[Edu-sig] Any suggestions about turlte.py

[Radenski, Atanas]

Vern,

My apologies for being unclear. In Windows, turtle commands in
interactive mode have been most problematic, meaning that Tk becomes
irresponsive. In Windows XP, this can be simulated very easily.

0. Launch IDLE and run a Python shell.
1. Launch IE Explorer and make sure it covers the Python shell.
2. Bring the shell to the front and enter:

>>> import turtle; pen = turtle.Pen();

After this, Tk becomes unresponsive.

In addition, I believe my students have had problems of the second type
you refer to: when a window with an already completed drawing/program
becomes unresponsive. Unfortunately, I could not recreate such a
situation today. I do not think I have had problems with a turtle
program that is *running*.

I have found Turtle graphics very useful, despite of all difficulties in
Windows. Even a partial improvement would be beneficial. 

To me it seems very important to keep the new turtle module as
compatible as possible with the current one. The reason is the turtle
module has already been used in various publications or internal
teaching materials. It would be nice if the updated turtle can be used
with existing resources. 

Again, thank you for doing this.

Atanas

Atanas Radenski      
mailto:radenski at chapman.edu      http://www.chapman.edu/~radenski/
 
I find television very educating. Every time somebody turns on the set,
I go into the other room and read a book - Groucho Marx

> -----Original Message-----
> From: Vern Ceder [mailto:vceder at canterburyschool.org]
> Sent: Tuesday, February 28, 2006 5:49 AM
> To: Radenski, Atanas; Edu-sig at python.org
> Subject: Re: [Edu-sig] Any suggestions about turlte.py
> 
> Atanas,
> 
> Thanks for the input - I wasn't aware of the first problem you
mention.
> I'm not sure about the secnond issue - do you mean that a turtle
program
> that is *running* will hang if covered by other graphics? Or that a
> window with an already completed drawing/program will become
> unrresponsive? I've seen the second behavior, but not the first.
> 
> Thanks,
> Vern
> 
> Radenski, Atanas wrote:
> > Hi,
> >
> > Thank you for taking care of the turtle.py module. Here are tow
> > suggestions.
> >
> > [1] I would suggest a correction of a bug in the fill function of
> > turtle.py. The statement:
> >
> >               # self._canvas.lower(item)
> >
> > should be removed. As it is now, it lowers polygons when filled.
This
> > causes inconsistent behavior because nothing else is lowered. Here
is a
> > suggested the statement in context:
> >
> >
> >     def fill(self, flag):
> >         if self._filling:
> >             path = tuple(self._path)
> >             smooth = self._filling < 0
> >             if len(path) > 2:
> >                 item = self._canvas._create('polygon', path,
> >                                             {'fill': self._color,
> >                                              'smooth': smooth})
> >                 self._items.append(item)
> >
> >                 # Should be removed, because
> >                 # nothing else is lowered but filled polygons:
> >
> >                 # self._canvas.lower(item)
> >
> >                 if self._tofill:
> >                     for item in self._tofill:
> >                         self._canvas.itemconfigure(item,
> > fill=self._color)
> >                         self._items.append(item)
> >         self._path = []
> >         self._tofill = []
> >         self._filling = flag
> >         if flag:
> >             self._path.append(self._position)
> >         self.forward(0)
> >
> > [2] A nuisance with this otherwise quite useful module is its
behavior
> > in Windows systems: It tends to *stop responding*. This happens when
the
> > canvas is covered by other graphics for a while, especially in cases
> > when execution is triggered form the interactive prompt. It would be
> > great if this problem can be fixed (although I am not sure what can
be
> > done about it.)
> >
> > Atanas
> >
> > Atanas Radenski
> > mailto:radenski at chapman.edu      http://www.chapman.edu/~radenski/
> >
> > I find television very educating. Every time somebody turns on the
set,
> > I go into the other room and read a book - Groucho Marx
> >
> >
> >
> >>-----Original Message-----
> >>From: edu-sig-bounces at python.org [mailto:edu-sig-bounces at python.org]
> >
> > On
> >
> >>Behalf Of Vern Ceder
> >>Sent: Monday, February 27, 2006 11:32 AM
> >>To: Edu-sig at python.org
> >>Subject: [Edu-sig] Any suggestions about turlte.py
> >>
> >>Hello everyone,
> >>
> >>As a consequence of my complaining about it in my PyCon talk, I have
> >>been invited to submit some patches for turtle.py. To my mind,
> >
> > turtle.py
> >
> >>should be something that one could actually use for some very simple
> >>"programming with graphics" lessons, with NO tweaking or additional
> >>software.
> >>
> >>So I think the following would be handy:
> >>
> >>1. equally usable with either "import * from turtle" or "import
> >
> > turtle"
> >
> >>imports
> >>2. should open with a window covering at least half the screen (the
> >>current default is too small to be useful)
> >>3. should offer some simple configuration choices for things like
> >>initial size and shape, but mostly rely on reasonable defaults
> >>4. should offer a class wrapper so that that one could easily
> >>instantiate different turtles for a first experience with objects.
> >>5. some minor tweaks to make it better behaved when run from IDLE
> >>
> >>Does anyone have any feedback on these ideas or any other
suggestions
> >>about how turtle.py might be improved without being fundamentally
> >
> > changed?
> >
> >>Note: this is about turtle.py only, for all its deficiencies. Any
> >>suggestions to try another library, system, or language will be
> >>cheerfully, but resolutely, ignored. ;)
> >>
> >>Cheers,
> >>Vern Ceder
> >>
> >>
> >>--
> >>This time for sure!
> >>    -Bullwinkle J. Moose
> >>-----------------------------
> >>Vern Ceder, Director of Technology
> >>Canterbury School, 3210 Smith Road, Ft Wayne, IN 46804
> >>vceder at canterburyschool.org; 260-436-0746; FAX: 260-436-5137
> >>_______________________________________________
> >>Edu-sig mailing list
> >>Edu-sig at python.org
> >>http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/edu-sig
> 
> --
> This time for sure!
>     -Bullwinkle J. Moose
> -----------------------------
> Vern Ceder, Director of Technology
> Canterbury School, 3210 Smith Road, Ft Wayne, IN 46804
> vceder at canterburyschool.org; 260-436-0746; FAX: 260-436-5137