[Distutils] [pyconuk] "just use debian"

Stephen Pascoe stephen.pascoe at lirico.co.uk
Tue Sep 23 12:59:18 CEST 2008

I'm interested in hearing what you find so annoying about the egg format
because for me it's the one part of the setuptools system that I would

If I had my way we'd separate out eggs from distutils/setuptools and all the
automagical package installation of easy_install and focus on making eggs
work as plugins.  Eggs are a best effort attempt to make a jar-like system
for Python and in many cases they work well (c.f. Trac plugins).  Sure,
there are some workarounds needed for C-extensions and packages that access
__file__, etc. but these problems seem more surmountable than the deeply
ingrained problems with distutils.


On Tue, Sep 23, 2008 at 11:47 AM, Chris Withers <chris at simplistix.co.uk>wrote:

> Nicolas Chauvat wrote:
>> Also some of the Debian Python packages are broken or grossly
>>> out-of-date.
>> File a bug report :)
> Yes, because that automatically frees up the packager's time to work on
> these issues...
>  My problem with setup tools is that they come from windows
> I don't think that's the case at all.
>  is (almost) no package management system. The consequence is that
>> their author reinvented the wheel, but limited it to Python, then
>> moved to eggs and made things worse.
> Yes, the egg format is annoying.
> No, I don't think having a package management system that targets only
> python packages is a bad idea.
>  My main tool is Python, but I have many other tools on my system. I
>> do not want to have as many package management utilities as
>> "subsystems".
> Then I suggest you volunteer to maintain the debian packages for every
> single python package.
>  If I have one tool for Python, one for Java, one for C,
>> one for Fortran, one for C libraries, one for Gnome, etc. integration
>> becomes a nightmare.
> If you have projects this large, then you likely want to roll your own OS
> packages anyway.
>  [Please note that for an experienced Debian developer, making the
>> initial package of a Python module can be a matter of half an hour to
>> a couple hours and releasing a new version a matter of minutes.]
> ...and for someone not using Debian or not an experienced Debian developer?
> Despite being a fan of Debian, I'm well aware of just how "friendly" a
> community it can be to the new user...
> cheers,
> Chris
> --
> Simplistix - Content Management, Zope & Python Consulting
>           - http://www.simplistix.co.uk
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