From david.durham.jr at gmail.com  Wed Oct  1 21:00:46 2008
From: david.durham.jr at gmail.com (David Durham, Jr.)
Date: Wed, 1 Oct 2008 14:00:46 -0500
Subject: [Chicago] this weeks gather
In-Reply-To: <92356.3702.qm@web34804.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
References: <276266d0809292037u30322532h9a2f567da69c7cc4@mail.gmail.com>
	<92356.3702.qm@web34804.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <fdb5fda0810011200s4c313813k9e90246cd2625941@mail.gmail.com>

So what's happenin' with this?  I know everyone was so happy to meet
me at the last one ...


On Tue, Sep 30, 2008 at 7:44 AM, Feihong Hsu <hsu.feihong at yahoo.com> wrote:
> D'oh, Wednesday's not good for me this week.
>
>
> --- On Mon, 9/29/08, Cosmin Stejerean <cstejerean at gmail.com> wrote:
>
> From: Cosmin Stejerean <cstejerean at gmail.com>
> Subject: Re: [Chicago] this weeks gather
> To: "The Chicago Python Users Group" <chicago at python.org>
> Date: Monday, September 29, 2008, 10:37 PM
>
> On Mon, Sep 29, 2008 at 10:14 AM, Kumar McMillan
> <kumar.mcmillan at gmail.com> wrote:
>>> On Sep 29, 2008, at 8:50 AM, Carl Karsten wrote:
>>>
>>>> How about Wed at Jef Tap?
>>
>> This week I might actually be able to make this.  But probably not til
>> 7:30ish or later.
>>
>
> That should be no problem.

From cstejerean at gmail.com  Wed Oct  1 21:25:56 2008
From: cstejerean at gmail.com (Cosmin Stejerean)
Date: Wed, 1 Oct 2008 14:25:56 -0500
Subject: [Chicago] this weeks gather
In-Reply-To: <fdb5fda0810011200s4c313813k9e90246cd2625941@mail.gmail.com>
References: <276266d0809292037u30322532h9a2f567da69c7cc4@mail.gmail.com>
	<92356.3702.qm@web34804.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
	<fdb5fda0810011200s4c313813k9e90246cd2625941@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <276266d0810011225gbc45e4ak8d3660bf76beff59@mail.gmail.com>

I'm assuming we're still on for today starting at 6 with Kumar
probably being there after 7:30.

On Wed, Oct 1, 2008 at 2:00 PM, David Durham, Jr.
<david.durham.jr at gmail.com> wrote:
> So what's happenin' with this?  I know everyone was so happy to meet
> me at the last one ...
>
>
> On Tue, Sep 30, 2008 at 7:44 AM, Feihong Hsu <hsu.feihong at yahoo.com> wrote:
>> D'oh, Wednesday's not good for me this week.
>>
>>
>> --- On Mon, 9/29/08, Cosmin Stejerean <cstejerean at gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>> From: Cosmin Stejerean <cstejerean at gmail.com>
>> Subject: Re: [Chicago] this weeks gather
>> To: "The Chicago Python Users Group" <chicago at python.org>
>> Date: Monday, September 29, 2008, 10:37 PM
>>
>> On Mon, Sep 29, 2008 at 10:14 AM, Kumar McMillan
>> <kumar.mcmillan at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>> On Sep 29, 2008, at 8:50 AM, Carl Karsten wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> How about Wed at Jef Tap?
>>>
>>> This week I might actually be able to make this.  But probably not til
>>> 7:30ish or later.
>>>
>>
>> That should be no problem.
> _______________________________________________
> Chicago mailing list
> Chicago at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>



-- 
Cosmin Stejerean
http://www.offbytwo.com

From kumar.mcmillan at gmail.com  Wed Oct  1 21:29:00 2008
From: kumar.mcmillan at gmail.com (Kumar McMillan)
Date: Wed, 1 Oct 2008 14:29:00 -0500
Subject: [Chicago] this weeks gather
In-Reply-To: <276266d0810011225gbc45e4ak8d3660bf76beff59@mail.gmail.com>
References: <276266d0809292037u30322532h9a2f567da69c7cc4@mail.gmail.com>
	<92356.3702.qm@web34804.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
	<fdb5fda0810011200s4c313813k9e90246cd2625941@mail.gmail.com>
	<276266d0810011225gbc45e4ak8d3660bf76beff59@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <b571660a0810011229l78a2648eub9f5194cc2bd3b62@mail.gmail.com>

On Wed, Oct 1, 2008 at 2:25 PM, Cosmin Stejerean <cstejerean at gmail.com> wrote:
> I'm assuming we're still on for today starting at 6 with Kumar
> probably being there after 7:30.

yep.  I might make it earlier, we'll see.

>
> On Wed, Oct 1, 2008 at 2:00 PM, David Durham, Jr.
> <david.durham.jr at gmail.com> wrote:
>> So what's happenin' with this?  I know everyone was so happy to meet
>> me at the last one ...
>>
>>
>> On Tue, Sep 30, 2008 at 7:44 AM, Feihong Hsu <hsu.feihong at yahoo.com> wrote:
>>> D'oh, Wednesday's not good for me this week.
>>>
>>>
>>> --- On Mon, 9/29/08, Cosmin Stejerean <cstejerean at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>> From: Cosmin Stejerean <cstejerean at gmail.com>
>>> Subject: Re: [Chicago] this weeks gather
>>> To: "The Chicago Python Users Group" <chicago at python.org>
>>> Date: Monday, September 29, 2008, 10:37 PM
>>>
>>> On Mon, Sep 29, 2008 at 10:14 AM, Kumar McMillan
>>> <kumar.mcmillan at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>> On Sep 29, 2008, at 8:50 AM, Carl Karsten wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> How about Wed at Jef Tap?
>>>>
>>>> This week I might actually be able to make this.  But probably not til
>>>> 7:30ish or later.
>>>>
>>>
>>> That should be no problem.
>> _______________________________________________
>> Chicago mailing list
>> Chicago at python.org
>> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>>
>
>
>
> --
> Cosmin Stejerean
> http://www.offbytwo.com
> _______________________________________________
> Chicago mailing list
> Chicago at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>

From shekay at pobox.com  Wed Oct  1 21:35:22 2008
From: shekay at pobox.com (sheila miguez)
Date: Wed, 1 Oct 2008 14:35:22 -0500
Subject: [Chicago] this weeks gather
In-Reply-To: <b571660a0810011229l78a2648eub9f5194cc2bd3b62@mail.gmail.com>
References: <276266d0809292037u30322532h9a2f567da69c7cc4@mail.gmail.com>
	<92356.3702.qm@web34804.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
	<fdb5fda0810011200s4c313813k9e90246cd2625941@mail.gmail.com>
	<276266d0810011225gbc45e4ak8d3660bf76beff59@mail.gmail.com>
	<b571660a0810011229l78a2648eub9f5194cc2bd3b62@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <a68ced640810011235g7cb61597k135d603ec4f84237@mail.gmail.com>

I might show up, but I worked from home today so it means I will only
show up if I am industrious enough to get there.

On Wed, Oct 1, 2008 at 2:29 PM, Kumar McMillan <kumar.mcmillan at gmail.com> wrote:
> On Wed, Oct 1, 2008 at 2:25 PM, Cosmin Stejerean <cstejerean at gmail.com> wrote:
>> I'm assuming we're still on for today starting at 6 with Kumar
>> probably being there after 7:30.
>
> yep.  I might make it earlier, we'll see.
>
>>
>> On Wed, Oct 1, 2008 at 2:00 PM, David Durham, Jr.
>> <david.durham.jr at gmail.com> wrote:
>>> So what's happenin' with this?  I know everyone was so happy to meet
>>> me at the last one ...
>>>
>>>
>>> On Tue, Sep 30, 2008 at 7:44 AM, Feihong Hsu <hsu.feihong at yahoo.com> wrote:
>>>> D'oh, Wednesday's not good for me this week.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> --- On Mon, 9/29/08, Cosmin Stejerean <cstejerean at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> From: Cosmin Stejerean <cstejerean at gmail.com>
>>>> Subject: Re: [Chicago] this weeks gather
>>>> To: "The Chicago Python Users Group" <chicago at python.org>
>>>> Date: Monday, September 29, 2008, 10:37 PM
>>>>
>>>> On Mon, Sep 29, 2008 at 10:14 AM, Kumar McMillan
>>>> <kumar.mcmillan at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>> On Sep 29, 2008, at 8:50 AM, Carl Karsten wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> How about Wed at Jef Tap?
>>>>>
>>>>> This week I might actually be able to make this.  But probably not til
>>>>> 7:30ish or later.
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> That should be no problem.
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Chicago mailing list
>>> Chicago at python.org
>>> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> Cosmin Stejerean
>> http://www.offbytwo.com
>> _______________________________________________
>> Chicago mailing list
>> Chicago at python.org
>> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>>
> _______________________________________________
> Chicago mailing list
> Chicago at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>



-- 
sheila

From kumar.mcmillan at gmail.com  Thu Oct  2 17:56:23 2008
From: kumar.mcmillan at gmail.com (Kumar McMillan)
Date: Thu, 2 Oct 2008 10:56:23 -0500
Subject: [Chicago] SkinnyCorp Venue
In-Reply-To: <f7729c000809251402i658e3774s4a0858d020d1ee93@mail.gmail.com>
References: <D8445185-DD71-421F-A289-EFE85F1FFD00@sent.com>
	<f7729c000809251402i658e3774s4a0858d020d1ee93@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <b571660a0810020856s5813591aqa6f0998f145b872f@mail.gmail.com>

On Thu, Sep 25, 2008 at 4:02 PM, Chris Webber <cwebber at imagescape.com> wrote:
> Weird.  This email never hit my @dustycloud.org address.  Sounds
> good... where's SkinnyCorp's address?

4043 N. Ravenswood Ave. Suite 106
http://www.skinnycorp.com/getintouch

>
> And what about talks then?

Looks like Chris is talking on Miro, the open source intenet tv / video player

I can give a talk on Freebase - http://www.freebase.com/help/faq - the
next gen open database with a developer API (and a Python library),
organized a bit differently than wikipedia.  Specifically, I can talk
about a collaborative view/edit interface I'm tinkering with for music
- http://www.freebase.com/view/music

From cwebber at dustycloud.org  Thu Oct  2 18:04:50 2008
From: cwebber at dustycloud.org (Christopher Allan Webber)
Date: Thu, 02 Oct 2008 11:04:50 -0500
Subject: [Chicago] SkinnyCorp Venue
In-Reply-To: <b571660a0810020856s5813591aqa6f0998f145b872f@mail.gmail.com>
	(Kumar McMillan's message of "Thu, 2 Oct 2008 10:56:23 -0500")
References: <D8445185-DD71-421F-A289-EFE85F1FFD00@sent.com>
	<f7729c000809251402i658e3774s4a0858d020d1ee93@mail.gmail.com>
	<b571660a0810020856s5813591aqa6f0998f145b872f@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <877i8r6l0d.fsf@dustycloud.org>

Sounds cool... Looking forward to hearing the talk!

"Kumar McMillan" <kumar.mcmillan at gmail.com> writes:

> On Thu, Sep 25, 2008 at 4:02 PM, Chris Webber <cwebber at imagescape.com> wrote:
>> Weird.  This email never hit my @dustycloud.org address.  Sounds
>> good... where's SkinnyCorp's address?
>
> 4043 N. Ravenswood Ave. Suite 106
> http://www.skinnycorp.com/getintouch
>
>>
>> And what about talks then?
>
> Looks like Chris is talking on Miro, the open source intenet tv / video player
>
> I can give a talk on Freebase - http://www.freebase.com/help/faq - the
> next gen open database with a developer API (and a Python library),
> organized a bit differently than wikipedia.  Specifically, I can talk
> about a collaborative view/edit interface I'm tinkering with for music
> - http://www.freebase.com/view/music
> _______________________________________________
> Chicago mailing list
> Chicago at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago

From cwebber at dustycloud.org  Thu Oct  2 18:20:42 2008
From: cwebber at dustycloud.org (Christopher Allan Webber)
Date: Thu, 02 Oct 2008 11:20:42 -0500
Subject: [Chicago] SkinnyCorp Venue
In-Reply-To: <877i8r6l0d.fsf@dustycloud.org> (Christopher Allan Webber's
	message of "Thu, 02 Oct 2008 11:04:50 -0500")
References: <D8445185-DD71-421F-A289-EFE85F1FFD00@sent.com>
	<f7729c000809251402i658e3774s4a0858d020d1ee93@mail.gmail.com>
	<b571660a0810020856s5813591aqa6f0998f145b872f@mail.gmail.com>
	<877i8r6l0d.fsf@dustycloud.org>
Message-ID: <873ajf6k9x.fsf@dustycloud.org>

Btw, are there internets at this place?  Ideally, ethernet internets I
can plug my shitty "wireless never works" laptop into.

Christopher Allan Webber <cwebber at dustycloud.org> writes:

> Sounds cool... Looking forward to hearing the talk!
>
> "Kumar McMillan" <kumar.mcmillan at gmail.com> writes:
>
>> On Thu, Sep 25, 2008 at 4:02 PM, Chris Webber <cwebber at imagescape.com> wrote:
>>> Weird.  This email never hit my @dustycloud.org address.  Sounds
>>> good... where's SkinnyCorp's address?
>>
>> 4043 N. Ravenswood Ave. Suite 106
>> http://www.skinnycorp.com/getintouch
>>
>>>
>>> And what about talks then?
>>
>> Looks like Chris is talking on Miro, the open source intenet tv / video player
>>
>> I can give a talk on Freebase - http://www.freebase.com/help/faq - the
>> next gen open database with a developer API (and a Python library),
>> organized a bit differently than wikipedia.  Specifically, I can talk
>> about a collaborative view/edit interface I'm tinkering with for music
>> - http://www.freebase.com/view/music
>> _______________________________________________
>> Chicago mailing list
>> Chicago at python.org
>> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
> _______________________________________________
> Chicago mailing list
> Chicago at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago

From cwebber at dustycloud.org  Thu Oct  2 18:32:29 2008
From: cwebber at dustycloud.org (Christopher Allan Webber)
Date: Thu, 02 Oct 2008 11:32:29 -0500
Subject: [Chicago] SkinnyCorp Venue
In-Reply-To: <873ajf6k9x.fsf@dustycloud.org> (Christopher Allan Webber's
	message of "Thu, 02 Oct 2008 11:20:42 -0500")
References: <D8445185-DD71-421F-A289-EFE85F1FFD00@sent.com>
	<f7729c000809251402i658e3774s4a0858d020d1ee93@mail.gmail.com>
	<b571660a0810020856s5813591aqa6f0998f145b872f@mail.gmail.com>
	<877i8r6l0d.fsf@dustycloud.org> <873ajf6k9x.fsf@dustycloud.org>
Message-ID: <87y717555u.fsf@dustycloud.org>

Brian Ray has pointed out my unfortunate typo.  Sorry, I meant to say
"intarwebs".  Our editors regret the error.

Christopher Allan Webber <cwebber at dustycloud.org> writes:

> Btw, are there internets at this place?  Ideally, ethernet internets I
> can plug my shitty "wireless never works" laptop into.
>
> Christopher Allan Webber <cwebber at dustycloud.org> writes:
>
>> Sounds cool... Looking forward to hearing the talk!
>>
>> "Kumar McMillan" <kumar.mcmillan at gmail.com> writes:
>>
>>> On Thu, Sep 25, 2008 at 4:02 PM, Chris Webber <cwebber at imagescape.com> wrote:
>>>> Weird.  This email never hit my @dustycloud.org address.  Sounds
>>>> good... where's SkinnyCorp's address?
>>>
>>> 4043 N. Ravenswood Ave. Suite 106
>>> http://www.skinnycorp.com/getintouch
>>>
>>>>
>>>> And what about talks then?
>>>
>>> Looks like Chris is talking on Miro, the open source intenet tv / video player
>>>
>>> I can give a talk on Freebase - http://www.freebase.com/help/faq - the
>>> next gen open database with a developer API (and a Python library),
>>> organized a bit differently than wikipedia.  Specifically, I can talk
>>> about a collaborative view/edit interface I'm tinkering with for music
>>> - http://www.freebase.com/view/music
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Chicago mailing list
>>> Chicago at python.org
>>> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>> _______________________________________________
>> Chicago mailing list
>> Chicago at python.org
>> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
> _______________________________________________
> Chicago mailing list
> Chicago at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago

From jordan at widefido.com  Thu Oct  2 18:36:55 2008
From: jordan at widefido.com (Jordan Sherer)
Date: Thu, 2 Oct 2008 11:36:55 -0500
Subject: [Chicago] SkinnyCorp Venue
In-Reply-To: <b571660a0810020856s5813591aqa6f0998f145b872f@mail.gmail.com>
References: <D8445185-DD71-421F-A289-EFE85F1FFD00@sent.com>
	<f7729c000809251402i658e3774s4a0858d020d1ee93@mail.gmail.com>
	<b571660a0810020856s5813591aqa6f0998f145b872f@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <DC80B1C1-1C2C-497C-B062-C130D1AF8A8B@widefido.com>

Is there parking available?


On Oct 2, 2008, at Oct 2   10:56 AM, Kumar McMillan wrote:

> On Thu, Sep 25, 2008 at 4:02 PM, Chris Webber  
> <cwebber at imagescape.com> wrote:
>> Weird.  This email never hit my @dustycloud.org address.  Sounds
>> good... where's SkinnyCorp's address?
>
> 4043 N. Ravenswood Ave. Suite 106
> http://www.skinnycorp.com/getintouch
>
>>
>> And what about talks then?
>
> Looks like Chris is talking on Miro, the open source intenet tv /  
> video player
>
> I can give a talk on Freebase - http://www.freebase.com/help/faq - the
> next gen open database with a developer API (and a Python library),
> organized a bit differently than wikipedia.  Specifically, I can talk
> about a collaborative view/edit interface I'm tinkering with for music
> - http://www.freebase.com/view/music
> _______________________________________________
> Chicago mailing list
> Chicago at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago


From ianb at colorstudy.com  Thu Oct  2 18:39:03 2008
From: ianb at colorstudy.com (Ian Bicking)
Date: Thu, 02 Oct 2008 11:39:03 -0500
Subject: [Chicago] SkinnyCorp Venue
In-Reply-To: <DC80B1C1-1C2C-497C-B062-C130D1AF8A8B@widefido.com>
References: <D8445185-DD71-421F-A289-EFE85F1FFD00@sent.com>	<f7729c000809251402i658e3774s4a0858d020d1ee93@mail.gmail.com>	<b571660a0810020856s5813591aqa6f0998f145b872f@mail.gmail.com>
	<DC80B1C1-1C2C-497C-B062-C130D1AF8A8B@widefido.com>
Message-ID: <48E4F927.2050209@colorstudy.com>

Jordan Sherer wrote:
> Is there parking available?

Yeah, parking there is easy.

-- 
Ian Bicking : ianb at colorstudy.com : http://blog.ianbicking.org

From jordan at widefido.com  Thu Oct  2 19:01:08 2008
From: jordan at widefido.com (Jordan Sherer)
Date: Thu, 2 Oct 2008 12:01:08 -0500
Subject: [Chicago] SkinnyCorp Venue
In-Reply-To: <48E4F927.2050209@colorstudy.com>
References: <D8445185-DD71-421F-A289-EFE85F1FFD00@sent.com>	<f7729c000809251402i658e3774s4a0858d020d1ee93@mail.gmail.com>	<b571660a0810020856s5813591aqa6f0998f145b872f@mail.gmail.com>
	<DC80B1C1-1C2C-497C-B062-C130D1AF8A8B@widefido.com>
	<48E4F927.2050209@colorstudy.com>
Message-ID: <FE1076DA-0AFD-4D17-8B4F-BCACB0958EF4@widefido.com>

Fantastic!

On Oct 2, 2008, at Oct 2   11:39 AM, Ian Bicking wrote:

> Jordan Sherer wrote:
>> Is there parking available?
>
> Yeah, parking there is easy.
>
> -- 
> Ian Bicking : ianb at colorstudy.com : http://blog.ianbicking.org
> _______________________________________________
> Chicago mailing list
> Chicago at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago


From pfein at pobox.com  Thu Oct  2 19:19:38 2008
From: pfein at pobox.com (Pete)
Date: Thu, 2 Oct 2008 12:19:38 -0500
Subject: [Chicago] SkinnyCorp Venue
In-Reply-To: <FE1076DA-0AFD-4D17-8B4F-BCACB0958EF4@widefido.com>
References: <D8445185-DD71-421F-A289-EFE85F1FFD00@sent.com>
	<f7729c000809251402i658e3774s4a0858d020d1ee93@mail.gmail.com>
	<b571660a0810020856s5813591aqa6f0998f145b872f@mail.gmail.com>
	<DC80B1C1-1C2C-497C-B062-C130D1AF8A8B@widefido.com>
	<48E4F927.2050209@colorstudy.com>
	<FE1076DA-0AFD-4D17-8B4F-BCACB0958EF4@widefido.com>
Message-ID: <1C59BEAB-F233-411D-944F-3284FE60F2D5@pobox.com>

204 No Content

Seriously, was this last email really necessary?

Brought to you by the Committee on the Conservation of Bits - don't  
let running out of bits byte you in the ass.

On Oct 2, 2008, at 12:01 PM, Jordan Sherer wrote:

> Fantastic!
>
> On Oct 2, 2008, at Oct 2   11:39 AM, Ian Bicking wrote:
>
>> Jordan Sherer wrote:
>>> Is there parking available?
>>
>> Yeah, parking there is easy.
>>
>> -- 
>> Ian Bicking : ianb at colorstudy.com : http://blog.ianbicking.org
>> _______________________________________________
>> Chicago mailing list
>> Chicago at python.org
>> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>
> _______________________________________________
> Chicago mailing list
> Chicago at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago


From bray at sent.com  Thu Oct  2 19:30:09 2008
From: bray at sent.com (Brian Ray)
Date: Thu, 2 Oct 2008 12:30:09 -0500
Subject: [Chicago] SkinnyCorp Venue
In-Reply-To: <1C59BEAB-F233-411D-944F-3284FE60F2D5@pobox.com>
References: <D8445185-DD71-421F-A289-EFE85F1FFD00@sent.com>
	<f7729c000809251402i658e3774s4a0858d020d1ee93@mail.gmail.com>
	<b571660a0810020856s5813591aqa6f0998f145b872f@mail.gmail.com>
	<DC80B1C1-1C2C-497C-B062-C130D1AF8A8B@widefido.com>
	<48E4F927.2050209@colorstudy.com>
	<FE1076DA-0AFD-4D17-8B4F-BCACB0958EF4@widefido.com>
	<1C59BEAB-F233-411D-944F-3284FE60F2D5@pobox.com>
Message-ID: <4D2169E9-8181-462F-A0C1-20EEAE1C887E@sent.com>


On Oct 2, 2008, at 12:19 PM, Pete wrote:

> 204 No Content
>
> Seriously, was this last email really necessary?


Was your?

In fact, was mine :P

--Brian Ray




From shekay at pobox.com  Thu Oct  2 20:02:48 2008
From: shekay at pobox.com (sheila miguez)
Date: Thu, 2 Oct 2008 13:02:48 -0500
Subject: [Chicago] SkinnyCorp Venue
In-Reply-To: <b571660a0810020856s5813591aqa6f0998f145b872f@mail.gmail.com>
References: <D8445185-DD71-421F-A289-EFE85F1FFD00@sent.com>
	<f7729c000809251402i658e3774s4a0858d020d1ee93@mail.gmail.com>
	<b571660a0810020856s5813591aqa6f0998f145b872f@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <a68ced640810021102o349bdbcckdb8add30de503a2f@mail.gmail.com>

If anyone has practice with django-jython and has got it working with
sqlite3, come to the meeting and help me? I can't even get the package
to load.

If anyone has ever been able to do so, I'd like to know about it. If
not, it would behoove me to dig around I guess, after looking at how
the other backends work.


On Thu, Oct 2, 2008 at 10:56 AM, Kumar McMillan
<kumar.mcmillan at gmail.com> wrote:
> On Thu, Sep 25, 2008 at 4:02 PM, Chris Webber <cwebber at imagescape.com> wrote:
>> Weird.  This email never hit my @dustycloud.org address.  Sounds
>> good... where's SkinnyCorp's address?
>
> 4043 N. Ravenswood Ave. Suite 106
> http://www.skinnycorp.com/getintouch
>
>>
>> And what about talks then?
>
> Looks like Chris is talking on Miro, the open source intenet tv / video player
>
> I can give a talk on Freebase - http://www.freebase.com/help/faq - the
> next gen open database with a developer API (and a Python library),
> organized a bit differently than wikipedia.  Specifically, I can talk
> about a collaborative view/edit interface I'm tinkering with for music
> - http://www.freebase.com/view/music
> _______________________________________________
> Chicago mailing list
> Chicago at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>



-- 
sheila

From shekay at pobox.com  Fri Oct  3 16:46:29 2008
From: shekay at pobox.com (sheila miguez)
Date: Fri, 3 Oct 2008 09:46:29 -0500
Subject: [Chicago] mobile apps
Message-ID: <a68ced640810030746h123a92b6y964cfbdde113b94d@mail.gmail.com>

I just discovered http://talking-points.org/ a project to provide
navigable way-points for blind (or sighted) pedestrians. they've
prototyped in Java using a bluetooth stack, I think on a tablet pc.
They'd like to have the project live beyond the life of a semester
project, so need outside life.

Chris did a mobile demo.

Any of you interested in joining the project? They would like to
expand to more mobile devices. I suspect any language that can glue
together and be multiplatform would work (could run in the jvm?
haven't read everyone on their wiki or their source yet (it's on
google code). I only just got on their mailing list yesterday.

I've been interested in doing work on accessible technology,
particularly mobile devices to help people navigate (I hadn't thought
exactly of blind, I was thinking more of people with cognitive
dysfunctions to allow them to be more independent) and was really
excited to discover a project like this that is open. neat.

-- 
sheila

From kumar.mcmillan at gmail.com  Fri Oct  3 17:07:19 2008
From: kumar.mcmillan at gmail.com (Kumar McMillan)
Date: Fri, 3 Oct 2008 10:07:19 -0500
Subject: [Chicago] mobile apps
In-Reply-To: <a68ced640810030746h123a92b6y964cfbdde113b94d@mail.gmail.com>
References: <a68ced640810030746h123a92b6y964cfbdde113b94d@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <b571660a0810030807n98ffbf8y5a0ef516106ae4e4@mail.gmail.com>

What would be neat is a mobile app accessible purely by sound.  That
is, a program that told you where you are and gave you voice prompts
for what to do next.  This is pretty much how Asterisk works -
http://www.asterisk.org/ - and even though it targets the telephone
(PBX) the same principles of request and voice-response apply.  In
fact, you can think of it just like a web application, you request a
resource and get a response.  The response probably contains a "main
menu" that helps you navigate the app.  Some ruby hackers figured this
out and wrote an adapter for Rails that allows you to create Asterisk
voice-response applications: http://www.snapvine.com/code/simoncode ,
http://www.snapvine.com/code/ragi/ .

The coolest thing to me about a voice response app is the psychology
of "audio icons." Just like using visual icons help a user identify
areas of a menu (i.e. picture of a house for Home), audio icons do the
same.  You might have a sound of chimes when you navigate to Home or a
sad trombone when an error happens, you get the idea.  It just helps
the user know where she is in the application.

K

On Fri, Oct 3, 2008 at 9:46 AM, sheila miguez <shekay at pobox.com> wrote:
> I just discovered http://talking-points.org/ a project to provide
> navigable way-points for blind (or sighted) pedestrians. they've
> prototyped in Java using a bluetooth stack, I think on a tablet pc.
> They'd like to have the project live beyond the life of a semester
> project, so need outside life.
>
> Chris did a mobile demo.
>
> Any of you interested in joining the project? They would like to
> expand to more mobile devices. I suspect any language that can glue
> together and be multiplatform would work (could run in the jvm?
> haven't read everyone on their wiki or their source yet (it's on
> google code). I only just got on their mailing list yesterday.
>
> I've been interested in doing work on accessible technology,
> particularly mobile devices to help people navigate (I hadn't thought
> exactly of blind, I was thinking more of people with cognitive
> dysfunctions to allow them to be more independent) and was really
> excited to discover a project like this that is open. neat.
>
> --
> sheila
> _______________________________________________
> Chicago mailing list
> Chicago at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>

From shekay at pobox.com  Fri Oct  3 17:28:03 2008
From: shekay at pobox.com (sheila miguez)
Date: Fri, 3 Oct 2008 10:28:03 -0500
Subject: [Chicago] mobile apps
In-Reply-To: <b571660a0810030807n98ffbf8y5a0ef516106ae4e4@mail.gmail.com>
References: <a68ced640810030746h123a92b6y964cfbdde113b94d@mail.gmail.com>
	<b571660a0810030807n98ffbf8y5a0ef516106ae4e4@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <a68ced640810030828v34a6ff56q5a7836c742b85990@mail.gmail.com>

On Fri, Oct 3, 2008 at 10:07 AM, Kumar McMillan
<kumar.mcmillan at gmail.com> wrote:
> What would be neat is a mobile app accessible purely by sound.  That
> is, a program that told you where you are and gave you voice prompts
> for what to do next.  This is pretty much how Asterisk works -

That's the idea of the talking-points group, even also with your audio tags.

is it okay if I forward your points about asterisk? I don't know if
they know about it.

I wonder if some of the IMSA students would be interested in this?


-- 
sheila

From carl at personnelware.com  Fri Oct  3 17:59:25 2008
From: carl at personnelware.com (Carl Karsten)
Date: Fri, 03 Oct 2008 10:59:25 -0500
Subject: [Chicago] mobile apps
In-Reply-To: <a68ced640810030828v34a6ff56q5a7836c742b85990@mail.gmail.com>
References: <a68ced640810030746h123a92b6y964cfbdde113b94d@mail.gmail.com>	<b571660a0810030807n98ffbf8y5a0ef516106ae4e4@mail.gmail.com>
	<a68ced640810030828v34a6ff56q5a7836c742b85990@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <48E6415D.8040307@personnelware.com>

sheila miguez wrote:
> On Fri, Oct 3, 2008 at 10:07 AM, Kumar McMillan
> <kumar.mcmillan at gmail.com> wrote:
>> What would be neat is a mobile app accessible purely by sound.  That
>> is, a program that told you where you are and gave you voice prompts
>> for what to do next.  This is pretty much how Asterisk works -
> 
> That's the idea of the talking-points group, even also with your audio tags.
> 
> is it okay if I forward your points about asterisk? I don't know if
> they know about it.
> 
> I wonder if some of the IMSA students would be interested in this?
> 
> 

Kumar - don't settle for asterisk, go for the Cadillac: yate
What showed me that Python was awesome:
http://www.oreillynet.com/pub/a/etel/2006/06/27/fast-prototyping-of-telephony-applications-with-yate.html

I never got that working, because I didn't really know python, so I read an
oreilly book.  some day I want to get back to that project.

Carl K

From kumar.mcmillan at gmail.com  Fri Oct  3 19:17:50 2008
From: kumar.mcmillan at gmail.com (Kumar McMillan)
Date: Fri, 3 Oct 2008 12:17:50 -0500
Subject: [Chicago] mobile apps
In-Reply-To: <48E6415D.8040307@personnelware.com>
References: <a68ced640810030746h123a92b6y964cfbdde113b94d@mail.gmail.com>
	<b571660a0810030807n98ffbf8y5a0ef516106ae4e4@mail.gmail.com>
	<a68ced640810030828v34a6ff56q5a7836c742b85990@mail.gmail.com>
	<48E6415D.8040307@personnelware.com>
Message-ID: <b571660a0810031017s28573095g690541a6a62aa4c4@mail.gmail.com>

On Fri, Oct 3, 2008 at 10:59 AM, Carl Karsten <carl at personnelware.com> wrote:
> Kumar - don't settle for asterisk, go for the Cadillac: yate
> What showed me that Python was awesome:
> http://www.oreillynet.com/pub/a/etel/2006/06/27/fast-prototyping-of-telephony-applications-with-yate.html

There are Python bindings for Asterisk -
http://py-asterisk.berlios.de/py-asterisk.php - which would address
the prototyping concern (it's Python!) and speed concern (just binds
to the c libs).

Anyway, I don't have any desire to make a phone app.  I hate the
phone.  I was just using it as an example of creating an audio
oriented app.

>
> I never got that working, because I didn't really know python, so I read an
> oreilly book.  some day I want to get back to that project.
>
> Carl K
> _______________________________________________
> Chicago mailing list
> Chicago at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>

From allan2600 at gmail.com  Sat Oct  4 18:34:33 2008
From: allan2600 at gmail.com (Allan Spale)
Date: Sat, 4 Oct 2008 11:34:33 -0500
Subject: [Chicago] New Member
Message-ID: <79acc5430810040934l145d5bfdl937bda0a1f054293@mail.gmail.com>

Hi,

My name is Allan and I am interested in learning more about the Chicago
Python users group and where and when your next meeting will occur.

To give you some background about myself...I have been working on an
internet startup for the past year or so in which I am developing an
open-source semantic database system that takes some of the ideas from
Freebase but goes into a somewhat different direction. You can read more
about the system here: http://my-kaleidoscope.org/platform.html. The
datastore I am using is pybsddb (BerkeleyDB module for Python), but the
system was designed in such a way to support any datastore whether it is a
traditional SQL system or something more non-traditional like Amazon S3. I
did a very scaled down demo at the O'Reilly Web 2.0 Expo in New York City a
few weeks ago doing a mashup of the working parts of my database system and
using Twitter as a frontend:
http://en.oreilly.com/webexny2008/public/schedule/detail/5266. I would
invite all of you to take a look at it, but I am having a terrible time
trying to get my code to work on the web server space that I listed (the
demo was a hack of running mostly local and partially on the webserver).

Attending this conference made me realize that I am probably not a good
candidate for funding my startup, but as I look for a job now (any leads
would be appreciated), I still want to develop this system for the Python
community. So, I am also interested in meeting developers who might be
interested in working on this project because my established codebase is
fairly large (about 15000 lines) even without many features being
implemented.

I look forward to meeting all of you at the next meeting.


Allan
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From maney at two14.net  Sun Oct  5 01:08:39 2008
From: maney at two14.net (Martin Maney)
Date: Sat, 4 Oct 2008 18:08:39 -0500
Subject: [Chicago] New Member
In-Reply-To: <79acc5430810040934l145d5bfdl937bda0a1f054293@mail.gmail.com>
References: <79acc5430810040934l145d5bfdl937bda0a1f054293@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <20081004230839.GA24209@furrr.two14.net>

On Sat, Oct 04, 2008 at 11:34:33AM -0500, Allan Spale wrote:
> My name is Allan and I am interested in learning more about the Chicago
> Python users group and where and when your next meeting will occur.

Welcome to the greatest Python User's Group that's hosted this year's
PyCon!

> Freebase but goes into a somewhat different direction. You can read more
> about the system here: http://my-kaleidoscope.org/platform.html. The

When I read about trying to make sense of all these streams spewing at
you, I thought immediately of this blogicle:

http://blogs.concedere.net:8080/blog/discipline/web/?permalink=Input-Output-Ratios.html

Especially the other blogicle that's linked (in the above - that
doesn't cut'n'paste as easily as the text) in this paragraph:

  Similarly there's much to be said for reducing the productive channels.
  When vast amounts of time and energy is wasted synchronizing and
  copying and managing data than a centralized solution is called for. If
  Web 2.0 has create a situation where the basic management of data
  across different silos is such a problem then maybe Web 1.0 and its
  single, simple homepages is the answer.

I'm not sure that simple home pages are really the answer even though
I've had one since before web 2.0 was a dream in the gleam in
O'Reilly's eye.  Well, not exactly one single one - there are various
bits in varying states of disrepair that I've been meaning to Do
Something About for, oh, more than ten years, some of them.  It's not
so much the tuit shortage as that every time I set out to Do Something
I realize that I'm facing The Problem Of Cleaning One's Workspace - I
know where all that stuff is, mostly, at a level that's below, hence
faster than, conscious thought, and cleaning will break all those
reflexive accesses... </digress>

-- 
C makes an art of confusing pointers with arrays and strings, which
leads to lotsa neat pointer tricks; APL mistakes everything for an array,
leading to neat one-liners; and Perl confuses everything period,
making each line a joyous adventure <wink>.  -- Tim Peters


From kumar.mcmillan at gmail.com  Mon Oct  6 16:41:20 2008
From: kumar.mcmillan at gmail.com (Kumar McMillan)
Date: Mon, 6 Oct 2008 09:41:20 -0500
Subject: [Chicago] New Member
In-Reply-To: <79acc5430810040934l145d5bfdl937bda0a1f054293@mail.gmail.com>
References: <79acc5430810040934l145d5bfdl937bda0a1f054293@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <b571660a0810060741q52944f0eked85722501c964e9@mail.gmail.com>

Hi Allan, welcome.

On Sat, Oct 4, 2008 at 11:34 AM, Allan Spale <allan2600 at gmail.com> wrote:
> Hi,
>
> My name is Allan and I am interested in learning more about the Chicago
> Python users group and where and when your next meeting will occur.

Our next meeting will be the best ever.  I just updated the wiki with
details: http://chipy.org/

Chris is giving a talk on Miro and I'll be giving a talk on freebase
but I'm not an expert on it.  I think Jordan Sherer might also give a
talk on desktop apps?

If there's time for discussion, maybe we can talk about the future of
"semantic web" -- freebase is just one of the semantic tools emerging
but I also don't know much about this so-called movement.

Kaleidoscope looks interesting but ambitious.  I get overwhelmed
easily when I hear of tools designed to organize all the data of the
world.  Not that I don't think it's possible, it just seems really
hard.  One thing is for sure, the Google model is far from perfect and
if something comes along and does it better then they will be in
trouble.  Freebase is pretty ambitious too.  But then again so was
wikipedia and that worked.

-Kumar

>
> To give you some background about myself...I have been working on an
> internet startup for the past year or so in which I am developing an
> open-source semantic database system that takes some of the ideas from
> Freebase but goes into a somewhat different direction. You can read more
> about the system here: http://my-kaleidoscope.org/platform.html. The
> datastore I am using is pybsddb (BerkeleyDB module for Python), but the
> system was designed in such a way to support any datastore whether it is a
> traditional SQL system or something more non-traditional like Amazon S3. I
> did a very scaled down demo at the O'Reilly Web 2.0 Expo in New York City a
> few weeks ago doing a mashup of the working parts of my database system and
> using Twitter as a frontend:
> http://en.oreilly.com/webexny2008/public/schedule/detail/5266. I would
> invite all of you to take a look at it, but I am having a terrible time
> trying to get my code to work on the web server space that I listed (the
> demo was a hack of running mostly local and partially on the webserver).
>
> Attending this conference made me realize that I am probably not a good
> candidate for funding my startup, but as I look for a job now (any leads
> would be appreciated), I still want to develop this system for the Python
> community. So, I am also interested in meeting developers who might be
> interested in working on this project because my established codebase is
> fairly large (about 15000 lines) even without many features being
> implemented.
>
> I look forward to meeting all of you at the next meeting.
>
>
> Allan
>
> _______________________________________________
> Chicago mailing list
> Chicago at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>
>

From jordan at widefido.com  Mon Oct  6 16:54:37 2008
From: jordan at widefido.com (Jordan Sherer)
Date: Mon, 6 Oct 2008 09:54:37 -0500
Subject: [Chicago] New Member
In-Reply-To: <b571660a0810060741q52944f0eked85722501c964e9@mail.gmail.com>
References: <79acc5430810040934l145d5bfdl937bda0a1f054293@mail.gmail.com>
	<b571660a0810060741q52944f0eked85722501c964e9@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <D0A4B911-7F54-4C6C-8DC9-B2E00045E245@widefido.com>

I *am* planning on attending the meet-up on Thursday. However, since  
this will be my first ChiPy meetup I am unsure about giving a talk. If  
people have enough interest in desktop apps built with Python, I can  
give a quick one.

A few questions:
What is the atmosphere like for talks?
Are there any general recommendations for giving a talk?
Is there anything in particular that people would like to hear about  
Python powered desktop apps?

Do you think I should wait until the November meet-up to talk?

Thanks!

Best,
Jordan


On Oct 6, 2008, at Oct 6   9:41 AM, Kumar McMillan wrote:

> Hi Allan, welcome.
>
> On Sat, Oct 4, 2008 at 11:34 AM, Allan Spale <allan2600 at gmail.com>  
> wrote:
>> Hi,
>>
>> My name is Allan and I am interested in learning more about the  
>> Chicago
>> Python users group and where and when your next meeting will occur.
>
> Our next meeting will be the best ever.  I just updated the wiki with
> details: http://chipy.org/
>
> Chris is giving a talk on Miro and I'll be giving a talk on freebase
> but I'm not an expert on it.  I think Jordan Sherer might also give a
> talk on desktop apps?
>
> If there's time for discussion, maybe we can talk about the future of
> "semantic web" -- freebase is just one of the semantic tools emerging
> but I also don't know much about this so-called movement.
>
> Kaleidoscope looks interesting but ambitious.  I get overwhelmed
> easily when I hear of tools designed to organize all the data of the
> world.  Not that I don't think it's possible, it just seems really
> hard.  One thing is for sure, the Google model is far from perfect and
> if something comes along and does it better then they will be in
> trouble.  Freebase is pretty ambitious too.  But then again so was
> wikipedia and that worked.
>
> -Kumar
>
>>
>> To give you some background about myself...I have been working on an
>> internet startup for the past year or so in which I am developing an
>> open-source semantic database system that takes some of the ideas  
>> from
>> Freebase but goes into a somewhat different direction. You can read  
>> more
>> about the system here: http://my-kaleidoscope.org/platform.html. The
>> datastore I am using is pybsddb (BerkeleyDB module for Python), but  
>> the
>> system was designed in such a way to support any datastore whether  
>> it is a
>> traditional SQL system or something more non-traditional like  
>> Amazon S3. I
>> did a very scaled down demo at the O'Reilly Web 2.0 Expo in New  
>> York City a
>> few weeks ago doing a mashup of the working parts of my database  
>> system and
>> using Twitter as a frontend:
>> http://en.oreilly.com/webexny2008/public/schedule/detail/5266. I  
>> would
>> invite all of you to take a look at it, but I am having a terrible  
>> time
>> trying to get my code to work on the web server space that I listed  
>> (the
>> demo was a hack of running mostly local and partially on the  
>> webserver).
>>
>> Attending this conference made me realize that I am probably not a  
>> good
>> candidate for funding my startup, but as I look for a job now (any  
>> leads
>> would be appreciated), I still want to develop this system for the  
>> Python
>> community. So, I am also interested in meeting developers who might  
>> be
>> interested in working on this project because my established  
>> codebase is
>> fairly large (about 15000 lines) even without many features being
>> implemented.
>>
>> I look forward to meeting all of you at the next meeting.
>>
>>
>> Allan
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Chicago mailing list
>> Chicago at python.org
>> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>>
>>
> _______________________________________________
> Chicago mailing list
> Chicago at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago


From kumar.mcmillan at gmail.com  Mon Oct  6 17:05:34 2008
From: kumar.mcmillan at gmail.com (Kumar McMillan)
Date: Mon, 6 Oct 2008 10:05:34 -0500
Subject: [Chicago] New Member
In-Reply-To: <D0A4B911-7F54-4C6C-8DC9-B2E00045E245@widefido.com>
References: <79acc5430810040934l145d5bfdl937bda0a1f054293@mail.gmail.com>
	<b571660a0810060741q52944f0eked85722501c964e9@mail.gmail.com>
	<D0A4B911-7F54-4C6C-8DC9-B2E00045E245@widefido.com>
Message-ID: <b571660a0810060805t3e287f10gfc6590ea0b5e1568@mail.gmail.com>

On Mon, Oct 6, 2008 at 9:54 AM, Jordan Sherer <jordan at widefido.com> wrote:
> I *am* planning on attending the meet-up on Thursday. However, since this
> will be my first ChiPy meetup I am unsure about giving a talk. If people
> have enough interest in desktop apps built with Python, I can give a quick
> one.

fwiw, I can't imagine my talk being longer than 10 - 15 min.  Quick
talks are good.  If you want to plan a talk for 5 min then I'd say go
for it.  We have done meetings with just lightning talks before
(strict time limit) and usually those turn out well.

>
> A few questions:
> What is the atmosphere like for talks?

very informal.  the audience varies in size, it seems that we've been
getting a lot more people to meetings lately.  Some people make
slides, others just talk.  Some demo code and break stuff.

> Are there any general recommendations for giving a talk?
> Is there anything in particular that people would like to hear about Python
> powered desktop apps?

personally, I'm always curious to see how people write automated tests
for desktop apps.  and when writing black box tests, what strategies
people have for getting meaningful failures.

>
> Do you think I should wait until the November meet-up to talk?
>
> Thanks!
>
> Best,
> Jordan
>
>
> On Oct 6, 2008, at Oct 6   9:41 AM, Kumar McMillan wrote:
>
>> Hi Allan, welcome.
>>
>> On Sat, Oct 4, 2008 at 11:34 AM, Allan Spale <allan2600 at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>> Hi,
>>>
>>> My name is Allan and I am interested in learning more about the Chicago
>>> Python users group and where and when your next meeting will occur.
>>
>> Our next meeting will be the best ever.  I just updated the wiki with
>> details: http://chipy.org/
>>
>> Chris is giving a talk on Miro and I'll be giving a talk on freebase
>> but I'm not an expert on it.  I think Jordan Sherer might also give a
>> talk on desktop apps?
>>
>> If there's time for discussion, maybe we can talk about the future of
>> "semantic web" -- freebase is just one of the semantic tools emerging
>> but I also don't know much about this so-called movement.
>>
>> Kaleidoscope looks interesting but ambitious.  I get overwhelmed
>> easily when I hear of tools designed to organize all the data of the
>> world.  Not that I don't think it's possible, it just seems really
>> hard.  One thing is for sure, the Google model is far from perfect and
>> if something comes along and does it better then they will be in
>> trouble.  Freebase is pretty ambitious too.  But then again so was
>> wikipedia and that worked.
>>
>> -Kumar
>>
>>>
>>> To give you some background about myself...I have been working on an
>>> internet startup for the past year or so in which I am developing an
>>> open-source semantic database system that takes some of the ideas from
>>> Freebase but goes into a somewhat different direction. You can read more
>>> about the system here: http://my-kaleidoscope.org/platform.html. The
>>> datastore I am using is pybsddb (BerkeleyDB module for Python), but the
>>> system was designed in such a way to support any datastore whether it is
>>> a
>>> traditional SQL system or something more non-traditional like Amazon S3.
>>> I
>>> did a very scaled down demo at the O'Reilly Web 2.0 Expo in New York City
>>> a
>>> few weeks ago doing a mashup of the working parts of my database system
>>> and
>>> using Twitter as a frontend:
>>> http://en.oreilly.com/webexny2008/public/schedule/detail/5266. I would
>>> invite all of you to take a look at it, but I am having a terrible time
>>> trying to get my code to work on the web server space that I listed (the
>>> demo was a hack of running mostly local and partially on the webserver).
>>>
>>> Attending this conference made me realize that I am probably not a good
>>> candidate for funding my startup, but as I look for a job now (any leads
>>> would be appreciated), I still want to develop this system for the Python
>>> community. So, I am also interested in meeting developers who might be
>>> interested in working on this project because my established codebase is
>>> fairly large (about 15000 lines) even without many features being
>>> implemented.
>>>
>>> I look forward to meeting all of you at the next meeting.
>>>
>>>
>>> Allan
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Chicago mailing list
>>> Chicago at python.org
>>> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>>>
>>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Chicago mailing list
>> Chicago at python.org
>> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>
> _______________________________________________
> Chicago mailing list
> Chicago at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>

From g at rrett.us.com  Mon Oct  6 17:51:29 2008
From: g at rrett.us.com (Garrett Smith)
Date: Mon, 6 Oct 2008 10:51:29 -0500 (CDT)
Subject: [Chicago] New Member
In-Reply-To: <1698713892.931661223307679914.JavaMail.root@mail-3.01.com>
Message-ID: <624053925.938061223308289016.JavaMail.root@mail-3.01.com>

Could have a Gong Show rule -- take as much time as you like, but you run the risk of getting booed off by raving and violently impatient geeks craving more and more for their ever feeding brains.

But AFAIC, if there's beer, folks can take as long as they like :)

----- "Kumar McMillan" <kumar.mcmillan at gmail.com> wrote:

> On Mon, Oct 6, 2008 at 9:54 AM, Jordan Sherer <jordan at widefido.com>
> wrote:
> > I *am* planning on attending the meet-up on Thursday. However, since
> this
> > will be my first ChiPy meetup I am unsure about giving a talk. If
> people
> > have enough interest in desktop apps built with Python, I can give a
> quick
> > one.
> 
> fwiw, I can't imagine my talk being longer than 10 - 15 min.  Quick
> talks are good.  If you want to plan a talk for 5 min then I'd say go
> for it.  We have done meetings with just lightning talks before
> (strict time limit) and usually those turn out well.
> 
> >
> > A few questions:
> > What is the atmosphere like for talks?
> 
> very informal.  the audience varies in size, it seems that we've been
> getting a lot more people to meetings lately.  Some people make
> slides, others just talk.  Some demo code and break stuff.
> 
> > Are there any general recommendations for giving a talk?
> > Is there anything in particular that people would like to hear about
> Python
> > powered desktop apps?
> 
> personally, I'm always curious to see how people write automated
> tests
> for desktop apps.  and when writing black box tests, what strategies
> people have for getting meaningful failures.
> 
> >
> > Do you think I should wait until the November meet-up to talk?
> >
> > Thanks!
> >
> > Best,
> > Jordan
> >
> >
> > On Oct 6, 2008, at Oct 6   9:41 AM, Kumar McMillan wrote:
> >
> >> Hi Allan, welcome.
> >>
> >> On Sat, Oct 4, 2008 at 11:34 AM, Allan Spale <allan2600 at gmail.com>
> wrote:
> >>>
> >>> Hi,
> >>>
> >>> My name is Allan and I am interested in learning more about the
> Chicago
> >>> Python users group and where and when your next meeting will
> occur.
> >>
> >> Our next meeting will be the best ever.  I just updated the wiki
> with
> >> details: http://chipy.org/
> >>
> >> Chris is giving a talk on Miro and I'll be giving a talk on
> freebase
> >> but I'm not an expert on it.  I think Jordan Sherer might also give
> a
> >> talk on desktop apps?
> >>
> >> If there's time for discussion, maybe we can talk about the future
> of
> >> "semantic web" -- freebase is just one of the semantic tools
> emerging
> >> but I also don't know much about this so-called movement.
> >>
> >> Kaleidoscope looks interesting but ambitious.  I get overwhelmed
> >> easily when I hear of tools designed to organize all the data of
> the
> >> world.  Not that I don't think it's possible, it just seems really
> >> hard.  One thing is for sure, the Google model is far from perfect
> and
> >> if something comes along and does it better then they will be in
> >> trouble.  Freebase is pretty ambitious too.  But then again so was
> >> wikipedia and that worked.
> >>
> >> -Kumar
> >>
> >>>
> >>> To give you some background about myself...I have been working on
> an
> >>> internet startup for the past year or so in which I am developing
> an
> >>> open-source semantic database system that takes some of the ideas
> from
> >>> Freebase but goes into a somewhat different direction. You can
> read more
> >>> about the system here: http://my-kaleidoscope.org/platform.html.
> The
> >>> datastore I am using is pybsddb (BerkeleyDB module for Python),
> but the
> >>> system was designed in such a way to support any datastore whether
> it is
> >>> a
> >>> traditional SQL system or something more non-traditional like
> Amazon S3.
> >>> I
> >>> did a very scaled down demo at the O'Reilly Web 2.0 Expo in New
> York City
> >>> a
> >>> few weeks ago doing a mashup of the working parts of my database
> system
> >>> and
> >>> using Twitter as a frontend:
> >>> http://en.oreilly.com/webexny2008/public/schedule/detail/5266. I
> would
> >>> invite all of you to take a look at it, but I am having a terrible
> time
> >>> trying to get my code to work on the web server space that I
> listed (the
> >>> demo was a hack of running mostly local and partially on the
> webserver).
> >>>
> >>> Attending this conference made me realize that I am probably not a
> good
> >>> candidate for funding my startup, but as I look for a job now (any
> leads
> >>> would be appreciated), I still want to develop this system for the
> Python
> >>> community. So, I am also interested in meeting developers who
> might be
> >>> interested in working on this project because my established
> codebase is
> >>> fairly large (about 15000 lines) even without many features being
> >>> implemented.
> >>>
> >>> I look forward to meeting all of you at the next meeting.
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> Allan
> >>>
> >>> _______________________________________________
> >>> Chicago mailing list
> >>> Chicago at python.org
> >>> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
> >>>
> >>>
> >> _______________________________________________
> >> Chicago mailing list
> >> Chicago at python.org
> >> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Chicago mailing list
> > Chicago at python.org
> > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
> >
> _______________________________________________
> Chicago mailing list
> Chicago at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago

From cwebber at dustycloud.org  Mon Oct  6 18:50:59 2008
From: cwebber at dustycloud.org (Christopher Allan Webber)
Date: Mon, 06 Oct 2008 11:50:59 -0500
Subject: [Chicago] New Member
In-Reply-To: <D0A4B911-7F54-4C6C-8DC9-B2E00045E245@widefido.com> (Jordan
	Sherer's message of "Mon, 6 Oct 2008 09:54:37 -0500")
References: <79acc5430810040934l145d5bfdl937bda0a1f054293@mail.gmail.com>
	<b571660a0810060741q52944f0eked85722501c964e9@mail.gmail.com>
	<D0A4B911-7F54-4C6C-8DC9-B2E00045E245@widefido.com>
Message-ID: <87wsglr7kc.fsf@dustycloud.org>

We're a pretty welcoming and informal group.  Come, talk about you
stuff, socialize, have fun!

Jordan Sherer <jordan at widefido.com> writes:

> I *am* planning on attending the meet-up on Thursday. However, since
> this will be my first ChiPy meetup I am unsure about giving a talk. If
> people have enough interest in desktop apps built with Python, I can
> give a quick one.
>
> A few questions:
> What is the atmosphere like for talks?
> Are there any general recommendations for giving a talk?
> Is there anything in particular that people would like to hear about
> Python powered desktop apps?
>
> Do you think I should wait until the November meet-up to talk?
>
> Thanks!
>
> Best,
> Jordan
>
>
> On Oct 6, 2008, at Oct 6   9:41 AM, Kumar McMillan wrote:
>
>> Hi Allan, welcome.
>>
>> On Sat, Oct 4, 2008 at 11:34 AM, Allan Spale <allan2600 at gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>>> Hi,
>>>
>>> My name is Allan and I am interested in learning more about the
>>> Chicago
>>> Python users group and where and when your next meeting will occur.
>>
>> Our next meeting will be the best ever.  I just updated the wiki with
>> details: http://chipy.org/
>>
>> Chris is giving a talk on Miro and I'll be giving a talk on freebase
>> but I'm not an expert on it.  I think Jordan Sherer might also give a
>> talk on desktop apps?
>>
>> If there's time for discussion, maybe we can talk about the future of
>> "semantic web" -- freebase is just one of the semantic tools emerging
>> but I also don't know much about this so-called movement.
>>
>> Kaleidoscope looks interesting but ambitious.  I get overwhelmed
>> easily when I hear of tools designed to organize all the data of the
>> world.  Not that I don't think it's possible, it just seems really
>> hard.  One thing is for sure, the Google model is far from perfect and
>> if something comes along and does it better then they will be in
>> trouble.  Freebase is pretty ambitious too.  But then again so was
>> wikipedia and that worked.
>>
>> -Kumar
>>
>>>
>>> To give you some background about myself...I have been working on an
>>> internet startup for the past year or so in which I am developing an
>>> open-source semantic database system that takes some of the ideas
>>> from
>>> Freebase but goes into a somewhat different direction. You can read
>>> more
>>> about the system here: http://my-kaleidoscope.org/platform.html. The
>>> datastore I am using is pybsddb (BerkeleyDB module for Python), but
>>> the
>>> system was designed in such a way to support any datastore whether
>>> it is a
>>> traditional SQL system or something more non-traditional like
>>> Amazon S3. I
>>> did a very scaled down demo at the O'Reilly Web 2.0 Expo in New
>>> York City a
>>> few weeks ago doing a mashup of the working parts of my database
>>> system and
>>> using Twitter as a frontend:
>>> http://en.oreilly.com/webexny2008/public/schedule/detail/5266. I
>>> would
>>> invite all of you to take a look at it, but I am having a terrible
>>> time
>>> trying to get my code to work on the web server space that I listed
>>> (the
>>> demo was a hack of running mostly local and partially on the
>>> webserver).
>>>
>>> Attending this conference made me realize that I am probably not a
>>> good
>>> candidate for funding my startup, but as I look for a job now (any
>>> leads
>>> would be appreciated), I still want to develop this system for the
>>> Python
>>> community. So, I am also interested in meeting developers who might
>>> be
>>> interested in working on this project because my established
>>> codebase is
>>> fairly large (about 15000 lines) even without many features being
>>> implemented.
>>>
>>> I look forward to meeting all of you at the next meeting.
>>>
>>>
>>> Allan
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Chicago mailing list
>>> Chicago at python.org
>>> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>>>
>>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Chicago mailing list
>> Chicago at python.org
>> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>
> _______________________________________________
> Chicago mailing list
> Chicago at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago

From bray at sent.com  Tue Oct  7 22:02:18 2008
From: bray at sent.com (Brian Ray)
Date: Tue, 07 Oct 2008 20:02:18 -0000
Subject: [Chicago] ANN ChiPy October Meeting at SkinnyCorp
Message-ID: <7AA2E07D-B024-4E7B-883B-0F3C7E1385CF@sent.com>

Chicago Python User Group
=========================

As you probably heard, our September meeting was a huge success. Great  
turnout, cool toys, fun programmers.  This one will be even better.

You better believe this will be our best meeting ever. Bring a friend,  
date, colleague, understudy, friend, guru...

NEWS
----

Remember you can get announcements only! Subscribe to <http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chipy-announce 
 > if you think want to cut the chatter.

When
----

Thursday, Oct 9th, ~7pm

Topics
------

  * Chris Webber -  `Miro <http://www.getmiro.com/>`_, a free, open  
source internet tv & video player
  * Kumar McMillan - `freebase <http://www.freebase.com/>`_, a free  
collaborative database with a rich API

Location
--------

Skinnycorp (http://skinnycorp.com)
4043 N. Ravenswood Ave. Chicago Suite 106


About ChiPy
-----------

ChiPy is a group of Chicago Python Programmers, l33t, and n00bs.
Meetings are held monthly at various locations around Chicago.
Also, ChiPy is a proud sponsor of many Open Source and Educational
efforts in Chicago. Stay tuned to the mailing list for more info.

ChiPy website: <http://chipy.org>
ChiPy Mailing List: <http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago>
Python website: <http://python.org>

From maney at two14.net  Tue Oct  7 22:54:16 2008
From: maney at two14.net (Martin Maney)
Date: Tue, 7 Oct 2008 15:54:16 -0500
Subject: [Chicago] ANN ChiPy October Meeting at SkinnyCorp
In-Reply-To: <7AA2E07D-B024-4E7B-883B-0F3C7E1385CF@sent.com>
References: <7AA2E07D-B024-4E7B-883B-0F3C7E1385CF@sent.com>
Message-ID: <20081007205416.GA4789@furrr.two14.net>

On Wed, Aug 13, 2008 at 11:04:33PM -0500, Brian Ray wrote:
> As you probably heard, our September meeting was a huge success. Great  
> turnout, cool toys, fun programmers.  This one will be even better.

I see you borrowed the time machine from Guido.

-- 
Hebb's dictum:  If it isn't worth doing, it isn't worth doing well.


From tottinge at gmail.com  Tue Oct  7 22:57:46 2008
From: tottinge at gmail.com (Tim Ottinger)
Date: Tue, 07 Oct 2008 15:57:46 -0500
Subject: [Chicago] ANN ChiPy October Meeting at SkinnyCorp
In-Reply-To: <20081007205416.GA4789@furrr.two14.net>
References: <7AA2E07D-B024-4E7B-883B-0F3C7E1385CF@sent.com>
	<20081007205416.GA4789@furrr.two14.net>
Message-ID: <48EBCD4A.3020301@gmail.com>

Martin Maney wrote:
> On Wed, Aug 13, 2008 at 11:04:33PM -0500, Brian Ray wrote:
>   
>> As you probably heard, our September meeting was a huge success. Great  
>> turnout, cool toys, fun programmers.  This one will be even better.
>>     
>
> I see you borrowed the time machine from Guido.
>   

import timeMachine


-- 

Tim ---------------------------
http://agileotter.blogspot.com/
http://tottinge.blogsome.com/
-Tim speaks only for himself---




From bray at sent.com  Tue Oct  7 23:22:13 2008
From: bray at sent.com (Brian Ray)
Date: Tue, 7 Oct 2008 16:22:13 -0500
Subject: [Chicago] ANN ChiPy October Meeting at SkinnyCorp
In-Reply-To: <20081007205416.GA4789@furrr.two14.net>
References: <7AA2E07D-B024-4E7B-883B-0F3C7E1385CF@sent.com>
	<20081007205416.GA4789@furrr.two14.net>
Message-ID: <9B8A9127-0B87-4EE9-83AF-BA3AEBC1205C@sent.com>


On Oct 7, 2008, at 3:54 PM, Martin Maney wrote:

> On Wed, Aug 13, 2008 at 11:04:33PM -0500, Brian Ray wrote:
>> As you probably heard, our September meeting was a huge success.  
>> Great
>> turnout, cool toys, fun programmers.  This one will be even better.
>
> I see you borrowed the time machine from Guido.


import timeMachine as fishToSlapManeyWith


Brian Ray




From verisimilidude at gmail.com  Tue Oct  7 23:38:24 2008
From: verisimilidude at gmail.com (Phil Robare)
Date: Tue, 7 Oct 2008 16:38:24 -0500
Subject: [Chicago] Watch out for Queue on cygwin
Message-ID: <6ad48f980810071438m6727bd30g98182593f1c55939@mail.gmail.com>

I created a simple threaded app - control thread, network thread,
output thread and communication between the threads was done using the
synchronized queue from the Queue module.  After I got it working it
would run for a while and then crash with:

sem_init: Resource temporarily unavailable
Error while running: (<class 'thread.error'>, error("can't allocate
lock",), <traceback object at 0x7ff41eb4>)
  File "SoupReader.py", line 252, in run
    line=self.in_queue.get(timeout=1.0)
  File "/tmp/python.6884/usr/lib/python2.5/Queue.py", line 174, in get
    self.not_empty.wait(remaining)
  File "/tmp/python.6884/usr/lib/python2.5/threading.py", line 208, in wait
    waiter = _allocate_lock()
Shutting down on error...

After spending time with the Queue.py and threading.py source (and
quickly figuring out my problem is in the C code) I googled sem_init,
and found it is the low-level Unix API for semaphore creation.  Since
I am forced by work situation to use Windows I was actually running
Python under cygwin.  Googling sem_init and cygwin found this post
from 2002 on the Python-Dev mailing list:
http://mail.python.org/pipermail/python-dev/2002-February/020492.html

The discussion there is that cygwin's sem_init, as called in the
Python libraries, in inherently subject to a race condition.  And that
fits the symptoms I was seeing.  Running the real windows python I
have no problems (other than those inherent in using Idle rather than
my preferred Vim + command line).

As I am unsure what to do with this hard won knowledge I have decided
to post it here, spamming it out to the teeming millions on this list
that don't care in the hope that I can save someone the pain I have
gone through.

Phil

From maney at two14.net  Wed Oct  8 13:35:11 2008
From: maney at two14.net (Martin Maney)
Date: Wed, 8 Oct 2008 06:35:11 -0500
Subject: [Chicago] ANN ChiPy October Meeting at SkinnyCorp
In-Reply-To: <9B8A9127-0B87-4EE9-83AF-BA3AEBC1205C@sent.com>
References: <7AA2E07D-B024-4E7B-883B-0F3C7E1385CF@sent.com>
	<20081007205416.GA4789@furrr.two14.net>
	<9B8A9127-0B87-4EE9-83AF-BA3AEBC1205C@sent.com>
Message-ID: <20081008113511.GC4789@furrr.two14.net>

On Tue, Oct 07, 2008 at 04:22:13PM -0500, Brian Ray wrote:
> import timeMachine as fishToSlapManeyWith

Trout you!

-- 
The trouble with customizing your environment is that it just doesn't
propagate, so it's not even worth the trouble.  -- Joel Spolsky

I keep my life in a CVS\\\Subversion\\\\\\\\\git repository. -- Joey Hess


From maney at two14.net  Wed Oct  8 13:46:30 2008
From: maney at two14.net (Martin Maney)
Date: Wed, 8 Oct 2008 06:46:30 -0500
Subject: [Chicago] Watch out for Queue on cygwin
In-Reply-To: <6ad48f980810071438m6727bd30g98182593f1c55939@mail.gmail.com>
References: <6ad48f980810071438m6727bd30g98182593f1c55939@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <20081008114630.GD4789@furrr.two14.net>

On Tue, Oct 07, 2008 at 04:38:24PM -0500, Phil Robare wrote:
> As I am unsure what to do with this hard won knowledge I have decided
> to post it here, spamming it out to the teeming millions on this list
> that don't care in the hope that I can save someone the pain I have
> gone through.

The only effective cure for Windows Pain known to man involves an
install CD or DVD of the non-MS OS of your choice.  Some of these may
come with $$$ new hardware as well.

-- 
The true danger is when liberty is nibbled away,
for expedients, and by parts.  -- Edmund Burke


From szybalski at gmail.com  Thu Oct  9 17:40:23 2008
From: szybalski at gmail.com (Lukasz Szybalski)
Date: Thu, 9 Oct 2008 10:40:23 -0500
Subject: [Chicago] 2 unique keys in a python dict?
Message-ID: <804e5c70810090840t1a7fffe2hd1f07bc8c762515a@mail.gmail.com>

Hello,
Is it possible to have multiple keys in a python dictionary?

Normally its only 1 key, and I need to have 2 dictionaries and somehow
manage the uniqueness.
me={}
me['First']='Lucas'
me['Last']='szybalski'

I would like to get 2 keys? Is there something similar to dict that
would have the property that 2 or more keys are unique?
me= ?


Thanks,
Lucas


-- 
Python and OpenOffice documents and templates
http://lucasmanual.com/mywiki/OpenOffice
Fast and Easy Backup solution with Bacula
http://lucasmanual.com/mywiki/Bacula

From mdipierro at cs.depaul.edu  Thu Oct  9 17:43:20 2008
From: mdipierro at cs.depaul.edu (Massimo Di Pierro)
Date: Thu, 9 Oct 2008 10:43:20 -0500
Subject: [Chicago] 2 unique keys in a python dict?
In-Reply-To: <804e5c70810090840t1a7fffe2hd1f07bc8c762515a@mail.gmail.com>
References: <804e5c70810090840t1a7fffe2hd1f07bc8c762515a@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <9B8B66B8-45B7-45BC-A052-11655C99B17A@cs.depaul.edu>

A key can be a tuple

me['key1','key2']='value'


On Oct 9, 2008, at 10:40 AM, Lukasz Szybalski wrote:

> Hello,
> Is it possible to have multiple keys in a python dictionary?
>
> Normally its only 1 key, and I need to have 2 dictionaries and somehow
> manage the uniqueness.
> me={}
> me['First']='Lucas'
> me['Last']='szybalski'
>
> I would like to get 2 keys? Is there something similar to dict that
> would have the property that 2 or more keys are unique?
> me= ?
>
>
> Thanks,
> Lucas
>
>
> --
> Python and OpenOffice documents and templates
> http://lucasmanual.com/mywiki/OpenOffice
> Fast and Easy Backup solution with Bacula
> http://lucasmanual.com/mywiki/Bacula
> _______________________________________________
> Chicago mailing list
> Chicago at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago


From skip at pobox.com  Thu Oct  9 17:49:52 2008
From: skip at pobox.com (skip at pobox.com)
Date: Thu, 9 Oct 2008 10:49:52 -0500
Subject: [Chicago] 2 unique keys in a python dict?
In-Reply-To: <804e5c70810090840t1a7fffe2hd1f07bc8c762515a@mail.gmail.com>
References: <804e5c70810090840t1a7fffe2hd1f07bc8c762515a@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <18670.10272.860766.169538@montanaro-dyndns-org.local>


    Lukasz> Is it possible to have multiple keys in a python dictionary?

Certainly.  Though I don't think that's really what you intended to ask.

    Lukasz> Normally its only 1 key, and I need to have 2 dictionaries and
    Lukasz> somehow manage the uniqueness.
    Lukasz> me={}
    Lukasz> me['First']='Lucas'
    Lukasz> me['Last']='szybalski'

    Lukasz> I would like to get 2 keys? Is there something similar to dict
    Lukasz> that would have the property that 2 or more keys are unique?
    Lukasz> me= ?

I'm unclear what you are asking.  Do you want a list of dictionaries?, e.g.:

    names = [
        {
            'First': 'Lucas',
            'Last': 'Szybalski',
        },
        {
            'First': 'Skip',
            'Last': 'Montanaro',
        }
    ]

Skip

From szybalski at gmail.com  Thu Oct  9 18:06:12 2008
From: szybalski at gmail.com (Lukasz Szybalski)
Date: Thu, 9 Oct 2008 11:06:12 -0500
Subject: [Chicago] 2 unique keys in a python dict?
In-Reply-To: <18670.10272.860766.169538@montanaro-dyndns-org.local>
References: <804e5c70810090840t1a7fffe2hd1f07bc8c762515a@mail.gmail.com>
	<18670.10272.860766.169538@montanaro-dyndns-org.local>
Message-ID: <804e5c70810090906m3008a1e0p6c5677b4545e4b77@mail.gmail.com>

On Thu, Oct 9, 2008 at 10:49 AM,  <skip at pobox.com> wrote:
>
>    Lukasz> Is it possible to have multiple keys in a python dictionary?
>
> Certainly.  Though I don't think that's really what you intended to ask.
>
>    Lukasz> Normally its only 1 key, and I need to have 2 dictionaries and
>    Lukasz> somehow manage the uniqueness.
>    Lukasz> me={}
>    Lukasz> me['First']='Lucas'
>    Lukasz> me['Last']='szybalski'
>
>    Lukasz> I would like to get 2 keys? Is there something similar to dict
>    Lukasz> that would have the property that 2 or more keys are unique?
>    Lukasz> me= ?
>
> I'm unclear what you are asking.  Do you want a list of dictionaries?, e.g.:
>
>    names = [
>        {
>            'First': 'Lucas',
>            'Last': 'Szybalski',
>        },
>        {
>            'First': 'Skip',
>            'Last': 'Montanaro',
>        }
>    ]
>


I have multiple records in a csv file for each userid. I need to
calculate total amount paid and last transaction.

id,paid,transaction
3,$10,20080101
3,$10,20080201


Final Total
me={}
me[3]=($20,20080201)  (dictionary with a list)

now
id,subid, paid,transaction
3,1,$10,20080101
3,2,$10,20080201

I guess what Massimo said will work, but now I need to know which row
is the paid and which is transaction?!!
me[3,1]=(10,20080101)
me[3,2]=(10,20080201)

I guess this could do it
me[3,1]={'paid':10 , 'transaction':20080101}

Thanks,
Lucas

From mdipierro at cs.depaul.edu  Thu Oct  9 18:19:02 2008
From: mdipierro at cs.depaul.edu (Massimo Di Pierro)
Date: Thu, 9 Oct 2008 11:19:02 -0500
Subject: [Chicago] 2 unique keys in a python dict?
In-Reply-To: <804e5c70810090906m3008a1e0p6c5677b4545e4b77@mail.gmail.com>
References: <804e5c70810090840t1a7fffe2hd1f07bc8c762515a@mail.gmail.com>
	<18670.10272.860766.169538@montanaro-dyndns-org.local>
	<804e5c70810090906m3008a1e0p6c5677b4545e4b77@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <77E4354C-38EF-4A7E-A74E-73A7A5FC4A7C@cs.depaul.edu>

Or....

edit the header of the CSV file and call your columns

     tid, paid, ttid

instead of

     id, paid, transaction

and remove the '$' signs from there

download web2py and type

python web2py.py -S welcome
 >>> db=SQLDB()
 >>> db.define_table('mytable',
     SQLField('tid','integer'),
     SQLField('paid','double'),
     SQLField('ttid','string'))

 >>> db.import_from_csv_file(open('yourfilename.csv'))
 >>> db.commit()
 >>>  
rows 
= 
db 
().select 
(db 
.mytable 
.ttid 
,db.mytable.paid.sum(),orderby=db.mytable.ttid,groupby=db.mytable.ttid)
 >>> for row in rows:
... print 'transaction',row.ttid,'total  
amount',row[db.mytable.paid.sum()]

On Oct 9, 2008, at 11:06 AM, Lukasz Szybalski wrote:

> On Thu, Oct 9, 2008 at 10:49 AM,  <skip at pobox.com> wrote:
>>
>>   Lukasz> Is it possible to have multiple keys in a python  
>> dictionary?
>>
>> Certainly.  Though I don't think that's really what you intended to  
>> ask.
>>
>>   Lukasz> Normally its only 1 key, and I need to have 2  
>> dictionaries and
>>   Lukasz> somehow manage the uniqueness.
>>   Lukasz> me={}
>>   Lukasz> me['First']='Lucas'
>>   Lukasz> me['Last']='szybalski'
>>
>>   Lukasz> I would like to get 2 keys? Is there something similar to  
>> dict
>>   Lukasz> that would have the property that 2 or more keys are  
>> unique?
>>   Lukasz> me= ?
>>
>> I'm unclear what you are asking.  Do you want a list of  
>> dictionaries?, e.g.:
>>
>>   names = [
>>       {
>>           'First': 'Lucas',
>>           'Last': 'Szybalski',
>>       },
>>       {
>>           'First': 'Skip',
>>           'Last': 'Montanaro',
>>       }
>>   ]
>>
>
>
> I have multiple records in a csv file for each userid. I need to
> calculate total amount paid and last transaction.
>
> id,paid,transaction
> 3,$10,20080101
> 3,$10,20080201
>
>
> Final Total
> me={}
> me[3]=($20,20080201)  (dictionary with a list)
>
> now
> id,subid, paid,transaction
> 3,1,$10,20080101
> 3,2,$10,20080201
>
> I guess what Massimo said will work, but now I need to know which row
> is the paid and which is transaction?!!
> me[3,1]=(10,20080101)
> me[3,2]=(10,20080201)
>
> I guess this could do it
> me[3,1]={'paid':10 , 'transaction':20080101}
>
> Thanks,
> Lucas
> _______________________________________________
> Chicago mailing list
> Chicago at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago


From jdh2358 at gmail.com  Thu Oct  9 18:53:34 2008
From: jdh2358 at gmail.com (John Hunter)
Date: Thu, 9 Oct 2008 11:53:34 -0500
Subject: [Chicago] 2 unique keys in a python dict?
In-Reply-To: <77E4354C-38EF-4A7E-A74E-73A7A5FC4A7C@cs.depaul.edu>
References: <804e5c70810090840t1a7fffe2hd1f07bc8c762515a@mail.gmail.com>
	<18670.10272.860766.169538@montanaro-dyndns-org.local>
	<804e5c70810090906m3008a1e0p6c5677b4545e4b77@mail.gmail.com>
	<77E4354C-38EF-4A7E-A74E-73A7A5FC4A7C@cs.depaul.edu>
Message-ID: <88e473830810090953m78ee4ab9of92b770aa9e7b633@mail.gmail.com>

On Thu, Oct 9, 2008 at 11:19 AM, Massimo Di Pierro
<mdipierro at cs.depaul.edu> wrote:

>>>> rows=db().select(db.mytable.ttid,db.mytable.paid.sum(),orderby=db.mytable.ttid,groupby=db.mytable.ttid)
>>>> for row in rows:
> ... print 'transaction',row.ttid,'total amount',row[db.mytable.paid.sum()]

Or use matplotlib's support for CSV files via numpy record arrays

  import matplotlib.mlab as mlab
  r = mlab.csv2rec('myfile.csv')
  print r.paid.sum()

csv2rec does type inference from the data in the file, and numpy
arrays support all the standard math and stat operations (mean, std,
logical masks, etc...)

JDH

From g at rrett.us.com  Thu Oct  9 19:17:50 2008
From: g at rrett.us.com (Garrett Smith)
Date: Thu, 9 Oct 2008 12:17:50 -0500 (CDT)
Subject: [Chicago] 2 unique keys in a python dict?
In-Reply-To: <77E4354C-38EF-4A7E-A74E-73A7A5FC4A7C@cs.depaul.edu>
Message-ID: <1729087912.3781771223572670785.JavaMail.root@mail-3.01.com>

Or just use Django.

----- "Massimo Di Pierro" <mdipierro at cs.depaul.edu> wrote:

> Or....
> 
> edit the header of the CSV file and call your columns
> 
>      tid, paid, ttid
> 
> instead of
> 
>      id, paid, transaction
> 
> and remove the '$' signs from there
> 
> download web2py and type
> 
> python web2py.py -S welcome
>  >>> db=SQLDB()
>  >>> db.define_table('mytable',
>      SQLField('tid','integer'),
>      SQLField('paid','double'),
>      SQLField('ttid','string'))
> 
>  >>> db.import_from_csv_file(open('yourfilename.csv'))
>  >>> db.commit()
>  >>>  
> rows 
> = 
> db 
> ().select 
> (db 
> .mytable 
> .ttid 
> ,db.mytable.paid.sum(),orderby=db.mytable.ttid,groupby=db.mytable.ttid)
>  >>> for row in rows:
> ... print 'transaction',row.ttid,'total  
> amount',row[db.mytable.paid.sum()]
> 
> On Oct 9, 2008, at 11:06 AM, Lukasz Szybalski wrote:
> 
> > On Thu, Oct 9, 2008 at 10:49 AM,  <skip at pobox.com> wrote:
> >>
> >>   Lukasz> Is it possible to have multiple keys in a python  
> >> dictionary?
> >>
> >> Certainly.  Though I don't think that's really what you intended to
>  
> >> ask.
> >>
> >>   Lukasz> Normally its only 1 key, and I need to have 2  
> >> dictionaries and
> >>   Lukasz> somehow manage the uniqueness.
> >>   Lukasz> me={}
> >>   Lukasz> me['First']='Lucas'
> >>   Lukasz> me['Last']='szybalski'
> >>
> >>   Lukasz> I would like to get 2 keys? Is there something similar to
>  
> >> dict
> >>   Lukasz> that would have the property that 2 or more keys are  
> >> unique?
> >>   Lukasz> me= ?
> >>
> >> I'm unclear what you are asking.  Do you want a list of  
> >> dictionaries?, e.g.:
> >>
> >>   names = [
> >>       {
> >>           'First': 'Lucas',
> >>           'Last': 'Szybalski',
> >>       },
> >>       {
> >>           'First': 'Skip',
> >>           'Last': 'Montanaro',
> >>       }
> >>   ]
> >>
> >
> >
> > I have multiple records in a csv file for each userid. I need to
> > calculate total amount paid and last transaction.
> >
> > id,paid,transaction
> > 3,$10,20080101
> > 3,$10,20080201
> >
> >
> > Final Total
> > me={}
> > me[3]=($20,20080201)  (dictionary with a list)
> >
> > now
> > id,subid, paid,transaction
> > 3,1,$10,20080101
> > 3,2,$10,20080201
> >
> > I guess what Massimo said will work, but now I need to know which
> row
> > is the paid and which is transaction?!!
> > me[3,1]=(10,20080101)
> > me[3,2]=(10,20080201)
> >
> > I guess this could do it
> > me[3,1]={'paid':10 , 'transaction':20080101}
> >
> > Thanks,
> > Lucas
> > _______________________________________________
> > Chicago mailing list
> > Chicago at python.org
> > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Chicago mailing list
> Chicago at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago

From szybalski at gmail.com  Thu Oct  9 19:21:49 2008
From: szybalski at gmail.com (Lukasz Szybalski)
Date: Thu, 9 Oct 2008 12:21:49 -0500
Subject: [Chicago] 2 unique keys in a python dict?
In-Reply-To: <88e473830810090953m78ee4ab9of92b770aa9e7b633@mail.gmail.com>
References: <804e5c70810090840t1a7fffe2hd1f07bc8c762515a@mail.gmail.com>
	<18670.10272.860766.169538@montanaro-dyndns-org.local>
	<804e5c70810090906m3008a1e0p6c5677b4545e4b77@mail.gmail.com>
	<77E4354C-38EF-4A7E-A74E-73A7A5FC4A7C@cs.depaul.edu>
	<88e473830810090953m78ee4ab9of92b770aa9e7b633@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <804e5c70810091021y2d67115cib571caa32b02d029@mail.gmail.com>

On Thu, Oct 9, 2008 at 11:53 AM, John Hunter <jdh2358 at gmail.com> wrote:
> On Thu, Oct 9, 2008 at 11:19 AM, Massimo Di Pierro
> <mdipierro at cs.depaul.edu> wrote:
>
>>>>> rows=db().select(db.mytable.ttid,db.mytable.paid.sum(),orderby=db.mytable.ttid,groupby=db.mytable.ttid)
>>>>> for row in rows:
>> ... print 'transaction',row.ttid,'total amount',row[db.mytable.paid.sum()]
>
> Or use matplotlib's support for CSV files via numpy record arrays
>
>  import matplotlib.mlab as mlab
>  r = mlab.csv2rec('myfile.csv')
>  print r.paid.sum()
>
> csv2rec does type inference from the data in the file, and numpy
> arrays support all the standard math and stat operations (mean, std,
> logical masks, etc...)

This is a combination of sqlserver2000, clarion tps files via odbc,
mysql server, all with different fields structure that at the end need
to show up on the excel.

Wish there was an easier way of merging these sources into some csv
based reporting tool, getting the proper totals, and output final csv
file in under 2 weeks.

Lucas

From mtobis at gmail.com  Thu Oct  9 19:34:56 2008
From: mtobis at gmail.com (Michael Tobis)
Date: Thu, 9 Oct 2008 12:34:56 -0500
Subject: [Chicago] 2 unique keys in a python dict?
In-Reply-To: <804e5c70810091021y2d67115cib571caa32b02d029@mail.gmail.com>
References: <804e5c70810090840t1a7fffe2hd1f07bc8c762515a@mail.gmail.com>
	<18670.10272.860766.169538@montanaro-dyndns-org.local>
	<804e5c70810090906m3008a1e0p6c5677b4545e4b77@mail.gmail.com>
	<77E4354C-38EF-4A7E-A74E-73A7A5FC4A7C@cs.depaul.edu>
	<88e473830810090953m78ee4ab9of92b770aa9e7b633@mail.gmail.com>
	<804e5c70810091021y2d67115cib571caa32b02d029@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <c3aa55550810091034o16617a7eq973949a488e7a750@mail.gmail.com>

You are up against the Law of Conservation of Messiness, a fundamental
constraint of the known universe.

I'm not entirely clear on the goal, but if you need to key off unique
combinations of (firstname,lastname), the tuple as key idea looked good to
me.

mt
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From mdipierro at cs.depaul.edu  Thu Oct  9 20:02:13 2008
From: mdipierro at cs.depaul.edu (Massimo Di Pierro)
Date: Thu, 9 Oct 2008 13:02:13 -0500
Subject: [Chicago] 2 unique keys in a python dict?
In-Reply-To: <88e473830810090953m78ee4ab9of92b770aa9e7b633@mail.gmail.com>
References: <804e5c70810090840t1a7fffe2hd1f07bc8c762515a@mail.gmail.com>
	<18670.10272.860766.169538@montanaro-dyndns-org.local>
	<804e5c70810090906m3008a1e0p6c5677b4545e4b77@mail.gmail.com>
	<77E4354C-38EF-4A7E-A74E-73A7A5FC4A7C@cs.depaul.edu>
	<88e473830810090953m78ee4ab9of92b770aa9e7b633@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <B6C51295-97FF-416C-AB75-23A91B0CE5C6@cs.depaul.edu>

Not quite the same. I believe Lukasz is not looking into adding up the  
column. He is looking into grouping records by transaction id and than  
summing up records within the same transaction.


On Oct 9, 2008, at 11:53 AM, John Hunter wrote:

> On Thu, Oct 9, 2008 at 11:19 AM, Massimo Di Pierro
> <mdipierro at cs.depaul.edu> wrote:
>
>>>>> rows 
>>>>> = 
>>>>> db 
>>>>> ().select 
>>>>> (db 
>>>>> .mytable 
>>>>> .ttid 
>>>>> ,db 
>>>>> .mytable 
>>>>> .paid.sum(),orderby=db.mytable.ttid,groupby=db.mytable.ttid)
>>>>> for row in rows:
>> ... print 'transaction',row.ttid,'total  
>> amount',row[db.mytable.paid.sum()]
>
> Or use matplotlib's support for CSV files via numpy record arrays
>
>  import matplotlib.mlab as mlab
>  r = mlab.csv2rec('myfile.csv')
>  print r.paid.sum()
>
> csv2rec does type inference from the data in the file, and numpy
> arrays support all the standard math and stat operations (mean, std,
> logical masks, etc...)
>
> JDH
> _______________________________________________
> Chicago mailing list
> Chicago at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago


From mdipierro at cs.depaul.edu  Thu Oct  9 20:05:11 2008
From: mdipierro at cs.depaul.edu (Massimo Di Pierro)
Date: Thu, 9 Oct 2008 13:05:11 -0500
Subject: [Chicago] 2 unique keys in a python dict?
In-Reply-To: <1729087912.3781771223572670785.JavaMail.root@mail-3.01.com>
References: <1729087912.3781771223572670785.JavaMail.root@mail-3.01.com>
Message-ID: <5E0DBB8C-631D-4F26-A42B-FF5FCD13F1FA@cs.depaul.edu>

Can the Django ORM import CSV files and/or generate ORDER BY queries  
without additional code snippets?
If so, could you post example?


On Oct 9, 2008, at 12:17 PM, Garrett Smith wrote:

> Or just use Django.
>
> ----- "Massimo Di Pierro" <mdipierro at cs.depaul.edu> wrote:
>
>> Or....
>>
>> edit the header of the CSV file and call your columns
>>
>>     tid, paid, ttid
>>
>> instead of
>>
>>     id, paid, transaction
>>
>> and remove the '$' signs from there
>>
>> download web2py and type
>>
>> python web2py.py -S welcome
>>>>> db=SQLDB()
>>>>> db.define_table('mytable',
>>     SQLField('tid','integer'),
>>     SQLField('paid','double'),
>>     SQLField('ttid','string'))
>>
>>>>> db.import_from_csv_file(open('yourfilename.csv'))
>>>>> db.commit()
>>>>>
>> rows
>> =
>> db
>> ().select
>> (db
>> .mytable
>> .ttid
>> ,db 
>> .mytable.paid.sum(),orderby=db.mytable.ttid,groupby=db.mytable.ttid)
>>>>> for row in rows:
>> ... print 'transaction',row.ttid,'total
>> amount',row[db.mytable.paid.sum()]
>>
>> On Oct 9, 2008, at 11:06 AM, Lukasz Szybalski wrote:
>>
>>> On Thu, Oct 9, 2008 at 10:49 AM,  <skip at pobox.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>  Lukasz> Is it possible to have multiple keys in a python
>>>> dictionary?
>>>>
>>>> Certainly.  Though I don't think that's really what you intended to
>>
>>>> ask.
>>>>
>>>>  Lukasz> Normally its only 1 key, and I need to have 2
>>>> dictionaries and
>>>>  Lukasz> somehow manage the uniqueness.
>>>>  Lukasz> me={}
>>>>  Lukasz> me['First']='Lucas'
>>>>  Lukasz> me['Last']='szybalski'
>>>>
>>>>  Lukasz> I would like to get 2 keys? Is there something similar to
>>
>>>> dict
>>>>  Lukasz> that would have the property that 2 or more keys are
>>>> unique?
>>>>  Lukasz> me= ?
>>>>
>>>> I'm unclear what you are asking.  Do you want a list of
>>>> dictionaries?, e.g.:
>>>>
>>>>  names = [
>>>>      {
>>>>          'First': 'Lucas',
>>>>          'Last': 'Szybalski',
>>>>      },
>>>>      {
>>>>          'First': 'Skip',
>>>>          'Last': 'Montanaro',
>>>>      }
>>>>  ]
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> I have multiple records in a csv file for each userid. I need to
>>> calculate total amount paid and last transaction.
>>>
>>> id,paid,transaction
>>> 3,$10,20080101
>>> 3,$10,20080201
>>>
>>>
>>> Final Total
>>> me={}
>>> me[3]=($20,20080201)  (dictionary with a list)
>>>
>>> now
>>> id,subid, paid,transaction
>>> 3,1,$10,20080101
>>> 3,2,$10,20080201
>>>
>>> I guess what Massimo said will work, but now I need to know which
>> row
>>> is the paid and which is transaction?!!
>>> me[3,1]=(10,20080101)
>>> me[3,2]=(10,20080201)
>>>
>>> I guess this could do it
>>> me[3,1]={'paid':10 , 'transaction':20080101}
>>>
>>> Thanks,
>>> Lucas
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Chicago mailing list
>>> Chicago at python.org
>>> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Chicago mailing list
>> Chicago at python.org
>> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
> _______________________________________________
> Chicago mailing list
> Chicago at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago


From mdipierro at cs.depaul.edu  Thu Oct  9 20:26:51 2008
From: mdipierro at cs.depaul.edu (Massimo Di Pierro)
Date: Thu, 9 Oct 2008 13:26:51 -0500
Subject: [Chicago] 2 unique keys in a python dict?
In-Reply-To: <804e5c70810091021y2d67115cib571caa32b02d029@mail.gmail.com>
References: <804e5c70810090840t1a7fffe2hd1f07bc8c762515a@mail.gmail.com>
	<18670.10272.860766.169538@montanaro-dyndns-org.local>
	<804e5c70810090906m3008a1e0p6c5677b4545e4b77@mail.gmail.com>
	<77E4354C-38EF-4A7E-A74E-73A7A5FC4A7C@cs.depaul.edu>
	<88e473830810090953m78ee4ab9of92b770aa9e7b633@mail.gmail.com>
	<804e5c70810091021y2d67115cib571caa32b02d029@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <35483D47-5D4A-4CDD-AC65-7FA1EFF4A0DD@cs.depaul.edu>

I do not know what tps files are but in web2py you can connect to  
multiple databases at once

     db=SQLDB('sqlite://....')
     db1=SQLDB('mssql://....')
     db2=SQLDB('mysql://....')

process them

     for row in db1(...).select():  
db.mytable.insert(field=row.other_field,...)
     for row in db2(...).select():  
db.mytable.insert(field=row.other_field,...)

and you can serialize any select query back in CSV using str(..)

     open('output.csv','w').write(str(db(....).select()))

If this is useful, feel free to email me personally with more details  
and I am happy to answer any question.

Massimo

On Oct 9, 2008, at 12:21 PM, Lukasz Szybalski wrote:

> On Thu, Oct 9, 2008 at 11:53 AM, John Hunter <jdh2358 at gmail.com>  
> wrote:
>> On Thu, Oct 9, 2008 at 11:19 AM, Massimo Di Pierro
>> <mdipierro at cs.depaul.edu> wrote:
>>
>>>>>> rows 
>>>>>> = 
>>>>>> db 
>>>>>> ().select 
>>>>>> (db 
>>>>>> .mytable 
>>>>>> .ttid 
>>>>>> ,db 
>>>>>> .mytable 
>>>>>> .paid.sum(),orderby=db.mytable.ttid,groupby=db.mytable.ttid)
>>>>>> for row in rows:
>>> ... print 'transaction',row.ttid,'total  
>>> amount',row[db.mytable.paid.sum()]
>>
>> Or use matplotlib's support for CSV files via numpy record arrays
>>
>> import matplotlib.mlab as mlab
>> r = mlab.csv2rec('myfile.csv')
>> print r.paid.sum()
>>
>> csv2rec does type inference from the data in the file, and numpy
>> arrays support all the standard math and stat operations (mean, std,
>> logical masks, etc...)
>
> This is a combination of sqlserver2000, clarion tps files via odbc,
> mysql server, all with different fields structure that at the end need
> to show up on the excel.
>
> Wish there was an easier way of merging these sources into some csv
> based reporting tool, getting the proper totals, and output final csv
> file in under 2 weeks.
>
> Lucas
> _______________________________________________
> Chicago mailing list
> Chicago at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago


From g at rrett.us.com  Thu Oct  9 20:29:16 2008
From: g at rrett.us.com (Garrett Smith)
Date: Thu, 9 Oct 2008 13:29:16 -0500 (CDT)
Subject: [Chicago] 2 unique keys in a python dict?
In-Reply-To: <675248666.3810431223576934075.JavaMail.root@mail-3.01.com>
Message-ID: <2133476363.3810671223576956759.JavaMail.root@mail-3.01.com>

*shrug*

Was just making a wee joke.

Base Python has a CSV module and sundry data structure support -- and then there's its ability to implement algorithms!


----- "Massimo Di Pierro" <mdipierro at cs.depaul.edu> wrote:

> Can the Django ORM import CSV files and/or generate ORDER BY queries 
> 
> without additional code snippets?
> If so, could you post example?
> 
> 
> On Oct 9, 2008, at 12:17 PM, Garrett Smith wrote:
> 
> > Or just use Django.
> >
> > ----- "Massimo Di Pierro" <mdipierro at cs.depaul.edu> wrote:
> >
> >> Or....
> >>
> >> edit the header of the CSV file and call your columns
> >>
> >>     tid, paid, ttid
> >>
> >> instead of
> >>
> >>     id, paid, transaction
> >>
> >> and remove the '$' signs from there
> >>
> >> download web2py and type
> >>
> >> python web2py.py -S welcome
> >>>>> db=SQLDB()
> >>>>> db.define_table('mytable',
> >>     SQLField('tid','integer'),
> >>     SQLField('paid','double'),
> >>     SQLField('ttid','string'))
> >>
> >>>>> db.import_from_csv_file(open('yourfilename.csv'))
> >>>>> db.commit()
> >>>>>
> >> rows
> >> =
> >> db
> >> ().select
> >> (db
> >> .mytable
> >> .ttid
> >> ,db 
> >>
> .mytable.paid.sum(),orderby=db.mytable.ttid,groupby=db.mytable.ttid)
> >>>>> for row in rows:
> >> ... print 'transaction',row.ttid,'total
> >> amount',row[db.mytable.paid.sum()]
> >>
> >> On Oct 9, 2008, at 11:06 AM, Lukasz Szybalski wrote:
> >>
> >>> On Thu, Oct 9, 2008 at 10:49 AM,  <skip at pobox.com> wrote:
> >>>>
> >>>>  Lukasz> Is it possible to have multiple keys in a python
> >>>> dictionary?
> >>>>
> >>>> Certainly.  Though I don't think that's really what you intended
> to
> >>
> >>>> ask.
> >>>>
> >>>>  Lukasz> Normally its only 1 key, and I need to have 2
> >>>> dictionaries and
> >>>>  Lukasz> somehow manage the uniqueness.
> >>>>  Lukasz> me={}
> >>>>  Lukasz> me['First']='Lucas'
> >>>>  Lukasz> me['Last']='szybalski'
> >>>>
> >>>>  Lukasz> I would like to get 2 keys? Is there something similar
> to
> >>
> >>>> dict
> >>>>  Lukasz> that would have the property that 2 or more keys are
> >>>> unique?
> >>>>  Lukasz> me= ?
> >>>>
> >>>> I'm unclear what you are asking.  Do you want a list of
> >>>> dictionaries?, e.g.:
> >>>>
> >>>>  names = [
> >>>>      {
> >>>>          'First': 'Lucas',
> >>>>          'Last': 'Szybalski',
> >>>>      },
> >>>>      {
> >>>>          'First': 'Skip',
> >>>>          'Last': 'Montanaro',
> >>>>      }
> >>>>  ]
> >>>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> I have multiple records in a csv file for each userid. I need to
> >>> calculate total amount paid and last transaction.
> >>>
> >>> id,paid,transaction
> >>> 3,$10,20080101
> >>> 3,$10,20080201
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> Final Total
> >>> me={}
> >>> me[3]=($20,20080201)  (dictionary with a list)
> >>>
> >>> now
> >>> id,subid, paid,transaction
> >>> 3,1,$10,20080101
> >>> 3,2,$10,20080201
> >>>
> >>> I guess what Massimo said will work, but now I need to know which
> >> row
> >>> is the paid and which is transaction?!!
> >>> me[3,1]=(10,20080101)
> >>> me[3,2]=(10,20080201)
> >>>
> >>> I guess this could do it
> >>> me[3,1]={'paid':10 , 'transaction':20080101}
> >>>
> >>> Thanks,
> >>> Lucas
> >>> _______________________________________________
> >>> Chicago mailing list
> >>> Chicago at python.org
> >>> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
> >>
> >> _______________________________________________
> >> Chicago mailing list
> >> Chicago at python.org
> >> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
> > _______________________________________________
> > Chicago mailing list
> > Chicago at python.org
> > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Chicago mailing list
> Chicago at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago

From jbsnyder at fanplastic.org  Thu Oct  9 20:30:37 2008
From: jbsnyder at fanplastic.org (James Snyder)
Date: Thu, 9 Oct 2008 13:30:37 -0500
Subject: [Chicago] 2 unique keys in a python dict?
In-Reply-To: <5E0DBB8C-631D-4F26-A42B-FF5FCD13F1FA@cs.depaul.edu>
References: <1729087912.3781771223572670785.JavaMail.root@mail-3.01.com>
	<5E0DBB8C-631D-4F26-A42B-FF5FCD13F1FA@cs.depaul.edu>
Message-ID: <1267242F-701C-4469-9A60-5C80BF98814C@fanplastic.org>

Someone has written a script that will do that:
http://www.djangosnippets.org/snippets/788/

You'd first have to create your model and do a syncdb to set up the  
tables, but that's easy

I don't have a full code example, but ORDER BY is not hard with the  
Django ORM. Look for order_by in the query docs: http://docs.djangoproject.com/en/dev/topics/db/queries/


Also, it may not give you nice object mapping goodness, but using the  
sqlite3 and csv modules aren't too bad.  Note that going that route,  
however, will require writing the SQL queries yourself :-)

-jsnyder

On Oct 9, 2008, at 1:05 PM, Massimo Di Pierro wrote:

> Can the Django ORM import CSV files and/or generate ORDER BY queries  
> without additional code snippets?
> If so, could you post example?
>
>
> On Oct 9, 2008, at 12:17 PM, Garrett Smith wrote:
>
>> Or just use Django.
>>
>> ----- "Massimo Di Pierro" <mdipierro at cs.depaul.edu> wrote:
>>
>>> Or....
>>>
>>> edit the header of the CSV file and call your columns
>>>
>>>    tid, paid, ttid
>>>
>>> instead of
>>>
>>>    id, paid, transaction
>>>
>>> and remove the '$' signs from there
>>>
>>> download web2py and type
>>>
>>> python web2py.py -S welcome
>>>>>> db=SQLDB()
>>>>>> db.define_table('mytable',
>>>    SQLField('tid','integer'),
>>>    SQLField('paid','double'),
>>>    SQLField('ttid','string'))
>>>
>>>>>> db.import_from_csv_file(open('yourfilename.csv'))
>>>>>> db.commit()
>>>>>>
>>> rows
>>> =
>>> db
>>> ().select
>>> (db
>>> .mytable
>>> .ttid
>>> ,db 
>>> .mytable.paid.sum(),orderby=db.mytable.ttid,groupby=db.mytable.ttid)
>>>>>> for row in rows:
>>> ... print 'transaction',row.ttid,'total
>>> amount',row[db.mytable.paid.sum()]
>>>
>>> On Oct 9, 2008, at 11:06 AM, Lukasz Szybalski wrote:
>>>
>>>> On Thu, Oct 9, 2008 at 10:49 AM,  <skip at pobox.com> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> Lukasz> Is it possible to have multiple keys in a python
>>>>> dictionary?
>>>>>
>>>>> Certainly.  Though I don't think that's really what you intended  
>>>>> to
>>>
>>>>> ask.
>>>>>
>>>>> Lukasz> Normally its only 1 key, and I need to have 2
>>>>> dictionaries and
>>>>> Lukasz> somehow manage the uniqueness.
>>>>> Lukasz> me={}
>>>>> Lukasz> me['First']='Lucas'
>>>>> Lukasz> me['Last']='szybalski'
>>>>>
>>>>> Lukasz> I would like to get 2 keys? Is there something similar to
>>>
>>>>> dict
>>>>> Lukasz> that would have the property that 2 or more keys are
>>>>> unique?
>>>>> Lukasz> me= ?
>>>>>
>>>>> I'm unclear what you are asking.  Do you want a list of
>>>>> dictionaries?, e.g.:
>>>>>
>>>>> names = [
>>>>>     {
>>>>>         'First': 'Lucas',
>>>>>         'Last': 'Szybalski',
>>>>>     },
>>>>>     {
>>>>>         'First': 'Skip',
>>>>>         'Last': 'Montanaro',
>>>>>     }
>>>>> ]
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> I have multiple records in a csv file for each userid. I need to
>>>> calculate total amount paid and last transaction.
>>>>
>>>> id,paid,transaction
>>>> 3,$10,20080101
>>>> 3,$10,20080201
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Final Total
>>>> me={}
>>>> me[3]=($20,20080201)  (dictionary with a list)
>>>>
>>>> now
>>>> id,subid, paid,transaction
>>>> 3,1,$10,20080101
>>>> 3,2,$10,20080201
>>>>
>>>> I guess what Massimo said will work, but now I need to know which
>>> row
>>>> is the paid and which is transaction?!!
>>>> me[3,1]=(10,20080101)
>>>> me[3,2]=(10,20080201)
>>>>
>>>> I guess this could do it
>>>> me[3,1]={'paid':10 , 'transaction':20080101}
>>>>
>>>> Thanks,
>>>> Lucas
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> Chicago mailing list
>>>> Chicago at python.org
>>>> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Chicago mailing list
>>> Chicago at python.org
>>> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>> _______________________________________________
>> Chicago mailing list
>> Chicago at python.org
>> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>
> _______________________________________________
> Chicago mailing list
> Chicago at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago

--
James Snyder
Biomedical Engineering
Northwestern University
jbsnyder at fanplastic.org
http://fanplastic.org/key.txt
ph: (847) 644-2322

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From mdipierro at cs.depaul.edu  Thu Oct  9 20:38:14 2008
From: mdipierro at cs.depaul.edu (Massimo Di Pierro)
Date: Thu, 9 Oct 2008 13:38:14 -0500
Subject: [Chicago] 2 unique keys in a python dict?
In-Reply-To: <1267242F-701C-4469-9A60-5C80BF98814C@fanplastic.org>
References: <1729087912.3781771223572670785.JavaMail.root@mail-3.01.com>
	<5E0DBB8C-631D-4F26-A42B-FF5FCD13F1FA@cs.depaul.edu>
	<1267242F-701C-4469-9A60-5C80BF98814C@fanplastic.org>
Message-ID: <75830FC3-FD0D-4F3D-A850-AC419AC1572C@cs.depaul.edu>

oops, I meant GROUP BY, not ORDER BY. I could not find any reference  
to GROUP BY in the Django docs.

Massimo

On Oct 9, 2008, at 1:30 PM, James Snyder wrote:

> Someone has written a script that will do that:
> http://www.djangosnippets.org/snippets/788/
>
> You'd first have to create your model and do a syncdb to set up the  
> tables, but that's easy
>
> I don't have a full code example, but ORDER BY is not hard with the  
> Django ORM. Look for order_by in the query docs: http://docs.djangoproject.com/en/dev/topics/db/queries/
>
>
> Also, it may not give you nice object mapping goodness, but using  
> the sqlite3 and csv modules aren't too bad.  Note that going that  
> route, however, will require writing the SQL queries yourself :-)
>
> -jsnyder
>
> On Oct 9, 2008, at 1:05 PM, Massimo Di Pierro wrote:
>
>> Can the Django ORM import CSV files and/or generate ORDER BY  
>> queries without additional code snippets?
>> If so, could you post example?
>>
>>
>> On Oct 9, 2008, at 12:17 PM, Garrett Smith wrote:
>>
>>> Or just use Django.
>>>
>>> ----- "Massimo Di Pierro" <mdipierro at cs.depaul.edu> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Or....
>>>>
>>>> edit the header of the CSV file and call your columns
>>>>
>>>>    tid, paid, ttid
>>>>
>>>> instead of
>>>>
>>>>    id, paid, transaction
>>>>
>>>> and remove the '$' signs from there
>>>>
>>>> download web2py and type
>>>>
>>>> python web2py.py -S welcome
>>>>>>> db=SQLDB()
>>>>>>> db.define_table('mytable',
>>>>    SQLField('tid','integer'),
>>>>    SQLField('paid','double'),
>>>>    SQLField('ttid','string'))
>>>>
>>>>>>> db.import_from_csv_file(open('yourfilename.csv'))
>>>>>>> db.commit()
>>>>>>>
>>>> rows
>>>> =
>>>> db
>>>> ().select
>>>> (db
>>>> .mytable
>>>> .ttid
>>>> ,db 
>>>> .mytable 
>>>> .paid.sum(),orderby=db.mytable.ttid,groupby=db.mytable.ttid)
>>>>>>> for row in rows:
>>>> ... print 'transaction',row.ttid,'total
>>>> amount',row[db.mytable.paid.sum()]
>>>>
>>>> On Oct 9, 2008, at 11:06 AM, Lukasz Szybalski wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> On Thu, Oct 9, 2008 at 10:49 AM,  <skip at pobox.com> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Lukasz> Is it possible to have multiple keys in a python
>>>>>> dictionary?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Certainly.  Though I don't think that's really what you  
>>>>>> intended to
>>>>
>>>>>> ask.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Lukasz> Normally its only 1 key, and I need to have 2
>>>>>> dictionaries and
>>>>>> Lukasz> somehow manage the uniqueness.
>>>>>> Lukasz> me={}
>>>>>> Lukasz> me['First']='Lucas'
>>>>>> Lukasz> me['Last']='szybalski'
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Lukasz> I would like to get 2 keys? Is there something similar to
>>>>
>>>>>> dict
>>>>>> Lukasz> that would have the property that 2 or more keys are
>>>>>> unique?
>>>>>> Lukasz> me= ?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I'm unclear what you are asking.  Do you want a list of
>>>>>> dictionaries?, e.g.:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> names = [
>>>>>>     {
>>>>>>         'First': 'Lucas',
>>>>>>         'Last': 'Szybalski',
>>>>>>     },
>>>>>>     {
>>>>>>         'First': 'Skip',
>>>>>>         'Last': 'Montanaro',
>>>>>>     }
>>>>>> ]
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> I have multiple records in a csv file for each userid. I need to
>>>>> calculate total amount paid and last transaction.
>>>>>
>>>>> id,paid,transaction
>>>>> 3,$10,20080101
>>>>> 3,$10,20080201
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Final Total
>>>>> me={}
>>>>> me[3]=($20,20080201)  (dictionary with a list)
>>>>>
>>>>> now
>>>>> id,subid, paid,transaction
>>>>> 3,1,$10,20080101
>>>>> 3,2,$10,20080201
>>>>>
>>>>> I guess what Massimo said will work, but now I need to know which
>>>> row
>>>>> is the paid and which is transaction?!!
>>>>> me[3,1]=(10,20080101)
>>>>> me[3,2]=(10,20080201)
>>>>>
>>>>> I guess this could do it
>>>>> me[3,1]={'paid':10 , 'transaction':20080101}
>>>>>
>>>>> Thanks,
>>>>> Lucas
>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>> Chicago mailing list
>>>>> Chicago at python.org
>>>>> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>>>>
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> Chicago mailing list
>>>> Chicago at python.org
>>>> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Chicago mailing list
>>> Chicago at python.org
>>> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Chicago mailing list
>> Chicago at python.org
>> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>
> --
> James Snyder
> Biomedical Engineering
> Northwestern University
> jbsnyder at fanplastic.org
> http://fanplastic.org/key.txt
> ph: (847) 644-2322
>
> <PGP.sig><ATT00001.txt>

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From mdipierro at cs.depaul.edu  Thu Oct  9 20:45:36 2008
From: mdipierro at cs.depaul.edu (Massimo Di Pierro)
Date: Thu, 9 Oct 2008 13:45:36 -0500
Subject: [Chicago] 2 unique keys in a python dict?
In-Reply-To: <1267242F-701C-4469-9A60-5C80BF98814C@fanplastic.org>
References: <1729087912.3781771223572670785.JavaMail.root@mail-3.01.com>
	<5E0DBB8C-631D-4F26-A42B-FF5FCD13F1FA@cs.depaul.edu>
	<1267242F-701C-4469-9A60-5C80BF98814C@fanplastic.org>
Message-ID: <98639B3E-2A44-4575-827A-07D97D691E8A@cs.depaul.edu>

In a more concise terms. Say I have a table "mytable" with a column a  
(double) and b (string) and want to read data in from a csv file,  
group by b, add all a's for the same b and write the result back in  
CSV. In web2py I do (complete code):

db.define_table('mytable,SQLField('a','double'),SQLField('b'))
db.mytable.import_from_csv_file(open('filename.csv'))
print  
str 
(db 
().select 
(db 
.mytable 
.a.sum(),db.mytable.b,orderby=db.mytable.b,groupby=db.mytable.b))

How do I do it in Django?


Massimo

On Oct 9, 2008, at 1:30 PM, James Snyder wrote:

> Someone has written a script that will do that:
> http://www.djangosnippets.org/snippets/788/
>
> You'd first have to create your model and do a syncdb to set up the  
> tables, but that's easy
>
> I don't have a full code example, but ORDER BY is not hard with the  
> Django ORM. Look for order_by in the query docs: http://docs.djangoproject.com/en/dev/topics/db/queries/
>
>
> Also, it may not give you nice object mapping goodness, but using  
> the sqlite3 and csv modules aren't too bad.  Note that going that  
> route, however, will require writing the SQL queries yourself :-)
>
> -jsnyder
>
> On Oct 9, 2008, at 1:05 PM, Massimo Di Pierro wrote:
>
>> Can the Django ORM import CSV files and/or generate ORDER BY  
>> queries without additional code snippets?
>> If so, could you post example?
>>
>>
>> On Oct 9, 2008, at 12:17 PM, Garrett Smith wrote:
>>
>>> Or just use Django.
>>>
>>> ----- "Massimo Di Pierro" <mdipierro at cs.depaul.edu> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Or....
>>>>
>>>> edit the header of the CSV file and call your columns
>>>>
>>>>    tid, paid, ttid
>>>>
>>>> instead of
>>>>
>>>>    id, paid, transaction
>>>>
>>>> and remove the '$' signs from there
>>>>
>>>> download web2py and type
>>>>
>>>> python web2py.py -S welcome
>>>>>>> db=SQLDB()
>>>>>>> db.define_table('mytable',
>>>>    SQLField('tid','integer'),
>>>>    SQLField('paid','double'),
>>>>    SQLField('ttid','string'))
>>>>
>>>>>>> db.import_from_csv_file(open('yourfilename.csv'))
>>>>>>> db.commit()
>>>>>>>
>>>> rows
>>>> =
>>>> db
>>>> ().select
>>>> (db
>>>> .mytable
>>>> .ttid
>>>> ,db 
>>>> .mytable 
>>>> .paid.sum(),orderby=db.mytable.ttid,groupby=db.mytable.ttid)
>>>>>>> for row in rows:
>>>> ... print 'transaction',row.ttid,'total
>>>> amount',row[db.mytable.paid.sum()]
>>>>
>>>> On Oct 9, 2008, at 11:06 AM, Lukasz Szybalski wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> On Thu, Oct 9, 2008 at 10:49 AM,  <skip at pobox.com> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Lukasz> Is it possible to have multiple keys in a python
>>>>>> dictionary?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Certainly.  Though I don't think that's really what you  
>>>>>> intended to
>>>>
>>>>>> ask.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Lukasz> Normally its only 1 key, and I need to have 2
>>>>>> dictionaries and
>>>>>> Lukasz> somehow manage the uniqueness.
>>>>>> Lukasz> me={}
>>>>>> Lukasz> me['First']='Lucas'
>>>>>> Lukasz> me['Last']='szybalski'
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Lukasz> I would like to get 2 keys? Is there something similar to
>>>>
>>>>>> dict
>>>>>> Lukasz> that would have the property that 2 or more keys are
>>>>>> unique?
>>>>>> Lukasz> me= ?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I'm unclear what you are asking.  Do you want a list of
>>>>>> dictionaries?, e.g.:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> names = [
>>>>>>     {
>>>>>>         'First': 'Lucas',
>>>>>>         'Last': 'Szybalski',
>>>>>>     },
>>>>>>     {
>>>>>>         'First': 'Skip',
>>>>>>         'Last': 'Montanaro',
>>>>>>     }
>>>>>> ]
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> I have multiple records in a csv file for each userid. I need to
>>>>> calculate total amount paid and last transaction.
>>>>>
>>>>> id,paid,transaction
>>>>> 3,$10,20080101
>>>>> 3,$10,20080201
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Final Total
>>>>> me={}
>>>>> me[3]=($20,20080201)  (dictionary with a list)
>>>>>
>>>>> now
>>>>> id,subid, paid,transaction
>>>>> 3,1,$10,20080101
>>>>> 3,2,$10,20080201
>>>>>
>>>>> I guess what Massimo said will work, but now I need to know which
>>>> row
>>>>> is the paid and which is transaction?!!
>>>>> me[3,1]=(10,20080101)
>>>>> me[3,2]=(10,20080201)
>>>>>
>>>>> I guess this could do it
>>>>> me[3,1]={'paid':10 , 'transaction':20080101}
>>>>>
>>>>> Thanks,
>>>>> Lucas
>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>> Chicago mailing list
>>>>> Chicago at python.org
>>>>> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>>>>
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> Chicago mailing list
>>>> Chicago at python.org
>>>> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Chicago mailing list
>>> Chicago at python.org
>>> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Chicago mailing list
>> Chicago at python.org
>> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>
> --
> James Snyder
> Biomedical Engineering
> Northwestern University
> jbsnyder at fanplastic.org
> http://fanplastic.org/key.txt
> ph: (847) 644-2322
>
> <PGP.sig><ATT00001.txt>

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From carl at personnelware.com  Thu Oct  9 21:21:05 2008
From: carl at personnelware.com (Carl Karsten)
Date: Thu, 09 Oct 2008 14:21:05 -0500
Subject: [Chicago] food-n-beer
Message-ID: <48EE59A1.2090109@personnelware.com>

Anyone want to meet for food before the meeting?

Harper, can I bring the icechest of beer?

I am driving in from Niles - anyone need a ride?

Carl K

From szybalski at gmail.com  Thu Oct  9 21:24:41 2008
From: szybalski at gmail.com (Lukasz Szybalski)
Date: Thu, 9 Oct 2008 14:24:41 -0500
Subject: [Chicago] 2 unique keys in a python dict?
In-Reply-To: <98639B3E-2A44-4575-827A-07D97D691E8A@cs.depaul.edu>
References: <1729087912.3781771223572670785.JavaMail.root@mail-3.01.com>
	<5E0DBB8C-631D-4F26-A42B-FF5FCD13F1FA@cs.depaul.edu>
	<1267242F-701C-4469-9A60-5C80BF98814C@fanplastic.org>
	<98639B3E-2A44-4575-827A-07D97D691E8A@cs.depaul.edu>
Message-ID: <804e5c70810091224m3888d94dx65317a42fccf0365@mail.gmail.com>

On Thu, Oct 9, 2008 at 1:45 PM, Massimo Di Pierro
<mdipierro at cs.depaul.edu> wrote:
> In a more concise terms. Say I have a table "mytable" with a column a
> (double) and b (string) and want to read data in from a csv file, group by
> b, add all a's for the same b and write the result back in CSV. In web2py I
> do (complete code):
> db.define_table('mytable,SQLField('a','double'),SQLField('b'))
> db.mytable.import_from_csv_file(open('filename.csv'))
> print
> str(db().select(db.mytable.a.sum(),db.mytable.b,orderby=db.mytable.b,groupby=db.mytable.b))
> How do I do it in Django?
>
> Massimo
> On Oct 9, 2008, at 1:30 PM, James Snyder wrote:
>
> Someone has written a script that will do that:
> http://www.djangosnippets.org/snippets/788/
> You'd first have to create your model and do a syncdb to set up the tables,
> but that's easy
> I don't have a full code example, but ORDER BY is not hard with the Django
> ORM. Look for order_by in the query
> docs: http://docs.djangoproject.com/en/dev/topics/db/queries/
>
> Also, it may not give you nice object mapping goodness, but using the
> sqlite3 and csv modules aren't too bad.  Note that going that route,
> however, will require writing the SQL queries yourself :-)
> -jsnyder
> On Oct 9, 2008, at 1:05 PM, Massimo Di Pierro wrote:
>
> Can the Django ORM import CSV files and/or generate ORDER BY queries without
> additional code snippets?
> If so, could you post example?


I use sqlalchemy to read from sqlserver2000, and mysql.

I use csv module with a DictReader so I get a dictonary. Based on that
you I loop csv records and use sqlalchemy to get more information. If
you want you can create any table you want...which supports sqlite,
memory , mysql, m$sql, postgre, oracle,... but for this purpose its a
1 in 5 years report.

order by, group by etc is supported, as well as session, transaction,
autocommit....

One of the sql query looks like:
allrecords=session.query(Records).filter(sqlalchemy.and_(Records.CASE_NO==(CASE_NUMBER),Records.TYPE!='I').order_by(Records.CLAIM_NO).all()

Can't get easier than that.....put this in a loop, and for any record
you can get the information you want from database....

sqlalchemy and cvs module works for me.
Lucas

From cstejerean at gmail.com  Thu Oct  9 21:41:54 2008
From: cstejerean at gmail.com (Cosmin Stejerean)
Date: Thu, 9 Oct 2008 14:41:54 -0500
Subject: [Chicago] food-n-beer
In-Reply-To: <48EE59A1.2090109@personnelware.com>
References: <48EE59A1.2090109@personnelware.com>
Message-ID: <276266d0810091241l4d1b12edk8731920a74d493b3@mail.gmail.com>

I'd like to grab food before the meeting, just let me know where.

On Thu, Oct 9, 2008 at 2:21 PM, Carl Karsten <carl at personnelware.com> wrote:
> Anyone want to meet for food before the meeting?
>
> Harper, can I bring the icechest of beer?
>
> I am driving in from Niles - anyone need a ride?
>
> Carl K
> _______________________________________________
> Chicago mailing list
> Chicago at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>



-- 
Cosmin Stejerean
http://www.offbytwo.com

From jdh2358 at gmail.com  Thu Oct  9 21:44:45 2008
From: jdh2358 at gmail.com (John Hunter)
Date: Thu, 9 Oct 2008 14:44:45 -0500
Subject: [Chicago] 2 unique keys in a python dict?
In-Reply-To: <B6C51295-97FF-416C-AB75-23A91B0CE5C6@cs.depaul.edu>
References: <804e5c70810090840t1a7fffe2hd1f07bc8c762515a@mail.gmail.com>
	<18670.10272.860766.169538@montanaro-dyndns-org.local>
	<804e5c70810090906m3008a1e0p6c5677b4545e4b77@mail.gmail.com>
	<77E4354C-38EF-4A7E-A74E-73A7A5FC4A7C@cs.depaul.edu>
	<88e473830810090953m78ee4ab9of92b770aa9e7b633@mail.gmail.com>
	<B6C51295-97FF-416C-AB75-23A91B0CE5C6@cs.depaul.edu>
Message-ID: <88e473830810091244h70743534lac9baa8cb89d7f7b@mail.gmail.com>

On Thu, Oct 9, 2008 at 1:02 PM, Massimo Di Pierro
<mdipierro at cs.depaul.edu> wrote:
> Not quite the same. I believe Lukasz is not looking into adding up the
> column. He is looking into grouping records by transaction id and than
> summing up records within the same transaction.

I see, if you want to group by id

  import matplotlib.mlab as mlab
  r = mlab.csv2rec('myfile.csv')
  stats = ( ('paid', np.sum, 'paidsum')
  key = ('id', )
  rgroup = mlab.rec_groupby(r, key, stats)
  print rgroup.paidsum

The stats variable is a sequence of (inputname, groupby_function, outputname)

From maney at two14.net  Thu Oct  9 22:59:45 2008
From: maney at two14.net (Martin Maney)
Date: Thu, 9 Oct 2008 15:59:45 -0500
Subject: [Chicago] 2 unique keys in a python dict?
In-Reply-To: <98639B3E-2A44-4575-827A-07D97D691E8A@cs.depaul.edu>
References: <1729087912.3781771223572670785.JavaMail.root@mail-3.01.com>
	<5E0DBB8C-631D-4F26-A42B-FF5FCD13F1FA@cs.depaul.edu>
	<1267242F-701C-4469-9A60-5C80BF98814C@fanplastic.org>
	<98639B3E-2A44-4575-827A-07D97D691E8A@cs.depaul.edu>
Message-ID: <20081009205945.GA15194@furrr.two14.net>

On Thu, Oct 09, 2008 at 01:45:36PM -0500, Massimo Di Pierro wrote:
> In a more concise terms. Say I have a table "mytable" with a column a  
> (double) and b (string) and want to read data in from a csv file, group 
> by b, add all a's for the same b and write the result back in CSV. In 
> web2py I do (complete code):

I guess that's your hammer - this only made me wonder why anyone would
use a web framework and a database for that problem.  Or what if
anything it means that this is so nearly builtin to one.

-- 
Some kinds of waste really are disgusting. SUVs, for example,
would arguably be gross even if they ran on a fuel which would
never run out and generated no pollution. SUVs are gross because
they're the solution to a gross problem. (How to make minivans
look more masculine.)  -- Paul Graham


From maney at two14.net  Thu Oct  9 23:01:29 2008
From: maney at two14.net (Martin Maney)
Date: Thu, 9 Oct 2008 16:01:29 -0500
Subject: [Chicago] food-n-beer
In-Reply-To: <276266d0810091241l4d1b12edk8731920a74d493b3@mail.gmail.com>
References: <48EE59A1.2090109@personnelware.com>
	<276266d0810091241l4d1b12edk8731920a74d493b3@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <20081009210129.GB15194@furrr.two14.net>

On Thu, Oct 09, 2008 at 02:41:54PM -0500, Cosmin Stejerean wrote:
> I'd like to grab food before the meeting, just let me know where.

Cafe 28, an apparently meatless place, seems to be the IRC favorite so
far.

/me feels that if there's no meat, there had better be lots of good
curry.  just sayin'

-- 
Obscurity is a far great threat to authors and creative artists
than piracy.  -- Tim O'Reilly


From rcriii at ramsdells.net  Thu Oct  9 22:06:37 2008
From: rcriii at ramsdells.net (rcriii at ramsdells.net)
Date: Thu, 9 Oct 2008 16:06:37 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: [Chicago] 2 unique keys in a python dict?
In-Reply-To: <804e5c70810090906m3008a1e0p6c5677b4545e4b77@mail.gmail.com>
References: <804e5c70810090840t1a7fffe2hd1f07bc8c762515a@mail.gmail.com>
	<18670.10272.860766.169538@montanaro-dyndns-org.local>
	<804e5c70810090906m3008a1e0p6c5677b4545e4b77@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <33435.12.158.28.4.1223582797.squirrel@mail.npsis.com>

Can I try?  If you have a csv file as below, the csv module will return an
iterable where each item is a list representing the line of data.  So if
you have a csv file that looks like this:

id,subid, paid,transaction
3,1,$10,20080101
3,2,$10,20080201
4,1,$20,20080922
42,1,$24,20080923

>>> import csv
>>> f = open('somedata.csv','r')
>>> r = csv.reader(f)
>>> data = [x for x in r]
>>> data
[['id', 'subid', ' paid', 'transaction'], ['3', '1', '$10', '20080101'],
['3', '2', '$10', '20080201'], ['4', '1', '$20', '20080922'], ['42', '1',
'$24', '20080923']]
>>> sum([int(x[2][1:]) for x in data if x[0]=='3'])
20
>>> max([int(x[3]) for x in data if x[0]=='3'])
20080201

Robert

>
>
> I have multiple records in a csv file for each userid. I need to
> calculate total amount paid and last transaction.
>
> id,paid,transaction
> 3,$10,20080101
> 3,$10,20080201
>
>
> Final Total
> me={}
> me[3]=($20,20080201)  (dictionary with a list)
>
> now
> id,subid, paid,transaction
> 3,1,$10,20080101
> 3,2,$10,20080201
>
> I guess what Massimo said will work, but now I need to know which row
> is the paid and which is transaction?!!
> me[3,1]=(10,20080101)
> me[3,2]=(10,20080201)
>
> I guess this could do it
> me[3,1]={'paid':10 , 'transaction':20080101}
>
> Thanks,
> Lucas
> _______________________________________________
> Chicago mailing list
> Chicago at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>



From jordan at widefido.com  Thu Oct  9 22:48:00 2008
From: jordan at widefido.com (Jordan Sherer)
Date: Thu, 9 Oct 2008 15:48:00 -0500
Subject: [Chicago] food-n-beer
In-Reply-To: <276266d0810091241l4d1b12edk8731920a74d493b3@mail.gmail.com>
References: <48EE59A1.2090109@personnelware.com>
	<276266d0810091241l4d1b12edk8731920a74d493b3@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <C8ECE936-607D-43A8-97CC-5145BE42D0F8@widefido.com>

Anybody decide on a place to eat?


On Oct 9, 2008, at Oct 9   2:41 PM, Cosmin Stejerean wrote:

> I'd like to grab food before the meeting, just let me know where.
>
> On Thu, Oct 9, 2008 at 2:21 PM, Carl Karsten  
> <carl at personnelware.com> wrote:
>> Anyone want to meet for food before the meeting?
>>
>> Harper, can I bring the icechest of beer?
>>
>> I am driving in from Niles - anyone need a ride?
>>
>> Carl K
>> _______________________________________________
>> Chicago mailing list
>> Chicago at python.org
>> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>>
>
>
>
> -- 
> Cosmin Stejerean
> http://www.offbytwo.com
> _______________________________________________
> Chicago mailing list
> Chicago at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago


From hsu.feihong at yahoo.com  Thu Oct  9 23:14:05 2008
From: hsu.feihong at yahoo.com (Feihong Hsu)
Date: Thu, 9 Oct 2008 14:14:05 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Chicago] food-n-beer
In-Reply-To: <20081009210129.GB15194@furrr.two14.net>
Message-ID: <176326.72533.qm@web34808.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

Cafe 28 is a Cuban/Mexican restaurant at:

1800 W Irving Park Road 
 
			
			(at Ravenswood Ave)

			Chicago,
				IL
				60613
			
		

I doubt there's much curry there, but there will be plenty of meat.


--- On Thu, 10/9/08, Martin Maney <maney at two14.net> wrote:
From: Martin Maney <maney at two14.net>
Subject: Re: [Chicago] food-n-beer
To: "The Chicago Python Users Group" <chicago at python.org>
Date: Thursday, October 9, 2008, 4:01 PM

On Thu, Oct 09, 2008 at 02:41:54PM -0500, Cosmin Stejerean wrote:
> I'd like to grab food before the meeting, just let me know where.

Cafe 28, an apparently meatless place, seems to be the IRC favorite so
far.

/me feels that if there's no meat, there had better be lots of good
curry.  just sayin'

-- 
Obscurity is a far great threat to authors and creative artists
than piracy.  -- Tim O'Reilly

_______________________________________________
Chicago mailing list
Chicago at python.org
http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago



      
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From mdipierro at cs.depaul.edu  Thu Oct  9 23:16:00 2008
From: mdipierro at cs.depaul.edu (Massimo Di Pierro)
Date: Thu, 9 Oct 2008 16:16:00 -0500
Subject: [Chicago] 2 unique keys in a python dict?
In-Reply-To: <20081009205945.GA15194@furrr.two14.net>
References: <1729087912.3781771223572670785.JavaMail.root@mail-3.01.com>
	<5E0DBB8C-631D-4F26-A42B-FF5FCD13F1FA@cs.depaul.edu>
	<1267242F-701C-4469-9A60-5C80BF98814C@fanplastic.org>
	<98639B3E-2A44-4575-827A-07D97D691E8A@cs.depaul.edu>
	<20081009205945.GA15194@furrr.two14.net>
Message-ID: <0A5A2381-2068-42DD-A9CC-67BCCD9DCAB6@cs.depaul.edu>

I am not suggesting using a web framework. I suggested using a DB +  
python based database abstraction layer (I do my examples in web2py  
because that is what I know best).

Lukasz said that, in fact, he is using SQLAlchemy.

Since Garrett mentioned Django (I did not) and I am not aware of how  
to use GROUP BY in Django, the conversation sidetracked.

My question still stands. How would I do a GROUP BY and a SUM of the  
grouped records in using Django without multiple queries?

I would honestly like to learn that.

Do you know?

Massimo

On Oct 9, 2008, at 3:59 PM, Martin Maney wrote:

> On Thu, Oct 09, 2008 at 01:45:36PM -0500, Massimo Di Pierro wrote:
>> In a more concise terms. Say I have a table "mytable" with a column a
>> (double) and b (string) and want to read data in from a csv file,  
>> group
>> by b, add all a's for the same b and write the result back in CSV. In
>> web2py I do (complete code):
>
> I guess that's your hammer - this only made me wonder why anyone would
> use a web framework and a database for that problem.  Or what if
> anything it means that this is so nearly builtin to one.
>
> --
> Some kinds of waste really are disgusting. SUVs, for example,
> would arguably be gross even if they ran on a fuel which would
> never run out and generated no pollution. SUVs are gross because
> they're the solution to a gross problem. (How to make minivans
> look more masculine.)  -- Paul Graham
>
> _______________________________________________
> Chicago mailing list
> Chicago at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago


From ssexton at nectarlab.com  Thu Oct  9 23:40:52 2008
From: ssexton at nectarlab.com (Scott Sexton)
Date: Thu, 9 Oct 2008 16:40:52 -0500
Subject: [Chicago] food-n-beer
In-Reply-To: <20081009210129.GB15194@furrr.two14.net>
References: <48EE59A1.2090109@personnelware.com>
	<276266d0810091241l4d1b12edk8731920a74d493b3@mail.gmail.com>
	<20081009210129.GB15194@furrr.two14.net>
Message-ID: <43299c0d0810091440t7dbe35bdld6ad941e920e01e1@mail.gmail.com>

There's plenty of meat at Cafe 28, but only one vegetarian option: Vegetable
Comal. It's really good though, and as a vegetarian myself, I would still
highly recommend it.

~Scott

On Thu, Oct 9, 2008 at 4:01 PM, Martin Maney <maney at two14.net> wrote:

> On Thu, Oct 09, 2008 at 02:41:54PM -0500, Cosmin Stejerean wrote:
> > I'd like to grab food before the meeting, just let me know where.
>
> Cafe 28, an apparently meatless place, seems to be the IRC favorite so
> far.
>
> /me feels that if there's no meat, there had better be lots of good
> curry.  just sayin'
>
> --
> Obscurity is a far great threat to authors and creative artists
> than piracy.  -- Tim O'Reilly
>
> _______________________________________________
> Chicago mailing list
> Chicago at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>
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From carl at fiftyfive.com  Thu Oct  9 22:50:14 2008
From: carl at fiftyfive.com (Carl Karsten)
Date: Thu, 9 Oct 2008 15:50:14 -0500 (CDT)
Subject: [Chicago] food-n-beer
In-Reply-To: <276266d0810091241l4d1b12edk8731920a74d493b3@mail.gmail.com>
References: <48EE59A1.2090109@personnelware.com>
	<276266d0810091241l4d1b12edk8731920a74d493b3@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <Pine.LNX.4.64.0810091546530.31399@road.fiftyfive.com>


v.close to meeting:

Cafe 28
1800 W Irving Park Road
(at Ravenswood Ave)
Chicago, IL 60613
(773) 528-2883
www.cafe28.org

     * Nearest Transit:
       Irving Park (Brown)

http://www.yelp.com/biz/cafe-28-chicago#hrid:5ZhiADkd9EB-D8SuBVFPXQ/query:beer

  "I dont do meat but some of their appetizers and sides do the 
trick for me. The tamales and the spinach and mushroom quesadillas are so 
yummy."

I can swing by the Ravenswood meta - incoming trans are  5:13   5:53

which time should I hit?

Carl K



On Thu, 9 Oct 2008, Cosmin Stejerean wrote:

> I'd like to grab food before the meeting, just let me know where.
>
> On Thu, Oct 9, 2008 at 2:21 PM, Carl Karsten <carl at personnelware.com> wrote:
>> Anyone want to meet for food before the meeting?
>>
>> Harper, can I bring the icechest of beer?
>>
>> I am driving in from Niles - anyone need a ride?
>>
>> Carl K
>> _______________________________________________
>> Chicago mailing list
>> Chicago at python.org
>> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>>
>
>
>
> -- 
> Cosmin Stejerean
> http://www.offbytwo.com
> _______________________________________________
> Chicago mailing list
> Chicago at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>
>

From grafumbly at nectarlab.com  Thu Oct  9 23:11:01 2008
From: grafumbly at nectarlab.com (Scott Sexton)
Date: Thu, 9 Oct 2008 16:11:01 -0500
Subject: [Chicago] food-n-beer
In-Reply-To: <20081009210129.GB15194@furrr.two14.net>
References: <48EE59A1.2090109@personnelware.com>
	<276266d0810091241l4d1b12edk8731920a74d493b3@mail.gmail.com>
	<20081009210129.GB15194@furrr.two14.net>
Message-ID: <43299c0d0810091411v6e06952bmf61b5f6c6c52574f@mail.gmail.com>

Cafe 28? The Cuban-Mexican restaurant on Irving Park? That's not meatless.
In fact, there's only one meatless dish: the Vegetable Comal. It's delicious
though, and as a vegetarian myself, I recommend it just for that.

http://chicago.metromix.com/restaurants/cuban/cafe-28-chicago/136207/content

~Scott

On Thu, Oct 9, 2008 at 4:01 PM, Martin Maney <maney at two14.net> wrote:

> On Thu, Oct 09, 2008 at 02:41:54PM -0500, Cosmin Stejerean wrote:
> > I'd like to grab food before the meeting, just let me know where.
>
> Cafe 28, an apparently meatless place, seems to be the IRC favorite so
> far.
>
> /me feels that if there's no meat, there had better be lots of good
> curry.  just sayin'
>
> --
> Obscurity is a far great threat to authors and creative artists
> than piracy.  -- Tim O'Reilly
>
> _______________________________________________
> Chicago mailing list
> Chicago at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>
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From maney at two14.net  Fri Oct 10 02:10:17 2008
From: maney at two14.net (Martin Maney)
Date: Thu, 9 Oct 2008 19:10:17 -0500
Subject: [Chicago] 2 unique keys in a python dict?
In-Reply-To: <0A5A2381-2068-42DD-A9CC-67BCCD9DCAB6@cs.depaul.edu>
References: <1729087912.3781771223572670785.JavaMail.root@mail-3.01.com>
	<5E0DBB8C-631D-4F26-A42B-FF5FCD13F1FA@cs.depaul.edu>
	<1267242F-701C-4469-9A60-5C80BF98814C@fanplastic.org>
	<98639B3E-2A44-4575-827A-07D97D691E8A@cs.depaul.edu>
	<20081009205945.GA15194@furrr.two14.net>
	<0A5A2381-2068-42DD-A9CC-67BCCD9DCAB6@cs.depaul.edu>
Message-ID: <20081010001017.GD15194@furrr.two14.net>

On Thu, Oct 09, 2008 at 04:16:00PM -0500, Massimo Di Pierro wrote:
> I am not suggesting using a web framework. I suggested using a DB +  
> python based database abstraction layer (I do my examples in web2py  
> because that is what I know best).
>
> Lukasz said that, in fact, he is using SQLAlchemy.

As we will see, I think either is silly overuse of complex tools for a
trivial job.  Unless the sheer size of the (unsorted) input to be
processed is huge, which I don't recall.

> Since Garrett mentioned Django (I did not) and I am not aware of how to 
> use GROUP BY in Django, the conversation sidetracked.

Oh, is that how it went?  I came across this thread after it was mostly
done, I guess, and only vaguely remember what I took to be a very
tongue in cheek mention of Django - you know, the obligatory "...or you
could use <hot thing that's got all the buzz>" mention.

> My question still stands. How would I do a GROUP BY and a SUM of the  
> grouped records in using Django without multiple queries?
>
> I would honestly like to learn that.
>
> Do you know?

I have to peel this onion in stages.

First layer: for the problem as originally stated, I'd use the CSV
library and some IMO trivial Python code (it's possible it's not quite
as simple as I imagine - from something more recent I'm not sure we've
actually got the full picture of what needs to be done in the end).

Second layer: if I were required to solve that problem using Django,
I'd import csv and proceed as above after whatever minimal Djangoness
requirement had been satisfied.

Third layer: if I had to solve the variant you seem to be asking for
above - assuming the raw records were already in a table by whatever
means - I, personally, would write a single SQL query, as this is
pretty trivial (well, after all, subtotals on a field are surely among
the common business tasks the designers of SQL had in mind).  This
exposes my bias as someone who had taken the time to learn a bit about
SQL, and more so about the relational model, years before Django came on
the scene.

Fourth layer: if you hold my feet to the fire to Do It All In Django,
No SQL Please, no problem.  Just fetch all the rows, sorted by id, and
iterate over them tossing off subtotals when the id column changes,
viz., reinvent what the simple SQL statement would be doing with much
greater data transfer requirements and reduced efficiency. (it was at
this point that the urge to override the random .sig quite became
irresistable)

There ought to be quite a bit of onion left at his point, but I'm not
sure what those layers would be.  Maybe implement the subtotal summing
in postscript and produce the report by sending the sorted data to the
print queue?  Hope it doesn't catch on fire...

-- 
This is like making a car shorter by cutting off a few inches
from each end with a Sawzall.  Of course there's little benefit,
because that's a dumb way to do it.  -- Neil R. Ormos


From maney at two14.net  Fri Oct 10 02:19:22 2008
From: maney at two14.net (Martin Maney)
Date: Thu, 9 Oct 2008 19:19:22 -0500
Subject: [Chicago] food-n-beer
In-Reply-To: <43299c0d0810091411v6e06952bmf61b5f6c6c52574f@mail.gmail.com>
References: <48EE59A1.2090109@personnelware.com>
	<276266d0810091241l4d1b12edk8731920a74d493b3@mail.gmail.com>
	<20081009210129.GB15194@furrr.two14.net>
	<43299c0d0810091411v6e06952bmf61b5f6c6c52574f@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <20081010001922.GE15194@furrr.two14.net>

On Thu, Oct 09, 2008 at 04:11:01PM -0500, Scott Sexton wrote:
> Cafe 28? The Cuban-Mexican restaurant on Irving Park? That's not meatless.
> In fact, there's only one meatless dish: the Vegetable Comal. It's delicious
> though, and as a vegetarian myself, I recommend it just for that.

Okay, I must have misunderstood the somewhat meandering discussion - I
had thought it odd there'd be so much apparent enthuiasm for a meat-fee
menu among a group best know for "*BURGERS* and beer".  ;-)

-- 
There is no greater hoax in this story than the rush
to put young children on computers, in the belief that
it will prepare them for tomorrow's jobs.  -- Todd Oppenheimer


From mdipierro at cs.depaul.edu  Fri Oct 10 04:39:28 2008
From: mdipierro at cs.depaul.edu (Massimo Di Pierro)
Date: Thu, 9 Oct 2008 21:39:28 -0500
Subject: [Chicago] 2 unique keys in a python dict?
In-Reply-To: <20081010001017.GD15194@furrr.two14.net>
References: <1729087912.3781771223572670785.JavaMail.root@mail-3.01.com>
	<5E0DBB8C-631D-4F26-A42B-FF5FCD13F1FA@cs.depaul.edu>
	<1267242F-701C-4469-9A60-5C80BF98814C@fanplastic.org>
	<98639B3E-2A44-4575-827A-07D97D691E8A@cs.depaul.edu>
	<20081009205945.GA15194@furrr.two14.net>
	<0A5A2381-2068-42DD-A9CC-67BCCD9DCAB6@cs.depaul.edu>
	<20081010001017.GD15194@furrr.two14.net>
Message-ID: <DC5599DC-278C-4A26-9CFF-B1014DF48BA2@cs.depaul.edu>

I do not want to insist but I did not get an answer.

How do I write a query in the Django ORM that generates something like  
"SELECT SUM(....) ... GROUP BY ..." without using SQL explicitly?

I need an example in Django. There is nothing in the Django  
documentation.

I know how to do this with other ORMs, I know how to do this without  
an ORM and I know how to do this in Django by looping explicitly.

I just do not know how to use GROUP BY and how to use SUM in Django.

I would like to show it to my class but I do not know how to do it.

Massimo

P.S. Incidentally I know how to do in postscript (as you suggest), in  
fact I did create this library for drawing in postscript (and yes,  
this is stupid, but 12 years ago it seemed like a good idea):

http://bazaar.launchpad.net/%7Emdipierro/qcd/development/annotate/1?file_id=mdp_postscript.h-20080712184703-6ns7zn7nw2d95ete-191




On Oct 9, 2008, at 7:10 PM, Martin Maney wrote:

> On Thu, Oct 09, 2008 at 04:16:00PM -0500, Massimo Di Pierro wrote:
>> I am not suggesting using a web framework. I suggested using a DB +
>> python based database abstraction layer (I do my examples in web2py
>> because that is what I know best).
>>
>> Lukasz said that, in fact, he is using SQLAlchemy.
>
> As we will see, I think either is silly overuse of complex tools for a
> trivial job.  Unless the sheer size of the (unsorted) input to be
> processed is huge, which I don't recall.
>
>> Since Garrett mentioned Django (I did not) and I am not aware of  
>> how to
>> use GROUP BY in Django, the conversation sidetracked.
>
> Oh, is that how it went?  I came across this thread after it was  
> mostly
> done, I guess, and only vaguely remember what I took to be a very
> tongue in cheek mention of Django - you know, the obligatory "...or  
> you
> could use <hot thing that's got all the buzz>" mention.
>
>> My question still stands. How would I do a GROUP BY and a SUM of the
>> grouped records in using Django without multiple queries?
>>
>> I would honestly like to learn that.
>>
>> Do you know?
>
> I have to peel this onion in stages.
>
> First layer: for the problem as originally stated, I'd use the CSV
> library and some IMO trivial Python code (it's possible it's not quite
> as simple as I imagine - from something more recent I'm not sure we've
> actually got the full picture of what needs to be done in the end).
>
> Second layer: if I were required to solve that problem using Django,
> I'd import csv and proceed as above after whatever minimal Djangoness
> requirement had been satisfied.
>
> Third layer: if I had to solve the variant you seem to be asking for
> above - assuming the raw records were already in a table by whatever
> means - I, personally, would write a single SQL query, as this is
> pretty trivial (well, after all, subtotals on a field are surely among
> the common business tasks the designers of SQL had in mind).  This
> exposes my bias as someone who had taken the time to learn a bit about
> SQL, and more so about the relational model, years before Django  
> came on
> the scene.
>
> Fourth layer: if you hold my feet to the fire to Do It All In Django,
> No SQL Please, no problem.  Just fetch all the rows, sorted by id, and
> iterate over them tossing off subtotals when the id column changes,
> viz., reinvent what the simple SQL statement would be doing with much
> greater data transfer requirements and reduced efficiency. (it was at
> this point that the urge to override the random .sig quite became
> irresistable)
>
> There ought to be quite a bit of onion left at his point, but I'm not
> sure what those layers would be.  Maybe implement the subtotal summing
> in postscript and produce the report by sending the sorted data to the
> print queue?  Hope it doesn't catch on fire...
>
> --
> This is like making a car shorter by cutting off a few inches
> from each end with a Sawzall.  Of course there's little benefit,
> because that's a dumb way to do it.  -- Neil R. Ormos
>
> _______________________________________________
> Chicago mailing list
> Chicago at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago


From cstejerean at gmail.com  Fri Oct 10 05:13:06 2008
From: cstejerean at gmail.com (Cosmin Stejerean)
Date: Thu, 9 Oct 2008 22:13:06 -0500
Subject: [Chicago] 2 unique keys in a python dict?
In-Reply-To: <DC5599DC-278C-4A26-9CFF-B1014DF48BA2@cs.depaul.edu>
References: <1729087912.3781771223572670785.JavaMail.root@mail-3.01.com>
	<5E0DBB8C-631D-4F26-A42B-FF5FCD13F1FA@cs.depaul.edu>
	<1267242F-701C-4469-9A60-5C80BF98814C@fanplastic.org>
	<98639B3E-2A44-4575-827A-07D97D691E8A@cs.depaul.edu>
	<20081009205945.GA15194@furrr.two14.net>
	<0A5A2381-2068-42DD-A9CC-67BCCD9DCAB6@cs.depaul.edu>
	<20081010001017.GD15194@furrr.two14.net>
	<DC5599DC-278C-4A26-9CFF-B1014DF48BA2@cs.depaul.edu>
Message-ID: <70502F91-96A5-4782-9E84-1D99BE7D0D82@gmail.com>


On Oct 9, 2008, at 9:39 PM, Massimo Di Pierro wrote:

> I do not want to insist but I did not get an answer.
>
> How do I write a query in the Django ORM that generates something  
> like "SELECT SUM(....) ... GROUP BY ..." without using SQL explicitly?
>
>


I'm not a Django ORM expert but to me it seems that:

a) there is no built-in way at the moment in the django orm to  
generate group by queries without falling back to SQL
b) you already know this
c) you keep asking the question anyway

Repeatedly asking the same question here doesn't seem to be producing  
results. I highly recommend trying somewhere else. I heard there's a  
chicago djangonauts group, maybe you can try bothering them.

- Cosmin

From MDiPierro at cs.depaul.edu  Fri Oct 10 06:38:10 2008
From: MDiPierro at cs.depaul.edu (DiPierro, Massimo)
Date: Thu, 9 Oct 2008 23:38:10 -0500
Subject: [Chicago] 2 unique keys in a python dict?
In-Reply-To: <70502F91-96A5-4782-9E84-1D99BE7D0D82@gmail.com>
References: <1729087912.3781771223572670785.JavaMail.root@mail-3.01.com>
	<5E0DBB8C-631D-4F26-A42B-FF5FCD13F1FA@cs.depaul.edu>
	<1267242F-701C-4469-9A60-5C80BF98814C@fanplastic.org>
	<98639B3E-2A44-4575-827A-07D97D691E8A@cs.depaul.edu>
	<20081009205945.GA15194@furrr.two14.net>
	<0A5A2381-2068-42DD-A9CC-67BCCD9DCAB6@cs.depaul.edu>
	<20081010001017.GD15194@furrr.two14.net>
	<DC5599DC-278C-4A26-9CFF-B1014DF48BA2@cs.depaul.edu>,
	<70502F91-96A5-4782-9E84-1D99BE7D0D82@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <C1AA20CAC1E41647BFF1D41215EDD475807EC291D8@wagner.cti.depaul.edu>

b) is false in fact I am still not convinced about a). Anyway I appreciate your straight answer.

I will refrain from asking Django questions to this list in the future since it seems to offend people I like and admire and that saddens me.
I also wish to point out again that it was not me who brought up Django on this thread.

Massimo

________________________________________
From: chicago-bounces+mdipierro=cs.depaul.edu at python.org [chicago-bounces+mdipierro=cs.depaul.edu at python.org] On Behalf Of Cosmin Stejerean [cstejerean at gmail.com]
Sent: Thursday, October 09, 2008 10:13 PM
To: The Chicago Python Users Group
Subject: Re: [Chicago] 2 unique keys in a python dict?

On Oct 9, 2008, at 9:39 PM, Massimo Di Pierro wrote:

> I do not want to insist but I did not get an answer.
>
> How do I write a query in the Django ORM that generates something
> like "SELECT SUM(....) ... GROUP BY ..." without using SQL explicitly?
>
>


I'm not a Django ORM expert but to me it seems that:

a) there is no built-in way at the moment in the django orm to
generate group by queries without falling back to SQL
b) you already know this
c) you keep asking the question anyway

Repeatedly asking the same question here doesn't seem to be producing
results. I highly recommend trying somewhere else. I heard there's a
chicago djangonauts group, maybe you can try bothering them.

- Cosmin
_______________________________________________
Chicago mailing list
Chicago at python.org
http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago

From szybalski at gmail.com  Fri Oct 10 15:53:37 2008
From: szybalski at gmail.com (Lukasz Szybalski)
Date: Fri, 10 Oct 2008 08:53:37 -0500
Subject: [Chicago] auto incrementing - what options do we have?
Message-ID: <804e5c70810100653i14e6c6a2yb80856a81aac42a3@mail.gmail.com>

Hello,
I was wondering if anybody has a good strategy for auto incrementing fields?

I want to auto increment field called "case#" .

I have a choice of database auto increment on field "case#" or do it
myself? (correct? No other choices exists? or something in between?)

1. I would like to be able to do pick a number where we will start
doing a case#?  (1,000,000+)
2. Reserver a case# for a special group which can auto increment case#
between 2,000,000-2,999,999, and add them as they come.
3. I don't want to use (system_id)

So it seems as the only way is to make my primary key:
case# - unique key, primary, not auto incrementing and let some
program manage auto incrementing.

What options have worked for you in this situation?

So right now options are:
1. let db auto increment
2. Hold the next case# in a separate database table, and let my
program use it to find next case# value. How would I lock/unlock the
next case# to make sure there is no race condition and each case#, and
there is no holes?
3. Any other options?

Have people used other strategy that is semi-automatic, and would work
for these cases?

Thanks,
Lucas



-- 
Python and OpenOffice documents and templates
http://lucasmanual.com/mywiki/OpenOffice
Fast and Easy Backup solution with Bacula
http://lucasmanual.com/mywiki/Bacula

From irick at uchicago.edu  Fri Oct 10 15:58:53 2008
From: irick at uchicago.edu (John-Stockton Irick)
Date: Fri, 10 Oct 2008 08:58:53 -0500
Subject: [Chicago] auto incrementing - what options do we have?
In-Reply-To: <804e5c70810100653i14e6c6a2yb80856a81aac42a3@mail.gmail.com>
References: <804e5c70810100653i14e6c6a2yb80856a81aac42a3@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <19c3441a0810100658u2fc613cas3f5a7f20dc5fa444@mail.gmail.com>

I'm going to assume that you're talking about mysql.

>From mysql.org
"
 To start with an AUTO_INCREMENT value other than 1, you can set that
value with CREATE TABLE or ALTER TABLE, like this:

mysql> ALTER TABLE tbl AUTO_INCREMENT = 100;
"

http://dev.mysql.com/doc/refman/5.0/en/example-auto-increment.html

Hope that helps.

On Fri, Oct 10, 2008 at 8:53 AM, Lukasz Szybalski <szybalski at gmail.com> wrote:
> Hello,
> I was wondering if anybody has a good strategy for auto incrementing fields?
>
> I want to auto increment field called "case#" .
>
> I have a choice of database auto increment on field "case#" or do it
> myself? (correct? No other choices exists? or something in between?)
>
> 1. I would like to be able to do pick a number where we will start
> doing a case#?  (1,000,000+)
> 2. Reserver a case# for a special group which can auto increment case#
> between 2,000,000-2,999,999, and add them as they come.
> 3. I don't want to use (system_id)
>
> So it seems as the only way is to make my primary key:
> case# - unique key, primary, not auto incrementing and let some
> program manage auto incrementing.
>
> What options have worked for you in this situation?
>
> So right now options are:
> 1. let db auto increment
> 2. Hold the next case# in a separate database table, and let my
> program use it to find next case# value. How would I lock/unlock the
> next case# to make sure there is no race condition and each case#, and
> there is no holes?
> 3. Any other options?
>
> Have people used other strategy that is semi-automatic, and would work
> for these cases?
>
> Thanks,
> Lucas
>
>
>
> --
> Python and OpenOffice documents and templates
> http://lucasmanual.com/mywiki/OpenOffice
> Fast and Easy Backup solution with Bacula
> http://lucasmanual.com/mywiki/Bacula
> _______________________________________________
> Chicago mailing list
> Chicago at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>



-- 
JS Irick
Lead Engineer
Cacioppo Labs
Center for Cognitive and Social Neuroscience
773-702-6279

From g at rrett.us.com  Fri Oct 10 16:42:33 2008
From: g at rrett.us.com (Garrett Smith)
Date: Fri, 10 Oct 2008 09:42:33 -0500 (CDT)
Subject: [Chicago] auto incrementing - what options do we have?
In-Reply-To: <19c3441a0810100658u2fc613cas3f5a7f20dc5fa444@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <929248334.652641223649753269.JavaMail.root@mail-3.01.com>

Just use an auto increment int column in mysql. The only reason you'd ever want to do that yourself is if you're a) bored, b) need something than other a simple incrementing integer c) will distribute the data across databases, in which case you'll need an approach that ensures key uniqueness.



----- "John-Stockton Irick" <irick at uchicago.edu> wrote:

> I'm going to assume that you're talking about mysql.
> 
> >From mysql.org
> "
>  To start with an AUTO_INCREMENT value other than 1, you can set that
> value with CREATE TABLE or ALTER TABLE, like this:
> 
> mysql> ALTER TABLE tbl AUTO_INCREMENT = 100;
> "
> 
> http://dev.mysql.com/doc/refman/5.0/en/example-auto-increment.html
> 
> Hope that helps.
> 
> On Fri, Oct 10, 2008 at 8:53 AM, Lukasz Szybalski
> <szybalski at gmail.com> wrote:
> > Hello,
> > I was wondering if anybody has a good strategy for auto incrementing
> fields?
> >
> > I want to auto increment field called "case#" .
> >
> > I have a choice of database auto increment on field "case#" or do
> it
> > myself? (correct? No other choices exists? or something in
> between?)
> >
> > 1. I would like to be able to do pick a number where we will start
> > doing a case#?  (1,000,000+)
> > 2. Reserver a case# for a special group which can auto increment
> case#
> > between 2,000,000-2,999,999, and add them as they come.
> > 3. I don't want to use (system_id)
> >
> > So it seems as the only way is to make my primary key:
> > case# - unique key, primary, not auto incrementing and let some
> > program manage auto incrementing.
> >
> > What options have worked for you in this situation?
> >
> > So right now options are:
> > 1. let db auto increment
> > 2. Hold the next case# in a separate database table, and let my
> > program use it to find next case# value. How would I lock/unlock
> the
> > next case# to make sure there is no race condition and each case#,
> and
> > there is no holes?
> > 3. Any other options?
> >
> > Have people used other strategy that is semi-automatic, and would
> work
> > for these cases?
> >
> > Thanks,
> > Lucas
> >
> >
> >
> > --
> > Python and OpenOffice documents and templates
> > http://lucasmanual.com/mywiki/OpenOffice
> > Fast and Easy Backup solution with Bacula
> > http://lucasmanual.com/mywiki/Bacula
> > _______________________________________________
> > Chicago mailing list
> > Chicago at python.org
> > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
> >
> 
> 
> 
> -- 
> JS Irick
> Lead Engineer
> Cacioppo Labs
> Center for Cognitive and Social Neuroscience
> 773-702-6279
> _______________________________________________
> Chicago mailing list
> Chicago at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago

From szybalski at gmail.com  Fri Oct 10 17:18:10 2008
From: szybalski at gmail.com (Lukasz Szybalski)
Date: Fri, 10 Oct 2008 10:18:10 -0500
Subject: [Chicago] auto incrementing - what options do we have?
In-Reply-To: <19c3441a0810100658u2fc613cas3f5a7f20dc5fa444@mail.gmail.com>
References: <804e5c70810100653i14e6c6a2yb80856a81aac42a3@mail.gmail.com>
	<19c3441a0810100658u2fc613cas3f5a7f20dc5fa444@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <804e5c70810100818h18f2b1ccxa0980b4a7e77496@mail.gmail.com>

On Fri, Oct 10, 2008 at 8:58 AM, John-Stockton Irick <irick at uchicago.edu> wrote:
> I'm going to assume that you're talking about mysql.
>
> >From mysql.org
> "
>  To start with an AUTO_INCREMENT value other than 1, you can set that
> value with CREATE TABLE or ALTER TABLE, like this:
>
> mysql> ALTER TABLE tbl AUTO_INCREMENT = 100;
> "
>
> http://dev.mysql.com/doc/refman/5.0/en/example-auto-increment.html
>
> Hope that helps.


Problem with that is that I want to have more control on case#. So if
this case is from A source the auto increment starts at case# 3000 and
if its from source B auto increment starts with case# 4000.

Lucas

From g at rrett.us.com  Fri Oct 10 17:38:57 2008
From: g at rrett.us.com (Garrett Smith)
Date: Fri, 10 Oct 2008 10:38:57 -0500 (CDT)
Subject: [Chicago] auto incrementing - what options do we have?
In-Reply-To: <804e5c70810100818h18f2b1ccxa0980b4a7e77496@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <942839683.675771223653137359.JavaMail.root@mail-3.01.com>

Auto-increment keys don't generally have meaningful values. If your various cases have meaning in your application (presuming they must if you want to include them in the schema), consider using another column to store case-specific data and let the auto-increment column just do its thing.

If you really want to hand craft the key values, the classic approach would be to use a table that holds your next key for each type. You need to read from that table, increment the applicable value and then write your new records within an isolated transaction (want read locks on everything you touch). Not the best approach for super high throughput applications, but unless you're planning on a wildly successful public facing web site, it should be fine.

It's common to use a stored procedure to increment the counter.

You can also use an abbreviated uuid, e.g. taking the last four or five characters, so your keys might look like a-89sj2, a-8s9sn, b-9sjnd, etc. These are more user friendly than true uuids. You'll need to anticipate key collisions in your application code and keep trying with new keys until the records make it into the table.


----- "Lukasz Szybalski" <szybalski at gmail.com> wrote:

> On Fri, Oct 10, 2008 at 8:58 AM, John-Stockton Irick
> <irick at uchicago.edu> wrote:
> > I'm going to assume that you're talking about mysql.
> >
> > >From mysql.org
> > "
> >  To start with an AUTO_INCREMENT value other than 1, you can set
> that
> > value with CREATE TABLE or ALTER TABLE, like this:
> >
> > mysql> ALTER TABLE tbl AUTO_INCREMENT = 100;
> > "
> >
> > http://dev.mysql.com/doc/refman/5.0/en/example-auto-increment.html
> >
> > Hope that helps.
> 
> 
> Problem with that is that I want to have more control on case#. So if
> this case is from A source the auto increment starts at case# 3000
> and
> if its from source B auto increment starts with case# 4000.
> 
> Lucas
> _______________________________________________
> Chicago mailing list
> Chicago at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago

From kumar.mcmillan at gmail.com  Fri Oct 10 17:43:32 2008
From: kumar.mcmillan at gmail.com (Kumar McMillan)
Date: Fri, 10 Oct 2008 10:43:32 -0500
Subject: [Chicago] auto incrementing - what options do we have?
In-Reply-To: <804e5c70810100653i14e6c6a2yb80856a81aac42a3@mail.gmail.com>
References: <804e5c70810100653i14e6c6a2yb80856a81aac42a3@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <b571660a0810100843g464fffd3k2396b720b1cb98fa@mail.gmail.com>

On Fri, Oct 10, 2008 at 8:53 AM, Lukasz Szybalski <szybalski at gmail.com> wrote:
> Hello,
> I was wondering if anybody has a good strategy for auto incrementing fields?
>
> I want to auto increment field called "case#" .
>
> I have a choice of database auto increment on field "case#" or do it
> myself? (correct? No other choices exists? or something in between?)
>
> 1. I would like to be able to do pick a number where we will start
> doing a case#?  (1,000,000+)
> 2. Reserver a case# for a special group which can auto increment case#
> between 2,000,000-2,999,999, and add them as they come.
> 3. I don't want to use (system_id)
>
> So it seems as the only way is to make my primary key:
> case# - unique key, primary, not auto incrementing and let some
> program manage auto incrementing.
>
> What options have worked for you in this situation?

Just make case_number a unique column.  Then all race conditions are
handled by the database.  If you want control over it don't make it
auto-incrementing, do that yourself.  case_number = last_case_number +
1.  As long as you do the select of the last case number *and* the new
insert all in one transaction, the database should be smart enough to
lock the right rows for you and all simultaneous selects of last case
number will block until the current insert transaction has committed.
Actually, you might have to explicitly declare table level locks as
opposed to row level locks.  Most dbs support LOCK TABLES, i.e. for
myql : http://dev.mysql.com/doc/refman/5.0/en/lock-tables.html which
is what you want in this case.

However, if your customers are saying they need to set ranges of case
numbers for special groups then it sounds to me like a much larger
problem: your users are putting special meaning on case numbers before
the cases are created.  Why?  It smells to me like other databases are
at work (like, *gasp* someone's personal Access database).  If that's
what's happening then you are essentially working with the
"distributed database" problem.  This is solved in a number of ways.
The easiest is to kick everyone in the groin and make them to stop
using Access because you just built a new db.  Another solution would
be the use of a central server that assigns node IDs to each database
(good luck integrating this into MS Access).  Then, all case numbers
are unique by node ID + case ID.  I.E. node 1 + case number 1 vs. node
2 + case number 1 are two unique case numbers.  Another approach is to
use hashes that uniquely identify each case by content somehow.  This
is how distributed version control works (google for Mercurial or git)
; it does not rely on any central server at all.

Kumar


>
> So right now options are:
> 1. let db auto increment
> 2. Hold the next case# in a separate database table, and let my
> program use it to find next case# value. How would I lock/unlock the
> next case# to make sure there is no race condition and each case#, and
> there is no holes?
> 3. Any other options?
>
> Have people used other strategy that is semi-automatic, and would work
> for these cases?
>
> Thanks,
> Lucas
>
>
>
> --
> Python and OpenOffice documents and templates
> http://lucasmanual.com/mywiki/OpenOffice
> Fast and Easy Backup solution with Bacula
> http://lucasmanual.com/mywiki/Bacula
> _______________________________________________
> Chicago mailing list
> Chicago at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>

From MDiPierro at cs.depaul.edu  Fri Oct 10 18:11:30 2008
From: MDiPierro at cs.depaul.edu (DiPierro, Massimo)
Date: Fri, 10 Oct 2008 11:11:30 -0500
Subject: [Chicago] auto incrementing - what options do we have?
In-Reply-To: <804e5c70810100818h18f2b1ccxa0980b4a7e77496@mail.gmail.com>
References: <804e5c70810100653i14e6c6a2yb80856a81aac42a3@mail.gmail.com>
	<19c3441a0810100658u2fc613cas3f5a7f20dc5fa444@mail.gmail.com>,
	<804e5c70810100818h18f2b1ccxa0980b4a7e77496@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <C1AA20CAC1E41647BFF1D41215EDD475807EC291E6@wagner.cti.depaul.edu>

A quick and dirty trick would be to have a normal auto-increment field and, after insert, compute "case" and update the insert.

db.define_table('mytable',SQLField('name'),SQLField('case',default=None,unique))
id=db.mytable.insert(name='value')
db(db.mytable.id==id).update(case=f(id))

where f is your function.

Massimo
________________________________________
From: chicago-bounces+mdipierro=cs.depaul.edu at python.org [chicago-bounces+mdipierro=cs.depaul.edu at python.org] On Behalf Of Lukasz Szybalski [szybalski at gmail.com]
Sent: Friday, October 10, 2008 10:18 AM
To: The Chicago Python Users Group
Subject: Re: [Chicago] auto incrementing - what options do we have?

On Fri, Oct 10, 2008 at 8:58 AM, John-Stockton Irick <irick at uchicago.edu> wrote:
> I'm going to assume that you're talking about mysql.
>
> >From mysql.org
> "
>  To start with an AUTO_INCREMENT value other than 1, you can set that
> value with CREATE TABLE or ALTER TABLE, like this:
>
> mysql> ALTER TABLE tbl AUTO_INCREMENT = 100;
> "
>
> http://dev.mysql.com/doc/refman/5.0/en/example-auto-increment.html
>
> Hope that helps.


Problem with that is that I want to have more control on case#. So if
this case is from A source the auto increment starts at case# 3000 and
if its from source B auto increment starts with case# 4000.

Lucas
_______________________________________________
Chicago mailing list
Chicago at python.org
http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago

From szybalski at gmail.com  Fri Oct 10 18:36:34 2008
From: szybalski at gmail.com (Lukasz Szybalski)
Date: Fri, 10 Oct 2008 11:36:34 -0500
Subject: [Chicago] auto incrementing - what options do we have?
In-Reply-To: <b571660a0810100843g464fffd3k2396b720b1cb98fa@mail.gmail.com>
References: <804e5c70810100653i14e6c6a2yb80856a81aac42a3@mail.gmail.com>
	<b571660a0810100843g464fffd3k2396b720b1cb98fa@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <804e5c70810100936t353b641bo124b818bdb0860c7@mail.gmail.com>

On Fri, Oct 10, 2008 at 10:43 AM, Kumar McMillan
<kumar.mcmillan at gmail.com> wrote:
> On Fri, Oct 10, 2008 at 8:53 AM, Lukasz Szybalski <szybalski at gmail.com> wrote:
>> Hello,
>> I was wondering if anybody has a good strategy for auto incrementing fields?
>>
>> I want to auto increment field called "case#" .
>>
>> I have a choice of database auto increment on field "case#" or do it
>> myself? (correct? No other choices exists? or something in between?)
>>
>> 1. I would like to be able to do pick a number where we will start
>> doing a case#?  (1,000,000+)
>> 2. Reserver a case# for a special group which can auto increment case#
>> between 2,000,000-2,999,999, and add them as they come.
>> 3. I don't want to use (system_id)
>>
>> So it seems as the only way is to make my primary key:
>> case# - unique key, primary, not auto incrementing and let some
>> program manage auto incrementing.
>>
>> What options have worked for you in this situation?
>
> Just make case_number a unique column.  Then all race conditions are
> handled by the database.  If you want control over it don't make it
> auto-incrementing, do that yourself.  case_number = last_case_number +
> 1.  As long as you do the select of the last case number *and* the new
> insert all in one transaction, the database should be smart enough to
> lock the right rows for you and all simultaneous selects of last case
> number will block until the current insert transaction has committed.
> Actually, you might have to explicitly declare table level locks as
> opposed to row level locks.  Most dbs support LOCK TABLES, i.e. for
> myql : http://dev.mysql.com/doc/refman/5.0/en/lock-tables.html which
> is what you want in this case.
>

This is doable.... The range of case# is assign to 3rd party vendor so
I will let him worry about auto incrementing as long as he doesn't
send me duplicates.  I'll do the separate table and make sure the auto
incrementing and insert happens on the same transaction. Has anybody
experimented with that and potential problems?  I don't see another
approach so why would this be  bottleneck compared to regular db auto
increment with another unique case#?

"A quick and dirty trick would be to have a normal auto-increment
field and, after insert, compute "case" and update the insert."
A little change to this:
Is it possible possible/ allowed by a database to let the db
autoincrement the filed, and then change that autoincremented number
to what I need it to be?  (3 possible choices for db might be mysql,
postgresql, maybe mssql?)


> However, if your customers are saying they need to set ranges of case
> numbers for special groups then it sounds to me like a much larger
> problem: your users are putting special meaning on case numbers before
> the cases are created.  Why?  It smells to me like other databases are
> at work (like, *gasp* someone's personal Access database).  If that's
> what's happening then you are essentially working with the
> "distributed database" problem.  This is solved in a number of ways.
> The easiest is to kick everyone in the groin and make them to stop
> using Access because you just built a new db.  Another solution would
> be the use of a central server that assigns node IDs to each database
> (good luck integrating this into MS Access).  Then, all case numbers
> are unique by node ID + case ID.  I.E. node 1 + case number 1 vs. node
> 2 + case number 1 are two unique case numbers.  Another approach is to
> use hashes that uniquely identify each case by content somehow.  This
> is how distributed version control works (google for Mercurial or git)
> ; it does not rely on any central server at all.

This could be interesting.. I'll look it over to see how this
application could be running in a distributed way.

Lucas

From david.durham.jr at gmail.com  Fri Oct 10 18:43:56 2008
From: david.durham.jr at gmail.com (David Durham, Jr.)
Date: Fri, 10 Oct 2008 11:43:56 -0500
Subject: [Chicago] auto incrementing - what options do we have?
In-Reply-To: <b571660a0810100843g464fffd3k2396b720b1cb98fa@mail.gmail.com>
References: <804e5c70810100653i14e6c6a2yb80856a81aac42a3@mail.gmail.com>
	<b571660a0810100843g464fffd3k2396b720b1cb98fa@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <fdb5fda0810100943y3ce55bb0m503f2eb8852ddbf3@mail.gmail.com>

On 10/10/08, Kumar McMillan <kumar.mcmillan at gmail.com> wrote:
>  Actually, you might have to explicitly declare table level locks as
>  opposed to row level locks.  Most dbs support LOCK TABLES, i.e. for
>  myql : http://dev.mysql.com/doc/refman/5.0/en/lock-tables.html which
>  is what you want in this case.

Right, but locking is not the only way to ensure transaction
integrity.  It's better to stick with simply setting transaction
isolation to what you need and letting the db deal with whether or not
it will use locking or something like MVCC.

-Dave

From szybalski at gmail.com  Fri Oct 10 19:08:34 2008
From: szybalski at gmail.com (Lukasz Szybalski)
Date: Fri, 10 Oct 2008 12:08:34 -0500
Subject: [Chicago] auto incrementing - what options do we have?
In-Reply-To: <fdb5fda0810100943y3ce55bb0m503f2eb8852ddbf3@mail.gmail.com>
References: <804e5c70810100653i14e6c6a2yb80856a81aac42a3@mail.gmail.com>
	<b571660a0810100843g464fffd3k2396b720b1cb98fa@mail.gmail.com>
	<fdb5fda0810100943y3ce55bb0m503f2eb8852ddbf3@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <804e5c70810101008q30725c11wf08b6f0f47af5d90@mail.gmail.com>

On Fri, Oct 10, 2008 at 11:43 AM, David Durham, Jr.
<david.durham.jr at gmail.com> wrote:
> On 10/10/08, Kumar McMillan <kumar.mcmillan at gmail.com> wrote:
>>  Actually, you might have to explicitly declare table level locks as
>>  opposed to row level locks.  Most dbs support LOCK TABLES, i.e. for
>>  myql : http://dev.mysql.com/doc/refman/5.0/en/lock-tables.html which
>>  is what you want in this case.
>
> Right, but locking is not the only way to ensure transaction
> integrity.  It's better to stick with simply setting transaction
> isolation to what you need and letting the db deal with whether or not
> it will use locking or something like MVCC.

So what would be the transaction isolation in this case? Is that
session option or do I change it only on first insert?

Lucas

From david.durham.jr at gmail.com  Fri Oct 10 19:23:11 2008
From: david.durham.jr at gmail.com (David Durham, Jr.)
Date: Fri, 10 Oct 2008 12:23:11 -0500
Subject: [Chicago] auto incrementing - what options do we have?
In-Reply-To: <804e5c70810101008q30725c11wf08b6f0f47af5d90@mail.gmail.com>
References: <804e5c70810100653i14e6c6a2yb80856a81aac42a3@mail.gmail.com>
	<b571660a0810100843g464fffd3k2396b720b1cb98fa@mail.gmail.com>
	<fdb5fda0810100943y3ce55bb0m503f2eb8852ddbf3@mail.gmail.com>
	<804e5c70810101008q30725c11wf08b6f0f47af5d90@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <fdb5fda0810101023h1a4b0de1x236e0d1e266ce730@mail.gmail.com>

On 10/10/08, Lukasz Szybalski <szybalski at gmail.com> wrote:
> On Fri, Oct 10, 2008 at 11:43 AM, David Durham, Jr.
>  <david.durham.jr at gmail.com> wrote:
>  > On 10/10/08, Kumar McMillan <kumar.mcmillan at gmail.com> wrote:
>  >>  Actually, you might have to explicitly declare table level locks as
>  >>  opposed to row level locks.  Most dbs support LOCK TABLES, i.e. for
>  >>  myql : http://dev.mysql.com/doc/refman/5.0/en/lock-tables.html which
>  >>  is what you want in this case.
>  >
>  > Right, but locking is not the only way to ensure transaction
>  > integrity.  It's better to stick with simply setting transaction
>  > isolation to what you need and letting the db deal with whether or not
>  > it will use locking or something like MVCC.
>
>
> So what would be the transaction isolation in this case? Is that
>  session option or do I change it only on first insert?

I think you want repeatable read or read serializable.  Here's a
Google feeling lucky for read serializable:

http://www.devx.com/getHelpOn/10MinuteSolution/16488/1954

With that said, you may find that dealing with id concurrency issues
within your database doesn't match your use-case, which would most
likely be high-volume distributed stuff (so far as I know).  In such
cases, it's perfectly reasonable to generate your own universally
unique id's and there are known algorithms for doing so (I think they
often rely on a mac address and timestamp to seed the algorithm).
UUIDs are not, in my experience, auto-incremented values, but if you
absolutely need auto-incremented values in a distributed high-volume
app then you or someone you know is probably just being weird :).

HTH,
Dave

From david.durham.jr at gmail.com  Fri Oct 10 19:31:46 2008
From: david.durham.jr at gmail.com (David Durham, Jr.)
Date: Fri, 10 Oct 2008 12:31:46 -0500
Subject: [Chicago] auto incrementing - what options do we have?
In-Reply-To: <fdb5fda0810101023h1a4b0de1x236e0d1e266ce730@mail.gmail.com>
References: <804e5c70810100653i14e6c6a2yb80856a81aac42a3@mail.gmail.com>
	<b571660a0810100843g464fffd3k2396b720b1cb98fa@mail.gmail.com>
	<fdb5fda0810100943y3ce55bb0m503f2eb8852ddbf3@mail.gmail.com>
	<804e5c70810101008q30725c11wf08b6f0f47af5d90@mail.gmail.com>
	<fdb5fda0810101023h1a4b0de1x236e0d1e266ce730@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <fdb5fda0810101031i3a17e40fuc6a06ecf382239a@mail.gmail.com>

>  > So what would be the transaction isolation in this case? Is that
>  >  session option or do I change it only on first insert?
>
> I think you want repeatable read or read serializable.  Here's a
>  Google feeling lucky for read serializable:
>
>  http://www.devx.com/getHelpOn/10MinuteSolution/16488/1954

..

Forgot to say that this can look like this:

   set transaction isolation level read serializable

and yes, this applies to an SQL Session.

-Dave

From g at rrett.us.com  Fri Oct 10 16:58:55 2008
From: g at rrett.us.com (Garrett Smith)
Date: Fri, 10 Oct 2008 09:58:55 -0500 (CDT)
Subject: [Chicago] Miro + set top
Message-ID: <1430059119.659101223650735923.JavaMail.root@mail-3.01.com>

Here's the vendor that is commonly used for MythTV-related hardware. We had a side discussion last night over excellent beer and soda water over the nature of lazy ass TV watchers (me) and the role couches play in the Internet TV ecosystem. 

http://www.hauppauge.com/index.htm 

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From mandric at gmail.com  Fri Oct 10 21:36:14 2008
From: mandric at gmail.com (Milan Andric)
Date: Fri, 10 Oct 2008 14:36:14 -0500
Subject: [Chicago] Miro + set top
In-Reply-To: <1430059119.659101223650735923.JavaMail.root@mail-3.01.com>
References: <1430059119.659101223650735923.JavaMail.root@mail-3.01.com>
Message-ID: <536089f30810101236p28fd0519o8eaa262f6337110d@mail.gmail.com>

One thing I find annoying is that dvd vendors don't put network ports
on dvd players.  Why does a guy have to sacrifice a goat to get a
cheap $.50 piece of hardware and basic video decoder software on his
dvd player?

These things sell like hot cakes all over the world except where
people have lots of extra money to throw around on their dvd
collections.

http://www.amazon.com/Avel-Linkplayer-Multimedia-Player-Networkable/dp/B000F8M6TA?tag=particculturf-20

--
Milan

On Fri, Oct 10, 2008 at 9:58 AM, Garrett Smith <g at rrett.us.com> wrote:
> Here's the vendor that is commonly used for MythTV-related hardware. We had
> a side discussion last night over excellent beer and soda water over the
> nature of lazy ass TV watchers (me) and the role couches play in the
> Internet TV ecosystem.
>
> http://www.hauppauge.com/index.htm
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Chicago mailing list
> Chicago at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>
>

From david.durham.jr at gmail.com  Fri Oct 10 21:57:06 2008
From: david.durham.jr at gmail.com (David Durham, Jr.)
Date: Fri, 10 Oct 2008 14:57:06 -0500
Subject: [Chicago] Miro + set top
In-Reply-To: <536089f30810101236p28fd0519o8eaa262f6337110d@mail.gmail.com>
References: <1430059119.659101223650735923.JavaMail.root@mail-3.01.com>
	<536089f30810101236p28fd0519o8eaa262f6337110d@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <fdb5fda0810101257s2699f826n9b750b513eba9b69@mail.gmail.com>

On 10/10/08, Milan Andric <mandric at gmail.com> wrote:
> One thing I find annoying is that dvd vendors don't put network ports
>  on dvd players.  Why does a guy have to sacrifice a goat to get a
>  cheap $.50 piece of hardware and basic video decoder software on his
>  dvd player?
>
>  These things sell like hot cakes all over the world except where
>  people have lots of extra money to throw around on their dvd
>  collections.
>
>  http://www.amazon.com/Avel-Linkplayer-Multimedia-Player-Networkable/dp/B000F8M6TA?tag=particculturf-20

If all you want to do is send/stream your media across a local
network, Popcorn hour is an option:

   http://www.popcornhour.com/onlinestore/

If you're looking to turn a spare computer into your psychopathic
media megalomaniac, here's a link to relevant MythTV (and thus linux)
hardware info:

  http://www.mythtv.org/wiki/index.php/Category:Hardware

Hauppauge products are prominently displayed here:

  http://www.mythtv.org/wiki/index.php/Category:Video_capture_cards

Of course, MythTV provides, I think, everything a PopcornHour machine
will and then some, but is currently not safe for tech-n00bs.

Now, I don't think MythTV currently does what Miro can.  It does have
some plugins for browsing multimedia frin feeds-based sources.  So
there's some crossover with Miro there, but I don't recall anything
for publishing content like Miro supports (I guess -- that bit in Miro
is still kind of fuzzy for me).

Anyway, maybe it would be interesting to see a Miro plugin for MythTV.
 Or if Miro added support for a MythTV backend as a kind of local
feeds source, that would be useful because the cross-platform
myth-frontends space is kind of sparse, but slowly filling up.

-Dave

From szybalski at gmail.com  Fri Oct 10 22:17:34 2008
From: szybalski at gmail.com (Lukasz Szybalski)
Date: Fri, 10 Oct 2008 15:17:34 -0500
Subject: [Chicago] auto incrementing - what options do we have?
In-Reply-To: <fdb5fda0810101031i3a17e40fuc6a06ecf382239a@mail.gmail.com>
References: <804e5c70810100653i14e6c6a2yb80856a81aac42a3@mail.gmail.com>
	<b571660a0810100843g464fffd3k2396b720b1cb98fa@mail.gmail.com>
	<fdb5fda0810100943y3ce55bb0m503f2eb8852ddbf3@mail.gmail.com>
	<804e5c70810101008q30725c11wf08b6f0f47af5d90@mail.gmail.com>
	<fdb5fda0810101023h1a4b0de1x236e0d1e266ce730@mail.gmail.com>
	<fdb5fda0810101031i3a17e40fuc6a06ecf382239a@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <804e5c70810101317i2ea1fc75he461123c4759d434@mail.gmail.com>

On Fri, Oct 10, 2008 at 12:31 PM, David Durham, Jr.
<david.durham.jr at gmail.com> wrote:
>>  > So what would be the transaction isolation in this case? Is that
>>  >  session option or do I change it only on first insert?
>>
>> I think you want repeatable read or read serializable.  Here's a
>>  Google feeling lucky for read serializable:
>>
>>  http://www.devx.com/getHelpOn/10MinuteSolution/16488/1954
>
> ..
>
> Forgot to say that this can look like this:
>
>   set transaction isolation level read serializable
>
> and yes, this applies to an SQL Session.
>

Thanks for the info. It seems as postgresql has the isolation
implemented which means I will be going with postgre then.
http://groups.google.com/group/sqlalchemy-devel/browse_thread/thread/653b6b2f49a940b8


FYI. This is some cool stuff. You can convert your existing database
to sqlalchemy source file and then manage the db structure from
there...


To convert your existing database to sqlalchemy source definitions use:

easy_install sqlalchemy-migrate
migrate create some "some repository" #Not sure if this is needed
migrate create_model --url="mysql://user:pass at localhost/production"
--repository=some >model.py

You could later use the model.py to generate same database in a
different db (mysql -> postgre, or mssql to postgre, etc)

Thanks guys,
Lucas

From maney at two14.net  Sat Oct 11 02:19:22 2008
From: maney at two14.net (Martin Maney)
Date: Fri, 10 Oct 2008 19:19:22 -0500
Subject: [Chicago] 2 unique keys in a python dict?
In-Reply-To: <DC5599DC-278C-4A26-9CFF-B1014DF48BA2@cs.depaul.edu>
References: <1729087912.3781771223572670785.JavaMail.root@mail-3.01.com>
	<5E0DBB8C-631D-4F26-A42B-FF5FCD13F1FA@cs.depaul.edu>
	<1267242F-701C-4469-9A60-5C80BF98814C@fanplastic.org>
	<98639B3E-2A44-4575-827A-07D97D691E8A@cs.depaul.edu>
	<20081009205945.GA15194@furrr.two14.net>
	<0A5A2381-2068-42DD-A9CC-67BCCD9DCAB6@cs.depaul.edu>
	<20081010001017.GD15194@furrr.two14.net>
	<DC5599DC-278C-4A26-9CFF-B1014DF48BA2@cs.depaul.edu>
Message-ID: <20081011001922.GA16115@furrr.two14.net>

On Thu, Oct 09, 2008 at 09:39:28PM -0500, Massimo Di Pierro wrote:
> I do not want to insist but I did not get an answer.

Sorry, that was all the answer I could give - to you or to the original
inquiry together.  If I'd realized you really didn't want a solution to
the thread's problem as such but one couched in a restricted way, I
might have avoided most of the effort.  OTOH, mapping the cave was fun,
too.

> How do I write a query in the Django ORM that generates something like  
> "SELECT SUM(....) ... GROUP BY ..." without using SQL explicitly?
>
> I need an example in Django. There is nothing in the Django  
> documentation.

That's because Django does not try to do everything that's possible in
SQL in its ORM.  Since you've read the documentation, I'm sure you've
seen the section titled (in the new, IMO overly fragmented, version)
"Falling back to raw SQL".  It's not as explicit as I thought I
recalled in earlier versions (or perhaps the clearer statement was in
fact elsewhere, not in the organized docs), but the message is: using
raw SQL is (an advanced) part of Django.  The ORM is not designed to do
everything that SQL can do, though it has grown somewhat since it was
originally shared with the world.

I want to note in passing that so far I have found raw SQL useful in a
few very specific places, generally to manage a query that spans
multiple related tables that became too costly when using the
programmatic relational access (thing.other_thing_set, eg.), and using
Django's select_related() would pick up far too much that was not
needed.  It's an escape hatch for special situations, and if you have
to use it all the time then perhaps you need a framework that's better
suited to the kind of work you're doing.  Just notin'

> I would like to show it to my class but I do not know how to do it.

In the narrow sense you're looking for, it can't, to the best of my
knowledge.

> P.S. Incidentally I know how to do in postscript (as you suggest), in  
> fact I did create this library for drawing in postscript (and yes, this 
> is stupid, but 12 years ago it seemed like a good idea):

I may be misremembering, but I think that at least briefly, when it was
new, my first Laserjet had more RAM than the PC it was attached to -
certainly it had at least a large fraction as much.  Under those
circumstances, I thought it made perfect sense to write a roff-like
text formatter in postscript.  (if nothing else, that finessed the lack
of readily available font metrics, at least in a form I understood.)  I
always loved RPN in the context of those wonderful old HP calculators,
but in a larger context it was... well, I never would have thought this
at the time, but it was somewhat like a foretaste of the way you have
to twist your thinking to code in assembler on some RISC-ish
microcontrollers, eg., Microchip's PIC family.  Or the twisted
framework. <wink>

-- 
There is overwhelming evidence that the higher the level of self-esteem,
the more likely one will be to treat others with respect, kindness, and
generosity. -- Nathaniel Branden


From maney at two14.net  Sat Oct 11 02:40:37 2008
From: maney at two14.net (Martin Maney)
Date: Fri, 10 Oct 2008 19:40:37 -0500
Subject: [Chicago] auto incrementing - what options do we have?
In-Reply-To: <804e5c70810101317i2ea1fc75he461123c4759d434@mail.gmail.com>
References: <804e5c70810100653i14e6c6a2yb80856a81aac42a3@mail.gmail.com>
	<b571660a0810100843g464fffd3k2396b720b1cb98fa@mail.gmail.com>
	<fdb5fda0810100943y3ce55bb0m503f2eb8852ddbf3@mail.gmail.com>
	<804e5c70810101008q30725c11wf08b6f0f47af5d90@mail.gmail.com>
	<fdb5fda0810101023h1a4b0de1x236e0d1e266ce730@mail.gmail.com>
	<fdb5fda0810101031i3a17e40fuc6a06ecf382239a@mail.gmail.com>
	<804e5c70810101317i2ea1fc75he461123c4759d434@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <20081011004037.GB16115@furrr.two14.net>

On Fri, Oct 10, 2008 at 03:17:34PM -0500, Lukasz Szybalski wrote:
> Thanks for the info. It seems as postgresql has the isolation
> implemented which means I will be going with postgre then.

Actually, if you're going to use postgres, you can instantiate the same
kind of incrementing counters that provide autoincrement values to
"serial number" columns, and access them to get unique, sequential
serial numbers.  Well, unique as long as the source that starts with
3000 never sends you more than 999 items, at which time it would clash
with the first one from the source that begins at 4000...

Command:     CREATE SEQUENCE
Description: define a new sequence generator
Syntax:
CREATE [ TEMPORARY | TEMP ] SEQUENCE name [ INCREMENT [ BY ] increment ]
    [ MINVALUE minvalue | NO MINVALUE ] [ MAXVALUE maxvalue | NO MAXVALUE ]
    [ START [ WITH ] start ] [ CACHE cache ] [ [ NO ] CYCLE ]
    [ OWNED BY { table.column | NONE } ]

Refer to the docs for more details, of course.

-- 
Although we may never know with complete certainty the identity
of the winner of this year's presidential election, the identity
of the loser is perfectly clear.  It is the nation's confidence
in the judge as an impartial guardian of the law.
 - Justice John Paul Stevens, from his dissenting opinion Dec 12, 2000


From mandric at gmail.com  Sat Oct 11 07:08:18 2008
From: mandric at gmail.com (Milan Andric)
Date: Sat, 11 Oct 2008 00:08:18 -0500
Subject: [Chicago] Miro + set top
In-Reply-To: <fdb5fda0810101257s2699f826n9b750b513eba9b69@mail.gmail.com>
References: <1430059119.659101223650735923.JavaMail.root@mail-3.01.com>
	<536089f30810101236p28fd0519o8eaa262f6337110d@mail.gmail.com>
	<fdb5fda0810101257s2699f826n9b750b513eba9b69@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <536089f30810102208g2970b79dn8d8e4787f6c7a927@mail.gmail.com>

On Fri, Oct 10, 2008 at 2:57 PM, David Durham, Jr.
<david.durham.jr at gmail.com> wrote:
> On 10/10/08, Milan Andric <mandric at gmail.com> wrote:
>> One thing I find annoying is that dvd vendors don't put network ports
>>  on dvd players.  Why does a guy have to sacrifice a goat to get a
>>  cheap $.50 piece of hardware and basic video decoder software on his
>>  dvd player?
>>
>>  These things sell like hot cakes all over the world except where
>>  people have lots of extra money to throw around on their dvd
>>  collections.
>>
>>  http://www.amazon.com/Avel-Linkplayer-Multimedia-Player-Networkable/dp/B000F8M6TA?tag=particculturf-20
>
> If all you want to do is send/stream your media across a local
> network, Popcorn hour is an option:
>
>   http://www.popcornhour.com/onlinestore/
>
> If you're looking to turn a spare computer into your psychopathic
> media megalomaniac, here's a link to relevant MythTV (and thus linux)
> hardware info:
>
>  http://www.mythtv.org/wiki/index.php/Category:Hardware


Never heard of popcorn player, but I've played with mythTv quite a
bit, actually just sold my hauppauge card on craigslist a few days
ago.  But my point is that there are already 5 boxes in my
entertainment center and 50 or so different dvd players at the stores.
Yet none of them have a simple ethernet port on them. That says alot
about the state of the art to me.

> Anyway, maybe it would be interesting to see a Miro plugin for MythTV.
>  Or if Miro added support for a MythTV backend as a kind of local
> feeds source, that would be useful because the cross-platform
> myth-frontends space is kind of sparse, but slowly filling up.

Yep, ideally you'd have one box that can play dvd/cd media as well as
anything on the local network or search/subscribe to feeds/podcasts,
and you could sit on the couch for a while. :)

--
Milan

From bray at sent.com  Sat Oct 11 23:22:31 2008
From: bray at sent.com (Brian Ray)
Date: Sat, 11 Oct 2008 16:22:31 -0500
Subject: [Chicago] OT 2 tickets
Message-ID: <BF6FCC32-3E9C-4A9A-967E-673C2055AC33@sent.com>


Hey all,

I have 2 extra Kooks tickets for tonight @ riviera. Ian willing to  
give away or would accept small donation :) I will be up in that area  
around 6 pm doors open at 8pm. Call or txt me at 773 835 9876. First  
come.

Sori to be see of, but I am sure we will end up talking about python  
at some point tonight.

--Brian

From szybalski at gmail.com  Sun Oct 12 06:34:49 2008
From: szybalski at gmail.com (Lukasz Szybalski)
Date: Sat, 11 Oct 2008 23:34:49 -0500
Subject: [Chicago] python to use utf8 as default for everything.
Message-ID: <804e5c70810112134p5baaae04h564d1d059bba5691@mail.gmail.com>

Hello,
I found this post that talks about how to switch default python
encoding to uft8 using sys.setdefaultencoding('utf-8').

http://blog.ianbicking.org/illusive-setdefaultencoding.html
sys.setdefaultencoding('utf-8')

but then it somehow gets deleted and needs to be reloaded?!!?? Is that
still the case? I wasn't sure how old this post is?

Thanks,
Lucas

From kumar.mcmillan at gmail.com  Mon Oct 13 02:11:57 2008
From: kumar.mcmillan at gmail.com (Kumar McMillan)
Date: Sun, 12 Oct 2008 19:11:57 -0500
Subject: [Chicago] python to use utf8 as default for everything.
In-Reply-To: <804e5c70810112134p5baaae04h564d1d059bba5691@mail.gmail.com>
References: <804e5c70810112134p5baaae04h564d1d059bba5691@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <b571660a0810121711o3a5fe893pe08230070a7fd161@mail.gmail.com>

On Sat, Oct 11, 2008 at 11:34 PM, Lukasz Szybalski <szybalski at gmail.com> wrote:
> Hello,
> I found this post that talks about how to switch default python
> encoding to uft8 using sys.setdefaultencoding('utf-8').
>
> http://blog.ianbicking.org/illusive-setdefaultencoding.html
> sys.setdefaultencoding('utf-8')

this seems like a good idea at first but IMHO it's a bad one.
Instead, you're better off writing your code to work with the default
encoding of python <= 2.5 which is ascii.  If not, your code will not
be portable.

>
> but then it somehow gets deleted and needs to be reloaded?!!?? Is that
> still the case? I wasn't sure how old this post is?
>
> Thanks,
> Lucas
> _______________________________________________
> Chicago mailing list
> Chicago at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>

From chris.mcavoy at gmail.com  Wed Oct 15 23:24:19 2008
From: chris.mcavoy at gmail.com (Chris McAvoy)
Date: Wed, 15 Oct 2008 16:24:19 -0500
Subject: [Chicago] Paster Templates
Message-ID: <3096c19d0810151424n4b123934p869a86dec5166bf9@mail.gmail.com>

Hi All,

I did 2.5 minutes of googling, so now I'm asking here, just to see:

Has anyone written a Paster template (Hi Ian!) that sets up a Django-based
AppEngine project?

If not, I'm going to...

Chris
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From david.durham.jr at gmail.com  Thu Oct 16 00:06:53 2008
From: david.durham.jr at gmail.com (David Durham, Jr.)
Date: Wed, 15 Oct 2008 17:06:53 -0500
Subject: [Chicago] Paster Templates
In-Reply-To: <3096c19d0810151424n4b123934p869a86dec5166bf9@mail.gmail.com>
References: <3096c19d0810151424n4b123934p869a86dec5166bf9@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <fdb5fda0810151506hb1c8c3cvbc449505ff15cd87@mail.gmail.com>

On Wed, Oct 15, 2008 at 4:24 PM, Chris McAvoy <chris.mcavoy at gmail.com> wrote:
> Hi All,
>
> I did 2.5 minutes of googling, so now I'm asking here, just to see:
>
> Has anyone written a Paster template (Hi Ian!) that sets up a Django-based
> AppEngine project?
>
> If not, I'm going to...

I don't think this is a Paster template, but do you know about the
Google App Engine Helper for Django

   http://code.google.com/p/google-app-engine-django/

If you start at minute 38 of this video, you can hear Guido talk about
what it does:

  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CmyFcChTc4M

-Dave

From chris.mcavoy at gmail.com  Thu Oct 16 00:12:35 2008
From: chris.mcavoy at gmail.com (Chris McAvoy)
Date: Wed, 15 Oct 2008 17:12:35 -0500
Subject: [Chicago] Paster Templates
In-Reply-To: <fdb5fda0810151506hb1c8c3cvbc449505ff15cd87@mail.gmail.com>
References: <3096c19d0810151424n4b123934p869a86dec5166bf9@mail.gmail.com>
	<fdb5fda0810151506hb1c8c3cvbc449505ff15cd87@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <3096c19d0810151512j50f015acse8f65d69005ca256@mail.gmail.com>

On Wed, Oct 15, 2008 at 5:06 PM, David Durham, Jr. <
david.durham.jr at gmail.com> wrote:

> I don't think this is a Paster template, but do you know about the
> Google App Engine Helper for Django
>
>   http://code.google.com/p/google-app-engine-django/
>
>
Oh...you know, that was around when appengine started, but it was sort of
sparse.  It looks filled in.  I'll check it out.  Thanks.

Chris
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From bray at sent.com  Thu Oct 16 16:47:18 2008
From: bray at sent.com (Brian Ray)
Date: Thu, 16 Oct 2008 09:47:18 -0500
Subject: [Chicago] Volunteer Organizer Needed
Message-ID: <9AFD76F9-56CB-4584-9A70-45A4F1C9BD5E@sent.com>

Can someone fill in for me for the next meeting as an organizer.  
Duties are really quite simple:

  * line up speakers, ask the list if they do not present themselves.
  * find/decide on a venue.
  * coordinate with venue.
  * make sure http://chipy.org is organized before the meeting.
  * send an announcement of the meeting 7-2 days before them meeting  
to both chicago list and chicago announcement list.

All you need to do is reply to this thread first saying you can do it!

Thanks so much for helping out this next month.

Warmest Regards,

Brian Ray




From sakamura at gmail.com  Thu Oct 16 17:47:16 2008
From: sakamura at gmail.com (Ishmael Rufus)
Date: Thu, 16 Oct 2008 10:47:16 -0500
Subject: [Chicago] Volunteer Organizer Needed
In-Reply-To: <9AFD76F9-56CB-4584-9A70-45A4F1C9BD5E@sent.com>
References: <9AFD76F9-56CB-4584-9A70-45A4F1C9BD5E@sent.com>
Message-ID: <48F76204.6070502@gmail.com>

Wow.. that's a lot to do.

Is there already a list of speakers for this month?
Brian Ray wrote:
> Can someone fill in for me for the next meeting as an organizer. 
> Duties are really quite simple:
>
>  * line up speakers, ask the list if they do not present themselves.
>  * find/decide on a venue.
>  * coordinate with venue.
>  * make sure http://chipy.org is organized before the meeting.
>  * send an announcement of the meeting 7-2 days before them meeting to 
> both chicago list and chicago announcement list.
>
> All you need to do is reply to this thread first saying you can do it!
>
> Thanks so much for helping out this next month.
>
> Warmest Regards,
>
> Brian Ray
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Chicago mailing list
> Chicago at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago


From carl at personnelware.com  Thu Oct 16 19:31:19 2008
From: carl at personnelware.com (Carl Karsten)
Date: Thu, 16 Oct 2008 12:31:19 -0500
Subject: [Chicago] Volunteer Organizer Needed
In-Reply-To: <9AFD76F9-56CB-4584-9A70-45A4F1C9BD5E@sent.com>
References: <9AFD76F9-56CB-4584-9A70-45A4F1C9BD5E@sent.com>
Message-ID: <48F77A67.90005@personnelware.com>

Brian Ray wrote:
> Can someone fill in for me for the next meeting as an organizer. Duties
> are really quite simple:
> 

add to the list:

* make sure we have a projector.

>  * line up speakers, ask the list if they do not present themselves.
>  * find/decide on a venue.

I'll make Rosemont happen if nothing else does.

yes, that is a threat, so someone better step up.

Carl K

From pfein at pobox.com  Thu Oct 16 20:59:30 2008
From: pfein at pobox.com (Pete)
Date: Thu, 16 Oct 2008 13:59:30 -0500
Subject: [Chicago] Volunteer Organizer Needed
In-Reply-To: <48F77A67.90005@personnelware.com>
References: <9AFD76F9-56CB-4584-9A70-45A4F1C9BD5E@sent.com>
	<48F77A67.90005@personnelware.com>
Message-ID: <439B7698-779F-45B4-AC49-AD52A8B634CA@pobox.com>


On Oct 16, 2008, at 12:31 PM, Carl Karsten wrote:

> Brian Ray wrote:
>>
>> * line up speakers, ask the list if they do not present themselves.

I'll talk briefly about... something!

> yes, that is a threat, so someone better step up.

Step!

--Pete

From g at rrett.us.com  Thu Oct 16 22:06:19 2008
From: g at rrett.us.com (Garrett Smith)
Date: Thu, 16 Oct 2008 15:06:19 -0500 (CDT)
Subject: [Chicago] Integrated wiki + forums
In-Reply-To: <1153173823.2597451224187308487.JavaMail.root@mail-3.01.com>
Message-ID: <835529437.2599131224187579154.JavaMail.root@mail-3.01.com>

Has anyone bumped into a decent wiki + forums tool? This would look something like trac, but serve more for general content sharing and knowledge exchange than for software project management. 

This is for a public facing support site, providing technical docs, knowledge articles, etc. as well discussion forums. 

Doesn't have to be in Python. Would prefer to avoid bloated hugeness ala Plone, Drupal, etc. 

The current leaning is MediaWiki and PhpBB -- both of which feel kinda dated and lame to me. I'd love to turn up a better option. 

Garrett 
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From bob.haugen at gmail.com  Thu Oct 16 22:13:46 2008
From: bob.haugen at gmail.com (Bob Haugen)
Date: Thu, 16 Oct 2008 15:13:46 -0500
Subject: [Chicago] Integrated wiki + forums
In-Reply-To: <835529437.2599131224187579154.JavaMail.root@mail-3.01.com>
References: <1153173823.2597451224187308487.JavaMail.root@mail-3.01.com>
	<835529437.2599131224187579154.JavaMail.root@mail-3.01.com>
Message-ID: <343ecb3e0810161313q299476aod01bb7014e9e8a1a@mail.gmail.com>

On Thu, Oct 16, 2008 at 3:06 PM, Garrett Smith <g at rrett.us.com> wrote:
> Has anyone bumped into a decent wiki + forums tool? This would look
> something like trac, but serve more for general content sharing and
> knowledge exchange than for software project management.

Depending on your schedule, http://pinaxproject.com/ has wikis now,
and plans to have forums.

The complete_project might be too big, and the basic_project is too
small.  And unfortunately the Goldilocks size is up to you (removing
components from the papa project or adding them to the baby).  But
more sizes and features are in the works.

From g at rrett.us.com  Thu Oct 16 22:28:00 2008
From: g at rrett.us.com (Garrett Smith)
Date: Thu, 16 Oct 2008 15:28:00 -0500 (CDT)
Subject: [Chicago] Integrated wiki + forums
In-Reply-To: <1781692188.2608521224188791200.JavaMail.root@mail-3.01.com>
Message-ID: <841942446.2609531224188880635.JavaMail.root@mail-3.01.com>

This looks pretty cool. It's nice to have something that's tackling the "composite application" story in Python. It'd be interesting to see if this model could be peeled away from dependence on a full stack like Django and turned into a middleware architecture -- like wsgi but for apps.

----- "Bob Haugen" <bob.haugen at gmail.com> wrote:

> On Thu, Oct 16, 2008 at 3:06 PM, Garrett Smith <g at rrett.us.com>
> wrote:
> > Has anyone bumped into a decent wiki + forums tool? This would look
> > something like trac, but serve more for general content sharing and
> > knowledge exchange than for software project management.
> 
> Depending on your schedule, http://pinaxproject.com/ has wikis now,
> and plans to have forums.
> 
> The complete_project might be too big, and the basic_project is too
> small.  And unfortunately the Goldilocks size is up to you (removing
> components from the papa project or adding them to the baby).  But
> more sizes and features are in the works.
> _______________________________________________
> Chicago mailing list
> Chicago at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago

From ianb at colorstudy.com  Thu Oct 16 22:31:26 2008
From: ianb at colorstudy.com (Ian Bicking)
Date: Thu, 16 Oct 2008 16:31:26 -0400
Subject: [Chicago] Integrated wiki + forums
In-Reply-To: <841942446.2609531224188880635.JavaMail.root@mail-3.01.com>
References: <841942446.2609531224188880635.JavaMail.root@mail-3.01.com>
Message-ID: <48F7A49E.2070500@colorstudy.com>

Garrett Smith wrote:
> This looks pretty cool. It's nice to have something that's tackling
> the "composite application" story in Python. It'd be interesting to
> see if this model could be peeled away from dependence on a full
> stack like Django and turned into a middleware architecture -- like
> wsgi but for apps.

That's kind of the idea of a project I'm working on:
   http://deliverance.openplans.org

-- 
Ian Bicking : ianb at colorstudy.com : http://blog.ianbicking.org

From bob.haugen at gmail.com  Thu Oct 16 22:39:11 2008
From: bob.haugen at gmail.com (Bob Haugen)
Date: Thu, 16 Oct 2008 15:39:11 -0500
Subject: [Chicago] Integrated wiki + forums
In-Reply-To: <48F7A49E.2070500@colorstudy.com>
References: <841942446.2609531224188880635.JavaMail.root@mail-3.01.com>
	<48F7A49E.2070500@colorstudy.com>
Message-ID: <343ecb3e0810161339p39e0e6d1pd1cc690053d63945@mail.gmail.com>

On Thu, Oct 16, 2008 at 3:31 PM, Ian Bicking <ianb at colorstudy.com> wrote:
> Garrett Smith wrote:
>>
>> This looks pretty cool. It's nice to have something that's tackling
>> the "composite application" story in Python. It'd be interesting to
>> see if this model could be peeled away from dependence on a full
>> stack like Django and turned into a middleware architecture -- like
>> wsgi but for apps.
>
> That's kind of the idea of a project I'm working on:
>  http://deliverance.openplans.org

Ian,  I'm also interested in Deliverance.  But you might ponder the
history of Pinax.  People talked about composite apps and built little
tidbits for a year, but it took off when a few of them actually built
and deployed (over a weekend, I think) a working demonstration
composite app.  Got anything like that in mind?

From mdipierro at cs.depaul.edu  Thu Oct 16 22:39:24 2008
From: mdipierro at cs.depaul.edu (Massimo Di Pierro)
Date: Thu, 16 Oct 2008 15:39:24 -0500
Subject: [Chicago] Integrated wiki + forums
In-Reply-To: <835529437.2599131224187579154.JavaMail.root@mail-3.01.com>
References: <835529437.2599131224187579154.JavaMail.root@mail-3.01.com>
Message-ID: <54B333F9-6A8E-4D07-94B1-6BFCD7F40D39@cs.depaul.edu>

Have you looked at KPAX?

Code: http://mdp.cti.depaul.edu/appliances/default/show/37
Video: http://www.vimeo.com/1098656

It has wiki, blog, news, folders, news, surveys, chat line, CAS based  
authentication and group based access control. It is written in Python.

Massimo


On Oct 16, 2008, at 3:06 PM, Garrett Smith wrote:

> Has anyone bumped into a decent wiki + forums tool? This would look  
> something like trac, but serve more for general content sharing and  
> knowledge exchange than for software project management.
>
> This is for a public facing support site, providing technical docs,  
> knowledge articles, etc. as well discussion forums.
>
> Doesn't have to be in Python. Would prefer to avoid bloated hugeness  
> ala Plone, Drupal, etc.
>
> The current leaning is MediaWiki and PhpBB -- both of which feel  
> kinda dated and lame to me. I'd love to turn up a better option.
>
> Garrett
> <ATT00001.txt>

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From bob.haugen at gmail.com  Thu Oct 16 22:45:49 2008
From: bob.haugen at gmail.com (Bob Haugen)
Date: Thu, 16 Oct 2008 15:45:49 -0500
Subject: [Chicago] Integrated wiki + forums
In-Reply-To: <343ecb3e0810161339p39e0e6d1pd1cc690053d63945@mail.gmail.com>
References: <841942446.2609531224188880635.JavaMail.root@mail-3.01.com>
	<48F7A49E.2070500@colorstudy.com>
	<343ecb3e0810161339p39e0e6d1pd1cc690053d63945@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <343ecb3e0810161345s555f9f58o5635a28a07690c8a@mail.gmail.com>

On Thu, Oct 16, 2008 at 3:39 PM, Bob Haugen <bob.haugen at gmail.com> wrote:
> [Pinax] took off when a few of them actually built
> and deployed (over a weekend, I think) a working demonstration
> composite app.  Got anything like that in mind?
>

Oops, yes you do:
http://www.openplans.org/projects/deliverance/to-do-for-release

"[OK] Live demo site.  Potentially deliverance.openplans.org, or
something silly like mygirlyzope.openplans.org"

From ianb at colorstudy.com  Thu Oct 16 22:51:13 2008
From: ianb at colorstudy.com (Ian Bicking)
Date: Thu, 16 Oct 2008 16:51:13 -0400
Subject: [Chicago] Integrated wiki + forums
In-Reply-To: <343ecb3e0810161339p39e0e6d1pd1cc690053d63945@mail.gmail.com>
References: <841942446.2609531224188880635.JavaMail.root@mail-3.01.com>	<48F7A49E.2070500@colorstudy.com>
	<343ecb3e0810161339p39e0e6d1pd1cc690053d63945@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <48F7A941.3010802@colorstudy.com>

Bob Haugen wrote:
> On Thu, Oct 16, 2008 at 3:31 PM, Ian Bicking <ianb at colorstudy.com> wrote:
>> Garrett Smith wrote:
>>> This looks pretty cool. It's nice to have something that's tackling
>>> the "composite application" story in Python. It'd be interesting to
>>> see if this model could be peeled away from dependence on a full
>>> stack like Django and turned into a middleware architecture -- like
>>> wsgi but for apps.
>> That's kind of the idea of a project I'm working on:
>>  http://deliverance.openplans.org
> 
> Ian,  I'm also interested in Deliverance.  But you might ponder the
> history of Pinax.  People talked about composite apps and built little
> tidbits for a year, but it took off when a few of them actually built
> and deployed (over a weekend, I think) a working demonstration
> composite app.  Got anything like that in mind?

In part I want to scrape together the right process management pieces 
and whatnot, so I can actually put up a demo that works and stays up. 
I'm afraid I've had too many fragile demos so now I go with conservative 
deployments (like the current static site) until I... well, until I 
figure out how this should all plug together beyond just the HTTP/HTML 
parts (which is another separate but highly related piece).

-- 
Ian Bicking : ianb at colorstudy.com : http://blog.ianbicking.org

From erion.omeri at gmail.com  Thu Oct 16 22:58:37 2008
From: erion.omeri at gmail.com (Erion Omeri)
Date: Thu, 16 Oct 2008 15:58:37 -0500
Subject: [Chicago] Integrated wiki + forums
In-Reply-To: <54B333F9-6A8E-4D07-94B1-6BFCD7F40D39@cs.depaul.edu>
References: <835529437.2599131224187579154.JavaMail.root@mail-3.01.com>
	<54B333F9-6A8E-4D07-94B1-6BFCD7F40D39@cs.depaul.edu>
Message-ID: <5923d77c0810161358p22eedf05ide88321272767152@mail.gmail.com>

That was very interesting, and looked really easy to use.

On Thu, Oct 16, 2008 at 3:39 PM, Massimo Di Pierro
<mdipierro at cs.depaul.edu> wrote:
> Have you looked at KPAX?
> Code: http://mdp.cti.depaul.edu/appliances/default/show/37
> Video: http://www.vimeo.com/1098656
> It has wiki, blog, news, folders, news, surveys, chat line, CAS based
> authentication and group based access control. It is written in Python.
> Massimo
>
> On Oct 16, 2008, at 3:06 PM, Garrett Smith wrote:
>
> Has anyone bumped into a decent wiki + forums tool? This would look
> something like trac, but serve more for general content sharing and
> knowledge exchange than for software project management.
>
> This is for a public facing support site, providing technical docs,
> knowledge articles, etc. as well discussion forums.
>
> Doesn't have to be in Python. Would prefer to avoid bloated hugeness ala
> Plone, Drupal, etc.
>
> The current leaning is MediaWiki and PhpBB -- both of which feel kinda dated
> and lame to me. I'd love to turn up a better option.
>
> Garrett
> <ATT00001.txt>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Chicago mailing list
> Chicago at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>
>

From shekay at pobox.com  Thu Oct 16 23:01:15 2008
From: shekay at pobox.com (sheila miguez)
Date: Thu, 16 Oct 2008 16:01:15 -0500
Subject: [Chicago] Volunteer Organizer Needed
In-Reply-To: <48F77A67.90005@personnelware.com>
References: <9AFD76F9-56CB-4584-9A70-45A4F1C9BD5E@sent.com>
	<48F77A67.90005@personnelware.com>
Message-ID: <a68ced640810161401l1b66d5cwedcaffe949635c9d@mail.gmail.com>

On Thu, Oct 16, 2008 at 12:31 PM, Carl Karsten <carl at personnelware.com> wrote:
> Brian Ray wrote:
>> Can someone fill in for me for the next meeting as an organizer. Duties
>> are really quite simple:
>>
>
> add to the list:
>
> * make sure we have a projector.
>
>>  * line up speakers, ask the list if they do not present themselves.
>>  * find/decide on a venue.
>
> I'll make Rosemont happen if nothing else does.
>
> yes, that is a threat, so someone better step up.

I am not going to Rosemont! evil!



-- 
sheila

From g at rrett.us.com  Thu Oct 16 23:27:51 2008
From: g at rrett.us.com (Garrett Smith)
Date: Thu, 16 Oct 2008 16:27:51 -0500 (CDT)
Subject: [Chicago] Integrated wiki + forums
In-Reply-To: <1145500015.2629401224192167142.JavaMail.root@mail-3.01.com>
Message-ID: <645788638.2631551224192471187.JavaMail.root@mail-3.01.com>

A couple marque apps (e.g. MediaWiki + WordPress), tied together with a simple skin and common authentication scheme would work.

Wow, that'd be a proof of concept!

----- "Ian Bicking" <ianb at colorstudy.com> wrote:

> Bob Haugen wrote:
> > On Thu, Oct 16, 2008 at 3:31 PM, Ian Bicking <ianb at colorstudy.com>
> wrote:
> >> Garrett Smith wrote:
> >>> This looks pretty cool. It's nice to have something that's
> tackling
> >>> the "composite application" story in Python. It'd be interesting
> to
> >>> see if this model could be peeled away from dependence on a full
> >>> stack like Django and turned into a middleware architecture --
> like
> >>> wsgi but for apps.
> >> That's kind of the idea of a project I'm working on:
> >>  http://deliverance.openplans.org
> > 
> > Ian,  I'm also interested in Deliverance.  But you might ponder the
> > history of Pinax.  People talked about composite apps and built
> little
> > tidbits for a year, but it took off when a few of them actually
> built
> > and deployed (over a weekend, I think) a working demonstration
> > composite app.  Got anything like that in mind?
> 
> In part I want to scrape together the right process management pieces
> 
> and whatnot, so I can actually put up a demo that works and stays up.
> 
> I'm afraid I've had too many fragile demos so now I go with
> conservative 
> deployments (like the current static site) until I... well, until I 
> figure out how this should all plug together beyond just the HTTP/HTML
> 
> parts (which is another separate but highly related piece).
> 
> -- 
> Ian Bicking : ianb at colorstudy.com : http://blog.ianbicking.org
> _______________________________________________
> Chicago mailing list
> Chicago at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago

From mdipierro at cs.depaul.edu  Thu Oct 16 23:29:23 2008
From: mdipierro at cs.depaul.edu (Massimo Di Pierro)
Date: Thu, 16 Oct 2008 16:29:23 -0500
Subject: [Chicago] Integrated wiki + forums
In-Reply-To: <5923d77c0810161358p22eedf05ide88321272767152@mail.gmail.com>
References: <835529437.2599131224187579154.JavaMail.root@mail-3.01.com>
	<54B333F9-6A8E-4D07-94B1-6BFCD7F40D39@cs.depaul.edu>
	<5923d77c0810161358p22eedf05ide88321272767152@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <4BBE8A87-17D8-4924-935C-4992C6EC969C@cs.depaul.edu>

I will soon get working on a version 2.0 so if you have a request for  
additional features let me know.

Massimo


On Oct 16, 2008, at 3:58 PM, Erion Omeri wrote:

> That was very interesting, and looked really easy to use.
>
> On Thu, Oct 16, 2008 at 3:39 PM, Massimo Di Pierro
> <mdipierro at cs.depaul.edu> wrote:
>> Have you looked at KPAX?
>> Code: http://mdp.cti.depaul.edu/appliances/default/show/37
>> Video: http://www.vimeo.com/1098656
>> It has wiki, blog, news, folders, news, surveys, chat line, CAS based
>> authentication and group based access control. It is written in  
>> Python.
>> Massimo
>>
>> On Oct 16, 2008, at 3:06 PM, Garrett Smith wrote:
>>
>> Has anyone bumped into a decent wiki + forums tool? This would look
>> something like trac, but serve more for general content sharing and
>> knowledge exchange than for software project management.
>>
>> This is for a public facing support site, providing technical docs,
>> knowledge articles, etc. as well discussion forums.
>>
>> Doesn't have to be in Python. Would prefer to avoid bloated  
>> hugeness ala
>> Plone, Drupal, etc.
>>
>> The current leaning is MediaWiki and PhpBB -- both of which feel  
>> kinda dated
>> and lame to me. I'd love to turn up a better option.
>>
>> Garrett
>> <ATT00001.txt>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Chicago mailing list
>> Chicago at python.org
>> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>>
>>
> _______________________________________________
> Chicago mailing list
> Chicago at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago


From ianb at colorstudy.com  Thu Oct 16 23:32:00 2008
From: ianb at colorstudy.com (Ian Bicking)
Date: Thu, 16 Oct 2008 17:32:00 -0400
Subject: [Chicago] Integrated wiki + forums
In-Reply-To: <645788638.2631551224192471187.JavaMail.root@mail-3.01.com>
References: <645788638.2631551224192471187.JavaMail.root@mail-3.01.com>
Message-ID: <48F7B2D0.8000305@colorstudy.com>

Garrett Smith wrote:
> A couple marque apps (e.g. MediaWiki + WordPress), tied together with
> a simple skin and common authentication scheme would work.
> 
> Wow, that'd be a proof of concept!

We do that on openplans.org -- the blogs are WordPress, the wiki is a 
modified Plone (as well as the mailing list), and then we have some 
other smaller pieces.  We implement common auth by having Plone drive 
the authentication, and then sync up its user db with WordPress, and 
some WordPress code to read Plone's auth cookie.

ClueMapper is using Deliverance to tie together a couple other pieces 
(Trac, a paste-bin, and a time tracker): 
http://projects.serverzen.com/pm/p/cluemapper

-- 
Ian Bicking : ianb at colorstudy.com : http://blog.ianbicking.org

From g at rrett.us.com  Thu Oct 16 23:37:50 2008
From: g at rrett.us.com (Garrett Smith)
Date: Thu, 16 Oct 2008 16:37:50 -0500 (CDT)
Subject: [Chicago] Integrated wiki + forums
In-Reply-To: <48F7B2D0.8000305@colorstudy.com>
Message-ID: <389780957.2634781224193070843.JavaMail.root@mail-3.01.com>

Are any of these site configurations rolled up as a template/project thingy that one could use for tire kicking?

----- "Ian Bicking" <ianb at colorstudy.com> wrote:

> Garrett Smith wrote:
> > A couple marque apps (e.g. MediaWiki + WordPress), tied together
> with
> > a simple skin and common authentication scheme would work.
> > 
> > Wow, that'd be a proof of concept!
> 
> We do that on openplans.org -- the blogs are WordPress, the wiki is a
> 
> modified Plone (as well as the mailing list), and then we have some 
> other smaller pieces.  We implement common auth by having Plone drive
> 
> the authentication, and then sync up its user db with WordPress, and 
> some WordPress code to read Plone's auth cookie.
> 
> ClueMapper is using Deliverance to tie together a couple other pieces
> 
> (Trac, a paste-bin, and a time tracker): 
> http://projects.serverzen.com/pm/p/cluemapper
> 
> -- 
> Ian Bicking : ianb at colorstudy.com : http://blog.ianbicking.org
> _______________________________________________
> Chicago mailing list
> Chicago at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago

From chris.mcavoy at gmail.com  Thu Oct 16 23:47:07 2008
From: chris.mcavoy at gmail.com (Chris McAvoy)
Date: Thu, 16 Oct 2008 16:47:07 -0500
Subject: [Chicago] Fwd: [Chicago-talk] Oktoberfestive social meetup
In-Reply-To: <2715accf0810161436u69d0da2dn3b24b7717b558df6@mail.gmail.com>
References: <Pine.GSO.4.61.0810141407150.25793@shell3>
	<2715accf0810161436u69d0da2dn3b24b7717b558df6@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <3096c19d0810161447v1e526d1at8ab422d68070865@mail.gmail.com>

The Perl Folks invited us to a meetup next Thursday:

"""
At the Git-a-thon, brian expressed the desire for an
qr/O[ck]tober\s?[fF]est/ dinner meetup at Lincoln Square's Chicago
Brauhaus, located right off the Western Ave. Brown Line stop.
(http://www.yelp.com/biz/chicago-brauhaus-chicago)

How about next Thursday, the 23rd?

-- Mike F.
"""

I'll forward details as they become available.

Chris
 <http://www.pair.com/%7Ecomdog/>
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From chris.mcavoy at gmail.com  Thu Oct 16 23:54:09 2008
From: chris.mcavoy at gmail.com (Chris McAvoy)
Date: Thu, 16 Oct 2008 16:54:09 -0500
Subject: [Chicago] Integrated wiki + forums
In-Reply-To: <48F7B2D0.8000305@colorstudy.com>
References: <645788638.2631551224192471187.JavaMail.root@mail-3.01.com>
	<48F7B2D0.8000305@colorstudy.com>
Message-ID: <3096c19d0810161454q2383cce7sd38dffdf31a5bca7@mail.gmail.com>

Authentication...gah

On Thu, Oct 16, 2008 at 4:32 PM, Ian Bicking <ianb at colorstudy.com> wrote:

>
> We do that on openplans.org -- the blogs are WordPress, the wiki is a
> modified Plone (as well as the mailing list), and then we have some other
> smaller pieces.  We implement common auth by having Plone drive the
> authentication, and then sync up its user db with WordPress, and some
> WordPress code to read Plone's auth cookie.
>
> ClueMapper is using Deliverance to tie together a couple other pieces
> (Trac, a paste-bin, and a time tracker):
> http://projects.serverzen.com/pm/p/cluemapper
>

IBM has a social network product that we're using internally at PSC called
Connections.  It's not too shabby, but it seems like something that could
just as well be a loose conflagration of best of breed tools.  The missing
piece, imho, is that single sign on authentication / authorization service.

A few months ago, I spend a great deal of time setting up CAS (
http://www.ja-sig.org/products/cas/) and getting it to run with Django.
Massimo has done the same with KPAX.

CAS has a really simple API, and does a good job of allowing you to choose
from a variety of auth backends (ldap, database...other stuff), it then
passes credentials back to the applications through a token...it's up to the
apps to handle authorization bits.  It's a nice scheme.  HOWEVER, CAS is a
total pain to set up.  At least, it was for me, as its a JEE app.

I know that there's some sorts of movement towards distributed auth schemes,
but none of them seem to tackle single sign on for internal apps.  It's a
space that's sort of been abandoned by Python folks.

It's really yet another case of the Java enterprise guys handing us our
asses by providing a few tools that end up making a ton of sense.

Anywho, I started drafting the above as a blog post last week...kind of
funny timing.

Chris
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From chris.mcavoy at gmail.com  Thu Oct 16 23:57:53 2008
From: chris.mcavoy at gmail.com (Chris McAvoy)
Date: Thu, 16 Oct 2008 16:57:53 -0500
Subject: [Chicago] Integrated wiki + forums
In-Reply-To: <3096c19d0810161454q2383cce7sd38dffdf31a5bca7@mail.gmail.com>
References: <645788638.2631551224192471187.JavaMail.root@mail-3.01.com>
	<48F7B2D0.8000305@colorstudy.com>
	<3096c19d0810161454q2383cce7sd38dffdf31a5bca7@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <3096c19d0810161457p71f6424at2c5c070d5c70dbe@mail.gmail.com>

Ian Bicking just stole my heart:
http://blog.ianbicking.org/2008/10/06/the-philosophy-of-deliverance/

I love that guy.

On Thu, Oct 16, 2008 at 4:54 PM, Chris McAvoy <chris.mcavoy at gmail.com>wrote:

> Authentication...gah
>
> On Thu, Oct 16, 2008 at 4:32 PM, Ian Bicking <ianb at colorstudy.com> wrote:
>
>>
>> We do that on openplans.org -- the blogs are WordPress, the wiki is a
>> modified Plone (as well as the mailing list), and then we have some other
>> smaller pieces.  We implement common auth by having Plone drive the
>> authentication, and then sync up its user db with WordPress, and some
>> WordPress code to read Plone's auth cookie.
>>
>> ClueMapper is using Deliverance to tie together a couple other pieces
>> (Trac, a paste-bin, and a time tracker):
>> http://projects.serverzen.com/pm/p/cluemapper
>>
>
> IBM has a social network product that we're using internally at PSC called
> Connections.  It's not too shabby, but it seems like something that could
> just as well be a loose conflagration of best of breed tools.  The missing
> piece, imho, is that single sign on authentication / authorization service.
>
> A few months ago, I spend a great deal of time setting up CAS (
> http://www.ja-sig.org/products/cas/) and getting it to run with Django.
> Massimo has done the same with KPAX.
>
> CAS has a really simple API, and does a good job of allowing you to choose
> from a variety of auth backends (ldap, database...other stuff), it then
> passes credentials back to the applications through a token...it's up to the
> apps to handle authorization bits.  It's a nice scheme.  HOWEVER, CAS is a
> total pain to set up.  At least, it was for me, as its a JEE app.
>
> I know that there's some sorts of movement towards distributed auth
> schemes, but none of them seem to tackle single sign on for internal apps.
> It's a space that's sort of been abandoned by Python folks.
>
> It's really yet another case of the Java enterprise guys handing us our
> asses by providing a few tools that end up making a ton of sense.
>
> Anywho, I started drafting the above as a blog post last week...kind of
> funny timing.
>
> Chris
>
>
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From mdipierro at cs.depaul.edu  Fri Oct 17 00:02:28 2008
From: mdipierro at cs.depaul.edu (Massimo Di Pierro)
Date: Thu, 16 Oct 2008 17:02:28 -0500
Subject: [Chicago] Integrated wiki + forums
In-Reply-To: <3096c19d0810161457p71f6424at2c5c070d5c70dbe@mail.gmail.com>
References: <645788638.2631551224192471187.JavaMail.root@mail-3.01.com>
	<48F7B2D0.8000305@colorstudy.com>
	<3096c19d0810161454q2383cce7sd38dffdf31a5bca7@mail.gmail.com>
	<3096c19d0810161457p71f6424at2c5c070d5c70dbe@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CA17E92E-ADAC-4F69-B408-DCC2062913C1@cs.depaul.edu>

I agree,

CAS comes with its own provider/consumer but I also run a provider  
here (https://mdp.cti.depaul.edu/cas) so that  users can connect to  
that and do not have to set it up. Still a lot of people find it  
unnecessary complex for most apps. So I got rid of it in T2

http://mdp.cti.depaul.edu/examples/static/t2.pdf
http://mdp.cti.depaul.edu/examples/static/web2py.app.plugin_t2.tar

I see a lot of potential overlap between what you are doing and T2.  
Perhaps you want to join forces?

Massimo


On Oct 16, 2008, at 4:57 PM, Chris McAvoy wrote:

> Ian Bicking just stole my heart:  http://blog.ianbicking.org/2008/10/06/the-philosophy-of-deliverance/
>
> I love that guy.
>
> On Thu, Oct 16, 2008 at 4:54 PM, Chris McAvoy  
> <chris.mcavoy at gmail.com> wrote:
> Authentication...gah
>
> On Thu, Oct 16, 2008 at 4:32 PM, Ian Bicking <ianb at colorstudy.com>  
> wrote:
>
> We do that on openplans.org -- the blogs are WordPress, the wiki is  
> a modified Plone (as well as the mailing list), and then we have  
> some other smaller pieces.  We implement common auth by having Plone  
> drive the authentication, and then sync up its user db with  
> WordPress, and some WordPress code to read Plone's auth cookie.
>
> ClueMapper is using Deliverance to tie together a couple other  
> pieces (Trac, a paste-bin, and a time tracker): http://projects.serverzen.com/pm/p/cluemapper
>
> IBM has a social network product that we're using internally at PSC  
> called Connections.  It's not too shabby, but it seems like  
> something that could just as well be a loose conflagration of best  
> of breed tools.  The missing piece, imho, is that single sign on  
> authentication / authorization service.
>
> A few months ago, I spend a great deal of time setting up CAS (http://www.ja-sig.org/products/cas/ 
> ) and getting it to run with Django.  Massimo has done the same with  
> KPAX.
>
> CAS has a really simple API, and does a good job of allowing you to  
> choose from a variety of auth backends (ldap, database...other  
> stuff), it then passes credentials back to the applications through  
> a token...it's up to the apps to handle authorization bits.  It's a  
> nice scheme.  HOWEVER, CAS is a total pain to set up.  At least, it  
> was for me, as its a JEE app.
>
> I know that there's some sorts of movement towards distributed auth  
> schemes, but none of them seem to tackle single sign on for internal  
> apps.  It's a space that's sort of been abandoned by Python folks.
>
> It's really yet another case of the Java enterprise guys handing us  
> our asses by providing a few tools that end up making a ton of sense.
>
> Anywho, I started drafting the above as a blog post last week...kind  
> of funny timing.
>
> Chris
>
>
> <ATT00001.txt>

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From g at rrett.us.com  Fri Oct 17 00:16:11 2008
From: g at rrett.us.com (Garrett Smith)
Date: Thu, 16 Oct 2008 17:16:11 -0500 (CDT)
Subject: [Chicago] Integrated wiki + forums
In-Reply-To: <48F7A49E.2070500@colorstudy.com>
Message-ID: <2122649114.2723041224195371446.JavaMail.root@mail-3.01.com>

I spent some time looking at Pinax. I'm surprised at how innovative the approach sounds, despite Zope and Plone having supported mini-app integration within a full stack for, um, like a decade?

I know it's convenient to leverage ORMs and templating frameworks, etc. for app integration, but do we really need another ecosystem that's tightly bound to an uber  framework?

Or, is the case that it's just not possible to build composite apps on a set of low-level support services without those services becoming yet another closed ecosystem? Ian? Anyone?

I appreciate what Deliverance is doing -- it's the extreme other side of integration and it just might be the right approach, if it can succeed. I'm a bit skeptical, but the vision is damn compelling.

----- "Ian Bicking" <ianb at colorstudy.com> wrote:

> Garrett Smith wrote:
> > This looks pretty cool. It's nice to have something that's tackling
> > the "composite application" story in Python. It'd be interesting to
> > see if this model could be peeled away from dependence on a full
> > stack like Django and turned into a middleware architecture -- like
> > wsgi but for apps.
> 
> That's kind of the idea of a project I'm working on:
>    http://deliverance.openplans.org
> 
> -- 
> Ian Bicking : ianb at colorstudy.com : http://blog.ianbicking.org
> _______________________________________________
> Chicago mailing list
> Chicago at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago

From bob.haugen at gmail.com  Fri Oct 17 00:34:23 2008
From: bob.haugen at gmail.com (Bob Haugen)
Date: Thu, 16 Oct 2008 17:34:23 -0500
Subject: [Chicago] Integrated wiki + forums
In-Reply-To: <2122649114.2723041224195371446.JavaMail.root@mail-3.01.com>
References: <48F7A49E.2070500@colorstudy.com>
	<2122649114.2723041224195371446.JavaMail.root@mail-3.01.com>
Message-ID: <343ecb3e0810161534p262747ddhd7fd105e7796507b@mail.gmail.com>

On Thu, Oct 16, 2008 at 5:16 PM, Garrett Smith <g at rrett.us.com> wrote:
> I spent some time looking at Pinax. I'm surprised at how innovative the approach sounds,
> despite Zope and Plone having supported mini-app integration within a full stack for, um, like a decade?
>
> I know it's convenient to leverage ORMs and templating frameworks, etc. for app integration,
> but do we really need another ecosystem that's tightly bound to an uber  framework?
>
> Or, is the case that it's just not possible to build composite apps on a set of low-level support services
> without those services becoming yet another closed ecosystem? Ian? Anyone?

The Pinax guys were already DJango devs before they started, and as
far as I know, never considered any alternatives.  (Not that I think
they should have done so. They did what made sense for them.)

But I understand what you're saying; I run into cases where I would
prefer to use (for example) SqlAlchemy.

From david.durham.jr at gmail.com  Fri Oct 17 00:39:22 2008
From: david.durham.jr at gmail.com (David Durham, Jr.)
Date: Thu, 16 Oct 2008 17:39:22 -0500
Subject: [Chicago] Volunteer Organizer Needed
In-Reply-To: <48F77A67.90005@personnelware.com>
References: <9AFD76F9-56CB-4584-9A70-45A4F1C9BD5E@sent.com>
	<48F77A67.90005@personnelware.com>
Message-ID: <fdb5fda0810161539r1502cd07hb1ebe065863227bb@mail.gmail.com>

>>  * line up speakers, ask the list if they do not present themselves.

I've been poking around with stackless python on a PSP.  I'd be
willing to present in the future if the following occurs:

1 - I actually finish a working game or something else useful with stackless
2 - I get a new PSP with video out (so I can put the demo up on the big screen)

This is a ways out, though.

-Dave

From cstejerean at gmail.com  Fri Oct 17 00:50:32 2008
From: cstejerean at gmail.com (Cosmin Stejerean)
Date: Thu, 16 Oct 2008 17:50:32 -0500
Subject: [Chicago] Integrated wiki + forums
In-Reply-To: <3096c19d0810161454q2383cce7sd38dffdf31a5bca7@mail.gmail.com>
References: <645788638.2631551224192471187.JavaMail.root@mail-3.01.com>
	<48F7B2D0.8000305@colorstudy.com>
	<3096c19d0810161454q2383cce7sd38dffdf31a5bca7@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <276266d0810161550h7196ce57udb92c6c8492d8375@mail.gmail.com>

> IBM has a social network product that we're using internally at PSC called
> Connections.  It's not too shabby, but it seems like something that could
> just as well be a loose conflagration of best of breed tools.  The missing
> piece, imho, is that single sign on authentication / authorization service.
>
> A few months ago, I spend a great deal of time setting up CAS
> (http://www.ja-sig.org/products/cas/) and getting it to run with Django.
> Massimo has done the same with KPAX.
>
> CAS has a really simple API, and does a good job of allowing you to choose
> from a variety of auth backends (ldap, database...other stuff), it then
> passes credentials back to the applications through a token...it's up to the
> apps to handle authorization bits.  It's a nice scheme.  HOWEVER, CAS is a
> total pain to set up.  At least, it was for me, as its a JEE app.
>
> I know that there's some sorts of movement towards distributed auth schemes,
> but none of them seem to tackle single sign on for internal apps.  It's a
> space that's sort of been abandoned by Python folks.
>
> It's really yet another case of the Java enterprise guys handing us our
> asses by providing a few tools that end up making a ton of sense.
>
> Anywho, I started drafting the above as a blog post last week...kind of
> funny timing.
>
> Chris
>
>

For internal corporate apps I like the IBM
authentication/authorization model. Applications typically live behind
a reverse proxy (WebSEAL) which talks to Tivoli Access Manager for the
authentication. URLs can be restricted in WebSEAL. If the URL is
allowed WebSEAL creates a security token (LTPA) that gets passed along
to an application deployed on WebSphere. WebSphere is configured to
trust tokens created by WebSEAL and further authorization can be done
at the application level using JAAS.

I spent a good amount of time reverse engineering the LTPA format and
I'm pretty much at a point where I can interop with this kind of an
environment (either by creating a replacement proxy or by creating
applications that can consume LTPA tokens). I've been meaning to
create some pure Python solutions for a while but I haven't had a need
to deploy Python apps in enterprises that needed single sign-on. One
of these days I'll get around to it and create a pair of WSGI
middleware for the token creation and consumption parts.

-- 
Cosmin Stejerean
http://www.offbytwo.com

From ianb at colorstudy.com  Fri Oct 17 01:04:23 2008
From: ianb at colorstudy.com (Ian Bicking)
Date: Thu, 16 Oct 2008 19:04:23 -0400
Subject: [Chicago] Integrated wiki + forums
In-Reply-To: <389780957.2634781224193070843.JavaMail.root@mail-3.01.com>
References: <389780957.2634781224193070843.JavaMail.root@mail-3.01.com>
Message-ID: <48F7C877.8030809@colorstudy.com>

Garrett Smith wrote:
> Are any of these site configurations rolled up as a template/project
> thingy that one could use for tire kicking?

You can run the large but pretty reliable build for opencore: 
http://www.openplans.org/projects/opencore/getting-started -- it 
includes all the infrastructure we use, including things like process 
management, and I think it sets up the layout we use for managing 
upgrades.  ClueMapper seems to use buildout, which should also be pretty 
straight-forward to build 
(http://projects.serverzen.com/pm/p/cluemapper/wiki/ClueMapperInstall).

Certainly there's some substantial overhead (mostly conceptual, not CPU) 
to using this kind of integration technique.  For myself it's the 
integration technique I'm by far most interested in, so I'm just sucking 
it up and trying to improve it when it seems clear.

I'm hoping to integrate a few other things sometime soon, in some 
yet-to-be-named stack.  repoze.who for authentication, I think, probably 
with a separate product (that a coworker, Rob Miller, might be inclined 
to write, probably in the repoze namespace) to do actual user 
management.  It would send the actual auth info via an HTTP header 
(probably signed), and then you'd have a little piece of middleware to 
move it from the (not entirely trusted) header to 
environ['REMOTE_USER'], which is more conventional (and quite a few 
systems already support or have plugins to read).

For passing trusted headers around we have a simple piece of middleware: 
https://svn.openplans.org/svn/signedheaders/trunk -- the format is 
pretty simple, and somewhere in the repository there's also code to 
consume those headers in PHP.

-- 
Ian Bicking : ianb at colorstudy.com : http://blog.ianbicking.org

From chris.mcavoy at gmail.com  Fri Oct 17 23:49:51 2008
From: chris.mcavoy at gmail.com (Chris McAvoy)
Date: Fri, 17 Oct 2008 16:49:51 -0500
Subject: [Chicago] Pycon Proposals Open
Message-ID: <3096c19d0810171449y4374fa67y1806f6e554112c54@mail.gmail.com>

Kind of slipped past me...and I'm on the committee.

http://us.pycon.org/2009/conference/proposals/

Chris
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From mdipierro at cs.depaul.edu  Sun Oct 19 23:25:19 2008
From: mdipierro at cs.depaul.edu (Massimo Di Pierro)
Date: Sun, 19 Oct 2008 16:25:19 -0500
Subject: [Chicago] pyExcelerator
In-Reply-To: <3096c19d0810171449y4374fa67y1806f6e554112c54@mail.gmail.com>
References: <3096c19d0810171449y4374fa67y1806f6e554112c54@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <0499ACAA-A549-4A2C-AE73-7612DB8A84D9@cs.depaul.edu>

Hello

Has anybody used xlrd or pyExcelerator. Do you know how to extract  
formulas from an excel file?
Actually I only need to write a test to determine if a cell is  
computed or not.
Thanks in advance for the help.

Massimo

From chris.mcavoy at gmail.com  Mon Oct 20 16:36:47 2008
From: chris.mcavoy at gmail.com (Chris McAvoy)
Date: Mon, 20 Oct 2008 09:36:47 -0500
Subject: [Chicago] pyExcelerator
In-Reply-To: <0499ACAA-A549-4A2C-AE73-7612DB8A84D9@cs.depaul.edu>
References: <3096c19d0810171449y4374fa67y1806f6e554112c54@mail.gmail.com>
	<0499ACAA-A549-4A2C-AE73-7612DB8A84D9@cs.depaul.edu>
Message-ID: <3096c19d0810200736r55f66420l828a4b40ddfc29ac@mail.gmail.com>

Hi Massimo,

On Sun, Oct 19, 2008 at 4:25 PM, Massimo Di Pierro
<mdipierro at cs.depaul.edu> wrote:
> Hello
>
> Has anybody used xlrd or pyExcelerator. Do you know how to extract formulas
> from an excel file?

I've used both, but not in the way you need.  Sorry.

Chris

From bray at sent.com  Tue Oct 21 18:47:07 2008
From: bray at sent.com (Brian Ray)
Date: Tue, 21 Oct 2008 11:47:07 -0500
Subject: [Chicago] wiki page For those looking for Python work in Chicago
Message-ID: <F631B315-DFFD-493F-B6F6-50D08D018ECE@sent.com>

Just a reminder:

   <http://chipy.org/looking>

If your looking for any sort of work, go ahead and make it easy for  
those who are looking for people (like me) to find you.  If your an  
employer, why not contact some of these people who have already  
published they are looking for work. You can do this first, before  
posting to this list. Sound good?

Add your information to the wiki page.  Go for it! Do not be shy.  
Being shy does not make it easy for yourself or for those who may want  
to give you a job.  And it may be the job you love and you will get to  
program in Python.

Regards,

Brian Ray




From bray at sent.com  Tue Oct 21 19:21:04 2008
From: bray at sent.com (Brian Ray)
Date: Tue, 21 Oct 2008 12:21:04 -0500
Subject: [Chicago] wiki page For those looking for Python work in Chicago
In-Reply-To: <F631B315-DFFD-493F-B6F6-50D08D018ECE@sent.com>
References: <F631B315-DFFD-493F-B6F6-50D08D018ECE@sent.com>
Message-ID: <16C55E46-F139-4362-84FF-FD3F6C44A910@sent.com>


On Oct 21, 2008, at 11:47 AM, Brian Ray wrote:

> Just a reminder:
>
>  <http://chipy.org/looking>
>
>

Just a point of clarification for the dorks on irc. I put the first  
entry "Guido" as an example.  I do not know if he is looking for work  
or not.

And, btw, #chipy on irc.freenode.net is a good place to chat these  
days. Come visit.

Have a nice day,

Brian Ray




From cstejerean at gmail.com  Tue Oct 21 20:11:22 2008
From: cstejerean at gmail.com (Cosmin Stejerean)
Date: Tue, 21 Oct 2008 13:11:22 -0500
Subject: [Chicago] wiki page For those looking for Python work in Chicago
In-Reply-To: <16C55E46-F139-4362-84FF-FD3F6C44A910@sent.com>
References: <F631B315-DFFD-493F-B6F6-50D08D018ECE@sent.com>
	<16C55E46-F139-4362-84FF-FD3F6C44A910@sent.com>
Message-ID: <276266d0810211111t32fd407fke128a2eb333f88d7@mail.gmail.com>

I went ahead and marked it clearly on the wiki so anyone else coming
across that page won't wonder what's up with Guido.

On Tue, Oct 21, 2008 at 12:21 PM, Brian Ray <bray at sent.com> wrote:
>
> On Oct 21, 2008, at 11:47 AM, Brian Ray wrote:
>
>> Just a reminder:
>>
>>  <http://chipy.org/looking>
>>
>>
>
> Just a point of clarification for the dorks on irc. I put the first entry
> "Guido" as an example.  I do not know if he is looking for work or not.
>
> And, btw, #chipy on irc.freenode.net is a good place to chat these days.
> Come visit.
>
> Have a nice day,
>
> Brian Ray
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Chicago mailing list
> Chicago at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>



-- 
Cosmin Stejerean
http://www.offbytwo.com

From carl at personnelware.com  Tue Oct 21 22:07:25 2008
From: carl at personnelware.com (Carl Karsten)
Date: Tue, 21 Oct 2008 15:07:25 -0500
Subject: [Chicago] weekly hangout: Oct 23, Thurs 6:30
Message-ID: <48FE367D.7030201@personnelware.com>


Fireside,
5739 N Ravenswood Ave
7 blocks north of Imaginary Landscape:

http://maps.google.com/maps?f=d&saddr=5121+North+Ravenswood+Avenue,+Chicago,+IL+60640+(Imaginary+Landscape)&daddr=5739+N+Ravenswood+Ave,+Chicago,+IL+60660+(Fireside)&hl=en&geocode=&mra=ls&dirflg=w&sll=41.978762,-87.674074&sspn=0.019748,0.04004&ie=UTF8&ll=41.980358,-87.674503&spn=0.019747,0.04004&z=15

I may go there in the afternoon and hang out with my laptop.  might get some
work done.

 metra hits ravenswood
inbound  5:13   5:53   6:17   http://metrarail.com/Sched/cnw_n/cnwn_wki.shtml

outbound 5:29 5:34 5:49 6:04 6:13 6:57
http://metrarail.com/Sched/cnw_n/cnwn_wko.shtml

Carl K

From g at rrett.us.com  Tue Oct 21 23:29:17 2008
From: g at rrett.us.com (Garrett Smith)
Date: Tue, 21 Oct 2008 16:29:17 -0500 (CDT)
Subject: [Chicago] weekly hangout: Oct 23, Thurs 6:30
In-Reply-To: <48FE367D.7030201@personnelware.com>
Message-ID: <458549139.1653141224624557208.JavaMail.root@mail-3.01.com>

If there's any way we could make this closer to the loop, I could make it in.

----- "Carl Karsten" <carl at personnelware.com> wrote:

> Fireside,
> 5739 N Ravenswood Ave
> 7 blocks north of Imaginary Landscape:
> 
> http://maps.google.com/maps?f=d&saddr=5121+North+Ravenswood+Avenue,+Chicago,+IL+60640+(Imaginary+Landscape)&daddr=5739+N+Ravenswood+Ave,+Chicago,+IL+60660+(Fireside)&hl=en&geocode=&mra=ls&dirflg=w&sll=41.978762,-87.674074&sspn=0.019748,0.04004&ie=UTF8&ll=41.980358,-87.674503&spn=0.019747,0.04004&z=15
> 
> I may go there in the afternoon and hang out with my laptop.  might
> get some
> work done.
> 
>  metra hits ravenswood
> inbound  5:13   5:53   6:17  
> http://metrarail.com/Sched/cnw_n/cnwn_wki.shtml
> 
> outbound 5:29 5:34 5:49 6:04 6:13 6:57
> http://metrarail.com/Sched/cnw_n/cnwn_wko.shtml
> 
> Carl K
> _______________________________________________
> Chicago mailing list
> Chicago at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago

From jordan at widefido.com  Tue Oct 21 23:38:54 2008
From: jordan at widefido.com (Jordan Sherer)
Date: Tue, 21 Oct 2008 16:38:54 -0500
Subject: [Chicago] weekly hangout: Oct 23, Thurs 6:30
In-Reply-To: <458549139.1653141224624557208.JavaMail.root@mail-3.01.com>
References: <458549139.1653141224624557208.JavaMail.root@mail-3.01.com>
Message-ID: <2881B7C9-676A-4CC0-B5AA-3A3E89AD53F5@widefido.com>

I second that.

On Oct 21, 2008, at Oct 21   4:29 PM, Garrett Smith wrote:

> If there's any way we could make this closer to the loop, I could  
> make it in.
>
> ----- "Carl Karsten" <carl at personnelware.com> wrote:
>
>> Fireside,
>> 5739 N Ravenswood Ave
>> 7 blocks north of Imaginary Landscape:
>>
>> http://maps.google.com/maps?f=d&saddr=5121+North+Ravenswood+Avenue,+Chicago,+IL+60640+(Imaginary+Landscape)&daddr=5739+N+Ravenswood+Ave,+Chicago,+IL+60660+(Fireside)&hl=en&geocode=&mra=ls&dirflg=w&sll=41.978762,-87.674074&sspn=0.019748,0.04004&ie=UTF8&ll=41.980358,-87.674503&spn=0.019747,0.04004&z=15
>>
>> I may go there in the afternoon and hang out with my laptop.  might
>> get some
>> work done.
>>
>> metra hits ravenswood
>> inbound  5:13   5:53   6:17
>> http://metrarail.com/Sched/cnw_n/cnwn_wki.shtml
>>
>> outbound 5:29 5:34 5:49 6:04 6:13 6:57
>> http://metrarail.com/Sched/cnw_n/cnwn_wko.shtml
>>
>> Carl K
>> _______________________________________________
>> Chicago mailing list
>> Chicago at python.org
>> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
> _______________________________________________
> Chicago mailing list
> Chicago at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago


From cstejerean at gmail.com  Tue Oct 21 23:45:14 2008
From: cstejerean at gmail.com (Cosmin Stejerean)
Date: Tue, 21 Oct 2008 16:45:14 -0500
Subject: [Chicago] weekly hangout: Oct 23, Thurs 6:30
In-Reply-To: <2881B7C9-676A-4CC0-B5AA-3A3E89AD53F5@widefido.com>
References: <458549139.1653141224624557208.JavaMail.root@mail-3.01.com>
	<2881B7C9-676A-4CC0-B5AA-3A3E89AD53F5@widefido.com>
Message-ID: <8AD43593-CD8A-4187-B924-215DCFED0421@gmail.com>

Given my track record for attending anything in Ravenswood I'm +1 for  
doing this closer to the loop.

On Oct 21, 2008, at 4:38 PM, Jordan Sherer wrote:

> I second that.
>
> On Oct 21, 2008, at Oct 21   4:29 PM, Garrett Smith wrote:
>
>> If there's any way we could make this closer to the loop, I could  
>> make it in.
>>
>> ----- "Carl Karsten" <carl at personnelware.com> wrote:
>>
>>> Fireside,
>>> 5739 N Ravenswood Ave
>>> 7 blocks north of Imaginary Landscape:
>>>
>>> http://maps.google.com/maps?f=d&saddr=5121+North+Ravenswood+Avenue,+Chicago,+IL+60640+(Imaginary+Landscape)&daddr=5739+N+Ravenswood+Ave,+Chicago,+IL+60660+(Fireside)&hl=en&geocode=&mra=ls&dirflg=w&sll=41.978762,-87.674074&sspn=0.019748,0.04004&ie=UTF8&ll=41.980358,-87.674503&spn=0.019747,0.04004&z=15
>>>
>>> I may go there in the afternoon and hang out with my laptop.  might
>>> get some
>>> work done.
>>>
>>> metra hits ravenswood
>>> inbound  5:13   5:53   6:17
>>> http://metrarail.com/Sched/cnw_n/cnwn_wki.shtml
>>>
>>> outbound 5:29 5:34 5:49 6:04 6:13 6:57
>>> http://metrarail.com/Sched/cnw_n/cnwn_wko.shtml
>>>
>>> Carl K
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Chicago mailing list
>>> Chicago at python.org
>>> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>> _______________________________________________
>> Chicago mailing list
>> Chicago at python.org
>> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>
> _______________________________________________
> Chicago mailing list
> Chicago at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago


From carl at personnelware.com  Tue Oct 21 23:56:14 2008
From: carl at personnelware.com (Carl Karsten)
Date: Tue, 21 Oct 2008 16:56:14 -0500
Subject: [Chicago] weekly hangout: Oct 23, Thurs 6:30
In-Reply-To: <8AD43593-CD8A-4187-B924-215DCFED0421@gmail.com>
References: <458549139.1653141224624557208.JavaMail.root@mail-3.01.com>	<2881B7C9-676A-4CC0-B5AA-3A3E89AD53F5@widefido.com>
	<8AD43593-CD8A-4187-B924-215DCFED0421@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <48FE4FFE.2020801@personnelware.com>

I owe one to the IL guys, so this one is close to them.

besides, just means you need more chances to see Ravenswood :)

Carl K

Cosmin Stejerean wrote:
> Given my track record for attending anything in Ravenswood I'm +1 for
> doing this closer to the loop.
> 
> On Oct 21, 2008, at 4:38 PM, Jordan Sherer wrote:
> 
>> I second that.
>>
>> On Oct 21, 2008, at Oct 21   4:29 PM, Garrett Smith wrote:
>>
>>> If there's any way we could make this closer to the loop, I could
>>> make it in.
>>>
>>> ----- "Carl Karsten" <carl at personnelware.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Fireside,
>>>> 5739 N Ravenswood Ave
>>>> 7 blocks north of Imaginary Landscape:
>>>>
>>>> http://maps.google.com/maps?f=d&saddr=5121+North+Ravenswood+Avenue,+Chicago,+IL+60640+(Imaginary+Landscape)&daddr=5739+N+Ravenswood+Ave,+Chicago,+IL+60660+(Fireside)&hl=en&geocode=&mra=ls&dirflg=w&sll=41.978762,-87.674074&sspn=0.019748,0.04004&ie=UTF8&ll=41.980358,-87.674503&spn=0.019747,0.04004&z=15
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> I may go there in the afternoon and hang out with my laptop.  might
>>>> get some
>>>> work done.
>>>>
>>>> metra hits ravenswood
>>>> inbound  5:13   5:53   6:17
>>>> http://metrarail.com/Sched/cnw_n/cnwn_wki.shtml
>>>>
>>>> outbound 5:29 5:34 5:49 6:04 6:13 6:57
>>>> http://metrarail.com/Sched/cnw_n/cnwn_wko.shtml
>>>>
>>>> Carl K
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> Chicago mailing list
>>>> Chicago at python.org
>>>> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Chicago mailing list
>>> Chicago at python.org
>>> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Chicago mailing list
>> Chicago at python.org
>> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Chicago mailing list
> Chicago at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
> 
> 

From shekay at pobox.com  Wed Oct 22 02:32:19 2008
From: shekay at pobox.com (sheila miguez)
Date: Tue, 21 Oct 2008 19:32:19 -0500
Subject: [Chicago] weekly hangout: Oct 23, Thurs 6:30
In-Reply-To: <48FE4FFE.2020801@personnelware.com>
References: <458549139.1653141224624557208.JavaMail.root@mail-3.01.com>
	<2881B7C9-676A-4CC0-B5AA-3A3E89AD53F5@widefido.com>
	<8AD43593-CD8A-4187-B924-215DCFED0421@gmail.com>
	<48FE4FFE.2020801@personnelware.com>
Message-ID: <a68ced640810211732u4d363719xb38648b19b424cc7@mail.gmail.com>

Next time next time we should meet at the place Garrett suggested... Map room?

On Tue, Oct 21, 2008 at 4:56 PM, Carl Karsten <carl at personnelware.com> wrote:
> I owe one to the IL guys, so this one is close to them.
>
> besides, just means you need more chances to see Ravenswood :)
>
> Carl K
>
> Cosmin Stejerean wrote:
>> Given my track record for attending anything in Ravenswood I'm +1 for
>> doing this closer to the loop.
>>
>> On Oct 21, 2008, at 4:38 PM, Jordan Sherer wrote:
>>
>>> I second that.
>>>
>>> On Oct 21, 2008, at Oct 21   4:29 PM, Garrett Smith wrote:
>>>
>>>> If there's any way we could make this closer to the loop, I could
>>>> make it in.
>>>>
>>>> ----- "Carl Karsten" <carl at personnelware.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Fireside,
>>>>> 5739 N Ravenswood Ave
>>>>> 7 blocks north of Imaginary Landscape:
>>>>>
>>>>> http://maps.google.com/maps?f=d&saddr=5121+North+Ravenswood+Avenue,+Chicago,+IL+60640+(Imaginary+Landscape)&daddr=5739+N+Ravenswood+Ave,+Chicago,+IL+60660+(Fireside)&hl=en&geocode=&mra=ls&dirflg=w&sll=41.978762,-87.674074&sspn=0.019748,0.04004&ie=UTF8&ll=41.980358,-87.674503&spn=0.019747,0.04004&z=15
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> I may go there in the afternoon and hang out with my laptop.  might
>>>>> get some
>>>>> work done.
>>>>>
>>>>> metra hits ravenswood
>>>>> inbound  5:13   5:53   6:17
>>>>> http://metrarail.com/Sched/cnw_n/cnwn_wki.shtml
>>>>>
>>>>> outbound 5:29 5:34 5:49 6:04 6:13 6:57
>>>>> http://metrarail.com/Sched/cnw_n/cnwn_wko.shtml
>>>>>
>>>>> Carl K
>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>> Chicago mailing list
>>>>> Chicago at python.org
>>>>> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> Chicago mailing list
>>>> Chicago at python.org
>>>> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Chicago mailing list
>>> Chicago at python.org
>>> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Chicago mailing list
>> Chicago at python.org
>> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>>
>>
> _______________________________________________
> Chicago mailing list
> Chicago at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>



-- 
sheila

From maney at two14.net  Wed Oct 22 02:33:47 2008
From: maney at two14.net (Martin Maney)
Date: Tue, 21 Oct 2008 19:33:47 -0500
Subject: [Chicago] weekly hangout: Oct 23, Thurs 6:30
In-Reply-To: <8AD43593-CD8A-4187-B924-215DCFED0421@gmail.com>
References: <458549139.1653141224624557208.JavaMail.root@mail-3.01.com>
	<2881B7C9-676A-4CC0-B5AA-3A3E89AD53F5@widefido.com>
	<8AD43593-CD8A-4187-B924-215DCFED0421@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <20081022003347.GA17579@furrr.two14.net>

On Tue, Oct 21, 2008 at 04:45:14PM -0500, Cosmin Stejerean wrote:
> Given my track record for attending anything in Ravenswood I'm +1 for  
> doing this closer to the loop.

> On Oct 21, 2008, at 4:38 PM, Jordan Sherer wrote:
>> I second that.

>> On Oct 21, 2008, at Oct 21   4:29 PM, Garrett Smith wrote:
>>> If there's any way we could make this closer to the loop, I could  
>>> make it in.

Just wait, Carl's gonna have one in Rosemont one of these days!


No, I (2) was gonna say something serious.  This ain't an
equal-opportunity bike shed - this is Carl (and, mostly, a few others
who keep an ear out on #chipy) getting together where it's convenient
for them.  It's not really anything like an Official Chipy Function,
just a few like-minded consumers of beer and hamburgers who are so
gregarious that hey've invited all the rest of us to join them.

<coughs>  No, explicit really is better than implicit.  If you want to
get together for beer and burgers (1) in an area more to your liking,
what you do is:

1) pick a place
2) pick a time
3) post a message
4) ...
5) profit!!!

That's it.  No secret handhake is needed to join this club.  The budget
is what you've got on you.  The dream you fulfill may be your own.

Hey, reinventing the wheel is what Pythonistas *do*!  :-)


(1) burgers is sort of a standing joke, after the very first one of
these (or was it the second?) met for "beer & food" at a place where
"food" was not very food-like in the opinion of several hungry folks. 
"Burgers" had been casually promised, but no burgers were to be had. 
So now that's the tongue in cheek sine qua non of Carl's Getogethers.

(2) I have a pretty complete disinterst in these squabbles 'cause the
difference between the loop and Ravenswood is just about invisible from
out here in the middle of DuPage.  So I literally couldn't care less
where these big smelly city things happen.  But I've been the one being
complained at about "how come you never do it near me?" in the past,
and it still annoys me when people do that instead of doing the
obvious, easy, productive thing.  </vent>

-- 
...that obsessive conviction, so common among authors and composers,
that all similarities between their works and any others which appear
later must inevitably be ascribed to plagiarism. -- 2nd Circuit, 1945


From cstejerean at gmail.com  Wed Oct 22 04:05:17 2008
From: cstejerean at gmail.com (Cosmin Stejerean)
Date: Tue, 21 Oct 2008 21:05:17 -0500
Subject: [Chicago] weekly hangout: Oct 23, Thurs 6:30
In-Reply-To: <20081022003347.GA17579@furrr.two14.net>
References: <458549139.1653141224624557208.JavaMail.root@mail-3.01.com>
	<2881B7C9-676A-4CC0-B5AA-3A3E89AD53F5@widefido.com>
	<8AD43593-CD8A-4187-B924-215DCFED0421@gmail.com>
	<20081022003347.GA17579@furrr.two14.net>
Message-ID: <276266d0810211905i432c90ebs3523ebf6960c8f5b@mail.gmail.com>

On Tue, Oct 21, 2008 at 7:33 PM, Martin Maney <maney at two14.net> wrote:
> On Tue, Oct 21, 2008 at 04:45:14PM -0500, Cosmin Stejerean wrote:
>> Given my track record for attending anything in Ravenswood I'm +1 for
>> doing this closer to the loop.
>
>> On Oct 21, 2008, at 4:38 PM, Jordan Sherer wrote:
>>> I second that.
>
>>> On Oct 21, 2008, at Oct 21   4:29 PM, Garrett Smith wrote:
>>>> If there's any way we could make this closer to the loop, I could
>>>> make it in.
>
> Just wait, Carl's gonna have one in Rosemont one of these days!
>
>
> No, I (2) was gonna say something serious.  This ain't an
> equal-opportunity bike shed - this is Carl (and, mostly, a few others
> who keep an ear out on #chipy) getting together where it's convenient
> for them.  It's not really anything like an Official Chipy Function,
> just a few like-minded consumers of beer and hamburgers who are so
> gregarious that hey've invited all the rest of us to join them.
>
> <coughs>  No, explicit really is better than implicit.  If you want to
> get together for beer and burgers (1) in an area more to your liking,
> what you do is:
>
> 1) pick a place
> 2) pick a time
> 3) post a message
> 4) ...
> 5) profit!!!
>
> That's it.  No secret handhake is needed to join this club.  The budget
> is what you've got on you.  The dream you fulfill may be your own.
>
> Hey, reinventing the wheel is what Pythonistas *do*!  :-)
>
>

Thanks for explaining to new members how this works. Let me add that
Garret, Jordan and I usually show up at these weekly beer and burger
meetings and that discussions about the time and place are definitely
on topic. Some discussion apparently happens on IRC, personally I
don't have the attention span to participate in #chipy so I'll add my
.02 on this list. Anyone else should feel free to do the same. One or
more meetings could occur as a result and as far as I'm concerned
that's perfectly fine.

-- 
Cosmin Stejerean
http://www.offbytwo.com

From ken at stox.org  Wed Oct 22 22:40:23 2008
From: ken at stox.org (Kenneth P. Stox)
Date: Wed, 22 Oct 2008 15:40:23 -0500
Subject: [Chicago] Guido's new blog
Message-ID: <1224708023.9778.45.camel@stox.dyndns.org>

This may be of interest to some members of the group:

http://neopythonic.blogspot.com/



From maney at two14.net  Thu Oct 23 14:22:55 2008
From: maney at two14.net (Martin Maney)
Date: Thu, 23 Oct 2008 07:22:55 -0500
Subject: [Chicago] weekly hangout: Oct 23, Thurs 6:30
In-Reply-To: <276266d0810211905i432c90ebs3523ebf6960c8f5b@mail.gmail.com>
References: <458549139.1653141224624557208.JavaMail.root@mail-3.01.com>
	<2881B7C9-676A-4CC0-B5AA-3A3E89AD53F5@widefido.com>
	<8AD43593-CD8A-4187-B924-215DCFED0421@gmail.com>
	<20081022003347.GA17579@furrr.two14.net>
	<276266d0810211905i432c90ebs3523ebf6960c8f5b@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <20081023122255.GB23834@furrr.two14.net>

On Tue, Oct 21, 2008 at 09:05:17PM -0500, Cosmin Stejerean wrote:
> Thanks for explaining to new members how this works. Let me add that
> Garret, Jordan and I usually show up at these weekly beer and burger
> meetings and that discussions about the time and place are definitely
> on topic.

Sure.  It was just having three in a row (from the time-collapsed
perspective of reading these when I got to them) just pushed that old
hot button, and I didn't pay attention to who was piping up.

Once I got to the point where I knew how the list was going to come
out, of course, other forces were in play.  :-)

-- 
vi is a microcosm of the Unix world.  Don't expect
to learn all of it at once; perhaps you shouldn't expect
to learn all of it at all.  -- Jon Lasser (Think Unix)


From verisimilidude at gmail.com  Fri Oct 24 02:54:24 2008
From: verisimilidude at gmail.com (Phil Robare)
Date: Thu, 23 Oct 2008 19:54:24 -0500
Subject: [Chicago] wiki page For those looking for Python work in Chicago
In-Reply-To: <F631B315-DFFD-493F-B6F6-50D08D018ECE@sent.com>
References: <F631B315-DFFD-493F-B6F6-50D08D018ECE@sent.com>
Message-ID: <6ad48f980810231754o4e3bb104kcc7e0f04675c1426@mail.gmail.com>

Great idea Brian.  But I'm having some problems trying to get it to happen.

What am I doing wrong.  I tried to put in my info several times.
Refresh works fine but time when I try to save I get a message
"Incorrect answer to security question."  I don't see a security
question.  Tried this in IE from Windoze and Firefox from Linux and
got the same result. The consistency is good I suppose, but I am still
frustrated.

Where's the security question?

Phil

On Tue, Oct 21, 2008 at 11:47 AM, Brian Ray <bray at sent.com> wrote:
> Just a reminder:
>
>  <http://chipy.org/looking>
>
> If your looking for any sort of work, go ahead and make it easy for those
> who are looking for people (like me) to find you.

From bray at sent.com  Fri Oct 24 05:18:05 2008
From: bray at sent.com (Brian Ray)
Date: Thu, 23 Oct 2008 22:18:05 -0500
Subject: [Chicago] wiki page For those looking for Python work in Chicago
In-Reply-To: <6ad48f980810231754o4e3bb104kcc7e0f04675c1426@mail.gmail.com>
References: <F631B315-DFFD-493F-B6F6-50D08D018ECE@sent.com>
	<6ad48f980810231754o4e3bb104kcc7e0f04675c1426@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <D7ABF401-A569-422A-91E6-21EFDF726BB5@sent.com>


On Oct 23, 2008, at 7:54 PM, Phil Robare wrote:

> Great idea Brian.  But I'm having some problems trying to get it to  
> happen.
>
> What am I doing wrong.  I tried to put in my info several times.
> Refresh works fine but time when I try to save I get a message
> "Incorrect answer to security question."  I don't see a security
> question.  Tried this in IE from Windoze and Firefox from Linux and
> got the same result. The consistency is good I suppose, but I am still
> frustrated.
>
> Where's the security question?
>

hmm, it should pop up in a alert dialog after you submit your change.  
I just tested it and it did for me.

I do think there might be a bug somewhere with it, but I have not ran  
into that bug enough to pin it down.

I am still would be open to having someone help be update to more  
recent version of moinmoin. It now has its own spam prevention.

Phil, of course you can just email me the change off the list and I  
can post it also.

Regards,

Brian Ray




From orblivion at gmail.com  Fri Oct 24 16:00:21 2008
From: orblivion at gmail.com (Dan Krol)
Date: Fri, 24 Oct 2008 09:00:21 -0500
Subject: [Chicago] wiki page For those looking for Python work in Chicago
In-Reply-To: <D7ABF401-A569-422A-91E6-21EFDF726BB5@sent.com>
References: <F631B315-DFFD-493F-B6F6-50D08D018ECE@sent.com>
	<6ad48f980810231754o4e3bb104kcc7e0f04675c1426@mail.gmail.com>
	<D7ABF401-A569-422A-91E6-21EFDF726BB5@sent.com>
Message-ID: <94e10adf0810240700w7df98f4fyf84b39a04c1958dd@mail.gmail.com>

Phil, I had the same problem because I had Noscript running on
Firefox. I allowed the site to run Javascript and it worked. I don't
know why IE wouldn't work though, maybe you have a JS blocker there as
well.

I personally think a security question without a popup would be a
little more user-friendly, but it's not a big deal.

On Thu, Oct 23, 2008 at 10:18 PM, Brian Ray <bray at sent.com> wrote:
>
> On Oct 23, 2008, at 7:54 PM, Phil Robare wrote:
>
>> Great idea Brian.  But I'm having some problems trying to get it to
>> happen.
>>
>> What am I doing wrong.  I tried to put in my info several times.
>> Refresh works fine but time when I try to save I get a message
>> "Incorrect answer to security question."  I don't see a security
>> question.  Tried this in IE from Windoze and Firefox from Linux and
>> got the same result. The consistency is good I suppose, but I am still
>> frustrated.
>>
>> Where's the security question?
>>
>
> hmm, it should pop up in a alert dialog after you submit your change. I just
> tested it and it did for me.
>
> I do think there might be a bug somewhere with it, but I have not ran into
> that bug enough to pin it down.
>
> I am still would be open to having someone help be update to more recent
> version of moinmoin. It now has its own spam prevention.
>
> Phil, of course you can just email me the change off the list and I can post
> it also.
>
> Regards,
>
> Brian Ray
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Chicago mailing list
> Chicago at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>

From bray at sent.com  Fri Oct 24 16:09:07 2008
From: bray at sent.com (Brian Ray)
Date: Fri, 24 Oct 2008 09:09:07 -0500
Subject: [Chicago] wiki page For those looking for Python work in Chicago
In-Reply-To: <94e10adf0810240700w7df98f4fyf84b39a04c1958dd@mail.gmail.com>
References: <F631B315-DFFD-493F-B6F6-50D08D018ECE@sent.com>
	<6ad48f980810231754o4e3bb104kcc7e0f04675c1426@mail.gmail.com>
	<D7ABF401-A569-422A-91E6-21EFDF726BB5@sent.com>
	<94e10adf0810240700w7df98f4fyf84b39a04c1958dd@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <8382DA10-2548-48E1-A7B4-B3CE71D3D10F@sent.com>


On Oct 24, 2008, at 9:00 AM, Dan Krol wrote:

>
> I personally think a security question without a popup would be a
> little more user-friendly, but it's not a big deal.


The moinmoin one that is built-in now does just this.  It has a  
security question without a pop-up.

Also, I noticed if you answer wrongly, it may not give you another  
chance without clearing the browser.

Sorry for the inconvenience, but we really do get hit pretty hard by  
spammers and such.

Thanks,

Brian Ray




From carl at personnelware.com  Mon Oct 27 18:31:46 2008
From: carl at personnelware.com (Carl Karsten)
Date: Mon, 27 Oct 2008 12:31:46 -0500
Subject: [Chicago] when is chipy food?
Message-ID: <4905FB02.1080403@personnelware.com>

When and where are we meeting this week?

Jef tap would be good so I can make a last ditch attempt at getting my Python
mug back.

Wed or Thurs should have nice weather, so sitting outside may be doable.

Carl K

From carl at personnelware.com  Mon Oct 27 18:56:31 2008
From: carl at personnelware.com (Carl Karsten)
Date: Mon, 27 Oct 2008 12:56:31 -0500
Subject: [Chicago] chipy food is Wed
In-Reply-To: <4905FB02.1080403@personnelware.com>
References: <4905FB02.1080403@personnelware.com>
Message-ID: <490600CF.4040304@personnelware.com>

Thurs is out, Tue is too soon, so Wed it is.

This weeks hang out:
6pm Wed Oct 29
Jefferson Tap

325 N Jefferson St, Chicago, IL 60661

http://maps.google.com/maps?ie=UTF-8&oe=utf-8&client=firefox-a&dq=jefferson+tap+loc:+Chicago,+IL&daddr=325+N+Jefferson+St,+Chicago,+IL+60661&geocode=5068642069020590215,41.887459,-87.642768&ll=41.887459,-87.642768&iwstate1=dir:to&iwloc=A&f=d

Carl K

From carl at personnelware.com  Mon Oct 27 19:11:49 2008
From: carl at personnelware.com (Carl Karsten)
Date: Mon, 27 Oct 2008 13:11:49 -0500
Subject: [Chicago] chipy food is Wed
In-Reply-To: <490600CF.4040304@personnelware.com>
References: <4905FB02.1080403@personnelware.com>
	<490600CF.4040304@personnelware.com>
Message-ID: <49060465.5000603@personnelware.com>

gah.  maybe Thurs is better.

Anyone else care?

more on this in a few hours.

Carl K

From cstejerean at gmail.com  Mon Oct 27 20:11:02 2008
From: cstejerean at gmail.com (Cosmin Stejerean)
Date: Mon, 27 Oct 2008 14:11:02 -0500
Subject: [Chicago] chipy food is Wed
In-Reply-To: <49060465.5000603@personnelware.com>
References: <4905FB02.1080403@personnelware.com>
	<490600CF.4040304@personnelware.com>
	<49060465.5000603@personnelware.com>
Message-ID: <276266d0810271211h6c296a06i752b2577050e8863@mail.gmail.com>

I'd prefer Wednesday.

On Mon, Oct 27, 2008 at 1:11 PM, Carl Karsten <carl at personnelware.com>wrote:

> gah.  maybe Thurs is better.
>
> Anyone else care?
>
> more on this in a few hours.
>
> Carl K
> _______________________________________________
> Chicago mailing list
> Chicago at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>



-- 
Cosmin Stejerean
http://www.offbytwo.com
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From carl at personnelware.com  Mon Oct 27 23:28:14 2008
From: carl at personnelware.com (Carl Karsten)
Date: Mon, 27 Oct 2008 17:28:14 -0500
Subject: [Chicago] chipy food is Wed, really.
In-Reply-To: <276266d0810271211h6c296a06i752b2577050e8863@mail.gmail.com>
References: <4905FB02.1080403@personnelware.com>	<490600CF.4040304@personnelware.com>	<49060465.5000603@personnelware.com>
	<276266d0810271211h6c296a06i752b2577050e8863@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <4906407E.1030605@personnelware.com>

OK, Wed is is.

Carl K

Cosmin Stejerean wrote:
> I'd prefer Wednesday.
> 
> On Mon, Oct 27, 2008 at 1:11 PM, Carl Karsten <carl at personnelware.com>wrote:
> 
>> gah.  maybe Thurs is better.
>>
>> Anyone else care?
>>
>> more on this in a few hours.
>>
>> Carl K
>> _______________________________________________
>> Chicago mailing list
>> Chicago at python.org
>> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>>
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Chicago mailing list
> Chicago at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago

From kumar.mcmillan at gmail.com  Tue Oct 28 20:31:47 2008
From: kumar.mcmillan at gmail.com (Kumar McMillan)
Date: Tue, 28 Oct 2008 14:31:47 -0500
Subject: [Chicago] chipy food is Wed, really.
In-Reply-To: <4906407E.1030605@personnelware.com>
References: <4905FB02.1080403@personnelware.com>
	<490600CF.4040304@personnelware.com>
	<49060465.5000603@personnelware.com>
	<276266d0810271211h6c296a06i752b2577050e8863@mail.gmail.com>
	<4906407E.1030605@personnelware.com>
Message-ID: <b571660a0810281231l48b295d9v5ab6ae8a8e7ee725@mail.gmail.com>

Wednesday, I can do that.

If anyone wants a change of scenery, there is the all-time best German
bar in Chicago, Resi's Bierstube:
http://chicago.metromix.com/restaurants/austrian/resis-bierstube-chicago/136004/content

It meets the requirement of being "close to the Metra" -- 3 or 4 block
walk from Ravenswood stop.  However, I don't think they have wireless.
 They do have 16+ Bavarian beers on tap (!), schnitzel, kraut, and if
we get the warm-up by Wed there is a beer garden in back.

On Mon, Oct 27, 2008 at 5:28 PM, Carl Karsten <carl at personnelware.com> wrote:
> OK, Wed is is.
>
> Carl K
>
> Cosmin Stejerean wrote:
>> I'd prefer Wednesday.
>>
>> On Mon, Oct 27, 2008 at 1:11 PM, Carl Karsten <carl at personnelware.com>wrote:
>>
>>> gah.  maybe Thurs is better.
>>>
>>> Anyone else care?
>>>
>>> more on this in a few hours.
>>>
>>> Carl K
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Chicago mailing list
>>> Chicago at python.org
>>> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Chicago mailing list
>> Chicago at python.org
>> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
> _______________________________________________
> Chicago mailing list
> Chicago at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>

From cstejerean at gmail.com  Tue Oct 28 23:02:31 2008
From: cstejerean at gmail.com (Cosmin Stejerean)
Date: Tue, 28 Oct 2008 17:02:31 -0500
Subject: [Chicago] chipy food is Wed, really.
In-Reply-To: <b571660a0810281231l48b295d9v5ab6ae8a8e7ee725@mail.gmail.com>
References: <4905FB02.1080403@personnelware.com>
	<490600CF.4040304@personnelware.com>
	<49060465.5000603@personnelware.com>
	<276266d0810271211h6c296a06i752b2577050e8863@mail.gmail.com>
	<4906407E.1030605@personnelware.com>
	<b571660a0810281231l48b295d9v5ab6ae8a8e7ee725@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <276266d0810281502m651bfdcrba341c52194f408b@mail.gmail.com>

Seems closer to 10 blocks but the beer selection sounds like a good enough
motivation to take the Damen bus.
On Tue, Oct 28, 2008 at 2:31 PM, Kumar McMillan <kumar.mcmillan at gmail.com>wrote:

> Wednesday, I can do that.
>
> If anyone wants a change of scenery, there is the all-time best German
> bar in Chicago, Resi's Bierstube:
>
> http://chicago.metromix.com/restaurants/austrian/resis-bierstube-chicago/136004/content
>
> It meets the requirement of being "close to the Metra" -- 3 or 4 block
> walk from Ravenswood stop.  However, I don't think they have wireless.
>  They do have 16+ Bavarian beers on tap (!), schnitzel, kraut, and if
> we get the warm-up by Wed there is a beer garden in back.
>
> On Mon, Oct 27, 2008 at 5:28 PM, Carl Karsten <carl at personnelware.com>
> wrote:
> > OK, Wed is is.
> >
> > Carl K
> >
> > Cosmin Stejerean wrote:
> >> I'd prefer Wednesday.
> >>
> >> On Mon, Oct 27, 2008 at 1:11 PM, Carl Karsten <carl at personnelware.com
> >wrote:
> >>
> >>> gah.  maybe Thurs is better.
> >>>
> >>> Anyone else care?
> >>>
> >>> more on this in a few hours.
> >>>
> >>> Carl K
> >>> _______________________________________________
> >>> Chicago mailing list
> >>> Chicago at python.org
> >>> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
> >>>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> >>
> >> _______________________________________________
> >> Chicago mailing list
> >> Chicago at python.org
> >> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
> > _______________________________________________
> > Chicago mailing list
> > Chicago at python.org
> > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
> >
> _______________________________________________
> Chicago mailing list
> Chicago at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>



-- 
Cosmin Stejerean
http://www.offbytwo.com
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From jcroneme at thoughtworks.com  Wed Oct 29 00:17:44 2008
From: jcroneme at thoughtworks.com (Josh Cronemeyer)
Date: Tue, 28 Oct 2008 18:17:44 -0500
Subject: [Chicago] chipy food is Wed, really.
In-Reply-To: <276266d0810281502m651bfdcrba341c52194f408b@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <OFDD2468D1.72A26775-ON862574F0.007FECF7-862574F0.00801A77@thoughtworks.com>

If it is at the bierstube count me in.

PEACE!
Josh Cronemeyer



"Cosmin Stejerean" <cstejerean at gmail.com> 
Sent by: chicago-bounces+jcroneme=thoughtworks.com at python.org
10/28/08 05:02 PM
Please respond to
The Chicago Python Users Group <chicago at python.org>


To
"The Chicago Python Users Group" <chicago at python.org>
cc

Subject
Re: [Chicago] chipy food is Wed, really.






Seems closer to 10 blocks but the beer selection sounds like a good enough 
motivation to take the Damen bus.

On Tue, Oct 28, 2008 at 2:31 PM, Kumar McMillan <kumar.mcmillan at gmail.com> 
wrote:
Wednesday, I can do that.

If anyone wants a change of scenery, there is the all-time best German
bar in Chicago, Resi's Bierstube:
http://chicago.metromix.com/restaurants/austrian/resis-bierstube-chicago/136004/content


It meets the requirement of being "close to the Metra" -- 3 or 4 block
walk from Ravenswood stop.  However, I don't think they have wireless.
 They do have 16+ Bavarian beers on tap (!), schnitzel, kraut, and if
we get the warm-up by Wed there is a beer garden in back.

On Mon, Oct 27, 2008 at 5:28 PM, Carl Karsten <carl at personnelware.com> 
wrote:
> OK, Wed is is.
>
> Carl K
>
> Cosmin Stejerean wrote:
>> I'd prefer Wednesday.
>>
>> On Mon, Oct 27, 2008 at 1:11 PM, Carl Karsten <carl at personnelware.com
>wrote:
>>
>>> gah.  maybe Thurs is better.
>>>
>>> Anyone else care?
>>>
>>> more on this in a few hours.
>>>
>>> Carl K
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Chicago mailing list
>>> Chicago at python.org
>>> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> 
------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Chicago mailing list
>> Chicago at python.org
>> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
> _______________________________________________
> Chicago mailing list
> Chicago at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>
_______________________________________________
Chicago mailing list
Chicago at python.org
http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago



-- 
Cosmin Stejerean
http://www.offbytwo.com_______________________________________________
Chicago mailing list
Chicago at python.org
http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago

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From kumar.mcmillan at gmail.com  Wed Oct 29 01:18:05 2008
From: kumar.mcmillan at gmail.com (Kumar McMillan)
Date: Tue, 28 Oct 2008 19:18:05 -0500
Subject: [Chicago] chipy food is Wed, really.
In-Reply-To: <276266d0810281502m651bfdcrba341c52194f408b@mail.gmail.com>
References: <4905FB02.1080403@personnelware.com>
	<490600CF.4040304@personnelware.com>
	<49060465.5000603@personnelware.com>
	<276266d0810271211h6c296a06i752b2577050e8863@mail.gmail.com>
	<4906407E.1030605@personnelware.com>
	<b571660a0810281231l48b295d9v5ab6ae8a8e7ee725@mail.gmail.com>
	<276266d0810281502m651bfdcrba341c52194f408b@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <b571660a0810281718h70e3f1fet3484385bf56f9f0a@mail.gmail.com>

On Tue, Oct 28, 2008 at 5:02 PM, Cosmin Stejerean <cstejerean at gmail.com> wrote:
> Seems closer to 10 blocks

3, 4, 8, 10, something like that ;)  The walk back is shorter, I promise!

>  but the beer selection sounds like a good enough
> motivation to take the Damen bus.
> On Tue, Oct 28, 2008 at 2:31 PM, Kumar McMillan <kumar.mcmillan at gmail.com>
> wrote:
>>
>> Wednesday, I can do that.
>>
>> If anyone wants a change of scenery, there is the all-time best German
>> bar in Chicago, Resi's Bierstube:
>>
>> http://chicago.metromix.com/restaurants/austrian/resis-bierstube-chicago/136004/content
>>
>> It meets the requirement of being "close to the Metra" -- 3 or 4 block
>> walk from Ravenswood stop.  However, I don't think they have wireless.
>>  They do have 16+ Bavarian beers on tap (!), schnitzel, kraut, and if
>> we get the warm-up by Wed there is a beer garden in back.
>>
>> On Mon, Oct 27, 2008 at 5:28 PM, Carl Karsten <carl at personnelware.com>
>> wrote:
>> > OK, Wed is is.
>> >
>> > Carl K
>> >
>> > Cosmin Stejerean wrote:
>> >> I'd prefer Wednesday.
>> >>
>> >> On Mon, Oct 27, 2008 at 1:11 PM, Carl Karsten
>> >> <carl at personnelware.com>wrote:
>> >>
>> >>> gah.  maybe Thurs is better.
>> >>>
>> >>> Anyone else care?
>> >>>
>> >>> more on this in a few hours.
>> >>>
>> >>> Carl K
>> >>> _______________________________________________
>> >>> Chicago mailing list
>> >>> Chicago at python.org
>> >>> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>> >>>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>> >>
>> >> _______________________________________________
>> >> Chicago mailing list
>> >> Chicago at python.org
>> >> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>> > _______________________________________________
>> > Chicago mailing list
>> > Chicago at python.org
>> > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>> >
>> _______________________________________________
>> Chicago mailing list
>> Chicago at python.org
>> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>
>
>
> --
> Cosmin Stejerean
> http://www.offbytwo.com
>
> _______________________________________________
> Chicago mailing list
> Chicago at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>
>

From MDiPierro at cs.depaul.edu  Wed Oct 29 03:55:19 2008
From: MDiPierro at cs.depaul.edu (Massimo Di Pierro)
Date: Tue, 28 Oct 2008 21:55:19 -0500
Subject: [Chicago] Google Checkout Level 1 and Level 2 ported to the Google
	App Engine
Message-ID: <6D7C2056-CD82-485B-888B-E815E6B68205@cs.depaul.edu>

Live demo with examples:

      http://web2py.appspot.com/plugin_checkout

Source code:

      http://mdp.cti.depaul.edu/appliances/default/show/43

Massimo

From carl at personnelware.com  Wed Oct 29 20:15:46 2008
From: carl at personnelware.com (Carl Karsten)
Date: Wed, 29 Oct 2008 14:15:46 -0500
Subject: [Chicago] food tonight: Bierstube at 6
In-Reply-To: <b571660a0810281231l48b295d9v5ab6ae8a8e7ee725@mail.gmail.com>
References: <4905FB02.1080403@personnelware.com>	<490600CF.4040304@personnelware.com>	<49060465.5000603@personnelware.com>	<276266d0810271211h6c296a06i752b2577050e8863@mail.gmail.com>	<4906407E.1030605@personnelware.com>
	<b571660a0810281231l48b295d9v5ab6ae8a8e7ee725@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <4908B662.3030201@personnelware.com>

Resi's Bierstube

    2034 W. Irving Park Rd.
    Chicago, IL 60618

    773-472-1749

If someone will give me a time to be at the Ravenswood stop, I can swing by and
give a ride to whoever is there.  If this is some reason for me to learn to
tweet... um... tell me what to do.  I have a cell phone - pretty sure that is
relevant.  that's about how much I know.

Carl K



Kumar McMillan wrote:
> Wednesday, I can do that.
> 
> If anyone wants a change of scenery, there is the all-time best German
> bar in Chicago, Resi's Bierstube:
> http://chicago.metromix.com/restaurants/austrian/resis-bierstube-chicago/136004/content
> 
> It meets the requirement of being "close to the Metra" -- 3 or 4 block
> walk from Ravenswood stop.  However, I don't think they have wireless.
>  They do have 16+ Bavarian beers on tap (!), schnitzel, kraut, and if
> we get the warm-up by Wed there is a beer garden in back.
> 
> On Mon, Oct 27, 2008 at 5:28 PM, Carl Karsten <carl at personnelware.com> wrote:
>> OK, Wed is is.
>>
>> Carl K
>>
>> Cosmin Stejerean wrote:
>>> I'd prefer Wednesday.
>>>
>>> On Mon, Oct 27, 2008 at 1:11 PM, Carl Karsten <carl at personnelware.com>wrote:
>>>
>>>> gah.  maybe Thurs is better.
>>>>
>>>> Anyone else care?
>>>>
>>>> more on this in a few hours.
>>>>
>>>> Carl K
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> Chicago mailing list
>>>> Chicago at python.org
>>>> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Chicago mailing list
>>> Chicago at python.org
>>> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>> _______________________________________________
>> Chicago mailing list
>> Chicago at python.org
>> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>>
> _______________________________________________
> Chicago mailing list
> Chicago at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
> 
> 

From chris.mcavoy at gmail.com  Wed Oct 29 20:17:45 2008
From: chris.mcavoy at gmail.com (Chris McAvoy)
Date: Wed, 29 Oct 2008 14:17:45 -0500
Subject: [Chicago] food tonight: Bierstube at 6
In-Reply-To: <4908B662.3030201@personnelware.com>
References: <4905FB02.1080403@personnelware.com>
	<490600CF.4040304@personnelware.com>
	<49060465.5000603@personnelware.com>
	<276266d0810271211h6c296a06i752b2577050e8863@mail.gmail.com>
	<4906407E.1030605@personnelware.com>
	<b571660a0810281231l48b295d9v5ab6ae8a8e7ee725@mail.gmail.com>
	<4908B662.3030201@personnelware.com>
Message-ID: <3096c19d0810291217p29f77c07r142250ebe26e1acb@mail.gmail.com>

What time?

On Wed, Oct 29, 2008 at 2:15 PM, Carl Karsten <carl at personnelware.com> wrote:
> Resi's Bierstube
>
>    2034 W. Irving Park Rd.
>    Chicago, IL 60618
>
>    773-472-1749
>
> If someone will give me a time to be at the Ravenswood stop, I can swing by and
> give a ride to whoever is there.  If this is some reason for me to learn to
> tweet... um... tell me what to do.  I have a cell phone - pretty sure that is
> relevant.  that's about how much I know.
>
> Carl K
>
>
>
> Kumar McMillan wrote:
>> Wednesday, I can do that.
>>
>> If anyone wants a change of scenery, there is the all-time best German
>> bar in Chicago, Resi's Bierstube:
>> http://chicago.metromix.com/restaurants/austrian/resis-bierstube-chicago/136004/content
>>
>> It meets the requirement of being "close to the Metra" -- 3 or 4 block
>> walk from Ravenswood stop.  However, I don't think they have wireless.
>>  They do have 16+ Bavarian beers on tap (!), schnitzel, kraut, and if
>> we get the warm-up by Wed there is a beer garden in back.
>>
>> On Mon, Oct 27, 2008 at 5:28 PM, Carl Karsten <carl at personnelware.com> wrote:
>>> OK, Wed is is.
>>>
>>> Carl K
>>>
>>> Cosmin Stejerean wrote:
>>>> I'd prefer Wednesday.
>>>>
>>>> On Mon, Oct 27, 2008 at 1:11 PM, Carl Karsten <carl at personnelware.com>wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> gah.  maybe Thurs is better.
>>>>>
>>>>> Anyone else care?
>>>>>
>>>>> more on this in a few hours.
>>>>>
>>>>> Carl K
>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>> Chicago mailing list
>>>>> Chicago at python.org
>>>>> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>>
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> Chicago mailing list
>>>> Chicago at python.org
>>>> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Chicago mailing list
>>> Chicago at python.org
>>> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Chicago mailing list
>> Chicago at python.org
>> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>>
>>
> _______________________________________________
> Chicago mailing list
> Chicago at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>

From chris.mcavoy at gmail.com  Wed Oct 29 20:17:58 2008
From: chris.mcavoy at gmail.com (Chris McAvoy)
Date: Wed, 29 Oct 2008 14:17:58 -0500
Subject: [Chicago] food tonight: Bierstube at 6
In-Reply-To: <3096c19d0810291217p29f77c07r142250ebe26e1acb@mail.gmail.com>
References: <4905FB02.1080403@personnelware.com>
	<490600CF.4040304@personnelware.com>
	<49060465.5000603@personnelware.com>
	<276266d0810271211h6c296a06i752b2577050e8863@mail.gmail.com>
	<4906407E.1030605@personnelware.com>
	<b571660a0810281231l48b295d9v5ab6ae8a8e7ee725@mail.gmail.com>
	<4908B662.3030201@personnelware.com>
	<3096c19d0810291217p29f77c07r142250ebe26e1acb@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <3096c19d0810291217i53cf9ef1p7ee3625c86181808@mail.gmail.com>

oh...6.

On Wed, Oct 29, 2008 at 2:17 PM, Chris McAvoy <chris.mcavoy at gmail.com> wrote:
> What time?
>
> On Wed, Oct 29, 2008 at 2:15 PM, Carl Karsten <carl at personnelware.com> wrote:
>> Resi's Bierstube
>>
>>    2034 W. Irving Park Rd.
>>    Chicago, IL 60618
>>
>>    773-472-1749
>>
>> If someone will give me a time to be at the Ravenswood stop, I can swing by and
>> give a ride to whoever is there.  If this is some reason for me to learn to
>> tweet... um... tell me what to do.  I have a cell phone - pretty sure that is
>> relevant.  that's about how much I know.
>>
>> Carl K
>>
>>
>>
>> Kumar McMillan wrote:
>>> Wednesday, I can do that.
>>>
>>> If anyone wants a change of scenery, there is the all-time best German
>>> bar in Chicago, Resi's Bierstube:
>>> http://chicago.metromix.com/restaurants/austrian/resis-bierstube-chicago/136004/content
>>>
>>> It meets the requirement of being "close to the Metra" -- 3 or 4 block
>>> walk from Ravenswood stop.  However, I don't think they have wireless.
>>>  They do have 16+ Bavarian beers on tap (!), schnitzel, kraut, and if
>>> we get the warm-up by Wed there is a beer garden in back.
>>>
>>> On Mon, Oct 27, 2008 at 5:28 PM, Carl Karsten <carl at personnelware.com> wrote:
>>>> OK, Wed is is.
>>>>
>>>> Carl K
>>>>
>>>> Cosmin Stejerean wrote:
>>>>> I'd prefer Wednesday.
>>>>>
>>>>> On Mon, Oct 27, 2008 at 1:11 PM, Carl Karsten <carl at personnelware.com>wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> gah.  maybe Thurs is better.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Anyone else care?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> more on this in a few hours.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Carl K
>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>> Chicago mailing list
>>>>>> Chicago at python.org
>>>>>> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>>>
>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>> Chicago mailing list
>>>>> Chicago at python.org
>>>>> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> Chicago mailing list
>>>> Chicago at python.org
>>>> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Chicago mailing list
>>> Chicago at python.org
>>> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>>>
>>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Chicago mailing list
>> Chicago at python.org
>> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>>
>

From kumar.mcmillan at gmail.com  Wed Oct 29 20:20:30 2008
From: kumar.mcmillan at gmail.com (Kumar McMillan)
Date: Wed, 29 Oct 2008 14:20:30 -0500
Subject: [Chicago] food tonight: Bierstube at 6
In-Reply-To: <4908B662.3030201@personnelware.com>
References: <4905FB02.1080403@personnelware.com>
	<490600CF.4040304@personnelware.com>
	<49060465.5000603@personnelware.com>
	<276266d0810271211h6c296a06i752b2577050e8863@mail.gmail.com>
	<4906407E.1030605@personnelware.com>
	<b571660a0810281231l48b295d9v5ab6ae8a8e7ee725@mail.gmail.com>
	<4908B662.3030201@personnelware.com>
Message-ID: <b571660a0810291220r294e918fj3e5c2d7c2b83bac1@mail.gmail.com>

On Wed, Oct 29, 2008 at 2:15 PM, Carl Karsten <carl at personnelware.com> wrote:
> Resi's Bierstube
>
>    2034 W. Irving Park Rd.
>    Chicago, IL 60618

note that the Brown Line Irving Park stop is still closed for
construction.  You'll have to get off on Addison (one stop before) and
walk up Lincoln.

>
>    773-472-1749
>
> If someone will give me a time to be at the Ravenswood stop, I can swing by and
> give a ride to whoever is there.  If this is some reason for me to learn to
> tweet... um... tell me what to do.  I have a cell phone - pretty sure that is
> relevant.  that's about how much I know.
>
> Carl K
>
>
>
> Kumar McMillan wrote:
>> Wednesday, I can do that.
>>
>> If anyone wants a change of scenery, there is the all-time best German
>> bar in Chicago, Resi's Bierstube:
>> http://chicago.metromix.com/restaurants/austrian/resis-bierstube-chicago/136004/content
>>
>> It meets the requirement of being "close to the Metra" -- 3 or 4 block
>> walk from Ravenswood stop.  However, I don't think they have wireless.
>>  They do have 16+ Bavarian beers on tap (!), schnitzel, kraut, and if
>> we get the warm-up by Wed there is a beer garden in back.
>>
>> On Mon, Oct 27, 2008 at 5:28 PM, Carl Karsten <carl at personnelware.com> wrote:
>>> OK, Wed is is.
>>>
>>> Carl K
>>>
>>> Cosmin Stejerean wrote:
>>>> I'd prefer Wednesday.
>>>>
>>>> On Mon, Oct 27, 2008 at 1:11 PM, Carl Karsten <carl at personnelware.com>wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> gah.  maybe Thurs is better.
>>>>>
>>>>> Anyone else care?
>>>>>
>>>>> more on this in a few hours.
>>>>>
>>>>> Carl K
>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>> Chicago mailing list
>>>>> Chicago at python.org
>>>>> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>>
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> Chicago mailing list
>>>> Chicago at python.org
>>>> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Chicago mailing list
>>> Chicago at python.org
>>> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Chicago mailing list
>> Chicago at python.org
>> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>>
>>
> _______________________________________________
> Chicago mailing list
> Chicago at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>

From lists at durin42.com  Wed Oct 29 20:18:22 2008
From: lists at durin42.com (Augie Fackler)
Date: Wed, 29 Oct 2008 14:18:22 -0500
Subject: [Chicago] food tonight: Bierstube at 6
In-Reply-To: <3096c19d0810291217p29f77c07r142250ebe26e1acb@mail.gmail.com>
References: <4905FB02.1080403@personnelware.com>
	<490600CF.4040304@personnelware.com>
	<49060465.5000603@personnelware.com>
	<276266d0810271211h6c296a06i752b2577050e8863@mail.gmail.com>
	<4906407E.1030605@personnelware.com>
	<b571660a0810281231l48b295d9v5ab6ae8a8e7ee725@mail.gmail.com>
	<4908B662.3030201@personnelware.com>
	<3096c19d0810291217p29f77c07r142250ebe26e1acb@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <8EAB7DD7-A9CE-44A1-AF46-C844379A4219@durin42.com>


On Oct 29, 2008, at 2:17 PM, Chris McAvoy wrote:

> What time?

$subject -> 6pm

>
>
> On Wed, Oct 29, 2008 at 2:15 PM, Carl Karsten  
> <carl at personnelware.com> wrote:
>> Resi's Bierstube
>>
>>   2034 W. Irving Park Rd.
>>   Chicago, IL 60618
>>
>>   773-472-1749
>>
>> If someone will give me a time to be at the Ravenswood stop, I can  
>> swing by and
>> give a ride to whoever is there.  If this is some reason for me to  
>> learn to
>> tweet... um... tell me what to do.  I have a cell phone - pretty  
>> sure that is
>> relevant.  that's about how much I know.
>>
>> Carl K
>>
>>
>>
>> Kumar McMillan wrote:
>>> Wednesday, I can do that.
>>>
>>> If anyone wants a change of scenery, there is the all-time best  
>>> German
>>> bar in Chicago, Resi's Bierstube:
>>> http://chicago.metromix.com/restaurants/austrian/resis-bierstube-chicago/136004/content
>>>
>>> It meets the requirement of being "close to the Metra" -- 3 or 4  
>>> block
>>> walk from Ravenswood stop.  However, I don't think they have  
>>> wireless.
>>> They do have 16+ Bavarian beers on tap (!), schnitzel, kraut, and if
>>> we get the warm-up by Wed there is a beer garden in back.
>>>
>>> On Mon, Oct 27, 2008 at 5:28 PM, Carl Karsten <carl at personnelware.com 
>>> > wrote:
>>>> OK, Wed is is.
>>>>
>>>> Carl K
>>>>
>>>> Cosmin Stejerean wrote:
>>>>> I'd prefer Wednesday.
>>>>>
>>>>> On Mon, Oct 27, 2008 at 1:11 PM, Carl Karsten <carl at personnelware.com 
>>>>> >wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> gah.  maybe Thurs is better.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Anyone else care?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> more on this in a few hours.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Carl K
>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>> Chicago mailing list
>>>>>> Chicago at python.org
>>>>>> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>>>
>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>> Chicago mailing list
>>>>> Chicago at python.org
>>>>> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> Chicago mailing list
>>>> Chicago at python.org
>>>> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Chicago mailing list
>>> Chicago at python.org
>>> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>>>
>>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Chicago mailing list
>> Chicago at python.org
>> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>>
> _______________________________________________
> Chicago mailing list
> Chicago at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>


From cstejerean at gmail.com  Wed Oct 29 22:04:36 2008
From: cstejerean at gmail.com (Cosmin Stejerean)
Date: Wed, 29 Oct 2008 16:04:36 -0500
Subject: [Chicago] food tonight: Bierstube at 6
In-Reply-To: <4908B662.3030201@personnelware.com>
References: <4905FB02.1080403@personnelware.com>
	<490600CF.4040304@personnelware.com>
	<49060465.5000603@personnelware.com>
	<276266d0810271211h6c296a06i752b2577050e8863@mail.gmail.com>
	<4906407E.1030605@personnelware.com>
	<b571660a0810281231l48b295d9v5ab6ae8a8e7ee725@mail.gmail.com>
	<4908B662.3030201@personnelware.com>
Message-ID: <276266d0810291404k1aa5a021t127cdb6dac956457@mail.gmail.com>

On Wed, Oct 29, 2008 at 2:15 PM, Carl Karsten <carl at personnelware.com>wrote:

> Resi's Bierstube
>
>    2034 W. Irving Park Rd.
>    Chicago, IL 60618
>
>    773-472-1749
>
> If someone will give me a time to be at the Ravenswood stop, I can swing by
> and
> give a ride to whoever is there.  If this is some reason for me to learn to
> tweet... um... tell me what to do.  I have a cell phone - pretty sure that
> is
> relevant.  that's about how much I know.
>
> Carl K
>

I'll be there at 5:13 (although I've yet to see that train ever be on time,
so probably closer to 5:20).

-- 
Cosmin Stejerean
http://www.offbytwo.com
-------------- next part --------------
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From carl at personnelware.com  Wed Oct 29 22:15:40 2008
From: carl at personnelware.com (Carl Karsten)
Date: Wed, 29 Oct 2008 16:15:40 -0500
Subject: [Chicago] food tonight: Bierstube at 6
In-Reply-To: <276266d0810291404k1aa5a021t127cdb6dac956457@mail.gmail.com>
References: <4905FB02.1080403@personnelware.com>	<490600CF.4040304@personnelware.com>	<49060465.5000603@personnelware.com>	<276266d0810271211h6c296a06i752b2577050e8863@mail.gmail.com>	<4906407E.1030605@personnelware.com>	<b571660a0810281231l48b295d9v5ab6ae8a8e7ee725@mail.gmail.com>	<4908B662.3030201@personnelware.com>
	<276266d0810291404k1aa5a021t127cdb6dac956457@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <4908D27C.8020801@personnelware.com>

Cosmin Stejerean wrote:
> 
> 
> On Wed, Oct 29, 2008 at 2:15 PM, Carl Karsten <carl at personnelware.com
> <mailto:carl at personnelware.com>> wrote:
> 
>     Resi's Bierstube
> 
>        2034 W. Irving Park Rd.
>        Chicago, IL 60618
> 
>        773-472-1749
> 
>     If someone will give me a time to be at the Ravenswood stop, I can
>     swing by and
>     give a ride to whoever is there.  If this is some reason for me to
>     learn to
>     tweet... um... tell me what to do.  I have a cell phone - pretty
>     sure that is
>     relevant.  that's about how much I know.
> 
>     Carl K
> 
> 
> I'll be there at 5:13 (although I've yet to see that train ever be on
> time, so probably closer to 5:20).

gah - I am checking out a motorcycle at 5:30 ... the sun is out, the walk will
do you good :)

got my HD?

Carl K



From kumar.mcmillan at gmail.com  Wed Oct 29 22:39:31 2008
From: kumar.mcmillan at gmail.com (Kumar McMillan)
Date: Wed, 29 Oct 2008 16:39:31 -0500
Subject: [Chicago] food tonight: Bierstube at 6
In-Reply-To: <276266d0810291404k1aa5a021t127cdb6dac956457@mail.gmail.com>
References: <4905FB02.1080403@personnelware.com>
	<490600CF.4040304@personnelware.com>
	<49060465.5000603@personnelware.com>
	<276266d0810271211h6c296a06i752b2577050e8863@mail.gmail.com>
	<4906407E.1030605@personnelware.com>
	<b571660a0810281231l48b295d9v5ab6ae8a8e7ee725@mail.gmail.com>
	<4908B662.3030201@personnelware.com>
	<276266d0810291404k1aa5a021t127cdb6dac956457@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <b571660a0810291439w21c8dc83wf84647d21beeb577@mail.gmail.com>

On Wed, Oct 29, 2008 at 4:04 PM, Cosmin Stejerean <cstejerean at gmail.com> wrote:
> On Wed, Oct 29, 2008 at 2:15 PM, Carl Karsten <carl at personnelware.com>
> wrote:
>> Resi's Bierstube
>>
>>    2034 W. Irving Park Rd.
>>    Chicago, IL 60618
>>
>>    773-472-1749
>
> I'll be there at 5:13 (although I've yet to see that train ever be on time,
> so probably closer to 5:20).

I'll be there closer to 7

From cstejerean at gmail.com  Wed Oct 29 23:12:26 2008
From: cstejerean at gmail.com (Cosmin Stejerean)
Date: Wed, 29 Oct 2008 17:12:26 -0500
Subject: [Chicago] food tonight: Bierstube at 6
In-Reply-To: <4908D27C.8020801@personnelware.com>
References: <4905FB02.1080403@personnelware.com>
	<490600CF.4040304@personnelware.com>
	<49060465.5000603@personnelware.com>
	<276266d0810271211h6c296a06i752b2577050e8863@mail.gmail.com>
	<4906407E.1030605@personnelware.com>
	<b571660a0810281231l48b295d9v5ab6ae8a8e7ee725@mail.gmail.com>
	<4908B662.3030201@personnelware.com>
	<276266d0810291404k1aa5a021t127cdb6dac956457@mail.gmail.com>
	<4908D27C.8020801@personnelware.com>
Message-ID: <276266d0810291512t7074db21o7f0cabb37f59927b@mail.gmail.com>

On Wed, Oct 29, 2008 at 4:15 PM, Carl Karsten <carl at personnelware.com>wrote:

> Cosmin Stejerean wrote:
> >
> >
> > On Wed, Oct 29, 2008 at 2:15 PM, Carl Karsten <carl at personnelware.com
> > <mailto:carl at personnelware.com>> wrote:
> >
> >     Resi's Bierstube
> >
> >        2034 W. Irving Park Rd.
> >        Chicago, IL 60618
> >
> >        773-472-1749
> >
> >     If someone will give me a time to be at the Ravenswood stop, I can
> >     swing by and
> >     give a ride to whoever is there.  If this is some reason for me to
> >     learn to
> >     tweet... um... tell me what to do.  I have a cell phone - pretty
> >     sure that is
> >     relevant.  that's about how much I know.
> >
> >     Carl K
> >
> >
> > I'll be there at 5:13 (although I've yet to see that train ever be on
> > time, so probably closer to 5:20).
>
> gah - I am checking out a motorcycle at 5:30 ... the sun is out, the walk
> will
> do you good :)
>
> got my HD?
>
> Carl K
>

Actually I'm running late, some problem at work, so walking is fine. Yes, I
got the HD.

-- 
Cosmin Stejerean
http://www.offbytwo.com
-------------- next part --------------
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From skip at pobox.com  Thu Oct 30 12:03:47 2008
From: skip at pobox.com (skip at pobox.com)
Date: Thu, 30 Oct 2008 06:03:47 -0500
Subject: [Chicago] Drupal equivalent?
Message-ID: <18697.38035.214156.786768@montanaro-dyndns-org.local>

A friend of mine is going to be running for alderman here in Evanston and
asked me about content management software for websites.  He mentioned
Drupal which I know nothing about.  Feature-wise I presume he's going to
want some fairly basic features: easy blog capability, user feedback,
top-level control of page appearance and templating, RSS feed generation,
basic database capability, probably role-based permissions.

In the Python world I'm vaguely familiar with Plone and Zope (the former
built on the latter, right?), but nothing else.  I know plenty of folks like
Django.  Is there a content management system built on top of it?  On the
CMS page of the Python wiki:

    http://wiki.python.org/moin/ContentManagementSystems

I see a handful, none of which I recognize other than Zope, Plone and
PyLucid.  I'm not keen on Zope simply because of its heft and seems like it
woild be massive overkill here.  That would seem to doom Plone as well.  (Is
it any easier to install/use?)  PyLucid seems to have some of the features I
mentioned about.  I see someone (Massimo?) has built a CMS atop web2py
called KPAX.

So what to people use/recommend for CMS on smallish websites?

Thanks,

Skip


From erion.omeri at gmail.com  Thu Oct 30 12:58:00 2008
From: erion.omeri at gmail.com (Erion Omeri)
Date: Thu, 30 Oct 2008 06:58:00 -0500
Subject: [Chicago] Drupal equivalent?
In-Reply-To: <18697.38035.214156.786768@montanaro-dyndns-org.local>
References: <18697.38035.214156.786768@montanaro-dyndns-org.local>
Message-ID: <5923d77c0810300458x4fbe5e11mceb8800a8dd4ecc8@mail.gmail.com>

Plone works great and easy to set up out of the box with default
settings. Getting it to work nice with Squid the caching service, load
balance it was a little tricky for us. Also we found the
administration architecture to be a little hard to use when
programming portlets(modules) for it. Plone is really powerful and
once you get your head around it, you can do a lot of things with it.
By default it uses Zope to store object and even the data but you can
make it store on a relational database as well. In my experience it
was a little pain to debug, and the online code modification views
made it convenient to access code, but not as powerful as any new IDE
out there.
One of the greatest benefits of Plone though, was the public view,
that content generators(users) would use that is why we did strong
move to convert all the websites that had static content to Plone at
UW-Oshkosh, which is still a working progress.

I overall I would still recommend Plone to anyone for its power and
extendability. http://www.plone.org

Django I dont have much experience with, although I have seen the
presentation at Google Tech Talks about it.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sMql3Di4Kgc

Good luck!

Erion

On Thu, Oct 30, 2008 at 6:03 AM,  <skip at pobox.com> wrote:
> A friend of mine is going to be running for alderman here in Evanston and
> asked me about content management software for websites.  He mentioned
> Drupal which I know nothing about.  Feature-wise I presume he's going to
> want some fairly basic features: easy blog capability, user feedback,
> top-level control of page appearance and templating, RSS feed generation,
> basic database capability, probably role-based permissions.
>
> In the Python world I'm vaguely familiar with Plone and Zope (the former
> built on the latter, right?), but nothing else.  I know plenty of folks like
> Django.  Is there a content management system built on top of it?  On the
> CMS page of the Python wiki:
>
>    http://wiki.python.org/moin/ContentManagementSystems
>
> I see a handful, none of which I recognize other than Zope, Plone and
> PyLucid.  I'm not keen on Zope simply because of its heft and seems like it
> woild be massive overkill here.  That would seem to doom Plone as well.  (Is
> it any easier to install/use?)  PyLucid seems to have some of the features I
> mentioned about.  I see someone (Massimo?) has built a CMS atop web2py
> called KPAX.
>
> So what to people use/recommend for CMS on smallish websites?
>
> Thanks,
>
> Skip
>
> _______________________________________________
> Chicago mailing list
> Chicago at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>

From erion.omeri at gmail.com  Thu Oct 30 12:59:47 2008
From: erion.omeri at gmail.com (Erion Omeri)
Date: Thu, 30 Oct 2008 06:59:47 -0500
Subject: [Chicago] Drupal equivalent?
In-Reply-To: <5923d77c0810300458x4fbe5e11mceb8800a8dd4ecc8@mail.gmail.com>
References: <18697.38035.214156.786768@montanaro-dyndns-org.local>
	<5923d77c0810300458x4fbe5e11mceb8800a8dd4ecc8@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <5923d77c0810300459k1738643dma852b2ce161bc87f@mail.gmail.com>

wrong link before:
Here is the correct on.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p-WXiqrzAf8



On Thu, Oct 30, 2008 at 6:58 AM, Erion Omeri <erion.omeri at gmail.com> wrote:
> Plone works great and easy to set up out of the box with default
> settings. Getting it to work nice with Squid the caching service, load
> balance it was a little tricky for us. Also we found the
> administration architecture to be a little hard to use when
> programming portlets(modules) for it. Plone is really powerful and
> once you get your head around it, you can do a lot of things with it.
> By default it uses Zope to store object and even the data but you can
> make it store on a relational database as well. In my experience it
> was a little pain to debug, and the online code modification views
> made it convenient to access code, but not as powerful as any new IDE
> out there.
> One of the greatest benefits of Plone though, was the public view,
> that content generators(users) would use that is why we did strong
> move to convert all the websites that had static content to Plone at
> UW-Oshkosh, which is still a working progress.
>
> I overall I would still recommend Plone to anyone for its power and
> extendability. http://www.plone.org
>
> Django I dont have much experience with, although I have seen the
> presentation at Google Tech Talks about it.
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sMql3Di4Kgc
>
> Good luck!
>
> Erion
>
> On Thu, Oct 30, 2008 at 6:03 AM,  <skip at pobox.com> wrote:
>> A friend of mine is going to be running for alderman here in Evanston and
>> asked me about content management software for websites.  He mentioned
>> Drupal which I know nothing about.  Feature-wise I presume he's going to
>> want some fairly basic features: easy blog capability, user feedback,
>> top-level control of page appearance and templating, RSS feed generation,
>> basic database capability, probably role-based permissions.
>>
>> In the Python world I'm vaguely familiar with Plone and Zope (the former
>> built on the latter, right?), but nothing else.  I know plenty of folks like
>> Django.  Is there a content management system built on top of it?  On the
>> CMS page of the Python wiki:
>>
>>    http://wiki.python.org/moin/ContentManagementSystems
>>
>> I see a handful, none of which I recognize other than Zope, Plone and
>> PyLucid.  I'm not keen on Zope simply because of its heft and seems like it
>> woild be massive overkill here.  That would seem to doom Plone as well.  (Is
>> it any easier to install/use?)  PyLucid seems to have some of the features I
>> mentioned about.  I see someone (Massimo?) has built a CMS atop web2py
>> called KPAX.
>>
>> So what to people use/recommend for CMS on smallish websites?
>>
>> Thanks,
>>
>> Skip
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Chicago mailing list
>> Chicago at python.org
>> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>>
>

From emperorcezar at gmail.com  Thu Oct 30 14:07:29 2008
From: emperorcezar at gmail.com (Adam Jenkins)
Date: Thu, 30 Oct 2008 08:07:29 -0500
Subject: [Chicago] Drupal equivalent?
In-Reply-To: <18697.38035.214156.786768@montanaro-dyndns-org.local>
References: <18697.38035.214156.786768@montanaro-dyndns-org.local>
Message-ID: <58a5f2220810300607s5f1a841dx6efed988df927b68@mail.gmail.com>

Three CMSes came up in my search. I checked the trac on each of them and
they seem active. I've heard their names before, but haven't actually needed
to try them. I hope it helps.
http://django-cms.org/
http://www.satchmoproject.com
http://pylucid.org/

On Thu, Oct 30, 2008 at 6:03 AM, <skip at pobox.com> wrote:

> A friend of mine is going to be running for alderman here in Evanston and
> asked me about content management software for websites.  He mentioned
> Drupal which I know nothing about.  Feature-wise I presume he's going to
> want some fairly basic features: easy blog capability, user feedback,
> top-level control of page appearance and templating, RSS feed generation,
> basic database capability, probably role-based permissions.
>
> In the Python world I'm vaguely familiar with Plone and Zope (the former
> built on the latter, right?), but nothing else.  I know plenty of folks
> like
> Django.  Is there a content management system built on top of it?  On the
> CMS page of the Python wiki:
>
>    http://wiki.python.org/moin/ContentManagementSystems
>
> I see a handful, none of which I recognize other than Zope, Plone and
> PyLucid.  I'm not keen on Zope simply because of its heft and seems like it
> woild be massive overkill here.  That would seem to doom Plone as well.
>  (Is
> it any easier to install/use?)  PyLucid seems to have some of the features
> I
> mentioned about.  I see someone (Massimo?) has built a CMS atop web2py
> called KPAX.
>
> So what to people use/recommend for CMS on smallish websites?
>
> Thanks,
>
> Skip
>
> _______________________________________________
> Chicago mailing list
> Chicago at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>
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From MDiPierro at cs.depaul.edu  Thu Oct 30 14:24:42 2008
From: MDiPierro at cs.depaul.edu (DiPierro, Massimo)
Date: Thu, 30 Oct 2008 08:24:42 -0500
Subject: [Chicago] Drupal equivalent?
In-Reply-To: <58a5f2220810300607s5f1a841dx6efed988df927b68@mail.gmail.com>
References: <18697.38035.214156.786768@montanaro-dyndns-org.local>,
	<58a5f2220810300607s5f1a841dx6efed988df927b68@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <C1AA20CAC1E41647BFF1D41215EDD4758087748248@wagner.cti.depaul.edu>

There is this one too:

http://www.vimeo.com/1098656

The link to download is at the bottom of the video.

Massimo
________________________________________
From: chicago-bounces+mdipierro=cs.depaul.edu at python.org [chicago-bounces+mdipierro=cs.depaul.edu at python.org] On Behalf Of Adam Jenkins [emperorcezar at gmail.com]
Sent: Thursday, October 30, 2008 8:07 AM
To: The Chicago Python Users Group
Subject: Re: [Chicago] Drupal equivalent?

Three CMSes came up in my search. I checked the trac on each of them and they seem active. I've heard their names before, but haven't actually needed to try them. I hope it helps.
http://django-cms.org/
http://www.satchmoproject.com
http://pylucid.org/

On Thu, Oct 30, 2008 at 6:03 AM, <skip at pobox.com<mailto:skip at pobox.com>> wrote:
A friend of mine is going to be running for alderman here in Evanston and
asked me about content management software for websites.  He mentioned
Drupal which I know nothing about.  Feature-wise I presume he's going to
want some fairly basic features: easy blog capability, user feedback,
top-level control of page appearance and templating, RSS feed generation,
basic database capability, probably role-based permissions.

In the Python world I'm vaguely familiar with Plone and Zope (the former
built on the latter, right?), but nothing else.  I know plenty of folks like
Django.  Is there a content management system built on top of it?  On the
CMS page of the Python wiki:

   http://wiki.python.org/moin/ContentManagementSystems

I see a handful, none of which I recognize other than Zope, Plone and
PyLucid.  I'm not keen on Zope simply because of its heft and seems like it
woild be massive overkill here.  That would seem to doom Plone as well.  (Is
it any easier to install/use?)  PyLucid seems to have some of the features I
mentioned about.  I see someone (Massimo?) has built a CMS atop web2py
called KPAX.

So what to people use/recommend for CMS on smallish websites?

Thanks,

Skip

_______________________________________________
Chicago mailing list
Chicago at python.org<mailto:Chicago at python.org>
http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago


From swgithen at mtu.edu  Thu Oct 30 14:35:05 2008
From: swgithen at mtu.edu (Steven Githens)
Date: Thu, 30 Oct 2008 09:35:05 -0400
Subject: [Chicago] Drupal equivalent?
In-Reply-To: <58a5f2220810300607s5f1a841dx6efed988df927b68@mail.gmail.com>
References: <18697.38035.214156.786768@montanaro-dyndns-org.local>
	<58a5f2220810300607s5f1a841dx6efed988df927b68@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <4909B809.4040106@mtu.edu>

Last month I started using PyLucid for a few small side websites.  The 
UI is still a bit clunky in spots, and the functionality is simple (part 
of why I chose it).  Because of that it's also small enough for me to be 
able to read the code in one sitting and fix something I need to in my 
little slice of free time budgeted towards it.  It's moderately active 
as well, and you can see them tag it every few months.  I can give a 
small demo of it at the next meeting.

Also, is our chipy.blip.tv account the sort of thing we can share 
internally?  I have the video from September and could upload if whoever 
runs it doesn't mind sharing the password.   I peeked around and it 
doesn't look like there is a feature to allow other Blip User ID's 
publish to a different channel ( though I could have missed it ).

cheers,
steve


Adam Jenkins wrote:
> Three CMSes came up in my search. I checked the trac on each of them 
> and they seem active. I've heard their names before, but haven't 
> actually needed to try them. I hope it helps.
> http://django-cms.org/
> http://www.satchmoproject.com
> http://pylucid.org/
>
> On Thu, Oct 30, 2008 at 6:03 AM, <skip at pobox.com 
> <mailto:skip at pobox.com>> wrote:
>
>     A friend of mine is going to be running for alderman here in
>     Evanston and
>     asked me about content management software for websites.  He mentioned
>     Drupal which I know nothing about.  Feature-wise I presume he's
>     going to
>     want some fairly basic features: easy blog capability, user feedback,
>     top-level control of page appearance and templating, RSS feed
>     generation,
>     basic database capability, probably role-based permissions.
>
>     In the Python world I'm vaguely familiar with Plone and Zope (the
>     former
>     built on the latter, right?), but nothing else.  I know plenty of
>     folks like
>     Django.  Is there a content management system built on top of it?
>      On the
>     CMS page of the Python wiki:
>
>        http://wiki.python.org/moin/ContentManagementSystems
>
>     I see a handful, none of which I recognize other than Zope, Plone and
>     PyLucid.  I'm not keen on Zope simply because of its heft and
>     seems like it
>     woild be massive overkill here.  That would seem to doom Plone as
>     well.  (Is
>     it any easier to install/use?)  PyLucid seems to have some of the
>     features I
>     mentioned about.  I see someone (Massimo?) has built a CMS atop web2py
>     called KPAX.
>
>     So what to people use/recommend for CMS on smallish websites?
>
>     Thanks,
>
>     Skip
>
>     _______________________________________________
>     Chicago mailing list
>     Chicago at python.org <mailto:Chicago at python.org>
>     http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> _______________________________________________
> Chicago mailing list
> Chicago at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>   


From kumar.mcmillan at gmail.com  Thu Oct 30 15:28:34 2008
From: kumar.mcmillan at gmail.com (Kumar McMillan)
Date: Thu, 30 Oct 2008 09:28:34 -0500
Subject: [Chicago] Drupal equivalent?
In-Reply-To: <4909B809.4040106@mtu.edu>
References: <18697.38035.214156.786768@montanaro-dyndns-org.local>
	<58a5f2220810300607s5f1a841dx6efed988df927b68@mail.gmail.com>
	<4909B809.4040106@mtu.edu>
Message-ID: <b571660a0810300728l3de9b251ya881d12a71a19756@mail.gmail.com>

On Thu, Oct 30, 2008 at 8:35 AM, Steven Githens <swgithen at mtu.edu> wrote:
> Last month I started using PyLucid for a few small side websites.  The UI is
> still a bit clunky in spots, and the functionality is simple (part of why I
> chose it).  Because of that it's also small enough for me to be able to read
> the code in one sitting and fix something I need to in my little slice of
> free time budgeted towards it.  It's moderately active as well, and you can
> see them tag it every few months.  I can give a small demo of it at the next
> meeting.

Steve, +1 for a talk on PyLucid

>
> Also, is our chipy.blip.tv account the sort of thing we can share
> internally?  I have the video from September and could upload if whoever
> runs it doesn't mind sharing the password.   I peeked around and it doesn't
> look like there is a feature to allow other Blip User ID's publish to a
> different channel ( though I could have missed it ).
>
> cheers,
> steve
>
>
> Adam Jenkins wrote:
>>
>> Three CMSes came up in my search. I checked the trac on each of them and
>> they seem active. I've heard their names before, but haven't actually needed
>> to try them. I hope it helps.
>> http://django-cms.org/
>> http://www.satchmoproject.com
>> http://pylucid.org/
>>
>> On Thu, Oct 30, 2008 at 6:03 AM, <skip at pobox.com <mailto:skip at pobox.com>>
>> wrote:
>>
>>    A friend of mine is going to be running for alderman here in
>>    Evanston and
>>    asked me about content management software for websites.  He mentioned
>>    Drupal which I know nothing about.  Feature-wise I presume he's
>>    going to
>>    want some fairly basic features: easy blog capability, user feedback,
>>    top-level control of page appearance and templating, RSS feed
>>    generation,
>>    basic database capability, probably role-based permissions.
>>
>>    In the Python world I'm vaguely familiar with Plone and Zope (the
>>    former
>>    built on the latter, right?), but nothing else.  I know plenty of
>>    folks like
>>    Django.  Is there a content management system built on top of it?
>>     On the
>>    CMS page of the Python wiki:
>>
>>       http://wiki.python.org/moin/ContentManagementSystems
>>
>>    I see a handful, none of which I recognize other than Zope, Plone and
>>    PyLucid.  I'm not keen on Zope simply because of its heft and
>>    seems like it
>>    woild be massive overkill here.  That would seem to doom Plone as
>>    well.  (Is
>>    it any easier to install/use?)  PyLucid seems to have some of the
>>    features I
>>    mentioned about.  I see someone (Massimo?) has built a CMS atop web2py
>>    called KPAX.
>>
>>    So what to people use/recommend for CMS on smallish websites?
>>
>>    Thanks,
>>
>>    Skip
>>
>>    _______________________________________________
>>    Chicago mailing list
>>    Chicago at python.org <mailto:Chicago at python.org>
>>    http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>>
>>
>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Chicago mailing list
>> Chicago at python.org
>> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Chicago mailing list
> Chicago at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/chicago
>

From christianzlong at yahoo.com  Thu Oct 30 15:39:19 2008
From: christianzlong at yahoo.com (Christian Long)
Date: Thu, 30 Oct 2008 09:39:19 -0500
Subject: [Chicago] Drupal equivalent?
In-Reply-To: <mailman.21537.1225374296.3486.chicago@python.org>
References: <mailman.21537.1225374296.3486.chicago@python.org>
Message-ID: <4909C717.9010707@yahoo.com>

Drupal itself is pretty nice to work with, has an active community, and 
is easily extended with modules.

I use it for my own little site

http://christianlong.com/

It has nice tagging and taxonomy features, and the admin interface is 
pleasant. I'm only using a small subset of its features.

Erion: are you in Oshkosh?  If so, I suggest we have a "far northern 
suburbs" chipy meeting.  Y'all are welcome to attend.  The closest 
station is Linden, on the Purple line ;)

Christian



From david.durham.jr at gmail.com  Thu Oct 30 15:46:46 2008
From: david.durham.jr at gmail.com (David Durham, Jr.)
Date: Thu, 30 Oct 2008 09:46:46 -0500
Subject: [Chicago] Drupal equivalent?
In-Reply-To: <5923d77c0810300458x4fbe5e11mceb8800a8dd4ecc8@mail.gmail.com>
References: <18697.38035.214156.786768@montanaro-dyndns-org.local>
	<5923d77c0810300458x4fbe5e11mceb8800a8dd4ecc8@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <fdb5fda0810300746t6a3a49a0x88148e3a96dbe0e8@mail.gmail.com>

On Thu, Oct 30, 2008 at 6:58 AM, Erion Omeri <erion.omeri at gmail.com> wrote:
> Plone works great and easy to set up out of the box with default
> settings. Getting it to work nice with Squid the caching service, load

Have you looked at varnish?

http://varnish.projects.linpro.no/

>From the FAQ:

Why bother with Varnish - why not use Squid?

Varnish was written from the ground up to be a high performance
caching reverse proxy. Squid is a forward proxy that can be configured
as a reverse proxy. Besides - Squid is rather old and designed like
computer programs were supposed to be designed in 1980. Please see
ArchitectNotes for details.

http://varnish.projects.linpro.no/wiki/ArchitectNotes

...
So what happens with squids elaborate memory management is that it
gets into fights with the kernels elaborate memory management, and
like any civil war, that never gets anything done.
...

> I overall I would still recommend Plone to anyone for its power and
> extendability. http://www.plone.org

I can also recommend Plone.  I actually use repoze.plone, which was a
breeze to setup for both dev and prod.  In dev I use paster and
mod_wsgi in prod.

http://repoze.org/quickstart.html#repoze.plone

-Dave

From maney at two14.net  Fri Oct 31 22:46:10 2008
From: maney at two14.net (Martin Maney)
Date: Fri, 31 Oct 2008 16:46:10 -0500
Subject: [Chicago] Seasonal Greetings
Message-ID: <20081031214610.GA858@furrr.two14.net>


"""Chippy the chipmunk is scary"""

import scary

print scary.BigBadBoo('Chippy')

# ...

# profit!



# okay, it seemed funnier in IRC

-- 
GUIs are just what some developer thinks you'll be needing  -- PJ


From szybalski at gmail.com  Fri Oct 31 22:57:00 2008
From: szybalski at gmail.com (Lukasz Szybalski)
Date: Fri, 31 Oct 2008 16:57:00 -0500
Subject: [Chicago] setuptools required?
Message-ID: <804e5c70810311457i253de85dld4a59fb2d3dcdc69@mail.gmail.com>

Hello,
I was wondering if anybody has a suggestion on how to automatically
download setuptools if its not available on the system.

What I have tried right now is to add ez_setup.py file to a source
folder and add a line

import ez_setup
ez_setup.main(['setuptools'])
...then regular setup.py stuff follows


this downloads and installs setuptools BUT the package that it
supposed to setup aka what is in setup.py is not setup correctly.
(unless I run the command second time)

So maybe somebody on this list knows how to get this working..
with the extra ez_setup stuff I get something like this:

Downloading http://pypi.python.org/packages/2.5/s/setuptools/setuptools-0.6c9-py2.5.egg
Searching for setuptools
Reading http://pypi.python.org/simple/setuptools/
Best match: setuptools 0.6c9
Downloading http://pypi.python.org/packages/2.5/s/setuptools/setuptools-0.6c9-py2.5.egg#md5=fe67c3e5a17b12c0e7c541b7ea43a8e6
Processing setuptools-0.6c9-py2.5.egg
Moving setuptools-0.6c9-py2.5.egg to /usr/lib/python2.5/site-packages
Adding setuptools 0.6c9 to easy-install.pth file
Installing easy_install script to /usr/bin
Installing easy_install-2.5 script to /usr/bin

Installed /usr/lib/python2.5/site-packages/setuptools-0.6c9-py2.5.egg
Processing dependencies for setuptools
Finished processing dependencies for setuptools
Processing setuptools-0.6c9-py2.5.egg
Removing /usr/lib/python2.5/site-packages/setuptools-0.6c9-py2.5.egg
Copying setuptools-0.6c9-py2.5.egg to /usr/lib/python2.5/site-packages
setuptools 0.6c9 is already the active version in easy-install.pth
Installing easy_install script to /usr/bin
Installing easy_install-2.5 script to /usr/bin

Installed /usr/lib/python2.5/site-packages/setuptools-0.6c9-py2.5.egg
Processing dependencies for setuptools==0.6c9
Finished processing dependencies for setuptools==0.6c9
running install
running bdist_egg
running egg_info
writing requirements to someapp.egg-info/requires.txt
writing someapp.egg-info/PKG-INFO
writing top-level names to someapp.egg-info/top_level.txt
writing dependency_links to someapp.egg-info/dependency_links.txt
writing entry points to someapp.egg-info/entry_points.txt
error: None


There is no error and I have no idea how to debug it?
Ideas? I tried in a default system wide location or in virtualenv and
it gives the same results.

Thanks,
Lucas

From cstejerean at gmail.com  Fri Oct 31 23:06:52 2008
From: cstejerean at gmail.com (Cosmin Stejerean)
Date: Fri, 31 Oct 2008 17:06:52 -0500
Subject: [Chicago] setuptools required?
In-Reply-To: <804e5c70810311457i253de85dld4a59fb2d3dcdc69@mail.gmail.com>
References: <804e5c70810311457i253de85dld4a59fb2d3dcdc69@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <276266d0810311506p285423casfe3b975f33176bc9@mail.gmail.com>

On Fri, Oct 31, 2008 at 4:57 PM, Lukasz Szybalski <szybalski at gmail.com>wrote:

> Hello,
> I was wondering if anybody has a suggestion on how to automatically
> download setuptools if its not available on the system.
>
> What I have tried right now is to add ez_setup.py file to a source
> folder and add a line
>
> import ez_setup
> ez_setup.main(['setuptools'])
> ...then regular setup.py stuff follows
>
>
Have you tried the following?

import ez_setup
ez_setup.use_setuptools()


-- 
Cosmin Stejerean
http://www.offbytwo.com
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From kumar.mcmillan at gmail.com  Fri Oct 31 23:49:07 2008
From: kumar.mcmillan at gmail.com (Kumar McMillan)
Date: Fri, 31 Oct 2008 17:49:07 -0500
Subject: [Chicago] setuptools required?
In-Reply-To: <276266d0810311506p285423casfe3b975f33176bc9@mail.gmail.com>
References: <804e5c70810311457i253de85dld4a59fb2d3dcdc69@mail.gmail.com>
	<276266d0810311506p285423casfe3b975f33176bc9@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <b571660a0810311549pe6c12f4k8cb572a9de66efe2@mail.gmail.com>

On Fri, Oct 31, 2008 at 5:06 PM, Cosmin Stejerean <cstejerean at gmail.com> wrote:
>
> Have you tried the following?
>
> import ez_setup
> ez_setup.use_setuptools()

This is what I use and it does a self update automatically.  If that
still doesn't work for you, be sure you are using the latest version
of the ez_setup.py script since some bugs were fixed in it (yay,
bootstrappping!)