[Mailman-Developers] Accessible DOM manipulations

Brad Knowles brad at stop.mail-abuse.org
Fri Jul 7 05:25:52 CEST 2006


Barry wrote:

> I'm sure a lot of that comes from me, inspired by early experience
> and my own general paranoid dinosaurism.  OTOH, I remember Guido
> telling me a few years ago that I might as well give up on that one,
> and so I have -- mostly.  That's why I love NoScript so much :).

No, you're not the only one.  I flat-out refuse to use most sites that
require JavaScript, and run with JavaScript, Java, popups, and most
extensions turned off by default (especially Flash).  With Safari, I use
PithHelmet to control what few sites I encounter that I will allow to use
JavaScript, Java, plug-ins, etc... and when I'm running Firefox I use
NoScript plus a number of other similar tools to do the same.

Unfortunately, most of the sites which try to force me to use JavaScript
do such a horrible job that they're pretty much completely unusable on
MacOS X regardless of whether I use Safari or Firefox (or Opera, or
anything else), and whether or not I allow JavaScript or not.


I've been burned badly and repeatedly.  And new sites are always popping
up all over the place that continue to introduce me to new ways to screw
up my browser and my machine, primarily through JavaScript, Flash, and all
that other crap that I always leave turned off.

You'll drag me into a pure JavaScript/AJAX world over my dead body -- and
maybe a few million dead web site authors, if I can ever get my hands on
the football.

> I'm no web developer expert by a long shot, but I've been following
> the discussions and istm that Ethan is striking a reasonable balance
> and is being extremely diligent in his research.  I for one am quite
> eager to see what he comes up with!

I'm skeptical, but I am curious to see the result.  I hope I'm being
open-minded enough that I'm giving him a fair chance to convince me that
these kinds of things are not Inherently Evil.

-- 
Brad Knowles, <brad at stop.mail-abuse.org>

"Those who would give up essential Liberty, to purchase a little
temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety."

     -- Benjamin Franklin (1706-1790), reply of the Pennsylvania
     Assembly to the Governor, November 11, 1755

  LOPSA member since December 2005.  See <http://www.lopsa.org/>.


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