[Edu-sig] Fw: Python sequences by reference - how to make clear

[Arthur]

> > > Sorry, I may have missed that suggestion amidst your rhetoric.
> > >
> > > Assuming you're lobbying for a builtin named copy(), should it be a
> > > deep copy or a shallow copy?
> >
> > Is this question a red herring, Guido? Surely one would ask for both
> > copy() and deepcopy(), the same functions exposed by the copy
> > module. Of course, I'm not convinced having them as builtins solves
> > the real problem. (Which is why I asked if the question was a red
> > herring.) If anything, having these functions as builtins might lead
> > to an excessive use of copying by the same individuals who hadn't
> > yet gotten a handle on mutable versus immutable objects.
>
> Exactly.  I'm trying to tease out what Arthur perceived the solution
> to be to the surprises with object aliasing.
>

My contention is simple. And nothing I am in a position to prove, with any
amount of rhetoric. Copy as built_in simply puts a whole area of
fundamentals on the table as fundamental. It is as important to understand
why you are not copying when you are not, as why you are copying when you
are. "Copy" is not CGI or tokenize.

If I am convinced that I would have confronted and overcome some of this
confusion much sooner in the process (and that I am typical) had I found
copy as a built_in, what is the suggestion for lending some weight to this
contention?

Art