mdipierro at cs.depaul.edu  Wed Dec  5 04:59:46 2007
From: mdipierro at cs.depaul.edu (Massimo Di Pierro)
Date: Tue, 4 Dec 2007 21:59:46 -0600
Subject: [Chicago] doctest to string/file?
In-Reply-To: <4D9A78DA-6C6D-4A33-A3CF-3B60DCC525CE@cs.depaul.edu>
References: <470D23E4.1010601@cognizo.com>
	<200710101621.04289.pfein@pobox.com>	<20071010214232.GA29439@wdfs>
	<470D4A0D.6010403@cognizo.com>	<4754869E.4070500@gmail.com>
	<18260.41675.465199.594246@montanaro.dyndns.org>	<47555C3B.5010204@gmail.com>
	<4D9A78DA-6C6D-4A33-A3CF-3B60DCC525CE@cs.depaul.edu>
Message-ID: <03801194-A117-463E-AF02-0EBED0A72F96@cs.depaul.edu>

Never mind. It appears doctest is not thread safe so I will just  
redirect stdout to a StringIO.

Massimo

On Dec 4, 2007, at 9:27 PM, DiPierro, Massimo wrote:

> Does everybody know if there is a way to redirect the output of
> doctest.testmod to a string or file?
>
> Massimo
> _______________________________________________
> Chicago mailing list
> Chicago at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago


From jeffh at dundeemt.com  Wed Dec  5 07:24:34 2007
From: jeffh at dundeemt.com (Jeff Hinrichs - DM&T)
Date: Wed, 5 Dec 2007 00:24:34 -0600
Subject: [Chicago] xkcd on Python
Message-ID: <5aaed53f0712042224w5b7b0d95u3d8ca6a5f571f125@mail.gmail.com>

http://imgs.xkcd.com/comics/python.png

"Better than everything in the medicine cabinet"

--jeff

From ken at stox.org  Wed Dec  5 07:40:29 2007
From: ken at stox.org (Kenneth P. Stox)
Date: Wed, 05 Dec 2007 00:40:29 -0600
Subject: [Chicago] xkcd on Python
In-Reply-To: <5aaed53f0712042224w5b7b0d95u3d8ca6a5f571f125@mail.gmail.com>
References: <5aaed53f0712042224w5b7b0d95u3d8ca6a5f571f125@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <1196836829.9596.76.camel@stox.dyndns.org>


On Wed, 2007-12-05 at 00:24 -0600, Jeff Hinrichs - DM&T wrote:
> http://imgs.xkcd.com/comics/python.png
> 
> "Better than everything in the medicine cabinet"

Reminds me of the first day I dove into python. It was just so clear and
intuitive. No other other language has done the same for me. Although, I
will admit, I always had a strong affection for PL/1.


From shekay at pobox.com  Wed Dec  5 16:32:41 2007
From: shekay at pobox.com (sheila miguez)
Date: Wed, 5 Dec 2007 09:32:41 -0600
Subject: [Chicago] xkcd on Python
In-Reply-To: <5aaed53f0712042224w5b7b0d95u3d8ca6a5f571f125@mail.gmail.com>
References: <5aaed53f0712042224w5b7b0d95u3d8ca6a5f571f125@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <a68ced640712050732qe9f8583n66e875bddbb938dc@mail.gmail.com>

On Dec 5, 2007 12:24 AM, Jeff Hinrichs - DM&T <jeffh at dundeemt.com> wrote:
> http://imgs.xkcd.com/comics/python.png
>
> "Better than everything in the medicine cabinet"

Don't link directly, it doesn't have the hover text. all of his comics
have hover text. if you don't notice at first and you get too far into
them, you obsessively go back and read them all.

someone I know once said that eventually we could speak a language of
xkcd hashes.

if you don't link to the comic page, you won't know the number then
you can't say, "yeah, that's just like 353."


-- 
sheila

From cwebber at imagescape.com  Wed Dec  5 16:49:15 2007
From: cwebber at imagescape.com (Christopher Allan Webber)
Date: Wed, 05 Dec 2007 09:49:15 -0600
Subject: [Chicago] xkcd on Python
In-Reply-To: <5aaed53f0712042224w5b7b0d95u3d8ca6a5f571f125@mail.gmail.com>
	(Jeff Hinrichs's message of "Wed, 5 Dec 2007 00:24:34 -0600")
References: <5aaed53f0712042224w5b7b0d95u3d8ca6a5f571f125@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <6yd4tlrvk4.fsf@imagepc03.rd.imagescape.com>

Already printed out, taped to our cabinets.

<3 xkcd

"Jeff Hinrichs - DM&T" <jeffh at dundeemt.com> writes:

> http://imgs.xkcd.com/comics/python.png
>
> "Better than everything in the medicine cabinet"
>
> --jeff
> _______________________________________________
> Chicago mailing list
> Chicago at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago

From shekay at pobox.com  Wed Dec  5 17:24:57 2007
From: shekay at pobox.com (sheila miguez)
Date: Wed, 5 Dec 2007 10:24:57 -0600
Subject: [Chicago] xkcd on Python
In-Reply-To: <6yd4tlrvk4.fsf@imagepc03.rd.imagescape.com>
References: <5aaed53f0712042224w5b7b0d95u3d8ca6a5f571f125@mail.gmail.com>
	<6yd4tlrvk4.fsf@imagepc03.rd.imagescape.com>
Message-ID: <a68ced640712050824p3c736bfdq6a738fe2545e5af8@mail.gmail.com>

he's got a comic for that too http://xkcd.com/352/ but I am not flying
cross country to Randal. Maybe we could fly him cross country to
PyCon.

On Dec 5, 2007 9:49 AM, Christopher Allan Webber <cwebber at imagescape.com> wrote:
> Already printed out, taped to our cabinets.
>
> <3 xkcd
>
>
> "Jeff Hinrichs - DM&T" <jeffh at dundeemt.com> writes:
>
> > http://imgs.xkcd.com/comics/python.png
> >
> > "Better than everything in the medicine cabinet"
> >
> > --jeff
> > _______________________________________________
> > Chicago mailing list
> > Chicago at python.org
> > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
> _______________________________________________
> Chicago mailing list
> Chicago at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>



-- 
sheila

From mtobis at gmail.com  Wed Dec  5 17:29:33 2007
From: mtobis at gmail.com (Michael Tobis)
Date: Wed, 5 Dec 2007 10:29:33 -0600
Subject: [Chicago] xkcd on Python
In-Reply-To: <a68ced640712050824p3c736bfdq6a738fe2545e5af8@mail.gmail.com>
References: <5aaed53f0712042224w5b7b0d95u3d8ca6a5f571f125@mail.gmail.com>
	<6yd4tlrvk4.fsf@imagepc03.rd.imagescape.com>
	<a68ced640712050824p3c736bfdq6a738fe2545e5af8@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <c3aa55550712050829w4a30d2e6r98963d1d61e2227f@mail.gmail.com>

T - Shirt opportunity! Top panel on one side, bottom panel on the other...

mt

On Dec 5, 2007 10:24 AM, sheila miguez <shekay at pobox.com> wrote:
> he's got a comic for that too http://xkcd.com/352/ but I am not flying
> cross country to Randal. Maybe we could fly him cross country to
> PyCon.
>
>
> On Dec 5, 2007 9:49 AM, Christopher Allan Webber <cwebber at imagescape.com> wrote:
> > Already printed out, taped to our cabinets.
> >
> > <3 xkcd
> >
> >
> > "Jeff Hinrichs - DM&T" <jeffh at dundeemt.com> writes:
> >
> > > http://imgs.xkcd.com/comics/python.png
> > >
> > > "Better than everything in the medicine cabinet"
> > >
> > > --jeff
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > Chicago mailing list
> > > Chicago at python.org
> > > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
> > _______________________________________________
> > Chicago mailing list
> > Chicago at python.org
> > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
> >
>
>
>
> --
> sheila
>
> _______________________________________________
> Chicago mailing list
> Chicago at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>

From cwebber at imagescape.com  Wed Dec  5 17:29:47 2007
From: cwebber at imagescape.com (Christopher Allan Webber)
Date: Wed, 05 Dec 2007 10:29:47 -0600
Subject: [Chicago] xkcd on Python
In-Reply-To: <a68ced640712050824p3c736bfdq6a738fe2545e5af8@mail.gmail.com>
	(sheila miguez's message of "Wed, 5 Dec 2007 10:24:57 -0600")
References: <5aaed53f0712042224w5b7b0d95u3d8ca6a5f571f125@mail.gmail.com>
	<6yd4tlrvk4.fsf@imagepc03.rd.imagescape.com>
	<a68ced640712050824p3c736bfdq6a738fe2545e5af8@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <6y63zdrtok.fsf@imagepc03.rd.imagescape.com>

I know, but wtf windows xp aol instant messenger in that comic?

Seriously now.

"sheila miguez" <shekay at pobox.com> writes:

> he's got a comic for that too http://xkcd.com/352/ but I am not flying
> cross country to Randal. Maybe we could fly him cross country to
> PyCon.
>
> On Dec 5, 2007 9:49 AM, Christopher Allan Webber <cwebber at imagescape.com> wrote:
>> Already printed out, taped to our cabinets.
>>
>> <3 xkcd
>>
>>
>> "Jeff Hinrichs - DM&T" <jeffh at dundeemt.com> writes:
>>
>> > http://imgs.xkcd.com/comics/python.png
>> >
>> > "Better than everything in the medicine cabinet"
>> >
>> > --jeff
>> > _______________________________________________
>> > Chicago mailing list
>> > Chicago at python.org
>> > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>> _______________________________________________
>> Chicago mailing list
>> Chicago at python.org
>> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>>
>
>
>
> -- 
> sheila
> _______________________________________________
> Chicago mailing list
> Chicago at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago

From shekay at pobox.com  Wed Dec  5 17:30:39 2007
From: shekay at pobox.com (sheila miguez)
Date: Wed, 5 Dec 2007 10:30:39 -0600
Subject: [Chicago] xkcd on Python
In-Reply-To: <a68ced640712050824p3c736bfdq6a738fe2545e5af8@mail.gmail.com>
References: <5aaed53f0712042224w5b7b0d95u3d8ca6a5f571f125@mail.gmail.com>
	<6yd4tlrvk4.fsf@imagepc03.rd.imagescape.com>
	<a68ced640712050824p3c736bfdq6a738fe2545e5af8@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <a68ced640712050830y35fa0f16rafad3a2f86d0637@mail.gmail.com>

http://syndicated.livejournal.com/xkcd_rss/85603.html?thread=7988835#t7988835

Maybe someone should send him an invite.

On Dec 5, 2007 10:24 AM, sheila miguez <shekay at pobox.com> wrote:
> he's got a comic for that too http://xkcd.com/352/ but I am not flying
> cross country to Randal. Maybe we could fly him cross country to
> PyCon.
>
>
> On Dec 5, 2007 9:49 AM, Christopher Allan Webber <cwebber at imagescape.com> wrote:
> > Already printed out, taped to our cabinets.
> >
> > <3 xkcd
> >
> >
> > "Jeff Hinrichs - DM&T" <jeffh at dundeemt.com> writes:
> >
> > > http://imgs.xkcd.com/comics/python.png
> > >
> > > "Better than everything in the medicine cabinet"
> > >
> > > --jeff
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > Chicago mailing list
> > > Chicago at python.org
> > > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
> > _______________________________________________
> > Chicago mailing list
> > Chicago at python.org
> > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
> >
>
>
>
> --
> sheila
>



-- 
sheila

From shekay at pobox.com  Wed Dec  5 17:37:18 2007
From: shekay at pobox.com (sheila miguez)
Date: Wed, 5 Dec 2007 10:37:18 -0600
Subject: [Chicago] xkcd on Python
In-Reply-To: <6y63zdrtok.fsf@imagepc03.rd.imagescape.com>
References: <5aaed53f0712042224w5b7b0d95u3d8ca6a5f571f125@mail.gmail.com>
	<6yd4tlrvk4.fsf@imagepc03.rd.imagescape.com>
	<a68ced640712050824p3c736bfdq6a738fe2545e5af8@mail.gmail.com>
	<6y63zdrtok.fsf@imagepc03.rd.imagescape.com>
Message-ID: <a68ced640712050837g1ea51b6bw3a15b519fb4ef81c@mail.gmail.com>

I had the exact same reaction!

On Dec 5, 2007 10:29 AM, Christopher Allan Webber
<cwebber at imagescape.com> wrote:
> I know, but wtf windows xp aol instant messenger in that comic?
>
> Seriously now.
>
>
> "sheila miguez" <shekay at pobox.com> writes:
>
> > he's got a comic for that too http://xkcd.com/352/ but I am not flying
> > cross country to Randal. Maybe we could fly him cross country to
> > PyCon.
> >
> > On Dec 5, 2007 9:49 AM, Christopher Allan Webber <cwebber at imagescape.com> wrote:
> >> Already printed out, taped to our cabinets.
> >>
> >> <3 xkcd
> >>
> >>
> >> "Jeff Hinrichs - DM&T" <jeffh at dundeemt.com> writes:
> >>
> >> > http://imgs.xkcd.com/comics/python.png
> >> >
> >> > "Better than everything in the medicine cabinet"
> >> >
> >> > --jeff
> >> > _______________________________________________
> >> > Chicago mailing list
> >> > Chicago at python.org
> >> > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
> >> _______________________________________________
> >> Chicago mailing list
> >> Chicago at python.org
> >> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
> >>
> >
> >
> >
> > --
> > sheila
> > _______________________________________________
> > Chicago mailing list
> > Chicago at python.org
> > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
> _______________________________________________
> Chicago mailing list
> Chicago at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>



-- 
sheila

From shekay at pobox.com  Wed Dec  5 17:57:50 2007
From: shekay at pobox.com (sheila miguez)
Date: Wed, 5 Dec 2007 10:57:50 -0600
Subject: [Chicago] xkcd on Python
In-Reply-To: <c3aa55550712050829w4a30d2e6r98963d1d61e2227f@mail.gmail.com>
References: <5aaed53f0712042224w5b7b0d95u3d8ca6a5f571f125@mail.gmail.com>
	<6yd4tlrvk4.fsf@imagepc03.rd.imagescape.com>
	<a68ced640712050824p3c736bfdq6a738fe2545e5af8@mail.gmail.com>
	<c3aa55550712050829w4a30d2e6r98963d1d61e2227f@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <a68ced640712050857m1be5b52dpeda53ca3a2fcc82@mail.gmail.com>

I like the

from __future__ import antigravity

suggestion.

can we get permission for that?

Ps. if he comes to chipy can we give him a group hug?

On Dec 5, 2007 10:29 AM, Michael Tobis <mtobis at gmail.com> wrote:
> T - Shirt opportunity! Top panel on one side, bottom panel on the other...
>
> mt
>
>
> On Dec 5, 2007 10:24 AM, sheila miguez <shekay at pobox.com> wrote:
> > he's got a comic for that too http://xkcd.com/352/ but I am not flying
> > cross country to Randal. Maybe we could fly him cross country to
> > PyCon.
> >
> >
> > On Dec 5, 2007 9:49 AM, Christopher Allan Webber <cwebber at imagescape.com> wrote:
> > > Already printed out, taped to our cabinets.
> > >
> > > <3 xkcd
> > >
> > >
> > > "Jeff Hinrichs - DM&T" <jeffh at dundeemt.com> writes:
> > >
> > > > http://imgs.xkcd.com/comics/python.png
> > > >
> > > > "Better than everything in the medicine cabinet"
> > > >
> > > > --jeff
> > > > _______________________________________________
> > > > Chicago mailing list
> > > > Chicago at python.org
> > > > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > Chicago mailing list
> > > Chicago at python.org
> > > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
> > >
> >
> >
> >
> > --
> > sheila
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Chicago mailing list
> > Chicago at python.org
> > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
> >
> _______________________________________________
> Chicago mailing list
> Chicago at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>



-- 
sheila

From ramadeus at rcn.com  Thu Dec  6 01:38:51 2007
From: ramadeus at rcn.com (Mike Kramlich)
Date: Wed, 5 Dec 2007 18:38:51 -0600
Subject: [Chicago] Chicago Digest, Vol 28, Issue 14
References: <mailman.63.1196852421.31021.chicago@python.org>
Message-ID: <002201c837a0$6834e090$5a098818@MIKEP43GHZ>

that strip usually rocks, btw, for those who haven't discovered it.
lots of funny & insightful stuff. and the author is clearly a programmer 
based on how frequently, and how well, he deals with stuff relating to it.
i'd put it up there (and possibly above) Dilbert, in my personal pantheon of 
best comic strips ev-ah. YMMV, of course. :)

he also has a great semi-famous one on Lisp!

Mike

> Message: 4
> Date: Wed, 5 Dec 2007 00:24:34 -0600
> From: "Jeff Hinrichs - DM&T" <jeffh at dundeemt.com>
> Subject: [Chicago] xkcd on Python
...snip...
>
> http://imgs.xkcd.com/comics/python.png

From skip at pobox.com  Wed Dec  5 23:52:33 2007
From: skip at pobox.com (skip at pobox.com)
Date: Wed, 5 Dec 2007 16:52:33 -0600
Subject: [Chicago] xkcd on Python
In-Reply-To: <1196836829.9596.76.camel@stox.dyndns.org>
References: <5aaed53f0712042224w5b7b0d95u3d8ca6a5f571f125@mail.gmail.com>
	<1196836829.9596.76.camel@stox.dyndns.org>
Message-ID: <18263.11185.385018.197328@montanaro.dyndns.org>


    >> http://imgs.xkcd.com/comics/python.png
    >> 
    >> "Better than everything in the medicine cabinet"

    Ken> Reminds me of the first day I dove into python. It was just so
    Ken> clear and intuitive.

Unlike, say, XML Schemas... :-(

Skip

From cwebber at imagescape.com  Thu Dec  6 17:27:16 2007
From: cwebber at imagescape.com (Christopher Allan Webber)
Date: Thu, 06 Dec 2007 10:27:16 -0600
Subject: [Chicago] Chicago Digest, Vol 28, Issue 14
In-Reply-To: <002201c837a0$6834e090$5a098818@MIKEP43GHZ> (Mike Kramlich's
	message of "Wed, 5 Dec 2007 18:38:51 -0600")
References: <mailman.63.1196852421.31021.chicago@python.org>
	<002201c837a0$6834e090$5a098818@MIKEP43GHZ>
Message-ID: <6yejdzrdp7.fsf@imagepc03.rd.imagescape.com>

XKCD > Dilbert... that's not even a contest, man.

Also, batch mail digests suck because when people reply to them it
breaks my beautiful threading in Gnus :(

"Mike Kramlich" <ramadeus at rcn.com> writes:

> that strip usually rocks, btw, for those who haven't discovered it.
> lots of funny & insightful stuff. and the author is clearly a programmer 
> based on how frequently, and how well, he deals with stuff relating to it.
> i'd put it up there (and possibly above) Dilbert, in my personal pantheon of 
> best comic strips ev-ah. YMMV, of course. :)
>
> he also has a great semi-famous one on Lisp!
>
> Mike
>
>> Message: 4
>> Date: Wed, 5 Dec 2007 00:24:34 -0600
>> From: "Jeff Hinrichs - DM&T" <jeffh at dundeemt.com>
>> Subject: [Chicago] xkcd on Python
> ...snip...
>>
>> http://imgs.xkcd.com/comics/python.png
> _______________________________________________
> Chicago mailing list
> Chicago at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago

From garrett at mojave-corp.com  Thu Dec  6 19:01:47 2007
From: garrett at mojave-corp.com (Garrett Smith)
Date: Thu, 6 Dec 2007 12:01:47 -0600 (CST)
Subject: [Chicago] xkcd on Python
In-Reply-To: <5aaed53f0712042224w5b7b0d95u3d8ca6a5f571f125@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <10692499.4581881196964107544.JavaMail.root@noc-106.smedia.info>

I hadn't thought about it before, but it's clear to me now that stick-figures are indeed the correct Pythonic form.


----- Original Message -----
From: "Jeff Hinrichs - DM&T" <jeffh at dundeemt.com>
To: "Omaha Python Users Group" <omaha at python.org>, "The Chicago Python Users Group" <chicago at python.org>
Sent: Wednesday, December 5, 2007 12:24:34 AM (GMT-0600) America/Mexico_City
Subject: [Chicago] xkcd on Python

http://imgs.xkcd.com/comics/python.png

"Better than everything in the medicine cabinet"

--jeff
_______________________________________________
Chicago mailing list
Chicago at python.org
http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago


From milan at andric.us  Thu Dec  6 20:09:36 2007
From: milan at andric.us (Milan Andric)
Date: Thu, 6 Dec 2007 13:09:36 -0600
Subject: [Chicago] xkcd on Python
In-Reply-To: <10692499.4581881196964107544.JavaMail.root@noc-106.smedia.info>
References: <5aaed53f0712042224w5b7b0d95u3d8ca6a5f571f125@mail.gmail.com>
	<10692499.4581881196964107544.JavaMail.root@noc-106.smedia.info>
Message-ID: <536089f30712061109y63312316wb8c0e2262acdba4d@mail.gmail.com>

from stickfigures import human

richard_stallman = human(hair = "overgrown")
richard_stallman.weapons.add("samurai sword")
richard_stallman.weapons.add("samurai sword")

On Dec 6, 2007 12:01 PM, Garrett Smith <garrett at mojave-corp.com> wrote:
> I hadn't thought about it before, but it's clear to me now that stick-figures are indeed the correct Pythonic form.
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Jeff Hinrichs - DM&T" <jeffh at dundeemt.com>
> To: "Omaha Python Users Group" <omaha at python.org>, "The Chicago Python Users Group" <chicago at python.org>
> Sent: Wednesday, December 5, 2007 12:24:34 AM (GMT-0600) America/Mexico_City
> Subject: [Chicago] xkcd on Python
>
> http://imgs.xkcd.com/comics/python.png
>
> "Better than everything in the medicine cabinet"
>
> --jeff
> _______________________________________________
> Chicago mailing list
> Chicago at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>
> _______________________________________________
> Chicago mailing list
> Chicago at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>



-- 
Milan

From carl at personnelware.com  Thu Dec  6 22:54:14 2007
From: carl at personnelware.com (Carl Karsten)
Date: Thu, 06 Dec 2007 15:54:14 -0600
Subject: [Chicago] django hosting
Message-ID: <47586F86.7030802@personnelware.com>

I just got the green to find a host for my django site.

Anyone want to refer me to their host and get a commission?

It will need to be on
http://code.djangoproject.com/wiki/DjangoFriendlyWebHosts
so if the site is not there, add it first.

Carl K

From ido at cs.uchicago.edu  Thu Dec  6 23:10:30 2007
From: ido at cs.uchicago.edu (Ido Rosen)
Date: Thu, 6 Dec 2007 16:10:30 -0600
Subject: [Chicago] django hosting
In-Reply-To: <47586F86.7030802@personnelware.com>
References: <47586F86.7030802@personnelware.com>
Message-ID: <B50BAAD3-EE39-4CD9-85FB-01A7431CF1EB@cs.uchicago.edu>

If you're using DreamHost, the "promo code" CHIPY will get you the  
maximum discount ($97).  I don't make any commission off of it, but  
you're already contributing to my welfare in a way by being a Python  
developer.  (Less shitty PHP in the world.)

Ido

On Dec 6, 2007, at 3:54 PM, Carl Karsten wrote:

> I just got the green to find a host for my django site.
>
> Anyone want to refer me to their host and get a commission?
>
> It will need to be on
> http://code.djangoproject.com/wiki/DjangoFriendlyWebHosts
> so if the site is not there, add it first.
>
> Carl K
> _______________________________________________
> Chicago mailing list
> Chicago at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>


From bray at sent.com  Fri Dec  7 02:44:38 2007
From: bray at sent.com (Brian Ray)
Date: Thu, 6 Dec 2007 19:44:38 -0600
Subject: [Chicago] django hosting
In-Reply-To: <47586F86.7030802@personnelware.com>
References: <47586F86.7030802@personnelware.com>
Message-ID: <6DBE4134-A21E-4C69-8066-9F5EA0199F35@sent.com>

I have used Rimu for several years. In fact http://chipy.org plus  
several other sites I host are there. Someone from ChiPy recommended  
to me. Its already on that list. It been up 156 days, before that it  
was up twice or more than that.  I have very little need for support,  
but I heard they have good support.

On Dec 6, 2007, at 3:54 PM, Carl Karsten wrote:

> I just got the green to find a host for my django site.
>
> Anyone want to refer me to their host and get a commission?
>
> It will need to be on
> http://code.djangoproject.com/wiki/DjangoFriendlyWebHosts
> so if the site is not there, add it first.
>
> Carl K
> _______________________________________________
> Chicago mailing list
> Chicago at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago

Brian Ray
bray at sent.com
http://kazavoo.com/blog



From cwurld at yahoo.com  Fri Dec  7 04:16:30 2007
From: cwurld at yahoo.com (Chuck Martin)
Date: Thu, 6 Dec 2007 19:16:30 -0800 (PST)
Subject: [Chicago] django hosting
In-Reply-To: <47586F86.7030802@personnelware.com>
Message-ID: <872870.79819.qm@web50203.mail.re2.yahoo.com>

I am very pleased with webfaction
(http://www.webfaction.com/) Their up time is great
and so is their tech support. They have gone above and
beyond my expectations several times.

Chuck

--- Carl Karsten <carl at personnelware.com> wrote:

> I just got the green to find a host for my django
> site.
> 
> Anyone want to refer me to their host and get a
> commission?
> 
> It will need to be on
>
http://code.djangoproject.com/wiki/DjangoFriendlyWebHosts
> so if the site is not there, add it first.
> 
> Carl K
> _______________________________________________
> Chicago mailing list
> Chicago at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
> 



      ____________________________________________________________________________________
Be a better friend, newshound, and 
know-it-all with Yahoo! Mobile.  Try it now.  http://mobile.yahoo.com/;_ylt=Ahu06i62sR8HDtDypao8Wcj9tAcJ 


From hsu.feihong at yahoo.com  Fri Dec  7 04:23:10 2007
From: hsu.feihong at yahoo.com (Feihong Hsu)
Date: Thu, 6 Dec 2007 19:23:10 -0800 (PST)
Subject: [Chicago] django hosting
In-Reply-To: <47586F86.7030802@personnelware.com>
Message-ID: <139448.76171.qm@web34813.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

I really like WebFaction. Their basic plan is reasonably priced and you get mod_python and postgres! I have been really pleased with their uptime, too. I haven't heard any complaints about the site going down since I signed up in January.

I have a DreamHost account too. DreamHost only offers FastCGI and MySQL, but much bigger bandwidth and disk space for about the same price. I personally think WebFaction is the better way to go for Django, but it depends on what you're doing.

- Feihong

Carl Karsten <carl at personnelware.com> wrote: I just got the green to find a host for my django site.

Anyone want to refer me to their host and get a commission?

It will need to be on
http://code.djangoproject.com/wiki/DjangoFriendlyWebHosts
so if the site is not there, add it first.

Carl K
_______________________________________________
Chicago mailing list
Chicago at python.org
http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago


       
---------------------------------
Never miss a thing.   Make Yahoo your homepage.
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From ramadeus at rcn.com  Fri Dec  7 13:31:03 2007
From: ramadeus at rcn.com (Mike Kramlich)
Date: Fri, 7 Dec 2007 06:31:03 -0600
Subject: [Chicago] django hosting
Message-ID: <000b01c838cd$0872c6d0$5a098818@MIKEP43GHZ>

Carl:

I've only used WebFaction for Django hosting, have been for a couple months, 
love them so far. They were one of the first 3-4 I looked at, and they gave 
the best vibe so I signed up.

Supportive. I've opened a few tickets with change requests and they've been 
fast and friendly. When you read posts by their guys you can tell they know 
their tech. I believe their own website or admin console uses Django, so 
somebody there knows it. Small, personal. It's not a mindless faceless 
corporation with rulebound idiots, for example. I like their style. Very 
automated. Simple but not straight-jacket simple, you basically get to do 
all the things you can do on any unix box (within reasonable limits, of 
course.) Fairly cheap, but possibly not the cheapest out there if that's 
your top goal. They just bumped up the resource limits for everyone's 
accounts the other day, permanently. Lots of help info in their blog, 
forums, FAQ, and a few tutorial videos. You can do shared or dedicated 
hosting, with several levels of each, and you can start small then upgrade 
your account level "in place" when you want.

data:
Uptime 101 days on one of the machines i'm using.
Generally don't see load averages higher than 0.1 - 0.3.
Page response latencies typically very small.

And though my site has had only trivial traffic supposedly a few sites on WF 
have survived Slashdot and Digg.

Mike Kramlich 

From maney at two14.net  Fri Dec  7 18:31:54 2007
From: maney at two14.net (Martin Maney)
Date: Fri, 7 Dec 2007 11:31:54 -0600
Subject: [Chicago] Chicago Digest, Vol 28, Issue 14
In-Reply-To: <6yejdzrdp7.fsf@imagepc03.rd.imagescape.com>
References: <mailman.63.1196852421.31021.chicago@python.org>
	<002201c837a0$6834e090$5a098818@MIKEP43GHZ>
	<6yejdzrdp7.fsf@imagepc03.rd.imagescape.com>
Message-ID: <20071207173154.GA11725@furrr.two14.net>

On Thu, Dec 06, 2007 at 10:27:16AM -0600, Christopher Allan Webber wrote:
> XKCD > Dilbert... that's not even a contest, man.
> 
> Also, batch mail digests suck because when people reply to them it
> breaks my beautiful threading in Gnus :(

That's unimportant, but when it breaks threading in mutt it makes me
<frown />.

+1/-1 - I can see Dilbert scoring higher with those who are unfortunate
enough to have real-life PHBs running the fucked company that employs
them.  Without that factor, I find I have to agree, Dilbert isn't even
in the same ballpark as xkcd for real geek humor.  By such a margin
that I never thought about comparing them until this came along...

Plus the relationships in Dilbert are all icky.  Or maybe imaginary,
I'm not really sure.

-- 
It isn't that secrets are never needed in security.
It's that they are never desirable.  -- Whitfield Diffie


From chris.mcavoy at gmail.com  Fri Dec  7 20:25:24 2007
From: chris.mcavoy at gmail.com (Chris McAvoy)
Date: Fri, 7 Dec 2007 13:25:24 -0600
Subject: [Chicago] django hosting
In-Reply-To: <000b01c838cd$0872c6d0$5a098818@MIKEP43GHZ>
References: <000b01c838cd$0872c6d0$5a098818@MIKEP43GHZ>
Message-ID: <3096c19d0712071125i7dd2da6en2d914a051a54b9f7@mail.gmail.com>

I have a dreamhost account, but the majority of my stuff is on linode.com.

Chris

On Dec 7, 2007 6:31 AM, Mike Kramlich <ramadeus at rcn.com> wrote:
> Carl:
>
> I've only used WebFaction for Django hosting, have been for a couple months,
> love them so far. They were one of the first 3-4 I looked at, and they gave
> the best vibe so I signed up.
>
> Supportive. I've opened a few tickets with change requests and they've been
> fast and friendly. When you read posts by their guys you can tell they know
> their tech. I believe their own website or admin console uses Django, so
> somebody there knows it. Small, personal. It's not a mindless faceless
> corporation with rulebound idiots, for example. I like their style. Very
> automated. Simple but not straight-jacket simple, you basically get to do
> all the things you can do on any unix box (within reasonable limits, of
> course.) Fairly cheap, but possibly not the cheapest out there if that's
> your top goal. They just bumped up the resource limits for everyone's
> accounts the other day, permanently. Lots of help info in their blog,
> forums, FAQ, and a few tutorial videos. You can do shared or dedicated
> hosting, with several levels of each, and you can start small then upgrade
> your account level "in place" when you want.
>
> data:
> Uptime 101 days on one of the machines i'm using.
> Generally don't see load averages higher than 0.1 - 0.3.
> Page response latencies typically very small.
>
> And though my site has had only trivial traffic supposedly a few sites on WF
> have survived Slashdot and Digg.
>
> Mike Kramlich
>
> _______________________________________________
> Chicago mailing list
> Chicago at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>

From loppear at gmail.com  Fri Dec  7 20:51:33 2007
From: loppear at gmail.com (Luke Opperman)
Date: Fri, 7 Dec 2007 13:51:33 -0600
Subject: [Chicago] django hosting
In-Reply-To: <3096c19d0712071125i7dd2da6en2d914a051a54b9f7@mail.gmail.com>
References: <000b01c838cd$0872c6d0$5a098818@MIKEP43GHZ>
	<3096c19d0712071125i7dd2da6en2d914a051a54b9f7@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <1ff0fe40712071151o7477d5a9sca7a7d43fc533c4e@mail.gmail.com>

Been with Rimuhosting for several years, exceedingly happy with their
support. Prices aren't as competitive with e.g. linode anymore, but
comparable or better than many of the other VPS hosts I've looked at
recently. Currently considering whether to add a server at rimu or switch to
linode or ?, so this thread has been pleasantly timely.

- Luke

On Dec 7, 2007 1:25 PM, Chris McAvoy <chris.mcavoy at gmail.com> wrote:

> I have a dreamhost account, but the majority of my stuff is on linode.com.
>
> Chris
>
> On Dec 7, 2007 6:31 AM, Mike Kramlich <ramadeus at rcn.com> wrote:
> > Carl:
> >
> > I've only used WebFaction for Django hosting, have been for a couple
> months,
> > love them so far. They were one of the first 3-4 I looked at, and they
> gave
> > the best vibe so I signed up.
> >
> > Supportive. I've opened a few tickets with change requests and they've
> been
> > fast and friendly. When you read posts by their guys you can tell they
> know
> > their tech. I believe their own website or admin console uses Django, so
> > somebody there knows it. Small, personal. It's not a mindless faceless
> > corporation with rulebound idiots, for example. I like their style. Very
> > automated. Simple but not straight-jacket simple, you basically get to
> do
> > all the things you can do on any unix box (within reasonable limits, of
> > course.) Fairly cheap, but possibly not the cheapest out there if that's
> > your top goal. They just bumped up the resource limits for everyone's
> > accounts the other day, permanently. Lots of help info in their blog,
> > forums, FAQ, and a few tutorial videos. You can do shared or dedicated
> > hosting, with several levels of each, and you can start small then
> upgrade
> > your account level "in place" when you want.
> >
> > data:
> > Uptime 101 days on one of the machines i'm using.
> > Generally don't see load averages higher than 0.1 - 0.3.
> > Page response latencies typically very small.
> >
> > And though my site has had only trivial traffic supposedly a few sites
> on WF
> > have survived Slashdot and Digg.
> >
> > Mike Kramlich
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Chicago mailing list
> > Chicago at python.org
> > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
> >
> _______________________________________________
> Chicago mailing list
> Chicago at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>
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From earlylightpublishing at yahoo.com  Sat Dec  8 14:53:38 2007
From: earlylightpublishing at yahoo.com (earlylight publishing)
Date: Sat, 8 Dec 2007 05:53:38 -0800 (PST)
Subject: [Chicago] Hi I'm New
In-Reply-To: <mailman.57.1197111624.30093.chicago@python.org>
Message-ID: <457362.2524.qm@web45106.mail.sp1.yahoo.com>

Hello everyone,
   
  I'm from the far far far west (couple hour's drive).  I'm new to the list, new to Python, and pretty darn new to programming in general.  I'm learning Python and Pygame because I want to write games for kids.  Since I don't know much yet I'll most likely just lurk and Google all the stuff I don't understand.  Not much else I wanted to say really except I'm happy to be here and I know I'll learn lots!




Please visit our website www.earlylightpublishing.com
       
---------------------------------
Be a better friend, newshound, and know-it-all with Yahoo! Mobile.  Try it now.
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From jason at hostedlabs.com  Sun Dec  2 19:41:37 2007
From: jason at hostedlabs.com (Jason Rexilius)
Date: Sun, 02 Dec 2007 12:41:37 -0600
Subject: [Chicago] BARcamp Updates - Events,  Jobs
Message-ID: <4752FC61.5040706@hostedlabs.com>

Hi Everyone!

   Another update about upcoming events and some other good stuff!

###################

This Thursday 12/6/07, 6pm @ Debonair Social Club  1575 N Milwaukee Ave 
in Wicker Park...  Ignite-Chicago!

Sean Harper is putting together a great winter-time event, a little more 
organized than BARcamp ;-)

Ignite Chicago is a small conference, free and open to the community, 
built around 5 minute presentations that include 20 slides each 
(allowing for 15 seconds / slide).
http://ignite-chicago.org/
RSVP at
http://upcoming.yahoo.com/event/309951


###################

Also wanted to tell everyone about some great jobs out there:

HostedLABS (my company) is hiring a CTO, Software Engineers, and PHP 
developers.  Will be at Ignite, would love to chat with people there!

Tribune is hiring some SA's, DBA's and QA folk (work on Metromix)

Harvest Trading is looking for a Unix SA.

Ludorum is looking for a Director of Technology.

Take a look at the Job Board (and feel free to post yours, its free for 
everyone):

http://barcampbeta.jobcoin.com/


###################

Last tid-bit..


Seems most people who replied wanted (2) BARcamps per year..  I am 
thinking seriously about that but think that perhaps doing Winter and 
Summer would be good timing for not conflicting with other BARcamps. 
Also winter is kinda dead ;-)

Any one have any last opinions on the 1 or 2 BARcamps per year questions?


Take care and see you all at Ignite this Thursday!

-jason


From jim at iterativerose.com  Thu Dec  6 12:10:17 2007
From: jim at iterativerose.com (Jim Holmes)
Date: Thu, 6 Dec 2007 06:10:17 -0500
Subject: [Chicago] Shout Out: CodeMash Is Near!
Message-ID: <015801c837f8$95da2de0$c18e89a0$@com>

I'd like to ask for your help publicizing CodeMash (www.CodeMash.org), a
community-driven, non-profit conference for software developers.  CodeMash
2007 was a tremendous success, and our 2008 event will certainly surpass our
2007 accomplishments.


CodeMash 2008 is being held 10 - 11 January, 2008, in Sandusky, Ohio.
That's not far away at all, and the cheap hotel room rates ($88 per night)
expire very shortly.

 

I'm attaching another flyer about CodeMash detailing some of the benefits of
attending and talking about some of the sessions this year.  I'd greatly
appreciate it if you could pass this on to your respective groups' mailing
lists.

 

Please contact me if you have any questions about CodeMash, or if you'd like
to be a part of organizing and executing the conference.  We're always
looking for input from community influencers throughout the region.

 

Thanks for your help,

 

Jim Holmes

President, CodeMash Conference

www.CodeMash.org

 

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From clintecker at gmail.com  Fri Dec  7 01:11:23 2007
From: clintecker at gmail.com (Clint Ecker)
Date: Thu, 6 Dec 2007 18:11:23 -0600
Subject: [Chicago] django hosting
In-Reply-To: <B50BAAD3-EE39-4CD9-85FB-01A7431CF1EB@cs.uchicago.edu>
References: <47586F86.7030802@personnelware.com>
	<B50BAAD3-EE39-4CD9-85FB-01A7431CF1EB@cs.uchicago.edu>
Message-ID: <63a0f2c50712061611y53140b8at18f1c513f9a73c53@mail.gmail.com>

I like WebFaction. http://www.webfaction.com

They have awesome shared hosting plans that give your own own proxied
Apache instance with mod_python.  Basically, you can tweak your own
Apache however you like through your own conf file.

I run lots of Django sites on WebFaction.  I also have been super
impressed with the service when I need issues/upgrades taken care of.

Clint

On Dec 6, 2007 4:10 PM, Ido Rosen <ido at cs.uchicago.edu> wrote:
> If you're using DreamHost, the "promo code" CHIPY will get you the
> maximum discount ($97).  I don't make any commission off of it, but
> you're already contributing to my welfare in a way by being a Python
> developer.  (Less shitty PHP in the world.)
>
> Ido
>
>
> On Dec 6, 2007, at 3:54 PM, Carl Karsten wrote:
>
> > I just got the green to find a host for my django site.
> >
> > Anyone want to refer me to their host and get a commission?
> >
> > It will need to be on
> > http://code.djangoproject.com/wiki/DjangoFriendlyWebHosts
> > so if the site is not there, add it first.
> >
> > Carl K
> > _______________________________________________
> > Chicago mailing list
> > Chicago at python.org
> > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
> >
>
> _______________________________________________
> Chicago mailing list
> Chicago at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>



-- 
Clint Ecker
c: 312.863.9323
---
twitter: clint
skype: clintology
AIM: clintecker
Gtalk: clintecker at gmail.com

From jsudlow at gmail.com  Sun Dec  9 02:57:24 2007
From: jsudlow at gmail.com (Jon Sudlow)
Date: Sat, 8 Dec 2007 19:57:24 -0600
Subject: [Chicago] Hi I'm New
In-Reply-To: <457362.2524.qm@web45106.mail.sp1.yahoo.com>
References: <mailman.57.1197111624.30093.chicago@python.org>
	<457362.2524.qm@web45106.mail.sp1.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <eb9a21ad0712081757o5216c308ke1c74b9fffd0fe9b@mail.gmail.com>

I've made a few games with python and pygame. Hit me up at
jsudlow at gmail.comif you have any questions or need some advice.
Sometimes its hard to put the
syntax of pygame, coupled with the animation and the tracking of sprites all
colliding with eachother. It takes a few iterations and key board slammings
to get everything worked out sometimes.
-Jon

On Dec 8, 2007 7:53 AM, earlylight publishing <
earlylightpublishing at yahoo.com> wrote:

> Hello everyone,
>
> I'm from the far far far west (couple hour's drive).  I'm new to the list,
> new to Python, and pretty darn new to programming in general.  I'm learning
> Python and Pygame because I want to write games for kids.  Since I don't
> know much yet I'll most likely just lurk and Google all the stuff I don't
> understand.  Not much else I wanted to say really except I'm happy to be
> here and I know I'll learn lots!
>
>
>
> Please visit our website www.earlylightpublishing.com
>
>  ------------------------------
> Be a better friend, newshound, and know-it-all with Yahoo! Mobile. Try it
> now.<http://us.rd.yahoo.com/evt=51733/*http://mobile.yahoo.com/;_ylt=Ahu06i62sR8HDtDypao8Wcj9tAcJ+>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Chicago mailing list
> Chicago at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>
>


-- 
Jon Sudlow
3225 Foster Avenue
221 Sohlberg Hall
C.P.O 2224
Chicago, Il  60625
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From carl at personnelware.com  Mon Dec 10 00:22:27 2007
From: carl at personnelware.com (Carl Karsten)
Date: Sun, 09 Dec 2007 17:22:27 -0600
Subject: [Chicago] django hosting
In-Reply-To: <47586F86.7030802@personnelware.com>
References: <47586F86.7030802@personnelware.com>
Message-ID: <475C78B3.1000804@personnelware.com>

Here are the recommendations:
====================
Dreamhost	FCGI	See How to set up Django.	$119.40
====================
WebFaction 	mod_python	 Host hundreds of Django sites. Your own 
Apache/mod_python instance for maximum control. They even have a Django-specific 
screencast And now they offer a Django-capable plan for $7.50 / month. 	$102
====================
RimuHosting VPS Hosting	Xen, dedicated	Mention when ordering. (VPS allows 
do-it-yourself installation, so FCGI/Lighttpd also possible)	$239.40
====================
Linode	User-mode Linux	Super helpful support staff and django users in IRC 
channel, built by developers for everyone!	$239.40
====================
Slicehost	Xen	 Xen VPS hosting, Built for Developers, starting at 256MB RAM	$240
====================

I could use some help understanding the pros/cons of some of the options.  About 
all I know is I don't need a dedicated box.

Price: $20/month is fine.

My intent is to have my client actually sign up and pay the bill directly.  So 
it will be their account, not something I have to worry about for the next 5+ 
years.  They can give me the pw, and if they get pissed at me they can change 
the pw and give it to someone else.

I have had an apache box running for as long as I have had a cable modem, which 
I think is over 10 years.  So I 'can' admin the box, but I am not sure I want 
to. I am also pretty sure that I am not a good admin, and my client deserves a 
good one.  so either I have to become good, or I have to pay someone to be good. 
  right now I would rather pay.

I am more interested in someone being paid to maintain a bunch of apache stuff 
running on whatever OS/hardware they feel is good, who will be on top of 
problems because thats all they do.  If there is a problem, they will be all 
over it and 100's of accounts will all have the same problem.  If a kernel 
upgrade doesn't get along with some apache thing, it won't be my problem.

mod_python vs FCGI - "Apache with mod_python currently is the preferred setup 
for using Django on a production server." 
http://www.djangoproject.com/documentation/modpython/
Is there any reason I would go with FCGI?

What is the deal with installing python modules, like PIL, reportlab and dateutil?

How are database backups done?

Carl K


From mandric at gmail.com  Mon Dec 10 02:45:23 2007
From: mandric at gmail.com (Milan Andric)
Date: Sun, 9 Dec 2007 19:45:23 -0600
Subject: [Chicago] django hosting
In-Reply-To: <475C78B3.1000804@personnelware.com>
References: <47586F86.7030802@personnelware.com>
	<475C78B3.1000804@personnelware.com>
Message-ID: <536089f30712091745p5c660241m555b0c7883de3d3e@mail.gmail.com>

On Dec 9, 2007 5:22 PM, Carl Karsten <carl at personnelware.com> wrote:

<snip>

>
> My intent is to have my client actually sign up and pay the bill directly.  So
> it will be their account, not something I have to worry about for the next 5+
> years.  They can give me the pw, and if they get pissed at me they can change
> the pw and give it to someone else.
>
> I have had an apache box running for as long as I have had a cable modem, which
> I think is over 10 years.  So I 'can' admin the box, but I am not sure I want
> to. I am also pretty sure that I am not a good admin, and my client deserves a
> good one.  so either I have to become good, or I have to pay someone to be good.
>   right now I would rather pay.
>
> I am more interested in someone being paid to maintain a bunch of apache stuff
> running on whatever OS/hardware they feel is good, who will be on top of
> problems because thats all they do.  If there is a problem, they will be all
> over it and 100's of accounts will all have the same problem.  If a kernel
> upgrade doesn't get along with some apache thing, it won't be my problem.
>
> mod_python vs FCGI - "Apache with mod_python currently is the preferred setup
> for using Django on a production server."
> http://www.djangoproject.com/documentation/modpython/
> Is there any reason I would go with FCGI?


I've had problems with Dreamhost starting around May, service always
going up and down.  At one point they moved http service from a server
and changed IP, not giving enough time for DNS caches to be flushed,
major f'up for a Hosting Provider.  On top of that I was getting a
'error id: "bad_httpd_conf"' pages with 200 "OK" http codes.  Really
annoying if your monitors just check the http code.   Maybe this is
the typical case with shared hosting.  One of my clients who actually
has a development site complained that site availability was beginning
to affect their development.  Our Dreamhost rating quickly began to
dive.

I moved to my own (256M) VPS from slicehost a couple months ago and
I'm quite happy.  I did need to build the slice but it was quite easy
and slicehost has put alot of work into their documentation lately.  I
host several low traffic sites with it.  If you go this route you
don't want to load mod_python into apache because it wastes too much
memory to serve non-python stuff with a mod_python/apache process.
Some people like proxying with lighttpd, but I'd rather just maintain
apache/fcgi.  That much optimization wasn't necessary, but it is more
scalable and a bit faster.

--
Milan

From fitz at red-bean.com  Mon Dec 10 04:43:29 2007
From: fitz at red-bean.com (Brian W. Fitzpatrick)
Date: Sun, 9 Dec 2007 21:43:29 -0600
Subject: [Chicago] xkcd on Python
In-Reply-To: <5aaed53f0712042224w5b7b0d95u3d8ca6a5f571f125@mail.gmail.com>
References: <5aaed53f0712042224w5b7b0d95u3d8ca6a5f571f125@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <fccecd3a0712091943v45f55c43obaa7eb1c0871d362@mail.gmail.com>

On Dec 5, 2007 12:24 AM, Jeff Hinrichs - DM&T <jeffh at dundeemt.com> wrote:
> http://imgs.xkcd.com/comics/python.png
>
> "Better than everything in the medicine cabinet"

Randall Munroe, xkcd's creator, talked at Google on Friday (In Mountain View).

Donald Knuth came and asked "What's the name of my O(log log n) search
algorithm?"

                        I swear I'm not kidding.

Guido van Rossum was also there and he asked "Do you expect me to fly?"

See http://xkcd.com/353/ and http://xkcd.com/342/ respectively.

-Fitz

From cwebber at imagescape.com  Mon Dec 10 16:39:20 2007
From: cwebber at imagescape.com (Christopher Allan Webber)
Date: Mon, 10 Dec 2007 09:39:20 -0600
Subject: [Chicago] Hi I'm New
In-Reply-To: <457362.2524.qm@web45106.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> (earlylight
	publishing's message of "Sat, 8 Dec 2007 05:53:38 -0800 (PST)")
References: <457362.2524.qm@web45106.mail.sp1.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <6y7ijmo8yf.fsf@imagepc03.rd.imagescape.com>

Welcome to ChiPy!

I'd say welcome, <name>, but it doesn't appear that you've given one
with your introduction, unless your name is "Earlylight Publishing" :)

earlylight publishing <earlylightpublishing at yahoo.com> writes:

> Hello everyone,
>
> I'm from the far far far west (couple hour's drive).  I'm new to the list,
> new to Python, and pretty darn new to programming in general.  I'm
> learning Python and Pygame because I want to write games for kids.  Since
> I don't know much yet I'll most likely just lurk and Google all the stuff
> I don't understand.  Not much else I wanted to say really except I'm happy
> to be here and I know I'll learn lots!
>
> Please visit our website www.earlylightpublishing.com
>
>
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Be a better friend, newshound, and know-it-all with Yahoo! Mobile. [1]Try
> it now.
>
> References
>
> Visible links
> 1. http://us.rd.yahoo.com/evt=51733/*http://mobile.yahoo.com/;_ylt=Ahu06i62sR8HDtDypao8Wcj9tAcJ
> _______________________________________________
> Chicago mailing list
> Chicago at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago

From jason at hostedlabs.com  Mon Dec 10 17:45:36 2007
From: jason at hostedlabs.com (Jason Rexilius)
Date: Mon, 10 Dec 2007 10:45:36 -0600
Subject: [Chicago] OT: job(s) posting
Message-ID: <475D6D30.1070303@hostedlabs.com>

Hey everyone!

   Forgive the job spam here but its slightly different from a standard 
job posting.

   My company, HostedLABS http://hostedlabs.com/ is looking to solve a 
number of problems and some can be tackled in different ways. The things 
I am looking to do are:

a) sponsor or pay people to work on a couple of open-source projects.

b) part-time work for poor but smart college students.

c) full-time employment with the company (salary + stock).


   So in that context let me describe what I'm looking for:

1) paid open-source project development: port the p0f daemon to an 
apache module.  See http://lcamtuf.coredump.cx/p0f.shtml

2) paid open-source project development: djbdns (tinydns) modifications, 
adding two modules or extensions to the NS server. see: 
http://cr.yp.to/djbdns.html

3) paid open-source project development: further code modifications to 
siege load test tool. see: http://www.joedog.org/JoeDog/Siege

4) part-time work: general linux systems admin work, evening/weekend 
hours. some coding also possible if desired.

5) full-time employment:

I really need at least two developers and one hard-core systems engineer 
(more than just SA).

The software development roles can be different but I have a general 
need for the following:

- low-level network, OS, filesystem, cluster development, usually in 
C/C++.  Familiarity with libraries such as Spread http://www.spread.org/ 
hack in Erlang, work on VFS or distributed lock managers. etc.  Just 
call it core development.

- systems management software development, Python, perl &| C/C++ where 
called for.  Self awareness and overall management of everything from IP 
space and network stacks to code deployment and system versioning.  SVN 
interface, OS tools usage, heartbeat libraries, rsync, etc. etc.  Call 
it large scale system management.

- web library and framework internals development, PHP. perl, python and 
Ruby.  Re-writing modules or libraries, hacking packages (such as 
Rails), etc.  There may be some C/C++ in the mix for some of these. This 
category is web library development.


For the systems engineer, knowledge of linux internals, virtuialization, 
advanced networking, building OS from scratch, cluster and grid 
filesystems, cluster computing, PXE boot, etc.  Lots of fun stuff to 
play with.  Architecture and design of large scale systems is on the plate.


Really looking for smart people who want to build really cool technology 
in a start-up environment.  For those of you who know me or have heard 
any of my talks you know that there is a global footprint component to 
this and there may be some travel involved on the systems side.

Thats it for now.  Thanks for reading and hope to see you all at the 
next event!

-jason




From bray at sent.com  Mon Dec 10 18:02:19 2007
From: bray at sent.com (bray at sent.com)
Date: Mon, 10 Dec 2007 11:02:19 -0600
Subject: [Chicago] xkcd on Python
In-Reply-To: <fccecd3a0712091943v45f55c43obaa7eb1c0871d362@mail.gmail.com>
References: <5aaed53f0712042224w5b7b0d95u3d8ca6a5f571f125@mail.gmail.com>
	<fccecd3a0712091943v45f55c43obaa7eb1c0871d362@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <1197306139.24763.1225788471@webmail.messagingengine.com>


On Sun, 9 Dec 2007 21:43:29 -0600, "Brian W. Fitzpatrick"
<fitz at red-bean.com> said:
> 
> Donald Knuth came and asked "What's the name of my O(log log n) search
> algorithm?"

He must have meant O(n log n) for QuickSort right? What was his answer?

On a separate note, I am taking an advanced data structures class right
now where we are studying a lot on complexities and algorithms. It
amazes me how much Python already looks like pseudocode. I am not
surprised the computer scientist like Python.  I am doing a couple algo
in Python for and a database class. I wanted to do a MST-PRIM with a Fib
Heap as the Queue, but I could not figure out how to do it without
pointer support. 

Anyway, nice story.

Regards,

Brian Ray
http://kazavoo.com/blog










From shekay at pobox.com  Mon Dec 10 18:13:54 2007
From: shekay at pobox.com (sheila miguez)
Date: Mon, 10 Dec 2007 11:13:54 -0600
Subject: [Chicago] pydev extensions
Message-ID: <a68ced640712100913i24a69d68nc5ec0b2b4ae5e38c@mail.gmail.com>

I use eclipse at work, with the vimplugin, and have installed it on my
homelaptop with same.

I have done a couple of things.

am trying out headless eclipse with eclim. I am not used to this yet,
so I am still faster with the gui and vimPlugin but the vim plugin is
not as nice as normal vim.

and I am trying out normal eclipse with pydev.

Has anyone used pydev extensions and think it is worth the cost? is it
really cooler than just pydev?

-- 
sheila

From pfein at pobox.com  Mon Dec 10 18:41:21 2007
From: pfein at pobox.com (Pete)
Date: Mon, 10 Dec 2007 12:41:21 -0500
Subject: [Chicago] xkcd on Python
In-Reply-To: <1197306139.24763.1225788471@webmail.messagingengine.com>
References: <5aaed53f0712042224w5b7b0d95u3d8ca6a5f571f125@mail.gmail.com>
	<fccecd3a0712091943v45f55c43obaa7eb1c0871d362@mail.gmail.com>
	<1197306139.24763.1225788471@webmail.messagingengine.com>
Message-ID: <200712101241.21710.pfein@pobox.com>

On Monday December 10 2007 12:02:19 pm bray at sent.com wrote:
> amazes me how much Python already looks like pseudocode. I am not

I've heard Python described as "pseudocode that runs".

-- 
Peter Fein   ||   773-575-0694   ||   pfein at pobox.com
http://www.pobox.com/~pfein/   ||   PGP: 0xCCF6AE6B
irc: pfein at freenode.net   ||   jabber: peter.fein at gmail.com

From varmaa at gmail.com  Mon Dec 10 19:48:15 2007
From: varmaa at gmail.com (Atul Varma)
Date: Mon, 10 Dec 2007 12:48:15 -0600
Subject: [Chicago] xkcd on Python
In-Reply-To: <1197306139.24763.1225788471@webmail.messagingengine.com>
References: <5aaed53f0712042224w5b7b0d95u3d8ca6a5f571f125@mail.gmail.com>
	<fccecd3a0712091943v45f55c43obaa7eb1c0871d362@mail.gmail.com>
	<1197306139.24763.1225788471@webmail.messagingengine.com>
Message-ID: <361b27370712101048k61818651s4c125fbc686f8385@mail.gmail.com>

 On Dec 10, 2007 11:02 AM, <bray at sent.com> wrote:

> On Sun, 9 Dec 2007 21:43:29 -0600, "Brian W. Fitzpatrick"
> <fitz at red-bean.com> said:
> >
> > Donald Knuth came and asked "What's the name of my O(log log n) search
> > algorithm?"
>
> He must have meant O(n log n) for QuickSort right? What was his answer?
>

He tactfully evaded the question.

One of my favorite quotes from the session was when he said "if Python is
executable pseudocode, then Perl is executable line noise."

- Atul
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From garrett at mojave-corp.com  Mon Dec 10 20:19:36 2007
From: garrett at mojave-corp.com (Garrett Smith)
Date: Mon, 10 Dec 2007 13:19:36 -0600 (CST)
Subject: [Chicago] Help plan our best meeting ever!
In-Reply-To: <4754DD55.40605@colorstudy.com>
Message-ID: <02cc01c83b64$1899a530$0701a8c0@mojave.local>

Do we have a lineup for this Thurs? I'm still leaning toward deferring
CouchDB to next month, given the bounteousness of this month. 

On , chicago-bounces+garrett=mojave-corp.com at python.org wrote:

> We appear to have an embarrassment of riches in possible presentation
> topics this month.  We can't all present.
> 
> * Sterling, a short demonstration on EasyGUI
> * Dave Shemenski, Heisenbug (not sure)
> * Chris Webber, an automation system
> * Feihong Hsu, a GUI wrapper
> * Ian Bicking, WebTest
> * Garrett Smith, CouchDB
> 
> I think we could do two short presentations and a long one,
> but that's
> about it.  And that's only 8 hours after Sheila's email.
> 
> So... how long do people think their presentations will be?  I'm
> probably in the 30 minute range, but I could do it in less.
> 
> Also, for people who think they will attend, what talk(s)
> interest you most?



From shekay at pobox.com  Mon Dec 10 23:09:46 2007
From: shekay at pobox.com (sheila miguez)
Date: Mon, 10 Dec 2007 16:09:46 -0600
Subject: [Chicago] Thursday, Dec. 13: Join us for our best meeting ever!
Message-ID: <a68ced640712101409q483f73c8j3f2e802a9418a07@mail.gmail.com>

Chicago Python User Group
=========================

Next Meeting
============

Come join us for our best meeting ever!

Thursday Dec. 13, 2007

Doors open at 6:30 pm, Meeting starts at 7:00 pm

Please RSVP!

Topics
------

* Sterling will give a short demonstration on EasyGUI
* Christopher Webber on his conceptually neat animation system
* Feihong Hsu on GUI wrapper libraries for either WinForms or
wxPython, depending
* Ian Bicking on WebTest, a functional testing tool for WSGI applications
* CouchDB, tentatively

Location
--------

 Orbitz
 8th floor, Planet Earth
 Ogilvy Transportation Center
 500 W Madison Chicago, IL 60661

Meet on the third floor next at the security desk to get guest badges,
then take the
elevators to the 8th floor.

* Ogilvy Station Information
<http://metrarail.com/Sched/cnw_n/chicago_ogilvie.shtml>
* Union Station Information <htp://metrarail.com/Sched/md_w/chicagounion.shtml>
* Downtown CTA map <http://transitchicago.com/maps/maps/2007D.html>

Please RSVP to Sheila Herndon, shekay at pobox com, by Tuesday. I will
need a list
of attendees to give to building security.

About ChiPy
-----------

ChiPy is a group of Chicago Python Programmers, l33t, and n00bs.
Meetings are held monthly at various locations around Chicago.
Also, ChiPy is a proud sponsor of many Open Source and Educational
efforts in Chicago. Stay tuned to the mailing list for more info.

ChiPy website: <http://chipy.org>
ChiPy Mailing List: <http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago>
Python website: <http://python.org>

From cwebber at imagescape.com  Mon Dec 10 23:38:24 2007
From: cwebber at imagescape.com (Christopher Allan Webber)
Date: Mon, 10 Dec 2007 16:38:24 -0600
Subject: [Chicago] Thursday, Dec. 13: Join us for our best meeting ever!
In-Reply-To: <a68ced640712101409q483f73c8j3f2e802a9418a07@mail.gmail.com>
	(sheila miguez's message of "Mon, 10 Dec 2007 16:09:46 -0600")
References: <a68ced640712101409q483f73c8j3f2e802a9418a07@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <6ywsrmkwf3.fsf@imagepc03.rd.imagescape.com>

I've opted out of presenting this month because of the large number of
presenters, but have requested to present next month instead.  See my
previous email:

> BTW, I'm happy to delay my presentation till next month.  I have an
> actual "use" of it coming up soon, and this will allow me to wait till
> after that test case.  It'll probaly also give me some time to clean
> up the code a bit.  But I seriously seriously want to claim dibs on
> presenting next month then, since I posted to the list about
> presenting before our last meeting even happened ;)

... updating the wiki as appropriate.


"sheila miguez" <shekay at pobox.com> writes:

> Chicago Python User Group
> =========================
>
> Next Meeting
> ============
>
> Come join us for our best meeting ever!
>
> Thursday Dec. 13, 2007
>
> Doors open at 6:30 pm, Meeting starts at 7:00 pm
>
> Please RSVP!
>
> Topics
> ------
>
> * Sterling will give a short demonstration on EasyGUI
> * Christopher Webber on his conceptually neat animation system
> * Feihong Hsu on GUI wrapper libraries for either WinForms or
> wxPython, depending
> * Ian Bicking on WebTest, a functional testing tool for WSGI applications
> * CouchDB, tentatively
>
> Location
> --------
>
>  Orbitz
>  8th floor, Planet Earth
>  Ogilvy Transportation Center
>  500 W Madison Chicago, IL 60661
>
> Meet on the third floor next at the security desk to get guest badges,
> then take the
> elevators to the 8th floor.
>
> * Ogilvy Station Information
> <http://metrarail.com/Sched/cnw_n/chicago_ogilvie.shtml>
> * Union Station Information <htp://metrarail.com/Sched/md_w/chicagounion.shtml>
> * Downtown CTA map <http://transitchicago.com/maps/maps/2007D.html>
>
> Please RSVP to Sheila Herndon, shekay at pobox com, by Tuesday. I will
> need a list
> of attendees to give to building security.
>
> About ChiPy
> -----------
>
> ChiPy is a group of Chicago Python Programmers, l33t, and n00bs.
> Meetings are held monthly at various locations around Chicago.
> Also, ChiPy is a proud sponsor of many Open Source and Educational
> efforts in Chicago. Stay tuned to the mailing list for more info.
>
> ChiPy website: <http://chipy.org>
> ChiPy Mailing List: <http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago>
> Python website: <http://python.org>
> _______________________________________________
> Chicago mailing list
> Chicago at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago

From shekay at pobox.com  Mon Dec 10 23:14:16 2007
From: shekay at pobox.com (sheila miguez)
Date: Mon, 10 Dec 2007 16:14:16 -0600
Subject: [Chicago] Thursday, Dec. 13: Join us for our best meeting ever!
In-Reply-To: <a68ced640712101409q483f73c8j3f2e802a9418a07@mail.gmail.com>
References: <a68ced640712101409q483f73c8j3f2e802a9418a07@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <a68ced640712101414h5261ff68re9cb53635971563@mail.gmail.com>

I have responses from 12 people.

Anyone who hasn't responded, please try to send me a reply by Tuesday.

... where else does Chris usually mail the meeting notice?

... skip, are you coming? I do not remember your name name.

-- 
sheila

From tottinge at gmail.com  Tue Dec 11 01:34:58 2007
From: tottinge at gmail.com (Tim Ottinger)
Date: Mon, 10 Dec 2007 18:34:58 -0600
Subject: [Chicago] Thursday, Dec. 13: Join us for our best meeting ever!
In-Reply-To: <a68ced640712101409q483f73c8j3f2e802a9418a07@mail.gmail.com>
References: <a68ced640712101409q483f73c8j3f2e802a9418a07@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <475DDB32.7070802@gmail.com>

I was trying to come for my first meeting ever.  I like that it's at the 
transportation center, since my house is on the metra line (about 90 
minute ride) but my kids have a Christmas concert that night.  I'm 
bummed.  Still, if we can have the meeting at the transportation center, 
it's probably worth my money to do the round-trip ticket + 3 hours of 
transit time.  I would love to meet a bunch of you in "meat space."

Good program, too.   I would love to be there. Bummed.
Tim

From garrett at mojave-corp.com  Tue Dec 11 07:10:45 2007
From: garrett at mojave-corp.com (Garrett Smith)
Date: Tue, 11 Dec 2007 00:10:45 -0600 (CST)
Subject: [Chicago] Thursday, Dec. 13: Join us for our best meeting ever!
In-Reply-To: <a68ced640712101414h5261ff68re9cb53635971563@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <21212541.79691197353445656.JavaMail.root@noc-106.smedia.info>

I'm in.

Thanks!


----- Original Message -----
From: "sheila miguez" <shekay at pobox.com>
To: "The Chicago Python Users Group" <chicago at python.org>
Sent: Monday, December 10, 2007 4:14:16 PM (GMT-0600) America/Chicago
Subject: Re: [Chicago] Thursday, Dec. 13: Join us for our best meeting ever!

I have responses from 12 people.

Anyone who hasn't responded, please try to send me a reply by Tuesday.

... where else does Chris usually mail the meeting notice?

... skip, are you coming? I do not remember your name name.

-- 
sheila
_______________________________________________
Chicago mailing list
Chicago at python.org
http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago


From jason at hostedlabs.com  Tue Dec 11 14:15:29 2007
From: jason at hostedlabs.com (Jason Rexilius)
Date: Tue, 11 Dec 2007 07:15:29 -0600
Subject: [Chicago] Thursday, Dec. 13: Join us for our best meeting ever!
In-Reply-To: <21212541.79691197353445656.JavaMail.root@noc-106.smedia.info>
References: <21212541.79691197353445656.JavaMail.root@noc-106.smedia.info>
Message-ID: <475E8D71.1030001@hostedlabs.com>

I'll be there..

From chris.mcavoy at gmail.com  Tue Dec 11 15:45:44 2007
From: chris.mcavoy at gmail.com (Chris McAvoy)
Date: Tue, 11 Dec 2007 08:45:44 -0600
Subject: [Chicago] Thursday, Dec. 13: Join us for our best meeting ever!
In-Reply-To: <a68ced640712101414h5261ff68re9cb53635971563@mail.gmail.com>
References: <a68ced640712101409q483f73c8j3f2e802a9418a07@mail.gmail.com>
	<a68ced640712101414h5261ff68re9cb53635971563@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <3096c19d0712110645n4aab6d0nba0348328523d68b@mail.gmail.com>

On Dec 10, 2007 4:14 PM, sheila miguez <shekay at pobox.com> wrote:
> I have responses from 12 people.
>
> Anyone who hasn't responded, please try to send me a reply by Tuesday.
>
> ... where else does Chris usually mail the meeting notice?
>

It depends on the month.  Sometimes I send it to LUNI, Chirb and
Chicago.pm, but most of the time I just send it to this list and
encourage people to forward it around.

I'm not going to make it this month.  Someone be hilarious and
annoying in my stead.

Chris

From cwebber at imagescape.com  Tue Dec 11 16:12:24 2007
From: cwebber at imagescape.com (Christopher Allan Webber)
Date: Tue, 11 Dec 2007 09:12:24 -0600
Subject: [Chicago] Thursday, Dec. 13: Join us for our best meeting ever!
In-Reply-To: <475DDB32.7070802@gmail.com> (Tim Ottinger's message of "Mon,
	10 Dec 2007 18:34:58 -0600")
References: <a68ced640712101409q483f73c8j3f2e802a9418a07@mail.gmail.com>
	<475DDB32.7070802@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <6yprxdl0yv.fsf@imagepc03.rd.imagescape.com>

I'll definetly be there.

Tim Ottinger <tottinge at gmail.com> writes:

> I was trying to come for my first meeting ever.  I like that it's at the 
> transportation center, since my house is on the metra line (about 90 
> minute ride) but my kids have a Christmas concert that night.  I'm 
> bummed.  Still, if we can have the meeting at the transportation center, 
> it's probably worth my money to do the round-trip ticket + 3 hours of 
> transit time.  I would love to meet a bunch of you in "meat space."
>
> Good program, too.   I would love to be there. Bummed.
> Tim
> _______________________________________________
> Chicago mailing list
> Chicago at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago

From maney at two14.net  Tue Dec 11 16:23:58 2007
From: maney at two14.net (Martin Maney)
Date: Tue, 11 Dec 2007 09:23:58 -0600
Subject: [Chicago] xkcd on Python
In-Reply-To: <361b27370712101048k61818651s4c125fbc686f8385@mail.gmail.com>
References: <5aaed53f0712042224w5b7b0d95u3d8ca6a5f571f125@mail.gmail.com>
	<fccecd3a0712091943v45f55c43obaa7eb1c0871d362@mail.gmail.com>
	<1197306139.24763.1225788471@webmail.messagingengine.com>
	<361b27370712101048k61818651s4c125fbc686f8385@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <20071211152358.GA22391@furrr.two14.net>

On Mon, Dec 10, 2007 at 12:48:15PM -0600, Atul Varma wrote:
>  On Dec 10, 2007 11:02 AM, <bray at sent.com> wrote:
> > On Sun, 9 Dec 2007 21:43:29 -0600, "Brian W. Fitzpatrick" said:
> > > Donald Knuth came and asked "What's the name of my O(log log n) search
> > > algorithm?"
> >
> > He must have meant O(n log n) for QuickSort right? What was his answer?
> 
> He tactfully evaded the question.

The actual expression in the cartoon was O(n log(log n)).  Just sayin'

> One of my favorite quotes from the session was when he said "if Python is
> executable pseudocode, then Perl is executable line noise."

Perl has been executable line noise since the beginning, so this is
trvially true.  :-)

-- 
...that obsessive conviction, so common among authors and composers,
that all similarities between their works and any others which appear
later must inevitably be ascribed to plagiarism. -- 2nd Circuit, 1945


From shekay at pobox.com  Tue Dec 11 16:41:43 2007
From: shekay at pobox.com (sheila miguez)
Date: Tue, 11 Dec 2007 09:41:43 -0600
Subject: [Chicago] Thursday, Dec. 13: Join us for our best meeting ever!
In-Reply-To: <a68ced640712101414h5261ff68re9cb53635971563@mail.gmail.com>
References: <a68ced640712101409q483f73c8j3f2e802a9418a07@mail.gmail.com>
	<a68ced640712101414h5261ff68re9cb53635971563@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <a68ced640712110741y1c4d870ue03eeec73280a632@mail.gmail.com>

PS. Please bring IDs for the security guards.

I'll try to leave my phone number with them downstairs in case anyone
needs me. Or I will hang out there.

This place isn't as bad as security as my first job. I heard in one
office they'd follow people around with a flashing light.

On Dec 10, 2007 4:14 PM, sheila miguez <shekay at pobox.com> wrote:
> I have responses from 12 people.
>
> Anyone who hasn't responded, please try to send me a reply by Tuesday.
>
> ... where else does Chris usually mail the meeting notice?
>
> ... skip, are you coming? I do not remember your name name.
>
> --
> sheila
>



-- 
sheila

From shekay at pobox.com  Tue Dec 11 16:42:54 2007
From: shekay at pobox.com (sheila miguez)
Date: Tue, 11 Dec 2007 09:42:54 -0600
Subject: [Chicago] Thursday, Dec. 13: Join us for our best meeting ever!
In-Reply-To: <3096c19d0712110645n4aab6d0nba0348328523d68b@mail.gmail.com>
References: <a68ced640712101409q483f73c8j3f2e802a9418a07@mail.gmail.com>
	<a68ced640712101414h5261ff68re9cb53635971563@mail.gmail.com>
	<3096c19d0712110645n4aab6d0nba0348328523d68b@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <a68ced640712110742l339324d8pa10fc907ed65cba6@mail.gmail.com>

On Dec 11, 2007 8:45 AM, Chris McAvoy <chris.mcavoy at gmail.com> wrote:
> On Dec 10, 2007 4:14 PM, sheila miguez <shekay at pobox.com> wrote:
> > I have responses from 12 people.
> >
> > Anyone who hasn't responded, please try to send me a reply by Tuesday.
> >
> > ... where else does Chris usually mail the meeting notice?
> >
>
> It depends on the month.  Sometimes I send it to LUNI, Chirb and
> Chicago.pm, but most of the time I just send it to this list and
> encourage people to forward it around.

Okay, people, help forward the message. I am shy about posting to
lists I don't subscribe to.

> I'm not going to make it this month.  Someone be hilarious and
> annoying in my stead.

I can be annoying but not as hilarious.

-- 
sheila

From hsu.feihong at yahoo.com  Tue Dec 11 16:53:48 2007
From: hsu.feihong at yahoo.com (Feihong Hsu)
Date: Tue, 11 Dec 2007 07:53:48 -0800 (PST)
Subject: [Chicago] Thursday, Dec. 13: Join us for our best meeting ever!
In-Reply-To: <475DDB32.7070802@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <269823.93935.qm@web34804.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

Wow, 90 minutes, huh? That sounds like my daily commute!

- Feihong

P.S. I'm not bragging, I'm crying on the inside when I say that. Seriously.

Tim Ottinger <tottinge at gmail.com> wrote: I was trying to come for my first meeting ever.  I like that it's at the 
transportation center, since my house is on the metra line (about 90 
minute ride) but my kids have a Christmas concert that night.  I'm 
bummed.  Still, if we can have the meeting at the transportation center, 
it's probably worth my money to do the round-trip ticket + 3 hours of 
transit time.  I would love to meet a bunch of you in "meat space."

Good program, too.   I would love to be there. Bummed.
Tim
_______________________________________________
Chicago mailing list
Chicago at python.org
http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago


       
---------------------------------
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From pfein at pobox.com  Tue Dec 11 17:09:50 2007
From: pfein at pobox.com (Pete)
Date: Tue, 11 Dec 2007 11:09:50 -0500
Subject: [Chicago] Thursday, Dec. 13: Join us for our best meeting ever!
In-Reply-To: <269823.93935.qm@web34804.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
References: <269823.93935.qm@web34804.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <200712111109.50413.pfein@pobox.com>

On Tuesday December 11 2007 10:53:48 am Feihong Hsu wrote:
> Wow, 90 minutes, huh? That sounds like my daily commute!

That works out to a month of commuting each year.

I'll refrain from copious OT commentary, other than to say:

Yikes. ;-(

-- 
Peter Fein   ||   773-575-0694   ||   pfein at pobox.com
http://www.pobox.com/~pfein/   ||   PGP: 0xCCF6AE6B
irc: pfein at freenode.net   ||   jabber: peter.fein at gmail.com

From cwebber at imagescape.com  Tue Dec 11 17:13:03 2007
From: cwebber at imagescape.com (Christopher Allan Webber)
Date: Tue, 11 Dec 2007 10:13:03 -0600
Subject: [Chicago] Thursday, Dec. 13: Join us for our best meeting ever!
In-Reply-To: <6yprxdl0yv.fsf@imagepc03.rd.imagescape.com> (Christopher Allan
	Webber's message of "Tue, 11 Dec 2007 09:12:24 -0600")
References: <a68ced640712101409q483f73c8j3f2e802a9418a07@mail.gmail.com>
	<475DDB32.7070802@gmail.com>
	<6yprxdl0yv.fsf@imagepc03.rd.imagescape.com>
Message-ID: <6ybq8xky5s.fsf@imagepc03.rd.imagescape.com>

Also, three of my coworkers are planning to attend:
 - Tamas Kemenczy
 - Bonnie King
 - Jacob Kronika

Christopher Allan Webber <cwebber at imagescape.com> writes:

> I'll definetly be there.
>
> Tim Ottinger <tottinge at gmail.com> writes:
>
>> I was trying to come for my first meeting ever.  I like that it's at the 
>> transportation center, since my house is on the metra line (about 90 
>> minute ride) but my kids have a Christmas concert that night.  I'm 
>> bummed.  Still, if we can have the meeting at the transportation center, 
>> it's probably worth my money to do the round-trip ticket + 3 hours of 
>> transit time.  I would love to meet a bunch of you in "meat space."
>>
>> Good program, too.   I would love to be there. Bummed.
>> Tim
>> _______________________________________________
>> Chicago mailing list
>> Chicago at python.org
>> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
> _______________________________________________
> Chicago mailing list
> Chicago at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago

From shekay at pobox.com  Tue Dec 11 17:06:35 2007
From: shekay at pobox.com (sheila miguez)
Date: Tue, 11 Dec 2007 10:06:35 -0600
Subject: [Chicago] Thursday, Dec. 13: Join us for our best meeting ever!
In-Reply-To: <269823.93935.qm@web34804.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
References: <475DDB32.7070802@gmail.com>
	<269823.93935.qm@web34804.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <a68ced640712110806o79c41dd5j83a441631869bff6@mail.gmail.com>

Ouch. Mine used to be 60. Now it is 45 or 15 depending.

Ps. I sent out a meeting notice to the developer mailing list at work
and if as many show up who accepted the meeting notice, the attendance
for this meeting will more than double. Not counting the tentatives.

I wonder if the weather will keep people away?


On Dec 11, 2007 9:53 AM, Feihong Hsu <hsu.feihong at yahoo.com> wrote:
> Wow, 90 minutes, huh? That sounds like my daily commute!
>
> - Feihong
>
> P.S. I'm not bragging, I'm crying on the inside when I say that. Seriously.
>
>
>
> Tim Ottinger <tottinge at gmail.com> wrote:
>  I was trying to come for my first meeting ever. I like that it's at the
> transportation center, since my house is on the metra line (about 90
> minute ride) but my kids have a Christmas concert that night. I'm
> bummed. Still, if we can have the meeting at the transportation center,
> it's probably worth my money to do the round-trip ticket + 3 hours of
> transit time. I would love to meet a bunch of you in "meat space."
>
> Good program, too. I would love to be there. Bummed.
> Tim
> _______________________________________________
> Chicago mailing list
> Chicago at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>
>
>
>  ________________________________
> Looking for last minute shopping deals? Find them fast with Yahoo! Search.
> _______________________________________________
> Chicago mailing list
> Chicago at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>
>



-- 
sheila

From cathyp222000 at hotmail.com  Wed Dec 12 02:05:41 2007
From: cathyp222000 at hotmail.com (Cathy Wang)
Date: Tue, 11 Dec 2007 20:05:41 -0500
Subject: [Chicago] Thursday, Dec. 13: Join us for our best meeting ever!
Message-ID: <BLU120-W123DD4616492F7085AD1AEDA650@phx.gbl>


Hi, Sheila:
 
Thanks for the message.
 
I am interested in joining this meeting.
 
Thanks,
 
Cathy
 
> Date: Mon, 10 Dec 2007 16:09:46 -0600> From: shekay at pobox.com> To: chicago at python.org> Subject: [Chicago] Thursday, Dec. 13: Join us for our best meeting ever!> > Chicago Python User Group> =========================> > Next Meeting> ============> > Come join us for our best meeting ever!> > Thursday Dec. 13, 2007> > Doors open at 6:30 pm, Meeting starts at 7:00 pm> > Please RSVP!> > Topics> ------> > * Sterling will give a short demonstration on EasyGUI> * Christopher Webber on his conceptually neat animation system> * Feihong Hsu on GUI wrapper libraries for either WinForms or> wxPython, depending> * Ian Bicking on WebTest, a functional testing tool for WSGI applications> * CouchDB, tentatively> > Location> --------> > Orbitz> 8th floor, Planet Earth> Ogilvy Transportation Center> 500 W Madison Chicago, IL 60661> > Meet on the third floor next at the security desk to get guest badges,> then take the> elevators to the 8th floor.> > * Ogilvy Station Information> <http://metrarail.com/Sched/cnw_n/chicago_ogilvie.shtml>> * Union Station Information <htp://metrarail.com/Sched/md_w/chicagounion.shtml>> * Downtown CTA map <http://transitchicago.com/maps/maps/2007D.html>> > Please RSVP to Sheila Herndon, shekay at pobox com, by Tuesday. I will> need a list> of attendees to give to building security.> > About ChiPy> -----------> > ChiPy is a group of Chicago Python Programmers, l33t, and n00bs.> Meetings are held monthly at various locations around Chicago.> Also, ChiPy is a proud sponsor of many Open Source and Educational> efforts in Chicago. Stay tuned to the mailing list for more info.> > ChiPy website: <http://chipy.org>> ChiPy Mailing List: <http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago>> Python website: <http://python.org>> _______________________________________________> Chicago mailing list> Chicago at python.org> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
_________________________________________________________________
Don't get caught with egg on your face. Play Chicktionary!
http://club.live.com/chicktionary.aspx?icid=chick_wlhmtextlink1_dec
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From pohara at virtualmotors.com  Wed Dec 12 19:49:04 2007
From: pohara at virtualmotors.com (Patrick O'Hara)
Date: Wed, 12 Dec 2007 11:49:04 -0700
Subject: [Chicago] Thursday, Dec. 13: Join us for our best meeting ever!
Message-ID: <9a8bcbb01a0f4e679b154f8090174465@maila24.webcontrolcenter.com>

see you all there.

----------------------------------------

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Ouch. Mine used to be 60. Now it is 45 or 15 depending.

Ps. I sent out a meeting notice to the developer mailing list at work
and if as many show up who accepted the meeting notice, the attendance
for this meeting will more than double. Not counting the tentatives.

I wonder if the weather will keep people away?

On Dec 11, 2007 9:53 AM, Feihong Hsu wrote:
> Wow, 90 minutes, huh? That sounds like my daily commute!
>
> - Feihong
>
> P.S. I'm not bragging, I'm crying on the inside when I say that. Seriously.
>
>
>
> Tim Ottinger wrote:
> I was trying to come for my first meeting ever. I like that it's at the
> transportation center, since my house is on the metra line (about 90
> minute ride) but my kids have a Christmas concert that night. I'm
> bummed. Still, if we can have the meeting at the transportation center,
> it's probably worth my money to do the round-trip ticket + 3 hours of
> transit time. I would love to meet a bunch of you in "meat space."
>
> Good program, too. I would love to be there. Bummed.
> Tim
> _______________________________________________
> Chicago mailing list
> Chicago at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>
>
>
> ________________________________
> Looking for last minute shopping deals? Find them fast with Yahoo! Search.
> _______________________________________________
> Chicago mailing list
> Chicago at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>
>

-- 
sheila
_______________________________________________
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From robkapteyn at gmail.com  Wed Dec 12 22:47:08 2007
From: robkapteyn at gmail.com (Rob Kapteyn)
Date: Wed, 12 Dec 2007 15:47:08 -0600
Subject: [Chicago] Thursday, Dec. 13: Join us for our best meeting ever!
In-Reply-To: <a68ced640712101409q483f73c8j3f2e802a9418a07@mail.gmail.com>
References: <a68ced640712101409q483f73c8j3f2e802a9418a07@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <B2BACA83-2C4D-4940-8B8C-4E72DD8A7191@gmail.com>

RSVP for me too.


On Dec 10, 2007, at 4:09 PM, sheila miguez wrote:

> Chicago Python User Group
> =========================
>
> Next Meeting
> ============
>
> Come join us for our best meeting ever!
>
> Thursday Dec. 13, 2007
>
> Doors open at 6:30 pm, Meeting starts at 7:00 pm
>
> Please RSVP!
>
> Topics
> ------
>
> * Sterling will give a short demonstration on EasyGUI
> * Christopher Webber on his conceptually neat animation system
> * Feihong Hsu on GUI wrapper libraries for either WinForms or
> wxPython, depending
> * Ian Bicking on WebTest, a functional testing tool for WSGI  
> applications
> * CouchDB, tentatively
>
> Location
> --------
>
> Orbitz
> 8th floor, Planet Earth
> Ogilvy Transportation Center
> 500 W Madison Chicago, IL 60661
>
> Meet on the third floor next at the security desk to get guest badges,
> then take the
> elevators to the 8th floor.
>
> * Ogilvy Station Information
> <http://metrarail.com/Sched/cnw_n/chicago_ogilvie.shtml>
> * Union Station Information <htp://metrarail.com/Sched/md_w/chicagounion.shtml 
> >
> * Downtown CTA map <http://transitchicago.com/maps/maps/2007D.html>
>
> Please RSVP to Sheila Herndon, shekay at pobox com, by Tuesday. I will
> need a list
> of attendees to give to building security.
>
> About ChiPy
> -----------
>
> ChiPy is a group of Chicago Python Programmers, l33t, and n00bs.
> Meetings are held monthly at various locations around Chicago.
> Also, ChiPy is a proud sponsor of many Open Source and Educational
> efforts in Chicago. Stay tuned to the mailing list for more info.
>
> ChiPy website: <http://chipy.org>
> ChiPy Mailing List: <http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago>
> Python website: <http://python.org>
> _______________________________________________
> Chicago mailing list
> Chicago at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago


From skip at pobox.com  Wed Dec 12 23:33:56 2007
From: skip at pobox.com (skip at pobox.com)
Date: Wed, 12 Dec 2007 16:33:56 -0600
Subject: [Chicago] Alternative RSVP mechanism?
Message-ID: <18272.25044.172991.92416@montanaro.dyndns.org>


I notice that the BayPiggies use the Python wiki to RSVP about upcoming
meetings:

    http://wiki.python.org/moin/BayPiggiesGoogleMeetings

Maybe having an RSVP page on the ChiPy wiki would be a good alternative to
everyone acknowledging their impending/intended attendance on the mailing
list.  For hosts who have to present a list of possible attendees to their
building security folks it would make it easier to just be able to print
that page and hand it to the powers-that-be.

Just a thought from a non-attender...

Skip

From shekay at pobox.com  Thu Dec 13 16:08:57 2007
From: shekay at pobox.com (sheila miguez)
Date: Thu, 13 Dec 2007 09:08:57 -0600
Subject: [Chicago] Alternative RSVP mechanism?
In-Reply-To: <18272.25044.172991.92416@montanaro.dyndns.org>
References: <18272.25044.172991.92416@montanaro.dyndns.org>
Message-ID: <a68ced640712130708o3835d917v10cc386823c6847b@mail.gmail.com>

On Dec 12, 2007 4:33 PM,  <skip at pobox.com> wrote:
>
> I notice that the BayPiggies use the Python wiki to RSVP about upcoming
> meetings:
>
>     http://wiki.python.org/moin/BayPiggiesGoogleMeetings
>
> Maybe having an RSVP page on the ChiPy wiki would be a good alternative to
> everyone acknowledging their impending/intended attendance on the mailing
> list.  For hosts who have to present a list of possible attendees to their
> building security folks it would make it easier to just be able to print
> that page and hand it to the powers-that-be.
>
> Just a thought from a non-attender...

+1

I've been keeping a list on the wiki here at work just to help me keep
track of things.

For the local java user group, people rsvp on the website as well.


-- 
sheila

From shekay at pobox.com  Thu Dec 13 16:10:59 2007
From: shekay at pobox.com (sheila miguez)
Date: Thu, 13 Dec 2007 09:10:59 -0600
Subject: [Chicago] Tonight's meeting logistics
Message-ID: <a68ced640712130710p69f6d90cwa59369212311cdb6@mail.gmail.com>

Hi all,

For help with building security, it will help if people can arrive
close to the time that the meeting starts since we have been asked to
escort the group to the meeting place. I will arrange to have someone
(probably me) stay downstairs for a while to help stragglers.

-- 
sheila

From carl at personnelware.com  Thu Dec 13 17:20:18 2007
From: carl at personnelware.com (Carl Karsten)
Date: Thu, 13 Dec 2007 10:20:18 -0600
Subject: [Chicago] Tonight's meeting logistics
In-Reply-To: <a68ced640712130710p69f6d90cwa59369212311cdb6@mail.gmail.com>
References: <a68ced640712130710p69f6d90cwa59369212311cdb6@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <47615BC2.4010403@personnelware.com>

sheila miguez wrote:
> Hi all,
> 
> For help with building security, it will help if people can arrive
> close to the time that the meeting starts since we have been asked to
> escort the group to the meeting place. I will arrange to have someone
> (probably me) stay downstairs for a while to help stragglers.
> 

Aside from not being fair to you, you should probably be at or near the meeting. 
    Does the escort have to be an Orbitz employee?

Instead of having someone stay downstairs, I bet the security guard could be 
persuaded to call one of us if anyone shows up.

Carl K

From shekay at pobox.com  Thu Dec 13 17:58:21 2007
From: shekay at pobox.com (sheila miguez)
Date: Thu, 13 Dec 2007 10:58:21 -0600
Subject: [Chicago] Tonight's meeting logistics
In-Reply-To: <47615BC2.4010403@personnelware.com>
References: <a68ced640712130710p69f6d90cwa59369212311cdb6@mail.gmail.com>
	<47615BC2.4010403@personnelware.com>
Message-ID: <a68ced640712130858l99553b7id29ed2acb2da5cc8@mail.gmail.com>

On Dec 13, 2007 10:20 AM, Carl Karsten <carl at personnelware.com> wrote:
>
> sheila miguez wrote:
> > Hi all,
> >
> > For help with building security, it will help if people can arrive
> > close to the time that the meeting starts since we have been asked to
> > escort the group to the meeting place. I will arrange to have someone
> > (probably me) stay downstairs for a while to help stragglers.
> >
>
> Aside from not being fair to you, you should probably be at or near the meeting.
>     Does the escort have to be an Orbitz employee?

It has to be an Orbitz employee.

> Instead of having someone stay downstairs, I bet the security guard could be
> persuaded to call one of us if anyone shows up.


It's not that big of a deal if I wait downstairs for a while to catch
stragglers, and I will leave my phone number with the security guard
in case anyone comes after the talks start.




-- 
sheila

From szybalski at gmail.com  Thu Dec 13 18:12:26 2007
From: szybalski at gmail.com (Lukasz Szybalski)
Date: Thu, 13 Dec 2007 11:12:26 -0600
Subject: [Chicago] python and reports
Message-ID: <804e5c70712130912o203e29b0sc101ac823bfb8366@mail.gmail.com>

Hello,
Do you guys know an easy/FAST way to create reports in python?

Reportlab - but that seems to have a lot of pre-settings you need to
do to make the pdf.
Some template html system - you will need to learn one of the template
languages and start using it.

is there anything else that you tried and it worked for you?

Lucas


-- 
-- 
Vim auto completion for python
http://lucasmanual.com/mywiki/FrontPage#head-8ce19b13e89893059e126b719bebe4ee32fe103c
TurboGears from start to finish:
http://www.lucasmanual.com/mywiki/TurboGears

From carl at personnelware.com  Thu Dec 13 18:23:26 2007
From: carl at personnelware.com (Carl Karsten)
Date: Thu, 13 Dec 2007 11:23:26 -0600
Subject: [Chicago] python and reports
In-Reply-To: <804e5c70712130912o203e29b0sc101ac823bfb8366@mail.gmail.com>
References: <804e5c70712130912o203e29b0sc101ac823bfb8366@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <47616A8E.8030202@personnelware.com>

Lukasz Szybalski wrote:
> Hello,
> Do you guys know an easy/FAST way to create reports in python?
> 
> Reportlab - but that seems to have a lot of pre-settings you need to
> do to make the pdf.
> Some template html system - you will need to learn one of the template
> languages and start using it.
> 
> is there anything else that you tried and it worked for you?
> 

I have used the dabo report designer.  It is 2 things:  engine: given a layout 
xml and some data, uses reportlab to create a pdf.  layout editor - GUI tool to 
create the .xml.

The editor has 3 modes: raw xml, objects, preview.  the objects view lets you 
drag things around, but is kinda clunky.  I just edit the xml, then flip to the 
objects to see if I am close, repeat.  once I think I have it all right, preview 
(gens pdf, displays it).  repeat.

http://dabodev.com

Carl K

From pfein at pobox.com  Thu Dec 13 18:46:20 2007
From: pfein at pobox.com (Pete)
Date: Thu, 13 Dec 2007 12:46:20 -0500
Subject: [Chicago] python and reports
In-Reply-To: <804e5c70712130912o203e29b0sc101ac823bfb8366@mail.gmail.com>
References: <804e5c70712130912o203e29b0sc101ac823bfb8366@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <200712131246.20166.pfein@pobox.com>

On Thursday December 13 2007 12:12:26 pm Lukasz Szybalski wrote:
> is there anything else that you tried and it worked for you?

CSV?

Seriously, this depends pretty heavily on what you're trying to report & who 
your target audience is.

-- 
Peter Fein   ||   773-575-0694   ||   pfein at pobox.com
http://www.pobox.com/~pfein/   ||   PGP: 0xCCF6AE6B
irc: pfein at freenode.net   ||   jabber: peter.fein at gmail.com

From MDiPierro at cti.depaul.edu  Thu Dec 13 19:13:57 2007
From: MDiPierro at cti.depaul.edu (DiPierro, Massimo)
Date: Thu, 13 Dec 2007 12:13:57 -0600
Subject: [Chicago] python and reports
In-Reply-To: <804e5c70712130912o203e29b0sc101ac823bfb8366@mail.gmail.com>
References: <804e5c70712130912o203e29b0sc101ac823bfb8366@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <C1AA20CAC1E41647BFF1D41215EDD4755F48A791A2@wagner.cti.depaul.edu>

I use latex for www.appealmypropertytaxes.com

apt-get install tetex

I do not use any specific module, just create a .tex file with the content, process it, and read back the generated pdf. The optional latex package pstricks allow you to draw on the document and overlay text and picture using coordinates.
It is slower than reportlab but gives you more flexibility.

Massimo

________________________________________
From: chicago-bounces at python.org [chicago-bounces at python.org] On Behalf Of Lukasz Szybalski [szybalski at gmail.com]
Sent: Thursday, December 13, 2007 11:12 AM
To: The Chicago Python Users Group
Subject: [Chicago] python and reports

Hello,
Do you guys know an easy/FAST way to create reports in python?

Reportlab - but that seems to have a lot of pre-settings you need to
do to make the pdf.
Some template html system - you will need to learn one of the template
languages and start using it.

is there anything else that you tried and it worked for you?

Lucas


--
--
Vim auto completion for python
http://lucasmanual.com/mywiki/FrontPage#head-8ce19b13e89893059e126b719bebe4ee32fe103c
TurboGears from start to finish:
http://www.lucasmanual.com/mywiki/TurboGears
_______________________________________________
Chicago mailing list
Chicago at python.org
http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago

From szybalski at gmail.com  Thu Dec 13 22:36:29 2007
From: szybalski at gmail.com (Lukasz Szybalski)
Date: Thu, 13 Dec 2007 15:36:29 -0600
Subject: [Chicago] python and reports
In-Reply-To: <200712131246.20166.pfein@pobox.com>
References: <804e5c70712130912o203e29b0sc101ac823bfb8366@mail.gmail.com>
	<200712131246.20166.pfein@pobox.com>
Message-ID: <804e5c70712131336o46fe3d7ewd8c86a235fdca96c@mail.gmail.com>

On Dec 13, 2007 11:46 AM, Pete <pfein at pobox.com> wrote:
> On Thursday December 13 2007 12:12:26 pm Lukasz Szybalski wrote:
> > is there anything else that you tried and it worked for you?
>

Right now I just need to print a formatted page(complex letter style
page). Something similar to merge fields and word documents would work
but through python. My data is in tag file, so I have key and value
that I could pass in.

So I'm either thinking of using xhtml or rtf to create my page layout
and then use cheetah to fill in these values. I know cheetah will work
for xhtml, I don't know about rtf. From then I would need to find
something to convert these into pdf.

I found old template that has merge fields but I don't know if its any
use to me. I doubt cheetah\reportlab will be able to fill in the merge
fields.

Ideas?

Lucas

From kumar.mcmillan at gmail.com  Fri Dec 14 00:00:33 2007
From: kumar.mcmillan at gmail.com (Kumar McMillan)
Date: Thu, 13 Dec 2007 17:00:33 -0600
Subject: [Chicago] Leapfrog Online is looking for some Django developers
Message-ID: <b571660a0712131500p27b41037q98c7d67c2ef48ae@mail.gmail.com>

Hey everybody,

(nicely formatted version with clickable links:
http://farmdev.com/thoughts/37/leapfrog-online-is-looking-for-some-django-developers-chicago-area-/
)

http://leapfrogonline.com/ is looking to hire several Python
developers to work on a Django site. If you know Python but not
Django, this is an excellent opportunity to learn. If you know Django
but want to learn how to use Python in other contexts, you'll get to
do that, too. You'll be working on a high traffic website that hooks
into several web services to help customers find Broadband Internet
connectivity based on geo location (just US and Canada at the moment).
Surrounding that basic function are all kinds of front-end and
back-end features, services and systems.

The Software Engineer position is outlined in detail here:
http://www.leapfrogonline.com/who/careers.php#55

You can send your resume to kumar.mcmillan at gmail.com or send it
through the site above. These are full-time positions but if you'd
rather work with us as a contractor that may be possible.

What Do We Do?
--------------

Leapfrog Online does performance-based customer acquisition, which
translates to "we don't make money unless our clients make money."
Because of this our software has to work well and we need to collect
lots of structured, sensical data so our analysts can build the right
marketing strategies. In a more abstract sense, the interesting
challenges we face are building high-availability websites,
fault-tolerant web services, pushing and pulling at hundreds of gigs
of data, and accounting for tight security all along the way. As for
the atmosphere, we're still a small company but we're not a struggling
startup.

We Care About Open Source
-------------------------

We use open source tools that are right for the job. Currently we use
Python or Ruby for websites / web services (Django, Pylons, Paste,
Ruby on Rails), Python for backend tools, PostgreSQL for databases,
and Trac for our projects. We use rich web interface libraries like
Ext JS and we even wrote a distributed content system in Erlang
because it was a good fit.

We have contributed patches to most of the projects listed above and
maintain our own projects like nose, a few nose plugins, fixture,
wsgi_intercept, and sv. We give talks at conferences like Pycon (see
#24, #85 and #127). Also, Jeff Cohen (one of our senior developers)
runs a popular blog called Softies on Rails and teaches and writes
books about Rails.

Scrum: You'll Like It
---------------------

We started with Extreme Programming a few years ago and have moved
towards Scrum and other Agile methods as our approach to software
development. We are constantly refining our process, keeping what
works, discarding what doesn't. The company is on board with Scrum all
the way up to the principles and we are always working to improve how
Scrum is integrated holistically (a training program is in the works).

We think you'll like Agile for development. We have several teams of
no more than three developers who work in two week "sprints." The
sprints are planned out by product owners, developers, and project
managers with user stories estimated in "story points" so that the
business gets what it needs in order of priority. A sprint is exactly
what it sounds like -- you just work! At the end of each sprint the
work is released and you attend a retrospective meeting to see what
was good, bad, and ugly, and how much work you did. Nothing is perfect
so, of course, there are emergencies and derailments here and there
but for the most part Scrum keeps things moving at a productive pace.
As a developer, I find this discipline empowering and highly
motivational.

You Must Test It
----------------

We are nutty about automated testing (in case you didn't notice). All
code must have automated regression tests so if you're not familiar
with this way of writing software, you will learn! We have a fairly
involved continuous integration process running in buildbot (though
probably moving to Bamboo soon) that performs several builds of each
app, one with stable 3rd party libs, the others with trunk versions of
3rd party libs. As well as getting immediate feedback when a bad
change is checked in, this also helps us pinpoint bugs in our
dependencies before they are released. Our QA department is also
different than most in that it consists of developers who are writing
functional and/or integration tests in code and adding these to the
build process. They are essentially software engineers like the rest
of us.

Your Time Is Valuable
---------------------

No one has a sleeping bad under their desk here; we work until 5 or 6
(weekdays only) to achieve a "sustainable pace." Most of us have been
through the "death march" routine at other companies so we know it
doesn't work long term. Scrum helps us maintain this ethic.
No Pigeonholes

While we are currently looking for Python/Django programmers, we are
always interested in meeting people who think in Ruby/Rails, PHP 5 and
other open source web technologies, too. We're especially interested
if you're feeling ecumenical and want to learn about and work with,
say, both Python and Ruby. You might only work in one language most of
the time, but we think it is important for developers to stretch
themselves and understand what tools are best for the job.

_

thanks for reading and see you at ChiPy tonight,
Kumar

PS. bring your resume :)

From maney at two14.net  Fri Dec 14 04:21:29 2007
From: maney at two14.net (Martin Maney)
Date: Thu, 13 Dec 2007 21:21:29 -0600
Subject: [Chicago] python and reports
In-Reply-To: <804e5c70712131336o46fe3d7ewd8c86a235fdca96c@mail.gmail.com>
References: <804e5c70712130912o203e29b0sc101ac823bfb8366@mail.gmail.com>
	<200712131246.20166.pfein@pobox.com>
	<804e5c70712131336o46fe3d7ewd8c86a235fdca96c@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <20071214032129.GA28974@furrr.two14.net>

On Thu, Dec 13, 2007 at 03:36:29PM -0600, Lukasz Szybalski wrote:
> Right now I just need to print a formatted page(complex letter style
> page). Something similar to merge fields and word documents would work
> but through python. My data is in tag file, so I have key and value
> that I could pass in.

So what you're saying is the template is one big honkin' string, you
turn the tag file into a dict, and

print template % tag_dict

(hmmm, that started out as tongue in cheek, but now that I think about
it I would have killed for something like that that was so simple to
implement, oh, about twenty years ago.  ended up doing a variation on
that theme in C, which was about as painful as you imagine it would
be.)

> So I'm either thinking of using xhtml or rtf to create my page layout
> and then use cheetah to fill in these values. I know cheetah will work
> for xhtml, I don't know about rtf.

Django's templates are quite happy producing output other than HTML,
since they aren't really at all HTML specific (other than perhaps a
fine disregard for leaving meaningless whitespace in the output). 
Jinja began as a separate-from-Django version of Django's template
engine (more or less), but seems to have since evolved in the direction
of the PHP error (embed your code in the template!  make it all one
great steaming mess!  say, what was the point of replacing print
statements with a separate template, again?).

Just sketching on recycled paper here...

-- 
Writing blog entries is like tapping out a tune on a piano,
or drawing a little sketch on newsprint.  Writing a book is
closer to painting a mural or composing an opera.  -- Charles Petzold


From ianb at colorstudy.com  Fri Dec 14 06:01:09 2007
From: ianb at colorstudy.com (Ian Bicking)
Date: Thu, 13 Dec 2007 23:01:09 -0600
Subject: [Chicago] January venue?
Message-ID: <47620E15.6080700@colorstudy.com>

Lets get ahead of the game.  Anyone have a venue for January?

-- 
Ian Bicking : ianb at colorstudy.com : http://blog.ianbicking.org

From tcp at mac.com  Fri Dec 14 06:16:27 2007
From: tcp at mac.com (Ted Pollari)
Date: Thu, 13 Dec 2007 21:16:27 -0800
Subject: [Chicago] January venue?
In-Reply-To: <47620E15.6080700@colorstudy.com>
References: <47620E15.6080700@colorstudy.com>
Message-ID: <294DD8E9-9EF2-43CF-A399-F7A45CE13B1B@mac.com>


On Dec 13, 2007, at 9:01 PM, Ian Bicking wrote:

> Lets get ahead of the game.  Anyone have a venue for January?


Please do -- I may actually be in town for that meeting... =)

-ted

From hsu.feihong at yahoo.com  Fri Dec 14 06:28:35 2007
From: hsu.feihong at yahoo.com (Feihong Hsu)
Date: Thu, 13 Dec 2007 21:28:35 -0800 (PST)
Subject: [Chicago] python and reports
In-Reply-To: <804e5c70712131336o46fe3d7ewd8c86a235fdca96c@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <760110.45750.qm@web34812.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

Tiny RML2PDF might be a good choice for you:

http://www.openreport.org/index.py/trml2pdf

Also, there are a plethora of Python template engines out there, but if you're generating XML then Genshi is pretty nice. Personally, I prefer to use Mako, which is a more general-purpose template language (Mako took the best parts out of the Django and Myghty template languages and mashed them together).

- Feihong

Lukasz Szybalski <szybalski at gmail.com> wrote: On Dec 13, 2007 11:46 AM, Pete 
 wrote:
> On Thursday December 13 2007 12:12:26 pm Lukasz Szybalski wrote:
> > is there anything else that you tried and it worked for you?
>

Right now I just need to print a formatted page(complex letter style
page). Something similar to merge fields and word documents would work
but through python. My data is in tag file, so I have key and value
that I could pass in.

So I'm either thinking of using xhtml or rtf to create my page layout
and then use cheetah to fill in these values. I know cheetah will work
for xhtml, I don't know about rtf. From then I would need to find
something to convert these into pdf.

I found old template that has merge fields but I don't know if its any
use to me. I doubt cheetah\reportlab will be able to fill in the merge
fields.

Ideas?

Lucas
_______________________________________________
Chicago mailing list
Chicago at python.org
http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago



       
---------------------------------
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From chris.mcavoy at gmail.com  Fri Dec 14 13:31:45 2007
From: chris.mcavoy at gmail.com (Chris McAvoy)
Date: Fri, 14 Dec 2007 06:31:45 -0600
Subject: [Chicago] January venue?
In-Reply-To: <47620E15.6080700@colorstudy.com>
References: <47620E15.6080700@colorstudy.com>
Message-ID: <3096c19d0712140431l6f1021cdrbb5ca53bf3a1429b@mail.gmail.com>

I'll check with Scott Zibble (via cc on this email, efficiency!) to
see if he's on for Performics.

Chris

On Dec 13, 2007 11:01 PM, Ian Bicking <ianb at colorstudy.com> wrote:
> Lets get ahead of the game.  Anyone have a venue for January?
>
> --
> Ian Bicking : ianb at colorstudy.com : http://blog.ianbicking.org
> _______________________________________________
> Chicago mailing list
> Chicago at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>

From shekay at pobox.com  Fri Dec 14 19:51:59 2007
From: shekay at pobox.com (sheila miguez)
Date: Fri, 14 Dec 2007 12:51:59 -0600
Subject: [Chicago] wxpita
Message-ID: <a68ced640712141051o49c3638ak238050c3e4d40d69@mail.gmail.com>

Feihong's talk was fun. I did not hear all of the suggestion about
delegating things back to the wxWidgets. Could someone give a
synopsis?

-- 
sheila

From asl2 at pobox.com  Fri Dec 14 21:54:02 2007
From: asl2 at pobox.com (Aaron Lav)
Date: Fri, 14 Dec 2007 15:54:02 -0500
Subject: [Chicago] wxpita
In-Reply-To: <a68ced640712141051o49c3638ak238050c3e4d40d69@mail.gmail.com>
References: <a68ced640712141051o49c3638ak238050c3e4d40d69@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <20071214205401.GA10668@panix.com>



From robert.a.zeh at gmail.com  Sat Dec 15 03:31:04 2007
From: robert.a.zeh at gmail.com (Robert Zeh)
Date: Fri, 14 Dec 2007 20:31:04 -0600
Subject: [Chicago] January venue?
In-Reply-To: <47620E15.6080700@colorstudy.com>
References: <47620E15.6080700@colorstudy.com>
Message-ID: <77B48D6A-6B59-487E-B174-D756397F5DAD@gmail.com>

I might be able to work something out downtown (by the Chicago Board  
of Trade) with my company  - GETCO.

I'll check on Monday.

Robert


On Dec 13, 2007, at 11:01 PM, Ian Bicking wrote:

> Lets get ahead of the game.  Anyone have a venue for January?
>
> -- 
> Ian Bicking : ianb at colorstudy.com : http://blog.ianbicking.org
> _______________________________________________
> Chicago mailing list
> Chicago at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago


From hsu.feihong at yahoo.com  Sat Dec 15 06:33:56 2007
From: hsu.feihong at yahoo.com (Feihong Hsu)
Date: Fri, 14 Dec 2007 21:33:56 -0800 (PST)
Subject: [Chicago] wxpita
In-Reply-To: <a68ced640712141051o49c3638ak238050c3e4d40d69@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <127023.45537.qm@web34803.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

I'm not 100% sure I understand your question, but I'll take a stab at an answer.

The core of wxPita's API is the layout and event binding stuff. All that happens outside of wxPython -- although the names of the classes are the same, no widgets are being created when you're using that part of the framework. 

Since the wxPita classes aren't real widgets, you can't treat them as if they were. So I came up with two special ways to modify the state of the GUI right after the widgets are initialized:

- Fake methods
- Init callbacks

The fake methods just emulate simple method calls that you can make on the real widgets. For example,

f.combobox.SetSelection(0)

Where f.combobox is a wrapper object for wx.ComboBox. This doesn't execute anything, it just saves the name of the method and its arguments for later, to be invoked right after the real widget is created.

The Init callbacks look like this:

@f.Init
def _():
    for s in ['cat', 'bat', 'dog', 'foo', 'box']:
        f.combobox.Append(s)

    # You can't use a Fake Method for this because wx.Font
    # objects can't be instantiated until the wx.App object has been created:
    f.combobox.SetFont(wx.Font(14, wx.SWISS, wx.NORMAL, wx.NORMAL))

The Init callback is invoked right after widget creation, but the difference is that by that time, the wrapper objects have been replaced by the real widgets. So, whereas f.combobox was a wrapper before, inside the Init callback it's a real live wxPython widget. So you can do anything inside the Init callback that you can normally do in wxPython.

Incidentally, I decided to do away with the Fake Method approach. It's too magical and weird. I also changed the Init callback slightly from how it was in yesterday's presentation (it doesn't accept a parameter anymore, and it can only be used on container wrappers). 

The comments and questions I got were excellent; they really helped me settle certain design decisions that were nagging me.  In particular, the event binding API I devised with was quite ugly, but after fooling around for a while I finally came up with something halfway decent:

@f.button.button_clicked
def onclick(evt):
    print 'You clicked on', evt.EventObject.GetLabel()

@f.combobox.combobox_selected
def _(evt)
    print 'You selected', evt.EventObject.GetSelectionString()

f.button2.button_clicked.register(onclick)

Again, I'm still using the wxPython names for everything, except now I provide the option of using the event type IDs, which are generally more descriptive than the the event binder names.

I will see if I can upload everything to Google Code over the weekend. The reason I didn't today was because I got sidetracked by data binding, but I can't figure that out very quickly so I'll just check in what I have now.

Cheers,
Feihong

sheila miguez <shekay at pobox.com> wrote: Feihong's talk was fun. I did not hear all of the suggestion about
delegating things back to the wxWidgets. Could someone give a
synopsis?

-- 
sheila
_______________________________________________
Chicago mailing list
Chicago at python.org
http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago


       
---------------------------------
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From bray at sent.com  Sat Dec 15 14:03:23 2007
From: bray at sent.com (Brian Ray)
Date: Sat, 15 Dec 2007 07:03:23 -0600
Subject: [Chicago] January venue?
In-Reply-To: <77B48D6A-6B59-487E-B174-D756397F5DAD@gmail.com>
References: <47620E15.6080700@colorstudy.com>
	<77B48D6A-6B59-487E-B174-D756397F5DAD@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <3B29724C-6025-449C-AB73-EC40102FFE79@sent.com>


On Dec 14, 2007, at 8:31 PM, Robert Zeh wrote:

> I might be able to work something out downtown (by the Chicago Board
> of Trade) with my company  - GETCO.


GETCO is another one of those financial organizations who frequently  
look for Python talent, but are not sure what they are looking for-- 
frequently annoying many hard core Python advocates. Bring us in for a  
software engineering job and then telling us its a QA job once we get  
half way through a day long interview ; )  But, I did not want this to  
turn us off..

I have been to GETCO offices and met ten or so developers, in  
August.   They have a really nice office space in BOT.  They appeared  
to have a conference room large enough to hold the 20-30 we are  
getting. They guys I met at GETCO, several had some pretty solid  
Python background-esp. in QA testing and build automation (SCONS). A  
couple of guys have attended ChiPy meetings in the past--at Monadnock   
IIRC.  Overall, I pretty interesting group of guys and they probably  
have a lot more to contribute on how they use Python.

BWT, I am back.  I no longer have class on Thursday nights.  How are  
things going? I heard Orbitz was a blast. Good job.

I will just sort of sit in the background for a while. Certainly I can  
attend and present on how the company I now lead will be using Python.  
But, if needed, I can get back into organizing again, now.   
Nonetheless, I certainly do not want to de-rail the current efforts.

Brian Ray
bray at sent.com
http://kazavoo.com/blog

From shekay at pobox.com  Sat Dec 15 17:55:52 2007
From: shekay at pobox.com (sheila miguez)
Date: Sat, 15 Dec 2007 10:55:52 -0600
Subject: [Chicago] wxpita
In-Reply-To: <127023.45537.qm@web34803.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
References: <a68ced640712141051o49c3638ak238050c3e4d40d69@mail.gmail.com>
	<127023.45537.qm@web34803.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <a68ced640712150855x29db85cg9409f43782044615@mail.gmail.com>

On Dec 14, 2007 11:33 PM, Feihong Hsu <hsu.feihong at yahoo.com> wrote:

> The fake methods just emulate simple method calls that you can make on the
> real widgets. For example,

I think Aaron had made a suggestion for forwarding methods you hadn't
faked out yet to the real widgets. But I couldn't hear the entire
conversation.



-- 
sheila

From asl2 at pobox.com  Sat Dec 15 18:44:17 2007
From: asl2 at pobox.com (Aaron Lav)
Date: Sat, 15 Dec 2007 12:44:17 -0500
Subject: [Chicago] wxpita
In-Reply-To: <a68ced640712150855x29db85cg9409f43782044615@mail.gmail.com>
References: <a68ced640712141051o49c3638ak238050c3e4d40d69@mail.gmail.com>
	<127023.45537.qm@web34803.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
	<a68ced640712150855x29db85cg9409f43782044615@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <20071215174417.GA15056@panix.com>

On Sat, Dec 15, 2007 at 10:55:52AM -0600, sheila miguez wrote:
> On Dec 14, 2007 11:33 PM, Feihong Hsu <hsu.feihong at yahoo.com> wrote:
> 
> > The fake methods just emulate simple method calls that you can make on the
> > real widgets. For example,
> 
> I think Aaron had made a suggestion for forwarding methods you hadn't
> faked out yet to the real widgets. But I couldn't hear the entire
> conversation.

Apparently my message
(http://mail.python.org/pipermail/chicago/2007-December/003124.html)
came out blank: this not being heard seems to cross media boundaries,
sorry.

Anyway, the idea was to use __getattr__ (and __setattr__, if the wx
API requires it) to forward any calls which aren't part of the wxPita
API to a lazily created wx object.  So __getattr__ would look something like

  def __getattr__(self, attribute):
      if not self._wx_obj:
         self.create_wx_obj()
      return getattr(self._wx_obj, attribute)

(The delegating class needs to be new-style, since __getattr__ for
classic classes gets called for all attributes, not just unknown ones.
__setattr__ would need to check for known "fake class" attributes, and
not delegate them.   See http://docs.python.org/ref/attribute-access.html)

If there's a name clash between a fake object method and a wx method,
this delegator won't work, but such clashes seem likely to lead to
confusion anyway, and it'd be better to rename the fake object method.

With a simple delegator like this, it's possible for the abstraction
to leak (for example, if a wx method were to return a bound method,
it'd be bound to _wx_obj, not the fake object).

Also, since many wx objects can't be created without the wxApp object,
you'd also need to create the wxApp object as-needed in create_wx_obj().

There was also a brief discussion of how the arguments to the fake
object should be saved (string vs. dict), but that's orthogonal to
this issue.

     Aaron


From hsu.feihong at yahoo.com  Sat Dec 15 19:26:33 2007
From: hsu.feihong at yahoo.com (Feihong Hsu)
Date: Sat, 15 Dec 2007 10:26:33 -0800 (PST)
Subject: [Chicago] wxpita
In-Reply-To: <20071215174417.GA15056@panix.com>
Message-ID: <273490.54392.qm@web34802.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

As I said, I threw out the Fake Method stuff because the abstraction was too leaky. However, I do override __getattr__ for two reasons:

- Allow the user to keep using the top-level wrapper object as if it was a real widget.
- Store event binding information so that events can be bound at widget creation time

For those interested, this is the source code:

    def __getattr__(self, name):
        # If the widget has already been created, this wrapper object just
        # acts as its proxy:
        if self.widget:
           return getattr(self.widget, name)
        else:
            return EventRecorder(self, name)

This was not the way that it worked at the time that I gave the talk. But I changed it afterwards based on the feedback I got, and I think it's easier to use now. I guess the moral of the story is: if you run out of ideas for your project, give a talk at Chipy and just steal other people's ideas.

Cheers,
Feihong

Aaron Lav <asl2 at pobox.com> wrote: On Sat, Dec 15, 2007 at 10:55:52AM -0600, sheila miguez wrote:
> On Dec 14, 2007 11:33 PM, Feihong Hsu  wrote:
> 
> > The fake methods just emulate simple method calls that you can make on the
> > real widgets. For example,
> 
> I think Aaron had made a suggestion for forwarding methods you hadn't
> faked out yet to the real widgets. But I couldn't hear the entire
> conversation.

Apparently my message
(http://mail.python.org/pipermail/chicago/2007-December/003124.html)
came out blank: this not being heard seems to cross media boundaries,
sorry.

Anyway, the idea was to use __getattr__ (and __setattr__, if the wx
API requires it) to forward any calls which aren't part of the wxPita
API to a lazily created wx object.  So __getattr__ would look something like

  def __getattr__(self, attribute):
      if not self._wx_obj:
         self.create_wx_obj()
      return getattr(self._wx_obj, attribute)

(The delegating class needs to be new-style, since __getattr__ for
classic classes gets called for all attributes, not just unknown ones.
__setattr__ would need to check for known "fake class" attributes, and
not delegate them.   See http://docs.python.org/ref/attribute-access.html)

If there's a name clash between a fake object method and a wx method,
this delegator won't work, but such clashes seem likely to lead to
confusion anyway, and it'd be better to rename the fake object method.

With a simple delegator like this, it's possible for the abstraction
to leak (for example, if a wx method were to return a bound method,
it'd be bound to _wx_obj, not the fake object).

Also, since many wx objects can't be created without the wxApp object,
you'd also need to create the wxApp object as-needed in create_wx_obj().

There was also a brief discussion of how the arguments to the fake
object should be saved (string vs. dict), but that's orthogonal to
this issue.

     Aaron

_______________________________________________
Chicago mailing list
Chicago at python.org
http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago


       
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From hsu.feihong at yahoo.com  Sat Dec 15 21:42:52 2007
From: hsu.feihong at yahoo.com (Feihong Hsu)
Date: Sat, 15 Dec 2007 12:42:52 -0800 (PST)
Subject: [Chicago] wxPita released on Google Code
In-Reply-To: <273490.54392.qm@web34802.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <456301.41279.qm@web34815.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

Hi everyone, I put my wxPita library on Google Code. You can find it at:

http://wxpita.googlecode.com/

Cheers,
Feihong


       
---------------------------------
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From bray at sent.com  Sat Dec 15 23:46:28 2007
From: bray at sent.com (Brian Ray)
Date: Sat, 15 Dec 2007 16:46:28 -0600
Subject: [Chicago] xkcd on Python
In-Reply-To: <20071211152358.GA22391@furrr.two14.net>
References: <5aaed53f0712042224w5b7b0d95u3d8ca6a5f571f125@mail.gmail.com>
	<fccecd3a0712091943v45f55c43obaa7eb1c0871d362@mail.gmail.com>
	<1197306139.24763.1225788471@webmail.messagingengine.com>
	<361b27370712101048k61818651s4c125fbc686f8385@mail.gmail.com>
	<20071211152358.GA22391@furrr.two14.net>
Message-ID: <795C1C68-C634-4754-A5D4-D5F09B40148A@sent.com>


On Dec 11, 2007, at 9:23 AM, Martin Maney wrote:

> On Mon, Dec 10, 2007 at 12:48:15PM -0600, Atul Varma wrote:
>> On Dec 10, 2007 11:02 AM, <bray at sent.com> wrote:
>>> On Sun, 9 Dec 2007 21:43:29 -0600, "Brian W. Fitzpatrick" said:
>>>> Donald Knuth came and asked "What's the name of my O(log log n)  
>>>> search
>>>> algorithm?"
>>>
>>> He must have meant O(n log n) for QuickSort right? What was his  
>>> answer?
>>
>> He tactfully evaded the question.
>
> The actual expression in the cartoon was O(n log(log n)).  Just sayin'


Yeah probably heap sort? I have seen it written in O(n log log n),  
also. But like most of this stuff you need TeX to even typeset  
correctly.

I am sure Google hope's I share the video:

<http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zJOS0sV2a24>

He has a candid and interesting demeanor. His online repertoire is  
certainly nerdy and funny--often times in a tongue in cheek, inside  
joke sort of way. I did not read regularly or even take note until  
about a dozen people sent me the anti-gravity comic the other day. I  
noticed the PyCon organizer list is taking note, also.


Brian Ray
bray at sent.com
http://kazavoo.com/blog

From zibble at gmail.com  Sun Dec 16 02:07:22 2007
From: zibble at gmail.com (Scott Zibble)
Date: Sat, 15 Dec 2007 19:07:22 -0600
Subject: [Chicago] January venue?
In-Reply-To: <3096c19d0712140431l6f1021cdrbb5ca53bf3a1429b@mail.gmail.com>
References: <47620E15.6080700@colorstudy.com>
	<3096c19d0712140431l6f1021cdrbb5ca53bf3a1429b@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <d5f4f5590712151707g51c76d27m92201ee25fe743f7@mail.gmail.com>

My work account apparently thinks Chipy is spam.  Hrmph.

Performics is definitely an option.  Although if Robert Zeh is excited about
trying to get his office to host, that might be good for Chipy, too...

On Dec 14, 2007 6:31 AM, Chris McAvoy <chris.mcavoy at gmail.com> wrote:

> I'll check with Scott Zibble (via cc on this email, efficiency!) to
> see if he's on for Performics.
>
> Chris
>
> On Dec 13, 2007 11:01 PM, Ian Bicking <ianb at colorstudy.com> wrote:
> > Lets get ahead of the game.  Anyone have a venue for January?
> >
> > --
> > Ian Bicking : ianb at colorstudy.com : http://blog.ianbicking.org
> > _______________________________________________
> > Chicago mailing list
> > Chicago at python.org
> > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
> >
> _______________________________________________
> Chicago mailing list
> Chicago at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>
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From robert.a.zeh at gmail.com  Sun Dec 16 03:59:21 2007
From: robert.a.zeh at gmail.com (Robert Zeh)
Date: Sat, 15 Dec 2007 20:59:21 -0600
Subject: [Chicago] January venue?
In-Reply-To: <3B29724C-6025-449C-AB73-EC40102FFE79@sent.com>
References: <47620E15.6080700@colorstudy.com>
	<77B48D6A-6B59-487E-B174-D756397F5DAD@gmail.com>
	<3B29724C-6025-449C-AB73-EC40102FFE79@sent.com>
Message-ID: <6BBC8743-A8A8-4E25-AD0B-72D505112B00@gmail.com>



On Dec 15, 2007, at 7:03 AM, Brian Ray wrote:

>
> On Dec 14, 2007, at 8:31 PM, Robert Zeh wrote:
>
>> I might be able to work something out downtown (by the Chicago Board
>> of Trade) with my company  - GETCO.
>
>
> GETCO is another one of those financial organizations who frequently
> look for Python talent, but are not sure what they are looking for--
> frequently annoying many hard core Python advocates. Bring us in for a
> software engineering job and then telling us its a QA job once we get
> half way through a day long interview ; )  But, I did not want this to
> turn us off..

Argh.  My apologies for the aggravation.  Do you mind if I forward  
this on internally at work?  I hate it when these things happen and  
feedback helps.

<snip>
> I have been to GETCO offices and met ten or so developers, in
> August.   They have a really nice office space in BOT.  They appeared
> to have a conference room large enough to hold the 20-30 we are
> getting. They guys I met at GETCO, several had some pretty solid
> Python background-esp. in QA testing and build automation (SCONS). A
> couple of guys have attended ChiPy meetings in the past--at Monadnock
> IIRC.  Overall, I pretty interesting group of guys and they probably
> have a lot more to contribute on how they use Python.


<snip>

Thanks for the compliments.  I can't promise anyone will be there  
other than (decidedly uninteresting) me, and I can't even promise the  
same meeting room.  Actually, I can't promise anything until after I  
push for things on Monday --- the date would be Thursday January 10th,  
right?  I'll try to send something out Monday night about our hosting  
availability.

Robert


From bray at sent.com  Sun Dec 16 04:48:56 2007
From: bray at sent.com (Brian Ray)
Date: Sat, 15 Dec 2007 21:48:56 -0600
Subject: [Chicago] January venue?
In-Reply-To: <6BBC8743-A8A8-4E25-AD0B-72D505112B00@gmail.com>
References: <47620E15.6080700@colorstudy.com>
	<77B48D6A-6B59-487E-B174-D756397F5DAD@gmail.com>
	<3B29724C-6025-449C-AB73-EC40102FFE79@sent.com>
	<6BBC8743-A8A8-4E25-AD0B-72D505112B00@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <7B028E95-981E-4ECE-9035-4CACD913E89E@sent.com>


On Dec 15, 2007, at 8:59 PM, Robert Zeh wrote:
>
> On Dec 15, 2007, at 7:03 AM, Brian Ray wrote:
>
>>
>> On Dec 14, 2007, at 8:31 PM, Robert Zeh wrote:
>>
>>> I might be able to work something out downtown (by the Chicago Board
>>> of Trade) with my company  - GETCO.
>>
>>
>> GETCO is another one of those financial organizations who frequently
>> look for Python talent, but are not sure what they are looking for--
>> frequently annoying many hard core Python advocates. Bring us in  
>> for a
>> software engineering job and then telling us its a QA job once we get
>> half way through a day long interview ; )  But, I did not want this  
>> to
>> turn us off..
>
> Argh.  My apologies for the aggravation.  Do you mind if I forward
> this on internally at work?  I hate it when these things happen and
> feedback helps.
>

Sure, if you think it will help.  Searching the ChiPy archives, you  
will see some solicitations looking for Python talent. Often times  
these come from recruiters. The one big problem I have had was trying  
to figure out what these jobs entail. I am an employer now and am also  
look for talent. Now I feel a bit jaded about working with recruiters  
for this reason. OTOH, extremely talented Python programmers are worth  
their weight in gold, can be hard to find, and some recruiters do good  
legitimate recruiting--others are sharks.

Even on the Trade Industry side, there are different levels of  
legitimate. I was just trying to clarify that beyond the HR issues  
that may exist everywhere, GETCO seems good.  And the fact that there  
is someone there even trying to host, is a really good sign ;)


> <snip>
>> I have been to GETCO offices and met ten or so developers, in
>> August.   They have a really nice office space in BOT.  They appeared
>> to have a conference room large enough to hold the 20-30 we are
>> getting. They guys I met at GETCO, several had some pretty solid
>> Python background-esp. in QA testing and build automation (SCONS). A
>> couple of guys have attended ChiPy meetings in the past--at Monadnock
>> IIRC.  Overall, I pretty interesting group of guys and they probably
>> have a lot more to contribute on how they use Python.
>
>
> <snip>
>
> Thanks for the compliments.  I can't promise anyone will be there
> other than (decidedly uninteresting) me, and I can't even promise the
> same meeting room.  Actually, I can't promise anything until after I
> push for things on Monday --- the date would be Thursday January 10th,
> right?  I'll try to send something out Monday night about our hosting
> availability.


Didn't you work on Boost? Sounds interesting to me.Yes its the 10th.   
I like the idea of finding new and exciting venues. OTOH, I also  
really like the places where we have already been.  I would certainly  
ask about hosting and get back to us.

Brian Ray
bray at sent.com
http://kazavoo.com/blog

From clint at bluehatsecurity.com  Sat Dec 15 20:32:28 2007
From: clint at bluehatsecurity.com (Clint Laskowski)
Date: Sat, 15 Dec 2007 13:32:28 -0600
Subject: [Chicago] wxpita
In-Reply-To: <273490.54392.qm@web34802.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
References: <273490.54392.qm@web34802.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <47642BCC.7080704@bluehatsecurity.com>

Is there any reference to wxPita on the web? I searched and didn't find 
anything. I wasn't at the meeting.

-- Clint

Feihong Hsu wrote:
> As I said, I threw out the Fake Method stuff because the abstraction 
> was too leaky. However, I do override __getattr__ for two reasons:
>
> - Allow the user to keep using the top-level wrapper object as if it 
> was a real widget.
> - Store event binding information so that events can be bound at 
> widget creation time
>
> For those interested, this is the source code:
>
>     def __getattr__(self, name):
>         # If the widget has already been created, this wrapper object just
>         # acts as its proxy:
>         if self.widget:
>            return getattr(self.widget, name)
>         else:
>             return EventRecorder(self, name)
>
> This was not the way that it worked at the time that I gave the talk. 
> But I changed it afterwards based on the feedback I got, and I think 
> it's easier to use now. I guess the moral of the story is: if you run 
> out of ideas for your project, give a talk at Chipy and just steal 
> other people's ideas.
>
> Cheers,
> Feihong
>
> */Aaron Lav <asl2 at pobox.com>/* wrote:
>
>     On Sat, Dec 15, 2007 at 10:55:52AM -0600, sheila miguez wrote:
>     > On Dec 14, 2007 11:33 PM, Feihong Hsu wrote:
>     >
>     > > The fake methods just emulate simple method calls that you can
>     make on the
>     > > real widgets. For example,
>     >
>     > I think Aaron had made a suggestion for forwarding methods you
>     hadn't
>     > faked out yet to the real widgets. But I couldn't hear the entire
>     > conversation.
>
>     Apparently my message
>     (http://mail.python.org/pipermail/chicago/2007-December/003124.html)
>     came out blank: this not being heard seems to cross media boundaries,
>     sorry.
>
>     Anyway, the idea was to use __getattr__ (and __setattr__, if the wx
>     API requires it) to forward any calls which aren't part of the wxPita
>     API to a lazily created wx object. So __getattr__ would look
>     something like
>
>     def __getattr__(self, attribute):
>     if not self._wx_obj:
>     self.create_wx_obj()
>     return getattr(self._wx_obj, attribute)
>
>     (The delegating class needs to be new-style, since __getattr__ for
>     classic classes gets called for all attributes, not just unknown ones.
>     __setattr__ would need to check for known "fake class" attributes, and
>     not delegate them. See
>     http://docs.python.org/ref/attribute-access.html)
>
>     If there's a name clash between a fake object method and a wx method,
>     this delegator won't work, but such clashes seem likely to lead to
>     confusion anyway, and it'd be better to rename the fake object method.
>
>     With a simple delegator like this, it's possible for the abstraction
>     to leak (for example, if a wx method were to return a bound method,
>     it'd be bound to _wx_obj, not the fake object).
>
>     Also, since many wx objects can't be created without the wxApp object,
>     you'd also need to create the wxApp object as-needed in
>     create_wx_obj().
>
>     There was also a brief discussion of how the arguments to the fake
>     object should be saved (string vs. dict), but that's orthogonal to
>     this issue.
>
>     Aaron
>
>     _______________________________________________
>     Chicago mailing list
>     Chicago at python.org
>     http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Be a better friend, newshound, and know-it-all with Yahoo! Mobile. Try 
> it now. 
> <http://us.rd.yahoo.com/evt=51733/*http://mobile.yahoo.com/;_ylt=Ahu06i62sR8HDtDypao8Wcj9tAcJ%20> 
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
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> Chicago at python.org
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From clint at bluehatsecurity.com  Mon Dec 17 01:21:28 2007
From: clint at bluehatsecurity.com (Clint Laskowski)
Date: Sun, 16 Dec 2007 18:21:28 -0600
Subject: [Chicago] wxpita
In-Reply-To: <127023.45537.qm@web34803.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
References: <127023.45537.qm@web34803.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <4765C108.2030003@bluehatsecurity.com>

I've started to play with wxPita a bit and it is very cool. Is there 
anything written up on it yet in terms of simple documentation?

How do I join the project or add to the wiki for it? I've started 
writing some notes and I'd be glad to add them as the start of 
documentation, if there is interest.

-- Clint

Feihong Hsu wrote:
> I'm not 100% sure I understand your question, but I'll take a stab at 
> an answer.
>
> The core of wxPita's API is the layout and event binding stuff. All 
> that happens outside of wxPython -- although the names of the classes 
> are the same, no widgets are being created when you're using that part 
> of the framework.
>
> Since the wxPita classes aren't real widgets, you can't treat them as 
> if they were. So I came up with two special ways to modify the state 
> of the GUI right after the widgets are initialized:
>
> - Fake methods
> - Init callbacks
>
> The fake methods just emulate simple method calls that you can make on 
> the real widgets. For example,
>
> f.combobox.SetSelection(0)
>
> Where f.combobox is a wrapper object for wx.ComboBox. This doesn't 
> execute anything, it just saves the name of the method and its 
> arguments for later, to be invoked right after the real widget is created.
>
> The Init callbacks look like this:
>
> @f.Init
> def _():
>     for s in ['cat', 'bat', 'dog', 'foo', 'box']:
>         f.combobox.Append(s)
>
>     # You can't use a Fake Method for this because wx.Font
>     # objects can't be instantiated until the wx.App object has been 
> created:
>     f.combobox.SetFont(wx.Font(14, wx.SWISS, wx.NORMAL, wx.NORMAL))
>
> The Init callback is invoked right after widget creation, but the 
> difference is that by that time, the wrapper objects have been 
> replaced by the real widgets. So, whereas f.combobox was a wrapper 
> before, inside the Init callback it's a real live wxPython widget. So 
> you can do anything inside the Init callback that you can normally do 
> in wxPython.
>
> Incidentally, I decided to do away with the Fake Method approach. It's 
> too magical and weird. I also changed the Init callback slightly from 
> how it was in yesterday's presentation (it doesn't accept a parameter 
> anymore, and it can only be used on container wrappers).
>
> The comments and questions I got were excellent; they really helped me 
> settle certain design decisions that were nagging me.  In particular, 
> the event binding API I devised with was quite ugly, but after fooling 
> around for a while I finally came up with something halfway decent:
>
> @f.button.button_clicked
> def onclick(evt):
>     print 'You clicked on', evt.EventObject.GetLabel()
>
> @f.combobox.combobox_selected
> def _(evt)
>     print 'You selected', evt.EventObject.GetSelectionString()
>
> f.button2.button_clicked.register(onclick)
>
> Again, I'm still using the wxPython names for everything, except now I 
> provide the option of using the event type IDs, which are generally 
> more descriptive than the the event binder names.
>
> I will see if I can upload everything to Google Code over the weekend. 
> The reason I didn't today was because I got sidetracked by data 
> binding, but I can't figure that out very quickly so I'll just check 
> in what I have now.
>
> Cheers,
> Feihong
>
> */sheila miguez <shekay at pobox.com>/* wrote:
>
>     Feihong's talk was fun. I did not hear all of the suggestion about
>     delegating things back to the wxWidgets. Could someone give a
>     synopsis?
>
>     -- 
>     sheila
>     _______________________________________________
>     Chicago mailing list
>     Chicago at python.org
>     http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Never miss a thing. Make Yahoo your homepage. 
> <http://us.rd.yahoo.com/evt=51438/*http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> _______________________________________________
> Chicago mailing list
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> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>
>
>
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>
> This message was checked by NOD32 antivirus system.
> http://www.eset.com
>   
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From bray at sent.com  Mon Dec 17 03:52:45 2007
From: bray at sent.com (Brian Ray)
Date: Sun, 16 Dec 2007 20:52:45 -0600
Subject: [Chicago] wxpita
In-Reply-To: <47642BCC.7080704@bluehatsecurity.com>
References: <273490.54392.qm@web34802.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
	<47642BCC.7080704@bluehatsecurity.com>
Message-ID: <341B48AB-7912-41EF-A095-0F9178432D33@sent.com>


On Dec 15, 2007, at 1:32 PM, Clint Laskowski wrote:

> Is there any reference to wxPita on the web? I searched and didn't  
> find anything. I wasn't at the meeting.



http://wxpita.googlecode.com/

I am also taking a look at it. I am no stranger to wx. Often times the  
SWIG'd GUI lib shows some un-pythonics--probably do to the porting.  
Nevertheless, wx is a awesome and huge GUI library. I started with the  
C++ and just recently within the last year or so started getting into  
wxPython. You almost have to learn the C++ way first or you will get  
frustrated. I recall wishing someone would make it more pythonic.  
Maybe wxpita is it. Wish I was there to see the demo.

-- Brian

From robert.a.zeh at gmail.com  Tue Dec 18 03:04:23 2007
From: robert.a.zeh at gmail.com (Robert Zeh)
Date: Mon, 17 Dec 2007 20:04:23 -0600
Subject: [Chicago] January venue?
In-Reply-To: <7B028E95-981E-4ECE-9035-4CACD913E89E@sent.com>
References: <47620E15.6080700@colorstudy.com>
	<77B48D6A-6B59-487E-B174-D756397F5DAD@gmail.com>
	<3B29724C-6025-449C-AB73-EC40102FFE79@sent.com>
	<6BBC8743-A8A8-4E25-AD0B-72D505112B00@gmail.com>
	<7B028E95-981E-4ECE-9035-4CACD913E89E@sent.com>
Message-ID: <7BB56CF4-69DB-45F6-A85C-17434FE51751@gmail.com>

GETCO can host.  I will be working out the details over the next few  
days in terms of exact location, making sure there is a video  
projection system, etc.  The only caveat is that we probably won't  
have wi-fi.

On Dec 15, 2007, at 9:48 PM, Brian Ray wrote:
<snip>
>
> Didn't you work on Boost? Sounds interesting to me.Yes its the 10th.
> I like the idea of finding new and exciting venues. OTOH, I also
> really like the places where we have already been.  I would certainly
> ask about hosting and get back to us.
>
> Brian Ray
> bray at sent.com
> http://kazavoo.com/blog
> _______________________________________________


Yes, I've gotten some patches into boost over the past few years.   
Nothing major.  I also wrote a SCCS -> Subversion Python script that's  
gotten some interesting use --- I never expected to hear from someone  
at the U.N. after writing that.

Robert


From tcp at mac.com  Tue Dec 18 03:26:08 2007
From: tcp at mac.com (Ted Pollari)
Date: Mon, 17 Dec 2007 18:26:08 -0800
Subject: [Chicago] January venue?
In-Reply-To: <7BB56CF4-69DB-45F6-A85C-17434FE51751@gmail.com>
References: <47620E15.6080700@colorstudy.com>
	<77B48D6A-6B59-487E-B174-D756397F5DAD@gmail.com>
	<3B29724C-6025-449C-AB73-EC40102FFE79@sent.com>
	<6BBC8743-A8A8-4E25-AD0B-72D505112B00@gmail.com>
	<7B028E95-981E-4ECE-9035-4CACD913E89E@sent.com>
	<7BB56CF4-69DB-45F6-A85C-17434FE51751@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <371BA0E0-22B7-4BCF-8D4C-79AD22C73A6C@mac.com>


On Dec 17, 2007, at 6:04 PM, Robert Zeh wrote:

> GETCO can host.  I will be working out the details over the next few
> days in terms of exact location, making sure there is a video
> projection system, etc.  The only caveat is that we probably won't
> have wi-fi.


Can you provide wired access?  If so, I'm sure someone could bring a  
wireless access point.

If not, IMHO, it reduces the attractiveness of the venue to not have  
net access --  but, honestly, I don't want to offend given your  
gracious offer of hosting...and I certainly don't speak for anyone but  
me =)

-ted


From bray at sent.com  Tue Dec 18 03:51:04 2007
From: bray at sent.com (Brian Ray)
Date: Mon, 17 Dec 2007 20:51:04 -0600
Subject: [Chicago] January venue?
In-Reply-To: <371BA0E0-22B7-4BCF-8D4C-79AD22C73A6C@mac.com>
References: <47620E15.6080700@colorstudy.com>
	<77B48D6A-6B59-487E-B174-D756397F5DAD@gmail.com>
	<3B29724C-6025-449C-AB73-EC40102FFE79@sent.com>
	<6BBC8743-A8A8-4E25-AD0B-72D505112B00@gmail.com>
	<7B028E95-981E-4ECE-9035-4CACD913E89E@sent.com>
	<7BB56CF4-69DB-45F6-A85C-17434FE51751@gmail.com>
	<371BA0E0-22B7-4BCF-8D4C-79AD22C73A6C@mac.com>
Message-ID: <91B848CF-DA61-425A-B356-BC74BF111FE6@sent.com>


On Dec 17, 2007, at 8:26 PM, Ted Pollari wrote:

> On Dec 17, 2007, at 6:04 PM, Robert Zeh wrote:
>
>> GETCO can host.  I will be working out the details over the next few
>> days in terms of exact location, making sure there is a video
>> projection system, etc.  The only caveat is that we probably won't
>> have wi-fi.
>
>
> Can you provide wired access?  If so, I'm sure someone could bring a
> wireless access point.
>
> If not, IMHO, it reduces the attractiveness of the venue to not have
> net access --  but, honestly, I don't want to offend given your
> gracious offer of hosting...and I certainly don't speak for anyone but
> me =)


What's the big deal about the internet anyway?

But seriously, there is a good chance you can hop onto someone's  
anywhere in the loop.  And if not, so what? It (the internets) seems  
to distract from the presentations and conversation.

Just my $.02.

Can we book GETCO this month and Performics next? What is Performics  
flexibility on this matter, Scott?

Brian Ray
bray at sent.com
http://kazavoo.com/blog

From ianb at colorstudy.com  Tue Dec 18 04:23:19 2007
From: ianb at colorstudy.com (Ian Bicking)
Date: Mon, 17 Dec 2007 21:23:19 -0600
Subject: [Chicago] January venue?
In-Reply-To: <371BA0E0-22B7-4BCF-8D4C-79AD22C73A6C@mac.com>
References: <47620E15.6080700@colorstudy.com>	<77B48D6A-6B59-487E-B174-D756397F5DAD@gmail.com>	<3B29724C-6025-449C-AB73-EC40102FFE79@sent.com>	<6BBC8743-A8A8-4E25-AD0B-72D505112B00@gmail.com>	<7B028E95-981E-4ECE-9035-4CACD913E89E@sent.com>	<7BB56CF4-69DB-45F6-A85C-17434FE51751@gmail.com>
	<371BA0E0-22B7-4BCF-8D4C-79AD22C73A6C@mac.com>
Message-ID: <47673D27.80502@colorstudy.com>

Ted Pollari wrote:
> On Dec 17, 2007, at 6:04 PM, Robert Zeh wrote:
> 
>> GETCO can host.  I will be working out the details over the next few
>> days in terms of exact location, making sure there is a video
>> projection system, etc.  The only caveat is that we probably won't
>> have wi-fi.
> 
> 
> Can you provide wired access?  If so, I'm sure someone could bring a  
> wireless access point.
> 
> If not, IMHO, it reduces the attractiveness of the venue to not have  
> net access --  but, honestly, I don't want to offend given your  
> gracious offer of hosting...and I certainly don't speak for anyone but  
> me =)

I don't think it's a big deal, so long as presenters know ahead of time 
and prepare accordingly.


-- 
Ian Bicking : ianb at colorstudy.com : http://blog.ianbicking.org

From tcp at mac.com  Tue Dec 18 04:24:06 2007
From: tcp at mac.com (Ted Pollari)
Date: Mon, 17 Dec 2007 19:24:06 -0800
Subject: [Chicago] January venue?
In-Reply-To: <91B848CF-DA61-425A-B356-BC74BF111FE6@sent.com>
References: <47620E15.6080700@colorstudy.com>
	<77B48D6A-6B59-487E-B174-D756397F5DAD@gmail.com>
	<3B29724C-6025-449C-AB73-EC40102FFE79@sent.com>
	<6BBC8743-A8A8-4E25-AD0B-72D505112B00@gmail.com>
	<7B028E95-981E-4ECE-9035-4CACD913E89E@sent.com>
	<7BB56CF4-69DB-45F6-A85C-17434FE51751@gmail.com>
	<371BA0E0-22B7-4BCF-8D4C-79AD22C73A6C@mac.com>
	<91B848CF-DA61-425A-B356-BC74BF111FE6@sent.com>
Message-ID: <CE979466-00D4-45AD-8750-B2CADA02799C@mac.com>


On Dec 17, 2007, at 6:51 PM, Brian Ray wrote:


> What's the big deal about the internet anyway?
>
> But seriously, there is a good chance you can hop onto someone's
> anywhere in the loop.  And if not, so what? It (the internets) seems
> to distract from the presentations and conversation.



Because there's always something that's forgotten but is internet  
accessible, because there are always questions that can be answered  
much much more quickly with net access, because someone will  
inevitably show something really cool that will spawn conversations  
and downloads, because sometimes some of us need to do some work  
(albeit quietly) while the meeting goes on, because some of us are  
addicted, because some of us need bus schedules, because some of us  
don't have iPhones, because it settles arguments about who's right and  
who's wrong, because it starts arguments...wait, um...because, because  
of the wonderful things it does.


-ted

From bray at sent.com  Tue Dec 18 04:53:22 2007
From: bray at sent.com (Brian Ray)
Date: Mon, 17 Dec 2007 21:53:22 -0600
Subject: [Chicago] January venue?
In-Reply-To: <CE979466-00D4-45AD-8750-B2CADA02799C@mac.com>
References: <47620E15.6080700@colorstudy.com>
	<77B48D6A-6B59-487E-B174-D756397F5DAD@gmail.com>
	<3B29724C-6025-449C-AB73-EC40102FFE79@sent.com>
	<6BBC8743-A8A8-4E25-AD0B-72D505112B00@gmail.com>
	<7B028E95-981E-4ECE-9035-4CACD913E89E@sent.com>
	<7BB56CF4-69DB-45F6-A85C-17434FE51751@gmail.com>
	<371BA0E0-22B7-4BCF-8D4C-79AD22C73A6C@mac.com>
	<91B848CF-DA61-425A-B356-BC74BF111FE6@sent.com>
	<CE979466-00D4-45AD-8750-B2CADA02799C@mac.com>
Message-ID: <F1D67DC9-24A8-4C04-9058-C06105D7A5E1@sent.com>


On Dec 17, 2007, at 9:24 PM, Ted Pollari wrote:

> On Dec 17, 2007, at 6:51 PM, Brian Ray wrote:
>
>
>> What's the big deal about the internet anyway?
>>
>> But seriously, there is a good chance you can hop onto someone's
>> anywhere in the loop.  And if not, so what? It (the internets) seems
>> to distract from the presentations and conversation.
>
>
>
> Because there's always something that's forgotten but is internet
> accessible, because there are always questions that can be answered
> much much more quickly with net access, because someone will
> inevitably show something really cool that will spawn conversations
> and downloads, because sometimes some of us need to do some work
> (albeit quietly) while the meeting goes on, because some of us are
> addicted, because some of us need bus schedules, because some of us
> don't have iPhones, because it settles arguments about who's right and
> who's wrong, because it starts arguments...wait, um...because, because
> of the wonderful things it does.


Point in case!


Brian Ray
bray at sent.com
http://kazavoo.com/blog

From cwebber at imagescape.com  Tue Dec 18 17:36:06 2007
From: cwebber at imagescape.com (Christopher Allan Webber)
Date: Tue, 18 Dec 2007 10:36:06 -0600
Subject: [Chicago] Conversation topics for January
Message-ID: <6yd4t4hseh.fsf@imagepc03.rd.imagescape.com>

So I'm starting a separate thread to discuss topics for January.  Not
really the same conversation as the venue, so..

I've claimed dibs on presenting this month since I forefitted
last month (okay, I needed some more time to prepare the animation
system too, but..)

Last month it was a totally theoretical animation system.  But this
month it's no longer theoretical... I proposed using the animation
system, and I'm happy to say that not only did it run successfully,
but (partly because of it,) I am now engaged ;)

So, conversation topic #1 for next month:
 - PyStage, an animation framework (or, How To Propose To Your Fiance
   Using Python)

(..Yes, the presentation will be done entirely in PyStage too ;)

From garrett at mojave-corp.com  Tue Dec 18 17:53:21 2007
From: garrett at mojave-corp.com (Garrett Smith)
Date: Tue, 18 Dec 2007 10:53:21 -0600 (CST)
Subject: [Chicago] Conversation topics for January
In-Reply-To: <6yd4t4hseh.fsf@imagepc03.rd.imagescape.com>
Message-ID: <30710437.641641197996801184.JavaMail.root@noc-106.smedia.info>

I'm in for the deferred CouchDB talk!


----- Original Message -----
From: "Christopher Allan Webber" <cwebber at imagescape.com>
To: "ChiPy" <chicago at python.org>
Sent: Tuesday, December 18, 2007 10:36:06 AM (GMT-0600) America/Chicago
Subject: [Chicago] Conversation topics for January

So I'm starting a separate thread to discuss topics for January.  Not
really the same conversation as the venue, so..

I've claimed dibs on presenting this month since I forefitted
last month (okay, I needed some more time to prepare the animation
system too, but..)

Last month it was a totally theoretical animation system.  But this
month it's no longer theoretical... I proposed using the animation
system, and I'm happy to say that not only did it run successfully,
but (partly because of it,) I am now engaged ;)

So, conversation topic #1 for next month:
 - PyStage, an animation framework (or, How To Propose To Your Fiance
   Using Python)

(..Yes, the presentation will be done entirely in PyStage too ;)
_______________________________________________
Chicago mailing list
Chicago at python.org
http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago


From mandric at gmail.com  Tue Dec 18 17:58:47 2007
From: mandric at gmail.com (Milan Andric)
Date: Tue, 18 Dec 2007 10:58:47 -0600
Subject: [Chicago] PyCon Things to do
Message-ID: <536089f30712180858j1814a73ar6b09e7c0e65f512d@mail.gmail.com>

I was looking at PyCon yesterday, specifically the "Explore Chicago" section.
http://us.pycon.org/2008/chicago/explore/

I didn't see Segway Tours!

-- 
Milan

From ianb at colorstudy.com  Tue Dec 18 18:24:03 2007
From: ianb at colorstudy.com (Ian Bicking)
Date: Tue, 18 Dec 2007 11:24:03 -0600
Subject: [Chicago] PyCon Things to do
In-Reply-To: <536089f30712180858j1814a73ar6b09e7c0e65f512d@mail.gmail.com>
References: <536089f30712180858j1814a73ar6b09e7c0e65f512d@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <47680233.9060808@colorstudy.com>

Milan Andric wrote:
> I was looking at PyCon yesterday, specifically the "Explore Chicago" section.
> http://us.pycon.org/2008/chicago/explore/

Hmm... I feel like we should have more of a Blue Line focus in the 
Chicago material.  We should have stuff listed in Wicker Park, Logan 
Square, and... those neighborhoods past that about which I know very 
little ;)  Anyway, those areas are really quite a bit closer than downtown.

I wish I knew those areas better though, so I could add some things myself.

-- 
Ian Bicking : ianb at colorstudy.com : http://blog.ianbicking.org

From hsu.feihong at yahoo.com  Wed Dec 19 04:08:58 2007
From: hsu.feihong at yahoo.com (Feihong Hsu)
Date: Tue, 18 Dec 2007 19:08:58 -0800 (PST)
Subject: [Chicago] wxpita
In-Reply-To: <4765C108.2030003@bluehatsecurity.com>
Message-ID: <64382.70936.qm@web34802.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

I think to join the project you have to get a Google Code account (or maybe you just need a Gmail account), and you go to the project page (http://wxpita.googlecode.com), and click the 'Join project' link. Then I, as the Project Owner, have to approve you as a Project Member.

Once you are a Project Member you should be able to edit the wiki and otherwise muck around. I would love some help getting the documentation written. Or writing simple example programs that are bundled into the examples.zip download.

BTW, I finally added the data binding stuff into the latest release of wxPita. It integrates with an event-driven programming framework called Trellis, which is written by Philip J. Eby. If people are interested, I can do a two-for-one talk about Trellis and wxPita/wxPython. Since I already gave a talk this month, if January is full then I'll wait until February.

Cheers,
Feihong

Clint Laskowski <clint at bluehatsecurity.com> wrote:           I've started to play with wxPita a bit and it is very cool. Is there anything written up on it yet in terms of simple documentation?
 
 How do I join the project or add to the wiki for it? I've started writing some notes and I'd be glad to add them as the start of documentation, if there is interest.
 
 -- Clint
 
 Feihong Hsu wrote: I'm not 100% sure I understand your question, but I'll take a stab at an answer.
   
 The core of wxPita's API is the layout and event binding stuff. All that happens outside of wxPython -- although the names of the classes are the same, no widgets are being created when you're using that part of the framework. 
   
 Since the wxPita classes aren't real widgets, you can't treat them as if they were. So I came up with two special ways to modify the state of the GUI right after the widgets are initialized:
   
 - Fake methods
 - Init callbacks
   
 The fake methods just emulate simple method calls that you can make on the real widgets. For example,
   
 f.combobox.SetSelection(0)
   
 Where f.combobox is a wrapper object for wx.ComboBox. This doesn't execute anything, it just saves the name of the method and its arguments for later, to be invoked right after the real widget is created.
   
 The Init callbacks look like this:
   
 @f.Init
 def _():
     for s in ['cat', 'bat', 'dog', 'foo', 'box']:
         f.combobox.Append(s)
   
     # You can't use a Fake Method for this because wx.Font
     # objects can't be instantiated until the wx.App object has been created:
     f.combobox.SetFont(wx.Font(14, wx.SWISS, wx.NORMAL, wx.NORMAL))
   
 The Init callback is invoked right after widget creation, but the difference is that by that time, the wrapper objects have been replaced by the real widgets. So, whereas f.combobox was a wrapper before, inside the Init callback it's a real live wxPython widget. So you can do anything inside the Init callback that you can normally do in wxPython.
   
 Incidentally, I decided to do away with the Fake Method approach. It's too magical and weird. I also changed the Init callback slightly from how it was in yesterday's presentation (it doesn't accept a parameter anymore, and it can only be used on container wrappers). 
   
 The comments and questions I got were excellent; they really helped me settle certain design decisions that were nagging me.  In particular, the event binding API I devised with was quite ugly, but after fooling around for a while I finally came up with something halfway decent:
   
 @f.button.button_clicked
 def onclick(evt):
     print 'You clicked on', evt.EventObject.GetLabel()
   
 @f.combobox.combobox_selected
 def _(evt)
     print 'You selected', evt.EventObject.GetSelectionString()
   
 f.button2.button_clicked.register(onclick)
   
 Again, I'm still using the wxPython names for everything, except now I provide the option of using the event type IDs, which are generally more descriptive than the the event binder names.
   
 I will see if I can upload everything to Google Code over the weekend. The reason I didn't today was because I got sidetracked by data binding, but I can't figure that out very quickly so I'll just check in what I have now.
   
 Cheers,
 Feihong
   
   sheila miguez <shekay at pobox.com> wrote:    Feihong's talk was fun. I did not hear all of the suggestion about
 delegating things back to the wxWidgets. Could someone give a
 synopsis?
     
 -- 
 sheila
 _______________________________________________
 Chicago mailing list
 Chicago at python.org
 http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
      
    
   
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From hsu.feihong at yahoo.com  Wed Dec 19 04:20:52 2007
From: hsu.feihong at yahoo.com (Feihong Hsu)
Date: Tue, 18 Dec 2007 19:20:52 -0800 (PST)
Subject: [Chicago] Conversation topics for January
In-Reply-To: <6yd4t4hseh.fsf@imagepc03.rd.imagescape.com>
Message-ID: <781901.59126.qm@web34807.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

Congratulations! 

I'm looking forward to this presentation. 

Now that you've created a marriage proposal system, you should start working on PyMarriage. But don't let your spouse know that you're managing your interactions with her through a software framework, or you'll have to start working on PyDivorce.

Cheers,
Feihong

Christopher Allan Webber <cwebber at imagescape.com> wrote: So I'm starting a separate thread to discuss topics for January.  Not
really the same conversation as the venue, so..

I've claimed dibs on presenting this month since I forefitted
last month (okay, I needed some more time to prepare the animation
system too, but..)

Last month it was a totally theoretical animation system.  But this
month it's no longer theoretical... I proposed using the animation
system, and I'm happy to say that not only did it run successfully,
but (partly because of it,) I am now engaged ;)

So, conversation topic #1 for next month:
 - PyStage, an animation framework (or, How To Propose To Your Fiance
   Using Python)

(..Yes, the presentation will be done entirely in PyStage too ;)
_______________________________________________
Chicago mailing list
Chicago at python.org
http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago


       
---------------------------------
Never miss a thing.   Make Yahoo your homepage.
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From jason at multiply.org  Wed Dec 26 18:18:53 2007
From: jason at multiply.org (jason gessner)
Date: Wed, 26 Dec 2007 11:18:53 -0600
Subject: [Chicago] python 3 on leopard anyone?
Message-ID: <4e0c849b0712260918j21ea2a53ldb415a29b987cbd3@mail.gmail.com>

hi all.

i don't want to clutter the list with a bunch of compiler flag
questions, but has anyone had any luck getting ptyhon 3 alphas
compiled on leopard?  If so, please contact me off list (or if others
say they are interested on the list) with any notes you have on what
it took.

thanks!

-jason

From skip at pobox.com  Thu Dec 27 20:00:50 2007
From: skip at pobox.com (skip at pobox.com)
Date: Thu, 27 Dec 2007 13:00:50 -0600
Subject: [Chicago] OT: MacBook vs. MacBook Pro?
Message-ID: <18291.63074.40202.26574@montanaro.dyndns.org>


I've got a 15" Powerbook G4 that should be retired.  I'm thinking of
replacing it with a MacBook, but I'm wondering if I'll be disapppointed with
the smaller 13" screen.  The other major difference seems to be in the
graphics configuration (NVidia GeForce vs Intel GMA - where the Intel
processor eats up a chunk of main memory instead of having its own memory).
Anybody out there with a decent amount of experience with the two (more than
just fooling around at the Apple Store) with both systems have any opinions?
Bottom line, is the Pro worth the extra $1,000?

Thanks,

Skip Montanaro


From bray at sent.com  Thu Dec 27 20:34:18 2007
From: bray at sent.com (bray at sent.com)
Date: Thu, 27 Dec 2007 13:34:18 -0600
Subject: [Chicago] python 3 on leopard anyone?
In-Reply-To: <4e0c849b0712260918j21ea2a53ldb415a29b987cbd3@mail.gmail.com>
References: <4e0c849b0712260918j21ea2a53ldb415a29b987cbd3@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <1198784058.14842.1228450035@webmail.messagingengine.com>


On Wed, 26 Dec 2007 11:18:53 -0600, "jason gessner" <jason at multiply.org>
said:
> 
> i don't want to clutter the list with a bunch of compiler flag
> questions, but has anyone had any luck getting ptyhon 3 alphas
> compiled on leopard?  If so, please contact me off list (or if others
> say they are interested on the list) with any notes you have on what
> it took.
> 

I suggest you repost this question to the Python Mac SIG
http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/pythonmac-sig after searching
the archive.  There also is a #macpython and #pyobjc that are mostly
quiet (freenode).  I find #macdev probably the most useful. But
sometimes you will get scored for talking about things not Cocoa
oriented--its a thick skin channel.


Best,

Brian Ray

 






From bray at sent.com  Thu Dec 27 20:46:46 2007
From: bray at sent.com (bray at sent.com)
Date: Thu, 27 Dec 2007 13:46:46 -0600
Subject: [Chicago] OT: MacBook vs. MacBook Pro?
In-Reply-To: <18291.63074.40202.26574@montanaro.dyndns.org>
References: <18291.63074.40202.26574@montanaro.dyndns.org>
Message-ID: <1198784806.16849.1228450565@webmail.messagingengine.com>


On Thu, 27 Dec 2007 13:00:50 -0600, skip at pobox.com said:
> 
> I've got a 15" Powerbook G4 that should be retired.  I'm thinking of
> replacing it with a MacBook, but I'm wondering if I'll be disapppointed
> with
> the smaller 13" screen.  The other major difference seems to be in the
> graphics configuration (NVidia GeForce vs Intel GMA - where the Intel
> processor eats up a chunk of main memory instead of having its own
> memory).
> Anybody out there with a decent amount of experience with the two (more
> than
> just fooling around at the Apple Store) with both systems have any
> opinions?
> Bottom line, is the Pro worth the extra $1,000?
> 


Overall, I am quite pleased with the MacBook.

I have had both the MacBook and MacBook Pro.  For most common tasks, I
like the MacBook better. If I were to do some major image or video
editing, I would probably prefer the MacBook Pro.  Both cases, I
upgraded the RAM to 2GB. The Pro had a DVI slot, where I had to purchase
a Mini-DVI to DVI  The only times I have had problem with CPU
performance is when I run Parallels at the same time. I do not do a lot
of image editing on my laptop, but the standard iLife apps seem to
perform well. Photoshop and other Movie editing seems a little slow.

I did upgrade to Leopard on my MacBook and did not seem much performance
differences. If there were any, I think they were positive.

Regards,
Brian




From cstejerean at gmail.com  Fri Dec 28 01:09:53 2007
From: cstejerean at gmail.com (Cosmin Stejerean)
Date: Thu, 27 Dec 2007 18:09:53 -0600
Subject: [Chicago] OT: MacBook vs. MacBook Pro?
In-Reply-To: <18291.63074.40202.26574@montanaro.dyndns.org>
References: <18291.63074.40202.26574@montanaro.dyndns.org>
Message-ID: <276266d0712271609t7210af13sef39e7616dc2b022@mail.gmail.com>

About a year ago I was debating between the MacBook Pro and the MacBook. A
friend let me borrow his MacBook for a bit and after playing with it here is
what made me decide to buy a 15' MacBook Pro.
1. The keyboard on the 13'' Mac is (or at least seems) smaller which makes
it uncomfortable for me to type on.
2. I was used to 15'' laptop screen so the 13'' seemed too small
3. The MacBook used to get very hot (hotter than the MBP where the aluminum
case seems to help). Recent firmware upgrades have made this less of a
problem (and tools like FanControl)
4. I wanted a dedicated graphics card to be able to play some games if
necessary (then I found out there aren't that many games for OSX, I wasn't
willing to install XP and in the mean time I bought a PS3)

Here are some things that I've discovered since making the decision

1. The FireWire 800 port came in handy. I could not get my Western Digital
My Book Pro to connect using FireWire 400. Research seems to indicate it
might be some conflict with the iSight camera. Works flawlessly using
FireWire 800.

2. Coming from a 15.4 Dell with 1680x1050 I was disappointed with the
1440x900 resolution.
3. Buying a MBP is much better on Amazon. The price is lower, there are
usually rebates and you don't pay sales tax (which on a $2000 purchase makes
a significant difference).
4. Most of the time I'm at home and I have my laptop connected to an
external monitor, keyboard and mouse so the original concerns about size did
not seem very relevant in the long run.

In conclusion: If you don't intend to do graphics rendering or run a couple
of VM's at the same time the 13'' should suffice, but if you plan on using
the laptop itself (without an external keyboard/monitor) the size can make a
difference.

On Dec 27, 2007 1:00 PM, <skip at pobox.com> wrote:

>
> I've got a 15" Powerbook G4 that should be retired.  I'm thinking of
> replacing it with a MacBook, but I'm wondering if I'll be disapppointed
> with
> the smaller 13" screen.  The other major difference seems to be in the
> graphics configuration (NVidia GeForce vs Intel GMA - where the Intel
> processor eats up a chunk of main memory instead of having its own
> memory).
> Anybody out there with a decent amount of experience with the two (more
> than
> just fooling around at the Apple Store) with both systems have any
> opinions?
> Bottom line, is the Pro worth the extra $1,000?
>
> Thanks,
>
> Skip Montanaro
>
> _______________________________________________
> Chicago mailing list
> Chicago at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>



-- 
Cosmin Stejerean
http://blog.offbytwo.com
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From adam at spatialsystems.org  Fri Dec 28 02:50:03 2007
From: adam at spatialsystems.org (adam at spatialsystems.org)
Date: Thu, 27 Dec 2007 18:50:03 -0700
Subject: [Chicago] OT: MacBook vs. MacBook Pro?
Message-ID: <20071227185003.292eb6c930850de810cf35869bff7bc4.40b97ece85.wbe@email.secureserver.net>

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From pohara at virtualmotors.com  Fri Dec 28 03:21:29 2007
From: pohara at virtualmotors.com (Patrick O'Hara)
Date: Thu, 27 Dec 2007 20:21:29 -0600
Subject: [Chicago] OT:leopard vs   Tiger
References: <20071227185003.292eb6c930850de810cf35869bff7bc4.40b97ece85.wbe@email.secureserver.net>
Message-ID: <003c01c848f8$5bde1730$0300d20a@IBMUO5W0HB49M3>

Lepoard,
 hmmmmmmmmmmmmm, 
why does Lepoard fail to recognize  my wirless network  
unless i go upstairs  to my home offce  shut off COMCAST CABLE MODEM
unplug  router,
THEN WAIT 5 MINUTES AND POWER BACK ON?
Tiger  automatically  recognized my  wireless network and NEVER  WAS A PAIN LIKE THIS??

  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: adam at spatialsystems.org 
  To: The Chicago Python Users Group 
  Sent: Thursday, December 27, 2007 7:50 PM
  Subject: Re: [Chicago] OT: MacBook vs. MacBook Pro?


  Also, I noticed that TF.cgi was putting TRUE or FALSE in there with a newline, I just removed that.

  Thanks,
  Adam




    -------- Original Message --------
    Subject: Re: [Chicago] OT: MacBook vs. MacBook Pro?
    From: "Cosmin Stejerean" <cstejerean at gmail.com>
    Date: Thu, December 27, 2007 6:09 pm
    To: "The Chicago Python Users Group" <chicago at python.org>

    About a year ago I was debating between the MacBook Pro and the MacBook. A friend let me borrow his MacBook for a bit and after playing with it here is what made me decide to buy a 15' MacBook Pro. 


    1. The keyboard on the 13'' Mac is (or at least seems) smaller which makes it uncomfortable for me to type on.
    2. I was used to 15'' laptop screen so the 13'' seemed too small
    3. The MacBook used to get very hot (hotter than the MBP where the aluminum case seems to help). Recent firmware upgrades have made this less of a problem (and tools like FanControl)
    4. I wanted a dedicated graphics card to be able to play some games if necessary (then I found out there aren't that many games for OSX, I wasn't willing to install XP and in the mean time I bought a PS3) 


    Here are some things that I've discovered since making the decision 


    1. The FireWire 800 port came in handy. I could not get my Western Digital My Book Pro to connect using FireWire 400. Research seems to indicate it might be some conflict with the iSight camera. Works flawlessly using FireWire 800. 


    2. Coming from a 15.4 Dell with 1680x1050 I was disappointed with the 1440x900 resolution.
    3. Buying a MBP is much better on Amazon. The price is lower, there are usually rebates and you don't pay sales tax (which on a $2000 purchase makes a significant difference). 
    4. Most of the time I'm at home and I have my laptop connected to an external monitor, keyboard and mouse so the original concerns about size did not seem very relevant in the long run.


    In conclusion: If you don't intend to do graphics rendering or run a couple of VM's at the same time the 13'' should suffice, but if you plan on using the laptop itself (without an external keyboard/monitor) the size can make a difference.  


    On Dec 27, 2007 1:00 PM, <skip at pobox.com> wrote:


      I've got a 15" Powerbook G4 that should be retired.  I'm thinking of
      replacing it with a MacBook, but I'm wondering if I'll be disapppointed with
      the smaller 13" screen.  The other major difference seems to be in the 
      graphics configuration (NVidia GeForce vs Intel GMA - where the Intel
      processor eats up a chunk of main memory instead of having its own memory).
      Anybody out there with a decent amount of experience with the two (more than 
      just fooling around at the Apple Store) with both systems have any opinions?
      Bottom line, is the Pro worth the extra $1,000?

      Thanks,

      Skip Montanaro

      _______________________________________________ 
      Chicago mailing list
      Chicago at python! .org
      http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago




    -- 
    Cosmin Stejerean
    http://blog.offbytwo.com 

----------------------------------------------------------------------------
    _______________________________________________
    Chicago mailing list
    Chicago at python.org
    http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago



------------------------------------------------------------------------------


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  Chicago mailing list
  Chicago at python.org
  http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
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From kumar.mcmillan at gmail.com  Fri Dec 28 03:53:51 2007
From: kumar.mcmillan at gmail.com (Kumar McMillan)
Date: Thu, 27 Dec 2007 20:53:51 -0600
Subject: [Chicago] OT:leopard vs Tiger
In-Reply-To: <003c01c848f8$5bde1730$0300d20a@IBMUO5W0HB49M3>
References: <20071227185003.292eb6c930850de810cf35869bff7bc4.40b97ece85.wbe@email.secureserver.net>
	<003c01c848f8$5bde1730$0300d20a@IBMUO5W0HB49M3>
Message-ID: <b571660a0712271853u2ddb5382p1a43d9dfdc188d67@mail.gmail.com>

On Dec 27, 2007 8:21 PM, Patrick O'Hara <pohara at virtualmotors.com> wrote:
>
>
> Lepoard,
>  hmmmmmmmmmmmmm,
> why does Lepoard fail to recognize  my wirless network
> unless i go upstairs  to my home offce  shut off COMCAST CABLE MODEM
> unplug  router,
> THEN WAIT 5 MINUTES AND POWER BACK ON?
> Tiger  automatically  recognized my  wireless network and NEVER  WAS A PAIN
> LIKE THIS??

it's a known issue.  Maybe some clues here:
http://www.google.com/search?q=leopard+wireless+problems

I'm waiting a bit til I switch :)

>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: adam at spatialsystems.org
> To: The Chicago Python Users Group
> Sent: Thursday, December 27, 2007 7:50 PM
> Subject: Re: [Chicago] OT: MacBook vs. MacBook Pro?
>
>
> Also, I noticed that TF.cgi was putting TRUE or FALSE in there with a
> newline, I just removed that.
>
> Thanks,
> Adam
>
>
>
>
> -------- Original Message --------
> Subject: Re: [Chicago] OT: MacBook vs. MacBook Pro?
> From: "Cosmin Stejerean" <cstejerean at gmail.com>
> Date: Thu, December 27, 2007 6:09 pm
> To: "The Chicago Python Users Group" <chicago at python.org>
>
> About a year ago I was debating between the MacBook Pro and the MacBook. A
> friend let me borrow his MacBook for a bit and after playing with it here is
> what made me decide to buy a 15' MacBook Pro.
>
>
> 1. The keyboard on the 13'' Mac is (or at least seems) smaller which makes
> it uncomfortable for me to type on.
> 2. I was used to 15'' laptop screen so the 13'' seemed too small
> 3. The MacBook used to get very hot (hotter than the MBP where the aluminum
> case seems to help). Recent firmware upgrades have made this less of a
> problem (and tools like FanControl)
> 4. I wanted a dedicated graphics card to be able to play some games if
> necessary (then I found out there aren't that many games for OSX, I wasn't
> willing to install XP and in the mean time I bought a PS3)
>
>
> Here are some things that I've discovered since making the decision
>
>
> 1. The FireWire 800 port came in handy. I could not get my Western Digital
> My Book Pro to connect using FireWire 400. Research seems to indicate it
> might be some conflict with the iSight camera. Works flawlessly using
> FireWire 800.
>
>
> 2. Coming from a 15.4 Dell with 1680x1050 I was disappointed with the
> 1440x900 resolution.
> 3. Buying a MBP is much better on Amazon. The price is lower, there are
> usually rebates and you don't pay sales tax (which on a $2000 purchase makes
> a significant difference).
> 4. Most of the time I'm at home and I have my laptop connected to an
> external monitor, keyboard and mouse so the original concerns about size did
> not seem very relevant in the long run.
>
>
> In conclusion: If you don't intend to do graphics rendering or run a couple
> of VM's at the same time the 13'' should suffice, but if you plan on using
> the laptop itself (without an external keyboard/monitor) the size can make a
> difference.
>
>
> On Dec 27, 2007 1:00 PM, <skip at pobox.com> wrote:
>
> >
> > I've got a 15" Powerbook G4 that should be retired.  I'm thinking of
> > replacing it with a MacBook, but I'm wondering if I'll be disapppointed
> with
> > the smaller 13" screen.  The other major difference seems to be in the
> > graphics configuration (NVidia GeForce vs Intel GMA - where the Intel
> > processor eats up a chunk of main memory instead of having its own
> memory).
> > Anybody out there with a decent amount of experience with the two (more
> than
> > just fooling around at the Apple Store) with both systems have any
> opinions?
> > Bottom line, is the Pro worth the extra $1,000?
> >
> > Thanks,
> >
> > Skip Montanaro
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Chicago mailing list
> > Chicago at python! .org
> > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
> >
>
>
>
> --
> Cosmin Stejerean
> http://blog.offbytwo.com ________________________________
>  _______________________________________________
> Chicago mailing list
> Chicago at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>
>
>  ________________________________
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Chicago mailing list
> Chicago at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>
> _______________________________________________
> Chicago mailing list
> Chicago at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>
>

From chris.mcavoy at gmail.com  Fri Dec 28 03:57:33 2007
From: chris.mcavoy at gmail.com (Chris McAvoy)
Date: Thu, 27 Dec 2007 20:57:33 -0600
Subject: [Chicago] OT:leopard vs Tiger
In-Reply-To: <003c01c848f8$5bde1730$0300d20a@IBMUO5W0HB49M3>
References: <20071227185003.292eb6c930850de810cf35869bff7bc4.40b97ece85.wbe@email.secureserver.net>
	<003c01c848f8$5bde1730$0300d20a@IBMUO5W0HB49M3>
Message-ID: <3096c19d0712271857r528fd6a0v5f9e0373b0a25de9@mail.gmail.com>

On Dec 27, 2007 8:21 PM, Patrick O'Hara <pohara at virtualmotors.com> wrote:
> NEVER  WAS A PAIN
> LIKE THIS??

I feel like delivering a well placed burn, based on this out of
context quote, but it would violate my new years resolution.

To not deliver well placed burns.

Feel free to imagine how scathing my burn would have been, had I not
resolved to refrain from burning ass-hat out-of-context terrible
grammar worse spelling list posters.

Chris

From thomas at yager-madden.net  Fri Dec 28 04:01:33 2007
From: thomas at yager-madden.net (Thomas)
Date: Thu, 27 Dec 2007 21:01:33 -0600
Subject: [Chicago] OT:leopard vs Tiger
In-Reply-To: <3096c19d0712271857r528fd6a0v5f9e0373b0a25de9@mail.gmail.com>
References: <20071227185003.292eb6c930850de810cf35869bff7bc4.40b97ece85.wbe@email.secureserver.net>
	<003c01c848f8$5bde1730$0300d20a@IBMUO5W0HB49M3>
	<3096c19d0712271857r528fd6a0v5f9e0373b0a25de9@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <2b006dba0712271901m32af361bk36d79b977c0800a6@mail.gmail.com>

On Dec 27, 2007 8:57 PM, Chris McAvoy <chris.mcavoy at gmail.com> wrote:

> I feel like delivering a well placed burn, based on this out of
> context quote, but it would violate my new years resolution.

But dude, you still have a few days, before you have to start sticking
to your new years resolutions! It's still the old year, until next
week!

-- 
Thomas

From mtemkin at speakeasy.net  Fri Dec 28 05:35:06 2007
From: mtemkin at speakeasy.net (Marc Temkin)
Date: Thu, 27 Dec 2007 22:35:06 -0600
Subject: [Chicago] Notice of upcoming ACM Google Presentation on 1/9/2008
Message-ID: <003f01c8490b$05a311a0$6401a8c0@DREAMCATCHER232>

Hi,
    please post this info re the upcoming ACM Google Presentation on
1/9/2008.  
        Thanks,
            Marc Temkin
 
For January 9th hosting at Google Chicago

Title: Building Scalable Systems and Moving Large Datasets

Abstract:

 

In order to manage ever-increasing computation needs, Google continues to
scale its hardware and software systems to meet the need to store more data,
serve more requests, and at the same time improve results.

 

Using Google Code's Subversion server as a case study, this talk will cover
Google's hardware philosophy and several core infrastructure technologies
such as GFS, BigTable, and MapReduce. We'll also review advances in storage
as they relate to Google's project for moving large scientific datasets.

 

 

 

Brian Fitzpatrick, Engineering Manager, Google 

Brian Fitzpatrick started his career at Google in 2005 as the first software
engineer hired in the Chicago office. Brian leads Google's Chicago
engineering efforts and also serves as engineering manager for Google Code
and internal advisor for Google's open source efforts. Prior to joining
Google, Brian was a senior software engineer on the version control team at
CollabNet, working on Subversion, cvs2svn, and CVS. He has also worked at
Apple Computer as a senior engineer in their professional services division,
developing both client and web applications for Apple's largest corporate
customers.

 

Brian has been an active open source contributor for over ten years. After
years of writing small open source programs and bugfixes, he became a core
Subversion developer in 2000, and then the lead developer of the cvs2svn
utility. He was nominated as a member of the Apache Software Foundation in
2002 and spent two years as the ASF's VP of Public Relations. Brian has
written numerous articles and given many presentations on a wide variety of
subjects from version control to software development, including co-writing
"Version Control with Subversion" as well as chapters for "Unix in a
Nutshell" and "Linux in a Nutshell."

 

Brian has an A.B. in Classics from Loyola University Chicago with a major in
Latin, a minor in Greek, and a concentration in Fine Arts and Ceramics.
Despite growing up in New Orleans and working for Silicon Valley companies
for most of his career, he decided years ago that Chicago was his home and
stubbornly refuses to move to California.

 

Brians' Website:

 

http://www.red-bean.com/fitz/bio.shtml

-------------- next part --------------
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From maney at two14.net  Sat Dec 29 03:10:32 2007
From: maney at two14.net (Martin Maney)
Date: Fri, 28 Dec 2007 20:10:32 -0600
Subject: [Chicago] OT:leopard vs   Tiger
In-Reply-To: <003c01c848f8$5bde1730$0300d20a@IBMUO5W0HB49M3>
References: <20071227185003.292eb6c930850de810cf35869bff7bc4.40b97ece85.wbe@email.secureserver.net>
	<003c01c848f8$5bde1730$0300d20a@IBMUO5W0HB49M3>
Message-ID: <20071229021032.GA15490@furrr.two14.net>

On Thu, Dec 27, 2007 at 08:21:29PM -0600, Patrick O'Hara wrote:
> Lepoard,
>  hmmmmmmmmmmmmm, 
> why does Lepoard fail to recognize  my wirless network  
> unless i go upstairs  to my home offce  shut off COMCAST CABLE MODEM
> unplug  router,
> THEN WAIT 5 MINUTES AND POWER BACK ON?
> Tiger  automatically  recognized my  wireless network and NEVER  WAS A PAIN LIKE THIS??

Oh, I know this one.  Never owned a Mac of any sort, but I read all
about it a couple weeks ago.  Leopard is Apple's Vista.

-- 
vi is a microcosm of the Unix world.  Don't expect
to learn all of it at once; perhaps you shouldn't expect
to learn all of it at all.  -- Jon Lasser (Think Unix)


From tcp at mac.com  Sat Dec 29 05:01:47 2007
From: tcp at mac.com (Ted Pollari)
Date: Fri, 28 Dec 2007 20:01:47 -0800
Subject: [Chicago] OT:leopard vs   Tiger
In-Reply-To: <20071229021032.GA15490@furrr.two14.net>
References: <20071227185003.292eb6c930850de810cf35869bff7bc4.40b97ece85.wbe@email.secureserver.net>
	<003c01c848f8$5bde1730$0300d20a@IBMUO5W0HB49M3>
	<20071229021032.GA15490@furrr.two14.net>
Message-ID: <E1473C1A-7952-4D0B-9827-B57232A4C355@mac.com>


On Dec 28, 2007, at 6:10 PM, Martin Maney wrote:

>  Leopard is Apple's Vista.


Sadly, it really is.  I've been using it for a month or two now and I  
really can't say I'm in love with it.  They've fixed a few annoyances  
but added a whole bunch more.  At least Python 2.5.1 ships with it!

-t

From tim.saylor at gmail.com  Sat Dec 29 23:37:23 2007
From: tim.saylor at gmail.com (Tim Saylor)
Date: Sat, 29 Dec 2007 16:37:23 -0600
Subject: [Chicago] Chicago Digest, Vol 28, Issue 34
In-Reply-To: <mailman.64.1198839616.6003.chicago@python.org>
References: <mailman.64.1198839616.6003.chicago@python.org>
Message-ID: <9fb45b0b0712291437o672fb2f9n371ca1e518e70814@mail.gmail.com>

On 12/28/07, chicago-request at python.org <chicago-request at python.org> wrote:
> Send Chicago mailing list submissions to
> 	chicago at python.org
>
> To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
> 	http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
> or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to
> 	chicago-request at python.org
>
> You can reach the person managing the list at
> 	chicago-owner at python.org
>
> When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
> than "Re: Contents of Chicago digest..."
>

From sgithens at caret.cam.ac.uk  Sun Dec 30 05:39:00 2007
From: sgithens at caret.cam.ac.uk (swg)
Date: Sat, 29 Dec 2007 22:39:00 -0600
Subject: [Chicago] Conversation topics for January
In-Reply-To: <6yd4t4hseh.fsf@imagepc03.rd.imagescape.com>
References: <6yd4t4hseh.fsf@imagepc03.rd.imagescape.com>
Message-ID: <477720E4.8020606@caret.cam.ac.uk>

If there's time and interest, I'd have fun doing a lightening talk about 
Python scripting support in OpenOffice if it hasn't been covered in a 
meeting yet.

-Steve

Christopher Allan Webber wrote:
> So I'm starting a separate thread to discuss topics for January.  Not
> really the same conversation as the venue, so..
>
> I've claimed dibs on presenting this month since I forefitted
> last month (okay, I needed some more time to prepare the animation
> system too, but..)
>
> Last month it was a totally theoretical animation system.  But this
> month it's no longer theoretical... I proposed using the animation
> system, and I'm happy to say that not only did it run successfully,
> but (partly because of it,) I am now engaged ;)
>
> So, conversation topic #1 for next month:
>  - PyStage, an animation framework (or, How To Propose To Your Fiance
>    Using Python)
>
> (..Yes, the presentation will be done entirely in PyStage too ;)
> _______________________________________________
> Chicago mailing list
> Chicago at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>
>   

From sobolak at gmail.com  Sun Dec 30 06:12:24 2007
From: sobolak at gmail.com (Brian Sobolak)
Date: Sat, 29 Dec 2007 23:12:24 -0600
Subject: [Chicago] Notice of upcoming ACM Google Presentation on 1/9/2008
In-Reply-To: <003f01c8490b$05a311a0$6401a8c0@DREAMCATCHER232>
References: <003f01c8490b$05a311a0$6401a8c0@DREAMCATCHER232>
Message-ID: <de1ad2fe0712292112t55b7231u6a629d026103b278@mail.gmail.com>

Mark --

Sounds interesting.  Are there more details?  Where to RSVP, where is
it located, what time, etc?

brian


On Dec 27, 2007 10:35 PM, Marc Temkin <mtemkin at speakeasy.net> wrote:
>
>
> Hi,
>     please post this info re the upcoming ACM Google Presentation on
> 1/9/2008.
>         Thanks,
>             Marc Temkin
>
>
>
> For January 9th hosting at Google Chicago
>
> Title: Building Scalable Systems and Moving Large Datasets
>
> Abstract:
>
>
>
> In order to manage ever-increasing computation needs, Google continues to
> scale its hardware and software systems to meet the need to store more data,
> serve more requests, and at the same time improve results.
>
>
>
> Using Google Code's Subversion server as a case study, this talk will cover
> Google's hardware philosophy and several core infrastructure technologies
> such as GFS, BigTable, and MapReduce. We'll also review advances in storage
> as they relate to Google's project for moving large scientific datasets.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Brian Fitzpatrick, Engineering Manager, Google
>
> Brian Fitzpatrick started his career at Google in 2005 as the first software
> engineer hired in the Chicago office. Brian leads Google's Chicago
> engineering efforts and also serves as engineering manager for Google Code
> and internal advisor for Google's open source efforts. Prior to joining
> Google, Brian was a senior software engineer on the version control team at
> CollabNet, working on Subversion, cvs2svn, and CVS. He has also worked at
> Apple Computer as a senior engineer in their professional services division,
> developing both client and web applications for Apple's largest corporate
> customers.
>
>
>
> Brian has been an active open source contributor for over ten years. After
> years of writing small open source programs and bugfixes, he became a core
> Subversion developer in 2000, and then the lead developer of the cvs2svn
> utility. He was nominated as a member of the Apache Software Foundation in
> 2002 and spent two years as the ASF's VP of Public Relations. Brian has
> written numerous articles and given many presentations on a wide variety of
> subjects from version control to software development, including co-writing
> "Version Control with Subversion" as well as chapters for "Unix in a
> Nutshell" and "Linux in a Nutshell."
>
>
>
> Brian has an A.B. in Classics from Loyola University Chicago with a major in
> Latin, a minor in Greek, and a concentration in Fine Arts and Ceramics.
> Despite growing up in New Orleans and working for Silicon Valley companies
> for most of his career, he decided years ago that Chicago was his home and
> stubbornly refuses to move to California.
>
>
>
> Brians' Website:
>
>
>
> http://www.red-bean.com/fitz/bio.shtml
> _______________________________________________
> Chicago mailing list
> Chicago at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>
>



-- 
--
Brian Sobolak
http://www.planetshwoop.com/

From esinclai at pobox.com  Sun Dec 30 17:39:06 2007
From: esinclai at pobox.com (Eric Sinclair)
Date: Sun, 30 Dec 2007 10:39:06 -0600
Subject: [Chicago] Notice of upcoming ACM Google Presentation on 1/9/2008
In-Reply-To: <de1ad2fe0712292112t55b7231u6a629d026103b278@mail.gmail.com>
References: <003f01c8490b$05a311a0$6401a8c0@DREAMCATCHER232>
	<de1ad2fe0712292112t55b7231u6a629d026103b278@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <F4CE03A0-33BB-4732-9EA5-0AFDDE9436AC@pobox.com>

Looks like the ACM Chicago event listing hasn't been updated with  
contact details, but the event is listed in the sidebar, and the  
December coordinator was Greg Neumarke (greg at neumarke.net), the chair  
of the local chapter.

	http://oldwww.acm.org/chapters/chicago/  <- great URL redirection  
result

-Eric

On Dec 29, 2007, at 11:12 PM, Brian Sobolak wrote:

> Mark --
>
> Sounds interesting.  Are there more details?  Where to RSVP, where is
> it located, what time, etc?
>
> brian
>
>
> On Dec 27, 2007 10:35 PM, Marc Temkin <mtemkin at speakeasy.net> wrote:
>>
>>
>> Hi,
>>   please post this info re the upcoming ACM Google Presentation on
>> 1/9/2008.
>>       Thanks,
>>           Marc Temkin
>>
>>
>>
>> For January 9th hosting at Google Chicago
>>
>> Title: Building Scalable Systems and Moving Large Datasets
>>
>> Abstract:
>>
>>
>>
>> In order to manage ever-increasing computation needs, Google  
>> continues to
>> scale its hardware and software systems to meet the need to store  
>> more data,
>> serve more requests, and at the same time improve results.
>>
>>
>>
>> Using Google Code's Subversion server as a case study, this talk  
>> will cover
>> Google's hardware philosophy and several core infrastructure  
>> technologies
>> such as GFS, BigTable, and MapReduce. We'll also review advances in  
>> storage
>> as they relate to Google's project for moving large scientific  
>> datasets.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Brian Fitzpatrick, Engineering Manager, Google
>>
>> Brian Fitzpatrick started his career at Google in 2005 as the first  
>> software
>> engineer hired in the Chicago office. Brian leads Google's Chicago
>> engineering efforts and also serves as engineering manager for  
>> Google Code
>> and internal advisor for Google's open source efforts. Prior to  
>> joining
>> Google, Brian was a senior software engineer on the version control  
>> team at
>> CollabNet, working on Subversion, cvs2svn, and CVS. He has also  
>> worked at
>> Apple Computer as a senior engineer in their professional services  
>> division,
>> developing both client and web applications for Apple's largest  
>> corporate
>> customers.
>>
>>
>>
>> Brian has been an active open source contributor for over ten  
>> years. After
>> years of writing small open source programs and bugfixes, he became  
>> a core
>> Subversion developer in 2000, and then the lead developer of the  
>> cvs2svn
>> utility. He was nominated as a member of the Apache Software  
>> Foundation in
>> 2002 and spent two years as the ASF's VP of Public Relations. Brian  
>> has
>> written numerous articles and given many presentations on a wide  
>> variety of
>> subjects from version control to software development, including co- 
>> writing
>> "Version Control with Subversion" as well as chapters for "Unix in a
>> Nutshell" and "Linux in a Nutshell."
>>
>>
>>
>> Brian has an A.B. in Classics from Loyola University Chicago with a  
>> major in
>> Latin, a minor in Greek, and a concentration in Fine Arts and  
>> Ceramics.
>> Despite growing up in New Orleans and working for Silicon Valley  
>> companies
>> for most of his career, he decided years ago that Chicago was his  
>> home and
>> stubbornly refuses to move to California.
>>
>>
>>
>> Brians' Website:
>>
>>
>>
>> http://www.red-bean.com/fitz/bio.shtml
>> _______________________________________________
>> Chicago mailing list
>> Chicago at python.org
>> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>>
>>
>
>
>
> -- 
> --
> Brian Sobolak
> http://www.planetshwoop.com/
> _______________________________________________
> Chicago mailing list
> Chicago at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago

-- 
esinclai at pobox.com                           aim/skype/twitter: esinclai
http://www.kittyjoyce.com/eric/log/    jabber: esinclai at gmail.com