From andre.roberge at gmail.com Sat Dec 1 03:44:34 2007 From: andre.roberge at gmail.com (Andre Roberge) Date: Fri, 30 Nov 2007 22:44:34 -0400 Subject: [Edu-sig] Crunchy news Message-ID: <7528bcdd0711301844o153c6693mc05b6975a3350da8@mail.gmail.com> Hi everyone, It's been too quiet here lately, so I thought I would pipe in ;-) Crunchy (http://code.google.com/p/crunchy) has *almost* reached version 1.0. Currently, a few high school students are doing Crunchy-related tasks as part of Google's Highly Open Participation (GHOP) contest. And I just produced a first Crunchy screencast ( http://showmedo.com/videos/video?name=1430000&fromSeriesID=143). It was recorded in one go, so it's not as polished as it could have been, but it should give a good idea of Crunchy's current capabilities. I know, for having corresponded with at least one of them, that some of Jeff Elkner's students worked on Crunchy related project (porting How to Think Like a Computer Scientist, as well as possibly the Livewires module) as well as other projects (GASP, for instance) but I have not heard from him. So, Jeff, if you are still on this list, how about letting everyone know all the good work that you guys have been doing? For those that have contact with pre-university students (13+), please encourage them to take part in GHOP. Andr? -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mail.python.org/pipermail/edu-sig/attachments/20071130/071e9772/attachment.htm From lac at openend.se Sun Dec 9 13:50:36 2007 From: lac at openend.se (Laura Creighton) Date: Sun, 9 Dec 2007 13:50:36 +0100 Subject: [Edu-sig] Skolelinux wins Scandinavian Free Software Award Message-ID: <200712091250.lB9CoaKn030880@theraft.openend.se> http://mail.fsfeurope.org/pipermail/press-release-sv/2007q4/000026.html (Skol/Skole == School) Laura From kirby.urner at gmail.com Sun Dec 9 22:57:58 2007 From: kirby.urner at gmail.com (kirby urner) Date: Sun, 9 Dec 2007 13:57:58 -0800 Subject: [Edu-sig] Yo from PDX! Message-ID: Back from a break, up to date on the archives. On the Portland scene: the local user group is hot, jump started by a snake charmer from Texas, with me 'n Jason co-anchoring on meetup.com, but with our own profile at python.org as well, which makes us official. Jeff S. has been doing a good job of anchoring meetings. We've swapped pizza with PHP folks, shared a meeting room with Ruby (projectors back to back (pointing in opposite directions)). All this open source friendliness is owing to Portland Cubespace, the site of our first Portland Barcamp (elements of which I migrated to Centralia, for a test run of a physician-geek hybrid event (worked OK, for an alpha version)). A couple years ago I started tracking koreducators.org and its mission to charter and fly a new school (public) in Portland. Their battle royale was nobly fought and well executed (I had only a bit part, made a strategic "boo!" sound on one of the public meeting tapes), and today LEP High is a reality, runs Ubuntu open source, attracts a broad spectrum of talented future entrepreneurs (the focus of LEP is Leadership & Entrepreneurship meaning you need to be thinking in terms of running a small business in order to graduate). I've been in to catalyze the Python culture, open source more generally, or maybe programming more generally, as that's a kind of "hard fun" that, like reading, like skiing, you don't spontaneously enjoy until you're somewhat good at it, meaning a chicken and egg vicious circle unless you've got good jump start materials. I got a circular from Helen King recently about complementary efforts in Cape Town, to leverage open source and its benefits. Lesson planning is a kind of source coding. Teachers closest to the action often have the best ideas, but frequently aren't tasked with sharing them. A more Japanese approach, availing of post-WWII state of the art theories (Peter Drucker and so on), breaks down any firewall between so-called managers and so-called workers, by setting up some revolving door plans. Administrate for awhile, teach for awhile, be a student for awhile. Keep switching. Don't think in terms of promotion or demotion, but of keeping limber, aware, in touch with the big picture. This is the kind of management consulting message we give from my tiny partnership, 4D Solutions, when called upon (but of course the devil is in the details, so I didn't just give away the store). Anyway, that's enough from my corner: PPUG is running smoothly, in coordination with other language communities, thanks to Cubespace; one of Portland's most innovative flagships is having fun with Python; schools of the future will distribute curriculum writing more wisely, to those best in a position to reflect, if only given the time to do so. Kirby Urner Senior Partner 4D Solutions (4dsolutions.net) PS: on the international scene, I'm remembering how hard Laura and Aiste worked on the last Europython so have been recalling some of those meetings and discussions. I made a couple posts to the Europython archive, I hoped of a helpful nature, but Portland and Vilnius or literally on other sides of the globe, so no way do I feel in a position to offer any micromanagement skills (more what I offer locally-based clients). http://mail.python.org/pipermail/europython/2007-November/date.html From kirby.urner at gmail.com Wed Dec 12 03:24:58 2007 From: kirby.urner at gmail.com (kirby urner) Date: Tue, 11 Dec 2007 18:24:58 -0800 Subject: [Edu-sig] Wrapping functions in a Function class Message-ID: Got a green light for my talk @ Pycon, meaning I'll be doing a quick run through some group theory stuff, as we teach pre-college in our prototype Pythonic Math Class of the Future (what the talk is about). Here's a pertainent link: http://mail.geneseo.edu/pipermail/math-thinking-l/2007-November/001211.html Note this idiom of using a decorator to wrap a function as a class object, with __call__ made to pass through an argument for evaluation (like it were still just a regular function) and __mul__ made to make functions "composable" i.e. "objects that multiply" (our motive for wrapping functions within objects in the first place i.e. to make use of Python's special names, __mul__ in particular). Kirby From bblais at bryant.edu Wed Dec 12 12:01:28 2007 From: bblais at bryant.edu (Brian Blais) Date: Wed, 12 Dec 2007 06:01:28 -0500 Subject: [Edu-sig] "do" as a keyword In-Reply-To: References: <13lts6gb9t2j350@corp.supernews.com> Message-ID: <8629A7C4-59DB-42C2-853A-24760A7B9B80@bryant.edu> On Dec 11, 2007, at Dec 11:11:11 PM, Terry Reedy wrote: > > "Steven D'Aprano" wrote in > message > news:13lts6gb9t2j350 at corp.supernews.com... > || > | But loops that run at least once is a basic element of algorithms. > | Perhaps not as common as the zero or more times of the while > loop, but > | still fundamental. It is a shame it has to be faked using: > | > | while True: # force the first iteration to always run > | process > | if condition: break > | > | Ugly and misleading. > > I disagree. Nothing is being faked. The generic loop is > > while True: > pre_process > if condition: break > post_process > I find that when teaching beginning programmers, they usually think in "until" terms, and not "while" terms. do: Forward() until Touched() and I have to explain to them that Python doesn't have "until", and that the logic for while is exactly the opposite: while not Touched(): Forward() they find the "while" logic to be unintuitive, and I often find myself feeling the same way: crafting it with the until logic, and then reversing it. Perhaps I should do as above, and do: while True: Forward() if Touched(): break but somehow that feels wrong to me, like bypassing the point of the while: all that power to check for conditions, and you just use it to check True, and then use a break inside. It's readable, I guess, but not a programming construct I am immediately drawn to. Brian Blais -- Brian Blais bblais at bryant.edu http://web.bryant.edu/~bblais -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mail.python.org/pipermail/edu-sig/attachments/20071212/4facb263/attachment.htm From kirby.urner at gmail.com Wed Dec 12 15:32:02 2007 From: kirby.urner at gmail.com (kirby urner) Date: Wed, 12 Dec 2007 06:32:02 -0800 Subject: [Edu-sig] "do" as a keyword In-Reply-To: <8629A7C4-59DB-42C2-853A-24760A7B9B80@bryant.edu> References: <13lts6gb9t2j350@corp.supernews.com> <8629A7C4-59DB-42C2-853A-24760A7B9B80@bryant.edu> Message-ID: > I find that when teaching beginning programmers, they usually think in > "until" terms, and not "while" terms. > If really beginning, an overview of this whole idea of control structures makes sense, such as this wikipedia article: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Control_flow Then explain how Python is very minimalist in its approach, unlike some languages, which try to provide all kinds of control structure semantics, including multiple case loops (do... case... case...) which Python famously does not natively have either. > they find the "while" logic to be unintuitive, and I often find myself > feeling the same way: crafting it with the until logic, and then reversing > it. I wouldn't make "intuitive" the guiding light in all cases, as it's often just code for "conditioned reflex" or "what we're used to." Usually beginners outgrow their initial discomfort, like when learning to drive stick instead of automatic or whatever. Kirby From vceder at canterburyschool.org Wed Dec 12 15:55:33 2007 From: vceder at canterburyschool.org (Vern Ceder) Date: Wed, 12 Dec 2007 09:55:33 -0500 Subject: [Edu-sig] "do" as a keyword In-Reply-To: <8629A7C4-59DB-42C2-853A-24760A7B9B80@bryant.edu> References: <13lts6gb9t2j350@corp.supernews.com> <8629A7C4-59DB-42C2-853A-24760A7B9B80@bryant.edu> Message-ID: <475FF665.8000308@canterburyschool.org> Brian Blais wrote: > I find that when teaching beginning programmers, they usually think in > "until" terms, and not "while" terms. I haven't noticed that so much myself, actually... My students (grades 8-10) tend to think in fixed numbers of repetitions and the whole idea of a flexible loop is a big jump for some. That may be age/development related, though... > > they find the "while" logic to be unintuitive, and I often find myself > feeling the same way: crafting it with the until logic, and then > reversing it. Perhaps I should do as above, and do: I would second Kirby's comment that "intuitive" in programming contexts often means "what we're used to" or even "the way I do it". ;-) > while True: > Forward() > if Touched(): break > > but somehow that feels wrong to me, like bypassing the point of the > while: all that power to check for conditions, and you just use it to > check True, and then use a break inside. It's readable, I guess, but > not a programming construct I am immediately drawn to. I agree with you here... except for event loops, where the while True: syntax is exactly what you need. Again, I'm with Kirby on Python's parsimony in control structures. A repeat 0 to x times structure is more general than a repeat 1 to x times structure, and having a special case for the latter wouldn't be "Pythonic" as I grok the term... Cheers, Vern -- This time for sure! -Bullwinkle J. Moose ----------------------------- Vern Ceder, Director of Technology Canterbury School, 3210 Smith Road, Ft Wayne, IN 46804 vceder at canterburyschool.org; 260-436-0746; FAX: 260-436-5137 From mpaul213 at gmail.com Wed Dec 12 17:11:32 2007 From: mpaul213 at gmail.com (michel paul) Date: Wed, 12 Dec 2007 08:11:32 -0800 Subject: [Edu-sig] "do" as a keyword In-Reply-To: <8629A7C4-59DB-42C2-853A-24760A7B9B80@bryant.edu> References: <13lts6gb9t2j350@corp.supernews.com> <8629A7C4-59DB-42C2-853A-24760A7B9B80@bryant.edu> Message-ID: <40ea4eb00712120811y60eb6d25pd5fae962023ef967@mail.gmail.com> > they find the "while" logic to be unintuitive I've found that a good way to explain 'while' is to consider it as an 'if' statement that repeats. Kids grasp simple conditionals fairly easily. I would sometimes hear them talk about 'if loops' when they were actually trying to discuss conditional statements, and I would say to them hey look, there's no such THING as an 'if loop'! But then it occurred to me - well, that's what a while statement is! So, let's just take a simple conditional, change the 'if' to 'while', and there you have a loop! Only problem, it will keep repeating forever, so now we have to consider ways to get it to stop. Speaking from my own learning experiences, 'while True' initially seemed awkward, probably for the same reason 'if True' would - why bother? But at this point I actually do like the 'while True' structure. - Michel Paul On Dec 12, 2007 3:01 AM, Brian Blais wrote: > On Dec 11, 2007, at Dec 11:11:11 PM, Terry Reedy wrote: > > > "Steven D'Aprano" wrote in message > news:13lts6gb9t2j350 at corp.supernews.com... > || > | But loops that run at least once is a basic element of algorithms. > | Perhaps not as common as the zero or more times of the while loop, but > | still fundamental. It is a shame it has to be faked using: > | > | while True: # force the first iteration to always run > | process > | if condition: break > | > | Ugly and misleading. > > I disagree. Nothing is being faked. The generic loop is > > while True: > pre_process > if condition: break > post_process > > > I find that when teaching beginning programmers, they usually think in > "until" terms, and not "while" terms. > > do: > Forward() > until Touched() > > and I have to explain to them that Python doesn't have "until", and that > the logic for while is exactly the opposite: > > while not Touched(): > Forward() > > they find the "while" logic to be unintuitive, and I often find myself > feeling the same way: crafting it with the until logic, and then reversing > it. Perhaps I should do as above, and do: > > while True: > Forward() > if Touched(): break > > but somehow that feels wrong to me, like bypassing the point of the while: > all that power to check for conditions, and you just use it to check True, > and then use a break inside. It's readable, I guess, but not a programming > construct I am immediately drawn to. > > > Brian Blais > > > -- > Brian Blais > bblais at bryant.edu > http://web.bryant.edu/~bblais > > > > > _______________________________________________ > Edu-sig mailing list > Edu-sig at python.org > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/edu-sig > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mail.python.org/pipermail/edu-sig/attachments/20071212/c4cbd6f3/attachment.htm From kirby.urner at gmail.com Wed Dec 12 17:26:07 2007 From: kirby.urner at gmail.com (kirby urner) Date: Wed, 12 Dec 2007 08:26:07 -0800 Subject: [Edu-sig] "do" as a keyword In-Reply-To: <40ea4eb00712120811y60eb6d25pd5fae962023ef967@mail.gmail.com> References: <13lts6gb9t2j350@corp.supernews.com> <8629A7C4-59DB-42C2-853A-24760A7B9B80@bryant.edu> <40ea4eb00712120811y60eb6d25pd5fae962023ef967@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: Also people have different styles, like you don't need to use a bare True, but might go like: untouched = True while untouched: keepmoving() or something similar. Kirby From aharrin at luc.edu Wed Dec 12 17:35:23 2007 From: aharrin at luc.edu (Andrew Harrington) Date: Wed, 12 Dec 2007 10:35:23 -0600 Subject: [Edu-sig] Wrapping functions in a Function class In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Nice wrapper class Kirby! One thought: multiplying functions is another operation. I would tend to reserve '*' for that, or you will be confusing of limited. Since the raised circle is not a python operator, it appears you need to use a different, nonstandard composition symbol. Perhaps '%' (it has a raise circle as part of it :-) ). Then have the Function class do the basic arithmetic operations *and* composition. On Dec 11, 2007 8:24 PM, kirby urner wrote: > Got a green light for my talk @ Pycon, meaning I'll be doing a quick > run through some group theory stuff, as we teach pre-college in our > prototype Pythonic Math Class of the Future (what the talk is about). > > Here's a pertainent link: > http://mail.geneseo.edu/pipermail/math-thinking-l/2007-November/001211.html > > Note this idiom of using a decorator to wrap a function as a class > object, with __call__ made to pass through an argument for evaluation > (like it were still just a regular function) and __mul__ made to make > functions "composable" i.e. "objects that multiply" (our motive for > wrapping functions within objects in the first place i.e. to make use > of Python's special names, __mul__ in particular). > > Kirby > _______________________________________________ > Edu-sig mailing list > Edu-sig at python.org > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/edu-sig > -- Andrew N. Harrington Director of Academic Programs Computer Science Department Loyola University Chicago 512B Lewis Towers (office) Snail mail to Lewis Towers 416 820 North Michigan Avenue Chicago, Illinois 60611 http://www.cs.luc.edu/~anh Phone: 312-915-7999 Fax: 312-915-7998 gdp at cs.luc.edu for graduate administration upd at cs.luc.edu for undergrad administration aharrin at luc.edu as professor From christian.mascher at gmx.de Wed Dec 12 17:54:08 2007 From: christian.mascher at gmx.de (Christian Mascher) Date: Wed, 12 Dec 2007 17:54:08 +0100 Subject: [Edu-sig] [Fwd: Re: "do" as a keyword] Message-ID: <47601230.2050406@gmx.de> -------------- next part -------------- An embedded message was scrubbed... From: Christian Mascher Subject: Re: [Edu-sig] "do" as a keyword Date: Wed, 12 Dec 2007 17:53:37 +0100 Size: 2939 Url: http://mail.python.org/pipermail/edu-sig/attachments/20071212/225a9efb/attachment.eml From kirby.urner at gmail.com Wed Dec 12 18:04:45 2007 From: kirby.urner at gmail.com (kirby urner) Date: Wed, 12 Dec 2007 09:04:45 -0800 Subject: [Edu-sig] Wrapping functions in a Function class In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On Dec 12, 2007 8:35 AM, Andrew Harrington wrote: > Nice wrapper class Kirby! > One thought: multiplying functions is another operation. I would > tend to reserve '*' for that, or you will be confusing of limited. We say "another operation" but then we deliberately re-confuse them (the two symbols) in abstract algebra by just using the same symbol, suggesting it's all __mul__ under the hood, provided you've got closure, an identity, an inverse or whatever. Then you need __add__ so you can talk about rings and fields (two ops, connected by distributive feature -- __div__ and __sub__ are derivative ops, provided we have inverses). > Since the raised circle is not a python operator, it appears you need > to use a different, nonstandard composition symbol. Perhaps '%' (it > has a raise circle as part of it :-) ). Then have the Function class > do the basic arithmetic operations *and* composition. In my classroom, I'm doing the abstract algebra thing and showing how __mul__ takes on a meaning depending on namespace. Over here, it works with integers, over there, with functions, and over there, with some other set of elements. Arithmetic takes a back seat. This isn't Everyday Math or anything close (which isn't to say these can't co-exist, as they already do). Kirby From kirby.urner at gmail.com Wed Dec 12 19:09:59 2007 From: kirby.urner at gmail.com (kirby urner) Date: Wed, 12 Dec 2007 10:09:59 -0800 Subject: [Edu-sig] [Fwd: Re: "do" as a keyword] In-Reply-To: <47601230.2050406@gmx.de> References: <47601230.2050406@gmx.de> Message-ID: On Dec 12, 2007 8:54 AM, Christian Mascher wrote: << SNIP >> > If Python's main goal was to be "the most beginner friendly programming > language for the first x hours", then it should probably provide many > more such constructs; PASCAL FOR-loop is also easier to teach to novices > than Pythons list iteration on a range()-result. Python was originally designed for adult professionals with some coding experience, is not all that beginner friendly in the "never programmed ever" sense. Some curricula use toy languages as stepping stones, others start with Python as maybe the easiest of the real world languages (because of REPL etc.). http://xkcd.com/353/ Here's some code for testing a keepmoving() framework, such as Brian was proposing. Note my caveat, as well as my use of a generator for a generic controller (with flagged changing syntax).** Anyway, enough from my corner. Back at ya next week! Kirby ** http://mail.python.org/pipermail/edu-sig/2007-September/008236.html # ===== frogger.py ========= """ Note: many schools of thought discourage using global variables to signal state changes across functions. However, understanding about global variables is critical so consider this example instructional, not necessarily a model for production code. Kirby Urner 4dsolutions.net """ from random import randint def controller(): while True: someval = randint(0,9) print someval # toggle off? if someval == 5: yield False else: yield True handofgod = controller() untouched = True def keepmoving(): global untouched untouched = handofgod.next() # next(handofgod) in 3.x def main(): while untouched: keepmoving() def test(): global untouched untouched = True main() print "=====" untouched = True main() if __name__ == '__main__': test() From bblais at bryant.edu Wed Dec 12 19:19:35 2007 From: bblais at bryant.edu (Brian Blais) Date: Wed, 12 Dec 2007 13:19:35 -0500 Subject: [Edu-sig] "do" as a keyword In-Reply-To: References: <13lts6gb9t2j350@corp.supernews.com> <8629A7C4-59DB-42C2-853A-24760A7B9B80@bryant.edu> <40ea4eb00712120811y60eb6d25pd5fae962023ef967@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: On Dec 12, 2007, at Dec 12:11:26 AM, kirby urner wrote: > Also people have different styles, like you > don't need to use a bare True, but might > go like: > > untouched = True > > while untouched: > keepmoving() > > or something similar. > > True, and this is what I do, but I find myself more often than not, in the robotics context, thinking of the loop in "until" mode, and then reversing the logic to fit it into the "while". > I wouldn't make "intuitive" the guiding light in all cases, as it's > often just code for "conditioned reflex" or "what we're used to." > Usually beginners outgrow their initial discomfort, like when > learning to drive stick instead of automatic or whatever. > That is also true, if the intuition were limited to the beginner. Unfortunately, I find myself thinking in this way, and I don't consider myself to be a beginner, and I have a firm understanding of while, for, and if structures. I think it is usually in the context of robotics, or moving agents, that I find that I think in terms of "until". I recognize that it is a special case, and not in the pythonic tradition, and I am not endorsing adding it for that reason. I'll try the while-true-if-break construct on for size, and see how well it fits my brain after using it for a while. bb -- Brian Blais bblais at bryant.edu http://web.bryant.edu/~bblais -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mail.python.org/pipermail/edu-sig/attachments/20071212/2e84e968/attachment.htm From lavendula6654 at yahoo.com Thu Dec 13 01:08:26 2007 From: lavendula6654 at yahoo.com (Elaine) Date: Wed, 12 Dec 2007 16:08:26 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Edu-sig] Programming Classes at Foothill Message-ID: <226235.38334.qm@web31710.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Winter quarter classes start Monday, 7 January, at Foothill College. These two may be of interest to you: 1) Introduction to Python Programming Prerequisite: Any programming language experience CIS 68K - Monday evenings at Middlefield campus in Palo Alto 2) Application Software Development with Ajax Prerequisite: Knowledge of HTML and JavaScript COIN 71 - Thursday evenings at Middlefield campus in Palo Alto If you are interested in taking a class, please register as soon as possible by going to: http://www.foothill.fhda.edu/reg/index.php If not enough students sign up, a class may be cancelled. If you have any questions, please contact the instructor, Elaine Haight, at haightElaine at foothill.edu ____________________________________________________________________________________ Looking for last minute shopping deals? Find them fast with Yahoo! Search. http://tools.search.yahoo.com/newsearch/category.php?category=shopping From EJStrassberger at cps.edu Tue Dec 18 16:31:42 2007 From: EJStrassberger at cps.edu (Earl Strassberger) Date: Tue, 18 Dec 2007 09:31:42 -0600 Subject: [Edu-sig] Pycon 2008 Message-ID: An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mail.python.org/pipermail/edu-sig/attachments/20071218/36237d91/attachment.htm From aharrin at luc.edu Tue Dec 18 17:23:31 2007 From: aharrin at luc.edu (Andrew Harrington) Date: Tue, 18 Dec 2007 10:23:31 -0600 Subject: [Edu-sig] Pycon 2008 In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Earl, I have already asked about taking my students. There are likely to be a number of beginner tutorials on Thursday, but they cost a substantial amount of money. A bugaboo is the food. The hotel extracts $65/day/person. The single-day registration rate will be at least that much. There is no provision for "without food". Basically, the fees for the conference are not going into overhead much at all, but to direct costs per person. There are a number of talks classified as "beginner", but that generally means beginner at some module, not total beginner at Python. Students, like anyone needy, can apply for the limited amount of financial aid, particularly if they volunteer to help. On Dec 18, 2007 9:31 AM, Earl Strassberger wrote: > > Hello, > > I looked over the conference schedule for Pycon 2008 in Chicago. I am > considering taking my few high school students to the conference but I did > not see many sessions appropriate for people new to Python. Can I expect > more sessions to be added? Also, I did not see the cost and I wonder what > it is. > > Thanks, > > Earl Strassberger > Senn High School > > _______________________________________________ > Edu-sig mailing list > Edu-sig at python.org > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/edu-sig > > -- Andrew N. Harrington Director of Academic Programs Computer Science Department Loyola University Chicago 512B Lewis Towers (office) Snail mail to Lewis Towers 416 820 North Michigan Avenue Chicago, Illinois 60611 http://www.cs.luc.edu/~anh Phone: 312-915-7999 Fax: 312-915-7998 gdp at cs.luc.edu for graduate administration upd at cs.luc.edu for undergrad administration aharrin at luc.edu as professor From kirby.urner at gmail.com Tue Dec 18 17:34:02 2007 From: kirby.urner at gmail.com (kirby urner) Date: Tue, 18 Dec 2007 08:34:02 -0800 Subject: [Edu-sig] Pycon 2008 In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Hi Earl -- My Pythonic Math Classroom of the Future (#53) might be interesting to your students -- shows how we teach group theory in Python, pre-college, other stuff (drawing some real world examples from our Portland flagships). Everything'll go by kinda fast in 30 minutes though (but young folks are used to high bandwidth and multitasking no?). I too have floated the idea of bringing students (though not as their chaperon -- bringing family too). Hey, speaking of high school, I wonder if anyone has seen this film I just learned about: http://www.2mminutes.com/trailer.html Any good? Kirby 4D/PDX On Dec 18, 2007 7:31 AM, Earl Strassberger wrote: > > Hello, > > I looked over the conference schedule for Pycon 2008 in Chicago. I am > considering taking my few high school students to the conference but I did > not see many sessions appropriate for people new to Python. Can I expect > more sessions to be added? Also, I did not see the cost and I wonder what > it is. > > Thanks, > > Earl Strassberger > Senn High School > > _______________________________________________ > Edu-sig mailing list > Edu-sig at python.org > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/edu-sig > > From kirby.urner at gmail.com Thu Dec 20 06:55:46 2007 From: kirby.urner at gmail.com (kirby urner) Date: Wed, 19 Dec 2007 21:55:46 -0800 Subject: [Edu-sig] Movies anyone? Message-ID: I'm wondering if anyone is using, or thinking of using, this imdbpy to give students an early appreciation for the power of an open source Python package, to deliver relevant movie-related information. Cut and pasting (excerpting) from http://imdbpy.sourceforge.net/docs/README.users.txt, the scripts look like this (if you've not used imdb: every movie, actor etc. is tagged with a number): $ get_movie.py 0133093 Movie ===== Title: Matrix, The Genres: Action, Thriller, Sci-Fi. Director: Andy Wachowski (as The Wachowski Brothers), Larry Wachowski (as The Wachowski Brothers). Writer: Andy Wachowski (written by) (as The Wachowski Brothers), Larry Wachowski (written by) (as The Wachowski Brothers). Cast: Keanu Reeves (Neo (Thomas A. Anderson)), Laurence Fishburne (Morpheus), Carrie-Anne Moss (Trinity), Hugo Weaving (Agent Smith), Joe Pantoliano (Cypher (Mr. Reagan)). Runtime: 136. Country: USA. Language: English. Rating: 8.5 Votes: 114,264 Plot: In the near future, a computer hacker named Neo (Keanu Reeves) discovers that all life on Earth may be nothing more than an elaborate facade created by a malevolent cyber-intelligence, for the purpose of placating us while our life essence is "farmed" to fuel the Matrix's campaign of domination in the "real" world. He joins like-minded Rebel warriors Morpheus (Laurence Fishburne) and Trinity (Carrie Ann Moss) in their struggle to overthrow the Matrix. I've written my own screen scraper for imdb (probably wrote about it here, don't remember), but it never performed satisfactorily. Used it with one Saturday Academy class as a part of my intro. At least useful for explaining what "screen scraper" means. Imdbpy would be more impressive I think, also better than the xml-rpc script we played with at Winterhaven (8th grade, write-up at my site). Kirby 4dsolutions.net From vceder at canterburyschool.org Thu Dec 20 12:56:51 2007 From: vceder at canterburyschool.org (Vern Ceder) Date: Thu, 20 Dec 2007 06:56:51 -0500 Subject: [Edu-sig] Movies anyone? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <476A5883.9040001@canterburyschool.org> Now this is cool. Lots of possible options with live data that is of interest to a lot of people... what's not to like? :) Thanks for posting this. Vern kirby urner wrote: > I'm wondering if anyone is using, or thinking of using, this imdbpy to > give students an early appreciation for the power of an open source > Python package, to deliver relevant movie-related information. > > Cut and pasting (excerpting) from > http://imdbpy.sourceforge.net/docs/README.users.txt, the scripts look > like this (if you've not used imdb: every movie, actor etc. is tagged > with a number): > > $ get_movie.py 0133093 > Movie > ===== > Title: Matrix, The > Genres: Action, Thriller, Sci-Fi. > Director: Andy Wachowski (as The Wachowski Brothers), Larry Wachowski > (as The Wachowski Brothers). > Writer: Andy Wachowski (written by) (as The Wachowski Brothers), Larry > Wachowski (written by) (as The Wachowski Brothers). > Cast: Keanu Reeves (Neo (Thomas A. Anderson)), Laurence Fishburne > (Morpheus), Carrie-Anne Moss (Trinity), Hugo Weaving (Agent Smith), > Joe Pantoliano (Cypher (Mr. Reagan)). > Runtime: 136. > Country: USA. > Language: English. > Rating: 8.5 > Votes: 114,264 > Plot: In the near future, a computer hacker named Neo (Keanu Reeves) > discovers that all life on Earth may be nothing more than an elaborate > facade created by a malevolent cyber-intelligence, for the purpose of > placating us while our life essence is "farmed" to fuel the Matrix's > campaign of domination in the "real" world. He joins like-minded Rebel > warriors Morpheus (Laurence Fishburne) and Trinity (Carrie Ann Moss) > in their struggle to overthrow the Matrix. > > I've written my own screen scraper for imdb (probably wrote about it > here, don't remember), but it never performed satisfactorily. Used it > with one Saturday Academy class as a part of my intro. At least > useful for explaining what "screen scraper" means. Imdbpy would be > more impressive I think, also better than the xml-rpc script we played > with at Winterhaven (8th grade, write-up at my site). > > Kirby > 4dsolutions.net > _______________________________________________ > Edu-sig mailing list > Edu-sig at python.org > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/edu-sig -- This time for sure! -Bullwinkle J. Moose ----------------------------- Vern Ceder, Director of Technology Canterbury School, 3210 Smith Road, Ft Wayne, IN 46804 vceder at canterburyschool.org; 260-436-0746; FAX: 260-436-5137 From jan.ulrich at hasecke.com Thu Dec 20 13:05:24 2007 From: jan.ulrich at hasecke.com (Jan Ulrich Hasecke) Date: Thu, 20 Dec 2007 13:05:24 +0100 Subject: [Edu-sig] Movies anyone? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Hi Kirby, Am 20.12.2007 um 06:55 schrieb kirby urner: > I'm wondering if anyone is using, or thinking of using, this imdbpy to > give students an early appreciation for the power of an open source > Python package, to deliver relevant movie-related information. > > Cut and pasting (excerpting) from > http://imdbpy.sourceforge.net/docs/README.users.txt, the scripts look > like this (if you've not used imdb: every movie, actor etc. is tagged > with a number): > > $ get_movie.py 0133093 > Movie > ===== > Title: Matrix, The > Genres: Action, Thriller, Sci-Fi. [?] ?h, yes. We did. :-) And we did it with Matrix as example too? (must be a programmers paranoia ;-) A colleague of mine and me wrote a chapter in a collaborative students book about python and we actually showed how to make a webbased filmdatabase using Grok and imdbpy. An abstract of this chapter will be published in a German IT-magazine in the new year. The book is not published though, so I have to ask, whether it is already possible to make the repository of our example code public. Grok is a convention over configuration framework for Zope. See http://grok.zope.org for more information. Viele Gr??e juh Mit freundlichen Gr??en Jan Ulrich Hasecke -- hasecke.com Jan Ulrich Hasecke Schubertstr. 4 42719 Solingen -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: PGP.sig Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 186 bytes Desc: Signierter Teil der Nachricht Url : http://mail.python.org/pipermail/edu-sig/attachments/20071220/8947d962/attachment.pgp From dreed at capital.edu Thu Dec 20 15:51:18 2007 From: dreed at capital.edu (David Reed) Date: Thu, 20 Dec 2007 09:51:18 -0500 Subject: [Edu-sig] Movies anyone? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <7B9B08FE-4556-4434-8FDD-3ED8BB77B72A@capital.edu> On Dec 20, 2007, at 12:55 AM, kirby urner wrote: > I'm wondering if anyone is using, or thinking of using, this imdbpy to > give students an early appreciation for the power of an open source > Python package, to deliver relevant movie-related information. > > Cut and pasting (excerpting) from > http://imdbpy.sourceforge.net/docs/README.users.txt, the scripts look > like this (if you've not used imdb: every movie, actor etc. is tagged > with a number): > > $ get_movie.py 0133093 > > I've written my own screen scraper for imdb (probably wrote about it > here, don't remember), but it never performed satisfactorily. Used it > with one Saturday Academy class as a part of my intro. At least > useful for explaining what "screen scraper" means. Imdbpy would be > more impressive I think, also better than the xml-rpc script we played > with at Winterhaven (8th grade, write-up at my site). > > You can download ASCII files with the info from imdb.com. http://www.imdb.com/interfaces#plain I use this for an assignment to play the Kevin Bacon game when studying graph algorithms. I have a couple Python scripts I wrote to massage the data into a format better suited for that assignment. I also remove movies containing "bad words" - IMDB contains "adult movies" (I found that out after one of my students looked through the file - fortunately it was a student who was not offended). Before using scripts that scrape their website, I would read: http://www.imdb.com/help/show_article?conditions IANAL, but that seems to indicate screen scraping of their website is not allowed. Using the ASCII files for personal use is allowed, but you are not allowed to redistribute them. Dave From jeff at taupro.com Fri Dec 21 12:21:16 2007 From: jeff at taupro.com (Jeff Rush) Date: Fri, 21 Dec 2007 05:21:16 -0600 Subject: [Edu-sig] Pycon 2008 In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <476BA1AC.3090908@taupro.com> Andrew Harrington wrote: > Earl, I have already asked about taking my students. > > There are likely to be a number of beginner tutorials on Thursday, but > they cost a substantial amount of money. > > There are a number of talks classified as "beginner", but that > generally means beginner at some module, not total beginner at Python. > > On Dec 18, 2007 9:31 AM, Earl Strassberger wrote: >> >> I looked over the conference schedule for Pycon 2008 in Chicago. I am >> considering taking my few high school students to the conference but I did >> not see many sessions appropriate for people new to Python. Can I expect >> more sessions to be added? Also, I did not see the cost and I wonder what >> it is. Let's not drop this matter. In my involvement with PyCon over the years, there has been a wish to involve students but the approach has not been clear, so no one tackles it. Each year there is a bit of discussion -- are students welcome? should we offer total beginner talks? if we did would enough people come to justify it? enough didn't come last year so why offer them now? what if we offer them and just 3 people show up? Generally the PyCon organizers don't get a lot of involvement in planning from those who have the necessary contacts with the public and university school systems, so we don't know -how- to attract that student audience. Just offering novice classes doesn't cause them to attend. That audience has special needs re scheduling (can they attend weekdays?), money (can they afford a 3-day ticket?) and topics (are they totally new to Python or just at a novice level?) >From the educators here, please give us more information about your needs. 1. What audience are you representing ('students' may mean K-12, 9-12 or university) each with their own issues. 2. In your opinion, can your students attend on weekends or weekdays? 3. Are your students able to afford any amount whatsoever? Must it be free? 4. Are you wanting to bring your more advanced students or trying to get non-programmers interested in how cool Python is? The former can attend existing talks but may need financial support, while the latter need custom presentation content not normally at PyCon. 5. How many students (min and expected#) do you think you can motivate to attend? 6. Will students register in advance or must we play it loose and let those who walk in the door attend? And to those qualified to -teach- total non-Python programmers, would you be willing to prepare a free class? How about if the PSF paid for your class on behalf of the students? Would you be willing to put forth serious effort and come up with a professional course, with handouts and exercises? And freely share your materials with other teachers afterward so it can be replicated worldwide? Would it be a half-day, full-day or series of mini topics? For what age groups? Personally I'd really like to see more students at PyCon. But I don't have kids nor am I affiliated with a university in any way so I lack the contacts to make it happen. We need one or more leaders to come forward and represent the interests of the students, and I believe such would be welcomed with open arms by the PyCon and PSF staff. -Jeff From EJStrassberger at cps.edu Fri Dec 21 15:37:09 2007 From: EJStrassberger at cps.edu (Earl Strassberger) Date: Fri, 21 Dec 2007 08:37:09 -0600 Subject: [Edu-sig] Pycon 2008 In-Reply-To: <476BA1AC.3090908@taupro.com> References: <, > <,> <476BA1AC.3090908@taupro.com> Message-ID: An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mail.python.org/pipermail/edu-sig/attachments/20071221/b204b6e3/attachment.htm From vceder at canterburyschool.org Fri Dec 21 15:57:20 2007 From: vceder at canterburyschool.org (Vern Ceder) Date: Fri, 21 Dec 2007 09:57:20 -0500 Subject: [Edu-sig] Pycon 2008 In-Reply-To: References: <, > <, > <476BA1AC.3090908@taupro.com> Message-ID: <476BD450.7040808@canterburyschool.org> I also have some HS students who might be able to attend for a day or two, but again, I'm not willing to pay (or ask their parents to pay) for a 3 day registration for them. OTOH, I'm sure they would consume their fair share of food, etc on the day(s) they do attend. And Earl, if you need any assistance let me know off list - I'm in Ft Wayne, IN and may be able to help out in one way or another. Cheers, Vern Earl Strassberger wrote: > Thank you Jeff for your thoughtful reply. Below is my information. > I am starting a computer programming sequence at an inner city public > high school in Chicago. Last year was the first year. I started with > Java however, the book I picked and the language itself were much too > difficult. Note that I am an old procedural programmer (started with > Fortran in the 60s and COBOL in 1979). I was learning OOP and Java just > ahead of my students. > > After one semester I discovered ALICE from Carneige Mellon University. > My students are doing very well with it. It teaches the concepts of > OOP through animation. Syntax is not a problem because you drag tiles. > It is free and it is good. I use a book by Wanda Dann. > > This year 4 of those students are studying Python, pretty much on their > own. They are mixed in my other classes, so I don't have much time to > help them. We are using Michael Dawson's book. It is working well for > them. Again, I am learning it just ahead of my students! > > These four students have been in my various computer classes for four > years. My plan was to take them on a field trip on one of the > conference days. So a weekday is fine. I did not see the cost of the > conference. Since it would come out of my pocket I'm starting to get > concerned. Of more concern is appropriate sessions, I only saw a few. > As someone said, "beginner" means new to a topic but with experience in > Python. > > I would sure like some real beginner courses. Dawson starts off with > procedural concepts. We may not even get to objects by the time of the > conference and certainly not GUI material. A session on creating simple > programs involving GUI would be great and probably catch their interest. > Especially if there were some handouts showing them what they could > quickly do when they got back to school or home. > > So, I would bring myself and 4 senior high school students. I am > willing to pay something for each, hopefully it would be a reduced price > (free is always acceptable :-) ). We are all beginners. We can miss one > day of school. If the conference continues on the weekend could that > day(s) be free for them? We could register in advance if the schedule > is published. > > Thanks, > > Earl Strassberger > Senn High School > > *Jeff Rush > writes: > *Andrew Harrington wrote: >> Earl, I have already asked about taking my students. >> >> There are likely to be a number of beginner tutorials on Thursday, but >> they cost a substantial amount of money. >> >> There are a number of talks classified as "beginner", but that >> generally means beginner at some module, not total beginner at Python. >> >> On Dec 18, 2007 9:31 AM, Earl Strassberger > wrote: >> > >> > I looked over the conference schedule for Pycon 2008 in Chicago. I am >> > considering taking my few high school students to the conference but > I did >> > not see many sessions appropriate for people new to Python. Can I expect >> > more sessions to be added? Also, I did not see the cost and I wonder > what >> > it is. > > Let's not drop this matter. In my involvement with PyCon over the years, > there has been a wish to involve students but the approach has not been > clear, > so no one tackles it. Each year there is a bit of discussion -- are > students > welcome? should we offer total beginner talks? if we did would enough > people > come to justify it? enough didn't come last year so why offer them now? > what > if we offer them and just 3 people show up? > > Generally the PyCon organizers don't get a lot of involvement in > planning from > those who have the necessary contacts with the public and university school > systems, so we don't know -how- to attract that student audience. Just > offering novice classes doesn't cause them to attend. That audience has > special needs re scheduling (can they attend weekdays?), money (can they > afford a 3-day ticket?) and topics (are they totally new to Python or > just at > a novice level?) > >> From the educators here, please give us more information about your needs. > > 1. What audience are you representing ('students' may mean K-12, 9-12 or > university) each with their own issues. > > 2. In your opinion, can your students attend on weekends or weekdays? > > 3. Are your students able to afford any amount whatsoever? Must it be free? > > 4. Are you wanting to bring your more advanced students or trying to get > non-programmers interested in how cool Python is? The former can attend > existing talks but may need financial support, while the latter need custom > presentation content not normally at PyCon. > > 5. How many students (min and expected#) do you think you can motivate > to attend? > > 6. Will students register in advance or must we play it loose and let those > who walk in the door attend? > > > And to those qualified to -teach- total non-Python programmers, would you be > willing to prepare a free class? How about if the PSF paid for your > class on > behalf of the students? Would you be willing to put forth serious > effort and > come up with a professional course, with handouts and exercises? And freely > share your materials with other teachers afterward so it can be replicated > worldwide? Would it be a half-day, full-day or series of mini topics? For > what age groups? > > > Personally I'd really like to see more students at PyCon. But I don't have > kids nor am I affiliated with a university in any way so I lack the contacts > to make it happen. We need one or more leaders to come forward and > represent > the interests of the students, and I believe such would be welcomed with > open > arms by the PyCon and PSF staff. > > -Jeff > _______________________________________________ > Edu-sig mailing list > Edu-sig at python.org > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/edu-sig > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > _______________________________________________ > Edu-sig mailing list > Edu-sig at python.org > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/edu-sig -- This time for sure! -Bullwinkle J. Moose ----------------------------- Vern Ceder, Director of Technology Canterbury School, 3210 Smith Road, Ft Wayne, IN 46804 vceder at canterburyschool.org; 260-436-0746; FAX: 260-436-5137 From goodmansond at gmail.com Fri Dec 21 16:26:52 2007 From: goodmansond at gmail.com (DeanG) Date: Fri, 21 Dec 2007 09:26:52 -0600 Subject: [Edu-sig] Pycon 2008 In-Reply-To: <476BD450.7040808@canterburyschool.org> References: <476BA1AC.3090908@taupro.com> <476BD450.7040808@canterburyschool.org> Message-ID: Although I haven't seen any details yet I would like to encourage you to contact the Python Conference Committee regarding details of scholarships and other financial aid for the conference. http://us.pycon.org/2008/helping/ From jeff at taupro.com Fri Dec 21 16:57:06 2007 From: jeff at taupro.com (Jeff Rush) Date: Fri, 21 Dec 2007 09:57:06 -0600 Subject: [Edu-sig] Pycon 2008 In-Reply-To: References: <476BA1AC.3090908@taupro.com> <476BD450.7040808@canterburyschool.org> Message-ID: <476BE252.5010601@taupro.com> DeanG wrote: > Although I haven't seen any details yet I would like to encourage you > to contact the Python Conference Committee regarding details of > scholarships and other financial aid for the conference. > http://us.pycon.org/2008/helping/ Certainly there is (or will be soon) financial aid available, but I imagine that will be mostly for the standard 3-day registration and maybe a tutorial. It will help, but the key question is whether the existing slate of talks has anything to offer your particular students. Vern, how many high school students might you bring, and at what programming level are they? Can they benefit from the level of talks we had last year, for example? I don't really think it is the money aspect, but whether there are sufficient numbers of potential students to justify a special effort on their behalf. If there aren't, a handful of students is peanuts financially for the conference financial aid committee to just cover and move on. But if some critical mass of students can be found, then there is a stronger case re asking for conference concessions in content and scheduling. -Jeff From aharrin at luc.edu Fri Dec 21 17:29:32 2007 From: aharrin at luc.edu (Andrew Harrington) Date: Fri, 21 Dec 2007 10:29:32 -0600 Subject: [Edu-sig] Pycon 2008 In-Reply-To: References: <476BA1AC.3090908@taupro.com> Message-ID: I am very interested in having local students get something out of this conference. If some contact/guide is needed at the conference to make this happen, I am interested in taking part. Andy On Dec 21, 2007 8:37 AM, Earl Strassberger wrote: > > Thank you Jeff for your thoughtful reply. Below is my information. > I am starting a computer programming sequence at an inner city public high > school in Chicago. Last year was the first year. I started with Java > however, the book I picked and the language itself were much too difficult. > Note that I am an old procedural programmer (started with Fortran in the 60s > and COBOL in 1979). I was learning OOP and Java just ahead of my students. > > After one semester I discovered ALICE from Carneige Mellon University. My > students are doing very well with it. It teaches the concepts of OOP > through animation. Syntax is not a problem because you drag tiles. It is > free and it is good. I use a book by Wanda Dann. > > This year 4 of those students are studying Python, pretty much on their > own. They are mixed in my other classes, so I don't have much time to help > them. We are using Michael Dawson's book. It is working well for them. > Again, I am learning it just ahead of my students! > > These four students have been in my various computer classes for four > years. My plan was to take them on a field trip on one of the conference > days. So a weekday is fine. I did not see the cost of the conference. > Since it would come out of my pocket I'm starting to get concerned. Of more > concern is appropriate sessions, I only saw a few. As someone said, > "beginner" means new to a topic but with experience in Python. > > I would sure like some real beginner courses. Dawson starts off with > procedural concepts. We may not even get to objects by the time of the > conference and certainly not GUI material. A session on creating simple > programs involving GUI would be great and probably catch their interest. > Especially if there were some handouts showing them what they could quickly > do when they got back to school or home. > > So, I would bring myself and 4 senior high school students. I am willing > to pay something for each, hopefully it would be a reduced price (free is > always acceptable :-) ). We are all beginners. We can miss one day of > school. If the conference continues on the weekend could that day(s) be > free for them? We could register in advance if the schedule is published. > > > Thanks, > > Earl Strassberger > Senn High School > > > Jeff Rush writes: > > > Andrew Harrington wrote: > > Earl, I have already asked about taking my students. > > > > There are likely to be a number of beginner tutorials on Thursday, but > > they cost a substantial amount of money. > > > > There are a number of talks classified as "beginner", but that > > generally means beginner at some module, not total beginner at Python. > > > > On Dec 18, 2007 9:31 AM, Earl Strassberger > wrote: > >> > >> I looked over the conference schedule for Pycon 2008 in Chicago. I am > >> considering taking my few high school students to the conference but I > did > >> not see many sessions appropriate for people new to Python. Can I > expect > >> more sessions to be added? Also, I did not see the cost and I wonder > what > >> it is. > > Let's not drop this matter. In my involvement with PyCon over the years, > there has been a wish to involve students but the approach has not been > clear, > so no one tackles it. Each year there is a bit of discussion -- are > students > welcome? should we offer total beginner talks? if we did would enough > people > come to justify it? enough didn't come last year so why offer them now? > what > if we offer them and just 3 people show up? > > Generally the PyCon organizers don't get a lot of involvement in planning > from > those who have the necessary contacts with the public and university school > systems, so we don't know -how- to attract that student audience. Just > offering novice classes doesn't cause them to attend. That audience has > special needs re scheduling (can they attend weekdays?), money (can they > afford a 3-day ticket?) and topics (are they totally new to Python or just > at > a novice level?) > > >From the educators here, please give us more information about your needs. > > 1. What audience are you representing ('students' may mean K-12, 9-12 or > university) each with their own issues. > > 2. In your opinion, can your students attend on weekends or weekdays? > > 3. Are your students able to afford any amount whatsoever? Must it be > free? > > 4. Are you wanting to bring your more advanced students or trying to get > non-programmers interested in how cool Python is? The former can attend > existing talks but may need financial support, while the latter need custom > presentation content not normally at PyCon. > > 5. How many students (min and expected#) do you think you can motivate to > attend? > > 6. Will students register in advance or must we play it loose and let those > who walk in the door attend? > > > And to those qualified to -teach- total non-Python programmers, would you > be > willing to prepare a free class? How about if the PSF paid for your class > on > behalf of the students? Would you be willing to put forth serious effort > and > come up with a professional course, with handouts and exercises? And > freely > share your materials with other teachers afterward so it can be replicated > worldwide? Would it be a half-day, full-day or series of mini topics? For > what age groups? > > > Personally I'd really like to see more students at PyCon. But I don't have > kids nor am I affiliated with a university in any way so I lack the > contacts > to make it happen. We need one or more leaders to come forward and > represent > the interests of the students, and I believe such would be welcomed with > open > arms by the PyCon and PSF staff. > > -Jeff > _______________________________________________ > Edu-sig mailing list > Edu-sig at python.org > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/edu-sig > > > _______________________________________________ > Edu-sig mailing list > Edu-sig at python.org > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/edu-sig > > -- Andrew N. Harrington Director of Academic Programs Computer Science Department Loyola University Chicago 512B Lewis Towers (office) Snail mail to Lewis Towers 416 820 North Michigan Avenue Chicago, Illinois 60611 http://www.cs.luc.edu/~anh Phone: 312-915-7999 Fax: 312-915-7998 gdp at cs.luc.edu for graduate administration upd at cs.luc.edu for undergrad administration aharrin at luc.edu as professor From jjposner at snet.net Fri Dec 21 21:27:40 2007 From: jjposner at snet.net (John Posner) Date: Fri, 21 Dec 2007 15:27:40 -0500 Subject: [Edu-sig] Turtle work (2 of 2) Message-ID: <009801c8440f$ef3909b0$eb59a8c0@jposner> A while ago, Horst Jens noted on this forum that Gregor Lingl has created Xturtle, an extension of the standard Python "turtle" module. I played with it, loved it, and decided to start working on a point-and-click interface to it. For those interested, the current state-of-the-script is at this Yahoo-hosted site: http://www.geocities.com/jjphoogrp/ To facilitate a transition to "real coding", the user's point-and-click work generates an executable transcript -- comments included! (Actually, I would defend the viewpoint that a point-and-click sequence *is* real coding. So maybe we should call it "traditional coding".) If there's some interest in pushing this project further, I'll place it on SourceForge. -John -- John Posner 5 Bayberry Ridge Rd Westport, CT 06880 203-222-4952 jjposner at snet.net From jjposner at snet.net Fri Dec 21 21:27:37 2007 From: jjposner at snet.net (John Posner) Date: Fri, 21 Dec 2007 15:27:37 -0500 Subject: [Edu-sig] Turtle work (1 of 2) Message-ID: <009701c8440f$ed312bc0$eb59a8c0@jposner> Here's some work I did a few months ago, prompted by visiting Andy Judkis's class in a NJ magnet high school, where he teaches some Python programming. This is well-trod ground, but I think "more is better" when it comes to having practical answers to the beginner's very reasonable question, "why start counting at 0 instead of 1?". Many classes doing graphics with the standard Python "turtle" module reach the point where the instructor says, "We've seen how easy it is to draw a white square, and to draw a black square. Now, write a program that creates a full chess board, with white and black squares." One strategy is to repeatedly (1) using "setx" and "sety" to place the turtle at the corner of the next square, then (2) drawing the square. It's easy to see how 0-based counting makes it easier to determine where to start drawing a particular square: # determine the row and column (0-based count vs. 1-based count) # 0-BASED row = square_num // SQ_IN_ROW # integer division col = square_num % SQ_IN_ROW # 1-BASED # row = ((square_num - 1) // SQ_IN_ROW) + 1 # integer division # col = ((square_num - 1) % SQ_IN_ROW) + 1 (Admittedly, jumping around like this is not the most "turtle-like" of strategies!) The ease with which you can answer the question, "what row/column position is square #43 at?" is pretty nifty. As a bonus, we have a good practical application of integer arithmetic and modular arithmetic. The remainder of this message contains the entire chess-board program. There are 0-based vs. 1-based alternatives at several points in the code. """ draw a chess board, using 0-based or 1-based counting """ import sys from turtle import * #################### global variables # number of squares in each row, and number of rows SQ_IN_ROW = 8 # length of a square's side SIDELEN = 40 #################### classes / functions def DrawBox(square_num): """ draw one square of the chess board uses global: tur """ # determine the row and column (0-based count vs. 1-based count) # 0-BASED row = square_num // SQ_IN_ROW # integer division col = square_num % SQ_IN_ROW # 1-BASED # row = ((square_num - 1) // SQ_IN_ROW) + 1 # integer division # col = ((square_num - 1) % SQ_IN_ROW) + 1 # set color of this square (0-based count vs. 1-based count) # 0-BASED: different rules for even/odd rows if (row%2 == 0 and col%2 == 0) or (row%2 == 1 and col%2 == 1): # 1-BASED: turns out to be "same as above" # if (row%2 == 1 and col%2 == 1) or (row%2 == 0 and col%2 == 0): fill_box = True else: fill_box = False tur.up() # go to lower-left corner of this square tur.setx(col*SIDELEN) tur.sety(row*SIDELEN) tur.setheading(0) # start filling (maybe) if fill_box: tur.begin_fill() # start drawing tur.down() for i in range(4): tur.forward(SIDELEN) tur.left(90) # end filling (maybe) if fill_box: tur.end_fill() #################### main routine if __name__ == '__main__': # this global is used in functions tur = Pen() # use a loop to draw all the squares (0-based count vs. 1-based count) # 0-BASED for n in range(SQ_IN_ROW * SQ_IN_ROW): # 1-BASED # for n in range(1, SQ_IN_ROW * SQ_IN_ROW + 1): DrawBox(n) junk = raw_input("Press a key ...") sys.exit(0) -- John Posner 5 Bayberry Ridge Rd Westport, CT 06880 203-222-4952 jjposner at snet.net From lac at openend.se Fri Dec 21 23:57:16 2007 From: lac at openend.se (Laura Creighton) Date: Fri, 21 Dec 2007 23:57:16 +0100 Subject: [Edu-sig] Pycon 2008 In-Reply-To: Message from DeanG of "Fri, 21 Dec 2007 09:26:52 CST." References: <476BA1AC.3090908@taupro.com> <476BD450.7040808@canterburyschool.org> Message-ID: <200712212257.lBLMvGPD001347@theraft.openend.se> Just looking in, it sounds as if what the high school students might like is a Sprint. Get to pair program with real python programmers. Build something. Learn stuff. No conference fee needed, no requirement to eat catered lunches. What do you think? Laura From kirby.urner at gmail.com Sat Dec 22 01:17:17 2007 From: kirby.urner at gmail.com (kirby urner) Date: Fri, 21 Dec 2007 16:17:17 -0800 Subject: [Edu-sig] Pycon 2008 In-Reply-To: <200712212257.lBLMvGPD001347@theraft.openend.se> References: <476BA1AC.3090908@taupro.com> <476BD450.7040808@canterburyschool.org> <200712212257.lBLMvGPD001347@theraft.openend.se> Message-ID: Regarding high schoolers @ Pycons, I think we shouldn't be shy about letting some devil's advocate suggest that Pycons are for the most part *not* very friendly to absolute beginners, of any age. Come if you want to, most definitely, but be prepared for something two or three standard deviations from what you're used to, if not (a) a geek or (b) a pythonista. But if you've seen lots of Monty Python, that'll help you feel at home. This is not exclusivity based on snobbery nor any reflection on the friendliness of Pythoneers *as people* whom I've found to be not only friendly, but personable, gregarious -- many other positive attributes apply (smart, multi-lingual, worldly...). It's not like we're a conference of introverts with no social skills, *but* (admit it) we occupy a very specialized niche. When subspecies dentists get together to discuss their trade how many even *think* in terms of bringing high schoolers? That we're even having this discussion is (a) a good sign and (b) suggestive of a positive future. But if at the end of the day, we get few or no high school visitors to Pycon 2008, I don't think we should hang our heads and mutter about failure (why set ourselves up in that way?). Here's what I'd like to see in terms of outreach and recruitment: better promotion of the streaming media versions of conference talks after the fact (maybe not the tutorials?), more hyping of Showmedo (Jeff Rush was doing this) because there's content suitable for high schoolers and (drum roll) their teachers, and, last but not least, more actual use of Python in the schools, and I'm not just talking about OLPC. I also wish we took this "Python Nation" moniker more seriously (am I the only one using it?), kick started by the BDFL concept (dictator *of what*? -- "some nation" is just part of the grammar of the word -- plus our neighbors in the Republic of Perl could use some company (kinda lonely being the only one)). Then we could have at least a couple "portfolios" that we pick up in rotation, voluntarily, as volunteers, and in good coordination with one another. I'm thinking in particular of Minister of Education (CP4E type stuff) and Minister of Propaganda (what we currently call "advocacy") and yes, I'd suggest at backwards R in Propaganda (which is how I already spell DARPA). Along these lines, I'd bill myself a former and/or retired Minister of Education, having already done the London stint with Guido at the Shuttleworth Summit, frequented the Europython scene, plus given Python a big boost in the already very open to open source Portland, Oregon scene. Retired maybe, but hey, I'd do it again if asked. So why do I suggest all this stuff? Because "geeks having fun" carries the "hard fun" message we associate with "programming just for the fun of it." Doing more with Python Nation looks like fun to me, but not "idle fun" not "mindless entertainment". I don't want us to make Python in Education be something too somber-serious -- that'd be unfriendly in that other sense (not personable, not accessible, not joyful). Whether or not we succeed in attracting lots of high schoolers to Pycons, I think there's much we could do to attract high schoolers to Python. Anyway, food for thought. Kirby Urner @ Mosgo's Internet Cafe Arcata, California From horst.jens at chello.at Sun Dec 23 09:13:57 2007 From: horst.jens at chello.at (Horst JENS) Date: Sun, 23 Dec 2007 09:13:57 +0100 Subject: [Edu-sig] Turtle work (2 of 2) In-Reply-To: <009801c8440f$ef3909b0$eb59a8c0@jposner> References: <009801c8440f$ef3909b0$eb59a8c0@jposner> Message-ID: <1198397642.6335.8.camel@horst-laptop> Hi John, i am extremely interested in your program. Works very well, only problem i have is that the Tk-Fonts are hard to read on my screen resolution. I will use your excellent xturtle-gui for my Python-courses for kids. I think your program is a great way to let a kid "play" around and click buttons before introducing it to a python code editor. Sadly i am already involved in more projects than i can handle, but maybe i will find the time to contribute to your project a bit. What did Gregor said to your program ? bye, -Horst Am Freitag, den 21.12.2007, 15:27 -0500 schrieb John Posner: > A while ago, Horst Jens noted on this forum that Gregor Lingl has created > Xturtle, an extension of the standard Python "turtle" module. I played with > it, loved it, and decided to start working on a point-and-click interface to > it. For those interested, the current state-of-the-script is at this > Yahoo-hosted site: > > http://www.geocities.com/jjphoogrp/ > > To facilitate a transition to "real coding", the user's point-and-click work > generates an executable transcript -- comments included! (Actually, I would > defend the viewpoint that a point-and-click sequence *is* real coding. So > maybe we should call it "traditional coding".) > > If there's some interest in pushing this project further, I'll place it on > SourceForge. > > -John > > -- > John Posner > 5 Bayberry Ridge Rd > Westport, CT 06880 > 203-222-4952 > jjposner at snet.net > > _______________________________________________ > Edu-sig mailing list > Edu-sig at python.org > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/edu-sig -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: Dies ist ein digital signierter Nachrichtenteil Url : http://mail.python.org/pipermail/edu-sig/attachments/20071223/e227fb6b/attachment.pgp From kirby.urner at gmail.com Sun Dec 23 17:06:31 2007 From: kirby.urner at gmail.com (kirby urner) Date: Sun, 23 Dec 2007 08:06:31 -0800 Subject: [Edu-sig] Turtle Graphics Message-ID: The more I think about turtle graphics, the more I think some enterprising faculty is going to spin it as a way to intersect multiple languages around a common topic, plus there's the "sharing with kids" memeplex, anything but simple, so lots of ways to spin within the spin. Translation: why not start with Logo, the granddaddy language in this context, then explore the forks, whether with all the regalia is up to the teacher e.g. talk about Mindstorms and Lego Robotics (note pun on Lego/Logo) and use this as a leaping off point to robotics more generally. Along another fork: we move into Python (a huge territory). As long time readers of this archive likely already know: there's some move afoot to organize a curriculum (your option to use or not use) such that we go avatar -> immersion -> behind the scenes. What this means is: piloting some "self" in various contexts is the motif of many games (shooters included), as in turtle graphics; then you need an environment; then you get curious to see "how people do it" (so you can come up with new designs closer to your dreams). What's so good about Python in particular is the 'self' metaphor, while not a keyword, is very explicit and clear, enabling multiple turtles right out of the box. The original Logo was more seeing the turtle as a "one and only" like a console or other i/o device. The idea of "several" gets implemented in various derivatives. Kirby From jjposner at snet.net Sun Dec 23 17:46:38 2007 From: jjposner at snet.net (John Posner) Date: Sun, 23 Dec 2007 11:46:38 -0500 Subject: [Edu-sig] FW: Turtle work (2 of 2) Message-ID: <009d01c84583$634a38a0$eb59a8c0@jposner> > > i am extremely interested in your program. Works very well, only problem i have is > that the Tk-Fonts are hard to read on my screen resolution. > Yes, Horst, I didn't pay much attention to screen resolution for this first-pass coding. I used the Helvetica font because it's supposed to be supported in all Tkinter implementations -- and because my favorite tennis player is Swiss :-). If more controls are to be added, I think I'll need to change to a multiple-page control panel: Colors, Sizes, Actions, etc. I'd be interested in getting advice on what graphical widget(s) to use. Is it wise (dependable, portable, etc.) to use the "Pmw" widgets described in the John Grayson "Python and Tkinter Programming" book? Pmw's "Notebook" widget would be an obvious candidate. > > What did Gregor said to your program ? > I haven't been able to coax any response from Gregor. :-( Thanks, John From kirby.urner at gmail.com Mon Dec 24 04:18:14 2007 From: kirby.urner at gmail.com (kirby urner) Date: Sun, 23 Dec 2007 19:18:14 -0800 Subject: [Edu-sig] Turtle Graphics In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On Dec 23, 2007 8:06 AM, kirby urner wrote: << SNIP >> > What's so good about Python in particular is the 'self' metaphor, > while not a keyword, is very explicit and clear, enabling multiple > turtles right out of the box. The original Logo was more seeing the > turtle as a "one and only" like a console or other i/o device. The > idea of "several" gets implemented in various derivatives. > > Kirby > I was thinking later, at some point during my long drive from Monterey to LA today, via Rt. 1 (Big Sur) and 101 (Santa Barbara), that the above isn't as clearly expressed as it could be. I'm recalling something Alan Kay relayed during the Shuttleworth summit in London, on behalf of Logo avatar Seymour Papert (who was invited, but couldn't come). Alan said that SP thought it was OK to "make the receiver explicit" or something like that. What did he (Alan) mean? FD 10 or FORWARD 10 doesn't mention a specific turtle. In Smalltalk talk, "forward" is a "message" to an implicit object. myturtle.forward(10), on the other hand, has an explicit "receiver" (myturtle), the recipient of the "forward" message. Python makes the receiver explicit by having us first create an instance from a class e.g.: mutant_ninja = Turtle() mutant_ninja now (a) has its own self and (b) is an explicit receiver for messages. It remembers its own state (pen up, pen down, pen color, xpos, ypos). You can squeeze these attributes out of self.__dict__ if you really want to ("interrogating the self"). Given the "explicit receiver" motif, it's very easy to think in terms of multiple turtles, each with its own state. This is natural to children because multiple instances of any animal or object is the usual thing, i.e. every noun has its plural form. When I first introduce OO concepts, I usually speak in terms of blueprints, designs. "This blueprint for a house (class) could be used to build any number of houses, which we call 'instances' of the house class." Likewise with turtles (multiple instances, one class). So the distinction I was making was between original Logo syntax, which doesn't explicitly mention the turtle (because there's only one), and Python syntax, which suggests multiple explicit instances, right out of the box. Kirby in LA (finally -- 1290 miles since Thursday) From da.ajoy at gmail.com Mon Dec 24 16:57:32 2007 From: da.ajoy at gmail.com (Daniel Ajoy) Date: Mon, 24 Dec 2007 10:57:32 -0500 Subject: [Edu-sig] Turtle Graphics In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <476F909C.28581.2E61BF71@da.ajoy.gmail.com> On 24 Dec 2007 at 12:00, edu-sig-request at python.org wrote: > So the distinction I was making was between original > Logo syntax, which doesn't explicitly mention the > turtle (because there's only one), In MicroWorlds Logo there are many turtles and the usual way to handle this is: talkto "turtle1 repeat 4 [fd 10 rt 90] talkto "turtle2 do.something.else or things like: everyone [repeat 4 [fd 10 rt 90]] MicroWorlds Logo also has syntactic sugar for talkto: turtle1, repeat 4 [fd 10 rt 90] but you can't say: make "anyturtle "turtle1 :anyturtle, repeat 4 [fd 10 rt 90] Daniel From kirby.urner at gmail.com Mon Dec 24 17:09:00 2007 From: kirby.urner at gmail.com (kirby urner) Date: Mon, 24 Dec 2007 08:09:00 -0800 Subject: [Edu-sig] Turtle Graphics In-Reply-To: <476F909C.28581.2E61BF71@da.ajoy.gmail.com> References: <476F909C.28581.2E61BF71@da.ajoy.gmail.com> Message-ID: Thanks Daniel, I was hoping you'd chime in as I think of you when I think of Logo, as a true master thereof. My own history takes me to McGraw-Hill, Avenue of the Americas in the 1980s, where Nola Hague and the gang were working on computer literacy textbooks for the masses. Back then, pre open source revolution, we had like two choices: Logo, with a flavor on the Apple II, and BASIC, which tended to run on PCs, but both could do both I think. Memory fades. Anyway, I'm glad you spell out some of the differences below. Given Logo is not used in industry and commerce, I wouldn't worry about getting the syntax confused with lots of dialects. This is a sandbox, a place to have fun, not a place to get a PhD in Logo Programming. We race through at high speed in my book (an expression -- I'm more into blogging than book writing). What I want both in CS0 (intro CS) and pre-college both is a sense of "the language tree" ala that famous O'Reilley timeline I like projecting. Languages come and go, and there're many more interesting things to say about them than what's hot and what's not, many stories, many lessons about the real world to absorb. Kirby On Dec 24, 2007 7:57 AM, Daniel Ajoy wrote: > On 24 Dec 2007 at 12:00, edu-sig-request at python.org wrote: > > > So the distinction I was making was between original > > Logo syntax, which doesn't explicitly mention the > > turtle (because there's only one), > > In MicroWorlds Logo there are many turtles and the usual > way to handle this is: > > talkto "turtle1 > repeat 4 [fd 10 rt 90] > > talkto "turtle2 > do.something.else > > or things like: > > everyone [repeat 4 [fd 10 rt 90]] > > MicroWorlds Logo also has syntactic sugar for talkto: > > turtle1, repeat 4 [fd 10 rt 90] > > but you can't say: > > make "anyturtle "turtle1 > :anyturtle, repeat 4 [fd 10 rt 90] > > > Daniel > > > _______________________________________________ > Edu-sig mailing list > Edu-sig at python.org > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/edu-sig > From kirby.urner at gmail.com Mon Dec 24 17:11:49 2007 From: kirby.urner at gmail.com (kirby urner) Date: Mon, 24 Dec 2007 08:11:49 -0800 Subject: [Edu-sig] Turtle Graphics In-Reply-To: References: <476F909C.28581.2E61BF71@da.ajoy.gmail.com> Message-ID: On Dec 24, 2007 8:09 AM, kirby urner wrote: << SNIP >> > What I want both in CS0 (intro CS) and pre-college both > is a sense of "the language tree" ala that famous O'Reilley > timeline I like projecting. Languages come and go, and > there're many more interesting things to say about them > than what's hot and what's not, many stories, many > lessons about the real world to absorb. > > Kirby Woops, pen slip. Reilley is my mother's family name from her Irish dad whereas O'Reilly as in Tim, is our fearless Safari leader publisher. Kirby From kirby.urner at gmail.com Fri Dec 28 03:56:01 2007 From: kirby.urner at gmail.com (kirby urner) Date: Thu, 27 Dec 2007 18:56:01 -0800 Subject: [Edu-sig] Greetings from LA Message-ID: The local coffee shop, one in a franchise, Coffee Bean & Tea Leaf, has a flatscreen customized to flash news, other stories, amidst a color themed desktop (branded -- not sure at what point in the streaming). OLPC commercials, something I hadn't seen yet in Portland. The National Guard has rock band intro, sponsors the pre show in movie theaters (before the previews). Fighting the red coats remains relevant (in the minds of *these* recruiters anyway). Other segments I'd not seen in my focus group area (PDX). I get some OLPC bounce traffic through Canada, other places, but am more platform agnostic, kinda like Squeak, in my curriculum writing (Oregon... Alaska) If it runs in a browser, that's good enough for me (almost). That could mean a Python interpreter ala Crunchy Frog, or, on a batteries included system, you'll probably had IDLE or whatever, so no need to reinvent the wheel. Just get a conversation going, start charming the snake. Use your community for support, but dive in solo as well (the art of self teaching -- for those many hours on airplanes when you're *not* part of an "away team"). In other words, start by finding out if you can just get away with what's in your distro, and use the web to read the tutorials, lesson plans... watch those peer-authored Youtubes (many worth collecting, organizing, recontextualizing). Lots to see and do, and Python is everywhere, once you know what you're looking for (Safari helps -- shameless plug). Kirby Urner on Ubuntu Dell in the City of Whittier near to the City of Angels i.e. in Greater LA -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mail.python.org/pipermail/edu-sig/attachments/20071227/a07c0790/attachment.htm From kirby.urner at gmail.com Mon Dec 31 02:19:03 2007 From: kirby.urner at gmail.com (kirby urner) Date: Sun, 30 Dec 2007 17:19:03 -0800 Subject: [Edu-sig] OLPC news Message-ID: Walter Bender is a good source of OLPC news for those of you in Python Nation tracking the spread of Python by this vector (both as an under the hood engine, and as a user friendly API). Not to worry, I won't be flooding edu-sig with cross-posts; I save most of the OLPC stuff for my blogs. That being said, I'm all ears re exciting Python applications set to run on the XO, either in these early iterations or down the road a piece. I'm especially interested in applications that take us beyond Latin-1 at the interface level (not expecting a lot of non-Latin-1 3rd party py modules this early in the game, though I do know people are poking around with this stuff, given 3.x is in testing). Kirby still in Greater LA (working vacation -- got a new paying gig at PPS LEP High for more Python, is this morning's good news). """ Michael Burns of the Oregon State Open Source Lab has been working each night improving and growing the Community Support forum (See http://olpc.osuosl.org/), which is now exceeding 1,000 posts; 200 registered users have answered hundreds of first-time computer questions from G1G1 donors. There is already a growing community of users helping other users on the site. The site includes a live (IRC) chat (See http://olpc.osuosl.org/chat), a feature that works from any computer, including directly from the XO, and a volunteers map (See http://olpc.osuosl.org/forum/phoogle_map.php) that lets developers, enthusiasts and users put a push-pin next to their home town. """ Source: http://lists.laptop.org/pipermail/devel/2007-December/009072.html -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mail.python.org/pipermail/edu-sig/attachments/20071230/6309f910/attachment.htm From jeff at taupro.com Mon Dec 31 02:39:12 2007 From: jeff at taupro.com (Jeff Rush) Date: Sun, 30 Dec 2007 19:39:12 -0600 Subject: [Edu-sig] OLPC news In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <47784840.3020007@taupro.com> kirby urner wrote: > > Walter Bender is a good source of OLPC news for those of > you in Python Nation tracking the spread of Python by this > vector (both as an under the hood engine, and as a user > friendly API). Can you give contact info or a blog for this Walter Bender? I've been trying to find the hotbed of Python activity for OLPC and haven't found it yet, and I'm unfamiliar with Walter. > Not to worry, I won't be flooding edu-sig with cross-posts; > I save most of the OLPC stuff for my blogs. Cross-posts -from where-? I'd like to get on that list to get more involved with OLPC. We've got six XO laptops here in the Dallas Pythoneers but haven't managed to form a community yet, so finding a good list would help. Don't get me wrong - there are LOTS of lists for OLPC; I'm looking for the one with knowledgeable Python people motivated to actually produce 'activities' for the XO, not critique it or hand-wave about it. People with answers, not just questions. -Jeff From vceder at canterburyschool.org Mon Dec 31 03:14:38 2007 From: vceder at canterburyschool.org (Vern Ceder) Date: Sun, 30 Dec 2007 21:14:38 -0500 Subject: [Edu-sig] OLPC news In-Reply-To: <47784840.3020007@taupro.com> References: <47784840.3020007@taupro.com> Message-ID: <4778508E.3000209@canterburyschool.org> Jeff, Have you been monitoring the development and games lists on laptop.org? There is a certain amount of noice, but here has also been some interesting discussion of using pygame and the new olpc-games framework. And there has also been some discussion of the little Python IDE in the XO, Pippy. Walter's summaries are exhaustive and well worth the read, but they don't deal with specifics. But still, it's hard - I have an advanced high school Python class working on coding an XO app and it's been a struggle to get a clear idea of how things work. On the other hand, most of the core developers (with some exceptions) have been very good about responding and answering questions. Cheers, Vern Jeff Rush wrote: > kirby urner wrote: >> Walter Bender is a good source of OLPC news for those of >> you in Python Nation tracking the spread of Python by this >> vector (both as an under the hood engine, and as a user >> friendly API). > > Can you give contact info or a blog for this Walter Bender? I've been trying > to find the hotbed of Python activity for OLPC and haven't found it yet, and > I'm unfamiliar with Walter. > > >> Not to worry, I won't be flooding edu-sig with cross-posts; >> I save most of the OLPC stuff for my blogs. > > Cross-posts -from where-? I'd like to get on that list to get more involved > with OLPC. We've got six XO laptops here in the Dallas Pythoneers but haven't > managed to form a community yet, so finding a good list would help. > > Don't get me wrong - there are LOTS of lists for OLPC; I'm looking for the one > with knowledgeable Python people motivated to actually produce 'activities' > for the XO, not critique it or hand-wave about it. People with answers, not > just questions. > > -Jeff > > _______________________________________________ > Edu-sig mailing list > Edu-sig at python.org > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/edu-sig -- This time for sure! -Bullwinkle J. Moose ----------------------------- Vern Ceder, Director of Technology Canterbury School, 3210 Smith Road, Ft Wayne, IN 46804 vceder at canterburyschool.org; 260-436-0746; FAX: 260-436-5137 From krstic at solarsail.hcs.harvard.edu Mon Dec 31 06:57:56 2007 From: krstic at solarsail.hcs.harvard.edu (=?UTF-8?Q?Ivan_Krsti=C4=87?=) Date: Mon, 31 Dec 2007 00:57:56 -0500 Subject: [Edu-sig] OLPC news In-Reply-To: <47784840.3020007@taupro.com> References: <47784840.3020007@taupro.com> Message-ID: <8B13451D-F6E7-41C7-922C-67BA50B66417@solarsail.hcs.harvard.edu> On Dec 30, 2007, at 8:39 PM, Jeff Rush wrote: > Can you give contact info or a blog for this Walter Bender? Walter sends out weekly e-mail updates over the community-news list: > Don't get me wrong - there are LOTS of lists for OLPC; I'm looking > for the one > with knowledgeable Python people motivated to actually produce > 'activities' > for the XO, not critique it or hand-wave about it. People with > answers, not > just questions. For this, you want the Sugar list: The entire Sugar team and virtually all activity developers subscribe to the list, and even us systems-folk read it and post reasonably frequently. Cheers, -- Ivan Krsti? | http://radian.org