From mdipierro at cs.depaul.edu Sat Mar 1 09:19:48 2008 From: mdipierro at cs.depaul.edu (Massimo Di Pierro) Date: Sat, 1 Mar 2008 02:19:48 -0600 Subject: [Chicago] CAS Message-ID: <8E564C59-5408-40FA-8ABE-383069746D1D@cs.depaul.edu> In case anybody is interested I have released a new web2py appliance to provide consumer and provider functionalities for the CAS (Central Authentication Service) protocol. The appliance is here with source code (BSD) http://mdp.cti.depaul.edu/appliances/default/show/22 and it is running here so that you do not need to run it yourself: https://mdp.cti.depaul.edu/cas Have a nice week-end. Massimo From skip at pobox.com Sat Mar 1 22:56:33 2008 From: skip at pobox.com (skip at pobox.com) Date: Sat, 1 Mar 2008 15:56:33 -0600 Subject: [Chicago] My visit to the conference hotel Message-ID: <18377.53521.758348.701590@montanaro-dyndns-org.local> I visited the conference hotel today at noon to sample the lunch fare and talk things over with Marcia Perzyna. I also met Michael, the head chef (didn't catch his last name). Unfortunately, nobody else was with me to provide alternative opinions. In no particular order, my comments: * They will be serving boxed lunches via a buffet line. The samples today included steak fajita wraps, chicken wraps, italian subs and roast beef sandwiches. I tried the steak fajita, chicken wrap and the sub. I think they will be fine for lunch. * There was no vegetarian sandwich option displayed in the menu or in the samples I was shown. I told them that between 10% and 20% of the registrants specified vegetarian or vegan food. I told them that they could either substitute one of the meat sandwiches with some sort of vegetarian option (say, a roasted veggie wrap) or just reduce all the other sandwich options by 10-20% and add a vegetarian option. Given that they currenty have four meat options I think they could serve two or three of them at each lunch with a veggie option. That would allow them to rotate the meat choices and thus vary the lunch menu a bit day-by-day. * I sent an email to Marcia with the breakdown of the food choices people made and will try to keep her updated as we get closer to the conference. She has my email and phone number if she has any questions. I understand she also met with Carl Karsten and Tim (last name?) Thursday evening. * Seating will be kind of all over the place. Marcia identified three places in particular: Atrium - 100-120 people, Metro - 250, Rickenbacker - 120 max. If conference rooms are empty we can also move there with our food. It's only a few steps from where they will be serving. In my past experience I never liked everyone-in-one-huge- room seating anyway. It's very loud and you're sitting at tables with a dozen people, so you can't hear anyone except your immediate neighbors. * I couldn't get into their parking lot because someone was working on the entry gate, so I just parked in the 15-minute loading zone while I was there. Marcia said they have 600 spaces in the hotel parking lot. She also said they notified the Village of Rosemont about the conference in case there is any overflow. She said the Village's parking garage is right next to the hotel and is $11/day. That might well be an option for us locals who drive. She confirmed that it's about a five-minute walk from the Rosemont Blue Line stop. We can probably cajole them into having their shuttle buses swing by there on their way to O'Hare. We may need that option given the sort of winter we've had so far in Chicago! * One evening (tutorial day?) they will be serving pizza. They get it from Pizzeria Uno, though I gather it's baked on-site (probably just shipped frozen to the hotel). The samples they had today were veggie, cheese, pepperoni and sausage. Basic thin-medium crust pizza. It was decent, not spectacular. Not deep dish for you massive-quantity-of- cheese-types. I suggested that they serve roughly equal quantities of all four types. * Marcia indicated that they originally bid on the conference expecting about 600 people. According to the t-shirt page we have around 900 total registrations at this point, so while they appear to have the capacity to handle our conference, things will be a bit different than either they or we expected. I guess that's the price of popularity. * Vegan options are still a bit up-in-the air. It's fairly uncommon to get pastries made without eggs, for example. We'll have to press them a little to satisfy that option I think. Overall I think we will be fine. The food isn't four-star, but it's not rubber chicken either. Skip From tcp at mac.com Sat Mar 1 23:32:58 2008 From: tcp at mac.com (Ted Pollari) Date: Sat, 1 Mar 2008 14:32:58 -0800 Subject: [Chicago] My visit to the conference hotel In-Reply-To: <18377.53521.758348.701590@montanaro-dyndns-org.local> References: <18377.53521.758348.701590@montanaro-dyndns-org.local> Message-ID: <790F3E10-648C-4CE1-932B-D87DCECFB27F@mac.com> On Mar 1, 2008, at 1:56 PM, skip at pobox.com wrote: > She said the Village's > parking garage is right next to the hotel and is $11/day. That > might > well be an option for us locals who drive. Excellent find, Skip! We should probably add this to the hotel info > She confirmed that it's > about a five-minute walk from the Rosemont Blue Line stop. We > can > probably cajole them into having their shuttle buses swing by > there on > their way to O'Hare. We may need that option given the sort of > winter > we've had so far in Chicago! The hotel's webpage states that trips to or from the blue line are possible, all you need to do is call/ask. Are you thinking we should ask for regular service there on the mornings of the conference (i.e. the peak times people'd want the ride from the blue line)? > > * Marcia indicated that they originally bid on the conference > expecting > about 600 people. According to the t-shirt page we have around > 900 > total registrations at this point, so while they appear to have > the > capacity to handle our conference, things will be a bit > different than > either they or we expected. Then they took extremely poor notes -- I recall discussions with them during the initial site visit (Carl and Larry from CTE were there with me) and 600 people was our *minimum* estimate when we were discussing this with the hotel management, including the catering folks. We made it clear that we expected more than that number, possibly up to 900 or more. They were enthusiastic and confident that they could handle it. > > > Overall I think we will be fine. The food isn't four-star, but it's > not > rubber chicken either. Thanks -- I appreciate the leg-work on your part to check all this out. -Ted From goodger at python.org Sat Mar 1 23:55:28 2008 From: goodger at python.org (David Goodger) Date: Sat, 01 Mar 2008 17:55:28 -0500 Subject: [Chicago] [PyCON-Organizers] My visit to the conference hotel In-Reply-To: <790F3E10-648C-4CE1-932B-D87DCECFB27F@mac.com> References: <18377.53521.758348.701590@montanaro-dyndns-org.local> <790F3E10-648C-4CE1-932B-D87DCECFB27F@mac.com> Message-ID: <47C9DEE0.6080402@python.org> [Ted Pollari - 2008-03-01 17:32] [re hotel shuttle] > The hotel's webpage states that trips to or from the blue line are > possible, all you need to do is call/ask. Are you thinking we should > ask for regular service there on the mornings of the conference (i.e. > the peak times people'd want the ride from the blue line)? Yes, exactly. -- David Goodger -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 251 bytes Desc: OpenPGP digital signature Url : http://mail.python.org/pipermail/chicago/attachments/20080301/36e841c3/attachment.pgp From goodger at python.org Sat Mar 1 23:52:17 2008 From: goodger at python.org (David Goodger) Date: Sat, 01 Mar 2008 17:52:17 -0500 Subject: [Chicago] [PyCON-Organizers] My visit to the conference hotel In-Reply-To: <18377.53521.758348.701590@montanaro-dyndns-org.local> References: <18377.53521.758348.701590@montanaro-dyndns-org.local> Message-ID: <47C9DE21.10407@python.org> [skip at pobox.com - 2008-03-01 16:56] > I visited the conference hotel today at noon to sample the lunch fare and > talk things over with Marcia Perzyna. I also met Michael, the head chef > (didn't catch his last name). Unfortunately, nobody else was with me to > provide alternative opinions. Thanks for doing this, Skip! > * There was no vegetarian sandwich option displayed in the menu or in > the samples I was shown. I told them that between 10% and 20% of the > registrants specified vegetarian or vegan food. I told them that they > could either substitute one of the meat sandwiches with some sort of > vegetarian option (say, a roasted veggie wrap) or just reduce all the > other sandwich options by 10-20% and add a vegetarian option. Given > that they currenty have four meat options I think they could serve two > or three of them at each lunch with a veggie option. That would allow > them to rotate the meat choices and thus vary the lunch menu a bit > day-by-day. Good idea. Note that you can see food option totals (and individual names) here: http://us.pycon.org/2008/registration/report/food/ (requires superuser account, which you now have). > * I sent an email to Marcia with the breakdown of the food choices > people made and will try to keep her updated as we get closer to the > conference. She has my email and phone number if she has any > questions. I understand she also met with Carl Karsten and Tim (last > name?) Thursday evening. Tim Costello of CTE? He does tech for them (maybe more). > * Seating will be kind of all over the place. Marcia identified three > places in particular: Atrium - 100-120 people, Metro - 250, > Rickenbacker - 120 max. If conference rooms are empty we can also > move there with our food. The ballrooms and open space rooms on the lower level will all be available for seating. > It's only a few steps from where they will be serving. Do you know where they'll be serving? > In my past experience I never liked everyone-in-one-huge- > room seating anyway. It's very loud and you're sitting at tables with > a dozen people, so you can't hear anyone except your immediate > neighbors. Agreed. > * I couldn't get into their parking lot because someone was working on > the entry gate, so I just parked in the 15-minute loading zone while I > was there. Marcia said they have 600 spaces in the hotel parking lot. > She also said they notified the Village of Rosemont about the > conference in case there is any overflow. She said the Village's > parking garage is right next to the hotel and is $11/day. That might > well be an option for us locals who drive. Could you find specific information (address, directions) and add it to http://us.pycon.org/2008/registration/hotel/#parking ? > She confirmed that it's > about a five-minute walk from the Rosemont Blue Line stop. We can > probably cajole them into having their shuttle buses swing by there on > their way to O'Hare. We may need that option given the sort of winter > we've had so far in Chicago! Yes. > * One evening (tutorial day?) they will be serving pizza. Yes, the Thursday between afternoon and evening classes. ... > Overall I think we will be fine. The food isn't four-star, but it's not > rubber chicken either. One of the reasons for having 90-minute lunch breaks (on Friday & Saturday; 60 on Sunday) is to give picky people more time to go out to eat. Great report. Thanks again! -- David Goodger -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 251 bytes Desc: OpenPGP digital signature Url : http://mail.python.org/pipermail/chicago/attachments/20080301/f58e31bf/attachment.pgp From goodger at python.org Sat Mar 1 23:59:55 2008 From: goodger at python.org (David Goodger) Date: Sat, 01 Mar 2008 17:59:55 -0500 Subject: [Chicago] [PyCON-Organizers] My visit to the conference hotel In-Reply-To: <47C9DBA6.9030004@tummy.com> References: <18377.53521.758348.701590@montanaro-dyndns-org.local> <47C9DBA6.9030004@tummy.com> Message-ID: <47C9DFEB.60308@python.org> [Sean Reifschneider - 2008-03-01 17:41] > You have to be careful about trying to just meet the vegetarian options, > because often other people will select a vegetarian option even if they > aren't vegetarians. For a variety of reasons including seeing the > vegetarian options, them looking better than other options, whatever. I > say this from personal experience, I'm not a vegetarian but I will often > select non-meat options for a meal because I don't feel like meat... > > So, trying for exactly enough to meet the vegetarian demand is likely to > leave some vegetarians disappointed... And in a pinch, my experience has > been that there are few meat eaters that won't "fail over" to a vegetarian > option, if the meat is all gone, than the other way around. ;-) Right. Better to go with a healthy proportion of vegetarian-friendly food. > It may be worth while to have some sort of a sign if we are expecting that > vegetarian options (or particularly vegan) may be just enough to go around. If that's the case, yes, definitely. > I would say: Have all the options available every day and people can do > their own rotation. "Ooh, there's a fajita wrap and italian sub, hard > choice" then the next day I'm stuck with roast beef with no option of the > one I didn't have the other day. ;-/ +1 -- David Goodger -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 251 bytes Desc: OpenPGP digital signature Url : http://mail.python.org/pipermail/chicago/attachments/20080301/da0831f2/attachment.pgp From pfein at pobox.com Sun Mar 2 01:10:22 2008 From: pfein at pobox.com (Pete) Date: Sat, 1 Mar 2008 19:10:22 -0500 Subject: [Chicago] My visit to the conference hotel In-Reply-To: <18377.53521.758348.701590@montanaro-dyndns-org.local> References: <18377.53521.758348.701590@montanaro-dyndns-org.local> Message-ID: <200803011910.22508.pfein@pobox.com> On Saturday March 1 2008 4:56:33 pm skip at pobox.com wrote: > * There was no vegetarian sandwich option displayed in the menu or in > the samples I was shown. I told them that between 10% and 20% of the > registrants specified vegetarian or vegan food. I told them that > they could either substitute one of the meat sandwiches with some sort of > vegetarian option (say, a roasted veggie wrap) or just reduce all the other > sandwich options by 10-20% and add a vegetarian option. Given that they > currenty have four meat options I think they could serve two or three of > them at each lunch with a veggie option. That would allow them to rotate > the meat choices and thus vary the lunch menu a bit day-by-day. As a functional vegetarian, let me commence the requisite Vegetarian Whining: A roasted veggie wrap is not a real meal. Such meals usually consist of a few overcooked greasy peppers & onions, and maybe some broccoli & cheese if you're lucky. Missing here is any significant source of protein. While I don't expect the kitchens of Corporate America to start serving up tofu or tempeh, there are ways of making vegetarians happy that the hotel may be able to accomodate. In particular, rice and legumes (lentils, beans, peas) *together* (you've got to have both) make a full-protein meal. Stuff some in the aformentioned wrap and you've got happy herbivores. That said, like most vegetarians, I'm used to such treatment, and will probably go out for lunch or bring my own burrito. > locals who drive. She confirmed that it's about a five-minute walk from > the Rosemont Blue Line stop. We can probably cajole them into having their Looking at the Google map, that sounds about right. Maybe we can post a sign at the El exit pointing the direction to walk? > * Vegan options are still a bit up-in-the air. It's fairly uncommon to > get pastries made without eggs, for example. We'll have to press > them a little to satisfy that option I think. Strict vegan/halal/kosher folk probably expect to find/bring their own food in general. Given the tiny numbers of people asking for such meals (less than 1% total), I don't think it's unreasonable to encourage them to seek lunch elsewhere - it's not like an airplane flight with no other options. -- Peter Fein || 773-575-0694 || pfein at pobox.com http://www.pobox.com/~pfein/ || PGP: 0xCCF6AE6B irc: pfein at freenode.net || jabber: peter.fein at gmail.com From carl at personnelware.com Sun Mar 2 01:45:36 2008 From: carl at personnelware.com (Carl Karsten) Date: Sat, 01 Mar 2008 18:45:36 -0600 Subject: [Chicago] My visit to the conference hotel In-Reply-To: <200803011910.22508.pfein@pobox.com> References: <18377.53521.758348.701590@montanaro-dyndns-org.local> <200803011910.22508.pfein@pobox.com> Message-ID: <47C9F8B0.2000602@personnelware.com> >> * Vegan options are still a bit up-in-the air. It's fairly uncommon to >> get pastries made without eggs, for example. We'll have to press >> them a little to satisfy that option I think. > > Strict vegan/halal/kosher folk probably expect to find/bring their own food in > general. Given the tiny numbers of people asking for such meals (less than > 1% total), I don't think it's unreasonable to encourage them to seek lunch > elsewhere - it's not like an airplane flight with no other options. > bah. we own the hotel. If we tell anyone to do anything, it will be telling the hotel to get us some special food. Carl K (a carnivore, but sensitive to the desires of his fellow species) Now only if there was a corn-free option. (there is corn everywhere. even a gin and tonic has high fructose corn syrup, unless you go for the rat poison based sweetener.) From hsu.feihong at yahoo.com Sun Mar 2 04:26:46 2008 From: hsu.feihong at yahoo.com (Feihong Hsu) Date: Sat, 1 Mar 2008 19:26:46 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Chicago] [PyCON-Organizers] My visit to the conference hotel In-Reply-To: <47C9DEE0.6080402@python.org> Message-ID: <931522.50460.qm@web34802.mail.mud.yahoo.com> I recently took the CTA to get to Rosemont and thought I would add my thoughts. I think it takes a more than 5 minutes to get from the station to the hotel (it's more like 10). Especially if you aren't sure of the way and are lugging your baggage behind you. Immediately upon exiting the station, there were no street signs in plain view so I was at a loss as to which direction to go. Also, with the snow piled up, I wasn't even sure where the walkways were. I ended up following this one guy, hoping he was going towards where I wanted to go :-\ So yeah, I think if they allow us we ought to post some signs at the CTA station, with some pointers on which way to walk (for the record, once you exit the station you turn left immediately, then turn left again, walk under the overpass, keep walking for half a mile, and the hotel is on the other side of the road). I don't know what the weather will be like in March, but there was a decent amount of ice on the sidewalk last Thursday (mostly under the overpass, which doesn't get much sun). I'm used to walking on ice, but if you're from warmer climes... Well, I hope we can arrange a shuttle to the hotel. David Goodger wrote: [Ted Pollari - 2008-03-01 17:32] [re hotel shuttle] > The hotel's webpage states that trips to or from the blue line are > possible, all you need to do is call/ask. Are you thinking we should > ask for regular service there on the mornings of the conference (i.e. > the peak times people'd want the ride from the blue line)? Yes, exactly. -- David Goodger _______________________________________________ Chicago mailing list Chicago at python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago --------------------------------- Be a better friend, newshound, and know-it-all with Yahoo! Mobile. Try it now. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mail.python.org/pipermail/chicago/attachments/20080301/9172f781/attachment.htm From anthony.r.rubin at gmail.com Sun Mar 2 04:48:13 2008 From: anthony.r.rubin at gmail.com (Anthony Rubin) Date: Sat, 01 Mar 2008 21:48:13 -0600 Subject: [Chicago] [PyCON-Organizers] My visit to the conference hotel In-Reply-To: <931522.50460.qm@web34802.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <931522.50460.qm@web34802.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <47CA237D.9000600@gmail.com> Feihong Hsu wrote: > I recently took the CTA to get to Rosemont and thought I would add my > thoughts. I think it takes a more than 5 minutes to get from the > station to the hotel (it's more like 10). Especially if you aren't > sure of the way and are lugging your baggage behind you. Immediately > upon exiting the station, there were no street signs in plain view so > I was at a loss as to which direction to go. Also, with the snow piled > up, I wasn't even sure where the walkways were. I ended up following > this one guy, hoping he was going towards where I wanted to go :-\ > > So yeah, I think if they allow us we ought to post some signs at the > CTA station, with some pointers on which way to walk (for the record, > once you exit the station you turn left immediately, then turn left > again, walk under the overpass, keep walking for half a mile, and the > hotel is on the other side of the road). > > I don't know what the weather will be like in March, but there was a > decent amount of ice on the sidewalk last Thursday (mostly under the > overpass, which doesn't get much sun). I'm used to walking on ice, but > if you're from warmer climes... Well, I hope we can arrange a shuttle > to the hotel. > A few days ago I posted directions to the hotel from the CTA station. As it is almost half a mile and you have to cross the street it does take about ten minutes to get there. I timed it on Thursday and I knew exactly where I was going. They will likely have the sidewalks cleaned up well on the weekend of PyCon because of the Chicago Flower & Garden Show. They will probably have cops helping people cross River Road as well. Anthony Rubin Chicago, IL From carl at personnelware.com Sun Mar 2 05:25:20 2008 From: carl at personnelware.com (Carl Karsten) Date: Sat, 01 Mar 2008 22:25:20 -0600 Subject: [Chicago] [PyCON-Organizers] My visit to the conference hotel In-Reply-To: <931522.50460.qm@web34802.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <931522.50460.qm@web34802.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <47CA2C30.1090407@personnelware.com> Feihong Hsu wrote: > I recently took the CTA to get to Rosemont ... > (for the record, once you > exit the station you turn left immediately, then turn left again, walk under > the overpass, keep walking for half a mile, and the hotel is on the other > side of the road). added your directions to http://us.pycon.org/2008/chicago/hotel/ Thanks. > > I don't know what the weather will be like in March, Look out side. That is what the weather is like in March :) Carl K From hsu.feihong at yahoo.com Sun Mar 2 06:20:53 2008 From: hsu.feihong at yahoo.com (Feihong Hsu) Date: Sat, 1 Mar 2008 21:20:53 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Chicago] [PyCON-Organizers] My visit to the conference hotel In-Reply-To: <47CA237D.9000600@gmail.com> Message-ID: <302681.82383.qm@web34813.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Yes, thank you for those directions. I didn't quite remember them, but they must have been somewhere in the back of mind. That's probably why I thought it would be a good idea to follow that one guy, even though everybody else was going in another direction. Anthony Rubin wrote: Feihong Hsu wrote: > I recently took the CTA to get to Rosemont and thought I would add my > thoughts. I think it takes a more than 5 minutes to get from the > station to the hotel (it's more like 10). Especially if you aren't > sure of the way and are lugging your baggage behind you. Immediately > upon exiting the station, there were no street signs in plain view so > I was at a loss as to which direction to go. Also, with the snow piled > up, I wasn't even sure where the walkways were. I ended up following > this one guy, hoping he was going towards where I wanted to go :-\ > > So yeah, I think if they allow us we ought to post some signs at the > CTA station, with some pointers on which way to walk (for the record, > once you exit the station you turn left immediately, then turn left > again, walk under the overpass, keep walking for half a mile, and the > hotel is on the other side of the road). > > I don't know what the weather will be like in March, but there was a > decent amount of ice on the sidewalk last Thursday (mostly under the > overpass, which doesn't get much sun). I'm used to walking on ice, but > if you're from warmer climes... Well, I hope we can arrange a shuttle > to the hotel. > A few days ago I posted directions to the hotel from the CTA station. As it is almost half a mile and you have to cross the street it does take about ten minutes to get there. I timed it on Thursday and I knew exactly where I was going. They will likely have the sidewalks cleaned up well on the weekend of PyCon because of the Chicago Flower & Garden Show. They will probably have cops helping people cross River Road as well. Anthony Rubin Chicago, IL _______________________________________________ Chicago mailing list Chicago at python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago --------------------------------- Never miss a thing. Make Yahoo your homepage. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mail.python.org/pipermail/chicago/attachments/20080301/a4b72a42/attachment.htm From skip at pobox.com Tue Mar 4 04:41:39 2008 From: skip at pobox.com (skip at pobox.com) Date: Mon, 3 Mar 2008 21:41:39 -0600 Subject: [Chicago] [PyCON-Organizers] My visit to the conference hotel In-Reply-To: <47CC9947.2060801@gmail.com> References: <18377.53521.758348.701590@montanaro-dyndns-org.local> <47C9DBA6.9030004@tummy.com> <47C9DFEB.60308@python.org> <47CC9947.2060801@gmail.com> Message-ID: <18380.50419.765014.213816@montanaro-dyndns-org.local> Don> People indicated their dietary preference at registration. There were no "carnivore" or "omnivor" options. If someone didn't specify one of the more restrictive dietary options we know nothing about what they will eat. In fact, I will happily eat cheese or veggie pizza instead of a sausage pizza or a roasted veggie burrito instead of a steak burrito. Also, given the fact that over 10% of the registrations marked "vegetarian" or "vegan" and the hotel's initial stab at a lunch menu included *no* vegetarian options I believe they should cut back on the meat-based sandwiches and offer some vegetarian/vegan options. That's what I've told them in my discussions with them. Skip From cstejerean at gmail.com Tue Mar 4 07:32:24 2008 From: cstejerean at gmail.com (Cosmin Stejerean) Date: Tue, 4 Mar 2008 00:32:24 -0600 Subject: [Chicago] [PyCON-Organizers] My visit to the conference hotel In-Reply-To: <47CCE54F.3080007@gmail.com> References: <18377.53521.758348.701590@montanaro-dyndns-org.local> <47C9DBA6.9030004@tummy.com> <47C9DFEB.60308@python.org> <47CC9947.2060801@gmail.com> <47CCE54F.3080007@gmail.com> Message-ID: <276266d0803032232s2d3d5f02v5392cbdcac132f86@mail.gmail.com> > I think I've made my point abundantly clear now. If I haven't, continuing > to blather on isn't going to get me anywhere, so I'm done here. As I > prefaced my first email, if we're already going to have enough to > accommodate all of the 88%, then I have nothing to add, and I'm sorry for > all the on-list noise. > > Don Spaulding > I understand your concern, I'm not particularly happy with having to eat a "roasted veggie wrap" if the "meat" options run out. But I'm guessing a vegetarian would be even less happy with having to eat a meat sandwich (or not eat anything at all) if we run out of veggie options. I think your point is valid, but there is a problem with your original proposal. Putting a sign reminding folks to eat only the option they signed up for a month in advance isn't going to help so there is no point to create that sign. The only result of putting up such a sign is making it look like PyCon wasn't able to buy enough food and is now trying to make sure there is enough for everyone. Let's order enough food for everyone. - Cosmin -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mail.python.org/pipermail/chicago/attachments/20080304/699f73e8/attachment.htm From donspauldingii at gmail.com Tue Mar 4 01:35:19 2008 From: donspauldingii at gmail.com (Don Spaulding II) Date: Mon, 03 Mar 2008 18:35:19 -0600 Subject: [Chicago] [PyCON-Organizers] My visit to the conference hotel In-Reply-To: <47C9DFEB.60308@python.org> References: <18377.53521.758348.701590@montanaro-dyndns-org.local> <47C9DBA6.9030004@tummy.com> <47C9DFEB.60308@python.org> Message-ID: <47CC9947.2060801@gmail.com> David Goodger wrote: > [Sean Reifschneider - 2008-03-01 17:41] >> You have to be careful about trying to just meet the vegetarian options, >> because often other people will select a vegetarian option even if they >> aren't vegetarians. For a variety of reasons including seeing the >> vegetarian options, them looking better than other options, whatever. I >> say this from personal experience, I'm not a vegetarian but I will often >> select non-meat options for a meal because I don't feel like meat... >> >> So, trying for exactly enough to meet the vegetarian demand is likely to >> leave some vegetarians disappointed... And in a pinch, my experience >> has >> been that there are few meat eaters that won't "fail over" to a >> vegetarian >> option, if the meat is all gone, than the other way around. ;-) > > Right. Better to go with a healthy proportion of vegetarian-friendly > food. If this means we're converting meat meals to veggie meals, I'm a big -1. If it simply means ordering more veggie meals, without altering the number of meated ones, disregard the rest of this rant ;-) I can get behind over-ordering each type of meal, but don't change the ratio of meat/non-meat meals in expectation of people switching. People indicated their dietary preference at registration. I'd rather we "enforced" that in some way and if people want to eat something different, they should make their own arrangements or else make sure they aren't taking away a "reserved" meal (where enforced means "a sign in front of veggie/vegan/etc meals" and reserved means "a preference indicated at registration time"). As a carnivore by habit, I've "failed-over" to a vegetarian option at a conference before and been *very* disappointed (although it also seemed eerily similar to the greasy pepper wrap Pete mentioned elsewhere in this thread). If the question boils down to "which type of meal would we rather run out of?", don't assume the best answer is meated ones. Don -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mail.python.org/pipermail/chicago/attachments/20080303/a76bc2f0/attachment-0001.htm From doug.napoleone at gmail.com Tue Mar 4 01:56:18 2008 From: doug.napoleone at gmail.com (Douglas Napoleone) Date: Mon, 3 Mar 2008 19:56:18 -0500 Subject: [Chicago] [PyCON-Organizers] My visit to the conference hotel In-Reply-To: <47CC9947.2060801@gmail.com> References: <18377.53521.758348.701590@montanaro-dyndns-org.local> <47C9DBA6.9030004@tummy.com> <47C9DFEB.60308@python.org> <47CC9947.2060801@gmail.com> Message-ID: On Mon, Mar 3, 2008 at 7:35 PM, Don Spaulding II wrote: > > > > David Goodger wrote: > [Sean Reifschneider - 2008-03-01 17:41] > > You have to be careful about trying to just meet the vegetarian options, > because often other people will select a vegetarian option even if they > aren't vegetarians. For a variety of reasons including seeing the > vegetarian options, them looking better than other options, whatever. I > say this from personal experience, I'm not a vegetarian but I will often > select non-meat options for a meal because I don't feel like meat... > > So, trying for exactly enough to meet the vegetarian demand is likely to > leave some vegetarians disappointed... And in a pinch, my experience has > been that there are few meat eaters that won't "fail over" to a vegetarian > option, if the meat is all gone, than the other way around. ;-) > > Right. Better to go with a healthy proportion of vegetarian-friendly food. > If this means we're converting meat meals to veggie meals, I'm a big -1. > If it simply means ordering more veggie meals, without altering the number > of meated ones, disregard the rest of this rant ;-) > > I can get behind over-ordering each type of meal, but don't change the > ratio of meat/non-meat meals in expectation of people switching. > > People indicated their dietary preference at registration. I'd rather we > "enforced" that in some way and if people want to eat something different, > they should make their own arrangements or else make sure they aren't taking > away a "reserved" meal (where enforced means "a sign in front of > veggie/vegan/etc meals" and reserved means "a preference indicated at > registration time"). -1 policing attendees. (-100 acutally unless you volunteer to do the actual work of making sure 900+ attendees only pick options they selected during registration, then only -1 if you take on this taks) If you want a sign, fine we can make the sing, but I can garentee that it will not work, I would rather have enough food to cover the people who want vegetarian meals. In short you cant 'enforce' jack, so you need to 'plan' appropriately. With 12% of registrations indicating vegetarian, we must offer an adequate vegetarian option, and in a quantity which will cover the majority of that 12%. Given that non-vegetarian's will often pick the veg option on site (and we have NO way of enforcing that they do not, and to do so would be rude in my opinion), then we need to order more than a 12% allotment. THAT was the point being made. Not that we should run out of meat options first. > > As a carnivore by habit, I've "failed-over" to a vegetarian option at a > conference before and been *very* disappointed (although it also seemed > eerily similar to the greasy pepper wrap Pete mentioned elsewhere in this > thread). If the question boils down to "which type of meal would we rather > run out of?", don't assume the best answer is meated ones. Pete is wrong, his logic is an over simplification of the problem. We can not control which option will run out first unless we specifically under order an option. We should make sure that we have enough vegetarian options to cover the majority of those who ordered it. We should have enough meat options ordered so that some of the people who choose 'vegetarian' can also choose a meat. In short we should not run out of either option. We need to order the food before we know the full registration count after all. > > Don > > _______________________________________________ > Pycon-organizers mailing list > Pycon-organizers at python.org > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/pycon-organizers > > From donspauldingii at gmail.com Tue Mar 4 06:59:43 2008 From: donspauldingii at gmail.com (Don Spaulding II) Date: Mon, 03 Mar 2008 23:59:43 -0600 Subject: [Chicago] [PyCON-Organizers] My visit to the conference hotel In-Reply-To: References: <18377.53521.758348.701590@montanaro-dyndns-org.local> <47C9DBA6.9030004@tummy.com> <47C9DFEB.60308@python.org> <47CC9947.2060801@gmail.com> Message-ID: <47CCE54F.3080007@gmail.com> Douglas Napoleone wrote: > On Mon, Mar 3, 2008 at 7:35 PM, Don Spaulding II > wrote: > >> >> David Goodger wrote: >> >> Right. Better to go with a healthy proportion of vegetarian-friendly food. >> >> Don Spaulding wrote: >> >> If this means we're converting meat meals to veggie meals, I'm a big -1. >> If it simply means ordering more veggie meals, without altering the number >> of meated ones, disregard the rest of this rant ;-) >> >> I can get behind over-ordering each type of meal, but don't change the >> ratio of meat/non-meat meals in expectation of people switching. >> >> People indicated their dietary preference at registration. I'd rather we >> "enforced" that in some way and if people want to eat something different, >> they should make their own arrangements or else make sure they aren't taking >> away a "reserved" meal (where enforced means "a sign in front of >> veggie/vegan/etc meals" and reserved means "a preference indicated at >> registration time"). >> > -1 policing attendees. (-100 acutally unless you volunteer to do the > actual work of making sure 900+ attendees only pick options they > selected during registration, then only -1 if you take on this taks) > If you want a sign, fine we can make the sing, but I can garentee that > it will not work, I would rather have enough food to cover the people > who want vegetarian meals. > policing attendees? -100? actual work? guaranteed failure? anyone up for some sensationalism? sigh......my point is simple, have enough meat for the people who didn't indicate special requirements. If you want to accommodate some of them eating veggie meals by ordering more, that's fine, but don't assume meat-eaters are OK eating veggie meals. > In short you cant 'enforce' jack, so you need to 'plan' appropriately. > I'll copy and paste......since you can't be bothered to read what I write, I won't be bothered to phrase it a second time. """ On Mon, Mar 3, 2008 at 7:35 PM, Don Spaulding II wrote: >> (where enforced means "a sign in front of veggie/vegan/etc meals" >> and reserved means "a preference indicated at registration time") """ > With 12% of registrations indicating vegetarian, we must offer an > adequate vegetarian option, and in a quantity which will cover the > majority of that 12%. Given that non-vegetarian's will often pick the > veg option on site (and we have NO way of enforcing that they do not, > and to do so would be rude in my opinion), then we need to order more > than a 12% allotment. THAT was the point being made. Not that we > should run out of meat options first. > Let me be clear, I think we should do everything we can to accommodate everyone. I was under the impression that we were taking the 88-12 split and making it 85-15 to accommodate meaties who want veggies. People made a choice at registration time for their meals, so us changing their minds after the fact is a bit presumptuous. If instead the discussion was, "take the 88-12 split and make it 88-17" then I have no problems (which I thought I made clear in the preface to my first email). >> As a carnivore by habit, I've "failed-over" to a vegetarian option at a >> conference before and been *very* disappointed (although it also seemed >> eerily similar to the greasy pepper wrap Pete mentioned elsewhere in this >> thread). If the question boils down to "which type of meal would we rather >> run out of?", don't assume the best answer is meated ones. >> > Pete is wrong, his logic is an over simplification of the problem. Apparently I should have quoted Pete for context here. He made no attempt to frame the problem except to say "Veggie meals sometimes suck, and if that's the case, I'll go out to eat". I was relating the food he described to the "fail-over" vegetarian experience I had. Nothing more. > We > can not control which option will run out first unless we specifically > under order an option. We should make sure that we have enough > vegetarian options to cover the majority of those who ordered it. We > should have enough meat options ordered so that some of the people who > choose 'vegetarian' can also choose a meat. In short we should not run > out of either option. We need to order the food before we know the > full registration count after all. I think I've made my point abundantly clear now. If I haven't, continuing to blather on isn't going to get me anywhere, so I'm done here. As I prefaced my first email, if we're already going to have enough to accommodate all of the 88%, then I have nothing to add, and I'm sorry for all the on-list noise. Don Spaulding -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mail.python.org/pipermail/chicago/attachments/20080303/fa02746c/attachment-0001.htm From steve at holdenweb.com Tue Mar 4 12:36:57 2008 From: steve at holdenweb.com (Steve Holden) Date: Tue, 04 Mar 2008 06:36:57 -0500 Subject: [Chicago] [PyCON-Organizers] My visit to the conference hotel In-Reply-To: <47CCE54F.3080007@gmail.com> References: <18377.53521.758348.701590@montanaro-dyndns-org.local> <47C9DBA6.9030004@tummy.com> <47C9DFEB.60308@python.org> <47CC9947.2060801@gmail.com> <47CCE54F.3080007@gmail.com> Message-ID: <47CD3459.3010808@holdenweb.com> Don Spaulding II wrote: [...] > sigh......my point is simple, have enough meat for the people who didn't > indicate special requirements. If you want to accommodate some of them > eating veggie meals by ordering more, that's fine, but don't assume > meat-eaters are OK eating veggie meals. >> In short you cant 'enforce' jack, so you need to 'plan' appropriately. >> This is a reasonable point, but you should accept that the pushback you are getting is really the voice of experience speaking, and Sean's point (that meat-eaters are more likely to decide to eat vegetarian in the event of any shortage rather than vice versa) is simply an observation from prior years. > I think I've made my point abundantly clear now. If I haven't, > continuing to blather on isn't going to get me anywhere, so I'm done > here. As I prefaced my first email, if we're already going to have > enough to accommodate all of the 88%, then I have nothing to add, and > I'm sorry for all the on-list noise. > Don't worry about it. The food is always something that occupies an apparently disporportionate amount of attention, but it can affect (some) people's perceptions of the conference quite strongly. I teach classes for a professional training outfit, and I am used to seeing classes dinged for reasons like "cookies not as large as last time". Go figure. You have indeed made your point abundantly clear, but you are entitled to. I suspect this year we can probably better afford to slightly over-cater than we have been able to in previous years, but nobody likes waste. That's just the kind of tree-hugging yoghurt-knitters we are :) regards Steve -- Steve Holden +1 571 484 6266 +1 800 494 3119 Holden Web LLC http://www.holdenweb.com/ From shekay at pobox.com Tue Mar 4 16:51:41 2008 From: shekay at pobox.com (sheila miguez) Date: Tue, 4 Mar 2008 09:51:41 -0600 Subject: [Chicago] [PyCON-Organizers] My visit to the conference hotel In-Reply-To: <47CD3459.3010808@holdenweb.com> References: <18377.53521.758348.701590@montanaro-dyndns-org.local> <47C9DBA6.9030004@tummy.com> <47C9DFEB.60308@python.org> <47CC9947.2060801@gmail.com> <47CCE54F.3080007@gmail.com> <47CD3459.3010808@holdenweb.com> Message-ID: On Tue, Mar 4, 2008 at 5:36 AM, Steve Holden wrote: > over-cater than we have been able to in previous years, but nobody likes > waste. That's just the kind of tree-hugging yoghurt-knitters we are :) Ask CTE if we get charged for wasted portions. If there is waste, 1) ask what the hotel does with it. Maybe it goes for meals for hotel staff. end of story, that's not a bad destination 2) if it is legal, and logistics are not unwieldy, consider donating to http://www.chicagosfoodbank.org/ -- sheila From shekay at pobox.com Tue Mar 4 17:01:01 2008 From: shekay at pobox.com (sheila miguez) Date: Tue, 4 Mar 2008 10:01:01 -0600 Subject: [Chicago] [PyCON-Organizers] My visit to the conference hotel In-Reply-To: <18380.50419.765014.213816@montanaro-dyndns-org.local> References: <18377.53521.758348.701590@montanaro-dyndns-org.local> <47C9DBA6.9030004@tummy.com> <47C9DFEB.60308@python.org> <47CC9947.2060801@gmail.com> <18380.50419.765014.213816@montanaro-dyndns-org.local> Message-ID: On Mon, Mar 3, 2008 at 9:41 PM, wrote: > > Don> People indicated their dietary preference at registration. > > There were no "carnivore" or "omnivor" options. If someone didn't specify > one of the more restrictive dietary options we know nothing about what they > will eat. In fact, I will happily eat cheese or veggie pizza instead of a > sausage pizza or a roasted veggie burrito instead of a steak burrito. I didn't mark vegetarian because I will eat meat. Depending on cuisine will prefer vegetarian dishes. I doubt the hotel will be able to prepare, e.g. south Indian style food though, so I'll probably go with non vegetarian. I suppose it is late in the game to ask if the hotel can prepare something other than sandwich wraps of grilled vegs at a bargain cost? falafal in pitas? dosas? upatham? iddly? bao? -- sheila From skip at pobox.com Tue Mar 4 18:49:56 2008 From: skip at pobox.com (skip at pobox.com) Date: Tue, 4 Mar 2008 11:49:56 -0600 Subject: [Chicago] [PyCON-Organizers] My visit to the conference hotel In-Reply-To: References: <18377.53521.758348.701590@montanaro-dyndns-org.local> <47C9DBA6.9030004@tummy.com> <47C9DFEB.60308@python.org> <47CC9947.2060801@gmail.com> <18380.50419.765014.213816@montanaro-dyndns-org.local> Message-ID: <18381.35780.215151.167691@montanaro-dyndns-org.local> sheila> I doubt the hotel will be able to prepare, e.g. south Indian sheila> style food though, so I'll probably go with non vegetarian. I sheila> suppose it is late in the game to ask if the hotel can prepare sheila> something other than sandwich wraps of grilled vegs at a bargain sheila> cost? We can always ask. I'll send them an email. Skip From codexile at gmail.com Wed Mar 5 05:59:00 2008 From: codexile at gmail.com (Jeff Gibson) Date: Tue, 4 Mar 2008 22:59:00 -0600 Subject: [Chicago] Restaurants - vegetarian, vegan, kosher, halal? In-Reply-To: <918725.18270.qm@web34807.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <6yhcg34a2q.fsf@imagescape.com> <918725.18270.qm@web34807.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: It's far far south, but the best vegan joint in town is Soul Vegetarian vegan soul food buffet. can't go wrong. On Wed, Feb 20, 2008 at 4:05 PM, Feihong Hsu wrote: > Geez, apparently Amitabul is the most controversial restaurant in > Chicago. Now I just HAVE to go check it out sometime. Although my > experience with Korean food has mostly been with barbeque, so I'm a > little biased against vegan places. > > > > --- Christopher Allan Webber wrote: > > > Wow. Some strong opinions about Amitabul, here. > > > > I've only been there once, but the one time I went I walked away > > feeling like it was the best meal I ever had in my life. I had > > something that was "something or other's special delights". It had > > sweet potatoes and chestnut potatoes. That's all I can remember, > > but > > it was amazing. > > > > Isaac Csandl writes: > > > > > On Feb 17, 2008, at 9:25 PM, Pete wrote: > > > > > >> On Sunday February 17 2008 8:13:00 pm Kumar McMillan wrote: > > >>> I'm not sure what one should make of this, but the worst food > > I've > > >>> ever had was at Amitabul. It tasted like cardboard and I > > honestly > > >>> couldn't believe vegan food could be made this bad (I love > > vegan food > > >>> and have had many good meals at Chicago Diner and many spots in > > NY). > > >> > > >> By contrast, I think the food at Amitabul is fantastic and the > > >> Chicago Diner > > >> tastes like cardboard. YMMV. > > > > > > I've been Amitabul twice. The first time it was awesome. The > > second > > > time it was like cardboard. So yeah, YMMV. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > Chicago mailing list > > > Chicago at python.org > > > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago > > _______________________________________________ > > Chicago mailing list > > Chicago at python.org > > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago > > > > > > > ____________________________________________________________________________________ > Looking for last minute shopping deals? > Find them fast with Yahoo! Search. http://tools.search.yahoo.com/newsearch/category.php?category=shopping > > > _______________________________________________ > Chicago mailing list > Chicago at python.org > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago > From cstejerean at gmail.com Wed Mar 5 08:37:07 2008 From: cstejerean at gmail.com (Cosmin Stejerean) Date: Wed, 5 Mar 2008 01:37:07 -0600 Subject: [Chicago] Help with PyCon: need proctors for Python Lab Message-ID: <276266d0803042337j7083888bo69e68711f2c0644d@mail.gmail.com> This year I'm "organizing" the Python Lab, an event where groups of 3-5 people work together to solve problems in Python ( http://us.pycon.org/2008/conference/pythonlab/). This event is a great way to get new folks introduced to Python, test driven development and paired programming. I need YOUR help to make this event successful. We need about 4 to 5 proctors to help coordinate the event, distribute problems, answer questions, etc. If you'd like to help (and are attending PyCon) please let me know. - Cosmin -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mail.python.org/pipermail/chicago/attachments/20080305/f111c65a/attachment.htm From goodger at python.org Wed Mar 5 22:37:44 2008 From: goodger at python.org (David Goodger) Date: Wed, 5 Mar 2008 16:37:44 -0500 Subject: [Chicago] [PyCON-Organizers] My visit to the conference hotel In-Reply-To: References: <18377.53521.758348.701590@montanaro-dyndns-org.local> <47C9DBA6.9030004@tummy.com> <47C9DFEB.60308@python.org> <47CC9947.2060801@gmail.com> <47CCE54F.3080007@gmail.com> <47CD3459.3010808@holdenweb.com> Message-ID: <4335d2c40803051337m3ac5f666jf90df8c098bbcc51@mail.gmail.com> On Tue, Mar 4, 2008 at 10:51 AM, sheila miguez wrote: > Ask CTE if we get charged for wasted portions. We get charged for what we order. There is typically some waste, which we do pay for, but they try to minimize it. Last year we ordered about 5%-10% less than the attendance numbers warranted, and there was enough (but not too much waste!). CTE will have one or two people on-site at all times, watching the food situation and making sure we get what we ask and pay for. > If there is waste, > 1) ask what the hotel does with it. Maybe it goes for meals for hotel > staff. end of story, that's not a bad destination > 2) if it is legal, and logistics are not unwieldy, consider donating > to http://www.chicagosfoodbank.org/ I asked about this, and the answer is: sometimes, it depends. The hotel has an arrangement with "Share" or "Second Harvest", but not everything is eligible. The hotel is liable if anyone gets sick from their food, so they're very careful. In any case, there's nothing we can do about it at this point. The logistics would be unwieldy. -- David Goodger From maney at two14.net Thu Mar 6 13:33:20 2008 From: maney at two14.net (Martin Maney) Date: Thu, 6 Mar 2008 06:33:20 -0600 Subject: [Chicago] Python/Mono slapdown [no pycon content] Message-ID: <20080306123320.GA23578@furrr.two14.net> Mortadelo is a GUI tool that allows easy access to [some of] the capabilities of Linux's SystemTap - but that's not important. Mortadelo is written in C#, and one of the authors, who has some prior experience using Python, has taken the time to talk about what he likes and dislikes about both languages (and, inescapably, their libraries, low-level bindings, etc.) http://www.gnome.org/~federico/news-2007-06.html#18 Having just been looking at SWIG and ctypes, I'm tempted to guess that he might not be familiar with the latter, but as I know literally nothing about how C# handles binding to extenal C code I could be mistaken. -- The opinions that are held with passion are always those for which no good ground exists; indeed the passion is the measure of the holder's lack of rational conviction -- Bertrand Russell From chris.mcavoy at gmail.com Thu Mar 6 14:23:32 2008 From: chris.mcavoy at gmail.com (Chris McAvoy) Date: Thu, 6 Mar 2008 07:23:32 -0600 Subject: [Chicago] Volunteer Signups! Message-ID: <3096c19d0803060523x2b5752acsb3ed11a442205c6a@mail.gmail.com> Hi ChiPy & Pycon-organizers, There's a bunch of open volunteer positions that we need to fill this week, so please figure out how you can help out. * Session Chairs Doug Napoleone, in a tremendous burst of creative energy, built a pretty cool pycon schedule application at http://us.pycon.org/2008/conference/schedule/ which includes session chair signups. We need session chairs for each 3 session block. Session chairs are responsible for introducing the speaker, and showing the speaker cards that let them know how much time they have left. It's a pretty easy job, and gives you a little bit of Pycon exposure and a chance to get to know the speakers. So, take a look at the schedule, figure out what you which talks you want to attend, and sign up as a session chair. You have to log in to the application (you should all have logins from when you registered), then you float over the session, and magical link "sign up as session chair" appears. Everyone will get an instruction sheet for the day of the talks on your (very light) duties, as well as hand printed time-cards to show the speakers. * Registration desk We need a few more people to sign up to work the registration desk, especially Thursday. If you're interested, sign up here: http://wiki.python.org/moin/Volunteer_Signup * Bag Stuffing Thursday night of the conference, ChiPy is having it's monthly meeting at the hotel. Peter Fein is going to talk about a project he's been working on, and we're all going to stuff bags. It'll be fun. Like a party. * Twitter Channel We have a twitter channel for last minute volunteer requests. Sort of a 'flash mob' volunteer squad. Twitter is a microblogging site that lets you "follow" a writer. Updates to the writers channel can be sent to your mobile phone, instant messenger, or you can view them over the web. The intent of the pyconvolunteers channel is to give us a way to contact a big group of people in a hurry. Expect messages like, "we need people in ballroom 5 to help move chairs." Signup is here: http://twitter.com/pyconvolunteers You'll create your own twitter account, and then "follow" the pyconvolunteers user. I encourage you to register your mobile phone, as it will make it easy for us to contact the group when necessary. Ok folks, that's all for now. I think we're in relatively good shape. I'm looking forward to meeting everyone next week! Chris From hsu.feihong at yahoo.com Thu Mar 6 15:00:54 2008 From: hsu.feihong at yahoo.com (Feihong Hsu) Date: Thu, 6 Mar 2008 06:00:54 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Chicago] Python/Mono slapdown [no pycon content] In-Reply-To: <20080306123320.GA23578@furrr.two14.net> Message-ID: <348806.93564.qm@web34808.mail.mud.yahoo.com> "Really hard to call C functions. This is a killer." "Useless lambdas." This guy doesn't have enough experience with Python to be making this comparison. Besides, it's not an all-or-nothing proposition. You can mix Python and Mono development using Python.NET. --- Martin Maney wrote: > > Mortadelo is a GUI tool that allows easy access to [some of] the > capabilities of Linux's SystemTap - but that's not important. > Mortadelo is written in C#, and one of the authors, who has some > prior > experience using Python, has taken the time to talk about what he > likes > and dislikes about both languages (and, inescapably, their > libraries, > low-level bindings, etc.) > > http://www.gnome.org/~federico/news-2007-06.html#18 > > Having just been looking at SWIG and ctypes, I'm tempted to guess > that > he might not be familiar with the latter, but as I know literally > nothing about how C# handles binding to extenal C code I could be > mistaken. > > -- > The opinions that are held with passion are always those for which > no good ground exists; indeed the passion is the measure > of the holder's lack of rational conviction -- Bertrand Russell > > _______________________________________________ > Chicago mailing list > Chicago at python.org > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago > ____________________________________________________________________________________ Looking for last minute shopping deals? Find them fast with Yahoo! Search. http://tools.search.yahoo.com/newsearch/category.php?category=shopping From cstejerean at gmail.com Thu Mar 6 16:26:20 2008 From: cstejerean at gmail.com (Cosmin Stejerean) Date: Thu, 6 Mar 2008 09:26:20 -0600 Subject: [Chicago] Volunteer Signups! In-Reply-To: <3096c19d0803060523x2b5752acsb3ed11a442205c6a@mail.gmail.com> References: <3096c19d0803060523x2b5752acsb3ed11a442205c6a@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <276266d0803060726k46cd3d10p23caa70296d84775@mail.gmail.com> I'd like to add a request for volunteers (I tried sending this to the ChiPy list 2 days ago but I'm starting to think it didn't go through. I apologize for the spam if you're getting this more than once). This year I'm "organizing" the Python Lab, an event where groups of 3-5 people work together to solve problems in Python ( http://us.pycon.org/2008/conference/pythonlab/). We need about 4 to 5 proctors to help coordinate the event, distribute problems, answer questions, etc. If you'd like to help (and are attending PyCon) please let me know. -- Cosmin Stejerean http://blog.offbytwo.com On Thu, Mar 6, 2008 at 7:23 AM, Chris McAvoy wrote: > Hi ChiPy & Pycon-organizers, > > There's a bunch of open volunteer positions that we need to fill this > week, so please figure out how you can help out. > > * Session Chairs > > Doug Napoleone, in a tremendous burst of creative energy, built a > pretty cool pycon schedule application at > http://us.pycon.org/2008/conference/schedule/ which includes session > chair signups. > > We need session chairs for each 3 session block. Session chairs are > responsible for introducing the speaker, and showing the speaker cards > that let them know how much time they have left. It's a pretty easy > job, and gives you a little bit of Pycon exposure and a chance to get > to know the speakers. > > So, take a look at the schedule, figure out what you which talks you > want to attend, and sign up as a session chair. You have to log in to > the application (you should all have logins from when you registered), > then you float over the session, and magical link "sign up as session > chair" appears. > > Everyone will get an instruction sheet for the day of the talks on > your (very light) duties, as well as hand printed time-cards to show > the speakers. > > * Registration desk > > We need a few more people to sign up to work the registration desk, > especially Thursday. If you're interested, sign up here: > http://wiki.python.org/moin/Volunteer_Signup > > * Bag Stuffing > > Thursday night of the conference, ChiPy is having it's monthly meeting > at the hotel. Peter Fein is going to talk about a project he's been > working on, and we're all going to stuff bags. It'll be fun. Like a > party. > > * Twitter Channel > > We have a twitter channel for last minute volunteer requests. Sort of > a 'flash mob' volunteer squad. Twitter is a microblogging site that > lets you "follow" a writer. Updates to the writers channel can be > sent to your mobile phone, instant messenger, or you can view them > over the web. The intent of the pyconvolunteers channel is to give us > a way to contact a big group of people in a hurry. Expect messages > like, "we need people in ballroom 5 to help move chairs." > > Signup is here: http://twitter.com/pyconvolunteers You'll create your > own twitter account, and then "follow" the pyconvolunteers user. I > encourage you to register your mobile phone, as it will make it easy > for us to contact the group when necessary. > > Ok folks, that's all for now. I think we're in relatively good shape. > I'm looking forward to meeting everyone next week! > > Chris > _______________________________________________ > Chicago mailing list > Chicago at python.org > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mail.python.org/pipermail/chicago/attachments/20080306/eac7f571/attachment.htm From goodger at python.org Thu Mar 6 16:37:09 2008 From: goodger at python.org (David Goodger) Date: Thu, 06 Mar 2008 10:37:09 -0500 Subject: [Chicago] [PyCON-Organizers] Volunteer Signups! In-Reply-To: <276266d0803060726k46cd3d10p23caa70296d84775@mail.gmail.com> References: <3096c19d0803060523x2b5752acsb3ed11a442205c6a@mail.gmail.com> <276266d0803060726k46cd3d10p23caa70296d84775@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <47D00FA5.4070206@python.org> [Cosmin Stejerean - 2008-03-06 10:26] > I'd like to add a request for volunteers (I tried sending this to the > ChiPy list 2 days ago but I'm starting to think it didn't go through. I > apologize for the spam if you're getting this more than once). It came through. Check the list archives if you're unsure. It may be that you're not getting a lot of responses because people here are already over-committed. There are other avenues, like the pycon-interest list, python-announce, and the PyCon blog. I gave you access to the PyCon blog; please use it. -- David > This year I'm "organizing" the Python Lab, an event where groups of 3-5 > people work together to solve problems in Python > (http://us.pycon.org/2008/conference/pythonlab/). We need about 4 to 5 > proctors to help coordinate the event, distribute problems, answer > questions, etc. If you'd like to help (and are attending PyCon) please > let me know. -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 251 bytes Desc: OpenPGP digital signature Url : http://mail.python.org/pipermail/chicago/attachments/20080306/6913da36/attachment.pgp From cstejerean at gmail.com Thu Mar 6 17:01:59 2008 From: cstejerean at gmail.com (Cosmin Stejerean) Date: Thu, 6 Mar 2008 10:01:59 -0600 Subject: [Chicago] [PyCON-Organizers] Volunteer Signups! In-Reply-To: <47D00FA5.4070206@python.org> References: <3096c19d0803060523x2b5752acsb3ed11a442205c6a@mail.gmail.com> <276266d0803060726k46cd3d10p23caa70296d84775@mail.gmail.com> <47D00FA5.4070206@python.org> Message-ID: <276266d0803060801v4ab10cd8g4b1299dd57b389b0@mail.gmail.com> On Thu, Mar 6, 2008 at 9:37 AM, David Goodger wrote: > [Cosmin Stejerean - 2008-03-06 10:26] > > I'd like to add a request for volunteers (I tried sending this to the > > ChiPy list 2 days ago but I'm starting to think it didn't go through. I > > apologize for the spam if you're getting this more than once). > > It came through. Check the list archives if you're unsure. Didn't think of that. Thanks. > It may be that you're not getting a lot of responses because people here > are > already over-committed. There are other avenues, like the pycon-interest > list, > python-announce, and the PyCon blog. I gave you access to the PyCon blog; > please use it. Will do. I wanted to ask on ChiPy first. I'll go ahead and put something together for the PyCon blog and other mailing lists. > > -- David > > > This year I'm "organizing" the Python Lab, an event where groups of 3-5 > > people work together to solve problems in Python > > (http://us.pycon.org/2008/conference/pythonlab/). We need about 4 to 5 > > proctors to help coordinate the event, distribute problems, answer > > questions, etc. If you'd like to help (and are attending PyCon) please > > let me know. > > > -- Cosmin Stejerean http://blog.offbytwo.com -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mail.python.org/pipermail/chicago/attachments/20080306/0cba2f6e/attachment-0001.htm From ianb at colorstudy.com Thu Mar 6 18:34:39 2008 From: ianb at colorstudy.com (Ian Bicking) Date: Thu, 06 Mar 2008 11:34:39 -0600 Subject: [Chicago] Python/Mono slapdown [no pycon content] In-Reply-To: <20080306123320.GA23578@furrr.two14.net> References: <20080306123320.GA23578@furrr.two14.net> Message-ID: <47D02B2F.2060007@colorstudy.com> Martin Maney wrote: > Mortadelo is a GUI tool that allows easy access to [some of] the > capabilities of Linux's SystemTap - but that's not important. > Mortadelo is written in C#, and one of the authors, who has some > prior experience using Python, has taken the time to talk about what > he likes and dislikes about both languages (and, inescapably, their > libraries, low-level bindings, etc.) > > http://www.gnome.org/~federico/news-2007-06.html#18 > > Having just been looking at SWIG and ctypes, I'm tempted to guess > that he might not be familiar with the latter, but as I know > literally nothing about how C# handles binding to extenal C code I > could be mistaken. I don't know what it looks like in C# either. ctypes is about as good as you can get for calling, except that it doesn't read header files. I believe Pyrex can read header files now? That adds to the build Some other things he says: > No lexical scoping. Well this just isn't true. Nested scopes are writable. But Python definitely as lexical scopes. > Hard (impossible?) to make cons-free structures. For this particular > program, this is a killer. You have to use Numeric. > "enum Foo { Bar, Baz, Beep }" is just much nicer than "(Bar, Baz, > Beep) = range (oh-how-many-elements-again?)" There's an enum library that handles this reasonably (the range thing is indeed lame). Ian From kumar.mcmillan at gmail.com Thu Mar 6 22:12:46 2008 From: kumar.mcmillan at gmail.com (Kumar McMillan) Date: Thu, 6 Mar 2008 15:12:46 -0600 Subject: [Chicago] March Chipy Meeting In-Reply-To: <200802202147.30509.pfein@pobox.com> References: <200802202147.30509.pfein@pobox.com> Message-ID: In a John Wayne shoot-first-ask-questions-later kind of way, I removed the old "next meeting" message (the PyCon practice run) from http://chipy.org/ and replaced it with the March meeting message that was already there, one heading below. On Wed, Feb 20, 2008 at 8:47 PM, Pete wrote: > Hi all- > > In an effort to to take some pressure off the in-town folks, I hereby declare > myself de-facto coordinator of the March Chipy meeting. Huzzah! > > Chipy's March Meeting, our best (and maybe biggest) ever! We'll be having it > the night before Pycon, at the Pycon space, so hopefully we'll attract early > Pycon arrivers and show them how we kick it Chicago style. > > Date: Thursday, 3/13. 7 pm. A bit later than usual to give folks more time > get out to O'hare. > > Location: Crowne Plaza Chicago O'Hare hotel 5440 N River Rd Rosemont, IL 60018 > > Directions: http://us.pycon.org/2008/chicago/hotel/ The hotel is 3 blocks > from the Rosemont blue line stop. > > Speakers: > Peter Fein - GrassyKnoll: A web service for collections > http://grassyknoll.googlecode.com > > Post-Meeting: > Pycon needs help! Schwag bags need stuffing and t-shirts need folding. Make > your mamma proud by showing off those folding skillz. Beer and pizza may be > provided. This is a great, low commitment opportunity to help make Chicago's > first Pycon a success. > > Logistics: > My talk is likely to be longish, but perhaps we'd have some time for a few > short talks as well. IIRC, someone else expressed interest on the mailing > list, but I can't find the message... Please email me if you're interested in > presenting. > > As usual, details are subject to change, as we figure out what hotel space is > available. > > w00t! > > --Pete > > -- > Peter Fein || 773-575-0694 || pfein at pobox.com > http://www.pobox.com/~pfein/ || PGP: 0xCCF6AE6B > irc: pfein at freenode.net || jabber: peter.fein at gmail.com > _______________________________________________ > Chicago mailing list > Chicago at python.org > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago > From chris.mcavoy at gmail.com Thu Mar 6 22:17:46 2008 From: chris.mcavoy at gmail.com (Chris McAvoy) Date: Thu, 6 Mar 2008 15:17:46 -0600 Subject: [Chicago] March Chipy Meeting In-Reply-To: References: <200802202147.30509.pfein@pobox.com> Message-ID: <3096c19d0803061317x646c6ab9naafec060573b64e@mail.gmail.com> John Wayne loved Wiki's. On Thu, Mar 6, 2008 at 3:12 PM, Kumar McMillan wrote: > In a John Wayne shoot-first-ask-questions-later kind of way, I removed > the old "next meeting" message (the PyCon practice run) from > http://chipy.org/ and replaced it with the March meeting message that > was already there, one heading below. > > > > On Wed, Feb 20, 2008 at 8:47 PM, Pete wrote: > > Hi all- > > > > In an effort to to take some pressure off the in-town folks, I hereby declare > > myself de-facto coordinator of the March Chipy meeting. Huzzah! > > > > Chipy's March Meeting, our best (and maybe biggest) ever! We'll be having it > > the night before Pycon, at the Pycon space, so hopefully we'll attract early > > Pycon arrivers and show them how we kick it Chicago style. > > > > Date: Thursday, 3/13. 7 pm. A bit later than usual to give folks more time > > get out to O'hare. > > > > Location: Crowne Plaza Chicago O'Hare hotel 5440 N River Rd Rosemont, IL 60018 > > > > Directions: http://us.pycon.org/2008/chicago/hotel/ The hotel is 3 blocks > > from the Rosemont blue line stop. > > > > Speakers: > > Peter Fein - GrassyKnoll: A web service for collections > > http://grassyknoll.googlecode.com > > > > Post-Meeting: > > Pycon needs help! Schwag bags need stuffing and t-shirts need folding. Make > > your mamma proud by showing off those folding skillz. Beer and pizza may be > > provided. This is a great, low commitment opportunity to help make Chicago's > > first Pycon a success. > > > > Logistics: > > My talk is likely to be longish, but perhaps we'd have some time for a few > > short talks as well. IIRC, someone else expressed interest on the mailing > > list, but I can't find the message... Please email me if you're interested in > > presenting. > > > > As usual, details are subject to change, as we figure out what hotel space is > > available. > > > > w00t! > > > > --Pete > > > > -- > > Peter Fein || 773-575-0694 || pfein at pobox.com > > http://www.pobox.com/~pfein/ || PGP: 0xCCF6AE6B > > irc: pfein at freenode.net || jabber: peter.fein at gmail.com > > _______________________________________________ > > Chicago mailing list > > Chicago at python.org > > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago > > > _______________________________________________ > Chicago mailing list > Chicago at python.org > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago > From tcp at mac.com Thu Mar 6 23:17:51 2008 From: tcp at mac.com (Ted Pollari) Date: Thu, 6 Mar 2008 14:17:51 -0800 Subject: [Chicago] March Chipy Meeting In-Reply-To: <3096c19d0803061317x646c6ab9naafec060573b64e@mail.gmail.com> References: <200802202147.30509.pfein@pobox.com> <3096c19d0803061317x646c6ab9naafec060573b64e@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <495C89BF-1368-4603-B294-E287653EFE6E@mac.com> On Mar 6, 2008, at 1:17 PM, Chris McAvoy wrote: > John Wayne loved Wiki's. John Wayne flattened the tire of your new bicycle and Steve Jobs was pissed about it. From maney at two14.net Fri Mar 7 00:09:34 2008 From: maney at two14.net (Martin Maney) Date: Thu, 6 Mar 2008 17:09:34 -0600 Subject: [Chicago] Python/Mono slapdown [no pycon content] In-Reply-To: <47D02B2F.2060007@colorstudy.com> References: <20080306123320.GA23578@furrr.two14.net> <47D02B2F.2060007@colorstudy.com> Message-ID: <20080306230934.GA24479@furrr.two14.net> On Thu, Mar 06, 2008 at 11:34:39AM -0600, Ian Bicking wrote: > Martin Maney wrote: >> Having just been looking at SWIG and ctypes, I'm tempted to guess >> that he might not be familiar with the latter, but as I know >> literally nothing about how C# handles binding to extenal C code I >> could be mistaken. > > I don't know what it looks like in C# either. ctypes is about as good as > you can get for calling, except that it doesn't read header files. I Having played with ctypes for a good part of the day (of the copious free time part of the day, anywhow), I gotta say it's looking pretty good. I think I'm past the bit where I spend more time figuring out how ctypes does things than puzzling out the not very documented existing library I need to talk to; it didn't help that the very first function I needed to call was one that takes *argc, *argv (and modifies both as it consumes arguments)... yeah, it's a crappy interface, I can understand why it hasn't changed much in years and years. But if you want to talk to the Netware servers... > Some other things he says: > >> No lexical scoping. > > Well this just isn't true. Nested scopes are writable. But Python > definitely as lexical scopes. Yeah, that's an odd one. I was hoping someone who'd at least dabbled in C# might guess what he thought he was missing, but perhaps he's just wrong, or using the wrong name for whatever it is he wants. >> Hard (impossible?) to make cons-free structures. For this particular >> program, this is a killer. > > You have to use Numeric. I know enough to think "maybe Numeric could do something here". But to be honest I don't know if I'd have pursued that vague thought, since I tend to think that Numeric is for, well, numeric (viz, floating point) stuff. At least that's how I remember it being described... >> "enum Foo { Bar, Baz, Beep }" is just much nicer than "(Bar, Baz, >> Beep) = range (oh-how-many-elements-again?)" > > There's an enum library that handles this reasonably (the range thing is > indeed lame). I have to admit that I could sympathize with him if he replied to the effect that chasing around after third party libraries didn't give him a warm and fuzzy feeling. BTW, Google found a bewildering assortment of things for "Python enum" - which one did you have in mind? -- In terms of utility rather than dollars, I can spend "nothing" (which to a first approximation is the value of a dollar out of my weekly budget) to get a non-zero chance of completely changing my life. Or, in yet other terms, I can just wait for them to send me the check by mistake, which can't be *that* much less likely than actually winning [the lottery]. -- David Dyer-Bennet From ianb at colorstudy.com Fri Mar 7 00:38:37 2008 From: ianb at colorstudy.com (Ian Bicking) Date: Thu, 06 Mar 2008 17:38:37 -0600 Subject: [Chicago] Python/Mono slapdown [no pycon content] In-Reply-To: <20080306230934.GA24479@furrr.two14.net> References: <20080306123320.GA23578@furrr.two14.net> <47D02B2F.2060007@colorstudy.com> <20080306230934.GA24479@furrr.two14.net> Message-ID: <47D0807D.6080905@colorstudy.com> Martin Maney wrote: >>> Hard (impossible?) to make cons-free structures. For this particular >>> program, this is a killer. >> You have to use Numeric. > > I know enough to think "maybe Numeric could do something here". But to > be honest I don't know if I'd have pursued that vague thought, since I > tend to think that Numeric is for, well, numeric (viz, floating point) > stuff. At least that's how I remember it being described... It's basically for holding lots of data and handling it efficiently. It's used a lot by PyGame, for instance, because things like bitmaps fit that model. Anytime you have to efficiently handle lots of numeric data (including bytes and ints) it is handy, as it stores them efficiently and only turns them into Python objects on demand. Like, imagine a list of 4-byte integers. You can store that linearly in memory with no overhead, but they aren't Python objects, and don't even fit into any Python model of information (well, except maybe using buffers or arrays). But you can create a wrapper that acts like a list, and creates Python integers from those bytes in memory on demand. That's what Numeric does. I also think with buffer or array, and the struct module, you can do this on your own. >>> "enum Foo { Bar, Baz, Beep }" is just much nicer than "(Bar, Baz, >>> Beep) = range (oh-how-many-elements-again?)" >> There's an enum library that handles this reasonably (the range thing is >> indeed lame). > > I have to admit that I could sympathize with him if he replied to the > effect that chasing around after third party libraries didn't give him > a warm and fuzzy feeling. BTW, Google found a bewildering assortment > of things for "Python enum" - which one did you have in mind? The one on pypi: http://pypi.python.org/pypi/enum/0.4.3 Ian From skip at pobox.com Fri Mar 7 01:45:15 2008 From: skip at pobox.com (skip at pobox.com) Date: Thu, 6 Mar 2008 18:45:15 -0600 Subject: [Chicago] Anyone here have a little time for some SpamBayes work? Message-ID: <18384.36891.594623.439927@montanaro-dyndns-org.local> Are there any SpamBayes users on this list (well, besides me)? I'm hoping I can cajole someone with a non-free Yahoo! Mail account to try getting the SpamBayes IMAP filter to work with that system. Windows, Mac or Unix/Linux, doesn't matter at this point. (I sort of got it to work with Gmail via their IMAP interface, though with decidedly mixed results.) Thx, Skip From maney at two14.net Fri Mar 7 03:15:19 2008 From: maney at two14.net (Martin Maney) Date: Thu, 6 Mar 2008 20:15:19 -0600 Subject: [Chicago] Python/Mono slapdown [no pycon content] In-Reply-To: <47D0807D.6080905@colorstudy.com> References: <20080306123320.GA23578@furrr.two14.net> <47D02B2F.2060007@colorstudy.com> <20080306230934.GA24479@furrr.two14.net> <47D0807D.6080905@colorstudy.com> Message-ID: <20080307021519.GA29670@furrr.two14.net> On Thu, Mar 06, 2008 at 05:38:37PM -0600, Ian Bicking wrote: > It's basically for holding lots of data and handling it efficiently. > It's used a lot by PyGame, for instance, because things like bitmaps fit > that model. Anytime you have to efficiently handle lots of numeric data > (including bytes and ints) it is handy, as it stores them efficiently > and only turns them into Python objects on demand. Since you already know all about it, I'm gonna ask you rather than digging it up myself: does this stretch to cover things less homogenous than arrays? Or, as would often be the case I think, arrays of binary structs - still a fixed layout, say, but not just X integers, all alike. > I also think with buffer or array, and the struct module, you can do > this on your own. But again, if the app's main, large data store is this big array of binary structs, then a more C-like view of data (as I believe C# has) will have a better match to it. And I'm not saying that to argue that Python ought to have a more C-like data model, just that it's IMO well chosen level of abstraction inherently makes it less convenient to deal with this sort of structured binary data. I prefer that tradeoff the way it is, but I don't seem to deal with that sort of binary blob much. > The one on pypi: http://pypi.python.org/pypi/enum/0.4.3 Finney's enum. Saw that one, did think it looked like the most ready for use... but it also looks rather heavyweight (from the point of view of a hardcore C hacker, a role I can still remember well enough to fake sometimes) if all one really wants is to get a sequence of integer values bound to a specified set of names... something I may need to do for pyncp fairly soon, come to think of it. I really don't see that the x,y,z = range(n) is any worse a kluge than, say the traditional x and True or False substitute for the ternary operator, and that was viscously defended as The One Way on c.l.p for years despite it's obvious fragility and unintuitive form. BTW, I was happy today to "discover" a replacement for that specific usage (taking an arbitrary Python object and converting it to 1 or 0 as it evaluates to true or false in Python). int(bool(x)) works just fine, for sufficently recent versions (I'm pretty sure it wasn't an available option when I started, using 1.5.something - amazing how much trouble I have remembering some of the features added since then if they're not ones I use often, especially when they replaced a well-worn idiom). ... okay, except that it does require you to keep the list and n in sync, but it gives a clear and immediate error at the least hint of any sort of testing if you didn't, so it's pretty innocuous. -- Here's my message to the record industry and its allies: I'm not a thief. I'm a customer. When you treat me like a thief, I won't be your customer. -- Dan Gillmor From mtobis at gmail.com Fri Mar 7 03:38:58 2008 From: mtobis at gmail.com (Michael Tobis) Date: Thu, 6 Mar 2008 20:38:58 -0600 Subject: [Chicago] Python/Mono slapdown [no pycon content] In-Reply-To: <20080307021519.GA29670@furrr.two14.net> References: <20080306123320.GA23578@furrr.two14.net> <47D02B2F.2060007@colorstudy.com> <20080306230934.GA24479@furrr.two14.net> <47D0807D.6080905@colorstudy.com> <20080307021519.GA29670@furrr.two14.net> Message-ID: On Thu, Mar 6, 2008 at 8:15 PM, Martin Maney wrote: > does this stretch to cover things less homogenous > than arrays? Or, as would often be the case I think, arrays of binary > structs - still a fixed layout, say, but not just X integers, all > alike. > Yup, as long as the number of bytes per element is fixed. > > > I also think with buffer or array, and the struct module, you can do > > this on your own. > > But again, if the app's main, large data store is this big array of > binary structs, then a more C-like view of data (as I believe C# has) > will have a better match to it. You get some nice things, like complex slices and arbitrary subsets without copy, elementwise loops, and very high level notation (ufuncs). And I'm not saying that to argue that > Python ought to have a more C-like data model, just that it's IMO well > chosen level of abstraction inherently makes it less convenient to deal > with this sort of structured binary data. There is a cost. It's not an entirely Pythonic way of looking at things. It has advantages though, especially if there is an underlying rectangular or multi-dimensional rectangular structure to the data. mt -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mail.python.org/pipermail/chicago/attachments/20080306/f430e5c0/attachment.htm From christianzlong at yahoo.com Fri Mar 7 04:07:01 2008 From: christianzlong at yahoo.com (Christian Long) Date: Thu, 06 Mar 2008 21:07:01 -0600 Subject: [Chicago] Anyone here have a little time for some SpamBayes work? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <47D0B155.8030500@yahoo.com> I have a Yahoo account I access through POP. I did not know that they started offering IMAP access. I don't have SpamBayes installed now, but I'd be happy to help test. Where do I start? Christian Long IRC : czzl From skip at pobox.com Fri Mar 7 04:43:44 2008 From: skip at pobox.com (skip at pobox.com) Date: Thu, 6 Mar 2008 21:43:44 -0600 Subject: [Chicago] Anyone here have a little time for some SpamBayes work? In-Reply-To: <47D0B155.8030500@yahoo.com> References: <47D0B155.8030500@yahoo.com> Message-ID: <18384.47600.943148.909656@montanaro-dyndns-org.local> Christian> I have a Yahoo account I access through POP. I did not know Christian> that they started offering IMAP access. I don't have Christian> SpamBayes installed now, but I'd be happy to help test. Christian> Where do I start? I was apparently wrong about Yahoo! Mail supporting IMAP. (Ken Stox alerted me to that fact.) I went back and looked again but couldn't find a "we support IMAP" statement on their website. OTOH, I did find a reference in an old discussion group message with an IMAP server address that seems to still be active at some level: % telnet imap.next.mail.yahoo.com 143 Trying 69.147.85.201... Connected to imap1.beta.mail.sp1.yahoo.com. Escape character is '^]'. * OK IMAP4rev1 server ready (3.5.24) Could you maybe see if that works? Unfortunately, imaps isn't supported, so don't do this with a username and password you care about. Skip From chris.mcavoy at gmail.com Fri Mar 7 17:36:30 2008 From: chris.mcavoy at gmail.com (Chris McAvoy) Date: Fri, 7 Mar 2008 10:36:30 -0600 Subject: [Chicago] Fwd: [Chirb] Chirb @ Flourish In-Reply-To: <49d805d70803062044y3502c88ajbfceafe5c39a3f4a@mail.gmail.com> References: <49d805d70803062044y3502c88ajbfceafe5c39a3f4a@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <3096c19d0803070836p4f66b0dep16f89d93a9e1fd51@mail.gmail.com> Hi All, I requested a table for ChiPy at Flourish. Chris ---------- Forwarded message ---------- From: Joshua McAdams Date: Thu, Mar 6, 2008 at 10:44 PM Subject: [Chirb] Chirb @ Flourish To: Chirb discussion list The Flourish (http://www.flourishconf.com) organizers are giving expo tables to local users groups. If you guys/gals are interested in promoting Chirb, you might want to grab one. Robert Serrano is who you'd need to contact. _______________________________________________ ChicagoGroup-Members-List at rubyforge.org http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/chicagogroup-members-list From christianzlong at yahoo.com Fri Mar 7 18:00:24 2008 From: christianzlong at yahoo.com (Christian Long) Date: Fri, 07 Mar 2008 11:00:24 -0600 Subject: [Chicago] Any Komodo users here? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <47D174A8.7010601@yahoo.com> I use Komodo for my IDE. In 4.3 they introduced a new, unpleasant Find & Replace dialog. Netroots to the rescue! If this concerns you, please sign my petition. Petition to restore the Find and Replace dialog in ActiveState Komodo http://www.gopetition.com/online/17507.html I'll be lobbying at Pycon. Can I wear a sandwich board in the hotel? Christian From shekay at pobox.com Fri Mar 7 20:48:34 2008 From: shekay at pobox.com (sheila miguez) Date: Fri, 7 Mar 2008 13:48:34 -0600 Subject: [Chicago] [PyCON-Organizers] Volunteer Signups! In-Reply-To: <3096c19d0803060523x2b5752acsb3ed11a442205c6a@mail.gmail.com> References: <3096c19d0803060523x2b5752acsb3ed11a442205c6a@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: On Thu, Mar 6, 2008 at 7:23 AM, Chris McAvoy wrote: > Hi ChiPy & Pycon-organizers, > then you float over the session, and magical link "sign up as session > chair" appears. > Hi, my magical link isn't showing up. -- sheila From chris.mcavoy at gmail.com Fri Mar 7 21:13:01 2008 From: chris.mcavoy at gmail.com (Chris McAvoy) Date: Fri, 7 Mar 2008 14:13:01 -0600 Subject: [Chicago] [PyCON-Organizers] Volunteer Signups! In-Reply-To: References: <3096c19d0803060523x2b5752acsb3ed11a442205c6a@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <3096c19d0803071213jabf89u82dc9a2b82279b9d@mail.gmail.com> Are you logged in? On Fri, Mar 7, 2008 at 1:48 PM, sheila miguez wrote: > On Thu, Mar 6, 2008 at 7:23 AM, Chris McAvoy wrote: > > Hi ChiPy & Pycon-organizers, > > > > then you float over the session, and magical link "sign up as session > > chair" appears. > > > > Hi, my magical link isn't showing up. > > -- > sheila > _______________________________________________ > Chicago mailing list > Chicago at python.org > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago > From shekay at pobox.com Fri Mar 7 21:25:15 2008 From: shekay at pobox.com (sheila miguez) Date: Fri, 7 Mar 2008 14:25:15 -0600 Subject: [Chicago] [PyCON-Organizers] Volunteer Signups! In-Reply-To: <3096c19d0803071213jabf89u82dc9a2b82279b9d@mail.gmail.com> References: <3096c19d0803060523x2b5752acsb3ed11a442205c6a@mail.gmail.com> <3096c19d0803071213jabf89u82dc9a2b82279b9d@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: I am. evidently I am also very impatient. because by waiting a few, just a few moments, the oddly shaped but functional magical tooltip arose. On Fri, Mar 7, 2008 at 2:13 PM, Chris McAvoy wrote: > Are you logged in? > > > > On Fri, Mar 7, 2008 at 1:48 PM, sheila miguez wrote: > > On Thu, Mar 6, 2008 at 7:23 AM, Chris McAvoy wrote: > > > Hi ChiPy & Pycon-organizers, > > > > > > > then you float over the session, and magical link "sign up as session > > > chair" appears. > > > > > > > Hi, my magical link isn't showing up. > > > > -- > > sheila > > _______________________________________________ > > Chicago mailing list > > Chicago at python.org > > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago > > > _______________________________________________ > Chicago mailing list > Chicago at python.org > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago > -- sheila From shekay at pobox.com Fri Mar 7 21:32:17 2008 From: shekay at pobox.com (sheila miguez) Date: Fri, 7 Mar 2008 14:32:17 -0600 Subject: [Chicago] [PyCON-Organizers] Volunteer Signups! In-Reply-To: References: <3096c19d0803060523x2b5752acsb3ed11a442205c6a@mail.gmail.com> <3096c19d0803071213jabf89u82dc9a2b82279b9d@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: Is it a bug or a feature that when I sign up as session chair by choosing the link in a hover text for one talk that I am also signed up to chair the other talks in the same room in the block for that day? It was convenient, since I was going to do that, but the interface doesn't imply that behavior. On Fri, Mar 7, 2008 at 2:25 PM, sheila miguez wrote: > I am. evidently I am also very impatient. > > because by waiting a few, just a few moments, the oddly shaped but > functional magical tooltip arose. > > > > On Fri, Mar 7, 2008 at 2:13 PM, Chris McAvoy wrote: > > Are you logged in? > > > > > > > > On Fri, Mar 7, 2008 at 1:48 PM, sheila miguez wrote: > > > On Thu, Mar 6, 2008 at 7:23 AM, Chris McAvoy wrote: > > > > Hi ChiPy & Pycon-organizers, > > > > > > > > > > then you float over the session, and magical link "sign up as session > > > > chair" appears. > > > > > > > > > > Hi, my magical link isn't showing up. > > > > > > -- > > > sheila > > > _______________________________________________ > > > Chicago mailing list > > > Chicago at python.org > > > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Chicago mailing list > > Chicago at python.org > > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago > > > > > > -- > sheila > -- sheila From chris.mcavoy at gmail.com Fri Mar 7 21:36:38 2008 From: chris.mcavoy at gmail.com (Chris McAvoy) Date: Fri, 7 Mar 2008 14:36:38 -0600 Subject: [Chicago] [PyCON-Organizers] Volunteer Signups! In-Reply-To: References: <3096c19d0803060523x2b5752acsb3ed11a442205c6a@mail.gmail.com> <3096c19d0803071213jabf89u82dc9a2b82279b9d@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <3096c19d0803071236u14ddd606o5af436c27e15711d@mail.gmail.com> Feature. You're in for one, you're in for three. On Fri, Mar 7, 2008 at 2:32 PM, sheila miguez wrote: > Is it a bug or a feature that when I sign up as session chair by > choosing the link in a hover text for one talk that I am also signed > up to chair the other talks in the same room in the block for that > day? > > It was convenient, since I was going to do that, but the interface > doesn't imply that behavior. > > > On Fri, Mar 7, 2008 at 2:25 PM, sheila miguez wrote: > > I am. evidently I am also very impatient. > > > > because by waiting a few, just a few moments, the oddly shaped but > > functional magical tooltip arose. > > > > > > > > On Fri, Mar 7, 2008 at 2:13 PM, Chris McAvoy wrote: > > > Are you logged in? > > > > > > > > > > > > On Fri, Mar 7, 2008 at 1:48 PM, sheila miguez wrote: > > > > On Thu, Mar 6, 2008 at 7:23 AM, Chris McAvoy wrote: > > > > > Hi ChiPy & Pycon-organizers, > > > > > > > > > > > > > then you float over the session, and magical link "sign up as session > > > > > chair" appears. > > > > > > > > > > > > > Hi, my magical link isn't showing up. > > > > > > > > -- > > > > sheila > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > > Chicago mailing list > > > > Chicago at python.org > > > > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > Chicago mailing list > > > Chicago at python.org > > > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > sheila > > > > > > -- > > > sheila > _______________________________________________ > Chicago mailing list > Chicago at python.org > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago > From tcp at mac.com Fri Mar 7 21:34:50 2008 From: tcp at mac.com (Ted Pollari) Date: Fri, 7 Mar 2008 12:34:50 -0800 Subject: [Chicago] [PyCON-Organizers] Volunteer Signups! In-Reply-To: References: <3096c19d0803060523x2b5752acsb3ed11a442205c6a@mail.gmail.com> <3096c19d0803071213jabf89u82dc9a2b82279b9d@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: On Mar 7, 2008, at 12:32 PM, sheila miguez wrote: > Is it a bug or a feature that when I sign up as session chair by > choosing the link in a hover text for one talk that I am also signed > up to chair the other talks in the same room in the block for that > day? > > It was convenient, since I was going to do that, but the interface > doesn't imply that behavior. It does, in fact, specify that that will happen in the tool-tip, I thought... -t From jeffh at dundeemt.com Fri Mar 7 22:02:14 2008 From: jeffh at dundeemt.com (Jeff Hinrichs - DM&T) Date: Fri, 7 Mar 2008 15:02:14 -0600 Subject: [Chicago] Any Komodo users here? In-Reply-To: <47D174A8.7010601@yahoo.com> References: <47D174A8.7010601@yahoo.com> Message-ID: <5aaed53f0803071302g23bf3cdcqe2348bf6bcbfbc9b@mail.gmail.com> Is it the lack of a tabbed interface? I just upgraded and am looking at it now. -jeff On Fri, Mar 7, 2008 at 11:00 AM, Christian Long wrote: > > I use Komodo for my IDE. In 4.3 they introduced a new, unpleasant Find > & Replace dialog. Netroots to the rescue! If this concerns you, please > sign my petition. > > Petition to restore the Find and Replace dialog in ActiveState Komodo > http://www.gopetition.com/online/17507.html > > I'll be lobbying at Pycon. Can I wear a sandwich board in the hotel? > > Christian > > > _______________________________________________ > Chicago mailing list > Chicago at python.org > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago > -- Jeff Hinrichs From shekay at pobox.com Fri Mar 7 22:18:43 2008 From: shekay at pobox.com (sheila miguez) Date: Fri, 7 Mar 2008 15:18:43 -0600 Subject: [Chicago] [PyCON-Organizers] Volunteer Signups! In-Reply-To: References: <3096c19d0803060523x2b5752acsb3ed11a442205c6a@mail.gmail.com> <3096c19d0803071213jabf89u82dc9a2b82279b9d@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: On Fri, Mar 7, 2008 at 2:34 PM, Ted Pollari wrote: > > It does, in fact, specify that that will happen in the tool-tip, I > thought... > > -t btw, some of the tooltips go off the screen. and can't be scrolled -- sheila From mdipierro at cs.depaul.edu Fri Mar 7 23:22:09 2008 From: mdipierro at cs.depaul.edu (Massimo Di Pierro) Date: Fri, 7 Mar 2008 16:22:09 -0600 Subject: [Chicago] new apps Message-ID: Hi everybody, New free web2py appliances on http://mdp.cti.depaul.edu/appliances/default/index including a eStore (uses Google checkout), Scriptaculous (to use effects in web2py) , Podcasts (to receive podcasts), and CAS. Massimo From christianzlong at yahoo.com Fri Mar 7 23:47:48 2008 From: christianzlong at yahoo.com (Christian Long) Date: Fri, 07 Mar 2008 16:47:48 -0600 Subject: [Chicago] Any Komodo users here? In-Reply-To: <5aaed53f0803071302g23bf3cdcqe2348bf6bcbfbc9b@mail.gmail.com> References: <47D174A8.7010601@yahoo.com> <5aaed53f0803071302g23bf3cdcqe2348bf6bcbfbc9b@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <47D1C614.1090803@yahoo.com> Jeff Hinrichs - DM&T wrote: > Is it the lack of a tabbed interface? I just upgraded and am looking at it now. > -jeff * It's different. Find & replace is a frequent, no-look operation for which I have keystroke sequences in muscle memory. * It's ugly. I can't really justify this one, but it just doesn't look nice to me. * The funny tri-state check-box they use for Match Case is a non-standard UI element. from internet import lecture * Having "Replace in files" as an option alongside all the others makes me nervous. I know they support undo, I'd just rather have it separate. It all amounts to a big change in the way I work, like stubbing my toe every time I go through the workshop. I might eventually get used to it, but for now I have work to do and I would love to have the option of using the old dialog. ActiveState got right back to me with an email asking for more detail on my complaint, which I provided :) Also, note this quote: """ Since all of the code for Find & Replace is available in Open Komodo (http://www.openkomodo.com/), it should be possible to create an extension which makes Komodo use the old dialog for find and replace operations. """ So, there's hope. I asked them if they would whip up a quick (unofficial) plugin themselves, which I would be happy to help test and maintain. They're thinkin' about it. Christian > > On Fri, Mar 7, 2008 at 11:00 AM, Christian Long > wrote: >> I use Komodo for my IDE. In 4.3 they introduced a new, unpleasant Find >> & Replace dialog. Netroots to the rescue! If this concerns you, please >> sign my petition. >> >> Petition to restore the Find and Replace dialog in ActiveState Komodo >> http://www.gopetition.com/online/17507.html >> >> I'll be lobbying at Pycon. Can I wear a sandwich board in the hotel? >> >> Christian >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Chicago mailing list >> Chicago at python.org >> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago >> > > > From carl at personnelware.com Fri Mar 7 23:38:07 2008 From: carl at personnelware.com (Carl Karsten) Date: Fri, 07 Mar 2008 16:38:07 -0600 Subject: [Chicago] rocken AV plan Message-ID: <47D1C3CF.7000205@personnelware.com> I am holding the AV contract. how sweet it is: projectors, screens, wireless mics for everyone (a pair for each session fo the the audience questions - it will be easier to get a mic to a person than trying to get the person to the mic (we are squished) - one is for the person asking a question, the other will be on it's way to the next person - the session chair will get to figure out who is next. if we are short on labor, we can hire a temp for each room to run mics.) sound system, guys running the sound system, dueling podiums for the Lightning talks, How much would you pay for all that stuff? including 4 42" plasma dislays I thought would be nice for the OS scheadule stations, the cost was around 50k. but it was missing some things, like no projectors on Saturday?! and its a bit high. So this morning we had a meeting at CTE. we took off some things, like the CD and DVD recorders. and added a few things. new plan: Every minute of pycon, including all 10 tutorials, will be video taped. even the smaller tutorials will have a small sound system, about the only thing we may not get is the tutorial attendees that don't use a mic to ask a question. If you see that happening, you have my permission to hit them with a stick. I would like to remind everyone that in 2006 for 400 attendees, the price was around 20k. 2007's cost will never happen again. I took a chance, and I got lucky. I will never take that chance again. This also includes tax, labor and the 22% service charge, $35,518.48 You can thank Larry for getting us way more equipment for way less money. fricken magic. I got more goodies on the horizon, but at least the bare minim, plus a truck load of extras is nailed down. Carl K From nerkles at gmail.com Sat Mar 8 18:09:25 2008 From: nerkles at gmail.com (Isaac Csandl) Date: Sat, 8 Mar 2008 11:09:25 -0600 Subject: [Chicago] rocken AV plan In-Reply-To: <47D1C3CF.7000205@personnelware.com> References: <47D1C3CF.7000205@personnelware.com> Message-ID: On Mar 7, 2008, at 4:38 PM, Carl Karsten wrote: > I am holding the AV contract. how sweet it is: Nice! This is going to be awesome. :) From pfein at pobox.com Mon Mar 10 11:27:58 2008 From: pfein at pobox.com (Pete) Date: Mon, 10 Mar 2008 06:27:58 -0400 Subject: [Chicago] ANN: GrassyKnoll 0.3 Message-ID: <200803100628.01068.pfein@pobox.com> I'm pleased to announce the 0.3 release of GrassyKnoll, a search engine written in Python. This is an exploratory release - while fully functional, it is not production ready. http://grassyknoll.googlecode.com/ Going to Pycon? I'll be giving a presentation on GrassyKnoll at the ChiPy meeting Thursday night: http://us.pycon.org/2008/chicago/chipy/ Highlights ========== * Multiple storage options * Multiple networked frontends * Multiple wire formats * A clean, powerful data model * Lock-free concurrency * Extensive high-level & source code documentation * A large suite of unittests Use Cases ========= Grassyknoll can provide network-accessible search platform for applications such as: * Site Search: provide "search this site" functionality on your website * Intranet Search: index all of your enterprise data * Desktop Search: simultaneously index and search your laptop's documents, emails, etc.. * More! -- Peter Fein || 773-575-0694 || pfein at pobox.com http://www.pobox.com/~pfein/ || PGP: 0xCCF6AE6B irc: pfein at freenode.net || jabber: peter.fein at gmail.com From bob.haugen at gmail.com Mon Mar 10 14:33:32 2008 From: bob.haugen at gmail.com (Bob Haugen) Date: Mon, 10 Mar 2008 08:33:32 -0500 Subject: [Chicago] Volunteer Signups! In-Reply-To: <3096c19d0803060523x2b5752acsb3ed11a442205c6a@mail.gmail.com> References: <3096c19d0803060523x2b5752acsb3ed11a442205c6a@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <343ecb3e0803100633h4502a073la91e243b64a072d9@mail.gmail.com> On Thu, Mar 6, 2008 at 8:23 AM, Chris McAvoy wrote: > * Bag Stuffing > > Thursday night of the conference, ChiPy is having it's monthly meeting > at the hotel. Peter Fein is going to talk about a project he's been > working on, and we're all going to stuff bags. It'll be fun. Like a > party. Still planning a bag stuffing session Wed night? If so, what time? From tcp at mac.com Mon Mar 10 14:37:26 2008 From: tcp at mac.com (Ted Pollari) Date: Mon, 10 Mar 2008 08:37:26 -0500 Subject: [Chicago] Volunteer Signups! In-Reply-To: <343ecb3e0803100633h4502a073la91e243b64a072d9@mail.gmail.com> References: <3096c19d0803060523x2b5752acsb3ed11a442205c6a@mail.gmail.com> <343ecb3e0803100633h4502a073la91e243b64a072d9@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <13C821A5-7284-4E06-ACE3-EB7C19615052@mac.com> On Mar 10, 2008, at 8:33 AM, Bob Haugen wrote: > On Thu, Mar 6, 2008 at 8:23 AM, Chris McAvoy > wrote: >> * Bag Stuffing >> >> Thursday night of the conference, ChiPy is having it's monthly >> meeting >> at the hotel. Peter Fein is going to talk about a project he's been >> working on, and we're all going to stuff bags. It'll be fun. Like a >> party. > > Still planning a bag stuffing session Wed night? If so, what time? Last I heard, bag stuffing will be from 6-9pm Wed night. We'd love all the help we can get and the more people there, the cooler it all gets. -ted -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mail.python.org/pipermail/chicago/attachments/20080310/8549ae48/attachment.htm From chris.mcavoy at gmail.com Mon Mar 10 17:02:18 2008 From: chris.mcavoy at gmail.com (Chris McAvoy) Date: Mon, 10 Mar 2008 11:02:18 -0500 Subject: [Chicago] Pycon! Bags! Meeting! Message-ID: <3096c19d0803100902j382440ddwb2f1c927d34c9f98@mail.gmail.com> Hi All, Please join us for our most ad-hoc meeting yet! Wednesday night we're all getting together to help with the bag stuffing effort. WE NEED YOUR HELP. So, if you have time Wednesday night from 7-9 or so, come to the hotel and look for bag stuffers. Pizza will be provided. Thursday night we're going to try and have an official ChiPy meeting. However, it's pretty sketchy as to where it will be. So you'll have to do some detective work. As details become available, they'll be put on the list. Also, bring your stuffing hands, as we'll probably be stuffing more bags. If there's a theme to Wednesday and Thursday night, it's 1) be flexible, 2) be prepared to stuff bags 3) it's fun. Chris From tcp at mac.com Mon Mar 10 21:36:17 2008 From: tcp at mac.com (Ted Pollari) Date: Mon, 10 Mar 2008 15:36:17 -0500 Subject: [Chicago] Pycon! Bags! Meeting! In-Reply-To: <3096c19d0803100902j382440ddwb2f1c927d34c9f98@mail.gmail.com> References: <3096c19d0803100902j382440ddwb2f1c927d34c9f98@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <996246ED-D2F1-44E0-9308-C9C163058866@mac.com> On Mar 10, 2008, at 11:02 AM, Chris McAvoy wrote: > Wednesday night we're all getting together to help with the bag > stuffing effort. WE NEED YOUR HELP. So, if you have time Wednesday > night from 7-9 or so, come to the hotel and look for bag stuffers. > Pizza will be provided. Correction: The start-time for the big party is 6:00 pm, but show up whenever you can... extra pizza will be accounted for if you rsvp to the ChiPy list by noon on to say you're joining us. -tcp From bob.haugen at gmail.com Mon Mar 10 22:21:11 2008 From: bob.haugen at gmail.com (Bob Haugen) Date: Mon, 10 Mar 2008 16:21:11 -0500 Subject: [Chicago] Pycon! Bags! Meeting! In-Reply-To: <996246ED-D2F1-44E0-9308-C9C163058866@mac.com> References: <3096c19d0803100902j382440ddwb2f1c927d34c9f98@mail.gmail.com> <996246ED-D2F1-44E0-9308-C9C163058866@mac.com> Message-ID: <343ecb3e0803101421i24c7069ek463c2164aeacaef3@mail.gmail.com> > Correction: The start-time for the big party is 6:00 pm, but show up > whenever you can... extra pizza will be accounted for if you rsvp to > the ChiPy list by noon on to say you're joining us. I'll be there. From carl at personnelware.com Mon Mar 10 22:43:45 2008 From: carl at personnelware.com (Carl Karsten) Date: Mon, 10 Mar 2008 16:43:45 -0500 Subject: [Chicago] power for 1000 alex Message-ID: <47D5AB91.1010502@personnelware.com> PyCon needs about 100 power strips, maybe 200. the big 6' long suckers. I just saw some at Microcenter for $45 each. thats 4500-$9000 saving $10 would be handy. Where should I get them from? Carl K From robkapteyn at gmail.com Mon Mar 10 22:45:12 2008 From: robkapteyn at gmail.com (Rob Kapteyn) Date: Mon, 10 Mar 2008 16:45:12 -0500 Subject: [Chicago] Pycon! Bags! Meeting! In-Reply-To: <996246ED-D2F1-44E0-9308-C9C163058866@mac.com> References: <3096c19d0803100902j382440ddwb2f1c927d34c9f98@mail.gmail.com> <996246ED-D2F1-44E0-9308-C9C163058866@mac.com> Message-ID: <1EFCBB05-809C-48E4-92DA-72100C8E5209@gmail.com> Me+1 will be there. -Rob On Mar 10, 2008, at 3:36 PM, Ted Pollari wrote: > > On Mar 10, 2008, at 11:02 AM, Chris McAvoy wrote: > >> Wednesday night we're all getting together to help with the bag >> stuffing effort. WE NEED YOUR HELP. So, if you have time Wednesday >> night from 7-9 or so, come to the hotel and look for bag stuffers. >> Pizza will be provided. > > Correction: The start-time for the big party is 6:00 pm, but show up > whenever you can... extra pizza will be accounted for if you rsvp to > the ChiPy list by noon on to say you're joining us. > > > -tcp > _______________________________________________ > Chicago mailing list > Chicago at python.org > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago From cstejerean at gmail.com Mon Mar 10 22:51:22 2008 From: cstejerean at gmail.com (Cosmin Stejerean) Date: Mon, 10 Mar 2008 16:51:22 -0500 Subject: [Chicago] Pycon! Bags! Meeting! In-Reply-To: <1EFCBB05-809C-48E4-92DA-72100C8E5209@gmail.com> References: <3096c19d0803100902j382440ddwb2f1c927d34c9f98@mail.gmail.com> <996246ED-D2F1-44E0-9308-C9C163058866@mac.com> <1EFCBB05-809C-48E4-92DA-72100C8E5209@gmail.com> Message-ID: <276266d0803101451y62aff965x311ba1ab8987d38b@mail.gmail.com> 6 is a bit early, I can be there at 7. - Cosmin On Mon, Mar 10, 2008 at 4:45 PM, Rob Kapteyn wrote: > Me+1 will be there. > -Rob > > On Mar 10, 2008, at 3:36 PM, Ted Pollari wrote: > > > > > On Mar 10, 2008, at 11:02 AM, Chris McAvoy wrote: > > > >> Wednesday night we're all getting together to help with the bag > >> stuffing effort. WE NEED YOUR HELP. So, if you have time Wednesday > >> night from 7-9 or so, come to the hotel and look for bag stuffers. > >> Pizza will be provided. > > > > Correction: The start-time for the big party is 6:00 pm, but show up > > whenever you can... extra pizza will be accounted for if you rsvp to > > the ChiPy list by noon on to say you're joining us. > > > > > > -tcp > > _______________________________________________ > > Chicago mailing list > > Chicago at python.org > > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago > > _______________________________________________ > Chicago mailing list > Chicago at python.org > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago > -- Cosmin Stejerean http://blog.offbytwo.com -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mail.python.org/pipermail/chicago/attachments/20080310/022e718e/attachment.htm From anthony.r.rubin at gmail.com Mon Mar 10 22:54:55 2008 From: anthony.r.rubin at gmail.com (Anthony Rubin) Date: Mon, 10 Mar 2008 16:54:55 -0500 Subject: [Chicago] power for 1000 alex In-Reply-To: <47D5AB91.1010502@personnelware.com> References: <47D5AB91.1010502@personnelware.com> Message-ID: <4cf38240803101454v408c4c5bme6e87b6008da60db@mail.gmail.com> If you call up CDW they will likely give you a better price for that quantity. On Mon, Mar 10, 2008 at 4:43 PM, Carl Karsten wrote: > PyCon needs about 100 power strips, maybe 200. the big 6' long suckers. I just > saw some at Microcenter for $45 each. thats 4500-$9000 > > saving $10 would be handy. > > Where should I get them from? > > Carl K > _______________________________________________ > Chicago mailing list > Chicago at python.org > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago > From tcp at mac.com Mon Mar 10 22:57:20 2008 From: tcp at mac.com (Ted Pollari) Date: Mon, 10 Mar 2008 16:57:20 -0500 Subject: [Chicago] power for 1000 alex In-Reply-To: <4cf38240803101454v408c4c5bme6e87b6008da60db@mail.gmail.com> References: <47D5AB91.1010502@personnelware.com> <4cf38240803101454v408c4c5bme6e87b6008da60db@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: On Mar 10, 2008, at 4:54 PM, Anthony Rubin wrote: > If you call up CDW they will likely give you a better price for that > quantity. +1 and they're here, in Chicago, right? -ted From anthony.r.rubin at gmail.com Mon Mar 10 23:05:43 2008 From: anthony.r.rubin at gmail.com (Anthony Rubin) Date: Mon, 10 Mar 2008 17:05:43 -0500 Subject: [Chicago] power for 1000 alex In-Reply-To: References: <47D5AB91.1010502@personnelware.com> <4cf38240803101454v408c4c5bme6e87b6008da60db@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <4cf38240803101505k32705115ie4c7e8c1b25a725e@mail.gmail.com> They are in the NW suburbs. On Mon, Mar 10, 2008 at 4:57 PM, Ted Pollari wrote: > > On Mar 10, 2008, at 4:54 PM, Anthony Rubin wrote: > > > If you call up CDW they will likely give you a better price for that > > quantity. > > > +1 > > and they're here, in Chicago, right? > > -ted > > _______________________________________________ > Chicago mailing list > Chicago at python.org > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago > From goodmansond at gmail.com Mon Mar 10 23:17:34 2008 From: goodmansond at gmail.com (DeanG) Date: Mon, 10 Mar 2008 17:17:34 -0500 Subject: [Chicago] power for 1000 alex In-Reply-To: <4cf38240803101505k32705115ie4c7e8c1b25a725e@mail.gmail.com> References: <47D5AB91.1010502@personnelware.com> <4cf38240803101454v408c4c5bme6e87b6008da60db@mail.gmail.com> <4cf38240803101505k32705115ie4c7e8c1b25a725e@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: Discount or Advertisement/Sponsorship opportunity? On Mon, Mar 10, 2008 at 5:05 PM, Anthony Rubin wrote: > They are in the NW suburbs. > > > > On Mon, Mar 10, 2008 at 4:57 PM, Ted Pollari wrote: > > > > On Mar 10, 2008, at 4:54 PM, Anthony Rubin wrote: > > > > > If you call up CDW they will likely give you a better price for that > > > quantity. > > > > > > +1 > > > > and they're here, in Chicago, right? > > > > -ted > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Chicago mailing list > > Chicago at python.org > > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago > > > _______________________________________________ > Chicago mailing list > Chicago at python.org > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago > From carl at personnelware.com Mon Mar 10 23:37:03 2008 From: carl at personnelware.com (Carl Karsten) Date: Mon, 10 Mar 2008 17:37:03 -0500 Subject: [Chicago] power for 1000 alex In-Reply-To: <4cf38240803101454v408c4c5bme6e87b6008da60db@mail.gmail.com> References: <47D5AB91.1010502@personnelware.com> <4cf38240803101454v408c4c5bme6e87b6008da60db@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <47D5B80F.9080601@personnelware.com> um, let me try again: If someone will take responsibility of figuring out where I should get them from, I will get them. better yet if someone will get them and bring them to the hotel (we can start bringing stuff there now.) submit the receipt PSF will reimburse you. Otherwise I will just get them from somewhere close, because I don't have time to shop around. Carl K Anthony Rubin wrote: > If you call up CDW they will likely give you a better price for that quantity. > > On Mon, Mar 10, 2008 at 4:43 PM, Carl Karsten wrote: >> PyCon needs about 100 power strips, maybe 200. the big 6' long suckers. I just >> saw some at Microcenter for $45 each. thats 4500-$9000 >> >> saving $10 would be handy. >> >> Where should I get them from? >> >> Carl K >> _______________________________________________ >> Chicago mailing list >> Chicago at python.org >> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago >> > _______________________________________________ > Chicago mailing list > Chicago at python.org > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago > From tcp at mac.com Mon Mar 10 23:39:07 2008 From: tcp at mac.com (Ted Pollari) Date: Mon, 10 Mar 2008 17:39:07 -0500 Subject: [Chicago] [PyCON-Organizers] power for 1000 alex In-Reply-To: <47D5B33D.30000@taupro.com> References: <47D5AB91.1010502@personnelware.com> <47D5B33D.30000@taupro.com> Message-ID: <2E1AE58E-3AB9-4061-9C44-47580158E520@mac.com> On Mar 10, 2008, at 5:16 PM, Jeff Rush wrote: > Carl Karsten wrote: >> PyCon needs about 100 power strips, maybe 200. the big 6' long >> suckers. I just >> saw some at Microcenter for $45 each. thats 4500-$9000 >> >> saving $10 would be handy. >> >> Where should I get them from? > > 1. According to old threads on the list, the hotel is supposed to be > providing > all of the power strips this time around, along with the labor to > tape them > down. If we're doing it all, that a very big last-minute project, > and impacts > I thought the union rules for the hotel. > This was always my understanding, and thus I may be the source of this (apparent) misunderstanding. The hotel will be getting us power to many strategic points, but they do not have the hardware to do what we need. As for the labor -- at this point it's more important that it get done and I care less about who does it and I'm not inclined to start asking questions about union rules -- they had their chance to object to this plan already =) > 2. I shipped the powerstrips we used in past years to CTE offices - > nowhere > the quantity you mention thought. > We have them, we need more. Do you remember how long they were? Were they 72 inch strips? > 3. The best price I see for 6' strips is Fry's Electronics - $25/ea. > Excellent, thank you for the looking/finding > 4. Due to the ballroom layouts and the cramped space, I thought we > were not > using many tables, so why are so many strips needed? Tables or no tables, I'd expect that people will want to use their laptops and use means a need for power. In years past, I'd bet the popularity of the tables was at least 40% power related. As such, we need to do something to handle power concerns and we can't just let people fight over the 3 rows of chairs at the back -- that won't meet demand. As such, we're going to wire many more rows of the theater seating. I fear that if we don't, power will be the thing to complain about once we get networking straightened out. -ted From steve at holdenweb.com Mon Mar 10 22:54:24 2008 From: steve at holdenweb.com (Steve Holden) Date: Mon, 10 Mar 2008 17:54:24 -0400 Subject: [Chicago] [PyCON-Organizers] power for 1000 alex In-Reply-To: <47D5AB91.1010502@personnelware.com> References: <47D5AB91.1010502@personnelware.com> Message-ID: <47D5AE10.6060303@holdenweb.com> Carl Karsten wrote: > PyCon needs about 100 power strips, maybe 200. the big 6' long suckers. I just > saw some at Microcenter for $45 each. thats 4500-$9000 > > saving $10 would be handy. > > Where should I get them from? > I dunno, but if you're buying 100 you ought to be able to get a discount. Your biggest problem is going to be finding someone with 100 in stock. regards Steve -- Steve Holden +1 571 484 6266 +1 800 494 3119 Holden Web LLC http://www.holdenweb.com/ From jeff at taupro.com Mon Mar 10 23:16:29 2008 From: jeff at taupro.com (Jeff Rush) Date: Mon, 10 Mar 2008 17:16:29 -0500 Subject: [Chicago] [PyCON-Organizers] power for 1000 alex In-Reply-To: <47D5AB91.1010502@personnelware.com> References: <47D5AB91.1010502@personnelware.com> Message-ID: <47D5B33D.30000@taupro.com> Carl Karsten wrote: > PyCon needs about 100 power strips, maybe 200. the big 6' long suckers. I just > saw some at Microcenter for $45 each. thats 4500-$9000 > > saving $10 would be handy. > > Where should I get them from? 1. According to old threads on the list, the hotel is supposed to be providing all of the power strips this time around, along with the labor to tape them down. If we're doing it all, that a very big last-minute project, and impacts I thought the union rules for the hotel. 2. I shipped the powerstrips we used in past years to CTE offices - nowhere the quantity you mention thought. 3. The best price I see for 6' strips is Fry's Electronics - $25/ea. 4. Due to the ballroom layouts and the cramped space, I thought we were not using many tables, so why are so many strips needed? -Jeff From ken at stox.org Tue Mar 11 00:37:21 2008 From: ken at stox.org (Kenneth P. Stox) Date: Mon, 10 Mar 2008 18:37:21 -0500 Subject: [Chicago] [PyCON-Organizers] power for 1000 alex In-Reply-To: <2E1AE58E-3AB9-4061-9C44-47580158E520@mac.com> References: <47D5AB91.1010502@personnelware.com> <47D5B33D.30000@taupro.com> <2E1AE58E-3AB9-4061-9C44-47580158E520@mac.com> Message-ID: <1205192241.9590.91.camel@stox.dyndns.org> On Mon, 2008-03-10 at 17:39 -0500, Ted Pollari wrote: > This was always my understanding, and thus I may be the source of this > (apparent) misunderstanding. The hotel will be getting us power to > many strategic points, but they do not have the hardware to do what we > need. As for the labor -- at this point it's more important that it > get done and I care less about who does it and I'm not inclined to > start asking questions about union rules -- they had their chance to > object to this plan already =) Do NOT TAUNT Happy Union! Sorry to say this, but one of the surest paths to disaster is to screw around with the Unions in Chicago. I learned this the hard way at McCormick years ago. From tcp at mac.com Tue Mar 11 00:50:33 2008 From: tcp at mac.com (Ted Pollari) Date: Mon, 10 Mar 2008 18:50:33 -0500 Subject: [Chicago] [PyCON-Organizers] power for 1000 alex In-Reply-To: <1205192241.9590.91.camel@stox.dyndns.org> References: <47D5AB91.1010502@personnelware.com> <47D5B33D.30000@taupro.com> <2E1AE58E-3AB9-4061-9C44-47580158E520@mac.com> <1205192241.9590.91.camel@stox.dyndns.org> Message-ID: On Mar 10, 2008, at 6:37 PM, Kenneth P. Stox wrote: > Do NOT TAUNT Happy Union! First off, excellent reference... > Sorry to say this, but one of the surest paths > to disaster is to screw around with the Unions in Chicago. I learned > this the hard way at McCormick years ago. I hear your warning -- well, I have to believe that CTE wouldn't let us do this without some assurance that we'll be okay... -tcp From merush at taupro.com Tue Mar 11 00:22:01 2008 From: merush at taupro.com (Mary E Rush) Date: Mon, 10 Mar 2008 18:22:01 -0500 Subject: [Chicago] [PyCON-Organizers] power for 1000 alex In-Reply-To: <2E1AE58E-3AB9-4061-9C44-47580158E520@mac.com> References: <47D5AB91.1010502@personnelware.com> <47D5B33D.30000@taupro.com> <2E1AE58E-3AB9-4061-9C44-47580158E520@mac.com> Message-ID: <47D5C299.9010805@taupro.com> Ted Pollari wrote: > On Mar 10, 2008, at 5:16 PM, Jeff Rush wrote: > > > >> 2. I shipped the powerstrips we used in past years to CTE offices - >> nowhere >> the quantity you mention thought. >> > We have them, we need more. Do you remember how long they were? Were > they 72 inch strips? > The ones we sent were 48 inches. I couldn't pull the one all the way out from under the couch without unplugging it, but it has for-sure 11 sockets, and probably 12. >> 3. The best price I see for 6' strips is Fry's Electronics - $25/ea. >> > > Excellent, thank you for the looking/finding > Jeff says when he was in Fry's a couple weeks ago, they had them on a couple of skids in the aisle. He also says we will definitely need power strips for the tutorials. Mary From carl at personnelware.com Tue Mar 11 02:28:50 2008 From: carl at personnelware.com (Carl Karsten) Date: Mon, 10 Mar 2008 20:28:50 -0500 Subject: [Chicago] can I buy a ubuntu dell from a local store? Message-ID: <47D5E052.5080805@personnelware.com> I need to get 4 laptops to run Ubuntu. Dell sells laptops with Ubuntu loaded, and I would like to get one of those. tomorrow. I don't have time to wait for them to assemble and ship it. (yeah, like many things, should have done this a week ago...) So, anyone know a store around here that can sell me one? Carl K From mtobis at gmail.com Tue Mar 11 05:15:59 2008 From: mtobis at gmail.com (Michael Tobis) Date: Mon, 10 Mar 2008 23:15:59 -0500 Subject: [Chicago] Pycon! Bags! Meeting! In-Reply-To: <276266d0803101451y62aff965x311ba1ab8987d38b@mail.gmail.com> References: <3096c19d0803100902j382440ddwb2f1c927d34c9f98@mail.gmail.com> <996246ED-D2F1-44E0-9308-C9C163058866@mac.com> <1EFCBB05-809C-48E4-92DA-72100C8E5209@gmail.com> <276266d0803101451y62aff965x311ba1ab8987d38b@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: mmmm pizza never one to let a ChiPy food thread pass me by. Count me in. (Arriving in town tomorrow...) mt On Mon, Mar 10, 2008 at 4:51 PM, Cosmin Stejerean wrote: > 6 is a bit early, I can be there at 7. > > - Cosmin > > > On Mon, Mar 10, 2008 at 4:45 PM, Rob Kapteyn wrote: > > > Me+1 will be there. > > -Rob > > > > On Mar 10, 2008, at 3:36 PM, Ted Pollari wrote: > > > > > > > > On Mar 10, 2008, at 11:02 AM, Chris McAvoy wrote: > > > > > >> Wednesday night we're all getting together to help with the bag > > >> stuffing effort. WE NEED YOUR HELP. So, if you have time Wednesday > > >> night from 7-9 or so, come to the hotel and look for bag stuffers. > > >> Pizza will be provided. > > > > > > Correction: The start-time for the big party is 6:00 pm, but show up > > > whenever you can... extra pizza will be accounted for if you rsvp to > > > the ChiPy list by noon on to say you're joining us. > > > > > > > > > -tcp > > > _______________________________________________ > > > Chicago mailing list > > > Chicago at python.org > > > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Chicago mailing list > > Chicago at python.org > > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago > > > > > > -- > Cosmin Stejerean > http://blog.offbytwo.com > _______________________________________________ > Chicago mailing list > Chicago at python.org > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mail.python.org/pipermail/chicago/attachments/20080310/73b76069/attachment.htm From tcp at mac.com Tue Mar 11 05:26:56 2008 From: tcp at mac.com (Ted Pollari) Date: Mon, 10 Mar 2008 23:26:56 -0500 Subject: [Chicago] Pycon! Bags! Meeting! In-Reply-To: <276266d0803101451y62aff965x311ba1ab8987d38b@mail.gmail.com> References: <3096c19d0803100902j382440ddwb2f1c927d34c9f98@mail.gmail.com> <996246ED-D2F1-44E0-9308-C9C163058866@mac.com> <1EFCBB05-809C-48E4-92DA-72100C8E5209@gmail.com> <276266d0803101451y62aff965x311ba1ab8987d38b@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: On Mar 10, 2008, at 4:51 PM, Cosmin Stejerean wrote: > 6 is a bit early, I can be there at 7. > > - Cosmin We'll take all the help we can get! Rumor has it that the process may start with any people on hand as early as 4:00 pm or so (maybe even 3!!) -- but there'll certainly be enough for whenever people can get there Wednesday... On that note, if I am not there by 6, it's because I'm out filling shopping carts full of booty for PyCon... okay, more like office supplies than pirate treasure, but, whatever.... -ted From d-beazley at sbcglobal.net Tue Mar 11 13:43:14 2008 From: d-beazley at sbcglobal.net (David Beazley) Date: Tue, 11 Mar 2008 05:43:14 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Chicago] Power for 1000 In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <346255.51124.qm@web81905.mail.mud.yahoo.com> I just wanted to add my 0.02 on this powerstrip thread. My brother works in audio-visual production and does a lot of conferences/tradeshows (including many at Chicago hotels and at McCormick). Chicago is legendary for its unions as so far as I understand it, the union has to be involved with everything short of you speaking into a microphone. Frankly, I don't think PyCon should get involved with that. Also, unless you know something about the wiring, I don't think you can just go around plugging in several hundred power strips. It might violate fire-code or any number of other laws (of which there are many). Also, I've been to big conferences such as USENIX and O'Reilly before---I don't EVER remember a conference of that size trying to provide power to 1000 people. That's what batteries are for. The only place you might need power is in tutorials. -Dave From shekay at pobox.com Tue Mar 11 15:23:15 2008 From: shekay at pobox.com (sheila miguez) Date: Tue, 11 Mar 2008 09:23:15 -0500 Subject: [Chicago] Pycon! Bags! Meeting! In-Reply-To: References: <3096c19d0803100902j382440ddwb2f1c927d34c9f98@mail.gmail.com> <996246ED-D2F1-44E0-9308-C9C163058866@mac.com> <1EFCBB05-809C-48E4-92DA-72100C8E5209@gmail.com> <276266d0803101451y62aff965x311ba1ab8987d38b@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: On Mon, Mar 10, 2008 at 11:26 PM, Ted Pollari wrote: > > On Mar 10, 2008, at 4:51 PM, Cosmin Stejerean wrote: > > > 6 is a bit early, I can be there at 7. > > > > - Cosmin > > > We'll take all the help we can get! Rumor has it that the process may > start with any people on hand as early as 4:00 pm or so (maybe even > 3!!) -- but there'll certainly be enough for whenever people can get > there Wednesday... I'm not gonna be there Wednesday evening unless I can convince my brother that bag stuffing is an integral part of spring break. -- sheila From mtobis at gmail.com Tue Mar 11 16:04:08 2008 From: mtobis at gmail.com (Michael Tobis) Date: Tue, 11 Mar 2008 10:04:08 -0500 Subject: [Chicago] Pycon! Bags! Meeting! In-Reply-To: References: <3096c19d0803100902j382440ddwb2f1c927d34c9f98@mail.gmail.com> <996246ED-D2F1-44E0-9308-C9C163058866@mac.com> <1EFCBB05-809C-48E4-92DA-72100C8E5209@gmail.com> <276266d0803101451y62aff965x311ba1ab8987d38b@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: OK for the when; what about the where? mt -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mail.python.org/pipermail/chicago/attachments/20080311/ac270354/attachment.htm From tcp at mac.com Tue Mar 11 16:31:40 2008 From: tcp at mac.com (Ted Pollari) Date: Tue, 11 Mar 2008 10:31:40 -0500 Subject: [Chicago] Pycon! Bags! Meeting! In-Reply-To: References: <3096c19d0803100902j382440ddwb2f1c927d34c9f98@mail.gmail.com> <996246ED-D2F1-44E0-9308-C9C163058866@mac.com> <1EFCBB05-809C-48E4-92DA-72100C8E5209@gmail.com> <276266d0803101451y62aff965x311ba1ab8987d38b@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: On Mar 11, 2008, at 10:04 AM, Michael Tobis wrote: > OK for the when; what about the where? > > mt The atrium, I believe. When you walk into the lobby, turn left and walk a little ways. The first hallway on the right; it'll be the big open space on your left. See: http://www.flickr.com/photos/pollari/422429379/sizes/l/ From pfein at pobox.com Tue Mar 11 16:34:04 2008 From: pfein at pobox.com (Pete) Date: Tue, 11 Mar 2008 11:34:04 -0400 Subject: [Chicago] Power for 1000 In-Reply-To: <346255.51124.qm@web81905.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <346255.51124.qm@web81905.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <200803111134.04728.pfein@pobox.com> On Tuesday March 11 2008 8:43:14 am David Beazley wrote: > Also, I've been to big conferences such as USENIX and > O'Reilly before---I don't EVER remember a conference > of that size trying to provide power to 1000 people. > That's what batteries are for. The only place you > might need power is in tutorials. I'll second that - last year, I only plugged in my laptop when my battery was low. People we're generally cool about unplugging if someone needed to charge up. Given that your typical laptop gets around 2 hours on battery and 1/2 hour talks, outlets for around 1/3 of the attendees should suffice. --Pete -- Peter Fein || 773-575-0694 || pfein at pobox.com http://www.pobox.com/~pfein/ || PGP: 0xCCF6AE6B irc: pfein at freenode.net || jabber: peter.fein at gmail.com From pfein at pobox.com Tue Mar 11 20:09:31 2008 From: pfein at pobox.com (Pete) Date: Tue, 11 Mar 2008 15:09:31 -0400 Subject: [Chicago] Pycon! Bags! Meeting! In-Reply-To: <3096c19d0803100902j382440ddwb2f1c927d34c9f98@mail.gmail.com> References: <3096c19d0803100902j382440ddwb2f1c927d34c9f98@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <200803111509.31208.pfein@pobox.com> On Monday March 10 2008 12:02:18 pm Chris McAvoy wrote: > Thursday night we're going to try and have an official ChiPy meeting. > However, it's pretty sketchy as to where it will be. So you'll have > to do some detective work. As details become available, they'll be > put on the list. Also, bring your stuffing hands, as we'll probably > be stuffing more bags. There's an open 30 minute slot on Saturday 2:10-2:45 in Ballroom 3. http://us.pycon.org/2008/conference/schedule/ It has been suggested by yours truly on #pycon and pycon-organizers at python.org that we have our meeting then. This would be not only ChiPy's best, and perhaps biggest, meeting ever, but also our most timely. The main problem with a Thursday night meeting was lack of space. Here's a space lacking a meeting. ;-) What do y'all think? --Pete PS: Here's an outline of the talk I pitched. Title: GrassyKnoll: A Search Engine in Python Summary: GrassyKnoll is a search engine written in Python. ?It features a powerful storage model supporting several backends, a RESTful HTTP inteface and message passing concurrency for multi-core and distributed programming. It was conceived and prototyped at the PyCon 2007 sprints. This talk will discuss GrassyKnoll's archictecture and its potential for large-scale computing. ?It is intended for intermediate to advanced Python programmers. ?Familiarity with HTTP, threads and distributed computing is helpful but not required. Outline ======= ?- Introduction ? ?- project goals ? ?- project history ? ?- status ?- Collections: a universal storage model ? ?- description of the model ? ?- comparison to traditional databases ? ?- Supported backends: lucene, sqlite, etc. ? ?- Queries: Questions Answered, quickly ?- REST: Embracing HTTP ? ?- description of REST ? ?- comparison to RPC ? ?- advantages of REST ? ?- REST and the Collection model ?- Message Passing: Concurrency Simplified ? ?- description, theory and influences ? ?- Advantages: Death to deadlock & Killing the GIL ? ?- Distributed Computing with HTTP : turtles all the way down ?- Future Work ? ?- Sprinting ? ?- More backends ? ?- Towards a new HTTP library for Python ? ?- Possible use cases -- Peter Fein || 773-575-0694 || pfein at pobox.com http://www.pobox.com/~pfein/ || PGP: 0xCCF6AE6B irc: pfein at freenode.net || jabber: peter.fein at gmail.com From tcp at mac.com Tue Mar 11 20:23:07 2008 From: tcp at mac.com (Ted Pollari) Date: Tue, 11 Mar 2008 14:23:07 -0500 Subject: [Chicago] Pycon! Bags! Meeting! In-Reply-To: <200803111509.31208.pfein@pobox.com> References: <3096c19d0803100902j382440ddwb2f1c927d34c9f98@mail.gmail.com> <200803111509.31208.pfein@pobox.com> Message-ID: <9704AA64-69C3-4665-A35D-4B8022EBDA94@mac.com> On Mar 11, 2008, at 2:09 PM, Pete wrote: > On Monday March 10 2008 12:02:18 pm Chris McAvoy wrote: >> Thursday night we're going to try and have an official ChiPy meeting. >> However, it's pretty sketchy as to where it will be. So you'll have >> to do some detective work. As details become available, they'll be >> put on the list. Also, bring your stuffing hands, as we'll probably >> be stuffing more bags. > > There's an open 30 minute slot on Saturday 2:10-2:45 in Ballroom 3. > http://us.pycon.org/2008/conference/schedule/ > > It has been suggested by yours truly on #pycon and pycon-organizers at python.org > that we have our meeting then. This would be not only ChiPy's best, > and > perhaps biggest, meeting ever, but also our most timely. > > The main problem with a Thursday night meeting was lack of space. > Here's a > space lacking a meeting. ;-) What do y'all think? This sounds like a decent compromise -- we could double-up on non- traditional meetings...Thursday would then mainly be a "come, help, volunteer!" thing and then Friday would be Pete's talk? (if we can sell the organizers on it) -tcp From pkropf at gmail.com Tue Mar 11 16:51:45 2008 From: pkropf at gmail.com (Peter Kropf) Date: Tue, 11 Mar 2008 08:51:45 -0700 Subject: [Chicago] [PyCON-Organizers] power for 1000 alex In-Reply-To: <47D5AE10.6060303@holdenweb.com> References: <47D5AB91.1010502@personnelware.com> <47D5AE10.6060303@holdenweb.com> Message-ID: On Mon, Mar 10, 2008 at 2:54 PM, Steve Holden wrote: > Carl Karsten wrote: > > PyCon needs about 100 power strips, maybe 200. the big 6' long suckers. > I just > > saw some at Microcenter for $45 each. thats 4500-$9000 > > > > saving $10 would be handy. > > > > Where should I get them from? > > > I dunno, but if you're buying 100 you ought to be able to get a > discount. Your biggest problem is going to be finding someone with 100 > in stock. Just an FYI, I'll be in Lombard, IL till tomorrow and could get to the Fry's here and pickup additional 6' power strips if needed. - Peter -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mail.python.org/pipermail/chicago/attachments/20080311/45ef41e1/attachment.htm From mdipierro at cs.depaul.edu Tue Mar 11 21:40:22 2008 From: mdipierro at cs.depaul.edu (Massimo Di Pierro) Date: Tue, 11 Mar 2008 15:40:22 -0500 Subject: [Chicago] [PyCON-Organizers] power for 1000 alex In-Reply-To: References: <47D5AB91.1010502@personnelware.com> <47D5AE10.6060303@holdenweb.com> Message-ID: <91569C07-27F2-4CB0-92AD-43F348349C50@cs.depaul.edu> 3.99? http://www.acehardware.com/product/index.jsp? productId=1286473&cp=2568454.2632223.1259253&parentPage=family On Mar 11, 2008, at 10:51 AM, Peter Kropf wrote: > On Mon, Mar 10, 2008 at 2:54 PM, Steve Holden > wrote: > Carl Karsten wrote: > > PyCon needs about 100 power strips, maybe 200. the big 6' long > suckers. I just > > saw some at Microcenter for $45 each. thats 4500-$9000 > > > > saving $10 would be handy. > > > > Where should I get them from? > > > I dunno, but if you're buying 100 you ought to be able to get a > discount. Your biggest problem is going to be finding someone with 100 > in stock. > > > Just an FYI, I'll be in Lombard, IL till tomorrow and could get to > the Fry's here and pickup additional 6' power strips if needed. > > - Peter > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mail.python.org/pipermail/chicago/attachments/20080311/81cde0d1/attachment-0001.htm From mdipierro at cs.depaul.edu Tue Mar 11 21:42:59 2008 From: mdipierro at cs.depaul.edu (Massimo Di Pierro) Date: Tue, 11 Mar 2008 15:42:59 -0500 Subject: [Chicago] [PyCON-Organizers] power for 1000 alex In-Reply-To: <91569C07-27F2-4CB0-92AD-43F348349C50@cs.depaul.edu> References: <47D5AB91.1010502@personnelware.com> <47D5AE10.6060303@holdenweb.com> <91569C07-27F2-4CB0-92AD-43F348349C50@cs.depaul.edu> Message-ID: <30FAC080-3D5B-4876-A4AF-7DFC33C1609B@cs.depaul.edu> You may needs to add a few of these http://www.acehardware.com/product/index.jsp? productId=1341286&cp=2568454.2632223.2632263.1259176&parentPage=family for $4.79. Can I keep the $7000 you save? Massimo On Mar 11, 2008, at 3:40 PM, Massimo Di Pierro wrote: > 3.99? > > http://www.acehardware.com/product/index.jsp? > productId=1286473&cp=2568454.2632223.1259253&parentPage=family > > > > On Mar 11, 2008, at 10:51 AM, Peter Kropf wrote: > >> On Mon, Mar 10, 2008 at 2:54 PM, Steve Holden >> wrote: >> Carl Karsten wrote: >> > PyCon needs about 100 power strips, maybe 200. the big 6' long >> suckers. I just >> > saw some at Microcenter for $45 each. thats 4500-$9000 >> > >> > saving $10 would be handy. >> > >> > Where should I get them from? >> > >> I dunno, but if you're buying 100 you ought to be able to get a >> discount. Your biggest problem is going to be finding someone with >> 100 >> in stock. >> >> >> Just an FYI, I'll be in Lombard, IL till tomorrow and could get to >> the Fry's here and pickup additional 6' power strips if needed. >> >> - Peter >> >> > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mail.python.org/pipermail/chicago/attachments/20080311/b70c550f/attachment.htm From robkapteyn at gmail.com Tue Mar 11 22:30:47 2008 From: robkapteyn at gmail.com (Rob Kapteyn) Date: Tue, 11 Mar 2008 16:30:47 -0500 Subject: [Chicago] Power for 1000 In-Reply-To: <346255.51124.qm@web81905.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <346255.51124.qm@web81905.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <93DBFF09-D08C-4AEA-9440-4107704C5A1B@gmail.com> The conference in in Rosemont, just outside of Chicago. I know a lot of conferences go to Rosemont just because there is much less bureaucratic hassle. My experience is that those hotels are very accommodating. Dallas had power strips for just about everybody. We do want to make sure that the power strips provide some overload protection (almost all do). I did some quick calculations (below). We also need to make sure that the main conference room provides enough outlets. The MAX rating on most laptop power bricks is 45 or 65 watts. Assuming an average power utilization of 40 watts per laptop (not all will be charging): 40 watts / 120 volts = 0.33 amps per laptop. Normal outlets and power strips are rated for 15 amps before the breaker pops: 15 amps / 0.33 amps per laptop = 45 laptops maximum per outlet or power strip. For 1000, the hotel should provide at least 1000 laptops / 45 laptops per outlet == 23 outlets. -Rob On Mar 11, 2008, at 7:43 AM, David Beazley wrote: > I just wanted to add my 0.02 on this powerstrip > thread. My brother works in audio-visual production > and does a lot of conferences/tradeshows (including > many at Chicago hotels and at McCormick). Chicago is > legendary for its unions as so far as I understand it, > the union has to be involved with everything short of > you speaking into a microphone. Frankly, I don't > think PyCon should get involved with that. Also, > unless you know something about the wiring, I don't > think you can just go around plugging in several > hundred power strips. It might violate fire-code or > any number of other laws (of which there are many). > > Also, I've been to big conferences such as USENIX and > O'Reilly before---I don't EVER remember a conference > of that size trying to provide power to 1000 people. > That's what batteries are for. The only place you > might need power is in tutorials. > > -Dave > > > > > _______________________________________________ > Chicago mailing list > Chicago at python.org > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago From cstejerean at gmail.com Tue Mar 11 22:33:14 2008 From: cstejerean at gmail.com (Cosmin Stejerean) Date: Tue, 11 Mar 2008 16:33:14 -0500 Subject: [Chicago] [PyCON-Organizers] power for 1000 alex In-Reply-To: <30FAC080-3D5B-4876-A4AF-7DFC33C1609B@cs.depaul.edu> References: <47D5AB91.1010502@personnelware.com> <47D5AE10.6060303@holdenweb.com> <91569C07-27F2-4CB0-92AD-43F348349C50@cs.depaul.edu> <30FAC080-3D5B-4876-A4AF-7DFC33C1609B@cs.depaul.edu> Message-ID: <276266d0803111433x73f1bffbg7ac8489844f93df@mail.gmail.com> Something tells me this is not the kind of power strips PyCon is looking for. I am thinking more along the lines of http://www.amazon.com/Power-Strip-12-Outlets-Inch/dp/B000Z5AN34/ref=sr_1_19?ie=UTF8&s=electronics&qid=1205270866&sr=1-19 - Cosmin On Tue, Mar 11, 2008 at 3:42 PM, Massimo Di Pierro wrote: > You may needs to add a few of these > > http://www.acehardware.com/product/index.jsp?productId=1341286&cp=2568454.2632223.2632263.1259176&parentPage=family > > for $4.79. > > Can I keep the $7000 you save? > > Massimo > > On Mar 11, 2008, at 3:40 PM, Massimo Di Pierro wrote: > > 3.99? > > http://www.acehardware.com/product/index.jsp?productId=1286473&cp=2568454.2632223.1259253&parentPage=family > > > > On Mar 11, 2008, at 10:51 AM, Peter Kropf wrote: > > On Mon, Mar 10, 2008 at 2:54 PM, Steve Holden wrote: > > > Carl Karsten wrote: > > > PyCon needs about 100 power strips, maybe 200. the big 6' long > > suckers. I just > > > saw some at Microcenter for $45 each. thats 4500-$9000 > > > > > > saving $10 would be handy. > > > > > > Where should I get them from? > > > > > I dunno, but if you're buying 100 you ought to be able to get a > > discount. Your biggest problem is going to be finding someone with 100 > > in stock. > > > > Just an FYI, I'll be in Lombard, IL till tomorrow and could get to the > Fry's here and pickup additional 6' power strips if needed. > > - Peter > > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > Chicago mailing list > Chicago at python.org > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago > > -- Cosmin Stejerean http://blog.offbytwo.com -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mail.python.org/pipermail/chicago/attachments/20080311/4b8f78bd/attachment.htm From tcp at mac.com Tue Mar 11 22:49:41 2008 From: tcp at mac.com (Ted Pollari) Date: Tue, 11 Mar 2008 16:49:41 -0500 Subject: [Chicago] [PyCON-Organizers] power for 1000 alex In-Reply-To: References: <47D5AB91.1010502@personnelware.com> <47D5AE10.6060303@holdenweb.com> Message-ID: <5B3FA966-B867-4542-A214-AB46251A60B5@mac.com> On Mar 11, 2008, at 10:51 AM, Peter Kropf wrote: > > > Just an FYI, I'll be in Lombard, IL till tomorrow and could get to > the Fry's here and pickup additional 6' power strips if needed. > > - Peter Thanks, but the word from Carl is that it is done -- 150 more 4 ft strips made it to the hotel this afternoon! -tcp From shekay at pobox.com Tue Mar 11 23:39:27 2008 From: shekay at pobox.com (sheila miguez) Date: Tue, 11 Mar 2008 17:39:27 -0500 Subject: [Chicago] Pycon! Bags! Meeting! In-Reply-To: <9704AA64-69C3-4665-A35D-4B8022EBDA94@mac.com> References: <3096c19d0803100902j382440ddwb2f1c927d34c9f98@mail.gmail.com> <200803111509.31208.pfein@pobox.com> <9704AA64-69C3-4665-A35D-4B8022EBDA94@mac.com> Message-ID: On Tue, Mar 11, 2008 at 2:23 PM, Ted Pollari wrote: > > On Mar 11, 2008, at 2:09 PM, Pete wrote: > > It has been suggested by yours truly on #pycon and pycon-organizers at python.org > > that we have our meeting then. This would be not only ChiPy's best, > > and > > perhaps biggest, meeting ever, but also our most timely. > > > > The main problem with a Thursday night meeting was lack of space. > > Here's a > > space lacking a meeting. ;-) What do y'all think? > > > This sounds like a decent compromise -- we could double-up on non- > traditional meetings...Thursday would then mainly be a "come, help, > volunteer!" thing and then Friday would be Pete's talk? (if we can > sell the organizers on it) Does that mean no non-pycon people at our chipy meeting? -- sheila From hsu.feihong at yahoo.com Wed Mar 12 00:31:47 2008 From: hsu.feihong at yahoo.com (Feihong Hsu) Date: Tue, 11 Mar 2008 16:31:47 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Chicago] Pycon! Bags! Meeting! In-Reply-To: <996246ED-D2F1-44E0-9308-C9C163058866@mac.com> Message-ID: <621264.71367.qm@web34802.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Count me in. --- Ted Pollari wrote: > > Correction: The start-time for the big party is 6:00 pm, but show > up > whenever you can... extra pizza will be accounted for if you rsvp > to > the ChiPy list by noon on to say you're joining us. > > > -tcp > _______________________________________________ > Chicago mailing list > Chicago at python.org > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago > ____________________________________________________________________________________ Looking for last minute shopping deals? Find them fast with Yahoo! Search. http://tools.search.yahoo.com/newsearch/category.php?category=shopping From tcp at mac.com Wed Mar 12 00:27:56 2008 From: tcp at mac.com (Ted Pollari) Date: Tue, 11 Mar 2008 18:27:56 -0500 Subject: [Chicago] Need PyCon Shopping Help Message-ID: <40EDF70F-887C-4E4C-82D3-730BFA4ACDD5@mac.com> Hey ChiPy folks... We need 3 inch wide gaffers tape, say 30 rolls (60 yrdx3in) -- can someone locate and purchase this? I know it's a big cost, but you'll be reimbursed ASAP by David Goodger (so save the receipt) -- we need this to make it to the hotel tomorrow evening (say, by 5 or so) -- I've got my hands full buying a bunch of other stuff and can't take the time at the moment to source the gaff tape after our initial source (American Sci. & Surplus) turned out to no longer carry the cheap stuff. Any takers? Feel free to call me @ 773.817.0768 if you need quicker answers! thanks, ted From pfein at pobox.com Wed Mar 12 08:49:28 2008 From: pfein at pobox.com (Pete) Date: Wed, 12 Mar 2008 03:49:28 -0400 Subject: [Chicago] Pycon! Bags! Meeting! In-Reply-To: <9704AA64-69C3-4665-A35D-4B8022EBDA94@mac.com> References: <3096c19d0803100902j382440ddwb2f1c927d34c9f98@mail.gmail.com> <200803111509.31208.pfein@pobox.com> <9704AA64-69C3-4665-A35D-4B8022EBDA94@mac.com> Message-ID: <200803120349.30245.pfein@pobox.com> Here's a quick set of links to everything you'd want to know about my project, GrassyKnoll: http://code.google.com/p/grassyknoll/wiki/GrassyKnoll Except the talk, which I'm working on. zzzZZZzz... --Pete On Tuesday March 11 2008 3:23:07 pm Ted Pollari wrote: > On Mar 11, 2008, at 2:09 PM, Pete wrote: > > On Monday March 10 2008 12:02:18 pm Chris McAvoy wrote: > >> Thursday night we're going to try and have an official ChiPy meeting. > >> However, it's pretty sketchy as to where it will be. So you'll have > >> to do some detective work. As details become available, they'll be > >> put on the list. Also, bring your stuffing hands, as we'll probably > >> be stuffing more bags. > > > > There's an open 30 minute slot on Saturday 2:10-2:45 in Ballroom 3. > > http://us.pycon.org/2008/conference/schedule/ > > > > It has been suggested by yours truly on #pycon and > > pycon-organizers at python.org that we have our meeting then. This would be > > not only ChiPy's best, and > > perhaps biggest, meeting ever, but also our most timely. > > > > The main problem with a Thursday night meeting was lack of space. > > Here's a > > space lacking a meeting. ;-) What do y'all think? > > This sounds like a decent compromise -- we could double-up on non- > traditional meetings...Thursday would then mainly be a "come, help, > volunteer!" thing and then Friday would be Pete's talk? (if we can > sell the organizers on it) > > -tcp > _______________________________________________ > Chicago mailing list > Chicago at python.org > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago -- Peter Fein || 773-575-0694 || pfein at pobox.com http://www.pobox.com/~pfein/ || PGP: 0xCCF6AE6B irc: pfein at freenode.net || jabber: peter.fein at gmail.com From pfein at pobox.com Wed Mar 12 15:16:09 2008 From: pfein at pobox.com (Pete) Date: Wed, 12 Mar 2008 10:16:09 -0400 Subject: [Chicago] Need PyCon Shopping Help In-Reply-To: <40EDF70F-887C-4E4C-82D3-730BFA4ACDD5@mac.com> References: <40EDF70F-887C-4E4C-82D3-730BFA4ACDD5@mac.com> Message-ID: <200803121016.09243.pfein@pobox.com> On Tuesday March 11 2008 7:27:56 pm Ted Pollari wrote: > Hey ChiPy folks... > > We need 3 inch wide gaffers tape, say 30 rolls (60 yrdx3in) -- can > someone locate and purchase this? I know it's a big cost, but you'll > be reimbursed ASAP by David Goodger (so save the receipt) -- we need > this to make it to the hotel tomorrow evening (say, by 5 or so) -- > I've got my hands full buying a bunch of other stuff and can't take > the time at the moment to source the gaff tape after our initial > source (American Sci. & Surplus) turned out to no longer carry the > cheap stuff. Maybe http://www.grandstage.com? It's a theater supply company, I used to rent/do last minute buys from there when I was in college. Professional quality gaffe tape is several dollars per roll, but it's great stuff - think duck tape on awesome. They would probably have 30 rolls. Perhaps someone who works in the loop could stop by? It's at Lake & Desplaines, 1 blk east of the Kennedy. There's also http://chicagospotlight.com/ but I have less experience with them. Also near loop. > Any takers? Takers should probably call the places first. --Pete -- Peter Fein || 773-575-0694 || pfein at pobox.com http://www.pobox.com/~pfein/ || PGP: 0xCCF6AE6B irc: pfein at freenode.net || jabber: peter.fein at gmail.com From skip at pobox.com Wed Mar 12 15:23:23 2008 From: skip at pobox.com (skip at pobox.com) Date: Wed, 12 Mar 2008 09:23:23 -0500 Subject: [Chicago] Need PyCon Shopping Help In-Reply-To: <200803121016.09243.pfein@pobox.com> References: <40EDF70F-887C-4E4C-82D3-730BFA4ACDD5@mac.com> <200803121016.09243.pfein@pobox.com> Message-ID: <18391.59227.264781.661250@montanaro-dyndns-org.local> Pete> Perhaps someone who works in the loop could stop by? It's at Lake & Pete> Desplaines, 1 blk east of the Kennedy. I work at Wacker & Monroe, roughly kitty corner from the Opera House. It looks to be about a 10-15 minute walk. Want me to run out and get 30 rolls of 60 yds x 3" wide tape? Just say the word. Skip From mtobis at gmail.com Wed Mar 12 16:04:00 2008 From: mtobis at gmail.com (Michael Tobis) Date: Wed, 12 Mar 2008 10:04:00 -0500 Subject: [Chicago] Need PyCon Shopping Help In-Reply-To: <18391.59227.264781.661250@montanaro-dyndns-org.local> References: <40EDF70F-887C-4E4C-82D3-730BFA4ACDD5@mac.com> <200803121016.09243.pfein@pobox.com> <18391.59227.264781.661250@montanaro-dyndns-org.local> Message-ID: Talk to Ted first. I had just arranged to pick up some 2" that a place on Lawrence has in stock. I was just heading out. http://www.chicagocanvas.com/site/epage/35470_579.htm Good prices but they have no 3" tape. Please check up on stock at Grand Stage and let me know. I will skip my field trip if you can get an acceptable price on the 3". Ted is at 773.817.0768 I'm at 773 793 9828. mt On Wed, Mar 12, 2008 at 9:23 AM, wrote: > > Pete> Perhaps someone who works in the loop could stop by? It's at > Lake & > Pete> Desplaines, 1 blk east of the Kennedy. > > I work at Wacker & Monroe, roughly kitty corner from the Opera House. It > looks to be about a 10-15 minute walk. Want me to run out and get 30 > rolls > of 60 yds x 3" wide tape? Just say the word. > > Skip > _______________________________________________ > Chicago mailing list > Chicago at python.org > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mail.python.org/pipermail/chicago/attachments/20080312/2dd57bd6/attachment.htm From skip at pobox.com Wed Mar 12 16:12:28 2008 From: skip at pobox.com (skip at pobox.com) Date: Wed, 12 Mar 2008 10:12:28 -0500 Subject: [Chicago] Need PyCon Shopping Help In-Reply-To: References: <40EDF70F-887C-4E4C-82D3-730BFA4ACDD5@mac.com> <200803121016.09243.pfein@pobox.com> <18391.59227.264781.661250@montanaro-dyndns-org.local> Message-ID: <18391.62172.405370.856456@montanaro-dyndns-org.local> Grand Stage has 11 rolls of 3" gaffer's tape in stock. I failed to ask what the price was. (Sorry about that.) Skip From tcp at mac.com Wed Mar 12 16:18:16 2008 From: tcp at mac.com (Ted Pollari) Date: Wed, 12 Mar 2008 10:18:16 -0500 Subject: [Chicago] Need PyCon Shopping Help In-Reply-To: <18391.59227.264781.661250@montanaro-dyndns-org.local> References: <40EDF70F-887C-4E4C-82D3-730BFA4ACDD5@mac.com> <200803121016.09243.pfein@pobox.com> <18391.59227.264781.661250@montanaro-dyndns-org.local> Message-ID: On Mar 12, 2008, at 9:23 AM, skip at pobox.com wrote: > > Pete> Perhaps someone who works in the loop could stop by? It's > at Lake & > Pete> Desplaines, 1 blk east of the Kennedy. > > I work at Wacker & Monroe, roughly kitty corner from the Opera > House. It > looks to be about a 10-15 minute walk. Want me to run out and get > 30 rolls > of 60 yds x 3" wide tape? Just say the word. > > Skip I'd say 20 3 inch rolls should be sufficient if it's less than (or about) $26 a roll if not, call or email (calling would probably be best as I'm leaving the office shortly) -ted From tcp at mac.com Wed Mar 12 16:21:16 2008 From: tcp at mac.com (Ted Pollari) Date: Wed, 12 Mar 2008 10:21:16 -0500 Subject: [Chicago] Need PyCon Shopping Help In-Reply-To: <18391.62172.405370.856456@montanaro-dyndns-org.local> References: <40EDF70F-887C-4E4C-82D3-730BFA4ACDD5@mac.com> <200803121016.09243.pfein@pobox.com> <18391.59227.264781.661250@montanaro-dyndns-org.local> <18391.62172.405370.856456@montanaro-dyndns-org.local> Message-ID: On Mar 12, 2008, at 10:12 AM, skip at pobox.com wrote: > Grand Stage has 11 rolls of 3" gaffer's tape in stock. I failed to > ask what > the price was. (Sorry about that.) > > Skip Yeah, sure, go pick it up all 11 of them as long as it's not much more than $30 a roll and if they have the 2 inch, pick up 5 more of those, as long as they're not ridiculously more than the prices Michael found -- in which case, can you call him and have him pick up 5 or 10 rolls? -t From skip at pobox.com Wed Mar 12 16:51:22 2008 From: skip at pobox.com (skip at pobox.com) Date: Wed, 12 Mar 2008 10:51:22 -0500 Subject: [Chicago] Need PyCon Shopping Help In-Reply-To: References: <40EDF70F-887C-4E4C-82D3-730BFA4ACDD5@mac.com> <200803121016.09243.pfein@pobox.com> <18391.59227.264781.661250@montanaro-dyndns-org.local> <18391.62172.405370.856456@montanaro-dyndns-org.local> Message-ID: <18391.64506.185100.315989@montanaro-dyndns-org.local> Ted> ... can you call him and have him pick up 5 or 10 rolls? Am I supposed to have anyone's phone number? I don't think I do. Skip From korpios at korpios.com Wed Mar 12 18:20:35 2008 From: korpios at korpios.com (Tom Tobin) Date: Wed, 12 Mar 2008 12:20:35 -0500 Subject: [Chicago] Board game socials: where to stash games? Message-ID: Is there a good spot for stashing board games for the board game socials? I'll be showing up to the PyCon meeting tomorrow at the hotel, and I'd like to bring as many games as I can somehow cram through the Blue Line. ^_^ From rcriii at ramsdells.net Tue Mar 11 23:36:00 2008 From: rcriii at ramsdells.net (rcriii at ramsdells.net) Date: Tue, 11 Mar 2008 16:36:00 -0600 (MDT) Subject: [Chicago] Carpool from Downers Grove Message-ID: <10221.12.20.83.70.1205274960.squirrel@216.194.122.18> I'll be driving from Downers Grove to Pycon, so if anyone is interested in carpooling and is coming from that direction, respond to me directly. Robert From rcriii at ramsdells.net Tue Mar 11 15:46:28 2008 From: rcriii at ramsdells.net (rcriii at ramsdells.net) Date: Tue, 11 Mar 2008 10:46:28 -0400 (EDT) Subject: [Chicago] Downers Grove Carpool to Pycon Message-ID: <10097.12.20.83.70.1205246788.squirrel@canton.npsis.com> I'll be attending the conference but not staying at the hotel. If anyone wishes to carpool from the direction of Downers Grove, respond to me directly. From skip at pobox.com Wed Mar 12 18:28:06 2008 From: skip at pobox.com (skip at pobox.com) Date: Wed, 12 Mar 2008 12:28:06 -0500 Subject: [Chicago] Board game socials: where to stash games? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <18392.4774.775120.632368@montanaro-dyndns-org.local> Tom> Is there a good spot for stashing board games for the board game Tom> socials? Maybe in someone's hotel room? Skip From pfein at pobox.com Wed Mar 12 19:33:57 2008 From: pfein at pobox.com (Pete) Date: Wed, 12 Mar 2008 14:33:57 -0400 Subject: [Chicago] Need PyCon Shopping Help In-Reply-To: <18391.64506.185100.315989@montanaro-dyndns-org.local> References: <40EDF70F-887C-4E4C-82D3-730BFA4ACDD5@mac.com> <18391.64506.185100.315989@montanaro-dyndns-org.local> Message-ID: <200803121433.57358.pfein@pobox.com> On Wednesday March 12 2008 11:51:22 am skip at pobox.com wrote: > Ted> ... can you call him and have him pick up 5 or 10 rolls? > > Am I supposed to have anyone's phone number? I don't think I do. Mine's below. I'm getting a bunch of USB keydrives at microcenter. Anyone wants anything else, call me. -- Peter Fein || 773-575-0694 || pfein at pobox.com http://www.pobox.com/~pfein/ || PGP: 0xCCF6AE6B irc: pfein at freenode.net || jabber: peter.fein at gmail.com From sgithens at caret.cam.ac.uk Wed Mar 12 22:12:54 2008 From: sgithens at caret.cam.ac.uk (swg) Date: Wed, 12 Mar 2008 16:12:54 -0500 Subject: [Chicago] Pycon! Bags! Meeting! In-Reply-To: <996246ED-D2F1-44E0-9308-C9C163058866@mac.com> References: <3096c19d0803100902j382440ddwb2f1c927d34c9f98@mail.gmail.com> <996246ED-D2F1-44E0-9308-C9C163058866@mac.com> Message-ID: <47D84756.6040305@caret.cam.ac.uk> Late RSVP, but I'll be there, though it may be closer to 7 than 6. -Steve Ted Pollari wrote: > On Mar 10, 2008, at 11:02 AM, Chris McAvoy wrote: > > >> Wednesday night we're all getting together to help with the bag >> stuffing effort. WE NEED YOUR HELP. So, if you have time Wednesday >> night from 7-9 or so, come to the hotel and look for bag stuffers. >> Pizza will be provided. >> > > Correction: The start-time for the big party is 6:00 pm, but show up > whenever you can... extra pizza will be accounted for if you rsvp to > the ChiPy list by noon on to say you're joining us. > > > -tcp > _______________________________________________ > Chicago mailing list > Chicago at python.org > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago > > From anthony.r.rubin at gmail.com Thu Mar 13 01:46:30 2008 From: anthony.r.rubin at gmail.com (Anthony Rubin) Date: Wed, 12 Mar 2008 19:46:30 -0500 Subject: [Chicago] Pycon! Bags! Meeting! In-Reply-To: <200803111509.31208.pfein@pobox.com> References: <3096c19d0803100902j382440ddwb2f1c927d34c9f98@mail.gmail.com> <200803111509.31208.pfein@pobox.com> Message-ID: <4cf38240803121746sa5b846ale91a08e805bc0643@mail.gmail.com> Has there been any movement on this? On Tue, Mar 11, 2008 at 2:09 PM, Pete wrote: > On Monday March 10 2008 12:02:18 pm Chris McAvoy wrote: > > Thursday night we're going to try and have an official ChiPy meeting. > > However, it's pretty sketchy as to where it will be. So you'll have > > to do some detective work. As details become available, they'll be > > put on the list. Also, bring your stuffing hands, as we'll probably > > be stuffing more bags. > > There's an open 30 minute slot on Saturday 2:10-2:45 in Ballroom 3. > http://us.pycon.org/2008/conference/schedule/ > > It has been suggested by yours truly on #pycon and pycon-organizers at python.org > that we have our meeting then. This would be not only ChiPy's best, and > perhaps biggest, meeting ever, but also our most timely. > > The main problem with a Thursday night meeting was lack of space. Here's a > space lacking a meeting. ;-) What do y'all think? > > --Pete > > PS: Here's an outline of the talk I pitched. > > Title: GrassyKnoll: A Search Engine in Python > > Summary: GrassyKnoll is a search engine written in Python. It features a > powerful storage model supporting several backends, a RESTful HTTP inteface > and message passing concurrency for multi-core and distributed programming. > It was conceived and prototyped at the PyCon 2007 sprints. > > This talk will discuss GrassyKnoll's archictecture and its potential for > large-scale computing. It is intended for intermediate to advanced Python > programmers. Familiarity with HTTP, threads and distributed computing is > helpful but not required. > > Outline > ======= > - Introduction > - project goals > - project history > - status > - Collections: a universal storage model > - description of the model > - comparison to traditional databases > - Supported backends: lucene, sqlite, etc. > - Queries: Questions Answered, quickly > - REST: Embracing HTTP > - description of REST > - comparison to RPC > - advantages of REST > - REST and the Collection model > - Message Passing: Concurrency Simplified > - description, theory and influences > - Advantages: Death to deadlock & Killing the GIL > - Distributed Computing with HTTP : turtles all the way down > - Future Work > - Sprinting > - More backends > - Towards a new HTTP library for Python > - Possible use cases > > > -- > Peter Fein || 773-575-0694 || pfein at pobox.com > http://www.pobox.com/~pfein/ || PGP: 0xCCF6AE6B > irc: pfein at freenode.net || jabber: peter.fein at gmail.com > > > _______________________________________________ > Chicago mailing list > Chicago at python.org > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago > From chris.mcavoy at gmail.com Thu Mar 13 04:09:04 2008 From: chris.mcavoy at gmail.com (Chris McAvoy) Date: Wed, 12 Mar 2008 22:09:04 -0500 Subject: [Chicago] ChiPy @ Pycon is Go! Message-ID: <3096c19d0803122009j20b0825ayf98926d444f6c92f@mail.gmail.com> We have a great spot just off the lobby. Carl is going to provide a projector, Pete is going to provide a presentation, we're all set. 7pm, at the Pycon hotel, just off the main lobby. See you all there. We won't have to stuff bags, as all bags were stuffed tonight. Thanks to everyone that came out. Chris From chris.mcavoy at gmail.com Thu Mar 13 04:10:34 2008 From: chris.mcavoy at gmail.com (Chris McAvoy) Date: Wed, 12 Mar 2008 22:10:34 -0500 Subject: [Chicago] Registration Desk Tomorrow Morning @ 7:30am Message-ID: <3096c19d0803122010g66f9dbf8m16425348b26eeaec@mail.gmail.com> Hi All, For those interested in working the registration desk tomorrow, it opens around 7:30. Volunteers who want to work the morning shift should get there around then. There's probably opportunities for later shifts, but I don't have the details. Chris From chris.mcavoy at gmail.com Thu Mar 13 04:14:30 2008 From: chris.mcavoy at gmail.com (Chris McAvoy) Date: Wed, 12 Mar 2008 22:14:30 -0500 Subject: [Chicago] Three slots open for session chairs! Message-ID: <3096c19d0803122014sef7c41ei77798e865b3cf188@mail.gmail.com> Hi All, One slot Friday, two on Sunday. Priority is obviously on filling the Friday slot. Get 'em while their hot! http://us.pycon.org/2008/conference/schedule/ Also, as an aside, thanks Doug N...this schedule app is making this job a breeze. Great...great work. Chris From tprinty at mail.edisonave.net Thu Mar 13 04:21:20 2008 From: tprinty at mail.edisonave.net (Tom Printy) Date: Wed, 12 Mar 2008 22:21:20 -0500 Subject: [Chicago] Three slots open for session chairs! In-Reply-To: <3096c19d0803122014sef7c41ei77798e865b3cf188@mail.gmail.com> References: <3096c19d0803122014sef7c41ei77798e865b3cf188@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <1205378480.5793.0.camel@localhost> Hello, I wonder if anyone has any parking tips? Some place that dosen't charge 18.00 per day? Thanks see you guys tommorrow! -Tom On Wed, 2008-03-12 at 22:14 -0500, Chris McAvoy wrote: > Hi All, > > One slot Friday, two on Sunday. Priority is obviously on filling the > Friday slot. Get 'em while their hot! > > http://us.pycon.org/2008/conference/schedule/ > > Also, as an aside, thanks Doug N...this schedule app is making this > job a breeze. Great...great work. > > Chris > _______________________________________________ > Chicago mailing list > Chicago at python.org > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago From chris.mcavoy at gmail.com Thu Mar 13 04:28:00 2008 From: chris.mcavoy at gmail.com (Chris McAvoy) Date: Wed, 12 Mar 2008 22:28:00 -0500 Subject: [Chicago] Three slots open for session chairs! In-Reply-To: <1205378480.5793.0.camel@localhost> References: <3096c19d0803122014sef7c41ei77798e865b3cf188@mail.gmail.com> <1205378480.5793.0.camel@localhost> Message-ID: <3096c19d0803122028w7c3e53c4v7c6093a0e21e41a7@mail.gmail.com> The CTA lot down the street is $3, up to 14 hours (I think). Then it bumps to $6. Regardless, it's way cheaper than $18. On Wed, Mar 12, 2008 at 10:21 PM, Tom Printy wrote: > Hello, > > I wonder if anyone has any parking tips? Some place that dosen't charge > 18.00 per day? > > Thanks see you guys tommorrow! > > -Tom > > > > > > > On Wed, 2008-03-12 at 22:14 -0500, Chris McAvoy wrote: > > Hi All, > > > > One slot Friday, two on Sunday. Priority is obviously on filling the > > Friday slot. Get 'em while their hot! > > > > http://us.pycon.org/2008/conference/schedule/ > > > > Also, as an aside, thanks Doug N...this schedule app is making this > > job a breeze. Great...great work. > > > > Chris > > _______________________________________________ > > Chicago mailing list > > Chicago at python.org > > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago > > _______________________________________________ > Chicago mailing list > Chicago at python.org > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago > From skip at pobox.com Thu Mar 13 05:00:45 2008 From: skip at pobox.com (skip at pobox.com) Date: Wed, 12 Mar 2008 23:00:45 -0500 Subject: [Chicago] Three slots open for session chairs! In-Reply-To: <1205378480.5793.0.camel@localhost> References: <3096c19d0803122014sef7c41ei77798e865b3cf188@mail.gmail.com> <1205378480.5793.0.camel@localhost> Message-ID: <18392.42733.283992.410807@montanaro-dyndns-org.local> Tom> I wonder if anyone has any parking tips? Some place that dosen't Tom> charge 18.00 per day? I am told the village lot right next door to the hotel is $11/day. Skip From wescpy at gmail.com Thu Mar 13 06:31:56 2008 From: wescpy at gmail.com (wesley chun) Date: Wed, 12 Mar 2008 22:31:56 -0700 Subject: [Chicago] [PyCON-Organizers] Three slots open for session chairs! In-Reply-To: <18392.42733.283992.410807@montanaro-dyndns-org.local> References: <3096c19d0803122014sef7c41ei77798e865b3cf188@mail.gmail.com> <1205378480.5793.0.camel@localhost> <18392.42733.283992.410807@montanaro-dyndns-org.local> Message-ID: <78b3a9580803122231r178ab430qf035be84e2f4c146@mail.gmail.com> please add all your responses to the travel wiki... this will be useful info for next year!! http://us.pycon.org/2008/chicago/travel/ be specific w/regards to whose lot and the daily cost. thanks! -wesley From jsudlow at gmail.com Thu Mar 13 16:42:16 2008 From: jsudlow at gmail.com (Jon Sudlow) Date: Thu, 13 Mar 2008 10:42:16 -0500 Subject: [Chicago] Registration Desk Tomorrow Morning @ 7:30am In-Reply-To: <3096c19d0803122010g66f9dbf8m16425348b26eeaec@mail.gmail.com> References: <3096c19d0803122010g66f9dbf8m16425348b26eeaec@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: I was wondering if the registration desk accepts cash? On Wed, Mar 12, 2008 at 10:10 PM, Chris McAvoy wrote: > Hi All, > > For those interested in working the registration desk tomorrow, it > opens around 7:30. Volunteers who want to work the morning shift > should get there around then. There's probably opportunities for > later shifts, but I don't have the details. > > Chris > _______________________________________________ > Chicago mailing list > Chicago at python.org > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago > -- Jon Sudlow 3225 Foster Avenue 221 Sohlberg Hall C.P.O 2224 Chicago, Il 60625 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mail.python.org/pipermail/chicago/attachments/20080313/e8d0c16b/attachment.htm From tprinty at mail.edisonave.net Thu Mar 13 17:26:30 2008 From: tprinty at mail.edisonave.net (tprinty at mail.edisonave.net) Date: Thu, 13 Mar 2008 11:26:30 -0500 (CDT) Subject: [Chicago] Three slots open for session chairs! In-Reply-To: <3096c19d0803122028w7c3e53c4v7c6093a0e21e41a7@mail.gmail.com> References: <3096c19d0803122014sef7c41ei77798e865b3cf188@mail.gmail.com> <1205378480.5793.0.camel@localhost> <3096c19d0803122028w7c3e53c4v7c6093a0e21e41a7@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <1115.63.250.241.10.1205425590.squirrel@mail.edisonave.net> > The CTA lot down the street is $3, up to 14 hours (I think). Then it > bumps to $6. Regardless, it's way cheaper than $18. > Thanks Chris..... I am at Pycon and I have time till 1:20. Does anyone need any help? -Tom From pfein at pobox.com Thu Mar 13 19:19:52 2008 From: pfein at pobox.com (Pete) Date: Thu, 13 Mar 2008 14:19:52 -0400 Subject: [Chicago] OMG Events! Message-ID: <200803131419.54659.pfein@pobox.com> Chipy Meeting 1 THurs 7 pm Atrium FUNder & Lighting! Chipy Meeting 2 Sat. 2:10 -2:45 pm room TBD GrassyKnoll -- Peter Fein || 773-575-0694 || pfein at pobox.com http://www.pobox.com/~pfein/ || PGP: 0xCCF6AE6B irc: pfein at freenode.net || jabber: peter.fein at gmail.com From chris.mcavoy at gmail.com Thu Mar 13 20:04:01 2008 From: chris.mcavoy at gmail.com (Chris McAvoy) Date: Thu, 13 Mar 2008 14:04:01 -0500 Subject: [Chicago] OMG Events! In-Reply-To: <200803131419.54659.pfein@pobox.com> References: <200803131419.54659.pfein@pobox.com> Message-ID: <3096c19d0803131204n54d03857x2ecc8f9099504881@mail.gmail.com> Pete's bit about funder and lightning refers to the fact that we'll be rocking lightning talks at tonights meeting. So, bring your lightning. Chris On Thu, Mar 13, 2008 at 1:19 PM, Pete wrote: > Chipy Meeting 1 > THurs 7 pm Atrium > FUNder & Lighting! > > Chipy Meeting 2 > Sat. 2:10 -2:45 pm room TBD > GrassyKnoll > > -- > Peter Fein || 773-575-0694 || pfein at pobox.com > http://www.pobox.com/~pfein/ || PGP: 0xCCF6AE6B > irc: pfein at freenode.net || jabber: peter.fein at gmail.com > _______________________________________________ > Chicago mailing list > Chicago at python.org > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago > From sakamura at gmail.com Fri Mar 14 00:19:39 2008 From: sakamura at gmail.com (Ishmael Rufus) Date: Thu, 13 Mar 2008 18:19:39 -0500 Subject: [Chicago] can I buy a ubuntu dell from a local store? In-Reply-To: <47D5E052.5080805@personnelware.com> References: <47D5E052.5080805@personnelware.com> Message-ID: <47D9B68B.50800@gmail.com> Why not purchase from Microcenter / Frys electronics and load Ubuntu on each machine? (1 hr) Carl Karsten wrote: > I need to get 4 laptops to run Ubuntu. Dell sells laptops with Ubuntu loaded, > and I would like to get one of those. tomorrow. I don't have time to wait for > them to assemble and ship it. (yeah, like many things, should have done this a > week ago...) > > So, anyone know a store around here that can sell me one? > > > Carl K > _______________________________________________ > Chicago mailing list > Chicago at python.org > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago > From tcp at mac.com Fri Mar 14 00:23:16 2008 From: tcp at mac.com (Ted Pollari) Date: Thu, 13 Mar 2008 18:23:16 -0500 Subject: [Chicago] can I buy a ubuntu dell from a local store? In-Reply-To: <47D9B68B.50800@gmail.com> References: <47D5E052.5080805@personnelware.com> <47D9B68B.50800@gmail.com> Message-ID: <7D05C838-A6BA-42C4-B965-B124D578A7CB@mac.com> On Mar 13, 2008, at 6:19 PM, Ishmael Rufus wrote: > Why not purchase from Microcenter / Frys electronics and load Ubuntu > on > each machine? (1 hr) Because then you're paying for Windows... -tcp From chris.mcavoy at gmail.com Fri Mar 14 04:50:34 2008 From: chris.mcavoy at gmail.com (Chris McAvoy) Date: Thu, 13 Mar 2008 22:50:34 -0500 Subject: [Chicago] Last Minute Chair Request Message-ID: <3096c19d0803132050w4c4ebaabkd257550c386e59a5@mail.gmail.com> Hi All, We have one slot open tomorrow, for the 2:10pm Ballroom I talks. Can someone please fill it? Chris From skip at pobox.com Fri Mar 14 06:33:01 2008 From: skip at pobox.com (skip at pobox.com) Date: Fri, 14 Mar 2008 00:33:01 -0500 Subject: [Chicago] [PyCON-Organizers] Last Minute Chair Request In-Reply-To: <3096c19d0803132050w4c4ebaabkd257550c386e59a5@mail.gmail.com> References: <3096c19d0803132050w4c4ebaabkd257550c386e59a5@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <18394.3597.562575.796801@montanaro-dyndns-org.local> Chris> We have one slot open tomorrow, for the 2:10pm Ballroom I talks. Chris> Can someone please fill it? Chris, I'll do it if the slot is still open. Call my cell (847-971-7098) during the morning so we can rendevous. Skip From chris.mcavoy at gmail.com Sat Mar 15 16:29:17 2008 From: chris.mcavoy at gmail.com (Chris McAvoy) Date: Sat, 15 Mar 2008 10:29:17 -0500 Subject: [Chicago] Big Gap in Session Chairs on Sunday Message-ID: <3096c19d0803150829oe55a9f2l98b59cfaf2260e10@mail.gmail.com> Can anyone fill in the two session chair gaps tomorrow? http://us.pycon.org/2008/conference/schedule/ Chris From pfein at pobox.com Sat Mar 15 22:16:57 2008 From: pfein at pobox.com (Pete) Date: Sat, 15 Mar 2008 17:16:57 -0400 Subject: [Chicago] BEER BOF In-Reply-To: <3096c19d0803150829oe55a9f2l98b59cfaf2260e10@mail.gmail.com> References: <3096c19d0803150829oe55a9f2l98b59cfaf2260e10@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <200803151716.58036.pfein@pobox.com> Atrium, 10 PM to http://maproom.com please update wiki -- Peter Fein || 773-575-0694 || pfein at pobox.com http://www.pobox.com/~pfein/ || PGP: 0xCCF6AE6B irc: pfein at freenode.net || jabber: peter.fein at gmail.com From facundobatista at gmail.com Sat Mar 15 22:41:32 2008 From: facundobatista at gmail.com (Facundo Batista) Date: Sat, 15 Mar 2008 16:41:32 -0500 Subject: [Chicago] [PyCON-Organizers] BEER BOF In-Reply-To: <200803151716.58036.pfein@pobox.com> References: <3096c19d0803150829oe55a9f2l98b59cfaf2260e10@mail.gmail.com> <200803151716.58036.pfein@pobox.com> Message-ID: 2008/3/15, Pete : > Atrium, 10 PM > to http://maproom.com > > please update wiki Sorry, some questions: - What is BEER? (or do you mean the God's beverage?) - If it's in the Atrium, why you put a link to some place in Chicago? - Which part of the wiki we should update? Thanks! -- . Facundo Blog: http://www.taniquetil.com.ar/plog/ PyAr: http://www.python.org/ar/ From pfein at pobox.com Sun Mar 16 01:21:36 2008 From: pfein at pobox.com (Pete) Date: Sat, 15 Mar 2008 20:21:36 -0400 Subject: [Chicago] [PyCON-Organizers] BEER BOF In-Reply-To: References: <3096c19d0803150829oe55a9f2l98b59cfaf2260e10@mail.gmail.com> <200803151716.58036.pfein@pobox.com> Message-ID: <200803152021.36648.pfein@pobox.com> On Saturday March 15 2008 5:41:32 pm Facundo Batista wrote: > 2008/3/15, Pete : > > Atrium, 10 PM > > to http://maproom.com > > > > please update wiki > > Sorry, some questions: > > - What is BEER? (or do you mean the God's beverage?) Yeah, cerveza. MicroBrew. Malt. Y'know: Beer > - If it's in the Atrium, why you put a link to some place in Chicago? We're going from the atrium TO the place in chicago. > - Which part of the wiki we should update? anywhere you like. > Thanks! Better yet, show up! --Pete -- Peter Fein || 773-575-0694 || pfein at pobox.com http://www.pobox.com/~pfein/ || PGP: 0xCCF6AE6B irc: pfein at freenode.net || jabber: peter.fein at gmail.com From list at phaedrusdeinus.org Sun Mar 16 17:01:51 2008 From: list at phaedrusdeinus.org (John Melesky) Date: Sun, 16 Mar 2008 11:01:51 -0500 Subject: [Chicago] Can't make it to the PyCon sprints? Message-ID: <5E045CDA-950E-4D4C-B96B-8BBADCE476CC@phaedrusdeinus.org> Do you have to show up to work tomorrow instead of spending the day hanging out with Python luminaries contributing to open source projects? All is not yet lost! Come to TechCoffee instead! We get together at 6:30am Monday morning, at the Caribou Coffee near the corner of LaSalle and Lake in the loop (spitting distance from every CTA line). Grab some caffeine, identify a bug or feature to work on, and try and crank through it in a couple hours (or at least get a good start). Is 6:30am incredibly early? Yep. But think about it this way: would you rather start your workweek hacking on some open source projects and getting stuff done, or dragging yourself to work to barely tune into the monday morning status meeting? -johnnnnnnnn ps- http://techcoffee.com/ for more info From pfein at pobox.com Sun Mar 16 17:54:32 2008 From: pfein at pobox.com (Pete) Date: Sun, 16 Mar 2008 12:54:32 -0400 Subject: [Chicago] make it to the PyCon sprints! In-Reply-To: <5E045CDA-950E-4D4C-B96B-8BBADCE476CC@phaedrusdeinus.org> References: <5E045CDA-950E-4D4C-B96B-8BBADCE476CC@phaedrusdeinus.org> Message-ID: <200803161254.32929.pfein@pobox.com> On Sunday March 16 2008 12:01:51 pm John Melesky wrote: > Do you have to show up to work tomorrow instead of spending the day > hanging out with Python luminaries contributing to open source projects? Got to work? Pycon Sprints at all night! Sprints generally run from 10 am until midnight. Show up when you can, there's lots to do: http://us.pycon.org/2008/sprints/projects/ It's like a wiki of ad-hoc ChiPy meetings There'll be Galcon. ;-) --Pete -- Peter Fein || 773-575-0694 || pfein at pobox.com http://www.pobox.com/~pfein/ || PGP: 0xCCF6AE6B irc: pfein at freenode.net || jabber: peter.fein at gmail.com From pfein at pobox.com Sun Mar 16 17:56:12 2008 From: pfein at pobox.com (Pete) Date: Sun, 16 Mar 2008 12:56:12 -0400 Subject: [Chicago] [PyCON-Organizers] Sprint needs In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <200803161256.12444.pfein@pobox.com> On Sunday March 16 2008 11:42:14 am Peter Kropf wrote: > > GrassyKnoll: A table, some tape. > > ? ?Orly Sorry, didn't see that. GrassyKnoll Sprint/BoF: Orly, 4:45 pm Sunday! Tutorials, SVN access, discussion. Crayons. ORLY? -- Peter Fein || 773-575-0694 || pfein at pobox.com http://www.pobox.com/~pfein/ || PGP: 0xCCF6AE6B irc: pfein at freenode.net || jabber: peter.fein at gmail.com From john at phaedrusdeinus.org Sun Mar 16 19:04:33 2008 From: john at phaedrusdeinus.org (John Melesky) Date: Sun, 16 Mar 2008 13:04:33 -0500 Subject: [Chicago] [PyCON-Organizers] Sprint needs In-Reply-To: <200803161256.12444.pfein@pobox.com> References: <200803161256.12444.pfein@pobox.com> Message-ID: On Mar 16, 2008, at 11:56 AM, Pete wrote: > GrassyKnoll Sprint/BoF: Orly, 4:45 pm Sunday! > > Tutorials, SVN access, discussion. > > Crayons. > > ORLY? I take it i'm not the only one who had to fight the urge to print out a large copy of http://o--rly.com/ and put it over the room placard? -johnnnnnnn From szybalski at gmail.com Mon Mar 17 14:48:12 2008 From: szybalski at gmail.com (Lukasz Szybalski) Date: Mon, 17 Mar 2008 08:48:12 -0500 Subject: [Chicago] can I buy a ubuntu dell from a local store? In-Reply-To: <47D5E052.5080805@personnelware.com> References: <47D5E052.5080805@personnelware.com> Message-ID: <804e5c70803170648j43dacff5xc373125038035180@mail.gmail.com> On Mon, Mar 10, 2008 at 8:28 PM, Carl Karsten wrote: > I need to get 4 laptops to run Ubuntu. Dell sells laptops with Ubuntu loaded, > and I would like to get one of those. tomorrow. I don't have time to wait for > them to assemble and ship it. (yeah, like many things, should have done this a > week ago...) > I think uic microstation store has one of these premier accounts with dell. I would give them a call and see if they have few laptops available. http://www.microstation.uic.edu/ -- Automotive Recall Database. Cars, Trucks, etc. http://www.lucasmanual.com/recall/ TurboGears Documentation: http://www.lucasmanual.com/mywiki/TurboGears From sgithens at caret.cam.ac.uk Tue Mar 18 07:26:12 2008 From: sgithens at caret.cam.ac.uk (swg) Date: Tue, 18 Mar 2008 01:26:12 -0500 Subject: [Chicago] Can't make it to the PyCon sprints? In-Reply-To: <5E045CDA-950E-4D4C-B96B-8BBADCE476CC@phaedrusdeinus.org> References: <5E045CDA-950E-4D4C-B96B-8BBADCE476CC@phaedrusdeinus.org> Message-ID: <47DF6084.20206@caret.cam.ac.uk> Is this every Monday morning? -steve John Melesky wrote: > Do you have to show up to work tomorrow instead of spending the day > hanging out with Python luminaries contributing to open source projects? > > All is not yet lost! Come to TechCoffee instead! > > We get together at 6:30am Monday morning, at the Caribou Coffee near > the corner of LaSalle and Lake in the loop (spitting distance from > every CTA line). Grab some caffeine, identify a bug or feature to work > on, and try and crank through it in a couple hours (or at least get a > good start). > > Is 6:30am incredibly early? Yep. But think about it this way: would > you rather start your workweek hacking on some open source projects > and getting stuff done, or dragging yourself to work to barely tune > into the monday morning status meeting? > > -johnnnnnnnn > > ps- http://techcoffee.com/ for more info > _______________________________________________ > Chicago mailing list > Chicago at python.org > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago > > From skip at pobox.com Tue Mar 18 14:22:05 2008 From: skip at pobox.com (skip at pobox.com) Date: Tue, 18 Mar 2008 08:22:05 -0500 Subject: [Chicago] Can't make it to the PyCon sprints? In-Reply-To: <47DF6084.20206@caret.cam.ac.uk> References: <5E045CDA-950E-4D4C-B96B-8BBADCE476CC@phaedrusdeinus.org> <47DF6084.20206@caret.cam.ac.uk> Message-ID: <18399.49661.11112.215992@montanaro-dyndns-org.local> swg> Is this every Monday morning? It ran for (I think) about ten weeks last summer. I wasn't aware it was running again. Skip From joebaker at dcresearch.com Tue Mar 18 20:53:34 2008 From: joebaker at dcresearch.com (Joe Baker) Date: Tue, 18 Mar 2008 14:53:34 -0500 Subject: [Chicago] can I buy a ubuntu dell from a local store? In-Reply-To: <804e5c70803170648j43dacff5xc373125038035180@mail.gmail.com> References: <47D5E052.5080805@personnelware.com> <804e5c70803170648j43dacff5xc373125038035180@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <47E01DBE.8030308@dcresearch.com> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 Lukasz Szybalski wrote: | On Mon, Mar 10, 2008 at 8:28 PM, Carl Karsten wrote: |> I need to get 4 laptops to run Ubuntu. Dell sells laptops with Ubuntu loaded, |> and I would like to get one of those. tomorrow. I don't have time to wait for |> them to assemble and ship it. (yeah, like many things, should have done this a |> week ago...) |> | I think uic microstation store has one of these premier accounts with | dell. I would give them a call and see if they have few laptops | available. | http://www.microstation.uic.edu/ | | | System76 are Ubuntu Partners. They even have a forum up on ubuntuforums.com http://system76.com They even provide telephone technical support. - -- Joe Baker "I want my country back!" Vote Ron Paul for President http://www.ronpaul2008.com -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.6 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org iD8DBQFH4B297J1dPd3sAmARAtQhAKCSy6+XOeOlb87DmjP3L/Gcwt7OYACfUc7+ 5bQD9ZOSMbB1jfUPoPG7lu0= =en9Q -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- From joebaker at dcresearch.com Tue Mar 18 20:56:00 2008 From: joebaker at dcresearch.com (Joe Baker) Date: Tue, 18 Mar 2008 14:56:00 -0500 Subject: [Chicago] HD DV Player needed Message-ID: <47E01E50.8010808@dcresearch.com> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 We have 8 potentially one hour long tutorial tapes we need a camera to digitize. Does anybody have such a camera that could be dropped off at PyCon for a day? - -Joe Baker -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.6 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org iD8DBQFH4B5P7J1dPd3sAmARAqNTAKCaQQDatv0VsTFXeJboZRDFPT+cJQCgj2Sq uLEnLmB5iEI2pjnsVyA6uw0= =UIXj -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- From list at phaedrusdeinus.org Wed Mar 19 16:35:20 2008 From: list at phaedrusdeinus.org (John Melesky) Date: Wed, 19 Mar 2008 10:35:20 -0500 Subject: [Chicago] Can't make it to the PyCon sprints? In-Reply-To: <47DF6084.20206@caret.cam.ac.uk> References: <5E045CDA-950E-4D4C-B96B-8BBADCE476CC@phaedrusdeinus.org> <47DF6084.20206@caret.cam.ac.uk> Message-ID: <1912CF11-B756-487F-8E80-AF5E9E79B64A@phaedrusdeinus.org> On Mar 18, 2008, at 1:26 AM, swg wrote: > Is this every Monday morning? Until April 14th, which is the last one in this "season". We decided to do ten-week runs for a couple reasons. First, to play with the day and time (though we've more or less standardized on early Monday mornings). Second, to make it more possible to set goals for your ten-week TechCoffee sprint. Third, it's easier to commit to ten sessions than an eternity of sessions (or, conversely, it's harder to push attendance off until next week forever if you know that there are only a limited number of chances). Fourth, and perhaps most importantly, so we can switch off organizers on a regular basis. Which leads me to my next point: I'm moving in July, so want someone else to take over for next season. Any volunteers? -johnnnnnnnn From skip at pobox.com Thu Mar 20 16:08:48 2008 From: skip at pobox.com (skip at pobox.com) Date: Thu, 20 Mar 2008 10:08:48 -0500 Subject: [Chicago] Teach Me at a ChiPy meeting? Message-ID: <18402.32256.320906.294656@montanaro-dyndns-org.local> There has been a fair amount of discussion on the pycon-organizers list about the Teach Me Twisted "event" at PyCon. Any thought about having something like that at an upcoming ChiPy meeting? Maybe "Teach Me Django" or "Teach Me Nose". Skip From varmaa at gmail.com Thu Mar 20 16:25:21 2008 From: varmaa at gmail.com (Atul Varma) Date: Thu, 20 Mar 2008 10:25:21 -0500 Subject: [Chicago] Teach Me at a ChiPy meeting? In-Reply-To: <18402.32256.320906.294656@montanaro-dyndns-org.local> References: <18402.32256.320906.294656@montanaro-dyndns-org.local> Message-ID: <361b27370803200825u2ea1b531vbfd74855b1d1ca37@mail.gmail.com> Good idea. I like the idea of doing a "Teach me..." of something that's typically either very hard to understand or not very well documented. Django and Nose are both notable for their excellent documentation, and they're easy to understand for what they are, so I'm not sure if they'd make really good candidates, but I could be wrong. Uh, I know it's kind of semi-redundant, but how about "Teach me Twisted" again? Unless there were a ton of Chipizens at the open space session at pycon, I think it'd be very helpful. Other potential candidates for things that are hard to grok and/or not terribly well-documented: * Teach me PyPy * Teach me Zope * Teach me asyncore/asynchat * Teach me generators - Atul On Thu, Mar 20, 2008 at 10:08 AM, wrote: > There has been a fair amount of discussion on the pycon-organizers list > about the Teach Me Twisted "event" at PyCon. Any thought about having > something like that at an upcoming ChiPy meeting? Maybe "Teach Me Django" > or "Teach Me Nose". > > Skip > > _______________________________________________ > Chicago mailing list > Chicago at python.org > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mail.python.org/pipermail/chicago/attachments/20080320/4efa1dd8/attachment.htm From chris.mcavoy at gmail.com Thu Mar 20 16:25:46 2008 From: chris.mcavoy at gmail.com (Chris McAvoy) Date: Thu, 20 Mar 2008 10:25:46 -0500 Subject: [Chicago] Teach Me at a ChiPy meeting? In-Reply-To: <18402.32256.320906.294656@montanaro-dyndns-org.local> References: <18402.32256.320906.294656@montanaro-dyndns-org.local> Message-ID: <3096c19d0803200825h37a89e9eu57aba32860bbbc75@mail.gmail.com> On Thu, Mar 20, 2008 at 10:08 AM, wrote: > There has been a fair amount of discussion on the pycon-organizers list > about the Teach Me Twisted "event" at PyCon. Any thought about having > something like that at an upcoming ChiPy meeting? Maybe "Teach Me Django" > or "Teach Me Nose". I'm all for the format. It's a really great idea. I volunteer to be taught something. I'm willing to be taught Pylons, Nose, Twisted, WSGI, SQLAlchemy!, Functional Programming w/ Python, or Python threading / forking. Any takers? Chris From maney at two14.net Thu Mar 20 16:50:28 2008 From: maney at two14.net (Martin Maney) Date: Thu, 20 Mar 2008 10:50:28 -0500 Subject: [Chicago] Teach Me at a ChiPy meeting? In-Reply-To: <361b27370803200825u2ea1b531vbfd74855b1d1ca37@mail.gmail.com> References: <18402.32256.320906.294656@montanaro-dyndns-org.local> <361b27370803200825u2ea1b531vbfd74855b1d1ca37@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <20080320155028.GA7653@furrr.two14.net> On Thu, Mar 20, 2008 at 10:25:21AM -0500, Atul Varma wrote: > * Teach me Zope Wouldn't that take several days? (weeks?) :-/ > * Teach me asyncore/asynchat Yeah, those have what looks like decent documentation... until you try to use them for something less simple than a toy, at which point you start wondering why they never even mention a whole bunch of things. I can't recall what it was that I ran into that was like that, but maybe I'll take that old project off the backmost burner this weekend. > * Teach me generators Generators per se are pretty simple, no? They do seem to get used in all sorts of non-obvious ways... -- Not on the wealthy, who buy only what they want when they want it, was the vast superstructure of industry founded and built up, but on those who, aching for a luxury beyond their reach and for a leisure forever denied them, could be bullied or wheedled into spending their few hardly won shillings on whatever might give them, if only for a moment, a leisured and luxurious illusion. -- Dorothy Sayers, _Murder Must Advertise_ From varmaa at gmail.com Thu Mar 20 17:00:48 2008 From: varmaa at gmail.com (Atul Varma) Date: Thu, 20 Mar 2008 11:00:48 -0500 Subject: [Chicago] Teach Me at a ChiPy meeting? In-Reply-To: <20080320155028.GA7653@furrr.two14.net> References: <18402.32256.320906.294656@montanaro-dyndns-org.local> <361b27370803200825u2ea1b531vbfd74855b1d1ca37@mail.gmail.com> <20080320155028.GA7653@furrr.two14.net> Message-ID: <361b27370803200900i14e2eb9i2b52aeb4bcd5e1ee@mail.gmail.com> On Thu, Mar 20, 2008 at 10:50 AM, Martin Maney wrote: > > * Teach me generators > > Generators per se are pretty simple, no? They do seem to get used in all > sorts of non-obvious ways... > Yeah, I was thinking more of the non-obvious ways I guess... Especially 2.5's ability to send a generator information--it'd be great to see examples of when this is useful, and where to draw the line between using a generator in a way that makes code more understandable vs. more obfuscated. Following up on Chris' comments, I think a "teach me SQLAlchemy" would be cool. Instead of "Teach me threading/forking", though, I would do a "Teach me concurrency", which would basically help people figure out what kinds of concurrency options are available and how to choose between them--e.g. threads, processes, greenlets, deferreds, generators, etc. I guess that is kind of insanely broad, but it could be neat. - Atul -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mail.python.org/pipermail/chicago/attachments/20080320/906a3ae6/attachment.htm From hsu.feihong at yahoo.com Thu Mar 20 17:16:54 2008 From: hsu.feihong at yahoo.com (Feihong Hsu) Date: Thu, 20 Mar 2008 09:16:54 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Chicago] Teach Me at a ChiPy meeting? In-Reply-To: <3096c19d0803200825h37a89e9eu57aba32860bbbc75@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <657746.86784.qm@web34802.mail.mud.yahoo.com> I'm up for "Teach Me Twisted|PyGame|SQLAlchemy|pyglet|Paramiko". I'd volunteer to be an "expert" for wxPython, Windows Forms, docutils, lxml, Mako, Genshi, win32com, PyUno (OpenOffice), and, uh, .NET. Please note that I put expert in quotes; if we were at PyCon I'm sure there'd be at least 20 people better than me at any of those topics. Since we're a local user group, I don't think we need to make sure that we have enough experts on hand. We just need a few people who've had some experience with a module, who are familiar with basic usage scenarios, and can give some insight on patterns, idioms, and such. I advocate creating a shared Google Spreadsheet that contains a list of people, what they want to be taught, and what they would be willing to teach. --- Chris McAvoy wrote: > On Thu, Mar 20, 2008 at 10:08 AM, wrote: > > There has been a fair amount of discussion on the > pycon-organizers list > > about the Teach Me Twisted "event" at PyCon. Any thought about > having > > something like that at an upcoming ChiPy meeting? Maybe "Teach > Me Django" > > or "Teach Me Nose". > > I'm all for the format. It's a really great idea. I volunteer to > be > taught something. I'm willing to be taught Pylons, Nose, Twisted, > WSGI, SQLAlchemy!, Functional Programming w/ Python, or Python > threading / forking. > > Any takers? > > Chris > _______________________________________________ > Chicago mailing list > Chicago at python.org > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago > ____________________________________________________________________________________ Be a better friend, newshound, and know-it-all with Yahoo! Mobile. Try it now. http://mobile.yahoo.com/;_ylt=Ahu06i62sR8HDtDypao8Wcj9tAcJ From hsu.feihong at yahoo.com Thu Mar 20 17:30:16 2008 From: hsu.feihong at yahoo.com (Feihong Hsu) Date: Thu, 20 Mar 2008 09:30:16 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Chicago] Teach Me at a ChiPy meeting? In-Reply-To: <20080320155028.GA7653@furrr.two14.net> Message-ID: <660886.93092.qm@web34808.mail.mud.yahoo.com> --- Martin Maney wrote: > On Thu, Mar 20, 2008 at 10:25:21AM -0500, Atul Varma wrote: > > * Teach me Zope > > Wouldn't that take several days? (weeks?) :-/ Yeah, as long as we're proposing super-ambitious topics, how about "Teach Me the Meaning of Life" or "Teach Me the Secret of the Universe". ____________________________________________________________________________________ Looking for last minute shopping deals? Find them fast with Yahoo! Search. http://tools.search.yahoo.com/newsearch/category.php?category=shopping From maney at two14.net Thu Mar 20 18:14:39 2008 From: maney at two14.net (Martin Maney) Date: Thu, 20 Mar 2008 12:14:39 -0500 Subject: [Chicago] Teach Me at a ChiPy meeting? In-Reply-To: <361b27370803200900i14e2eb9i2b52aeb4bcd5e1ee@mail.gmail.com> References: <18402.32256.320906.294656@montanaro-dyndns-org.local> <361b27370803200825u2ea1b531vbfd74855b1d1ca37@mail.gmail.com> <20080320155028.GA7653@furrr.two14.net> <361b27370803200900i14e2eb9i2b52aeb4bcd5e1ee@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <20080320171439.GC7653@furrr.two14.net> On Thu, Mar 20, 2008 at 11:00:48AM -0500, Atul Varma wrote: > cool. Instead of "Teach me threading/forking", though, I would do a "Teach > me concurrency", which would basically help people figure out what kinds of > concurrency options are available and how to choose between them--e.g. > threads, processes, greenlets, deferreds, generators, etc. I guess that is > kind of insanely broad, but it could be neat. It would be a great topic for some kind of presentation (maybe not a Teach Me ...). The trick would be to do it without getting bogged down in the details; a clean model for why different kinds of problems fit different types of solutions is of huge value... and I had to work to avoid using the word "patterns" in that sentence, which would only have muddied the waters . [ot, after noticing the randomly selected sig quote: /me wonders if Joey's using git now? I know he has a neat sounding tool to help with managing your /etc using git that I'd need to find time to play with.] -- The trouble with customizing your environment is that it just doesn't propagate, so it's not even worth the trouble. -- Joel Spolsky I keep my life in a CVS repository. -- Joey Hess From varmaa at gmail.com Thu Mar 20 18:24:10 2008 From: varmaa at gmail.com (Atul Varma) Date: Thu, 20 Mar 2008 12:24:10 -0500 Subject: [Chicago] Teach Me at a ChiPy meeting? In-Reply-To: <20080320171439.GC7653@furrr.two14.net> References: <18402.32256.320906.294656@montanaro-dyndns-org.local> <361b27370803200825u2ea1b531vbfd74855b1d1ca37@mail.gmail.com> <20080320155028.GA7653@furrr.two14.net> <361b27370803200900i14e2eb9i2b52aeb4bcd5e1ee@mail.gmail.com> <20080320171439.GC7653@furrr.two14.net> Message-ID: <361b27370803201024m29778770t5fee22a4e8f07986@mail.gmail.com> On Thu, Mar 20, 2008 at 12:14 PM, Martin Maney wrote: > [ot, after noticing the randomly selected sig quote: /me wonders if > Joey's using git now? I know he has a neat sounding tool to help with > managing your /etc using git that I'd need to find time to play with.] > Hey, this can be OT if you use mercurial instead of git. :) It would be really easy with mercurial, too... I think just do this as root: $ cd /etc $ hg init $ hg add * $ hg commit o yea. - Atul -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mail.python.org/pipermail/chicago/attachments/20080320/0547a579/attachment-0001.htm From maney at two14.net Thu Mar 20 18:06:34 2008 From: maney at two14.net (Martin Maney) Date: Thu, 20 Mar 2008 12:06:34 -0500 Subject: [Chicago] Teach Me at a ChiPy meeting? In-Reply-To: <660886.93092.qm@web34808.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <20080320155028.GA7653@furrr.two14.net> <660886.93092.qm@web34808.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <20080320170634.GB7653@furrr.two14.net> On Thu, Mar 20, 2008 at 09:30:16AM -0700, Feihong Hsu wrote: > Yeah, as long as we're proposing super-ambitious topics, how about > "Teach Me the Meaning of Life" or "Teach Me the Secret of the Universe". Or how to solve NP-complete problems, that's another good one. -- Vs lbh pna ernq guvf, lbh'er va ivbyngvba bs gur Qvtvgny Zvyyraavhz Pbclevtug Npg. -- anon. From skip at pobox.com Thu Mar 20 18:29:24 2008 From: skip at pobox.com (skip at pobox.com) Date: Thu, 20 Mar 2008 12:29:24 -0500 Subject: [Chicago] Teach Me at a ChiPy meeting? In-Reply-To: <361b27370803200825u2ea1b531vbfd74855b1d1ca37@mail.gmail.com> References: <18402.32256.320906.294656@montanaro-dyndns-org.local> <361b27370803200825u2ea1b531vbfd74855b1d1ca37@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <18402.40692.881520.548108@montanaro-dyndns-org.local> >>>>> "Atul" == Atul Varma writes: Atul> Good idea. I like the idea of doing a "Teach me..." of something Atul> that's typically either very hard to understand or not very well Atul> documented. Django and Nose are both notable for their excellent Atul> documentation, and they're easy to understand for what they are, Atul> so I'm not sure if they'd make really good candidates, but I could Atul> be wrong. I think one of the problems with "excellent documentation" is that it can be kind of overwhelming, like drinking from a fire hose, making it difficult at times to know where to start. In that case, a novice coaxing experts into a nearly shortest path to a useful problem solution might be useful. Here's another idea. Instead of learning to use a specific Python-based package, how about learning to the same thing with different packages? For example: Teach Me Google Maps with Django Teach Me Google Maps with Pylons Teach Me Google Maps with TurboGears ... Also, we have to have a few domain experts in the audience for the entertaining novice to draw on for expertise. Given the struggles I'm going through at work right at this very moment, I'd probably appreciate a Teach Me NumPy session. Skip From maney at two14.net Thu Mar 20 18:33:16 2008 From: maney at two14.net (Martin Maney) Date: Thu, 20 Mar 2008 12:33:16 -0500 Subject: [Chicago] Teach Me at a ChiPy meeting? In-Reply-To: <361b27370803201024m29778770t5fee22a4e8f07986@mail.gmail.com> References: <18402.32256.320906.294656@montanaro-dyndns-org.local> <361b27370803200825u2ea1b531vbfd74855b1d1ca37@mail.gmail.com> <20080320155028.GA7653@furrr.two14.net> <361b27370803200900i14e2eb9i2b52aeb4bcd5e1ee@mail.gmail.com> <20080320171439.GC7653@furrr.two14.net> <361b27370803201024m29778770t5fee22a4e8f07986@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <20080320173316.GD7653@furrr.two14.net> On Thu, Mar 20, 2008 at 12:24:10PM -0500, Atul Varma wrote: > On Thu, Mar 20, 2008 at 12:14 PM, Martin Maney wrote: > > > [ot, after noticing the randomly selected sig quote: /me wonders if > > Joey's using git now? I know he has a neat sounding tool to help with > > managing your /etc using git that I'd need to find time to play with.] > > > > Hey, this can be OT if you use mercurial instead of git. :) It would be > really easy with mercurial, too... I think just do this as root: IIRC the cool part was arranging to have the packaging system do commits when config files get changed. And helping manage the things that you don't want to have tracked. Oh, and managing permissions and maybe non-file special files. And so forth. http://kitenet.net/~joey/blog/entry/announcing_etckeeper/ -- vi is a microcosm of the Unix world. Don't expect to learn all of it at once; perhaps you shouldn't expect to learn all of it at all. -- Jon Lasser (Think Unix) From ianb at colorstudy.com Thu Mar 20 18:35:08 2008 From: ianb at colorstudy.com (Ian Bicking) Date: Thu, 20 Mar 2008 12:35:08 -0500 Subject: [Chicago] Teach Me at a ChiPy meeting? In-Reply-To: <18402.32256.320906.294656@montanaro-dyndns-org.local> References: <18402.32256.320906.294656@montanaro-dyndns-org.local> Message-ID: <47E2A04C.20607@colorstudy.com> skip at pobox.com wrote: > There has been a fair amount of discussion on the pycon-organizers list > about the Teach Me Twisted "event" at PyCon. Any thought about having > something like that at an upcoming ChiPy meeting? Maybe "Teach Me Django" > or "Teach Me Nose". I've heard talk of Teach Me Twisted, but don't know much about the format. Except that Steve turned it into a drinking game. Are there any other details about the format? Just sit down, everyone with a computer, and get everyone to start writing some code? Ian From tcp at mac.com Thu Mar 20 18:44:41 2008 From: tcp at mac.com (Ted Pollari) Date: Thu, 20 Mar 2008 12:44:41 -0500 Subject: [Chicago] Teach Me at a ChiPy meeting? In-Reply-To: <47E2A04C.20607@colorstudy.com> References: <18402.32256.320906.294656@montanaro-dyndns-org.local> <47E2A04C.20607@colorstudy.com> Message-ID: On Mar 20, 2008, at 12:35 PM, Ian Bicking wrote: > I've heard talk of Teach Me Twisted, but don't know much about the > format. Except that Steve turned it into a drinking game. Are there > any other details about the format? Just sit down, everyone with a > computer, and get everyone to start writing some code? I sat in on it for the first 30 minutes or so -- basically, Steve was up at the front, asking the 'teachers' in the audience to lead him down the twisted path. They'd agree on a task/project and he'd do as much as he could, asking questions as he went, explaining how he understood something (and asking if it were right/wrong) as he went along. Whiskey helped this process, but at the core, it was Steve's lack of embarrassment and excellent moderation skills (and sense of humor) that made this work, IMHO. -ted From Feihong.Hsu at gmail.com Thu Mar 20 17:48:06 2008 From: Feihong.Hsu at gmail.com (Feihong.Hsu at gmail.com) Date: Thu, 20 Mar 2008 09:48:06 -0700 Subject: [Chicago] ChiPy Teach Me Matrix (Google Docs) Message-ID: <0016368e1b660448e122415dbfc60660@google.com> I've shared a document with you called "ChiPy Teach Me Matrix": http://spreadsheets.google.com/ccc?key=pmM2wzAvN4vS6zaS6DyGvNw&inv=chicago at python.org&t=4760205156178495560&guest It's not an attachment -- it's stored online at Google Docs. To open this document, just click the link above. I just went ahead and took a stab at a "Teach Me Matrix". Go ahead, logon to Google Docs and add your name and whatever topics you want. Under each topic, put either "learn" or "teach", indicating whether you'd want to be student or teacher for that topic. If you don't care about the topic, then just leave that cell blank. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mail.python.org/pipermail/chicago/attachments/20080320/2a2f6564/attachment.htm From ed at leafe.com Thu Mar 20 18:42:15 2008 From: ed at leafe.com (Ed Leafe) Date: Thu, 20 Mar 2008 12:42:15 -0500 Subject: [Chicago] Teach Me at a ChiPy meeting? In-Reply-To: <47E2A04C.20607@colorstudy.com> References: <18402.32256.320906.294656@montanaro-dyndns-org.local> <47E2A04C.20607@colorstudy.com> Message-ID: On Mar 20, 2008, at 12:35 PM, Ian Bicking wrote: > I've heard talk of Teach Me Twisted, but don't know much about the > format. Except that Steve turned it into a drinking game. Are there > any other details about the format? Just sit down, everyone with a > computer, and get everyone to start writing some code? Steve started with the premise that he knew a little bit about Twisted, but not enough to feel confident in using it in his apps. He would start by summarizing what he knew, and the folks in the crowd would correct him if he misunderstood something, or elaborate on some things that weren't very clear to him. Those of us in the audience who were in the same boat as Steve learned a lot, as I had similar gaps of understanding of Twisted. It certainly didn't hurt to have Glyph and other Twisted folks in the crowd! -- Ed Leafe From skip at pobox.com Thu Mar 20 22:13:32 2008 From: skip at pobox.com (skip at pobox.com) Date: Thu, 20 Mar 2008 16:13:32 -0500 Subject: [Chicago] Teach Me at a ChiPy meeting? In-Reply-To: <47E2A04C.20607@colorstudy.com> References: <18402.32256.320906.294656@montanaro-dyndns-org.local> <47E2A04C.20607@colorstudy.com> Message-ID: <18402.54140.652513.29009@montanaro-dyndns-org.local> Ian> I've heard talk of Teach Me Twisted, but don't know much about the Ian> format. Except that Steve turned it into a drinking game. Are Ian> there any other details about the format? Just sit down, everyone Ian> with a computer, and get everyone to start writing some code? Other than Steve, Itamar and probably Moshe who else was actually at this session? It wasn't taped. Nobody (except maybe Steve) has said they were there. Maybe it's just an urban legend. :-) Skip From skip at pobox.com Thu Mar 20 22:10:28 2008 From: skip at pobox.com (skip at pobox.com) Date: Thu, 20 Mar 2008 16:10:28 -0500 Subject: [Chicago] Teach Me at a ChiPy meeting? In-Reply-To: <20080320170634.GB7653@furrr.two14.net> References: <20080320155028.GA7653@furrr.two14.net> <660886.93092.qm@web34808.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <20080320170634.GB7653@furrr.two14.net> Message-ID: <18402.53956.387781.924079@montanaro-dyndns-org.local> Martin> Or how to solve NP-complete problems, that's another good one. ^ efficiently :-) Skip From maney at two14.net Fri Mar 21 03:09:08 2008 From: maney at two14.net (Martin Maney) Date: Thu, 20 Mar 2008 21:09:08 -0500 Subject: [Chicago] Teach Me at a ChiPy meeting? In-Reply-To: <18402.53956.387781.924079@montanaro-dyndns-org.local> References: <20080320155028.GA7653@furrr.two14.net> <660886.93092.qm@web34808.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <20080320170634.GB7653@furrr.two14.net> <18402.53956.387781.924079@montanaro-dyndns-org.local> Message-ID: <20080321020908.GA8414@furrr.two14.net> On Thu, Mar 20, 2008 at 04:10:28PM -0500, skip at pobox.com wrote: > > Martin> Or how to solve NP-complete problems, that's another good one. > ^ > efficiently -1, obvious :-) -- In software as well as in modern art, the distinction between intentional and accidental omissions is often difficult to make. -- Andrew Hunt & David Thomas From goodmansond at gmail.com Fri Mar 21 20:10:32 2008 From: goodmansond at gmail.com (DeanG) Date: Fri, 21 Mar 2008 14:10:32 -0500 Subject: [Chicago] Fwd: [PyCON-Organizers] OT: lost Carcassonne In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: ---------- Forwarded message ---------- From: sheila miguez Date: Fri, Mar 21, 2008 at 9:54 AM Subject: [PyCON-Organizers] OT: lost Carcassonne To: pycon-organizers Does anyone have an extra copy of Carcassonne? I have lost mine. -- sheila _______________________________________________ Pycon-organizers mailing list Pycon-organizers at python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/pycon-organizers From korpios at korpios.com Fri Mar 21 20:29:31 2008 From: korpios at korpios.com (Tom Tobin) Date: Fri, 21 Mar 2008 14:29:31 -0500 Subject: [Chicago] Fwd: [PyCON-Organizers] OT: lost Carcassonne In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: I'll check my duffel bag when I get home; I had others at the board game BoF pack it for me (since I ended up being too busy with other BoFs), and there's a chance that the wrong games got put in there. On 3/21/08, DeanG wrote: > ---------- Forwarded message ---------- > From: sheila miguez > Date: Fri, Mar 21, 2008 at 9:54 AM > Subject: [PyCON-Organizers] OT: lost Carcassonne > To: pycon-organizers > > > Does anyone have an extra copy of Carcassonne? I have lost mine. > > -- > sheila > _______________________________________________ > Pycon-organizers mailing list > Pycon-organizers at python.org > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/pycon-organizers > _______________________________________________ > Chicago mailing list > Chicago at python.org > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago > From skip at pobox.com Fri Mar 21 23:12:42 2008 From: skip at pobox.com (skip at pobox.com) Date: Fri, 21 Mar 2008 17:12:42 -0500 Subject: [Chicago] NoonHat Message-ID: <18404.13018.95963.766392@montanaro-dyndns-org.local> One of the lightning talks I liked best was Brian Dorsey's presentation about NoonHat: http://www.noonhat.com/lunch/ http://youtube.com/watch?v=2f4c1dQW3vY The key observation which led Brian to develop it was that people are rarely exposed to differing points of view. They pretty much hang with people they agree with. He put up a graph (of the nodes and arcs type) which showed the "also bought" association of a set of books related to the 2004 presidential election. Not too surprisingly, there were lots of connections between books of one political stripe, but very few between books with dissimilar viewpoints. The result was NoonHat.com (Django+Python+database+Google mash-up). I signed up for lunch at the conference, but got no matches. I also signed up for a Loop lunch on Thursday. That didn't pan out either. Still, I think it's a great idea, so I'm spreading the word. Check it out, see if you agree. If so, sign up for lunch. Pass it around. Cheers, -- Skip Montanaro - skip at pobox.com - http://www.webfast.com/~skip/ From shekay at pobox.com Sat Mar 22 01:04:42 2008 From: shekay at pobox.com (sheila miguez) Date: Fri, 21 Mar 2008 19:04:42 -0500 Subject: [Chicago] OT: lost Carcassonne In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: I found it. It was stashed away in the a/v room. we're packing up. On 3/21/08, Tom Tobin wrote: > I'll check my duffel bag when I get home; I had others at the board > game BoF pack it for me (since I ended up being too busy with other > BoFs), and there's a chance that the wrong games got put in there. > > On 3/21/08, DeanG wrote: > > ---------- Forwarded message ---------- > > From: sheila miguez > > Date: Fri, Mar 21, 2008 at 9:54 AM > > Subject: [PyCON-Organizers] OT: lost Carcassonne > > To: pycon-organizers > > > > > > Does anyone have an extra copy of Carcassonne? I have lost mine. > > > > -- > > sheila > > _______________________________________________ > > Pycon-organizers mailing list > > Pycon-organizers at python.org > > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/pycon-organizers > > _______________________________________________ > > Chicago mailing list > > Chicago at python.org > > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago > > > _______________________________________________ > Chicago mailing list > Chicago at python.org > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago > -- sheila From shekay at pobox.com Sun Mar 23 16:31:37 2008 From: shekay at pobox.com (sheila miguez) Date: Sun, 23 Mar 2008 10:31:37 -0500 Subject: [Chicago] selecting talks Re: [PyCON-Organizers] Talk slot durations (was: FWD: Re: Pycon disappointment) Message-ID: I'm moving this thread here because I think my reply is too hare-brained and informal for the organizers list. I hate lengthy blahblahblahs on how things should get done and would like some concrete way to test out ideas so that we can cut the crap and get on with it. where "it" is more fun. 2008/3/21 Atul Varma : > I like this idea of people having to "prove themselves" to some extent to > present at PyCon, and I wonder if there's a way to integrate this kind of > concept with local Python interest groups [snip] I think the pycon organizers should find a way to test ideas being discussed in these threads. Perhaps we could test ideas on previous conferences. e.g. apply proposed selection procedures to historical data sets, and judge the resulting conference models with the historical outcomes. Which algorithm rejected/selected what were considered high quality talks, which algorithms selected talks that were not selected in the historical conference? &c. We won't have the benefit of knowing the quality of talks that didn't go in to previous conferences (unless rejected talks were given somewhere else and we have that data), but perhaps we have enough data to run through voting scenarios on past conference talks to compare generated scores with actual talk quality. Alternatively, If we can obtain access to data from upcoming conferences we could run through scenarios to compare hypothetical model against actual results. If this is easy to test, we could at least get an idea of "holy crap that method sucks!" though perhaps they will all be too close to call. This is just something I was pondering whilst thinking of different ideas on voting and also ranking talks to consider scheduling--Randall Monroe once had a voting scheme on ideas for the perfect date, perhaps similar to the voting schemes he uses on sites like . (loosely based, he says, on Condorcet voting criteria) Also, being a gamer, I thought of the voting system with different criteria for giving voters more points to vote on talks. and talks would have different costs for voting. by analogy, designing stats and leveling up characters. -- sheila From varmaa at gmail.com Sun Mar 23 17:08:29 2008 From: varmaa at gmail.com (Atul Varma) Date: Sun, 23 Mar 2008 11:08:29 -0500 Subject: [Chicago] selecting talks Re: [PyCON-Organizers] Talk slot durations (was: FWD: Re: Pycon disappointment) In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <361b27370803230908t38c390gb8caa42ac3234cc3@mail.gmail.com> On Sun, Mar 23, 2008 at 10:31 AM, sheila miguez wrote: > Also, being a gamer, I thought of the voting system with different > criteria for giving voters more points to vote on talks. and talks > would have different costs for voting. by analogy, designing stats and > leveling up characters. > I'm not sure if this idea is along the same lines as what you're saying here, but what if the way to choose what talks get busted is based purely on a completely democratic voting process within the community? For instance, once all the talks are turned in, they're all publicly viewable on the PyCon website; they could even have comment threads where discussion could take place, e.g. potential audience members could ask the potential presenter in advance about their proposal, people who have heard the presenter talk before could provide comments, etc. Then each community member is given a pool of, say, 50 points, that they can distribute between proposals however they like (or a different voting system could be used, I dunno). Anyways, maybe I just repeated your idea using different words, I'm not sure... But it does seem like a community-driven conference could use a slightly more community-driven mechanism for selecting talks. - Atul -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mail.python.org/pipermail/chicago/attachments/20080323/4252dca7/attachment.htm From ed at leafe.com Sun Mar 23 17:34:21 2008 From: ed at leafe.com (Ed Leafe) Date: Sun, 23 Mar 2008 11:34:21 -0500 Subject: [Chicago] selecting talks Re: [PyCON-Organizers] Talk slot durations (was: FWD: Re: Pycon disappointment) In-Reply-To: <361b27370803230908t38c390gb8caa42ac3234cc3@mail.gmail.com> References: <361b27370803230908t38c390gb8caa42ac3234cc3@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <7C26B22E-72DB-4AC2-BB39-CD5978A9DF35@leafe.com> On Mar 23, 2008, at 11:08 AM, Atul Varma wrote: > I'm not sure if this idea is along the same lines as what you're > saying here, but what if the way to choose what talks get busted is > based purely on a completely democratic voting process within the > community? For instance, once all the talks are turned in, they're > all publicly viewable on the PyCon website; they could even have > comment threads where discussion could take place, e.g. potential > audience members could ask the potential presenter in advance about > their proposal, people who have heard the presenter talk before > could provide comments, etc. Then each community member is given a > pool of, say, 50 points, that they can distribute between proposals > however they like (or a different voting system could be used, I > dunno). Unfortunately, the description of a proposed talk can have little to do with the quality of the talk. There were several talks that I had anticipated eagerly last week, based on the description, only to find that they were boring and uninformative. Conversely, I went to a few that didn't sound all that interesting on paper but were very engaging in person. -- Ed Leafe -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mail.python.org/pipermail/chicago/attachments/20080323/2b5e7ee6/attachment.htm From carl at personnelware.com Sun Mar 23 17:36:07 2008 From: carl at personnelware.com (Carl Karsten) Date: Sun, 23 Mar 2008 11:36:07 -0500 Subject: [Chicago] selecting talks Re: [PyCON-Organizers] Talk slot durations (was: FWD: Re: Pycon disappointment) In-Reply-To: <361b27370803230908t38c390gb8caa42ac3234cc3@mail.gmail.com> References: <361b27370803230908t38c390gb8caa42ac3234cc3@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <47E686F7.7010304@personnelware.com> Atul Varma wrote: > On Sun, Mar 23, 2008 at 10:31 AM, sheila miguez wrote: > >> Also, being a gamer, I thought of the voting system with different >> criteria for giving voters more points to vote on talks. and talks >> would have different costs for voting. by analogy, designing stats and >> leveling up characters. >> > > I'm not sure if this idea is along the same lines as what you're saying > here, but what if the way to choose what talks get busted is based purely on > a completely democratic voting process within the community? For instance, > once all the talks are turned in, they're all publicly viewable on the PyCon > website; they could even have comment threads where discussion could take > place, e.g. potential audience members could ask the potential presenter in > advance about their proposal, people who have heard the presenter talk > before could provide comments, etc. Then each community member is given a > pool of, say, 50 points, that they can distribute between proposals however > they like (or a different voting system could be used, I dunno). > > Anyways, maybe I just repeated your idea using different words, I'm not > sure... But it does seem like a community-driven conference could use a > slightly more community-driven mechanism for selecting talks. > +1 Carl K From list at phaedrusdeinus.org Sun Mar 23 17:51:55 2008 From: list at phaedrusdeinus.org (John Melesky) Date: Sun, 23 Mar 2008 11:51:55 -0500 Subject: [Chicago] selecting talks Re: [PyCON-Organizers] Talk slot durations (was: FWD: Re: Pycon disappointment) In-Reply-To: <361b27370803230908t38c390gb8caa42ac3234cc3@mail.gmail.com> References: <361b27370803230908t38c390gb8caa42ac3234cc3@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: On Mar 23, 2008, at 11:08 AM, Atul Varma wrote: > I'm not sure if this idea is along the same lines as what you're > saying here, but what if the way to choose what talks get busted is > based purely on a completely democratic voting process within the > community? For instance, once all the talks are turned in, they're > all publicly viewable on the PyCon website; they could even have > comment threads where discussion could take place, e.g. potential > audience members could ask the potential presenter in advance about > their proposal, people who have heard the presenter talk before > could provide comments, etc. This sounds alot like the way BarCamp Milwaukee handled it. > Then each community member is given a pool of, say, 50 points, that > they can distribute between proposals however they like (or a > different voting system could be used, I dunno). Except for this part. Instead of 50 points, every registered user could vote a talk up or down if they wished (in a reddit/digg-like fashion). No real need to limit people. Upsides of doing things thiswise: - Easier to gauge interest in talks, and so plan different-sized spaces accordingly - More participatory Possible downsides: - Puts perhaps even more weight on the talk summary/abstract than the committee method does - Presenters can psyche themselves out looking at high or low vote counts for their talks - Should we let the masses choose their own talks? -johnnnnnnnn From varmaa at gmail.com Sun Mar 23 18:12:31 2008 From: varmaa at gmail.com (Atul Varma) Date: Sun, 23 Mar 2008 12:12:31 -0500 Subject: [Chicago] selecting talks Re: [PyCON-Organizers] Talk slot durations (was: FWD: Re: Pycon disappointment) In-Reply-To: References: <361b27370803230908t38c390gb8caa42ac3234cc3@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <361b27370803231012sfd4be82j28698c8978d58fb0@mail.gmail.com> On Sun, Mar 23, 2008 at 11:51 AM, John Melesky wrote: > > Then each community member is given a pool of, say, 50 points, that > > they can distribute between proposals however they like (or a > > different voting system could be used, I dunno). > > Except for this part. Instead of 50 points, every registered user > could vote a talk up or down if they wished (in a reddit/digg-like > fashion). No real need to limit people. > My (admittedly off-the-cuff) impetus for limiting people was to provide some mechanism for actually choosing between lots of really good proposals; for instance, if every single PyCon talk happened to get a "thumbs up" from every single community member, this wouldn't actually help in determining what talks to accept--this isn't really a problem with BARcamp AFAIK because there's always room for more talks, but it is a problem with PyCon. By giving people a limited number of points, they're forced to choose which talks they want to vote for, which will help determine which of the really interesting talks ultimately get picked (if this is even an issue, which I'm not sure is the case). In other words, I'm not saying that I think we should definitely give people a limited number of points, I'm just saying that there can be good reasons to do so, depending on the context. :) Possible downsides: > - Puts perhaps even more weight on the talk summary/abstract than the > committee method does Personally I think that this can be a good thing; if the speaker isn't willing to put much effort into a talk summary/abstract, then how much effort are they likely to put into their actual presentation? And with the more social aspects of comment threads, even if their talk didn't get accepted, they will hopefully at least get some good feedback that will help them create a better proposal next year, or they can take what they've worked on so far and present it at a different venue, e.g. ChiPy or BARcamp, or perhaps make a screencast out of it, etc. - Should we let the masses choose their own talks? > If the masses are intelligent, then I'm all for this, and I think that the Python community is pretty intelligent. The only real potential downside I see here is if only a certain segment of the Python community ends up voting--for instance, if only veteran Pythonistas vote, then the conference will be largely skewed towards them. This probably isn't such a big deal when the voting process occurs relatively close to the actual event, which is the case with BARcamp, but with an event like PyCon where the voting would take place 3-5 months before the event, I'm guessing that the voter turnout could be significantly different from the attendee turnout. - Atul -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mail.python.org/pipermail/chicago/attachments/20080323/4e1e5335/attachment-0001.htm From hsu.feihong at yahoo.com Sun Mar 23 23:56:49 2008 From: hsu.feihong at yahoo.com (Feihong Hsu) Date: Sun, 23 Mar 2008 15:56:49 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Chicago] selecting talks Re: [PyCON-Organizers] Talk slot durations (was: FWD: Re: Pycon disappointment) In-Reply-To: <361b27370803230908t38c390gb8caa42ac3234cc3@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <267279.76127.qm@web34801.mail.mud.yahoo.com> I think the problem with a totally community-driven voting system is that the presentations focusing on the most popular, well-established projects will always get more votes. That wouldn't leave a lot of room for presentations about relatively new or obscure projects. I know that some talks this year were rather weak. The same thing was true last year. I don't think this is as big a problem as people think it is. It sucks for those of us who attend a bad talk, but even a bad talk serves a purpose. If a talk was bad, it usually wasn't because the presenter didn't put a lot of effort into it, it was probably because they lacked conference speaking skills. Speaking at a conference is not like speaking in front of your local user group. It's similar in some ways, but the larger audience and the higher expectations make it quite different. The amount and kind of preparation you do for a conference talk is on a totally different scale. So I argue that the only way to learn how to do a conference talk is to actually do it. A certain number of talks should be allocated to members of the Python community who are not experienced speakers (but of course they still have provide an interesting talk proposal). Some first-time speakers will do well, and they'll go on to speak again at future PyCons or other conferences. This is of real benefit to our community. Some first-time speakers will fail hard and waste the time of everyone who attends their talk. However, even failures are valuable learning experiences, and if these people analyze what they did wrong, they might become stronger speakers (some people will overcompensate in response to harsh criticism and become even stronger than speakers who succeeded on their first try). I probably wrote more than I needed to get my point across, but I could summarize by saying that it's impossible to separate the wheat from the chaff when you don't even plant the seeds. So let's plant the seeds, and see what germinates. Cheers, Feihong P.S. A few of you were (un)lucky enough to attend the practice run of my Python.NET talk. It ran for 72 minutes (!) and was a big rambling mess of a talk. If I had done that at PyCon, I would have understood if people boo'ed me off the stage. After the practice run, I gave the talk a significant make-over, in accordance with the feedback I got from the audience. As valuable as the practice run was, I'll confess that I was thinking about being lazy and not doing it at all! I came pretty close to giving a horrible talk at PyCon. As it is, I'm not certain that I gave a GOOD talk, but I'm fairly certain that it wasn't horrible. As my experience shows, succeeding as a first-time speaker involves some degree of luck. Or maybe the lesson is to not be lazy, but I don't think that's it because we're all lazy at some time in some way. --- Atul Varma wrote: > I'm not sure if this idea is along the same lines as what you're > saying > here, but what if the way to choose what talks get busted is based > purely on > a completely democratic voting process within the community? For > instance, > once all the talks are turned in, they're all publicly viewable on > the PyCon > website; they could even have comment threads where discussion > could take > place, e.g. potential audience members could ask the potential > presenter in > advance about their proposal, people who have heard the presenter > talk > before could provide comments, etc. Then each community member is > given a > pool of, say, 50 points, that they can distribute between proposals > however > they like (or a different voting system could be used, I dunno). > > Anyways, maybe I just repeated your idea using different words, I'm > not > sure... But it does seem like a community-driven conference could > use a > slightly more community-driven mechanism for selecting talks. ____________________________________________________________________________________ Be a better friend, newshound, and know-it-all with Yahoo! Mobile. Try it now. http://mobile.yahoo.com/;_ylt=Ahu06i62sR8HDtDypao8Wcj9tAcJ From shekay at pobox.com Mon Mar 24 01:15:28 2008 From: shekay at pobox.com (sheila miguez) Date: Sun, 23 Mar 2008 19:15:28 -0500 Subject: [Chicago] selecting talks Re: [PyCON-Organizers] Talk slot durations (was: FWD: Re: Pycon disappointment) In-Reply-To: <361b27370803230908t38c390gb8caa42ac3234cc3@mail.gmail.com> References: <361b27370803230908t38c390gb8caa42ac3234cc3@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: On Sun, Mar 23, 2008 at 11:08 AM, Atul Varma wrote: > advance about their proposal, people who have heard the presenter talk > before could provide comments, etc. Then each community member is given a > pool of, say, 50 points, that they can distribute between proposals however > they like (or a different voting system could be used, I dunno). > > Anyways, maybe I just repeated your idea using different words, I'm not > sure... But it does seem like a community-driven conference could use a > slightly more community-driven mechanism for selecting talks. I missed out on voting because I have been incredibly busy for the past year, but I think voting was open? Please, someone speak up. re: a pool of voting points On the list and in person people have expressed a desire to give speakers with more experience priority -- if someone decides to do that, the cost of voting for an experienced speaker could go up, e.g. it costs 2 points instead of 1. The other point of my letter was the idea that we should just try to test out some of these voting procedures on sample data to see if we like the outcomes. I would like if we could do this in order to avoid lengthy go-nowhere threads about how voting should work. -- sheila From shekay at pobox.com Mon Mar 24 01:21:11 2008 From: shekay at pobox.com (sheila miguez) Date: Sun, 23 Mar 2008 19:21:11 -0500 Subject: [Chicago] selecting talks Re: [PyCON-Organizers] Talk slot durations (was: FWD: Re: Pycon disappointment) In-Reply-To: <361b27370803231012sfd4be82j28698c8978d58fb0@mail.gmail.com> References: <361b27370803230908t38c390gb8caa42ac3234cc3@mail.gmail.com> <361b27370803231012sfd4be82j28698c8978d58fb0@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: On Sun, Mar 23, 2008 at 12:12 PM, Atul Varma wrote: > On Sun, Mar 23, 2008 at 11:51 AM, John Melesky > > Except for this part. Instead of 50 points, every registered user > > could vote a talk up or down if they wished (in a reddit/digg-like > > fashion). No real need to limit people. > > > > My (admittedly off-the-cuff) impetus for limiting people was to provide some > mechanism for actually choosing between lots of really good proposals; for > instance, if every single PyCon talk happened to get a "thumbs up" from > every single community member, this wouldn't actually help in determining Right, so we need some limiting factor. a point pool. or perhaps a forced-choice approach e.g. "A and B are in the same slot. Which do you go see?" Then go through rounds of combinations (go see the bestthing.info I mentioned for the idea). Or, some other limiting ideas I am ignornat of. -- sheila From list at phaedrusdeinus.org Mon Mar 24 04:45:06 2008 From: list at phaedrusdeinus.org (John Melesky) Date: Sun, 23 Mar 2008 22:45:06 -0500 Subject: [Chicago] selecting talks Re: [PyCON-Organizers] Talk slot durations (was: FWD: Re: Pycon disappointment) In-Reply-To: <361b27370803231012sfd4be82j28698c8978d58fb0@mail.gmail.com> References: <361b27370803230908t38c390gb8caa42ac3234cc3@mail.gmail.com> <361b27370803231012sfd4be82j28698c8978d58fb0@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <67F9DC85-FE2C-4571-882A-F461D5DBD1E2@phaedrusdeinus.org> On Mar 23, 2008, at 12:12 PM, Atul Varma wrote: > My (admittedly off-the-cuff) impetus for limiting people was to > provide some mechanism for actually choosing between lots of really > good proposals; for instance, if every single PyCon talk happened to > get a "thumbs up" from every single community member, this wouldn't > actually help in determining what talks to accept--this isn't really > a problem with BARcamp AFAIK because there's always room for more > talks, but it is a problem with PyCon. That sort of outcome is theoretically possible, but profoundly unlikely. Additionally, some management of the results would be necessary by the actual organizers (if only to finalize the schedule), which would mediate any such pathological behavior on the part of the community. > The only real potential downside I see here is if only a certain > segment of the Python community ends up voting--for instance, if > only veteran Pythonistas vote, then the conference will be largely > skewed towards them. I agree this is the big caution, especially if you limit voters to those who have actually registered for the conference. I'm not sure what the solution is to that problem. On the flip side, though, the current committee system suffers from that same issue. -johnnnnnn From maney at two14.net Mon Mar 24 14:31:54 2008 From: maney at two14.net (Martin Maney) Date: Mon, 24 Mar 2008 08:31:54 -0500 Subject: [Chicago] selecting talks Re: [PyCON-Organizers] Talk slot durations (was: FWD: Re: Pycon disappointment) In-Reply-To: <7C26B22E-72DB-4AC2-BB39-CD5978A9DF35@leafe.com> References: <361b27370803230908t38c390gb8caa42ac3234cc3@mail.gmail.com> <7C26B22E-72DB-4AC2-BB39-CD5978A9DF35@leafe.com> Message-ID: <20080324133154.GB27142@furrr.two14.net> On Sun, Mar 23, 2008 at 11:34:21AM -0500, Ed Leafe wrote: > Unfortunately, the description of a proposed talk can have little to do > with the quality of the talk. There were several talks that I had > anticipated eagerly last week, based on the description, only to find that > they were boring and uninformative. Conversely, I went to a few that didn't > sound all that interesting on paper but were very engaging in person. Yep. The academic method is to ignore - indeed, to hide - the identity of the author from reviewers in order to avoid so far as possible bias based on personalities. That can work pretty well for choosing what papers to publish - the work the reviewers see is exactly what will be published. But I think I have to come around to the other side in this case, because when what you're reviewing is some sort of written sketch, or perhaps a draft version of the slides, for a proposed talk, there's a hugely important gap between what the reviewers see and what gets "published". And in this case knowing the author's track record as a speaker very likely does more good than harm - as many more than Ed have said in one way or another, an intrinsically interesting subject won't make up for a poor presentation, or at least not as well as a good speaker can make up for a less than exciting [or so you thought it] topic. Of course best is when the subject and the speaker are both first rate, and if reviewers have no basis for judging the speaker, they are literally working half blind. Of course all this pales into insignificance next to the clear and pressing need to schedule 2009's pycon so that it overlaps the working season of the water taxis, which resume service today! -- Allen Funt was one of the great psychologists of the twentieth century. His informal experiments and demonstrations on "Candid Camera" showed us as much about human psychology and its surprising limitations as the work of any academic psychologist. -- Daniel Dennett From maney at two14.net Mon Mar 24 14:39:41 2008 From: maney at two14.net (Martin Maney) Date: Mon, 24 Mar 2008 08:39:41 -0500 Subject: [Chicago] selecting talks Re: [PyCON-Organizers] Talk slot durations (was: FWD: Re: Pycon disappointment) In-Reply-To: <267279.76127.qm@web34801.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <361b27370803230908t38c390gb8caa42ac3234cc3@mail.gmail.com> <267279.76127.qm@web34801.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <20080324133941.GC27142@furrr.two14.net> On Sun, Mar 23, 2008 at 03:56:49PM -0700, Feihong Hsu wrote: > scale. So I argue that the only way to learn how to do a conference > talk is to actually do it. A certain number of talks should be Which suggests that we need "minor league" conferences where people can get more practice. Smaller, more regional, more diverse... More like PyCon back when it started, maybe, in some ways. Quantity has a virtue all its own, but so does it have the vices of its virtues. Besides, Big PyCon comes at a time of year when I'm just not free. :-U -- Man's mind, once stretched by a new idea, never regains its original dimensions. -- Oliver Wendell Holmes From hsu.feihong at yahoo.com Mon Mar 24 15:07:28 2008 From: hsu.feihong at yahoo.com (Feihong Hsu) Date: Mon, 24 Mar 2008 07:07:28 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Chicago] selecting talks Re: [PyCON-Organizers] Talk slot durations (was: FWD: Re: Pycon disappointment) In-Reply-To: <20080324133941.GC27142@furrr.two14.net> Message-ID: <237649.80829.qm@web34806.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Yes, I agree. But until we get some regional PyCons going I think we should still be willing to take a chance on unproven speakers. I heard some rumors of an Ohio PyCon, but I haven't seen any announcements... --- Martin Maney wrote: > On Sun, Mar 23, 2008 at 03:56:49PM -0700, Feihong Hsu wrote: > > scale. So I argue that the only way to learn how to do a > conference > > talk is to actually do it. A certain number of talks should be > > Which suggests that we need "minor league" conferences where people > can > get more practice. Smaller, more regional, more diverse... More > like > PyCon back when it started, maybe, in some ways. Quantity has a > virtue > all its own, but so does it have the vices of its virtues. > > Besides, Big PyCon comes at a time of year when I'm just not free. > :-U > > -- > Man's mind, once stretched by a new idea, > never regains its original dimensions. -- Oliver Wendell Holmes > > _______________________________________________ > Chicago mailing list > Chicago at python.org > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago > ____________________________________________________________________________________ Never miss a thing. Make Yahoo your home page. http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs From tcp at mac.com Mon Mar 24 15:35:19 2008 From: tcp at mac.com (Ted Pollari) Date: Mon, 24 Mar 2008 07:35:19 -0700 Subject: [Chicago] selecting talks Re: [PyCON-Organizers] Talk slot durations (was: FWD: Re: Pycon disappointment) In-Reply-To: <20080324133941.GC27142@furrr.two14.net> References: <361b27370803230908t38c390gb8caa42ac3234cc3@mail.gmail.com> <267279.76127.qm@web34801.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <20080324133941.GC27142@furrr.two14.net> Message-ID: On Mar 24, 2008, at 6:39 AM, Martin Maney wrote: > On Sun, Mar 23, 2008 at 03:56:49PM -0700, Feihong Hsu wrote: >> scale. So I argue that the only way to learn how to do a conference >> talk is to actually do it. A certain number of talks should be > > Which suggests that we need "minor league" conferences where people > can > get more practice. Smaller, more regional, more diverse... More like > PyCon back when it started, maybe, in some ways. Quantity has a > virtue > all its own, but so does it have the vices of its virtues. So, there's been a lot of talk here and there about regional conferences... who wants to organize the midwest conference? (NOT IT!) -ted From szybalski at gmail.com Mon Mar 24 15:49:19 2008 From: szybalski at gmail.com (Lukasz Szybalski) Date: Mon, 24 Mar 2008 09:49:19 -0500 Subject: [Chicago] selecting talks Re: [PyCON-Organizers] Talk slot durations (was: FWD: Re: Pycon disappointment) In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <804e5c70803240749p569414cbjb7beb8385a63c95b@mail.gmail.com> On Sun, Mar 23, 2008 at 10:31 AM, sheila miguez wrote: > I'm moving this thread here because I think my reply is too > hare-brained and informal for the organizers list. I hate lengthy > blahblahblahs on how things should get done and would like some > concrete way to test out ideas so that we can cut the crap and get on > with it. where "it" is more fun. > > 2008/3/21 Atul Varma : > > > I like this idea of people having to "prove themselves" to some extent to > > present at PyCon, and I wonder if there's a way to integrate this kind of > > concept with local Python interest groups [snip] > > I think the pycon organizers should find a way to test ideas being > discussed in these threads. > > Perhaps we could test ideas on previous conferences. e.g. apply > proposed selection procedures to historical data sets, and judge the > resulting conference models with the historical outcomes. Which > algorithm rejected/selected what were considered high quality talks, > which algorithms selected talks that were not selected in the > historical conference? &c. > > We won't have the benefit of knowing the quality of talks that didn't > go in to previous conferences (unless rejected talks were given > somewhere else and we have that data), but perhaps we have enough data > to run through voting scenarios on past conference talks to compare > generated scores with actual talk quality. > > Alternatively, If we can obtain access to data from upcoming > conferences we could run through scenarios to compare hypothetical > model against actual results. > > If this is easy to test, we could at least get an idea of "holy crap > that method sucks!" though perhaps they will all be too close to call. > > > This is just something I was pondering whilst thinking of different > ideas on voting and also ranking talks to consider scheduling--Randall > Monroe once had a voting scheme on ideas for the perfect date, perhaps > similar to the voting schemes he uses on sites like > . (loosely based, he says, on > Condorcet voting criteria) > > Also, being a gamer, I thought of the voting system with different > criteria for giving voters more points to vote on talks. and talks > would have different costs for voting. by analogy, designing stats and > leveling up characters. > Are there any data available that tells you who picked what talk, how many people showed up, who registered for what, some survey on a talk (good +, bad -), any other indicators? pycon 2008 and previous pycons? Lucas From nerkles at gmail.com Mon Mar 24 15:53:03 2008 From: nerkles at gmail.com (isaac) Date: Mon, 24 Mar 2008 09:53:03 -0500 Subject: [Chicago] selecting talks Re: [PyCON-Organizers] Talk slot durations (was: FWD: Re: Pycon disappointment) In-Reply-To: References: <361b27370803230908t38c390gb8caa42ac3234cc3@mail.gmail.com> <267279.76127.qm@web34801.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <20080324133941.GC27142@furrr.two14.net> Message-ID: <57427b5b0803240753g44f02c0et3c2ae87745376bf4@mail.gmail.com> If there were a way for people who register early to communicate with speakers ahead of time and discuss expectations, that may help a little. The descriptions of sessions could be clarified as the date approaches, and people could adjust their schedules accordingly. That process would have to be cut off at some point so speakers and attendees can finalize their plans. If the speakers know more about who's coming and what they expect to learn, they can be better prepared, and know what to include/exclude from the presentation/tutorial. --isaac -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mail.python.org/pipermail/chicago/attachments/20080324/fbb0d6ba/attachment.htm From shekay at pobox.com Mon Mar 24 16:23:39 2008 From: shekay at pobox.com (sheila miguez) Date: Mon, 24 Mar 2008 10:23:39 -0500 Subject: [Chicago] selecting talks Re: [PyCON-Organizers] Talk slot durations (was: FWD: Re: Pycon disappointment) In-Reply-To: <804e5c70803240749p569414cbjb7beb8385a63c95b@mail.gmail.com> References: <804e5c70803240749p569414cbjb7beb8385a63c95b@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: On Mon, Mar 24, 2008 at 9:49 AM, Lukasz Szybalski wrote: > Are there any data available that tells you who picked what talk, how > many people showed up, who registered for what, some survey on a talk > (good +, bad -), any other indicators? > > pycon 2008 and previous pycons? That's one thing I was hoping to find out by posting to the list. -- sheila From bob.haugen at gmail.com Tue Mar 25 01:35:18 2008 From: bob.haugen at gmail.com (Bob Haugen) Date: Mon, 24 Mar 2008 19:35:18 -0500 Subject: [Chicago] selecting talks Re: [PyCON-Organizers] Talk slot durations (was: FWD: Re: Pycon disappointment) In-Reply-To: <20080324133941.GC27142@furrr.two14.net> References: <361b27370803230908t38c390gb8caa42ac3234cc3@mail.gmail.com> <267279.76127.qm@web34801.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <20080324133941.GC27142@furrr.two14.net> Message-ID: <343ecb3e0803241735p16dea177sd2ddd44b7199057e@mail.gmail.com> Re quality of presentations: the PLoP (Pattern Languages of Programming) conferences have this practice called shepherding, where experienced people help the less experienced improve their presentations before the big show. Works pretty well. From abb2104 at columbia.edu Thu Mar 27 02:31:25 2008 From: abb2104 at columbia.edu (abb2104 at columbia.edu) Date: Wed, 26 Mar 2008 21:31:25 -0400 Subject: [Chicago] netflix prize Message-ID: <20080326213125.np701d42sk0ss4kk@cubmail.cc.columbia.edu> Hi, I'm a junior programmer from Columbia, and I want to know, is anyone a part of a netflix prize team? I'm doing a data mining project, and just picked up Collective Intelligence by Toby Segaran, and the first thing that I read is about the netflix prize. If anyone is a member of a team, can I join. If not, would you want to start out own team? Thanks, Adam From tprinty at mail.edisonave.net Thu Mar 27 14:30:53 2008 From: tprinty at mail.edisonave.net (Tom Printy) Date: Thu, 27 Mar 2008 08:30:53 -0500 Subject: [Chicago] netflix prize In-Reply-To: <20080326213125.np701d42sk0ss4kk@cubmail.cc.columbia.edu> References: <20080326213125.np701d42sk0ss4kk@cubmail.cc.columbia.edu> Message-ID: <1206624654.13640.0.camel@localhost> Hi, If you do start a team please let me know. I have done some work in this space while at Sourcelight Technologies (www.sourcelight.com) . Thanks -Tom Printy On Wed, 2008-03-26 at 21:31 -0400, abb2104 at columbia.edu wrote: > Hi, > > I'm a junior programmer from Columbia, and I want to know, is anyone a > part of a netflix prize team? I'm doing a data mining project, and > just picked up Collective Intelligence by Toby Segaran, and the first > thing that I read is about the netflix prize. If anyone is a member of > a team, can I join. If not, would you want to start out own team? > > Thanks, > > Adam > _______________________________________________ > Chicago mailing list > Chicago at python.org > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago From gershon.bialer at gmail.com Thu Mar 27 15:36:58 2008 From: gershon.bialer at gmail.com (gershon bialer) Date: Thu, 27 Mar 2008 09:36:58 -0500 Subject: [Chicago] netflix prize In-Reply-To: <20080326213125.np701d42sk0ss4kk@cubmail.cc.columbia.edu> References: <20080326213125.np701d42sk0ss4kk@cubmail.cc.columbia.edu> Message-ID: Hi, I just looked at the Netflix. I'd be interested in working on it, if you start team. Gershon Bialer On Wed, Mar 26, 2008 at 8:31 PM, wrote: > Hi, > > I'm a junior programmer from Columbia, and I want to know, is anyone a > part of a netflix prize team? I'm doing a data mining project, and > just picked up Collective Intelligence by Toby Segaran, and the first > thing that I read is about the netflix prize. If anyone is a member of > a team, can I join. If not, would you want to start out own team? > > Thanks, > > Adam > _______________________________________________ > Chicago mailing list > Chicago at python.org > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mail.python.org/pipermail/chicago/attachments/20080327/f0bd15fd/attachment.htm From cstejerean at gmail.com Thu Mar 27 16:41:17 2008 From: cstejerean at gmail.com (Cosmin Stejerean) Date: Thu, 27 Mar 2008 10:41:17 -0500 Subject: [Chicago] netflix prize In-Reply-To: References: <20080326213125.np701d42sk0ss4kk@cubmail.cc.columbia.edu> Message-ID: <276266d0803270841v3d3f85d0ked6885bb1cbe1b4d@mail.gmail.com> I've started looking at the Netflix prize around the time when it was announced but I quickly lost focus since I couldn't find anyone to work with. If a team is started I'd love to join. - Cosmin On Thu, Mar 27, 2008 at 9:36 AM, gershon bialer wrote: > Hi, > > I just looked at the Netflix. I'd be interested in working on it, if you > start team. > > Gershon Bialer > > > > On Wed, Mar 26, 2008 at 8:31 PM, wrote: > > > Hi, > > > > I'm a junior programmer from Columbia, and I want to know, is anyone a > > part of a netflix prize team? I'm doing a data mining project, and > > just picked up Collective Intelligence by Toby Segaran, and the first > > thing that I read is about the netflix prize. If anyone is a member of > > a team, can I join. If not, would you want to start out own team? > > > > Thanks, > > > > Adam > > _______________________________________________ > > Chicago mailing list > > Chicago at python.org > > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago > > > > > _______________________________________________ > Chicago mailing list > Chicago at python.org > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago > > -- Cosmin Stejerean http://blog.offbytwo.com From kumar.mcmillan at gmail.com Thu Mar 27 17:01:22 2008 From: kumar.mcmillan at gmail.com (Kumar McMillan) Date: Thu, 27 Mar 2008 11:01:22 -0500 Subject: [Chicago] netflix prize In-Reply-To: <276266d0803270841v3d3f85d0ked6885bb1cbe1b4d@mail.gmail.com> References: <20080326213125.np701d42sk0ss4kk@cubmail.cc.columbia.edu> <276266d0803270841v3d3f85d0ked6885bb1cbe1b4d@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: On Thu, Mar 27, 2008 at 10:41 AM, Cosmin Stejerean wrote: > I've started looking at the Netflix prize around the time when it was > announced but I quickly lost focus since I couldn't find anyone to > work with. If a team is started I'd love to join. ditto. I got as far as downloading the data, planning out a strategy with IPython2 (Chris McAvoy wrote some code for this already, I think), and attempting to grok a simple approach using the Slope One algorithm ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Slope_One ). I'd say creating a team would provide good motivation to dig back into this project. Slope One won't get us anywhere near the winning RMSE but still it would be interesting to implement this kind of logic and personally I'd like to learn more about putting these kind of algorithms to use in Python. I imagine the contest will be over soon too (http://www.netflixprize.com/leaderboard), but that doesn't mean it wouldn't be fun to play :) btw ... this would be a great Saturday House project : http://groups.google.com/group/chicago-saturday-house Kumar From chris.mcavoy at gmail.com Thu Mar 27 18:14:36 2008 From: chris.mcavoy at gmail.com (Chris McAvoy) Date: Thu, 27 Mar 2008 12:14:36 -0500 Subject: [Chicago] netflix prize In-Reply-To: References: <20080326213125.np701d42sk0ss4kk@cubmail.cc.columbia.edu> <276266d0803270841v3d3f85d0ked6885bb1cbe1b4d@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <3096c19d0803271014j670f39daxe4075975ad65a796@mail.gmail.com> I'm all for it...I really like the Netflix prize concept, but don't really know what i'm doing. I bought Programming Collective Intelligence, and it got me part way, but I still haven't implemented anything from it. Chris On Thu, Mar 27, 2008 at 11:01 AM, Kumar McMillan wrote: > On Thu, Mar 27, 2008 at 10:41 AM, Cosmin Stejerean wrote: > > I've started looking at the Netflix prize around the time when it was > > announced but I quickly lost focus since I couldn't find anyone to > > work with. If a team is started I'd love to join. > > ditto. I got as far as downloading the data, planning out a strategy > with IPython2 (Chris McAvoy wrote some code for this already, I > think), and attempting to grok a simple approach using the Slope One > algorithm ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Slope_One ). I'd say > creating a team would provide good motivation to dig back into this > project. Slope One won't get us anywhere near the winning RMSE but > still it would be interesting to implement this kind of logic and > personally I'd like to learn more about putting these kind of > algorithms to use in Python. I imagine the contest will be over soon > too (http://www.netflixprize.com/leaderboard), but that doesn't mean > it wouldn't be fun to play :) > > btw ... this would be a great Saturday House project : > http://groups.google.com/group/chicago-saturday-house > > Kumar > > > _______________________________________________ > Chicago mailing list > Chicago at python.org > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago > From tcp at mac.com Thu Mar 27 18:17:44 2008 From: tcp at mac.com (Ted Pollari) Date: Thu, 27 Mar 2008 10:17:44 -0700 Subject: [Chicago] netflix prize In-Reply-To: <3096c19d0803271014j670f39daxe4075975ad65a796@mail.gmail.com> References: <20080326213125.np701d42sk0ss4kk@cubmail.cc.columbia.edu> <276266d0803270841v3d3f85d0ked6885bb1cbe1b4d@mail.gmail.com> <3096c19d0803271014j670f39daxe4075975ad65a796@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <352843EF-078F-4460-8B8F-2A2582E18A4F@mac.com> On Mar 27, 2008, at 10:14 AM, Chris McAvoy wrote: > I'm all for it...I really like the Netflix prize concept, but don't > really know what i'm doing. I bought Programming Collective > Intelligence, and it got me part way, but I still haven't implemented > anything from it. > > Chris Just because I know both Chris and I have read this (and because it's a psychologist kicking computer-geek butt): http://www.wired.com/techbiz/media/magazine/16-03/mf_netflix -- it's an interesting piece and may give y'all something to think about for all this. or not. -ted From mdipierro at cs.depaul.edu Thu Mar 27 18:20:16 2008 From: mdipierro at cs.depaul.edu (Massimo Di Pierro) Date: Thu, 27 Mar 2008 12:20:16 -0500 Subject: [Chicago] netflix prize In-Reply-To: <3096c19d0803271014j670f39daxe4075975ad65a796@mail.gmail.com> References: <20080326213125.np701d42sk0ss4kk@cubmail.cc.columbia.edu> <276266d0803270841v3d3f85d0ked6885bb1cbe1b4d@mail.gmail.com> <3096c19d0803271014j670f39daxe4075975ad65a796@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <8BE29B4E-6D7A-4417-BA3F-AE4B0FE5FAC0@cs.depaul.edu> Does anybody know what information is in the data they provide. Other than user's rating, what's in the movies database that one can use for correlation (like actors in the movies, producers, genre, etc.)? Massimo On Mar 27, 2008, at 12:14 PM, Chris McAvoy wrote: > I'm all for it...I really like the Netflix prize concept, but don't > really know what i'm doing. I bought Programming Collective > Intelligence, and it got me part way, but I still haven't implemented > anything from it. > > Chris > > On Thu, Mar 27, 2008 at 11:01 AM, Kumar McMillan > wrote: >> On Thu, Mar 27, 2008 at 10:41 AM, Cosmin Stejerean >> wrote: >>> I've started looking at the Netflix prize around the time when it >>> was >>> announced but I quickly lost focus since I couldn't find anyone to >>> work with. If a team is started I'd love to join. >> >> ditto. I got as far as downloading the data, planning out a >> strategy >> with IPython2 (Chris McAvoy wrote some code for this already, I >> think), and attempting to grok a simple approach using the Slope One >> algorithm ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Slope_One ). I'd say >> creating a team would provide good motivation to dig back into this >> project. Slope One won't get us anywhere near the winning RMSE but >> still it would be interesting to implement this kind of logic and >> personally I'd like to learn more about putting these kind of >> algorithms to use in Python. I imagine the contest will be over >> soon >> too (http://www.netflixprize.com/leaderboard), but that doesn't mean >> it wouldn't be fun to play :) >> >> btw ... this would be a great Saturday House project : >> http://groups.google.com/group/chicago-saturday-house >> >> Kumar >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Chicago mailing list >> Chicago at python.org >> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago >> > _______________________________________________ > Chicago mailing list > Chicago at python.org > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago From robkapteyn at gmail.com Thu Mar 27 18:40:50 2008 From: robkapteyn at gmail.com (Rob Kapteyn) Date: Thu, 27 Mar 2008 12:40:50 -0500 Subject: [Chicago] netflix prize In-Reply-To: <3096c19d0803271014j670f39daxe4075975ad65a796@mail.gmail.com> References: <20080326213125.np701d42sk0ss4kk@cubmail.cc.columbia.edu> <276266d0803270841v3d3f85d0ked6885bb1cbe1b4d@mail.gmail.com> <3096c19d0803271014j670f39daxe4075975ad65a796@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: Watch this talk from PyCon when the videos are posted: 131. MPI Cluster Programming with Python and Amazon EC2 Peter Skomoroch (Juice Analytics) http://us.pycon.org/2008/conference/talks/ Even though it doesn't say so in the description, a lot of this talk was about using the cluster to analyze data for the NetFlix prize. -Rob On Mar 27, 2008, at 12:14 PM, Chris McAvoy wrote: > I'm all for it...I really like the Netflix prize concept, but don't > really know what i'm doing. I bought Programming Collective > Intelligence, and it got me part way, but I still haven't implemented > anything from it. > > Chris > > On Thu, Mar 27, 2008 at 11:01 AM, Kumar McMillan > wrote: >> On Thu, Mar 27, 2008 at 10:41 AM, Cosmin Stejerean > > wrote: >>> I've started looking at the Netflix prize around the time when it >>> was >>> announced but I quickly lost focus since I couldn't find anyone to >>> work with. If a team is started I'd love to join. >> >> ditto. I got as far as downloading the data, planning out a strategy >> with IPython2 (Chris McAvoy wrote some code for this already, I >> think), and attempting to grok a simple approach using the Slope One >> algorithm ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Slope_One ). I'd say >> creating a team would provide good motivation to dig back into this >> project. Slope One won't get us anywhere near the winning RMSE but >> still it would be interesting to implement this kind of logic and >> personally I'd like to learn more about putting these kind of >> algorithms to use in Python. I imagine the contest will be over soon >> too (http://www.netflixprize.com/leaderboard), but that doesn't mean >> it wouldn't be fun to play :) >> >> btw ... this would be a great Saturday House project : >> http://groups.google.com/group/chicago-saturday-house >> >> Kumar >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Chicago mailing list >> Chicago at python.org >> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago >> > _______________________________________________ > Chicago mailing list > Chicago at python.org > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mail.python.org/pipermail/chicago/attachments/20080327/79157a45/attachment-0001.htm From tcp at mac.com Thu Mar 27 19:04:54 2008 From: tcp at mac.com (Ted Pollari) Date: Thu, 27 Mar 2008 11:04:54 -0700 Subject: [Chicago] netflix prize In-Reply-To: References: <20080326213125.np701d42sk0ss4kk@cubmail.cc.columbia.edu> <276266d0803270841v3d3f85d0ked6885bb1cbe1b4d@mail.gmail.com> <3096c19d0803271014j670f39daxe4075975ad65a796@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: On Mar 27, 2008, at 10:40 AM, Rob Kapteyn wrote: > Watch this talk from PyCon when the videos are posted: > > 131. MPI Cluster Programming with Python and Amazon EC2 > Peter Skomoroch (Juice Analytics) > http://us.pycon.org/2008/conference/talks/ > > Even though it doesn't say so in the description, a lot of this talk > was about using the cluster to analyze data for the NetFlix prize. > > -Rob > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XR3rIVLjA-U (the audio is really bad for the first minute or three and then kinda bad after that...it may be fixed in the future, maybe) -tcp -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mail.python.org/pipermail/chicago/attachments/20080327/6e9e99af/attachment.htm From jsudlow at gmail.com Thu Mar 27 19:13:18 2008 From: jsudlow at gmail.com (Jon Sudlow) Date: Thu, 27 Mar 2008 13:13:18 -0500 Subject: [Chicago] netflix prize In-Reply-To: References: <20080326213125.np701d42sk0ss4kk@cubmail.cc.columbia.edu> <276266d0803270841v3d3f85d0ked6885bb1cbe1b4d@mail.gmail.com> <3096c19d0803271014j670f39daxe4075975ad65a796@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: I'd be very interested in joining a team that was working on this kind of problem. On Thu, Mar 27, 2008 at 1:04 PM, Ted Pollari wrote: > > On Mar 27, 2008, at 10:40 AM, Rob Kapteyn wrote: > > Watch this talk from PyCon when the videos are posted: > > 131. MPI Cluster Programming with Python and Amazon EC2 > Peter Skomoroch (Juice Analytics) > http://us.pycon.org/2008/conference/talks/ > > Even though it doesn't say so in the description, a lot of this talk was > about using the cluster to analyze data for the NetFlix prize. > > -Rob > > > > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XR3rIVLjA-U > > (the audio is really bad for the first minute or three and then kinda bad > after that...it may be fixed in the future, maybe) > > -tcp > > _______________________________________________ > Chicago mailing list > Chicago at python.org > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago > > -- Jon Sudlow 3225 Foster Avenue 221 Sohlberg Hall C.P.O 2224 Chicago, Il 60625 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mail.python.org/pipermail/chicago/attachments/20080327/98de3e85/attachment.htm From szybalski at gmail.com Thu Mar 27 19:58:16 2008 From: szybalski at gmail.com (Lukasz Szybalski) Date: Thu, 27 Mar 2008 13:58:16 -0500 Subject: [Chicago] Fwd: Perl/Python Frameworks for the Framework Rumble at Flourish In-Reply-To: <3d76512f0803271140y9eefc37k2e1a50567e299995@mail.gmail.com> References: <3d76512f0803271140y9eefc37k2e1a50567e299995@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <804e5c70803271158s3c32441fu8a4516c0f7853141@mail.gmail.com> For those of you that are participating in Flourish. Chicago April 4-5 at UIC. http://www.flourishconf.com Organizers are requesting people to represent their web framework at Flourish Rumble. Please email Roberto Serrano , or info at flourishconf.com if you are willing to participate. 7 sponsors and 200+ attendees already! ---------- Forwarded message ---------- From: Roberto Serrano Date: Thu, Mar 27, 2008 at 1:40 PM Subject: Perl/Python Frameworks for the Framework Rumble at Flourish I'm working with Chicago Tech's Dave Chakrabarti to get the Rumble competition off the ground. We discuss the possibility of having a meeting early this coming week to talk about the final rules, etc. I do not remember getting exact contacts of people that may want to participate from your groups, and this is the time we need names and contacts so that we can arrange that meeting. Thank you! The Web Application Framework Development (WAFD) Rumble is a development competition where attendees representing different communities will have the opportunity to see which web application framework can create the best website in the shortest amount of time. They will have to crunch to build the website with only a site flowchart, graphics, database schema, test data, and use cases. Representatives from different web application frameworks are eligible to compete - we are hoping to peg representatives from TurboGears, ROR, django, CakePHP, catalyst, etc. Contestants must be respresenting a web application framework in order to be eligible to compete. Interested parties should send e-mail to info at flourishconf.com From deadwisdom at gmail.com Thu Mar 27 22:07:37 2008 From: deadwisdom at gmail.com (Brantley Harris) Date: Thu, 27 Mar 2008 16:07:37 -0500 Subject: [Chicago] class continued, or metaclassing + framehackery, or an exercise in never using this because it's BAD... but fun. Message-ID: <694c06d60803271407k4113a647sfb59d05faca7dc2d@mail.gmail.com> import sys class ContinueMeta(type): def __new__(cls, name, bases, dct): if name == 'continued': return type.__new__(cls, name, bases, dct) existing = sys._getframe(1).f_locals[name] for k, v in dct.items(): setattr(existing, k, v) return existing class continued(object): __metaclass__ = ContinueMeta ### Testing ### class Widget(object): def __init__(self): print "Widget created!" class Widget(continued): def hello(self): print "Hello world!" ---------- >>> w = Widget() >>> w.hello() Widget created! Hello world! From tprinty at mail.edisonave.net Thu Mar 27 22:50:30 2008 From: tprinty at mail.edisonave.net (Tom Printy) Date: Thu, 27 Mar 2008 16:50:30 -0500 Subject: [Chicago] netflix prize In-Reply-To: <8BE29B4E-6D7A-4417-BA3F-AE4B0FE5FAC0@cs.depaul.edu> References: <20080326213125.np701d42sk0ss4kk@cubmail.cc.columbia.edu> <276266d0803270841v3d3f85d0ked6885bb1cbe1b4d@mail.gmail.com> <3096c19d0803271014j670f39daxe4075975ad65a796@mail.gmail.com> <8BE29B4E-6D7A-4417-BA3F-AE4B0FE5FAC0@cs.depaul.edu> Message-ID: <1206654631.13640.2.camel@localhost> On Thu, 2008-03-27 at 12:20 -0500, Massimo Di Pierro wrote: > Does anybody know what information is in the data they provide. Other > than user's rating, what's in the movies database that one can use > for correlation (like actors in the movies, producers, genre, etc.)? Well we could crawl IMDB for this info. Or I may be able to get my hands on the data ;) -Tom From mdipierro at cs.depaul.edu Thu Mar 27 23:12:02 2008 From: mdipierro at cs.depaul.edu (Massimo Di Pierro) Date: Thu, 27 Mar 2008 17:12:02 -0500 Subject: [Chicago] netflix prize In-Reply-To: <1206654631.13640.2.camel@localhost> References: <20080326213125.np701d42sk0ss4kk@cubmail.cc.columbia.edu> <276266d0803270841v3d3f85d0ked6885bb1cbe1b4d@mail.gmail.com> <3096c19d0803271014j670f39daxe4075975ad65a796@mail.gmail.com> <8BE29B4E-6D7A-4417-BA3F-AE4B0FE5FAC0@cs.depaul.edu> <1206654631.13640.2.camel@localhost> Message-ID: <92F1CB2E-4702-4F56-9662-58762A5FE7FF@cs.depaul.edu> Let us know what you find. Massimo On Mar 27, 2008, at 4:50 PM, Tom Printy wrote: > On Thu, 2008-03-27 at 12:20 -0500, Massimo Di Pierro wrote: >> Does anybody know what information is in the data they provide. Other >> than user's rating, what's in the movies database that one can use >> for correlation (like actors in the movies, producers, genre, etc.)? > Well we could crawl IMDB for this info. Or I may be able to get my > hands > on the data ;) > > > -Tom > > _______________________________________________ > Chicago mailing list > Chicago at python.org > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago From kumar.mcmillan at gmail.com Thu Mar 27 23:53:38 2008 From: kumar.mcmillan at gmail.com (Kumar McMillan) Date: Thu, 27 Mar 2008 17:53:38 -0500 Subject: [Chicago] netflix prize In-Reply-To: <92F1CB2E-4702-4F56-9662-58762A5FE7FF@cs.depaul.edu> References: <20080326213125.np701d42sk0ss4kk@cubmail.cc.columbia.edu> <276266d0803270841v3d3f85d0ked6885bb1cbe1b4d@mail.gmail.com> <3096c19d0803271014j670f39daxe4075975ad65a796@mail.gmail.com> <8BE29B4E-6D7A-4417-BA3F-AE4B0FE5FAC0@cs.depaul.edu> <1206654631.13640.2.camel@localhost> <92F1CB2E-4702-4F56-9662-58762A5FE7FF@cs.depaul.edu> Message-ID: Massimo, I've attached the README from the download. It explains what's contained in the data and yes there is movie title and release year. I've also heard of how people have been getting sneaky and matching the rating data (which just has CustomerID) to the movie data, crawling IMDB, and "matching" netflix ratings to that of IMDB to expose the identity behind CustomerIDs. I don't think netflix was too happy about this ;) I just read it somewhere a while back, haven't looked at the details. Google gave me: http://www.netflixprize.com/community/viewtopic.php?pid=5864 On Thu, Mar 27, 2008 at 5:12 PM, Massimo Di Pierro wrote: > Let us know what you find. > > Massimo > > > > On Mar 27, 2008, at 4:50 PM, Tom Printy wrote: > > > On Thu, 2008-03-27 at 12:20 -0500, Massimo Di Pierro wrote: > >> Does anybody know what information is in the data they provide. Other > >> than user's rating, what's in the movies database that one can use > >> for correlation (like actors in the movies, producers, genre, etc.)? > > Well we could crawl IMDB for this info. Or I may be able to get my > > hands > > on the data ;) > > > > > > -Tom > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Chicago mailing list > > Chicago at python.org > > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago > > _______________________________________________ > Chicago mailing list > Chicago at python.org > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago > -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: README Type: application/octet-stream Size: 5915 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://mail.python.org/pipermail/chicago/attachments/20080327/3ac0c950/attachment-0001.obj From jsudlow at gmail.com Fri Mar 28 03:50:49 2008 From: jsudlow at gmail.com (Jon Sudlow) Date: Thu, 27 Mar 2008 21:50:49 -0500 Subject: [Chicago] netflix prize In-Reply-To: References: <20080326213125.np701d42sk0ss4kk@cubmail.cc.columbia.edu> <276266d0803270841v3d3f85d0ked6885bb1cbe1b4d@mail.gmail.com> <3096c19d0803271014j670f39daxe4075975ad65a796@mail.gmail.com> <8BE29B4E-6D7A-4417-BA3F-AE4B0FE5FAC0@cs.depaul.edu> <1206654631.13640.2.camel@localhost> <92F1CB2E-4702-4F56-9662-58762A5FE7FF@cs.depaul.edu> Message-ID: Your exactly right. I dont think netflix is looking for someone to crawl a third party data source to get a fuzzy match and use those results to help predict the ratings. By the way, when you do a group like this, one person is responsible to register the crew and communicate with Netflix. Who is the 'team leader', because we have to register to get our hands on the ratings data. -jon On Thu, Mar 27, 2008 at 5:53 PM, Kumar McMillan wrote: > Massimo, I've attached the README from the download. It explains > what's contained in the data and yes there is movie title and release > year. I've also heard of how people have been getting sneaky and > matching the rating data (which just has CustomerID) to the movie > data, crawling IMDB, and "matching" netflix ratings to that of IMDB to > expose the identity behind CustomerIDs. I don't think netflix was too > happy about this ;) I just read it somewhere a while back, haven't > looked at the details. Google gave me: > http://www.netflixprize.com/community/viewtopic.php?pid=5864 > > On Thu, Mar 27, 2008 at 5:12 PM, Massimo Di Pierro > wrote: > > Let us know what you find. > > > > Massimo > > > > > > > > On Mar 27, 2008, at 4:50 PM, Tom Printy wrote: > > > > > On Thu, 2008-03-27 at 12:20 -0500, Massimo Di Pierro wrote: > > >> Does anybody know what information is in the data they provide. > Other > > >> than user's rating, what's in the movies database that one can use > > >> for correlation (like actors in the movies, producers, genre, etc.)? > > > Well we could crawl IMDB for this info. Or I may be able to get my > > > hands > > > on the data ;) > > > > > > > > > -Tom > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > Chicago mailing list > > > Chicago at python.org > > > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Chicago mailing list > > Chicago at python.org > > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago > > > > _______________________________________________ > Chicago mailing list > Chicago at python.org > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago > > -- Jon Sudlow 3225 Foster Avenue 221 Sohlberg Hall C.P.O 2224 Chicago, Il 60625 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mail.python.org/pipermail/chicago/attachments/20080327/7f560f83/attachment.htm From gershon.bialer at gmail.com Fri Mar 28 04:00:42 2008 From: gershon.bialer at gmail.com (gershon bialer) Date: Thu, 27 Mar 2008 22:00:42 -0500 Subject: [Chicago] netflix prize In-Reply-To: References: <20080326213125.np701d42sk0ss4kk@cubmail.cc.columbia.edu> <276266d0803270841v3d3f85d0ked6885bb1cbe1b4d@mail.gmail.com> <3096c19d0803271014j670f39daxe4075975ad65a796@mail.gmail.com> <8BE29B4E-6D7A-4417-BA3F-AE4B0FE5FAC0@cs.depaul.edu> <1206654631.13640.2.camel@localhost> <92F1CB2E-4702-4F56-9662-58762A5FE7FF@cs.depaul.edu> Message-ID: If we were to go down that route, we could presumably get a copy of the movie scripts, and do some natural language processing on the script. This would probably only be useful if we didn't have that much rating data for the script, but I suppose there could be some uses. Also, if the user really likes certain actors, their presence in the movie could increase the rating. However, I suppose should all be detectable straight from the data, assuming there is sufficient data. Gershon Bialer On Thu, Mar 27, 2008 at 9:50 PM, Jon Sudlow wrote: > Your exactly right. I dont think netflix is looking for someone to crawl a > third party data source to get a fuzzy match and use those results to help > predict the ratings. > > By the way, when you do a group like this, one person is responsible to > register the crew and communicate with Netflix. Who is the 'team leader', > because we have to register to get our hands on the ratings data. > -jon > > > On Thu, Mar 27, 2008 at 5:53 PM, Kumar McMillan > wrote: > > > Massimo, I've attached the README from the download. It explains > > what's contained in the data and yes there is movie title and release > > year. I've also heard of how people have been getting sneaky and > > matching the rating data (which just has CustomerID) to the movie > > data, crawling IMDB, and "matching" netflix ratings to that of IMDB to > > expose the identity behind CustomerIDs. I don't think netflix was too > > happy about this ;) I just read it somewhere a while back, haven't > > looked at the details. Google gave me: > > http://www.netflixprize.com/community/viewtopic.php?pid=5864 > > > > On Thu, Mar 27, 2008 at 5:12 PM, Massimo Di Pierro > > wrote: > > > Let us know what you find. > > > > > > Massimo > > > > > > > > > > > > On Mar 27, 2008, at 4:50 PM, Tom Printy wrote: > > > > > > > On Thu, 2008-03-27 at 12:20 -0500, Massimo Di Pierro wrote: > > > >> Does anybody know what information is in the data they provide. > > Other > > > >> than user's rating, what's in the movies database that one can use > > > >> for correlation (like actors in the movies, producers, genre, > > etc.)? > > > > Well we could crawl IMDB for this info. Or I may be able to get my > > > > hands > > > > on the data ;) > > > > > > > > > > > > -Tom > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > > Chicago mailing list > > > > Chicago at python.org > > > > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > Chicago mailing list > > > Chicago at python.org > > > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Chicago mailing list > > Chicago at python.org > > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago > > > > > > > -- > Jon Sudlow > 3225 Foster Avenue > 221 Sohlberg Hall > C.P.O 2224 > Chicago, Il 60625 > > _______________________________________________ > Chicago mailing list > Chicago at python.org > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mail.python.org/pipermail/chicago/attachments/20080327/9a7f70c0/attachment.htm From mdipierro at cs.depaul.edu Fri Mar 28 04:00:54 2008 From: mdipierro at cs.depaul.edu (Massimo Di Pierro) Date: Thu, 27 Mar 2008 22:00:54 -0500 Subject: [Chicago] netflix prize In-Reply-To: References: <20080326213125.np701d42sk0ss4kk@cubmail.cc.columbia.edu> <276266d0803270841v3d3f85d0ked6885bb1cbe1b4d@mail.gmail.com> <3096c19d0803271014j670f39daxe4075975ad65a796@mail.gmail.com> <8BE29B4E-6D7A-4417-BA3F-AE4B0FE5FAC0@cs.depaul.edu> <1206654631.13640.2.camel@localhost> <92F1CB2E-4702-4F56-9662-58762A5FE7FF@cs.depaul.edu> Message-ID: <386D354B-D10F-4C74-8897-17F340100CC4@cs.depaul.edu> I agree. That's probably not what they want but I thought, perhaps, they were providing more data themselves. Massimo On Mar 27, 2008, at 9:50 PM, Jon Sudlow wrote: > Your exactly right. I dont think netflix is looking for someone to > crawl a third party data source to get a fuzzy match and use those > results to help predict the ratings. > > By the way, when you do a group like this, one person is > responsible to register the crew and communicate with Netflix. Who > is the 'team leader', because we have to register to get our hands > on the ratings data. > -jon > > On Thu, Mar 27, 2008 at 5:53 PM, Kumar McMillan > wrote: > Massimo, I've attached the README from the download. It explains > what's contained in the data and yes there is movie title and release > year. I've also heard of how people have been getting sneaky and > matching the rating data (which just has CustomerID) to the movie > data, crawling IMDB, and "matching" netflix ratings to that of IMDB to > expose the identity behind CustomerIDs. I don't think netflix was too > happy about this ;) I just read it somewhere a while back, haven't > looked at the details. Google gave me: > http://www.netflixprize.com/community/viewtopic.php?pid=5864 > > On Thu, Mar 27, 2008 at 5:12 PM, Massimo Di Pierro > wrote: > > Let us know what you find. > > > > Massimo > > > > > > > > On Mar 27, 2008, at 4:50 PM, Tom Printy wrote: > > > > > On Thu, 2008-03-27 at 12:20 -0500, Massimo Di Pierro wrote: > > >> Does anybody know what information is in the data they > provide. Other > > >> than user's rating, what's in the movies database that one > can use > > >> for correlation (like actors in the movies, producers, genre, > etc.)? > > > Well we could crawl IMDB for this info. Or I may be able to > get my > > > hands > > > on the data ;) > > > > > > > > > -Tom > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > Chicago mailing list > > > Chicago at python.org > > > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Chicago mailing list > > Chicago at python.org > > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago > > > > _______________________________________________ > Chicago mailing list > Chicago at python.org > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago > > > > > -- > Jon Sudlow > 3225 Foster Avenue > 221 Sohlberg Hall > C.P.O 2224 > Chicago, Il 60625 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mail.python.org/pipermail/chicago/attachments/20080327/4dd8ef28/attachment.htm From mdipierro at cs.depaul.edu Fri Mar 28 04:07:24 2008 From: mdipierro at cs.depaul.edu (Massimo Di Pierro) Date: Thu, 27 Mar 2008 22:07:24 -0500 Subject: [Chicago] netflix prize In-Reply-To: References: <20080326213125.np701d42sk0ss4kk@cubmail.cc.columbia.edu> <276266d0803270841v3d3f85d0ked6885bb1cbe1b4d@mail.gmail.com> <3096c19d0803271014j670f39daxe4075975ad65a796@mail.gmail.com> <8BE29B4E-6D7A-4417-BA3F-AE4B0FE5FAC0@cs.depaul.edu> <1206654631.13640.2.camel@localhost> <92F1CB2E-4702-4F56-9662-58762A5FE7FF@cs.depaul.edu> Message-ID: thank you Kumar. Massimo On Mar 27, 2008, at 5:53 PM, Kumar McMillan wrote: > Massimo, I've attached the README from the download. It explains > what's contained in the data and yes there is movie title and release > year. I've also heard of how people have been getting sneaky and > matching the rating data (which just has CustomerID) to the movie > data, crawling IMDB, and "matching" netflix ratings to that of IMDB to > expose the identity behind CustomerIDs. I don't think netflix was too > happy about this ;) I just read it somewhere a while back, haven't > looked at the details. Google gave me: > http://www.netflixprize.com/community/viewtopic.php?pid=5864 > > On Thu, Mar 27, 2008 at 5:12 PM, Massimo Di Pierro > wrote: >> Let us know what you find. >> >> Massimo >> >> >> >> On Mar 27, 2008, at 4:50 PM, Tom Printy wrote: >> >>> On Thu, 2008-03-27 at 12:20 -0500, Massimo Di Pierro wrote: >>>> Does anybody know what information is in the data they provide. >>>> Other >>>> than user's rating, what's in the movies database that one can use >>>> for correlation (like actors in the movies, producers, genre, >>>> etc.)? >>> Well we could crawl IMDB for this info. Or I may be able to get my >>> hands >>> on the data ;) >>> >>> >>> -Tom >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Chicago mailing list >>> Chicago at python.org >>> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Chicago mailing list >> Chicago at python.org >> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago >> >> From pfein at pobox.com Fri Mar 28 20:06:48 2008 From: pfein at pobox.com (Pete) Date: Fri, 28 Mar 2008 15:06:48 -0400 Subject: [Chicago] class continued, or metaclassing + framehackery, or an exercise in never using this because it's BAD... but fun. In-Reply-To: <694c06d60803271407k4113a647sfb59d05faca7dc2d@mail.gmail.com> References: <694c06d60803271407k4113a647sfb59d05faca7dc2d@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: I don't get it. On Mar 27, 2008, at 5:07 PM, Brantley Harris wrote: > import sys > > class ContinueMeta(type): > def __new__(cls, name, bases, dct): > if name == 'continued': > return type.__new__(cls, name, bases, dct) > existing = sys._getframe(1).f_locals[name] > for k, v in dct.items(): > setattr(existing, k, v) > return existing > > class continued(object): > __metaclass__ = ContinueMeta > > ### Testing ### > class Widget(object): > def __init__(self): > print "Widget created!" > > class Widget(continued): > def hello(self): > print "Hello world!" > > ---------- >>>> w = Widget() >>>> w.hello() > Widget created! > Hello world! > _______________________________________________ > Chicago mailing list > Chicago at python.org > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago Pete pfein at pobox.com From paulsmith at pobox.com Fri Mar 28 20:18:42 2008 From: paulsmith at pobox.com (Paul Smith) Date: Fri, 28 Mar 2008 14:18:42 -0500 Subject: [Chicago] class continued, or metaclassing + framehackery, or an exercise in never using this because it's BAD... but fun. In-Reply-To: References: <694c06d60803271407k4113a647sfb59d05faca7dc2d@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <8c58fcec0803281218x53654f12g3289eccc6359afc9@mail.gmail.com> If I read this correctly, it's not unlike the "open classes" that the Ruby-iphiles are always raving about and abusing. Cheers, -Paul On Fri, Mar 28, 2008 at 2:06 PM, Pete wrote: > I don't get it. > > On Mar 27, 2008, at 5:07 PM, Brantley Harris wrote: > > import sys > > > > class ContinueMeta(type): > > def __new__(cls, name, bases, dct): > > if name == 'continued': > > return type.__new__(cls, name, bases, dct) > > existing = sys._getframe(1).f_locals[name] > > for k, v in dct.items(): > > setattr(existing, k, v) > > return existing > > > > class continued(object): > > __metaclass__ = ContinueMeta > > > > ### Testing ### > > class Widget(object): > > def __init__(self): > > print "Widget created!" > > > > class Widget(continued): > > def hello(self): > > print "Hello world!" > > > > ---------- > >>>> w = Widget() > >>>> w.hello() > > Widget created! > > Hello world! > > _______________________________________________ > > Chicago mailing list > > Chicago at python.org > > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago > > Pete > pfein at pobox.com > > > > _______________________________________________ > Chicago mailing list > Chicago at python.org > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago > -- Paul Smith http://www.pauladamsmith.com/ -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mail.python.org/pipermail/chicago/attachments/20080328/4d960834/attachment.htm From pfein at pobox.com Fri Mar 28 22:06:30 2008 From: pfein at pobox.com (Pete) Date: Fri, 28 Mar 2008 17:06:30 -0400 Subject: [Chicago] class continued, or metaclassing + framehackery, or an exercise in never using this because it's BAD... but fun. In-Reply-To: <8c58fcec0803281218x53654f12g3289eccc6359afc9@mail.gmail.com> References: <694c06d60803271407k4113a647sfb59d05faca7dc2d@mail.gmail.com> <8c58fcec0803281218x53654f12g3289eccc6359afc9@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: Oh, I totally missed: > > class Widget(object): > > class Widget(continued): So the idea is that you can "redefine" an existing class to add methods to it? What's the benefit over monkeypatching? FWIW, I'm not sure "continue" is the best verbiage here... might as well call it MonkeyMeta or somesuch. On the whole, neato. I might borrow the getframe-in-metaclass technique for a problem where arbitrary block syntax would be nice. Too bad the make PEP got rejected, I find a use for it every once in a while: http://www.python.org/dev/peps/pep-0359/ On Mar 28, 2008, at 3:18 PM, Paul Smith wrote: > If I read this correctly, it's not unlike the "open classes" that > the Ruby-iphiles are always raving about and abusing. > > Cheers, > -Paul > > On Fri, Mar 28, 2008 at 2:06 PM, Pete wrote: > I don't get it. > > On Mar 27, 2008, at 5:07 PM, Brantley Harris wrote: > > import sys > > > > class ContinueMeta(type): > > def __new__(cls, name, bases, dct): > > if name == 'continued': > > return type.__new__(cls, name, bases, dct) > > existing = sys._getframe(1).f_locals[name] > > for k, v in dct.items(): > > setattr(existing, k, v) > > return existing > > > > class continued(object): > > __metaclass__ = ContinueMeta > > > > ### Testing ### > > class Widget(object): > > def __init__(self): > > print "Widget created!" > > > > class Widget(continued): > > def hello(self): > > print "Hello world!" > > > > ---------- > >>>> w = Widget() > >>>> w.hello() > > Widget created! > > Hello world! > > _______________________________________________ > > Chicago mailing list > > Chicago at python.org > > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago > > Pete > pfein at pobox.com > > > > _______________________________________________ > Chicago mailing list > Chicago at python.org > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago > > > > -- > Paul Smith > http://www.pauladamsmith.com/ > _______________________________________________ > Chicago mailing list > Chicago at python.org > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago Pete pfein at pobox.com -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mail.python.org/pipermail/chicago/attachments/20080328/8c63af40/attachment.htm From ianb at colorstudy.com Fri Mar 28 22:36:25 2008 From: ianb at colorstudy.com (Ian Bicking) Date: Fri, 28 Mar 2008 16:36:25 -0500 Subject: [Chicago] class continued, or metaclassing + framehackery, or an exercise in never using this because it's BAD... but fun. In-Reply-To: <694c06d60803271407k4113a647sfb59d05faca7dc2d@mail.gmail.com> References: <694c06d60803271407k4113a647sfb59d05faca7dc2d@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <47ED64D9.5000500@colorstudy.com> Brantley Harris wrote: > import sys > > class ContinueMeta(type): > def __new__(cls, name, bases, dct): > if name == 'continued': > return type.__new__(cls, name, bases, dct) > existing = sys._getframe(1).f_locals[name] > for k, v in dct.items(): > setattr(existing, k, v) > return existing > > class continued(object): > __metaclass__ = ContinueMeta I think maybe class decorators do this more reasonably. Something like: def monkeypatch(cls): def do_the_patch(new_cls): cls.update(new_cls.__dict__) return cls return do_the_patch @monkeypatch(Widget) class Widget: def hello(self): print 'hello' Of course you need py3k to do this, but you've all upgraded already, right? Ian From ianb at colorstudy.com Fri Mar 28 22:41:58 2008 From: ianb at colorstudy.com (Ian Bicking) Date: Fri, 28 Mar 2008 16:41:58 -0500 Subject: [Chicago] Fwd: Perl/Python Frameworks for the Framework Rumble at Flourish In-Reply-To: <804e5c70803271158s3c32441fu8a4516c0f7853141@mail.gmail.com> References: <3d76512f0803271140y9eefc37k2e1a50567e299995@mail.gmail.com> <804e5c70803271158s3c32441fu8a4516c0f7853141@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <47ED6626.6090607@colorstudy.com> Lukasz Szybalski wrote: > For those of you that are participating in Flourish. Chicago April 4-5 > at UIC. http://www.flourishconf.com > > Organizers are requesting people to represent their web framework at > Flourish Rumble. > Please email Roberto Serrano , or info at flourishconf.com > if you are willing to participate. There's another hackathon-thingy at Flourish as well, "Code for a Cause Hack-a-thon": http://www.flourishconf.com/flourish2008/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=13&Itemid=30#HackAThon Instead of competing against each other, presumably you will be competing against despair itself, by questing for a better world through the power of your code. I plan on doing this one, though I cannot deny that the Rumble would probably be more emotionally satisfying. Ian From ianb at colorstudy.com Fri Mar 28 22:51:18 2008 From: ianb at colorstudy.com (Ian Bicking) Date: Fri, 28 Mar 2008 16:51:18 -0500 Subject: [Chicago] class continued, or metaclassing + framehackery, or an exercise in never using this because it's BAD... but fun. In-Reply-To: <47ED64D9.5000500@colorstudy.com> References: <694c06d60803271407k4113a647sfb59d05faca7dc2d@mail.gmail.com> <47ED64D9.5000500@colorstudy.com> Message-ID: <47ED6856.5050805@colorstudy.com> Ian Bicking wrote: > Brantley Harris wrote: >> import sys >> >> class ContinueMeta(type): >> def __new__(cls, name, bases, dct): >> if name == 'continued': >> return type.__new__(cls, name, bases, dct) >> existing = sys._getframe(1).f_locals[name] >> for k, v in dct.items(): >> setattr(existing, k, v) >> return existing >> >> class continued(object): >> __metaclass__ = ContinueMeta > > I think maybe class decorators do this more reasonably. Something like: > > def monkeypatch(cls): > def do_the_patch(new_cls): > cls.update(new_cls.__dict__) > return cls > return do_the_patch > > @monkeypatch(Widget) > class Widget: > def hello(self): > print 'hello' > > Of course you need py3k to do this, but you've all upgraded already, right? OK, I haven't upgraded, so this is all untested, but to make the decorator more awesome: def monkeypatch(cls): def do_the_patch(new_cls): fake_class = type('Intermediate%s' % cls.__name__, cls.__bases__, cls.__dict__) cls.__dict__.clear() cls.__bases__ += (fake_class,) cls.__dict__.update(new_cls.__dict__) return cls return do_the_patch Then, maybe you could do: class Widget(SomethingMoreParent): def onclick(self): print 'yo!' w = Widget() @monkeypatch(Widget): class Widget: def onclick(self): super().onclick() print 'hey!' w.onclick() # yo! # hey! I'm not sure this will work, because I don't know how py3k super() works. And I'm fuzzy on how py2k super() works, as except for the class decorator syntax itself (which is just equivalent to monkeypatch(Widget)(Widget)) this is all valid in Python 2. I think super(Widget, self).onclick() would actually work right. Ian From mdipierro at cs.depaul.edu Fri Mar 28 22:57:40 2008 From: mdipierro at cs.depaul.edu (Massimo Di Pierro) Date: Fri, 28 Mar 2008 16:57:40 -0500 Subject: [Chicago] Fwd: Perl/Python Frameworks for the Framework Rumble at Flourish In-Reply-To: <47ED6626.6090607@colorstudy.com> References: <3d76512f0803271140y9eefc37k2e1a50567e299995@mail.gmail.com> <804e5c70803271158s3c32441fu8a4516c0f7853141@mail.gmail.com> <47ED6626.6090607@colorstudy.com> Message-ID: <90948682-D72A-49AC-BFD9-77B6552813E9@cs.depaul.edu> My understanding is that even in the case of the ramble the goal is develop something for a non-profit organization. Massimo On Mar 28, 2008, at 4:41 PM, Ian Bicking wrote: > Lukasz Szybalski wrote: >> For those of you that are participating in Flourish. Chicago April >> 4-5 >> at UIC. http://www.flourishconf.com >> >> Organizers are requesting people to represent their web framework at >> Flourish Rumble. >> Please email Roberto Serrano , or >> info at flourishconf.com >> if you are willing to participate. > > There's another hackathon-thingy at Flourish as well, "Code for a > Cause > Hack-a-thon": > http://www.flourishconf.com/flourish2008/index.php? > option=com_content&task=view&id=13&Itemid=30#HackAThon > > Instead of competing against each other, presumably you will be > competing against despair itself, by questing for a better world > through > the power of your code. > > I plan on doing this one, though I cannot deny that the Rumble would > probably be more emotionally satisfying. > > Ian > _______________________________________________ > Chicago mailing list > Chicago at python.org > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago From kumar.mcmillan at gmail.com Sat Mar 29 02:39:49 2008 From: kumar.mcmillan at gmail.com (Kumar McMillan) Date: Fri, 28 Mar 2008 20:39:49 -0500 Subject: [Chicago] class continued, or metaclassing + framehackery, or an exercise in never using this because it's BAD... but fun. In-Reply-To: <47ED6856.5050805@colorstudy.com> References: <694c06d60803271407k4113a647sfb59d05faca7dc2d@mail.gmail.com> <47ED64D9.5000500@colorstudy.com> <47ED6856.5050805@colorstudy.com> Message-ID: On Fri, Mar 28, 2008 at 4:51 PM, Ian Bicking wrote: > > OK, I haven't upgraded, so this is all untested, but to make the > decorator more awesome: after fixing print('yo!') I still got a syntax error on the @monkeypatch(Widget) using python3.0 (alpha 2). Strange, though, since it looks like this went through a while ago: http://www.python.org/dev/peps/pep-3129/ . Maybe it needs a future import or my alpha is too far out of date. metaclasses are a mess... can't wait for class decorators! > > > def monkeypatch(cls): > def do_the_patch(new_cls): > fake_class = type('Intermediate%s' % cls.__name__, > cls.__bases__, cls.__dict__) > cls.__dict__.clear() > cls.__bases__ += (fake_class,) > cls.__dict__.update(new_cls.__dict__) > > return cls > return do_the_patch > > Then, maybe you could do: > > class Widget(SomethingMoreParent): > def onclick(self): > print 'yo!' > > w = Widget() > > @monkeypatch(Widget): > class Widget: > def onclick(self): > super().onclick() > print 'hey!' > > w.onclick() > # yo! > # hey! > > > > I'm not sure this will work, because I don't know how py3k super() > works. And I'm fuzzy on how py2k super() works, as except for the class > decorator syntax itself (which is just equivalent to > monkeypatch(Widget)(Widget)) this is all valid in Python 2. I think > super(Widget, self).onclick() would actually work right. > > > > Ian > _______________________________________________ > Chicago mailing list > Chicago at python.org > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago > From kumar.mcmillan at gmail.com Sat Mar 29 06:37:44 2008 From: kumar.mcmillan at gmail.com (Kumar McMillan) Date: Sat, 29 Mar 2008 00:37:44 -0500 Subject: [Chicago] class continued, or metaclassing + framehackery, or an exercise in never using this because it's BAD... but fun. In-Reply-To: References: <694c06d60803271407k4113a647sfb59d05faca7dc2d@mail.gmail.com> <47ED64D9.5000500@colorstudy.com> <47ED6856.5050805@colorstudy.com> Message-ID: On Fri, Mar 28, 2008 at 8:39 PM, Kumar McMillan wrote: > On Fri, Mar 28, 2008 at 4:51 PM, Ian Bicking wrote: > > > > OK, I haven't upgraded, so this is all untested, but to make the > > decorator more awesome: > > after fixing print('yo!') I still got a syntax error on the > @monkeypatch(Widget) using python3.0 (alpha 2). duh. it just had a trailing colon `:' causing the error. This works. It prints "yo! \n hey! ": def monkeypatch(new_cls): def do_the_patch(cls): return type('Intermediate%s' % cls.__name__, (new_cls,) + cls.__bases__, cls.__dict__.copy()) return do_the_patch class WidgetYo: def onclick(self): print('yo!') @monkeypatch(WidgetYo) class Widget: def onclick(self): super(Widget, self).onclick() print('hey!') w = Widget() w.onclick() ...altering cls.__bases__ in place doesn't seem to be possible (TypeError: __bases__ assignment: 'WidgetYo' deallocator differs from 'object'). K From ken at stox.org Fri Mar 28 22:38:29 2008 From: ken at stox.org (Kenneth P. Stox) Date: Fri, 28 Mar 2008 16:38:29 -0500 Subject: [Chicago] [Fwd: Flourish Conference Update] Message-ID: <1206740309.8588.28.camel@stox.dyndns.org> -------- Forwarded Message -------- > Subject: Flourish Conference Update > Date: Fri, 28 Mar 2008 12:46:07 -0500 > > To all Flourishers this year, > > We've just posted the official schedule of talks and we invite you to > take a look at it. Our apologies for the short notice. It's taken a > while to get this just right. > > We want remind you guys that we're having a Code For A Cause > Hack-a-thon. So, if you're interested in the full open source > experience, try your hand at a little open source hacking at our open > source conference. As the name says, it's all for a good cause and > it's run by our friends at Chicago Technology Cooperative. > > Also, we're trying to get the conference a bit more publicity this > year. With that in mind, we've posted on a few social bookmarking > sites. If you've got the time, please throw a few votes our way. > > * http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=147424 > * http://reddit.com/info/6diq5/comments/ > * > http://digg.com/linux_unix/Open_source_conference_for_Chicago_hackers > > Thank you very much, > Flourish Team From hsu.feihong at yahoo.com Mon Mar 31 19:59:05 2008 From: hsu.feihong at yahoo.com (Feihong Hsu) Date: Mon, 31 Mar 2008 10:59:05 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Chicago] StarScream: A New Presentation Tool Message-ID: <289185.9588.qm@web34806.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Hi everyone, At the last ChiPy meeting, I gave a talk on the weird tool I used for my PyCon talk. I've finally gotten around to cleaning up the code and releasing it under the BSD License. http://starscream-slideshow.googlecode.com/ Cheers, Feihong --------------------------------- OMG, Sweet deal for Yahoo! users/friends: Get A Month of Blockbuster Total Access, No Cost. W00t -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... 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