[Inpycon] Everybody Pays Policy

atul jha koolhead17 at gmail.com
Thu Sep 26 13:53:43 CEST 2013


Anand,


On Thu, Sep 26, 2013 at 5:19 PM, Anand B Pillai <anandpillai at letterboxes.org
> wrote:

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> On Thursday 26 September 2013 04:39 PM, atul jha wrote:
> > Sankarshan,
> >
> >
> > On Thu, Sep 26, 2013 at 4:32 PM, sankarshan
> > <foss.mailinglists at gmail.com>wrote:
> >
> >> On Thu, Sep 26, 2013 at 4:23 PM, atul jha <koolhead17 at gmail.com>
> >> wrote:
> >>
> >>> On Thu, Sep 26, 2013 at 3:53 PM, Noufal Ibrahim
> >>> <noufal at nibrahim.net.in> wrote:
> >>
> >>>> Because democracy, as has been repeatedly proved, is not the
> >>>> best way to make imporant functional decisions. We "argue"
> >>>> constructively and then come to a (semi) consensus. It isn't
> >>>> pollution, it's the purpose of the list.
> >>>>
> >>> </snip> Hmm. So you suggesting closed door discussion and then
> >>> throwing it out
> >> loud
> >>> & claiming it community wants it?
> >>
> >> No. I don't think he did mention that. And, your statement is an
> >> interpretation of what he wrote. I would like to default to
> >> believe that the event organization which constitutes members
> >> from PSSI (and, some how are members of PSF) have the best
> >> interests of the Python community in India in their hearts. I
> >> sense this thread calling that into question. I do not believe
> >> that is healthy.
> >>
> >> To be able to make changes one needs to participate. Atul,
> >> perhaps you need to explore how you can participate in the PyCon
> >> India process for the 2014 edition and, thereafter drive the
> >> changes you like to see.
> >>
> >> PSSI has a fiduciary duty to the Python community in India. I do
> >> not seem them shirking that role.
> >>
> >>> <snip>
> >>>>
> >>>> I don't want the opinion of someone who doesn't care about
> >>>> the conference to influence how we run it. Do you?
> >>>>
> >>> </snip> How welcoming are you for advise from someone who wants
> >>> to help?
> >>
> >> Creating a poll is one step to helping. The next step is to be
> >> able to devise means of assessing the outcome of the poll and,
> >> also being able to have ownership of the changes. Ownership and
> >> execution requires participation. I think Noufal has earlier
> >> alluded to the requirement of individuals stepping up to
> >> participate and contribute and not just stay at the first step.
> >>
> >>> As Kiran mentioned, its good idea we should conduct a poll &
> >>> have
> >> everyones
> >>> voice heard, instead of sitting inside a close door and
> >>> deciding what and how for all.
> >>>
> >>> If i/others was/were not part of past event are you doing
> >>> enough to let
> >> us
> >>> in so we can be there for next event?
> >>
> >> I think this is a dangerous assumption to make. I do not see
> >> Noufal or, the PSSI gating/preventing anyone to stand up and be
> >> counted. If you have specific instances where you feel that your
> >> contributions have been actively prevented by the organization
> >> or, individuals, I would suggest seeking redress within the PSSI.
> >> That would require to be addressed.
> >>
> >>
> >> Every single reply of Naufel was as if i have done something
> >> really bad by
> > letting my voice in here.
> >
>
> This kind of arguments are not productive. Let us stick to your
> original point and not digress.
>
> Noufal or me or anyone for that matter is not running the conference
> as a personal show or something. It is a community conference driven
> by a number of people, almost all equal. However as you know democracy
> is not flat but it is tiered. You do need people at different levels
> and hierarchies to drive things forward. Otherwise things just wouldn't
> work and democracy would becomes a very noisy and unproductive
> anarchy.
>
> To further qualify my point, you wouldn't even want to consider
> this a democracy in the first place. A few people who took the time
> and effort to do things early on naturally are perceived as leaders
> of the community. They aren't democratically elected - but are
> in this position by meritocracy. So I don't fully buy the democracy
> argument. Meritocracy is never given on a platter - it is achieved
> by virtue of hard work - Give respect to it.
>
> The other pragmatic aspect is to run something like this in the
> way that everyone is happy - would need a lot of dedication in terms
> of time, space and human resources. Quite often decisions are made to
> take the shortest path forward - not because we are autocrats but
> because of lack of time or people to get things done in the most
> pleasing way for all - it just never happens.
>
> > All his mails have been totally unwelcoming, which is the reason
> > for outburst. If you are calling yourself an organizer or what not
> > for community you need to have guts to hear everyone & not
> > stereotyping.
> >
>
>
> No personal attacks please and no naming/shaming business. If you
> can step up and contribute to running of the conference, perhaps
> we would be more than willing to give a lot of time and mind space
> to understand your views - the point of meritocracy in the first place.
>
> So please do that and don't resort to unproductive paths such
> as personal criticisms. Your ideas and suggestions are welcome,
> your mud slinging ain't.
>
>
> I had no intention in throwing muds on one another. If this team has
sensible bunch of guys open to listen to everyone then better they should
 act like that.


> - --
> Regards,
>
> - --Anand
>
> -
>
> --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Software Architect/Consultant
> anandpillai at letterboxes.org
>
> Please note my updated email address <anandpillai at letterboxes.org>.
> Kindly update your address books.
>
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-- 
Atul

www.atuljha.com

irc(freenode) : koolhead17
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