From jurgis.pralgauskis at gmail.com Mon Apr 6 23:08:00 2015 From: jurgis.pralgauskis at gmail.com (Jurgis Pralgauskis) Date: Tue, 7 Apr 2015 00:08:00 +0300 Subject: [Edu-sig] Code.org puzzle solving activities in Python Message-ID: https://github.com/skilstak/code-dot-org-python -- Jurgis Pralgauskis tel: 8-616 77613; Don't worry, be happy and make things better ;) http://galvosukykla.lt -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From kirby.urner at gmail.com Thu Apr 9 18:43:26 2015 From: kirby.urner at gmail.com (kirby urner) Date: Thu, 9 Apr 2015 09:43:26 -0700 Subject: [Edu-sig] Post Mortem (Bridges submission) Message-ID: My 3-page paper concluding with the graphic rendered by this source code: https://mail.python.org/pipermail/edu-sig/2015-March/011203.html (Python + POV-Ray) was roundly rejected by the Bridges reviewers. http://bridgesmathart.org/ "Citations are to Wikipedia pages, or peculiarly to the author's undergraduate philosophy thesis on Wittgenstein." says REVIEW 1, as a reason for rejection. Yes, just to the one Wikipedia page, where I get two graphics: a Wikipedia page I wrote most of, and the graphics were mine, contributed by me. Compare: http://wikieducator.org/Synergetics http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Synergetics_%28Fuller%29 "The paper is not formatted according to Bridges guidelines, as found on the Bridges website." They say it's about Art but papers are not part of the Art. The Art goes on a pedestal somewhere in the viewing chambers. The paper must conform, not express individuality or the artist's idiosyncrasies (cite "peculiarly"). REVIEW 2: "The paper first reminds us (in a very complicated way) that the volume of a tetrahedron with edge-length 2 is 0.9428. But after that it is not clear, what this paper is trying to tell us." What it's trying to tell you is that volume is 1.00000 in Synergetics because 3rd powering is modeled as an extrapolation of this treatment of A X B: https://youtu.be/2B1XXV2Eoh8 A x B x C is modeled as 3 edges from the origin of a regular tetrahedron. The lid defined by the three lengths defines a volume. When all edges are D (2R, 2 x radius of the unit-radius balls), that's Unit Volume. So we need a conversion constant: SQRT(9/8). That's in the published literature. I cited Dr. Bob Gray on that one. Review of the reviews: shows no comprehension of Synergetics which, having been published in the 1970s, is not something we should still be so clueless about, especially at a Math + Art conference. My confidence in the Bridges review process was never very high. I look forward to sharing these negative reviews as symptomatic of institutional retardation. Here's the paper, feel free to take a look: http://4dsolutions.net/synergetica/bridges_paper_final.pdf Read and make up your own mind. "The paper unfortunately does not give this reader any confidence that the author knows how to communicate clearly, which is important for Bridges conference purposes." REVIEW 1. Kirby -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From kirby.urner at gmail.com Fri Apr 10 01:53:33 2015 From: kirby.urner at gmail.com (kirby urner) Date: Thu, 9 Apr 2015 16:53:33 -0700 Subject: [Edu-sig] Post Mortem (Bridges submission) In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On Thu, Apr 9, 2015 at 9:43 AM, kirby urner wrote: > > My 3-page paper concluding with the graphic rendered by this source code: > > https://mail.python.org/pipermail/edu-sig/2015-March/011203.html (Python > + POV-Ray) > > was roundly rejected by the Bridges reviewers. > http://bridgesmathart.org/ > > They rejected my friend David's paper too. We were hoping to present back to back. I set up the volume units, David phi-scales them. David: "I stand by describing the volume of an icosahedron in E modules 420E + 100e3 = 18.512995" Bridges: ""Outside some tedious but not very deep mathematics there is no artistic or other cultural component that one expects to see in a formal Bridges paper.? As a proposal screener for OSCON I'm mystified as to why they have reviewers directly taunting the proposers, especially when it's about Art for crying out loud. Where's the respect? I hope PSF takes this as a lesson. Minus a real Code of Conduct you're opening yourself to abuse. Your company submits a paper and it comes back with heaping bucket fulls of scorn. We don't do that with Pycon. We're friendly, not gratuitously rude. At least I got to the roadshow version at Portland State, branded as Mosaic. http://controlroom.blogspot.com/2015/02/a-tale-of-two-logos.html I had planned to invite my daughter to this, maybe meet the famous Vi, but that was before the many insults. Maybe Vi will come to Pycon. She'd be most welcome I bet. Kirby -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From kurner at oreillyschool.com Fri Apr 10 06:35:21 2015 From: kurner at oreillyschool.com (Kirby Urner) Date: Thu, 9 Apr 2015 21:35:21 -0700 Subject: [Edu-sig] Post Mortem (Bridges submission) In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On Thu, Apr 9, 2015 at 4:53 PM, kirby urner wrote: > > > On Thu, Apr 9, 2015 at 9:43 AM, kirby urner wrote: > >> >> My 3-page paper concluding with the graphic rendered by this source code: >> >> https://mail.python.org/pipermail/edu-sig/2015-March/011203.html >> (Python + POV-Ray) >> >> was roundly rejected by the Bridges reviewers. >> http://bridgesmathart.org/ >> >> > They rejected my friend David's paper too. We were hoping to present back > to back. I set up the volume units, David phi-scales them. > > David: "I stand by describing the volume of an icosahedron in E modules > 420E + 100e3 = 18.512995" > Just to give the flavor of David's paper, a bit arcane but accessible to high schoolers: """ PHI SCALING By scaling the edges of the E module larger or smaller by increments of phi we increase/decrease the volume by phi to the third power. The notation used describes the various sizes of the E module as they are scaled by phi^1 and their volumes are greatened or lessened by phi^3. Note the lower case e is used for the phi^-3 increments and E = e, but e alone is not utilized. E module denotations e6 = ((sqrt 2)/8)phi^-9 or .002325 e3 = ((sqrt 2)/8)phi^-6 or .009851 E = ((sqrt 2)/8)phi^-3 or .041731 E3 = ((sqrt 2)/8)phi^0 or .176766 E6 = ((sqrt 2)/8)phi^3 or .748838 The T module = 1/24 or .041666 The E module can be made of lesser scaled modules with the general volumetric relationship: E3 = 4E + 1e3 = 17e3 + 4e6 and so on. Likewise the volume of which has been dubbed the Super RT or a rhombic triacontahedron with a radius of phi^1 and the long diagonal of the rhombic face = 2, which is RBFullers edge for the tetrahedron, octahedron and the VE or cuboctahdron and the resultant icosahedron from the Jitterbug transformation process. The volume of the Super RT is 15?2 or 21.213203. 120E3 = 480E + 120e3 VOLUMES OF FIVE-FOLD POLYHEDRA The icosahedron with an edge of 2, inscribe within the Super RT, it has a volume of 18.52295 or 5(sqrt 2)phi^2. It has an exact E module volume of 100E + 20e3 or 420e3 + 100e6. The pentagonal dodecahedron, which inscribes in the Super RT with edges = 2(phi^-1) has a volume of 15.350018 = 84E + 12e3 = 348e3 + 84e6 """ You get the gist yes? He's measuring volumes in terms of a sliver, a tetrahedron, in various scales (shape constant). I've done a lot of Python code around these modules, the E, T, A and B, sometimes using Cyrillic to show off Unicode: https://mail.python.org/pipermail/edu-sig/2014-May/011026.html Here's a picture of the E module: http://www.rwgrayprojects.com/synergetics/s09/figs/f86411b.html (120 of these guys assemble into a rhombic triacontahedron). > > Bridges: ""Outside some tedious but not very deep mathematics there is no > artistic or other cultural component that one expects to see in a formal > Bridges paper.? > Another reason they rejected David's paper is his choice of symbols for Phi was what the reader used for Null, as in Null Set. Wrong Unicode glyph! David is a union pipe fitter, a blue collar guy. He does his best to conform to academic rules but sometimes he makes mistakes. Kirby OST -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From kurner at oreillyschool.com Fri Apr 10 16:01:44 2015 From: kurner at oreillyschool.com (Kirby Urner) Date: Fri, 10 Apr 2015 07:01:44 -0700 Subject: [Edu-sig] Post Mortem (Bridges submission) In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: > VOLUMES OF FIVE-FOLD POLYHEDRA > > The icosahedron with an edge of 2, inscribe within the Super RT, it has a > volume of 18.52295 or 5(sqrt 2)phi^2. It has an exact E module volume of > 100E + 20e3 or 420e3 + 100e6. > > The pentagonal dodecahedron, which inscribes in the Super RT with edges = > 2(phi^-1) has a volume of 15.350018 = 84E + 12e3 = 348e3 + 84e6 > > """ > Oops, I quoted from an early draft. David corrected me: On Fri, Apr 10, 2015 at 3:45 AM, David Koski wrote: The volumes for the icosahedron and pentagonal dodecahedron are not correct on this Should be Icosahedron = 100E3 + 20E = 420E + 100e3 Pentagonal Dodecahedron = 84E3 +12E = 348E + 84e3 All better now. Kirby OST -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From ntoll at ntoll.org Sat Apr 11 14:07:04 2015 From: ntoll at ntoll.org (Nicholas H.Tollervey) Date: Sat, 11 Apr 2015 13:07:04 +0100 Subject: [Edu-sig] Python in Education published by O'Reilly Message-ID: <55290E68.8080809@ntoll.org> Hi, In case you missed it, my FREE short report "Python in Education" was published yesterday by O'Reilly. There's an extract from it here (on O'Reilly Radar): radar.oreilly.com/2015/04/five-reasons-why-python-is-a-popular-teaching-language.html You can download the complete work in various digital format from here: http://www.oreilly.com/programming/free/python-in-education.csp Alternatively, if you're currently at PyCon you can grab a dead-tree version from the O'Reilly booth. I believe it'll also be available IRL at OSCON. All feedback most welcome! Best wishes, N. -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 490 bytes Desc: OpenPGP digital signature URL: From chalmer.lowe at gmail.com Sat Apr 11 18:11:27 2015 From: chalmer.lowe at gmail.com (Chalmer Lowe) Date: Sat, 11 Apr 2015 06:11:27 -1000 Subject: [Edu-sig] Python education summit open space today at 2.30 to 4.00 In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: If you python, if you educate... Please come see us today at room 513d from 2.30 to 4.00. Love to continue our education summit conversations. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From phillip.kent at gmail.com Sun Apr 12 12:14:51 2015 From: phillip.kent at gmail.com (Phillip Kent) Date: Sun, 12 Apr 2015 11:14:51 +0100 Subject: [Edu-sig] Fwd: Python in Education published by O'Reilly In-Reply-To: References: <55290E68.8080809@ntoll.org> Message-ID: Hi Nicholas. Great writing. Well done. I'd like to add one idea: disruptive potential. For me, one of the strengths of Python is that the features you describe combine together to give it a high disruptive potential, in the sense which I wrote about here.. http://www.phillipkent.net/blog/maximising-disruptive-potential-programming "....The most valuable consequences of programming are those which disrupt conventional relationships of people with knowledge and ideas, and (therefore) to disrupt the conventional relationships between people and other people. Therefore the best programming language to select is the one that will maximise the disruption to established practices...." As a teacher, you well understand how educational systems are weakened by intellectual divisions and tribalism. That's why we need disruptive potential for educational computing. - Phillip On Sat, Apr 11, 2015 at 1:07 PM, Nicholas H.Tollervey wrote: > Hi, > > In case you missed it, my FREE short report "Python in Education" was > published yesterday by O'Reilly. There's an extract from it here (on > O'Reilly Radar): > radar.oreilly.com/2015/04/five-reasons-why-python-is-a-popular-teaching-language.html > > You can download the complete work in various digital format from here: > http://www.oreilly.com/programming/free/python-in-education.csp > > Alternatively, if you're currently at PyCon you can grab a dead-tree > version from the O'Reilly booth. I believe it'll also be available IRL > at OSCON. > > All feedback most welcome! > > Best wishes, > > N. > > > _______________________________________________ > Edu-sig mailing list > Edu-sig at python.org > https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/edu-sig > From jeff at elkner.net Sun Apr 12 13:05:28 2015 From: jeff at elkner.net (Jeff Elkner) Date: Sun, 12 Apr 2015 07:05:28 -0400 Subject: [Edu-sig] Thanks Jessica and Chalmers for a wonderful EDU Summit! Message-ID: Shout out to Jessica and Chalmers for all the hard work they put in organizing the EDU Summit at Pycon 2015 in Montreal! All of the presentations where both simulating and inspiring, and the combination of topics was very well orchestrated. Now let's see if we can get something to happen within our community between now and the next EDU Summit. I'm most interested in two specific things: 1. Improvements to IDLE to make it a more effective beginners learning tool. Al Sweigart presented a very well thought out plan for this in his talk. To his list I would only add being able to save graphics artifacts generated by the turtle module as svg files. 2. Improving out presence on the python.org website. Both Dr. Chuck and Van Lindberg had great suggestions for improving our web presence. I think what is lacking now is a plan to find and allocate the resources it would require to make things happen. Thanks again, Jessica and Chalmers! Jeff From jurgis.pralgauskis at gmail.com Mon Apr 27 17:19:54 2015 From: jurgis.pralgauskis at gmail.com (Jurgis Pralgauskis) Date: Mon, 27 Apr 2015 18:19:54 +0300 Subject: [Edu-sig] turtle: properties instead of setters/getters ? Message-ID: Hi, turtle module is nice way to introduce to Python, but, if I want to increase x by 10, I have to write t.setx( t.xcor() + 1) which is uglier (and not beginner friendly) than common: t.x = t.x + 1 beginners tend to forget () after xcor and so on... This could be achieved with several property /decorator lines Would it be possible for Py 3.5? :) ps.: I teach programming games, and more robust expressions (for collision checking) would look cleaner: if ball.x-5 > box.x-10 and ball.x+5 < box.x+10: ball.x =100 instead of if ball.xcor()-5 > box.xcor()-10 and ball.xcor()+5 < box.xcor()+10: ball.setx( 100 ) pps.: I don't know how would default turtle instance behave could I then write x = x + 1 instead of setx( xcor() + 1) ? -- Jurgis Pralgauskis tel: 8-616 77613; Don't worry, be happy and make things better ;) http://galvosukykla.lt -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From jurgis.pralgauskis at gmail.com Mon Apr 27 17:36:02 2015 From: jurgis.pralgauskis at gmail.com (Jurgis Pralgauskis) Date: Mon, 27 Apr 2015 18:36:02 +0300 Subject: [Edu-sig] turtle: properties instead of setters/getters ? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: The same would apply to many other properties: y heading position speed pensize color shape shear tilt visible maybe sth else.. On Mon, Apr 27, 2015 at 6:19 PM, Jurgis Pralgauskis < jurgis.pralgauskis at gmail.com> wrote: > Hi, > > turtle module is nice way to introduce to Python, > but, if I want to increase x by 10, I have to write > > t.setx( t.xcor() + 1) > > which is uglier (and not beginner friendly) than common: > t.x = t.x + 1 > > beginners tend to forget () after xcor and so on... > > This could be achieved with several property > /decorator > lines > Would it be possible for Py 3.5? :) > > > ps.: I teach programming games, > and more robust expressions (for collision checking) would look cleaner: > if ball.x-5 > box.x-10 and ball.x+5 < box.x+10: > ball.x =100 > > instead of > if ball.xcor()-5 > box.xcor()-10 and ball.xcor()+5 < box.xcor()+10: > ball.setx( 100 ) > > pps.: > I don't know how would default turtle instance behave > could I then write x = x + 1 > instead of setx( xcor() + 1) > ? > > > -- > Jurgis Pralgauskis > tel: 8-616 77613; > Don't worry, be happy and make things better ;) > http://galvosukykla.lt > -- Jurgis Pralgauskis tel: 8-616 77613; Don't worry, be happy and make things better ;) http://galvosukykla.lt -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From andre.roberge at gmail.com Tue Apr 28 01:16:47 2015 From: andre.roberge at gmail.com (Andre Roberge) Date: Mon, 27 Apr 2015 20:16:47 -0300 Subject: [Edu-sig] turtle: properties instead of setters/getters ? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On Mon, Apr 27, 2015 at 12:19 PM, Jurgis Pralgauskis < jurgis.pralgauskis at gmail.com> wrote: > Hi, > > turtle module is nice way to introduce to Python, > but, if I want to increase x by 10, I have to write > > t.setx( t.xcor() + 1) > > which is uglier (and not beginner friendly) than common: > t.x = t.x + 1 > > beginners tend to forget () after xcor and so on... > > This could be achieved with several property > /decorator > lines > Would it be possible for Py 3.5? :) > > I doubt very much that anything is going to happen with the official Turtle module unless the person that actually wrote it decides it's worth looking into. Following a suggestion you made on this list, I submitted a patch ( http://bugs.python.org/issue23660) about 6 weeks ago and no one has looked into it as far as I can tell. You could possibly write your own Turtle module, as a wrapper to the official one, using properties the way you mention. > > ps.: I teach programming games, > and more robust expressions (for collision checking) would look cleaner: > if ball.x-5 > box.x-10 and ball.x+5 < box.x+10: > ball.x =100 > > instead of > if ball.xcor()-5 > box.xcor()-10 and ball.xcor()+5 < box.xcor()+10: > ball.setx( 100 ) > Yes, I prefer the first style too. > > pps.: > I don't know how would default turtle instance behave > could I then write x = x + 1 > instead of setx( xcor() + 1) > ? > This would not be possible: x would just be a variable, with no relation to a given turtle. At the very least, one would need to call some update() function which could look at the values of the variables in locals() and proceed from there.... But I think that this would be counter-intuitive and not a good way to teach about Python. Andr? > > > -- > Jurgis Pralgauskis > tel: 8-616 77613; > Don't worry, be happy and make things better ;) > http://galvosukykla.lt > > _______________________________________________ > Edu-sig mailing list > Edu-sig at python.org > https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/edu-sig > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From jurgis.pralgauskis at gmail.com Tue Apr 28 23:56:18 2015 From: jurgis.pralgauskis at gmail.com (Jurgis Pralgauskis) Date: Wed, 29 Apr 2015 00:56:18 +0300 Subject: [Edu-sig] turtle: properties instead of setters/getters ? In-Reply-To: <553E5EAF.9030905@fuentelibre.org> References: <553E5EAF.9030905@fuentelibre.org> Message-ID: Trinket.io now proposes turtle graphics with good feature -- image rotation while turning (which is absent in TK)...... http://blog.trinket.io/using-images-in-turtle-programs/ so you can try it without installing Py locally :) There is nice collection of over 50 examples: https://code.google.com/p/python-turtle-demo/downloads/list On Mon, Apr 27, 2015 at 7:07 PM, Sebastian Silva wrote: > Hi, > I also teach game programming to kids, but haven't used the turtle module. > > I collect and sometimes translate some resources to spanish here: > http://pe.sugarlabs.org/ir/Python > > I don't know if this is the right forum but I wanted to chime in to say +1 > and curious to see how such a requests works within the Python community. > > Best regards > Sebastian > > > > On 27/04/15 10:36, Jurgis Pralgauskis wrote: > > The same would apply to many other properties: > > y > heading > position > > speed > pensize > > color > shape > shear > tilt > visible > > maybe sth else.. > > > > > On Mon, Apr 27, 2015 at 6:19 PM, Jurgis Pralgauskis < > jurgis.pralgauskis at gmail.com> wrote: > >> Hi, >> >> turtle module is nice way to introduce to Python, >> but, if I want to increase x by 10, I have to write >> >> t.setx( t.xcor() + 1) >> >> which is uglier (and not beginner friendly) than common: >> t.x = t.x + 1 >> >> beginners tend to forget () after xcor and so on... >> >> This could be achieved with several property >> /decorator >> lines >> Would it be possible for Py 3.5? :) >> >> >> ps.: I teach programming games, >> and more robust expressions (for collision checking) would look cleaner: >> if ball.x-5 > box.x-10 and ball.x+5 < box.x+10: >> ball.x =100 >> >> instead of >> if ball.xcor()-5 > box.xcor()-10 and ball.xcor()+5 < box.xcor()+10: >> ball.setx( 100 ) >> >> pps.: >> I don't know how would default turtle instance behave >> could I then write x = x + 1 >> instead of setx( xcor() + 1) >> ? >> >> >> -- >> Jurgis Pralgauskis >> tel: 8-616 77613; >> Don't worry, be happy and make things better ;) >> http://galvosukykla.lt >> > > > > -- > Jurgis Pralgauskis > tel: 8-616 77613; > Don't worry, be happy and make things better ;) > http://galvosukykla.lt > > > _______________________________________________ > Edu-sig mailing listEdu-sig at python.orghttps://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/edu-sig > > > -- > I+D SomosAzucar.Org > "icarito" #somosazucar en Freenode IRC > "Nadie libera a nadie, nadie se libera solo. Los seres humanos se liberan en comuni?n" - P. Freire > > -- Jurgis Pralgauskis tel: 8-616 77613; Don't worry, be happy and make things better ;) http://galvosukykla.lt -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From jurgis.pralgauskis at gmail.com Tue Apr 28 23:57:45 2015 From: jurgis.pralgauskis at gmail.com (Jurgis Pralgauskis) Date: Wed, 29 Apr 2015 00:57:45 +0300 Subject: [Edu-sig] turtle: properties instead of setters/getters ? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: As I started with proposals, there is one more "mouse move" event: onpointed() (or variables mouse.x, mouse.y accessible as in Processing.org) seems quite easily achievable http://stackoverflow.com/questions/22925599/mouse-position-python-tkinter On Mon, Apr 27, 2015 at 6:36 PM, Jurgis Pralgauskis < jurgis.pralgauskis at gmail.com> wrote: > The same would apply to many other properties: > > y > heading > position > > speed > pensize > > color > shape > shear > tilt > visible > > maybe sth else.. > > > > > On Mon, Apr 27, 2015 at 6:19 PM, Jurgis Pralgauskis < > jurgis.pralgauskis at gmail.com> wrote: > >> Hi, >> >> turtle module is nice way to introduce to Python, >> but, if I want to increase x by 10, I have to write >> >> t.setx( t.xcor() + 1) >> >> which is uglier (and not beginner friendly) than common: >> t.x = t.x + 1 >> >> beginners tend to forget () after xcor and so on... >> >> This could be achieved with several property >> /decorator >> lines >> Would it be possible for Py 3.5? :) >> >> >> ps.: I teach programming games, >> and more robust expressions (for collision checking) would look cleaner: >> if ball.x-5 > box.x-10 and ball.x+5 < box.x+10: >> ball.x =100 >> >> instead of >> if ball.xcor()-5 > box.xcor()-10 and ball.xcor()+5 < box.xcor()+10: >> ball.setx( 100 ) >> >> pps.: >> I don't know how would default turtle instance behave >> could I then write x = x + 1 >> instead of setx( xcor() + 1) >> ? >> >> >> -- >> Jurgis Pralgauskis >> tel: 8-616 77613; >> Don't worry, be happy and make things better ;) >> http://galvosukykla.lt >> > > > > -- > Jurgis Pralgauskis > tel: 8-616 77613; > Don't worry, be happy and make things better ;) > http://galvosukykla.lt > -- Jurgis Pralgauskis tel: 8-616 77613; Don't worry, be happy and make things better ;) http://galvosukykla.lt -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From jurgis.pralgauskis at gmail.com Wed Apr 29 00:04:18 2015 From: jurgis.pralgauskis at gmail.com (Jurgis Pralgauskis) Date: Wed, 29 Apr 2015 01:04:18 +0300 Subject: [Edu-sig] turtle: properties instead of setters/getters ? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Hi, On Tue, Apr 28, 2015 at 2:16 AM, Andre Roberge wrote: > > > I doubt very much that anything is going to happen with the official > Turtle module unless the person that actually wrote it decides it's worth > looking into. > > Following a suggestion you made on this list, I submitted a patch ( > http://bugs.python.org/issue23660) about 6 weeks ago and no one has > looked into it as far as I can tell. > > You could possibly write your own Turtle module, as a wrapper to the > official one, using properties the way you mention. > > Yes... but I would feel a bit lonely :) There were some changes for turtle in py3, and earlier many improvements were taken from xturtle module, which originated from here . Maybe it is possible to find the guys behind it... Probably the more (tested) improvements are in one place/module, the more it is possible to get it into upstream. -- Jurgis Pralgauskis tel: 8-616 77613; Don't worry, be happy and make things better ;) http://galvosukykla.lt -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: