[Mailman-Developers] 2.1.8 documentation mismatch

[Ian Eiloart]

--On 7 June 2006 09:20:46 -0400 Barry Warsaw <barry at python.org> wrote:

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> On Tue, 6 Jun 2006 22:02:44 -0700
> Mark Sapiro <msapiro at value.net> wrote:

>
> Ian mentioned that he thinks we should change "Reject" to "Bounce", but
> I'm not sure I like that.  Rejecting a message or a subscription
> request is the action that the admin takes.

OK, i'm talking about messages here, not subscription requests. As I 
understand the terms, a "reject" is an SMTP response to a remote server (or 
MTA) trying to send email. It means "I'm not accepting this email, you 
choose what to do with it". The sending MTA may choose to generate a DSN, 
and a DSN that reports a hard (5xx) rejection is often referred to as a 
bounce message.

With Mailman, rejection isn't possible. We've already accepted the message 
and queued it. When a Mailman list rule, or an administrator decides to 
"reject" a message, in fact they're choosing to send a DSN bounce message.

There's a REALLY REALLY REALLY important difference in the case of spam. 
Most spambots will ignore a reject and NOT generate a DSN bounce message. 
However, if you choose to bounce the message, then a DNS will be sent to an 
innocent third party. That's collateral spam, and it's a nightmare.

Unfortunately, RFC2821 says that you must generate such collateral spam, 
and that's why I want my MTA to be able to read Mailman's config - so that 
it can reject email properly at SMTP time.

> Mailman's response to
> that rejection is return the original message wrapped in a response.
> The term "bounce" to me implies a more automatic return that happens at
> a lower level in the mail stack, and it might be confused with
> terminology in the bounce processing u/i.

> So I think the following terms should be used consistently (I'm not
> suggesting a mass rewrite to adhere to this):
>
> Approve
> Hold
> Reject
> Discard
>
> - -Barry
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-- 
Ian Eiloart
IT Services, University of Sussex