From mwh at python.net Mon Sep 1 15:39:12 2003 From: mwh at python.net (Michael Hudson) Date: Mon Sep 1 09:38:57 2003 Subject: [EuroPython] vote results Message-ID: <2m65kctypr.fsf@starship.python.net> Due to Sobig.F and other factors, it took a bit longer than it should, but the upshot of the vote between last year's track chairs was that EP2004 should be held in G?teborg, Sweden. I believe fixing a date would be a good next step. Cheers, mwh -- languages shape the way we think, or don't. -- Erik Naggum, comp.lang.lisp From jacob at strakt.com Mon Sep 1 18:30:48 2003 From: jacob at strakt.com (Jacob =?iso-8859-1?q?Hall=E9n?=) Date: Mon Sep 1 11:31:38 2003 Subject: [EuroPython] Re: Vote results Message-ID: <200309011531.h81FVObZ032470@theraft.strakt.com> I would like to thank you for the confidence you have shown in us and our ability to take the work of Denis, Tom and all the other people around Charleroi and build and even better Europython conference. We will do our very best to live up to and exceed your expectations. We will proceed with contacts with the low cost lodgings and with Chalmers this week. I will also soon be back with requests for volunteers as track chairs, website developers and other functions, so please, think over what sort of involvement you would like to have in next years Europython. Jacob Hall?n From jacob at strakt.com Mon Sep 8 01:11:30 2003 From: jacob at strakt.com (Jacob =?iso-8859-1?q?Hall=E9n?=) Date: Sun Sep 7 18:12:15 2003 Subject: [EuroPython] Timing of Europython 2004 Message-ID: <200309072212.h87MCBbZ018287@theraft.strakt.com> Hi! Item 1: We have information from the providers of cheap housing. They have a total of 233 beds. 15 rooms with 4 beds, 5 singlerooms and 84 doublerooms. They are fully furnished and have private bathrooms and TV. There is also access to shared kitchens in each entrance. These are all avaliable the first, second and third full weeks of August. A fair number are available June 7-9. The rest of the period 1 June - 31 August, they are mostly fully booked. I would therefore like to propose that we hold the Europython 4-6 August or possibly 11-13 August. Advantages of an August conference is that school will be out everywhere. Disadvantages are that southern Europe has vacations and that the first week of August may be too close to OSCON to get Guido to come. However, the dates for OSCON have yet to be announced, so we don't quite know when it is going to be. I have assumed that having the conference in the first week of August is less disruptive to vacation plans than having it in the second week. In the third week of August, the freshmen start at Chalmers, which means reduced availability of suitable conference rooms, so I think that is not a reasonable option. We could look at other times as well, but that would mean that people would lodge all over town. A lot of the closeness and informal contact making would get lost. Unless I hear wild protests, I will work on the August 4-6 alternative, with time for sprints 31 July - 3 August. Item 2: I would like to invite the Chalmers Computer Society (http://www.cd.chalmers.se) as co-organisers of the Europython. Student organisations at Chalmers get nice rebates on renting space from the university (I did not calculate with any such rebates in my proposal). We could also get some volunteers for the conference. For the society, it would be good for their image. Jacob Hall?n From gotcha at swing.be Mon Sep 8 11:29:21 2003 From: gotcha at swing.be (Godefroid Chapelle) Date: Mon Sep 8 04:29:24 2003 Subject: [EuroPython] Timing of Europython 2004 In-Reply-To: <200309072212.h87MCBbZ018287@theraft.strakt.com> Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.2.20030908102456.02188c10@pop.swing.be> Hi all, I must say that June 7-9 looks much much better to us in Belgium than begin of August. We (Xavier and I) have the feeling that having the conference just in the middle of summer holidays will cut us from the participation of a lot of people. A conference in August is a supplementary constraint people have to manage (for those that have children or coworkers having children and taking their vacations in those times). At 00:11 8/09/2003, Jacob Hall?n wrote: >Hi! > >Item 1: >We have information from the providers of cheap housing. They have a total of >233 beds. 15 rooms with 4 beds, 5 singlerooms and 84 doublerooms. They are >fully furnished and have private bathrooms and TV. There is also access to >shared kitchens in each entrance. > >These are all avaliable the first, second and third full weeks of August. A >fair number are available June 7-9. The rest of the period 1 June - 31 >August, they are mostly fully booked. > >I would therefore like to propose that we hold the Europython 4-6 August or >possibly 11-13 August. Advantages of an August conference is that school will >be out everywhere. Disadvantages are that southern Europe has vacations and >that the first week of August may be too close to OSCON to get Guido to come. >However, the dates for OSCON have yet to be announced, so we don't quite know >when it is going to be. > >I have assumed that having the conference in the first week of August is less >disruptive to vacation plans than having it in the second week. In the third >week of August, the freshmen start at Chalmers, which means reduced >availability of suitable conference rooms, so I think that is not a >reasonable option. > >We could look at other times as well, but that would mean that people would >lodge all over town. A lot of the closeness and informal contact making would >get lost. > >Unless I hear wild protests, I will work on the August 4-6 alternative, with >time for sprints 31 July - 3 August. > >Item 2: >I would like to invite the Chalmers Computer Society >(http://www.cd.chalmers.se) as co-organisers of the Europython. Student >organisations at Chalmers get nice rebates on renting space from the >university (I did not calculate with any such rebates in my proposal). We >could also get some volunteers for the conference. For the society, it would >be good for their image. > >Jacob Hall?n > > >_______________________________________________ >EuroPython mailing list >EuroPython@python.org >http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/europython -- Godefroid Chapelle BubbleNet sprl rue Victor Horta, 18 / 202 1348 Louvain-la-Neuve Belgium Tel + 32 (10) 459901 TVA 467 093 008 RC Niv 49849 From faassen at vet.uu.nl Mon Sep 8 19:04:14 2003 From: faassen at vet.uu.nl (Martijn Faassen) Date: Mon Sep 8 12:04:15 2003 Subject: [EuroPython] Timing of Europython 2004 In-Reply-To: <5.1.0.14.2.20030908102456.02188c10@pop.swing.be> References: <200309072212.h87MCBbZ018287@theraft.strakt.com> <5.1.0.14.2.20030908102456.02188c10@pop.swing.be> Message-ID: <20030908160413.GA8419@vet.uu.nl> Godefroid Chapelle wrote: > I must say that June 7-9 looks much much better to us in Belgium than begin > of August. > > We (Xavier and I) have the feeling that having the conference just in the > middle of summer holidays will > cut us from the participation of a lot of people. A conference in August is > a supplementary constraint people have to manage (for those that have > children or coworkers having children and taking their vacations in those > times). While august would not be a big problem for me, many people do have their holidays during this time and june does look better to me as well. Regards, Martijn From lac at strakt.com Mon Sep 8 20:06:28 2003 From: lac at strakt.com (Laura Creighton) Date: Mon Sep 8 13:06:37 2003 Subject: [EuroPython] OSCON 2004 will be July 26-30, 2004 Message-ID: <200309081706.h88H6S3p015364@ratthing-b246.strakt.com> so says Vee McMillan, Speaker manager. Laura From tom at aragne.com Mon Sep 8 21:04:19 2003 From: tom at aragne.com (Tom Deprez) Date: Mon Sep 8 13:59:32 2003 Subject: [EuroPython] Timing of Europython 2004 References: <200309072212.h87MCBbZ018287@theraft.strakt.com> Message-ID: <00de01c37633$c16bc120$897ba8c0@skullsplitter> > > Unless I hear wild protests, I will work on the August 4-6 > alternative, with time for sprints 31 July - 3 August. While I probably can make myself available in August, I'm not sure if others can say the same so easely. If I recall correctly, we had the previous conferences outside the holiday period, just because it was difficult for some people to arange it during those periods. Unfortunately, I don't know the percentage of this group. It would be good if people could tell us, so people if possible, please give some feedback on your preferred period. > Item 2: > I would like to invite the Chalmers Computer Society > (http://www.cd.chalmers.se) as co-organisers of the Europython. > Student organisations at Chalmers get nice rebates on renting space > from the university (I did not calculate with any such rebates in my > proposal). We could also get some volunteers for the conference. For > the society, it would be good for their image. Nice. Regards, Tom. From tim at 2wave.net Mon Sep 8 20:47:12 2003 From: tim at 2wave.net (Tim Couper) Date: Mon Sep 8 14:34:14 2003 Subject: [EuroPython] August Europython? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: August is likely to attract the smallest number of attendees (apart from possibly December), certainly in the UK, and I suspect in other nations. I think we have to do it in June at the latest. Tim Jakob wrote: Item 1: We have information from the providers of cheap housing. They have a total of 233 beds. 15 rooms with 4 beds, 5 singlerooms and 84 doublerooms. They are fully furnished and have private bathrooms and TV. There is also access to shared kitchens in each entrance. These are all avaliable the first, second and third full weeks of August. A fair number are available June 7-9. The rest of the period 1 June - 31 August, they are mostly fully booked. I would therefore like to propose that we hold the Europython 4-6 August or possibly 11-13 August. Advantages of an August conference is that school will be out everywhere. Disadvantages are that southern Europe has vacations and that the first week of August may be too close to OSCON to get Guido to come. However, the dates for OSCON have yet to be announced, so we don't quite know when it is going to be. I have assumed that having the conference in the first week of August is less disruptive to vacation plans than having it in the second week. In the third week of August, the freshmen start at Chalmers, which means reduced availability of suitable conference rooms, so I think that is not a reasonable option. We could look at other times as well, but that would mean that people would lodge all over town. A lot of the closeness and informal contact making would get lost. Unless I hear wild protests, I will work on the August 4-6 alternative, with time for sprints 31 July - 3 August. From gherman at darwin.in-berlin.de Mon Sep 8 21:52:11 2003 From: gherman at darwin.in-berlin.de (Dinu Gherman) Date: Mon Sep 8 14:52:19 2003 Subject: [EuroPython] August Europython? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <8DEA5FD7-E22D-11D7-8633-00039345C610@darwin.in-berlin.de> Tim Couper: > August is likely to attract the smallest number of attendees (apart > from > possibly December), certainly in the UK, and I suspect in other > nations. I > think we have to do it in June at the latest. France and Italy are virtually shut down in August with every- body being on vacation... Dinu -- Dinu C. Gherman ...................................................................... "Fascism should more appropriately be called corporatism because it is a merger of state and corporate power." (Benito Mussolini) From Nicolas.Chauvat at logilab.fr Tue Sep 9 11:18:18 2003 From: Nicolas.Chauvat at logilab.fr (Nicolas Chauvat) Date: Tue Sep 9 04:18:29 2003 Subject: [EuroPython] August Europython? In-Reply-To: <8DEA5FD7-E22D-11D7-8633-00039345C610@darwin.in-berlin.de> References: <8DEA5FD7-E22D-11D7-8633-00039345C610@darwin.in-berlin.de> Message-ID: <20030909081818.GA2556@logilab.fr> On Mon, Sep 08, 2003 at 08:52:11PM +0200, Dinu Gherman wrote: > Tim Couper: > > >August is likely to attract the smallest number of attendees (apart > >from > >possibly December), certainly in the UK, and I suspect in other > >nations. I > >think we have to do it in June at the latest. > > France and Italy are virtually shut down in August with every- > body being on vacation... August is definitely not the best time if you want to attract people from France, unless you plan on having them spend their vacation in Sweden and incidentally attend EP04, which I might do if it is held at that time :-) -- Nicolas Chauvat http://www.logilab.com - "Mais o? est donc Ornicar ?" - LOGILAB, Paris (France) From faassen at vet.uu.nl Tue Sep 9 19:30:49 2003 From: faassen at vet.uu.nl (Martijn Faassen) Date: Tue Sep 9 12:30:54 2003 Subject: [EuroPython] Timing of Europython 2004 In-Reply-To: <00de01c37633$c16bc120$897ba8c0@skullsplitter> References: <200309072212.h87MCBbZ018287@theraft.strakt.com> <00de01c37633$c16bc120$897ba8c0@skullsplitter> Message-ID: <20030909163049.GA13143@vet.uu.nl> Tom Deprez wrote: > While I probably can make myself available in August, I'm not sure if > others can say the same so easely. If I recall correctly, we had the > previous conferences outside the holiday period, just because it was > difficult for some people to arange it during those periods. Note that late june for both previous times was hard for students, as it is often an examination period. Earlier june may work better for them. Regards, Martijn From jacob at strakt.com Tue Sep 9 19:35:48 2003 From: jacob at strakt.com (Jacob =?iso-8859-1?q?Hall=E9n?=) Date: Tue Sep 9 12:36:31 2003 Subject: [EuroPython] Timing of Europython 2004 In-Reply-To: <20030909163049.GA13143@vet.uu.nl> References: <200309072212.h87MCBbZ018287@theraft.strakt.com> <00de01c37633$c16bc120$897ba8c0@skullsplitter> <20030909163049.GA13143@vet.uu.nl> Message-ID: <200309091636.h89GaRbZ028204@theraft.strakt.com> Ok, there seems to be an overwelming preference for the 7-9 June alternative, so we will focus on making that happen. We will investigate accomodation for both before and after the conference for the purpose of holding sprints. Jacob From magnus at thinkware.se Tue Sep 9 20:28:34 2003 From: magnus at thinkware.se (Magnus Lycka) Date: Tue Sep 9 13:28:42 2003 Subject: =?ISO-8859-1?B?UmU6IFtFdXJvUHl0aG9uXSBBdWd1c3QgRXVyb3B5dGhvbj8=?= Message-ID: Nicolas Chauvat wrote: > August is definitely not the best time if you want to attract people from > France, unless you plan on having them spend their vacation in Sweden and > incidentally attend EP04, which I might do if it is held at that time :-) Yes! It's the Pythonic thing to do, as anyone who's seen the Holy Grail knows! :) Since the responses to Jacob's mail so far seems to be June 5 - August 0, I guess you might have to come twice. But June is nice too, so stay a little longer and make it a mini vacation! As far as I understood, there will be fewer rooms available in June at the location Jacob talked about. That is a pity, because they are on walking distance from Chalmers and you get excellent value for money. I hope there will be a fair amount of them available in June as well though, so for those who book early, they should still be available. Also the bigger hotels might not have switched to lower summer prices yet in early June, but there are several cheap places to stay in G?teborg a short tram ride from Chalmers, for those who are prepared to bring bedclothes and live without daily room cleaning, and possibly share the room with one or more other people (depending on how much you want to pay). There are also some smaller, well located hotels that have fair rates. As I understand, it's good to make reservations a couple of months beforehand, so it would be great if we could get the program finished reasonably early, so that people can make up their minds earlier. (That will also mean less of a financial strain on the organizers I guess.) -- Magnus Lycka, Thinkware AB Alvans vag 99, SE-907 50 UMEA, SWEDEN phone: int+46 70 582 80 65, fax: int+46 70 612 80 65 http://www.thinkware.se/ mailto:magnus@thinkware.se From jfroche at jfroche.be Tue Sep 9 21:16:33 2003 From: jfroche at jfroche.be (=?iso-8859-1?Q?Jean-Fran=E7ois?= Roche) Date: Tue Sep 9 14:16:43 2003 Subject: [EuroPython] Timing of Europython 2004 In-Reply-To: <20030909163049.GA13143@vet.uu.nl> References: <200309072212.h87MCBbZ018287@theraft.strakt.com> <00de01c37633$c16bc120$897ba8c0@skullsplitter> <20030909163049.GA13143@vet.uu.nl> Message-ID: <20030909181632.GA20366@jfroche.be> On Tue, Sep 09, 2003 at 06:30:49PM +0200, Martijn Faassen wrote: > Tom Deprez wrote: > > While I probably can make myself available in August, I'm not sure if > > others can say the same so easely. If I recall correctly, we had the > > previous conferences outside the holiday period, just because it was > > difficult for some people to arange it during those periods. > > Note that late june for both previous times was hard for students, > as it is often an examination period. Earlier june may work better > for them. In Belgium full June is an examination period :( Are we the only students like that? Jean-Fran?ois From jacob at strakt.com Wed Sep 10 17:46:01 2003 From: jacob at strakt.com (Jacob =?iso-8859-1?q?Hall=E9n?=) Date: Wed Sep 10 10:46:49 2003 Subject: [EuroPython] Preliminary reservations made Message-ID: <200309101446.h8AEkebZ020890@theraft.strakt.com> I have made a preliminary reservation at SGS Veckobost?der for all the rooms they have available for 6-9 june 2004. They have a total of 157 beds available. One is in a single room, there are 100 beds in double rooms and 56 in 4-bed rooms. I have also made a preliminary reservation for 20 beds the 4 days before the conference and 30 beds the 5 days after the conference, so that there is room for sprints and people who want to stay for holidays. We will investigate some other accomodation alternatives, now that we have the dates set. It is also time to get things rolling about the conference venue. Jacob From mwh at python.net Mon Sep 15 06:16:53 2003 From: mwh at python.net (Michael Hudson) Date: Mon Sep 15 06:16:24 2003 Subject: [EuroPython] Preliminary reservations made In-Reply-To: <200309101446.h8AEkebZ020890@theraft.strakt.com> ( =?iso-8859-1?q?Jacob_Hall=E9n's_message_of?= "Wed, 10 Sep 2003 16:46:01 +0200") References: <200309101446.h8AEkebZ020890@theraft.strakt.com> Message-ID: <2mznh6cq5m.fsf@starship.python.net> Jacob Hall?n writes: > I have made a preliminary reservation at SGS Veckobost?der for all the rooms > they have available for 6-9 june 2004. Yay. > We will investigate some other accomodation alternatives, now that > we have the dates set. It is also time to get things rolling about > the conference venue. Should we also think about writing a press release announcing the con? Cheers, mwh -- 81. In computing, turning the obvious into the useful is a living definition of the word "frustration". -- Alan Perlis, http://www.cs.yale.edu/homes/perlis-alan/quotes.html From mwh at python.net Tue Sep 16 06:37:43 2003 From: mwh at python.net (Michael Hudson) Date: Tue Sep 16 06:37:13 2003 Subject: [EuroPython] Preliminary reservations made In-Reply-To: <200309151043.h8FAhmq3016139@ratthing-b246.strakt.com> (Laura Creighton's message of "Mon, 15 Sep 2003 12:43:48 +0200") References: <200309101446.h8AEkebZ020890@theraft.strakt.com> <2mznh6cq5m.fsf@starship.python.net> <200309151043.h8FAhmq3016139@ratthing-b246.strakt.com> Message-ID: <2msmmxauiw.fsf@starship.python.net> sending back to the EP list... Laura Creighton writes: > In a message of Mon, 15 Sep 2003 11:16:53 BST, Michael Hudson writes: >>Jacob Hall?n writes: >> >>> I have made a preliminary reservation at SGS Veckobost?der for all the r >>ooms >>> they have available for 6-9 june 2004. >> >>Yay. >> >>> We will investigate some other accomodation alternatives, now that >>> we have the dates set. It is also time to get things rolling about >>> the conference venue. >> >>Should we also think about writing a press release announcing the con? >> >>Cheers, >>mwh > > Absolutely. But I am too busy writing pypy funding proposal this week > (until Thursday at any rate). I started here: http://www.europython.org/draftwiki/EP2004InitialPressRelease Please, anyone help. I suck at writing things like this. 2002's version is here: http://europython.zope.nl/draftwiki/PressReleaseEnglish > If you want to write a first draft, I am getting very fond of the > pypy 'how to share writing a doc' svn repository stuff. Where is this? > I also want to get a bot from moshe for europython irc, if that has > gone away, and have some meetings sometime, and set up the > 'how to write a paper' clinic start meetings. Aahz wants to get > a Zope team to make a 'how to submit a paper' Zope site for > Pycon. I said that we had a different stucture, but would like > whatever they do to be designed so we can use it too. (This talk > is happening on pycon-organisers). That'd all be cool, but isn't incredibly urgent yet, is it? > I want to make it a lot easier for people to participate this year > in the running of the con. It seems to me as if year 1 was better than > year 2 in this respect. I am not sure what the barriers to participation > were, so I am not sure how to knock them down. Well, I didn't encounter any terrible difficulty getting involved (almost the reverse...). Perhaps it's just a matter of communicating the needs and the oppurtunities better. > Maybe the wiki was essential to get participation. Maybe a contest > for a logo was. Maybe more planning in advance -- maybe something > else, like being new was. I expect/hope that having a longer lead in time will make *everything* easier... > At any rate, I'mswamped this week. But an announcement is needed. A presentable (if simple) website to point people at would also be nice. I thought there was something here: http://www.europython.org/2004/ but there doesn't seem to be at the moment. What news on that front? Cheers, mwh -- That one is easily explained away as massively intricate conspiracy, though. -- Chris Klein, alt.sysadmin.recovery From jacob at strakt.com Wed Sep 17 19:03:00 2003 From: jacob at strakt.com (Jacob =?iso-8859-1?q?Hall=E9n?=) Date: Wed Sep 17 19:03:45 2003 Subject: [EuroPython] Quick update Message-ID: <200309172303.h8HN3fbZ009189@theraft.strakt.com> I met Dar?o earlier this week and we discussed what venue we would like to use. We agreed that one of the houses with lecture halls, containing 3 large and 2 smaller halls would be ideal, except that if we have over 250 attendees, there will not be room enough for everyone for the keynotes. If we are more than that, we will have the keynotes in a larger hall that is about 4 minutes walk away from the main venue. This hall accomodates 450. Dar?o is busy arranging another conference this week, and will make the contacts with Chalmers conference service early next week. I think it would be good to have the first word on the venue before sending out a press release. The idea with the computer society seems to be a dud, since I can't find anyone in charge to talk to. Jacob From gotcha at swing.be Thu Sep 18 06:31:15 2003 From: gotcha at swing.be (Godefroid Chapelle) Date: Thu Sep 18 06:30:11 2003 Subject: [EuroPython] Quick update In-Reply-To: <200309172303.h8HN3fbZ009189@theraft.strakt.com> Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.2.20030918123056.01e54ae8@pop.swing.be> At 01:03 18/09/2003, Jacob Hall?n wrote: >I met Dar?o earlier this week and we discussed what venue we would like to >use. We agreed that one of the houses with lecture halls, containing 3 large >and 2 smaller halls would be ideal, except that if we have over 250 attendees, >there will not be room enough for everyone for the keynotes. If we are more >than that, we will have the keynotes in a larger hall that is about 4 minutes >walk away from the main venue. This hall accomodates 450. Very good >Dar?o is busy arranging another conference this week, and will make the >contacts with Chalmers conference service early next week. I think it would >be good to have the first word on the venue before sending out a press >release. > >The idea with the computer society seems to be a dud, since I can't find >anyone in charge to talk to. > >Jacob Thanks for the job done. -- Godefroid Chapelle BubbleNet sprl rue Victor Horta, 18 / 202 1348 Louvain-la-Neuve Belgium Tel + 32 (10) 459901 TVA 467 093 008 RC Niv 49849 From mwh at python.net Thu Sep 18 06:34:09 2003 From: mwh at python.net (Michael Hudson) Date: Thu Sep 18 06:33:37 2003 Subject: [EuroPython] Quick update In-Reply-To: <200309172303.h8HN3fbZ009189@theraft.strakt.com> ( =?iso-8859-1?q?Jacob_Hall=E9n's_message_of?= "Thu, 18 Sep 2003 01:03:00 +0200") References: <200309172303.h8HN3fbZ009189@theraft.strakt.com> Message-ID: <2mpthy8jxa.fsf@starship.python.net> Jacob Hall?n writes: > I met Dar?o earlier this week and we discussed what venue we would like to > use. We agreed that one of the houses with lecture halls, containing 3 large > and 2 smaller halls would be ideal, except that if we have over 250 attendees, > there will not be room enough for everyone for the keynotes. If we are more > than that, we will have the keynotes in a larger hall that is about 4 minutes > walk away from the main venue. This hall accomodates 450. Sounds good. > Dar?o is busy arranging another conference this week, and will make the > contacts with Chalmers conference service early next week. I think it would > be good to have the first word on the venue before sending out a press > release. Oh, sure. I was only agitating to have some text ready for when the PR becomes appropriate, not to send it out too soon. Cheers, mwh -- It's an especially annoying American buzzword for "business use, as opposed to consumer, research, or educational use". -- Tim Peters defines "enterprise" From jacob at strakt.com Thu Sep 18 11:38:00 2003 From: jacob at strakt.com (Jacob =?iso-8859-1?q?Hall=E9n?=) Date: Thu Sep 18 11:38:46 2003 Subject: [EuroPython] Starting to plan Message-ID: <200309181538.h8IFcfbZ029939@theraft.strakt.com> Hi all, it is time to draw up the plans for the contents of EP2004. I have listed the tracks that we had at EP2003. I would like your input on a few matters. 1. I think it is reasonable that last conference track champions get to say if they want to champion the track again. If they are unwilling, we will look for somebody else to run the track, or consider if we want to strike it from the schedule. 2. How much time should we plan for for each track? This is of course dependent on what sort of speaker interest we get, but it is good to have a preliminary figure. The speaker interest is connected to the ambitions of each track champion after all. 3. Are there any important changes we should make to the format of the tracks? Last years tracks ================= Lightning Talks, Open Space, Bofs Track champions: Anna Ravenscroft; Moshe Zadka Comments: We should have plenty of space for bofs and openspace sessions, and I think it is a good idea to have lightning talks at a time when little else is going on. Python Frameworks Track Track champions: Martijn Faassen Python Language Track Track champions: Michael Hudson Python in Business Track Track champions: Tim Couper; Marc-Andre Lemburg Python in Science & Industry Track Track champion: Nicolas Chauvat Zope Track Track champions: Paul Everitt; Heimo Laukkanen New conference things ===================== It is also time to consider what new things we should add. Personally, I would like to see a refereed paper track. It doesn't have to be long; a day or even half a day would be enough. The important thing is to be early with the announcement of this track, so that we have enough time for the authors to produce papers and for the reviewers to read and comment. I would also like to support sessions of the kind that Guido asked for in his keynote at EP2003, where he has one or more seminars with a fairly small number of people. This could be supported with other celebrities who are coming. Something that is a bit of a dream right now is to have something called "Consult the bots", where we would have Alex Martelli, Fredrik Lund and Tim Peters available for people to consult. "Bring your problem and get face-to-face advice from the gurus." These are my current ideas for improvement and change to the conference format. I'd like to hear other peoples views and ideas. Corporate involvement ===================== Python conferences hardly attract any exhibitors. If we get the venue we plan for, there will be some space for exhibitors. I would like to make a number of small spaces (2-3 sqare meters each) avaliable for free or for a very minimal charge for exhibiting companies. Companies sponsoring the conference in one way or another should get priority. Any space left should be distributed randomly among those who register before a certain date. We may even give the companies just one day each, to give more people the chance to show themselves. I would also like to make space available for public product demonstrations, where the company gets a time slot in one of the smaller rooms. We may want to charge a fee for such a demo slot. If we attract exhibitors who want more space, we will charge the cost for renting extra space, and then some. By dumping the prices on exhibitor space now, we can build a platform for revenue in the future. Exhibitors who get a good result out of being at EP will want to come back. Their willingness to pay will be better when they know what results to expect. Website ======= Can we keep the website where it is and as it is? Tom, are you willing and interested in continuing with the building of the EP webiste? What resources do you need for the work to go smoothly? Brochure ======== Reportlab/Andy Robinson has already voluntered to do the brochure. Any reason not to accept this? Volunteers sought ================= Apart from the people above, I am currently looking for suitable people for some jobs. I am sure there will be more functions needed later. Before the conference: * Interviewers (The interviews are a great idea. Attracts people to the website over and over again. Even gets people to come back to the website after the conference is over.) * Coordinator for getting sponsors and exhibitors * Local information * Registration and room booking * Food planning * Badge design * Recruiter of keynote speakers and chief whip for getting interesting speakers to the conference * Marketing coordinator * Schedule coordinator During the conference: * Reception * Technical support (Conference server, network access, projectors, test sessions) * Liason with service providers All these jobs need a written plan with the items When, Who, What. It will take me quite a while to write all these, so if anybody feels like it, please write one or two of these, apart from considering if you would like to take on one (or more) of the jobs. The idea is to cut the arranging of the conference into bits that are so small that they are not a burden to anyone. Please talk to your friends and get them involved too. Ok, that is it for now. I'm happy for any feedback. Jacob From mwh at python.net Thu Sep 18 13:53:30 2003 From: mwh at python.net (Michael Hudson) Date: Thu Sep 18 13:52:58 2003 Subject: [EuroPython] Starting to plan In-Reply-To: <200309181538.h8IFcfbZ029939@theraft.strakt.com> ( =?iso-8859-1?q?Jacob_Hall=E9n's_message_of?= "Thu, 18 Sep 2003 17:38:00 +0200") References: <200309181538.h8IFcfbZ029939@theraft.strakt.com> Message-ID: <2mad927zl1.fsf@starship.python.net> Jacob Hall?n writes: > Hi all, > > it is time to draw up the plans for the contents of EP2004. I have > listed the tracks that we had at EP2003. I would like your input on a > few matters. > > 1. I think it is reasonable that last conference track champions get > to say if they want to champion the track again. If they are > unwilling, we will look for somebody else to run the track, or > consider if we want to strike it from the schedule. Yup. I'm willing to do Python Language again. > 2. How much time should we plan for for each track? This is of course > dependent on what sort of speaker interest we get, but it is good to > have a preliminary figure. The speaker interest is connected to the > ambitions of each track champion after all. > > 3. Are there any important changes we should make to the format of the > tracks? Well, I'm not quite sure where to hang this point, but I would like to see a bit more cross pollination between the tracks. I, for one, would be quite interested in a "Zope (3?) for Python Programmers" tutorial, and I suspect a "Python for Zope users" tutorial might be well received. Tutorials are good, in general. We didn't really have them this year. > Last years tracks > ================= > Lightning Talks, Open Space, Bofs > Track champions: Anna Ravenscroft; Moshe Zadka > Comments: We should have plenty of space for bofs and openspace sessions, > and I think it is a good idea to have lightning talks at a time when little > else is going on. Yup. > I would also like to support sessions of the kind that Guido asked > for in his keynote at EP2003, where he has one or more seminars with > a fairly small number of people. This could be supported with other > celebrities who are coming. Can you expand? I'm not sure I quite get you. > Something that is a bit of a dream right now is to have something > called "Consult the bots", where we would have Alex Martelli, Fredrik > Lund and Tim Peters available for people to consult. "Bring your > problem and get face-to-face advice from the gurus." Hmm. > Volunteers sought > ================= > Apart from the people above, I am currently looking for suitable people > for some jobs. I am sure there will be more functions needed later. I'm not sure I can or should volunteer for any of the specific jobs you mention, but I'll promise to keep on kicking people up the arse when I think the process is slipping :-) Cheers, mwh -- Enlightenment is probably antithetical to impatience. -- Erik Naggum, comp.lang.lisp From ghum at gmx.net Thu Sep 18 17:42:01 2003 From: ghum at gmx.net (Harald Armin Massa) Date: Thu Sep 18 17:40:15 2003 Subject: [EuroPython] Starting to plan References: <200309181538.h8IFcfbZ029939@theraft.strakt.com> Message-ID: <001c01c37e2d$f5737b00$642aa8c0@tog2> > 3. Are there any important changes we should make to the format of the > tracks? I would like to propose an additional track: "social knowledge" Topics should pe: - presentation skills - negotiating skills - business arguments I'm volunteering to do at least one talk in this track, if I remember correctly Anna also was thinking about helping with this track. Harald From paul at zope-europe.org Fri Sep 19 01:17:27 2003 From: paul at zope-europe.org (Paul Everitt) Date: Fri Sep 19 01:17:35 2003 Subject: [EuroPython] Starting to plan In-Reply-To: <2mad927zl1.fsf@starship.python.net> Message-ID: <8F430FD9-EA60-11D7-BD05-000393C2939A@zope-europe.org> On Thursday, Sep 18, 2003, at 19:53 Europe/Paris, Michael Hudson wrote: > Jacob Hall?n writes: > >> Hi all, >> >> it is time to draw up the plans for the contents of EP2004. I have >> listed the tracks that we had at EP2003. I would like your input on a >> few matters. >> >> 1. I think it is reasonable that last conference track champions get >> to say if they want to champion the track again. If they are >> unwilling, we will look for somebody else to run the track, or >> consider if we want to strike it from the schedule. > > Yup. I'm willing to do Python Language again. I'm willing to do Zope again, as long as it means I foist all the work on Heimo again. :^) >> 2. How much time should we plan for for each track? This is of course >> dependent on what sort of speaker interest we get, but it is good to >> have a preliminary figure. The speaker interest is connected to the >> ambitions of each track champion after all. >> >> 3. Are there any important changes we should make to the format of the >> tracks? > > Well, I'm not quite sure where to hang this point, but I would like to > see a bit more cross pollination between the tracks. I, for one, > would be quite interested in a "Zope (3?) for Python Programmers" > tutorial, and I suspect a "Python for Zope users" tutorial might be > well received. I very much agree. The track chairs arranged the schedules in blissful isolation. Though it might be hard to add the extra preparation to coordinate, it's still a good goal. > Tutorials are good, in general. We didn't really have them this year. +100. EPC2003 was too much of the "I talk you listen" format. I gave a 3 hour hands-on tutorial to 40 people at OSCOM 3 this past year (writing CMS clients in Mozilla). Most of them said later that such a format was the most valuable part of the conference. Will the venue support such needs? It's a space (lots of smaller rooms) and logistics (network, beamer) issue. >> Last years tracks >> ================= >> Lightning Talks, Open Space, Bofs >> Track champions: Anna Ravenscroft; Moshe Zadka >> Comments: We should have plenty of space for bofs and openspace >> sessions, >> and I think it is a good idea to have lightning talks at a time when >> little >> else is going on. > > Yup. > >> I would also like to support sessions of the kind that Guido asked >> for in his keynote at EP2003, where he has one or more seminars with >> a fairly small number of people. This could be supported with other >> celebrities who are coming. > > Can you expand? I'm not sure I quite get you. > >> Something that is a bit of a dream right now is to have something >> called "Consult the bots", where we would have Alex Martelli, Fredrik >> Lund and Tim Peters available for people to consult. "Bring your >> problem and get face-to-face advice from the gurus." > > Hmm. > >> Volunteers sought >> ================= >> Apart from the people above, I am currently looking for suitable >> people >> for some jobs. I am sure there will be more functions needed later. > > I'm not sure I can or should volunteer for any of the specific jobs > you mention, but I'll promise to keep on kicking people up the arse > when I think the process is slipping :-) One other point for discussion...I think that EPC2003 showed less of a company exhibitor stance that EPC2002. I wonder if something was lost, or whether the loss wasn't valuable. IMO, we need to show companies, even if it means charging them *nothing* (other than registration) for the privilege. At least, nothing for small (under 15) companies. --Paul From bea at webwitches.com Fri Sep 19 03:29:28 2003 From: bea at webwitches.com (Beatrice Fontaine) Date: Fri Sep 19 03:26:41 2003 Subject: [EuroPython] Starting to plan In-Reply-To: <001c01c37e2d$f5737b00$642aa8c0@tog2> References: <200309181538.h8IFcfbZ029939@theraft.strakt.com> <001c01c37e2d$f5737b00$642aa8c0@tog2> Message-ID: <1063956568.2329.55.camel@localhost> On Thu, 2003-09-18 at 23:42, Harald Armin Massa wrote: > > 3. Are there any important changes we should make to the format of the > > tracks? > > I would like to propose an additional track: > > "social knowledge" > > Topics should pe: > > - presentation skills > - negotiating skills > - business arguments > > > I'm volunteering to do at least one talk in this track, if I remember > correctly Anna also was thinking about helping with this track. > > > Harald I would be absolutely thrilled to deal with that one. My Python skills may still be rudimentary but I have been successfully convincing people to use Open Source products (mainly Zope and recently Plone for two rather visible projects), preaching Linux to the masses, etc. for a good while now. I have had my own IT-company since 1995 (Belgium, then Finland, now Sweden) and have been running it working on smaller and larger EU-projects, mainly in the area of E-learning (since before it was called that), use of IT in small companies, and entrepreneurship. Web development, product localisation, PR stuff and EU-project management. I used to be a corporate drone and got fed up with it back in 1994 so I took my projects and went (with corporate consent and probably relief). I've been living and working with Shae since 1999 and am one of his most successful converts, at least as far a Open Source is concerned... I am a business geek'ette and anything but a cavern dweller (i.e. I am not IV'ed to my box). I have found that getting people like me to do advocacy is one good way to get the public at large to understand the actual potential impact of Open Source on their own business activities - like up here in the North of Sweden where offering a web hotel seems to be synonymous with selling FP 2000 to everyone naive enough to buy it, literally and figuratively. I have given a few talks/workshops on human networking in virtual cooperation, intercultural communication, teleworking, and on getting chix into IT. For our own business, I have to restart the whole issue of "why this solution and not another" (or rather "_the_ other") and "what was that thing called again" every time I begin a new negotiation. Even though whole governments have started buying into Linux, getting Open Source products into business at the small business level takes a lot of conviction (which geeks have in large amounts), but especially the power to convince (which is by far less fun to try out, for many). "I just know it's right and you are a moron if you don't get it" may work in some cases. I haven't tried it out myself, personally. So, that was me blowing my own brass section. To cut the long story short: if a sufficient number of people want that track, I would go as far as offering to run it. Any more takers? -- B?atrice Fontaine From faassen at vet.uu.nl Fri Sep 19 06:29:31 2003 From: faassen at vet.uu.nl (Martijn Faassen) Date: Fri Sep 19 06:30:07 2003 Subject: [EuroPython] Starting to plan In-Reply-To: <200309181538.h8IFcfbZ029939@theraft.strakt.com> References: <200309181538.h8IFcfbZ029939@theraft.strakt.com> Message-ID: <20030919102931.GA14662@vet.uu.nl> Jacob Hall?n wrote: > 1. I think it is reasonable that last conference track champions get > to say if they want to champion the track again. If they are > unwilling, we will look for somebody else to run the track, or > consider if we want to strike it from the schedule. I can do Python Frameworks again. Assistance would of course not be unwelcome though. :) > 2. How much time should we plan for for each track? This is of course > dependent on what sort of speaker interest we get, but it is good to > have a preliminary figure. The speaker interest is connected to the > ambitions of each track champion after all. This year the Python Frameworks track had 1.5 days (a day and a morning), consisting of 6 blocks of 90 minutes. > 3. Are there any important changes we should make to the format of the > tracks? I like the 90 minutes block structure; it allows 2 x 45 or 3 x 30. In order to improve quality I'd like to be a bit more formal in what gets approved and not, but this requires: * more information about the talks given (slides or even a paper, though I'm not sure we're ready for the whole-hog paper thing yet) * more submissions than there are timeslots, otherwise rejecting talks becomes a rather frustrating exercise. Initially this year I had more talks than I could fit in. After going up from 4 blocks to 6 blocks it became easier though still tight, but then some speakers dropped out (as they always will). Then I had some space to spare in the end (just half an hour or so). So we have a bit of a paradox: * encourage people to submit more talks * but make it harder to get accepted, which means submission requirements become more extensive so we have enough info to decide.. Ideas? > Last years tracks > ================= > Lightning Talks, Open Space, Bofs > Track champions: Anna Ravenscroft; Moshe Zadka > Comments: We should have plenty of space for bofs and openspace sessions, > and I think it is a good idea to have lightning talks at a time when little > else is going on. Agreed. This was difficult this year, as there were so many talks. It worked fairly well though as the Zope track tends to be sufficiently different (and it overlapped with lightning talks). Perhaps Zope lightning talks in parallel with the Python ones could be interesting? Or perhaps it's actually nicer to have a wild mixture of all talks in a single track.. > New conference things > ===================== > It is also time to consider what new things we should add. Personally, > I would like to see a refereed paper track. It doesn't have to be long; > a day or even half a day would be enough. The important thing is to be > early with the announcement of this track, so that we have enough time > for the authors to produce papers and for the reviewers to read and > comment. Ah, that's an idea I hadn't considered yet; make only some talks have refereed papers. Would we be able to attract enough people willing to submit a paper to this? > I would also like to support sessions of the kind that Guido asked for > in his keynote at EP2003, where he has one or more seminars with a > fairly small number of people. This could be supported with other > celebrities who are coming. > > Something that is a bit of a dream right now is to have something > called "Consult the bots", where we would have Alex Martelli, Fredrik > Lund and Tim Peters available for people to consult. "Bring your > problem and get face-to-face advice from the gurus." We had a very fun talk originally written by Moshez but presented by Michael, myself and Alex Martelli about 'Dos and Don's in Python'. It was very interactive and I think fun for the audience as well. I'm not sure I understand what Guido asked for though. I'm thinking more in the lines of panels. Panel discussions with lots of audience interaction are fun too; I tend to be noisy audience myself so I appreciate it especially. :) [snip] > Website > ======= > Can we keep the website where it is and as it is? I don't think there's a problem in keeping it at amaze. One issue that I'm not sure has been formally resolved is the domain name though; europython.org is owned by someone else who's been letting us use it. Not sure who knows the details on this one. > Tom, are you willing and interested in continuing with the building of > the EP webiste? What resources do you need for the work to go smoothly? Note that there are plans to redo the site in Zope/Plone (as opposed to Zope/hacks as it is now). These plans existed last year as well but did not materialize due to lack of volunteers. My impression was that some movement had happened already on this, but Tom would know more. Is it your suggestion the Plone migration is not necessary and we should continue as we are? I have no particular preference either way myself. > Brochure > ======== > Reportlab/Andy Robinson has already voluntered to do the brochure. > Any reason not to accept this? It seems to be a mutually beneficial partnership; we get the brochure and Reportlab can use it for a demo and publicity. So no objections there from me. > Volunteers sought > ================= > Apart from the people above, I am currently looking for suitable people > for some jobs. I am sure there will be more functions needed later. > > Before the conference: > * Interviewers > (The interviews are a great idea. Attracts people to the website over > and over again. Even gets people to come back to the website after the > conference is over.) Yeah, I really it when FOSDEM did it in 2002 I think (though this year they did it less well, for some reason). So I copied the idea for EuroPython in 2002. It went well last year as well. I'm willing to conduct interviews. Tom's a great interviewer so I hope he'll join in. We need to plan the interviews a bit earlier this year; start a month earlier. Some of the interviews were online a bit too late, and the stream of interviews was *so* rapid news sites couldn't keep up with them properly and missed some. With a little bit of planning we can trickle them out once every two or three days though. I like the quantity aspect though; let's aim for 10 or more interviews again. Because of this we need a little bit of coordination with interviews too; someone to recruit interviewers and interviewees, and to make sure it trickles out at the right rate, and that the news sites are informed. Perhaps this should be merged with the person in charge of news message on the website. > * Coordinator for getting sponsors and exhibitors > * Local information > * Registration and room booking > * Food planning > * Badge design > * Recruiter of keynote speakers and chief whip for getting interesting > speakers to the conference I can help with it; I have some experience. I helped getting Guido, Jim Fulton and Armin Rigo getting on board in 2002. This year I was very happy to have Daniel Veillard of libxml2 fame on my track. [snip] Seems I wrote a bit of a plan concerning interviews already. Tom should definitely chip in on this too; he conducted by far the most interviews. Regards, Martijn From faassen at vet.uu.nl Fri Sep 19 06:32:18 2003 From: faassen at vet.uu.nl (Martijn Faassen) Date: Fri Sep 19 06:32:17 2003 Subject: [EuroPython] Starting to plan In-Reply-To: <2mad927zl1.fsf@starship.python.net> References: <200309181538.h8IFcfbZ029939@theraft.strakt.com> <2mad927zl1.fsf@starship.python.net> Message-ID: <20030919103218.GB14662@vet.uu.nl> Michael Hudson wrote: > Well, I'm not quite sure where to hang this point, but I would like to > see a bit more cross pollination between the tracks. I, for one, > would be quite interested in a "Zope (3?) for Python Programmers" > tutorial, and I suspect a "Python for Zope users" tutorial might be > well received. Those are good suggestions. Python for Zope users sounds like something I might like to help with. > Tutorials are good, in general. We didn't really have them this year. Agreed. I also propose we try to keep them short, 30 or 45 minutes, mostly. And interactive. And with some humor. This keeps people from falling asleep. Regards, Martijn From faassen at vet.uu.nl Fri Sep 19 06:41:14 2003 From: faassen at vet.uu.nl (Martijn Faassen) Date: Fri Sep 19 06:41:14 2003 Subject: [EuroPython] Starting to plan In-Reply-To: <8F430FD9-EA60-11D7-BD05-000393C2939A@zope-europe.org> References: <2mad927zl1.fsf@starship.python.net> <8F430FD9-EA60-11D7-BD05-000393C2939A@zope-europe.org> Message-ID: <20030919104114.GC14662@vet.uu.nl> Paul Everitt wrote: > >Well, I'm not quite sure where to hang this point, but I would like to > >see a bit more cross pollination between the tracks. I, for one, > >would be quite interested in a "Zope (3?) for Python Programmers" > >tutorial, and I suspect a "Python for Zope users" tutorial might be > >well received. > > I very much agree. The track chairs arranged the schedules in blissful > isolation. Not true though for me and Michael; we tried to coordinate. We also interacted with Anna and Moshe of the lightning talks track, though of course less coordination there was necessary. > Though it might be hard to add the extra preparation to > coordinate, it's still a good goal. Hanging out regularly on #europython is a cheap and efficient way to encourage coordination. It's no coincidence the individuals I pointed out above were there a lot. We had some trouble getting feedback from some track chairs by email when me and Michael were trying to steal more space and time from them. :) I think if we hadn't pushed forward the talks deadline quite as much as we did this year we would've been better on track with the planning and coordination here too. We cut it a bit too tight and this wasn't really necessary either as we really had enough talks. > >Tutorials are good, in general. We didn't really have them this year. > > +100. EPC2003 was too much of the "I talk you listen" format. I gave > a 3 hour hands-on tutorial to 40 people at OSCOM 3 this past year > (writing CMS clients in Mozilla). Most of them said later that such a > format was the most valuable part of the conference. Hands-on might be better. 3 hour tutorials scare me, though.. We will have sprints of course, which can take over at least some of that role. Especially if we organize a sprint geared more towards Python beginners and intermediates, to build something cool. PyPy is a bit over their heads, and so is Zope 3 (though that is more flexible). > >I'm not sure I can or should volunteer for any of the specific jobs > >you mention, but I'll promise to keep on kicking people up the arse > >when I think the process is slipping :-) > > One other point for discussion...I think that EPC2003 showed less of a > company exhibitor stance that EPC2002. I wonder if something was lost, > or whether the loss wasn't valuable. EPC2002 didn't get that much mileage out of exhibitors, and a lot of frustration (ask Denis). I think that's why there was less effort spent this year. > IMO, we need to show companies, even if it means charging them > *nothing* (other than registration) for the privilege. At least, > nothing for small (under 15) companies. Some of the problem is that these small companies don't really have enough resources to man a company booth. Posters might be nice here. You can just put up a poster and occasionally someone from the company can hang around there, perhaps during a special poster session when people can file in. Larger stuff (like a whole table!) would be for organizations (such as perhaps the PyPy people or say, Zope Europe) that can drag in some volunteers, or larger companies that have the resources. Regards, Martijn From faassen at vet.uu.nl Fri Sep 19 06:44:08 2003 From: faassen at vet.uu.nl (Martijn Faassen) Date: Fri Sep 19 06:44:20 2003 Subject: [EuroPython] Starting to plan In-Reply-To: <1063956568.2329.55.camel@localhost> References: <200309181538.h8IFcfbZ029939@theraft.strakt.com> <001c01c37e2d$f5737b00$642aa8c0@tog2> <1063956568.2329.55.camel@localhost> Message-ID: <20030919104408.GD14662@vet.uu.nl> Beatrice Fontaine wrote: > So, that was me blowing my own brass section. To cut the long story > short: if a sufficient number of people want that track, I would go as > far as offering to run it. > > Any more takers? It sounds like a fun track. Some overlap may exist with the business track though, so this needs to be coordinated well. It'd be nice if there were some ideas to get python/zope specific content into the talks, too, as it's a Python conference after all.. Regards, Martijn From Nicolas.Chauvat at logilab.fr Fri Sep 19 06:45:32 2003 From: Nicolas.Chauvat at logilab.fr (Nicolas Chauvat) Date: Fri Sep 19 06:45:40 2003 Subject: [EuroPython] Starting to plan In-Reply-To: <20030919102931.GA14662@vet.uu.nl> References: <200309181538.h8IFcfbZ029939@theraft.strakt.com> <20030919102931.GA14662@vet.uu.nl> Message-ID: <20030919104532.GA7596@logilab.fr> On Fri, Sep 19, 2003 at 12:29:31PM +0200, Martijn Faassen wrote: > Note that there are plans to redo the site in Zope/Plone (as opposed to > Zope/hacks as it is now). These plans existed last year as well but did > not materialize due to lack of volunteers. My impression was that some > movement had happened already on this, but Tom would know more. There is a new site based on Plone already in the works and available. Volunteers willing to learn more about Plone would be very welcome to join, since I plan on having very little time for this myself, although I pretend to know exactly how to have a very nice technical design for the site. Just don't have time to implement it, but will help anyone willing to do the implementation. -- Nicolas Chauvat http://www.logilab.com - "Mais o? est donc Ornicar ?" - LOGILAB, Paris (France) From Nicolas.Chauvat at logilab.fr Fri Sep 19 06:49:24 2003 From: Nicolas.Chauvat at logilab.fr (Nicolas Chauvat) Date: Fri Sep 19 06:49:39 2003 Subject: [EuroPython] Starting to plan In-Reply-To: <20030919104114.GC14662@vet.uu.nl> References: <2mad927zl1.fsf@starship.python.net> <8F430FD9-EA60-11D7-BD05-000393C2939A@zope-europe.org> <20030919104114.GC14662@vet.uu.nl> Message-ID: <20030919104924.GB7596@logilab.fr> > > IMO, we need to show companies, even if it means charging them > > *nothing* (other than registration) for the privilege. At least, > > nothing for small (under 15) companies. > > Some of the problem is that these small companies don't really have enough > resources to man a company booth. Posters might be nice here. You can just > put up a poster and occasionally someone from the company can hang around > there, perhaps during a special poster session when people can file in. +1 on having posters and free space for small companies. Just find a way to make sure the thing does not turn into wild posting everywhere :-) -- Nicolas Chauvat http://www.logilab.com - "Mais o? est donc Ornicar ?" - LOGILAB, Paris (France) From huima at iki.fi Fri Sep 19 07:04:06 2003 From: huima at iki.fi (Heimo Laukkanen) Date: Fri Sep 19 06:57:39 2003 Subject: [EuroPython] Starting to plan Message-ID: <3F6AE2A6.8070509@iki.fi> > So, that was me blowing my own brass section. To cut the long story > short: if a sufficient number of people want that track, I would go as > far as offering to run it. I think this is a great idea that would require a lot of work, but could be something extremely valuable for entrepreneurial-participants of the conference. This kind of track would also be a good place to include issues about working EU, local municipals / goverments or educational sector around Europe. Excellent idea. -huima From huima at iki.fi Fri Sep 19 07:29:05 2003 From: huima at iki.fi (Heimo Laukkanen) Date: Fri Sep 19 07:22:36 2003 Subject: [EuroPython] Starting to plan Message-ID: <3F6AE881.5080106@iki.fi> > I'm willing to do Zope again, as long as it means I foist all the work > on Heimo again. :^) Rock on! Like I previously said it was fun and would really like to do it again. > I very much agree. The track chairs arranged the schedules in blissful > isolation. Though it might be hard to add the extra preparation to > coordinate, it's still a good goal. Coordination is a good idea. For that however we need to think of the profiles / stereotypes of different visitors and what do they want to get out of the conference since the interests can very very very easily overlap on multiple different tracks, especially on very technical or programming focused people. On Zope track we also had people who were very new to whole genre and were there mostly because of what they had just learned about Zope / Plone. > +100. EPC2003 was too much of the "I talk you listen" format. I gave > a 3 hour hands-on tutorial to 40 people at OSCOM 3 this past year > (writing CMS clients in Mozilla). Most of them said later that such a > format was the most valuable part of the conference. > > Will the venue support such needs? It's a space (lots of smaller > rooms) and logistics (network, beamer) issue. +100 Harder to do, more expensive to do, requires a lot more work from the presenter but is highly valuable. What I usually want from a conference falls into following categories: 1) Talks that illuminate new paths of thought, paradigms, developments 2) Examples and cases of problem solving, even better if someone has distilled his lessons into patterns that can be reused. 3) Workshops where people have to also participate and work with the guidance of the instructor 4) Sprint / Panel-discussion / Debate where people participating bring their own experiences and ideas and try to solve something together > One other point for discussion...I think that EPC2003 showed less of a > company exhibitor stance that EPC2002. I wonder if something was lost, > or whether the loss wasn't valuable. > > IMO, we need to show companies, even if it means charging them > *nothing* (other than registration) for the privilege. At least, > nothing for small (under 15) companies. +10 Showing companies is good and a stand/table is a natural place to come to meet people and talk about what their company does. However with small companies this could be problematic also because of the social nature of EPC - meaning that people want to meet and talk with their friends and colleagues, mingle - rather than stand next to a table and get new people to contact and talk with them. But I am not sure, this is just my impression on how keen technical people are to stand still and try to contact people and tell them about their work ,--) But all and all I do agree with Paul. Showing more companies sends right message to the participants, even subconscious - about thriving community and businesses. This is important for the newcomers who will go back to their organisations and social circles and tell how much they saw. -huima From Nicolas.Chauvat at logilab.fr Fri Sep 19 07:29:58 2003 From: Nicolas.Chauvat at logilab.fr (Nicolas Chauvat) Date: Fri Sep 19 07:30:03 2003 Subject: [EuroPython] Starting to plan In-Reply-To: <3F6AE881.5080106@iki.fi> References: <3F6AE881.5080106@iki.fi> Message-ID: <20030919112958.GB8660@logilab.fr> On Fri, Sep 19, 2003 at 02:29:05PM +0300, Heimo Laukkanen wrote: > But all and all I do agree with Paul. Showing more companies sends right > message to the participants, even subconscious - about thriving > community and businesses. This is important for the newcomers who will > go back to their organisations and social circles and tell how much they > saw. Nod. Showing python companies is good PR for Python. -- Nicolas Chauvat http://www.logilab.com - "Mais o? est donc Ornicar ?" - LOGILAB, Paris (France) From dario at ita.chalmers.se Fri Sep 19 08:01:19 2003 From: dario at ita.chalmers.se (=?iso-8859-1?Q?Dario_Lopez-K=E4sten?=) Date: Fri Sep 19 08:01:37 2003 Subject: [EuroPython] New EPC website. References: <20030826103313.GA26574@vet.uu.nl><20030826115504.GC6768@carolo.net> <019601c36bc9$eec062d0$4bdf1081@WALTER> Message-ID: <001101c37ea5$bcbe7d50$e0f61081@WALTER> I have allready started work on the new website and feedback from other people has been overwhelmingly non-existant. I haven't done any signifcat work since July or so, and I am waiting for feedback. So far I have started implementing a few things and have written some plans for it. I will continue doing stuff and I will simply assume that lack of feedback equals acceptance of the work being done :-) You will find the site at: http://europython-develop.zope.nl/epc/ Regarding the issue of retaingin or rebuilding the site, I think it has to be rebuilt anyway and will continue to work on it (as it also fits in well with development I am doing for another UG), but perhaps it is not necessary to have it finished and replace the existing site for EPC 2004. Cheers, /dario - -------------------------------------------------------------------- Dario Lopez-K?sten, IT Systems & Services Chalmers University of Tech. From lac at strakt.com Fri Sep 19 11:09:44 2003 From: lac at strakt.com (Laura Creighton) Date: Fri Sep 19 11:09:52 2003 Subject: [EuroPython] Starting to plan In-Reply-To: Message from Michael Hudson of "Thu, 18 Sep 2003 18:53:30 BST." <2mad927zl1.fsf@starship.python.net> References: <200309181538.h8IFcfbZ029939@theraft.strakt.com> <2mad927zl1.fsf@starship.python.net> Message-ID: <200309191509.h8JF9iq3004105@ratthing-b246.strakt.com> In a message of Thu, 18 Sep 2003 18:53:30 BST, Michael Hudson writes: >I'm not sure I can or should volunteer for any of the specific jobs >you mention, but I'll promise to keep on kicking people up the arse >when I think the process is slipping :-) > >Cheers, >mwh great. you have hereby volunteered for the position 'EuroPython nag'. feel feel to recruit demi-nags if you think that they are needed. cheer cheer cheer. Laura From lac at strakt.com Fri Sep 19 17:31:56 2003 From: lac at strakt.com (Laura Creighton) Date: Fri Sep 19 17:32:00 2003 Subject: [EuroPython] Aahz wants Trevor to build a 'paper submission Zope thing' Message-ID: <200309192131.h8JLVuq3006327@ratthing-b246.strakt.com> for Pycon. I said, make it general enough that we can use it too, and we have different categories (track chairman, people in your track who are all reading each others stuff as part of improving). I'm not up for deciding what we want in this. Laura ------- Forwarded Message Return-Path: pydotorg-redesign-bounces@python.org From: Aahz To: pydotorg-redesign@python.org NOTE: see NOTE below Now that we've signed a contract for the PyCon DC 2004 facilities, we need to start gearing up for other parts of a successful conference. Specificially, we need a way to manage proposals from potential speakers. Since we've been talking about ways of adding a CMS to python.org, I figured that requesting the Zope folks to do a small-scale trial would be a Good Idea. We'd like to have this system up by October 15, because we want to have a proposal deadline of December 1. (Trevor, could you please repost your pycon-organizers response here?) NOTE: At this point, I'm overall more interested in hearing from people who think they might be able to do this work than I am in critiques of the design. Here's a draft design document: There are three kinds of users: organizers, reviewers, and submitters. All organizers are reviewers; all reviewers can submit. Each submitter can make multiple submissions. Each submission can have any number of reviews. Reviewers may not review their own submissions. Submitters can see other proposals. Submitters may see only reviews for their own submissions; reviewers can see all reviews. The system maintains a transaction log of modifications; each group can see the appropriate history of modifications. (E.g., a submitter can update zir proposal; reviewers can see the history, but not other submitters.) The system can create the following reports: * Submissions with two or fewer reviews * Reviews organized by reviewer * Submissions with blank Status Submitter fields: Date submitted Date last modified Title Type (editable field with drop-down list defaults) Summary (150 char max) Requested timespan (30 or 60 minutes) Proposal, 500-2000 words (50k byte limit) -- should be text, reST, or HTML Reviewer fields: Date first reviewed Date review last modified Proposal review Proposal quality (0-10) Estimated interest level (0-10) Proposal vote (either yes/no or Apache style) may edit Type drop-down list Organizer fields: Status (blank/Accepted/Rejected) Date accepted/rejected Final timespan - -- Aahz (aahz@pythoncraft.com) <*> http://www.pythoncraft.com/ "It is easier to optimize correct code than to correct optimized code." - --Bill Harlan _______________________________________________ Pydotorg-redesign mailing list Pydotorg-redesign@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/pydotorg-redesign ------- End of Forwarded Message From Nicolas.Chauvat at logilab.fr Sat Sep 20 02:33:14 2003 From: Nicolas.Chauvat at logilab.fr (Nicolas Chauvat) Date: Sat Sep 20 02:33:19 2003 Subject: [EuroPython] Re: Aahz wants Trevor to build a 'paper submission Zope thing' In-Reply-To: <200309192131.h8JLVuq3006327@ratthing-b246.strakt.com> References: <200309192131.h8JLVuq3006327@ratthing-b246.strakt.com> Message-ID: <20030920063313.GD5645@logilab.fr> On Fri, Sep 19, 2003 at 11:31:56PM +0200, Laura Creighton wrote: > > I said, make it general enough that we can use it too, and we > have different categories (track chairman, people in your track who > are all reading each others stuff as part of improving). I'm not up > for deciding what we want in this. > Trevor wrote: > > NOTE: At this point, I'm overall more interested in hearing from people > who think they might be able to do this work than I am in critiques of > the design. > > ... Please use: 1. Plone + Archetypes (see http://plone.org/documentation/archetypes) OR remove Archetypes dependency on Plone and use CMF+Archetypes 2. CMF workflow Will take a day or two for the technical part. Probably several more days for fancy graphical design if the out-of-the-box one does not fit. Here is a sample archetypes schema, which is the *only* thing you have to write to get your content types in shape: ----------------8<----------------------------- from Products.ArchExample.config import ARTICLE_GROUPS # do the other imports schema = BaseSchema + Schema(( StringField('group', vocabulary=ARTICLE_GROUPS, widget=SelectionWidget(), ), StringField('blurb', searchable=1, widget=TextAreaWidget, ), TextField('body', searchable=1, required=1, allowable_content_types=('text/plain', 'text/structured', 'text/html',), widget=RichWidget, ), )) class Article(BaseContent): schema = schema registerType(Article) ----------------8<----------------------------- (see http://cvs.sourceforge.net/cgi-bin/viewcvs.cgi/archetypes/ArchExample) This is what I have been meaning to do for EP04's website, but I lack time... Hope this helps. -- Nicolas Chauvat http://www.logilab.com - "Mais o? est donc Ornicar ?" - LOGILAB, Paris (France) From andy at reportlab.com Sat Sep 20 02:58:09 2003 From: andy at reportlab.com (Andy Robinson) Date: Sat Sep 20 02:58:35 2003 Subject: [EuroPython] ReportLab Conference Kit - coming if you want it. Message-ID: I just saw Laura's post and thought I'd better say something quick. This is really a 'pre-announcement' about 6 weeks too early, but I don't people to do extra work unless they want to. ReportLab is building a "Conference Kit" which will be done by end November, and will be used to generate all documentation, timetables and maybe even badges for the XML Conference in Philly, Dec 7-12 2003. Click here and see who the major sponsor is :-) www.xmlconference.org This will be a hosted, supported service. It's designed to be "multi event" from the ground up. We're doing it becuse it's the best way to show the industry at large what we can do with PDF generation in a very dramatic way. We will be delighted to offer it for free to Python conferences, with the benefits of a permanent support team standing behind it. (We also fully understand events which want to build their own system, I'd just hate someone to do their own because they didn't know about this). In particular it can do a lot of what PyCon needs if desired. It could be used on two levels: (a) for events like EuroPython and OSCON, which have an online track management system for track submission system, it will be used to generate programs and brochures. They can pump across records into our database and keep their existing excellent system for track and timetable management. Ditto if PyCon goes that way. (b) if you want an out-of-the box system to run a conference then it will handle speaker/talk/paper submission out of the box. We are also working on tie-ups with a very large network of printing firms, so those events wanted proper printing can get it all sorted out with a few clicks. If we are able to blag some help for the Python events as a result of this, we will do so. However, it is not appropriate to discuss this with the relevant parties until early December when our system should be up and visible. At the systems end it is very simple: (1) a hosted MySQL database for each event, allowing remote access with any tools you want for those savvy enough to work on the data. (This will have referential integrity). (2) web interface built with Python and Preppy allowing administration, track-management, timetable and document requests. This will be hosted by us, but 'skinnable' so you can add your own page template for each conference of frameset it in. No Zope/Twisted/high-tech stuff, sorry. I'll handle liaison with EuroPython, and I think changes for next year should have minimal impact. For PyCon, it's basically up to the organisers whether and how much to use it, but it's going to be there if you want from early December, and Steve Holden has checkin rights :-) Best Regards, Andy Robinson CEO/Chief Architect, ReportLab Europe Ltd. office: +44-20-8540-9926 mobile: +44-7976-355742 From aahz at pythoncraft.com Sat Sep 20 13:41:37 2003 From: aahz at pythoncraft.com (Aahz) Date: Sat Sep 20 13:41:41 2003 Subject: [EuroPython] Re: Aahz wants Trevor to build a 'paper submission Zope thing' In-Reply-To: <20030920063313.GD5645@logilab.fr> References: <200309192131.h8JLVuq3006327@ratthing-b246.strakt.com> <20030920063313.GD5645@logilab.fr> Message-ID: <20030920174137.GB26477@panix.com> On Sat, Sep 20, 2003, Nicolas Chauvat wrote: > > Please use: > > 1. Plone + Archetypes (see http://plone.org/documentation/archetypes) > > OR remove Archetypes dependency on Plone and use CMF+Archetypes > > 2. CMF workflow > > Will take a day or two for the technical part. That sounds good to me. -- Aahz (aahz@pythoncraft.com) <*> http://www.pythoncraft.com/ "It is easier to optimize correct code than to correct optimized code." --Bill Harlan From aahz at pythoncraft.com Sat Sep 20 13:48:37 2003 From: aahz at pythoncraft.com (Aahz) Date: Sat Sep 20 13:48:40 2003 Subject: [EuroPython] Re: ReportLab Conference Kit - coming if you want it. In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20030920174837.GC26477@panix.com> On Sat, Sep 20, 2003, Andy Robinson wrote: > > ReportLab is building a "Conference Kit" which will be done by end > November, and will be used to generate all documentation, timetables > and maybe even badges for the XML Conference in Philly, Dec 7-12 2003. Unless this is based on Zope (or some other web development system that includes a full-blown CMS), it doesn't meet my goal for putting out this proposal. What we need for PyCon is actually pretty small, and while bells and whistles would be handy, my primary concern is the long-term maintenance of www.python.org. There have been suggestions that python.org could use a CMS to solicit contributions from the community. However, none of the current webmasters uses Zope, and I think a small-scale Real World [tm] trial is the way to move things forward. Also, I really want something available by mid-October. If your system is that powerful and it's easy to import data, we may well switch in January for the process of actually scheduling presentations and so forth. -- Aahz (aahz@pythoncraft.com) <*> http://www.pythoncraft.com/ "It is easier to optimize correct code than to correct optimized code." --Bill Harlan From DavidA at ActiveState.com Sat Sep 20 18:54:02 2003 From: DavidA at ActiveState.com (David Ascher) Date: Sat Sep 20 19:04:28 2003 Subject: [EuroPython] Re: [Pycon-organizers] Re: ReportLab Conference Kit - coming if you want it. In-Reply-To: <20030920174837.GC26477@panix.com> References: <20030920174837.GC26477@panix.com> Message-ID: <3F6CDA8A.4050601@ActiveState.com> Aahz wrote: >On Sat, Sep 20, 2003, Andy Robinson wrote: > > >>ReportLab is building a "Conference Kit" which will be done by end >>November, and will be used to generate all documentation, timetables >>and maybe even badges for the XML Conference in Philly, Dec 7-12 2003. >> >> > >Unless this is based on Zope (or some other web development system that >includes a full-blown CMS), it doesn't meet my goal for putting out this >proposal. What we need for PyCon is actually pretty small, and while >bells and whistles would be handy, my primary concern is the long-term >maintenance of www.python.org. > > What's the point behind blending the python.org maintenance requirements and those of a conference planning group? It strikes me as setting the bar high enough to make it more than likely that no solution will be especially good for either task. I'd much rather solve the conference related processes completely independently of the website maintenance. If things like mandating Zope or any particular solution become the way things are done around here, I'll have to bail. --david From dario at ita.chalmers.se Sat Sep 20 20:11:40 2003 From: dario at ita.chalmers.se (=?iso-8859-1?Q?Dario_Lopez-K=E4sten?=) Date: Sat Sep 20 20:12:03 2003 Subject: [EuroPython] ReportLab Conference Kit - coming if you want it. References: Message-ID: <017c01c37fd4$ee666c70$e0f61081@WALTER> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Andy Robinson" > ReportLab is building a "Conference Kit" > which will be done by end November, and will > be used to generate all documentation, timetables > and maybe even badges for the XML Conference in > Philly, Dec 7-12 2003. Click here and see who > the major sponsor is :-) > www.xmlconference.org > cool, will it available for downloadning (the kit I mean :-)? /dario - -------------------------------------------------------------------- Dario Lopez-K?sten, IT Systems & Services Chalmers University of Tech. From sholden at holdenweb.com Sat Sep 20 21:03:51 2003 From: sholden at holdenweb.com (Steve Holden) Date: Sat Sep 20 21:07:07 2003 Subject: [EuroPython] ReportLab Conference Kit - coming if you want it. In-Reply-To: <017c01c37fd4$ee666c70$e0f61081@WALTER> Message-ID: The conference kit isn't going to be open source, but the intention is (I believe) that "worthy" conferences such as PyCon and EuroPython will be able to avail themselves of it for nothing. Right, Andy? regards -- Steve Holden http://www.holdenweb.com/ Python Web Programming http://pydish.holdenweb.com/pwp/ Interview with GvR August 14, 2003 http://www.onlamp.com/python/ > -----Original Message----- > From: Dario Lopez-K?sten [mailto:dario@ita.chalmers.se] > Sent: Saturday, September 20, 2003 8:12 PM > To: Andy Robinson; europython@python.org; aahz@pythoncraft.com; > sholden@holdenweb.com; pycon-organizers@python.org > Subject: Re: [EuroPython] ReportLab Conference Kit - coming > if you want > it. > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Andy Robinson" > > > ReportLab is building a "Conference Kit" > > which will be done by end November, and will > > be used to generate all documentation, timetables > > and maybe even badges for the XML Conference in > > Philly, Dec 7-12 2003. Click here and see who > > the major sponsor is :-) > > www.xmlconference.org > > > > cool, will it available for downloadning (the kit I mean :-)? > > /dario > > - -------------------------------------------------------------------- > Dario Lopez-K?sten, IT Systems & Services Chalmers University of Tech. > > > From paul at zope-europe.org Sun Sep 21 02:08:40 2003 From: paul at zope-europe.org (Paul Everitt) Date: Sun Sep 21 04:15:42 2003 Subject: [EuroPython] Starting to plan In-Reply-To: <20030919112958.GB8660@logilab.fr> Message-ID: <0C13D62C-EBFA-11D7-B8F7-003065C7DEAE@zope-europe.org> On Friday, Sep 19, 2003, at 13:29 Europe/Paris, Nicolas Chauvat wrote: > On Fri, Sep 19, 2003 at 02:29:05PM +0300, Heimo Laukkanen wrote: > >> But all and all I do agree with Paul. Showing more companies sends >> right >> message to the participants, even subconscious - about thriving >> community and businesses. This is important for the newcomers who will >> go back to their organisations and social circles and tell how much >> they >> saw. > > Nod. Showing python companies is good PR for Python. Clarification: I didn't intend that companies sit in their booths the entire time. Perhaps just between breaks, during lunch, and at the end of the day. --Paul From johanc at easypublisher.com Sun Sep 21 10:55:02 2003 From: johanc at easypublisher.com (Johan Carlsson) Date: Sun Sep 21 10:54:34 2003 Subject: [EuroPython] EU votes for software patent the 26 of September Message-ID: <3F6DBBC6.3070602@easypublisher.com> (sorry for the cross posting) The European Union votes for software patents on the 26 of September (the voting has been delayed). I hope that everybody that shares my view that software patents are a threat for small software companies and the Open Source movement contact their representatives in The European Parliament to convice them to vode agains this proposed patent law. If you haven't yet thought about this issue I suggest the following links: http://k.lenz.name/LB/archives/000288.html http://swpat.ffii.org/events/2003/europarl/05/ -- Johan Carlsson Tel: + 46 8 31 24 94 Colliberty Mob: + 46 70 558 25 24 Torsgatan 72 Email: johanc@easypublisher.com SE-113 37 STOCKHOLM From andy at reportlab.com Sun Sep 21 19:18:57 2003 From: andy at reportlab.com (Andy Robinson) Date: Sun Sep 21 19:19:20 2003 Subject: [EuroPython] Starting to plan In-Reply-To: <3F6AE881.5080106@iki.fi> Message-ID: > > IMO, we need to show companies, even if it means charging them > > *nothing* (other than registration) for the privilege. At least, > > nothing for small (under 15) companies. Free resources are never used sensibly and I suspect over half the people there will turn out to be in 'very small companies' and you'll need a lot of tables. May I suggest a different kind of 'sponsorship package' which I think is appropriate to our community. Let's recognize that the small firms there probably have 1-3 people and they want to be in the talks too, and don't have much money. Nevertheless some people find it easier to come if there is some 'business case' and they know they can somehow show what they are doing. 1. Companies pay a small fee for a stand (e.g. Eur 100). They are expected to man it at certain times when people can walk around - let's say 17:00-19:00 each evening. 2. They also get a "product presentation" lightning talk slot where they can do a very short (5 min) "pitch". 3. They get minor branding on the site and a page on what they do in the program (they contribute this online, all automated, so we have a directory of exhibitors). 4. Some of their money is used to buy drinks in the same time slot, to encourage people to walk around and listen...(sigh, I suspect Chimay may not be available...) 5. Open Source projects who want the same deal get it for free, or for something very small (20 Euros?) if there are costs in providing the tables. I think this way you might have a package which attracted quite a lot of small firms. The key thing is, those of us taking part in this are not limited from attending or even organizing the conference because it fits into a welld efined time slot. Also, I think a number of talks could be moved into the commercial space, meaning that you convert "someone getting in free to give a talk about their product" into "someone paying their fare to attend, and paying a little more to support the event". Just my 2p worth, Andy Robinson From pb829hkq at bigfoot.com Mon Sep 22 17:39:12 2003 From: pb829hkq at bigfoot.com (Rosanna Mcnair) Date: Sun Sep 21 22:39:54 2003 Subject: [EuroPython] High Potenbt female attractant gqky lyjjpfqam Message-ID: <2npr5ajs1f$-a$u6@w75.ed6itu7.ci> An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mail.python.org/pipermail/europython/attachments/20030922/03b4b231/attachment.html From mwh at python.net Mon Sep 22 07:17:49 2003 From: mwh at python.net (Michael Hudson) Date: Mon Sep 22 07:17:14 2003 Subject: [EuroPython] New EPC website. In-Reply-To: <001101c37ea5$bcbe7d50$e0f61081@WALTER> ( =?iso-8859-1?q?Dario_Lopez-K=E4sten's_message_of?= "Fri, 19 Sep 2003 14:01:19 +0200") References: <20030826103313.GA26574@vet.uu.nl> <20030826115504.GC6768@carolo.net> <019601c36bc9$eec062d0$4bdf1081@WALTER> <001101c37ea5$bcbe7d50$e0f61081@WALTER> Message-ID: <2mwuc15axu.fsf@starship.python.net> Dario Lopez-K?sten writes: > I have allready started work on the new website and feedback from other > people has been overwhelmingly non-existant. Well, I, for one, had forgotten the URL :-) > I haven't done any signifcat work since July or so, and I am waiting for > feedback. What kind of feedback? I find it a little weird that there's a "You are not logged in Log in Join" thing on the front page. I can see how we might to create website account for people during registration/paper submission, but it looks a bit odd up front. http://europython-develop.zope.nl/sessions/descriptions gives an error. To the uninitiated (me) it looks like YA plone site. What stuff should I be looking at and giving feedback on? Cheers, mwh -- Usenet is like a herd of performing elephants with diarrhea -- massive, difficult to redirect, awe-inspiring, entertaining, and a source of mind-boggling amounts of excrement when you least expect it. -- spaf (1992) From dario at ita.chalmers.se Mon Sep 22 08:12:42 2003 From: dario at ita.chalmers.se (=?iso-8859-1?Q?Dario_Lopez-K=E4sten?=) Date: Mon Sep 22 08:13:03 2003 Subject: [EuroPython] New EPC website. References: <20030826103313.GA26574@vet.uu.nl><20030826115504.GC6768@carolo.net><019601c36bc9$eec062d0$4bdf1081@WALTER><001101c37ea5$bcbe7d50$e0f61081@WALTER> <2mwuc15axu.fsf@starship.python.net> Message-ID: <009101c38102$d2d2bd90$4bdf1081@WALTER> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Michael Hudson" >Dario Lopez-K?sten writes: > > I have allready started work on the new website and feedback from other > people has been overwhelmingly non-existant. > >Well, I, for one, had forgotten the URL :-) ah, that happens to all of us :-). I mysefl have had to go trhu old emails to remember it :-) >> I haven't done any signifcat work since July or so, and I am waiting for >> feedback. > >What kind of feedback? Mostly if the ideas in http://europython-develop.zope.nl/epc/todo are more or less sound. As you pointed out it is, at the moment at least, YAPS (Yet Another Plone Site). I have no access from the /epc directory to go one level up, so I have not been able to incorporate stuff from the old site nor can I see what corrections need to be made. I only played with some short time and then RL took over for some time. THere is some need to do some development on products as has been stated in some of the emails, so I guess that is the next step. I fore see that this will aslo be the hardest part, since it is always easy to publish stuff that allready exsit than to make admin interfaces for the new contenttypes that are needed. Regarding the YAPS look & feel, but I don't feel like doing anything significant in that area until funtionality is a bit more in place. Others are of course free to chip in :-) Cheers, /dario