From barry at wooz.org Wed Nov 1 04:41:30 2000 From: barry at wooz.org (Barry A. Warsaw) Date: Tue, 31 Oct 2000 22:41:30 -0500 (EST) Subject: [Mailman-Users] Get listed. :) Message-ID: <14847.37098.537126.455758@anthem.concentric.net> I'm putting together the on-line documentation for the 2.0 release and I'd like to include a list of sites that run Mailman. I've got Python.Org and lists.apple.com (if that's cool with you Chuq ;). Please send any others you'd like to include to me directly. Thanks, -Barry From johnny at cathat.net Wed Nov 1 05:02:20 2000 From: johnny at cathat.net (Johnny Fuerst) Date: Tue, 31 Oct 2000 22:02:20 -0600 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Get listed. :) In-Reply-To: <14847.37098.537126.455758@anthem.concentric.net>; from barry@wooz.org on Tue, Oct 31, 2000 at 10:41:30PM -0500 References: <14847.37098.537126.455758@anthem.concentric.net> Message-ID: <20001031220220.A1038@cathat.net> Hey Barry, Can I list my site, if right now, I am only running 1.1? Sincerely, Johnny On Tue, Oct 31, 2000 at 10:41:30PM -0500, Barry A. Warsaw wrote: > > I'm putting together the on-line documentation for the 2.0 release and > I'd like to include a list of sites that run Mailman. I've got > Python.Org and lists.apple.com (if that's cool with you Chuq ;). > Please send any others you'd like to include to me directly. > > Thanks, > -Barry > > ------------------------------------------------------ > Mailman-Users maillist - Mailman-Users at python.org > http://www.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users -- On Behalf Of: Johnny Fuerst, Governor ................ governor at cathat.net Opinions stated in this message are mine and mine alone, and do not necessarily represent those of my ISP/employer! .period. ------------------------------------------------------------ 'I Desire Compassion, and not a Sacrifice.' 'La Vida E Bella' ____________________________ Random Quote: If you eat a live frog in the morning, nothing worse will happen to either of you for the rest of the day. johnny at cathat.net From kavandi at alias.net.au Wed Nov 1 05:09:17 2000 From: kavandi at alias.net.au (Kevin Thompson) Date: Wed, 1 Nov 2000 12:09:17 +0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] export a list to text Message-ID: Hi, I have a paranoid client who wants his list as text file, even tho I am tarballing/ftp to remote location. Can I export from Mailman, I cannot find this function. Thanks in Advance Kevin From chuqui at plaidworks.com Wed Nov 1 05:21:14 2000 From: chuqui at plaidworks.com (Chuq Von Rospach) Date: Tue, 31 Oct 2000 20:21:14 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Re: [Mailman-Developers] Get listed. :) In-Reply-To: <14847.37098.537126.455758@anthem.concentric.net> References: <14847.37098.537126.455758@anthem.concentric.net> Message-ID: At 10:41 PM -0500 10/31/00, Barry A. Warsaw wrote: >I've got >Python.Org and lists.apple.com (if that's cool with you Chuq ;). >Please send any others you'd like to include to me directly. It's cool with Apple. Also, fi you would, www.hockeyfanz.com, the Other Me. -- Chuq Von Rospach - Plaidworks Consulting (mailto:chuqui at plaidworks.com) Apple Mail List Gnome (mailto:chuq at apple.com) Be just, and fear not. From mrlist at ActiveState.com Wed Nov 1 06:10:54 2000 From: mrlist at ActiveState.com (Eric Wang) Date: Tue, 31 Oct 2000 21:10:54 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] hi, please help, weird upgrade problem to rc1! Message-ID: <20001031210504.03B9.MRLIST@activestate.com> Hi guys, I am trying to upgrade my 2.0beta2 to current rc1, But the strange thing is, after upgrade, the mailman won't reply the welcome message for the confirmation of subscription mail any more. And the subscriber is on pending always. But if I change it back to beta2, everything works fine. Any clue? Thanks! Eric From bob at nleaudio.com Wed Nov 1 06:20:04 2000 From: bob at nleaudio.com (Bob Puff@NLE) Date: Wed, 01 Nov 2000 00:20:04 -0500 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Mail based administration References: <200010301809020254.14CC0AFB@neverslow.com> Message-ID: <39FFA804.A01A5C5@nleaudio.com> Hello, I have been looking for the docs on how to administrate Mailman lists via email (as opposed to the web-based administration). Where can I find info on this? Bob From bob at nleaudio.com Wed Nov 1 06:22:46 2000 From: bob at nleaudio.com (Bob Puff@NLE) Date: Wed, 01 Nov 2000 00:22:46 -0500 Subject: [Mailman-Users] De-html Message-ID: <39FFA8A6.271221E@nleaudio.com> The recent thread of using de-mime is interesting, and I will be checking this out. What I am looking for though is a way to simply remove the HTML from the plain (text) digests... leaving the html in the normal posts and mime digests. Is there a way to do this? Perhaps with a 3rd-party program? If not, is it possible to strip ALL HTML from incoming posts to the list, including when a person's mailer sends both plain text _and_ HTML in the same message? Bob From chuqui at plaidworks.com Wed Nov 1 06:50:28 2000 From: chuqui at plaidworks.com (Chuq Von Rospach) Date: Tue, 31 Oct 2000 21:50:28 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] De-html In-Reply-To: <39FFA8A6.271221E@nleaudio.com> References: <39FFA8A6.271221E@nleaudio.com> Message-ID: At 12:22 AM -0500 11/1/00, Bob Puff at NLE wrote: >What I am looking for though is a way to simply remove the HTML from >the plain (text) digests... leaving the html in the normal posts and >mime digests. Is there a way to do this? Perhaps with a 3rd-party >program? No easy way to do that. It'd require internal hooks in the digester, and they don't exist that I've seen. >If not, is it possible to strip ALL HTML from incoming posts to the >list, including when a person's mailer sends both plain text _and_ >HTML in the same message? that's waht de-mime does. Strips all messages to just the text part, discarding the rest. -- Chuq Von Rospach - Plaidworks Consulting (mailto:chuqui at plaidworks.com) Apple Mail List Gnome (mailto:chuq at apple.com) Be just, and fear not. From chuqui at plaidworks.com Wed Nov 1 06:51:05 2000 From: chuqui at plaidworks.com (Chuq Von Rospach) Date: Tue, 31 Oct 2000 21:51:05 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Mail based administration In-Reply-To: <39FFA804.A01A5C5@nleaudio.com> References: <200010301809020254.14CC0AFB@neverslow.com> <39FFA804.A01A5C5@nleaudio.com> Message-ID: At 12:20 AM -0500 11/1/00, Bob Puff at NLE wrote: >I have been looking for the docs on how to administrate Mailman >lists via email (as opposed to the web-based administration). Where >can I find info on this? > If you're looking for something like what majordomo does, mailman doesn't. -- Chuq Von Rospach - Plaidworks Consulting (mailto:chuqui at plaidworks.com) Apple Mail List Gnome (mailto:chuq at apple.com) Be just, and fear not. From xiao.bing at oztime.com Wed Nov 1 09:10:37 2000 From: xiao.bing at oztime.com (Xiao Bing) Date: Wed, 1 Nov 2000 16:10:37 +0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] I Can't get any error msg!!! Message-ID: <00c301c043db$37641aa0$eb00a8c0@prc.oztime.com> I modify The subscription script for my request. like this(msg include some Chinese Charactors.Never mind) --------------------------------------------------------------------# This Python Program is wroten by Xiao.Bing # 2000.11 # oz_subscribe.py """Process subscription requests from oz_maillist form.""" import sys import os import string import cgi from Mailman import Utils from Mailman import MailList from Mailman import Errors from Mailman.htmlformat import * from Mailman import mm_cfg from Mailman.Logging.Syslog import syslog def main(): doc = Document() parts = Utils.GetPathPieces() if not parts: doc.AddItem(Header(2, "????")) doc.AddItem(Bold('????????CGI??????????!')) print doc.Format(bgcolor="#ffffff") return listname = string.lower(parts[0]) try: mlist = MailList.MailList(listname) mlist.IsListInitialized() except Errors.MMListError, e: doc.AddItem(Header(2, "????")) doc.AddItem(Bold('??????????????%s' % listname)) print doc.Format(bgcolor="#ffffff") syslog('error', 'No such list "%s": %s\n' % (listname, e)) return try: process_form(mlist, doc) finally: mlist.Save() mlist.Unlock() def process_form(mlist, doc): form = cgi.FieldStorage() error = 0 results = '' # Preliminaries done, actual processing of the form input below. if not form.has_key("email"): error = 1 results = results + "????????????????????Email????.
" # # define email so we don't get a NameError below # with if email == mlist.GetListEmail() -scott # email = "" else: email = form["email"].value remote = remote_addr() if email == mlist.GetListEmail(): error = 1 if remote: remote = "Web site " + remote else: remote = "unidentified origin" badremote = "\n\tfrom " + remote syslog("mischief", "Attempt to self subscribe %s:%s" % (email, badremote)) # results = results + "You must not subscribe a list to itself!
" results = results + "??????????????????!
" # ?????????????????? digest = mlist.digest_is_default if not mlist.digestable: digest = 0 elif not mlist.nondigestable: digest = 1 if not error: try: if mlist.FindUser(email): raise Errors.MMAlreadyAMember, email if digest: digesting = " digest" else: digesting = "" mlist.AddMember(email, "", digest, remote) # # check for all the errors that mlist.AddMember can throw # options on the web page for this cgi # except Errors.MMBadEmailError: results = results + ("????????????????????????????????" "??????????????.

") except Errors.MMListError: results = results + ("??????????????" "????????????????.

") except Errors.MMSubscribeNeedsConfirmation: results = results + ("????????????????????," "????????????????????" "%s. ??????: " "??????????????????,??????" "????????!

" % email) except Errors.MMNeedApproval, x: results = results + ("???????????? " "???? %s. ??????????????" "????????????????????." "????????????????

" % x) except Errors.MMHostileAddress: results = results + ("??????????????,????" "????????????????????????.

") except Errors.MMAlreadyAMember: results = results + "??????????????!

" # # these shouldn't happen, but if someone's futzing with the cgi # they might -scott # except Errors.MMCantDigestError: results = results + \ "No one can subscribe to the digest of this list!" except Errors.MMMustDigestError: results = results + \ "This list only supports digest subscriptions!" else: results = results + \ "??????!?????????????????? %s ????????.

" % \ (mlist.real_name) PrintResults(mlist, results, doc) def PrintResults(mlist, results, doc): replacements = mlist.GetStandardReplacements() replacements[''] = results output = mlist.ParseTags('oz_sub_success.html', replacements) doc.AddItem(output) print doc.Format(bgcolor="#ffffff") def remote_addr(): "Try to return the remote addr, or if unavailable, None." if os.environ.has_key('REMOTE_HOST'): return os.environ['REMOTE_HOST'] elif os.environ.has_key('REMOTE_ADDR'): return os.environ['REMOTE_ADDR'] else: return None -------------------------------------------------------------------------- I write a simple HTML code to invoke the script.

Please Input you email addr: 

--------------------------------------------------------------------------- oz_subscribe is a CGI program produced by a script(PY) file with same name. oztime_tech is a MailList name. But I get a error msg Bug in Mailman version 2.0rc1 We're sorry, we hit a bug! Please inform the webmaster for this site of this problem. Printing of traceback and other system information has been explicitly inhibited, but the webmaster can find this information in the Mailman error logs. So I go to see the error log.I found nothing.(Before did these.I simply cleared all content in the error log file) Why?Who can help me? -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mail.python.org/pipermail/mailman-users/attachments/20001101/118e66c7/attachment.html From jtpjatae at bi.ehu.es Wed Nov 1 10:10:26 2000 From: jtpjatae at bi.ehu.es (Eduardo Jacob) Date: Wed, 01 Nov 2000 10:10:26 +0100 Subject: [Mailman-Users] MIME attachments again. Message-ID: <4.3.2.7.2.20001101101012.00da48d0@158.227.65.40> At 17:21 31/10/00, you wrote: > > >foo:"| /usr/local/etc/demime.pl - |/home/mailman/mail/wrapper post foo" > > > > The problem is that with this, line, smrsh as shipped in RH > > 6.1,complains and doesn't let you execute this line. Do you have an > idea of > > how to fix it?, perhaps a shell script? > ># cd /etc/smrsh ; ln -s /usr/local/etc/demime.pl It was added. The problem is that smrsh doesn't like to see the second | in the line. More on this: if I modify smrsh for not checking for the "|" character it works. Eduardo From Nigel.Metheringham at VData.co.uk Wed Nov 1 11:18:37 2000 From: Nigel.Metheringham at VData.co.uk (Nigel Metheringham) Date: Wed, 01 Nov 2000 10:18:37 +0000 Subject: [Mailman-Users] De-html In-Reply-To: Message from Chuq Von Rospach of "Tue, 31 Oct 2000 21:50:28 PST." Message-ID: chuqui at plaidworks.com said: > that's waht de-mime does. Strips all messages to just the text part, > discarding the rest. I'm going to have a play with this and see if I can also save attachments and generate URLs for them... since I reasonably often send patches to lists I don't want to discard them entirely :-) Nigel. -- [ - Opinions expressed are personal and may not be shared by VData - ] [ Nigel Metheringham Nigel.Metheringham at VData.co.uk ] [ Phone: +44 1423 850000 Fax +44 1423 858866 ] From chuqui at plaidworks.com Wed Nov 1 16:14:32 2000 From: chuqui at plaidworks.com (Chuq Von Rospach) Date: Wed, 1 Nov 2000 07:14:32 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] MIME attachments again. In-Reply-To: <4.3.2.7.2.20001101101012.00da48d0@158.227.65.40> References: <4.3.2.7.2.20001101101012.00da48d0@158.227.65.40> Message-ID: At 10:10 AM +0100 11/1/00, Eduardo Jacob wrote: >It was added. The problem is that smrsh doesn't like to see the >second | in the line. More on this: if I modify smrsh for not >checking for the "|" character it works. or you can create a special shell script that hides what's going on inside... -- Chuq Von Rospach - Plaidworks Consulting (mailto:chuqui at plaidworks.com) Apple Mail List Gnome (mailto:chuq at apple.com) Be just, and fear not. From jsmoriss at jsm-mv.dyndns.org Wed Nov 1 18:55:33 2000 From: jsmoriss at jsm-mv.dyndns.org (Jean-Sebastien Morisset) Date: Wed, 1 Nov 2000 12:55:33 -0500 Subject: [Mailman-Users] dumpdb -- how to re-import? Message-ID: <20001101125532.A1899@marvin.homeip.net> I have to use dumpdb to change the archive_directory and private_archive_file_dir settings. The GUI just doesn't let you change these. Anyway, once I've made my changes, how do I import the file *back* into the config.db? Thanks, js. -- Jean-Sebastien Morisset, Sr. UNIX Admin Personal Homepage UNIX, Internet, Homebrewing, Cigars, PCS, CP2020 and other Fun Stuff... This is Linux Country. On a quiet night you can hear Windows NT reboot! From Dan.Mick at West.Sun.COM Wed Nov 1 20:23:08 2000 From: Dan.Mick at West.Sun.COM (Dan Mick) Date: Wed, 1 Nov 2000 11:23:08 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Mailman-Users] dumpdb -- how to re-import? Message-ID: <200011011921.LAA23138@utopia.west.sun.com> > I have to use dumpdb to change the archive_directory and > private_archive_file_dir settings. No, you really don't; dumpdb is a dumper only. config_list is an input/output tool, but doesn't include those settings directly. Sounds like you really want move_list: """Move a list to a new directory. What this really does is just update the three archive list attributes public_archive_file_dir, private_archive_file_dir, and archive_directory by recalculating them based on the new Defaults. It then saves the list. Usage: move_list [options] listname Options: --help -h Print this help message and exit. listname must be a valid mailing list name and is required. """ > The GUI just doesn't let you change > these. Anyway, once I've made my changes, how do I import the file *back* > into the config.db? > > Thanks, > js. > -- > Jean-Sebastien Morisset, Sr. UNIX Admin > Personal Homepage > UNIX, Internet, Homebrewing, Cigars, PCS, CP2020 and other Fun Stuff... > This is Linux Country. On a quiet night you can hear Windows NT reboot! > > ------------------------------------------------------ > Mailman-Users maillist - Mailman-Users at python.org > http://www.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users From fanninj at aottsd.uscourts.gov Wed Nov 1 21:34:52 2000 From: fanninj at aottsd.uscourts.gov (Jim Fannin) Date: Wed, 1 Nov 2000 14:34:52 -0600 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Help Managing Passwords Message-ID: <00cc01c04443$300f98c0$0d52849c@aottsd.ao.dcn> Our organization prefers that passwords not be included in welcome announcements or monthly reminders. Is it possible to remove the passwords from the messages (welcome and monthly reminder)? Thanks, Jim Fannin fanninj at aottsd.uscourts.gov From gietl at gietl.com Wed Nov 1 21:25:57 2000 From: gietl at gietl.com (Andreas Gietl) Date: Wed, 01 Nov 2000 21:25:57 +0100 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Help Managing Passwords References: <00cc01c04443$300f98c0$0d52849c@aottsd.ao.dcn> Message-ID: <3A007C55.FADAB8FE@gietl.com> look at the templats in $prefix/templates search for %{password}s which is the tag that will be replaced by the password! Jim Fannin wrote: > > Our organization prefers that passwords not be included in welcome > announcements or monthly reminders. Is it possible to remove the passwords > from the messages (welcome and monthly reminder)? > > Thanks, > Jim Fannin > fanninj at aottsd.uscourts.gov > > ------------------------------------------------------ > Mailman-Users maillist - Mailman-Users at python.org > http://www.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users -- andreas gietl gietl internet services fon +49 9402 2551 fax +49 9402 2604 mobile +49 171 60 70 008 gietl at gietl.com ############################################ # Das Handbuch sagt, das Programm ben?tige # # Windows 95 oder besser. Also habe ich # # Linux installiert! # ############################################ From mrlist at ActiveState.com Wed Nov 1 20:57:27 2000 From: mrlist at ActiveState.com (Eric Wang) Date: Wed, 01 Nov 2000 11:57:27 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Did rc1 do some naughty things? help~~~~ Message-ID: <20001101115126.3170.MRLIST@activestate.com> Hi, guys As I said before I have some problems to upgrade the mailman from beta2 to rc1, but after the upgarde, the mailman won't reply the welcome message for the confirmation of subscription mail any more. And the subscriber is on pending always. So I decide to move it back, but after make install back to beta2, I found the web administration interface doesn't work anymore. Did rc1 do some naughty thing? modified the data structure or what? This is really frustrating ! guys, please help, thanks! From gietl at gietl.com Wed Nov 1 21:54:36 2000 From: gietl at gietl.com (Andreas Gietl) Date: Wed, 01 Nov 2000 21:54:36 +0100 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Did rc1 do some naughty things? help~~~~ References: <20001101115126.3170.MRLIST@activestate.com> Message-ID: <3A00830C.E41A5103@gietl.com> you're not the only one. i got the same problems on a few linux-machines using exim-3.16. Which MTA do you use? Eric Wang wrote: > > Hi, guys > > As I said before I have some problems to upgrade the mailman from beta2 > to rc1, but after the upgarde, the mailman won't reply the welcome message > for the confirmation of subscription mail any more. And the subscriber > is on pending always. > > So I decide to move it back, but after make install back to beta2, I found > the web administration interface doesn't work anymore. Did rc1 do some > naughty thing? modified the data structure or what? > This is really frustrating ! > > guys, please help, thanks! > > ------------------------------------------------------ > Mailman-Users maillist - Mailman-Users at python.org > http://www.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users -- andreas gietl gietl internet services fon +49 9402 2551 fax +49 9402 2604 mobile +49 171 60 70 008 gietl at gietl.com ############################################ # Das Handbuch sagt, das Programm ben?tige # # Windows 95 oder besser. Also habe ich # # Linux installiert! # ############################################ From kole at metagency.com Wed Nov 1 22:04:28 2000 From: kole at metagency.com (Kole Dunn) Date: Wed, 1 Nov 2000 13:04:28 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Little problem with Mailman Message-ID: Hi, I created a list name and got the email, but when going to the links I get this message "We're sorry, we hit a bug!" Followed by this "Traceback" message. Can someone help? Running RH 6.2 Traceback (innermost last): File "/home/mailman/scripts/driver", line 85, in run_main logger = StampedLogger('error', File "/home/mailman/Mailman/Logging/StampedLogger.py", line 48, in __init__ Logger.__init__(self, category, nofail, immediate) File "/home/mailman/Mailman/Logging/Logger.py", line 40, in __init__ self.__get_f() File "/home/mailman/Mailman/Logging/Logger.py", line 63, in __get_f reraise() File "/home/mailman/Mailman/Logging/Logger.py", line 55, in __get_f f = self.__fp = open(self.__filename, 'a+') IOError: (13, 'Permission denied') ------------------------------------------------- METAgency - Merchandise and Ecommerce Technology 775.284.8657 www.metagency.com From gietl at gietl.com Wed Nov 1 22:09:30 2000 From: gietl at gietl.com (Andreas Gietl) Date: Wed, 01 Nov 2000 22:09:30 +0100 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Little problem with Mailman References: Message-ID: <3A00868A.5CEACBF@gietl.com> Like you see in the last line, mailman failed to open a certain file and got an Error from the OS: Permission denied I think your log-directory or file is not owned by the mailman group or not writeable for that gid. Kole Dunn wrote: > > Hi, > I created a list name and got the email, but when going to the links > I get this message "We're sorry, we hit a bug!" Followed by this > "Traceback" message. Can someone help? Running RH 6.2 > > Traceback (innermost last): > File "/home/mailman/scripts/driver", line 85, in run_main > logger = StampedLogger('error', > File "/home/mailman/Mailman/Logging/StampedLogger.py", line 48, in __init__ > Logger.__init__(self, category, nofail, immediate) > File "/home/mailman/Mailman/Logging/Logger.py", line 40, in __init__ > self.__get_f() > File "/home/mailman/Mailman/Logging/Logger.py", line 63, in __get_f > reraise() > File "/home/mailman/Mailman/Logging/Logger.py", line 55, in __get_f > f = self.__fp = open(self.__filename, 'a+') > IOError: (13, 'Permission denied') > > ------------------------------------------------- > METAgency - Merchandise and Ecommerce Technology > 775.284.8657 www.metagency.com > > ------------------------------------------------------ > Mailman-Users maillist - Mailman-Users at python.org > http://www.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users -- andreas gietl gietl internet services fon +49 9402 2551 fax +49 9402 2604 mobile +49 171 60 70 008 gietl at gietl.com ############################################ # Das Handbuch sagt, das Programm ben?tige # # Windows 95 oder besser. Also habe ich # # Linux installiert! # ############################################ From gietl at gietl.com Wed Nov 1 22:14:43 2000 From: gietl at gietl.com (Andreas Gietl) Date: Wed, 01 Nov 2000 22:14:43 +0100 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Little problem with Mailman References: Message-ID: <3A0087C3.4CB844D0@gietl.com> perhaps $prefix/bin/check_perms -f solves your problem! but i'm not quite sure, whether it fixes the logs too! Kole Dunn wrote: > > Hi, > I created a list name and got the email, but when going to the links > I get this message "We're sorry, we hit a bug!" Followed by this > "Traceback" message. Can someone help? Running RH 6.2 > > Traceback (innermost last): > File "/home/mailman/scripts/driver", line 85, in run_main > logger = StampedLogger('error', > File "/home/mailman/Mailman/Logging/StampedLogger.py", line 48, in __init__ > Logger.__init__(self, category, nofail, immediate) > File "/home/mailman/Mailman/Logging/Logger.py", line 40, in __init__ > self.__get_f() > File "/home/mailman/Mailman/Logging/Logger.py", line 63, in __get_f > reraise() > File "/home/mailman/Mailman/Logging/Logger.py", line 55, in __get_f > f = self.__fp = open(self.__filename, 'a+') > IOError: (13, 'Permission denied') > > ------------------------------------------------- > METAgency - Merchandise and Ecommerce Technology > 775.284.8657 www.metagency.com > > ------------------------------------------------------ > Mailman-Users maillist - Mailman-Users at python.org > http://www.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users -- andreas gietl gietl internet services fon +49 9402 2551 fax +49 9402 2604 mobile +49 171 60 70 008 gietl at gietl.com ############################################ # Das Handbuch sagt, das Programm ben?tige # # Windows 95 oder besser. Also habe ich # # Linux installiert! # ############################################ From kole at metagency.com Wed Nov 1 22:26:23 2000 From: kole at metagency.com (Kole Dunn) Date: Wed, 1 Nov 2000 13:26:23 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] New traceback message.. Message-ID: The listinfo page now comes up, but the admin page now gives this (string index out of range?): Traceback: Traceback (innermost last): File "/home/mailman/scripts/driver", line 112, in run_main main() File "/home/mailman/Mailman/Cgi/admin.py", line 103, in main is_auth = lst.WebAuthenticate(password=adminpw, File "/home/mailman/Mailman/SecurityManager.py", line 83, in WebAuthenticate return self.CheckCookie(cookie_key) File "/home/mailman/Mailman/SecurityManager.py", line 117, in CheckCookie if cookiedata[keylen+1] <> '"' and cookiedata[-1] <> '"': IndexError: string index out of range ------------------------------------------------- METAgency - Merchandise and Ecommerce Technology 775.284.8657 www.metagency.com From Dan.Mick at West.Sun.COM Wed Nov 1 22:55:07 2000 From: Dan.Mick at West.Sun.COM (Dan Mick) Date: Wed, 1 Nov 2000 13:55:07 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Mailman-Users] Help Managing Passwords Message-ID: <200011012153.NAA29936@utopia.west.sun.com> > Our organization prefers that passwords not be included in welcome > announcements or monthly reminders. Is it possible to remove the passwords > from the messages (welcome and monthly reminder)? 1) you shouldn't remove them from the welcome message; otherwise, people subscribing via email will not know their password. 2) what's the point of the monthly reminder if not to remind the user of his password? If you don't want a monthly reminder, you can turn it off. From mrlist at ActiveState.com Wed Nov 1 22:56:18 2000 From: mrlist at ActiveState.com (Eric Wang) Date: Wed, 01 Nov 2000 13:56:18 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Did rc1 do some naughty things? help~~~~ In-Reply-To: <3A00830C.E41A5103@gietl.com> References: <20001101115126.3170.MRLIST@activestate.com> <3A00830C.E41A5103@gietl.com> Message-ID: <20001101135554.3176.MRLIST@activestate.com> Qmail, :( On Wed, 01 Nov 2000 21:54:36 +0100 Andreas Gietl wrote: > you're not the only one. i got the same problems on a few linux-machines > using exim-3.16. Which MTA do you use? > > Eric Wang wrote: > > > > Hi, guys > > > > As I said before I have some problems to upgrade the mailman from beta2 > > to rc1, but after the upgarde, the mailman won't reply the welcome message > > for the confirmation of subscription mail any more. And the subscriber > > is on pending always. > > > > So I decide to move it back, but after make install back to beta2, I found > > the web administration interface doesn't work anymore. Did rc1 do some > > naughty thing? modified the data structure or what? > > This is really frustrating ! > > > > guys, please help, thanks! > > > > ------------------------------------------------------ > > Mailman-Users maillist - Mailman-Users at python.org > > http://www.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users > > -- > andreas gietl > gietl internet services > fon +49 9402 2551 > fax +49 9402 2604 > mobile +49 171 60 70 008 > gietl at gietl.com > > ############################################ > # Das Handbuch sagt, das Programm ben~{vt~}ige # > # Windows 95 oder besser. Also habe ich # > # Linux installiert! # > ############################################ > > ------------------------------------------------------ > Mailman-Users maillist - Mailman-Users at python.org > http://www.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users From gietl at gietl.com Wed Nov 1 22:57:57 2000 From: gietl at gietl.com (Andreas Gietl) Date: Wed, 01 Nov 2000 22:57:57 +0100 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Did rc1 do some naughty things? help~~~~ References: <20001101115126.3170.MRLIST@activestate.com> <3A00830C.E41A5103@gietl.com> <20001101135554.3176.MRLIST@activestate.com> Message-ID: <3A0091E5.2044223A@gietl.com> good. that means it is no specific exim-problem. But i don't see why the list is simply ignoring our mails! Eric Wang wrote: > > Qmail, :( > > On Wed, 01 Nov 2000 21:54:36 +0100 > Andreas Gietl wrote: > > > you're not the only one. i got the same problems on a few linux-machines > > using exim-3.16. Which MTA do you use? > > > > Eric Wang wrote: > > > > > > Hi, guys > > > > > > As I said before I have some problems to upgrade the mailman from beta2 > > > to rc1, but after the upgarde, the mailman won't reply the welcome message > > > for the confirmation of subscription mail any more. And the subscriber > > > is on pending always. > > > > > > So I decide to move it back, but after make install back to beta2, I found > > > the web administration interface doesn't work anymore. Did rc1 do some > > > naughty thing? modified the data structure or what? > > > This is really frustrating ! > > > > > > guys, please help, thanks! > > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------ > > > Mailman-Users maillist - Mailman-Users at python.org > > > http://www.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users > > > > -- > > andreas gietl > > gietl internet services > > fon +49 9402 2551 > > fax +49 9402 2604 > > mobile +49 171 60 70 008 > > gietl at gietl.com > > > > ############################################ > > # Das Handbuch sagt, das Programm ben~{vt~}ige # > > # Windows 95 oder besser. Also habe ich # > > # Linux installiert! # > > ############################################ > > > > ------------------------------------------------------ > > Mailman-Users maillist - Mailman-Users at python.org > > http://www.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users -- andreas gietl gietl internet services fon +49 9402 2551 fax +49 9402 2604 mobile +49 171 60 70 008 gietl at gietl.com ############################################ # Das Handbuch sagt, das Programm ben?tige # # Windows 95 oder besser. Also habe ich # # Linux installiert! # ############################################ From Dan.Mick at west.sun.com Thu Nov 2 03:48:19 2000 From: Dan.Mick at west.sun.com (Dan Mick) Date: Wed, 1 Nov 2000 18:48:19 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Mailman-Users] Disabling passwords Message-ID: <200011020246.SAA11528@utopia.west.sun.com> > >> Or is there a way to set a password whitout having to go through the > >> webinterface. > > >> I have to change the passwords for over a 100 users on 20 lists so some > >> sort of command line tool/python script that takes a mailinglist username > >> and passwd would come in very handy. > > > Using withlist, it would be pretty easy to write; the passwords > > are stored in a simple array indexed by username. > > > Of course you have to know a little bit of Python. If you're > > Ehm, yeah, > that's my main problem. > I know almost no Python > (in fact all I know is that it's loops are indent based ;) ) > > > desperate I'll hack something up for you. Meanwhile here's the > > Please do. I really am desperate ;) So, it's been forever since you asked, but here's a way to change user passwords from the commandline: First, get patch 102211 for withlist from sourceforge: https://sourceforge.net/patch/?func=detailpatch&patch_id=102211&group_id=103 Here it is, in case you want to apply it without dealing with sourceforge, but beware the cut'n'paste monsters. Index: withlist =================================================================== RCS file: /cvsroot/mailman/mailman/bin/withlist,v retrieving revision 1.10 diff -u -r1.10 withlist --- withlist 2000/09/11 03:58:57 1.10 +++ withlist 2000/11/02 00:49:55 @@ -134,10 +134,11 @@ except getopt.error, m: usage(m) - if len(args) <> 1: + if len(args) < 1: usage('No list name supplied.') listname = string.lower(args[0]) + args = args[1:] lock = 0 run = None @@ -170,7 +171,7 @@ write('Importing', module, '...', file=sys.stderr) mod = __import__(module) write('Running %s.%s()' % (module, callable), '...', file=sys.stderr) - r = getattr(mod, callable)(m) + r = getattr(mod, callable)(m, args) Next, use this file with the new withlist: def pw(list, args): list.Lock() while args: a = args[0]; del args[0] p = args[0]; del args[0] print "%s's password changed from '%s' to '%s'" % \ (a, list.passwords[a], p) list.passwords[a] = p list.Save() list.Unlock() as follows: bin/withlist -r pw.pw [ ... ] Not much error-checking; I leave that to you. But it works. From bob at nleaudio.com Thu Nov 2 06:45:26 2000 From: bob at nleaudio.com (Bob Puff@NLE) Date: Thu, 02 Nov 2000 00:45:26 -0500 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Searchable archives Message-ID: <3A00FF76.6FFB44DA@nleaudio.com> How do you make the archives searchable? Also, I notice that in looking at the online archives, some message threads are grouped together, while some are not. Why is this? Sometimes they have the exact same subject line, and they are all listed as separate lines. Bob From gietl at gietl.com Thu Nov 2 12:09:19 2000 From: gietl at gietl.com (Andreas Gietl) Date: Thu, 02 Nov 2000 12:09:19 +0100 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Did rc1 do some naughty things? help~~~~ References: <20001101115126.3170.MRLIST@activestate.com> <3A00830C.E41A5103@gietl.com> <20001101135554.3176.MRLIST@activestate.com> <3A0091E5.2044223A@gietl.com> <20001102152825.A2496@server.onjapan.net> Message-ID: <3A014B5F.7A16F184@gietl.com> Well. I use it on about 50 machines and i am very satisified with its work. But what is Mailman doing? Since i upgraded from b2 to rc1 or to b5/6 i get the following behavior: A user subscribes on the listinfo page. The user gets the confirmation mail. The User replies it and nothing happens. Mailman gets the mail but does not react! Any ideas? andreas Jim Tittsler wrote: > > On Wed, Nov 01, 2000 at 10:57:57PM +0100, Andreas Gietl wrote: > > good. that means it is no specific exim-problem. > > But i don't see why the list is simply ignoring our mails! > > Definitely not exim specific because I use 2.0rc1 with Exim > 3.16 on two different machines. -- andreas gietl gietl internet services fon +49 9402 2551 fax +49 9402 2604 mobile +49 171 60 70 008 gietl at gietl.com ############################################ # Das Handbuch sagt, das Programm ben?tige # # Windows 95 oder besser. Also habe ich # # Linux installiert! # ############################################ From aravi at ptc.com Thu Nov 2 13:07:06 2000 From: aravi at ptc.com (Ravi Bhushan) Date: Thu, 02 Nov 2000 17:37:06 +0530 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Help !! Message-ID: <3A0158EA.E03615CC@india.ptc.com> Hello everyone, Can some one tell me on how to handle the attachments like MS-Word, Excel etc in archiving option. Currently any such doc attachment to the archived list, appears junk. As always, your advice is very much appreciated. Ravi From aravi at ptc.com Thu Nov 2 13:17:25 2000 From: aravi at ptc.com (Ravi Bhushan) Date: Thu, 02 Nov 2000 17:47:25 +0530 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Help ! Message-ID: <3A015B55.9ECBF9B@india.ptc.com> Hello everyone, Can some one tell me on how to handle the below error ? When I use the web page for subscribing a list, it says it is posting a confirmation mail to subscribe, but fails to deliver. The log file in mailman/logs/smtp-failures states the below error. Nov 02 14:56:59 2000 TrySMTPDelivery: To aravi at ptc.com: Nov 02 14:56:59 2000 TrySMTPDelivery: exceptions.TypeError / connect requires exactly 1 argument; 2 given (dequeued) Mail delivery from the Mailman Server is fine. I'm using Mailman v.1.1 and python version 2.0. Your valuable advice will be highly appreciated. - Ravi From kevin at maxson.com Thu Nov 2 16:55:10 2000 From: kevin at maxson.com (Kevin of Thornbury) Date: Thu, 02 Nov 2000 10:55:10 -0500 Subject: [Mailman-Users] No wrapper? Message-ID: <3A018E5E.63A67683@maxson.com> Hello, all. I wiped out my old mailman installation. The entire thing died; every action produced a "bad marshal data" error. I couldn't even get lists of subscribers for any of my lists. So I reinstalled 2.0rc1 (should be the safest, right?) on my RedHat 6.1 box. The installation went without error, but I have no wrapper program. In fact, /home/mailman/mail has nothing in it. What happened? _____ |_|_| Kevin Maxson (Lord Kevin of Thornbury) | | | Electronic Publications Manager, SCA, Inc. \|/ kevin at maxson.com http://www.sca.org From jtpjatae at bi.ehu.es Thu Nov 2 17:34:52 2000 From: jtpjatae at bi.ehu.es (Eduardo Jacob) Date: Thu, 02 Nov 2000 17:34:52 +0100 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Bug?: two different addresses get same Database Record Message-ID: <4.3.2.7.2.20001102173128.00cd9b60@158.227.65.40> I mangae a list with rc1. I have subscribed jtpjatae at bi.ehu.es to a mail list in normal mode and after that jtpjata at aintel.bi.ehu.es (which another different user) in digest mode and both of them are treated as jtpjatae at bi.ehu.es and options that appear belong to the first one. Eduardo From alex at phred.org Thu Nov 2 17:43:30 2000 From: alex at phred.org (alex wetmore) Date: Thu, 2 Nov 2000 08:43:30 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Mailman-Users] Searchable archives In-Reply-To: <3A00FF76.6FFB44DA@nleaudio.com> Message-ID: On Thu, 2 Nov 2000, Bob Puff at NLE wrote: > How do you make the archives searchable? There isn't an out of the box way to do this. I rolled my own solution using Windows 2000 Indexing Service and IIS (http://search.bikelist.org), while others have come up with similar solutions that are based on similar Unix packages. > Also, I notice that in looking at the online archives, some > message threads are grouped together, while some are not. Why is > this? Sometimes they have the exact same subject line, and they > are all listed as separate lines. Some clients properly reply with a good references line and some don't. alex From jtpjatae at bi.ehu.es Thu Nov 2 17:45:51 2000 From: jtpjatae at bi.ehu.es (Eduardo Jacob) Date: Thu, 02 Nov 2000 17:45:51 +0100 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Bug?: two different addresses get same Database Record Message-ID: <4.3.2.7.2.20001102174520.00cf2cd0@158.227.65.40> I meant jtpjatae at bi.ehu.es and jtpjatae at aintel.bi.ehu.es Eduardo From kevin at maxson.com Thu Nov 2 18:23:28 2000 From: kevin at maxson.com (Kevin of Thornbury) Date: Thu, 02 Nov 2000 12:23:28 -0500 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Re: No wrapper? References: <3A018E5E.63A67683@maxson.com> Message-ID: <3A01A310.9282D27B@maxson.com> Well, I created the wrapper program -- I went into the src directory and did a "make all" which created a bunch of programs I was missing, and then moved them to either /mail or /cgi-bin appropriately. I'm now creating lists, and I've aldready seen a "bad marshal data" message from the gate_news cron job. This doesn't leave me with a comfortable feeling. _____ |_|_| Kevin Maxson (Lord Kevin of Thornbury) | | | Electronic Publications Manager, SCA, Inc. \|/ kevin at maxson.com http://www.sca.org From robh at uunet.co.za Thu Nov 2 19:04:25 2000 From: robh at uunet.co.za (Rob Hunter) Date: Thu, 2 Nov 2000 20:04:25 +0200 (SAST) Subject: [Mailman-Users] odd errors with mailman Message-ID: Hi I seem to have a few oddities with mailman atm. Basically, no mail being posted is actually getting delivered by qrunner. I've done a bit of debugging and found a few oddities: 1) the date of the lock files is out: [root@] ~# date Thu Nov 2 20:00:56 SAST 2000 -rw-rw-r-- 2 root mailman 62 Nov 3 05:54 qrunner.lock -rw-rw-r-- 2 root mailman 62 Nov 3 05:54 qrunner.lock.snow.fingers.co.za.93164 as you can see the lock file had the wrong date. 2) Looks like every single mail that's trying to be delivered is getting "ignored": Oct 31 16:42:24 2000 (79341) -1 herman.kramer at za.didata.com (ignore) Oct 31 16:42:24 2000 (79341) -1 mozzie at netactive.co.za (ignore) Oct 31 16:42:24 2000 (79341) -1 mark.mcintyre at za.didata.com (ignore) 3) the error log shows this: Nov 01 18:29:33 2000 (86852) Delivery exception: Nov 01 18:29:33 2000 (86852) Traceback (most recent call last): File "/usr/local/mailman/Mailman/Handlers/HandlerAPI.py", line 82, in do_pipeline func(mlist, msg, msgdata) File "/usr/local/mailman/Mailman/Handlers/SMTPDirect.py", line 74, in process deliver(admin, msgtext, chunk, refused) File "/usr/local/mailman/Mailman/Handlers/SMTPDirect.py", line 211, in deliver conn.quit() File "/usr/local/mailman/Mailman/pythonlib/smtplib.py", line 513, in quit self.docmd("quit") File "/usr/local/mailman/Mailman/pythonlib/smtplib.py", line 283, in docmd return self.getreply() Nov 01 18:29:33 2000 qrunner(86852): Traceback (most recent call last): Nov 01 18:29:33 2000 qrunner(86852): File "/usr/local/mailman/cron/qrunner", line 276, in ? Nov 01 18:29:33 2000 qrunner(86852): kids = main(lock) Nov 01 18:29:33 2000 qrunner(86852): File "/usr/local/mailman/cron/qrunner", line 245, in main Nov 01 18:29:33 2000 qrunner(86852): keepqueued = dispose_message(mlist, msg, msgdata) Nov 01 18:29:33 2000 qrunner(86852): File "/usr/local/mailman/cron/qrunner", line 162, in dispose_m essage Nov 01 18:29:33 2000 qrunner(86852): return HandlerAPI.DeliverToList(mlist, msg, msgdata) Nov 01 18:29:33 2000 qrunner(86852): File "/usr/local/mailman/Mailman/Handlers/HandlerAPI.py", line 152, in DeliverToList Nov 01 18:29:33 2000 qrunner(86852): msg.Enqueue(mlist, newdata=msgdata) Nov 01 18:29:33 2000 qrunner(86852): File "/usr/local/mailman/Mailman/Message.py", line 176, in Enq ueue Nov 01 18:30:14 2000 (86868) Delivery exception: Nov 01 18:30:14 2000 (86868) Traceback (most recent call last): File "/usr/local/mailman/Mailman/Handlers/HandlerAPI.py", line 82, in do_pipeline func(mlist, msg, msgdata) and a whole lot more. Apologies for the long mail, but I wanted to include as much detail as possible. Also, according to the comment for the qrunner cron: # Retry failed deliveries once per minute. #*/1 * * * * /usr/local/bin/python -S /usr/local/mailman/cron/qrunner My deliveries would never run without me enabling/manually running this cron. Qrunner currently won't complete. My MTA is postfix, and postfix seems to be working perfectly. The box does vdomains and valiasing and those all work fine, aswell as some lists running with majordomo (been waiting to migrate them to mailman). Any suggestions would be appreciated. Regards --Rob From petejc at collab.net Thu Nov 2 19:33:05 2000 From: petejc at collab.net (pete collins) Date: Thu, 02 Nov 2000 13:33:05 -0500 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Html Archives are not being created Message-ID: <3A01B361.D6EAA588@collab.net> I am new to mailman . . . Mail works fine, however an html archive is not being created. ARCHIVE_TO_MBOX = 2 is set in Defaults.py Any ideas? Thanks --pete $ cat error Nov 02 12:46:00 2000 qrunner(13404): Traceback (innermost last): Nov 02 12:46:00 2000 qrunner(13404): File "/usr/local/sandbox/mailman/Mailman/Archiver/Archiver.py", line 213, in ArchiveMail Nov 02 12:46:00 2000 qrunner(13404): self.ExternalArchive(mm_cfg.PUBLIC_EXTERNAL_ARCHIVER, txt) Nov 02 12:46:00 2000 qrunner(13404): File "/usr/local/sandbox/mailman/Mailman/Archiver/Archiver.py", line 169, in ExternalArchive Nov 02 12:46:00 2000 qrunner(13404): cmd = ar % d Nov 02 12:46:00 2000 qrunner(13404): TypeError: __mod__ nor __rmod__ defined for these operands Nov 02 12:46:00 2000 (13404) CORRUPT ARCHIVE FOR LIST: test Nov 02 12:51:01 2000 qrunner(13452): Traceback (innermost last): Nov 02 12:51:01 2000 qrunner(13452): File "/usr/local/sandbox/mailman/Mailman/Archiver/Archiver.py", line 222, in ArchiveMail Nov 02 12:51:01 2000 qrunner(13452): h.close() Nov 02 12:51:01 2000 qrunner(13452): File "/usr/local/sandbox/mailman/Mailman/Archiver/pipermail.py", line 292, in close Nov 02 12:51:01 2000 qrunner(13452): self.write_TOC() Nov 02 12:51:01 2000 qrunner(13452): File "/usr/local/sandbox/mailman/Mailman/Archiver/HyperArch.py", line 887, in write_TOC Nov 02 12:51:01 2000 qrunner(13452): toc.write(self.html_TOC()) Nov 02 12:51:01 2000 qrunner(13452): File "/usr/local/sandbox/mailman/Mailman/Archiver/HyperArch.py", line 626, in html_TOC Nov 02 12:51:01 2000 qrunner(13452): d["archive_listing"] = string.join(accum, '') Nov 02 12:51:01 2000 qrunner(13452): NameError: accum Nov 02 12:51:01 2000 (13452) CORRUPT ARCHIVE FOR LIST: test From NeilK at ActiveState.com Thu Nov 2 21:39:59 2000 From: NeilK at ActiveState.com (Neil K) Date: Thu, 2 Nov 2000 12:39:59 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] FW: "awaits moderation" messages never stop Message-ID: Our problem: a posting to a moderated list generates the "awaits moderator approval" message many, many times. More details: - recently we upgraded Mailman from 2.0b2 --> 2.0rc1 - the new administrator (not me) noticed some problems with 2.0rc1 and tried to rollback to 2.0b2. Since we had had some subscriptions/unsubscriptions in the meantime, on about 12 lists, we kept the lists/ directory as is. { might be irrelevant: - after the rollback, we could not access the admin pages any more. - I noticed that the problem seemed to be with config.db. I added in a value which had been 'zapped' by versions.py -- num_spawns. That seemed to work. } - then they reported this flood of admin messages to me. My guess is that it has something to do with some remnant of the 2.0rc1 upgrade interfering with the 2.0b2 mailman software. I thought it might be related to the config.db, but there don't seem to be any other differences in its format. Thanks for any assistance you can offer. -- Neil Kandalgaonkar Web Application Developer, ActiveState From kole at metagency.com Thu Nov 2 22:14:38 2000 From: kole at metagency.com (Kole Dunn) Date: Thu, 2 Nov 2000 13:14:38 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Traceback message Message-ID: Hi, I get the the following message when trying to access my admin page for the list I created: Can anyone help me fix? Traceback: Traceback (innermost last): File "/home/mailman/scripts/driver", line 112, in run_main main() File "/home/mailman/Mailman/Cgi/admin.py", line 103, in main is_auth = lst.WebAuthenticate(password=adminpw, File "/home/mailman/Mailman/SecurityManager.py", line 83, in WebAuthenticate return self.CheckCookie(cookie_key) File "/home/mailman/Mailman/SecurityManager.py", line 117, in CheckCookie if cookiedata[keylen+1] <> '"' and cookiedata[-1] <> '"': IndexError: string index out of range ------------------------------------------------- METAgency - Merchandise and Ecommerce Technology 775.284.8657 www.metagency.com From kole at metagency.com Thu Nov 2 23:29:02 2000 From: kole at metagency.com (Kole Dunn) Date: Thu, 2 Nov 2000 14:29:02 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] new mailman problem Message-ID: The problem was only in Netscape, although now email bounces with the following message: ----- Transcript of session follows ----- sh: wrapper not available for sendmail programs 554 "|/home/mailman/mail/wrapper post metamembers"... Service unavailable How do I make it work? ------------------------------------------------- METAgency - Merchandise and Ecommerce Technology 775.284.8657 www.metagency.com From Dan.Mick at west.sun.com Thu Nov 2 23:46:40 2000 From: Dan.Mick at west.sun.com (Dan Mick) Date: Thu, 02 Nov 2000 14:46:40 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Traceback message References: Message-ID: <3A01EED0.95D6D858@west.sun.com> This code hasn't been in Mailman for a long time now. Upgrade to 2.0rc1. Kole Dunn wrote: > > Hi, > I get the the following message when trying to access my admin page > for the list I created: > Can anyone help me fix? > > Traceback: > > Traceback (innermost last): > File "/home/mailman/scripts/driver", line 112, in run_main > main() > File "/home/mailman/Mailman/Cgi/admin.py", line 103, in main > is_auth = lst.WebAuthenticate(password=adminpw, > File "/home/mailman/Mailman/SecurityManager.py", line 83, in WebAuthenticate > return self.CheckCookie(cookie_key) > File "/home/mailman/Mailman/SecurityManager.py", line 117, in CheckCookie > if cookiedata[keylen+1] <> '"' and cookiedata[-1] <> '"': > IndexError: string index out of range > > ------------------------------------------------- > METAgency - Merchandise and Ecommerce Technology > 775.284.8657 www.metagency.com > > ------------------------------------------------------ > Mailman-Users maillist - Mailman-Users at python.org > http://www.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users From mv7 at mv-7.com Fri Nov 3 00:08:50 2000 From: mv7 at mv-7.com (Aimee E. Farr) Date: Thu, 2 Nov 2000 17:08:50 -0600 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Intro - stupid lawyer questions Message-ID: Hiya, Mailman looks sweeeet. I don't tech. When I can avoid it, I don't work, either. Is anybody hosting yet? Bya, Aimee __________ ? Aimee E. Farr ? __________ @]||[@ Attorney At Law @]||[@ | 5400 Bosque, Suite. 675 | | Waco, TX 76710 | mailto:mv7 at mv-7.com | 254.405.1233 M 254.751.0030 VOX | 254.751.0963 FAX NOTICE: If your email client indicates an invalid digital certificate, notify me immediately by phone. This e-mail message and any attachment contains confidential information that may be legally privileged. If you are not the intended recipient, you must not review, copy, use or disseminate the contents of this transmission. If you received this e-mail in error, please immediately notify me by reply e-mail or by telephone and delete this message. This notice is automatically appended to each e-mail message leaving my office. Electronic signatures affixed to or associated with this transmission are for the limited purpose of identification and security only. From barry at wooz.org Fri Nov 3 00:08:51 2000 From: barry at wooz.org (Barry A. Warsaw) Date: Thu, 2 Nov 2000 18:08:51 -0500 (EST) Subject: [Mailman-Users] Fix (I think) for duplicates problem Message-ID: <14849.62467.911275.369342@anthem.concentric.net> The last followup to bug #117015 by deejster provided what I think is the critical clue to the strange duplication problem. Given that recipe I was indeed able to reproduce the bug: - a message gets held for whatever reason - the message is approved, but there are smtp errors during delivery - the message gets re-queued, but with a file name composed of the old filebase, not the new filebase. - fwap! you've now got a duplicate of the original message Here's a fix for this problem. It removes the filebase value from the original msgdata, so that this will be recalculated when the file is re-queued after approval. For those of you seeing duplicates, please apply this patch and let me know if it fixes your dup problem. This is important enough to spin a second release candidate. -Barry Index: ListAdmin.py =================================================================== RCS file: /cvsroot/mailman/mailman/Mailman/ListAdmin.py,v retrieving revision 1.46 diff -u -r1.46 ListAdmin.py --- ListAdmin.py 2000/10/10 06:33:31 1.46 +++ ListAdmin.py 2000/11/02 23:05:57 @@ -208,6 +208,12 @@ return LOST msg = Message.Message(fp) msgdata['approved'] = 1 + # Calculate a new filebase for the approved message, otherwise + # delivery errors will cause duplicates. + try: + del msgdata['filebase'] + except KeyError: + pass # Queue the file for delivery by qrunner. Trying to deliver the # message directly here can lead to a huge delay in web # turnaround. From NeilK at ActiveState.com Fri Nov 3 00:48:08 2000 From: NeilK at ActiveState.com (Neil K) Date: Thu, 2 Nov 2000 15:48:08 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Fix (I think) for duplicates problem In-Reply-To: <14849.62467.911275.369342@anthem.concentric.net> Message-ID: Thanks Barry. We figured out our problem, which I think is different from what you are talking about. Details: - our aborted upgrade to mailman 2.0rc1 left behind a few files. - somehow these files interfered with normal exception handling. - when mailman decides a message must be held for moderation, it sends the user a "held for moderation" message and raises an special exception. - but this exception was no longer handled appropriately, so it got passed all the way up to qmail. - qmail therefore thought the delivery was a failure, and would schedule another attempt. And so on. Deleting the leftover files from 2.0rc1 seems to have fixed it. This was certainly a very bizarre interaction... I'm not sure if a patch to mailman is appropriate. Perhaps the action of sending the 'held for moderation', or similar, email, should be deferred as late as possible. That way if there are problems, at least it won't be sent out an infinite number of times. Or alternatively, close the connection to the MTA sooner. -- Neil Kandalgaonkar Web Application Developer, ActiveState From atropos at fates.org Fri Nov 3 01:00:11 2000 From: atropos at fates.org (David B. O'Donnell) Date: Thu, 02 Nov 2000 19:00:11 -0500 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Rebuilding an archive In-Reply-To: <20001102143104.A6655@tangledhelix.com> Message-ID: <1503823.3182180411@mrspeel.fates.org> I posted on this before and didn't see any kind of reply, so hopefully this reframe will help. One of my lists has a corrupt archive. The archive listing shows subjects that only go up to 10 October, and that do not correspond to the actual messages that were archived. When I run ~mailman/bin/arch/listname, everything proceeds fine until it gets to October, where it blows up: Traceback (innermost last): File "bin/arch", line 129, in ? main() File "bin/arch", line 118, in main archiver.processUnixMailbox(fp, Article) File "/home/mailman/Mailman/Archiver/pipermail.py", line 523, in processUnixMailbox self.add_article(a) File "/home/mailman/Mailman/Archiver/HyperArch.py", line 926, in add_article self.__super_add_article(article) File "/home/mailman/Mailman/Archiver/pipermail.py", line 562, in add_article article.parentID = parentID = self.get_parent_info(arch, article) File "/home/mailman/Mailman/Archiver/pipermail.py", line 594, in get_parent_info article.subject) File "/home/mailman/Mailman/Archiver/HyperDatabase.py", line 303, in getOldestArticle self.__openIndices(archive) File "/home/mailman/Mailman/Archiver/HyperDatabase.py", line 245, in __openIndices t = DumbBTree(os.path.join(arcdir, archive + '-' + i)) File "/home/mailman/Mailman/Archiver/HyperDatabase.py", line 68, in __init__ self.load() File "/home/mailman/Mailman/Archiver/HyperDatabase.py", line 173, in load self.dict = marshal.load(fp) ValueError: bad marshal data The help for arch isn't exactly helpful in this kind of situation, and I don't recall seeing any information in the documentation or online about how to deal with archives, either. Any suggestions would be welcome. I would prefer not to lose that month's archive, but if I have to... -- David B. O'Donnell - atropos at fates.org - www.fates.org Help rescue cats in need: Fancy Cats Rescue Team, www.fancycats.org From kole at metagency.com Fri Nov 3 01:50:18 2000 From: kole at metagency.com (Kole Dunn) Date: Thu, 2 Nov 2000 16:50:18 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Symbolic link not working Message-ID: OK, I found the symbolic link note in the troubleshooting section, and created the link for /etc/smrsh. Here is the link that was created in /etc/smrsh: lrwxrwxrwx 1 root root 21 Nov 2 15:43 wrapper -> /home/mailman/wrapper But still get: ----- Transcript of session follows ----- sh: wrapper not available for sendmail programs 554 "|/etc/smrsh/wrapper mailowner metamembers"... Service unavailable Can anyone tell me why this is happening? Thanks ------------------------------------------------- METAgency - Merchandise and Ecommerce Technology 775.284.8657 www.metagency.com From Dan.Mick at West.Sun.COM Fri Nov 3 02:43:08 2000 From: Dan.Mick at West.Sun.COM (Dan Mick) Date: Thu, 2 Nov 2000 17:43:08 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Mailman-Users] Html Archives are not being created Message-ID: <200011030141.RAA11191@utopia.west.sun.com> > $ cat error > Nov 02 12:46:00 2000 qrunner(13404): Traceback (innermost last): > Nov 02 12:46:00 2000 qrunner(13404): File > "/usr/local/sandbox/mailman/Mailman/Archiver/Archiver.py", line 213, in > ArchiveMail > Nov 02 12:46:00 2000 qrunner(13404): > self.ExternalArchive(mm_cfg.PUBLIC_EXTERNAL_ARCHIVER, txt) > Nov 02 12:46:00 2000 qrunner(13404): File > "/usr/local/sandbox/mailman/Mailman/Archiver/Archiver.py", line 169, in > ExternalArchive > Nov 02 12:46:00 2000 qrunner(13404): cmd = ar % d > Nov 02 12:46:00 2000 qrunner(13404): TypeError: __mod__ nor __rmod__ > defined for these operands Looks like you've set PUBLIC_EXTERNAL_ARCHIVER to something illegal (in either Defaults.py or mm_cfg.py; the only place it should be set, of course, is mm_cfg.py). What's that set to, and why? > Nov 02 12:46:00 2000 (13404) CORRUPT ARCHIVE FOR LIST: test > Nov 02 12:51:01 2000 qrunner(13452): Traceback (innermost last): > Nov 02 12:51:01 2000 qrunner(13452): File > "/usr/local/sandbox/mailman/Mailman/Archiver/Archiver.py", line 222, in > ArchiveMail > Nov 02 12:51:01 2000 qrunner(13452): h.close() > Nov 02 12:51:01 2000 qrunner(13452): File > "/usr/local/sandbox/mailman/Mailman/Archiver/pipermail.py", line 292, in > close > Nov 02 12:51:01 2000 qrunner(13452): self.write_TOC() > Nov 02 12:51:01 2000 qrunner(13452): File > "/usr/local/sandbox/mailman/Mailman/Archiver/HyperArch.py", line 887, in > write_TOC > Nov 02 12:51:01 2000 qrunner(13452): toc.write(self.html_TOC()) > Nov 02 12:51:01 2000 qrunner(13452): File > "/usr/local/sandbox/mailman/Mailman/Archiver/HyperArch.py", line 626, in > html_TOC > Nov 02 12:51:01 2000 qrunner(13452): d["archive_listing"] = > string.join(accum, '') > Nov 02 12:51:01 2000 qrunner(13452): NameError: accum This has been fixed in the latest CVS; either wait for a new release, get the latest CVS, or apply this fix to Mailman/Archiver/HyperArch.py: 660c660 < d["archive_listing"] = string.join(accum, '') --- > d["archive_listing"] = string.join(accum, '') The "CORRUPT" messages are just "I got an exception I couldn't handle", so may go away when you fix both the above. From Dan.Mick at West.Sun.COM Fri Nov 3 02:47:26 2000 From: Dan.Mick at West.Sun.COM (Dan Mick) Date: Thu, 2 Nov 2000 17:47:26 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Mailman-Users] odd errors with mailman Message-ID: <200011030146.RAA11291@utopia.west.sun.com> 1) qrunner won't run with those lockfiles there, so they should be gone before you try again. 2) if you have the cron entry commented, qrunner won't run at all unless you run it by hand. I assume you know these things, but it never hurts. 3) Any theories for how the lock files got bogus dates? Did you have NTP problems, or did someone reset the date wrongly on this machine, or something? Is TZ a suspect (different for mailman vs. other processes or something?) 4) what do the "ignored" log entries show up in? One of Mailman's logs, or your MTA's? 5) the logs/error excerpt doesn't actually seem to show the error, which is odd. Could you mail me the whole file privately so I can look at it? 6) can you try running qrunner under some syscall-tracing utility (Solaris: truss, BSD: ktrace, Linux: strace) to see where it's stopping? > From: Rob Hunter > X-Sender: robh at hill.noc.uunet.co.za > To: mailman-users at python.org > Subject: [Mailman-Users] odd errors with mailman > X-Beenthere: mailman-users at python.org > X-Mailman-Version: 2.0beta6 > List-Post: > List-Id: Mailman mailing list management users > List-Archive: > Date: Thu, 2 Nov 2000 20:04:25 +0200 (SAST) > > Hi > > I seem to have a few oddities with mailman atm. Basically, no mail being > posted is actually getting delivered by qrunner. I've done a bit of > debugging and found a few oddities: > > 1) the date of the lock files is out: > > [root@] ~# date > Thu Nov 2 20:00:56 SAST 2000 > > -rw-rw-r-- 2 root mailman 62 Nov 3 05:54 qrunner.lock > -rw-rw-r-- 2 root mailman 62 Nov 3 05:54 > qrunner.lock.snow.fingers.co.za.93164 > > as you can see the lock file had the wrong date. > > 2) Looks like every single mail that's trying to be delivered is getting > "ignored": > > Oct 31 16:42:24 2000 (79341) -1 herman.kramer at za.didata.com (ignore) > Oct 31 16:42:24 2000 (79341) -1 mozzie at netactive.co.za (ignore) > Oct 31 16:42:24 2000 (79341) -1 mark.mcintyre at za.didata.com (ignore) > > 3) the error log shows this: > > Nov 01 18:29:33 2000 (86852) Delivery exception: > Nov 01 18:29:33 2000 (86852) Traceback (most recent call last): > File "/usr/local/mailman/Mailman/Handlers/HandlerAPI.py", line 82, in > do_pipeline > func(mlist, msg, msgdata) > File "/usr/local/mailman/Mailman/Handlers/SMTPDirect.py", line 74, in > process > deliver(admin, msgtext, chunk, refused) > File "/usr/local/mailman/Mailman/Handlers/SMTPDirect.py", line 211, in > deliver > conn.quit() > File "/usr/local/mailman/Mailman/pythonlib/smtplib.py", line 513, in > quit > self.docmd("quit") > File "/usr/local/mailman/Mailman/pythonlib/smtplib.py", line 283, in > docmd > return self.getreply() > > Nov 01 18:29:33 2000 qrunner(86852): Traceback (most recent call last): > Nov 01 18:29:33 2000 qrunner(86852): File > "/usr/local/mailman/cron/qrunner", line 276, in ? > Nov 01 18:29:33 2000 qrunner(86852): kids = main(lock) > Nov 01 18:29:33 2000 qrunner(86852): File > "/usr/local/mailman/cron/qrunner", line 245, in main > Nov 01 18:29:33 2000 qrunner(86852): keepqueued = > dispose_message(mlist, msg, msgdata) > Nov 01 18:29:33 2000 qrunner(86852): File > "/usr/local/mailman/cron/qrunner", line 162, in dispose_m > essage > Nov 01 18:29:33 2000 qrunner(86852): return > HandlerAPI.DeliverToList(mlist, msg, msgdata) > Nov 01 18:29:33 2000 qrunner(86852): File > "/usr/local/mailman/Mailman/Handlers/HandlerAPI.py", line > 152, in DeliverToList > Nov 01 18:29:33 2000 qrunner(86852): msg.Enqueue(mlist, > newdata=msgdata) > Nov 01 18:29:33 2000 qrunner(86852): File > "/usr/local/mailman/Mailman/Message.py", line 176, in Enq > ueue > Nov 01 18:30:14 2000 (86868) Delivery exception: > Nov 01 18:30:14 2000 (86868) Traceback (most recent call last): > File "/usr/local/mailman/Mailman/Handlers/HandlerAPI.py", line 82, in > do_pipeline > func(mlist, msg, msgdata) > > and a whole lot more. Apologies for the long mail, but I wanted to include > as much detail as possible. > > Also, according to the comment for the qrunner cron: > > # Retry failed deliveries once per minute. > #*/1 * * * * /usr/local/bin/python -S /usr/local/mailman/cron/qrunner > > My deliveries would never run without me enabling/manually running this > cron. Qrunner currently won't complete. My MTA is postfix, and postfix > seems to be working perfectly. The box does vdomains and valiasing and > those all work fine, aswell as some lists running with majordomo (been > waiting to migrate them to mailman). > > Any suggestions would be appreciated. > > Regards > > --Rob > > > > ------------------------------------------------------ > Mailman-Users maillist - Mailman-Users at python.org > http://www.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users From robh at uunet.co.za Fri Nov 3 06:54:11 2000 From: robh at uunet.co.za (Rob Hunter) Date: Fri, 3 Nov 2000 07:54:11 +0200 (SAST) Subject: [Mailman-Users] odd errors with mailman In-Reply-To: <200011030146.RAA11291@utopia.west.sun.com> Message-ID: howdie > 1) qrunner won't run with those lockfiles there, so they should > be gone before you try again. normally the lockfiles aren't there, it's just now when qrunner won't actually complete successfully. > 2) if you have the cron entry commented, qrunner won't run at all > unless you run it by hand. I commented it out, 'cos qrunner wouldn't run successfully, so I was running it manually while trying to debug, otherwise I just get loads of logs saying that it couldn't get lockfile. > I assume you know these things, but it never hurts. thanks :) > 3) Any theories for how the lock files got bogus dates? Did you > have NTP problems, or did someone reset the date wrongly on this machine, > or something? Is TZ a suspect (different for mailman vs. other processes > or something?) The date has never been a problem. I double-checked and ntp is running fine. ntp hardly ever corrects the date, it's normally pretty spot-on. > 4) what do the "ignored" log entries show up in? One of Mailman's logs, > or your MTA's? the smtp-error log (mailman) > 5) the logs/error excerpt doesn't actually seem to show the error, > which is odd. Could you mail me the whole file privately so I can > look at it? I actually fixed the problem (very) late last night, will detail down below, thanks :) > 6) can you try running qrunner under some syscall-tracing utility > (Solaris: truss, BSD: ktrace, Linux: strace) to see where it's stopping? thanks. What I failed to mention was - it's FreeBSD --STABLE. I managed to fix the problem. I was checking my postfix logs, and saw that I kept on getting timeouts while connecting from localhost, and it was showing the email address that it was trying to deliver to. I nuked all messages in the mailman queue with that email address. This is where I was stumped, 'cos then it just started timing out on another address. As a desperate measure, I nuked all mailman messages with that email address aswell, and hey presto, it started working. So for now the problem is gone, I still need to try and track down whether the problem lay with postfix (more than likely) or mailman. Any idea what all those errors were ? (the extract from the 'error' file that I pasted which was so lengthy). Thanks for the reply :) --Rob > > From: Rob Hunter > > X-Sender: robh at hill.noc.uunet.co.za > > To: mailman-users at python.org > > Subject: [Mailman-Users] odd errors with mailman > > X-Beenthere: mailman-users at python.org > > X-Mailman-Version: 2.0beta6 > > List-Post: > > List-Id: Mailman mailing list management users > > List-Archive: > > Date: Thu, 2 Nov 2000 20:04:25 +0200 (SAST) > > > > Hi > > > > I seem to have a few oddities with mailman atm. Basically, no mail being > > posted is actually getting delivered by qrunner. I've done a bit of > > debugging and found a few oddities: > > > > 1) the date of the lock files is out: > > > > [root@] ~# date > > Thu Nov 2 20:00:56 SAST 2000 > > > > -rw-rw-r-- 2 root mailman 62 Nov 3 05:54 qrunner.lock > > -rw-rw-r-- 2 root mailman 62 Nov 3 05:54 > > qrunner.lock.snow.fingers.co.za.93164 > > > > as you can see the lock file had the wrong date. > > > > 2) Looks like every single mail that's trying to be delivered is getting > > "ignored": > > > > Oct 31 16:42:24 2000 (79341) -1 herman.kramer at za.didata.com (ignore) > > Oct 31 16:42:24 2000 (79341) -1 mozzie at netactive.co.za (ignore) > > Oct 31 16:42:24 2000 (79341) -1 mark.mcintyre at za.didata.com (ignore) > > > > 3) the error log shows this: > > > > Nov 01 18:29:33 2000 (86852) Delivery exception: > > Nov 01 18:29:33 2000 (86852) Traceback (most recent call last): > > File "/usr/local/mailman/Mailman/Handlers/HandlerAPI.py", line 82, in > > do_pipeline > > func(mlist, msg, msgdata) > > File "/usr/local/mailman/Mailman/Handlers/SMTPDirect.py", line 74, in > > process > > deliver(admin, msgtext, chunk, refused) > > File "/usr/local/mailman/Mailman/Handlers/SMTPDirect.py", line 211, in > > deliver > > conn.quit() > > File "/usr/local/mailman/Mailman/pythonlib/smtplib.py", line 513, in > > quit > > self.docmd("quit") > > File "/usr/local/mailman/Mailman/pythonlib/smtplib.py", line 283, in > > docmd > > return self.getreply() > > > > Nov 01 18:29:33 2000 qrunner(86852): Traceback (most recent call last): > > Nov 01 18:29:33 2000 qrunner(86852): File > > "/usr/local/mailman/cron/qrunner", line 276, in ? > > Nov 01 18:29:33 2000 qrunner(86852): kids = main(lock) > > Nov 01 18:29:33 2000 qrunner(86852): File > > "/usr/local/mailman/cron/qrunner", line 245, in main > > Nov 01 18:29:33 2000 qrunner(86852): keepqueued = > > dispose_message(mlist, msg, msgdata) > > Nov 01 18:29:33 2000 qrunner(86852): File > > "/usr/local/mailman/cron/qrunner", line 162, in dispose_m > > essage > > Nov 01 18:29:33 2000 qrunner(86852): return > > HandlerAPI.DeliverToList(mlist, msg, msgdata) > > Nov 01 18:29:33 2000 qrunner(86852): File > > "/usr/local/mailman/Mailman/Handlers/HandlerAPI.py", line > > 152, in DeliverToList > > Nov 01 18:29:33 2000 qrunner(86852): msg.Enqueue(mlist, > > newdata=msgdata) > > Nov 01 18:29:33 2000 qrunner(86852): File > > "/usr/local/mailman/Mailman/Message.py", line 176, in Enq > > ueue > > Nov 01 18:30:14 2000 (86868) Delivery exception: > > Nov 01 18:30:14 2000 (86868) Traceback (most recent call last): > > File "/usr/local/mailman/Mailman/Handlers/HandlerAPI.py", line 82, in > > do_pipeline > > func(mlist, msg, msgdata) > > > > and a whole lot more. Apologies for the long mail, but I wanted to include > > as much detail as possible. > > > > Also, according to the comment for the qrunner cron: > > > > # Retry failed deliveries once per minute. > > #*/1 * * * * /usr/local/bin/python -S /usr/local/mailman/cron/qrunner > > > > My deliveries would never run without me enabling/manually running this > > cron. Qrunner currently won't complete. My MTA is postfix, and postfix > > seems to be working perfectly. The box does vdomains and valiasing and > > those all work fine, aswell as some lists running with majordomo (been > > waiting to migrate them to mailman). > > > > Any suggestions would be appreciated. > > > > Regards > > > > --Rob > > > > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------ > > Mailman-Users maillist - Mailman-Users at python.org > > http://www.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users > > --Rob From mailman at futureweb.at Fri Nov 3 09:07:34 2000 From: mailman at futureweb.at (Patrick N.) Date: Fri, 3 Nov 2000 09:07:34 +0100 Subject: [Mailman-Users] installation troubles Message-ID: hi, I did everything as stated in the install-help file, still, it seems the aliases are not working, I send a mail to the list, still, it just gets dropped into my main mailbox, not processed, anything I might have missed? thanks patrick ************** Futureweb St. Johann info at futureweb.at "I am easily satisfied by the very best" - Winston Churchill From rodrigo at linuxave.net Fri Nov 3 11:36:48 2000 From: rodrigo at linuxave.net (Rodrigo Moya) Date: 03 Nov 2000 09:36:48 -0100 Subject: [Mailman-Users] problem with archives Message-ID: <200011031029.CAA17583@gears.linuxave.net> Hi all! I've just created several lists, some private and some public. The archives for the private lists are working perfectly well, but when I select the link for the archive for a public list, I get this error: The requested URL /pipermail/announce-list/ was not found on this server Is there something to do with public lists to make the archives work? cheers From rodrigo at linuxave.net Fri Nov 3 13:13:16 2000 From: rodrigo at linuxave.net (Rodrigo Moya) Date: 03 Nov 2000 11:13:16 -0100 Subject: [Eric ] Re: [Mailman-Users] problem with archives Message-ID: <200011031206.EAA23120@gears.linuxave.net> -------------- next part -------------- An embedded message was scrubbed... From: Eric Subject: Re: [Mailman-Users] problem with archives Date: Fri, 03 Nov 2000 13:12:36 +0100 Size: 1862 Url: http://mail.python.org/pipermail/mailman-users/attachments/20001103/e66182c6/attachment.mht From a2m3 at Tonelli.sns.it Fri Nov 3 14:09:29 2000 From: a2m3 at Tonelli.sns.it (Andrea Mennucci) Date: Fri, 3 Nov 2000 14:09:29 +0100 Subject: [Mailman-Users] mailman: can't access the private archives of a list Message-ID: <20001103140929.A3306@Tonelli.sns.it> hello I use Debian GNU/Linux. I have a problem with mailman, and I have posted a bug to Debian, which follows. Unfortunately, I need to use private archives soon, so I am asking help to this list also. (I will also send any fix to the Debian mantainer) thanks a ps: please ignore the part about /usr/share/doc/README.Debian, that is Debian specific -- Andrea C. Mennucci, Scuola Normale Superiore, Pisa, Italy -------------- next part -------------- An embedded message was scrubbed... From: Andrea Mennucci Subject: mailman: can't access the private archives of a list Date: Thu, 02 Nov 2000 20:29:34 +0100 Size: 2516 Url: http://mail.python.org/pipermail/mailman-users/attachments/20001103/47527ac6/attachment.mht From petejc at collab.net Fri Nov 3 14:56:14 2000 From: petejc at collab.net (pete collins) Date: Fri, 03 Nov 2000 08:56:14 -0500 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Html Archives are not being created References: <200011030141.RAA11191@utopia.west.sun.com> Message-ID: <3A02C3FE.FE1849B7@collab.net> > This has been fixed in the latest CVS; either wait for a new release, > get the latest CVS, or apply this fix to Mailman/Archiver/HyperArch.py: > OK, i pulled from cvs. Everything works w/ no errors. However, i'm not getting that nice html archiving i've seen in older versions. I am getting this for my generated index.html page: The Test Archives You can get more information about this list or you can download the full raw archive ( 2 KB ). Currently, there are no archives. This is a step forward . . . Is html archiving busted in the tree right now? Thanks --pete From sub at sub.unibe.ch Fri Nov 3 14:37:12 2000 From: sub at sub.unibe.ch (Daniel Furter (SUB)) Date: Fri, 03 Nov 2000 14:37:12 +0100 Subject: [Mailman-Users] mass unsubscribe Message-ID: hello i have a particular problem with mailman right now: i have to restart my mailing list. all members have to leave the list and can subscribe again afterwards. this means all subscribers must be deleted. however i do not wish to remove the whole list with all the settings. is there something like a mass unsubscribe function for the administrato? i would be greatful about any notice, because otherwise i have to uncheck all the 1000 subcribe boxes... dAniel furter ___________________________________ Daniel Furter Administration StudentInnenschaft der Universitaet Bern (SUB) Lerchenweg 32, CH-3000 Bern 9 Fon: 031 301 00 03, Fax: 031 301 01 87 E-Mail: sub at sub.unibe.ch, WWW: subwww.unibe.ch From fil at bok.net Fri Nov 3 14:42:43 2000 From: fil at bok.net (Fil) Date: Fri, 3 Nov 2000 14:42:43 +0100 Subject: [Mailman-Users] list > 100,000 members? Message-ID: <20001103144243.A14561@orwell.bok.net> Hi mailman-users, has anyone managed to work out a mailman installation with a list bigger than 100,000 memebers ? Mine stays stuck when I use the web interface. It works great with smaller lists ! Are there any tricks? Splitting the list in smaller chunks?.. From fil at bok.net Fri Nov 3 14:43:29 2000 From: fil at bok.net (Fil) Date: Fri, 3 Nov 2000 14:43:29 +0100 Subject: [Mailman-Users] mass unsubscribe In-Reply-To: ; from sub@sub.unibe.ch on Fri, Nov 03, 2000 at 02:37:12PM +0100 References: Message-ID: <20001103144329.B14561@orwell.bok.net> bin/remove_members -a listname -a means "all" * Daniel Furter (SUB) (sub at sub.unibe.ch) ?crivait : > i have a particular problem with mailman right now: i have to restart my > mailing list. all members have to leave the list and can subscribe again > afterwards. this means all subscribers must be deleted. however i do not > wish to remove the whole list with all the settings. is there something > like a mass unsubscribe function for the administrato? i would be greatful > about any notice, because otherwise i have to uncheck all the 1000 subcribe > boxes... From doctor at kira.mcc.ac.uk Fri Nov 3 14:51:10 2000 From: doctor at kira.mcc.ac.uk (Mike Richardson) Date: Fri, 3 Nov 2000 13:51:10 +0000 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Minor, minor addition to mailman... Message-ID: <20001103135110.N706@kira.mcc.ac.uk> Just a sugggestion but it would be nice if each of the option lines on a page was numbered. So rather that telling an admin that: "the 'address of members accepted for posting to this list without implicit approval requirement' option has your email address in" we could say: "Privacy Option 7 has your email address in". Yes, I could do it myself and yes I probably will but I thought I'd suggest it anyway. And before you ask I could submit a patch but you'd also get all my other University of Manchester custom changes too... Mike. -- -------------------------------------------------------------------- Copyright 2000 Mike Richardson, Rm G98, Manchester Computing University of Manchester, M13 9PL. doctor at mcc.ac.uk, 0161 275-6009 -------------------------------------------------------------------- "If I want your opinion, I'll beat it out of you!" - Chuck Norris "If anything happens to my daughter I have a 45 and shovel" Clueless From gietl at gietl.com Fri Nov 3 15:07:44 2000 From: gietl at gietl.com (Andreas Gietl) Date: Fri, 03 Nov 2000 15:07:44 +0100 Subject: [Mailman-Users] forever pending subscriptions Message-ID: <3A02C6B0.2D82FC79@gietl.com> Hi. I'm using mailman on a lot of different machines with the Exim MTA in version 3.16 and everything worked fine with beta2. In the last weeks i tried a few times to upgrade to beta6 or rc1. But this always ends up in a very strange behavior. Since i am not the only one who reported this to the mailman-users-list and got no answer i also send this mail to the developers list, because i think it may be a bug. The Following happens: After upgrading to rc1 without any errors from make install mailman still works fine, but it does no subscriptions any longer. A user who signs up in the listinfo page gets his confirmation mail and after he/she confirmed the message (and the MTA delivered it w/o error) nothing happens. The subscribe log still shows the user as pending and nothing happens. Any suggestion would be appreciated. thx andreas -- andreas gietl gietl internet services fon +49 9402 2551 fax +49 9402 2604 mobile +49 171 60 70 008 gietl at gietl.com ############################################ # Das Handbuch sagt, das Programm ben?tige # # Windows 95 oder besser. Also habe ich # # Linux installiert! # ############################################ From morris at unc.edu Fri Nov 3 15:41:16 2000 From: morris at unc.edu (Joe Morris) Date: Fri, 3 Nov 2000 09:41:16 -0500 (EST) Subject: [Mailman-Users] mass unsubscribe In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Fri, 3 Nov 2000, Daniel Furter (SUB) wrote: | i have a particular problem with mailman right now: i have to restart my | mailing list. all members have to leave the list and can subscribe again | afterwards. this means all subscribers must be deleted. however i do not | wish to remove the whole list with all the settings. is there something | like a mass unsubscribe function for the administrato? i would be greatful | about any notice, because otherwise i have to uncheck all the 1000 subcribe | boxes... Here is the easiset way I know of... /bin/sync_members -a=no -f /dev/null That sync_members tool is a lifesaver for me! It's a powerful tool that I think others are not aware of. _______________________________________________________ Joe Morris http://www.ibiblio.org/morris Web Systems Manager, ATN http://help.unc.edu UNC-Chapel Hill http://www.unc.edu From doctor at kira.mcc.ac.uk Fri Nov 3 15:50:01 2000 From: doctor at kira.mcc.ac.uk (Mike Richardson) Date: Fri, 3 Nov 2000 14:50:01 +0000 Subject: [Mailman-Users] replacing the hostname Message-ID: <20001103145001.S706@kira.mcc.ac.uk> Hi, I'm running mailman 2.05b with exim 3.16. The machine's name is deprecate but all the lists (so far) use the host_name setting of lists.man.ac.uk. This is a CNAME to deprecate. Currently a message sent out from Mailman with have the machine's actual hostname, deprecate, in the list address where it appears in the mail, ie the To: field is list at deprecate... not list at lists.man.ac.uk Same applies to admin mesasges ie From: mailman at deprecate... The host_name setting is definitely 'lists.man.ac.uk' as is DEFAULT_HOST_NAME but I suspect this only applies to how the list deals with incoming messages. How can I get around this? What DNS, Mailman and/or exim changes do I need? I think I could use exim rewrite rules to just replace deprecate with lists.man but I'd like the setting in host_name to be the one which as the mail domain... Thanks Mike -- -------------------------------------------------------------------- Copyright 2000 Mike Richardson, Rm G98, Manchester Computing University of Manchester, M13 9PL. doctor at mcc.ac.uk, 0161 275-6009 -------------------------------------------------------------------- "If I want your opinion, I'll beat it out of you!" - Chuck Norris "If anything happens to my daughter I have a 45 and shovel" Clueless From jtpjatae at bi.ehu.es Fri Nov 3 16:01:02 2000 From: jtpjatae at bi.ehu.es (Eduardo Jacob) Date: Fri, 03 Nov 2000 16:01:02 +0100 Subject: [Mailman-Users] MIME attachments again. Message-ID: <4.3.2.7.2.20001103160039.00cfe400@158.227.65.40> At 15:38 31/10/00, you wrote: >You probably need to install the package named libhtml-format-perl that is >used by the demime script. Yes, that was missing, although the real problem (once I got that demime working...) was another one. Thank you for your suggestion. >However be aware that demime munges all non-ascii characters such as >accentuated letters. I'll take a look at it. Hopefully, although I am spanish, the list is in english, but thanks for the clue. Eduardo From jtpjatae at bi.ehu.es Fri Nov 3 16:01:16 2000 From: jtpjatae at bi.ehu.es (Eduardo Jacob) Date: Fri, 03 Nov 2000 16:01:16 +0100 Subject: [Mailman-Users] MIME attachments again. In-Reply-To: <20001031105116.B12231@mallorn.com> References: <4.3.2.7.2.20001031172427.00cd9390@158.227.65.40> <4.3.2.7.2.20001031153139.00cb1d30@158.227.65.40> <4.3.2.7.2.20001031153139.00cb1d30@158.227.65.40> <20001031102143.A12231@mallorn.com> <4.3.2.7.2.20001031172427.00cd9390@158.227.65.40> Message-ID: <4.3.2.7.2.20001103160004.00ce6e50@158.227.65.40> At 17:51 31/10/00, you wrote: > > ># cd /etc/smrsh ; ln -s /usr/local/etc/demime.pl > > > > It was added. The problem is that smrsh doesn't like to see the second > | in > > the line. More on this: if I modify smrsh for not checking for the "|" > > character it works. > >Ooops, sorry. Yes, wrapping that whole bit with a shell script is the >right thing to do. smrsh isn't smart enough to understand pipes and the >like, so it just blocks anything containing certain characters in the >delivery line (i.e. |, &, ;). Putting it all into a script hides the >process from smrsh. Yes, that was the solution. Thank you!! ------------------------------------------------------------------- Eduardo Jacob - Area de Ingenieria Telematica Departamento de Electronica y Telecomunicaciones ETSII y de IT Tel: +34 94 601 4214 UPV / EHU Fax: +34 94 601 4259 Alda Urquijo s/n E-mail: jtpjatae at bi.ehu.es E-48013 - Bilbao (Spain) PGP Key available: Send email w/subject: PGPKEY fingerprint : D8 FA 54 49 F7 40 BA AA 09 1A 73 40 A4 26 ED BD From virginia at texterity.com Fri Nov 3 16:43:40 2000 From: virginia at texterity.com (Virginia Beauregard) Date: Fri, 3 Nov 2000 10:43:40 -0500 (EST) Subject: [Mailman-Users] Symbolic link not working In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Thu, 2 Nov 2000, Kole Dunn wrote: > ----- Transcript of session follows ----- > sh: wrapper not available for sendmail programs > 554 "|/etc/smrsh/wrapper mailowner metamembers"... Service unavailable > > Can anyone tell me why this is happening? Looks like maybe you don't have sendmail compiled with smrsh support? Double check your sendmail.[mc|cf]. www.sendmail.org for help. -- Virginia J. Beauregard virginia at texterity.com UNIX Systems and Network Administrator Texterity, Inc. From jtpjatae at bi.ehu.es Fri Nov 3 16:11:17 2000 From: jtpjatae at bi.ehu.es (Eduardo Jacob) Date: Fri, 03 Nov 2000 16:11:17 +0100 Subject: [Mailman-Users] MIME attachments again. Message-ID: <4.3.2.7.2.20001103160039.00cfe400@158.227.65.40> At 15:38 31/10/00, you wrote: >You probably need to install the package named libhtml-format-perl that is >used by the demime script. Yes, that was missing, although the real problem (once I got that demime working...) was another one. Thank you for your suggestion. >However be aware that demime munges all non-ascii characters such as >accentuated letters. I'll take a look at it. Hopefully, although I am spanish, the list is in english, but thanks for the clue. Eduardo From Jean-Francois.Malouin at bic.mni.mcgill.ca Fri Nov 3 17:20:07 2000 From: Jean-Francois.Malouin at bic.mni.mcgill.ca (Jean-Francois Malouin) Date: Fri, 3 Nov 2000 11:20:07 -0500 Subject: [Mailman-Users] duplicate password reminder Message-ID: <20001103112007.B10486@bottom.bic.mni.mcgill.ca> Hello, I upgraded to 2.0rc1 (with sendmail-8.9.3) and I'm still seeing duplicate emails for the beginning of the month password reminder. I went through the archives bit found nothing specific. Any idea? Thanx jf -- Jean-Fran?ois Malouin, System/Network Manager, Mail: McConnell Brain Imaging Center Voice: (514) 398-8924 Montreal Neurological Institute Fax: (514) 398-8948 3801 University St. Montreal, Quebec, H3A 2B4 CAN #include From barry at wooz.org Fri Nov 3 19:19:41 2000 From: barry at wooz.org (barry at wooz.org) Date: Fri, 3 Nov 2000 13:19:41 -0500 (EST) Subject: [Mailman-Users] Fix (I think) for duplicates problem References: <14849.62467.911275.369342@anthem.concentric.net> Message-ID: <14851.445.927341.896264@anthem.concentric.net> >>>>> "NK" == Neil K writes: NK> We figured out our problem, which I think is different from NK> what you are talking about. Oh, whoops! I missed this in my inbox. Looks like you've largely solved the problem, so ignore my last message. NK> - our aborted upgrade to mailman 2.0rc1 left behind a few NK> files. I'd still /really/ like to know what problems you all had with rc1. It's a release candidate, so if there are bugs, better to catch them now than before 2.0 final goes out! NK> This was certainly a very bizarre interaction... I'm not sure NK> if a patch to mailman is appropriate. Probably not. Rolling back is a bad idea (and definitely "unsupported")! -Barry From barry at wooz.org Fri Nov 3 19:26:57 2000 From: barry at wooz.org (Barry A. Warsaw) Date: Fri, 3 Nov 2000 13:26:57 -0500 (EST) Subject: [Mailman-Users] odd errors with mailman References: Message-ID: <14851.881.497826.760588@anthem.concentric.net> >>>>> "RH" == Rob Hunter writes: RH> I seem to have a few oddities with mailman atm. Basically, no RH> mail being posted is actually getting delivered by RH> qrunner. I've done a bit of debugging and found a few RH> oddities: RH> 1) the date of the lock files is out: | [root@] ~# date | Thu Nov 2 20:00:56 SAST 2000 RH> -rw-rw-r-- 2 root mailman 62 Nov 3 05:54 qrunner.lock RH> -rw-rw-r-- 2 root mailman 62 Nov 3 05:54 RH> qrunner.lock.snow.fingers.co.za.93164 RH> as you can see the lock file had the wrong date. That's to be expected. LockFile modtimes are purposely set to some point in the future as part of the lock-breaking algorithm. RH> 2) Looks like every single mail that's trying to be delivered RH> is getting "ignored": That's basically telling you that smtplib is getting some lower level exception when trying to talk to your MTA. It's either getting a socket.error or a generic smtplib.SMTPException. logs/smtp should have more information in it. RH> My deliveries would never run without me enabling/manually RH> running this cron. Qrunner currently won't complete. My MTA is RH> postfix, and postfix seems to be working perfectly. The box RH> does vdomains and valiasing and those all work fine, aswell as RH> some lists running with majordomo (been waiting to migrate RH> them to mailman). It looks like there's some problem disconnecting from Postfix though. You're getting the error on the connection's quit. I haven't seen that before though. Check logs/smtp and see if there's any clues there. -Barry From marc_news at valinux.com Fri Nov 3 20:35:39 2000 From: marc_news at valinux.com (Marc MERLIN) Date: Fri, 3 Nov 2000 11:35:39 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Problem with qrunner and too much incoming mail Message-ID: <20001103113539.S22363@marc.merlins.org> [I am not Ccing mailman-developers as this is not encouraged, but if someone on both lists thinks it should be forwarded there, please feel free] As some of you may know, sourceforge.net's mailing lists run on mailman. With the upgrade to the 2.0 branch, when deliveries where switched from being directly handed out to the MTA to being spooled, and picked up by qrunner, more mail started getting spooled than qrunner could process per minute. The problem is due to qrunner being single threaded by default and having a global lock. Because some mailing lists have subscribers in domains where DNS is slow and unreliable, the MTA will hang on those rcpt to until DNS resolves or timeouts, and qrunner won't be done in time. After that, it's all downhill from there, more mail queues up, qrunner falls even further behind, etc, etc... We're currently playing with MTAs to optimize this a bit, but the real fix is on the mailing list side. Options: - Forget about qrunner and switch back to direct delivery and queueing only when direct delivery fails. Unfortunately, I'm told this is buggy, and mail can be lost. Is this still true? - Remove the locking in qrunner, run more than one qrunner at once, and hope for the best ;-) - Have a multithreaded qrunner that processes 10 or 20 mails at once (talking to 10 or 20 instances of the MTa in parrallel) My understanding is that python 2.0 has multithreading support and that mailman has some multithreading support. Is it something that could help me and that we should be looking at? - Other? Thanks for your help, we have to fix this somehow or switch MLMs :-) (or get killed by our users :-D) Something else I'm looking at is load balancing. One solution is to put X lists on each machine, but if you lose one machine, you lose a portion of your lists. Now, if I have X machines that mount /var/local/mailman, they'd be able to service all the lists (config.db would get locked correctly), but I'd still be stuck with only one queue runner because of the global lock. That said, I *could* have mailman/data and mailman/qfiles be a symlink to somewhere on the local disk, and patch qrunner to put its lock in data. This would allow for independant queue runners, but shared list configs and shared locks on the list configs themselves. Would that work? Am I insane? :-) Marc -- Microsoft is to operating systems & security .... .... what McDonalds is to gourmet cooking Home page: http://marc.merlins.org/ | Finger marc_f at merlins.org for PGP key From chuqui at plaidworks.com Fri Nov 3 21:24:47 2000 From: chuqui at plaidworks.com (Chuq Von Rospach) Date: Fri, 3 Nov 2000 12:24:47 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Problem with qrunner and too much incoming mail In-Reply-To: <20001103113539.S22363@marc.merlins.org> References: <20001103113539.S22363@marc.merlins.org> Message-ID: At 11:35 AM -0800 11/3/00, Marc MERLIN wrote: >We're currently playing with MTAs to optimize this a bit, but the real fix >is on the mailing list side. what's your MTA? Sendmail? postfix? >- Forget about qrunner and switch back to direct delivery and queueing only > when direct delivery fails. the other problem with this is peak load problems. Instead of getting nailed by a backlogged, you get nailed by trying to delivery all at once and having your system croak. You need some way to manage delivery to keep the peaks from killing you. >- Remove the locking in qrunner, run more than one qrunner at once, and hope > for the best ;-) you definitely don't want that. Definitely. >- Have a multithreaded qrunner that processes 10 or 20 mails at once > (talking to 10 or 20 instances of the MTa in parrallel) something I was going to bring up -- since I'm now running Mailman on a 2CPU system, it'd be nice to be able to run multiple qrunners. But it actually has some fairly serious implications in the locking areas as well, so it doesn't seem to be an easy fix. It's certainly not something I'd try to load into the 2.0 timeframe, not if we're RC candidate status. >- Other? I think it's a combination of factors .The quick fix is tweaking the MTA to be less sensitive. On my big server (50+ lists, 40,000+ subscribers) I simply haven't see more than a couple of hour delay, and that was only on the day when all of the "we've migrated to the new server" messages that went to everyone on every list at the same time started coming back in as MTA timeouts from the queue. to be really honest -- I wonder if the machine you're running this on is udnerpowered or misconfigured in some way, but I'd go beating on the MTA first. I agree that multiple qrunners would be nice, but I don't think it's a quick fix thing, but a 2.1 thing. >Now, if I have X machines that mount /var/local/mailman, they'd be able to >service all the lists (config.db would get locked correctly), but I'd still >be stuck with only one queue runner because of the global lock. >That said, I *could* have mailman/data and mailman/qfiles be a symlink to >somewhere on the local disk, and patch qrunner to put its lock in data. >This would allow for independant queue runners, but shared list configs and >shared locks on the list configs themselves. > >Would that work? I'm glad I'm not trying that on MY machine. I wish you luck... > -- Chuq Von Rospach - Plaidworks Consulting (mailto:chuqui at plaidworks.com) Apple Mail List Gnome (mailto:chuq at apple.com) Be just, and fear not. From Dan.Mick at west.sun.com Fri Nov 3 21:34:53 2000 From: Dan.Mick at west.sun.com (Dan Mick) Date: Fri, 03 Nov 2000 12:34:53 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Html Archives are not being created References: <200011030141.RAA11191@utopia.west.sun.com> <3A02C3FE.FE1849B7@collab.net> Message-ID: <3A03216D.959BC4ED@west.sun.com> Archives are working for me. pete collins wrote: > > > This has been fixed in the latest CVS; either wait for a new release, > > get the latest CVS, or apply this fix to Mailman/Archiver/HyperArch.py: > > > > OK, i pulled from cvs. Everything works w/ no errors. > However, i'm not getting that nice html archiving i've seen in older > versions. > > I am getting this for my generated index.html page: > > The Test Archives > > You can get more information about this list or you can download the full raw > archive ( 2 KB ). > > Currently, there are no archives. > > This is a step forward . . . > Is html archiving busted in the tree right now? > > Thanks > > --pete From Dan.Mick at west.sun.com Fri Nov 3 21:35:37 2000 From: Dan.Mick at west.sun.com (Dan Mick) Date: Fri, 03 Nov 2000 12:35:37 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] forever pending subscriptions References: <3A02C6B0.2D82FC79@gietl.com> Message-ID: <3A032199.67D1CA2E@west.sun.com> I just tested this again yesterday, and it worked for me. Andreas Gietl wrote: > > Hi. > > I'm using mailman on a lot of different machines with the Exim MTA in > version 3.16 and everything worked fine with beta2. > > In the last weeks i tried a few times to upgrade to beta6 or rc1. > But this always ends up in a very strange behavior. Since i am not the > only one who reported this to the mailman-users-list and got no answer i > also send this mail to the developers list, because i think it may be a > bug. > > The Following happens: > > After upgrading to rc1 without any errors from make install mailman > still works fine, but it does no subscriptions any longer. > A user who signs up in the listinfo page gets his confirmation mail and > after he/she confirmed the message (and the MTA delivered it w/o error) > nothing happens. The subscribe log still shows the user as pending and > nothing happens. > > Any suggestion would be appreciated. > > thx > > andreas > -- > andreas gietl > gietl internet services > fon +49 9402 2551 > fax +49 9402 2604 > mobile +49 171 60 70 008 > gietl at gietl.com > > ############################################ > # Das Handbuch sagt, das Programm ben?tige # > # Windows 95 oder besser. Also habe ich # > # Linux installiert! # > ############################################ > > ------------------------------------------------------ > Mailman-Users maillist - Mailman-Users at python.org > http://www.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users From claw at kanga.nu Fri Nov 3 21:53:35 2000 From: claw at kanga.nu (J C Lawrence) Date: Fri, 03 Nov 2000 12:53:35 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Problem with qrunner and too much incoming mail In-Reply-To: Message from Marc MERLIN of "Fri, 03 Nov 2000 11:35:39 PST." <20001103113539.S22363@marc.merlins.org> References: <20001103113539.S22363@marc.merlins.org> Message-ID: <9803.973284815@kanga.nu> On Fri, 3 Nov 2000 11:35:39 -0800 Marc MERLIN wrote: > The problem is due to qrunner being single threaded by default and > having a global lock. Because some mailing lists have subscribers > in domains where DNS is slow and unreliable, the MTA will hang on > those rcpt to until DNS resolves or timeouts, and qrunner won't be > done in time. After that, it's all downhill from there, more mail > queues up, qrunner falls even further behind, etc, etc... Running a cacheing nameserver (I've recommended DJB's dnscache before) would help significantly here. This doesn't of course remove the problem, just partially alleviates it. Further, in the case of Exim IIRC, it can be configured to not do DNS lookups on RCPT addresses messages at the time of receipt by the MTA based on the IP address/net of the source. Thus you could configure Exim to not do DNS lookups on everything received from localhost. Nigel -- can you confirm this? I didn't see this on a quick skim on the Exim docs but I seem to recall discussion of how to do this previously. Neither of these are real fixes of course. -- J C Lawrence Home: claw at kanga.nu ---------(*) Other: coder at kanga.nu http://www.kanga.nu/~claw/ Keys etc: finger claw at kanga.nu --=| A man is as sane as he is dangerous to his environment |=-- From barry at wooz.org Fri Nov 3 22:15:50 2000 From: barry at wooz.org (Barry A. Warsaw) Date: Fri, 3 Nov 2000 16:15:50 -0500 (EST) Subject: [Mailman-Developers] Re: [Mailman-Users] forever pending subscriptions References: <3A02C6B0.2D82FC79@gietl.com> <3A032199.67D1CA2E@west.sun.com> Message-ID: <14851.11014.397538.19202@anthem.concentric.net> >>>>> "AG" == Andreas Gietl writes: AG> After upgrading to rc1 without any errors from make install AG> mailman still works fine, but it does no subscriptions any AG> longer. A user who signs up in the listinfo page gets his AG> confirmation mail and after he/she confirmed the message (and AG> the MTA delivered it w/o error) nothing happens. The subscribe AG> log still shows the user as pending and nothing happens. >>>>> "DM" == Dan Mick writes: DM> I just tested this again yesterday, and it worked for me. Me too. When you do a "bin/dumpdb data/pending_subscriptions.db" do you still see the pending subscription in there? Do you still see the confirmation message in qfiles? If so, are there any obvious errors in logs/error? Does it have the expected Subject: header (i.e. at the end of the line, "request xxxxxx" where those x's are the numbers). -Barry From precision at valinux.com Fri Nov 3 22:47:43 2000 From: precision at valinux.com (Uriah Welcome) Date: Fri, 3 Nov 2000 13:47:43 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Problem with qrunner and too much incoming mail In-Reply-To: <9803.973284815@kanga.nu>; from claw@kanga.nu on Fri, Nov 03, 2000 at 12:53:35PM -0800 References: <20001103113539.S22363@marc.merlins.org> <9803.973284815@kanga.nu> Message-ID: <20001103134743.D32235@valinux.com> On Fri, Nov 03, 2000 at 12:53:35PM -0800, J C Lawrence wrote: > On Fri, 3 Nov 2000 11:35:39 -0800 > Marc MERLIN wrote: > > > The problem is due to qrunner being single threaded by default and > > having a global lock. Because some mailing lists have subscribers > > in domains where DNS is slow and unreliable, the MTA will hang on > > those rcpt to until DNS resolves or timeouts, and qrunner won't be > > done in time. After that, it's all downhill from there, more mail > > queues up, qrunner falls even further behind, etc, etc... > > Running a cacheing nameserver (I've recommended DJB's dnscache > before) would help significantly here. This doesn't of course > remove the problem, just partially alleviates it. We're already running djb's dnscache :) > Further, in the case of Exim IIRC, it can be configured to not do > DNS lookups on RCPT addresses messages at the time of receipt by the > MTA based on the IP address/net of the source. Thus you could > configure Exim to not do DNS lookups on everything received from > localhost. Nigel -- can you confirm this? I didn't see this on a > quick skim on the Exim docs but I seem to recall discussion of how > to do this previously. This would be really cool I think this would help quite a bit.. -- - U "Memory is like an orgasm. It's a lot better if you don't have to fake it." -- Seymour Cray commenting on virtual memory -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 248 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://mail.python.org/pipermail/mailman-users/attachments/20001103/a47fb0d8/attachment.pgp From wcooley at wirex.com Fri Nov 3 23:01:03 2000 From: wcooley at wirex.com (W. Reilly Cooley) Date: Fri, 3 Nov 2000 14:01:03 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] mailman: can't access the private archives of a list In-Reply-To: <20001103140929.A3306@Tonelli.sns.it>; from a2m3@Tonelli.sns.it on Fri, Nov 03, 2000 at 02:09:29PM +0100 References: <20001103140929.A3306@Tonelli.sns.it> Message-ID: <20001103140103.B3390@wirex.com> On Fri, Nov 03, 2000 at 02:09:29PM +0100, Andrea Mennucci wrote: > > the only problem is that > I have created a private list XYZ, with private archives, and > the web page for XYZ reads > ---- > About XYZ > To see the collection of prior postings to the list, visit > the XYZ Archives. The current archive is only available > to the list members. > ---- > but the link of the archive points to > http://tonelli.sns.it/mailman/private/XYZ/ > > which is non existent > > I have read all documentation and I cant find a way to fix it > Did you try sending a test message to the list? You get the error you mention before the first message is submitted, because the web archiver hasn't run yet. (I think) Wil -- W. Reilly Cooley, Esq. wcooley at wirex.com From kole at metagency.com Fri Nov 3 23:41:08 2000 From: kole at metagency.com (Kole Dunn) Date: Fri, 3 Nov 2000 14:41:08 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Symbolic link problem almost fixed.. Message-ID: Hello list, Virginia, I sent my problem to sendmail.org, and the kind person there had me run "ls -lL /etc/smrsh/wrapper" and then emailed me the following message, can someone tell me what I should do from here? (/home/mailman/mail/wrapper is where it should be..): >Output from ls -lL /etc/smrsh/wrapper: >lrwxrwxrwx 1 mailman mailman 21 Nov 2 15:43 >/etc/smrsh/wrapper -> /home/mailman/wrapper Then there is your problem. Apparently '/home/mailman/wrapper' either does not exist, is inaccessible. The command "ls -lL" should follow the link, and list the filemode of the final file rather than the filemode of the link. It only lists the filemode of the link because it cannot access the file itself. ------------------------------------------------- METAgency - Merchandise and Ecommerce Technology 775.284.8657 www.metagency.com From marc_news at valinux.com Fri Nov 3 23:46:50 2000 From: marc_news at valinux.com (Marc MERLIN) Date: Fri, 3 Nov 2000 14:46:50 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Problem with qrunner and too much incoming mail In-Reply-To: ; from chuqui@plaidworks.com on Fri, Nov 03, 2000 at 12:24:47PM -0800 References: <20001103113539.S22363@marc.merlins.org> Message-ID: <20001103144650.U22363@marc.merlins.org> On Fri, Nov 03, 2000 at 12:24:47PM -0800, Chuq Von Rospach wrote: > >We're currently playing with MTAs to optimize this a bit, but the real fix > >is on the mailing list side. > > what's your MTA? Sendmail? postfix? sendmail, switching to exim (hence the optimization). I'm talking about the exim folks to improve performance, but the real problem is with qrunner, not exim. > >- Forget about qrunner and switch back to direct delivery and queueing only > > when direct delivery fails. > > the other problem with this is peak load problems. Instead of getting > nailed by a backlogged, you get nailed by trying to delivery all at > once and having your system croak. You need some way to manage > delivery to keep the peaks from killing you. The machines in question can handle peak loads without problems. Is direct SMTP delivery (the option in Default.py) safe or not (I was told it could drop Emails due to bugs in the handling of certain failure conditions)? > >- Have a multithreaded qrunner that processes 10 or 20 mails at once > > (talking to 10 or 20 instances of the MTa in parrallel) > > something I was going to bring up -- since I'm now running Mailman on > a 2CPU system, it'd be nice to be able to run multiple qrunners. But > it actually has some fairly serious implications in the locking areas > as well, so it doesn't seem to be an easy fix. It's certainly not > something I'd try to load into the 2.0 timeframe, not if we're RC > candidate status. Ok, so the current thread option in mailman doesn't do that then I take it. > >- Other? > > I think it's a combination of factors .The quick fix is tweaking the > MTA to be less sensitive. On my big server (50+ lists, 40,000+ > subscribers) I simply haven't see more than a couple of hour delay, I'm talking 10,000 lists, and loads of subscribers. The mail part seems ok, mailman 1.1 was doing ok, it started failing when we switched to the 2.0 tree with qrunner. BTW, for us, a couple of hours delay isn't quite acceptable. > >Now, if I have X machines that mount /var/local/mailman, they'd be able to > >service all the lists (config.db would get locked correctly), but I'd still > >be stuck with only one queue runner because of the global lock. > >That said, I *could* have mailman/data and mailman/qfiles be a symlink to > >somewhere on the local disk, and patch qrunner to put its lock in data. > >This would allow for independant queue runners, but shared list configs and > >shared locks on the list configs themselves. > > > >Would that work? > > I'm glad I'm not trying that on MY machine. I wish you luck... :-) Marc -- Microsoft is to operating systems & security .... .... what McDonalds is to gourmet cooking Home page: http://marc.merlins.org/ | Finger marc_f at merlins.org for PGP key From marc_news at valinux.com Fri Nov 3 23:50:45 2000 From: marc_news at valinux.com (Marc MERLIN) Date: Fri, 3 Nov 2000 14:50:45 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Problem with qrunner and too much incoming mail In-Reply-To: <9803.973284815@kanga.nu>; from claw@kanga.nu on Fri, Nov 03, 2000 at 12:53:35PM -0800 References: <20001103113539.S22363@marc.merlins.org> <9803.973284815@kanga.nu> Message-ID: <20001103145045.V22363@marc.merlins.org> On Fri, Nov 03, 2000 at 12:53:35PM -0800, J C Lawrence wrote: > Further, in the case of Exim IIRC, it can be configured to not do > DNS lookups on RCPT addresses messages at the time of receipt by the > MTA based on the IP address/net of the source. Thus you could > configure Exim to not do DNS lookups on everything received from > localhost. Nigel -- can you confirm this? I didn't see this on a > quick skim on the Exim docs but I seem to recall discussion of how > to do this previously. Mmhhh, it has to do a dns lookup on the receipients if it wants to deliver the Email (you're probably thinking no lockup on the sender, which you can set as trusted). One option is to just blindly accept everything and spool it. You end up with a lot of spool and disk I/O that you really didn't have to do if you had done direct delivery from memory. That said, those are exim concerns and I have a separate thread about this on the exim list. Marc -- Microsoft is to operating systems & security .... .... what McDonalds is to gourmet cooking Home page: http://marc.merlins.org/ | Finger marc_f at merlins.org for PGP key From virginia at texterity.com Fri Nov 3 23:52:39 2000 From: virginia at texterity.com (Virginia Beauregard) Date: Fri, 3 Nov 2000 17:52:39 -0500 (EST) Subject: [Mailman-Users] Re: Symbolic link problem almost fixed.. In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Fri, 3 Nov 2000, Kole Dunn wrote: > >lrwxrwxrwx 1 mailman mailman 21 Nov 2 15:43 > >/etc/smrsh/wrapper -> /home/mailman/wrapper > > Then there is your problem. Apparently '/home/mailman/wrapper' > either does not exist, is inaccessible. You want the link to point to /home/mailman/mail/wrapper. -- Virginia J. Beauregard virginia at texterity.com UNIX Systems and Network Administrator Texterity, Inc. From kole at metagency.com Fri Nov 3 23:57:02 2000 From: kole at metagency.com (Kole Dunn) Date: Fri, 3 Nov 2000 14:57:02 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Re: Symbolic link problem almost fixed.. In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: OK, didnt see that, guess I'll get blasted by everyone now... >On Fri, 3 Nov 2000, Kole Dunn wrote: > >> >lrwxrwxrwx 1 mailman mailman 21 Nov 2 15:43 >> >/etc/smrsh/wrapper -> /home/mailman/wrapper >> >> Then there is your problem. Apparently '/home/mailman/wrapper' >> either does not exist, is inaccessible. > >You want the link to point to /home/mailman/mail/wrapper. > >-- >Virginia J. Beauregard virginia at texterity.com >UNIX Systems and Network Administrator Texterity, Inc. ------------------------------------------------- METAgency - Merchandise and Ecommerce Technology 775.284.8657 www.metagency.com From claw at kanga.nu Sat Nov 4 01:35:16 2000 From: claw at kanga.nu (J C Lawrence) Date: Fri, 03 Nov 2000 16:35:16 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Problem with qrunner and too much incoming mail In-Reply-To: Message from Marc MERLIN of "Fri, 03 Nov 2000 14:50:45 PST." <20001103145045.V22363@marc.merlins.org> References: <20001103113539.S22363@marc.merlins.org> <9803.973284815@kanga.nu> <20001103145045.V22363@marc.merlins.org> Message-ID: <29846.973298116@kanga.nu> On Fri, 3 Nov 2000 14:50:45 -0800 Marc MERLIN wrote: > On Fri, Nov 03, 2000 at 12:53:35PM -0800, J C Lawrence wrote: >> Further, in the case of Exim IIRC, it can be configured to not do >> DNS lookups on RCPT addresses messages at the time of receipt by >> the MTA based on the IP address/net of the source. Thus you >> could configure Exim to not do DNS lookups on everything received >> from localhost. Nigel -- can you confirm this? I didn't see >> this on a quick skim on the Exim docs but I seem to recall >> discussion of how to do this previously. > Mmhhh, it has to do a dns lookup on the receipients if it wants to > deliver the Email (you're probably thinking no lockup on the > sender, which you can set as trusted). True. The intent is to move the DNS query from list delivery time to MTA query time, thus taking the delay out of Mailman at the expense of the MTA et al. > One option is to just blindly accept everything and spool it. You > end up with a lot of spool and disk I/O that you really didn't > have to do if you had done direct delivery from memory. Which only works in the case of pass-thru, which is a pretty rough assumption. The guaranteed veracity requirements of MTA's pretty much insist on it hitting disk (or else the mail would be lost if Exim crashed/was_killed at that instant). > That said, those are exim concerns and I have a separate thread > about this on the exim list. Ahh, I hadn't noticed that yet. -- J C Lawrence Home: claw at kanga.nu ---------(*) Other: coder at kanga.nu http://www.kanga.nu/~claw/ Keys etc: finger claw at kanga.nu --=| A man is as sane as he is dangerous to his environment |=-- From gietl at gietl.com Sat Nov 4 13:58:10 2000 From: gietl at gietl.com (Andreas Gietl) Date: Sat, 04 Nov 2000 13:58:10 +0100 Subject: [Mailman-Developers] Re: [Mailman-Users] forever pending subscriptions References: <3A02C6B0.2D82FC79@gietl.com> <3A032199.67D1CA2E@west.sun.com> <14851.11014.397538.19202@anthem.concentric.net> Message-ID: <3A0407E2.42ABB0AF@gietl.com> "Barry A. Warsaw" wrote: > > >>>>> "AG" == Andreas Gietl writes: > > AG> After upgrading to rc1 without any errors from make install > AG> mailman still works fine, but it does no subscriptions any > AG> longer. A user who signs up in the listinfo page gets his > AG> confirmation mail and after he/she confirmed the message (and > AG> the MTA delivered it w/o error) nothing happens. The subscribe > AG> log still shows the user as pending and nothing happens. > > >>>>> "DM" == Dan Mick writes: > > DM> I just tested this again yesterday, and it worked for me. > > Me too. > > When you do a "bin/dumpdb data/pending_subscriptions.db" do you still > see the pending subscription in there? Yeah, the subscription is still in there! Do you still see the > confirmation message in qfiles? Yeah, the confirmation message is in there! If so, are there any obvious errors > in logs/error? nothing. i of course checked that! Does it have the expected Subject: header (i.e. at the > end of the line, "request xxxxxx" where those x's are the numbers). > Yeah. it does have. Do you need any further information? > -Barry > > ------------------------------------------------------ > Mailman-Users maillist - Mailman-Users at python.org > http://www.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users -- andreas gietl gietl internet services fon +49 9402 2551 fax +49 9402 2604 mobile +49 171 60 70 008 gietl at gietl.com ############################################ # Das Handbuch sagt, das Programm ben?tige # # Windows 95 oder besser. Also habe ich # # Linux installiert! # ############################################ From barry at wooz.org Sat Nov 4 16:30:58 2000 From: barry at wooz.org (Barry A. Warsaw) Date: Sat, 4 Nov 2000 10:30:58 -0500 (EST) Subject: [Mailman-Users] Problem with qrunner and too much incoming mail References: <20001103113539.S22363@marc.merlins.org> Message-ID: <14852.11186.967453.490195@anthem.concentric.net> >>>>> "MM" == Marc MERLIN writes: MM> [I am not Ccing mailman-developers as this is not encouraged, MM> but if someone on both lists thinks it should be forwarded MM> there, please feel free] I'm going to answer some of the other questions as best I can, and then I propose to move this discussion to mailman-developers so we can design a proper fix over there. MM> The problem is due to qrunner being single threaded by default MM> and having a global lock. Because some mailing lists have MM> subscribers in domains where DNS is slow and unreliable, the MM> MTA will hang on those rcpt to until DNS resolves or timeouts, MM> and qrunner won't be done in time. After that, it's all MM> downhill from there, more mail queues up, qrunner falls even MM> further behind, etc, etc... So one of the problems is that the handoff between Mailman and the MTA is synchronous with some aspect of the MTA's delivery to the remote site, namely dns lookup. One of the first things you need to do is break this synchrony, either by improving the dns lookup on the MTA side or putting the MTA in asynchronous mode for local message acceptance. Basically you want Mailman to just say "here, don't process this yet, just drop it in your outgoing queue and deal with it later." This might be related to DSN (delivery status notification); there's two DSN RFC (don't have the numbers handy right now), one that talks about the mime bounce format and another that talks about esmtp extensions for synchronous notification of delivery failures. You /don't/ want that! >From the followups, it sounds like Exim can be configured to take local delivery asynchronously, and I believe that that is how Postfix works by default. Dunno about Qmail or Sendmail, but I have to believe it's possible to put them in those modes. Now, to sketch out how I think Mailman ought to work for 2.1, and it would not be too hard to whip something up with the 2.0 architecture (ob plug: we might be able to arrange some consulting gigs with Digital Creations if necessary). First, I'd write a long-running process based around asynchat/asyncore that was essentially our own bulk mailer. The async* modules are standard Python modules which make possible select-based high performance servers. They aren't multithreaded, and do not need to be because these servers are primarily i/o bound. When i/o blocks on one channel blocks, another one picks up and works for a while. So this new process, let's call it `bulkmail'. Bulkmail would have one (probably) unix socket open to take new outgoing messages from qrunner. It'd probably write them to disk as a backup so failures don't drop messages. I'm thinking it would then sort recipients based on domains, and then it would start resolving MX records, caching the results. There'd be bins for each MX containing pointers to the messages that need to be delivered to that MX. As more messages came in for that MX, they'd be dropped at the end of the bin. Once a connetion to the MX is established, bulkmail would then just start delivering messages to it until the bin was emptied. Any i/o blocks in any of the processes will allow async* to switch to a different delivery channel. We may need to do some explicit channel management to make sure some are not starved. We'd have to have a watchdog to make sure bulkmail is running, and I'm sure there are other issues to work out, but I've gotta run. I think this will work better than the current SMTPDirect threading stuff. Thoughts? -Barry From barry at wooz.org Sat Nov 4 16:45:53 2000 From: barry at wooz.org (barry at wooz.org) Date: Sat, 4 Nov 2000 10:45:53 -0500 (EST) Subject: [Mailman-Developers] Re: [Mailman-Users] forever pending subscriptions References: <3A02C6B0.2D82FC79@gietl.com> <3A032199.67D1CA2E@west.sun.com> <14851.11014.397538.19202@anthem.concentric.net> <3A0407E2.42ABB0AF@gietl.com> Message-ID: <14852.12081.57421.807051@anthem.concentric.net> >>>>> "AG" == Andreas Gietl writes: >> Do you still see the >> confirmation message in qfiles? AG> Yeah, the confirmation message is in there! >> If so, are there any obvious errors >> in logs/error? AG> nothing. i of course checked that! >> Does it have the expected Subject: header (i.e. at the >> end of the line, "request xxxxxx" where those x's are the >> numbers). AG> Yeah. it does have. AG> Do you need any further information? Yes, do a bin/dumpdb qfiles/.db and look for the `pipeline' entry. That should show us where things are getting stuck. -Barry From claw at kanga.nu Sat Nov 4 18:06:39 2000 From: claw at kanga.nu (J C Lawrence) Date: Sat, 04 Nov 2000 09:06:39 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Developers] Re: [Mailman-Users] Problem with qrunner and too much incoming mail In-Reply-To: Message from barry@wooz.org (Barry A. Warsaw) of "Sat, 04 Nov 2000 10:30:58 EST." <14852.11186.967453.490195@anthem.concentric.net> References: <20001103113539.S22363@marc.merlins.org> <14852.11186.967453.490195@anthem.concentric.net> Message-ID: <20435.973357599@kanga.nu> On Sat, 4 Nov 2000 10:30:58 -0500 (EST) Barry A Warsaw wrote: > So this new process, let's call it `bulkmail'. Bulkmail would > have one (probably) unix socket open to take new outgoing messages > from qrunner. It'd probably write them to disk as a backup so > failures don't drop messages. I'm thinking it would then sort > recipients based on domains, and then it would start resolving MX > records, caching the results. There'd be bins for each MX > containing pointers to the messages that need to be delivered to > that MX. As more messages came in for that MX, they'd be dropped > at the end of the bin. > Once a connetion to the MX is established, bulkmail would then > just start delivering messages to it until the bin was emptied. > Any i/o blocks in any of the processes will allow async* to switch > to a different delivery channel. We may need to do some explicit > channel management to make sure some are not starved. Ouch. I really don't like this idea. For one, it make the processing of oubound mail from a list server unique to the rest of the mail system both on the local host, and the local 'net (consider smarthosts, intermittent connectivity, local domain based mail routing, firewalling etc). It also places needs for a long running process which then needs to be resistant and tolerant to unexpected/frequent shutdowns (laptops, home machines, etc). As discussed previously amongst Chuq, Nigel and I, the needs of large list server systems are rather different from the normal home hobbyest requirements, but are not compleatly alien. However, the needs of very large list installations (cf ListServ, Egroups, or SourceForge) are rather different yet again. I'm not convinced of the value in beating on Mailman to support the (comparitively rare if high profile) very large installations when the current (much larger and more common Mailman-wise) mid-size realm still needs attention. Certainly, such changes should not detract from Mailman's current level of suitability for smaller installations. Now that said, more intelligent handling of Mailman's outbound queue and its hand off to the local or a remote smarthost-like MTA could stand considerable improvement. I've posted a couple ideas which would require relatively small code changes and which should improve the situation. However, both ideas were deliberately attempting to minimise code impact. What would be a really good approach without concern for code impact? I suspect a modified form of the hash tree for queue storage (cf QMail's implementation minus the silly (for this use) inode specifics) with a slightly perverted form of your (Barry's) long running bulkmailer to process that hash queue. I'd tend to make the bulkmailer actually an intermittently running item to help support for intermittently connected nodes. Say something like: Cron launches the bulkmailer. The bulkmailer forks N children processing the queue. The bulkmailer exits upon an empty queue. Should cron launch a new bulkmailer when the prevvious incarnation hasn't exited yet, the new instance merely exits immediately. Locking for the above is fairly simple. Standard IPCs can be used for the instance collision checks. Locking on the hash queues could be a bit intereting from a portability and performance vantage given the fact that the list side will be attemptiong to deliver into the same tree at the same time that deliveries are happening (no more lock collisions please) -- which pretty much requires that locking be on the queue-entry level rather than the hash bucket level. Not rocket science, just a bit finnicky. Will this handle SourceForge? Probably. Certainly given a local MTA that does no checking on mail from localhost (and possibly which immeidately respools out to a dedicated smarthost) it would significantly improve the current state. Enough? Dunno. I'd need more specific data on their current setup, metrics etc. -- J C Lawrence Home: claw at kanga.nu ---------(*) Other: coder at kanga.nu http://www.kanga.nu/~claw/ Keys etc: finger claw at kanga.nu --=| A man is as sane as he is dangerous to his environment |=-- From mhnoyes at users.sourceforge.net Sat Nov 4 18:35:25 2000 From: mhnoyes at users.sourceforge.net (Mike Noyes) Date: Sat, 04 Nov 2000 09:35:25 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] member_posting_only=yes problem Message-ID: <4.2.2.20001104092026.00aa51b0@pop.mindspring.com> I'm the admin for a devel list on SourceForge. I have a member of my list that has different From and Reply-To addresses. He is subscribed with his Reply-To address. When I set member_posting_only=yes all of his messages are held for approval. Is there any way around this problem? Mailman 2.0beta5 -- Mike Noyes mhnoyes at users.sourceforge.net http://sourceforge.net/projects/leaf From johnny at cathat.net Sat Nov 4 19:11:00 2000 From: johnny at cathat.net (Johnny Fuerst) Date: Sat, 4 Nov 2000 12:11:00 -0600 Subject: [Mailman-Users] member_posting_only=yes problem In-Reply-To: <4.2.2.20001104092026.00aa51b0@pop.mindspring.com>; from mhnoyes@users.sourceforge.net on Sat, Nov 04, 2000 at 09:35:25AM -0800 References: <4.2.2.20001104092026.00aa51b0@pop.mindspring.com> Message-ID: <20001104121100.A16343@cathat.net> On Sat, Nov 04, 2000 at 09:35:25AM -0800, Mike Noyes wrote: > I'm the admin for a devel list on SourceForge. I have a member of my list > that has different From and Reply-To addresses. He is subscribed with his > Reply-To address. When I set member_posting_only=yes all of his messages > are held for approval. Is there any way around this problem? I am only running Mailman 1.1, but what I think is the solution should be the same. On the admin web screen, under privacy options for the list in question, there is an option which says allow posters not on list, or something like that. This is where you can add the guy's real address. -Johnny > Mailman 2.0beta5 > > -- > Mike Noyes > mhnoyes at users.sourceforge.net > http://sourceforge.net/projects/leaf > > > ------------------------------------------------------ > Mailman-Users maillist - Mailman-Users at python.org > http://www.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users -- On Behalf Of: Johnny Fuerst, Governor ................ governor at cathat.net Opinions stated in this message are mine and mine alone, and do not necessarily represent those of my ISP/employer! .period. ------------------------------------------------------------ 'I Desire Compassion, and not a Sacrifice.' 'La Vida E Bella' ____________________________ Random Quote: Good news. Ten weeks from Friday will be a pretty good day. johnny at cathat.net From mhnoyes at users.sourceforge.net Sat Nov 4 19:12:14 2000 From: mhnoyes at users.sourceforge.net (Mike Noyes) Date: Sat, 04 Nov 2000 10:12:14 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] member_posting_only=yes problem In-Reply-To: <20001104121100.A16343@cathat.net> References: <4.2.2.20001104092026.00aa51b0@pop.mindspring.com> <4.2.2.20001104092026.00aa51b0@pop.mindspring.com> Message-ID: <4.2.2.20001104100403.00ac5200@pop.mindspring.com> At 12:11 PM 11/4/00 -0600, Johnny Fuerst wrote: >On Sat, Nov 04, 2000 at 09:35:25AM -0800, Mike Noyes wrote: > > I'm the admin for a devel list on SourceForge. I have a > > member of my list that has different From and Reply-To > > addresses. He is subscribed with his Reply-To address. When > > I set member_posting_only=yes all of his messages are held > > for approval. Is there any way around this problem? > >I am only running Mailman 1.1, but what I think is the solution should be >the same. On the admin web screen, under privacy options for the list in >question, there is an option which says allow posters not on list, or >something like that. This is where you can add the guy's real address. First, thanks for the response. Is the quoted text below the setting you're referring to? If so, it adds his From address to the recipient list. He was not happy when I tried this. Is there another way to achieve the same thing? >Addresses of members accepted for posting to this list without implicit >approval requirement. (See "Restrict ... to list members" for whether or >not this is in addition to allowing posting by list members -- Mike Noyes mhnoyes at users.sourceforge.net http://sourceforge.net/projects/leaf From chuqui at plaidworks.com Sat Nov 4 19:32:15 2000 From: chuqui at plaidworks.com (Chuq Von Rospach) Date: Sat, 4 Nov 2000 10:32:15 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] member_posting_only=yes problem In-Reply-To: <4.2.2.20001104092026.00aa51b0@pop.mindspring.com> References: <4.2.2.20001104092026.00aa51b0@pop.mindspring.com> Message-ID: At 9:35 AM -0800 11/4/00, Mike Noyes wrote: >I'm the admin for a devel list on SourceForge. I have a member of my >list that has different From and Reply-To addresses. He is >subscribed with his Reply-To address. When I set >member_posting_only=yes all of his messages are held for approval. >Is there any way around this problem? well, at one level, I think what he's doing is wrong, but we won't get into that philosopical range war. But the basic issue is that he *isn't* a member of the list, since the From address isn't subscribed. Two solutions. 1) he subscribes both addresses to the list, and sets "nomail" flag to the one in his from address. he can do that without admin intervention, so that's what I usually recommend. 2) set his address as not needing admin overview -- that's an option on the privacy page of the admin page. that way, you're saying "this guy is okay" and it won't be held. which works as long as he really is okay, but that's an admin issue.. (grin) -- Chuq Von Rospach - Plaidworks Consulting (mailto:chuqui at plaidworks.com) Apple Mail List Gnome (mailto:chuq at apple.com) Be just, and fear not. From chuqui at plaidworks.com Sat Nov 4 19:29:15 2000 From: chuqui at plaidworks.com (Chuq Von Rospach) Date: Sat, 4 Nov 2000 10:29:15 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Developers] Re: [Mailman-Users] Problem with qrunner and too much incoming mail In-Reply-To: <20435.973357599@kanga.nu> References: <20001103113539.S22363@marc.merlins.org> <14852.11186.967453.490195@anthem.concentric.net> <20435.973357599@kanga.nu> Message-ID: > > Once a connetion to the MX is established, bulkmail would then >> just start delivering messages to it until the bin was emptied. >> Any i/o blocks in any of the processes will allow async* to switch >> to a different delivery channel. We may need to do some explicit >> channel management to make sure some are not starved. > >Ouch. I really don't like this idea. Neither do I. This is actually something that I've looked at long and hard in my non-mailman server work. After a fair amount of work and research, I finally came to the conclusion that you are MUCH better off letting the MTA do the MTA's work, and letting the MLM do the MLM work, and once you make the decision that the MLM has to *also* become an MTA, you're doing down a road you don't want to travel. Sendmail, for instance, has many years experience optimizing delivery as an MTA. It's a complex, nasty business with lots of subtleties. If you're building a list manager, how much work would you need to do to get a private delivery system that's as well tuned and efficient as sendmail already is? ditto all of the other MTAs. I've built some prototype systems to test this. Even though (in theory) you're adding a layer of delivery and other overhead, it's very difficult to come even close to the performance a tuned MTA can give you -- and you're writing a lot of code to do it. One of the systems I've been investigating, for instance, would do 100% customized mail driven by a template document and pulling data out of a database -- with a design parameter of up to 10 million deliveries. the goal is at least 500K deliveries an hour, preferably double that. Right now, on a system with a sendmail 8.9 base and a non-optimized delivery tool, I'm doing 400-450K/hour. I expect to see a nice addition when I move to sendmail 8.10.x in a week or so. this is on a Sun E250, FWIW, with the sendmail queues living in a ram disk. Good sized hardware, but not particularly big or fast hardware. Instead of reinventing the MTA wheel, I think we're much better off coming up with an MTA -> MLM interface that's very flexible and highly configurable (most especially in how to deliver and how much to parallelize the infeed to the MLM), and then focus on how to tune the MTA and MLM through documentation. Splitting the inbound and outbound queue would be my first thing here, and probably split bounces into a third queue. That's a pretty quick, easy optimization that makes sure the end user sees fast response without being bogged down by deliveries, and that's a huge perception issue. Then focus on parallelizing the delivery from mailman into the MTA, and make that configurable so each admin can tune it to their system and needs. >As discussed previously amongst Chuq, Nigel and I, the needs of >large list server systems are rather different from the normal home >hobbyest requirements, but are not compleatly alien. However, the >needs of very large list installations (cf ListServ, Egroups, or >SourceForge) are rather different yet again. This is a basic reality -- things don't scale. Or worse, they scale for a while, and then you need to switch paradigms. I found that one out the hard way. If someone wants a rhetoric on how to scale mail list servers infinitely, I'd be happy to explain how, since I've had to develop an architecture to do so. the nice thing is, it can be done without exceptional engineering hassles -- but it's not just adding another daemon or a faster CPU (although those are solutions for parts of it, just not ALKWAYs the solutions) > I'm not convinced of >the value in beating on Mailman to support the (comparitively rare >if high profile) very large installations when the current (much >larger and more common Mailman-wise) mid-size realm still needs >attention. Certainly, such changes should not detract from >Mailman's current level of suitability for smaller installations. I think we can build a Mailman that does this, at least for, oh, 95% of the universe out there, and the other 5% are going to have custom solutions anyway (or should!). What we don't want to do is screw up Mailman for the "typical" user to make it work for the big site; but we also don't want Mailman to get a reputation as a "small server only" system, because it'll cause people to reject it in implementations. Fortunately, I don't think you need to do that. It just needs some tweaking. >support for intermittently connected nodes. Say something like: > > Cron launches the bulkmailer. > The bulkmailer forks N children processing the queue. > The bulkmailer exits upon an empty queue. > Should cron launch a new bulkmailer when the prevvious incarnation > hasn't exited yet, the new instance merely exits immediately. > >Locking for the above is fairly simple. Standard IPCs can be used >for the instance collision checks. Locking on the hash queues could >be a bit intereting from a portability and performance vantage given >the fact that the list side will be attemptiong to deliver into the >same tree at the same time that deliveries are happening (no more >lock collisions please) -- which pretty much requires that locking >be on the queue-entry level rather than the hash bucket level. Not >rocket science, just a bit finnicky. > >Will this handle SourceForge? Probably. On reasonable hardware, definitely. That's basically how my current custom system works. right now, the number of parallel infeeds from mailman is 1. I'm willing to bet the delivery MTA is basically idle and bored. By moving to parallel infeeds, you can stoke the MTA up to speed, and the trick is for each site to figure out what number of parallel infeeds will work keeping the queues full for the MTA to stay busy without overloading them and causing the MTA to thrash. That's simply a case of tuning and modelling. And simply allowing "N" infeed threads to the MLM will solve Sourceforge's problem and pretty much everyone else's, without having to get into the MTA business, where the best we can really hope is to be "as good" as the real MTA. so my recommendation is: 1) split the current qfiles into three queues: inbound, outbound and bounce 2) parallelize the outbound queue into "N" configurable delivery threads. 3) work on documentation on how to tune this for maximum perforamnce with major MTAs, and how to tune MTAs for maxiumum performance. That's a set of pretty easy updates, no technological miracles or black boxes, and solves all but the worst problems someone running Mailman is likely to see. And for sites this *doesn't* solve, it's either because they're doing the 5 pounds in a 1 pound bag thing, or they probably need to start hiring people like us to custom build someething. -- Chuq Von Rospach - Plaidworks Consulting (mailto:chuqui at plaidworks.com) Apple Mail List Gnome (mailto:chuq at apple.com) Be just, and fear not. From chuqui at plaidworks.com Sat Nov 4 19:35:45 2000 From: chuqui at plaidworks.com (Chuq Von Rospach) Date: Sat, 4 Nov 2000 10:35:45 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Problem with qrunner and too much incoming mail In-Reply-To: <14852.11186.967453.490195@anthem.concentric.net> References: <20001103113539.S22363@marc.merlins.org> <14852.11186.967453.490195@anthem.concentric.net> Message-ID: At 10:30 AM -0500 11/4/00, Barry A. Warsaw wrote: > >So this new process, let's call it `bulkmail'. Just as a completely irrelevant aside -- be careful what you name things, since there are people out there with really stupid anti-spam systems that look at words like "bulk" and "mail" and say "oh! it must be spam!" No, I'm serious. In fact, majordomo admins are probably familiar with a delivery tool called bulk_mailer. there are a few sites out there that are really clueless that bounce mail because they find bulk_mailer in a Received line, and assume it's spam. Which is why my copies of bulk_mailer now identify themselves in the Received lines as ulkbbay-ailermay. So be very wary naming things that might even remotely have reference to things someone might remotely consider related to anything spam. Just to be safe. -- Chuq Von Rospach - Plaidworks Consulting (mailto:chuqui at plaidworks.com) Apple Mail List Gnome (mailto:chuq at apple.com) Be just, and fear not. From johnny at cathat.net Sat Nov 4 20:05:21 2000 From: johnny at cathat.net (Johnny Fuerst) Date: Sat, 4 Nov 2000 13:05:21 -0600 Subject: [Mailman-Users] member_posting_only=yes problem In-Reply-To: <4.2.2.20001104100403.00ac5200@pop.mindspring.com>; from mhnoyes@users.sourceforge.net on Sat, Nov 04, 2000 at 10:12:14AM -0800 References: <4.2.2.20001104092026.00aa51b0@pop.mindspring.com> <4.2.2.20001104092026.00aa51b0@pop.mindspring.com> <20001104121100.A16343@cathat.net> <4.2.2.20001104100403.00ac5200@pop.mindspring.com> Message-ID: <20001104130521.A16378@cathat.net> On Sat, Nov 04, 2000 at 10:12:14AM -0800, Mike Noyes wrote: > At 12:11 PM 11/4/00 -0600, Johnny Fuerst wrote: > >On Sat, Nov 04, 2000 at 09:35:25AM -0800, Mike Noyes wrote: > > > I'm the admin for a devel list on SourceForge. I have a > > > member of my list that has different From and Reply-To > > > addresses. He is subscribed with his Reply-To address. When > > > I set member_posting_only=yes all of his messages are held > > > for approval. Is there any way around this problem? > > > >I am only running Mailman 1.1, but what I think is the solution should be > >the same. On the admin web screen, under privacy options for the list in > >question, there is an option which says allow posters not on list, or > >something like that. This is where you can add the guy's real address. > > First, thanks for the response. > > Is the quoted text below the setting you're referring to? If so, it adds > his From address to the recipient list. He was not happy when I tried this. > Is there another way to achieve the same thing? I don't know of another way. But, I can see this as being somthing that maybe should be in a newer version of mailman. Allowing to tie additional address (aliases) for one member of a list. Because with the option we've discussed, the added member can pretty much have free reign to posting to that list, at least in my understanding, as the actual option is not for differing addresses, but appears to be intended for allowing people to simply post, with or without the admin's approval -which, in some cases, could turn out to be bad. > >Addresses of members accepted for posting to this list without implicit > >approval requirement. (See "Restrict ... to list members" for whether or > >not this is in addition to allowing posting by list members > > -- > Mike Noyes > mhnoyes at users.sourceforge.net > http://sourceforge.net/projects/leaf > > > ------------------------------------------------------ > Mailman-Users maillist - Mailman-Users at python.org > http://www.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users -- On Behalf Of: Johnny Fuerst, Governor ................ governor at cathat.net Opinions stated in this message are mine and mine alone, and do not necessarily represent those of my ISP/employer! .period. ------------------------------------------------------------ 'I Desire Compassion, and not a Sacrifice.' 'La Vida E Bella' ____________________________ Random Quote: You will be Told about it Tomorrow. Go Home and Prepare Thyself. johnny at cathat.net From mhnoyes at users.sourceforge.net Sat Nov 4 22:01:59 2000 From: mhnoyes at users.sourceforge.net (Mike Noyes) Date: Sat, 04 Nov 2000 13:01:59 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] member_posting_only=yes problem In-Reply-To: References: <4.2.2.20001104092026.00aa51b0@pop.mindspring.com> <4.2.2.20001104092026.00aa51b0@pop.mindspring.com> Message-ID: <4.2.2.20001104122547.00acfe30@pop.mindspring.com> At 10:32 AM 11/4/00 -0800, Chuq Von Rospach wrote: >At 9:35 AM -0800 11/4/00, Mike Noyes wrote: >>I'm the admin for a devel list on SourceForge. I have a member of my list >>that has different From and Reply-To addresses. He is subscribed with his >>Reply-To address. When I set member_posting_only=yes all of his messages >>are held for approval. Is there any way around this problem? > >well, at one level, I think what he's doing is wrong, but we won't get >into that philosopical range war. But the basic issue is that he *isn't* a >member of the list, since the From address isn't subscribed. > >Two solutions. > >1) he subscribes both addresses to the list, and sets "nomail" flag to the >one in his from address. he can do that without admin intervention, so >that's what I usually recommend. I'll suggest this solution to him. Thanks for the idea. >2) set his address as not needing admin overview -- that's an option on >the privacy page of the admin page. that way, you're saying "this guy is >okay" and it won't be held. which works as long as he really is okay, but >that's an admin issue.. (grin) He is trustworthy, but I don't want to set a bad precedent. -- Mike Noyes mhnoyes at users.sourceforge.net http://sourceforge.net/projects/leaf From mhnoyes at users.sourceforge.net Sat Nov 4 22:02:31 2000 From: mhnoyes at users.sourceforge.net (Mike Noyes) Date: Sat, 04 Nov 2000 13:02:31 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] member_posting_only=yes problem In-Reply-To: <20001104130521.A16378@cathat.net> References: <4.2.2.20001104100403.00ac5200@pop.mindspring.com> <4.2.2.20001104092026.00aa51b0@pop.mindspring.com> <4.2.2.20001104092026.00aa51b0@pop.mindspring.com> <20001104121100.A16343@cathat.net> <4.2.2.20001104100403.00ac5200@pop.mindspring.com> Message-ID: <4.2.2.20001104124427.00aff4d0@pop.mindspring.com> At 01:05 PM 11/4/00 -0600, Johnny Fuerst wrote: >On Sat, Nov 04, 2000 at 10:12:14AM -0800, Mike Noyes wrote: > > At 12:11 PM 11/4/00 -0600, Johnny Fuerst wrote: > > >On Sat, Nov 04, 2000 at 09:35:25AM -0800, Mike Noyes wrote: > > > > I'm the admin for a devel list on SourceForge. I have a > > > > member of my list that has different From and Reply-To > > > > addresses. He is subscribed with his Reply-To address. > > > > When I set member_posting_only=yes all of his messages > > > > are held for approval. Is there any way around this > > > > problem? > > > > > >I am only running Mailman 1.1, but what I think is the > > >solution should be the same. On the admin web screen, under > > >privacy options for the list in question, there is an > > >option which says allow posters not on list, or something > > >like that. This is where you can add the guy's real > > >address. > > > > > Is there another way to achieve the same thing? > >I don't know of another way. But, I can see this as being somthing that >maybe should be in a newer version of mailman. Allowing to tie additional >address (aliases) for one member of a list. ... You read my mind. I thought of one other way for mailman to solve the problem. It could check the Reply-To header along with From to verify list membership. This does open a potential spam hole. -- Mike Noyes mhnoyes at users.sourceforge.net http://sourceforge.net/projects/leaf From chuqui at plaidworks.com Sat Nov 4 23:07:29 2000 From: chuqui at plaidworks.com (Chuq Von Rospach) Date: Sat, 4 Nov 2000 14:07:29 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] member_posting_only=yes problem In-Reply-To: <4.2.2.20001104122547.00acfe30@pop.mindspring.com> References: <4.2.2.20001104092026.00aa51b0@pop.mindspring.com> <4.2.2.20001104092026.00aa51b0@pop.mindspring.com> <4.2.2.20001104122547.00acfe30@pop.mindspring.com> Message-ID: At 1:01 PM -0800 11/4/00, Mike Noyes wrote: >He is trustworthy, but I don't want to set a bad precedent. or worse, an adminstrative nightmare. Anything you have to do for the user is something that takes time you probably don't have... -- Chuq Von Rospach - Plaidworks Consulting (mailto:chuqui at plaidworks.com) Apple Mail List Gnome (mailto:chuq at apple.com) Be just, and fear not. From satyap at satya.virtualave.net Sun Nov 5 03:35:26 2000 From: satyap at satya.virtualave.net (Satya) Date: Sun, 5 Nov 2000 08:05:26 +0530 (IST) Subject: [Mailman-Users] Problem with qrunner and too much incoming mail In-Reply-To: <14852.11186.967453.490195@anthem.concentric.net> Message-ID: On Nov 4, 2000 at 10:30, Barry A. Warsaw wrote: >So one of the problems is that the handoff between Mailman and the MTA >is synchronous with some aspect of the MTA's delivery to the remote >site, namely dns lookup. One of the first things you need to do is >break this synchrony, either by improving the dns lookup on the MTA >side or putting the MTA in asynchronous mode for local message >acceptance. Basically you want Mailman to just say "here, don't >process this yet, just drop it in your outgoing queue and deal with it >later." This might be related to DSN (delivery status notification); Okay... there's this howto on Linux: Linux Mail-Queue mini-HOWTO Queue Remote Mail + Deliver Local Mail The Configuration Changes Nec- cessary to Make Sendmail Deliver Local Mail ***Now*** While Stashing Remote Mail in The Queue Until "I Say So". Which may work. It is sendmail-specific, though. -- Satya. US-bound grad students! For pre-apps, see Who stole my tagline? From chuqui at plaidworks.com Sun Nov 5 08:04:28 2000 From: chuqui at plaidworks.com (Chuq Von Rospach) Date: Sat, 4 Nov 2000 23:04:28 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Problem with qrunner and too much incoming mail In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: At 8:05 AM +0530 11/5/00, Satya wrote: > > >Okay... there's this howto on Linux: Linux Mail-Queue mini-HOWTO It hasn't been updated since sendmail 8.8.7, according to the copy on linuxdoc.org. It's basically useless -- exceptionally obsolete, and it's aimed explicitly at dial-on-demand connections. I went and took a look, and it really doesn't have much that's useful for what we're doing here, unfortunately. -- Chuq Von Rospach - Plaidworks Consulting (mailto:chuqui at plaidworks.com) Apple Mail List Gnome (mailto:chuq at apple.com) Be just, and fear not. From vikas98 at hotmail.com Sun Nov 5 08:30:51 2000 From: vikas98 at hotmail.com (Vikas Gupta) Date: Sun, 05 Nov 2000 07:30:51 GMT Subject: [Mailman-Users] cannot list public archives from listinfo, can from admin Message-ID: I know this has been asked on this list before but I think I have a new twist which I cant figure out. I have created a public list, which is listed fine under /admin, but does not appear under /listinfo. I get the : "There currently are no publicly-advertised mailman mailing lists" message. I believe I have folloed the INSTALL instrctions correctly for mailman and apache. Can anyone help me out? Thanks in advance, Vikas _________________________________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com. Share information about yourself, create your own public profile at http://profiles.msn.com. From jsmoriss at jsm-mv.dyndns.org Sun Nov 5 16:54:25 2000 From: jsmoriss at jsm-mv.dyndns.org (Jean-Sebastien Morisset) Date: Sun, 5 Nov 2000 10:54:25 -0500 Subject: [Mailman-Users] HTML support in v2.0beta6 Message-ID: <20001105105425.A18658@marvin.homeip.net> I switched to Mailman v2.0beta6 from Majordomo a few weeks ago. Everything is working smoothly, except for one mailing list which sends out HTML messages. They show up fine on Outlook etc., but Mailman seems to change the MIME/multipart encoding -- Mutt (and probably Pine too) shows 4 attachements when there should be only two! i.e.: --begin-- I 1 [multipa/alternativ, 7bit, 3.3K] I 2 ??> [text/plain, 7bit, us-ascii, 0.9K] I 3 ??> [multipa/related, 7bit, 2.1K] I 4 ??> [text/html, 7bit, us-ascii, 2.0K] --end-- Attachements #1 and #3 shouldn't be there! The content of #1 is identical to #2, but #3 looks a little suspicious. Here's the content of #3: --begin-- [-- Attachment #1 --] [-- Type: text/html, Encoding: 7bit, Size: 2.0K --] [-- text/html is unsupported --] --end-- The archiving doesn't work either. You can see a sample yourself at . Is this a known problem? I hope it's not a feature... Thanks, js. -- Jean-Sebastien Morisset, Sr. UNIX Admin Personal Homepage UNIX, Internet, Homebrewing, Cigars, PCS, CP2020 and other Fun Stuff... This is Linux Country. On a quiet night you can hear Windows NT reboot! From michael at smudo.emjay.net Sun Nov 5 20:48:15 2000 From: michael at smudo.emjay.net (Michael Johnson) Date: Sun, 5 Nov 2000 14:48:15 -0500 (EST) Subject: [Mailman-Users] Setup Trouble Message-ID: Hi Gang I've been trying to set up Mailman on my OS X system with the postfix MTA. I've cleared all the checks in the check_perms script and am to the pont of the mmsitepass part. When I run bin/mmsitepass , I get this: Traceback (most recent call last): File "./mmsitepass", line 32, in ? from Mailman import MailList File "/Users/mailman/Mailman/MailList.py", line 41, in ? from Mailman.Archiver import Archiver File "/Users/mailman/Mailman/Archiver/__init__.py", line 17, in ? from Archiver import * File "/Users/mailman/Mailman/Archiver/Archiver.py", line 34, in ? from Mailman import Mailbox File "/Users/mailman/Mailman/Mailbox.py", line 21, in ? import mailbox File "/Users/mailman/Mailman/Mailbox.py", line 23, in ? class Mailbox(mailbox.UnixMailbox): AttributeError: UnixMailbox I'm totally confused...I didn't see anything in the FAQ about this. I guess there have been no problems with the mmsitepass up to now. Any pointers on where to look to fix this? -Michael From bob at nleaudio.com Mon Nov 6 03:56:06 2000 From: bob at nleaudio.com (Bob Puff@NLE) Date: Sun, 05 Nov 2000 21:56:06 -0500 Subject: [Mailman-Users] member_posting_only=yes problem References: <4.2.2.20001104092026.00aa51b0@pop.mindspring.com> <4.2.2.20001104092026.00aa51b0@pop.mindspring.com> <4.2.2.20001104122547.00acfe30@pop.mindspring.com> Message-ID: <3A061DC6.BFB06011@nleaudio.com> Couldn't you subscribe his From: address to the list, and set it for 'inactive' (or whatever the "no receive mail for now" setting is? Bob Mike Noyes wrote: > > At 10:32 AM 11/4/00 -0800, Chuq Von Rospach wrote: > >At 9:35 AM -0800 11/4/00, Mike Noyes wrote: > >>I'm the admin for a devel list on SourceForge. I have a member of my list > >>that has different From and Reply-To addresses. He is subscribed with his > >>Reply-To address. When I set member_posting_only=yes all of his messages > >>are held for approval. Is there any way around this problem? > > > >well, at one level, I think what he's doing is wrong, but we won't get > >into that philosopical range war. But the basic issue is that he *isn't* a > >member of the list, since the From address isn't subscribed. > > > >Two solutions. > > > >1) he subscribes both addresses to the list, and sets "nomail" flag to the > >one in his from address. he can do that without admin intervention, so > >that's what I usually recommend. > > I'll suggest this solution to him. Thanks for the idea. > > >2) set his address as not needing admin overview -- that's an option on > >the privacy page of the admin page. that way, you're saying "this guy is > >okay" and it won't be held. which works as long as he really is okay, but > >that's an admin issue.. (grin) > > He is trustworthy, but I don't want to set a bad precedent. > > -- > Mike Noyes > mhnoyes at users.sourceforge.net > http://sourceforge.net/projects/leaf > > ------------------------------------------------------ > Mailman-Users maillist - Mailman-Users at python.org > http://www.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users From claw at kanga.nu Mon Nov 6 08:23:35 2000 From: claw at kanga.nu (J C Lawrence) Date: Sun, 05 Nov 2000 23:23:35 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Developers] Re: [Mailman-Users] Problem with qrunner and too much incoming mail In-Reply-To: Message from Chuq Von Rospach of "Sat, 04 Nov 2000 10:29:15 PST." References: <20001103113539.S22363@marc.merlins.org> <14852.11186.967453.490195@anthem.concentric.net> <20435.973357599@kanga.nu> Message-ID: <4754.973495415@kanga.nu> On Sat, 4 Nov 2000 10:29:15 -0800 Chuq Von Rospach wrote: >> > Once a connetion to the MX is established, bulkmail would then >>> just start delivering messages to it until the bin was emptied. >>> Any i/o blocks in any of the processes will allow async* to >>> switch to a different delivery channel. We may need to do some >>> explicit channel management to make sure some are not starved. >> Ouch. I really don't like this idea. > Neither do I. This is actually something that I've looked at long > and hard in my non-mailman server work. After a fair amount of > work and research, I finally came to the conclusion that you are > MUCH better off letting the MTA do the MTA's work, and letting the > MLM do the MLM work, and once you make the decision that the MLM > has to *also* become an MTA, you're doing down a road you don't > want to travel. Agreed. There's also the simple aspect of the fact that optimising for the very large case (which needs the MLM-sepcific MTA supports ala ListServ) is near on pessimal for the small and medium cases. Spiffy domain based routing and near-target explosion just don't make a whole lot of sense for lists with a few hundred/thousand members. Asides from which, the optimisations for mail delivery to a massive number of targets and mass mail delivery to a comparitively constrained target set can be rather different. That's ugly territorry. We don't need to go there yet. > Instead of reinventing the MTA wheel, I think we're much better > off coming up with an MTA -> MLM interface that's very flexible > and highly configurable (most especially in how to deliver and how > much to parallelize the infeed to the MLM), and then focus on how > to tune the MTA and MLM through documentation. Agreed. There's not a whole lot of tuning you can do on SMTP hand-offs to the MTA (which is necessary as a feature to support non-localhost MTAs which is in turn needed by many sites), but some MTAs have divers command line options that can be useful in an MLM delivery world (peeking quickly at the Exim docs). > Splitting the inbound and outbound queue would be my first thing > here, and probably split bounces into a third queue. That's a > pretty quick, easy optimization that makes sure the end user sees > fast response without being bogged down by deliveries, and that's > a huge perception issue. Then focus on parallelizing the delivery > from mailman into the MTA, and make that configurable so each > admin can tune it to their system and needs. Without spending any time collecting metrics, it does look like the low hanging fruit is in handling the MLM->MTA handoff. Given that the distribution of posts across lists is often uneven (and unpredictable), and that the optimal parallelism (N) is fairly fixed for a given machine, any pattern which supported keeping N pipes stuffed throwing things at the MTA (with minimal locking) would seem fair. As for splitting the queues, yep, hadn't thought about that aspect, but that's an obvious contention area for an active list. >> As discussed previously amongst Chuq, Nigel and I, the needs of >> large list server systems are rather different from the normal >> home hobbyest requirements, but are not compleatly alien. >> However, the needs of very large list installations (cf ListServ, >> Egroups, or SourceForge) are rather different yet again. > This is a basic reality -- things don't scale. Or worse, they > scale for a while, and then you need to switch paradigms. I found > that one out the hard way. If someone wants a rhetoric on how to > scale mail list servers infinitely, I'd be happy to explain how, > since I've had to develop an architecture to do so. the nice thing > is, it can be done without exceptional engineering hassles -- but > it's not just adding another daemon or a faster CPU (although > those are solutions for parts of it, just not ALKWAYs the > solutions) We should really have lunch some time. I'm currently working down off San Tomas and Saratoga (startup, oddly enough next door to BeOpen). I'm wrapping up this contract this month and looking for next one, so time is a little tight here, but I'd love to get together for a chat. You over at the main Apple campus? >> I'm not convinced of the value in beating on Mailman to support >> the (comparitively rare if high profile) very large installations >> when the current (much larger and more common Mailman-wise) >> mid-size realm still needs attention. Certainly, such changes >> should not detract from Mailman's current level of suitability >> for smaller installations. > I think we can build a Mailman that does this, at least for, oh, > 95% of the universe out there, and the other 5% are going to have > custom solutions anyway (or should!). What we don't want to do is > screw up Mailman for the "typical" user to make it work for the > big site; but we also don't want Mailman to get a reputation as a > "small server only" system, because it'll cause people to reject > it in implementations. Fortunately, I don't think you need to do > that. It just needs some tweaking. We must stop agreeing like this. Its getting embarassing. > And for sites this *doesn't* solve, it's either because they're > doing the 5 pounds in a 1 pound bag thing, or they probably need > to start hiring people like us to custom build someething. Ungghhhh. -- J C Lawrence Home: claw at kanga.nu ---------(*) Other: coder at kanga.nu http://www.kanga.nu/~claw/ Keys etc: finger claw at kanga.nu --=| A man is as sane as he is dangerous to his environment |=-- From chuqui at plaidworks.com Mon Nov 6 08:39:37 2000 From: chuqui at plaidworks.com (Chuq Von Rospach) Date: Sun, 5 Nov 2000 23:39:37 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Developers] Re: [Mailman-Users] Problem with qrunner and too much incoming mail In-Reply-To: <4754.973495415@kanga.nu> References: <20001103113539.S22363@marc.merlins.org> <14852.11186.967453.490195@anthem.concentric.net> <20435.973357599@kanga.nu> <4754.973495415@kanga.nu> Message-ID: At 11:23 PM -0800 11/5/00, J C Lawrence wrote: > >Agreed. There's also the simple aspect of the fact that optimising >for the very large case (which needs the MLM-sepcific MTA supports >ala ListServ) is near on pessimal for the small and medium cases. >Spiffy domain based routing and near-target explosion just don't >make a whole lot of sense for lists with a few hundred/thousand >members. Asides from which, the optimisations for mail delivery to >a massive number of targets and mass mail delivery to a >comparitively constrained target set can be rather different. Nope. This is a job for -- ta da -- an API with a plug in architecture. Don't try to solve the huge list probelm, but solve the 90% problem (what works for the first 90% of the sites out there), and make it easy to plug in a different delivery beast so that other 10% can simply write a new module and swap it in (and hopefully send it back to the mailman project...) > >We should really have lunch some time. I'm currently working down >off San Tomas and Saratoga (startup, oddly enough next door to >BeOpen). I'm wrapping up this contract this month and looking for >next one, so time is a little tight here, but I'd love to get >together for a chat. You over at the main Apple campus? Effectively, yes. I'm down by the data center, which is hidden a bit off campus. > > And for sites this *doesn't* solve, it's either because they're >> doing the 5 pounds in a 1 pound bag thing, or they probably need >> to start hiring people like us to custom build someething. > >Ungghhhh. heh. -- Chuq Von Rospach - Plaidworks Consulting (mailto:chuqui at plaidworks.com) Apple Mail List Gnome (mailto:chuq at apple.com) Be just, and fear not. From xiao.bing at oztime.com Mon Nov 6 09:05:38 2000 From: xiao.bing at oztime.com (Xiao Bing) Date: Mon, 6 Nov 2000 16:05:38 +0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Can Mailman cgi part can separate from Mail part? Message-ID: <047a01c047c8$599ff3a0$eb00a8c0@prc.oztime.com> We have a Mail server in host A. and We have a Apache httpd server in host B. Can I install mailman core part on host A. Then install Cgi part host B. How to do that? Jack -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mail.python.org/pipermail/mailman-users/attachments/20001106/e5458ba7/attachment.html From techgrrl at beeze.com Mon Nov 6 09:13:13 2000 From: techgrrl at beeze.com (Sarah K. Miller) Date: Mon, 6 Nov 2000 00:13:13 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Mailman Processes Hung Message-ID: <011801c047c9$6961ce70$3601a8c0@beeze.com> Can anyone offer an explanation of why these processes seem to be hanging? Also, will anything be damaged if we simply nuke them?? ----- Original Message ----- > mailman's spawned two more qrunner processes... > > $ uptime > 4:01pm up 51 day(s), 2:02, 1 user, load average: 2.15, 1.93, 1.50 > > $ ps -aef | grep mailman > > mailman 10100 10097 12 16:01:01 ? 0:03 /usr/local/bin/python -S > /export/ > home/mailman/cron/qrunner > > mailman 1375 171 0 Nov 04 ? 0:00 sh -c /usr/local/bin/python > -S /e > xport/home/mailman/cron/qrunner > > mailman 1376 1375 1 Nov 04 ? 9:20 /usr/local/bin/python -S > /export/ > home/mailman/cron/qrunner > > mys 10106 10085 1 16:01:12 pts/2 0:00 grep mailman > > mailman 10097 171 1 16:01:00 ? 0:00 sh -c /usr/local/bin/python > -S /e > xport/home/mailman/cron/qrunner > > mailman 24799 171 0 Nov 04 ? 0:00 sh -c /usr/local/bin/python > -S /e > xport/home/mailman/cron/qrunner > > mailman 24800 24799 1 Nov 04 ? 13:50 /usr/local/bin/python -S > /export/ > home/mailman/cron/qrunner ______________________________ Sarah K. Miller, List Administrator D i g i t a l E v e sarah at digitaleve.org www.digitaleve.org technology|creativity|community From strobel at hochfranken-online.de Mon Nov 6 12:50:01 2000 From: strobel at hochfranken-online.de (Rainer Strobel) Date: Mon, 6 Nov 2000 11:50:01 +0000 Subject: [Mailman-Users] sendmail says "Data format error" In-Reply-To: References: <200010301051.e9UApap29111@ds1.hochfranken-online.de> Message-ID: <200011061050.eA6Ao3817998@ds1.hochfranken-online.de> Hi > >Anybody who knows what's wrong when sendmail says: "DSN: Data format > >error" while mailman is trying to deliver a mail to the list-members > >? > > At what point is this happening? To everyone? Certain users? > It happens even when mailman tries to send a message to the list members. ******************************* Rainer Strobel HochFranken Online GmbH&Co.KG Bachstr.4, 95176 Konradsreuth Tel. 09292/9594-0 ******************************* -------------- next part -------------- This message contains a file prepared for transmission using the MIME BASE64 transfer encoding scheme. If you are using Pegasus Mail or another MIME-compliant system, you should be able to extract it from within your mailer. If you cannot, please ask your system administrator for help. ---- File information ----------- File: error.txt Date: 6 Nov 2000, 11:49 Size: 1218 bytes. Type: Unknown -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: error.txt Type: application/octet-stream Size: 1218 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://mail.python.org/pipermail/mailman-users/attachments/20001106/d11c5e85/attachment.obj From a2m3 at Tonelli.sns.it Mon Nov 6 12:00:22 2000 From: a2m3 at Tonelli.sns.it (Andrea Mennucci) Date: Mon, 6 Nov 2000 12:00:22 +0100 Subject: [Mailman-Users] mailman: can't access the private archives of a list In-Reply-To: <20001103140103.B3390@wirex.com>; from wcooley@wirex.com on Fri, Nov 03, 2000 at 02:01:03PM -0800 References: <20001103140929.A3306@Tonelli.sns.it> <20001103140103.B3390@wirex.com> Message-ID: <20001106120021.A4592@Tonelli.sns.it> hi On Fri, Nov 03, 2000 at 02:01:03PM -0800, W. Reilly Cooley wrote: > On Fri, Nov 03, 2000 at 02:09:29PM +0100, Andrea Mennucci wrote: > > > > the only problem is that > > I have created a private list XYZ, with private archives, and > > the web page for XYZ reads > > ---- > > About XYZ > > To see the collection of prior postings to the list, visit > > the XYZ Archives. The current archive is only available > > to the list members. > > ---- > > but the link of the archive points to > > http://tonelli.sns.it/mailman/private/XYZ/ > > > > which is non existent > > > > I have read all documentation and I cant find a way to fix it > > > > Did you try sending a test message to the list? You get the error you > mention before the first message is submitted, because the web archiver > hasn't run yet. (I think) > I had tried, but the problem is more complex than that I have tried also to add the lines Alias /mailman/private/ /var/lib/mailman/archives/private/ in /etc/apache/srm.conf but then when someone accesses the address http://tonelli.sns.it/mailman/private/XYZ/ s/he can read all the archive, without any password Instead mailman claims that > the XYZ Archives. The current archive is only available > > to the list members. and this is the functionality that I would like to get anyway thanks a. > -- Andrea C. Mennucci, Scuola Normale Superiore, Pisa, Italy From Dan.Mick at west.sun.com Mon Nov 6 12:11:12 2000 From: Dan.Mick at west.sun.com (Dan Mick) Date: Mon, 06 Nov 2000 03:11:12 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Mailman Processes Hung References: <011801c047c9$6961ce70$3601a8c0@beeze.com> Message-ID: <3A0691D0.339C235@west.sun.com> "Sarah K. Miller" wrote: > > Can anyone offer an explanation of why these processes seem to be hanging? Not without more info, but it's always instructive to look at what they're doing: use the system-call trace utility, that's what it's for. (truss, ktrace, strace) > Also, will anything be damaged if we simply nuke them?? Probably not, but try to be nice with signals, and go check ~mailman/locks to make sure they didn't leave one around (which might be why the others are hanging). > > ----- Original Message ----- > > mailman's spawned two more qrunner processes... > > > > $ uptime > > 4:01pm up 51 day(s), 2:02, 1 user, load average: 2.15, 1.93, 1.50 > > > > $ ps -aef | grep mailman > > > > mailman 10100 10097 12 16:01:01 ? 0:03 /usr/local/bin/python -S > > /export/ > > home/mailman/cron/qrunner > > > > mailman 1375 171 0 Nov 04 ? 0:00 sh -c > /usr/local/bin/python > > -S /e > > xport/home/mailman/cron/qrunner > > > > mailman 1376 1375 1 Nov 04 ? 9:20 /usr/local/bin/python -S > > /export/ > > home/mailman/cron/qrunner > > > > mys 10106 10085 1 16:01:12 pts/2 0:00 grep mailman > > > > mailman 10097 171 1 16:01:00 ? 0:00 sh -c > /usr/local/bin/python > > -S /e > > xport/home/mailman/cron/qrunner > > > > mailman 24799 171 0 Nov 04 ? 0:00 sh -c > /usr/local/bin/python > > -S /e > > xport/home/mailman/cron/qrunner > > > > mailman 24800 24799 1 Nov 04 ? 13:50 /usr/local/bin/python -S > > /export/ > > home/mailman/cron/qrunner > > ______________________________ > Sarah K. Miller, List Administrator > D i g i t a l E v e > sarah at digitaleve.org > www.digitaleve.org > technology|creativity|community > > ------------------------------------------------------ > Mailman-Users maillist - Mailman-Users at python.org > http://www.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users From Yuval.Hod at Ofeknw.com Mon Nov 6 13:17:44 2000 From: Yuval.Hod at Ofeknw.com (Yuval Hod) Date: Mon, 6 Nov 2000 14:17:44 +0200 Subject: [Mailman-Users] MGCP/MEGACO IP PHONES Message-ID: <51FE8E96A3F5D311BE7500508BC227FA3A0004@EUREXCH1> I'm looking for vendors of IP phones that complies with the above protocols Thanks Yuval From Mercedes.Cava at si.upct.es Mon Nov 6 14:01:09 2000 From: Mercedes.Cava at si.upct.es (Mercedes) Date: Mon, 06 Nov 2000 14:01:09 +0100 Subject: [Mailman-Users] cyrus? Message-ID: <3A06AB95.842B0C82@si.upct.es> Hello, only one question : Can I use cyrus-imap with Mailman? Thanks! -- ------------------------------------ Mercedes Cava Roda Universidad Politecnica de Cartagena Servicio de Informatica Seccion de Comunicaciones y Redes e-mail: Mercedes.Cava at si.upct.es Telefono: +34 968 32 57 98 ------------------------------------ From Nigel.Metheringham at VData.co.uk Mon Nov 6 17:16:53 2000 From: Nigel.Metheringham at VData.co.uk (Nigel Metheringham) Date: Mon, 06 Nov 2000 16:16:53 +0000 Subject: [Mailman-Users] cyrus? In-Reply-To: Message from Mercedes of "Mon, 06 Nov 2000 14:01:09 +0100." <3A06AB95.842B0C82@si.upct.es> Message-ID: Mercedes.Cava at si.upct.es said: > Can I use cyrus-imap with Mailman? Its completely irrelevant - Mailman and cyrus are orthogonal products and do not impinge on each other at all. Nigel. -- [ - Opinions expressed are personal and may not be shared by VData - ] [ Nigel Metheringham Nigel.Metheringham at VData.co.uk ] [ Phone: +44 1423 850000 Fax +44 1423 858866 ] From gietl at gietl.com Mon Nov 6 17:33:48 2000 From: gietl at gietl.com (Andreas Gietl) Date: Mon, 06 Nov 2000 17:33:48 +0100 Subject: [Mailman-Developers] Re: [Mailman-Users] forever pending subscriptions References: <3A02C6B0.2D82FC79@gietl.com> <3A032199.67D1CA2E@west.sun.com> <14851.11014.397538.19202@anthem.concentric.net> <3A0407E2.42ABB0AF@gietl.com> <14852.12081.57421.807051@anthem.concentric.net> Message-ID: <3A06DD6C.D4F23706@gietl.com> any further ideas? i'm sorry, but there is no pipeline entry: that's the db-file: { 'filebase': 'ccfe93988bf681ad271ad049fa54dcd7260a60ac', 'listname': 'bittecomgietltest2', 'torequest': 1, 'version': 2} and this is the .msg file: >From gietl at gietl.com Sat Nov 04 13:52:46 2000 Received: from [195.227.84.2] (helo=d1.x-mailer.de) by d18.x-mailer.de with esmtp (Exim 3.16 #1) id 13s2oQ-0003e1-00 for bittecomgietltest2-request at bitte.com; Sat, 04 Nov 2000 13:52:46 +0100 Received: from p3ee039ab.dip.t-dialin.net ([62.224.57.171] helo=gietl.com) by d1.x-mailer.de with esmtp (Exim 3.16 #1) id 13s2n9-0004iW-00 for bittecomgietltest2-request at bitte.com; Sat, 04 Nov 2000 13:51:27 +0100 Message-ID: <3A0406EC.6C4B8583 at gietl.com> Date: Sat, 04 Nov 2000 13:54:04 +0100 From: Andreas Gietl X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.73 [en] (WinNT; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: bittecomgietltest2-request at bitte.com Subject: Re: Bittecomgietltest2 -- confirmation of subscription -- request 569170 References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit bittecomgietltest2-request at bitte.com wrote: > > Bittecomgietltest2 -- confirmation of subscription -- request 569170 > > We have received a request from p3ee039ab.dip.t-dialin.net for > subscription of your email address, , to the > bittecomgietltest2 at bitte.com mailing list. To confirm the request, > please send a message to bittecomgietltest2-request at bitte.com, and > either: > > - maintain the subject line as is (the reply's additional "Re:" is > ok), > > - or include the following line - and only the following line - in the > message body: > > confirm 569170 > > (Simply sending a 'reply' to this message should work from most email > interfaces, since that usually leaves the subject line in the right > form.) > > If you do not wish to subscribe to this list, please simply disregard > this message. Send questions to bittecomgietltest2-admin at bitte.com. barry at wooz.org wrote: > > >>>>> "AG" == Andreas Gietl writes: > > >> Do you still see the > >> confirmation message in qfiles? > > AG> Yeah, the confirmation message is in there! > > >> If so, are there any obvious errors > >> in logs/error? > > AG> nothing. i of course checked that! > > >> Does it have the expected Subject: header (i.e. at the > >> end of the line, "request xxxxxx" where those x's are the > >> numbers). > > AG> Yeah. it does have. > AG> Do you need any further information? > > Yes, do a bin/dumpdb qfiles/.db and look for the > `pipeline' entry. > > That should show us where things are getting stuck. > -Barry > > ------------------------------------------------------ > Mailman-Users maillist - Mailman-Users at python.org > http://www.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users -- andreas gietl gietl internet services fon +49 9402 2551 fax +49 9402 2604 mobile +49 171 60 70 008 gietl at gietl.com ############################################ # Das Handbuch sagt, das Programm ben?tige # # Windows 95 oder besser. Also habe ich # # Linux installiert! # ############################################ From pray4sno at xmission.com Mon Nov 6 17:56:33 2000 From: pray4sno at xmission.com (pray4sno) Date: Mon, 6 Nov 2000 09:56:33 -0700 (MST) Subject: [Mailman-Users] Configure smrsh question... Message-ID: I've just installed Mailman on my box and have a small question relating to the "sh: wrapper not available for sendmail programs" error. In the docu it states: "You need to configure smrsh by creating a symbolic link from the mail wrapper ($prefix/mail/wrapper) to the directory identifying executables allowed to run under smrsh." I'm not totally clear on what this means... Does this mean that I need to: ln -s /home/mailman/mail/wrapper /etc/smrsh/wrapper or ln -s /etc/smrsh /home/mailman/mail/wrapper ?? I'm sure that this is a moronic question, I'm just totally unfamiliar with smrsh. Thanks! From ashley at pcraft.com Mon Nov 6 19:01:25 2000 From: ashley at pcraft.com (Ashley M. Kirchner) Date: Mon, 06 Nov 2000 11:01:25 -0700 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Upgrading Message-ID: <3A06F1F4.6AF02A1D@pcraft.com> Two questions: I'm moving our current mailman installation from one (slow) server to another (fast) one. a) Any gotcha's I should be aware of? I'm guessing I can just tar the whole mailman directory up on the old server, untar it on the new one, set the necessary aliases and cron tasks and things ought to be ok, right? b) The old machine is running 2.0beta5. Should I go ahead and upgrade to rc1, or beta6, or keep it as beta5? AMK4 -- W | | I haven't lost my mind; it's backed up on tape somewhere. |____________________________________________________________________ ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Ashley M. Kirchner . 303.442.6410 x130 SysAdmin / Websmith . 800.441.3873 x130 Photo Craft Laboratories, Inc. . eFax 248.671.0909 http://www.pcraft.com . 3550 Arapahoe Ave #6 .................. . . . . Boulder, CO 80303, USA From Nigel.Metheringham at VData.co.uk Mon Nov 6 19:07:07 2000 From: Nigel.Metheringham at VData.co.uk (Nigel Metheringham) Date: Mon, 06 Nov 2000 18:07:07 +0000 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Problem with qrunner and too much incoming mail In-Reply-To: Message from Marc MERLIN of "Fri, 03 Nov 2000 11:35:39 PST." <20001103113539.S22363@marc.merlins.org> Message-ID: [I am replying *only* to the question of how to get this going with current Mailman on current exim - I'm not touching future directions for any product in this message] [[I'm also assuming exim because I'm sure a message said this was with exim - or there was a message to the exim mailing list.]] marc_news at valinux.com said: > The problem is due to qrunner being single threaded by default and > having a global lock. Because some mailing lists have subscribers in > domains where DNS is slow and unreliable, the MTA will hang on > those rcpt to until DNS resolves or timeouts, and qrunner won't be > done in time. After that, it's all downhill from there, more mail > queues up, qrunner falls even further behind, etc, etc... Problem # 1 - DNS is slow Run a local DNS cache. I would strongly recommend Dan Bernstein's dnscache for this - its small, secure, focussed and doesn't expand to steal all your memory. For exim.org I run dnscache on the Mailman/exim box with a significant performance increase despite the hosting ISP having local DNS caches (based on bind) very close to the box. See http://cr.yp.to/djbdns.html for the djbdns package which includes dnscache. You also need his daemontools package to run it. Problem # 2 - Exim is checking addresses on receipt. The Exim/Mailman HOWTO has some performance tweaks - see http://www.exim.org/howto/mailman.html Specifically in there is:- # Verify receipient addresses on everything except local injects # DO NOT verify addresses from mailman - this would slow down # the acceptance of messages dramatically receiver_verify_hosts = !127.0.0.1/8:0.0.0.0/0 sender_verify That will verify senders (fast - they are local - you could turn that off if you wish), but does not verify recipients on stuff that mailman is sending out. You may want the other tweaks on that page too. However I only run a list of around 1K members, know a good bit about mail systems, but don't have the facilities to check things for really big lists. If people have specific advice for bigger systems then tell me and I'll add them to that document. marc_news at valinux.com said: > We're currently playing with MTAs to optimize this a bit, but the > real fix is on the mailing list side. No its not - your problem is that you are doing unnecessary work in the MTA and holding up Mailman accordingly. There probably is work needs doing to qrunner, but this ain't why. Its better to dump the mails into the MTA and let the MTA send bounces back than to do all this synchronous address checking here. Nigel. -- [ - Opinions expressed are personal and may not be shared by VData - ] [ Nigel Metheringham Nigel.Metheringham at VData.co.uk ] [ Phone: +44 1423 850000 Fax +44 1423 858866 ] From claw at kanga.nu Mon Nov 6 19:07:26 2000 From: claw at kanga.nu (J C Lawrence) Date: Mon, 06 Nov 2000 10:07:26 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] member_posting_only=yes problem In-Reply-To: Message from Mike Noyes of "Sat, 04 Nov 2000 09:35:25 PST." <4.2.2.20001104092026.00aa51b0@pop.mindspring.com> References: <4.2.2.20001104092026.00aa51b0@pop.mindspring.com> Message-ID: <29298.973534046@kanga.nu> On Sat, 04 Nov 2000 09:35:25 -0800 Mike Noyes wrote: > I'm the admin for a devel list on SourceForge. I have a member of > my list that has different From and Reply-To addresses. He is > subscribed with his Reply-To address. When I set > member_posting_only=yes all of his messages are held for > approval. Is there any way around this problem? The simple (hah!) solution is to subscribe his From: address and set it NOMAIL (in the options). -- J C Lawrence Home: claw at kanga.nu ---------(*) Other: coder at kanga.nu http://www.kanga.nu/~claw/ Keys etc: finger claw at kanga.nu --=| A man is as sane as he is dangerous to his environment |=-- From claw at kanga.nu Mon Nov 6 19:09:11 2000 From: claw at kanga.nu (J C Lawrence) Date: Mon, 06 Nov 2000 10:09:11 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] member_posting_only=yes problem In-Reply-To: Message from Chuq Von Rospach of "Sat, 04 Nov 2000 10:32:15 PST." References: <4.2.2.20001104092026.00aa51b0@pop.mindspring.com> Message-ID: <29802.973534151@kanga.nu> On Sat, 4 Nov 2000 10:32:15 -0800 Chuq Von Rospach wrote: > 2) set his address as not needing admin overview -- that's an > option on the privacy page of the admin page. that way, you're > saying "this guy is okay" and it won't be held. which works as > long as he really is okay, but that's an admin issue.. (grin) I've done this. When the list grew past 50ish it was a pain to manage. Beware the administrative scaling bugbear. -- J C Lawrence Home: claw at kanga.nu ---------(*) Other: coder at kanga.nu http://www.kanga.nu/~claw/ Keys etc: finger claw at kanga.nu --=| A man is as sane as he is dangerous to his environment |=-- From chuqui at plaidworks.com Mon Nov 6 20:05:34 2000 From: chuqui at plaidworks.com (Chuq Von Rospach) Date: Mon, 6 Nov 2000 11:05:34 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] sendmail says "Data format error" In-Reply-To: <200011061050.eA6Ao3817998@ds1.hochfranken-online.de> References: <200010301051.e9UApap29111@ds1.hochfranken-online.de> <200011061050.eA6Ao3817998@ds1.hochfranken-online.de> Message-ID: At 11:50 AM +0000 11/6/00, Rainer Strobel wrote: > > At what point is this happening? To everyone? Certain users? >> >It happens even when mailman tries to send a message to the list >members. What version of sendmail? Are progs supposed to go through smrsh? -- Chuq Von Rospach - Plaidworks Consulting (mailto:chuqui at plaidworks.com) Apple Mail List Gnome (mailto:chuq at apple.com) Be just, and fear not. From chuqui at plaidworks.com Mon Nov 6 20:08:01 2000 From: chuqui at plaidworks.com (Chuq Von Rospach) Date: Mon, 6 Nov 2000 11:08:01 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Upgrading In-Reply-To: <3A06F1F4.6AF02A1D@pcraft.com> References: <3A06F1F4.6AF02A1D@pcraft.com> Message-ID: > I'm moving our current mailman installation from one (slow) server > to another (fast) one. > > a) Any gotcha's I should be aware of? > I'm guessing I can just tar the whole mailman directory up on > the old server, untar it on the new one, set the necessary > aliases and cron tasks and things ought to be ok, right? is the architecture the same? because otherwise, I'm not sure the internal formats of the database files are architecture independent. If you aren't moving pathnames, you'll probably be okay. those are the two gotchas I can think of offhand. > b) The old machine is running 2.0beta5. Should I go ahead and > upgrade to rc1, or beta6, or keep it as beta5? Do yourself a favor -- move on beta5, then once the moved server is stable, THEN upgrade. you'll thank yourself later, because if you move AND upgrade at the same time, how will you figure out which one broke things? Keep it as simple as possible. you'll save time and work, even if it takes extra steps. -- Chuq Von Rospach - Plaidworks Consulting (mailto:chuqui at plaidworks.com) Apple Mail List Gnome (mailto:chuq at apple.com) Be just, and fear not. From ashley at pcraft.com Mon Nov 6 20:22:24 2000 From: ashley at pcraft.com (Ashley M. Kirchner) Date: Mon, 06 Nov 2000 12:22:24 -0700 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Upgrading References: <3A06F1F4.6AF02A1D@pcraft.com> Message-ID: <3A0704F0.AF89B73B@pcraft.com> Chuq Von Rospach wrote: > is the architecture the same? Architecture, yes. OS version, no. Although I don't think that would cause problems. > If you aren't moving pathnames, you'll probably be okay. those are > the two gotchas I can think of offhand. Pathnames are the same. > Do yourself a favor -- move on beta5, then once the moved server is > stable, THEN upgrade. you'll thank yourself later, because if you > move AND upgrade at the same time, how will you figure out which one > broke things? Ok. Advice taken. I just realized that really all I need to tar/archive/copy over are the following: $prefix/archives /data /lists /logs (since I want to keep them) ...any other (custom directory) I'm missing? All the other ones are Mailman specific, and will get recreated upon a new installation, right? AMK4 -- W | | I haven't lost my mind; it's backed up on tape somewhere. |____________________________________________________________________ ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Ashley M. Kirchner . 303.442.6410 x130 SysAdmin / Websmith . 800.441.3873 x130 Photo Craft Laboratories, Inc. . eFax 248.671.0909 http://www.pcraft.com . 3550 Arapahoe Ave #6 .................. . . . . Boulder, CO 80303, USA From steve at unidata.ucar.edu Mon Nov 6 22:08:37 2000 From: steve at unidata.ucar.edu (Steve Emmerson) Date: Mon, 06 Nov 2000 14:08:37 -0700 Subject: [Mailman-Users] can't subscribe to list Message-ID: <200011062108.eA6L8d416877@unidata.ucar.edu> Hi, I'm having a problem with Mailman adding members to a mailing-list. In the "Getting started" section of the INSTALL file, it says to create a list and then go to it and subscribe. I did that and received the confirmation email from Mailman. Responding to the confirmation email, however, doesn't add me to the list (according to both the list's web page and the "bin/listmembers" utility). Details: uname -a: Linux daffy.unidata.ucar.edu 2.2.16-3smp #1 SMP Mon Jun 19 19:00:35 EDT 2000 i686 unknown Mailman version: 2.0rc1 MTA: Exim 3.16 Python version: 1.5.2 Mailman user: mailman Mailman group: mailman bin/check_perms: no errors Exim configuration: MAILMAN_UID=mailman MAILMAN_GID=mailman When responding to the confirmation email: /var/log/maillog: Nov 6 13:16:23 daffy exim[22317]: 2000-11-06 13:16:23 13ssgp-0005nx-00 <= steve at unidata.ucar.edu H=laraine.unidata.ucar.edu (unidata.ucar.edu) [128.117.140.62] U=root P=esmtp S=2145 id=200011062016.eA6KGF415169 at unidata.ucar.edu from for test-request at sourceforge.unidata.ucar.edu Nov 6 13:16:23 daffy exim[22318]: 2000-11-06 13:16:23 13ssgp-0005nx-00 => test D=list_request_director T=list_request_transport Nov 6 13:16:23 daffy exim[22318]: 2000-11-06 13:16:23 13ssgp-0005nx-00 Completed /var/log/messages: <> $MAILMAN_HOME/logs/*: <> I think the thing that bothers me the most is that I can't find an error message anywhere. Any ideas would be gratefully appreciated. --Steve Emmerson From Dan.Mick at west.sun.com Mon Nov 6 22:26:55 2000 From: Dan.Mick at west.sun.com (Dan Mick) Date: Mon, 06 Nov 2000 13:26:55 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Configure smrsh question... References: Message-ID: <3A07221F.C01BCD2E@west.sun.com> pray4sno wrote: > > I've just installed Mailman on my box and have a small question relating > to the "sh: wrapper not available for sendmail programs" error. In the > docu it states: > > "You need to configure smrsh by creating a symbolic link from the mail > wrapper ($prefix/mail/wrapper) to the directory identifying executables > allowed to run under smrsh." > > I'm not totally clear on what this means... Does this mean that I need > to: > > ln -s /home/mailman/mail/wrapper /etc/smrsh/wrapper > > or > > ln -s /etc/smrsh /home/mailman/mail/wrapper > > ?? > > I'm sure that this is a moronic question, I'm just totally unfamiliar with > smrsh. I've never used smrsh, but I can tell you that it makes no sense to link an executable program to a directory, or vice versa. If you've installed mailman, /home/mailman/mail/wrapper is an executable, so the only reasonable thing to do is to have a link *to* that file appear in some smrsh directory. (it seems to me that the wording is not the best). The wording may be trying to reflect the order of args in the command; if you want a link to appear in /etc/smrsh, named 'wrapper', and have that link point to /home/mailman/mail/wrapper (which is how I'd describe what I think you need), you'd use ln -s /home/mailman/mail/wrapper /etc/smrsh/wrapper which one might read as "make a link from /home/mailman/mail/wrapper to /etc/smrsh/wrapper", but really it does the opposite; the ln command takes "src dest" arguments to be just like cp or mv. But really, the link points from the otherwise-nonexistent /etc/smrsh/wrapper to the already-present /home/mailman/mail/wrapper, so the link direction is pretty unambiguous. > > Thanks! > > ------------------------------------------------------ > Mailman-Users maillist - Mailman-Users at python.org > http://www.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users From Dan.Mick at west.sun.com Mon Nov 6 22:28:46 2000 From: Dan.Mick at west.sun.com (Dan Mick) Date: Mon, 06 Nov 2000 13:28:46 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] can't subscribe to list References: <200011062108.eA6L8d416877@unidata.ucar.edu> Message-ID: <3A07228E.C3C81E67@west.sun.com> cron? Are you sure? Steve Emmerson wrote: > > Hi, > > I'm having a problem with Mailman adding members to a mailing-list. In > the "Getting started" section of the INSTALL file, it says to create > a list and then go to it and subscribe. I did that and received the > confirmation email from Mailman. Responding to the confirmation email, > however, doesn't add me to the list (according to both the list's web > page and the "bin/listmembers" utility). > > Details: > uname -a: Linux daffy.unidata.ucar.edu 2.2.16-3smp #1 SMP Mon Jun 19 19:00:35 EDT 2000 i686 unknown > Mailman version: 2.0rc1 > MTA: Exim 3.16 > Python version: 1.5.2 > Mailman user: mailman > Mailman group: mailman > bin/check_perms: no errors > Exim configuration: MAILMAN_UID=mailman > MAILMAN_GID=mailman > > When responding to the confirmation email: > > /var/log/maillog: > > Nov 6 13:16:23 daffy exim[22317]: 2000-11-06 13:16:23 13ssgp-0005nx-00 <= steve at unidata.ucar.edu H=laraine.unidata.ucar.edu (unidata.ucar.edu) [128.117.140.62] U=root P=esmtp S=2145 id=200011062016.eA6KGF415169 at unidata.ucar.edu from for test-request at sourceforge.unidata.ucar.edu > Nov 6 13:16:23 daffy exim[22318]: 2000-11-06 13:16:23 13ssgp-0005nx-00 => test D=list_request_director T=list_request_transport Nov 6 13:16:23 daffy exim[22318]: 2000-11-06 13:16:23 13ssgp-0005nx-00 Completed > > /var/log/messages: <> > > $MAILMAN_HOME/logs/*: <> > > I think the thing that bothers me the most is that I can't find an error > message anywhere. > > Any ideas would be gratefully appreciated. > > --Steve Emmerson > > ------------------------------------------------------ > Mailman-Users maillist - Mailman-Users at python.org > http://www.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users From mrlist at ActiveState.com Tue Nov 7 03:05:04 2000 From: mrlist at ActiveState.com (Eric Wang) Date: Mon, 06 Nov 2000 18:05:04 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Has that confirmation reply always on pendig problem been solved ? Message-ID: <20001106175149.AFAE.MRLIST@activestate.com> Hi Guys, I had report this problem, and we are the only one, after upgrade the old version to rc1, there is a confirmation reply always on pendig problem.(We upgraded from beta2.2 to rc1) Did anybody solved that problem? From xiao.bing at oztime.com Tue Nov 7 03:52:10 2000 From: xiao.bing at oztime.com (Xiao Bing) Date: Tue, 7 Nov 2000 10:52:10 +0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] ?get a strange msg??? Message-ID: <074001c04865$b9a63c30$eb00a8c0@prc.oztime.com> A member post a email to the maillist.Then get a strange response ------------------------------------------> subject:Your message to Oz_maillist awaits moderator approval content: Your mail to 'Oz_maillist' with the subject =?gb2312?B?suLK1NTT1r4=?= Is being held until the list moderator can review it for approval. The reason it is being held: Message has implicit destination Either the message will get posted to the list, or you will receive notification of the moderator's decision. --------------------------------------------------------------> What is the reason? -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mail.python.org/pipermail/mailman-users/attachments/20001107/77f15f02/attachment.html From rob at peopleart.net Tue Nov 7 06:04:35 2000 From: rob at peopleart.net (Rob Martin) Date: Tue, 7 Nov 2000 00:04:35 -0500 (EST) Subject: [Mailman-Users] Cron /usr/local/bin/python -S /home/mailman/cron/qrunner (fwd) Message-ID: hi, i'm getting emails at a rate of 1 per minute (hmmm, about like that line in crontab.in? ;) with the following message. i've run check_perms -f and the system is clean. i know this has been addressed on the list before, but i've been unable to find a solution that works. i'm not running python < 1.5.2, i did 'make DIRSETGID=: install' as instructed, everything else works fine. specific system info follows the message body: ***** Subject: Cron /usr/local/bin/python -S /home/mailman/cron/qrunner Traceback (innermost last): File "/home/mailman/cron/qrunner", line 271, in ? lock.lock(timeout=0.5) File "/home/mailman/Mailman/LockFile.py", line 219, in lock self.__write() File "/home/mailman/Mailman/LockFile.py", line 350, in __write fp = open(self.__tmpfname, 'w') IOError: [Errno 13] Permission denied: '/home/mailman/locks/qrunner.lock.wi2600.19690' ***** system info: #1 system OS NetBSD 1.4 (GENERIC) #0: Fri May 7 12:27:31 PDT 1999 #2 Python version Python 1.5.2 (#1, Jun 14 2000, 15:00:14) [GCC egcs-2.91.60 19981201 (egcs-1.1.1 on netbsd1 #3 Sendmail version 220 wi2600.org ESMTP Sendmail 8.8.8/8.8.8; Mon, 6 Nov 2000 23:52:55 -0600 (CST) #4 check_perms result bash-2.04# ./check_perms No problems found #5 /home/mailman directory and permissions bash-2.04# ls -al total 40 drwxrwsr-x 18 root mailman 512 Nov 6 22:05 . drwxr-xr-x 3 root wheel 512 Aug 3 17:50 .. drwxrwsr-x 8 root mailman 1536 Nov 6 22:51 Mailman drwxrwsr-x 4 root mailman 512 Aug 3 17:51 archives drwxrwsr-x 2 root mailman 512 Nov 6 22:51 bin drwxrwsr-x 2 root mailman 512 Nov 6 22:52 cgi-bin drwxrwsr-x 2 root mailman 512 Nov 6 22:51 cron drwxrwsr-x 2 root mailman 512 Nov 6 22:51 data drwxrwsr-x 2 root mailman 512 Nov 6 22:51 filters drwxrwsr-x 2 root mailman 512 Nov 6 22:51 icons drwxrwsr-x 3 root mailman 512 Nov 6 22:56 lists drwxrwsr-x 2 root mailman 512 Nov 6 23:56 locks drwxrwsr-x 2 root mailman 512 Oct 2 13:05 logs drwxrwsr-x 2 root mailman 512 Nov 6 22:52 mail drwxrwsr-x 2 root mailman 512 Nov 6 22:16 qfiles drwxrwsr-x 2 root mailman 512 Nov 6 22:52 scripts drwxrwsr-x 2 root mailman 512 Aug 3 17:51 spam drwxrwsr-x 2 root mailman 1536 Nov 6 22:52 templates Any advice on this is welcome. If someone can confirm that this is a bug (and not a configuration/permissions issue), I'd be happy to forward it to the developers list too. Regards, M. Robert Martin From xiao.bing at oztime.com Tue Nov 7 07:35:48 2000 From: xiao.bing at oztime.com (Xiao Bing) Date: Tue, 7 Nov 2000 14:35:48 +0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Posting Held for Approval ?why? Message-ID: <08e701c04884$f75a7f40$eb00a8c0@prc.oztime.com> My posting email always need to be approved.Why? I get this msg from administrator page. ----------------------------------------------------------------------------- Blind carbon copies or other implicit destinations are not allowed. Try reposting your message by explicitly including the list address in the To: or Cc: fields. ----------------------------------------------------------------------------- Who can tell me why?I am so crazy now. Jack -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mail.python.org/pipermail/mailman-users/attachments/20001107/d7a2bad7/attachment.htm From chuqui at plaidworks.com Tue Nov 7 08:11:03 2000 From: chuqui at plaidworks.com (Chuq Von Rospach) Date: Mon, 6 Nov 2000 23:11:03 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Cron /usr/local/bin/python -S /home/mailman/cron/qrunner (fwd) In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: At 12:04 AM -0500 11/7/00, Rob Martin wrote: > File "/home/mailman/Mailman/LockFile.py", line 350, in __write > fp = open(self.__tmpfname, 'w') >IOError: [Errno 13] Permission denied: >'/home/mailman/locks/qrunner.lock.wi2600.19690' you don't have write access to /home/mailman/locks. are you running a system with symlink restrictions, perhaps? is bin/wrapper setgid mailman? Are there lockfiles in locks? Especially ones not owned by group mailman? If, for instance, locks/qrunner.lock was created by an earlier, misconfigured attempt and still hanging around in there, it'd hose you, because the attempt to set the lock fails. so check locks, and probably do a rm locks/* > >***** >system info: > >#1 system OS >NetBSD 1.4 (GENERIC) #0: Fri May 7 12:27:31 PDT 1999 > >#2 Python version >Python 1.5.2 (#1, Jun 14 2000, 15:00:14) [GCC egcs-2.91.60 19981201 >(egcs-1.1.1 on netbsd1 > >#3 Sendmail version >220 wi2600.org ESMTP Sendmail 8.8.8/8.8.8; Mon, 6 Nov 2000 23:52:55 -0600 >(CST) > >#4 check_perms result >bash-2.04# ./check_perms >No problems found > >#5 /home/mailman directory and permissions >bash-2.04# ls -al >total 40 >drwxrwsr-x 18 root mailman 512 Nov 6 22:05 . >drwxr-xr-x 3 root wheel 512 Aug 3 17:50 .. >drwxrwsr-x 8 root mailman 1536 Nov 6 22:51 Mailman >drwxrwsr-x 4 root mailman 512 Aug 3 17:51 archives >drwxrwsr-x 2 root mailman 512 Nov 6 22:51 bin >drwxrwsr-x 2 root mailman 512 Nov 6 22:52 cgi-bin >drwxrwsr-x 2 root mailman 512 Nov 6 22:51 cron >drwxrwsr-x 2 root mailman 512 Nov 6 22:51 data >drwxrwsr-x 2 root mailman 512 Nov 6 22:51 filters >drwxrwsr-x 2 root mailman 512 Nov 6 22:51 icons >drwxrwsr-x 3 root mailman 512 Nov 6 22:56 lists >drwxrwsr-x 2 root mailman 512 Nov 6 23:56 locks >drwxrwsr-x 2 root mailman 512 Oct 2 13:05 logs >drwxrwsr-x 2 root mailman 512 Nov 6 22:52 mail >drwxrwsr-x 2 root mailman 512 Nov 6 22:16 qfiles >drwxrwsr-x 2 root mailman 512 Nov 6 22:52 scripts >drwxrwsr-x 2 root mailman 512 Aug 3 17:51 spam >drwxrwsr-x 2 root mailman 1536 Nov 6 22:52 templates > > >Any advice on this is welcome. If someone can confirm that this is a bug >(and not a configuration/permissions issue), I'd be happy to forward it to >the developers list too. > >Regards, > >M. Robert Martin > > >------------------------------------------------------ >Mailman-Users maillist - Mailman-Users at python.org >http://www.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users -- Chuq Von Rospach - Plaidworks Consulting (mailto:chuqui at plaidworks.com) Apple Mail List Gnome (mailto:chuq at apple.com) Be just, and fear not. From chuqui at plaidworks.com Tue Nov 7 08:11:39 2000 From: chuqui at plaidworks.com (Chuq Von Rospach) Date: Mon, 6 Nov 2000 23:11:39 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Posting Held for Approval ?why? In-Reply-To: <08e701c04884$f75a7f40$eb00a8c0@prc.oztime.com> References: <08e701c04884$f75a7f40$eb00a8c0@prc.oztime.com> Message-ID: At 2:35 PM +0800 11/7/00, Xiao Bing wrote: >----------------------------------------------------------------------------- >Blind carbon copies or other implicit destinations are not allowed. Try >reposting your message by explicitly including the list address in the To: or >Cc: fields. >----------------------------------------------------------------------------- the mailman server can't find the list name in the to: or cc: lines. So you're Bcc:ing the list, which is triggering an admin request. -- Chuq Von Rospach - Plaidworks Consulting (mailto:chuqui at plaidworks.com) Apple Mail List Gnome (mailto:chuq at apple.com) Be just, and fear not. From techgrrl at beeze.com Tue Nov 7 09:09:17 2000 From: techgrrl at beeze.com (Sarah K. Miller) Date: Tue, 7 Nov 2000 00:09:17 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Mailman Locks Hung References: <011801c047c9$6961ce70$3601a8c0@beeze.com> Message-ID: <011101c04892$07273910$3601a8c0@beeze.com> This may be related to my earlier question about hung processes, but since I'm in slightly over my head, I'm not sure. Please be patient. :) Over a timespan of approximately 4 hours, one of my mailing lists generated 54 locks identical to the one below and left them hanging. 217333 -rw-rw-r-- 1 nobody mailman 60 Nov 6 19:56 de-seattle-discuss.lock.eve.18591 I need to know what might be causing these locks to hang. I've manually deleted them for now, but this is the 3rd time in the last 4 days that I've had to do so. Suggestions? ______________________________ Sarah K. Miller, List Administrator D i g i t a l E v e sarah at digitaleve.org www.digitaleve.org technology|creativity|community From eric at extranet.lu Tue Nov 7 10:10:36 2000 From: eric at extranet.lu (Eric Romang) Date: Tue, 07 Nov 2000 10:10:36 +0100 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Trouble with GID off mail wrapper Message-ID: <3A07C70C.EA2E08B8@extranet.lu> Hello, I have a little trouble with the GID off the mail wrapper. Everything is allright but only on the reply of the confirmation of one subscription. Here is the error message : ================================================================ The Postfix program : Command died with status 2: "/home/mailman/mail/wrapper mailcmd xyzstaff". Command output: Failure to exec script. WANTED gid 89, GOT gid 99. (Reconfigure to take 99?) ================================================================ Can somebody help me ? Thanks. Regards. Eric Romang http://www.xyz.lu eric at extranet.lu From satyap at satya.virtualave.net Tue Nov 7 10:52:50 2000 From: satyap at satya.virtualave.net (Satya) Date: Tue, 7 Nov 2000 15:22:50 +0530 (IST) Subject: [Mailman-Users] Trouble with GID off mail wrapper In-Reply-To: <3A07C70C.EA2E08B8@extranet.lu> Message-ID: On Nov 7, 2000 at 10:10, Eric Romang wrote: >The Postfix program > >: Command died with status 2: > "/home/mailman/mail/wrapper mailcmd xyzstaff". Command output: >Failure to > exec script. WANTED gid 89, GOT gid 99. (Reconfigure to take 99?) >================================================================ Chorus? I thought so. Re-compile, this time give the configure script an option --with-gid=89. Check your group IDs first and read the various READMEs and INSTALLs. -- Satya. US-bound grad students! For pre-apps, see "This is the *NIX version of the 'ILOVEVYOU' worm. It runs on the honor system. Forward this to everyone in your address book, and randomly delete some of your files." - Unknown From cpeter at mirae.kangwon.ac.kr Tue Nov 7 14:39:30 2000 From: cpeter at mirae.kangwon.ac.kr (Jin.LyongGil) Date: Tue, 7 Nov 2000 22:39:30 +0900 Subject: [Mailman-Users] hello Message-ID: <000801c048c0$28d8ee40$7e2b73d2@kangwon.ac.kr> I am new user . I just test at here. ============================= Chen.LongJi KangWon National University Multimedia Security Lab. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mail.python.org/pipermail/mailman-users/attachments/20001107/92c3afeb/attachment.html From johnny at cathat.net Tue Nov 7 14:50:27 2000 From: johnny at cathat.net (Johnny Fuerst) Date: Tue, 7 Nov 2000 07:50:27 -0600 Subject: [Mailman-Users] hello In-Reply-To: <000801c048c0$28d8ee40$7e2b73d2@kangwon.ac.kr>; from cpeter@mirae.kangwon.ac.kr on Tue, Nov 07, 2000 at 10:39:30PM +0900 References: <000801c048c0$28d8ee40$7e2b73d2@kangwon.ac.kr> Message-ID: <20001107075027.A53066@cathat.net> Got it well. Welcome!! On Tue, Nov 07, 2000 at 10:39:30PM +0900, Jin.LyongGil wrote: > I am new user . > I just test at here. > > ============================= > Chen.LongJi > KangWon National University > Multimedia Security Lab. -- On Behalf Of: Johnny Fuerst, Governor ................ governor at cathat.net Opinions stated in this message are mine and mine alone, and do not necessarily represent those of my ISP/employer! .period. ------------------------------------------------------------ 'I Desire Compassion, and not a Sacrifice.' 'La Vida E Bella' ____________________________ Random Quote: Support bacteria -- it's the only culture some people have! johnny at cathat.net From eric at extranet.lu Tue Nov 7 15:21:30 2000 From: eric at extranet.lu (Eric Romang) Date: Tue, 07 Nov 2000 15:21:30 +0100 Subject: [Mailman-Users] hello References: <000801c048c0$28d8ee40$7e2b73d2@kangwon.ac.kr> <20001107075027.A53066@cathat.net> Message-ID: <3A080FEA.14ABD166@extranet.lu> Agnan Ha se Ho :) Johnny Fuerst wrote: > > Got it well. Welcome!! > > On Tue, Nov 07, 2000 at 10:39:30PM +0900, Jin.LyongGil wrote: > > I am new user . > > I just test at here. > > > > ============================= > > Chen.LongJi > > KangWon National University > > Multimedia Security Lab. > > -- > On Behalf Of: > Johnny Fuerst, Governor ................ governor at cathat.net > Opinions stated in this message are mine and mine alone, and > do not necessarily represent those of my ISP/employer! > .period. > ------------------------------------------------------------ > 'I Desire Compassion, and not a Sacrifice.' > 'La Vida E Bella' > > ____________________________ > Random Quote: > Support bacteria -- it's the only culture some people have! > johnny at cathat.net > > ------------------------------------------------------ > Mailman-Users maillist - Mailman-Users at python.org > http://www.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users From rob at peopleart.net Tue Nov 7 14:36:27 2000 From: rob at peopleart.net (Rob Martin) Date: Tue, 7 Nov 2000 08:36:27 -0500 (EST) Subject: [Mailman-Users] hello In-Reply-To: <3A080FEA.14ABD166@extranet.lu> Message-ID: I think it's anyong-haseyo, and i offer it to Jin LyongGil too. Welcome :) rob martin On Tue, 7 Nov 2000, Eric Romang wrote: > Agnan Ha se Ho :) > > Johnny Fuerst wrote: > > > > Got it well. Welcome!! > > > > On Tue, Nov 07, 2000 at 10:39:30PM +0900, Jin.LyongGil wrote: > > > I am new user . > > > I just test at here. > > > > > > ============================= > > > Chen.LongJi > > > KangWon National University > > > Multimedia Security Lab. > > > > -- > > On Behalf Of: > > Johnny Fuerst, Governor ................ governor at cathat.net > > Opinions stated in this message are mine and mine alone, and > > do not necessarily represent those of my ISP/employer! > > .period. > > ------------------------------------------------------------ > > 'I Desire Compassion, and not a Sacrifice.' > > 'La Vida E Bella' > > > > ____________________________ > > Random Quote: > > Support bacteria -- it's the only culture some people have! > > johnny at cathat.net > > > > ------------------------------------------------------ > > Mailman-Users maillist - Mailman-Users at python.org > > http://www.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users > > ------------------------------------------------------ > Mailman-Users maillist - Mailman-Users at python.org > http://www.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users > -- ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ Welcome to MS-Linux version 3.0. Please enter your login name, or press escape to login as root. login: > _ ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ From mlambert at alternatives.ca Tue Nov 7 16:54:49 2000 From: mlambert at alternatives.ca (Michel Lambert) Date: Tue, 07 Nov 2000 10:54:49 -0500 Subject: [Mailman-Users] where Message-ID: <3A0825C7.5DADB90F@alternatives.ca> Dear all I am just trying to change the adresse of the administrative person who is receiving the admin messages (like mail awaiting for approuval, etc...) Just cannot find any setting that is doing this thanks in advance for help Michel Lambert From mhnoyes at users.sourceforge.net Tue Nov 7 19:02:45 2000 From: mhnoyes at users.sourceforge.net (Mike Noyes) Date: Tue, 07 Nov 2000 10:02:45 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] member_posting_only=yes problem In-Reply-To: <4.2.2.20001104092026.00aa51b0@pop.mindspring.com> Message-ID: <4.2.2.20001107095644.00aa6a20@pop.mindspring.com> At 09:35 AM 11/4/00 -0800, Mike Noyes wrote: >I'm the admin for a devel list on SourceForge. I have a member of my list >that has different From and Reply-To addresses. He is subscribed with his >Reply-To address. When I set member_posting_only=yes all of his messages >are held for approval. Is there any way around this problem? At 10:32 AM 11/4/00 -0800, Chuq Von Rospach wrote: >Two solutions. > >1) he subscribes both addresses to the list, and sets "nomail" flag to the >one in his from address. he can do that without admin intervention, so >that's what I usually recommend. I thank all the list members that helped. I implemented the suggestion above from Chuq. Also, I opened the following feature request for Mailman. http://sourceforge.net/bugs/?func=detailbug&bug_id=121894&group_id=103 Thanks again for all the help. -- Mike Noyes mhnoyes at users.sourceforge.net http://sourceforge.net/projects/leaf From sjp at siliconlogic.com Tue Nov 7 20:33:35 2000 From: sjp at siliconlogic.com (Steve Phillips) Date: Tue, 07 Nov 2000 13:33:35 -0600 Subject: [Mailman-Users] How to get list of lists I'm subscribed to? Message-ID: <3A08590F.3D170A84@siliconlogic.com> I know how to go to the web page that shows all of the lists served by our Mailman, but how do I find out which lists I'm subscribed to? I guess I'm looking for a way to ask mailman to give a list of all the email lists a particular user is subscribed to. -- Steve Phillips Phone: (715) 830-1200 x109 Silicon Logic Engineering, LLP FAX: (715) 830-1887 7 South Dewey Street Mailto:sjp at siliconlogic.com Eau Claire, WI 54701 Web: http://www.siliconlogic.com From Dan.Mick at west.sun.com Tue Nov 7 21:30:52 2000 From: Dan.Mick at west.sun.com (Dan Mick) Date: Tue, 07 Nov 2000 12:30:52 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] How to get list of lists I'm subscribed to? References: <3A08590F.3D170A84@siliconlogic.com> Message-ID: <3A08667C.1F098D8C@west.sun.com> Steve Phillips wrote: > I know how to go to the web page that shows all of the lists served by > our Mailman, but how do I find out which lists I'm subscribed to? I > guess I'm looking for a way to ask mailman to give a list of all the > email lists a particular user is subscribed to. Big as life on the user subscription page: Your other subscriptions Enter your password to visit a list of links to option pages for all your subscriptions. There's also bin/find_member. Where did you look? From Dan.Mick at west.sun.com Tue Nov 7 21:28:33 2000 From: Dan.Mick at west.sun.com (Dan Mick) Date: Tue, 07 Nov 2000 12:28:33 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] where References: <3A0825C7.5DADB90F@alternatives.ca> Message-ID: <3A0865F1.FEFC596E@west.sun.com> Your aliases, specifically -admin. Michel Lambert wrote: > > Dear all > > I am just trying to change the adresse of the administrative person who > is receiving the admin messages (like mail awaiting for approuval, > etc...) Just cannot find any setting that is doing this > > thanks in advance for help > > Michel Lambert > > ------------------------------------------------------ > Mailman-Users maillist - Mailman-Users at python.org > http://www.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users From elwin at t-online.de Tue Nov 7 22:59:09 2000 From: elwin at t-online.de (Elwin Ehlers) Date: Tue, 07 Nov 2000 22:59:09 +0100 Subject: [Mailman-Users] 7/8 bit Message-ID: <3A087B2D.973AE07A@t-online.de> Ciao, some guys inside my list, need for the mail the german class mark / type (8 bit) ? = ß ? = ö ...... and not Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii and Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7 bit What is the option to change this. Elwin ___________________________________ Webdesign mailing list Webdesign at lug-bremen.de http://lug-bremen.de/mail/mail.html From dyoo at hkn.eecs.berkeley.edu Wed Nov 8 00:25:29 2000 From: dyoo at hkn.eecs.berkeley.edu (Daniel Yoo) Date: Tue, 7 Nov 2000 15:25:29 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Mailman-Users] Re: [Tutor] Help! I am a newbie with a fool question. In-Reply-To: <3A07FA0C.04489@mail-smtp2> Message-ID: This sounds like a mailman-specific question; you'll probably want to talk to the people at: http://www.list.org They have a mailing list where you can post your questions: http://www.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users/ You may want to mention the type of operating system, and what sort of MTA you're using. Is it sendmail, or qmail, or postfix? In the meantime, I'll try to forward your message to the mailman-users mailing list. >From a quick look, you probably want to make sure that your system can send email; try seeing if you can use pine to send a message to another email address. Mailman depends on your MTA to handle passing mail out to the network. I hope you can find and fix your problem. Good luck! > I am using mailman 2.0 > > Follwing is log file smtp-failures, > > TrySMTPDelivery: To cja888 at etang.com: > TrySMTPDelivery: socket.error / (111, 'Connection refused') (deferred) > TrySMTPDelivery: Maybe your MTA daemon needs restarting? > > How should I do to? From tib at tigerknight.org Wed Nov 8 02:20:52 2000 From: tib at tigerknight.org (Tib) Date: Tue, 7 Nov 2000 17:20:52 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Mailman-Users] linux secure problem Message-ID: Greetings Programs! I'm trying to install mailman and have seen the README.LINUX file about having restricted hard links. How exactly do I turn that off? I'm running mandrake 7. Tib From Dan.Mick at West.Sun.COM Wed Nov 8 02:41:52 2000 From: Dan.Mick at West.Sun.COM (Dan Mick) Date: Tue, 7 Nov 2000 17:41:52 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Mailman-Users] linux secure problem Message-ID: <200011080140.RAA01842@utopia.west.sun.com> > Greetings Programs! > > I'm trying to install mailman and have seen the README.LINUX file about having > restricted hard links. How exactly do I turn that off? I'm running mandrake 7. If you mean "how do I turn that feature of Mandrake off", I don't know; I don't run Mandrake, and this isn't a Mandrake list. Marc Merlin has contributed a patch program to allow Mailman to coexist with those restrictions; see contrib/securelinux_fix.py. From tib at tigerknight.org Wed Nov 8 02:50:33 2000 From: tib at tigerknight.org (Tib) Date: Tue, 7 Nov 2000 17:50:33 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Mailman-Users] linux secure problem In-Reply-To: <200011080140.RAA01842@utopia.west.sun.com> Message-ID: On Tue, 7 Nov 2000, Dan Mick wrote: > If you mean "how do I turn that feature of Mandrake off", I don't > know; I don't run Mandrake, and this isn't a Mandrake list. Darn, I was hoping on an off chance someone here would, since no one on the Mandrake list apparently knows either :] posted there twice with the question and gotten dead air. > Marc Merlin has contributed a patch program to allow Mailman to > coexist with those restrictions; see contrib/securelinux_fix.py. I looked in the contrib directory in the sourcepath I have for making mailman - only found qmail-to-mailman.py. Also checked on ftp.gnu.org as high up as I could go for a 'contrib' folder and under the mailman path. No luck :/ where do I find this patch exactly? Thanks :] Tib From Dan.Mick at West.Sun.COM Wed Nov 8 02:55:28 2000 From: Dan.Mick at West.Sun.COM (Dan Mick) Date: Tue, 7 Nov 2000 17:55:28 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Mailman-Users] linux secure problem Message-ID: <200011080154.RAA02323@utopia.west.sun.com> > > > Marc Merlin has contributed a patch program to allow Mailman to > > coexist with those restrictions; see contrib/securelinux_fix.py. > > I looked in the contrib directory in the sourcepath I have for making mailman - > only found qmail-to-mailman.py. Also checked on ftp.gnu.org as high up as I > could go for a 'contrib' folder and under the mailman path. No luck :/ where do > I find this patch exactly? Thanks :] if you've got rc1, then it must only be in CVS. See the CVS info on www.list.org. From michael at smudo.emjay.net Wed Nov 8 02:59:08 2000 From: michael at smudo.emjay.net (Michael Johnson) Date: Tue, 7 Nov 2000 20:59:08 -0500 (EST) Subject: [Mailman-Users] basic isntallation troubles Message-ID: So I've downloaded rc1 and tried to install it. Now, I have very similar trouble to what I had before. During the compilation on my Mac OS X PB PCI G4/192, it went throught he compilation of the libraries, then started into the "versions.py" part of the compilation and ended up with: Traceback (most recent call last): File "bin/update", line 30, in ? from Mailman import MailList File "/Users/mailman/Mailman/MailList.py", line 45, in ? from Mailman.Archiver import Archiver File "/Users/mailman/Mailman/Archiver/__init__.py", line 17, in ? from Archiver import * File "/Users/mailman/Mailman/Archiver/Archiver.py", line 33, in ? from Mailman import Mailbox File "/Users/mailman/Mailman/Mailbox.py", line 23, in ? import mailbox File "/Users/mailman/Mailman/Mailbox.py", line 27, in ? class Mailbox(mailbox.UnixMailbox): AttributeError: UnixMailbox This is the same problem I had last time I tried to install, but at a different point. It appears to be the same problem, though. Where do I look to fix whatever is wrong? -Michael PS Yuval - Congratulations on HSJ's ALHC first place finish! (Assuming you are the same Yuval Hod I know, that is.) From Dan.Mick at West.Sun.COM Wed Nov 8 03:09:13 2000 From: Dan.Mick at West.Sun.COM (Dan Mick) Date: Tue, 7 Nov 2000 18:09:13 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Mailman-Users] basic isntallation troubles Message-ID: <200011080207.SAA02734@utopia.west.sun.com> > File "/Users/mailman/Mailman/Mailbox.py", line 27, in ? > class Mailbox(mailbox.UnixMailbox): > AttributeError: UnixMailbox > > Where do I look to fix whatever is wrong? Well, that message appears to mean that, wherever you're getting the 'mailbox' module, it doesn't include a UnixMailbox attribute (which is a class defined in that module). Try "python -v bin/update" from the mailman install directory ($prefix, usually /home/mailman) and see what it says about where it's getting the mailbox module from; then look at that file and see if it has UnixMailbox in it. For example, I ran $ python -v ./update2 2>&1 | grep mailbox # /usr/lib/python1.5/mailbox.pyc matches /usr/lib/python1.5/mailbox.py import mailbox # precompiled from /usr/lib/python1.5/mailbox.pyc # cleanup[1] mailbox and looked at /usr/lib/python1.5/mailbox.py and saw UnixMailbox in it. In other words: suspect problems with your Python installation. From tib at tigerknight.org Wed Nov 8 05:27:48 2000 From: tib at tigerknight.org (Tib) Date: Tue, 7 Nov 2000 20:27:48 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Mailman-Users] linux secure problem In-Reply-To: <200011080154.RAA02323@utopia.west.sun.com> Message-ID: I found the patch program you were speaking of - and I tried to run it from the bin directory in Mailman's home path - it returned an error as follows: ------------------------------------------------ [root at unica bin]# ./mlmnpatch Traceback (most recent call last): File "./mlmnpatch", line 45, in ? from Mailman.mm_cfg import MAILMAN_UID, MAILMAN_GID ImportError: cannot import name MAILMAN_UID ------------------------------------------------ I'm not sure what this means or what to do, suggestions? Tib From Dan.Mick at West.Sun.COM Wed Nov 8 05:39:52 2000 From: Dan.Mick at West.Sun.COM (Dan Mick) Date: Tue, 7 Nov 2000 20:39:52 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Mailman-Users] linux secure problem Message-ID: <200011080438.UAA04792@utopia.west.sun.com> It's in my Defaults.py. What Mailman version are you trying to do this with? > I found the patch program you were speaking of - and I tried to run it from the > bin directory in Mailman's home path - it returned an error as follows: > ------------------------------------------------ > [root at unica bin]# ./mlmnpatch > > Traceback (most recent call last): > File "./mlmnpatch", line 45, in ? > from Mailman.mm_cfg import MAILMAN_UID, MAILMAN_GID > ImportError: cannot import name MAILMAN_UID > ------------------------------------------------ > > > I'm not sure what this means or what to do, suggestions? From vikas98 at hotmail.com Wed Nov 8 05:39:38 2000 From: vikas98 at hotmail.com (Vikas Gupta) Date: Wed, 08 Nov 2000 04:39:38 GMT Subject: [Mailman-Users] please someone Help! cannot list lists from listinfo!!! Message-ID: I know this has been asked on this list before but I think I have a new twist which I cant figure out. I have created a public list, which is listed fine under /admin, but does not appear under /listinfo. I get the : "There currently are no publicly-advertised mailman mailing lists" message. I believe I have folloed the INSTALL instrctions correctly for mailman and apache. Can anyone help me out? Thanks in advance, Vikas _________________________________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com. Share information about yourself, create your own public profile at http://profiles.msn.com. From tib at tigerknight.org Wed Nov 8 05:40:23 2000 From: tib at tigerknight.org (Tib) Date: Tue, 7 Nov 2000 20:40:23 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Mailman-Users] linux secure problem In-Reply-To: <200011080438.UAA04792@utopia.west.sun.com> Message-ID: mailman-2.0beta5 ? :] On Tue, 7 Nov 2000, Dan Mick wrote: > It's in my Defaults.py. > > What Mailman version are you trying to do this with? > > > I found the patch program you were speaking of - and I tried to run it from > the > > bin directory in Mailman's home path - it returned an error as follows: > > ------------------------------------------------ > > [root at unica bin]# ./mlmnpatch > > > > Traceback (most recent call last): > > File "./mlmnpatch", line 45, in ? > > from Mailman.mm_cfg import MAILMAN_UID, MAILMAN_GID > > ImportError: cannot import name MAILMAN_UID > > ------------------------------------------------ > > > > > > I'm not sure what this means or what to do, suggestions? > From tib at tigerknight.org Wed Nov 8 07:41:04 2000 From: tib at tigerknight.org (Tib) Date: Tue, 7 Nov 2000 22:41:04 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Mailman-Users] "We're sorry, we hit a bug!" In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Thankyou Dan Mick for your help :] I now have another problem (big surprise, eh?) for anyone who could spare some brain cells for some exercise. When on the mailman admin page for my test list I saw down at the bottom an 'Uh oh, we hit a bug!' comment and checked the error log as it recommended. As follows: admin(8148): [----- Mailman Version: 2.0rc1 -----] admin(8148): [----- Traceback ------] admin(8148): Traceback (most recent call last): admin(8148): File "/home/mailman/scripts/driver", line 96, in run_main admin(8148): main() admin(8148): File "../Mailman/Cgi/admin.py", line 138, in main admin(8148): mlist.Save() admin(8148): File "../Mailman/MailList.py", line 842, in Save admin(8148): self.__save(dict) admin(8148): File "../Mailman/MailList.py", line 818, in __save admin(8148): os.link(fname, fname_last) admin(8148): OSError: [Errno 1] Operation not permitted admin(8148): [----- Python Information -----] Somehow I have a sneaky suspicion this has something to do with the cgi-bin id? have an From kazh at easynet.fr Wed Nov 8 07:44:12 2000 From: kazh at easynet.fr (Alex) Date: Wed, 08 Nov 2000 07:44:12 +0100 Subject: [Mailman-Users] pics attach files Message-ID: <3A08F63C.73BD861@easynet.fr> hi all, Just want to know of it is possible to sent a picture attach file to a mailman mailing list but ignore it in the web interface ? Thank you and sorry for my english. Alex. From xiao.bing at oztime.com Wed Nov 8 08:48:04 2000 From: xiao.bing at oztime.com (Xiao Bing) Date: Wed, 8 Nov 2000 15:48:04 +0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Can use other mothed to handle a subscription request?How to do? Message-ID: <02af01c04958$3ff4a040$eb00a8c0@prc.oztime.com> REpat = re.compile( r"\s*RE\s*:\s*", re.IGNORECASE); who can expain the meaning of this sentence? What meaning of "\s*" stand for? I found some maillist user simply reply the requestion email which subject's prefix is ">:"??I hope maillist procedure can regard both ">:" and "Re:" are valid requestion subject.Who can tell to how to do?I know little about Python. Jack -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mail.python.org/pipermail/mailman-users/attachments/20001108/3058a2c8/attachment.htm From dj-mailman at insigma.com Wed Nov 8 12:17:48 2000 From: dj-mailman at insigma.com (James Aylett) Date: Wed, 8 Nov 2000 11:17:48 +0000 Subject: [Mailman-Users] mailman cron gets uppity Message-ID: <20001108111748.M31670@insigma.com> I'm having problems with Mailman 1.1, on Debian. Looking at the upgrade notes for 2.0b I see that the cron jobs have changed significantly, especially stuff to do with running the queue, so this problem /may/ have been fixed. Given that it usually only shows up at month ends, it's difficult to provoke, and I'd rather /know/ what's going on than upgrade and hope :) Basically, the monthly stuff for subscription reminders causes mailman to bomb out with a 'too many open files' error. It isn't exceeding the OS limit (at least, nothing else is having trouble, and the machine is floating at around 1300 open file handles at the moment), so I can only assume it's exceeding the ulimit. Which should be 1024, unless I'm either very confused or something's changing it. Worse, this leaves lots of run_queue processes lying around (this month, it was about 70). I've tried fiddling with some of the options set out in Defaults.py, that I think ought to restrict the number of concurrent mailman processes, but it isn't documented very clearly so I'm probably wrong (MAX_SPAWNS, DEFAULT_NUM_SPAWNS). Anyone have any ideas on this? James -- /--------------------------------------------------------------------------\ james aylett chief technical architect http://www.tangozebra.com/ tangozebra _____________________________________________________________________ This message has been checked for all known viruses by Star Internet delivered through the MessageLabs Virus Control Centre. For further information visit http://www.star.net.uk/stats.asp From rodrigo at linuxave.net Wed Nov 8 12:09:49 2000 From: rodrigo at linuxave.net (Rodrigo Moya) Date: 08 Nov 2000 10:09:49 -0100 Subject: [Mailman-Users] archives still not working Message-ID: <200011081203.EAA06900@gears.linuxave.net> Hi! The archives for the public lists I've got don't work. I always get: Not Found The requested URL /pipermail/announce-list/ was not found on this server. For the private ones, it works ok, but not with the public ones, which have already several messages. Any idea? Thanks very much From apian at ise.fhg.de Wed Nov 8 19:25:30 2000 From: apian at ise.fhg.de (Peter Apian-Bennewitz) Date: Wed, 08 Nov 2000 19:25:30 +0100 Subject: [Mailman-Users] 2.0r1: admin pages don't gork passwords Message-ID: <3A099A99.2520BA18@ise.fhg.de> Hi, after installing (and running bin/check_perms, setting up crontab etc ) 2.0.r1 I still get consistent "Authentication failed " from all admin pages (with site or admin password). Since there're hardly any doc or log files, I checked the C-wrapper and found cgi.py : # Logging support # =============== logfile = "" # Filename to log to, if not empty logfp = None which didn't write a byte, although it seems to be called. Any hints how to debug this beast are GREATLY appreciated. TIA Peter -- Peter Apian-Bennewitz apian at ise.fhg.de +49-761-4588-[123|302] Fraunhofer Institute for Solar Energy Systems, D-79100 Freiburg -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mail.python.org/pipermail/mailman-users/attachments/20001108/1792afde/attachment.html From gdinwiddie at min.net Wed Nov 8 20:38:05 2000 From: gdinwiddie at min.net (George Dinwiddie) Date: Wed, 8 Nov 2000 14:38:05 -0500 (EST) Subject: [Mailman-Users] Headers & footers on MIME/multipart messages Message-ID: <200011081938.OAA28485@min.net> The header and footer code is obviously not MIME-aware. Therefore, the header and footer get inserted outside the viewed part of the message body. It seems to me that, as a minimum, it would be preferable to only insert into the text/plain part of the message. Better, would be the ability to specify separate headers & footers for text/html and text/plain portions. It could start getting complicated, couldn't it. Unfortunately, multipart/alternative messages with text/plain and text/html versions are becoming very common. I wouldn't mind if the text/html portion was just stripped out and only the text/plain portion was sent out to the list. That would also solve the problem of javascript virusii embedded in the html. Thoughts? Comments? - George ------------------->8----snip, start of example mail-------------------- Message-ID: <001601c048f8$470e9080$1800a8c0 at .net> From: someuser at somewhere To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0013_01C048CE.5AC078C0" +-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------+ | This is the mailing list header | +-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------+ This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0013_01C048CE.5AC078C0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hello all... Anybody know anything about "Sails4free"? =20 ------=_NextPart_000_0013_01C048CE.5AC078C0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Hello all...
 
Anybody know anything about = "Sails4free"? =20
 
------=_NextPart_000_0013_01C048CE.5AC078C0-- _______________________________________________ Public-list mailing list -- Public-list at alberg30.org http://www.alberg30.org/mailman/listinfo/public-list To unsubscribe: email to Public-list-request at alberg30.org Include command "unsubscribe " in subject or body. Use command "help" for more options. ------------------->8----snip, end of example mail-------------------- -- ---------------------------------------------------------------------- George Dinwiddie gdinwiddie at min.net The gods do not deduct from man's allotted span those hours spent in sailing. NEW URL => http://www.Alberg30.org/ ---------------------------------------------------------------------- From mrlist at ActiveState.com Wed Nov 8 20:45:19 2000 From: mrlist at ActiveState.com (Eric Wang) Date: Wed, 08 Nov 2000 11:45:19 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] how can rebuild the heldmsg database? why mailman care? Message-ID: <20001108114003.3A2B.MRLIST@activestate.com> Hi guys, I deleted some helpmsg from filesystem manually, then the mail list web management tools "Tend to pending administrative requests" doesn't work anymore. it report some error. why mailman care about that? how can I rebuid the heldmsg database let it work again? Set "Restrict posting privilege to list members?" to no, change it a un-moderated mail list , then change it back will work? Regards, From mrlist at ActiveState.com Wed Nov 8 20:51:16 2000 From: mrlist at ActiveState.com (Eric Wang) Date: Wed, 08 Nov 2000 11:51:16 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] how can rebuild the heldmsg database? why mailman care? Message-ID: <20001108115044.3A33.MRLIST@activestate.com> Hi guys, I deleted some helpmsg from filesystem manually, then the mail list web management tools "Tend to pending administrative requests" doesn't work anymore. it report some error. why mailman care about that? how can I rebuid the heldmsg database let it work again? Set "Restrict posting privilege to list members?" to no, change it a un-moderated mail list , then change it back will work? Regards, the error: Bug in Mailman version 2.0beta2 We're sorry, we hit a bug! If you would like to help us identify the problem, please email a copy of this page to the webmaster for this site with a description of what happened. Thanks! Traceback: Traceback (innermost last): File "/home/mailman/scripts/driver", line 89, in run_main main() File "/home/mailman/Mailman/Cgi/admindb.py", line 121, in main PrintRequests(mlist, doc, form) File "/home/mailman/Mailman/Cgi/admindb.py", line 176, in PrintRequests PrintPostRequest(mlist, id, info, total, count, form) File "/home/mailman/Mailman/Cgi/admindb.py", line 209, in PrintPostRequest mlist.HandleRequest(id, 2, None) File "/home/mailman/Mailman/ListAdmin.py", line 124, in HandleRequest self.__handlepost(data, value, comment) File "/home/mailman/Mailman/ListAdmin.py", line 200, in __handlepost self.LogMsg('vette', note) File "/home/mailman/Mailman/MailList.py", line 891, in LogMsg logf.write(msg % args + '\n') TypeError: not enough arguments for format string From jeff at ollie.clive.ia.us Wed Nov 8 20:52:31 2000 From: jeff at ollie.clive.ia.us (Jeffrey C. Ollie) Date: Wed, 8 Nov 2000 13:52:31 -0600 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Headers & footers on MIME/multipart messages In-Reply-To: <200011081938.OAA28485@min.net>; from gdinwiddie@min.net on Wed, Nov 08, 2000 at 02:38:05PM -0500 References: <200011081938.OAA28485@min.net> Message-ID: <20001108135231.A20013@ollie.clive.ia.us> On Wed, Nov 08, 2000 at 02:38:05PM -0500, George Dinwiddie wrote: > > The header and footer code is obviously not MIME-aware. Therefore, > the header and footer get inserted outside the viewed part of the > message body. > > It seems to me that, as a minimum, it would be preferable to only > insert into the text/plain part of the message. Better, would be > the ability to specify separate headers & footers for text/html and > text/plain portions. What I'd rather see (and is probably more workable) is to convert a message to a multipart/mixed message with three parts: a text/plain part with the header, a part with the original type and content, and a text/plain part with the footer. I think that this scheme would be easier to code and wouldn't have the problem of messing up a cryptographically signed message. The problem of viruses embedded in messages is best left to a virus scanner hooked into the MTA (like Amavis or exiscan). Jeff -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 240 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://mail.python.org/pipermail/mailman-users/attachments/20001108/c604a2a6/attachment.pgp From chuqui at plaidworks.com Wed Nov 8 21:24:34 2000 From: chuqui at plaidworks.com (Chuq Von Rospach) Date: Wed, 8 Nov 2000 12:24:34 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] An interesting statistic. Message-ID: I thought people might find these numbers interesting. One of my servers sends out newsletters. Those newsletters are avilable both in HTML format and text format -- users can subscribe for whichever they prefer, although HTML is the default. Because of limitations in the AOL clients, we force AOL.com addresses to the text version. I think this list gives a good indication of acceptance of HTML email. My numbers: HTML: 85.4% AOL: 12.9% Text: 1.5% In other words -- given a choice, only 1.5% of subscribers choose text-only. I can't disclose the size of the subscriber base, but the list is in the seven digit world (greater than 1 million, less than ten) and has been around long enough that the subscriber base is stable. Something for the "text is king" email people to think about... It's pretty clear that MIME and/or HTML acceptance is beyond endemic in the general public. (and if 13% of the general subscriber base is AOL, the "AOL can go to hell" groups are hurting only themselves, too... Anyway, the data is data. The rest is IMHO. -- Chuq Von Rospach - Plaidworks Consulting (mailto:chuqui at plaidworks.com) Apple Mail List Gnome (mailto:chuq at apple.com) Be just, and fear not. From scottrus at raleigh.ibm.com Wed Nov 8 22:01:27 2000 From: scottrus at raleigh.ibm.com (Scott Russell) Date: Wed, 8 Nov 2000 16:01:27 -0500 Subject: [Mailman-Users] An interesting statistic. In-Reply-To: ; from chuqui@plaidworks.com on Wed, Nov 08, 2000 at 12:24:34PM -0800 References: Message-ID: <20001108160127.A32763@raleigh.ibm.com> This is true BUT there are some cravats. Your audiance, based on your sig, is Mac users. On the Mac platform HTML mail readers are the norm, not text based readers. In the unix world it's 180 from that. -- Scott On Wed, Nov 08, 2000 at 12:24:34PM -0800, Chuq Von Rospach wrote: > I thought people might find these numbers interesting. > > One of my servers sends out newsletters. Those newsletters are > avilable both in HTML format and text format -- users can subscribe > for whichever they prefer, although HTML is the default. Because of > limitations in the AOL clients, we force AOL.com addresses to the > text version. > > I think this list gives a good indication of acceptance of HTML email. > > My numbers: > > HTML: 85.4% > AOL: 12.9% > Text: 1.5% > > In other words -- given a choice, only 1.5% of subscribers choose > text-only. I can't disclose the size of the subscriber base, but the > list is in the seven digit world (greater than 1 million, less than > ten) and has been around long enough that the subscriber base is > stable. > > Something for the "text is king" email people to think about... It's > pretty clear that MIME and/or HTML acceptance is beyond endemic in > the general public. > > (and if 13% of the general subscriber base is AOL, the "AOL can go to > hell" groups are hurting only themselves, too... > > Anyway, the data is data. The rest is IMHO. > > -- > Chuq Von Rospach - Plaidworks Consulting (mailto:chuqui at plaidworks.com) > Apple Mail List Gnome (mailto:chuq at apple.com) > > Be just, and fear not. > > ------------------------------------------------------ > Mailman-Users maillist - Mailman-Users at python.org > http://www.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users -- Regards, Scott Russell (scottrus at raleigh.ibm.com) Linux Technology Center, System Admin, RHCE. From chuqui at plaidworks.com Wed Nov 8 22:08:16 2000 From: chuqui at plaidworks.com (Chuq Von Rospach) Date: Wed, 8 Nov 2000 13:08:16 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] An interesting statistic. In-Reply-To: <20001108160127.A32763@raleigh.ibm.com> References: <20001108160127.A32763@raleigh.ibm.com> Message-ID: At 4:01 PM -0500 11/8/00, Scott Russell wrote: >This is true BUT there are some cravats. Your audiance, based on your sig, >is Mac users. On the Mac platform HTML mail readers are the norm, not text >based readers. > >In the unix world it's 180 from that. I wouldn't say "mac users" because that's not necessarily true. But I will agree to some degree that I'm oriented at the general populace (and/or consumer), vs a technical audience. Goes to show you need to know your audience, but unless you're specifically aimed at a technical/unix audience, it's clear where the general net audience has gone. And I wonder just how many unix folks have adopted a graphical client as well.... I have my guesses, but I don't have nubmers for that. -- Chuq Von Rospach - Plaidworks Consulting (mailto:chuqui at plaidworks.com) Apple Mail List Gnome (mailto:chuq at apple.com) Be just, and fear not. From tib at tigerknight.org Wed Nov 8 22:44:12 2000 From: tib at tigerknight.org (Tib) Date: Wed, 8 Nov 2000 13:44:12 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Mailman-Users] patch problem Message-ID: I installed rc1 and applied the patch (which reported success btw) but found an error in my logs of: Nov 7 20:05:25 unica kernel: Security: denied hard link to 0.603 for UID 531, EUID 531, process python:27692 Nov 7 22:32:52 unica kernel: Security: denied hard link to 0.603 for UID 99, EUID 99, process python:8148 Those id's happen to be mailman(531) and nobody(99). what is the 0.603 and what id do I have to configure to get this to work properly? Tib From dans at audifans.com Wed Nov 8 23:02:35 2000 From: dans at audifans.com (Dan Simoes) Date: Wed, 08 Nov 2000 17:02:35 -0500 Subject: [Mailman-Users] need help with web interface bug Message-ID: <3A09CD7B.58104ABB@audifans.com> I recently switched my site from majordomo to mailman. Everything has been going great, until today, when I noticed that in some cases, users cannot change their options through the web interface. The error presented is the usual "Bug in Mailman..." and looks like others that have been reported here (included below). What is odd is that it will work fine for some lists, and not for others. I would really appreciate some help on this one - I have compared file permissions, etc and nothing is looking very obvious, but I am not that familiar with the inner workings. The only thing I could think of doing was upgrading from beta5 to beta6 (done, did not fix the problem) and deleting the bad lists and recreating them (haven't done that yet). Thanks for any pointers, I've already checked the archives back a few months. | Dan | -- Bug in Mailman version 2.0beta6 We're sorry, we hit a bug! If you would like to help us identify the problem, please email a copy of this page to the webmaster for this site with a description of what happened. Thanks! Traceback: Traceback (innermost last): File "/home/mailman/scripts/driver", line 96, in run_main main() File "/home/mailman/Mailman/Cgi/handle_opts.py", line 85, in main process_form(mlist, user, doc) File "/home/mailman/Mailman/Cgi/handle_opts.py", line 247, in process_form mlist.ConfirmUserPassword(user, form['digpw'].value) File "/home/mailman/Mailman/SecurityManager.py", line 155, in ConfirmUserPassword if self.ValidAdminPassword(pw): File "/home/mailman/Mailman/SecurityManager.py", line 65, in ValidAdminPassword return type(pw) == StringType and \ TypeError: argument 2: expected string without null bytes, string found Python information: Variable Value sys.version 1.5.2 (#2, Aug 25 2000, 03:03:24) [GCC 2.8.1] sys.executable /usr/local/bin/python sys.prefix /usr/local sys.exec_prefix /usr/local sys.path /usr/local sys.platform sunos5 Environment variables: Variable Value DOCUMENT_ROOT /files/www/audifans SERVER_ADDR 168.100.186.100 HTTP_ACCEPT_ENCODING gzip CONTENT_LENGTH 143 CONTENT_TYPE application/x-www-form-urlencoded PATH_TRANSLATED /files/www/audifans/v8/dans at audifans.com REMOTE_ADDR 63.69.130.254 SERVER_SOFTWARE Apache/1.3.14 (Unix) PHP/4.0.3pl1 GATEWAY_INTERFACE CGI/1.1 UNIQUE_ID OgnLxqhkumQAAAH8VEg HTTP_ACCEPT_LANGUAGE en REMOTE_PORT 46017 SERVER_PORT 80 TZ US/Eastern HTTP_USER_AGENT Mozilla/4.76 [en] (Windows NT 5.0; U) HTTP_ACCEPT_CHARSET iso-8859-1,*,utf-8 HTTP_ACCEPT image/gif, image/x-xbitmap, image/jpeg, image/pjpeg, image/png, */* REQUEST_URI /mailman/handle_opts/v8/dans at audifans.com PATH /usr/sbin:/usr/bin QUERY_STRING SERVER_PROTOCOL HTTP/1.0 PATH_INFO /v8/dans at audifans.com HTTP_HOST www.audifans.com REQUEST_METHOD POST SERVER_SIGNATURE Apache/1.3.14 Server at www.audifans.com Port 80 SCRIPT_NAME /mailman/handle_opts SERVER_ADMIN dans at audifans.com SCRIPT_FILENAME /home/mailman/cgi-bin/handle_opts PYTHONPATH /home/mailman HTTP_REFERER http://www.audifans.com/mailman/subscribe/v8 SERVER_NAME www.audifans.com HTTP_CONNECTION Keep-Alive From Dan.Mick at west.sun.com Wed Nov 8 23:25:07 2000 From: Dan.Mick at west.sun.com (Dan Mick) Date: Wed, 08 Nov 2000 14:25:07 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] "We're sorry, we hit a bug!" References: Message-ID: <3A09D2C3.619B97F0@west.sun.com> README.LINUX/Openwall security patches/"contrib/" Tib wrote: > > Thankyou Dan Mick for your help :] I now have another problem (big surprise, > eh?) for anyone who could spare some brain cells for some exercise. > > When on the mailman admin page for my test list I saw down at the bottom an > 'Uh oh, we hit a bug!' comment and checked the error log as it recommended. As > follows: > > admin(8148): [----- Mailman Version: 2.0rc1 -----] > admin(8148): [----- Traceback ------] > admin(8148): Traceback (most recent call last): > admin(8148): File "/home/mailman/scripts/driver", line 96, in run_main > admin(8148): main() > admin(8148): File "../Mailman/Cgi/admin.py", line 138, in main > admin(8148): mlist.Save() > admin(8148): File "../Mailman/MailList.py", line 842, in Save > admin(8148): self.__save(dict) > admin(8148): File "../Mailman/MailList.py", line 818, in __save > admin(8148): os.link(fname, fname_last) > admin(8148): OSError: [Errno 1] Operation not permitted > admin(8148): [----- Python Information -----] > > Somehow I have a sneaky suspicion this has something to do with the cgi-bin > id? have an > > ------------------------------------------------------ > Mailman-Users maillist - Mailman-Users at python.org > http://www.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users From Dan.Mick at west.sun.com Wed Nov 8 23:28:02 2000 From: Dan.Mick at west.sun.com (Dan Mick) Date: Wed, 08 Nov 2000 14:28:02 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] mailman cron gets uppity References: <20001108111748.M31670@insigma.com> Message-ID: <3A09D372.23EEA867@west.sun.com> There was a very-recent change to the CVS to destroy file handles when the SMTP mailer gets into problems (an error condiction was also consuming file handles). So there are probably two problems: ungraceful MTA exits, and this Mailman error-processing bug. It's been discussed very recently on either -users or -developers. Upgrading to CVS may be beneficial. James Aylett wrote: > > I'm having problems with Mailman 1.1, on Debian. Looking at the upgrade > notes for 2.0b I see that the cron jobs have changed significantly, > especially stuff to do with running the queue, so this problem /may/ have > been fixed. Given that it usually only shows up at month ends, it's > difficult to provoke, and I'd rather /know/ what's going on than upgrade and > hope :) > > Basically, the monthly stuff for subscription reminders causes mailman to > bomb out with a 'too many open files' error. It isn't exceeding the OS limit > (at least, nothing else is having trouble, and the machine is floating at > around 1300 open file handles at the moment), so I can only assume it's > exceeding the ulimit. Which should be 1024, unless I'm either very confused > or something's changing it. > > Worse, this leaves lots of run_queue processes lying around (this month, it > was about 70). > > I've tried fiddling with some of the options set out in Defaults.py, that I > think ought to restrict the number of concurrent mailman processes, but it > isn't documented very clearly so I'm probably wrong (MAX_SPAWNS, > DEFAULT_NUM_SPAWNS). > > Anyone have any ideas on this? > > James > > -- > /--------------------------------------------------------------------------\ > james aylett chief technical architect > http://www.tangozebra.com/ tangozebra > > _____________________________________________________________________ > This message has been checked for all known viruses by Star Internet delivered > through the MessageLabs Virus Control Centre. For further information visit > http://www.star.net.uk/stats.asp > > ------------------------------------------------------ > Mailman-Users maillist - Mailman-Users at python.org > http://www.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users From Dan.Mick at west.sun.com Wed Nov 8 23:29:47 2000 From: Dan.Mick at west.sun.com (Dan Mick) Date: Wed, 08 Nov 2000 14:29:47 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] 2.0r1: admin pages don't gork passwords References: <3A099A99.2520BA18@ise.fhg.de> Message-ID: <3A09D3DB.7BA7117@west.sun.com> > Since there're hardly any doc or log files, I checked the C-wrapper and found cgi.py : > > # Logging support > # =============== > > logfile = "" # Filename to log to, if not empty > logfp = None > > which didn't write a byte, although it seems to be called. I don't understand; are you saying you changed this code somehow? Clearly that code isn't going to write anything. > Any hints how to debug this beast are GREATLY appreciated. When you say 2.0r1 do you mean 2.0rc1, or beta1? 2.0rc1 is the last tarball, and I believe auth was changed a lot between beta1 and now. From Dan.Mick at west.sun.com Wed Nov 8 23:31:38 2000 From: Dan.Mick at west.sun.com (Dan Mick) Date: Wed, 08 Nov 2000 14:31:38 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] how can rebuild the heldmsg database? why mailman care? References: <20001108114003.3A2B.MRLIST@activestate.com> Message-ID: <3A09D44A.E0367E80@west.sun.com> Eric Wang wrote: > > Hi guys, > > I deleted some helpmsg from filesystem manually, What does this mean? > then the mail list > web management tools "Tend to pending administrative requests" > doesn't work anymore. it report some error. > why mailman care about that? > how can I rebuid the heldmsg database let it work again? > Set "Restrict posting privilege to list members?" to no, change it a > un-moderated mail list , then change it back will work? > > Regards, > > ------------------------------------------------------ > Mailman-Users maillist - Mailman-Users at python.org > http://www.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users From Dan.Mick at west.sun.com Wed Nov 8 23:37:45 2000 From: Dan.Mick at west.sun.com (Dan Mick) Date: Wed, 08 Nov 2000 14:37:45 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] need help with web interface bug References: <3A09CD7B.58104ABB@audifans.com> Message-ID: <3A09D5B9.C2046858@west.sun.com> Dan Simoes wrote: > > I recently switched my site from majordomo to mailman. Everything has > been going great, until today, when I noticed that in some cases, users > cannot change their options through the web interface. > > The error presented is the usual "Bug in Mailman..." and looks like > others that have been reported here (included below). It's obvious to everyone that "Bug in Mailman..." is not the error, and that the traceback particulars are the error, right? "The OS is patched not to allow hardlinks" is rather-obviously a completely different problem than "expected string without null bytes, string found". It looks like you've got a user with no password at all. I've seen this, but I don't know how it occurred. The only fix I found was to manually adjust the database, using bin/withlist. This isn't for the faint of heart. I don't know what caused it and it hasn't recurred, but I suspect bugs in the handling of "delete users at bounce time" that didn't delete them altogether, so suspect users that are in your subscribe or bounce log file as "removed" or "deleted" (forget what it says exactly). It's possible that if you use bin/remove_member on the addresses which are supposed to be all gone, things will heal themselves; if not, mail me privately and I'll walk you through some manual procedures that should fix up your list database. > What is odd is that it will work fine for some lists, and not for > others. > > I would really appreciate some help on this one - I have compared file > permissions, etc and nothing is looking very obvious, but I am not that > familiar with the inner workings. > > The only thing I could think of doing was upgrading from beta5 to beta6 > (done, did not fix the problem) rc1 is the current release; why are you using betas at all? > and deleting the bad lists and > recreating them (haven't done that yet). > > Thanks for any pointers, I've already checked the archives back a few > months. > > | Dan | > -- > > Bug in Mailman version 2.0beta6 > > We're sorry, we hit a bug! > > If you would like to help us identify the problem, please email a copy > of this page to the webmaster for this site with a description of what > happened. Thanks! > > Traceback: > > Traceback (innermost last): > File "/home/mailman/scripts/driver", line 96, in run_main > main() > File "/home/mailman/Mailman/Cgi/handle_opts.py", line 85, in main > process_form(mlist, user, doc) > File "/home/mailman/Mailman/Cgi/handle_opts.py", line 247, in > process_form > mlist.ConfirmUserPassword(user, form['digpw'].value) > File "/home/mailman/Mailman/SecurityManager.py", line 155, in > ConfirmUserPassword > if self.ValidAdminPassword(pw): > File "/home/mailman/Mailman/SecurityManager.py", line 65, in > ValidAdminPassword > return type(pw) == StringType and \ > TypeError: argument 2: expected string without null bytes, string found > > Python information: > > Variable > Value > sys.version > 1.5.2 (#2, Aug 25 2000, 03:03:24) [GCC 2.8.1] > sys.executable > /usr/local/bin/python > sys.prefix > /usr/local > sys.exec_prefix > /usr/local > sys.path > /usr/local > sys.platform > sunos5 > > Environment variables: > > Variable > Value > DOCUMENT_ROOT > /files/www/audifans > SERVER_ADDR > 168.100.186.100 > HTTP_ACCEPT_ENCODING > gzip > CONTENT_LENGTH > 143 > CONTENT_TYPE > application/x-www-form-urlencoded > PATH_TRANSLATED > /files/www/audifans/v8/dans at audifans.com > REMOTE_ADDR > 63.69.130.254 > SERVER_SOFTWARE > Apache/1.3.14 (Unix) PHP/4.0.3pl1 > GATEWAY_INTERFACE > CGI/1.1 > UNIQUE_ID > OgnLxqhkumQAAAH8VEg > HTTP_ACCEPT_LANGUAGE > en > REMOTE_PORT > 46017 > SERVER_PORT > 80 > TZ > US/Eastern > HTTP_USER_AGENT > Mozilla/4.76 [en] (Windows NT 5.0; U) > HTTP_ACCEPT_CHARSET > iso-8859-1,*,utf-8 > HTTP_ACCEPT > image/gif, image/x-xbitmap, image/jpeg, > image/pjpeg, image/png, */* > REQUEST_URI > /mailman/handle_opts/v8/dans at audifans.com > PATH > /usr/sbin:/usr/bin > QUERY_STRING > SERVER_PROTOCOL > HTTP/1.0 > PATH_INFO > /v8/dans at audifans.com > HTTP_HOST > www.audifans.com > REQUEST_METHOD > POST > SERVER_SIGNATURE > Apache/1.3.14 Server at www.audifans.com Port 80 > SCRIPT_NAME > /mailman/handle_opts > SERVER_ADMIN > dans at audifans.com > SCRIPT_FILENAME > /home/mailman/cgi-bin/handle_opts > PYTHONPATH > /home/mailman > HTTP_REFERER > http://www.audifans.com/mailman/subscribe/v8 > SERVER_NAME > www.audifans.com > HTTP_CONNECTION > Keep-Alive > > ------------------------------------------------------ > Mailman-Users maillist - Mailman-Users at python.org > http://www.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users From topwaysolar at sina.com Thu Nov 9 02:37:17 2000 From: topwaysolar at sina.com (daniel li) Date: Thu, 9 Nov 2000 09:37:17 +0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Solar Products from China Message-ID: <08aa01c049ee$0eaf7dc0$78e4fea9@8> Dear Sirs or Madam, We are glad to have learnt your name from the internet. We are a well established manufacturer and exporter of full range of solar products in China .Our major products are Solar Lanterns, Solar Garden lights, Solar Radios, Solar Cooling Caps, Solar Home Lighting Kits, Inverters,12VDC Energy Saving Lights , Solar Panels and so on. All the solar products are widely used in our daily lives, e.g. lighting, camping, and traveling. Products' details can be obtained from our on-line catalogue at : www.solar3000.com or www.suntopway.com . If you are interested in our solar products, please let us know by fax or E-mail at your earliest time. You may be sure that any enquiry from you will receive our careful attention. Looking forward to hearing from you promptly and the opportunity of establishing business relations with you in near future. Thanks and Best Regards! Sincerely yours, Daniel Li Marketing Director E-mail: topwaysolar at sina.com Shenzhen Top Way Solar Co., Ltd. Room L,10th Floor,Western Coast Building, Nanyou Dadao, Nanshan Shenzhen P. R. China Post Code : 518054 Tel :+ 86-755-6490200,6070402,6070440; Fax :+86-755-6070222,6490201; Website : www.solar3000.com or www.suntopway.com -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mail.python.org/pipermail/mailman-users/attachments/20001109/a58aa3ad/attachment.html From mbuddy at bigpond.net.au Thu Nov 9 02:51:55 2000 From: mbuddy at bigpond.net.au (Markus Buchanan) Date: Thu, 09 Nov 2000 12:51:55 +1100 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Problems with Pending email confirms Message-ID: Hi All, Let me preface this by saying I have read the INSTALL guides and done a search here first. I have a problem with emails being stuck in the subscribe confirmation stage. Like: Nov 09 10:55:35 2000 (9809) test: pending fred at earthling.net 144.132.34.38 I have also noted that the README.SENDMAIL states that smrsh can be a problem, and that a symlink can be a solution. It suggest to cd into the smrsh directory and create one. On my system (Cobalt RaQ3i) smrsh is in the /usr/sbin/ directory, not in a directory of it's own. Now as I am no guru, do I make the symlink in that directory? BTW I have Majordomo running, so I need to alter the wrapper to mailman_wrapper or similar. Is this easy to do by hacking the python files? Sorry if this is an easy one, but I have managed to get it this far without calling you guys for help! This is my first time on here, so be gentle... Cheers Markus From tneff at grassyhill.org Thu Nov 9 02:56:07 2000 From: tneff at grassyhill.org (Tom Neff) Date: Wed, 08 Nov 2000 20:56:07 -0500 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Re: HTML mail In-Reply-To: <20001108223005.E95081CFDB@dinsdale.python.org> Message-ID: <3054358265.973716967@[192.168.1.101]> If you want to make a convincing argument with numbers, clear out your database, make plain text the default INSTEAD of having HTML the default, load 'em up and send us that results table. I bet your majority would swing solidly the other way. Most users accept the default rather than risk actively making "a choice," and would probably accept Esperanto rendered into GIF images by default if that's what you gave them. Another interesting statistic would be how many messages, out of the total HTML messages received, actually USE any of the features of HTML mail. Most of my users basically appear to use it like any other text editor, for simple messages LIKE THESE THAT WE ARE EXCHANGING by the way, so that the HTML functionality is completely superfluous. From mbuddy at bigpond.net.au Thu Nov 9 03:17:57 2000 From: mbuddy at bigpond.net.au (Markus Buchanan) Date: Thu, 09 Nov 2000 13:17:57 +1100 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Problems with Pending email confirms In-Reply-To: Message-ID: By The Way, I have enabled the Cron settings as noted in the Instll guide as well... Markus From dan at ssc.com Thu Nov 9 03:39:05 2000 From: dan at ssc.com (Dan Wilder) Date: Wed, 8 Nov 2000 18:39:05 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Re: HTML mail In-Reply-To: <3054358265.973716967@[192.168.1.101]>; from tneff@grassyhill.org on Wed, Nov 08, 2000 at 08:56:07PM -0500 References: <20001108223005.E95081CFDB@dinsdale.python.org> <3054358265.973716967@[192.168.1.101]> Message-ID: <20001108183905.C11646@ssc.com> On Wed, Nov 08, 2000 at 08:56:07PM -0500, Tom Neff wrote: > If you want to make a convincing argument with numbers, clear out your > database, make plain text the default INSTEAD of having HTML the default, > load 'em up and send us that results table. I bet your majority would > swing solidly the other way. Most users accept the default rather than > risk actively making "a choice," and would probably accept Esperanto > rendered into GIF images by default if that's what you gave them. [ ... ] We run a number of email lists available in html and text. Signup defaults to text, but users can check the html box. The lists are Linux-oriented and technical, so we may assume the subscribers are reading them with a pretty fair variety of mailers, probably including Netscape email clients, Mutt, Pine, as well as Eudora, Outlook, whatever's popular now on Mac, and who knows what else! We have quite a few aol subscribers, who seem to split between the text and the html versions. I'm not at liberty to share the numbers, except to say subscriptions run more than four and less than six digits per list. The lists run pretty close to 60% text subscribers, 40% html. This despite subscribers having to act to request html. On the html lists, we don't attach additional headers or footers, nor is it likely we would, unless the list server was quite adapt at adding MIME attachments without error. The text lists have html postings converted on the way in using lynx -dump, and in addition, footers are attached. ----------------------------------------------------------------- Dan Wilder Technical Manager & Correspondent SSC, Inc. P.O. Box 55549 Phone: 206-782-7733 x123 Seattle, WA 98155-0549 URL http://www.linuxjournal.com/ ----------------------------------------------------------------- From chuqui at plaidworks.com Thu Nov 9 05:43:57 2000 From: chuqui at plaidworks.com (Chuq Von Rospach) Date: Wed, 8 Nov 2000 20:43:57 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Re: HTML mail In-Reply-To: <3054358265.973716967@[192.168.1.101]> References: <3054358265.973716967@[192.168.1.101]> Message-ID: At 8:56 PM -0500 11/8/00, Tom Neff wrote: >If you want to make a convincing argument with numbers, clear out >your database, make plain text the default INSTEAD of having HTML >the default, Tom, God could come down with stone tablets proving it, and you wouldn't believe it. I'm not trying to prove anything. I'm putting the numbers out there. you're welcome to believe what yo want. -- Chuq Von Rospach - Plaidworks Consulting (mailto:chuqui at plaidworks.com) Apple Mail List Gnome (mailto:chuq at apple.com) Be just, and fear not. From tneff at grassyhill.org Thu Nov 9 05:59:55 2000 From: tneff at grassyhill.org (Tom Neff) Date: Wed, 08 Nov 2000 23:59:55 -0500 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Re: HTML mail In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <3065386265.973727995@[192.168.1.101]> --On Wednesday, November 08, 2000 8:43 PM -0800 Chuq Von Rospach wrote: > At 8:56 PM -0500 11/8/00, Tom Neff wrote: >> If you want to make a convincing argument with numbers, clear out >> your database, make plain text the default INSTEAD of having HTML >> the default, > > Tom, God could come down with stone tablets proving it, and you wouldn't > believe it. Proof doesn't come from God, but from itself. God could appear with stone tablets containing claims that I was supposed to accept without proof, and I wouldn't automatically believe them, that's true. Or a scruffy pizza delivery guy could appear with a self-evident proposition scrawled on the back of a grease stained pie bag and I'd be all over it. We'd have to take the pizza out and eat it first though. :) > I'm not trying to prove anything. I'm putting the numbers out there. > you're welcome to believe what yo want. You are putting SOME numbers (not "the" numbers, since there are others) out there, and your particular numbers arrive with significant preconditions. I will quite cheerfully stand by my prior conjecture (leaving "belief" to the sages and medicine men): Most users simply accept the default format offered to them. If you make HTML the default format, you will ring up an impressive majority for HTML. If you make plain text the default format, a similar majority will go that way. If you offered no options at all, you would probably go for months without complaint. HTML is not a compelling user issue for most mailing lists. It is a compelling admin issue because of the extra bandwidth and the difficulties with Digests. Demime helps but it is not a panacaea. If it did not impose bandwidth and formatting burdens, most admins would no more care about HTML than they do about double versus single dashes in the message body. But the burdens do exist, and cooked user "preference" numbers do not alleviate them. From dans at audifans.com Thu Nov 9 06:31:05 2000 From: dans at audifans.com (Dan Simoes) Date: Thu, 09 Nov 2000 00:31:05 -0500 Subject: [Mailman-Users] need help with web interface bug References: <3A09CD7B.58104ABB@audifans.com> <3A09D5B9.C2046858@west.sun.com> Message-ID: <3A0A3699.202DA9E2@audifans.com> Dan Mick wrote: > It's obvious to everyone that "Bug in Mailman..." is not the error, and that > the traceback particulars are the error, right? Yes, I realize that. > It looks like you've got a user with no password at all. A user, or this user? In this case, I was the user. On 2 of 7 lists, I was able to change my settings. On the other 5 lists, I got the error. On the lists that are generating the error, they are doing this for all users, or at least a lot of them. > It's possible that if you use bin/remove_member on the addresses which are > supposed to be all gone, things will heal themselves; if not, mail me > privately and I'll walk you through some manual procedures that should > fix up your list database. Please share. Thanks. > rc1 is the current release; why are you using betas at all? Didn't realize it was out. I'll upgrade, thanks. | Dan | From rogerk at QueerNet.ORG Thu Nov 9 06:37:50 2000 From: rogerk at QueerNet.ORG (Roger B.A. Klorese) Date: Wed, 8 Nov 2000 21:37:50 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Mailman-Users] Re: HTML mail In-Reply-To: <3065386265.973727995@[192.168.1.101]> Message-ID: On Wed, 8 Nov 2000, Tom Neff wrote: > If it did not impose > bandwidth and formatting burdens, most admins would no more care about HTML > than they do about double versus single dashes in the message body. Any corporation that allocates bandwidth so thinly that raising its email traffic by 3x creates problems has much bigger problems than whether it accepts HTML mail. And digests are easy -- that's what MIME digests are for. -- ROGER B.A. KLORESE rogerk at QueerNet.ORG PO Box 14309 San Francisco, CA 94114 "There is only one real blasphemy -- the refusal of joy!" -- Paul Rudnick From bob at nleaudio.com Thu Nov 9 06:44:06 2000 From: bob at nleaudio.com (Bob Puff@NLE) Date: Thu, 09 Nov 2000 00:44:06 -0500 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Re: HTML mail References: <20001108223005.E95081CFDB@dinsdale.python.org> <3054358265.973716967@[192.168.1.101]> <20001108183905.C11646@ssc.com> Message-ID: <3A0A39A6.97C4705A@nleaudio.com> Ok guys, I need to ask: how are you making html digests with html posts, and yet stripping all the excess html junk from the text-only digests?? That's exactly what I want to do, but all I've seen so far is to use the demime program ahead of Mailman, which makes everything plain text.. negating the usefulness of the mime digests. On another line: I have heard that Outlook makes the mime digests look like a ton of little attachments. How do you fix this? The mime digest puts a ton of header information in each message (that is stripped out of the plain text version). This seems to be displayed fully in Eudora. Can a lot of this junk be cut out? Bob From dans at audifans.com Thu Nov 9 07:14:06 2000 From: dans at audifans.com (Dan Simoes) Date: Thu, 09 Nov 2000 01:14:06 -0500 Subject: [Mailman-Users] need help with web interface bug References: <3A09CD7B.58104ABB@audifans.com> <3A09D5B9.C2046858@west.sun.com> <3A0A3699.202DA9E2@audifans.com> Message-ID: <3A0A40AE.8AAD7F7A@audifans.com> Here's another tidbit I just discovered. If I, as a user, enter my password and try to change some options, such as setting digest mode, I hit the bug. If I enter the site password instead, it works fine. Hope this aids the debugging... Dan Simoes wrote: > > Dan Mick wrote: > > It's obvious to everyone that "Bug in Mailman..." is not the error, and that > > the traceback particulars are the error, right? > > Yes, I realize that. > > > It looks like you've got a user with no password at all. > > A user, or this user? In this case, I was the user. On 2 of 7 lists, I > was able to change my settings. On the other 5 lists, I got the error. > On the lists that are generating the error, they are doing this for all > users, or at least a lot of them. > > > It's possible that if you use bin/remove_member on the addresses > which are > > supposed to be all gone, things will heal themselves; if not, mail me > > privately and I'll walk you through some manual procedures that should > > fix up your list database. > > Please share. Thanks. > > > rc1 is the current release; why are you using betas at all? > Didn't realize it was out. I'll upgrade, thanks. > > | Dan | From tneff at panix.com Thu Nov 9 07:22:53 2000 From: tneff at panix.com (Tom Neff) Date: Thu, 09 Nov 2000 01:22:53 -0500 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Re: HTML mail In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <3070364246.973732973@[192.168.1.101]> --On Wednesday, November 08, 2000 9:37 PM -0800 "Roger B.A. Klorese" wrote: > Any corporation that allocates bandwidth so thinly that raising its email > traffic by 3x creates problems has much bigger problems than whether it > accepts HTML mail. This sounds plausible until you pause to consider that (a) the entity hosting or managing a mailing list may not necessarily be a "corporation," and it is not solely the concerns of corporations that ought to guide us as managers and developers of mailing list resources; (b) from one entity to the next, it is difficult to generalize about the portion of overall Net bandwidth dedicated to mail distribution. Most organizations would have difficulty tripling their OVERALL bandwidth consumption with discomfort and expense, so the closer to all-mail an outfit is, the bigger a deal HTML/MIME becomes; (c) even if a given list manager member's company, nonprofit, school, church, household, or air base does have "bigger problems," which seem to be in plenteous supply nowadays, it is not necessarily any of our business and should not be used as an excuse for wasteful, confusing mail formats when most people (as we are doing now) just write plain text anyway. > And digests are easy -- that's what MIME digests are for. MIME "digests" are both misnamed (since very little is digested, as opposed to omnivorously concatenated) and a major pain in the a** for 7/8 of the mailers in conventional use. What is more, they commit the WORST carnage in precisely the situation created by marching-morons mailers like Outlook Express - where multipart text/HTML bundles are submitted for distribution on lists that are themselves MIME "digested." It's a hideous mess, and it's definitely not why people wanted Digests in the first place - to reduce high-count discussion/announcement lists to a readable daily omnibus with concomitant space savings on redundant header info. I would like to see some Web based solutions that let members see a Web based Digest (or some other form) when they click on a notifying URL. From rogerk at QueerNet.ORG Thu Nov 9 07:27:13 2000 From: rogerk at QueerNet.ORG (Roger B.A. Klorese) Date: Wed, 8 Nov 2000 22:27:13 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Mailman-Users] Re: HTML mail In-Reply-To: <3070364246.973732973@[192.168.1.101]> Message-ID: On Thu, 9 Nov 2000, Tom Neff wrote: > This sounds plausible until you pause to consider that > (a) the entity hosting or managing a mailing list may not necessarily > be a "corporation," and it is not solely the concerns of corporations > that ought to guide us as managers and developers of mailing list > resources; I am including service providers as corporations, of course. Same for nonprofits. > (c) even if a given list manager member's company, nonprofit, school, > church, household, or air base does have "bigger problems," which seem to > be in plenteous supply nowadays, it is not necessarily any of our business > and should not be used as an excuse for wasteful, confusing mail formats > when most people (as we are doing now) just write plain text anyway. Confusing to whom? > MIME "digests" are both misnamed (since very little is digested, as opposed > to omnivorously concatenated) and a major pain in the a** for 7/8 of the > mailers in conventional use. *ALL* digests are misnamed by this metric. -- ROGER B.A. KLORESE rogerk at QueerNet.ORG PO Box 14309 San Francisco, CA 94114 "There is only one real blasphemy -- the refusal of joy!" -- Paul Rudnick From chuqui at plaidworks.com Thu Nov 9 07:31:22 2000 From: chuqui at plaidworks.com (Chuq Von Rospach) Date: Wed, 8 Nov 2000 22:31:22 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Re: HTML mail In-Reply-To: <3070364246.973732973@[192.168.1.101]> References: <3070364246.973732973@[192.168.1.101]> Message-ID: my apologies to the list. I thought folks would find the numbers interesting, perhaps useful. I didn't realize it'd import the standard list-managers mailing list HTML rant argument into mailman-users. My bad. if I'd known, I'd have just posted it to list-managers and saved this list the fun of watching the latest iteration of an old favorite. -- Chuq Von Rospach - Plaidworks Consulting (mailto:chuqui at plaidworks.com) Apple Mail List Gnome (mailto:chuq at apple.com) Be just, and fear not. From jwblist at olympus.net Thu Nov 9 07:42:09 2000 From: jwblist at olympus.net (John W Baxter) Date: Wed, 8 Nov 2000 22:42:09 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] An interesting statistic. In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: At 12:24 -0800 11/8/00, Chuq Von Rospach wrote: >One of my servers sends out newsletters. Those newsletters are >avilable both in HTML format and text format -- users can subscribe >for whichever they prefer, although HTML is the default. Because of >limitations in the AOL clients, we force AOL.com addresses to the >text version. The way this list (to which I subscribe) does HTML mail makes sense. It's about the only HTML mail I tolerate, and the only HTML mail I receive voluntarily. [All that said, I've been toying with the idea of switching to text to avoid waiting for the graphics to find their way over my 56K frame relay connection.] If the typical run of HTML were this sensible, I wouldn't be so vocally anti-HTML mail. The only time I send the stuff is to test something, usually with me as the recipient. --John -- John Baxter jwblist at olympus.net Port Ludlow, WA, USA From claw at kanga.nu Thu Nov 9 08:47:16 2000 From: claw at kanga.nu (J C Lawrence) Date: Wed, 08 Nov 2000 23:47:16 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Re: HTML mail In-Reply-To: Message from "Bob Puff@NLE" of "Thu, 09 Nov 2000 00:44:06 EST." <3A0A39A6.97C4705A@nleaudio.com> References: <20001108223005.E95081CFDB@dinsdale.python.org> <3054358265.973716967@[192.168.1.101]> <20001108183905.C11646@ssc.com> <3A0A39A6.97C4705A@nleaudio.com> Message-ID: <5754.973756036@kanga.nu> On Thu, 09 Nov 2000 00:44:06 -0500 Bob Puff at NLE wrote: > how are you making html digests with html posts, and yet stripping > all the excess html junk from the text-only digests?? I don't. For those users that wish to use digests and who don't wish to burst them before replying to them, well, that's their problem. As a list owner I don't have a whole lot of sympathy with digest users. Uncharitable to be sure, but outside of Outlook users, digest users who post replies to digests rank well up on my "annoying member class" list. > That's exactly what I want to do, but all I've seen so far is to > use the demime program ahead of Mailman, which makes everything > plain text. Which hardly seems a Bad Thing per se. > negating the usefulness of the mime digests. Certainly not. Correctly for MIME digests the individual message/rfc822 parts should be the entire constituent messages encluding all headers (I believe was fixed in v2 over v1.x's broken behaviour (trimmed header sets)), ready to be burst back into their individual messages exactly (and indistinguishably from) as if they had been received individually. > On another line: I have heard that Outlook makes the mime digests > look like a ton of little attachments. How do you fix this? It does. Arguably, and surprisingly given that this is Outlook, this is acceptable behaviour. The fact that Outlook has no facility to burst digests of either RFC affiliation admittedly makes something of a mockery of this small win. > The mime digest puts a ton of header information in each message > (that is stripped out of the plain text version). Yup. This is as per the RFC. How your MUA chooses to display (or not) this information is a matter to take up with the sources of your MUA. For those interested, Exmh (my MUA of choice) display message/rfc822 parts just fine, using the exact same logic it uses to display the normal RFC 822 messages we tend to think of as "email". > This seems to be displayed fully in Eudora. Can a lot of this > junk be cut out? Not while retaining compliance with the RFC. I suggest you approach the authors of Eudora in regard to improving their MIME supports. -- J C Lawrence Home: claw at kanga.nu ---------(*) Other: coder at kanga.nu http://www.kanga.nu/~claw/ Keys etc: finger claw at kanga.nu --=| A man is as sane as he is dangerous to his environment |=-- From chuqui at plaidworks.com Thu Nov 9 08:55:02 2000 From: chuqui at plaidworks.com (Chuq Von Rospach) Date: Wed, 8 Nov 2000 23:55:02 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Re: HTML mail In-Reply-To: <5754.973756036@kanga.nu> References: <20001108223005.E95081CFDB@dinsdale.python.org> <3054358265.973716967@[192.168.1.101]> <20001108183905.C11646@ssc.com> <3A0A39A6.97C4705A@nleaudio.com> <5754.973756036@kanga.nu> Message-ID: At 11:47 PM -0800 11/8/00, J C Lawrence wrote: > >Not while retaining compliance with the RFC. I suggest you approach >the authors of Eudora in regard to improving their MIME supports. > The same eudora authors who've yet to get their HTML engine up to snuff, but found time to implement a widget that lets you know if you're flaming someone... (whoopie...) Am I bitter? nooo... But as a long-long time Eudora user, I'm going to go evaluate Entourage from Office 2001. I know it has issues, too, but the Entourage project group seems to be interested in fixing things... -- Chuq Von Rospach - Plaidworks Consulting (mailto:chuqui at plaidworks.com) Apple Mail List Gnome (mailto:chuq at apple.com) Be just, and fear not. From claw at kanga.nu Thu Nov 9 09:05:20 2000 From: claw at kanga.nu (J C Lawrence) Date: Thu, 09 Nov 2000 00:05:20 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Re: HTML mail In-Reply-To: Message from Chuq Von Rospach of "Wed, 08 Nov 2000 23:55:02 PST." References: <20001108223005.E95081CFDB@dinsdale.python.org> <3054358265.973716967@[192.168.1.101]> <20001108183905.C11646@ssc.com> <3A0A39A6.97C4705A@nleaudio.com> <5754.973756036@kanga.nu> Message-ID: <6992.973757120@kanga.nu> On Wed, 8 Nov 2000 23:55:02 -0800 Chuq Von Rospach wrote: > At 11:47 PM -0800 11/8/00, J C Lawrence wrote: >> Not while retaining compliance with the RFC. I suggest you >> approach the authors of Eudora in regard to improving their MIME >> supports. > The same eudora authors who've yet to get their HTML engine up to > snuff, but found time to implement a widget that lets you know if > you're flaming someone... (whoopie...) > Am I bitter? nooo... But as a long-long time Eudora user, I'm > going to go evaluate Entourage from Office 2001. I know it has > issues, too, but the Entourage project group seems to be > interested in fixing things... I'd not heard of Entourage till now. As a list owner the Windows mail client I have the least complaint against is Pegasus. What that means I really have no idea. There's probably some value at this point in observing the fact that I find (n)MH to be a pretty fine mail client, whereas most other people seem to look at it in rather the same fashion they look at rat poison in their peanut butter. (You can tell what we talked about at work today). -- J C Lawrence Home: claw at kanga.nu ---------(*) Other: coder at kanga.nu http://www.kanga.nu/~claw/ Keys etc: finger claw at kanga.nu --=| A man is as sane as he is dangerous to his environment |=-- From chuqui at plaidworks.com Thu Nov 9 09:31:39 2000 From: chuqui at plaidworks.com (Chuq Von Rospach) Date: Thu, 9 Nov 2000 00:31:39 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Re: HTML mail In-Reply-To: <6992.973757120@kanga.nu> References: <20001108223005.E95081CFDB@dinsdale.python.org> <3054358265.973716967@[192.168.1.101]> <20001108183905.C11646@ssc.com> <3A0A39A6.97C4705A@nleaudio.com> <5754.973756036@kanga.nu> <6992.973757120@kanga.nu> Message-ID: At 12:05 AM -0800 11/9/00, J C Lawrence wrote: >I'd not heard of Entourage till now. Entourage is the new PIM/email client with Microsoft Office 2001 for the Mac. >As a list owner the Windows mail client I have the least complaint >against is Pegasus. I've actually gotten to a truce point with most clients. Where I still have issues are where stuff gets gatewayed into internal (non-internet-oriented) e-mail systems, like Lotus Notes. First Class is another one that causes problems, mostly by sending bounces to the author and ignoring all of the envelope and header info (hey, these standards are only a decade old, you can't expect people who write commercial email systems to adopt them that quickly!). And I've learned that if your email goes through a microsoft exchange server, you have my sympathy, but you're on your own... -- Chuq Von Rospach - Plaidworks Consulting (mailto:chuqui at plaidworks.com) Apple Mail List Gnome (mailto:chuq at apple.com) Be just, and fear not. From dj-mailman at insigma.com Thu Nov 9 11:38:00 2000 From: dj-mailman at insigma.com (James Aylett) Date: Thu, 9 Nov 2000 10:38:00 +0000 Subject: [Mailman-Users] mailman cron gets uppity In-Reply-To: <3A09D372.23EEA867@west.sun.com>; from Dan Mick on Wed, Nov 08, 2000 at 02:28:02PM -0800 References: <20001108111748.M31670@insigma.com> <3A09D372.23EEA867@west.sun.com> Message-ID: <20001109103800.U31670@tangozebra.com> On Wed, Nov 08, 2000 at 02:28:02PM -0800, Dan Mick wrote: > There was a very-recent change to the CVS to destroy file handles when > the SMTP mailer gets into problems (an error condiction was also consuming > file handles). So there are probably two problems: ungraceful MTA exits, > and this Mailman error-processing bug. > > Upgrading to CVS may be beneficial. I'll look into it. I'm not horrendously keen on upgrading until either bug #121953 is fixed, or I've got the time to sit down and figure out all the patches myself. (Since some of the web pages seem to have their BODY tag generated dynamically these days, this is probably harder than I want it to be :-( > It's been discussed very recently on either -users or -developers. A search via the python.org website didn't turn up anything useful :-/ Cheers, James -- /--------------------------------------------------------------------------\ james aylett chief technical architect http://www.tangozebra.com/ tangozebra _____________________________________________________________________ This message has been checked for all known viruses by Star Internet delivered through the MessageLabs Virus Control Centre. For further information visit http://www.star.net.uk/stats.asp From cpeter at mirae.kangwon.ac.kr Thu Nov 9 12:07:45 2000 From: cpeter at mirae.kangwon.ac.kr (Chen.LongJi) Date: Thu, 9 Nov 2000 20:07:45 +0900 Subject: [Mailman-Users] I can't see Message-ID: <008101c04a3d$4a57c360$7e2b73d2@kangwon.ac.kr> Hello, everyone, I just installed mailman2.0 at my linux server. everything is work. but the problem is If I use outlook express mail to list, then I can't read it. what's wrong? ?????. ============================= Chen.LongJi KangWon National University Multimedia Security Lab. ICQ:71410677 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mail.python.org/pipermail/mailman-users/attachments/20001109/fc076667/attachment.htm From yua at nycap.rr.com Thu Nov 9 15:38:07 2000 From: yua at nycap.rr.com (Alex Yu) Date: Thu, 9 Nov 2000 09:38:07 -0500 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Possible to deny incoming HTML messages? Message-ID: Hello, I have 2 questions. 1. Possible to deny incoming HTML messages? I wish to not allow any HTML messages on my lists. 2. Allow incoming attachments only in text format (.txt)? I am not subscribe to the list. Please e-mail me individually. Thanks for your help! Alex From wcarlson at vh.org Thu Nov 9 16:02:54 2000 From: wcarlson at vh.org (Bill Carlson) Date: Thu, 9 Nov 2000 09:02:54 -0600 (CST) Subject: [Mailman-Users] An interesting statistic. In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Wed, 8 Nov 2000, Chuq Von Rospach wrote: > I thought people might find these numbers interesting. > > One of my servers sends out newsletters. Those newsletters are > avilable both in HTML format and text format -- users can subscribe > for whichever they prefer, although HTML is the default. Because of > limitations in the AOL clients, we force AOL.com addresses to the > text version. > > I think this list gives a good indication of acceptance of HTML email. > > My numbers: > > HTML: 85.4% > AOL: 12.9% > Text: 1.5% > Your data is skewed because HTML is a default rather than a forced choice. One could also say that the majority of users don't change the defaults, which would ring true with my experience. I am on quite a few mailing lists, though admittedly most are Unix-related. The flames for people who post in HTML keep me warm at night (no, I certainly don't flame them). :) $.02, Bill Carlson -- Systems Programmer bill-carlson at uiowa.edu | Opinions are mine, Virtual Hospital http://www.vh.org/ | not my employer's. University of Iowa Hospitals and Clinics | From fanninj at aottsd.uscourts.gov Thu Nov 9 16:33:17 2000 From: fanninj at aottsd.uscourts.gov (Jim Fannin) Date: Thu, 9 Nov 2000 09:33:17 -0600 Subject: [Mailman-Users] mailman cron gets uppity References: <20001108111748.M31670@insigma.com> <3A09D372.23EEA867@west.sun.com> Message-ID: <013201c04a62$61e19cc0$0d52849c@aottsd.ao.dcn> I am fairly new to Mailman and the mailman list. I have found the discussion both useful and interesting at times. However, I must confess I need help with some of the abbreviations used here. I think I know what some of them are, but others are not familiar. Please explain: What is CVS, MTA? Also, I inherited the administration of our Mailman lists, and thus am not intimately familiar with the installation and inner workings. As a result, I am not sure what version we are running nor exactly how to find out. We are running 11 lists ranging in size from about 12 to 350 users. Everything seems to be running fine. Some guidance on how to find out what version we are running would also be appreciated. Thanks, Jim Fannin fanninj at aottsd.uscourts.gov ----- Original Message ----- From: "Dan Mick" To: "James Aylett" ; Sent: Wednesday, November 08, 2000 4:28 PM Subject: Re: [Mailman-Users] mailman cron gets uppity > There was a very-recent change to the CVS to destroy file handles when > the SMTP mailer gets into problems (an error condiction was also consuming > file handles). So there are probably two problems: ungraceful MTA exits, > and this Mailman error-processing bug. > > It's been discussed very recently on either -users or -developers. > > Upgrading to CVS may be beneficial. > > James Aylett wrote: > > > > I'm having problems with Mailman 1.1, on Debian. Looking at the upgrade > > notes for 2.0b I see that the cron jobs have changed significantly, > > especially stuff to do with running the queue, so this problem /may/ have > > been fixed. Given that it usually only shows up at month ends, it's > > difficult to provoke, and I'd rather /know/ what's going on than upgrade and > > hope :) > > > > Basically, the monthly stuff for subscription reminders causes mailman to > > bomb out with a 'too many open files' error. It isn't exceeding the OS limit > > (at least, nothing else is having trouble, and the machine is floating at > > around 1300 open file handles at the moment), so I can only assume it's > > exceeding the ulimit. Which should be 1024, unless I'm either very confused > > or something's changing it. > > > > Worse, this leaves lots of run_queue processes lying around (this month, it > > was about 70). > > > > I've tried fiddling with some of the options set out in Defaults.py, that I > > think ought to restrict the number of concurrent mailman processes, but it > > isn't documented very clearly so I'm probably wrong (MAX_SPAWNS, > > DEFAULT_NUM_SPAWNS). > > > > Anyone have any ideas on this? > > > > James > > > > -- > > /--------------------------------------------------------------------------\ > > james aylett chief technical architect > > http://www.tangozebra.com/ tangozebra > > > > _____________________________________________________________________ > > This message has been checked for all known viruses by Star Internet delivered > > through the MessageLabs Virus Control Centre. For further information visit > > http://www.star.net.uk/stats.asp > > > > ------------------------------------------------------ > > Mailman-Users maillist - Mailman-Users at python.org > > http://www.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users > > ------------------------------------------------------ > Mailman-Users maillist - Mailman-Users at python.org > http://www.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users > From Jean-Francois.Malouin at bic.mni.mcgill.ca Thu Nov 9 16:45:44 2000 From: Jean-Francois.Malouin at bic.mni.mcgill.ca (Jean-Francois Malouin) Date: Thu, 9 Nov 2000 10:45:44 -0500 Subject: [Mailman-Users] duplicate password reminder (bis) Message-ID: <20001109104544.B5971@bottom.bic.mni.mcgill.ca> Hello, Am I the only one with the problem that the users list password reminders on the 1st of the month are duplicated: each subscriber receives 2 copies of the email. I'm using Mailman-2.0rc1 with sendmail-8.9.3. [I was also having the same problem with the Mailman 1.1.] TIA, jf -- Jean-Fran?ois Malouin, System/Network Manager, Mail: McConnell Brain Imaging Center Voice: (514) 398-8924 Montreal Neurological Institute Fax: (514) 398-8948 3801 University St. Montreal, Quebec, H3A 2B4 CAN #include From gdinwiddie at min.net Thu Nov 9 15:40:50 2000 From: gdinwiddie at min.net (George Dinwiddie) Date: Thu, 9 Nov 2000 09:40:50 -0500 (EST) Subject: [Mailman-Users] Headers & footers on MIME/multipart messages In-Reply-To: <20001108135231.A20013@ollie.clive.ia.us> from "Jeffrey C. Ollie" at Nov 8, 0 01:52:31 pm Message-ID: <200011091444.JAA01677@min.net> That sounds reasonable, but I'm not conversant enough in MIME to know how messages that are multipart/mixed work. Mostly, I tend to use elm as my mail client. :-) - George P.S. What's the protocol for requesting a feature such as this? > Jeffrey C. Ollie said: > > On Wed, Nov 08, 2000 at 02:38:05PM -0500, George Dinwiddie wrote: > > > > The header and footer code is obviously not MIME-aware. Therefore, > > the header and footer get inserted outside the viewed part of the > > message body. > > > > It seems to me that, as a minimum, it would be preferable to only > > insert into the text/plain part of the message. Better, would be > > the ability to specify separate headers & footers for text/html and > > text/plain portions. > > What I'd rather see (and is probably more workable) is to convert a > message to a multipart/mixed message with three parts: a text/plain > part with the header, a part with the original type and content, and a > text/plain part with the footer. > > I think that this scheme would be easier to code and wouldn't have the > problem of messing up a cryptographically signed message. > > The problem of viruses embedded in messages is best left to a virus > scanner hooked into the MTA (like Amavis or exiscan). > > Jeff -- ---------------------------------------------------------------------- George Dinwiddie gdinwiddie at min.net The gods do not deduct from man's allotted span those hours spent in sailing. NEW URL => http://www.Alberg30.org/ ---------------------------------------------------------------------- From dj-mailman at insigma.com Thu Nov 9 16:48:57 2000 From: dj-mailman at insigma.com (James Aylett) Date: Thu, 9 Nov 2000 15:48:57 +0000 Subject: [Mailman-Users] mailman cron gets uppity In-Reply-To: <013201c04a62$61e19cc0$0d52849c@aottsd.ao.dcn>; from Jim Fannin on Thu, Nov 09, 2000 at 09:33:17AM -0600 References: <20001108111748.M31670@insigma.com> <3A09D372.23EEA867@west.sun.com> <013201c04a62$61e19cc0$0d52849c@aottsd.ao.dcn> Message-ID: <20001109154857.Y31670@insigma.com> On Thu, Nov 09, 2000 at 09:33:17AM -0600, Jim Fannin wrote: > I must confess I need help with some of the abbreviations used here. I > think I know what some of them are, but others are not familiar. > > Please explain: What is CVS, MTA? CVS = Concurrent Version Systems. It's a system used to track the changes as Mailman (and a large number of other projects) are developed. "Upgrading to CVS" (and similar phrases) means to get the bleeding edge versions straight out of the CVS system. These are potentially far less stable than the release versions that have been vetted for serious problems. MTA = Mail Transfer Agent. It's the software that receives email from the outside world via SMTP, and delivers it somewhere useful for users to be able to get to it. The other way round, it also handles sending outgoing email out to the world. Examples in the UNIX world include sendmail, exim, qmail and smail. (Most commercial Unixes will come with a sendmail variant, I think.) > Also, I inherited the administration of our Mailman lists, and thus am not > intimately familiar with the installation and inner workings. As a result, > I am not sure what version we are running nor exactly how to find out. We > are running 11 lists ranging in size from about 12 to 350 users. Everything > seems to be running fine. Some guidance on how to find out what version we > are running would also be appreciated. I seem to remember that early versions of Mailman didn't announce their version numbers. Certainly from v1.1 onwards, and probably from earlier, most webpages in the Mailman configuration system contain the version number at the bottom of the page. For instance, on we see, right at the bottom, the following: -------------------------------------------------------------------------- Mailman-Users list run by barry at wooz.org Mailman-Users administrative interface (requires authorization) ["Delivered by Mailman" logo] version 2.0beta6 -------------------------------------------------------------------------- which gives you the version number being run for the Mailman lists. (The Mailman pages may also have some other logos alongside. This only exists in recent Mailman installations - my 2.0 one has it, but not my earlier 1.1 system.) In theory you can find this version in the files that make up the mailman installation, but since which files exist changes between versions that isn't terribly helpful. Easier to look at a webpage :) James -- /--------------------------------------------------------------------------\ james aylett chief technical architect http://www.tangozebra.com/ tangozebra _____________________________________________________________________ This message has been checked for all known viruses by Star Internet delivered through the MessageLabs Virus Control Centre. For further information visit http://www.star.net.uk/stats.asp From fanninj at aottsd.uscourts.gov Thu Nov 9 17:06:09 2000 From: fanninj at aottsd.uscourts.gov (Jim Fannin) Date: Thu, 9 Nov 2000 10:06:09 -0600 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Re: HTML mail References: <20001108223005.E95081CFDB@dinsdale.python.org> <3054358265.973716967@[192.168.1.101]> <20001108183905.C11646@ssc.com> <3A0A39A6.97C4705A@nleaudio.com> <5754.973756036@kanga.nu> Message-ID: <016d01c04a66$f9369f40$0d52849c@aottsd.ao.dcn> I use a mail client on my PC which I have found to be quite flexible, powerful and very easy to use. It not only handles multiple pop3 accounts but can act as a mail server for small to medium size companies with their own internal networks. It avoids many of the problems with security and viruses associated with Outlook and is well supported with regular releases. It was a paltry $39 license fee. It is worth ten times that amount in my opinion. I manage 5 mail accounts and receive 1000-2000 emails through it daily, with no problems. I don't own, or get commission for recommending it (perhaps I should!). It's just very easy to use and extremely flexible. The product is called, "The Bat". Sorry I am not at home where I manage these accounts to tell you the company, but I will try to get the info for those who are interested. For those interested send me a private Email at fanninj at isitfriday.com Thanks, Jim Fannin fanninj at aottsd.uscourts.gov 210-301-6325 ----- Original Message ----- From: "Chuq Von Rospach" To: "J C Lawrence" ; "Bob Puff at NLE" Cc: "Dan Wilder" ; Sent: Thursday, November 09, 2000 1:55 AM Subject: Re: [Mailman-Users] Re: HTML mail > At 11:47 PM -0800 11/8/00, J C Lawrence wrote: > > > >Not while retaining compliance with the RFC. I suggest you approach > >the authors of Eudora in regard to improving their MIME supports. > > > > The same eudora authors who've yet to get their HTML engine up to > snuff, but found time to implement a widget that lets you know if > you're flaming someone... (whoopie...) > > Am I bitter? nooo... But as a long-long time Eudora user, I'm going > to go evaluate Entourage from Office 2001. I know it has issues, too, > but the Entourage project group seems to be interested in fixing > things... > > -- > Chuq Von Rospach - Plaidworks Consulting (mailto:chuqui at plaidworks.com) > Apple Mail List Gnome (mailto:chuq at apple.com) > > Be just, and fear not. > > ------------------------------------------------------ > Mailman-Users maillist - Mailman-Users at python.org > http://www.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users > From dans at audifans.com Thu Nov 9 17:07:46 2000 From: dans at audifans.com (Dan Simoes) Date: Thu, 09 Nov 2000 11:07:46 -0500 Subject: [Mailman-Users] confirmation reply bug - another victim Message-ID: <3A0ACBD2.AF0AC6A8@audifans.com> OK, so after I get chided for not running the latest and greatest, I upgraded my mailman to the 2.0rc1. I start getting emails from people that they are trying to subscribe but cannot, because the confirmation never seems to get through. I tested this, and they are right. Looking at the list archives, I am not alone. I checked the archive and followed the same debugging steps that were given to Andreas, with the exact same results - no obvious problems. So, I went back to my mailman beta 6 and reinstalled. "downgrade detected - this is probably not safe, exiting." Huh? Removed /home/mailman/Mailman. Retried the make install. Still no dice. moved mailman to mailman_old. Did a fresh install. Copied back some subdirs. Still not sure if it's 100% back, but I have a safe copy of the whole thing from 11/7 as a worst case scenario. Thanks. | Dan | From steve at unidata.ucar.edu Thu Nov 9 17:05:49 2000 From: steve at unidata.ucar.edu (Steve Emmerson) Date: Thu, 09 Nov 2000 09:05:49 -0700 Subject: [Mailman-Users] mailman cron gets uppity In-Reply-To: Your message of "Thu, 09 Nov 2000 09:33:17 CST." <013201c04a62$61e19cc0$0d52849c@aottsd.ao.dcn> Message-ID: <200011091605.eA9G5p420527@unidata.ucar.edu> Jim, >Date: Thu, 9 Nov 2000 09:33:17 -0600 >From: "Jim Fannin" >To: >Subject: Re: [Mailman-Users] mailman cron gets uppity The above message contained the following: > Please explain: What is CVS, MTA? CVS stands for Concurrent Versions System. Here's the first paragraph of its manual page: CVS is a version control system, which allows you to keep old versions of files (usually source code), keep a log of who, when, and why changes occurred, etc., like RCS or SCCS. Unlike the simpler systems, CVS does not just operate on one file at a time or one directory at a time, but operates on hierarchical collections of directories consisting of version controlled files. CVS helps to manage releases and to control the concurrent editing of source files among multiple authors. CVS allows triggers to enable/log/control various operations and works well over a wide area network. Many places (e.g. us, sourceforge.net) use it as the basis for software versioning control. For further information see . MTA stands for Mail Transport Agent, which is the thing that your Mail User Agent (MUA -- which you use to read the mail) uses to actually send and receive the mail. Mailman also uses an MTA to send and receive mailing-list mail. Examples of an MTA are "sendmail" and "exim". > Also, I inherited the administration of our Mailman lists, and thus am not > intimately familiar with the installation and inner workings. As a result, > I am not sure what version we are running nor exactly how to find out. We > are running 11 lists ranging in size from about 12 to 350 users. Everything > seems to be running fine. Some guidance on how to find out what version we > are running would also be appreciated. On my system I can execute the following: $ /opt/mailman/bin/version Using Mailman version 2.0rc1 Regards, Steve Emmerson From vail at newts.org Thu Nov 9 17:27:47 2000 From: vail at newts.org (Johnathan Vail) Date: Thu, 09 Nov 2000 11:27:47 -0500 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Performance for a Spam Cannon Message-ID: I am being asked to host a mailing list to send out weekly announcements to 17,000 people (these are all user initiated subscribers, not really spam. sorry for the misleading subject). I am currently running Mailman and Exim together and host a few lists of probably less than 500 total subscribers. My system is a Red Hat Linux 6.2 on a 233 MHZ machine, plenty of RAM and a 390K iDSL connection. Right now the list with a few hundred subscribers isn't noticed at all in terms of loading or queue lengths. I would like to schedule this to work in the early AM hours and if I can deliver in about an hour or so I would be happy. Does anyone have any estimates or numebrs for comparison on what I can expect? thanks, jv From dan at ssc.com Thu Nov 9 17:29:49 2000 From: dan at ssc.com (Dan Wilder) Date: Thu, 9 Nov 2000 08:29:49 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Re: HTML mail In-Reply-To: <5754.973756036@kanga.nu>; from claw@kanga.nu on Wed, Nov 08, 2000 at 11:47:16PM -0800 References: <20001108223005.E95081CFDB@dinsdale.python.org> <3054358265.973716967@[192.168.1.101]> <20001108183905.C11646@ssc.com> <3A0A39A6.97C4705A@nleaudio.com> <5754.973756036@kanga.nu> Message-ID: <20001109082948.B12447@ssc.com> On Wed, Nov 08, 2000 at 11:47:16PM -0800, J C Lawrence wrote: > On Thu, 09 Nov 2000 00:44:06 -0500 > Bob Puff at NLE wrote: > > > how are you making html digests with html posts, and yet stripping > > all the excess html junk from the text-only digests?? > > I don't. For those users that wish to use digests and who don't > wish to burst them before replying to them, well, that's their > problem. As a list owner I don't have a whole lot of sympathy with > digest users. Uncharitable to be sure, but outside of Outlook > users, digest users who post replies to digests rank well up on my > "annoying member class" list. We don't, either. -- ----------------------------------------------------------------- Dan Wilder Technical Manager & Correspondent SSC, Inc. P.O. Box 55549 Phone: 206-782-7733 x123 Seattle, WA 98155-0549 URL http://www.linuxjournal.com/ ----------------------------------------------------------------- From barry at wooz.org Thu Nov 9 17:48:35 2000 From: barry at wooz.org (Barry A. Warsaw) Date: Thu, 9 Nov 2000 11:48:35 -0500 (EST) Subject: [Mailman-Users] member_posting_only=yes problem References: <4.2.2.20001104092026.00aa51b0@pop.mindspring.com> Message-ID: <14858.54627.747064.138154@anthem.concentric.net> >>>>> "CVR" == Chuq Von Rospach writes: CVR> well, at one level, I think what he's doing is wrong, but we CVR> won't get into that philosopical range war. But the basic CVR> issue is that he *isn't* a member of the list, since the From CVR> address isn't subscribed. CVR> Two solutions. CVR> 1) he subscribes both addresses to the list, and sets CVR> "nomail" flag to the one in his from address. he can do that CVR> without admin intervention, so that's what I usually CVR> recommend. CVR> 2) set his address as not needing admin overview -- that's an CVR> option on the privacy page of the admin page. that way, CVR> you're saying "this guy is okay" and it won't be held. which CVR> works as long as he really is okay, but that's an admin CVR> issue.. (grin) The /real/ solution is to extend the notion of membership to a person instead of an email address. This is all dependant on the Real User Database, but the quick sketch is that you'd be able to register yourself with the site and associate a number of email addresses with your name. You could then do a lot of cool things like have different addresses subscribed to different lists as the primary repicient, use any of those addrs as `keys' to your account for login purposes, easily switch delivery addresses (no more begging the list admin to clone your address), and in this case, pass the membership test if any of your addresses is in the From: field. That's all pie-in-the-sky at the moment though. A short term solution (i.e. Mailman 2.1) may be to add an option that the list admin can turn on, which would add Reply-To: in the list of fields to use for the membership test. I'll add that to the TODO list. -Barry From barry at wooz.org Thu Nov 9 17:51:32 2000 From: barry at wooz.org (Barry A. Warsaw) Date: Thu, 9 Nov 2000 11:51:32 -0500 (EST) Subject: [Mailman-Users] Problem with qrunner and too much incoming mail References: Message-ID: <14858.54804.223539.165635@anthem.concentric.net> >>>>> "CVR" == Chuq Von Rospach writes: CVR> It hasn't been updated since sendmail 8.8.7, according to the CVR> copy on linuxdoc.org. It's basically useless -- exceptionally CVR> obsolete, and it's aimed explicitly at dial-on-demand CVR> connections. CVR> I went and took a look, and it really doesn't have much CVR> that's useful for what we're doing here, unfortunately. If anybody /does/ find some useful information for Sendmail, please let me know. I've add a general FAQ entry for this issue and for Exim, pointed the reader to the relevant config variable and README.EXIM. -Barry From barry at wooz.org Thu Nov 9 17:54:18 2000 From: barry at wooz.org (Barry A. Warsaw) Date: Thu, 9 Nov 2000 11:54:18 -0500 (EST) Subject: [Mailman-Users] member_posting_only=yes problem References: <4.2.2.20001104100403.00ac5200@pop.mindspring.com> <4.2.2.20001104092026.00aa51b0@pop.mindspring.com> <20001104121100.A16343@cathat.net> <4.2.2.20001104124427.00aff4d0@pop.mindspring.com> Message-ID: <14858.54970.737108.710529@anthem.concentric.net> >>>>> "MN" == Mike Noyes writes: MN> You read my mind. I thought of one other way for mailman to MN> solve the problem. It could check the Reply-To header along MN> with From to verify list membership. This does open a MN> potential spam hole. Yeah, but is it really any worse than the situation now? For some MUAs (certainly the one I use) and for any determined spammer, forging From: is no harder than forging Reply-To: That's why Mailman originally tried to use the envelope sender for the membership test, but that was doomed to failure for a number of reasons. -Barry From jeremy at alum.mit.edu Thu Nov 9 18:05:04 2000 From: jeremy at alum.mit.edu (Jeremy Hylton) Date: Thu, 9 Nov 2000 12:05:04 -0500 (EST) Subject: [Mailman-Users] Re: Mime in subject ... more ÄÅÖäåö In-Reply-To: <14858.2087.358323.188213@anthem.concentric.net> References: <14858.2087.358323.188213@anthem.concentric.net> Message-ID: <14858.55616.721708.122386@bitdiddle.concentric.net> Barry asked me to look at the small hack for pipermail.py that improves decoding support for message headers. The proposed change is in the wrong place; a change that effects that way the HTML output is generated should be in HyperArchy.py. (This isn't obvious.) HyperArchy.py already processes messages with encoded words in the subject and decodes them when possible. There may be a bug in the logic there, which I would need some help to debug. The decoding problem is straightforward, except that a mail archive may contain messages encoding using many different character sets. The message index can only produce HTML that uses a single character set, so it has to pick one and go with it. If it picks ISO-2202-JP, then it should not decode ISO-8859-1. It tries to pick the most frequently occuring charset. If you are experiencing a problem, my first guess would be that HyperArch has concluded that a particular message's charset does not match the one used for the index page. If there is a specific problem, can someone point me at a mail archive that appears to be broken? If you are looking at a particular message that contains endecoded subject lines, can you send me the HTML page? The key question I would have is whether the charset in the tag matches the charset in the subject line. Jeremy From mhnoyes at users.sourceforge.net Thu Nov 9 18:06:40 2000 From: mhnoyes at users.sourceforge.net (Mike Noyes) Date: Thu, 09 Nov 2000 09:06:40 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] member_posting_only=yes problem In-Reply-To: <14858.54627.747064.138154@anthem.concentric.net> References: <4.2.2.20001104092026.00aa51b0@pop.mindspring.com> Message-ID: <4.2.2.20001109090031.00ab9940@pop.mindspring.com> At 11:48 AM 11/9/00 -0500, Barry A. Warsaw wrote: > >>>>> "CVR" == Chuq Von Rospach writes: > > CVR> well, at one level, I think what he's doing is wrong, but we > CVR> won't get into that philosopical range war. But the basic > CVR> issue is that he *isn't* a member of the list, since the > CVR> From address isn't subscribed. > > CVR> Two solutions. > > CVR> 1) he subscribes both addresses to the list, and sets > CVR> "nomail" flag to the one in his from address. he can do that > CVR> without admin intervention, so that's what I usually > CVR> recommend. > > CVR> 2) set his address as not needing admin overview -- that's > CVR> an option on the privacy page of the admin page. that way, > CVR> you're saying "this guy is okay" and it won't be held. which > CVR> works as long as he really is okay, but that's an admin > CVR> issue.. (grin) > >The /real/ solution is to extend the notion of membership to a person >instead of an email address. This is all dependant on the Real User >Database, but the quick sketch is that you'd be able to register >yourself with the site and associate a number of email addresses with >your name. You could then do a lot of cool things like have different >addresses subscribed to different lists as the primary repicient, use any >of those addrs as `keys' to your account for login purposes, easily switch >delivery addresses (no more begging the list admin to clone your address), >and in this case, pass the membership test if any of your addresses is in >the From: field. > >That's all pie-in-the-sky at the moment though. Barry, Please, add this excellent idea to the Mailman feature request I opened. http://sourceforge.net/bugs/?func=detailbug&bug_id=121894&group_id=103 >A short term solution (i.e. Mailman 2.1) may be to add an option that >the list admin can turn on, which would add Reply-To: in the list of >fields to use for the membership test. I'll add that to the TODO >list. Thanks. -- Mike Noyes mhnoyes at users.sourceforge.net http://sourceforge.net/projects/leaf From barry at wooz.org Thu Nov 9 18:10:34 2000 From: barry at wooz.org (Barry A. Warsaw) Date: Thu, 9 Nov 2000 12:10:34 -0500 (EST) Subject: [Mailman-Users] Upgrading References: <3A06F1F4.6AF02A1D@pcraft.com> Message-ID: <14858.55946.381416.309154@anthem.concentric.net> >>>>> "CVR" == Chuq Von Rospach writes: CVR> I'm not sure the internal formats of the database files are CVR> architecture independent. They are. All the .db files contain Python marshals which are designed to be arch independent. (BTW, .pyc files are essentially marshals with some magic header metadata -- that's why .pyc file are portable across architectures too.) -Barry From Baggioto at atlas.unisinos.br Thu Nov 9 18:13:39 2000 From: Baggioto at atlas.unisinos.br (Luiz Alfredo Baggioto) Date: Thu, 9 Nov 2000 15:13:39 -0200 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Limit of users in a mailman list Message-ID: <3A0ABF21.5402.5C8503A@localhost> Hi Our institution is a university. We are using mailman for distribute messages for some disciplines and institutes, but now there will be necessity to distribute informations for all students. We thinking about create a list for distribute this informations for everybody - more or less 40.000. My question: are there anyone using a mailman list with this size? Are there known problems or possibilities? Thanks in advance ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Luiz Alfredo Baggiotto E-Mail: baggioto at atlas.unisinos.br ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Analista de Suporte DSI / SISCOM Universidade do Vale do Rio dos Sinos - UNISINOS Fone: 55 51 590-8386 Ramal: 1886 From apian at ise.fhg.de Thu Nov 9 15:20:54 2000 From: apian at ise.fhg.de (Peter Apian-Bennewitz) Date: Thu, 09 Nov 2000 15:20:54 +0100 Subject: [Mailman-Users] 2.0r1: admin pages don't gork passwords References: <3A099A99.2520BA18@ise.fhg.de> <3A09D3DB.7BA7117@west.sun.com> Message-ID: <3A0AB2C6.2B3A3EE3@ise.fhg.de> Dan Mick wrote: > > Since there're hardly any doc or log files, I checked the C-wrapper and found cgi.py : > > > > # Logging support > > # =============== > > > > logfile = "" # Filename to log to, if not empty > > logfp = None > > > > which didn't write a byte, although it seems to be called. > > I don't understand; are you saying you changed this code somehow? Clearly that code > isn't going to write anything. "Clearly" is an adjective that does not leap to mind with mailman's code.... I know it's not doing anything, however it was the only part where a hint oflogging or debug code appeared (at least to me). To restate: The problem is with the web admin interface. Maybe its mailman, maybe my Apache config is missing somethign (it's not the symlink config)- Just how do I debug mailman ? > > > > Any hints how to debug this beast are GREATLY appreciated. > > When you say 2.0r1 do you mean 2.0rc1, or beta1? 2.0rc1 > > > 2.0rc1 is the last tarball, and I believe auth was changed a lot between > beta1 and now. -- Peter Apian-Bennewitz apian at ise.fhg.de +49-761-4588-[123|302] Fraunhofer Institute for Solar Energy Systems, D-79100 Freiburg -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mail.python.org/pipermail/mailman-users/attachments/20001109/18973f07/attachment.html From barry at wooz.org Thu Nov 9 18:36:16 2000 From: barry at wooz.org (barry at wooz.org) Date: Thu, 9 Nov 2000 12:36:16 -0500 (EST) Subject: [Mailman-Users] member_posting_only=yes problem References: <4.2.2.20001104092026.00aa51b0@pop.mindspring.com> <4.2.2.20001109090031.00ab9940@pop.mindspring.com> Message-ID: <14858.57488.387093.99927@anthem.concentric.net> >>>>> "MN" == Mike Noyes writes: MN> Barry, Please, add this excellent idea to the Mailman feature MN> request I opened. MN> http://sourceforge.net/bugs/?func=detailbug&bug_id=121894&group_id=103 What I really want to do is add it to the Mailman design notes Wiki: http://www.zope.org/Members/bwarsaw/MailmanDesignNotes -Barry From hknief at auctionwatch.com Thu Nov 9 18:35:49 2000 From: hknief at auctionwatch.com (Herman Knief) Date: Thu, 9 Nov 2000 09:35:49 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Limit of users in a mailman list Message-ID: <5179B27750A9D411B968009027E06E27092CB8@exback.corp.auctionwatch.com> Yes... I actually run a newsletter that has 240,000 subscribers. Depending on the machine you are running this on, there are some issues with LARGE lists. One seems to be that mailman *appears* to load the entire config DB when you attempt to modify anything. This means a VERY large python process that tends to be rather slow. I am using dual PIII 650MHz boxes and it was quite painful. What I would suggest is setting up an umbrella list, that feeds several smaller lists. It's not too hard to manage, and improves performance dramatically. I try to limit my mailman lists to 25,000 members. It can handle about 40,000... but you begin to push the boundry of useability. - Herman Knief -----Original Message----- From: Luiz Alfredo Baggioto [mailto:Baggioto at atlas.unisinos.br] Sent: Thursday, November 09, 2000 9:14 AM To: mailman-users at python.org Subject: [Mailman-Users] Limit of users in a mailman list Hi Our institution is a university. We are using mailman for distribute messages for some disciplines and institutes, but now there will be necessity to distribute informations for all students. We thinking about create a list for distribute this informations for everybody - more or less 40.000. My question: are there anyone using a mailman list with this size? Are there known problems or possibilities? Thanks in advance ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------- Luiz Alfredo Baggiotto E-Mail: baggioto at atlas.unisinos.br ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------- Analista de Suporte DSI / SISCOM Universidade do Vale do Rio dos Sinos - UNISINOS Fone: 55 51 590-8386 Ramal: 1886 ------------------------------------------------------ Mailman-Users maillist - Mailman-Users at python.org http://www.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users From chuqui at plaidworks.com Thu Nov 9 18:37:56 2000 From: chuqui at plaidworks.com (Chuq Von Rospach) Date: Thu, 9 Nov 2000 09:37:56 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] member_posting_only=yes problem In-Reply-To: <14858.54627.747064.138154@anthem.concentric.net> References: <4.2.2.20001104092026.00aa51b0@pop.mindspring.com> <14858.54627.747064.138154@anthem.concentric.net> Message-ID: At 11:48 AM -0500 11/9/00, Barry A. Warsaw wrote: >The /real/ solution is to extend the notion of membership to a person >instead of an email address. This is all dependant on the Real User >Database, but the quick sketch is that you'd be able to register >yourself with the site and associate a number of email addresses with >your name. heh. I got a request for that this morning from a user... (grin) > You could then do a lot of cool things like have different >addresses subscribed to different lists as the primary repicient, use >any of those addrs as `keys' to your account for login purposes, Speaking of keys -- here's a thought. Rather than support lots of email aliases, how about assigning (optionally) an acccess key to a user. That key could be played in an X-Mailman-Key header, and would uniquely ID a user from any account (it would have to be stripped on the way through...), and ID into the user database. Might that make it easier for the type of user who would be likely to do this kind of thing? >A short term solution (i.e. Mailman 2.1) may be to add an option that >the list admin can turn on, which would add Reply-To: in the list of >fields to use for the membership test. I'll add that to the TODO >list. I think I have issues with this -- but I'm having trouble articulating them. I have to think this through and figure out if there's a problem here, or if I merely think there is. But my issue is that there is at least *some* authentification on the From line, but no controls at all on Reply-to by users MTAs. I really don't like the idea of being able to set my From: to chuqui at plaidworks.com, but tweak the reply-to to barry at wooz.org and be able to post to a list I'm not subscribed to. oh -- I know one reason why it's a bad idea. What about lists with Reply-to coerced? Mailman validates the address in the Reply-to for posting, and then deletes it from the header, replacing it iwth it's own. (does Mailman strip Reply-to when coercion isn't set? I don't remember offhand). You have a risk here of having someone who can post to the list without any visible trace of their access point -- if you have a sneaky troll whacking at a list after being kicked out, this will drive an admin crazy. The security of the "From" line can be shakey, no question. But the security of the reply-to is non-existant, and I just have issues setting up a system that allows authentification off of it. This one rings my alarm bells beyond what I just wrote, but I'm not sure why yet. I just think it's a bad idea.... -- Chuq Von Rospach - Plaidworks Consulting (mailto:chuqui at plaidworks.com) Apple Mail List Gnome (mailto:chuq at apple.com) Be just, and fear not. From marouf at earlham.edu Thu Nov 9 18:55:01 2000 From: marouf at earlham.edu (Nick Marouf) Date: Thu, 09 Nov 2000 12:55:01 -0500 Subject: [Mailman-Users] qrunner problem Message-ID: <3A0AE4F5.3D65FB3F@earlham.edu> Hi all, I've just noticed that when I message is sent for moderator approval it does not get to the list after it get approved, I am not sure if this only happens for certain moderator requests or not.. but I will check on that. I look through the archives and it seems that others are having the same problem.. and the qrunner log file has this of course. bash$ tail qrunner . . . Nov 08 23:19:01 2000 (11115) Could not acquire qrunner lock Nov 09 00:04:01 2000 (19845) Could not acquire qrunner lock Nov 09 08:26:01 2000 (8489) Could not acquire qrunner lock Running 2.0beta6 from cvs sometime around October 20th on RH6.2 Thanks for any help. Nick From mrlist at ActiveState.com Thu Nov 9 19:07:58 2000 From: mrlist at ActiveState.com (Eric Wang) Date: Thu, 09 Nov 2000 10:07:58 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] how can rebuild the heldmsg database? why mailman care? In-Reply-To: <3A09D44A.E0367E80@west.sun.com> References: <20001108114003.3A2B.MRLIST@activestate.com> <3A09D44A.E0367E80@west.sun.com> Message-ID: <20001109100753.E22D.MRLIST@activestate.com> I don't very understand either, but I copied the backup of request.db back, it goes back. thanks , anyway! On Wed, 08 Nov 2000 14:31:38 -0800 Dan Mick wrote: > > > Eric Wang wrote: > > > > Hi guys, > > > > I deleted some helpmsg from filesystem manually, > > What does this mean? > > > then the mail list > > web management tools "Tend to pending administrative requests" > > doesn't work anymore. it report some error. > > why mailman care about that? > > how can I rebuid the heldmsg database let it work again? > > Set "Restrict posting privilege to list members?" to no, change it a > > un-moderated mail list , then change it back will work? > > > > Regards, > > > > ------------------------------------------------------ > > Mailman-Users maillist - Mailman-Users at python.org > > http://www.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users From mrlist at ActiveState.com Thu Nov 9 19:09:49 2000 From: mrlist at ActiveState.com (Eric Wang) Date: Thu, 09 Nov 2000 10:09:49 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Developers] Re: [Mailman-Users] forever pending subscriptions In-Reply-To: <3A06DD6C.D4F23706@gietl.com> References: <14852.12081.57421.807051@anthem.concentric.net> <3A06DD6C.D4F23706@gietl.com> Message-ID: <20001109100851.E230.MRLIST@activestate.com> Has this problem been solved ? If so , please tell me how, thanks! On Mon, 06 Nov 2000 17:33:48 +0100 Andreas Gietl wrote: > any further ideas? > > i'm sorry, but there is no pipeline entry: > > that's the db-file: > { 'filebase': 'ccfe93988bf681ad271ad049fa54dcd7260a60ac', > 'listname': 'bittecomgietltest2', > 'torequest': 1, > 'version': 2} > > and this is the .msg file: > > >From gietl at gietl.com Sat Nov 04 13:52:46 2000 > Received: from [195.227.84.2] (helo=d1.x-mailer.de) > by d18.x-mailer.de with esmtp (Exim 3.16 #1) > id 13s2oQ-0003e1-00 > for bittecomgietltest2-request at bitte.com; Sat, 04 Nov 2000 > 13:52:46 +0100 > Received: from p3ee039ab.dip.t-dialin.net ([62.224.57.171] > helo=gietl.com) > by d1.x-mailer.de with esmtp (Exim 3.16 #1) > id 13s2n9-0004iW-00 > for bittecomgietltest2-request at bitte.com; Sat, 04 Nov 2000 > 13:51:27 +0100 > Message-ID: <3A0406EC.6C4B8583 at gietl.com> > Date: Sat, 04 Nov 2000 13:54:04 +0100 > From: Andreas Gietl > X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.73 [en] (WinNT; I) > X-Accept-Language: en > MIME-Version: 1.0 > To: bittecomgietltest2-request at bitte.com > Subject: Re: Bittecomgietltest2 -- confirmation of subscription -- > request 569170 > References: > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 > Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit > > > > bittecomgietltest2-request at bitte.com wrote: > > > > Bittecomgietltest2 -- confirmation of subscription -- request 569170 > > > > We have received a request from p3ee039ab.dip.t-dialin.net for > > subscription of your email address, , to the > > bittecomgietltest2 at bitte.com mailing list. To confirm the request, > > please send a message to bittecomgietltest2-request at bitte.com, and > > either: > > > > - maintain the subject line as is (the reply's additional "Re:" is > > ok), > > > > - or include the following line - and only the following line - in the > > message body: > > > > confirm 569170 > > > > (Simply sending a 'reply' to this message should work from most email > > interfaces, since that usually leaves the subject line in the right > > form.) > > > > If you do not wish to subscribe to this list, please simply disregard > > this message. Send questions to bittecomgietltest2-admin at bitte.com. > > barry at wooz.org wrote: > > > > >>>>> "AG" == Andreas Gietl writes: > > > > >> Do you still see the > > >> confirmation message in qfiles? > > > > AG> Yeah, the confirmation message is in there! > > > > >> If so, are there any obvious errors > > >> in logs/error? > > > > AG> nothing. i of course checked that! > > > > >> Does it have the expected Subject: header (i.e. at the > > >> end of the line, "request xxxxxx" where those x's are the > > >> numbers). > > > > AG> Yeah. it does have. > > AG> Do you need any further information? > > > > Yes, do a bin/dumpdb qfiles/.db and look for the > > `pipeline' entry. > > > > That should show us where things are getting stuck. > > -Barry > > > > ------------------------------------------------------ > > Mailman-Users maillist - Mailman-Users at python.org > > http://www.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users > > -- > andreas gietl > gietl internet services > fon +49 9402 2551 > fax +49 9402 2604 > mobile +49 171 60 70 008 > gietl at gietl.com > > ############################################ > # Das Handbuch sagt, das Programm ben~{vt~}ige # > # Windows 95 oder besser. Also habe ich # > # Linux installiert! # > ############################################ > > ------------------------------------------------------ > Mailman-Users maillist - Mailman-Users at python.org > http://www.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users From wsarka at smartpoint.com Thu Nov 9 20:49:37 2000 From: wsarka at smartpoint.com (Will Sarka,SmartPoint,303-402-1915,) Date: Thu, 09 Nov 2000 12:49:37 -0700 Subject: [Mailman-Users] (no subject) Message-ID: <3A0AFFD1.2020706@smartpoint.com> unsubscribe gnome mailman-users From bgoldstock at tvdata.com Thu Nov 9 20:02:41 2000 From: bgoldstock at tvdata.com (Brett Goldstock) Date: Thu, 9 Nov 2000 14:02:41 -0500 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Can't get it working In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: I've been trying for a few days to get Mailman working reliably, but I keep running into problems. I'm running Solaris 2.7 on an Ultra 60 with Apache 1.3.9. I originally compiled it under a user called mailman, but my Apache uses a User and Group setting of "nobody". This sort of worked, but my config.db file kept getting reset to an owner of "nobody", causing errors in the Mailman log. If I reset the ownership to mailman, my message don't get delivered and I get no errors in any log. I recompiled under mailman using the --with-mail-gid and --with-cgi-gid both set to "nobody". Now I get the following: ----- The following addresses had permanent fatal errors ----- "|/usr/local/mailman/mail/wrapper post test" (reason: 2) (expanded from: test) ----- Transcript of session follows ----- Failure to exec script. WANTED gid 60001, GOT gid 1. (Reconfigure to take 1?) 554 5.3.0 "|/usr/local/mailman/mail/wrapper post test"... unknown mailer error 2 I'm a little confused. I've read the INSTALL file, but I'm still not sure what I'm doing wrong. Thanks -Brett From barry at wooz.org Thu Nov 9 20:13:30 2000 From: barry at wooz.org (barry at wooz.org) Date: Thu, 9 Nov 2000 14:13:30 -0500 (EST) Subject: [Mailman-Developers] Re: [Mailman-Users] forever pending subscriptions References: <3A02C6B0.2D82FC79@gietl.com> <3A032199.67D1CA2E@west.sun.com> <14851.11014.397538.19202@anthem.concentric.net> <3A0407E2.42ABB0AF@gietl.com> <14852.12081.57421.807051@anthem.concentric.net> <3A06DD6C.D4F23706@gietl.com> Message-ID: <14858.63322.557304.241298@anthem.concentric.net> Trying to come back to this problem. It looks like Eric Wang is also seeing problems, so there must be /something/ going on. I can't figure out what though, so perhaps one of you guys can give me ssh access to the host in question? >>>>> "AG" == Andreas Gietl writes: AG> i'm sorry, but there is no pipeline entry: | that's the db-file: | { 'filebase': 'ccfe93988bf681ad271ad049fa54dcd7260a60ac', | 'listname': 'bittecomgietltest2', | 'torequest': 1, | 'version': 2} Okay, this looks pretty good, assuming the file is qfiles/ccfe93988bf681ad271ad049fa54dcd7260a60ac.db We don't get a `pipeline' key in the dictionary because, by virtue of the `torequest' key, qrunner sends this message through the email command parser instead of the delivery pipeline. So far so good. AG> and this is the .msg file: [...most headers deleted...] | To: bittecomgietltest2-request at bitte.com | Subject: Re: Bittecomgietltest2 -- confirmation of subscription -- | request 569170 | References: | Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 | Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit I notice that the Subject: line is wrapped, but not in an rfc 822 valid way. I'm assuming that something got munged in the forwarding of the message to this list, and that the text `request 569170' is actually at the end of the Subject: line. In my own tests, if the message looked exactly as you sent it, with the line being wrapped and `request' showing in column zero, the mailcmd parser will generate an error message back to the sender. But you're not seeing that. If the `request' line were wrapped a la rfc 822, Mailman should be able to grok out the command just fine. But you're not seeing that either. Another log file to look at: doe you see anything in logs/bounce? I don't expect you to -- just wondering. We're at the point of using debug statements now, and I don't want to bore mailman-users with that. If I can't get ssh access to your installation, let's carry on the debugging conversation on mailman-developers only. -Barry From barry at wooz.org Thu Nov 9 20:14:59 2000 From: barry at wooz.org (Barry A. Warsaw) Date: Thu, 9 Nov 2000 14:14:59 -0500 (EST) Subject: [Mailman-Users] how can rebuild the heldmsg database? why mailman care? References: <20001108114003.3A2B.MRLIST@activestate.com> Message-ID: <14858.63411.507057.69511@anthem.concentric.net> >>>>> "EW" == Eric Wang writes: EW> I deleted some helpmsg from filesystem manually, then the mail EW> list web management tools "Tend to pending administrative EW> requests" doesn't work anymore. it report some error. why EW> mailman care about that? how can I rebuid the heldmsg EW> database let it work again? Set "Restrict posting privilege EW> to list members?" to no, change it a un-moderated mail list , EW> then change it back will work? With the current Mailman, if a data/heldmsg-listname-N.txt file is deleted manually, the next time you hit the admindb page, it'll report that the file was lost and delete it from the pending requests database (i.e. it ought to recover gracefully). -Barry From chuqui at plaidworks.com Thu Nov 9 20:38:02 2000 From: chuqui at plaidworks.com (Chuq Von Rospach) Date: Thu, 9 Nov 2000 11:38:02 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Developers] Re: [Mailman-Users] forever pending subscriptions In-Reply-To: <14858.63322.557304.241298@anthem.concentric.net> References: <3A02C6B0.2D82FC79@gietl.com> <3A032199.67D1CA2E@west.sun.com> <14851.11014.397538.19202@anthem.concentric.net> <3A0407E2.42ABB0AF@gietl.com> <14852.12081.57421.807051@anthem.concentric.net> <3A06DD6C.D4F23706@gietl.com> <14858.63322.557304.241298@anthem.concentric.net> Message-ID: At 2:13 PM -0500 11/9/00, barry at wooz.org wrote: > | Subject: Re: Bittecomgietltest2 -- confirmation of subscription -- > | request 569170 I had one of these this week. the Subject line was wrapped 'request\n\t' and mailman didn't handle it. To my knowledge subject should never wrap anyway, and when I looked in my inbox archives, it was the users mail client that had done it. It looked like a client issue, but it gave us the clue to help him work around it. -- Chuq Von Rospach - Plaidworks Consulting (mailto:chuqui at plaidworks.com) Apple Mail List Gnome (mailto:chuq at apple.com) Be just, and fear not. From lindsey at mallorn.com Thu Nov 9 20:47:19 2000 From: lindsey at mallorn.com (Christopher P. Lindsey) Date: Thu, 9 Nov 2000 13:47:19 -0600 Subject: [Mailman-Developers] Re: [Mailman-Users] forever pending subscriptions In-Reply-To: ; from chuqui@plaidworks.com on Thu, Nov 09, 2000 at 11:38:02AM -0800 References: <3A02C6B0.2D82FC79@gietl.com> <3A032199.67D1CA2E@west.sun.com> <14851.11014.397538.19202@anthem.concentric.net> <3A0407E2.42ABB0AF@gietl.com> <14852.12081.57421.807051@anthem.concentric.net> <3A06DD6C.D4F23706@gietl.com> <14858.63322.557304.241298@anthem.concentric.net> Message-ID: <20001109134719.G27713@mallorn.com> > At 2:13 PM -0500 11/9/00, barry at wooz.org wrote: > > | Subject: Re: Bittecomgietltest2 -- confirmation of subscription -- > > | request 569170 > > I had one of these this week. the Subject line was wrapped > 'request\n\t' and mailman didn't handle it. To my knowledge > subject should never wrap anyway, and when I looked in my inbox > archives, it was the users mail client that had done it. It looked > like a client issue, but it gave us the clue to help him work around > it. That's a perfectly legitimate Subject: line... RFC822 lists the Subject: header as *text, where text is text = any CHAR, including bare ; => atoms, specials, CR & bare LF, but NOT ; comments and including CRLF> ; quoted-strings are ; NOT recognized. a CHAR type is any ASCII character in the numeric decimal range of 0-127. So, to reiterate, folding Subject: headers are valid... Chris From dans at audifans.com Thu Nov 9 20:51:20 2000 From: dans at audifans.com (Dan Simoes) Date: Thu, 09 Nov 2000 14:51:20 -0500 Subject: [Mailman-Developers] Re: [Mailman-Users] forever pending subscriptions References: <3A02C6B0.2D82FC79@gietl.com> <3A032199.67D1CA2E@west.sun.com> <14851.11014.397538.19202@anthem.concentric.net> <3A0407E2.42ABB0AF@gietl.com> <14852.12081.57421.807051@anthem.concentric.net> <3A06DD6C.D4F23706@gietl.com> <14858.63322.557304.241298@anthem.concentric.net> Message-ID: <3A0B0038.CD725B31@audifans.com> barry at wooz.org wrote: > > Trying to come back to this problem. It looks like Eric Wang is also > seeing problems, so there must be /something/ going on. I can't > figure out what though, so perhaps one of you guys can give me ssh > access to the host in question? I've also reported the same problems. After much woe, I am back at beta6, which seems to have fixed my web interface problems and does not present the confirmation issue. I would love to help, but at this point I have over 2000 pissed off users, and I can't risk another upgrade to test. I may do so in the future, but only if I have a solid way of backing out. I am also strongly considering a return to majordomo. Thanks, | Dan | From barry at wooz.org Thu Nov 9 21:38:20 2000 From: barry at wooz.org (barry at wooz.org) Date: Thu, 9 Nov 2000 15:38:20 -0500 (EST) Subject: [Mailman-Developers] Re: [Mailman-Users] forever pending subscriptions References: <3A02C6B0.2D82FC79@gietl.com> <3A032199.67D1CA2E@west.sun.com> <14851.11014.397538.19202@anthem.concentric.net> <3A0407E2.42ABB0AF@gietl.com> <14852.12081.57421.807051@anthem.concentric.net> <3A06DD6C.D4F23706@gietl.com> <14858.63322.557304.241298@anthem.concentric.net> <3A0B0038.CD725B31@audifans.com> Message-ID: <14859.2876.127155.739471@anthem.concentric.net> >>>>> "DS" == Dan Simoes writes: >> Trying to come back to this problem. It looks like Eric Wang >> is also seeing problems, so there must be /something/ going on. >> I can't figure out what though, so perhaps one of you guys can >> give me ssh access to the host in question? DS> I've also reported the same problems. After much woe, I am DS> back at beta6, which seems to have fixed my web interface DS> problems and does not present the confirmation issue. We tracked Andreas' problem down to the qrunner cron job not being installed, a common problem for upgraders from what I've seen. Please first be absolutely sure this isn't your problem! You can test this by cd'ing into /home/mailman and running % python -S cron/qrunner if that unclogs things, your cron isn't set up right. If not, then we'll need to look at things more closely. To start with, you can send me the output of "bin/dumpdb qfiles/whatever.db" and the associated .msg file. Also, look in the log files, especially logs/error and see if there's anything relevant. DS> I would love to help, but at this point I have over 2000 DS> pissed off users, and I can't risk another upgrade to test. I DS> may do so in the future, but only if I have a solid way of DS> backing out. Well, you may have to set up a test list in a different installation until you're confident that 2.0rc1 works for you. DS> I am also strongly considering a return to majordomo. I hope that won't be necessary, and I'm willing to help debug the problem. -Barry From barry at wooz.org Thu Nov 9 21:42:49 2000 From: barry at wooz.org (barry at wooz.org) Date: Thu, 9 Nov 2000 15:42:49 -0500 (EST) Subject: [Mailman-Developers] Re: [Mailman-Users] forever pending subscriptions References: <3A02C6B0.2D82FC79@gietl.com> <3A032199.67D1CA2E@west.sun.com> <14851.11014.397538.19202@anthem.concentric.net> <3A0407E2.42ABB0AF@gietl.com> <14852.12081.57421.807051@anthem.concentric.net> <3A06DD6C.D4F23706@gietl.com> <14858.63322.557304.241298@anthem.concentric.net> Message-ID: <14859.3145.597151.979023@anthem.concentric.net> >>>>> "CVR" == Chuq Von Rospach writes: CVR> I had one of these this week. the Subject line was wrapped CVR> 'request\n\t' and mailman didn't handle it. To my CVR> knowledge subject should never wrap anyway, and when I looked CVR> in my inbox archives, it was the users mail client that had CVR> done it. It looked like a client issue, but it gave us the CVR> clue to help him work around it. Hmm. I just tested this (wrapping before and after `request' with \n\t) and it works for me. The rfc822 module /should/ be able to handle this and return a Subject with the continuation lines. -Barry From Dan.Mick at west.sun.com Thu Nov 9 22:16:02 2000 From: Dan.Mick at west.sun.com (Dan Mick) Date: Thu, 09 Nov 2000 13:16:02 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] mailman cron gets uppity References: <200011091605.eA9G5p420527@unidata.ucar.edu> Message-ID: <3A0B1412.9C0D80E2@west.sun.com> > > Also, I inherited the administration of our Mailman lists, and thus am not > > intimately familiar with the installation and inner workings. As a result, > > I am not sure what version we are running nor exactly how to find out. We > > are running 11 lists ranging in size from about 12 to 350 users. Everything > > seems to be running fine. Some guidance on how to find out what version we > > are running would also be appreciated. > > On my system I can execute the following: > > $ /opt/mailman/bin/version > Using Mailman version 2.0rc1 It's also in the X-Mailman-Version: header. From Dan.Mick at west.sun.com Thu Nov 9 22:24:53 2000 From: Dan.Mick at west.sun.com (Dan Mick) Date: Thu, 09 Nov 2000 13:24:53 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Developers] Re: [Mailman-Users] forever pending subscriptions References: <3A02C6B0.2D82FC79@gietl.com> <3A032199.67D1CA2E@west.sun.com> <14851.11014.397538.19202@anthem.concentric.net> <3A0407E2.42ABB0AF@gietl.com> <14852.12081.57421.807051@anthem.concentric.net> <3A06DD6C.D4F23706@gietl.com> <14858.63322.557304.241298@anthem.concentric.net> <3A0B0038.CD725B31@audifans.com> <14859.2876.127155.739471@anthem.concentric.net> Message-ID: <3A0B1625.A270241@west.sun.com> barry at wooz.org wrote: > We tracked Andreas' problem down to the qrunner cron job not being > installed Well, there's a new one. Not mentioned anywhere in the installation docs, either. Glad we had to get Barry to debug this one. From Dan.Mick at west.sun.com Thu Nov 9 22:32:40 2000 From: Dan.Mick at west.sun.com (Dan Mick) Date: Thu, 09 Nov 2000 13:32:40 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] confirmation reply bug - another victim References: <3A0ACBD2.AF0AC6A8@audifans.com> Message-ID: <3A0B17F8.D6676991@west.sun.com> Dan Simoes wrote: > OK, so after I get chided for not running the latest and greatest, > I upgraded my mailman to the 2.0rc1. > > I start getting emails from people that they are trying to subscribe but > cannot, because the confirmation never seems to get through. I tested > this, and they are right. Many of us are not having this problem; my guess is that somehow some MUAs are sending confirmation replies that screw with mailman somehow. If *you* can reproduce it, would you mind trying to subscribe to a test list I'll set up on my latest-CVS server? > > Looking at the list archives, I am not alone. > I checked the archive and followed the same debugging steps that were > given to Andreas, with the exact same results - no obvious problems. Did you also make absolutely certain your cron jobs were right and running? Did you verify that running qrunner by hand didn't work? > Thanks. Sorry; it works for a lot of us, and it's clearly the right thing to do, but apparently there's still a lurking bug. From alex at phred.org Thu Nov 9 23:11:58 2000 From: alex at phred.org (alex wetmore) Date: Thu, 9 Nov 2000 14:11:58 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Headers & footers on MIME/multipart messages References: <200011081938.OAA28485@min.net> Message-ID: <095e01c04a9a$153863d0$5bf83b9d@redmond.corp.microsoft.com> From: "George Dinwiddie" > It seems to me that, as a minimum, it would be preferable to only insert into the text/plain > part of the message. Better, would be the ability to specify separate headers & footers > for text/html and text/plain portions. It could start getting complicated, couldn't it. > Unfortunately, multipart/alternative messages with text/plain and text/html versions are > becoming very common. I wouldn't mind if the text/html portion was just stripped out and > only the text/plain portion was sent out to the list. That would also solve the problem > of javascript virusii embedded in the html. My solution is to strip all HTML and non-text attachments from email and only allow the text through. I do this to the email before it gets to mailman. My perl script for this is at http://www.phred.org/~alex/stripmime.pl . My users (especially digest users) have been much much happier since I added this. Very occasionally a list member will attempt to send a photograph or other binary attachment and gets confused when they get a report saying that it was stripped -- but such attachments are a lot less frequent then HTML formatted email. Another list member (sorry, I don't remember who) has a script with similar functionality called demime. Internally they work very differently (he uses the Perl MIME modules (which buffer to temp files in disk, or the whole message into memory), while my script is implemented as a line by line filter with very little buffering), but they both get the job done. Someday I'll learn Python and rewrite this as a Python module so that it can be donated back to the Mailman project and come as a core part of the mailing list system. alex From claw at kanga.nu Fri Nov 10 00:01:59 2000 From: claw at kanga.nu (J C Lawrence) Date: Thu, 09 Nov 2000 15:01:59 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Performance for a Spam Cannon In-Reply-To: Message from Johnathan Vail of "Thu, 09 Nov 2000 11:27:47 EST." References: Message-ID: <23138.973810919@kanga.nu> On Thu, 09 Nov 2000 11:27:47 -0500 Johnathan Vail wrote: > I would like to schedule this to work in the early AM hours and if > I can deliver in about an hour or so I would be happy. Does > anyone have any estimates or numebrs for comparison on what I can > expect? Your timing is going to be dependant on: 1) distribution (domain etc) of your membership base 2) DNS issues (encluding remote presence and local cacheing) 3) the performance of your target MXes 4) whether or not you can use a smart host for any of the traffic Notice that only #1 and #4 are under your control. -- J C Lawrence Home: claw at kanga.nu ---------(*) Other: coder at kanga.nu http://www.kanga.nu/~claw/ Keys etc: finger claw at kanga.nu --=| A man is as sane as he is dangerous to his environment |=-- From mr.bad at pigdog.org Fri Nov 10 00:51:51 2000 From: mr.bad at pigdog.org (Mr.Bad) Date: 09 Nov 2000 15:51:51 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] An interesting statistic. In-Reply-To: Scott Russell's message of "Wed, 8 Nov 2000 16:01:27 -0500" References: <20001108160127.A32763@raleigh.ibm.com> Message-ID: <87g0l07lgo.fsf@roy.bad-people-of-the-future.san-francisco.ca.us> >>>>> "SR" == Scott Russell writes: SR> This is true BUT there are some cravats. Hahaha! This made my day. ~Mr. Bad -- ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ /\____/\ Mr. Bad \ / Pigdog Journal | http://pigdog.org/ | *Stay*Real*Bad* | (X \x) ( ((**) "If it's not bad, don't do it. \ If it's not crazy, don't say it." - Ben Franklin ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ From mrlist at ActiveState.com Fri Nov 10 01:15:44 2000 From: mrlist at ActiveState.com (Eric Wang) Date: Thu, 09 Nov 2000 16:15:44 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] How mail man talk to MTA about the bounce email? Message-ID: <20001109160924.8A8F.MRLIST@activestate.com> Hi, guys! Does anyone can explain me a little bit more about the mailman smart "bounce options"? How mailman actually do with the bounce email with MTA? It is pretty odd, we have one month old email in queue. From roryt at hol.gr Fri Nov 10 03:46:27 2000 From: roryt at hol.gr (I.Ioannou) Date: Fri, 10 Nov 2000 04:46:27 +0200 (EET) Subject: [Mailman-Users] Re: Mime in subject ... more=?us-ascii?Q?___=C4=C5=D6=E4=E5=F6?= In-Reply-To: <14858.55616.721708.122386@bitdiddle.concentric.net> Message-ID: On 09-Nov-00 Jeremy Hylton wrote: > in the wrong place; a change that effects that way the HTML output is > generated should be in HyperArchy.py. (This isn't obvious.) Yes, after a while I also confirmed that my hack was not working all the times, but as I say, I don't know Python, and this was my first attempt to debug a Python program > If there is a specific problem, can someone point me at a mail > archive > that appears to be broken? If you are looking at a particular check http://lists.hellug.gr/pipermail/i18ngr/2000/date.html You will notice that the problem is only in the date/thread/subject etc index page, not in the message. The message has the tag, so it is readable. I.Ioannou From mbuddy at bigpond.net.au Fri Nov 10 04:50:32 2000 From: mbuddy at bigpond.net.au (Markus Buchanan) Date: Fri, 10 Nov 2000 14:50:32 +1100 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Problems with Pending email confirms In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Hi all, For the information of those who come after.... The problem was indeed that majordomo uses a program also called wrapper, as outlined in the README.SENDMAIL instructions. However, the fix for Cobalt Servers (RaQ3i anyway) is to hack the newlist program and change the wrapper to mailman_wrapper and then create a symlink: % cd /usr/adm/sm.bin % ln -s /home/mailman/mail/wrapper mailman_wrapper Now it all works fine. I hope this is of some help to others... markus on 9/11/00 12:51 PM, Markus Buchanan at mbuddy at bigpond.net.au wrote: > Hi All, > > Let me preface this by saying I have read the INSTALL guides and done a > search here first. > > I have a problem with emails being stuck in the subscribe confirmation > stage. Like: > > Nov 09 10:55:35 2000 (9809) test: pending fred at earthling.net 144.132.34.38 > > I have also noted that the README.SENDMAIL states that smrsh can be a > problem, and that a symlink can be a solution. It suggest to cd into the > smrsh directory and create one. > > On my system (Cobalt RaQ3i) smrsh is in the /usr/sbin/ directory, not in a > directory of it's own. Now as I am no guru, do I make the symlink in that > directory? > > BTW I have Majordomo running, so I need to alter the wrapper to > mailman_wrapper or similar. Is this easy to do by hacking the python files? > > Sorry if this is an easy one, but I have managed to get it this far without > calling you guys for help! This is my first time on here, so be gentle... > > Cheers > > Markus > > > ------------------------------------------------------ > Mailman-Users maillist - Mailman-Users at python.org > http://www.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users From xiao.bing at oztime.com Fri Nov 10 05:50:21 2000 From: xiao.bing at oztime.com (Xiao Bing) Date: Fri, 10 Nov 2000 12:50:21 +0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] It seemed that Mailman CGI part and SMTP part must be on same machine? Message-ID: <01a701c04ad1$bbaf44e0$eb00a8c0@prc.oztime.com> I installed mailman on one machine.Then I want to change smtp server to another machine.I have simply modified mm_cfg.py. # SMTP host and port, when DELIVERY_MODULE is 'SMTPDirect' SMTPHOST = 'X.X.X.X' #OK,It 's my smtp server's ip SMTPPORT = 25 # port after a subscription.I received a confirm_request email. I replied it.Then I received another auto-response email. The following is a detailed description of the problems. ***** confirm 539985 >>>>> Invalid confirmation number! >>>>> Note that confirmation numbers expire 3 days after initial request. >>>>> Please check date and number and try again, from the start if necessary. What 's the matter? Who can tell me what I should do? Jack -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mail.python.org/pipermail/mailman-users/attachments/20001110/eb093ab5/attachment.htm From barry at wooz.org Fri Nov 10 06:22:25 2000 From: barry at wooz.org (barry at wooz.org) Date: Fri, 10 Nov 2000 00:22:25 -0500 (EST) Subject: [Mailman-Users] Re: Mime in subject ... more=?us-ascii?Q?___=C4=C5=D6=E4=E5=F6?= References: <14858.55616.721708.122386@bitdiddle.concentric.net> Message-ID: <14859.34321.787915.766419@anthem.concentric.net> >>>>> "II" == I Ioannou writes: >> If there is a specific problem, can someone point me at a mail >> archive that appears to be broken? If you are looking at a >> particular | check | http://lists.hellug.gr/pipermail/i18ngr/2000/date.html II> You will notice that the problem is only in the II> date/thread/subject etc index page, not in the message. The II> message has the tag, so it II> is readable. It certainly looks like there's at least two charsets in the subjects, so it is expected that at least /some/ of those won't be displayed properly. However, given that I see no META tag in the source, it could be there's a bug none of the charsets are used. Maybe Jeremy can take a closer look. -Barry From bob at nleaudio.com Fri Nov 10 06:51:20 2000 From: bob at nleaudio.com (Bob Puff@NLE) Date: Fri, 10 Nov 2000 00:51:20 -0500 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Online Archives are dead References: <3A02C6B0.2D82FC79@gietl.com> <3A032199.67D1CA2E@west.sun.com> <14851.11014.397538.19202@anthem.concentric.net> <3A0407E2.42ABB0AF@gietl.com> <14852.12081.57421.807051@anthem.concentric.net> <3A06DD6C.D4F23706@gietl.com> <14858.63322.557304.241298@anthem.concentric.net> <3A0B0038.CD725B31@audifans.com> <14859.2876.127155.739471@anthem.concentric.net> Message-ID: <3A0B8CD8.9C44E224@nleaudio.com> Hello, I just happened to be looking at my online archives tonight, and discovered that they suddenly stopped working sometime this past monday. I have several lists, and all seem to be working fine, including digests. But when I look inside the /home/mailman/archives/private/(listname)/2000-November/ directory, the last message is dated Nov 6, 00:33. This isn't quite right! Another strangeness I see is that when I issue a LS command in that directory, -sometimes- I only see a few files - not the couple hundred that are in there. Example: [root at main 2000-November]# d ./ 000297.html 000365.html 000433.html 000501.html 000569.html ../ 000298.html 000366.html 000434.html 000502.html 000570.html 000202.html 000299.html 000367.html 000435.html 000503.html 000571.html 000232.html 000300.html 000368.html 000436.html 000504.html 000572.html 000233.html 000301.html 000369.html 000437.html 000505.html 000573.html 000234.html 000302.html 000370.html 000438.html 000506.html 000574.html 00m000566.html 000295.html 000363.html 000431.html 000499.html 000567.html 000296.html 000364.html 000432.html 000500.html 000568.html [root at main 2000-November]# There really are files from 202-606, including the .html files. Also of note: inside /home/mailman/archives/private/(listname).mbox/ there is a rather large file that seems to be the accumulation of ALL messages from when I started the list up until the latest post. Why is this, and when does it get deleted? This could get really HUGE on an active list! I am running the 2.0rc1 version of Mailman on a Linux-Mandrake 7.1 system. Bob From Dan.Mick at West.Sun.COM Fri Nov 10 07:27:16 2000 From: Dan.Mick at West.Sun.COM (Dan Mick) Date: Thu, 9 Nov 2000 22:27:16 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Mailman-Users] Online Archives are dead Message-ID: <200011100625.WAA26493@utopia.west.sun.com> > Hello, > > I just happened to be looking at my online archives tonight, and discovered that they suddenly stopped working sometime this past monday. > > I have several lists, and all seem to be working fine, including digests. But when I look inside the /home/mailman/archives/private/(listname)/2000-November/ > directory, the last message is dated Nov 6, 00:33. This isn't quite right! > > Another strangeness I see is that when I issue a LS command in that directory, -sometimes- I only see a few files - not the couple hundred that are in there. Example: > > [root at main 2000-November]# d > ./ 000297.html 000365.html 000433.html 000501.html 000569.html > ../ 000298.html 000366.html 000434.html 000502.html 000570.html > 000202.html 000299.html 000367.html 000435.html 000503.html 000571.html > 000232.html 000300.html 000368.html 000436.html 000504.html 000572.html > 000233.html 000301.html 000369.html 000437.html 000505.html 000573.html > 000234.html 000302.html 000370.html 000438.html 000506.html 000574.html > 00m000566.html > 000295.html 000363.html 000431.html 000499.html 000567.html > 000296.html 000364.html 000432.html 000500.html 000568.html > [root at main 2000-November]# > There really are files from 202-606, including the .html files. ???? That sounds like an OS bug to me... > > Also of note: inside /home/mailman/archives/private/(listname).mbox/ there is a rather large file that seems to be the accumulation of ALL messages from when I started the list up until the latest post. Why is this, that's how it works. You can rebuild the archive from that mbox. > and when does it get deleted? This could get really HUGE on an active list! Yup, as could the archives themselves. Mailman doesn't try to rotate them for you. From bob at nleaudio.com Fri Nov 10 07:34:02 2000 From: bob at nleaudio.com (Bob Puff@NLE) Date: Fri, 10 Nov 2000 01:34:02 -0500 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Online Archives are dead References: <200011100625.WAA26493@utopia.west.sun.com> Message-ID: <3A0B96DA.39A0C625@nleaudio.com> Hi Dan, Any idea how I can 'kick-start' the archives? How do I rebuild the archives? How often should the archives be "updated" on the web pages? After every post? Bob Dan Mick wrote: > > > Hello, > > > > I just happened to be looking at my online archives tonight, and discovered > that they suddenly stopped working sometime this past monday. > > > > I have several lists, and all seem to be working fine, including digests. But > when I look inside the /home/mailman/archives/private/(listname)/2000-November/ > > directory, the last message is dated Nov 6, 00:33. This isn't quite right! > > > > Another strangeness I see is that when I issue a LS command in that directory, > -sometimes- I only see a few files - not the couple hundred that are in there. > Example: > > > > [root at main 2000-November]# d > > ./ 000297.html 000365.html 000433.html 000501.html 000569.html > > ../ 000298.html 000366.html 000434.html 000502.html 000570.html > > 000202.html 000299.html 000367.html 000435.html 000503.html 000571.html > > 000232.html 000300.html 000368.html 000436.html 000504.html 000572.html > > 000233.html 000301.html 000369.html 000437.html 000505.html 000573.html > > 000234.html 000302.html 000370.html 000438.html 000506.html 000574.html > > 00m000566.html > > 000295.html 000363.html 000431.html 000499.html 000567.html > > 000296.html 000364.html 000432.html 000500.html 000568.html > > [root at main 2000-November]# > > There really are files from 202-606, including the .html files. > > ???? > > That sounds like an OS bug to me... > > > > > Also of note: inside /home/mailman/archives/private/(listname).mbox/ there is > a rather large file that seems to be the accumulation of ALL messages from when > I started the list up until the latest post. Why is this, > > that's how it works. You can rebuild the archive from that mbox. > > > and when does it get deleted? This could get really HUGE on an active list! > > Yup, as could the archives themselves. Mailman doesn't try to rotate > them for you. > > ------------------------------------------------------ > Mailman-Users maillist - Mailman-Users at python.org > http://www.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users From Dan.Mick at West.Sun.COM Fri Nov 10 07:39:58 2000 From: Dan.Mick at West.Sun.COM (Dan Mick) Date: Thu, 9 Nov 2000 22:39:58 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Mailman-Users] Online Archives are dead Message-ID: <200011100638.WAA27247@utopia.west.sun.com> > Any idea how I can 'kick-start' the archives? no; don't know what's going wrong. That ls output is baffling tho, and surely indicative of some problem. > How do I rebuild the archives? remove them (except for the mbox file) and use bin/arch; see the top of bin/arch for instructions. > How often should the archives be "updated" on the web pages? After every post? Yes. From jwblist at olympus.net Fri Nov 10 08:31:05 2000 From: jwblist at olympus.net (John W Baxter) Date: Thu, 9 Nov 2000 23:31:05 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Re: HTML mail In-Reply-To: <3065386265.973727995@[192.168.1.101]> References: <3065386265.973727995@[192.168.1.101]> Message-ID: Chuq wrote: >> Tom, God could come down with stone tablets proving it, and you wouldn't >> believe it. I rather thought that was Moses: "I bring 15---CRASH---oops 10 commandments...". --John (the long-time Duluth-based Superintendent for the Duluth, Missabi, and Iron Range Railroad, in the early 70s was called "Moses" all over Duluth, because every couple of weeks he went up to "Mt Missabi" [company HQ] and brought back commandments) [And if anyone insists, I'll go look up the proper spelling of Missabi.] -- John Baxter jwblist at olympus.net Port Ludlow, WA, USA From ckwong at cuhk.edu.hk Fri Nov 10 09:01:32 2000 From: ckwong at cuhk.edu.hk (Wong Ching Kuen Frederick) Date: Fri, 10 Nov 2000 16:01:32 +0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] email database Message-ID: <003101c04aec$706b6e80$5544bd89@econ.cuhk.edu.hk> i just want to know where is the email of the lists stored in mailman. thanx. From jwblist at olympus.net Fri Nov 10 09:02:51 2000 From: jwblist at olympus.net (John W Baxter) Date: Fri, 10 Nov 2000 00:02:51 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] I can't see In-Reply-To: <008101c04a3d$4a57c360$7e2b73d2@kangwon.ac.kr> References: <008101c04a3d$4a57c360$7e2b73d2@kangwon.ac.kr> Message-ID: At 20:07 +0900 11/9/00, Chen.LongJi wrote: >I just installed mailman2.0 at my linux server. >everything is work. >but the problem is If I use outlook express mail to list, then >I can't read it. >what's wrong? You'll have better luck if you get rid of the HTML in your messages sent by Outlook Express. Avoid this stuff (which I've altered slightly in hopes that it slips through as part of the message and doesn't upset mail clients): < !DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN"> (And, who is pete? --Don't answer, I'm joking.) --John -- John Baxter jwblist at olympus.net Port Ludlow, WA, USA From camp at bigfoot.com Fri Nov 10 15:53:16 2000 From: camp at bigfoot.com (John Camp) Date: Fri, 10 Nov 2000 14:53:16 +0000 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Reply Message-ID: <5.0.0.25.2.20001110144844.02166330@relay05.indigo.ie> Barry A. Warsaw barry at wooz.org Fri, 27 Oct 2000 17:42:53 -0400 (EDT) wrote: >The one thing this article doesn't address is users who add their own >Reply-To: headers. What do you do then? Mailman's policy is to not >modify such a header if the original message already has one. Has there been an answer to this? If not, is there one? (And please don't say that it's a bad thing to do, anyway.) John Camp From robh at uunet.co.za Fri Nov 10 19:04:53 2000 From: robh at uunet.co.za (Rob Hunter) Date: Fri, 10 Nov 2000 20:04:53 +0200 (SAST) Subject: [Mailman-Users] more odd errors Message-ID: Hi there I seemed to fix my last problem by deleting 1 or 2 files from qfiles/ with suspect email addresses. (sounds odd I know, but it worked). I'm getting this currently: Nov 02 00:18:11 2000 (88613) All recipients refused: please run connect() first Nov 02 00:18:12 2000 (88613) smtp for 16 recips, completed in 611.111 seconds Nov 02 00:20:46 2000 (88613) All recipients refused: please run connect() first Nov 02 00:38:59 2000 (88854) All recipients refused: please run connect() first And: Oct 31 16:42:24 2000 (79341) -1 herman.kramer at za.didata.com (ignore) Oct 31 16:42:24 2000 (79341) -1 mozzie at netactive.co.za (ignore) Oct 31 16:42:24 2000 (79341) -1 mark.mcintyre at za.didata.com (ignore) Oct 31 16:42:24 2000 (79341) -1 jianni at iafrica.com (ignore) Oct 31 16:42:24 2000 (79341) -1 pauli at icon.co.za (ignore) Once again, qrunner lockfiles persist, 'cos qrunner can't successfully complete, and the viscious circle starts again. I'm running FreeBSD 4.1--STABLE with postfix-19991231.08 and mailman-2.0b5_1. Any suggestions? Regards --Rob From Dan.Mick at west.sun.com Fri Nov 10 19:34:12 2000 From: Dan.Mick at west.sun.com (Dan Mick) Date: Fri, 10 Nov 2000 10:34:12 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] more odd errors References: Message-ID: <3A0C3FA4.ACED2EFD@west.sun.com> Those logs/smtp messages indicate that your MTA is throwing up. There must be MTA logs you can check to find out why, or logs you can enable to find out why. Rob Hunter wrote: > > Hi there > > I seemed to fix my last problem by deleting 1 or 2 files from qfiles/ with > suspect email addresses. (sounds odd I know, but it worked). > > I'm getting this currently: > > > > Nov 02 00:18:11 2000 (88613) All recipients refused: please run connect() > first > Nov 02 00:18:12 2000 (88613) smtp for 16 recips, completed in 611.111 > seconds > Nov 02 00:20:46 2000 (88613) All recipients refused: please run connect() > first > Nov 02 00:38:59 2000 (88854) All recipients refused: please run connect() > first > > > And: > > > Oct 31 16:42:24 2000 (79341) -1 herman.kramer at za.didata.com (ignore) > Oct 31 16:42:24 2000 (79341) -1 mozzie at netactive.co.za (ignore) > Oct 31 16:42:24 2000 (79341) -1 mark.mcintyre at za.didata.com (ignore) > Oct 31 16:42:24 2000 (79341) -1 jianni at iafrica.com (ignore) > Oct 31 16:42:24 2000 (79341) -1 pauli at icon.co.za (ignore) > > > Once again, qrunner lockfiles persist, 'cos qrunner can't successfully > complete, and the viscious circle starts again. > > I'm running FreeBSD 4.1--STABLE with postfix-19991231.08 and > mailman-2.0b5_1. > > Any suggestions? > > Regards > > --Rob > > ------------------------------------------------------ > Mailman-Users maillist - Mailman-Users at python.org > http://www.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users From dans at audifans.com Fri Nov 10 21:20:45 2000 From: dans at audifans.com (Dan Simoes) Date: Fri, 10 Nov 2000 15:20:45 -0500 Subject: [Mailman-Users] more odd errors References: <3A0C3FA4.ACED2EFD@west.sun.com> Message-ID: <3A0C589D.411B4F30@audifans.com> I think I can help here. I saw the same thing last night. It was caused by some anti-relay controls I had enabled. I don't know postfix, but I think antirelay is on by default. Make sure that your MTA is allowing connections from localhost/127.0.0.1, and any other IPs bound to the same box (perhaps overkill, but just in case). >From the command line, try a: telnet localhost 25 and see if you get a connect. If it's refused, you may have TCP wrappers on as well. | Dan | Dan Mick wrote: > > Those logs/smtp messages indicate that your MTA is throwing up. > There must be MTA logs you can check to find out why, or logs you > can enable to find out why. > > Rob Hunter wrote: > > > > Hi there > > > > I seemed to fix my last problem by deleting 1 or 2 files from qfiles/ with > > suspect email addresses. (sounds odd I know, but it worked). > > > > I'm getting this currently: > > > > > > > > Nov 02 00:18:11 2000 (88613) All recipients refused: please run connect() > > first > > Nov 02 00:18:12 2000 (88613) smtp for 16 recips, completed in 611.111 > > seconds > > Nov 02 00:20:46 2000 (88613) All recipients refused: please run connect() > > first > > Nov 02 00:38:59 2000 (88854) All recipients refused: please run connect() > > first > > > > > > And: > > > > > > Oct 31 16:42:24 2000 (79341) -1 herman.kramer at za.didata.com (ignore) > > Oct 31 16:42:24 2000 (79341) -1 mozzie at netactive.co.za (ignore) > > Oct 31 16:42:24 2000 (79341) -1 mark.mcintyre at za.didata.com (ignore) > > Oct 31 16:42:24 2000 (79341) -1 jianni at iafrica.com (ignore) > > Oct 31 16:42:24 2000 (79341) -1 pauli at icon.co.za (ignore) > > > > > > Once again, qrunner lockfiles persist, 'cos qrunner can't successfully > > complete, and the viscious circle starts again. > > > > I'm running FreeBSD 4.1--STABLE with postfix-19991231.08 and > > mailman-2.0b5_1. > > > > Any suggestions? > > > > Regards > > > > --Rob > > > > ------------------------------------------------------ > > Mailman-Users maillist - Mailman-Users at python.org > > http://www.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users > > ------------------------------------------------------ > Mailman-Users maillist - Mailman-Users at python.org > http://www.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users From bob at nleaudio.com Fri Nov 10 21:25:54 2000 From: bob at nleaudio.com (Bob Puff@NLE) Date: Fri, 10 Nov 2000 15:25:54 -0500 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Online Archives are dead References: <200011100638.WAA27247@utopia.west.sun.com> Message-ID: <3A0C59D2.23DD1359@nleaudio.com> Oh boy, I think I messed it up now. I deleted the html archives in my /home/mailman/archives/private/testlist/ directory. Then I ran /bin/arch. It reconstructed the archives, but I think I've found a problem. The very last message, when looking at the "sort by date" for November, is huge.. This "one message" contains all the messages since the 6th. It appears that whatever the archiving program is using to figure out where the message ends and the next one begins is being confused. I tried editing the .mbox file (the big one with all the messages), but same thing. What now? Bob From bob at nleaudio.com Fri Nov 10 21:28:18 2000 From: bob at nleaudio.com (Bob Puff@NLE) Date: Fri, 10 Nov 2000 15:28:18 -0500 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Online Archives are dead References: <200011100638.WAA27247@utopia.west.sun.com> Message-ID: <3A0C5A62.B4F2FF14@nleaudio.com> Oh, I did figure out what was wrong with the LS file listing.. Turned out to be a bad telnet client! Server was fine. Bob Dan Mick wrote: > > > Any idea how I can 'kick-start' the archives? > > no; don't know what's going wrong. That ls output is baffling tho, > and surely indicative of some problem. > > > How do I rebuild the archives? > > remove them (except for the mbox file) and use bin/arch; see the top > of bin/arch for instructions. > > > How often should the archives be "updated" on the web pages? After every > post? > > Yes. From robh at uunet.co.za Fri Nov 10 21:32:06 2000 From: robh at uunet.co.za (Rob Hunter) Date: Fri, 10 Nov 2000 22:32:06 +0200 (SAST) Subject: [Mailman-Users] more odd errors In-Reply-To: <3A0C589D.411B4F30@audifans.com> Message-ID: Hi Dan Thanks for the reply. Nope, localhost works just fine, and it's only with mailman. I run pine on the box and use that as my mailer (sending from localhost) and the box does alot of other mail, aswell as lists running majordomo aswell. Thanks anyway. Regards --Rob On Fri, 10 Nov 2000, Dan Simoes wrote: > I think I can help here. I saw the same thing last night. > It was caused by some anti-relay controls I had enabled. > I don't know postfix, but I think antirelay is on by default. > Make sure that your MTA is allowing connections from > localhost/127.0.0.1, and any other IPs bound to the same box (perhaps > overkill, but just in case). > > >From the command line, try a: > telnet localhost 25 > and see if you get a connect. If it's refused, you may have TCP > wrappers on as well. > > | Dan | > > Dan Mick wrote: > > > > Those logs/smtp messages indicate that your MTA is throwing up. > > There must be MTA logs you can check to find out why, or logs you > > can enable to find out why. > > > > Rob Hunter wrote: > > > > > > Hi there > > > > > > I seemed to fix my last problem by deleting 1 or 2 files from qfiles/ with > > > suspect email addresses. (sounds odd I know, but it worked). > > > > > > I'm getting this currently: > > > > > > > > > > > > Nov 02 00:18:11 2000 (88613) All recipients refused: please run connect() > > > first > > > Nov 02 00:18:12 2000 (88613) smtp for 16 recips, completed in 611.111 > > > seconds > > > Nov 02 00:20:46 2000 (88613) All recipients refused: please run connect() > > > first > > > Nov 02 00:38:59 2000 (88854) All recipients refused: please run connect() > > > first > > > > > > > > > And: > > > > > > > > > Oct 31 16:42:24 2000 (79341) -1 herman.kramer at za.didata.com (ignore) > > > Oct 31 16:42:24 2000 (79341) -1 mozzie at netactive.co.za (ignore) > > > Oct 31 16:42:24 2000 (79341) -1 mark.mcintyre at za.didata.com (ignore) > > > Oct 31 16:42:24 2000 (79341) -1 jianni at iafrica.com (ignore) > > > Oct 31 16:42:24 2000 (79341) -1 pauli at icon.co.za (ignore) > > > > > > > > > Once again, qrunner lockfiles persist, 'cos qrunner can't successfully > > > complete, and the viscious circle starts again. > > > > > > I'm running FreeBSD 4.1--STABLE with postfix-19991231.08 and > > > mailman-2.0b5_1. > > > > > > Any suggestions? > > > > > > Regards > > > > > > --Rob > > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------ > > > Mailman-Users maillist - Mailman-Users at python.org > > > http://www.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users > > > > ------------------------------------------------------ > > Mailman-Users maillist - Mailman-Users at python.org > > http://www.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users > --Rob From mrlist at ActiveState.com Fri Nov 10 22:01:25 2000 From: mrlist at ActiveState.com (Eric Wang) Date: Fri, 10 Nov 2000 13:01:25 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Hi, how can change a existent mail list to another name without lose any data and members info? Message-ID: <20001110125906.F8FC.MRLIST@activestate.com> Hi, guys We need change the a mail list name, How can change a existent mail list to another name without lose any data and members info? Thanks very much! From katie at scs.agilent.com Fri Nov 10 22:05:55 2000 From: katie at scs.agilent.com (Katherine Dukelow) Date: Fri, 10 Nov 2000 13:05:55 PST Subject: [Mailman-Users] new user with installation question Message-ID: <200011102105.NAA22315@charm.scs.agilent.com> Hi, I'm trying to install mailman-2.0rc1 on a Linux system running apache 1.3.14. I am getting the following error: ******************************************************************************* Mailman CGI error!!! The expected gid of the Mailman CGI wrapper did not match the gid as set by the Web server. The most likely cause is that Mailman was configured and installed incorrectly. Please read the INSTALL instructions again, paying close attention to the --with-cgi-gid configure option. This entry is being stored in your syslog: Failure to exec script. WANTED gid 99, GOT gid 2. (Reconfigure to take 2?) ******************************************************************************* I have tried reinstalling with the following configuration command: ./configuration --with-cgi-gid=99 but I get the same error. Does anyone know what possible errors I could be making? Thanks, Katie From gossamer at tertius.net.au Fri Nov 10 22:15:55 2000 From: gossamer at tertius.net.au (Bek Oberin) Date: Sat, 11 Nov 2000 08:15:55 +1100 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Re: new user with installation question In-Reply-To: <200011102105.NAA22315@charm.scs.agilent.com>; from katie@scs.agilent.com on Fri, Nov 10, 2000 at 01:05:55PM -0800 References: <200011102105.NAA22315@charm.scs.agilent.com> Message-ID: <20001111081555.C10026@tertius.net.au> Katherine Dukelow wrote: > Failure to exec script. WANTED gid 99, GOT gid 2. (Reconfigure to take 2?) > ***************************************************************************** > I have tried reinstalling with the following configuration command: > ./configuration --with-cgi-gid=99 It says "Reconfigure to take 2", not "reconfigure to take 99". Try soething like: ./configuration --with-cgi-gid=2 -- : --Hacker-Neophile-Eclectic-Geek-Grrl-Queer-Disabled-Boychick-- : gossamer at tertius.net.au http://www.tertius.net.au/~gossamer/ : Courage is not the absence of fear, but rather the judgment that : something else is more important than fear. -- Ambrose Redmoon From robh at uunet.co.za Sat Nov 11 01:46:58 2000 From: robh at uunet.co.za (Rob Hunter) Date: Sat, 11 Nov 2000 02:46:58 +0200 (SAST) Subject: [Mailman-Users] more odd errors In-Reply-To: <3A0C589D.411B4F30@audifans.com> Message-ID: Hi Any of you using postfix? Here's where my problem lies: Nov 11 02:27:17 snow postfix/smtpd[61196]: timeout after DATA from localhost.fingers.co.za[127.0.0.1] Nov 11 02:27:17 snow postfix/smtpd[61196]: disconnect from localhost.fingers.co.za[127.0.0.1] Nov 11 02:27:17 snow postfix/smtpd[61196]: connect from localhost.fingers.co.za[127.0.0.1] Nov 11 02:27:17 snow postfix/smtpd[61196]: B7C343ECE: client=localhost.fingers.co.za[127.0.0.1] Nov 11 02:27:18 snow postfix/cleanup[61553]: B7C343ECE: message-id= It's not just with 1 delivery either, but it's only with some deliveries to mailman lists.... Any ideas? Regards --Rob On Fri, 10 Nov 2000, Dan Simoes wrote: > I think I can help here. I saw the same thing last night. > It was caused by some anti-relay controls I had enabled. > I don't know postfix, but I think antirelay is on by default. > Make sure that your MTA is allowing connections from > localhost/127.0.0.1, and any other IPs bound to the same box (perhaps > overkill, but just in case). > > >From the command line, try a: > telnet localhost 25 > and see if you get a connect. If it's refused, you may have TCP > wrappers on as well. > > | Dan | > > Dan Mick wrote: > > > > Those logs/smtp messages indicate that your MTA is throwing up. > > There must be MTA logs you can check to find out why, or logs you > > can enable to find out why. > > > > Rob Hunter wrote: > > > > > > Hi there > > > > > > I seemed to fix my last problem by deleting 1 or 2 files from qfiles/ with > > > suspect email addresses. (sounds odd I know, but it worked). > > > > > > I'm getting this currently: > > > > > > > > > > > > Nov 02 00:18:11 2000 (88613) All recipients refused: please run connect() > > > first > > > Nov 02 00:18:12 2000 (88613) smtp for 16 recips, completed in 611.111 > > > seconds > > > Nov 02 00:20:46 2000 (88613) All recipients refused: please run connect() > > > first > > > Nov 02 00:38:59 2000 (88854) All recipients refused: please run connect() > > > first > > > > > > > > > And: > > > > > > > > > Oct 31 16:42:24 2000 (79341) -1 herman.kramer at za.didata.com (ignore) > > > Oct 31 16:42:24 2000 (79341) -1 mozzie at netactive.co.za (ignore) > > > Oct 31 16:42:24 2000 (79341) -1 mark.mcintyre at za.didata.com (ignore) > > > Oct 31 16:42:24 2000 (79341) -1 jianni at iafrica.com (ignore) > > > Oct 31 16:42:24 2000 (79341) -1 pauli at icon.co.za (ignore) > > > > > > > > > Once again, qrunner lockfiles persist, 'cos qrunner can't successfully > > > complete, and the viscious circle starts again. > > > > > > I'm running FreeBSD 4.1--STABLE with postfix-19991231.08 and > > > mailman-2.0b5_1. > > > > > > Any suggestions? > > > > > > Regards > > > > > > --Rob > > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------ > > > Mailman-Users maillist - Mailman-Users at python.org > > > http://www.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users > > > > ------------------------------------------------------ > > Mailman-Users maillist - Mailman-Users at python.org > > http://www.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users > --Rob From bob at nleaudio.com Sat Nov 11 05:15:40 2000 From: bob at nleaudio.com (Bob Puff@NLE) Date: Fri, 10 Nov 2000 23:15:40 -0500 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Demime is what's killing my archives!!! References: <3A0647A5.7B09661B@nleaudio.com> <3.0.3.32.20001106090647.0166f790@127.0.0.1> Message-ID: <3A0CC7EC.10787400@nleaudio.com> Ok, after a lot of messing around this evening, I found the source of the problem of why my mailman archives stopped working. The problems started exactly when I added DEMIME! First, here's my ALIAS file line that calls demime (version 0.97c): testlist: "|/home/mailman/mail/demime.pl - |/home/mailman/mail/wrapper post testlist" Now here's what I discovered, after analyzing the headers of the messages that worked, and the ones that didn't. The very first line of the header normally starts with "From "... This first line seems to be getting swallowed by demime, even if the message has no HTML / MIME, or anything that needs attention. Here are two messages: the first one is WITHOUT demime, and the second is WITH demime installed on my "testlist": >From bob at nleaudio.com Fri Nov 10 22:58:44 2000 Delivered-To: testlist at nlenet.net Received: from ns.nlenet.net (ns.nlenet.net [64.65.206.24]) by main.nlenet.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1E08E3BC1 for ; Fri, 10 Nov 2000 22:58:44 -0500 (EST) Received: from nleaudio.com (nle.m0.nlenet.net [192.168.2.9]) by ns.nlenet.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id B297E76FE for ; Fri, 10 Nov 2000 22:58:43 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <3A0CC48D.B305618B at nleaudio.com> Date: Fri, 10 Nov 2000 23:01:17 -0500 From: "Bob Puff at NLE" X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.08 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: testlist at nleaudio.com Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [Testlist] test Sender: testlist-admin at nleaudio.com Errors-To: testlist-admin at nleaudio.com X-BeenThere: testlist at nleaudio.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0rc1 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: testlist at nleaudio.com List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: test without demime Return-Path: Delivered-To: testlist at nlenet.net Received: from ns.nlenet.net (ns.nlenet.net [64.65.206.24]) by main.nlenet.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id A857A3BC1 for ; Fri, 10 Nov 2000 23:00:49 -0500 (EST) Received: from nleaudio.com (nle.m0.nlenet.net [192.168.2.9]) by ns.nlenet.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7526E76FE for ; Fri, 10 Nov 2000 23:00:49 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <3A0CC50B.95E0A94E at nleaudio.com> Date: Fri, 10 Nov 2000 23:03:23 -0500 From: "Bob Puff at NLE" MIME-Version: 1.0 To: testlist at nleaudio.com Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [Testlist] test 2 Sender: testlist-admin at nleaudio.com Errors-To: testlist-admin at nleaudio.com X-BeenThere: testlist at nleaudio.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0rc1 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: testlist at nleaudio.com List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: test 2 with demime =============================================== Note that I also tried a blank demime_junkmail.cf file - no difference. As you can see from these messages, Msg #2 has one line missing at the top compared to message #1. And apparently, Mailman's html archiver looks for that, and needs it to work properly. Help! Bob From barry at digicool.com Sat Nov 11 05:24:05 2000 From: barry at digicool.com (Barry A. Warsaw) Date: Fri, 10 Nov 2000 23:24:05 -0500 (EST) Subject: [Mailman-Users] Announcing Mailman 2.0 release candidate 2 Message-ID: <14860.51685.368139.841987@anthem.concentric.net> This is it. Mailman 2.0 release candidate 2 is now available from SourceForge at http://sourceforge.net/project/showfiles.php?group_id=103 www.list.org and www.gnu.org should be updated soon. Excerpts from the NEWS file are given below. Of primary importance in this release is the fix of the last known mail duplication bug, and updated on-line documentation. You can view the documentation at http://mailman.sourceforge.net Please let me know if you find any errors in the docs. Unless something's royally screwed, those are the only changes I'll make before 2.0 final. Plan for that one week from today: Friday November 17th. Enjoy, -Barry -------------------- snip snip -------------------- 2.0 release candidate 2 (10-Nov-2000) - Documentation updates: start at admin/www/index.html - bin/withlist accepts additional command line arguments when used with the --run flag; bin/mmsitepass and bin/newlist accept -h/--help flags - bin/newlist has a -o/--output flag to append /etc/aliases suggestions to a specified file - SourceForge bugs fixed: 116615 (README.BSD update), 117015 (duplicate messages on moderated posts), 117548 (exception in HyperArch.py), 117682 (typos), 121185 (vsnprintf signature), 121591 and 122017 (bogus link after web unsubscribe), 121811 (`subscribe' in Subject: doesn't get archived) - SourceForge patches applied: 101812 (securelinux_fix.py contrib), 102097 (fix for bug 117548), 102211 (additional args for withlist), 102268 (case insensitive Content-Transfer-Encoding:) From tneff at bigfoot.com Sat Nov 11 05:58:11 2000 From: tneff at bigfoot.com (Tom Neff) Date: Fri, 10 Nov 2000 23:58:11 -0500 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Re: Demime is what's killing my archives!!! In-Reply-To: <20001111042706.ED9831CFD5@dinsdale.python.org> Message-ID: <3238082517.973900691@[192.168.0.2]> Yes, demime eats the envelope From_ header. You have three options: [1] Wrap demime in a script that strips, saves and restores the From_ line, like { read fl ; demime - | { echo $fl ; cat ; } ; } [2] use the -f1 switch to reformail(8), the tool supplied with maildrop(8). demime - | reformail -f1 [3] Hack demime. It's just a Perl script. --On Friday, November 10, 2000 11:27 PM -0500 mailman-users-request at python.org wrote: > Demime is what's killing my archives!!! From bob at nleaudio.com Sat Nov 11 06:33:52 2000 From: bob at nleaudio.com (Bob Puff@NLE) Date: Sat, 11 Nov 2000 00:33:52 -0500 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Re: Demime is what's killing my archives!!! References: <3238082517.973900691@[192.168.0.2]> Message-ID: <3A0CDA40.195B6A57@nleaudio.com> Thank you, Tom! I didn't have Maildrop, and I'm not familiar enough with Perl to start hacking, but suggestion #1 worked like a charm! It is probably more disk I/O than should be necessary, but I'm also CCing this to the demime list/author, so hopefully it can be fixed there. Thanks again! Bob Tom Neff wrote: > > Yes, demime eats the envelope From_ header. You have three options: > > [1] Wrap demime in a script that strips, saves and restores the From_ > line, like > > { read fl ; demime - | { echo $fl ; cat ; } ; } > > [2] use the -f1 switch to reformail(8), the tool supplied with maildrop(8). > > demime - | reformail -f1 > > [3] Hack demime. It's just a Perl script. > > --On Friday, November 10, 2000 11:27 PM -0500 > mailman-users-request at python.org wrote: > > > Demime is what's killing my archives!!! > > ------------------------------------------------------ > Mailman-Users maillist - Mailman-Users at python.org > http://www.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users From gjd at telesoft.mb.ca Sat Nov 11 07:59:55 2000 From: gjd at telesoft.mb.ca (Gary DeMontigny) Date: Sat, 11 Nov 2000 00:59:55 -0600 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Mailman 2.00 rc2 Message-ID: <3A0CEE6A.376A7F20@telesoft.mb.ca> Hello, I am running Mandrake 7.2 (i586) and am having trouble with the administration. I am unable to load the cgi pointing to my list ie. /mailman/admin/mylist. The errors I receive are either no data or premature end of script. According to the install docs I compiled Mailman with both --with-cgi-gid=apache and --with-mail-gid=mail and I still receive the same errors. There are no complaints of the wrong gid in any of my logs yet I cannot load the administration feature using Netscape. I able to load the listinfo but cannot edit any of the accounts. I didn't have this problem until I upgraded to the release candiates. Any idea what I am doing wrong or what has changed? -- / Gary DeMontigny / TeleSoft Systems / www.telesoft.mb.ca / gjd at telesoft.mb.ca From johnblock at storeshop.com Sat Nov 11 12:23:04 2000 From: johnblock at storeshop.com (John Block) Date: Sat, 11 Nov 2000 11:23:04 +0000 Subject: [Mailman-Users] installation instruction suggestions In-Reply-To: <14860.51685.368139.841987@anthem.concentric.net> Message-ID: Hello Barry > Please let me know if you find any errors in the docs. The odd line needs putting in to help the less able Set Ftp to Binary tar zxvf mailman-xxxx.tgz (I had to get the zxvf from support) Under configure options, it is not clear what to do. Is it tap in the command configure --option1 --option2 or is it edit the configure file, changing the lines... If it is edit the configure file, then putting these variable apart in an editable section and giving commented out examples would help. Thanks, John From jam at jamux.com Sat Nov 11 20:56:06 2000 From: jam at jamux.com (John A. Martin) Date: Sat, 11 Nov 2000 14:56:06 -0500 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Help: AttributeError: web_page_url Message-ID: <20001111195606.9C78D48031@athene.jamux.com> After upgrading apache from the Red Hat 6.2 apache-1.3.12-2.i386.rpm to apache-1.3.14-2.6.2.i386.rpm it seems to be impossible to access the Mailman web interface. Other stuff on the web site is OK. I do not believe apache's /etc/httpd/conf/httpd.conf was changed with respect to the entries pertaining to Mailman. No joy reverting back to the apache-1.3.12-2 package. Several tracebacks are logged leading back to 'AttributeError: web_page_url'. This Mailman has been in production for about a year. The Mailman web interface is now down and I don't have a clue. -------------- cut here ---->8 ---< head Bug in Mailman version 1.1 We're sorry, we hit a bug! If you would like to help us identify the problem, please email a copy of this page to the webmaster for this site with a description of what happened. Thanks! Traceback: Traceback (innermost last): File "/home/mailman/scripts/driver", line 112, in run_main main() File "/home/mailman/Mailman/Cgi/listinfo.py", line 40, in main FormatListinfoOverview() File "/home/mailman/Mailman/Cgi/listinfo.py", line 88, in FormatListinfoOverview l = MailList.MailList(n, lock = 0) File "/home/mailman/Mailman/MailList.py", line 62, in __init__ self.Load() File "/home/mailman/Mailman/MailList.py", line 824, in Load self.CheckValues() File "/home/mailman/Mailman/MailList.py", line 853, in CheckValues if self.web_page_url and self.web_page_url[-1] != '/': AttributeError: web_page_url Environment variables: Variable Value DOCUMENT_ROOT /home SERVER_ADDR 216.0.124.17 HTTP_ACCEPT_ENCODING gzip SERVER_PORT 80 GATEWAY_INTERFACE CGI/1.1 HTTP_ACCEPT_LANGUAGE en REMOTE_ADDR 216.0.124.17 SERVER_NAME lists.essential.org HTTP_CONNECTION Keep-Alive HTTP_USER_AGENT Mozilla/4.75 [en] (X11; U; Linux 2.2.14-12 i586; Nav) HTTP_ACCEPT_CHARSET iso-8859-1,*,utf-8 HTTP_ACCEPT image/gif, image/x-xbitmap, image/jpeg, image/pjpeg, image/png, */* REQUEST_URI /mailman/listinfo PATH /sbin:/usr/sbin:/bin:/usr/bin:/usr/X11R6/bin QUERY_STRING SCRIPT_FILENAME /home/mailman/cgi-bin/listinfo HTTP_HOST lists.essential.org REQUEST_METHOD GET SERVER_SIGNATURE Apache/1.3.14 Server at lists.essential.org Port 80 SCRIPT_NAME /mailman/listinfo SERVER_ADMIN root at localhost SERVER_SOFTWARE Apache/1.3.14 (Unix) (Red-Hat/Linux) mod_perl/1.23 PYTHONPATH /home/mailman SERVER_PROTOCOL HTTP/1.0 REMOTE_PORT 2936 ---- 8<------- cut here ----------> tail -------------- cut here ---->8 ---< head Bug in Mailman version 1.1 We're sorry, we hit a bug! If you would like to help us identify the problem, please email a copy of this page to the webmaster for this site with a description of what happened. Thanks! Traceback: Traceback (innermost last): File "/home/mailman/scripts/driver", line 112, in run_main main() File "/home/mailman/Mailman/Cgi/listinfo.py", line 40, in main FormatListinfoOverview() File "/home/mailman/Mailman/Cgi/listinfo.py", line 88, in FormatListinfoOverview l = MailList.MailList(n, lock = 0) File "/home/mailman/Mailman/MailList.py", line 62, in __init__ self.Load() File "/home/mailman/Mailman/MailList.py", line 824, in Load self.CheckValues() File "/home/mailman/Mailman/MailList.py", line 853, in CheckValues if self.web_page_url and self.web_page_url[-1] != '/': AttributeError: web_page_url Environment variables: Variable Value DOCUMENT_ROOT /home/listproc/httpd/html SERVER_ADDR 216.0.124.17 HTTP_ACCEPT_ENCODING gzip SERVER_PORT 80 REMOTE_ADDR 216.0.124.17 SERVER_SOFTWARE Apache/1.3.12 (Unix) (Red Hat/Linux) mod_perl/1.23 GATEWAY_INTERFACE CGI/1.1 HTTP_ACCEPT_LANGUAGE en REMOTE_PORT 1464 SERVER_NAME lists.essential.org HTTP_CONNECTION Keep-Alive HTTP_USER_AGENT Mozilla/4.75 [en] (X11; U; Linux 2.2.14-12 i586; Nav) HTTP_ACCEPT_CHARSET iso-8859-1,*,utf-8 HTTP_ACCEPT image/gif, image/x-xbitmap, image/jpeg, image/pjpeg, image/png, */* REQUEST_URI /mailman/listinfo PATH /sbin:/usr/sbin:/bin:/usr/bin:/usr/X11R6/bin QUERY_STRING SERVER_PROTOCOL HTTP/1.0 HTTP_HOST lists.essential.org REQUEST_METHOD GET SERVER_SIGNATURE Apache/1.3.12 Server at lists.essential.org Port 80 SCRIPT_NAME /mailman/listinfo SERVER_ADMIN root at localhost SCRIPT_FILENAME /home/mailman/cgi-bin/listinfo PYTHONPATH /home/mailman HTTP_REFERER http://lists.essential.org/ HTTP_PRAGMA no-cache ---- 8<------- cut here ----------> tail jam From gconnor at nekodojo.org Sun Nov 12 06:55:49 2000 From: gconnor at nekodojo.org (Greg Connor) Date: Sat, 11 Nov 2000 21:55:49 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Upgrade to 2.0rc2 destroyed some archives Message-ID: <3A0E30E5.1E30200E@nekodojo.org> After upgrading, some of my archives are now "corrupt" according to qrunner, and looks like additional messages are not being archived. This is the message from the error log that suggests archiving is not working. Nov 11 17:18:34 2000 qrunner(5155): Traceback (innermost last): Nov 11 17:18:34 2000 qrunner(5155): File "/home/mailman/Mailman/Archiver/Archiver.py", line 221, i n ArchiveMail Nov 11 17:18:34 2000 qrunner(5155): h.processUnixMailbox(f, HyperArch.Article) Nov 11 17:18:34 2000 qrunner(5155): File "/home/mailman/Mailman/Archiver/pipermail.py", line 521, in processUnixMailbox Nov 11 17:18:34 2000 qrunner(5155): a = articleClass(m, self.sequence) Nov 11 17:18:34 2000 qrunner(5155): File "/home/mailman/Mailman/Archiver/HyperArch.py", line 224, in __init__ Nov 11 17:18:34 2000 qrunner(5155): self.cenc = string.lower(cenc) Nov 11 17:18:34 2000 qrunner(5155): TypeError: read-only character buffer, None Nov 11 17:18:34 2000 (5155) CORRUPT ARCHIVE FOR LIST: poly-listowners I have tried to rebuild the archives, but I get a similar error (see below). Unfortunately, due to stupidity on my part, I deleted all the .mbox files and directories, thinking "What are these doing here, I thought I turned off 'mbox' archiving a long time ago". I didn't realize at the time, but "update" probably re-created these (since they aren't in my backup). Anyway, I tried to regenerate the mbox files by doing gunzip *.txt.gz cat *.txt > ../listname.mbox/listname.mbox and then moving the directory and re-running bin/arch. When I do that, it thinks about it for a while, and then I get this error. bin/arch creates a directory but there are no files inside. Traceback (innermost last): File "/home/mailman/bin/arch", line 129, in ? main() File "/home/mailman/bin/arch", line 118, in main archiver.processUnixMailbox(fp, Article) File "/home/mailman/Mailman/Archiver/pipermail.py", line 521, in processUnixMailbox a = articleClass(m, self.sequence) File "/home/mailman/Mailman/Archiver/HyperArch.py", line 224, in __init__ self.cenc = string.lower(cenc) TypeError: read-only character buffer, None I am still working on trying to get my archives back, but I wanted to put the word out in case this is a new issue. I searched the entire archive and I couldn't find any reference to self.cenc or string.lower(cenc). I have also tried padding each .txt file with one newline (even tried two) and the results are the same. If you happen to know how I can make the archives usable again, or how to rebuild the archives, help would be appreciated. My only thing left to try is to restore mailman from backup and try the upgrade again, but the rest of the upgrade was quite painful... Thanks gregc -- Greg Connor From gconnor at nekodojo.org Sun Nov 12 09:21:28 2000 From: gconnor at nekodojo.org (Greg Connor) Date: Sun, 12 Nov 2000 00:21:28 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Resolved: Upgrade to 2.0rc2 destroyed some archives References: <3A0E30E5.1E30200E@nekodojo.org> Message-ID: <3A0E5308.507577C3@nekodojo.org> Greg Connor wrote: > > After upgrading, some of my archives are now "corrupt" according to > qrunner, and looks like additional messages are not being archived. > This is the message from the error log that suggests archiving is not > working. OK, it looks like my initial analysis was not quite correct... the "CORRUPT" message seems to have been spurious and archives were actually working. Details follow... I restored my mailmail 1.1 directory from backup and performed the upgrade to 2.0rc2 again. This time, I got the same message suggesting the archive was corrupted: > Nov 11 23:23:10 2000 qrunner(10590): OSError: [Errno 2] No such file or directory: '/home/mailman/archives/private/poly-listowners.mbox/poly-listowners.mbox' > Nov 11 23:23:10 2000 (10590) CORRUPT ARCHIVE FOR LIST: poly-listowners But, it looks like the message was archived properly anyway. According to my mm_cfg.py setting "ARCHIVE_TO_MBOX = 0", the message was NOT supposed to be added to the mbox file, but HyperArch.py still throws an error that says "No such file or directory" for the mbox file. This implies that the mbox file must exist, even if you don't plan to add to it, but in my case, the only side effect is a spurious error message (and the message is still archived to the hypermail archive directory.) I created the mbox file and confirmed that ARCHIVE_TO_MBOX = 0 is still obeyed - nothing is added to the mbox file I decided to change back to ARCHIVE_TO_MBOX = 2, so I would get mbox files growing again, and this works too. It now seems like the only impact was the spurious message if we don't have mbox files and don't intend to use them. Regarding the previous error: > Nov 11 17:18:34 2000 qrunner(5155): File "/home/mailman/Mailman/Archiver/HyperArch.py", line 224, in __init__ > Nov 11 17:18:34 2000 qrunner(5155): self.cenc = string.lower(cenc) > Nov 11 17:18:34 2000 qrunner(5155): TypeError: read-only character buffer, None I tried the operation again with a proper "mbox" file, and the behavior was correct. I don't know what was wrong with the mbox file I made by sticking the .txt files all together. I now don't need to regenerate the mbox files... the above error was only encountered in my attempt to fix the first error message. I would still like to know how to create the mbox file again from the contents of the pipermail directory, but since archives are working correctly there is not so much need for this. I would only need to regenerate the mbox file if I want to delete some messages from the archive or something (or to have a second copy in case pipermail gets corrupted.) If anyone is interested in the details of what I did, I'm posting a log of the second upgrade operation: http://www.nekodojo.org/~gconnor/Mailman_20rc2_update_log.txt -- Greg Connor From gconnor at nekodojo.org Sun Nov 12 09:35:44 2000 From: gconnor at nekodojo.org (Greg Connor) Date: Sun, 12 Nov 2000 00:35:44 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] 2.0rc2 upgrade FAILS if lists have pending requests Message-ID: <3A0E5660.C5B26AA9@nekodojo.org> Error: "make update" and "make install" fail when there are pending requests. I got this message while updating from Mailman 1.1 to 2.0rc2 % make install ... Updating mailing list: poly-houston - updating old private mbox file looks like you have a really recent CVS installation... you're either one brave soul, or you already ran me - updating old public mbox file Updating mailing list: poly-under30 Traceback (innermost last): File "bin/update", line 350, in ? errors = main() File "bin/update", line 281, in main errors = errors + dolist(listname) File "bin/update", line 79, in dolist mlist = MailList.MailList(listname, lock=0) File "/home/mailman/Mailman/MailList.py", line 79, in __init__ self.Load() File "/home/mailman/Mailman/MailList.py", line 906, in Load self.CheckVersion(dict) File "/home/mailman/Mailman/MailList.py", line 917, in CheckVersion Update(self, stored_state) File "/home/mailman/Mailman/versions.py", line 54, in Update NewRequestsDatabase(l) File "/home/mailman/Mailman/versions.py", line 247, in NewRequestsDatabase l.HoldMessage(msg, reason) File "/home/mailman/Mailman/ListAdmin.py", line 145, in HoldMessage self.__opendb() File "/home/mailman/Mailman/ListAdmin.py", line 66, in __opendb assert self.Locked() and self.__filename AssertionError At this point, make install has failed while running update, and I have tried running check_perms, and fixing some errors, but running update again gives the same error. My workaround: I turned apache back on and I used the mailman/admindb form to respond to all the pending requests. (I tried this because the traceback says "NewRequestsDatabase" so this made me think it could not convert existing pending requests. Also, other lists went through "Updating" ok, and they didn't have pending requests.) After clearing the requests, make update got a bit further (to the next lists with pending requests) I cleared that one too, and the update was able to complete on the third try. I'm discarding the requests, but I think one could approve at this point too. Most everything is installed, but since sendmail isn't running, the message would probably just queue up for qrunner... If anyone is interested in the details of what I did, I'm posting a log of the second upgrade operation: http://www.nekodojo.org/~gconnor/Mailman_20rc2_update_log.txt Suggested fix: If possible, make it so that upgrading doesn't die if requests are pending. However, if the requests can't be converted, Mailman's install should deal with this gracefully and tell the user what needs to be done. If this can't be resolved, I suggest a note in the release notes telling peole that they have to clean out the administrative requests db for ALL lists before doing the upgrade. This is awkward because often the person approving the message is not the same person who is installing Mailman 2. -- Greg Connor From camp at bigfoot.com Sun Nov 12 15:57:48 2000 From: camp at bigfoot.com (John Camp) Date: Sun, 12 Nov 2000 14:57:48 +0000 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Archive headers Message-ID: <5.0.0.25.2.20001112145507.00a16a50@relay05.indigo.ie> Why should some archived messages be shown as having been sent by the list-address? This has started since rc1. John Camp From midnight at the-oasis.net Sun Nov 12 16:03:15 2000 From: midnight at the-oasis.net (Phil Barnett) Date: Sun, 12 Nov 2000 10:03:15 -0500 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Re: [Mailman-Developers] Announcing Mailman 2.0 release candidate 2 In-Reply-To: <14860.51685.368139.841987@anthem.concentric.net> Message-ID: <3A0E6AE3.10068.1DD45FA@localhost> On 10 Nov 2000, at 23:24, Barry A. Warsaw wrote: > Please let me know if you find any errors in the docs. Unless > something's royally screwed, those are the only changes I'll make > before 2.0 final. Plan for that one week from today: Friday November > 17th. I hope you'll also accepts bugs found in the program. ;-) (I posted this last night, but didn't see it in the list, so I'm posting it again) I upgraded from 2.0b6 from 2.0rc2 Friday night. A person wrote me and said the replyto: is no longer pointed to the list. I checked several messages and they were, but some were not. Any message I send to the list has a replyto of myself instead of to the list. Here is a mail message from before and one right after the change. Notice that on the first one the replyto is set to the list and the second one it's set to myself. I checked the list checkbox and it's still set to replyto the list. -------------Before-------------- Return-Path: Delivered-To: the-oasis-net- midnight at the-oasis.net Received: (qmail 11516 invoked from network); 11 Nov 2000 05:41:04 -0000 Received: from ns.dios.net (HELO taz2.fiberhosting.com) (mailman at 127.0.0.1) by ns.dios.net with SMTP; 11 Nov 2000 05:41:04 -0000 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mailman- harbourtalk at lists.harbour-project.org Received: (qmail 11475 invoked from network); 11 Nov 2000 05:40:06 -0000 Received: from max1- 221.mtld.fl.iag.net (HELO odo) (207.30.74.221) by taz.fiberhosting.com with SMTP; 11 Nov 2000 05:40:06 -0000 From: "Phil Barnett" To: harbourtalk at lists.harbour- project.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US- ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Message-ID: <3A0C9560.428.22A641 at localhost> Priority: normal X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v3.12c) Subject: [HarbourTalk] Mailman Upgrade. Sender: harbourtalk- admin at lists.harbour-project.org Errors-To: harbourtalk- admin at lists.harbour-project.org X-BeenThere: harbourtalk at lists.harbour- project.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.0beta6 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: harbourtalk at lists.harbour- project.org List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: General Talk about the Harbour Project List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: http://www.matrixlist.com/pipermail/har bourtalk/ Date: Sat, 11 Nov 2000 00:40:00 -0500 I am going to perform a Mailman upgrade to 2.0rc2. I'm configuring it and make-ing it tonight. There may be a slight delay for some messages. I'll be sending test messages during this test to Harbour Talk when I get it back up, and a notice here when the upgrade is done. If you see anything funny after that notice, please report it to me immediately. I'll do what I can even up to reverting to the prior version if necessary. Hopefully, it will upgrade nicely. -- Phil Barnett mailto:midnight at the-oasis.net WWW http://www.the-oasis.net/ FTP Site ftp://ftp.the-oasis.net _______________________________________ ________ HarbourTalk mailing list HarbourTalk at lists.harbour-project.org http://www.matrixlist.com/mailman/listi nfo/harbourtalk -------------After---------------- Return-Path: Delivered-To: the-oasis-net-midnight at the-oasis.net Received: (qmail 13034 invoked from network); 11 Nov 2000 05:51:04 -0000 Received: from ns.dios.net (HELO taz2.fiberhosting.com) (mailman at 127.0.0.1) by ns.dios.net with SMTP; 11 Nov 2000 05:51:04 -0000 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mailman-harbourtalk at lists.harbour-project.org Received: (qmail 13012 invoked from network); 11 Nov 2000 05:50:50 -0000 Received: from max1-221.mtld.fl.iag.net (HELO odo) (207.30.74.221) by taz.fiberhosting.com with SMTP; 11 Nov 2000 05:50:50 -0000 From: "Phil Barnett" To: harbourtalk at lists.harbour-project.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Subject: Re: [HarbourTalk] Mailman Upgrade. Reply-to: midnight at the-oasis.net Message-ID: <3A0C97E5.1835.2C7BDB at localhost> Priority: normal In-reply-to: <3A0C9560.428.22A641 at localhost> X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v3.12c) Sender: harbourtalk-admin at lists.harbour-project.org Errors-To: harbourtalk-admin at lists.harbour-project.org X-BeenThere: harbourtalk at lists.harbour-project.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.0rc2 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: General Talk about the Harbour Project List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Date: Sat, 11 Nov 2000 00:50:45 -0500 Ok, this is a test on Mailman 2.0rc2. -- Phil Barnett mailto:midnight at the-oasis.net WWW http://www.the-oasis.net/ FTP Site ftp://ftp.the-oasis.net _______________________________________________ HarbourTalk mailing list HarbourTalk at lists.harbour-project.org http://www.matrixlist.com/mailman/listinfo/harbourtalk -- Phil Barnett mailto:midnight at the-oasis.net WWW http://www.the-oasis.net/ FTP Site ftp://ftp.the-oasis.net From alex at phred.org Sun Nov 12 18:36:28 2000 From: alex at phred.org (alex wetmore) Date: Sun, 12 Nov 2000 09:36:28 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Mailman-Users] Re: Demime is what's killing my archives!!! In-Reply-To: <3238082517.973900691@[192.168.0.2]> Message-ID: There is another option, which is to use my stripmime tool. This doesn't eat the envelope header. http://www.phred.org/~alex/stripmime.pl alex On Fri, 10 Nov 2000, Tom Neff wrote: > Yes, demime eats the envelope From_ header. You have three options: > > [1] Wrap demime in a script that strips, saves and restores the From_ > line, like > > { read fl ; demime - | { echo $fl ; cat ; } ; } > > [2] use the -f1 switch to reformail(8), the tool supplied with maildrop(8). > > demime - | reformail -f1 > > [3] Hack demime. It's just a Perl script. > > --On Friday, November 10, 2000 11:27 PM -0500 > mailman-users-request at python.org wrote: > > > Demime is what's killing my archives!!! > > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------ > Mailman-Users maillist - Mailman-Users at python.org > http://www.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users > From dneary at auctionwatch.com Sun Nov 12 19:03:56 2000 From: dneary at auctionwatch.com (Dan Neary) Date: Sun, 12 Nov 2000 10:03:56 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] unsubscribe please Message-ID: <5179B27750A9D411B968009027E06E27015A79@exback.corp.auctionwatch.com> -----Original Message----- From: mailman-users-request at python.org [mailto:mailman-users-request at python.org] Sent: Sunday, November 12, 2000 9:02 AM To: mailman-users at python.org Subject: Mailman-Users digest, Vol 1 #864 - 6 msgs Send Mailman-Users mailing list submissions to mailman-users at python.org To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit http://www.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to mailman-users-request at python.org You can reach the person managing the list at mailman-users-admin at python.org When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific than "Re: Contents of Mailman-Users digest..." Today's Topics: 1. Help: AttributeError: web_page_url (John A. Martin) 2. Upgrade to 2.0rc2 destroyed some archives (Greg Connor) 3. Resolved: Upgrade to 2.0rc2 destroyed some archives (Greg Connor) 4. 2.0rc2 upgrade FAILS if lists have pending requests (Greg Connor) 5. Archive headers (John Camp) 6. Re: [Mailman-Developers] Announcing Mailman 2.0 release candidate 2 (Phil Barnett) --__--__-- Message: 1 To: Mailman-Users at python.org Date: Sat, 11 Nov 2000 14:56:06 -0500 From: "John A. Martin" Subject: [Mailman-Users] Help: AttributeError: web_page_url After upgrading apache from the Red Hat 6.2 apache-1.3.12-2.i386.rpm to apache-1.3.14-2.6.2.i386.rpm it seems to be impossible to access the Mailman web interface. Other stuff on the web site is OK. I do not believe apache's /etc/httpd/conf/httpd.conf was changed with respect to the entries pertaining to Mailman. No joy reverting back to the apache-1.3.12-2 package. Several tracebacks are logged leading back to 'AttributeError: web_page_url'. This Mailman has been in production for about a year. The Mailman web interface is now down and I don't have a clue. -------------- cut here ---->8 ---< head Bug in Mailman version 1.1 We're sorry, we hit a bug! If you would like to help us identify the problem, please email a copy of this page to the webmaster for this site with a description of what happened. Thanks! Traceback: Traceback (innermost last): File "/home/mailman/scripts/driver", line 112, in run_main main() File "/home/mailman/Mailman/Cgi/listinfo.py", line 40, in main FormatListinfoOverview() File "/home/mailman/Mailman/Cgi/listinfo.py", line 88, in FormatListinfoOverview l = MailList.MailList(n, lock = 0) File "/home/mailman/Mailman/MailList.py", line 62, in __init__ self.Load() File "/home/mailman/Mailman/MailList.py", line 824, in Load self.CheckValues() File "/home/mailman/Mailman/MailList.py", line 853, in CheckValues if self.web_page_url and self.web_page_url[-1] != '/': AttributeError: web_page_url Environment variables: Variable Value DOCUMENT_ROOT /home SERVER_ADDR 216.0.124.17 HTTP_ACCEPT_ENCODING gzip SERVER_PORT 80 GATEWAY_INTERFACE CGI/1.1 HTTP_ACCEPT_LANGUAGE en REMOTE_ADDR 216.0.124.17 SERVER_NAME lists.essential.org HTTP_CONNECTION Keep-Alive HTTP_USER_AGENT Mozilla/4.75 [en] (X11; U; Linux 2.2.14-12 i586; Nav) HTTP_ACCEPT_CHARSET iso-8859-1,*,utf-8 HTTP_ACCEPT image/gif, image/x-xbitmap, image/jpeg, image/pjpeg, image/png, */* REQUEST_URI /mailman/listinfo PATH /sbin:/usr/sbin:/bin:/usr/bin:/usr/X11R6/bin QUERY_STRING SCRIPT_FILENAME /home/mailman/cgi-bin/listinfo HTTP_HOST lists.essential.org REQUEST_METHOD GET SERVER_SIGNATURE Apache/1.3.14 Server at lists.essential.org Port 80 SCRIPT_NAME /mailman/listinfo SERVER_ADMIN root at localhost SERVER_SOFTWARE Apache/1.3.14 (Unix) (Red-Hat/Linux) mod_perl/1.23 PYTHONPATH /home/mailman SERVER_PROTOCOL HTTP/1.0 REMOTE_PORT 2936 ---- 8<------- cut here ----------> tail -------------- cut here ---->8 ---< head Bug in Mailman version 1.1 We're sorry, we hit a bug! If you would like to help us identify the problem, please email a copy of this page to the webmaster for this site with a description of what happened. Thanks! Traceback: Traceback (innermost last): File "/home/mailman/scripts/driver", line 112, in run_main main() File "/home/mailman/Mailman/Cgi/listinfo.py", line 40, in main FormatListinfoOverview() File "/home/mailman/Mailman/Cgi/listinfo.py", line 88, in FormatListinfoOverview l = MailList.MailList(n, lock = 0) File "/home/mailman/Mailman/MailList.py", line 62, in __init__ self.Load() File "/home/mailman/Mailman/MailList.py", line 824, in Load self.CheckValues() File "/home/mailman/Mailman/MailList.py", line 853, in CheckValues if self.web_page_url and self.web_page_url[-1] != '/': AttributeError: web_page_url Environment variables: Variable Value DOCUMENT_ROOT /home/listproc/httpd/html SERVER_ADDR 216.0.124.17 HTTP_ACCEPT_ENCODING gzip SERVER_PORT 80 REMOTE_ADDR 216.0.124.17 SERVER_SOFTWARE Apache/1.3.12 (Unix) (Red Hat/Linux) mod_perl/1.23 GATEWAY_INTERFACE CGI/1.1 HTTP_ACCEPT_LANGUAGE en REMOTE_PORT 1464 SERVER_NAME lists.essential.org HTTP_CONNECTION Keep-Alive HTTP_USER_AGENT Mozilla/4.75 [en] (X11; U; Linux 2.2.14-12 i586; Nav) HTTP_ACCEPT_CHARSET iso-8859-1,*,utf-8 HTTP_ACCEPT image/gif, image/x-xbitmap, image/jpeg, image/pjpeg, image/png, */* REQUEST_URI /mailman/listinfo PATH /sbin:/usr/sbin:/bin:/usr/bin:/usr/X11R6/bin QUERY_STRING SERVER_PROTOCOL HTTP/1.0 HTTP_HOST lists.essential.org REQUEST_METHOD GET SERVER_SIGNATURE Apache/1.3.12 Server at lists.essential.org Port 80 SCRIPT_NAME /mailman/listinfo SERVER_ADMIN root at localhost SCRIPT_FILENAME /home/mailman/cgi-bin/listinfo PYTHONPATH /home/mailman HTTP_REFERER http://lists.essential.org/ HTTP_PRAGMA no-cache ---- 8<------- cut here ----------> tail jam --__--__-- Message: 2 Date: Sat, 11 Nov 2000 21:55:49 -0800 From: Greg Connor To: mailman-users at python.org Subject: [Mailman-Users] Upgrade to 2.0rc2 destroyed some archives After upgrading, some of my archives are now "corrupt" according to qrunner, and looks like additional messages are not being archived. This is the message from the error log that suggests archiving is not working. Nov 11 17:18:34 2000 qrunner(5155): Traceback (innermost last): Nov 11 17:18:34 2000 qrunner(5155): File "/home/mailman/Mailman/Archiver/Archiver.py", line 221, i n ArchiveMail Nov 11 17:18:34 2000 qrunner(5155): h.processUnixMailbox(f, HyperArch.Article) Nov 11 17:18:34 2000 qrunner(5155): File "/home/mailman/Mailman/Archiver/pipermail.py", line 521, in processUnixMailbox Nov 11 17:18:34 2000 qrunner(5155): a = articleClass(m, self.sequence) Nov 11 17:18:34 2000 qrunner(5155): File "/home/mailman/Mailman/Archiver/HyperArch.py", line 224, in __init__ Nov 11 17:18:34 2000 qrunner(5155): self.cenc = string.lower(cenc) Nov 11 17:18:34 2000 qrunner(5155): TypeError: read-only character buffer, None Nov 11 17:18:34 2000 (5155) CORRUPT ARCHIVE FOR LIST: poly-listowners I have tried to rebuild the archives, but I get a similar error (see below). Unfortunately, due to stupidity on my part, I deleted all the .mbox files and directories, thinking "What are these doing here, I thought I turned off 'mbox' archiving a long time ago". I didn't realize at the time, but "update" probably re-created these (since they aren't in my backup). Anyway, I tried to regenerate the mbox files by doing gunzip *.txt.gz cat *.txt > ../listname.mbox/listname.mbox and then moving the directory and re-running bin/arch. When I do that, it thinks about it for a while, and then I get this error. bin/arch creates a directory but there are no files inside. Traceback (innermost last): File "/home/mailman/bin/arch", line 129, in ? main() File "/home/mailman/bin/arch", line 118, in main archiver.processUnixMailbox(fp, Article) File "/home/mailman/Mailman/Archiver/pipermail.py", line 521, in processUnixMailbox a = articleClass(m, self.sequence) File "/home/mailman/Mailman/Archiver/HyperArch.py", line 224, in __init__ self.cenc = string.lower(cenc) TypeError: read-only character buffer, None I am still working on trying to get my archives back, but I wanted to put the word out in case this is a new issue. I searched the entire archive and I couldn't find any reference to self.cenc or string.lower(cenc). I have also tried padding each .txt file with one newline (even tried two) and the results are the same. If you happen to know how I can make the archives usable again, or how to rebuild the archives, help would be appreciated. My only thing left to try is to restore mailman from backup and try the upgrade again, but the rest of the upgrade was quite painful... Thanks gregc -- Greg Connor --__--__-- Message: 3 Date: Sun, 12 Nov 2000 00:21:28 -0800 From: Greg Connor To: mailman-users at python.org Subject: [Mailman-Users] Resolved: Upgrade to 2.0rc2 destroyed some archives Greg Connor wrote: > > After upgrading, some of my archives are now "corrupt" according to > qrunner, and looks like additional messages are not being archived. > This is the message from the error log that suggests archiving is not > working. OK, it looks like my initial analysis was not quite correct... the "CORRUPT" message seems to have been spurious and archives were actually working. Details follow... I restored my mailmail 1.1 directory from backup and performed the upgrade to 2.0rc2 again. This time, I got the same message suggesting the archive was corrupted: > Nov 11 23:23:10 2000 qrunner(10590): OSError: [Errno 2] No such file or directory: '/home/mailman/archives/private/poly-listowners.mbox/poly-listowners.mbox' > Nov 11 23:23:10 2000 (10590) CORRUPT ARCHIVE FOR LIST: poly-listowners But, it looks like the message was archived properly anyway. According to my mm_cfg.py setting "ARCHIVE_TO_MBOX = 0", the message was NOT supposed to be added to the mbox file, but HyperArch.py still throws an error that says "No such file or directory" for the mbox file. This implies that the mbox file must exist, even if you don't plan to add to it, but in my case, the only side effect is a spurious error message (and the message is still archived to the hypermail archive directory.) I created the mbox file and confirmed that ARCHIVE_TO_MBOX = 0 is still obeyed - nothing is added to the mbox file I decided to change back to ARCHIVE_TO_MBOX = 2, so I would get mbox files growing again, and this works too. It now seems like the only impact was the spurious message if we don't have mbox files and don't intend to use them. Regarding the previous error: > Nov 11 17:18:34 2000 qrunner(5155): File "/home/mailman/Mailman/Archiver/HyperArch.py", line 224, in __init__ > Nov 11 17:18:34 2000 qrunner(5155): self.cenc = string.lower(cenc) > Nov 11 17:18:34 2000 qrunner(5155): TypeError: read-only character buffer, None I tried the operation again with a proper "mbox" file, and the behavior was correct. I don't know what was wrong with the mbox file I made by sticking the .txt files all together. I now don't need to regenerate the mbox files... the above error was only encountered in my attempt to fix the first error message. I would still like to know how to create the mbox file again from the contents of the pipermail directory, but since archives are working correctly there is not so much need for this. I would only need to regenerate the mbox file if I want to delete some messages from the archive or something (or to have a second copy in case pipermail gets corrupted.) If anyone is interested in the details of what I did, I'm posting a log of the second upgrade operation: http://www.nekodojo.org/~gconnor/Mailman_20rc2_update_log.txt -- Greg Connor --__--__-- Message: 4 Date: Sun, 12 Nov 2000 00:35:44 -0800 From: Greg Connor To: mailman-users at python.org Subject: [Mailman-Users] 2.0rc2 upgrade FAILS if lists have pending requests Error: "make update" and "make install" fail when there are pending requests. I got this message while updating from Mailman 1.1 to 2.0rc2 % make install ... Updating mailing list: poly-houston - updating old private mbox file looks like you have a really recent CVS installation... you're either one brave soul, or you already ran me - updating old public mbox file Updating mailing list: poly-under30 Traceback (innermost last): File "bin/update", line 350, in ? errors = main() File "bin/update", line 281, in main errors = errors + dolist(listname) File "bin/update", line 79, in dolist mlist = MailList.MailList(listname, lock=0) File "/home/mailman/Mailman/MailList.py", line 79, in __init__ self.Load() File "/home/mailman/Mailman/MailList.py", line 906, in Load self.CheckVersion(dict) File "/home/mailman/Mailman/MailList.py", line 917, in CheckVersion Update(self, stored_state) File "/home/mailman/Mailman/versions.py", line 54, in Update NewRequestsDatabase(l) File "/home/mailman/Mailman/versions.py", line 247, in NewRequestsDatabase l.HoldMessage(msg, reason) File "/home/mailman/Mailman/ListAdmin.py", line 145, in HoldMessage self.__opendb() File "/home/mailman/Mailman/ListAdmin.py", line 66, in __opendb assert self.Locked() and self.__filename AssertionError At this point, make install has failed while running update, and I have tried running check_perms, and fixing some errors, but running update again gives the same error. My workaround: I turned apache back on and I used the mailman/admindb form to respond to all the pending requests. (I tried this because the traceback says "NewRequestsDatabase" so this made me think it could not convert existing pending requests. Also, other lists went through "Updating" ok, and they didn't have pending requests.) After clearing the requests, make update got a bit further (to the next lists with pending requests) I cleared that one too, and the update was able to complete on the third try. I'm discarding the requests, but I think one could approve at this point too. Most everything is installed, but since sendmail isn't running, the message would probably just queue up for qrunner... If anyone is interested in the details of what I did, I'm posting a log of the second upgrade operation: http://www.nekodojo.org/~gconnor/Mailman_20rc2_update_log.txt Suggested fix: If possible, make it so that upgrading doesn't die if requests are pending. However, if the requests can't be converted, Mailman's install should deal with this gracefully and tell the user what needs to be done. If this can't be resolved, I suggest a note in the release notes telling peole that they have to clean out the administrative requests db for ALL lists before doing the upgrade. This is awkward because often the person approving the message is not the same person who is installing Mailman 2. -- Greg Connor --__--__-- Message: 5 Date: Sun, 12 Nov 2000 14:57:48 +0000 To: mailman-users at python.org From: John Camp Subject: [Mailman-Users] Archive headers Why should some archived messages be shown as having been sent by the list-address? This has started since rc1. John Camp --__--__-- Message: 6 From: "Phil Barnett" To: mailman-developers-admin at python.org, mailman-users at python.org Date: Sun, 12 Nov 2000 10:03:15 -0500 Reply-To: midnight at the-oasis.net Subject: [Mailman-Users] Re: [Mailman-Developers] Announcing Mailman 2.0 release candidate 2 On 10 Nov 2000, at 23:24, Barry A. Warsaw wrote: > Please let me know if you find any errors in the docs. Unless > something's royally screwed, those are the only changes I'll make > before 2.0 final. Plan for that one week from today: Friday November > 17th. I hope you'll also accepts bugs found in the program. ;-) (I posted this last night, but didn't see it in the list, so I'm posting it again) I upgraded from 2.0b6 from 2.0rc2 Friday night. A person wrote me and said the replyto: is no longer pointed to the list. I checked several messages and they were, but some were not. Any message I send to the list has a replyto of myself instead of to the list. Here is a mail message from before and one right after the change. Notice that on the first one the replyto is set to the list and the second one it's set to myself. I checked the list checkbox and it's still set to replyto the list. -------------Before-------------- Return-Path: Delivered-To: the-oasis-net- midnight at the-oasis.net Received: (qmail 11516 invoked from network); 11 Nov 2000 05:41:04 -0000 Received: from ns.dios.net (HELO taz2.fiberhosting.com) (mailman at 127.0.0.1) by ns.dios.net with SMTP; 11 Nov 2000 05:41:04 -0000 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mailman- harbourtalk at lists.harbour-project.org Received: (qmail 11475 invoked from network); 11 Nov 2000 05:40:06 -0000 Received: from max1- 221.mtld.fl.iag.net (HELO odo) (207.30.74.221) by taz.fiberhosting.com with SMTP; 11 Nov 2000 05:40:06 -0000 From: "Phil Barnett" To: harbourtalk at lists.harbour- project.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US- ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Message-ID: <3A0C9560.428.22A641 at localhost> Priority: normal X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v3.12c) Subject: [HarbourTalk] Mailman Upgrade. Sender: harbourtalk- admin at lists.harbour-project.org Errors-To: harbourtalk- admin at lists.harbour-project.org X-BeenThere: harbourtalk at lists.harbour- project.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.0beta6 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: harbourtalk at lists.harbour- project.org List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: General Talk about the Harbour Project List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: http://www.matrixlist.com/pipermail/har bourtalk/ Date: Sat, 11 Nov 2000 00:40:00 -0500 I am going to perform a Mailman upgrade to 2.0rc2. I'm configuring it and make-ing it tonight. There may be a slight delay for some messages. I'll be sending test messages during this test to Harbour Talk when I get it back up, and a notice here when the upgrade is done. If you see anything funny after that notice, please report it to me immediately. I'll do what I can even up to reverting to the prior version if necessary. Hopefully, it will upgrade nicely. -- Phil Barnett mailto:midnight at the-oasis.net WWW http://www.the-oasis.net/ FTP Site ftp://ftp.the-oasis.net _______________________________________ ________ HarbourTalk mailing list HarbourTalk at lists.harbour-project.org http://www.matrixlist.com/mailman/listi nfo/harbourtalk -------------After---------------- Return-Path: Delivered-To: the-oasis-net-midnight at the-oasis.net Received: (qmail 13034 invoked from network); 11 Nov 2000 05:51:04 -0000 Received: from ns.dios.net (HELO taz2.fiberhosting.com) (mailman at 127.0.0.1) by ns.dios.net with SMTP; 11 Nov 2000 05:51:04 -0000 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mailman-harbourtalk at lists.harbour-project.org Received: (qmail 13012 invoked from network); 11 Nov 2000 05:50:50 -0000 Received: from max1-221.mtld.fl.iag.net (HELO odo) (207.30.74.221) by taz.fiberhosting.com with SMTP; 11 Nov 2000 05:50:50 -0000 From: "Phil Barnett" To: harbourtalk at lists.harbour-project.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Subject: Re: [HarbourTalk] Mailman Upgrade. Reply-to: midnight at the-oasis.net Message-ID: <3A0C97E5.1835.2C7BDB at localhost> Priority: normal In-reply-to: <3A0C9560.428.22A641 at localhost> X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v3.12c) Sender: harbourtalk-admin at lists.harbour-project.org Errors-To: harbourtalk-admin at lists.harbour-project.org X-BeenThere: harbourtalk at lists.harbour-project.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.0rc2 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: General Talk about the Harbour Project List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Date: Sat, 11 Nov 2000 00:50:45 -0500 Ok, this is a test on Mailman 2.0rc2. -- Phil Barnett mailto:midnight at the-oasis.net WWW http://www.the-oasis.net/ FTP Site ftp://ftp.the-oasis.net _______________________________________________ HarbourTalk mailing list HarbourTalk at lists.harbour-project.org http://www.matrixlist.com/mailman/listinfo/harbourtalk -- Phil Barnett mailto:midnight at the-oasis.net WWW http://www.the-oasis.net/ FTP Site ftp://ftp.the-oasis.net --__--__-- ------------------------------------------------------ Mailman-Users maillist - Mailman-Users at python.org http://www.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users End of Mailman-Users Digest From njs at scifi.squawk.com Sun Nov 12 16:04:24 2000 From: njs at scifi.squawk.com (Nick Simicich) Date: Sun, 12 Nov 2000 10:04:24 -0500 Subject: [demime-l] Re: [Mailman-Users] Re: Demime is what's killing my archives!!! In-Reply-To: <3A0CDA40.195B6A57@nleaudio.com> References: <3238082517.973900691@[192.168.0.2]> Message-ID: <3.0.3.32.20001112100424.018d4220@127.0.0.1> At 12:33 AM 11/11/2000 -0500, Bob Puff at NLE wrote: > >Thank you, Tom! I didn't have Maildrop, and I'm not familiar enough with Perl to start hacking, but suggestion #1 worked like a charm! Tom's suggestion is a good quick hack, but has a problem. It will hide demime's return code. Demime could generate an error response and no output, and it will just go through. > >It is probably more disk I/O than should be necessary, but I'm also CCing this to the demime list/author, so hopefully it can be fixed there. > >Thanks again! > >Bob > > >Tom Neff wrote: >> >> Yes, demime eats the envelope From_ header. You have three options: >> >> [1] Wrap demime in a script that strips, saves and restores the From_ >> line, like >> >> { read fl ; demime - | { echo $fl ; cat ; } ; } >> >> [2] use the -f1 switch to reformail(8), the tool supplied with maildrop(8). >> >> demime - | reformail -f1 >> >> [3] Hack demime. It's just a Perl script. >> >> --On Friday, November 10, 2000 11:27 PM -0500 >> mailman-users-request at python.org wrote: >> >> > Demime is what's killing my archives!!! >> >> ------------------------------------------------------ >> Mailman-Users maillist - Mailman-Users at python.org >> http://www.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users >- >To unsubscribe, send e-mail with the single word unsubscribe >to demime-l-request at scifi.squawk.com. A digest is available. >To switch, send "set digest" to demime-l-request at scifi.squawk.com. >Web subscription interface is at http://cowboywww.squawk.com/cgi/subscribe-pl > > > -- We will fight for bovine freedom, And hold our large heads high. We will run free, with the buffalo or die! Cows with Guns. - Dana Lyons, Cows With Guns Nick Simicich mailto:njs at scifi.squawk.com http://scifi.squawk.com/njs.html -- Stop by and Light Up The World! From njs at scifi.squawk.com Sun Nov 12 16:01:09 2000 From: njs at scifi.squawk.com (Nick Simicich) Date: Sun, 12 Nov 2000 10:01:09 -0500 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Re: [demime-l] Demime is what's killing my archives!!! In-Reply-To: <3A0CC7EC.10787400@nleaudio.com> References: <3A0647A5.7B09661B@nleaudio.com> <3.0.3.32.20001106090647.0166f790@127.0.0.1> Message-ID: <3.0.3.32.20001112100109.01822008@127.0.0.1> At 11:15 PM 11/10/2000 -0500, Bob Puff at NLE wrote: > >Ok, after a lot of messing around this evening, I found the source of the problem of why my mailman archives stopped working. The problems started exactly when I added DEMIME! > >First, here's my ALIAS file line that calls demime (version 0.97c): > >testlist: "|/home/mailman/mail/demime.pl - |/home/mailman/mail/wrapper post testlist" Try the following: testlist: "|/home/mailman/mail/demime.pl testlist-post" testlist-post: "|/home/mailman/mail/wrapper post testlist" Some mailers, like postfix, will allow you to protect aliases from being sent to off machine. If you have that capability, you can protect testlist-post from being sent to. Yes, I remove the from line. In fact, I always reformat the headers. Passing the mesage back through the MTA will put the from line back. >Now here's what I discovered, after analyzing the headers of the messages that worked, and the ones that didn't. > >The very first line of the header normally starts with "From "... This first line seems to be getting swallowed by demime, even if the message has no HTML / MIME, or anything that needs attention. > >Here are two messages: the first one is WITHOUT demime, and the second is WITH demime installed on my "testlist": > >>From bob at nleaudio.com Fri Nov 10 22:58:44 2000 >Delivered-To: testlist at nlenet.net >Received: from ns.nlenet.net (ns.nlenet.net [64.65.206.24]) > by main.nlenet.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1E08E3BC1 > for ; Fri, 10 Nov 2000 22:58:44 -0500 (EST) >Received: from nleaudio.com (nle.m0.nlenet.net [192.168.2.9]) > by ns.nlenet.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id B297E76FE > for ; Fri, 10 Nov 2000 22:58:43 -0500 (EST) >Message-ID: <3A0CC48D.B305618B at nleaudio.com> >Date: Fri, 10 Nov 2000 23:01:17 -0500 >From: "Bob Puff at NLE" >X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.08 [en] (Win95; I) >MIME-Version: 1.0 >To: testlist at nleaudio.com >Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii >Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit >Subject: [Testlist] test >Sender: testlist-admin at nleaudio.com >Errors-To: testlist-admin at nleaudio.com >X-BeenThere: testlist at nleaudio.com >X-Mailman-Version: 2.0rc1 >Precedence: bulk >Reply-To: testlist at nleaudio.com >List-Post: >List-Subscribe: , > >List-Id: >List-Unsubscribe: , > >List-Archive: > >test without demime > > >Return-Path: >Delivered-To: testlist at nlenet.net >Received: from ns.nlenet.net (ns.nlenet.net [64.65.206.24]) by > main.nlenet.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id A857A3BC1 for > ; Fri, 10 Nov 2000 23:00:49 -0500 (EST) >Received: from nleaudio.com (nle.m0.nlenet.net [192.168.2.9]) by > ns.nlenet.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7526E76FE for > ; Fri, 10 Nov 2000 23:00:49 -0500 (EST) >Message-ID: <3A0CC50B.95E0A94E at nleaudio.com> >Date: Fri, 10 Nov 2000 23:03:23 -0500 >From: "Bob Puff at NLE" >MIME-Version: 1.0 >To: testlist at nleaudio.com >Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii >Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit >Subject: [Testlist] test 2 >Sender: testlist-admin at nleaudio.com >Errors-To: testlist-admin at nleaudio.com >X-BeenThere: testlist at nleaudio.com >X-Mailman-Version: 2.0rc1 >Precedence: bulk >Reply-To: testlist at nleaudio.com >List-Help: >List-Post: >List-Subscribe: , > >List-Id: >List-Unsubscribe: , > >List-Archive: > >test 2 with demime > >=============================================== > >Note that I also tried a blank demime_junkmail.cf file - no difference. >As you can see from these messages, Msg #2 has one line missing at the top compared to message #1. And apparently, Mailman's html archiver looks for that, and needs it to work properly. > >Help! > >Bob >- >To unsubscribe, send e-mail with the single word unsubscribe >to demime-l-request at scifi.squawk.com. A digest is available. >To switch, send "set digest" to demime-l-request at scifi.squawk.com. >Web subscription interface is at http://cowboywww.squawk.com/cgi/subscribe-pl > > > -- We will fight for bovine freedom, And hold our large heads high. We will run free, with the buffalo or die! Cows with Guns. - Dana Lyons, Cows With Guns Nick Simicich mailto:njs at scifi.squawk.com http://scifi.squawk.com/njs.html -- Stop by and Light Up The World! From gconnor at nekodojo.org Sun Nov 12 19:40:56 2000 From: gconnor at nekodojo.org (Greg Connor) Date: Sun, 12 Nov 2000 10:40:56 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Archive headers References: <5.0.0.25.2.20001112145507.00a16a50@relay05.indigo.ie> Message-ID: <3A0EE438.9B3743F8@nekodojo.org> Did you change your alias definitions? Sendmail changes the header for you, if you define aliases for "listname" and "owner-listname" - all messages appear to come from the list owner. I usually just undefine "owner-*" and leave "*-owner" only... this doesn't trigger sendmail "alias owner" behavior. Not sure if this matches your problem, but is easy to workaround if so. John Camp wrote: > Why should some archived messages be shown as having been sent by the > list-address? This has started since rc1. > > John Camp > > ------------------------------------------------------ > Mailman-Users maillist - Mailman-Users at python.org > http://www.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users From bet at rahul.net Sun Nov 12 20:07:49 2000 From: bet at rahul.net (Bennett Todd) Date: Sun, 12 Nov 2000 14:07:49 -0500 Subject: [demime-l] Re: [Mailman-Users] Re: Demime is what's killing my archives!!! In-Reply-To: <3.0.3.32.20001112100424.018d4220@127.0.0.1>; from njs@scifi.squawk.com on Sun, Nov 12, 2000 at 10:04:24AM -0500 References: <3238082517.973900691@[192.168.0.2]> <3A0CDA40.195B6A57@nleaudio.com> <3.0.3.32.20001112100424.018d4220@127.0.0.1> Message-ID: <20001112140749.Z21681@oven.com> 2000-11-12-10:04:24 Nick Simicich: > Tom's suggestion [ wrap demime in something to save the From > line ] is a good quick hack, but has a problem. It will hide > demime's return code. How about if it were coded like listname: "|(read f;echo $f;exec /path/to/demime-)|/path/to/mailman/wrapper ..." Seems to me that wrapping ought to pass the From line along, then leave the rest of the job to demime, with no extra processes left around cluttering up the symbol table, or concealing exit codes. -Bennett -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 240 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://mail.python.org/pipermail/mailman-users/attachments/20001112/f2c3d336/attachment.pgp From bob at nleaudio.com Sun Nov 12 21:47:59 2000 From: bob at nleaudio.com (Bob Puff@NLE) Date: Sun, 12 Nov 2000 15:47:59 -0500 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Upgrade to 2.0rc2 References: <3A0E30E5.1E30200E@nekodojo.org> <3A0E5308.507577C3@nekodojo.org> Message-ID: <3A0F01FF.D84FF695@nleaudio.com> Hello, I am currently using version 2.0rc1. Did the wrapper get updated? I'm wondering if I can simply copy the updated files over without having to do a total re-install. Thanks. Bob From tneff at bigfoot.com Sun Nov 12 23:19:55 2000 From: tneff at bigfoot.com (Tom Neff) Date: Sun, 12 Nov 2000 17:19:55 -0500 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Re: Demime is what's killing my archives!!! In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <3386987061.974049595@[192.168.0.2]> --On Sunday, November 12, 2000 9:36 AM -0800 alex wetmore wrote: > There is another option, which is to use my stripmime tool. This > doesn't eat the envelope header. > > http://www.phred.org/~alex/stripmime.pl Yes, although Alex's script is not quite as full-service as demime, which will deliver text/plain even if the input message ONLY supplies text/html or text/enriched. I will prepare a patch for demime tomorrow. It doesn't look too hard. From ckwong at cuhk.edu.hk Mon Nov 13 09:36:20 2000 From: ckwong at cuhk.edu.hk (Wong Ching Kuen Frederick) Date: Mon, 13 Nov 2000 16:36:20 +0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] approval of subscription Message-ID: <019f01c04d4c$cc097900$5544bd89@econ.cuhk.edu.hk> can admin use email for the approval of subscription instead of the web interface? From jtpjatae at bi.ehu.es Mon Nov 13 10:37:46 2000 From: jtpjatae at bi.ehu.es (Eduardo Jacob) Date: Mon, 13 Nov 2000 10:37:46 +0100 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Bug?: two different addresses get same Database Record In-Reply-To: <200011032218.OAA05438@utopia.west.sun.com> Message-ID: <4.3.2.7.2.20001113103659.00e399d0@158.227.65.40> > > Error Subscribing: > > > > jtpjatae at aintel.bi.ehu.es -- Already a member > > >> > >Yes. But that means that jtpjatae at aintel.bi.ehu.es must be showing >up in list_members, no? No. That's the bug. Eduardo From tib at tigerknight.org Mon Nov 13 12:43:41 2000 From: tib at tigerknight.org (Tib) Date: Mon, 13 Nov 2000 03:43:41 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Mailman-Users] Previous problem with hard links Message-ID: Greetings Programs! I've been futzing with Mailman and trying to get it to work for some time now on this secure kernel, and think I may have stumbled upon something. If it's not new, it's definitely new information to me and a solution I'd not heard of before. I was getting errors of hard links being denied for quite a while and suddenly they stopped. I went through everything I could think of and hit on it by accident again a few test lists later. It's the archives. Public archives on a system with a secure kernel will cause disaster for some reason. After all, if I remember right (which I may be wrong, but hey - I've not had public archives since the first test and not had problems since then either) the public archives are just links to the actual files which are in the private area. Mailman has been working just fine now since I made the archives private - which would make sense to me anyway, can only think of a few reasons why you'd want a mailing list archive accessible to anyone but members anyway. One might also try keeping the subscriber list private - I'm not sure on that one since it's always been a private type setting for me, but hey - who knows. I'm not gonna tinker anymore now that it runs and I don't want to have it crap out on me. Just thought I'd share the knowledge I found that I'd not heard from anyone before :] Take care! Tib From humbert at hagen.de Mon Nov 13 14:47:58 2000 From: humbert at hagen.de (L. Humbert) Date: Mon, 13 Nov 2000 14:47:58 +0100 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Q: Solution to autamatic adminstrate a bunch of new lists Message-ID: <3A0FF10D.650C6FC1@hagen.de> Hi, at our institution for teacher training we are going to give mail-accounts to over 100 persons. We have to set up (pre-administrate) roughly 40 maillists for internal communication and want to use Mailman. Every person will be assigned to three maillists. We are thinking of building the initial lists, every user should _automatic_ be subscribed. The three lists differ from person to person. So what's about the following solution: one entry in the passwd will consist the three lists, a user will automatically subscribed to. Now the questions: How to a) set up automatic (per python-script) all the lists, b) get the users subscribing automatic to the right three lists. This question deals with the problem of scripting Mailman. Please give us some hints how to solve this problem. We have to solve the problem in the next two months. Ludger Humbert From detertj at msoe.edu Mon Nov 13 15:32:58 2000 From: detertj at msoe.edu (Jonathan C. Detert) Date: Mon, 13 Nov 2000 08:32:58 -0600 Subject: [Mailman-Users] /home/mailman/cron/senddigest yields ValueError Message-ID: <20001113083258.C6528@carlisle.msoe.edu> Hello, Can anyone explain what the error shown below means, and how to fix it? Thanks ----- Forwarded message from Cron Daemon ----- From: root at lists.msoe.edu (Cron Daemon) To: mailman at lists.msoe.edu Subject: Cron /usr/bin/python -S /home/mailman/cron/senddigests Date: Sun, 12 Nov 2000 12:00:05 -0600 Message-Id: <200011121800.eACI05I30274 at lists.msoe.edu> Traceback (innermost last): File "/home/mailman/cron/senddigests", line 65, in ? main() File "/home/mailman/cron/senddigests", line 42, in main send_list_digest(mlist) File "/home/mailman/cron/senddigests", line 53, in send_list_digest ToDigest.inject_digest(mlist, digestfile, topicsfile) File "/home/mailman/Mailman/Handlers/ToDigest.py", line 176, in inject_digest msg = digest.asText() File "/home/mailman/Mailman/Handlers/ToDigest.py", line 245, in asText return self.Present(mime=0) File "/home/mailman/Mailman/Handlers/ToDigest.py", line 279, in Present lines.append(self.__mlist.digest_header % self.TemplateRefs()) ValueError: unsupported format character ' ' (0xd) ----- End forwarded message ----- -- Happy Landings, Jon Detert Unix System Administrator, Milwaukee School of Engineering 1025 N. Broadway, Milwaukee, Wisconsin 53202 From tim at maths.tcd.ie Mon Nov 13 17:11:49 2000 From: tim at maths.tcd.ie (tim at maths.tcd.ie) Date: Mon, 13 Nov 2000 16:11:49 +0000 (GMT) Subject: [Mailman-Users] Q: Solution to autamatic adminstrate a bunch of new lists In-Reply-To: <3A0FF10D.650C6FC1@hagen.de> from "L. Humbert" at "Nov 13, 2000 02:47:58 pm" Message-ID: <200011131611.aa43462@boole.maths.tcd.ie> > This question deals with the problem of scripting Mailman. Please give > us some hints how to solve this problem. > We have to solve the problem in the next two months. I didn't understand the question exactly, but I would guess the simplest way is to write a Perl script to write out the members of each list and then run ~mailman/bin/add_members for each list. From edlau at ucf.ics.uci.edu Mon Nov 13 19:30:56 2000 From: edlau at ucf.ics.uci.edu (Edmund Lau) Date: Mon, 13 Nov 2000 10:30:56 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Mailman-Users] Archives failing after upgrade Message-ID: I upgraded Mailman from rc1 to rc2 over the weekend but evidently there were some problems. My web archives for all my lists are failing. Here's a traceback after running bin/arch : --- Traceback (most recent call last): File "./arch", line 129, in ? main() File "./arch", line 118, in main archiver.processUnixMailbox(fp, Article) File "/home/mailman/Mailman/Archiver/pipermail.py", line 521, in processUnixMailbox a = articleClass(m, self.sequence) File "/home/mailman/Mailman/Archiver/HyperArch.py", line 224, in __init__ self.cenc = string.lower(cenc) File "/usr/local/pkg/python-1.6/lib/python1.6/string.py", line 47, in lower return s.lower() AttributeError: 'None' object has no attribute 'lower' --- When qrunner is queueing an Email for a list delievery, there is an extra line of errors in my error log which basically says my archieve is corrupt. The good thing is, nothing is really lost because I can still see them being stored in the mbox file so I can reconstruct them later. I was thinking my situation might be related to what Greg Connor recently went through but our tracebacks are different. At the moment, arch fails on all my lists, whether there were pending requests or not. I went back through the logs and discovered that when I had upgraded there were two lists (out of the 6 I'm running) with admin requests waiting. Anyone with ideas on how to start debugging so I can be back in a "sane" state? Thanks! -Ed From mentor at alb-net.com Mon Nov 13 20:00:40 2000 From: mentor at alb-net.com (Mentor Cana) Date: Mon, 13 Nov 2000 14:00:40 -0500 (EST) Subject: [Mailman-Users] Archives failing after upgrade In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Same with my installation. later, Mentor On Mon, 13 Nov 2000, at 10:30, Edmund Lau wrote: > I upgraded Mailman from rc1 to rc2 over the weekend but evidently there > were some problems. My web archives for all my lists are failing. Here's > a traceback after running bin/arch : > > --- > Traceback (most recent call last): > File "./arch", line 129, in ? > main() > File "./arch", line 118, in main > archiver.processUnixMailbox(fp, Article) > File "/home/mailman/Mailman/Archiver/pipermail.py", line 521, in > processUnixMailbox > a = articleClass(m, self.sequence) > File "/home/mailman/Mailman/Archiver/HyperArch.py", line 224, in > __init__ > self.cenc = string.lower(cenc) > File "/usr/local/pkg/python-1.6/lib/python1.6/string.py", line 47, in > lower > return s.lower() > AttributeError: 'None' object has no attribute 'lower' > --- > > When qrunner is queueing an Email for a list delievery, there is an extra > line of errors in my error log which basically says my archieve is > corrupt. > > The good thing is, nothing is really lost because I can still see them > being stored in the mbox file so I can reconstruct them later. I was > thinking my situation might be related to what Greg Connor recently went > through but our tracebacks are different. At the moment, arch fails on > all my lists, whether there were pending requests or not. I went back > through the logs and discovered that when I had upgraded there were two > lists (out of the 6 I'm running) with admin requests waiting. > > Anyone with ideas on how to start debugging so I can be back in a "sane" > state? Thanks! > > -Ed > > > ------------------------------------------------------ > Mailman-Users maillist - Mailman-Users at python.org > http://www.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users > From ircd at capangil.de Mon Nov 13 20:25:32 2000 From: ircd at capangil.de (Tobias Capangil) Date: Mon, 13 Nov 2000 20:25:32 +0100 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Archives failing after upgrade References: Message-ID: <008701c04da7$8712d750$a88001d9@toby> Hi, it works for me, but whenever I want so see the archives I only get this html: "The Team Archives You can get more information about this list or you can download the full raw archive ( 168 KB ). ---> Currently, there are no archives. <---" Why is there only the full raw archive, but not the great table with all messages ? Thanks in advance, Tobias Capangil -----Urspr?ngliche Nachricht----- Von: "Mentor Cana" An: "Edmund Lau" Cc: Gesendet: Montag, 13. November 2000 20:00 Betreff: Re: [Mailman-Users] Archives failing after upgrade > > Same with my installation. > > later, > Mentor > > On Mon, 13 Nov 2000, at 10:30, Edmund Lau wrote: > > > I upgraded Mailman from rc1 to rc2 over the weekend but evidently there > > were some problems. My web archives for all my lists are failing. Here's > > a traceback after running bin/arch : > > > > --- > > Traceback (most recent call last): > > File "./arch", line 129, in ? > > main() > > File "./arch", line 118, in main > > archiver.processUnixMailbox(fp, Article) > > File "/home/mailman/Mailman/Archiver/pipermail.py", line 521, in > > processUnixMailbox > > a = articleClass(m, self.sequence) > > File "/home/mailman/Mailman/Archiver/HyperArch.py", line 224, in > > __init__ > > self.cenc = string.lower(cenc) > > File "/usr/local/pkg/python-1.6/lib/python1.6/string.py", line 47, in > > lower > > return s.lower() > > AttributeError: 'None' object has no attribute 'lower' > > --- > > > > When qrunner is queueing an Email for a list delievery, there is an extra > > line of errors in my error log which basically says my archieve is > > corrupt. > > > > The good thing is, nothing is really lost because I can still see them > > being stored in the mbox file so I can reconstruct them later. I was > > thinking my situation might be related to what Greg Connor recently went > > through but our tracebacks are different. At the moment, arch fails on > > all my lists, whether there were pending requests or not. I went back > > through the logs and discovered that when I had upgraded there were two > > lists (out of the 6 I'm running) with admin requests waiting. > > > > Anyone with ideas on how to start debugging so I can be back in a "sane" > > state? Thanks! > > > > -Ed > > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------ > > Mailman-Users maillist - Mailman-Users at python.org > > http://www.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------ > Mailman-Users maillist - Mailman-Users at python.org > http://www.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users > From ge204 at eng.cam.ac.uk Mon Nov 13 20:34:12 2000 From: ge204 at eng.cam.ac.uk (Gunnar Evermann) Date: 13 Nov 2000 19:34:12 +0000 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Archives failing after upgrade In-Reply-To: Edmund Lau's message of "Mon, 13 Nov 2000 10:30:56 -0800 (PST)" References: Message-ID: Edmund Lau writes: > I upgraded Mailman from rc1 to rc2 over the weekend but evidently there > were some problems. My web archives for all my lists are failing. Here's > a traceback after running bin/arch : > File "/home/mailman/Mailman/Archiver/HyperArch.py", line 224, in > __init__ > self.cenc = string.lower(cenc) > File "/usr/local/pkg/python-1.6/lib/python1.6/string.py", line 47, in > lower > return s.lower() > AttributeError: 'None' object has no attribute 'lower' > --- > > When qrunner is queueing an Email for a list delievery, there is an extra > line of errors in my error log which basically says my archieve is > corrupt. This happens if a message in the mbox has no Content-Transfer-Encoding header. Eric Forsberg send a patch to fix this: http://sourceforge.net/patch/download.php?id=102268 Gunnar From Joel.Dudley at DevelopOnline.com Mon Nov 13 21:33:22 2000 From: Joel.Dudley at DevelopOnline.com (Joel Dudley) Date: Mon, 13 Nov 2000 13:33:22 -0700 Subject: [Mailman-Users] no cookie Message-ID: I just installed mailman 1.1-6 on debian and thew web interface keeps asking me for a password every time I try to do something in the admin pages. I don't believe that the authentication cookie is being stored. Any ideas? Thanks. - Joel From marc_news at valinux.com Mon Nov 13 22:46:36 2000 From: marc_news at valinux.com (Marc MERLIN) Date: Mon, 13 Nov 2000 13:46:36 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] approval of subscription In-Reply-To: <019f01c04d4c$cc097900$5544bd89@econ.cuhk.edu.hk>; from ckwong@cuhk.edu.hk on Mon, Nov 13, 2000 at 04:36:20PM +0800 References: <019f01c04d4c$cc097900$5544bd89@econ.cuhk.edu.hk> Message-ID: <20001113134636.G27544@marc.merlins.org> On Mon, Nov 13, 2000 at 04:36:20PM +0800, Wong Ching Kuen Frederick wrote: > can admin use email for the approval of subscription instead of the web > interface? Nope, sorry. Marc -- Microsoft is to operating systems & security .... .... what McDonalds is to gourmet cooking Home page: http://marc.merlins.org/ | Finger marc_f at merlins.org for PGP key From Andreas.Schamanek at univie.ac.at Mon Nov 13 22:50:33 2000 From: Andreas.Schamanek at univie.ac.at (Andreas Schamanek) Date: Mon, 13 Nov 2000 22:50:33 +0100 (MET) Subject: [Mailman-Users] users without passwords Message-ID: Hi mailing list managers, I am new to this list so you got one free flame mail to send to me! But, hey, only 1, OK? ;-) Can somebody give me some hint how it's possible that a user is subscribed to a list without a password? While testing RC2 I wanted to send a password reminder to myself. But I received only a warning message telling me that my own email-address is not associated with any password. MTIA, -- Andreas From Andreas.Schamanek at univie.ac.at Mon Nov 13 22:55:01 2000 From: Andreas.Schamanek at univie.ac.at (Andreas Schamanek) Date: Mon, 13 Nov 2000 22:55:01 +0100 (MET) Subject: [Mailman-Users] approval of subscription In-Reply-To: <20001113134636.G27544@marc.merlins.org> Message-ID: On Mon, 13 Nov 2000, Marc MERLIN wrote: > On Mon, Nov 13, 2000 at 04:36:20PM +0800, Wong Ching Kuen Frederick wrote: > > can admin use email for the approval of subscription instead of the web > > interface? > > Nope, sorry. BTW, much to my regret. Maybe I am hardliner but for me firing up my browser is just a bit too much effort and _lynx_ unfortunately is not the browser of my choice when it comes to Mailman. Just my 2 cents, -- Andreas From marc_news at valinux.com Mon Nov 13 23:04:38 2000 From: marc_news at valinux.com (Marc MERLIN) Date: Mon, 13 Nov 2000 14:04:38 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Previous problem with hard links In-Reply-To: ; from tib@tigerknight.org on Mon, Nov 13, 2000 at 03:43:41AM -0800 References: Message-ID: <20001113140438.H27544@marc.merlins.org> On Mon, Nov 13, 2000 at 03:43:41AM -0800, Tib wrote: > Greetings Programs! > > I've been futzing with Mailman and trying to get it to work for some time now > on this secure kernel, and think I may have stumbled upon something. If it's > not new, it's definitely new information to me and a solution I'd not heard of > before. > > I was getting errors of hard links being denied for quite a while and suddenly > they stopped. I went through everything I could think of and hit on it by I already wrote a program that allows you to run mailman with the secure linux patch. It's in the current mailman CVS and you can get it here too: http://sourceforge.net/patch/?func=detailpatch&patch_id=101812&group_id=103 Marc -- Microsoft is to operating systems & security .... .... what McDonalds is to gourmet cooking Home page: http://marc.merlins.org/ | Finger marc_f at merlins.org for PGP key From barry at digicool.com Mon Nov 13 23:35:05 2000 From: barry at digicool.com (Barry A. Warsaw) Date: Mon, 13 Nov 2000 17:35:05 -0500 (EST) Subject: [Mailman-Users] Upgrade to 2.0rc2 destroyed some archives References: <3A0E30E5.1E30200E@nekodojo.org> Message-ID: <14864.27801.707127.220773@anthem.concentric.net> >>>>> "GC" == Greg Connor writes: GC> Nov 11 17:18:34 2000 qrunner(5155): Traceback (innermost GC> last): Nov 11 17:18:34 2000 qrunner(5155): File GC> "/home/mailman/Mailman/Archiver/Archiver.py", line 221, i n GC> ArchiveMail Nov 11 17:18:34 2000 qrunner(5155): GC> h.processUnixMailbox(f, HyperArch.Article) Nov 11 17:18:34 GC> 2000 qrunner(5155): File GC> "/home/mailman/Mailman/Archiver/pipermail.py", line 521, in GC> processUnixMailbox Nov 11 17:18:34 2000 qrunner(5155): a = GC> articleClass(m, self.sequence) Nov 11 17:18:34 2000 GC> qrunner(5155): File GC> "/home/mailman/Mailman/Archiver/HyperArch.py", line 224, in GC> __init__ Nov 11 17:18:34 2000 qrunner(5155): self.cenc = GC> string.lower(cenc) Nov 11 17:18:34 2000 qrunner(5155): GC> TypeError: read-only character buffer, None Nov 11 17:18:34 GC> 2000 (5155) CORRUPT ARCHIVE FOR LIST: poly-listowners Here's the patch for this problem. -Barry -------------------- snip snip -------------------- Index: HyperArch.py =================================================================== RCS file: /cvsroot/mailman/mailman/Mailman/Archiver/HyperArch.py,v retrieving revision 1.45 retrieving revision 1.46 diff -u -r1.45 -r1.46 --- HyperArch.py 2000/11/10 23:46:06 1.45 +++ HyperArch.py 2000/11/13 21:50:05 1.46 @@ -218,8 +218,8 @@ # Snag the content-* headers. RFC 1521 states that their values are # case insensitive. - ctype = message.getheader('Content-Type') or "text/plain" - cenc = message.getheader('Content-Transfer-Encoding') + ctype = message.getheader('Content-Type', 'text/plain') + cenc = message.getheader('Content-Transfer-Encoding', '') self.ctype = string.lower(ctype) self.cenc = string.lower(cenc) self.decoded = {} From tib at tigerknight.org Mon Nov 13 23:43:06 2000 From: tib at tigerknight.org (Tib) Date: Mon, 13 Nov 2000 14:43:06 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Mailman-Users] Previous problem with hard links In-Reply-To: <20001113140438.H27544@marc.merlins.org> Message-ID: On Mon, 13 Nov 2000, Marc MERLIN wrote: > On Mon, Nov 13, 2000 at 03:43:41AM -0800, Tib wrote: > I already wrote a program that allows you to run mailman with the secure > linux patch. It's in the current mailman CVS and you can get it here too: > http://sourceforge.net/patch/?func=detailpatch&patch_id=101812&group_id=103 Actually I'd tried this patch already, and met with no success. :/ I wrote this list a few times but hadn't been able to find a resolution after that, and then the problem stopped altogether when I used private logs. I don't know why the patch didn't work, and if a solution could be found I'd appreciate it a lot. Until then - I'll keep on with what works for me for now :] Thanks Tib From Richard.Eames at flinders.edu.au Tue Nov 14 00:04:51 2000 From: Richard.Eames at flinders.edu.au (Richard Eames) Date: Tue, 14 Nov 2000 09:34:51 +1030 Subject: [Mailman-Users] How to batch set user passwords Message-ID: <4.2.0.58.20001114093013.00b58a20@post.flinders.edu.au> I need to move a large number of list subscribers from a previously used listserver (not mailman) to mailman. I can see how to write a script to parse each old list and add members to the new lists, however I want each person to have only one password (at least at the start) rather than one per list. Is there a way to set a list subscribers password from the command line? Anyone got a script ? Much thanks in advance PS mailman is great From justin13 at look.ca Tue Nov 14 03:28:13 2000 From: justin13 at look.ca (Justin) Date: Mon, 13 Nov 2000 18:28:13 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] HELP !!!! Message-ID: <01d801c04de2$89c4d620$0200a8c0@yec1.on.wave.home.com> When i try and post a msg i get this error >: Command died with status 2: "/home/mailman/mail/wrapper mailcmd communica". Command output: Failure to exec script. WANTED gid 12, GOT gid 99. (Reconfigure to take 99?) How can i fix this . ? -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mail.python.org/pipermail/mailman-users/attachments/20001113/ed22c4e9/attachment.htm From justin13 at look.ca Tue Nov 14 04:20:50 2000 From: justin13 at look.ca (Justin) Date: Mon, 13 Nov 2000 19:20:50 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] IT Works!!! but one last thing...... Message-ID: <030a01c04de9$e36c05c0$0200a8c0@yec1.on.wave.home.com> Thanks for the help......just one thing.... when i send a mail to mylist-request at mydomain.com the e-mails in the message dont show up with the domain they show up with the host name ..... i have edited the mm_cfg.py and added DEFAULT_HOST_NAME = 'mydomain.com' just a lil problem. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mail.python.org/pipermail/mailman-users/attachments/20001113/a0f2ed7a/attachment.html From lovelace at wayfarer.org Tue Nov 14 01:37:45 2000 From: lovelace at wayfarer.org (Tanner Lovelace) Date: Mon, 13 Nov 2000 19:37:45 -0500 Subject: [Mailman-Users] When using qmail, messages bounce if they have capital letters in the listname portion of the address Message-ID: <3A108959.6A2BC992@wayfarer.org> Greetings, I recently installed Mailman on my system. I use qmail as my mailer daemon so I used the qmail-to-mailman.py script contributed by Bruce Perens. I noticed however, that when using the script it bounces any address that has any kind of capital letters in the username portion of the e-mail address. This is apparently because of the fact that the script checks for the existence of the list directory to verify a list's existence. Since the directory is lowercased upon creation, the script needs to lowercase the username portion of the address also. (example: if you have a list called mailinglist at lists.domain.com and send a message to MailingList at lists.domain.com it will bounce the message saying there is no list by that name.) I asked Bruce about it and he suggested I submit my patch. One question I had, though, was if this was the correct way to handle this. Domain names are defined to be case insensitive but generally usernames are not. Unfortunately, many users come from the MS-Windows world where most things are case insensitive and are likely to get confused by case sensitivity. I've gone ahead and submitted this as a bug to sourceforge and submitted a corresponding patch. I hope that was the correct thing to do. Anyway, here is the patch. What are the chances that this can make it into the 2.0 release? --- contrib/qmail-to-mailman.py-orig Mon Nov 13 19:13:23 2000 +++ contrib/qmail-to-mailman.py Mon Nov 13 19:14:00 2000 @@ -62,6 +62,8 @@ sys.stderr.write("LOCAL not set in environment?\n") sys.exit(100) + local = string.lower(local) + local = re.sub("^mailman-","",local) names = ("root", "postmaster", "mailer-daemon", "mailman-owner", "owner", -- Tanner Lovelace lovelace at wayfarer.org http://wtl.wayfarer.org/ Cthulu for President. Why settle for the lesser evil? From ckwong at cuhk.edu.hk Tue Nov 14 03:42:32 2000 From: ckwong at cuhk.edu.hk (Wong Ching Kuen Frederick) Date: Tue, 14 Nov 2000 10:42:32 +0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] request.db Message-ID: <00eb01c04de4$89e8ee00$5544bd89@econ.cuhk.edu.hk> i just want to know what is the meaning of each field in request.db. thanx!!! {6: (2, (974104201.486, 'abc at xyz.com', 'zevica', 0))} From satyap at satya.virtualave.net Tue Nov 14 04:27:03 2000 From: satyap at satya.virtualave.net (Satya) Date: Tue, 14 Nov 2000 08:57:03 +0530 (IST) Subject: [Mailman-Users] HELP !!!! In-Reply-To: <01d801c04de2$89c4d620$0200a8c0@yec1.on.wave.home.com> Message-ID: On Nov 13, 2000 at 18:28, Justin wrote: > "/home/mailman/mail/wrapper mailcmd communica". Command output: Failure to > exec script. WANTED gid 12, GOT gid 99. (Reconfigure to take 99?) Reinstall with --with-cgi-gid=99 (look up the appropriate switch in the README or INSTALL file) Oh, I see how this message is confusing. For a moment I thought the message says the system wanted a gid of 12 and got 99, so mailman should give what the system wants, i.e. 12. Of course it means that *mailman* wants 12 and got 99 from Apache(?). The message could be better worded. Who's giving that message? Mailman or someone else? -- Satya. US-bound grad students! For pre-apps, see If you're not part of the solution, you're part of the precipitate. From Dan.Mick at west.sun.com Tue Nov 14 04:40:14 2000 From: Dan.Mick at west.sun.com (Dan Mick) Date: Mon, 13 Nov 2000 19:40:14 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] /home/mailman/cron/senddigest yields ValueError References: <20001113083258.C6528@carlisle.msoe.edu> Message-ID: <3A10B41E.1B532B24@west.sun.com> Looks to me like your digest_header value has a "percent-newline" ("%\n") sequence in it; the % operator tried to substitute things from TemplateRefs() into the digest_header, and failed with the message "unsupported format character.." and things that indicate "newline". Rethink your digest text wrt percent signs. "Jonathan C. Detert" wrote: > > Hello, > > Can anyone explain what the error shown below means, and how to fix it? > > Thanks > > ----- Forwarded message from Cron Daemon ----- > > From: root at lists.msoe.edu (Cron Daemon) > To: mailman at lists.msoe.edu > Subject: Cron /usr/bin/python -S /home/mailman/cron/senddigests > Date: Sun, 12 Nov 2000 12:00:05 -0600 > Message-Id: <200011121800.eACI05I30274 at lists.msoe.edu> > > Traceback (innermost last): > File "/home/mailman/cron/senddigests", line 65, in ? > main() > File "/home/mailman/cron/senddigests", line 42, in main > send_list_digest(mlist) > File "/home/mailman/cron/senddigests", line 53, in send_list_digest > ToDigest.inject_digest(mlist, digestfile, topicsfile) > File "/home/mailman/Mailman/Handlers/ToDigest.py", line 176, in inject_digest > msg = digest.asText() > File "/home/mailman/Mailman/Handlers/ToDigest.py", line 245, in asText > return self.Present(mime=0) > File "/home/mailman/Mailman/Handlers/ToDigest.py", line 279, in Present > lines.append(self.__mlist.digest_header % self.TemplateRefs()) > ValueError: unsupported format character ' > ' (0xd) > > ----- End forwarded message ----- > > -- > Happy Landings, > > Jon Detert > Unix System Administrator, Milwaukee School of Engineering > 1025 N. Broadway, Milwaukee, Wisconsin 53202 > > ------------------------------------------------------ > Mailman-Users maillist - Mailman-Users at python.org > http://www.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users From midnight at the-oasis.net Tue Nov 14 04:44:32 2000 From: midnight at the-oasis.net (Phil Barnett) Date: Mon, 13 Nov 2000 22:44:32 -0500 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Can I revert? Message-ID: <3A106ED0.210.594BE3C@localhost> Has anyone reverted from 2.0rc2 to a prior version? Were there any changes that were version specific that were changed during the upgrade? -- Phil Barnett mailto:midnight at the-oasis.net WWW http://www.the-oasis.net/ FTP Site ftp://ftp.the-oasis.net From midnight at the-oasis.net Tue Nov 14 04:44:31 2000 From: midnight at the-oasis.net (Phil Barnett) Date: Mon, 13 Nov 2000 22:44:31 -0500 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Bug in 2.0rc2 adding newlist Message-ID: <3A106ECF.1857.594BDCE@localhost> Running 2.0rc2. I was trying to add a list with bin/newlist and got this: Initial bin/newlist password: Traceback (innermost last): File "bin/newlist", line 213, in ? main(sys.argv) File "bin/newlist", line 163, in main mlist.Create(listname, owner_mail, pw) File "/home/mailman/Mailman/MailList.py", line 775, in Create self.InitVars(name, admin, crypted_password) File "/home/mailman/Mailman/MailList.py", line 335, in InitVars Archiver.InitVars(self) # has configurable stuff File "/home/mailman/Mailman/Archiver/Archiver.py", line 108, in InitVars Utils.mkdir(self.private_archive_file_dir) File "/home/mailman/Mailman/Utils.py", line 568, in mkdir os.mkdir(dir, mode) OSError: [Errno 2] No such file or directory: '/home/mailman/archives/private/bin/newlist.mbox' The rest of the .mbox's are in /home/mailman/archives/private/ without the /bin/ Any idea how to get past this? -- Phil Barnett mailto:midnight at the-oasis.net WWW http://www.the-oasis.net/ FTP Site ftp://ftp.the-oasis.net From barry at digicool.com Tue Nov 14 05:55:33 2000 From: barry at digicool.com (Barry A. Warsaw) Date: Mon, 13 Nov 2000 23:55:33 -0500 (EST) Subject: [Mailman-Users] 2.0rc2 upgrade FAILS if lists have pending requests References: <3A0E5660.C5B26AA9@nekodojo.org> Message-ID: <14864.50629.757078.773075@anthem.concentric.net> >>>>> "GC" == Greg Connor writes: GC> Error: "make update" and "make install" fail when there are GC> pending requests. Buglet in rc2. Here's the fix. -Barry -------------------- snip snip -------------------- Index: MailList.py =================================================================== RCS file: /cvsroot/mailman/mailman/Mailman/MailList.py,v retrieving revision 1.187 retrieving revision 1.188 diff -u -r1.187 -r1.188 --- MailList.py 2000/11/10 17:56:55 1.187 +++ MailList.py 2000/11/14 04:44:01 1.188 @@ -913,9 +913,10 @@ else: self.InitVars() # Init any new variables, self.Load(check_version = 0) # then reload the file - from versions import Update - Update(self, stored_state) - self.data_version = mm_cfg.DATA_FILE_VERSION + if self.Locked(): + from versions import Update + Update(self, stored_state) + self.data_version = mm_cfg.DATA_FILE_VERSION if self.Locked(): self.Save() From barry at digicool.com Tue Nov 14 06:01:07 2000 From: barry at digicool.com (Barry A. Warsaw) Date: Tue, 14 Nov 2000 00:01:07 -0500 (EST) Subject: [Mailman-Users] Upgrade to 2.0rc2 References: <3A0E30E5.1E30200E@nekodojo.org> <3A0E5308.507577C3@nekodojo.org> <3A0F01FF.D84FF695@nleaudio.com> Message-ID: <14864.50963.317708.35385@anthem.concentric.net> >>>>> "B" == Bob writes: B> I am currently using version 2.0rc1. Did the wrapper get B> updated? Yes, but only in a very trivial way. If your system provides vsnprintf() then you won't notice it (and if you're system /didn't/ provide it, you'd probably know by now because the wrapper wouldn't have compiled). B> I'm wondering if I can simply copy the updated files B> over without having to do a total re-install. Thanks. Why don't you want to do a "make install"? Is it because you don't want to have to re-compile the binaries? Mailman's top level Makefile ought to have a install-arch-indep and install-arch-dep targets, but it doesn't. You might try: % SUBDIRS="bin cron filters misc Mailman scripts templates" make install That ought to skip doing a make in the src directory. -Barry From jburley at kuci.org Tue Nov 14 06:17:23 2000 From: jburley at kuci.org (Joshua Burley) Date: Mon, 13 Nov 2000 21:17:23 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] MH and Reply-To Message-ID: <20001114051723.7D0C71CD94@dinsdale.python.org> I've got my list to reply to the Poster, but that just seems to leave a Reply-To out of the headers completely. And MH doesn't like that. Pine, webmail, and other apps default to the To: address, but most of our users use MH. Any ideas? Any patches? How can I get that Reply-To inserted? Thanks, josh Josh Burley josh at kuci.org "Jesus saves, Allah forgives, Cthulu thinks you'd make a nice sandwich." From barry at digicool.com Tue Nov 14 06:16:56 2000 From: barry at digicool.com (Barry A. Warsaw) Date: Tue, 14 Nov 2000 00:16:56 -0500 (EST) Subject: [Mailman-Users] Re: [Mailman-Developers] Announcing Mailman 2.0 release candidate 2 References: <14860.51685.368139.841987@anthem.concentric.net> <3A0E6AE3.10068.1DD45FA@localhost> Message-ID: <14864.51912.327124.393642@anthem.concentric.net> >>>>> "PB" == Phil Barnett writes: PB> I upgraded from 2.0b6 from 2.0rc2 Friday night. A person wrote PB> me and said the replyto: is no longer pointed to the list. I PB> checked several messages and they were, but some were not. Any PB> message I send to the list has a replyto of myself instead of PB> to the list. Please remember that if the original message has a Reply-To: already, Mailman will not overwrite that, even if "explicit reply-to" is set. So, did the original mesasge have a Reply-To already? I just tested this using rc2. With reply_goes_to_list set to "explicit address" and reply_to_address set to some non-blank value, any message without a Reply-To: gets one set to that value. Any message that already has a Reply-To: set is unchanged. That's expected behavior (i.e. works for me!) -Barry From midnight at the-oasis.net Tue Nov 14 06:37:27 2000 From: midnight at the-oasis.net (Phil Barnett) Date: Tue, 14 Nov 2000 00:37:27 -0500 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Re: [Mailman-Developers] Announcing Mailman 2.0 release candidate 2 In-Reply-To: <14864.51912.327124.393642@anthem.concentric.net> Message-ID: <3A108947.2828.5FC21DD@localhost> On 14 Nov 2000, at 0:16, Barry A. Warsaw wrote: > > >>>>> "PB" == Phil Barnett writes: > > PB> I upgraded from 2.0b6 from 2.0rc2 Friday night. A person wrote > PB> me and said the replyto: is no longer pointed to the list. I > PB> checked several messages and they were, but some were not. Any > PB> message I send to the list has a replyto of myself instead of > PB> to the list. > > Please remember that if the original message has a Reply-To: already, > Mailman will not overwrite that, even if "explicit reply-to" is set. > So, did the original mesasge have a Reply-To already? > > I just tested this using rc2. With reply_goes_to_list set to > "explicit address" and reply_to_address set to some non-blank value, > any message without a Reply-To: gets one set to that value. Any > message that already has a Reply-To: set is unchanged. That's > expected behavior (i.e. works for me!) Expected behavour for whom? For all the users on my lists, it has them screaming. They want to know why Mailman is broken after the upgrade. 2.0b6 did not exhibit this behaviour. How can I make 2.0rc2 work like b6 did? I think it's rather impossible to get all list users on the planet to remove their replyto so they can reply to the list on a list that replyto list is set. Expecially so since setting replyto is generally a global setting in most MUA's. Why was this changed? Is there a way to make Mailman to have this be selectable behaviour for it to work both ways? Not being able to force replyto to the list is broken behaviour in my users eyes, and, they are the ones who really count. My open source developers list is ready to switch back to egroups over this. That can't be good news. -- Phil Barnett mailto:midnight at the-oasis.net WWW http://www.the-oasis.net/ FTP Site ftp://ftp.the-oasis.net From midnight at the-oasis.net Tue Nov 14 06:43:23 2000 From: midnight at the-oasis.net (Phil Barnett) Date: Tue, 14 Nov 2000 00:43:23 -0500 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Re: [Mailman-Developers] Reverting question In-Reply-To: <14864.52862.465404.35651@anthem.concentric.net> Message-ID: <3A108AAB.25143.6018DAE@localhost> On 14 Nov 2000, at 0:32, Barry A. Warsaw wrote: > > >>>>> "PB" == Phil Barnett writes: > > PB> Am I likely to encounter problems going from 2.0rc2 to 2.0b6? > > Do you mean downgrading? Don't do that! If you really mean from > 2.0b6 to 2.0rc2 then you should be fine. Any data formats that need > updating will get updated automatically. I specifically mean downgrading. I have a hornets nest on my hands and I'm about to lose my lists back to egroups. This lack of reply to the list 'updated feature' has them HEATED. Perhaps I'm not clear. If I lose them to egroups, there is no point to me running Mailman anymore. This 'upgraded feature' is suicidal for Mailman on my machine. -- Phil Barnett mailto:midnight at the-oasis.net WWW http://www.the-oasis.net/ FTP Site ftp://ftp.the-oasis.net From chuqui at plaidworks.com Tue Nov 14 06:45:25 2000 From: chuqui at plaidworks.com (Chuq Von Rospach) Date: Mon, 13 Nov 2000 21:45:25 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Re: [Mailman-Developers] Announcing Mailman 2.0 release candidate 2 In-Reply-To: <14864.51912.327124.393642@anthem.concentric.net> References: <14860.51685.368139.841987@anthem.concentric.net> <3A0E6AE3.10068.1DD45FA@localhost> <14864.51912.327124.393642@anthem.concentric.net> Message-ID: At 12:16 AM -0500 11/14/00, Barry A. Warsaw wrote: >Please remember that if the original message has a Reply-To: already, >Mailman will not overwrite that, even if "explicit reply-to" is set. I know we don't want to change this for 2.0, but IMHO, if we're going to coerce reply-to, Mailman SHOULD. I've seen other systems that rewrite an existing reply-to to x-reply-to, which at least keeps the context. As the official "let the user decide" bigot here on the list (grin), I do think that if you choose to coerce reply-to, it ought to be unilateral and consistent. Either that, or always leave it to the user and not coerce stuff... I think doing it "except when..." doesn't really add anything useful, but opens it to confusion... The way I see it, if a user is on a list where reply-to is set to the list (or some explicit value), their expectation is that it's going to be set. Not set unless someone else sets it first. So from the user expectation view, if it's going to be coerced, coerce it unconditionally.... FWIW... -- Chuq Von Rospach - Plaidworks Consulting (mailto:chuqui at plaidworks.com) Apple Mail List Gnome (mailto:chuq at apple.com) Be just, and fear not. From simon at uow.edu.au Tue Nov 14 06:57:49 2000 From: simon at uow.edu.au (Simon Coggins) Date: Tue, 14 Nov 2000 16:57:49 +1100 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Re: [Mailman-Developers] Reverting question In-Reply-To: <3A108AAB.25143.6018DAE@localhost>; from midnight@the-oasis.net on Tue, Nov 14, 2000 at 12:43:23AM -0500 References: <14864.52862.465404.35651@anthem.concentric.net> <3A108AAB.25143.6018DAE@localhost> Message-ID: <20001114165748.B3475@uow.edu.au> I have to agree here. Not being able to override the reply-to: fields on lists is a *MAJOr* problem. I've also had this problem with my lists. And I was hoping for a 'fix' but it looks like it's intended behaviour?. I think if thats going to be the case there should be another option. 'Force list replyto' . Regards Simon On Tue, Nov 14, 2000 at 12:43:23AM -0500, Phil Barnett wrote: > On 14 Nov 2000, at 0:32, Barry A. Warsaw wrote: > > > > > >>>>> "PB" == Phil Barnett writes: > > > > PB> Am I likely to encounter problems going from 2.0rc2 to 2.0b6? > > > > Do you mean downgrading? Don't do that! If you really mean from > > 2.0b6 to 2.0rc2 then you should be fine. Any data formats that need > > updating will get updated automatically. > > I specifically mean downgrading. I have a hornets nest on my > hands and I'm about to lose my lists back to egroups. > > This lack of reply to the list 'updated feature' has them HEATED. > > Perhaps I'm not clear. If I lose them to egroups, there is no point to > me running Mailman anymore. > > This 'upgraded feature' is suicidal for Mailman on my machine. > > > -- > Phil Barnett mailto:midnight at the-oasis.net > WWW http://www.the-oasis.net/ > FTP Site ftp://ftp.the-oasis.net > > _______________________________________________ > Mailman-Developers mailing list > Mailman-Developers at python.org > http://www.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-developers -- Simon Coggins (SAGE-AU Member) Email: simon at uow.edu.au Network and System Management Officer Phone: +61-2-4221-3775 Information Technology Systems (ITS) Mobile: 0408 115861 University of Wollongong, 2522, Australia Fax: +61-2-4229-1985 From barry at digicool.com Tue Nov 14 07:03:02 2000 From: barry at digicool.com (Barry A. Warsaw) Date: Tue, 14 Nov 2000 01:03:02 -0500 (EST) Subject: [Mailman-Users] Re: [Mailman-Developers] Announcing Mailman 2.0 release candidate 2 References: <14860.51685.368139.841987@anthem.concentric.net> <3A0E6AE3.10068.1DD45FA@localhost> <14864.51912.327124.393642@anthem.concentric.net> Message-ID: <14864.54678.897125.666360@anthem.concentric.net> >>>>> "CVR" == Chuq Von Rospach writes: >> Please remember that if the original message has a Reply-To: >> already, Mailman will not overwrite that, even if "explicit >> reply-to" is set. CVR> I know we don't want to change this for 2.0, but IMHO, if CVR> we're going to coerce reply-to, Mailman SHOULD. I've seen CVR> other systems that rewrite an existing reply-to to CVR> x-reply-to, which at least keeps the context. As the official CVR> "let the user decide" bigot here on the list (grin), I do CVR> think that if you choose to coerce reply-to, it ought to be CVR> unilateral and consistent. Either that, or always leave it to CVR> the user and not coerce stuff... I think doing it "except CVR> when..." doesn't really add anything useful, but opens it to CVR> confusion... CVR> The way I see it, if a user is on a list where reply-to is CVR> set to the list (or some explicit value), their expectation CVR> is that it's going to be set. Not set unless someone else CVR> sets it first. So from the user expectation view, if it's CVR> going to be coerced, coerce it unconditionally.... But what happens to users who set reply-to because their from just isn't correct? That can happen for a lot of reasons (from stupid isp's to too-busy-to-fix-it sysadmins, etc.). Most people can't hack their from header, which is arguably where such last-ditch fixes should go. Phil saw this behavior in 2.0b6 because there was a logic bug that caused reply-to to always get inserted. Fixing that reverted to the current behavior. For reference, the attached patch should do what you're advocating (untested). It won't go into 2.0, but I'm open to changing this for 2.1, maybe as a per-list option. -Barry -------------------- snip snip -------------------- Index: CookHeaders.py =================================================================== RCS file: /cvsroot/mailman/mailman/Mailman/Handlers/CookHeaders.py,v retrieving revision 1.17 diff -u -r1.17 CookHeaders.py --- CookHeaders.py 2000/10/27 18:55:21 1.17 +++ CookHeaders.py 2000/11/14 05:59:40 @@ -80,7 +80,7 @@ # or if there is already a reply-to set. If the user has set # one we assume they have a good reason for it, and we don't # second guess them. - if not fasttrack and not msg.get('reply-to'): + if not fasttrack: # Set Reply-To: header to point back to this list if mlist.reply_goes_to_list == 1: msg['Reply-To'] = mlist.GetListEmail() From barry at digicool.com Tue Nov 14 07:07:01 2000 From: barry at digicool.com (Barry A. Warsaw) Date: Tue, 14 Nov 2000 01:07:01 -0500 (EST) Subject: [Mailman-Users] Re: [Mailman-Developers] Reverting question References: <14864.52862.465404.35651@anthem.concentric.net> <3A108AAB.25143.6018DAE@localhost> Message-ID: <14864.54917.27112.665096@anthem.concentric.net> >>>>> "PB" == Phil Barnett writes: PB> I specifically mean downgrading. I have a hornets nest on my PB> hands and I'm about to lose my lists back to egroups. You don't want to downgrade. See my untested patch in a different followup. PB> This lack of reply to the list 'updated feature' has them PB> HEATED. I'm surprised. I would think that munging reply-to is only useful for lists of people who don't know how to drive their MUAs. Is the problem just that they got used to one way of doing things, and now there's a different way? That I can sympathize with. Is it that suddenly, some people are getting two copies of messages because people don't know how to trim their headers? Yeah, that sucks. Or is it something else? -Barry From bob at nleaudio.com Tue Nov 14 07:16:59 2000 From: bob at nleaudio.com (Bob Puff@NLE) Date: Tue, 14 Nov 2000 01:16:59 -0500 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Re: [Mailman-Developers] Announcing Mailman 2.0 release candidate 2 References: <14860.51685.368139.841987@anthem.concentric.net> <3A0E6AE3.10068.1DD45FA@localhost> <14864.51912.327124.393642@anthem.concentric.net> Message-ID: <3A10D8DB.353BFBD2@nleaudio.com> > I know we don't want to change this for 2.0, but IMHO, if we're going > to coerce reply-to, Mailman SHOULD. I've seen other systems that > rewrite an existing reply-to to x-reply-to, which at least keeps the > context. As the official "let the user decide" bigot here on the list > (grin), I do think that if you choose to coerce reply-to, it ought to > be unilateral and consistent. Either that, or always leave it to the > user and not coerce stuff... I think doing it "except when..." > doesn't really add anything useful, but opens it to confusion... > > The way I see it, if a user is on a list where reply-to is set to the > list (or some explicit value), their expectation is that it's going > to be set. Not set unless someone else sets it first. So from the > user expectation view, if it's going to be coerced, coerce it > unconditionally.... Chuq, I TOTALLY agree. I have a couple lists that -MUST- have the REPLY-TO headers set to the list, and I need it to be that way no matter what the sender tries to do. Sometimes people inadvertently set a "reply-to" in their email client. Barry, please make it so! Bob From Andreas.Schamanek at univie.ac.at Tue Nov 14 07:16:17 2000 From: Andreas.Schamanek at univie.ac.at (Andreas Schamanek) Date: Tue, 14 Nov 2000 07:16:17 +0100 (MET) Subject: [Mailman-Users] Re: [Mailman-Developers] Reverting question In-Reply-To: <20001114165748.B3475_@uow.edu.au> Message-ID: On Tue, 14 Nov 2000, Simon Coggins wrote: > I have to agree here. Not being able to override the reply-to: > fields on lists is a *MAJOr* problem. I've also had this problem > with my lists. And I was hoping for a 'fix' but it looks like it's > intended behaviour?. > > I think if thats going to be the case there should be another > option. 'Force list replyto' . Wanna give Barry and the others a break? See, if you really need Reply-To:s inserted, a simple change in /etc/aliases like mylist-l: "|/usr/bin/egrep -vi '^Reply-To: ' | /usr/sbin/sendmail mylist-l_raw" mylist-l_raw: "|/home/mailman/mail/wrapper post mylist-l" does the trick. That's of course too simple but if you do not tell anybody it might help you until v2.1 :-) -- Andreas From chuqui at plaidworks.com Tue Nov 14 07:17:17 2000 From: chuqui at plaidworks.com (Chuq Von Rospach) Date: Mon, 13 Nov 2000 22:17:17 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Re: [Mailman-Developers] Announcing Mailman 2.0 release candidate 2 In-Reply-To: <14864.54678.897125.666360@anthem.concentric.net> References: <14860.51685.368139.841987@anthem.concentric.net> <3A0E6AE3.10068.1DD45FA@localhost> <14864.51912.327124.393642@anthem.concentric.net> <14864.54678.897125.666360@anthem.concentric.net> Message-ID: At 1:03 AM -0500 11/14/00, Barry A. Warsaw wrote: >But what happens to users who set reply-to because their from just >isn't correct? That can happen for a lot of reasons (from stupid >isp's to too-busy-to-fix-it sysadmins, etc.). Most people can't hack >their from header, which is arguably where such last-ditch fixes >should go. I'm sorry, but that's a very rare case I just can't get up any energy to worry about in the scheme of things. The number of users affected by this is bigger than zero, but tiny compared to the number of users that are going to be confused (or, as Phil shows), upset over the functionality. Put the two cases on a scale, and see which one is the lesser evil -- especially given that the "we'll fix it in the reply-to" hack is a braindamage hack fixing other braindamage, not standardized, supported, and really shouldn't be used (IMHO) -- if it's caused by a braindamaged admin, then yell at the admin's boss or something. But ignoring all of the philosophical issues about the reply-to, simply look at which is the lesser evil, and I think the answer is obvious. There's no 100% solution here, so aim to serve the better good. -- Chuq Von Rospach - Plaidworks Consulting (mailto:chuqui at plaidworks.com) Apple Mail List Gnome (mailto:chuq at apple.com) Be just, and fear not. From midnight at the-oasis.net Tue Nov 14 07:31:00 2000 From: midnight at the-oasis.net (Phil Barnett) Date: Tue, 14 Nov 2000 01:31:00 -0500 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Re: [Mailman-Developers] Reverting question In-Reply-To: <14864.54917.27112.665096@anthem.concentric.net> Message-ID: <3A1095D4.14770.62D26CF@localhost> On 14 Nov 2000, at 1:07, Barry A. Warsaw wrote: > I'm surprised. I would think that munging reply-to is only useful for > lists of people who don't know how to drive their MUAs. Is the > problem just that they got used to one way of doing things, and now > there's a different way? That I can sympathize with. Is it that > suddenly, some people are getting two copies of messages because > people don't know how to trim their headers? Yeah, that sucks. > > Or is it something else? I use Pegasus. My replyto is global. If I unset my replyto, it's removed from ALL of my mail. I don't really want to be going to my configuration page and blanking it for some mail and turning it back on for other mail. First, it's a hassle. Second, I'll undoubtedly do it wrong at some point. I want a replyto in my mail. Every mail list that I have participated in overrides replyto when replyto is set to the list. To my fellow list users who have been using lists that do this for the last three years, not having it work that way is disconcerting to say the least. egroups and opensource.org are two examples of list providers that override replyto. But, I certainly understand the desire to have it work the way you have it set now. I just think the behaviour should be selectable. It doesn't have to be all or none. Thanks for the patch! Now, if I could create a new list, I'd be back on track... -- Phil Barnett mailto:midnight at the-oasis.net WWW http://www.the-oasis.net/ FTP Site ftp://ftp.the-oasis.net From bob at nleaudio.com Tue Nov 14 08:10:10 2000 From: bob at nleaudio.com (Bob Puff@NLE) Date: Tue, 14 Nov 2000 02:10:10 -0500 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Searchable Archives References: <14860.51685.368139.841987@anthem.concentric.net> <3A0E6AE3.10068.1DD45FA@localhost> <14864.51912.327124.393642@anthem.concentric.net> <14864.54678.897125.666360@anthem.concentric.net> Message-ID: <3A10E552.CCB12417@nleaudio.com> Two questions, actually: #1. I love the feature Mailman has of masking the originator's email address in the public archives. Excellent spam prevention. HOWEVER! If you "download the full raw archive", you get everything, including the full email addresses. How can I disable this link? The spamming software that crawls over pages looking for emails will surely hit a jackpot with these files. #2. Is there any, ANY way to make the archives searchable? (Under Linux) Bob From ckwong at cuhk.edu.hk Tue Nov 14 09:59:07 2000 From: ckwong at cuhk.edu.hk (Wong Ching Kuen Frederick) Date: Tue, 14 Nov 2000 16:59:07 +0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] diable password checking Message-ID: <008801c04e19$2598e560$5544bd89@econ.cuhk.edu.hk> can i disable the password checking of accessing cgi-bin/admindb from the browsers? From mdejong at cygnus.com Tue Nov 14 10:21:34 2000 From: mdejong at cygnus.com (Mo DeJong) Date: Tue, 14 Nov 2000 01:21:34 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Mailman-Users] Why can't I set mailman to bounce non-member posts? Message-ID: Hello all. I use mailman on my sourceforge project and I am bothered by the seeming inability to set an option that will reject posts to a given list from a non member. I can set it such that a post from a non-member is not accepted, but the post is the "held for approval" and I end up having to explicitly reject these posts by logging in as the admin and rejecting it. If there no way to tell mailman to just reject posts from non-members without putting them in the admin queue? I can't seem to find an option to do this in the Web GUI. thanks Mo DeJong Red Hat Inc From johnblock at storeshop.com Tue Nov 14 11:25:00 2000 From: johnblock at storeshop.com (John Block) Date: Tue, 14 Nov 2000 10:25:00 +0000 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Re: Reverting question In-Reply-To: <14864.54917.27112.665096@anthem.concentric.net> Message-ID: Hello Barry > I'm surprised. I would think that munging reply-to is only useful for > lists of people who don't know how to drive their MUAs. MUA? My mail software gives a range of reply options: to all recipients, to sender, to recipients, so there is still choice. Anyhow, I just tried to reply to the question about searchable archives and only got the poster's address. My use for mailman will be to let users help each other and be publically supported and build up an archive of messages to create a searchable brainfile people can query for solutions. If, in many cases, help is only routed to the original poster and not publically, then this plan turns to dust. John From johnblock at storeshop.com Tue Nov 14 11:18:20 2000 From: johnblock at storeshop.com (John Block) Date: Tue, 14 Nov 2000 10:18:20 +0000 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Re: Searchable Archives In-Reply-To: <3A10E552.CCB12417@nleaudio.com> Message-ID: Hello Bob Fortunatly I'm skilled enough to beable to cut and paste addresses so you will get this publically. > #2. Is there any, ANY way to make the archives searchable? (Under Linux) My plan is to have pipermail which is included in the tarball create html pages. I'm then plannning to get the http://www.thunderstone.com search engine installed to search the html Thunderstone seems to offer alternative search terms based on relationships in the data. A feature which has has got me excited) John From Nigel.Metheringham at VData.co.uk Tue Nov 14 12:38:06 2000 From: Nigel.Metheringham at VData.co.uk (Nigel Metheringham) Date: Tue, 14 Nov 2000 11:38:06 +0000 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Re: Searchable Archives In-Reply-To: Message from John Block of "Tue, 14 Nov 2000 10:18:20 GMT." Message-ID: [Dropped from mailman-developers - We *really* need a feature to moderate or bounce messages that are copied across multiple related lists. I am getting rather unimpressed by getting every message twice] bob at nleaudio.com said: > #2. Is there any, ANY way to make the archives searchable? (Under > Linux) There are patches on Sourceforge to add htdig indexing. They need a little work - I'll try and produce an updated set for rc2 The current incarnation is in place on the exim list - see http://www.exim.org/pipermail/exim-users/ Nigel. -- [ - Opinions expressed are personal and may not be shared by VData - ] [ Nigel Metheringham Nigel.Metheringham at VData.co.uk ] [ Phone: +44 1423 850000 Fax +44 1423 858866 ] From a2m3 at Tonelli.sns.it Tue Nov 14 15:46:48 2000 From: a2m3 at Tonelli.sns.it (Andrea Mennucci) Date: Tue, 14 Nov 2000 15:46:48 +0100 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Re: Mailman private archives issue. In-Reply-To: ; from vikas98@hotmail.com on Fri, Nov 10, 2000 at 11:02:47PM +0000 References: Message-ID: <20001114154648.A21204@Tonelli.sns.it> I am cross posting this answer to mailman-users On Fri, Nov 10, 2000 at 11:02:47PM +0000, Vikas Gupta wrote: > Hello, > I found youur posting on the Mailman-Users archives. YOu describe not being > able to see private archives on the web. I am also having the same problem. > I was wondering if you had found a solution and could share it with me. > > my problem was due to the way mailman is installed in Debian/GNU Linux I have solved the problem I corrected in the file /etc/mailman/mm_cfg.py in this way: - PRIVATE_ARCHIVE_URL = '/mailman/private' + PRIVATE_ARCHIVE_URL = '/cgi-bin/mailman/private' now it works as advertised > -- Andrea C. Mennucci, Scuola Normale Superiore, Pisa, Italy From cpb at fermi.ioppublishing.com Tue Nov 14 15:56:57 2000 From: cpb at fermi.ioppublishing.com (Chris Brown) Date: Tue, 14 Nov 2000 14:56:57 +0000 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Using Mailman for an alert service Message-ID: <3A1152B9.46DC36FE@fermi.ioppublishing.com> Hi I'm new to Mailman and have a question I'd like answered before I continue my investigation. Is it possible to set Mailman up to run an automated alerts distribution service? Posting to the list by subscribers is completely disabled. A program/script is used to generate and send a message to the list at specific times. It is likely my MTA will be qmail running on a Linux box. Many thanks Chris From rodrigo at linuxave.net Tue Nov 14 15:05:16 2000 From: rodrigo at linuxave.net (Rodrigo Moya) Date: 14 Nov 2000 13:05:16 -0100 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Re: Mailman private archives issue. In-Reply-To: <20001114154648.A21204@Tonelli.sns.it> References: <20001114154648.A21204@Tonelli.sns.it> Message-ID: <200011141459.GAA29829@gears.linuxave.net> Hi Andrea, > > I am cross posting this answer to mailman-users > > On Fri, Nov 10, 2000 at 11:02:47PM +0000, Vikas Gupta wrote: > > Hello, > > I found youur posting on the Mailman-Users archives. YOu describe not being > > able to see private archives on the web. I am also having the same problem. > > I was wondering if you had found a solution and could share it with me. > > > > > > my problem was due to the way mailman is > installed in Debian/GNU Linux > > I have solved the problem > > I corrected in the file /etc/mailman/mm_cfg.py > > in this way: > > - PRIVATE_ARCHIVE_URL = '/mailman/private' > + PRIVATE_ARCHIVE_URL = '/cgi-bin/mailman/private' > and what about public archives? I mean, I can't make them work. In my mm_cfg.py file, I've got: PUBLIC_ARCHIVE_URL = '/pipermail' PRIVATE_ARCHIVE_URL = '/mailman/private' but /pipermail is not a valid path, I get always this error. I've also tried changing it to /mailman/public but nothing, they still don't work. What setting have you got for the PUBLIC_ARCHIVE_URL thing? cheers From detertj at msoe.edu Tue Nov 14 16:28:19 2000 From: detertj at msoe.edu (Jonathan C. Detert) Date: Tue, 14 Nov 2000 09:28:19 -0600 Subject: [Mailman-Users] /home/mailman/cron/senddigest yields ValueError In-Reply-To: <3A10B41E.1B532B24@west.sun.com>; from Dan.Mick@west.sun.com on Mon, Nov 13, 2000 at 07:40:14PM -0800 References: <20001113083258.C6528@carlisle.msoe.edu> <3A10B41E.1B532B24@west.sun.com> Message-ID: <20001114092819.J6528@carlisle.msoe.edu> Thanks for the reply. Below are two follow-up questions - * Dan Mick [001113 21:26]: > Looks to me like your digest_header value has a "percent-newline" ("%\n") > sequence in it; the % operator tried to substitute things from TemplateRefs() into > the digest_header, and failed with the message "unsupported format character.." and > things that indicate "newline". > > Rethink your digest text wrt percent signs. I know nothing about mailman's interworkings; are my assumptions (below) correct? - i assume there is no global default value for "digest_headers"; - i assume the only supplied interface to a list's digest_headers is via the web admin interface; - i assume the value of digest_headers is stored in the lists's config.db data file. After checking the value of all my lists digest_headers, I found one that looked suspicious. It had a format like this: "Bla bla bla, etc. %(info) _____________________________________" Does the "%(info)" token need to be followed by the letter 's'? Thanks for your help! > "Jonathan C. Detert" wrote: > > > > Hello, > > > > Can anyone explain what the error shown below means, and how to fix it? > > > > Thanks > > > > ----- Forwarded message from Cron Daemon ----- > > > > From: root at lists.msoe.edu (Cron Daemon) > > To: mailman at lists.msoe.edu > > Subject: Cron /usr/bin/python -S /home/mailman/cron/senddigests > > Date: Sun, 12 Nov 2000 12:00:05 -0600 > > Message-Id: <200011121800.eACI05I30274 at lists.msoe.edu> > > > > Traceback (innermost last): > > File "/home/mailman/cron/senddigests", line 65, in ? > > main() > > File "/home/mailman/cron/senddigests", line 42, in main > > send_list_digest(mlist) > > File "/home/mailman/cron/senddigests", line 53, in send_list_digest > > ToDigest.inject_digest(mlist, digestfile, topicsfile) > > File "/home/mailman/Mailman/Handlers/ToDigest.py", line 176, in inject_digest > > msg = digest.asText() > > File "/home/mailman/Mailman/Handlers/ToDigest.py", line 245, in asText > > return self.Present(mime=0) > > File "/home/mailman/Mailman/Handlers/ToDigest.py", line 279, in Present > > lines.append(self.__mlist.digest_header % self.TemplateRefs()) > > ValueError: unsupported format character ' > > ' (0xd) > > > > ----- End forwarded message ----- > > > > -- > > Happy Landings, > > > > Jon Detert > > Unix System Administrator, Milwaukee School of Engineering > > 1025 N. Broadway, Milwaukee, Wisconsin 53202 > > > > ------------------------------------------------------ > > Mailman-Users maillist - Mailman-Users at python.org > > http://www.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users -- Happy Landings, Jon Detert Unix System Administrator, Milwaukee School of Engineering 1025 N. Broadway, Milwaukee, Wisconsin 53202 From chuqui at plaidworks.com Tue Nov 14 16:43:33 2000 From: chuqui at plaidworks.com (Chuq Von Rospach) Date: Tue, 14 Nov 2000 07:43:33 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] [Mailman-Developers] Re: Reverting question In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: At 10:25 AM +0000 11/14/00, John Block wrote: > > I'm surprised. I would think that munging reply-to is only useful for >> lists of people who don't know how to drive their MUAs. > >MUA? Mail User Agent (aka client) Other jargon: MLM (mail list manager) MTA (mail transfer agent) In general I'm against coercing Reply-To. Strongly. But there are times when it's the right/necessary thing to do, so you want that option. In general yous houldn't use it, but sometimes you need it. One classic case is a mailing list under NDA discussing a beta software release, where all e-mail has to be logged and evaluated, and the *wrong* thing to do is reply privately to a person, because the beta team needs a copy. In that case, reply-to gets coerced to the list, and that reply-to needs to be dominant (i.e., an existing reply-to from a user *can't* take precedent). -- Chuq Von Rospach - Plaidworks Consulting (mailto:chuqui at plaidworks.com) Apple Mail List Gnome (mailto:chuq at apple.com) Be just, and fear not. From barry at digicool.com Tue Nov 14 17:40:45 2000 From: barry at digicool.com (Barry A. Warsaw) Date: Tue, 14 Nov 2000 11:40:45 -0500 (EST) Subject: [Mailman-Users] Re: [Mailman-Developers] Re: Reverting question References: Message-ID: <14865.27405.857124.313441@anthem.concentric.net> >>>>> "CVR" == Chuq Von Rospach writes: CVR> In general I'm against coercing Reply-To. Strongly. Me too. CVR> But there are times when it's the right/necessary thing to CVR> do, so you want that option. In general yous houldn't use it, CVR> but sometimes you need it. One classic case is a mailing list CVR> under NDA discussing a beta software release, where all CVR> e-mail has to be logged and evaluated, and the *wrong* thing CVR> to do is reply privately to a person, because the beta team CVR> needs a copy. In that case, reply-to gets coerced to the CVR> list, and that reply-to needs to be dominant (i.e., an CVR> existing reply-to from a user *can't* take precedent). That's the key thing that I don't like about Reply-To munging: it makes it much more difficult to do private replies. Maybe it's just the lists I manage, but my users are just as heated about /not/ doing reply-to munging as apparently other users on other lists are about doing it. The primary complaint is that people accidently send private responses to the whole list. This happens because they've trained themselves to know the difference between replies and followups, and have MUAs that separate those functions. The only grumblings occur when people don't trim their CC headers (like I've done here) and folks start getting duplicates. That can be handled in other ways (e.g. the list /could/ suppress deliveries to list members that it sees explicitly in the recipients list, although as we've discussed before, that has some potential for abuse). I've slept on this one and I'm prepared to change things for 2.0 final so that if Reply-To munging is turned on, it'll override any existing Reply-To field in the original message. The deciding factor for me was realizing how difficult it was to send private replies with munging turned on, so it might as well be equally difficult for every poster. I'm concerned about making this change so late in the game, but I'm willing to do it, /if/ I get enough positive feedback asap. I'm attaching a diff against the current CVS tree. Please try it and let me know. If I get enough positive responses with few or no negative responses, I'll add this ("enough" being defined completely subjectively :). -Barry -------------------- snip snip -------------------- Index: Mailman/Defaults.py.in =================================================================== RCS file: /cvsroot/mailman/mailman/Mailman/Defaults.py.in,v retrieving revision 1.124 diff -u -r1.124 Defaults.py.in --- Mailman/Defaults.py.in 2000/11/09 02:00:30 1.124 +++ Mailman/Defaults.py.in 2000/11/14 16:38:16 @@ -310,7 +310,15 @@ from: list at listme.com from: .*@uplinkpro.com """ -# Replies to posts inherently directed to list or original sender? + +# Mailman can be configured to "munge" Reply-To: headers for any passing +# messages. One the one hand, there are a lot of good reasons not to munge +# Reply-To: but on the other, people really seem to want this feature. See +# the help for reply_goes_to_list in the web UI for links discussing the +# issue. +# 0 - Reply-To: not munged +# 1 - Reply-To: set back to the list +# 2 - Reply-To: set to an explicit value (reply_to_address) DEFAULT_REPLY_GOES_TO_LIST = 0 # SUBSCRIBE POLICY Index: Mailman/MailList.py =================================================================== RCS file: /cvsroot/mailman/mailman/Mailman/MailList.py,v retrieving revision 1.188 diff -u -r1.188 MailList.py --- Mailman/MailList.py 2000/11/14 04:44:01 1.188 +++ Mailman/MailList.py 2000/11/14 16:38:18 @@ -424,13 +424,21 @@ is strongly recommended for most mailing lists.''', # Details for reply_goes_to_list - """There are many reasons not to introduce headers like -Reply-To: into other people's messages. One is that some posters -depend on their own Reply-To: settings to convey their valid return -address. See + """This option controls what Mailman does to the +Reply-To: header in messages flowing through this mailing list. When +set to Poster, no Reply-To: header is added by Mailman, +although if one is present in the original message, it is not stripped. +Setting this value to either This list or Explicit address +causes Mailman to insert a specific Reply-To: header in all messages, +overriding in the original message if necessary. + +

There are many reasons not to introduce or override the Reply-To: +header. One is that some posters depend on their own Reply-To: +settings to convey their valid return address. Another is that modifying +Reply-To: makes it much more difficult to send private replies. See `Reply-To' Munging -Considered Harmful for a general discussion of this issue. See -Reply-To +Considered Harmful for a general discussion of this issue. See Reply-To Munging Considered Useful for a dissenting opinion.

Some mailing lists have restricted posting privileges, with a parallel list Index: Mailman/Handlers/CookHeaders.py =================================================================== RCS file: /cvsroot/mailman/mailman/Mailman/Handlers/CookHeaders.py,v retrieving revision 1.17 diff -u -r1.17 CookHeaders.py --- Mailman/Handlers/CookHeaders.py 2000/10/27 18:55:21 1.17 +++ Mailman/Handlers/CookHeaders.py 2000/11/14 16:38:19 @@ -76,11 +76,8 @@ msg['Precedence'] = 'bulk' # # Reply-To: munging. Do not do this if the message is "fast tracked", - # meaning it is internally crafted and delivered to a specific user, - # or if there is already a reply-to set. If the user has set - # one we assume they have a good reason for it, and we don't - # second guess them. - if not fasttrack and not msg.get('reply-to'): + # meaning it is internally crafted and delivered to a specific user. + if not fasttrack: # Set Reply-To: header to point back to this list if mlist.reply_goes_to_list == 1: msg['Reply-To'] = mlist.GetListEmail() From frush at ale.ftc.agilent.com Tue Nov 14 18:22:42 2000 From: frush at ale.ftc.agilent.com (Ray Frush) Date: Tue, 14 Nov 2000 10:22:42 -0700 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Re: Mailman-Users digest, Vol 1 #870 - 2 msgs References: <20001114170146.9D8861D16F@dinsdale.python.org> Message-ID: <3A1174E2.F0236153@ale.ftc.agilent.com> > I've slept on this one and I'm prepared to change things for 2.0 final > so that if Reply-To munging is turned on, it'll override any existing > Reply-To field in the original message. The deciding factor for me > was realizing how difficult it was to send private replies with > munging turned on, so it might as well be equally difficult for every > poster. If Reply-to munging is enabled, I would expect that it would really munge. That is, if you turn on the feature, it will ALWAYS exhibit the behaviour. In the current version, Reply-To: munging appears broken because it appears to work part of the time. Count this as a vote to enable the much debated Reply-to munging that will override any client (MUA) Reply-to settings. -- Ray Frush "Either you are part of the solution, T:970.288.6223 or part of the precipitate." -*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*- Agilent Technologies IT | Technical Computing | Fort Collins Site From robh at uunet.co.za Tue Nov 14 18:34:38 2000 From: robh at uunet.co.za (Rob Hunter) Date: Tue, 14 Nov 2000 19:34:38 +0200 (SAST) Subject: [Mailman-Users] more odd errors (fwd) Message-ID: Hi I'm hoping someone has a suggestion for me as to how to fix this problem. It was suggested that the problem was being caused by Postfix, and I sent a mail or 2 to the postfix list. They in turn suggested that it's a mailman problem. To confirm this, I killed the postfix process and started up exim (I'd recently moved from exim to Postfix so I still had a working installation). I get the following error from Exim: 2000-11-14 19:30:57 unexpected disconnection while reading SMTP data from localhost.fingers.co.za (snow.fingers.co.za) [127.0.0.1] This is specifically when qrunner cron runs (I disabled the cron and ran it manually for debugging purposes). If there's any other logs that you'd like me to check, or anything else to try, please let me know. Regards --Rob ---------- Forwarded message ---------- Date: Fri, 10 Nov 2000 20:04:53 +0200 (SAST) From: Rob Hunter To: mailman-users at python.org Subject: [Mailman-Users] more odd errors Hi there I seemed to fix my last problem by deleting 1 or 2 files from qfiles/ with suspect email addresses. (sounds odd I know, but it worked). I'm getting this currently: Nov 02 00:18:11 2000 (88613) All recipients refused: please run connect() first Nov 02 00:18:12 2000 (88613) smtp for 16 recips, completed in 611.111 seconds Nov 02 00:20:46 2000 (88613) All recipients refused: please run connect() first Nov 02 00:38:59 2000 (88854) All recipients refused: please run connect() first And: Oct 31 16:42:24 2000 (79341) -1 herman.kramer at za.didata.com (ignore) Oct 31 16:42:24 2000 (79341) -1 mozzie at netactive.co.za (ignore) Oct 31 16:42:24 2000 (79341) -1 mark.mcintyre at za.didata.com (ignore) Oct 31 16:42:24 2000 (79341) -1 jianni at iafrica.com (ignore) Oct 31 16:42:24 2000 (79341) -1 pauli at icon.co.za (ignore) Once again, qrunner lockfiles persist, 'cos qrunner can't successfully complete, and the viscious circle starts again. I'm running FreeBSD 4.1--STABLE with postfix-19991231.08 and mailman-2.0b5_1. Any suggestions? Regards --Rob ------------------------------------------------------ Mailman-Users maillist - Mailman-Users at python.org http://www.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users From dj-mailman at insigma.com Tue Nov 14 18:37:54 2000 From: dj-mailman at insigma.com (James Aylett) Date: Tue, 14 Nov 2000 17:37:54 +0000 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Re: Mailman-Users digest, Vol 1 #870 - 2 msgs In-Reply-To: <3A1174E2.F0236153@ale.ftc.agilent.com>; from Ray Frush on Tue, Nov 14, 2000 at 10:22:42AM -0700 References: <20001114170146.9D8861D16F@dinsdale.python.org> <3A1174E2.F0236153@ale.ftc.agilent.com> Message-ID: <20001114173754.P24873@insigma.com> On Tue, Nov 14, 2000 at 10:22:42AM -0700, Ray Frush wrote: > If Reply-to munging is enabled, I would expect that it would really > munge. That is, if you turn on the feature, it will ALWAYS exhibit the > behaviour. In the current version, Reply-To: munging appears broken > because it appears to work part of the time. I'm inclined to agree. The current behaviour isn't actually terribly useful, because if you're using it to encourage traffic back to the list (a) it won't really do its job, (b) that's more an MUA issue. If you're using it to scoop a gateway address into a list, it won't help, because the list won't be mentioned anywhere if the sender had Reply-To: set. This could again be considered an MUA issue (some MUA's detect lists by, eg, List-Id, whereas others just look for the To/Cc address). Alternatively, you could hack the alias to the list in the To: line to be the canonical list address, in the MLM. Not sure if this is worse; I'd suspect that done carefully it's actually much, much better. Things would get interesting if we got into encapsulated messages going to the list, where playing with a header could mess up the encapsulation, but I doubt that will happen. I can't think of another reason to munge Reply-To. So my vote would have to be forceful munging. J -- /--------------------------------------------------------------------------\ james aylett chief technical architect http://www.tangozebra.com/ tangozebra _____________________________________________________________________ This message has been checked for all known viruses by Star Internet delivered through the MessageLabs Virus Control Centre. For further information visit http://www.star.net.uk/stats.asp From jam at jamux.com Tue Nov 14 18:47:41 2000 From: jam at jamux.com (John A. Martin) Date: Tue, 14 Nov 2000 12:47:41 -0500 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Help: AttributeError: web_page_url In-Reply-To: <20001111195606.9C78D48031@athene.jamux.com> ("John A. Martin"; Sat, 11 Nov 2000 14:56:06 -0500) Message-ID: <20001114174741.558A748031@athene.jamux.com> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 >>>>> "jam" == John A Martin >>>>> "[Mailman-Users] Help: AttributeError: web_page_url" >>>>> Sat, 11 Nov 2000 14:56:06 -0500 Here is the resolution of the problem. Maybe this will prevent a bum steer for someone searching the archives and perhaps help more generally. jam> After upgrading apache from the Red Hat 6.2 jam> apache-1.3.12-2.i386.rpm to apache-1.3.14-2.6.2.i386.rpm it jam> seems to be impossible to access the Mailman web interface. It turned out that only web access to the .../mailman/listinfo/ page and _any_ access to a single mailing list were impossible. The problem proved to be unrelated to the apache upgrade but rather induced by a contemporaneous "No space left on device" condition which tickled a known bug in Mailman 1.1. Below are the significant portions of the initial error indication. jam> -------------- cut here ---->8 ---< head jam> Bug in Mailman version 1.1 jam> Traceback (innermost last): jam> [[ ... ]] jam> File "/home/mailman/Mailman/MailList.py", line 853, in jam> CheckValues jam> if self.web_page_url and self.web_page_url[-1] != '/': jam> AttributeError: web_page_url jam> ---- 8<------- cut here ----------> tail While 'bin/check_db' over all lists said all were fine, 'python -i withlist -l' on the problem list gave the same traceback as above. Then, following the suggestion, >>>>> "BAW" == Barry A Warsaw wrote: BAW> .... I'd make a copy of the config.db file, and then BAW> copy config.db.last to config.db. If the .last file BAW> is okay, your list should be back in production, ... all was well. Thanks Barry! jam -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.0.4 (GNU/Linux) Comment: OpenPGP encrypted mail preferred. See iEYEARECAAYFAjoReqYACgkQUEvv1b/iXy8tIACghMB5PMZWFPcj1VnoLPg1diks 4O4AoIw2Ec9iewauNdxRtNw4cPrrWB+E =xp1M -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- From robh at uunet.co.za Tue Nov 14 18:48:04 2000 From: robh at uunet.co.za (Rob Hunter) Date: Tue, 14 Nov 2000 19:48:04 +0200 (SAST) Subject: [Mailman-Users] mirrors Message-ID: Hi I'd decided to try and upgrade to see if that maybe fixes my problem (currently using mailman-2.0beta5). I get timeouts while trying to pull the file off download.sourceforge.net. Any other mirrors? Are any more mirrors needed? Regards --Rob From chuqui at plaidworks.com Tue Nov 14 18:51:13 2000 From: chuqui at plaidworks.com (Chuq Von Rospach) Date: Tue, 14 Nov 2000 09:51:13 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Why can't I set mailman to bounce non-member posts? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: At 1:21 AM -0800 11/14/00, Mo DeJong wrote: > >If there no way to tell mailman to just >reject posts from non-members without >putting them in the admin queue? not at this time. It's on the Todo list. -- Chuq Von Rospach - Plaidworks Consulting (mailto:chuqui at plaidworks.com) Apple Mail List Gnome (mailto:chuq at apple.com) Be just, and fear not. From chuqui at plaidworks.com Tue Nov 14 18:49:53 2000 From: chuqui at plaidworks.com (Chuq Von Rospach) Date: Tue, 14 Nov 2000 09:49:53 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Re: [Mailman-Developers] Re: Reverting question In-Reply-To: <14865.27405.857124.313441@anthem.concentric.net> References: <14865.27405.857124.313441@anthem.concentric.net> Message-ID: At 11:40 AM -0500 11/14/00, Barry A. Warsaw wrote: >That's the key thing that I don't like about Reply-To munging: it >makes it much more difficult to do private replies. Maybe it's just >the lists I manage, but my users are just as heated about /not/ doing >reply-to munging as apparently other users on other lists are about >doing it. It's a religious issue to some level, but I've done any number of studies (at least half a dozen) on it with my users over the years. I've never found *any* list or user population where the majority wants reply-to coerced. What you really end up with, if you survey the *entire* user base, is a noisy minority that wants it, and that minority is under 20-25% of those that have opinions. So what ends up happening is that because they're the ones making noise, the list gets set that way. But if you survey the entire user base and get a non-biased sample, they're the minority viewpoint (the same is true of Subject line tweaks, like the [Mailman-users] flag. Only with those, I've never found a list where even 5% of the users wanted it, and there's usually a solid majority that hate the damn things.... But again, you tend to run into noisy minorites that push their preferences, and unless you take the time to go out and run formal list surveys (which are time consuming), it's hard to tell whether it is a squeaky wheel or whether it's a list consensus... >The only grumblings occur when people don't >trim their CC headers (like I've done here) and folks start getting >duplicates. Another vocal minority. Less than 1% of a typical subscriber base cares about this. Those that do tend to be very sensitive to it and vocal, but whacking the server for that group isn't a smart idea (IMHO), since there are client ways of doing it, like message-ID trapping. > That can be handled in other ways (e.g. the list /could/ >suppress deliveries to list members that it sees explicitly in the >recipients list, although as we've discussed before, that has some >potential for abuse). True, but it's what I'd like to see happen down the road, at least as a configuration option for the server admin. If you know they're getting it direct, why send them a second copy? or maybe tag this to a users "metoo" flag? If they've told the server not to send them copies of their own posts, assume they also don't want duplicates? That might be the easiest way, and leave it by default off, but then users can set it if they care. >I've slept on this one and I'm prepared to change things for 2.0 final >so that if Reply-To munging is turned on, it'll override any existing >Reply-To field in the original message. The deciding factor for me >was realizing how difficult it was to send private replies with >munging turned on, so it might as well be equally difficult for every >poster. I think that's the right thing to do, and it sets you in line with how other MLMs work, so it better matches user expectations, I think... It's a touch issue, because there are personal preferences, because Reply-to is used for different things (not always correctly), and because it just plain old isn't all that well defined as a header, despite it's long-standing usage... -- Chuq Von Rospach - Plaidworks Consulting (mailto:chuqui at plaidworks.com) Apple Mail List Gnome (mailto:chuq at apple.com) Be just, and fear not. From chuqui at plaidworks.com Tue Nov 14 18:50:49 2000 From: chuqui at plaidworks.com (Chuq Von Rospach) Date: Tue, 14 Nov 2000 09:50:49 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Using Mailman for an alert service In-Reply-To: <3A1152B9.46DC36FE@fermi.ioppublishing.com> References: <3A1152B9.46DC36FE@fermi.ioppublishing.com> Message-ID: At 2:56 PM +0000 11/14/00, Chris Brown wrote: >Is it possible to set Mailman up to run an automated alerts distribution >service? Posting to the list by subscribers is completely disabled. A >program/script is used to generate and send a message to the list at >specific times. sure can. Simply set up the "posting" address to point to a mailbot reminding folks its not a discussion list, and then post via some non-public address. Set it moderated to catch stuff that might filter in. Fairly easy to do. -- Chuq Von Rospach - Plaidworks Consulting (mailto:chuqui at plaidworks.com) Apple Mail List Gnome (mailto:chuq at apple.com) Be just, and fear not. From edgar at mathcs.emory.edu Tue Nov 14 19:23:13 2000 From: edgar at mathcs.emory.edu (Edgar Leon) Date: Tue, 14 Nov 2000 13:23:13 -0500 (EST) Subject: [Mailman-Users] Header Message-ID: <200011141823.NAA22955@cssun.mathcs.emory.edu> I have a simple question about the header sent by Mailman: I would like to delete the header below or to move it to the end of the message: >List-Help: >List-Post: >List-Subscribe: , >List-Id: List of Third Party Companies >List-Unsubscribe: , >List-Archive: http://lists.????.com/mailman/private/thirdpartylist/ I have an account on Hostway.com. They limit a mail alias to only 4 entries. They have a graphical interface with only 4 fields and tech support says that there is no way around it. They recommend Mailman if you want to create an alias with more than 4 entries. I am using use Mailman as an alias rather than a list. I don't want the users to subscribe or unsubscribe to this list. I checked the FAQ at list.org and could not find the solution. Thanks. Edgar From chuqui at plaidworks.com Tue Nov 14 19:32:48 2000 From: chuqui at plaidworks.com (Chuq Von Rospach) Date: Tue, 14 Nov 2000 10:32:48 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Header In-Reply-To: <200011141823.NAA22955@cssun.mathcs.emory.edu> References: <200011141823.NAA22955@cssun.mathcs.emory.edu> Message-ID: At 1:23 PM -0500 11/14/00, Edgar Leon wrote: >I have a simple question about the header sent by Mailman: > >I would like to delete the header below or to move it to the end of the >message: those headers are to support RFC2369. I'd encourage you to NOT dink with them. If you delete them, you lose support for these new standards. if you try to move them to the end of the message, they're no longer message headers (!). To do this -- you'd have to modify the source. you don't want to do this.... -- Chuq Von Rospach - Plaidworks Consulting (mailto:chuqui at plaidworks.com) Apple Mail List Gnome (mailto:chuq at apple.com) Be just, and fear not. From bob at nleaudio.com Tue Nov 14 19:42:01 2000 From: bob at nleaudio.com (Bob Puff@NLE) Date: Tue, 14 Nov 2000 13:42:01 -0500 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Header References: <200011141823.NAA22955@cssun.mathcs.emory.edu> Message-ID: <3A118779.FF2B34BE@nleaudio.com> I would also like to lose the extra mailman headers, or at least trim them down to something manageable. I have all that info in the footer, so there's no need for it in the headers (which simply take up more disk space, and aren't viewed by most users). Bob From tneff at bigfoot.com Tue Nov 14 20:15:04 2000 From: tneff at bigfoot.com (Tom Neff) Date: Tue, 14 Nov 2000 14:15:04 -0500 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Re: reply munging In-Reply-To: <20001114170149.12C7A1D177@dinsdale.python.org> Message-ID: <3548695322.974211304@NY110-19-024B.bloomberg.com> > That's the key thing that I don't like about Reply-To munging: it > makes it much more difficult to do private replies. And for others, the key thing is that with private replies by default, potentially interesting group discussions are stillborn because people are unaware that instead of making a public comment, they just whispered to one person. That's why LIST ADMIN CONTROL is more important than unilaterally forcing one particular "right way" down everybody's throats. Admins should have this choice, and not be bludgeoned by one side of a religious question. From tneff at bigfoot.com Tue Nov 14 20:29:26 2000 From: tneff at bigfoot.com (Tom Neff) Date: Tue, 14 Nov 2000 14:29:26 -0500 Subject: [Mailman-Users] PATCH: Prevent 'demime' from swallowing envelope "From_" In-Reply-To: <20001114170149.12C7A1D177@dinsdale.python.org> Message-ID: <3549557291.974212166@NY110-19-024B.bloomberg.com> As promised (a day late), here is the patch for demime. Demime is the most powerful tool I know about for extracting PLAIN TEXT from mail messages with any of the following problems: * Binary attachments (winmail.dat, my_dog_skip.jpg, ruinyerpc.exe); * Multipart "Outlook-Ese" bundles of plain text, HTML, and/or Rich Text repeating the same message content; * Text messages sent in ONLY rich text or HTML. The author is Nick Simicich and the latest version is available at http://scifi.squawk.com/demime.html . My patch, based on demime 0.97b, addresses one small point: When you feed demime a full Unix-formatted mail message including the leading "From_" or "Envelope From" header line, it swallows it, which can complicate subsquent processing if you use demime as one "stage" of a mail processing pipe. This patch saves the "envelope from" if it is seen, and re-emits it at the beginning of the output message. I freely release it for Nick or other users to do anything they want. Hopefully nothing is line-wrapped to illegibity below. *** demime.orig Wed Aug 23 11:38:27 2000 --- demime Tue Nov 14 14:07:49 2000 *************** *** 1,5 **** --- 1,7 ---- #! /usr/bin/perl -wT + # Patched to pass through envelope "From_" - 11/14/2000 tneff + # The following changes are likely to make "taint" much happier. $ENV{'PATH'} = '/bin:/usr/bin:/sbin:/usr/sbin'; *************** *** 886,897 **** } ! sub parsehead (\@\$\$\%\@\%\@) { # Parse header producing keyed list of headers and other # indexes to headers. Also folds lines to single line. # Used on main header and section headers in mime sections. use strict; ! # die "Wrong number of args to parsehead." if (@_ != 7); ! my ($mail, $endhead, $fromhead, $headtypes, $headarr, $head, $headkey) = @_; my $line; my $l; my $lag = ""; --- 888,899 ---- } ! sub parsehead (\@\$\$\%\@\%\@\$) { # Parse header producing keyed list of headers and other ### tneff # indexes to headers. Also folds lines to single line. # Used on main header and section headers in mime sections. use strict; ! # die "Wrong number of args to parsehead." if (@_ != 8); ### tneff ! my ($mail, $endhead, $fromhead, $headtypes, $headarr, $head, $headkey, $envfrom) = @_; ### tneff my $line; my $l; my $lag = ""; *************** *** 920,925 **** --- 922,928 ---- $headarr->[$#{$headarr}] = $head->{$lag, $i}; # Replace last array element with continuation } elsif ($line=~ /^from\s([^ ]*)/i) { $$fromhead = $1; + $$envfrom = $line; } } while (defined $mail->[$$endhead] and $mail->[$$endhead] =~ /^$/) { *************** *** 950,962 **** no strict; } ! sub headout (\@\%$) { # Headout prints a structured, reformatted header use strict; ! my ($headkey, $head, $deferred_message) = @_; my $line; my $tline; my @line; my ($i, $j, $k, $hkl); for($i = 0; $i < @$headkey; $i += 3) { # print "$i $headkey->[$i+2]: $headkey->[$i+1]\n"; $j = 0; --- 953,966 ---- no strict; } ! sub headout (\@\%$$) { # Headout prints a structured, reformatted header ### tneff use strict; ! my ($headkey, $head, $deferred_message, $envfrom) = @_; ### tneff my $line; my $tline; my @line; my ($i, $j, $k, $hkl); + mail_print ($envfrom) if $envfrom; ### tneff for($i = 0; $i < @$headkey; $i += 3) { # print "$i $headkey->[$i+2]: $headkey->[$i+1]\n"; $j = 0; *************** *** 1316,1323 **** my $recurdepth = shift; my $inhead = shift; my @routine = (); ! my $endhead; my $fromhead; my %headtypes; my @headarr; my %head; my @headkey; my @head; ! parsehead(@$inhead, $endhead, $fromhead, %headtypes, @head, %head, @headkey); if(defined $head{'content-type', 0} and $head{'content-type',0} =~ /^multipart\/alternative;.*?(boundary)=(?:(")([^"]*?)(")|([^;]+)(?:[;]|$))/ i) { # nothing # # print "Quote = $2, delimiter = $3, Quote = $4, 5 = $5, 6 = $6, 7 = $7\n"; --- 1320,1327 ---- my $recurdepth = shift; my $inhead = shift; my @routine = (); ! my $endhead; my $fromhead; my %headtypes; my @headarr; my %head; my @headkey; my @head; my $envfrom; ### tneff ! parsehead(@$inhead, $endhead, $fromhead, %headtypes, @head, %head, @headkey, $envfrom); if(defined $head{'content-type', 0} and $head{'content-type',0} =~ /^multipart\/alternative;.*?(boundary)=(?:(")([^"]*?)(")|([^;]+)(?:[;]|$))/ i) { # nothing # # print "Quote = $2, delimiter = $3, Quote = $4, 5 = $5, 6 = $6, 7 = $7\n"; *************** *** 1387,1392 **** --- 1391,1397 ---- my %headtypes = (); my @headkey = (); my $fromhead = ""; + my $envfrom = ""; ### tneff my $endhead = $[; *************** *** 1395,1401 **** # Parse out the mainline mail header. ! parsehead(@$mail, $endhead, $fromhead, %headtypes, @head, %head, @headkey); my $content_transfer_encoding = $head{'content-transfer-encoding', 0}; --- 1400,1406 ---- # Parse out the mainline mail header. ! parsehead(@$mail, $endhead, $fromhead, %headtypes, @head, %head, @headkey, $envfrom); ### tneff my $content_transfer_encoding = $head{'content-transfer-encoding', 0}; *************** *** 1461,1467 **** # return &EX_OK; # } # end untested code ! headout(@headkey, %head, $deferred_message); mail_print "\n"; textout([ @{$mail}[$endhead..$#{$mail}] ], $content_transfer_encoding); --- 1466,1472 ---- # return &EX_OK; # } # end untested code ! headout(@headkey, %head, $deferred_message, $envfrom); ### tneff mail_print "\n"; textout([ @{$mail}[$endhead..$#{$mail}] ], $content_transfer_encoding); *************** *** 1472,1478 **** my ($saverich) = split(/;/,$head{'content-type',0}); $head{'content-type',0} = "text/plain; charset=\"us-ascii\""; adj_msgid if $recurdepth == 1; ! headout(@headkey, %head, $deferred_message); mail_print "X-Converted-To-Plain-Text: from $saverich by $main::demime_version\n\n"; my @body = @{$mail}[$endhead..$#{$mail}]; richout(\@body, $content_transfer_encoding); --- 1477,1483 ---- my ($saverich) = split(/;/,$head{'content-type',0}); $head{'content-type',0} = "text/plain; charset=\"us-ascii\""; adj_msgid if $recurdepth == 1; ! headout(@headkey, %head, $deferred_message, $envfrom); ### tneff mail_print "X-Converted-To-Plain-Text: from $saverich by $main::demime_version\n\n"; my @body = @{$mail}[$endhead..$#{$mail}]; richout(\@body, $content_transfer_encoding); *************** *** 1484,1490 **** $head{'content-type',0} = "text/plain; charset=\"us-ascii\""; adj_msgid if $recurdepth == 1; ! headout(@headkey, %head, $deferred_message); mail_print "X-Converted-To-Plain-Text: from $saverich by $main::demime_version\n\n"; htmlout([@{$mail}[$endhead..$#{$mail}]],$content_transfer_encoding); --- 1489,1495 ---- $head{'content-type',0} = "text/plain; charset=\"us-ascii\""; adj_msgid if $recurdepth == 1; ! headout(@headkey, %head, $deferred_message, $envfrom); ### tneff mail_print "X-Converted-To-Plain-Text: from $saverich by $main::demime_version\n\n"; htmlout([@{$mail}[$endhead..$#{$mail}]],$content_transfer_encoding); *************** *** 1496,1502 **** $head{'content-type',0} = "text/plain; charset=\"us-ascii\""; adj_msgid if $recurdepth == 1; ! headout(@headkey, %head, $deferred_message); mail_print "X-Converted-To-Plain-Text: from $saverich by $main::demime_version\n\n"; my @body = @{$mail}[$endhead..$#{$mail}]; --- 1501,1507 ---- $head{'content-type',0} = "text/plain; charset=\"us-ascii\""; adj_msgid if $recurdepth == 1; ! headout(@headkey, %head, $deferred_message, $envfrom); ### tneff mail_print "X-Converted-To-Plain-Text: from $saverich by $main::demime_version\n\n"; my @body = @{$mail}[$endhead..$#{$mail}]; *************** *** 1535,1541 **** my ($saverich) = split(/;/,$head{'content-type',0}); $head{'content-type',0} = "text/plain; charset=\"us-ascii\""; adj_msgid if $recurdepth == 1; ! headout(@headkey, %head, $deferred_message); mail_print "X-Converted-To-Plain-Text: from $saverich by $main::demime_version\n"; mail_print ("X-Converted-To-Plain-Text: Alternative section used was ", $sections[$winsect]->[2],"\n\n"); --- 1540,1546 ---- my ($saverich) = split(/;/,$head{'content-type',0}); $head{'content-type',0} = "text/plain; charset=\"us-ascii\""; adj_msgid if $recurdepth == 1; ! headout(@headkey, %head, $deferred_message, $envfrom); ### tneff mail_print "X-Converted-To-Plain-Text: from $saverich by $main::demime_version\n"; mail_print ("X-Converted-To-Plain-Text: Alternative section used was ", $sections[$winsect]->[2],"\n\n"); *************** *** 1546,1553 **** my @headarr = (); my %head = (); my @headkey = (); parsehead(@{$sections[$winsect]->[4]}, ! $endhead, $fromhead, %headtypes, @head, %head, @headkey); &{$routine[$winval]}($sections[$winsect]->[3], $head{'content-transfer-encoding',0}); --- 1551,1559 ---- my @headarr = (); my %head = (); my @headkey = (); + my $envfrom = ""; ### tneff parsehead(@{$sections[$winsect]->[4]}, ! $endhead, $fromhead, %headtypes, @head, %head, @headkey, $envfrom); ### tneff &{$routine[$winval]}($sections[$winsect]->[3], $head{'content-transfer-encoding',0}); *************** *** 1601,1607 **** # print "The winning section has $winval\n"; $head{'content-type',0} = "text/plain; charset=\"us-ascii\""; adj_msgid if $recurdepth == 1; ! headout(@headkey, %head, $deferred_message); mail_print "X-Converted-To-Plain-Text: from $saverich by $main::demime_version\n"; mail_print ("X-Converted-To-Plain-Text: Alternative section used was ", $sections[$winsect]->[2],"\n\n"); --- 1607,1613 ---- # print "The winning section has $winval\n"; $head{'content-type',0} = "text/plain; charset=\"us-ascii\""; adj_msgid if $recurdepth == 1; ! headout(@headkey, %head, $deferred_message, $envfrom); ### tneff mail_print "X-Converted-To-Plain-Text: from $saverich by $main::demime_version\n"; mail_print ("X-Converted-To-Plain-Text: Alternative section used was ", $sections[$winsect]->[2],"\n\n"); *************** *** 1615,1622 **** my @headarr = (); my %head = (); my @headkey = (); parsehead(@{$sections[$i]->[4]}, ! $endhead, $fromhead, %headtypes, @head, %head, @headkey); if(defined $selval{$s}) { # if(defined $head{"content-transfer-encoding",0}) { # my $cte = lc $head{'content-transfer-encoding',0}; --- 1621,1629 ---- my @headarr = (); my %head = (); my @headkey = (); + my $envfrom = ""; ### tneff parsehead(@{$sections[$i]->[4]}, ! $endhead, $fromhead, %headtypes, @head, %head, @headkey, $envfrom); ### tneff if(defined $selval{$s}) { # if(defined $head{"content-transfer-encoding",0}) { # my $cte = lc $head{'content-transfer-encoding',0}; From m at whiteywillpay.net Tue Nov 14 20:53:01 2000 From: m at whiteywillpay.net (Matt Singerman) Date: Tue, 14 Nov 2000 14:53:01 -0500 (EST) Subject: [Mailman-Users] useful documentation? Message-ID: Hello all, I am trying to find some documentation about Mailman itself, and basically how it is set up on a server, how lists are maintained on the server, and so on. I have found some information on using it from a user's perspective and the list owner's, but not from the server administrator's perspective. Forgive me if I am missing some obvious webpage, but can someone please point me in the right direction? Many thanks. Matt Singerman | "Don't feel sad, I'm in heaven now, m at whiteywillpay.net | singing with the pretty angels" http://whiteywillpay.net/ | -- JonBenet Ramsey From vikas98 at hotmail.com Tue Nov 14 20:59:19 2000 From: vikas98 at hotmail.com (Vikas Gupta) Date: Tue, 14 Nov 2000 19:59:19 GMT Subject: [Mailman-Users] Re: Mailman private archives issue. Message-ID: Hmm, i tried what you suggested below. Did you change anything in your httpd.conf? vikas >From: Andrea Mennucci >To: Vikas Gupta >CC: mailman-users at python.org >Subject: [Mailman-Users] Re: Mailman private archives issue. >Date: Tue, 14 Nov 2000 15:46:48 +0100 > > >I am cross posting this answer to mailman-users > >On Fri, Nov 10, 2000 at 11:02:47PM +0000, Vikas Gupta wrote: > > Hello, > > I found youur posting on the Mailman-Users archives. YOu describe not >being > > able to see private archives on the web. I am also having the same >problem. > > I was wondering if you had found a solution and could share it with me. > > > > > >my problem was due to the way mailman is >installed in Debian/GNU Linux > >I have solved the problem > >I corrected in the file /etc/mailman/mm_cfg.py > >in this way: > >- PRIVATE_ARCHIVE_URL = '/mailman/private' >+ PRIVATE_ARCHIVE_URL = '/cgi-bin/mailman/private' > >now it works as advertised > > > > > >-- >Andrea C. Mennucci, Scuola Normale Superiore, Pisa, Italy > >------------------------------------------------------ >Mailman-Users maillist - Mailman-Users at python.org >http://www.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users From vikas98 at hotmail.com Tue Nov 14 21:01:11 2000 From: vikas98 at hotmail.com (Vikas Gupta) Date: Tue, 14 Nov 2000 20:01:11 GMT Subject: [Mailman-Users] Re: Mailman private archives issue. Message-ID: (sorry if this was posted twice). I tried your solution below. Did you change/add anything to your httpd.conf file? bikas >From: Andrea Mennucci >To: Vikas Gupta >CC: mailman-users at python.org >Subject: [Mailman-Users] Re: Mailman private archives issue. >Date: Tue, 14 Nov 2000 15:46:48 +0100 > > >I am cross posting this answer to mailman-users > >On Fri, Nov 10, 2000 at 11:02:47PM +0000, Vikas Gupta wrote: > > Hello, > > I found youur posting on the Mailman-Users archives. YOu describe not >being > > able to see private archives on the web. I am also having the same >problem. > > I was wondering if you had found a solution and could share it with me. > > > > > >my problem was due to the way mailman is >installed in Debian/GNU Linux > >I have solved the problem > >I corrected in the file /etc/mailman/mm_cfg.py > >in this way: > >- PRIVATE_ARCHIVE_URL = '/mailman/private' >+ PRIVATE_ARCHIVE_URL = '/cgi-bin/mailman/private' > >now it works as advertised > > > > > >-- >Andrea C. Mennucci, Scuola Normale Superiore, Pisa, Italy > >------------------------------------------------------ >Mailman-Users maillist - Mailman-Users at python.org >http://www.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users From jwblist at olympus.net Tue Nov 14 21:33:16 2000 From: jwblist at olympus.net (John W Baxter) Date: Tue, 14 Nov 2000 12:33:16 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Re: [Mailman-Developers] Reverting question In-Reply-To: <14864.54917.27112.665096@anthem.concentric.net> References: <14864.52862.465404.35651@anthem.concentric.net> <3A108AAB.25143.6018DAE@localhost> <14864.54917.27112.665096@anthem.concentric.net> Message-ID: At 1:07 -0500 11/14/00, Barry A. Warsaw wrote: >I'm surprised. I would think that munging reply-to is only useful for >lists of people who don't know how to drive their MUAs. Is the >problem just that they got used to one way of doing things, and now >there's a different way? That I can sympathize with. Is it that >suddenly, some people are getting two copies of messages because >people don't know how to trim their headers? Yeah, that sucks. I'm not on such a list (we're expecting to switch to Mailman when it settles down). But I would be perturbed if on a single list sometimes the Reply button sets up a reply to the list and sometimes it sets up a private reply. [I can--and do--deal with both kinds of list, and both are a nuisance some of the time.] The idea that Reply's result on a single list depends on who* sent the message seems like a faulty solution to the unsolvable problem that neither reply-goes-to-the-list nor reply-goes-to-the-sender is right. [Right would take mindreading: reply goes where I expect *this* reply to go.] *Or, even worse, where a given person was were when the message was sent. --John -- John Baxter jwblist at olympus.net Port Ludlow, WA, USA From fingers at fingers.co.za Tue Nov 14 22:09:05 2000 From: fingers at fingers.co.za (fingers) Date: Tue, 14 Nov 2000 23:09:05 +0200 (SAST) Subject: [Mailman-Users] port for FreeBSD Message-ID: Hi Is there anyone on the list who uses FreeBSD and is able to update the port? Current port is for beta6, but I see latest rc is rc2. Regards --Rob From m at whiteywillpay.net Tue Nov 14 22:18:08 2000 From: m at whiteywillpay.net (Matt Singerman) Date: Tue, 14 Nov 2000 16:18:08 -0500 (EST) Subject: [Mailman-Users] port for FreeBSD In-Reply-To: Message-ID: We run Mailman 1.2 here on a FreeBSD 3.4-STABLE system. It is increidbly stable, and most problems are user-related :) Odds are, if you want to install RC2, you should be running FreeBSD 4.1.x, and just compile it from source. Matt Singerman | "Don't feel sad, I'm in heaven now, m at whiteywillpay.net | singing with the pretty angels" http://whiteywillpay.net/ | -- JonBenet Ramsey On Tue, 14 Nov 2000, fingers wrote: > Hi > > Is there anyone on the list who uses FreeBSD and is able to update the > port? Current port is for beta6, but I see latest rc is rc2. > > Regards > > --Rob > > > ------------------------------------------------------ > Mailman-Users maillist - Mailman-Users at python.org > http://www.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users > From katana at montrose.net Wed Nov 15 02:07:27 2000 From: katana at montrose.net (James McLaughlin) Date: Tue, 14 Nov 2000 17:07:27 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Very new...have ???'s Message-ID: I have been reading through the docs concerning Mailman and I have a few questions: . Sendmail is the oldest and most widely-used MTA, and comes pre-installed on most Unix systems, however it is not the recommended MTA to use with Mailman. What sort of things am I going to miss out on if I use sendmail. Since I am fairly new to adminning bigger sites....mailman is something I need for my server, but I am questiontive about what sort of performance hit I am going to take useing Sendmail instead of Qmail or Postfix.... Can someone explain what I am going to encounter using sendmail rather than one of the new ones. James From johnblock at storeshop.com Tue Nov 14 17:48:05 2000 From: johnblock at storeshop.com (John Block) Date: Tue, 14 Nov 2000 16:48:05 +0000 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Re: Reverting question In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Hello Chuq Thank you for clearing up the TLAs. > In general I'm against coercing Reply-To. Strongly. Who is coercing? By just having the sender as a reply option, the software is stopping the none technical from replying to the list. The more aware are caused irritation as they can't simply hit their "r" button. If you can't reply publically easily, for a lot of people the motivations to reply are removed. There is no name in print on the screen, no look how clever I am, no visible penny in the help bank so i can get help in return > But there are times when it's the right/necessary thing to do, so you > want that option. In general yous houldn't use it, but sometimes you > need it. In other words it should be a togglable feature. One classic case is a mailing list under NDA discussing a > beta software release, where all e-mail has to be logged and > evaluated, That should be the case on any help list, so people can search archives before needlessly bothering everyone else with something which has been solved already. Thanks, John From jburley at kuci.org Wed Nov 15 02:21:04 2000 From: jburley at kuci.org (Joshua Burley) Date: Tue, 14 Nov 2000 17:21:04 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Archiving error Message-ID: <20001115012105.191A71CD59@dinsdale.python.org> I'm getting the following error while trying to archive... any ideas? What's causing this? # bin/arch staff Traceback (innermost last): File "bin/arch", line 129, in ? main() File "bin/arch", line 118, in main archiver.processUnixMailbox(fp, Article) File "/u1/pkg/mailman-2.0rc2/Mailman/Archiver/pipermail.py", line 521, in processUnixMailbox a = articleClass(m, self.sequence) File "/u1/pkg/mailman-2.0rc2/Mailman/Archiver/HyperArch.py", line 224, in __init__ self.cenc = string.lower(cenc) TypeError: read-only character buffer, None .josh Josh Burley josh at kuci.org "Jesus saves, Allah forgives, Cthulu thinks you'd make a nice sandwich." From midnight at the-oasis.net Wed Nov 15 02:43:35 2000 From: midnight at the-oasis.net (Phil Barnett) Date: Tue, 14 Nov 2000 20:43:35 -0500 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Re: [Mailman-Developers] Re: Reverting question In-Reply-To: <14865.27405.857124.313441@anthem.concentric.net> Message-ID: <3A11A3F7.18327.A4C5ED2@localhost> On 14 Nov 2000, at 11:40, Barry A. Warsaw wrote: > I'm concerned about making this change so late in the game, but I'm > willing to do it, /if/ I get enough positive feedback asap. I'm > attaching a diff against the current CVS tree. Please try it and let > me know. If I get enough positive responses with few or no negative > responses, I'll add this ("enough" being defined completely > subjectively :). I absolutely respect your desire for the route of least munging. I also clearly see the need to have replyto totally munged. I am happy that you have described the simple patch that makes it work the way I need it. My suggestion is to make this a software selection and let the mailing list manager decide exactly the depth of munging desired. That allows everyone to get what they need. -- Phil Barnett mailto:midnight at the-oasis.net WWW http://www.the-oasis.net/ FTP Site ftp://ftp.the-oasis.net From jburley at kuci.org Wed Nov 15 02:44:39 2000 From: jburley at kuci.org (Joshua Burley) Date: Tue, 14 Nov 2000 17:44:39 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Archival - more info Message-ID: <20001115014440.3DC421D079@dinsdale.python.org> I'm using qmail on my system, and the weird part is, messages that originate from off of the machine archive fine, but those from the same machine do not. I've also tried setting the archive directories world--writable (just to see if that was the problem) and it did not help. .josh Josh Burley josh at kuci.org "Jesus saves, Allah forgives, Cthulu thinks you'd make a nice sandwich." From marc_news at valinux.com Wed Nov 15 02:50:12 2000 From: marc_news at valinux.com (Marc MERLIN) Date: Tue, 14 Nov 2000 17:50:12 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Re: [Mailman-Developers] Reverting question In-Reply-To: <20001114165748.B3475@uow.edu.au>; from simon@uow.edu.au on Tue, Nov 14, 2000 at 04:57:49PM +1100 References: <14864.52862.465404.35651@anthem.concentric.net> <3A108AAB.25143.6018DAE@localhost> <20001114165748.B3475@uow.edu.au> Message-ID: <20001114175012.T27544@marc.merlins.org> On Tue, Nov 14, 2000 at 04:57:49PM +1100, Simon Coggins wrote: > I have to agree here. Not being able to override the reply-to: fields on > lists is a *MAJOr* problem. I've also had this problem with my lists. And I > was hoping for a 'fix' but it looks like it's intended behaviour?. The irony of this coming back over and over again... http://www.unicom.com/pw/reply-to-harmful.html 1) Don't set a reply-to in your lists (see above link) 2) If you don't want to take that advise, you certainly shouldn't overwrite a users' reply to with the list's 3) If you insist in doing the above 2, you can patch the code Marc -- Microsoft is to operating systems & security .... .... what McDonalds is to gourmet cooking Home page: http://marc.merlins.org/ | Finger marc_f at merlins.org for PGP key From claw at kanga.nu Wed Nov 15 03:02:02 2000 From: claw at kanga.nu (J C Lawrence) Date: Tue, 14 Nov 2000 18:02:02 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Very new...have ???'s In-Reply-To: Message from "James McLaughlin" of "Tue, 14 Nov 2000 17:07:27 PST." References: Message-ID: <5579.974253722@kanga.nu> On Tue, 14 Nov 2000 17:07:27 -0800 James McLaughlin wrote: > Sendmail is the oldest and most widely-used MTA, and comes > pre-installed on most Unix systems, however it is not the > recommended MTA to use with Mailman. > What sort of things am I going to miss out on if I use sendmail. > Since I am fairly new to adminning bigger sites....mailman is > something I need for my server, but I am questiontive about what > sort of performance hit I am going to take useing Sendmail instead > of Qmail or Postfix.... You won't lose anything in using Sendmail, not in terms of features not working or things breaking. What you lose are the comparitive benefits of the other MTAs. Things like easier/spiffier configurations, performance/scalability etc. -- J C Lawrence Home: claw at kanga.nu ---------(*) Other: coder at kanga.nu http://www.kanga.nu/~claw/ Keys etc: finger claw at kanga.nu --=| A man is as sane as he is dangerous to his environment |=-- From chuqui at plaidworks.com Wed Nov 15 03:13:53 2000 From: chuqui at plaidworks.com (Chuq Von Rospach) Date: Tue, 14 Nov 2000 18:13:53 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Re: [Mailman-Developers] Reverting question In-Reply-To: <20001114175012.T27544@marc.merlins.org> References: <14864.52862.465404.35651@anthem.concentric.net> <3A108AAB.25143.6018DAE@localhost> <20001114165748.B3475@uow.edu.au> <20001114175012.T27544@marc.merlins.org> Message-ID: At 5:50 PM -0800 11/14/00, Marc MERLIN wrote: >2) If you don't want to take that advise, you certainly shouldn't overwrite > a users' reply to with the list's I'll disagree. If you feel you must coerce reply-to, coerce it unconditionally. You've already decided the list's needs outweigh the individual's needs, or you woudln't be coercing in the first place Once you make that decision, whether or not the user ALSO uses a reply-to is meaningless, and trying to take that into consideration only confuses things, because then the list has its reply-to coerced -- sometimes, and you have to know how to read mail headers ot figure out when. Not good for the typical user, who may never figure out why something isn't working randomly. -- Chuq Von Rospach - Plaidworks Consulting (mailto:chuqui at plaidworks.com) Apple Mail List Gnome (mailto:chuq at apple.com) Be just, and fear not. From satyap at satya.virtualave.net Wed Nov 15 03:18:35 2000 From: satyap at satya.virtualave.net (Satya) Date: Wed, 15 Nov 2000 07:48:35 +0530 (IST) Subject: [Mailman-Users] Header In-Reply-To: <3A118779.FF2B34BE@nleaudio.com> Message-ID: On Nov 14, 2000 at 13:42, Bob Puff at NLE wrote: >I would also like to lose the extra mailman headers, or at least trim >them down to something manageable. I have all that info in the footer, >so there's no need for it in the headers (which simply take up more disk >space, and aren't viewed by most users). Those headers are for the RFC. There is not point putting it in the footers. The MUA is supposed to look at the headers and provide appropriate functions. Pine provides a link to 'list management functions' at the bottom of the message. Putting the same stuff in the footer actually takes more disk space, depending how you do it. -- Satya. US-bound grad students! For pre-apps, see The more I learn about the Internet, the more amazed I am that it works at all. From njs at scifi.squawk.com Wed Nov 15 01:31:07 2000 From: njs at scifi.squawk.com (Nick Simicich) Date: Tue, 14 Nov 2000 19:31:07 -0500 Subject: [demime-l] Re: [Mailman-Users] Re: Demime is what's killing my archives!!! In-Reply-To: <20001112140749.Z21681@oven.com> References: <3.0.3.32.20001112100424.018d4220@127.0.0.1> <3238082517.973900691@[192.168.0.2]> <3A0CDA40.195B6A57@nleaudio.com> <3.0.3.32.20001112100424.018d4220@127.0.0.1> Message-ID: <3.0.3.32.20001114193107.01315fc8@127.0.0.1> At 02:07 PM 11/12/2000 -0500, Bennett Todd wrote: > >2000-11-12-10:04:24 Nick Simicich: >> Tom's suggestion [ wrap demime in something to save the From >> line ] is a good quick hack, but has a problem. It will hide >> demime's return code. > >How about if it were coded like > >listname: "|(read f;echo $f;exec /path/to/demime-)|/path/to/mailman/wrapper ..." > >Seems to me that wrapping ought to pass the From line along, then >leave the rest of the job to demime, with no extra processes left >around cluttering up the symbol table, or concealing exit codes. This is what I used to recommend. However, I discovered that any demime failure would be hidden and only the RC from the last process in the stage would count. What is new in 98a is that you can specify a syntax like demime '|other-program' and demime will report either its own rc or the rc of the other program if one is non-zero. -- We will fight for bovine freedom, And hold our large heads high. We will run free, with the buffalo or die! Cows with Guns. - Dana Lyons, Cows With Guns Nick Simicich mailto:njs at scifi.squawk.com http://scifi.squawk.com/njs.html -- Stop by and Light Up The World! From Dan.Mick at West.Sun.COM Wed Nov 15 03:48:04 2000 From: Dan.Mick at West.Sun.COM (Dan Mick) Date: Tue, 14 Nov 2000 18:48:04 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Mailman-Users] Re: [Mailman-Developers] Reverting question Message-ID: <200011150246.SAA26058@utopia.west.sun.com> > At 5:50 PM -0800 11/14/00, Marc MERLIN wrote: > >2) If you don't want to take that advise, you certainly shouldn't overwrite > > a users' reply to with the list's > > I'll disagree. If you feel you must coerce reply-to, coerce it > unconditionally. You've already decided the list's needs outweigh the > individual's needs, or you woudln't be coercing in the first place > Once you make that decision, whether or not the user ALSO uses a > reply-to is meaningless, and trying to take that into consideration > only confuses things, because then the list has its reply-to coerced > -- sometimes, and you have to know how to read mail headers ot figure > out when. Not good for the typical user, who may never figure out why > something isn't working randomly. I have to agree with Chuq; all or nothing seems to be the only sane policy. (and I'm a big Reply-To hater.) From gleblanc at cu-portland.edu Wed Nov 15 05:27:14 2000 From: gleblanc at cu-portland.edu (Gregory Leblanc) Date: 15 Nov 2000 12:27:14 +0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Re: [Mailman-Developers] Reverting question In-Reply-To: <20001114175012.T27544@marc.merlins.org> References: <14864.52862.465404.35651@anthem.concentric.net> <3A108AAB.25143.6018DAE@localhost> <20001114165748.B3475@uow.edu.au> <20001114175012.T27544@marc.merlins.org> Message-ID: <200011150427.eAF4REH20639@peecee.linuxweasel.com> > On Tue, Nov 14, 2000 at 04:57:49PM +1100, Simon Coggins wrote: > > I have to agree here. Not being able to override the reply-to: fields on > > lists is a *MAJOr* problem. I've also had this problem with my lists. And I > > was hoping for a 'fix' but it looks like it's intended behaviour?. > > The irony of this coming back over and over again... > http://www.unicom.com/pw/reply-to-harmful.html Fine, that's all well and good, munging reply to is harmful. Sometimes the harm that it causes is less than the harm that it prevents. > 1) Don't set a reply-to in your lists (see above link) This is a good policy in most cases, but there ARE some where it doesn't make sense. > 2) If you don't want to take that advise, you certainly shouldn't overwrite > a users' reply to with the list's I'm sorry, but this is silly. If you're going to write reply-to headers via your MLM, you need to write them ALL the time, otherwise you end up with strange and un-predictable behaviour. Keep the reply-to header certainly, but if headers are sending mail back to the list, the user's reply-to really doesn't make much difference, unless you need to send a private reply. If you're sending a private reply, you can get it out of the x-reply-to header. Greg From lovelace at wayfarer.org Wed Nov 15 05:42:53 2000 From: lovelace at wayfarer.org (Tanner Lovelace) Date: Tue, 14 Nov 2000 23:42:53 -0500 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Re: Reverting question References: <14864.52862.465404.35651@anthem.concentric.net> <3A108AAB.25143.6018DAE@localhost> <20001114165748.B3475@uow.edu.au> <20001114175012.T27544@marc.merlins.org> Message-ID: <3A12144D.64C33371@wayfarer.org> Marc MERLIN wrote: > > The irony of this coming back over and over again... > http://www.unicom.com/pw/reply-to-harmful.html One good URL deserves another (straight from the "reply_goes_to_list Option" documentation): http://www.metasystema.org/essays/reply-to-useful.mhtml There are arguments on both sides for this issue. I personally think it depends a lot on what the people on your list prefer. I run a large non-technical mailing list where we tried making the "Reply-To" point to the list for a while. Unfortunately, it resulted in someone accidentally posting a very unflattering message about someone else on the list. Since, this is a non-technical list (actually it's about as non-technical as you can get since it's a list for medieval recreationist list), I can't assume that people will automatically understand the ramifications of the "Reply-To" header so I decided that for my list it would be better to have the "Reply-To" not point to the list. For other lists, however, I think it could be advantageous. Because of that, I think that letting the list administrator decide, rather than the software, is the best method. I also think, though, that sometimes setting the "Reply-To" and sometimes not, depending on whether or not it has already been set has the potential to confuse a lot of people. If you're going to provide *that* functionality, you should make sure it is *extremely* well documented. Tanner Lovelace P.S. I'm kind of curious as to how many people use Mailman with qmail. Are there any statistics on this? I haven't been able to find any. -- Tanner Lovelace lovelace at wayfarer.org http://wtl.wayfarer.org/ Cthulu for President. Why settle for the lesser evil? From claw at kanga.nu Wed Nov 15 05:50:15 2000 From: claw at kanga.nu (J C Lawrence) Date: Tue, 14 Nov 2000 20:50:15 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Re: [Mailman-Developers] Reverting question In-Reply-To: Message from Gregory Leblanc of "15 Nov 2000 12:27:14 +0800." <200011150427.eAF4REH20639@peecee.linuxweasel.com> References: <14864.52862.465404.35651@anthem.concentric.net> <3A108AAB.25143.6018DAE@localhost> <20001114165748.B3475@uow.edu.au> <20001114175012.T27544@marc.merlins.org> <200011150427.eAF4REH20639@peecee.linuxweasel.com> Message-ID: <21313.974263815@kanga.nu> On 15 Nov 2000 12:27:14 +0800 Gregory Leblanc wrote: > I'm sorry, but this is silly. If you're going to write reply-to > headers via your MLM, you need to write them ALL the time, > otherwise you end up with strange and un-predictable behaviour. > Keep the reply-to header certainly, but if headers are sending > mail back to the list, the user's reply-to really doesn't make > much difference, unless you need to send a private reply. If > you're sending a private reply, you can get it out of the > x-reply-to header. This depends on your reasons for reply-to munging. For instance, enforcing reply-to overwriting removes the ability of a poster to control where followup discussion of a post which is posted to multiple reply-to setting lists will occur. Is this always useful? Certainly not. Is it ever sometimes useful? Certainly, especially if given an email proficient userbase (I've seen this technique used to good effect in engineering depts). Which is better? Depends on your needs. Which should Mailman default to? Probably overwriting reply-to is the better (more common/popular) choice. Is there an advantage to offering yet another config option? I'd say, "Yes". -- J C Lawrence Home: claw at kanga.nu ---------(*) Other: coder at kanga.nu http://www.kanga.nu/~claw/ Keys etc: finger claw at kanga.nu --=| A man is as sane as he is dangerous to his environment |=-- From chuqui at plaidworks.com Wed Nov 15 06:22:49 2000 From: chuqui at plaidworks.com (Chuq Von Rospach) Date: Tue, 14 Nov 2000 21:22:49 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Re: Reverting question In-Reply-To: <3A12144D.64C33371@wayfarer.org> References: <14864.52862.465404.35651@anthem.concentric.net> <3A108AAB.25143.6018DAE@localhost> <20001114165748.B3475@uow.edu.au> <20001114175012.T27544@marc.merlins.org> <3A12144D.64C33371@wayfarer.org> Message-ID: At 11:42 PM -0500 11/14/00, Tanner Lovelace wrote: >There are arguments on both sides for this issue. I >personally think it depends a lot on what the people >on your list prefer. But you need to be wary of making the mistake of "who's making noise" being "what the people on the list prefer". Becaues I've found, if I survey my lists, that the ones making the noise *don't* represent the overall preferences of the list, but are instead a noisy minority. Just because someone's complaining doesn't mean they're right.... -- Chuq Von Rospach - Plaidworks Consulting (mailto:chuqui at plaidworks.com) Apple Mail List Gnome (mailto:chuq at apple.com) Be just, and fear not. From claw at kanga.nu Wed Nov 15 06:44:48 2000 From: claw at kanga.nu (J C Lawrence) Date: Tue, 14 Nov 2000 21:44:48 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Re: Reverting question In-Reply-To: Message from Chuq Von Rospach of "Tue, 14 Nov 2000 21:22:49 PST." References: <14864.52862.465404.35651@anthem.concentric.net> <3A108AAB.25143.6018DAE@localhost> <20001114165748.B3475@uow.edu.au> <20001114175012.T27544@marc.merlins.org> <3A12144D.64C33371@wayfarer.org> Message-ID: <26367.974267088@kanga.nu> On Tue, 14 Nov 2000 21:22:49 -0800 Chuq Von Rospach wrote: > At 11:42 PM -0500 11/14/00, Tanner Lovelace wrote: >> There are arguments on both sides for this issue. I personally >> think it depends a lot on what the people on your list prefer. > But you need to be wary of making the mistake of "who's making > noise" being "what the people on the list prefer". Becaues I've > found, if I survey my lists, that the ones making the noise > *don't* represent the overall preferences of the list, but are > instead a noisy minority. Just because someone's complaining > doesn't mean they're right.... I've found the same statistics. That said, I've deliberately decided to comply with the noisy moinority view for the worst of reasons: I value the contributions of certain members of that minority highly (they occupy useful/divergent views or represent intellectually significant factions of the list topic), and, quite simply, the majority do not disagree enough to act on it (leave the list). An ugly trade-off, but one that (seems to) work. -- J C Lawrence Home: claw at kanga.nu ---------(*) Other: coder at kanga.nu http://www.kanga.nu/~claw/ Keys etc: finger claw at kanga.nu --=| A man is as sane as he is dangerous to his environment |=-- From marc_news at valinux.com Wed Nov 15 07:34:41 2000 From: marc_news at valinux.com (Marc MERLIN) Date: Tue, 14 Nov 2000 22:34:41 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Re: [Mailman-Developers] Reverting question In-Reply-To: <3A11F004.13A1BCDF@nleaudio.com>; from bob@nleaudio.com on Tue, Nov 14, 2000 at 09:08:04PM -0500 References: <14864.52862.465404.35651@anthem.concentric.net> <3A108AAB.25143.6018DAE@localhost> <20001114165748.B3475@uow.edu.au> <20001114175012.T27544@marc.merlins.org> <14864.52862.465404.35651@anthem.concentric.net> <3A108AAB.25143.6018DAE@localhost> <20001114165748.B3475@uow.edu.au> <20001114175012.T27544@marc.merlins.org> <3A11F004.13A1BCDF@nleaudio.com> Message-ID: <20001114223441.G9163@marc.merlins.org> [Reply-To set to mailman-users at python.org] On Tue, Nov 14, 2000 at 06:13:53PM -0800, Chuq Von Rospach wrote: > At 5:50 PM -0800 11/14/00, Marc MERLIN wrote: > >2) If you don't want to take that advise, you certainly shouldn't overwrite > > a users' reply to with the list's > > I'll disagree. If you feel you must coerce reply-to, coerce it > unconditionally. You've already decided the list's needs outweigh the A few others mentionned that. The problem here, is that by putting a reply-to, you are already trying to prevent me from replying directly to the poster (well, not quite since mutt lets me tell it to ignore all those reply-tos), but by munging reply tos unconditionally, you are completely preventing me from replying to someone who has a non valid from address and set a good reply-to, or someone who'd like me to reply to him at another address. Doing a reply-to rewrite also prevents me from Ccing a second list and setting a reply-to there to move the discussion. That said, I could see why others would prefer unconditionally overwriting the reply-to. Well, in both cases, you lose, which is yet another reason why lists should not set a reply-to :-) I think I agree with JC in saying that short of removing the reply to misfeature altogether, unconditional rewriting should probably be an option On Wed, Nov 15, 2000 at 12:27:14PM +0800, Gregory Leblanc wrote: > Fine, that's all well and good, munging reply to is harmful. Sometimes > the harm that it causes is less than the harm that it prevents. I've yet to have a single person show me what harm not munging reply-to creates... It's all about users that have been trained to do the wrong thing and some of them who then believe it's the only way to go. > This is a good policy in most cases, but there ARE some where it doesn't > make sense. Yep, the only one I know is onelist which tries to force as many traffic back to the list in order to spam you with more messages which each contain a small add they make money on. Ok, more seriously, the only downside of group replies is that for MUAs that don't support list-reply, like mutt does, the sender gets two copies of the answer (which are easy to get rid off by removing duplicate messages that contain the same message id) > I'm sorry, but this is silly. If you're going to write reply-to headers > via your MLM, you need to write them ALL the time, otherwise you end up > with strange and un-predictable behaviour. Keep the reply-to header Point taken. The other option is wrong too though, for the reason I explained. But I guess if you choose to shoot yourself in the foot, it'd be nice to be able to chose which gun you're going to use (i.e. make the unconditional rewriting an option) > certainly, but if headers are sending mail back to the list, the user's > reply-to really doesn't make much difference, unless you need to send a > private reply. If you're sending a private reply, you can get it out of > the x-reply-to header. Great, I need to patch my MUA some more to attempt to deal with all this misconfiguration nonsense. On Tue, Nov 14, 2000 at 11:42:53PM -0500, Tanner Lovelace wrote: > Marc MERLIN wrote: > > > > The irony of this coming back over and over again... > > http://www.unicom.com/pw/reply-to-harmful.html > > One good URL deserves another (straight from the > "reply_goes_to_list Option" documentation): > > http://www.metasystema.org/essays/reply-to-useful.mhtml Yeah, except that the author is full of shit. Ok, I'll bite. - "Reply-To gives the respondant an option which would not otherwise exist: namely the ability to reply only to the list." false, see list-reply function in good MUAs (mutt is one) - "If you use a reasonable mailer, Reply-To munging does provide new functionality, namely the ability to reply only to the list" No comment... (the author completely ignores list-reply, and says that MUAs should all be patched to allow overriding reply-tos so that they can continue to be misused) - "Reply-To munging adds additional functionality, it actually increases freedom of choice" *cough* bullshit *cough* For one, it prevents a thread across two lists and the redirection to one list or a third list. - some mailers apparently do not have a separate reply to all function Ok, 1) I have yet to see one 2) in the point above, the author was saying that any MUA that can't override a reply-to is not a reasonable mailer and shouldn't be used. The irony... - "For discussion type lists, I would estimate that ninety percent of the time, people want to reply to the list" Yeah, so? That's why you have several reply functions, where one does not require more work than the other (the author mentions having to type addresses by hand, I'm not sure why) - "Some administrators claim that munging Reply-To headers is harmful because it surprises people, and can cause damage when things go awry" Damn straight. If you reply to the list by mistake due to reply-to munging, you look like an idiot, or worse. If you reply to the sender only by mistake, no harm is done, the mistake can be fixed. - "It's What People Want" Yeah, there are misguided people out there, and they are often vocal. Users typically know nothing about mail standards or what header sender vs envelope sender means. I don't think there opinion is that relevant :-) Ok, more seriously, users do matter but if they're trained the wrong way when they start, some get very resistant to change, regardless of whether it's a good thing or not. We did get a bit off topic here, I apologize to all the people who already know about all this, but since we have lots of listmasters here, I'm hoping a few with switch, and hopefully more will configure their lists the right way in the first place (that's when it's easy, changing is hard) > There are arguments on both sides for this issue. I personally think it > depends a lot on what the people on your list prefer. I run a large > non-technical mailing list where we tried making the "Reply-To" point to > the list for a while. Unfortunately, it resulted in someone accidentally > posting a very unflattering message about someone else on the list. Yep, this happens all the time. Many of us have seen this. > the "Reply-To" not point to the list. For other lists, however, I think > it could be advantageous. Because of that, I think that letting the list > administrator decide, rather than the software, is the best method. While I'm very much against reply-to munging (duh!), I'm for freedom of choice. I do think that mailman should offer a reply-to option, but with a very big disclaimer and maybe this discussion (or another one) so that inexperienced listmasters realize what they're doing. > I also think, though, that sometimes setting the "Reply-To" and sometimes > not, depending on whether or not it has already been set has the > potential to confuse a lot of people. If you're going to provide *that* > functionality, you should make sure it is *extremely* well documented. Agreed. Marc -- Microsoft is to operating systems & security .... .... what McDonalds is to gourmet cooking Home page: http://marc.merlins.org/ | Finger marc_f at merlins.org for PGP key From claw at kanga.nu Wed Nov 15 07:57:21 2000 From: claw at kanga.nu (J C Lawrence) Date: Tue, 14 Nov 2000 22:57:21 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Re: [Mailman-Developers] Reverting question In-Reply-To: Message from Marc MERLIN of "Tue, 14 Nov 2000 22:34:41 PST." <20001114223441.G9163@marc.merlins.org> References: <14864.52862.465404.35651@anthem.concentric.net> <3A108AAB.25143.6018DAE@localhost> <20001114165748.B3475@uow.edu.au> <20001114175012.T27544@marc.merlins.org> <14864.52862.465404.35651@anthem.concentric.net> <3A108AAB.25143.6018DAE@localhost> <20001114165748.B3475@uow.edu.au> <20001114175012.T27544@marc.merlins.org> <3A11F004.13A1BCDF@nleaudio.com> <20001114223441.G9163@marc.merlins.org> Message-ID: <32332.974271441@kanga.nu> On Tue, 14 Nov 2000 22:34:41 -0800 Marc MERLIN wrote: > Ok, more seriously, the only downside of group replies is that for > MUAs that don't support list-reply, like mutt does, the sender > gets two copies of the answer (which are easy to get rid off by > removing duplicate messages that contain the same message id) On *-ix platforms which have procmail/formail. Windows, MacOS, and BeOS users, to name but a few, have slightly more difficulty on this area. Sad, but true. >> http://www.metasystema.org/essays/reply-to-useful.mhtml > Yeah, except that the author is full of shit. Key points: This argument is a FAQ I've yet to see a single case where someone has been persuaded by the arguments of the other side once the argument has begun. Now, can we get on with some more productive discussions, like how vi users are scum-sucking brainless cretins and emacs users are the obviously intelligent few who can see and use true brilliance? > I do think that mailman should offer a reply-to option, but with a > very big disclaimer and maybe this discussion (or another one) so > that inexperienced listmasters realize what they're doing. I note that this is already done. > Microsoft is to operating systems & security Now, about them silly sendmail users... -- J C Lawrence Home: claw at kanga.nu ---------(*) Other: coder at kanga.nu http://www.kanga.nu/~claw/ Keys etc: finger claw at kanga.nu --=| A man is as sane as he is dangerous to his environment |=-- From marc_news at valinux.com Wed Nov 15 08:39:43 2000 From: marc_news at valinux.com (Marc MERLIN) Date: Tue, 14 Nov 2000 23:39:43 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Re: [Mailman-Developers] Reverting question In-Reply-To: <32332.974271441@kanga.nu>; from claw@kanga.nu on Tue, Nov 14, 2000 at 10:57:21PM -0800 References: <20001114175012.T27544@marc.merlins.org> <14864.52862.465404.35651@anthem.concentric.net> <3A108AAB.25143.6018DAE@localhost> <20001114165748.B3475@uow.edu.au> <20001114175012.T27544@marc.merlins.org> <3A11F004.13A1BCDF@nleaudio.com> <20001114223441.G9163@marc.merlins.org> <32332.974271441@kanga.nu> Message-ID: <20001114233943.B21148@marc.merlins.org> On Tue, Nov 14, 2000 at 10:57:21PM -0800, J C Lawrence wrote: > I've yet to see a single case where someone has been persuaded by > the arguments of the other side once the argument has begun. I've been on several lists that have been converted away from reply-to munging. I've never been on any list that was converted to reply-to munging. 'nuf said. > > I do think that mailman should offer a reply-to option, but with a > > very big disclaimer and maybe this discussion (or another one) so > > that inexperienced listmasters realize what they're doing. > > I note that this is already done. I'm basically replying to the list to apologize on this issue. Indeed mailman already gives plenty of warning about this, I just never saw the configuration help page > > Microsoft is to operating systems & security > > Now, about them silly sendmail users... Troll :-) Marc -- Microsoft is to operating systems & security .... .... what McDonalds is to gourmet cooking Home page: http://marc.merlins.org/ | Finger marc_f at merlins.org for PGP key From chuqui at plaidworks.com Wed Nov 15 08:31:27 2000 From: chuqui at plaidworks.com (Chuq Von Rospach) Date: Tue, 14 Nov 2000 23:31:27 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Re: [Mailman-Developers] Reverting question In-Reply-To: <32332.974271441@kanga.nu> References: <14864.52862.465404.35651@anthem.concentric.net> <3A108AAB.25143.6018DAE@localhost> <20001114165748.B3475@uow.edu.au> <20001114175012.T27544@marc.merlins.org> <14864.52862.465404.35651@anthem.concentric.net> <3A108AAB.25143.6018DAE@localhost> <20001114165748.B3475@uow.edu.au> <20001114175012.T27544@marc.merlins.org> <3A11F004.13A1BCDF@nleaudio.com> <20001114223441.G9163@marc.merlins.org> <32332.974271441@kanga.nu> Message-ID: At 10:57 PM -0800 11/14/00, J C Lawrence wrote: > I've yet to see a single case where someone has been persuaded by > the arguments of the other side once the argument has begun. isn't this where someone's supposed to call the other a fascist and make a spurious Hitler reference? >Now, can we get on with some more productive discussions, like how >vi users are scum-sucking brainless cretins and emacs users are the >obviously intelligent few who can see and use true brilliance? What's the difference between an emacs user and a vi user? Give each a file and a set of changes. the vi user sits down and hacks in the changes, and goes to lunch. the emacs user sits down and writes a macro that'll make the changes while he's at lunch. At the end, they both have the changed file, but the emacs user has a macro he'll put in his library and never use again. > > Microsoft is to operating systems & security First, get an OS that doesn't hate you... >Now, about them silly sendmail users... (sticks out tongue) -- Chuq Von Rospach - Plaidworks Consulting (mailto:chuqui at plaidworks.com) Apple Mail List Gnome (mailto:chuq at apple.com) Be just, and fear not. From chuqui at plaidworks.com Wed Nov 15 08:33:39 2000 From: chuqui at plaidworks.com (Chuq Von Rospach) Date: Tue, 14 Nov 2000 23:33:39 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Developers] Re: [Mailman-Users] Re: Reverting question In-Reply-To: <26367.974267088@kanga.nu> References: <14864.52862.465404.35651@anthem.concentric.net> <3A108AAB.25143.6018DAE@localhost> <20001114165748.B3475@uow.edu.au> <20001114175012.T27544@marc.merlins.org> <3A12144D.64C33371@wayfarer.org> <26367.974267088@kanga.nu> Message-ID: At 9:44 PM -0800 11/14/00, J C Lawrence wrote: >I've found the same statistics. That said, I've deliberately >decided to comply with the noisy moinority view for the worst of >reasons: I value the contributions of certain members of that >minority highly Not all users are created equal (and not all users like finding that out). You definitely identify your key users and try to make them happy, but I don't do that unquestioningly. Sometimes, even a key user gets too far out of hand, and you risk mutating them into trolls. >list). An ugly trade-off, but one that (seems to) work. It's not ugly at all. it's managing a group of people. The more a person contributes -- the more slack they get cut, and the more I value their opinion. What you put in, you get out. -- Chuq Von Rospach - Plaidworks Consulting (mailto:chuqui at plaidworks.com) Apple Mail List Gnome (mailto:chuq at apple.com) Be just, and fear not. From chuqui at plaidworks.com Wed Nov 15 08:47:51 2000 From: chuqui at plaidworks.com (Chuq Von Rospach) Date: Tue, 14 Nov 2000 23:47:51 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Re: [Mailman-Developers] Reverting question In-Reply-To: <20001114233943.B21148@marc.merlins.org> References: <20001114175012.T27544@marc.merlins.org> <14864.52862.465404.35651@anthem.concentric.net> <3A108AAB.25143.6018DAE@localhost> <20001114165748.B3475@uow.edu.au> <20001114175012.T27544@marc.merlins.org> <3A11F004.13A1BCDF@nleaudio.com> <20001114223441.G9163@marc.merlins.org> <32332.974271441@kanga.nu> <20001114233943.B21148@marc.merlins.org> Message-ID: At 11:39 PM -0800 11/14/00, Marc MERLIN wrote: >I've been on several lists that have been converted away from reply-to >munging. >I've never been on any list that was converted to reply-to munging. >'nuf said. I've actually experimented on my users. I've had lists that started with no reply-to, added it for a while, then removed it. And monitored preferences and problems. All my discussion lists are not coerced -- that's what people ended up preferring, and the problems are significantly lessened (we won't even get into vacation bots that get reply-toed onto the list and through thousands of messages onto the list before the admin wakes up....) > > Now, about them silly sendmail users... > >Troll :-) You rang? -- Chuq Von Rospach - Plaidworks Consulting (mailto:chuqui at plaidworks.com) Apple Mail List Gnome (mailto:chuq at apple.com) Be just, and fear not. From chuqui at plaidworks.com Wed Nov 15 08:45:43 2000 From: chuqui at plaidworks.com (Chuq Von Rospach) Date: Tue, 14 Nov 2000 23:45:43 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Re: [Mailman-Developers] Reverting question In-Reply-To: <20001114223441.G9163@marc.merlins.org> References: <14864.52862.465404.35651@anthem.concentric.net> <3A108AAB.25143.6018DAE@localhost> <20001114165748.B3475@uow.edu.au> <20001114175012.T27544@marc.merlins.org> <14864.52862.465404.35651@anthem.concentric.net> <3A108AAB.25143.6018DAE@localhost> <20001114165748.B3475@uow.edu.au> <20001114175012.T27544@marc.merlins.org> <3A11F004.13A1BCDF@nleaudio.com> <20001114223441.G9163@marc.merlins.org> Message-ID: I'll note for the record that the above subject line is a great example of why subject line munging is stupid.... But I digress, and haven't even started.... > >Ok, more seriously, the only downside of group replies is that for MUAs that >don't support list-reply, like mutt does, the sender gets two copies of the >answer (which are easy to get rid off by removing duplicate messages that >contain the same message id) And my research shows that only 1-2% of a typical user base cares -- and for those that do, it's fairly easily fixed on the client side, so I consider that a major non-issue. Although do think the MLM can be taught to be intelligent here, too. and I posted a note to -developers suggesting a way to extend the "metoo" flag in the user record to allow users to configure this if they care... >Point taken. The other option is wrong too though, for the reason I >explained. I think this entire argument explains why coercing reply-to is bogus -- because all of us, who happen to be fairly experienced in running lists and writing list software and (at the least) using lists -- can't even begin to agree on how it ought to be done. If there's that much disagreement on the basic issues surrounding it, then we really don't know how/why to use it properly, which means we shouldn't. IMHO, of course. But if reply-to were really useful, ti'd be obvious how to properly use it, and basically, it's not. Which is what started this whole thing, since the way Mailman does it is ambiguous. > > certainly, but if headers are sending mail back to the list, the user's > > reply-to really doesn't make much difference, unless you need to send a > > private reply. If you're sending a private reply, you can get it out of > > the x-reply-to header. > >Great, I need to patch my MUA some more to attempt to deal with all this >misconfiguration nonsense. What we *really* need is to fix this for real -- which means MUAs need to be taught to honor the List-Post header from RFC 2369, and that header gives the MUA the option to add a "reply to list" option, and that fixes things for real -- becase you now have reply-author, reply-list and reply-all. The big problem boils down to us trying to force reply-to to force what is relaly a tri-state operation into a two-state operation, and sort of by definition, there's no right way of doing that, because nyou can't squeeze three into two (period). > >- "If you use a reasonable mailer, Reply-To munging does provide new > functionality, namely the ability to reply only to the list" and "reasonable mailer" is defined as "any mailer that does things the way the author prefers them", I guess. >- "Reply-To munging adds additional functionality, it actually increases > freedom of choice" > *cough* bullshit *cough* Yes, it gives you the freedom to do exactly what the list admin wants, and only that. >- "For discussion type lists, I would estimate that ninety percent of the > time, people want to reply to the list" > Yeah, so? and even that -- isn't true. He ought to actually sit down and do scientific surveys instead of estimating... I know people hate real numbers because facts get in the way of their opinions, but.... >- "Some administrators claim that munging Reply-To headers is harmful because > it surprises people, and can cause damage when things go awry" > Damn straight. So it's the stupid user's fault that we made them do something they weren't expecting to do, and they got burnt by it... >- "It's What People Want" > Yeah, there are misguided people out there, again, that's an opinion. He ought to go find some facts to prove it. My facts disagree with him. -- Chuq Von Rospach - Plaidworks Consulting (mailto:chuqui at plaidworks.com) Apple Mail List Gnome (mailto:chuq at apple.com) Be just, and fear not. From ckwong at cuhk.edu.hk Wed Nov 15 09:48:22 2000 From: ckwong at cuhk.edu.hk (Wong Ching Kuen Frederick) Date: Wed, 15 Nov 2000 16:48:22 +0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] run add_members by nobody Message-ID: <02b101c04ee0$cf56ffc0$5544bd89@econ.cuhk.edu.hk> how can i set the permission such that i can run the add_members script by user nobody (the web server) even i use setgid, it say permission denied. thanx. fred From Mercedes.Cava at si.upct.es Wed Nov 15 14:24:41 2000 From: Mercedes.Cava at si.upct.es (Mercedes) Date: Wed, 15 Nov 2000 14:24:41 +0100 Subject: [Mailman-Users] lists privates Message-ID: <3A128E99.A792CF91@si.upct.es> Hi', what can I do to no permit the subscription to the list for all persons who don't already includes in the lists? -- ------------------------------------ From jfreeman at connix.com Wed Nov 15 15:08:54 2000 From: jfreeman at connix.com (Joshua S. Freeman) Date: Wed, 15 Nov 2000 09:08:54 -0500 (EST) Subject: [Mailman-Users] newbie question Message-ID: I apologize if this is already addressed somewhere else... I'm running into one of the problems addressed in the FAQ: "Q. What if I get "document contains no data" from the web server, or mail isn't getting delivered, or I see "Premature end of script headers" or "Mailman CGI error!!!" " In my case, I can bring up my listinfo page (http://monica.threeofus.com/mailman/listinfo/test) but if I try to click on the link for "Test administrative interface" at the bottom of that page, nothing happens for a while and then I get "document contains no data". I've read the relevant portion of the INSTALL file (as directed in the answer in the FAQ). I understand the part about setting --with-cgi-gid=nobody but I *don't* understand what to do wrt setting --with-mail-gid= ??? what should I look for in my /etc/passwd or /etc/groups file? what is the 'right' group id to set for mail?... I'm no guru... I need a little handholding here... TIA, J. From michel at ziobudda.net Wed Nov 15 17:27:47 2000 From: michel at ziobudda.net (michel) Date: Wed, 15 Nov 2000 17:27:47 +0100 (CET) Subject: [Mailman-Users] Q: R: to Re: Message-ID: is there a possibility to transform R: in Re: . I can not to say to my users to patch ther OE. Tnx Saluti al mondo intero, ed anche a quello parzialmente scremato. -- Michel Morelli michel at ziobudda.net ICQ UIN: 58351764 PR of Linux in Italy http://www.ziobudda.net http://www.linuxlab.it From a2m3 at Tonelli.sns.it Wed Nov 15 19:40:41 2000 From: a2m3 at Tonelli.sns.it (Andrea Mennucci) Date: Wed, 15 Nov 2000 19:40:41 +0100 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Re: Mailman private archives issue. In-Reply-To: <200011141459.GAA29829@gears.linuxave.net>; from rodrigo@linuxave.net on Tue, Nov 14, 2000 at 01:05:16PM -0100 References: <20001114154648.A21204@Tonelli.sns.it> <200011141459.GAA29829@gears.linuxave.net> Message-ID: <20001115194040.A1527@Tonelli.sns.it> hi as lonk as I can tell, I am able to use public archives (problem is, I have none... but when I had, I was able to) you have to add Alias /pipermail/ /var/lib/mailman/archives/public/ to /etc/apache/srm.conf I am sending you my file mm_cfg.py as well as the help that the Debian mantainer wrote On Tue, Nov 14, 2000 at 01:05:16PM -0100, Rodrigo Moya wrote: > Hi Andrea, > > > > > I am cross posting this answer to mailman-users > > > > On Fri, Nov 10, 2000 at 11:02:47PM +0000, Vikas Gupta wrote: > > > Hello, > > > I found youur posting on the Mailman-Users archives. YOu describe not being > > > able to see private archives on the web. I am also having the same problem. > > > I was wondering if you had found a solution and could share it with me. > > > > > > > > > > my problem was due to the way mailman is > > installed in Debian/GNU Linux > > > > I have solved the problem > > > > I corrected in the file /etc/mailman/mm_cfg.py > > > > in this way: > > > > - PRIVATE_ARCHIVE_URL = '/mailman/private' > > + PRIVATE_ARCHIVE_URL = '/cgi-bin/mailman/private' > > > and what about public archives? I mean, I can't make them work. In my mm_cfg.py > file, I've got: > > PUBLIC_ARCHIVE_URL = '/pipermail' > PRIVATE_ARCHIVE_URL = '/mailman/private' > > but /pipermail is not a valid path, I get always this error. I've also tried > changing it to /mailman/public but nothing, they still don't work. > > What setting have you got for the PUBLIC_ARCHIVE_URL thing? > > cheers > -- Andrea C. Mennucci, Scuola Normale Superiore, Pisa, Italy -------------- next part -------------- # -*- python -*- # Copyright (C) 1998 by the Free Software Foundation, Inc. # # This program is free software; you can redistribute it and/or # modify it under the terms of the GNU General Public License # as published by the Free Software Foundation; either version 2 # of the License, or (at your option) any later version. # # This program is distributed in the hope that it will be useful, # but WITHOUT ANY WARRANTY; without even the implied warranty of # MERCHANTABILITY or FITNESS FOR A PARTICULAR PURPOSE. See the # GNU General Public License for more details. # # You should have received a copy of the GNU General Public License # along with this program; if not, write to the Free Software # Foundation, Inc., 59 Temple Place - Suite 330, Boston, MA 02111-1307, USA. """This is the module which takes your site-specific settings. >From a raw distribution it should be copied to mm_cfg.py. If you already have an mm_cfg.py, be careful to add in only the new settings you want. The complete set of distributed defaults, with annotation, are in ./Defaults. In mm_cfg, override only those you want to change, after the from Defaults import * line (see below). Note that these are just default settings - many can be overridden via the admin and user interfaces on a per-list or per-user basis. Note also that some of the settings are resolved against the active list setting by using the value as a format string against the list-instance-object's dictionary - see the distributed value of DEFAULT_MSG_FOOTER for an example.""" ####################################################### # Here's where we get the distributed defaults. # from Defaults import * ############################################################## # Put YOUR site-specific configuration below, in mm_cfg.py . # # See Defaults.py for explanations of the values. # DEFAULT_HOST_NAME = 'Tonelli.sns.it' DEFAULT_URL = 'http://Tonelli.sns.it/cgi-bin/mailman' DELIVERED_BY_URL = '/doc/mailman/images/mailman.jpg' MAILMAN_OWNER = 'mailman-owner@%s' % DEFAULT_HOST_NAME PUBLIC_ARCHIVE_URL = '/pipermail' PRIVATE_ARCHIVE_URL = '/cgi-bin/mailman/private' USE_ENVELOPE_SENDER = 0 # Note - if you're looking for something that is imported from mm_cfg, but you # didn't find it above, it's probably in Defaults.py. -------------- next part -------------- Notes for the debian mailman package. ===================================== You can access the web interface of mailman on http:///cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo This may not work if your webserver does not allow symlinks in the cgi-bin directory. In this case (or in case you want to access mailman thru a shorter URL) you should add something like the following to your webserver configuration (this line is for apache): ScriptAlias /mailman/ /usr/lib/mailman/cgi-bin/ In this case you need to set the DEFAULT_URL in /etc/mailman/mm_cfg.py to http:///mailman/ for the cookie authentication code to work. The public archives are located in /var/lib/mailman/archives/public, you can create a symlink from /var/www if you like, or create an alias like the following: Alias /pipermail/ /var/lib/mailman/archives/public/ You can create new lists with the newlist command (you have to add the aliases it needs by hand to /etc/aliases or the corresponding database because mailman can not know about configuration of all MTA's, but newlist tells you about the alias it needs). Additionally you need a mailman-owner alias pointing probably to you. For users of exim: if you want to use the /etc/aliases file for mailman aliases, you'll need to specify a user=list line or something like that in the system_aliases director. If a broken image shows on your mailman html pages, it is probably because you don't have the /doc/ alias enabled in your webserver. Copy the /usr/share/doc/mailman/images/mailman.jpg to a place where your webserver can access it and modify the DELIVERED_BY_URL option accordingly in your mm_cfg.py (the default is '/doc/mailman/images/mailman.jpg'). Gergely Madarasz From micah at riseup.net Wed Nov 15 19:51:41 2000 From: micah at riseup.net (Micah Anderson) Date: Wed, 15 Nov 2000 10:51:41 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Default replies? Message-ID: <20001115105141.A13818@riseup.net> All my new lists are being created with the option "Where are replies to list messages directed? POSTER is strongly recommended for most mailinglists" set to "This list" instead of poster. I went into the Defaults.py file and found the following: # Replies to posts inherently directed to list or original sender? DEFAULT_REPLY_GOES_TO_LIST = 0 Which I would think is it - so I set it to 1 and then created a new list, but it was still set to "This list" am I setting this wrong? Is this the wrong setting? Thanks! Micah From edlau at ucf.ics.uci.edu Wed Nov 15 20:02:09 2000 From: edlau at ucf.ics.uci.edu (Edmund Lau) Date: Wed, 15 Nov 2000 11:02:09 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Mailman-Users] Bulk user changes? Message-ID: Thanks for everyone's help on the rc2 archive bug! Now for another question... I'm looking for a way to change list members' variables in a bulk fashion, similar to what bin/config_list does for lists. Anyone with tips? -Ed From Dan.Mick at west.sun.com Wed Nov 15 21:24:37 2000 From: Dan.Mick at west.sun.com (Dan Mick) Date: Wed, 15 Nov 2000 12:24:37 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Default replies? References: <20001115105141.A13818@riseup.net> Message-ID: <3A12F105.40236207@west.sun.com> Micah Anderson wrote: > > All my new lists are being created with the option "Where are replies to > list messages directed? POSTER is strongly recommended for most > mailinglists" set to "This list" instead of poster. I went into the > Defaults.py file and found the following: > > # Replies to posts inherently directed to list or original sender? > DEFAULT_REPLY_GOES_TO_LIST = 0 > > Which I would think is it - so I set it to 1 and then created a new list, > but it was still set to "This list" am I setting this wrong? Is this the > wrong setting? Did you also check mm_cfg.py? You are not supposed to change anything in Defaults.py, as the comments say, but rather in mm_cfg.py, as the comments again say. mm_cfg settings override Defaults settings. If it's not in mm_cfg.py, let's talk further. From Jason.DiCioccio at Epylon.com Wed Nov 15 22:49:09 2000 From: Jason.DiCioccio at Epylon.com (Jason DiCioccio) Date: Wed, 15 Nov 2000 13:49:09 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Personalized Emails Message-ID: <657B20E93E93D4118F9700D0B73CE3EA02428C@goofy.epylon.lan> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 Okay, I basically know what to do for this however I'm having trouble finding mailman's support for it (if existant). I am sending out a large corporate email and would like to to be personalized. I have made a perl script to replace all instances of %FULLNAME% with the appropriate name from our database.. However, I'm having trouble finding out whether I can get mailman to pipe each piece of mail it sends out (it wont work via /etc/aliases, that only receives the post, doesn't send it) through this script so that the mail can be sent personalized.. If anyone has any clue on how I might do this, I would greatly appreciate it! Thanks in advance! - -JD- - ------- Jason DiCioccio Evil Genius Unix BOFH mailto:jasond at epylon.com 415-593-2761 Direct & Fax 415-593-2900 Main Epylon Corporation 645 Harrison Street, Suite 200 San Francisco, CA 94107 www.epylon.com BSD is for people who love Unix - Linux is for people who hate Microsoft -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: PGPfreeware 6.5.8 for non-commercial use iQA/AwUBOhME9FCmU62pemyaEQL+WwCeLeja5NJd/TEaGMOx5xX6bSyvelUAoJnG Saz46J2Zmn+b3RltGLlztmsi =Im6N -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- <> -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: Jason DiCioccio.vcf Type: application/octet-stream Size: 338 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://mail.python.org/pipermail/mailman-users/attachments/20001115/45c74309/attachment.obj From Dan.Mick at West.Sun.COM Wed Nov 15 23:17:19 2000 From: Dan.Mick at West.Sun.COM (Dan Mick) Date: Wed, 15 Nov 2000 14:17:19 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Mailman-Users] Personalized Emails Message-ID: <200011152215.OAA18548@utopia.west.sun.com> > Okay, I basically know what to do for this however I'm having trouble > finding mailman's support for it (if existant). I am sending out a > large corporate email and would like to to be personalized. I have > made a perl script to replace all instances of %FULLNAME% with the > appropriate name from our database.. However, I'm having trouble > finding out whether I can get mailman to pipe each piece of mail it > sends out (it wont work via /etc/aliases, that only receives the > post, doesn't send it) through this script so that the mail can be > sent personalized.. If anyone has any clue on how I might do this, I > would greatly appreciate it! No; this is basically not what a mailing-list manager does. MLMs use the economies of scale: make one message, and ship it to a bunch of people. You want to ship a different message to every person, so there's no "broadcast" aspect involved; it's just a bunch of individual mails, one after another, with similar content. For this, sendmail is just fine (assuming you're using sendmail), or even something like "mail" or "mailx" usually supports the '-t' switch to take To: from the file. If you just create a file in /tmp, say, with: To: $user@$address Subject: Your Personal Message Dear $fullname: Here's a message just for you; it was sent to $user@$address. in it, and then use something like "mailx -t /tmp/mailmsg", it will go where you want (assuming you process it by substituting the $ variables). I do this to send reminders to people who have their mail set to "nomail" on Mailman. Check out the mailx/mail/sendmail doc on your system. From claw at kanga.nu Wed Nov 15 23:31:41 2000 From: claw at kanga.nu (J C Lawrence) Date: Wed, 15 Nov 2000 14:31:41 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Personalized Emails In-Reply-To: Message from Jason DiCioccio of "Wed, 15 Nov 2000 13:49:09 PST." <657B20E93E93D4118F9700D0B73CE3EA02428C@goofy.epylon.lan> References: <657B20E93E93D4118F9700D0B73CE3EA02428C@goofy.epylon.lan> Message-ID: <18858.974327501@kanga.nu> On Wed, 15 Nov 2000 13:49:09 -0800 Jason DiCioccio wrote: > Okay, I basically know what to do for this however I'm having > trouble finding mailman's support for it (if existant). I am > sending out a large corporate email and would like to to be > personalized. I have made a perl script to replace all instances > of %FULLNAME% with the appropriate name from our > database.. However, I'm having trouble finding out whether I can > get mailman to pipe each piece of mail it sends out (it wont work > via /etc/aliases, that only receives the post, doesn't send it) > through this script so that the mail can be sent personalized.. If > anyone has any clue on how I might do this, I would greatly > appreciate it! This is not a mailman feature. You can however do this fairly simply under Exim (as your MTA) by using your script as a delivery time filter (it gets run on a given message at the time of remote SMTP delivery). Mostly likely similar structures exist for other MTAs, but I haven't checked. -- J C Lawrence Home: claw at kanga.nu ---------(*) Other: coder at kanga.nu http://www.kanga.nu/~claw/ Keys etc: finger claw at kanga.nu --=| A man is as sane as he is dangerous to his environment |=-- From Andreas.Schamanek at univie.ac.at Wed Nov 15 23:34:21 2000 From: Andreas.Schamanek at univie.ac.at (Andreas Schamanek) Date: Wed, 15 Nov 2000 23:34:21 +0100 (MET) Subject: [Mailman-Users] Q: R: to Re: In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Wed, 15 Nov 2000, michel wrote: > is there a possibility to transform R: in Re: . I can not to say to my > users to patch ther OE. Tnx you can't do it with Mailman, sorry. but have a look at procmail. i am doing it with procmail (see http://www.procmail.org) HTH, -- Andreas From gerald at impressive.net Wed Nov 15 23:39:27 2000 From: gerald at impressive.net (Gerald Oskoboiny) Date: Wed, 15 Nov 2000 17:39:27 -0500 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Re: [Mailman-Developers] Re: Reverting question In-Reply-To: <14865.27405.857124.313441@anthem.concentric.net>; from barry@digicool.com on Tue, Nov 14, 2000 at 11:40:45AM -0500 References: <14865.27405.857124.313441@anthem.concentric.net> Message-ID: <20001115173927.E11322@impressive.net> On Tue, Nov 14, 2000 at 11:40:45AM -0500, Barry A. Warsaw wrote: > >>>>> "CVR" == Chuq Von Rospach writes: > > CVR> In general I'm against coercing Reply-To. Strongly. > > Me too. Me too. > The primary complaint is that people accidently send private responses > to the whole list. This happens because they've trained themselves to > know the difference between replies and followups, and have MUAs that > separate those functions. Yes, and that's definitely a Good Thing: it should be a very conscious choice whether to send a private reply or to send mail to possibly hundreds or thousands of people. > The only grumblings occur when people don't > trim their CC headers (like I've done here) and folks start getting > duplicates. That can be handled in other ways (e.g. the list /could/ > suppress deliveries to list members that it sees explicitly in the > recipients list, although as we've discussed before, that has some > potential for abuse). Another solution to this is the Mail-Followup-To header: (not widely supported yet) http://cr.yp.to/proto/replyto.html (related info for mutt users: http://larve.net/people/hugo/2000/07/ml-mutt ) -- Gerald Oskoboiny http://impressive.net/people/gerald/ From nhruby at arches.uga.edu Wed Nov 15 23:54:07 2000 From: nhruby at arches.uga.edu (nathan r. hruby) Date: Wed, 15 Nov 2000 17:54:07 -0500 (EST) Subject: [Mailman-Users] Personalized Emails In-Reply-To: <200011152215.OAA18548@utopia.west.sun.com> Message-ID: On Wed, 15 Nov 2000, Dan Mick wrote: > Check out the mailx/mail/sendmail doc on your system. If you've got elm installed, check out fastmail also. Does the same stuff as mail -t but allows you to set Reply-To: headers and (to me) it's, well, faster :) -n ........ nathan hruby Webmaster: UGA Department of Drama and Theatre Project Maintainer: phpSlash, Carousel nhruby at arches.uga.edu ........ From jacob at siliconmetrics.com Wed Nov 15 23:25:04 2000 From: jacob at siliconmetrics.com (Jacob Brown) Date: Wed, 15 Nov 2000 16:25:04 -0600 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Problem with GID Message-ID: <3A130D40.E1374C1@siliconmetrics.com> I have this problem where people can't send messages to the mailing lists from the machine that is running mailman. I set the setgid bit and the right group and everything, but whenever some one mails the list it says ----- Transcript of session follows ----- Failure to exec script. WANTED gid 1, GOT gid 45. (Reconfigure to take 45?) 554 "|/home/mailman/mail/wrapper post blah"... unknown mailer error 2 Where 45 is whatever the users GID happens to be when he is sending the mail. Does the setguid bit not work in mailman? Thanks, Jacob Brown From Dan.Mick at West.Sun.COM Thu Nov 16 00:39:17 2000 From: Dan.Mick at West.Sun.COM (Dan Mick) Date: Wed, 15 Nov 2000 15:39:17 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Mailman-Users] Problem with GID Message-ID: <200011152337.PAA22333@utopia.west.sun.com> > I have this problem where people can't send messages to the mailing > lists from the machine that is running mailman. I set the setgid bit > and the right group and everything, but whenever some one mails the list > it says > > ----- Transcript of session follows ----- > Failure to exec script. WANTED gid 1, GOT gid 45. (Reconfigure to take > 45?) > 554 "|/home/mailman/mail/wrapper post blah"... unknown mailer error 2 > > Where 45 is whatever the users GID happens to be when he is sending the > mail. > Does the setguid bit not work in mailman? How exactly are the users trying to mail from that machine? What MTA are you running? Does the '45' really change from user to user? From Dan.Mick at west.sun.com Thu Nov 16 00:51:07 2000 From: Dan.Mick at west.sun.com (Dan Mick) Date: Wed, 15 Nov 2000 15:51:07 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Mailman-Users] /home/mailman/cron/senddigest yields ValueError Message-ID: <200011152349.PAA22715@utopia.west.sun.com> > Thanks for the reply. Below are two follow-up questions - Sorry for the delay in answering. > * Dan Mick [001113 21:26]: > > Looks to me like your digest_header value has a "percent-newline" ("%\n") > > sequence in it; the % operator tried to substitute things from TemplateRefs() into > > the digest_header, and failed with the message "unsupported format character.." and > > things that indicate "newline". > > > > Rethink your digest text wrt percent signs. > > > I know nothing about mailman's interworkings; are my assumptions (below) > correct? > > - i assume there is no global default value for "digest_headers"; mm_cfg.DEFAULT_DIGEST_HEADER, which you set in mm_cfg.py if you wish (see comments in Defaults.py) > - i assume the only supplied interface to a list's digest_headers is via > the web admin interface; Well, you can always set anything about a list with bin/withlist directly, or you could have set the default from mm_cfg, but the current value should always show *up* in the web interface. > - i assume the value of digest_headers is stored in the lists's > config.db data file. Yes, like everything about the list. It's an attribute of the MailList object. See, for instance, bin/dumpdb of config.db for exhaustive info. > After checking the value of all my lists digest_headers, I found one > that looked suspicious. It had a format like this: > "Bla bla bla, etc. > %(info) > _____________________________________" > > Does the "%(info)" token need to be followed by the letter 's'? Yes. See http://www.python.org/doc/current/lib/typesseq-strings.html, which is referred to in the Details for digest_header, digest_footer, and all the other "interpolated strings". It's basically %s, but with a dictionary key; %(info)s means "get the dictionary item with key "info" and substitute it as a string (%s)". From ppruett at webengr.com Thu Nov 16 02:18:01 2000 From: ppruett at webengr.com (ppruett) Date: Thu, 16 Nov 2000 01:18:01 +0000 (GMT) Subject: [Mailman-Users] Mailman -virtual- sendmail & openbsd In-Reply-To: <200011152337.PAA22333@utopia.west.sun.com> Message-ID: I think I am need to change something on sendmail?... I have been using Mailman on openbsd and it is working with list.webengr.com I wanted it to answer to other domains, so I did the magic for dns like list.cocoavillage.com IN CNAME list.webengr.com and set the hostname in the Mailman admin interface and edited /etc/mail/local-host-names on the mailman computer and I even got my Oreilly book and read and tried "O DontExpandCnames True" just incase. So my lists respond and work with the other domains but the "To" and other email gets changed so even though I send to cv-forum at list.cocoavillage.com the subscribers get back cv-forum at list.webengr.com I checked some sendmail logs and I think that sendmail is rewritting the email header... anyone out there have the 'quickfix' or is it somehting like have to use masquerade on sendmail or other... -tia paul From marc_news at valinux.com Thu Nov 16 02:44:44 2000 From: marc_news at valinux.com (Marc MERLIN) Date: Wed, 15 Nov 2000 17:44:44 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] IT Works!!! but one last thing...... In-Reply-To: <030a01c04de9$e36c05c0$0200a8c0@yec1.on.wave.home.com>; from justin13@look.ca on Mon, Nov 13, 2000 at 07:20:50PM -0800 References: <030a01c04de9$e36c05c0$0200a8c0@yec1.on.wave.home.com> Message-ID: <20001115174444.F5356@marc.merlins.org> On Mon, Nov 13, 2000 at 07:20:50PM -0800, Justin wrote: > Thanks for the help......just one thing.... > > when i send a mail to mylist-request at mydomain.com > > the e-mails in the message dont show up with the domain > they show up with the host name ..... > > i have edited the mm_cfg.py > and added > DEFAULT_HOST_NAME = 'mydomain.com' > > just a lil problem. This only affects new lists you create. You have to go to the web admin interface for your existing list and reconfigure it with the new domain name. Marc -- Microsoft is to operating systems & security .... .... what McDonalds is to gourmet cooking Home page: http://marc.merlins.org/ | Finger marc_f at merlins.org for PGP key From claw at kanga.nu Thu Nov 16 04:14:57 2000 From: claw at kanga.nu (J C Lawrence) Date: Wed, 15 Nov 2000 19:14:57 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Accounting In-Reply-To: Message from Mike Richardson of "Wed, 04 Oct 2000 08:44:42 BST." <20001004084442.K3505@kira.mcc.ac.uk> References: <20001004084442.K3505@kira.mcc.ac.uk> Message-ID: <13214.974344497@kanga.nu> On Wed, 4 Oct 2000 08:44:42 +0100 Mike Richardson wrote: > I'm working on a cgi script to extract info from Mailman's logs > (and other custom logging I've added.) At the moment its just for > my own information but I expect the scope will expand as list > admin request more information. If anyone is interested I'll > release the (perl) scripts once they are a little more... refined. Did anything happen with this? -- J C Lawrence Home: claw at kanga.nu ---------(*) Other: coder at kanga.nu URL: http://www.kanga.nu/~claw/ --=| A man is as sane as he is dangerous to his environment |=-- From marc_news at valinux.com Thu Nov 16 04:53:04 2000 From: marc_news at valinux.com (Marc MERLIN) Date: Wed, 15 Nov 2000 19:53:04 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Doing load balancing with mailman Message-ID: <20001115195304.E21148@marc.merlins.org> [I didn't Cc mailman-developers, but if I should ask programing specific questions there, let me know] While a correctly tuned mailman+exim config should be able to handle sourceforge's lists just fine, I've been encouraged to look into a failover/load balancing solution :-) So, I've seen two options so far: Option #1: Lists are physically split between let's say 2 mail servers. All mail goes to listname at lists.sourceforge.net, which is MXed the two mail servers. I know how to configure exim so that it rewrites the envelope To to resend the mail to the other list server if listname is not local to that mail server. So far so good. The problem, is that for web access, I then have to show URLs with http://lists1.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/listname and http://lists2.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/listname Ok, that can be fixed with some clever apache rewriting/proxying, but it'd be a bit iffy. As far as failover is concerned, I can rsync the list configs on a periodic basis and with some symlink magic, I could have one mail server mostly take over the other mail server's lists if it were to disappear. This requires mail header rewriting, http URL rewriting, plus other magic, and it's not very "automatic". Option #2: Hold on, this is scary :-) /var/local/mailman is NFS mounted on the mail servers. /var/local/mailman/qfiles is a symlink to local disk qrunner is modified to set a lockfile in qfiles and not data (it should hopefully be a simple patch) cron jobs are run on only one mail server, with the exception of qrunner. both mail servers offer web access (same URL with load balancing) to the same lists. Voila :-) Did I forget anything? Is there any reason why this wouldn't work? (mailman's locking looks NFS safe to me, but I don't know if having locks created for possibl the same lists in the mailman/locks directory, by two different machines would be a problem for some reason that would escape me right now). Is there anything else besides qrunner that I'd need to patch? Thanks Marc -- Microsoft is to operating systems & security .... .... what McDonalds is to gourmet cooking Home page: http://marc.merlins.org/ | Finger marc_f at merlins.org for PGP key From lovelace at wayfarer.org Thu Nov 16 05:29:15 2000 From: lovelace at wayfarer.org (Tanner Lovelace) Date: Wed, 15 Nov 2000 23:29:15 -0500 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Mailman -virtual- sendmail & openbsd References: Message-ID: <3A13629B.4070106@wayfarer.org> My guess is that you would have to actually put in an A record instead of the CNAME. I believe that MX records (I'm assuming you have one for list.cocoavillage.com) are not supposed to point to CNAMES. This could be why sendmail is rewriting the header... Of course, it could be because it's just sendmail. :-) Tanner Lovelace ppruett wrote: > I think I am need to change something on sendmail?... > > I have been using Mailman on openbsd and it is working > with list.webengr.com > > I wanted it to answer to other domains, so I > did the magic for dns like > list.cocoavillage.com IN CNAME list.webengr.com > and set the hostname in the Mailman admin interface > and edited > /etc/mail/local-host-names on the mailman computer > and I even got my Oreilly book and read > and tried "O DontExpandCnames True" > just incase. > > So my lists respond and work with the other domains > but the "To" and other email gets changed > so even though I send to cv-forum at list.cocoavillage.com > the subscribers get back cv-forum at list.webengr.com > I checked some sendmail logs and I think > that sendmail is rewritting the email header... > > anyone out there have the 'quickfix' or > is it somehting like have to use masquerade on sendmail > or other... > > -tia > > paul > > From barry at digicool.com Thu Nov 16 05:34:31 2000 From: barry at digicool.com (Barry A. Warsaw) Date: Wed, 15 Nov 2000 23:34:31 -0500 (EST) Subject: [Mailman-Users] Re: [Mailman-Developers] Reverting question References: <14864.52862.465404.35651@anthem.concentric.net> <3A108AAB.25143.6018DAE@localhost> <20001114165748.B3475@uow.edu.au> <20001114175012.T27544@marc.merlins.org> <3A11F004.13A1BCDF@nleaudio.com> <20001114223441.G9163@marc.merlins.org> Message-ID: <14867.25559.227185.305800@anthem.concentric.net> >>>>> "MM" == Marc MERLIN writes: MM> While I'm very much against reply-to munging (duh!), I'm for MM> freedom of choice. I do think that mailman should offer a MM> reply-to option, but with a very big disclaimer and maybe this MM> discussion (or another one) so that inexperienced listmasters MM> realize what they're doing. Marc, Very nice rebuttal to the rebuttal to the reply-to-considered-harmful article. You should write that up nicely and put it on the web some place. I'd love to point to it in the details page. BTW, I've applied the unconditional Reply-To: munging patch. -Barry From chuqui at plaidworks.com Thu Nov 16 06:10:29 2000 From: chuqui at plaidworks.com (Chuq Von Rospach) Date: Wed, 15 Nov 2000 21:10:29 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] IT Works!!! but one last thing...... In-Reply-To: <20001115174444.F5356@marc.merlins.org> References: <030a01c04de9$e36c05c0$0200a8c0@yec1.on.wave.home.com> <20001115174444.F5356@marc.merlins.org> Message-ID: At 5:44 PM -0800 11/15/00, Marc MERLIN wrote: > > just a lil problem. > >This only affects new lists you create. >You have to go to the web admin interface for your existing list and >reconfigure it with the new domain name. which is why when we redo this stuff, we have to set it up as a hierarchy of values. Sitewide values that can be overridden if you want, but if you leave the default, when you update the site value, it is rippled out to everything. -- Chuq Von Rospach - Plaidworks Consulting (mailto:chuqui at plaidworks.com) Apple Mail List Gnome (mailto:chuq at apple.com) Be just, and fear not. From chuqui at plaidworks.com Thu Nov 16 06:07:22 2000 From: chuqui at plaidworks.com (Chuq Von Rospach) Date: Wed, 15 Nov 2000 21:07:22 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Re: [Mailman-Developers] Re: Reverting question In-Reply-To: <20001115173927.E11322@impressive.net> References: <14865.27405.857124.313441@anthem.concentric.net> <20001115173927.E11322@impressive.net> Message-ID: At 5:39 PM -0500 11/15/00, Gerald Oskoboiny wrote: >Another solution to this is the Mail-Followup-To header: >(not widely supported yet) > > http://cr.yp.to/proto/replyto.html No, it's actually stillborn... dan may still be pushing it, but I don't think anyone else is. Since the new RFC supports list-post, we really don't NEED Mail-Followup-To. Instead, an MUA can look for the existance of List-Post and use it to enable reply-to-list. -- Chuq Von Rospach - Plaidworks Consulting (mailto:chuqui at plaidworks.com) Apple Mail List Gnome (mailto:chuq at apple.com) Be just, and fear not. From claw at kanga.nu Thu Nov 16 06:31:59 2000 From: claw at kanga.nu (J C Lawrence) Date: Wed, 15 Nov 2000 21:31:59 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Mailman + Exim + ReiserFS Message-ID: <24988.974352719@kanga.nu> Is anybody else here running the above combo: Mailman (1.1) + Exim (3.16-7) + ReiserFS (3.5.27)? I did some playing about today and I *appear* to be getting trashed queue files -- or at least the queue files (I set the MTA to throttle the incoming mail).in ~/data appear to contain random gobs of system memory rather than the actual messages per se. Web searches aren't revealing anything. Very worrying. -- J C Lawrence Home: claw at kanga.nu ---------(*) Other: coder at kanga.nu URL: http://www.kanga.nu/~claw/ --=| A man is as sane as he is dangerous to his environment |=-- From gerald at impressive.net Thu Nov 16 06:48:57 2000 From: gerald at impressive.net (Gerald Oskoboiny) Date: Thu, 16 Nov 2000 00:48:57 -0500 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Mail-Followup-To (was Re: [Mailman-Developers] Re: Reverting question) In-Reply-To: ; from chuqui@plaidworks.com on Wed, Nov 15, 2000 at 09:07:22PM -0800 References: <14865.27405.857124.313441@anthem.concentric.net> <20001115173927.E11322@impressive.net> Message-ID: <20001116004857.F11322@impressive.net> On Wed, Nov 15, 2000 at 09:07:22PM -0800, Chuq Von Rospach wrote: > At 5:39 PM -0500 11/15/00, Gerald Oskoboiny wrote: > > >Another solution to this is the Mail-Followup-To header: > >(not widely supported yet) > > > > http://cr.yp.to/proto/replyto.html > > No, it's actually stillborn... That's a matter of opinion :) > dan may still be pushing it, but I don't think anyone else is. There's me, and a few other people... (and you, once I convince you ;) I just pointed to Dan's page since that's the best writeup of it that I have found. > Since the new RFC supports list-post, we really don't NEED > Mail-Followup-To. Instead, an MUA can look for the existance of > List-Post and use it to enable reply-to-list. That doesn't work for crossposted threads (like this one), or for non-subscribers who want to be Cc'd on a given thread. -- Gerald Oskoboiny http://impressive.net/people/gerald/ From marc_news at valinux.com Thu Nov 16 06:51:14 2000 From: marc_news at valinux.com (Marc MERLIN) Date: Wed, 15 Nov 2000 21:51:14 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] IT Works!!! but one last thing...... In-Reply-To: ; from chuqui@plaidworks.com on Wed, Nov 15, 2000 at 09:10:29PM -0800 References: <030a01c04de9$e36c05c0$0200a8c0@yec1.on.wave.home.com> <20001115174444.F5356@marc.merlins.org> Message-ID: <20001115215113.F21148@marc.merlins.org> On Wed, Nov 15, 2000 at 09:10:29PM -0800, Chuq Von Rospach wrote: > which is why when we redo this stuff, we have to set it up as a hierarchy > of values. Sitewide values that can be overridden if you want, but if you > leave the default, when you update the site value, it is rippled out to > everything. That sounds good. In the meantime, I use this: chef:/var/local/mailman/bin/scripts$ more dumplistconfigs #!/bin/bash if [ $# -ne 1 ]; then echo "$0 destdir" exit fi chown mailman $1 cd ~mailman/lists/ for i in * do echo "Dumping list $i in $1/$i" ~mailman/bin/config_list -o $1/$i $i done chef:/var/local/mailman/bin/scripts$ more reconfigalllistsfromdump #!/bin/bash if [ $# -ne 2 ]; then echo "$0 --IknowwhatImdoing /dir/to/get/all/configs/from" echo "This will clobber all existing configs with the ones you provide" echo "I hope you know what you're doing!" exit -1 fi if [ z"$1" != z--IknowwhatImdoing ]; then echo "You obviously don't know what you're doing, so don't do it :-)" exit -1 fi cd ~mailman/lists/ for i in * do echo "Configuring list $i with values from $2/$i" ~mailman/bin/config_list -i $2/$i $i done I run the first script, cd to the config dump directory and do: perl -p -i -e "s/option = .*/option = newvalue/" After that, I run the second script Marc -- Microsoft is to operating systems & security .... .... what McDonalds is to gourmet cooking Home page: http://marc.merlins.org/ | Finger marc_f at merlins.org for PGP key From techgrrl at beeze.com Thu Nov 16 08:04:31 2000 From: techgrrl at beeze.com (Sarah K. Miller) Date: Wed, 15 Nov 2000 23:04:31 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Duplicate Subscription Requests Message-ID: <00dd01c04f9b$78b3fa40$0b00a8c0@beeze.com> We are using a form to accept subscriptions to several Mailman lists. The form then sends an e-mail with the proper command to listname-request at domain. For reasons that are not at all clear to us, this one inbound message to -request is generating anywhere from 2-7 requests. For example: User filled out the form and submitted it (hitting the submit button only once) and this is what Mailman generated: Nov 15 16:31:50 2000 (25777) tech.programming.visual-basic: pending user at yahoo.com layl$ Nov 15 16:31:52 2000 (25777) tech.programming.visual-basic: pending user at yahoo.com layl$ Nov 15 16:31:53 2000 (25777) tech.programming.visual-basic: pending user at yahoo.com layl$ Nov 15 16:31:55 2000 (25777) tech.programming.visual-basic: pending user at yahoo.com layl$ Does anyone have any idea why this would be happening and what we can do about it? We have verified that the form is in fact only submitting one request and not multiples. Is it possible that something in the message headers is causing the duplicate requests? -- Sarah From kent at tensa.com Thu Nov 16 10:23:13 2000 From: kent at tensa.com (Kent Howard) Date: Thu, 16 Nov 2000 01:23:13 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Html Archives are not being created In-Reply-To: <3A03216D.959BC4ED@west.sun.com>; from Dan.Mick@west.sun.com on Fri, Nov 03, 2000 at 12:34:53PM -0800 References: <200011030141.RAA11191@utopia.west.sun.com> <3A02C3FE.FE1849B7@collab.net> <3A03216D.959BC4ED@west.sun.com> Message-ID: <20001116012313.A2682@wakani.home> On Fri, Nov 03, 2000 at 12:34:53PM -0800, Dan Mick wrote: > Archives are working for me. > > pete collins wrote: > > > This has been fixed in the latest CVS; either wait for a new release, > > > get the latest CVS, or apply this fix to Mailman/Archiver/HyperArch.py: > > > > OK, i pulled from cvs. Everything works w/ no errors. > > However, i'm not getting that nice html archiving i've seen in older > > versions. > > > > I am getting this for my generated index.html page: > > > > The Test Archives > > > > You can get more information about this list or you can download the full raw > > archive ( 2 KB ). > > > > Currently, there are no archives. I also have not been able to get HTML archives to work. I'm experiencing the exact same thing as Pete Collins. No errors are showing up in the logs and the listname.pck and index.htm file timestamps are updating when a post is received and the message is archived into the mbox file, but no messages ever show up in the HTML archives. I just get the "Currently, there are no archives." message. I've tried "bin/arch listname" and it runs now (on rc2) without errors, but still no messages show up in the HTML archives. I'm totally out of ideas. Anyone out there have any? - Kent From rodrigo at linuxave.net Thu Nov 16 09:48:35 2000 From: rodrigo at linuxave.net (Rodrigo Moya) Date: 16 Nov 2000 07:48:35 -0100 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Re: Mailman private archives issue. In-Reply-To: <20001115194040.A1527@Tonelli.sns.it> References: <20001114154648.A21204@Tonelli.sns.it> <200011141459.GAA29829@gears.linuxave.net> <20001115194040.A1527@Tonelli.sns.it> Message-ID: <200011160943.BAA04869@gears.linuxave.net> > > > hi > > > as lonk as I can tell, I am able to use public archives > (problem is, I have none... but when I had, I was able to) > > > you have to add > > Alias /pipermail/ /var/lib/mailman/archives/public/ > > to /etc/apache/srm.conf > oops, I feel stupid. Was it so simple? The fact is that I asked in the list and nobody answered, and I couldn't find any docs talking about this. Thanks very much: the archives are now working. cheers From kent at tensa.com Thu Nov 16 11:15:50 2000 From: kent at tensa.com (Kent Howard) Date: Thu, 16 Nov 2000 02:15:50 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Html Archives are not being created In-Reply-To: <20001116012313.A2682@wakani.home>; from kent@tensa.com on Thu, Nov 16, 2000 at 01:23:13AM -0800 References: <200011030141.RAA11191@utopia.west.sun.com> <3A02C3FE.FE1849B7@collab.net> <3A03216D.959BC4ED@west.sun.com> <20001116012313.A2682@wakani.home> Message-ID: <20001116021550.A2818@wakani.home> On Thu, Nov 16, 2000 at 01:23:13AM -0800, Kent Howard wrote: > I also have not been able to get HTML archives to work. I'm > experiencing the exact same thing as Pete Collins. No errors are > showing up in the logs and the listname.pck and index.htm file > timestamps are updating when a post is received and the message is > archived into the mbox file, but no messages ever show up in the HTML > archives. I just get the "Currently, there are no archives." message. > I've tried "bin/arch listname" and it runs now (on rc2) without > errors, but still no messages show up in the HTML archives. I'm > totally out of ideas. Anyone out there have any? Argh... looks like since I was using qmail and didn't realize I needed to use preline to put a mbox From_ line into the message when it is received. Therefore, my mbox file isn't really in mbox format. :( I just went back and added the preline command to the delivery rules, dumped the bad mbox files, and now new messages have the proper From_ line. But when a post is made (or bin/arch is run) the following error is reported. Traceback (innermost last): File "bin/arch", line 129, in ? main() File "bin/arch", line 118, in main archiver.processUnixMailbox(fp, Article) File "/home/mailman/Mailman/Archiver/pipermail.py", line 521, in processUnixMailbox a = articleClass(m, self.sequence) File "/home/mailman/Mailman/Archiver/HyperArch.py", line 224, in __init__ self.cenc = string.lower(cenc) TypeError: read-only character buffer, None ...time passes... Looked through the mailman-users archives and found this patch posted on the 13th. And all is working! YES!!! diff -u -r1.45 -r1.46 --- HyperArch.py 2000/11/10 23:46:06 1.45 +++ HyperArch.py 2000/11/13 21:50:05 1.46 @@ -218,8 +218,8 @@ # Snag the content-* headers. RFC 1521 states that their # values are # case insensitive. - ctype = message.getheader('Content-Type') or "text/plain" - cenc = message.getheader('Content-Transfer-Encoding') + ctype = message.getheader('Content-Type', 'text/plain') + cenc = message.getheader('Content-Transfer-Encoding', '') self.ctype = string.lower(ctype) self.cenc = string.lower(cenc) self.decoded = {} From pasztor at ppke.hu Thu Nov 16 14:11:03 2000 From: pasztor at ppke.hu (PASZTOR Miklos) Date: Thu, 16 Nov 2000 14:11:03 +0100 (CET) Subject: [Mailman-Users] Posting problem Message-ID: Hello, I have been using mailman (v1.1) for some time, and it works fine. Now I have a problem. There is a list (just one) to which postings bounce to the -admin, and in the logs/error there is the following: Nov 16 13:36:54 2000 post: Traceback (innermost last): post: File "/home/mailman/scripts/post", line 73, in ? post: mlist.Post(msg, approved=fromusenet) post: File "/home/mailman/Mailman/MailList.py", line 1360, in Post post: self.DeliverToList(msg, recipients, post: TypeError : illegal argument type for built-in operation Please help. TIA, Mikl?s --------- P?sztor Mikl?s ------------------ pasztor at ppke.hu ---------- P?zm?ny P?ter Katolikus Egyetem Budapest, Szentkir?lyi utca 28. Tel: (36)-(1)-429-7200/323 From barry at digicool.com Thu Nov 16 14:54:16 2000 From: barry at digicool.com (Barry A. Warsaw) Date: Thu, 16 Nov 2000 08:54:16 -0500 (EST) Subject: [Mailman-Users] Re: [Mailman-Developers] Re: Reverting question References: <14865.27405.857124.313441@anthem.concentric.net> <20001115173927.E11322@impressive.net> Message-ID: <14867.59144.179977.605777@anthem.concentric.net> >>>>> "CVR" == Chuq Von Rospach writes: CVR> Since the new RFC supports list-post, we really don't NEED CVR> Mail-Followup-To. Instead, an MUA can look for the existance CVR> of List-Post and use it to enable reply-to-list. Chuq, are you referring to draft-ietf-drums-msg-fmt-09.txt of 11-Sep-2000? There's no mention of List-Post in there that I can find. -Barry From nbecker at fred.net Thu Nov 16 17:45:01 2000 From: nbecker at fred.net (nbecker at fred.net) Date: 16 Nov 2000 11:45:01 -0500 Subject: [Mailman-Users] RPM upgrade lost listinfo In-Reply-To: PASZTOR Miklos's message of "Thu, 16 Nov 2000 14:11:03 +0100 (CET)" Message-ID: I just upgraded 2.0beta5 using the RedHat RPM (from rh7-powertools). I upgraded becuase they changed the user of apache from nobody to apache, which broke mailman. After upgrading most things seem OK, but when I visit the page http://localhost/mailman/listinfo Only a group "test" shows, not the other lists I created. Maybe we need a command to sanity check these databases? From barry at digicool.com Thu Nov 16 19:16:52 2000 From: barry at digicool.com (Barry A. Warsaw) Date: Thu, 16 Nov 2000 13:16:52 -0500 (EST) Subject: [Mailman-Users] Re: [Mailman-Developers] Re: Reverting question References: <14865.27405.857124.313441@anthem.concentric.net> <20001115173927.E11322@impressive.net> Message-ID: <14868.9364.657224.536341@anthem.concentric.net> >>>>> "CVR" == Chuq Von Rospach writes: CVR> Since the new RFC supports list-post, we really don't NEED CVR> Mail-Followup-To. Instead, an MUA can look for the existance CVR> of List-Post and use it to enable reply-to-list. Duh. List-Post: is in RFC 2369 and of course Mailman already inserts this header in messages. Sad what happens to short term memory when you get older. :) BTW, I think this is the right bit of information that an MUA would need to support a "post-to-list" option. Seems to me all the information is there without Reply-To munging for the user agent to support whatever followup/reply operation it wants. Reply-To munging should be considered a hack that's (questionably) necessary until the MUAs catch on. -Barry From gleblanc at cu-portland.edu Thu Nov 16 20:22:31 2000 From: gleblanc at cu-portland.edu (Gregory Leblanc) Date: 17 Nov 2000 03:22:31 +0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] RPM upgrade lost listinfo In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20001116192222.F0AE71D1EC@dinsdale.python.org> > I just upgraded 2.0beta5 using the RedHat RPM (from rh7-powertools). > I upgraded becuase they changed the user of apache from nobody to > apache, which broke mailman. Did you upgrade to or from 2.0beta5? What operating system are you using? Their default RPMs pretty much only work on RH7. I'm tyring to bash their spec file into order to send it to Barry, but it's not there yet. Greg From nbecker at fred.net Thu Nov 16 20:39:43 2000 From: nbecker at fred.net (nbecker at fred.net) Date: 16 Nov 2000 14:39:43 -0500 Subject: [Mailman-Users] RPM upgrade lost listinfo In-Reply-To: Gregory Leblanc's message of "17 Nov 2000 03:22:31 +0800" References: <20001116191901.AF8F5478F@post.xecu.net> Message-ID: I upgraded from 2.0beta5 on RH6.2 to 2.0beta5 on RH7.0. I believe on RH6.2 i built from the SRPM. After upgrading to RH7.0 is just installed the RPM from redhat powertools. From aaryn at Ag.Arizona.Edu Thu Nov 16 20:41:49 2000 From: aaryn at Ag.Arizona.Edu (Aaryn) Date: Thu, 16 Nov 2000 12:41:49 -0700 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Re: Mailman bounces from nonlocal users Message-ID: <3.0.6.32.20001116124149.009e2a00@server.deanox.com> good to hear. I don't think the solution has ever been posted to mailman-users, though. On Thu, 16 Nov 2000, Lee Howard wrote: > Date: Thu, 16 Nov 2000 09:50:49 -0700 > From: Lee Howard > To: Aaryn > Subject: Re: Mailman bounces from nonlocal users > > Thanks. I ended up catching it 10 minutes after my mail to you. It was > bouncing mail from 127.0.0.1 because of [a lack of] relaying priviledges. > Seems strange to me, but it works now that I've added relaying permissions > for 127.0.0.1. > > Thanks. > > Lee. > > At 08:56 AM 11/16/00 -0700, Aaryn wrote: > >on second thought, the problem was se4ndmail. we had upgraded sendmail > >but were using an old sendmail.cf file. > > > >aaryn > > > >On Wed, 15 Nov 2000, Lee Howard wrote: > > > >> Date: Wed, 15 Nov 2000 23:20:54 -0700 > >> From: Lee Howard > >> To: aaryn at Ag.Arizona.Edu > >> Subject: Mailman bounces from nonlocal users > >> > >> Hi. I noticed a post to the mailman-users list from September where posts > >> were bouncing for everyone except for local users. > >> > >> I was wondering if you had found the problem. I am experiencing identical > >> issues. > >> > >> Thanks. > >> > >> Lee Howard > >> > >> > >> > > > > From Dan.Mick at west.sun.com Thu Nov 16 20:47:36 2000 From: Dan.Mick at west.sun.com (Dan Mick) Date: Thu, 16 Nov 2000 11:47:36 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Re: Mailman private archives issue. References: <20001114154648.A21204@Tonelli.sns.it> <200011141459.GAA29829@gears.linuxave.net> <20001115194040.A1527@Tonelli.sns.it> <200011160943.BAA04869@gears.linuxave.net> Message-ID: <3A1439D8.2DFE55A6@west.sun.com> Rodrigo Moya wrote: > > > > > > > hi > > > > > > as lonk as I can tell, I am able to use public archives > > (problem is, I have none... but when I had, I was able to) > > > > > > you have to add > > > > Alias /pipermail/ /var/lib/mailman/archives/public/ > > > > to /etc/apache/srm.conf > > > oops, I feel stupid. Was it so simple? The fact is that I asked in the list > and nobody answered, and I couldn't find any docs talking about this. Gee, you didn't look very hard then: >From INSTALL: - Configure your web server to point to the Pipermail public mailing list archives: For example, in Apache: Alias /pipermail/ $varprefix/archives/public/ where $varprefix is usually $prefix unless you've used the --with-var-prefix option to configure. Consult your web server's documentation for details. Also be sure to configure your web server to follow symbolic links in this directory, otherwise public Pipermail archives won't be accessible. For Apache users, consult the FollowSymLinks option. Now restart your web server. From barry at digicool.com Thu Nov 16 23:35:03 2000 From: barry at digicool.com (Barry A. Warsaw) Date: Thu, 16 Nov 2000 17:35:03 -0500 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Announcing Mailman 2.0 release candidate 3 Message-ID: <14868.24855.54781.693947@anthem.concentric.net> Mailman 2.0 release candidate 3 is now available from SourceForge at http://sourceforge.net/project/showfiles.php?group_id=103 www.list.org should be updated soon (I'm not going to bother the gnu.org guys again until 2.0 final is released). Excerpts from the NEWS file are given below. This should quash the few known 2.0rc2 buglets. Of course the on-line documentation is available at: http://mailman.sourceforge.net New goal for 2.0 final: Wed 22-Nov-2000 Enjoy, -Barry -------------------- snip snip -------------------- 2.0 release candidate 3 (16-Nov-2000) - By popular demand, Reply-To: munging policy is now to always override any Reply-To: header in the original message, if reply_goes_to_list is set to "This list" or "Explicit Address" - bin/newlist given -q/--quiet flag instead of the positional argument - Hopefully last fix to DEFAULT_URL not ending in a slash sensitivity - 2.0rc2 buglets fixed: o newlist argument parsing o updating with unlocked lists o HyperArch.py traceback when there's no Content-Transfer-Encoding: header - SourceForge bugs fixed: 122358 (qmail-to-mailman.py listname case folding) - SourceForge patches applied: 102373 (qmail-to-mailman.py listname case folding) From kburris at graycary.com Thu Nov 16 23:56:57 2000 From: kburris at graycary.com (Burris, Keith) Date: Thu, 16 Nov 2000 14:56:57 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Large Messages and Delivery Delays Message-ID: <058801c05020$856f18c0$ba03020a@pa.internal> This morning a subscriber on one of our internal lists passed a message that was roughly 4MB (PowerPoint presentation attached). Eventually the message was delivered, but Mailman was blocked up for about 40 minutes. There is an entry in the digest log at about the time the MTA handed the message of to Mailman. The post log shows a corresponding entry about 40 minutes later. The smtp log shows the message being handed back to the MTA about 10 seconds later. I'm relatively new to Mailman and I can't say I've looked at the internals at all, so I'm hoping for some help drawing an inference from these facts. Is possible that the digest process is where the delay is occurring? Are there any steps I can take (short of imposing a size limit on messages) to alleviate this problem? We are running 2b6 with Exim as the MTA, Linux 2.2.15 on a 266MHz PII with 128MB RAM. Thanks in advance! ----------------------------------------------------------------------------- [INFO] -- Content Manager: NOTICE: This email message is for the sole use of the intended recipient(s) and may contain confidential and privileged information. Any unauthorized review, use, disclosure or distribution is prohibited. If you are not the intended recipient, please contact the sender by reply email and destroy all copies of the original message. To contact our email administrator directly, send to postmaster at graycary.com Thank you. ----------------------------------------------------------------------------- From techgrrl at beeze.com Fri Nov 17 00:37:02 2000 From: techgrrl at beeze.com (Sarah K. Miller) Date: Thu, 16 Nov 2000 15:37:02 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Editing the pending subscribers db Message-ID: <035101c05026$1f494a10$0b00a8c0@beeze.com> Is there a way to hand edit the pending subscribers file? We ended up with several duplicate entries that we would like to get rid of, without subjecting the subscribers to endless reject messages. Thanks From techgrrl at beeze.com Fri Nov 17 00:58:41 2000 From: techgrrl at beeze.com (Sarah K. Miller) Date: Thu, 16 Nov 2000 15:58:41 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] How to decrease high loads Message-ID: <03bc01c05029$26086720$0b00a8c0@beeze.com> We're running Mailman on a Sun Sparc Station 5, with 256 megs of RAM and a 9.2 Gig hard drive. We've got about 80 lists, with the busiest one producing approx 30 messages a day. We have a lot of people signing up for lists right now though, creating a lot of traffic. We are seeing load averages in excess of 25 when multiple sign-ups are being processed. Is there anyway to configure mailman to decrease the load average? And yes, we're working on getting a better machine, but we have to limp by with what we have for now . . . -- Sarah From marc_news at valinux.com Fri Nov 17 01:38:13 2000 From: marc_news at valinux.com (Marc MERLIN) Date: Thu, 16 Nov 2000 16:38:13 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Previous problem with hard links In-Reply-To: ; from tib@tigerknight.org on Mon, Nov 13, 2000 at 02:43:06PM -0800 References: <20001113140438.H27544@marc.merlins.org> Message-ID: <20001116163812.L9808@marc.merlins.org> On Mon, Nov 13, 2000 at 02:43:06PM -0800, Tib wrote: > On Mon, 13 Nov 2000, Marc MERLIN wrote: > > > On Mon, Nov 13, 2000 at 03:43:41AM -0800, Tib wrote: > > > I already wrote a program that allows you to run mailman with the secure > > linux patch. It's in the current mailman CVS and you can get it here too: > > http://sourceforge.net/patch/?func=detailpatch&patch_id=101812&group_id=103 > > Actually I'd tried this patch already, and met with no success. :/ I wrote Actually the first versions didn't do everything that was needed. The one that's there now should Give it another shot, just in case. Marc -- Microsoft is to operating systems & security .... .... what McDonalds is to gourmet cooking Home page: http://marc.merlins.org/ | Finger marc_f at merlins.org for PGP key From marc_news at valinux.com Fri Nov 17 01:49:46 2000 From: marc_news at valinux.com (Marc MERLIN) Date: Thu, 16 Nov 2000 16:49:46 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Large Messages and Delivery Delays In-Reply-To: <058801c05020$856f18c0$ba03020a@pa.internal>; from kburris@graycary.com on Thu, Nov 16, 2000 at 02:56:57PM -0800 References: <058801c05020$856f18c0$ba03020a@pa.internal> Message-ID: <20001116164946.N9808@marc.merlins.org> On Thu, Nov 16, 2000 at 02:56:57PM -0800, Burris, Keith wrote: > This morning a subscriber on one of our internal lists passed a message > that was roughly 4MB (PowerPoint presentation attached). Eventually the You go find the user with a big LART and explain to him that next time he puts the attachment on a web page or a file server and references the location in his Email :-) You should also restrict your message size acceptable on the list back to 100KB (that's a mailman option) > message was delivered, but Mailman was blocked up for about 40 minutes. > There is an entry in the digest log at about the time the MTA handed the > message of to Mailman. The post log shows a corresponding entry about 40 > minutes later. The smtp log shows the message being handed back to the > MTA about 10 seconds later. I've had users do a lot worse to my mailman install, and it's been doing (mostly) ok. I think the bottleneck was probably among those: - memory (your machine probably started swapping) - MTA - disk I/O Marc -- Microsoft is to operating systems & security .... .... what McDonalds is to gourmet cooking Home page: http://marc.merlins.org/ | Finger marc_f at merlins.org for PGP key From armond.r.paiva at intel.com Fri Nov 17 02:11:40 2000 From: armond.r.paiva at intel.com (Paiva, Armond R) Date: Thu, 16 Nov 2000 17:11:40 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Subscription approval with 'discussion' type lists Message-ID: I've noticed that when a list is set as a 'discussion' type list by setting the 'Reply-to' list option to 'list' as apposed to 'sender', the 'reply-to' entry on the subscription confirmation email is changed to the list address instead of the list-request address. And therefor, when the subscribing user replies to the confirmation it gets ignored by the list (not bounced back), and their subscription is never confirmed. For example say we create a list called 'test' and our domain is mailman.com. If the 'Reply-to' option for the 'test' list is set to 'sender' then when a user subscribes, the reply-to entry on the confirmation email will be set to 'test-request at mailman.com'. And, the user can simply reply and the confirmation will go through. However, If the 'Reply-to' option of the list is set to 'list' then the 'reply-to' entry on the confirmation will be 'test at mailman.com' and replying will not work. We are using version 2.0beta6. Does anybody have a work around for this? -Armond From mdejong at cygnus.com Fri Nov 17 02:32:34 2000 From: mdejong at cygnus.com (Mo DeJong) Date: Thu, 16 Nov 2000 17:32:34 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Mailman-Users] What is with all this password stuff? In-Reply-To: <20001117012002.8D9261D262@dinsdale.python.org> Message-ID: I just tried to unsubscribe from the list and I got this back: On Thu, 16 Nov 2000 mailman-users-request at python.org wrote: > This is an automated response. > > There were problems with the email commands you sent to Mailman via > the administrative address . ... > The following is a detailed description of the problems. > > > ***** unsubscribe > >>>>> Usage: unsubscribe [] Is it just me, or does mailman try to do too many things with passwords? I have enough passwords to deal with, I don't need any more. I really don't need to be told that I need a remember a password to unsubscribe from a mailing list. Does this password thing seem like a stupid idea to anyone else? Please tell me this is a bug and will get fixed? Mo DeJong Red Hat Inc From Dan.Mick at West.Sun.COM Fri Nov 17 02:41:17 2000 From: Dan.Mick at West.Sun.COM (Dan Mick) Date: Thu, 16 Nov 2000 17:41:17 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Mailman-Users] What is with all this password stuff? Message-ID: <200011170139.RAA01757@utopia.west.sun.com> > Is it just me, or does mailman try to do too many > things with passwords? It's not just you, but that's how it's designed right now. > I have enough passwords > to deal with, I don't need any more. I really > don't need to be told that I need a remember > a password to unsubscribe from a mailing list. Like it or not, that's how it is, and when you joined the list, you were told that, in great detail. > Does this password thing seem like a stupid > idea to anyone else? Please tell me this is > a bug and will get fixed? It's not a bug; it may be modified, but not imminently. From vikas98 at hotmail.com Fri Nov 17 03:19:37 2000 From: vikas98 at hotmail.com (Vikas Gupta) Date: Fri, 17 Nov 2000 02:19:37 GMT Subject: [Mailman-Users] Cannot access admin page! Message-ID: I had everything working fine yesterday (i think). But today, I try to access the admin page for a public list (which i could access yesterday) and my browser hangs. WHat could cause this? WHat python files control the admin pages? ListAdmin.py? The only thing i changed was some html in the roster.py file, and then i tried to add another mailist list. After this i tried to go to the admin page, but my browser just hangs as if it cant find the page. Anyone know what I might have done? Help is much appreciated. vikas _________________________________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com. Share information about yourself, create your own public profile at http://profiles.msn.com. From vikas98 at hotmail.com Fri Nov 17 03:47:34 2000 From: vikas98 at hotmail.com (Vikas Gupta) Date: Fri, 17 Nov 2000 02:47:34 GMT Subject: [Mailman-Users] forgot to mention--cannot access admin page Message-ID: I also cannot receive any mail that should go throught the Mailman system! If i send maiil to Mailman, I dont receive any reply. Is my GID messed up? It has been been working fine for about 2 weeks with no problems. COuld it have changed all of a sudden? Its frustating to see a mailing list up one minute and then down the next (without any changes)! vikas _________________________________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com. Share information about yourself, create your own public profile at http://profiles.msn.com. From otaylor at redhat.com Fri Nov 17 03:55:56 2000 From: otaylor at redhat.com (Owen Taylor) Date: 16 Nov 2000 21:55:56 -0500 Subject: [Mailman-Users] What is with all this password stuff? In-Reply-To: Mo DeJong's message of "Thu, 16 Nov 2000 17:32:34 -0800 (PST)" References: Message-ID: Mo DeJong writes: > I just tried to unsubscribe from the list and > I got this back: > > On Thu, 16 Nov 2000 mailman-users-request at python.org wrote: > > > This is an automated response. > > > > There were problems with the email commands you sent to Mailman via > > the administrative address . > > ... > > > The following is a detailed description of the problems. > > > > > > ***** unsubscribe > > >>>>> Usage: unsubscribe [] > > > > Is it just me, or does mailman try to do too many > things with passwords? I have enough passwords > to deal with, I don't need any more. I really > don't need to be told that I need a remember > a password to unsubscribe from a mailing list. The secret to using mailman is _not_ to try to remember your passwords. (Without stopping to count, I'm sure I'm subscribed to more than 50 different mailman lists on 6-7 servers...) Instead, when you want to do something to your list options or unsubscribe, go to the web page and have it mail you a password reminder. Then, when you get it go back to the page and do whatever you wanted to do. (you can also request a password reminder by mail - I think simply echo password | mail foo-list-request at foo.org works.) But the point is, let the list server keep track of the password for you. If you do that, its fairly convenient. > Does this password thing seem like a stupid > idea to anyone else? Please tell me this is > a bug and will get fixed? I think that you wouldn't get too much disagreement if you said: - Users should have one password per site, not per list - Attempting to unsubscribe without a password should result in a confirmation message, as is sent out when subscribing. However these are both significant amounts of work to implement, and from what I understand are definitely not pre-2.0 features. Regards, Owen From barry at digicool.com Fri Nov 17 04:27:17 2000 From: barry at digicool.com (Barry A. Warsaw) Date: Thu, 16 Nov 2000 22:27:17 -0500 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Subscription approval with 'discussion' type lists References: Message-ID: <14868.42389.67987.403168@anthem.concentric.net> >>>>> "ARP" == Armond R Paiva writes: ARP> We are using version 2.0beta6. ARP> Does anybody have a work around for this? Upgrade to 2.0rc3. This problem has been fixed. -Barry From chuqui at plaidworks.com Fri Nov 17 05:39:43 2000 From: chuqui at plaidworks.com (Chuq Von Rospach) Date: Thu, 16 Nov 2000 20:39:43 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] What is with all this password stuff? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: At 9:55 PM -0500 11/16/00, Owen Taylor wrote: > > - Users should have one password per site, not per list very high on my list of future features -- but requires rebuilding the entire backend of mailman from scratch to do right. > - Attempting to unsubscribe without a password should > result in a confirmation message, as is sent out > when subscribing. > >However these are both significant amounts of work to implement, and >from what I understand are definitely not pre-2.0 features. that might not be too hard to do, actually -- but not for 2.0. And there's also (c) allow the admin to make unsub passwords optional. Whcih is also not a 2.0 feature at this point. -- Chuq Von Rospach - Plaidworks Consulting (mailto:chuqui at plaidworks.com) Apple Mail List Gnome (mailto:chuq at apple.com) The vet said it was behavioral, but I prefer to think of it as genetic. It cuts down on the liability -- Get Fuzzy From rtindall at fsr.com Fri Nov 17 18:36:01 2000 From: rtindall at fsr.com (Rob Tindall) Date: Fri, 17 Nov 2000 09:36:01 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Mailman-Users] Missing From: line in the archives In-Reply-To: <20001117170235.586D11D2EA@dinsdale.python.org> Message-ID: I've suddenly become responsible for setting up twenty or so lists under Mailman, and I have almost everything working. The only fly in the installation is the archives; the files go to the .mbox file, and the web page can find the archive, but I have to manually add the "From: someone at some time" line to make the archive work. This is set up under FreeBSD using Procmail. I haven't been able to find any documentation on how to add a From header to the archive yet, and this is getting time critical. Any assistance would be greatly appreciated. Mailman is 2.0rc1. Thanks, R. Tindall On Fri, 17 Nov 2000 mailman-users-request at python.org wrote: > Send Mailman-Users mailing list submissions to > mailman-users at python.org > > To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit > http://www.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users > or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to > mailman-users-request at python.org > > You can reach the person managing the list at > mailman-users-admin at python.org > > When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific > than "Re: Contents of Mailman-Users digest..." > > From rob at curiouslabs.com Fri Nov 17 19:07:56 2000 From: rob at curiouslabs.com (Rob Saul) Date: Fri, 17 Nov 2000 10:07:56 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] passwords not getting sent out Message-ID: <3A1573FC.25CD22EE@curiouslabs.com> I'm having a problem with password reminders not getting sent out monthly even though I've configured a list to do so. I tried forcing it by running mailpasswds by hand, but this had the same result. I get the feeling I've forgotten something in the configuration of the list, but can't determine what. Any clues much appreciated. ~Rob p.s. this is using rc2 From gdinwiddie at min.net Fri Nov 17 19:24:39 2000 From: gdinwiddie at min.net (George Dinwiddie) Date: Fri, 17 Nov 2000 13:24:39 -0500 (EST) Subject: [Mailman-Users] Header In-Reply-To: <200011141823.NAA22955@cssun.mathcs.emory.edu> from "Edgar Leon" at Nov 14, 0 01:23:13 pm Message-ID: <200011171824.NAA15059@min.net> Edgar, If they use procmail as the Mail Delivery Agent, you might find this recipe useful: http://www.min.net/~gdinwiddie/programming/rc.forward It allows procmail to do virtual address forwarding. - George > Edgar Leon said: > > I have an account on Hostway.com. They limit a mail alias to only 4 entries. > They have a graphical interface with only 4 fields and tech support says that > there is no way around it. They recommend Mailman if you want to create an alias > with more than 4 entries. I am using use Mailman as an alias rather than > a list. I don't want the users to subscribe or unsubscribe to this > list. -- ---------------------------------------------------------------------- George Dinwiddie gdinwiddie at min.net The gods do not deduct from man's allotted span those hours spent in sailing. NEW URL => http://www.Alberg30.org/ ---------------------------------------------------------------------- From pese at yhman.tnuni.sk Fri Nov 17 19:31:57 2000 From: pese at yhman.tnuni.sk (Peter Sedivy - PeSe) Date: Fri, 17 Nov 2000 19:31:57 +0100 (CET) Subject: [Mailman-Users] qrunner + 451 SMTP Error Message-ID: hello I' running FreBSD with mailman 2.0b5 i've mysterious problems to send some bigger messages through mailman qrunner log is exhausted With : Nov 17 19:26:01 2000 (23421) qrunner ended Nov 17 19:27:00 2000 (23424) qrunner begining Nov 17 19:27:01 2000 (23424) Could not acquire qrunner lock Nov 17 19:27:01 2000 (23424) qrunner ended Nov 17 19:28:01 2000 (23427) qrunner begining Nov 17 19:28:02 2000 (23427) Could not acquire qrunner lock Nov 17 19:28:02 2000 (23427) qrunner ended Nov 17 19:29:00 2000 (23436) qrunner begining Nov 17 19:29:01 2000 (23436) Could not acquire qrunner lock Nov 17 19:29:01 2000 (23436) qrunner ended smtp is still writing stuff like that: Nov 17 03:36:38 2000 (14197) smtp for 79 recips, completed in 14736.353 seconds Nov 17 05:37:04 2000 (15899) All recipients refused: (451, '4.4.1 timeout waiting for input during message collect') Nov 17 07:42:41 2000 (15899) All recipients refused: (451, '4.4.1 timeout waiting for input during message collect') Nov 17 07:42:41 2000 (15899) smtp for 79 recips, completed in 14740.161 seconds Nov 17 09:43:04 2000 (17589) All recipients refused: (451, '4.4.1 timeout waiting for input during message collect') Nov 17 11:48:39 2000 (17589) All recipients refused: (451, '4.4.1 timeout waiting for input during message collect') Nov 17 11:48:39 2000 (17589) smtp for 79 recips, completed in 14738.566 seconds Nov 17 14:40:26 2000 (19384) All recipients refused: (451, '4.4.1 timeout waiting for input during message collect') Nov 17 14:40:26 2000 (19384) smtp for 79 recips, completed in 10284.771 seconds Nov 17 16:41:07 2000 (20758) All recipients refused: (451, '4.4.1 timeout waiting for input during message collect') so directory qfiles is pretty full and no massage has been sent I don't know how to solve this problem Please help me PeSe ================================================================= Omnia mea mecum porto ***** Peter Sedivy - PeSe ================================================================= e-MAIL: pese at yhman.tnuni.sk URL: http://yhman.tnuni.sk/pese/ ================================================================= From micah at colltech.com Fri Nov 17 21:22:45 2000 From: micah at colltech.com (Micah Anderson) Date: Fri, 17 Nov 2000 14:22:45 -0600 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Default replies? In-Reply-To: <3A12F105.40236207@west.sun.com>; from Dan.Mick@west.sun.com on Wed, Nov 15, 2000 at 12:24:37PM -0800 References: <20001115105141.A13818@riseup.net> <3A12F105.40236207@west.sun.com> Message-ID: <20001117142244.B27794@psasolar.colltech.com> Nope - as it turns out it is not in mm_cfg.py. Just for kicks I tried to add it in there, but that didn't change anything. Can we talk further on this? :) Micah On Wed, 15 Nov 2000, Dan Mick wrote: > > > Micah Anderson wrote: > > > > All my new lists are being created with the option "Where are replies to > > list messages directed? POSTER is strongly recommended for most > > mailinglists" set to "This list" instead of poster. I went into the > > Defaults.py file and found the following: > > > > # Replies to posts inherently directed to list or original sender? > > DEFAULT_REPLY_GOES_TO_LIST = 0 > > > > Which I would think is it - so I set it to 1 and then created a new list, > > but it was still set to "This list" am I setting this wrong? Is this the > > wrong setting? > > Did you also check mm_cfg.py? You are not supposed to change anything in > Defaults.py, as the comments say, but rather in mm_cfg.py, as the comments again > say. mm_cfg settings override Defaults settings. > > If it's not in mm_cfg.py, let's talk further. > > ------------------------------------------------------ > Mailman-Users maillist - Mailman-Users at python.org > http://www.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users -- Micah Anderson Collective Technologies www.colltech.com "To be and not to do is not to be at all" From Vulch at kernow.demon.co.uk Fri Nov 17 21:40:14 2000 From: Vulch at kernow.demon.co.uk (Anthony Frost) Date: Fri, 17 Nov 2000 20:40:14 +0000 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Dynamic (ish) footers in mails Message-ID: <28aa81f4a%Vulch@kerrier.vulch.org> One of the lists I host is for former members of a university organisation. We've now fixed the date for our next reunion (27th January 2001) and I was wondering about including a "days till the bar opens" count (70 days 22:23:59) in the message footer. Is it possible to pull in a bit of dynamically generated text in this way? Anthony -- | 99% of accidents occur in the home.... | | | | ...Stay safe, go out lots. | From claw at kanga.nu Fri Nov 17 21:43:32 2000 From: claw at kanga.nu (J C Lawrence) Date: Fri, 17 Nov 2000 12:43:32 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] How to decrease high loads In-Reply-To: Message from "Sarah K. Miller" of "Thu, 16 Nov 2000 15:58:41 PST." <03bc01c05029$26086720$0b00a8c0@beeze.com> References: <03bc01c05029$26086720$0b00a8c0@beeze.com> Message-ID: <9812.974493812@kanga.nu> On Thu, 16 Nov 2000 15:58:41 -0800 Sarah K Miller wrote: > We're running Mailman on a Sun Sparc Station 5, with 256 megs of > RAM and a 9.2 Gig hard drive. We've got about 80 lists, with the > busiest one producing approx 30 messages a day. We have a lot of > people signing up for lists right now though, creating a lot of > traffic. We are seeing load averages in excess of 25 when multiple > sign-ups are being processed. Is there anyway to configure mailman > to decrease the load average? And yes, we're working on getting a > better machine, but we have to limp by with what we have for now . While you don't provide the details in this area, I'd suspect that your richest vein for handling this would likely be at the MTA. Note: Depending on the size of your membership lists, the system you discuss is more than adequate for handling the better part of a million messages a day without undue strain. Mailing lists are not terribly resource intensive, not at the CPU level. What they consume are IO (disk and network) and RAM -- both of which appear reasonable (tho you don't comment on your connectivity). -- J C Lawrence claw at kanga.nu ---------(*) : http://www.kanga.nu/~claw/ --=| A man is as sane as he is dangerous to his environment |=-- From claw at kanga.nu Fri Nov 17 21:48:27 2000 From: claw at kanga.nu (J C Lawrence) Date: Fri, 17 Nov 2000 12:48:27 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Cannot access admin page! In-Reply-To: Message from "Vikas Gupta" of "Fri, 17 Nov 2000 02:19:37 GMT." References: Message-ID: <10139.974494107@kanga.nu> On Fri, 17 Nov 2000 02:19:37 GMT Vikas Gupta wrote: > I had everything working fine yesterday (i think). But today, I > try to access the admin page for a public list (which i could > access yesterday) and my browser hangs. WHat could cause this? > WHat python files control the admin pages? ListAdmin.py? Check that you don't have a stray (and bogus) lock file for the list in ~/locks. -- J C Lawrence claw at kanga.nu ---------(*) : http://www.kanga.nu/~claw/ --=| A man is as sane as he is dangerous to his environment |=-- From techgrrl at beeze.com Fri Nov 17 21:54:28 2000 From: techgrrl at beeze.com (Sarah K. Miller) Date: Fri, 17 Nov 2000 12:54:28 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] How to decrease high loads References: <03bc01c05029$26086720$0b00a8c0@beeze.com> <9812.974493812@kanga.nu> Message-ID: <00fe01c050d8$9436a0e0$0b00a8c0@beeze.com> > > We're running Mailman on a Sun Sparc Station 5, with 256 megs of > > RAM and a 9.2 Gig hard drive. We've got about 80 lists, with the > > busiest one producing approx 30 messages a day. We have a lot of > > people signing up for lists right now though, creating a lot of > > traffic. We are seeing load averages in excess of 25 when multiple > > sign-ups are being processed. Is there anyway to configure mailman > > to decrease the load average? And yes, we're working on getting a > > better machine, but we have to limp by with what we have for now . > > While you don't provide the details in this area, I'd suspect that > your richest vein for handling this would likely be at the MTA. > > Note: Depending on the size of your membership lists, the system you > discuss is more than adequate for handling the better part of a > million messages a day without undue strain. Mailing lists are not > terribly resource intensive, not at the CPU level. What they > consume are IO (disk and network) and RAM -- both of which appear > reasonable (tho you don't comment on your connectivity). Our MTA is sendmail. What we're seeing is multiple python processes spawning, which seem to eat huge amounts of resources. Is this normal? From michelle at kargo.com Fri Nov 17 22:14:36 2000 From: michelle at kargo.com (Michelle E. Harris) Date: Fri, 17 Nov 2000 16:14:36 -0500 Subject: [Mailman-Users] SSH to run webserver and mailman on separate machines Message-ID: Hello all, I browsed the archives and found discouragement towards the idea of using wrapper scripts on a web machine to execute the actual cgi progams on a separate machine hosting Mailman. I understand the arguments of why this overkill. However, my sysadmin is strongly against the idea of having ANY public web access to the machine which will be hosting Mailman. Hence, I don't see any alternative past SSH. Does anyone know how to do it? I greatly appreciate your help. -Michelle Harris From mrlist at ActiveState.com Fri Nov 17 22:56:59 2000 From: mrlist at ActiveState.com (Eric Wang) Date: Fri, 17 Nov 2000 13:56:59 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] after upgrade to rc2. the subscription process become slower Message-ID: <20001117135137.BB55.MRLIST@activestate.com> Hi Guys, After I upgraded to 2.0 rc2, actually everything is fine , only the subscription process seems become slower, when I was using the beta2, after replied the comfirmation email, I can get the welcome message almost in very short time, but right now take more than 20 mins normally. I know the qrunner works as a cron job in half hour interval, I was just wondering why the mailman has such differerence in this two versions. From claw at kanga.nu Fri Nov 17 23:08:40 2000 From: claw at kanga.nu (J C Lawrence) Date: Fri, 17 Nov 2000 14:08:40 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] How to decrease high loads In-Reply-To: Message from "Sarah K. Miller" of "Fri, 17 Nov 2000 12:54:28 PST." <00fe01c050d8$9436a0e0$0b00a8c0@beeze.com> References: <03bc01c05029$26086720$0b00a8c0@beeze.com> <9812.974493812@kanga.nu> <00fe01c050d8$9436a0e0$0b00a8c0@beeze.com> Message-ID: <17135.974498920@kanga.nu> On Fri, 17 Nov 2000 12:54:28 -0800 Sarah K Miller wrote: > Our MTA is sendmail. What we're seeing is multiple python > processes spawning, which seem to eat huge amounts of > resources. Is this normal? Without stats and logs on what those processes are, and what their observed runtime behaviour is I'm going to assume a few things: It seems likely that the processes in question are queue runners (ie processes that are attemting to deilver mail to recipients). If so, you need to reconfigure your MTA (sendmail) to use a reasonable number of queue runners and no more. I'm not a sendmail user, and am not familiar with recent versions, so I'll let others comment on the specifics there. That said, I would of course recommend moving to another more reasonable/scalable MTA such as Exim or Postfix. This is not to say that sendmail can't be made to work well for you -- just that I consider doing so needlessly difficult to both accomplish and monitor. While unlikely (I've run larger setups on smaller systems without problems) if the large number of executing processes are Mailman wrapper instances, especially wrapper instances that area handling "post", then you are likely running Mailman v1.0 or earlier. v1.1 improves this area slightly. v2,w hich not quite ready for prime time (its close) improves it significantly. -- J C Lawrence claw at kanga.nu ---------(*) : http://www.kanga.nu/~claw/ --=| A man is as sane as he is dangerous to his environment |=-- From jeff at stikman.com Fri Nov 17 23:48:07 2000 From: jeff at stikman.com (Jeff Grossman) Date: Fri, 17 Nov 2000 14:48:07 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Install Problem Message-ID: Hello, I just installed Mailman 2.0rc3 and when I went to the /mailman/ url for my site, it said Forbidden. This is the line from the Apache error log: [Fri Nov 17 14:42:42 2000] [error] [client XX.XX.X.XXX] attempt to invoke direct ory as script: /home/mailman/cgi-bin What does that mean? -- Jeff Grossman (jeff at stikman.com) From techgrrl at beeze.com Fri Nov 17 23:51:47 2000 From: techgrrl at beeze.com (Sarah K. Miller) Date: Fri, 17 Nov 2000 14:51:47 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] How to decrease high loads References: <03bc01c05029$26086720$0b00a8c0@beeze.com> <9812.974493812@kanga.nu> <00fe01c050d8$9436a0e0$0b00a8c0@beeze.com> <17135.974498920@kanga.nu> Message-ID: <024701c050e8$f8a520a0$0b00a8c0@beeze.com> Here's what's taking the server to it's knees. We're running Mailman 2.0, beta6. So, in essence, is this a sendmail problem that might be solved if we switch to a different MTA? $ uptime 2:49pm up 94 day(s), 22:28, 1 user, load average: 15.90, 7.21, 4.98 $ ps -ef |grep mailman daemon 2183 2176 5 14:49:15 ? 0:02 /usr/local/bin/python -S /export/home/mailman/scripts/mailcmd tech.programming. mailman 2188 2186 1 14:49:26 pts/1 0:00 -ksh daemon 2178 2172 5 14:49:13 ? 0:02 /usr/local/bin/python -S /export/home/mailman/scripts/mailcmd tech.programming. mailman 2134 173 0 14:49:00 ? 0:00 sh -c /usr/local/bin/python -S /export/home/mailman/cron/qrunner daemon 2184 2179 6 14:49:16 ? 0:02 /usr/local/bin/python -S /export/home/mailman/scripts/mailcmd tech.webdev.tools daemon 2196 2195 5 14:49:41 ? 0:01 /usr/local/bin/python -S /export/home/mailman/scripts/mailcmd tech.webdev.tools daemon 2181 2177 5 14:49:15 ? 0:02 /usr/local/bin/python -S /export/home/mailman/scripts/mailcmd tech.reviews daemon 2185 2180 5 14:49:17 ? 0:02 /usr/local/bin/python -S /export/home/mailman/scripts/mailcmd tech.webdev.desig daemon 2182 2175 5 14:49:15 ? 0:02 /usr/local/bin/python -S /export/home/mailman/scripts/mailcmd tech.webdev.infor daemon 2175 2168 0 14:49:12 ? 0:00 sh -c /export/home/mailman/mail/wrapper mailcmd tech.webdev.information-archite mailman 2199 2188 0 14:50:00 pts/1 0:00 grep mailman daemon 2177 2169 0 14:49:13 ? 0:00 sh -c /export/home/mailman/mail/wrapper mailcmd tech.reviews daemon 2180 2174 0 14:49:14 ? 0:00 sh -c /export/home/mailman/mail/wrapper mailcmd tech.webdev.design mailman 2200 173 1 14:50:00 ? 0:00 sh -c /usr/local/bin/python -S /export/home/mailman/cron/gate_news daemon 2176 2165 0 14:49:12 ? 0:00 sh -c /export/home/mailman/mail/wrapper mailcmd tech.programming.visual-basic daemon 2195 2192 0 14:49:40 ? 0:00 sh -c /export/home/mailman/mail/wrapper mailcmd tech.webdev.tools.dreamweaver daemon 2179 2173 0 14:49:13 ? 0:00 sh -c /export/home/mailman/mail/wrapper mailcmd tech.webdev.tools daemon 2172 2163 0 14:49:11 ? 0:00 sh -c /export/home/mailman/mail/wrapper mailcmd tech.programming.xml mailman 2139 2134 3 14:49:01 ? 0:01 /usr/local/bin/python -S /export/home/mailman/cron/qrunner > Without stats and logs on what those processes are, and what their > observed runtime behaviour is I'm going to assume a few things: From claw at kanga.nu Fri Nov 17 23:56:15 2000 From: claw at kanga.nu (J C Lawrence) Date: Fri, 17 Nov 2000 14:56:15 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] How to decrease high loads In-Reply-To: Message from "Sarah K. Miller" of "Fri, 17 Nov 2000 14:51:47 PST." <024701c050e8$f8a520a0$0b00a8c0@beeze.com> References: <03bc01c05029$26086720$0b00a8c0@beeze.com> <9812.974493812@kanga.nu> <00fe01c050d8$9436a0e0$0b00a8c0@beeze.com> <17135.974498920@kanga.nu> <024701c050e8$f8a520a0$0b00a8c0@beeze.com> Message-ID: <21414.974501775@kanga.nu> On Fri, 17 Nov 2000 14:51:47 -0800 Sarah K Miller wrote: > Here's what's taking the server to it's knees. We're running > Mailman 2.0, beta6. So, in essence, is this a sendmail problem > that might be solved if we switch to a different MTA? Before I comment further, please also post the list of the top 30 processes when the system is loaded. That, with the data you just posted, will show (better) what is going on and indicate where to look or do next. -- J C Lawrence claw at kanga.nu ---------(*) : http://www.kanga.nu/~claw/ --=| A man is as sane as he is dangerous to his environment |=-- From Dan.Mick at West.Sun.COM Sat Nov 18 00:54:12 2000 From: Dan.Mick at West.Sun.COM (Dan Mick) Date: Fri, 17 Nov 2000 15:54:12 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Mailman-Users] Install Problem Message-ID: <200011172352.PAA02209@utopia.west.sun.com> > I just installed Mailman 2.0rc3 and when I went to the /mailman/ url for my > site, it said Forbidden. This is the line from the Apache error log: > > [Fri Nov 17 14:42:42 2000] [error] [client XX.XX.X.XXX] attempt to invoke > direct > ory as script: /home/mailman/cgi-bin > > What does that mean? I'm not certain, but did you do this? (from INSTALL): - Configure your web server to give $prefix/cgi-bin permission to run CGI scripts. You probably need to be root to do this. The line you should add might look something like the following (with the real absolute directory substituted for $prefix, of course): Exec /mailman/* $prefix/cgi-bin/* or: ScriptAlias /mailman/ $prefix/cgi-bin/ Consult your web server's documentation for details. From jeff at stikman.com Sat Nov 18 01:53:24 2000 From: jeff at stikman.com (Jeff Grossman) Date: Fri, 17 Nov 2000 16:53:24 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Mail Problem Message-ID: I have set up Mailman 2.0rc3. I went and setup a test mailing list. If I send an e-mail to test-request at stikman.com with the subject of 'Subscribe', the mail is returned. Here is the log entry: Nov 17 16:47:32 apple smrsh: uid 8: attempt to use wrapper mailcmd test Nov 17 16:47:32 apple sendmail[15110]: eAI0lWZ15109: to="|/home/mailman/mail/wra pper mailcmd test", ctladdr= (8/0), delay=00:00:00, xd elay=00:00:00, mailer=prog, pri=30015, dsn=5.0.0, stat=Service unavailable Nov 17 16:47:32 apple sendmail[15110]: eAI0lWZ15109: eAI0lWZ15110: DSN: Service unavailable What is wrong? I am using Sendmail 8.11.1 on a Redhat 6.2 system. --- Jeff Grossman (jeff at stikman.com) From jeff at stikman.com Sat Nov 18 01:56:59 2000 From: jeff at stikman.com (Jeff Grossman) Date: Fri, 17 Nov 2000 16:56:59 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] E-mail Address Problem Message-ID: I just installed Mailman 2.0rc3. At the bottom of the original e-mail after I created a new mailing list, it says "Please address all questions to mailman-owner at stikman.com.". But, on the webpage at /mailman/listinfo it says "(Send questions or comments to mailman-owner at apple.stikman.com.)". How do I get the listinfo page to drop off the machine name of apple? I want all e-mail addresses to only say stikman.com. Thanks, Jeff --- Jeff Grossman (jeff at stikman.com) From mrbill at mrbill.net Sat Nov 18 03:40:35 2000 From: mrbill at mrbill.net (Bill Bradford) Date: Fri, 17 Nov 2000 20:40:35 -0600 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Extracting mailing lists; moving lists to another machine Message-ID: <20001117204035.E9697@mrbill.net> I've asked before, but nobody has had a simple answer. Two things I'd like to be able to do: 1. Get a list of the email addresses subscribed to each list (for backup purposes). 2. Whats the "official" procedure for moving lists from one machine to another? Bill -- Bill Bradford mrbill at mrbill.net Austin, TX From Dan.Mick at West.Sun.COM Sat Nov 18 03:46:04 2000 From: Dan.Mick at West.Sun.COM (Dan Mick) Date: Fri, 17 Nov 2000 18:46:04 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Mailman-Users] Extracting mailing lists; moving lists to another machine Message-ID: <200011180244.SAA08352@utopia.west.sun.com> > I've asked before, but nobody has had a simple answer. Two things I'd like > to be able to do: > > 1. Get a list of the email addresses subscribed to each list (for backup > purposes). bin/list_members. Try looking at bin/. There are useful things there. > 2. Whats the "official" procedure for moving lists from one machine to > another? There isn't one. From claw at kanga.nu Sat Nov 18 04:30:36 2000 From: claw at kanga.nu (J C Lawrence) Date: Fri, 17 Nov 2000 19:30:36 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Extracting mailing lists; moving lists to another machine In-Reply-To: Message from Bill Bradford of "Fri, 17 Nov 2000 20:40:35 CST." <20001117204035.E9697@mrbill.net> References: <20001117204035.E9697@mrbill.net> Message-ID: <12677.974518236@kanga.nu> On Fri, 17 Nov 2000 20:40:35 -0600 Bill Bradford wrote: > 1. Get a list of the email addresses subscribed to each list (for > backup purposes). ~/bin/list_members. -- J C Lawrence claw at kanga.nu ---------(*) : http://www.kanga.nu/~claw/ --=| A man is as sane as he is dangerous to his environment |=-- From marc_news at valinux.com Sat Nov 18 06:00:00 2000 From: marc_news at valinux.com (Marc MERLIN) Date: Fri, 17 Nov 2000 21:00:00 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Extracting mailing lists; moving lists to another machine In-Reply-To: <200011180244.SAA08352@utopia.west.sun.com>; from Dan.Mick@West.Sun.COM on Fri, Nov 17, 2000 at 06:46:04PM -0800 References: <200011180244.SAA08352@utopia.west.sun.com> Message-ID: <20001117210000.V17368@marc.merlins.org> On Fri, Nov 17, 2000 at 06:46:04PM -0800, Dan Mick wrote: > > 2. Whats the "official" procedure for moving lists from one machine to > > another? > > There isn't one. You can move lists though, it's not a problem. If the target machine uses a differentn directory for the mailman install, you have to use move_list at the end to fix the path names inside the lists config.db files. Marc -- Microsoft is to operating systems & security .... .... what McDonalds is to gourmet cooking Home page: http://marc.merlins.org/ | Finger marc_f at merlins.org for PGP key From andyheath2 at lineone.net Sat Nov 18 09:53:06 2000 From: andyheath2 at lineone.net (Andy Heath) Date: Sat, 18 Nov 2000 08:53:06 +0000 Subject: [Mailman-Users] interface mailman list passwords python cgi Message-ID: <3A164372.2B43C505@lineone.net> I don't know whether I should send this to mailman users or developers so apologies if not appropriate. I need to write some cgi applications with python that interface to mailman 1.0 email id's and passwords - access only to list members, that sort of thing. I'd appreciate advice on how to go about this. I find some "config.db" files which obviously is some sort of database containing the info. Is there some easy way I can get into this info ? Later I will need to move the solution to working with mailman 2.0 All advice welcome Andy -- ------------------------------------------------------------ Andy Heath Home:+44 (0)114 2885738 a.k.heath at shu.ac.uk From m at whiteywillpay.net Sat Nov 18 17:38:19 2000 From: m at whiteywillpay.net (Matt Singerman) Date: Sat, 18 Nov 2000 11:38:19 -0500 (EST) Subject: [Mailman-Users] All posts on list being held for approval Message-ID: Hi all, We host a list, members-list at trinityindiana.org, which is set so that only members may post. Currently, there are only two addresses on the list. the problem is, all posts are being held for administrative approval, and not just non-members' posts. Any ideas what this might be caused by? What other details should I give to help sort this out? Matt Singerman | "Don't feel sad, I'm in heaven now, m at whiteywillpay.net | singing with the pretty angels" http://whiteywillpay.net/ | -- JonBenet Ramsey From claw at kanga.nu Sat Nov 18 17:38:44 2000 From: claw at kanga.nu (J C Lawrence) Date: Sat, 18 Nov 2000 08:38:44 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] interface mailman list passwords python cgi In-Reply-To: Message from Andy Heath of "Sat, 18 Nov 2000 08:53:06 GMT." <3A164372.2B43C505@lineone.net> References: <3A164372.2B43C505@lineone.net> Message-ID: <14507.974565524@kanga.nu> On Sat, 18 Nov 2000 08:53:06 +0000 Andy Heath wrote: > I need to write some cgi applications with python that interface > to mailman 1.0 email id's and passwords - access only to list > members, that sort of thing. Study ~bin/withlist. > I'd appreciate advice on how to go about this. I find some > "config.db" files which obviously is some sort of database > containing the info. Is there some easy way I can get into this > info ? config.db is a python pickle -- essentially a streamed python structure. -- J C Lawrence claw at kanga.nu ---------(*) : http://www.kanga.nu/~claw/ --=| A man is as sane as he is dangerous to his environment |=-- From dpprm at frontier.net Sat Nov 18 20:07:19 2000 From: dpprm at frontier.net (Dexter P. McCann) Date: Sat, 18 Nov 2000 11:07:19 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] (no subject) Message-ID: <000701c05192$c7785100$aad52dc7@computer> Where do I go to get help with my visioneer paperport 6100 scanner. I can get it to preview but not scan. This has been an ongoing problem and I cannot find help resolving it. Thank you. Pat -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mail.python.org/pipermail/mailman-users/attachments/20001118/24f16f0a/attachment.html From tpot at linuxcare.com.au Sun Nov 19 06:37:31 2000 From: tpot at linuxcare.com.au (Tim Potter) Date: Sun, 19 Nov 2000 16:37:31 +1100 (EST) Subject: [Mailman-Users] Extracting mailing lists; moving lists to another machine In-Reply-To: <20001117210000.V17368@marc.merlins.org> References: <200011180244.SAA08352@utopia.west.sun.com> <20001117210000.V17368@marc.merlins.org> Message-ID: <14871.26395.632604.16207@gargle.gargle.HOWL> Marc MERLIN writes: > > > 2. Whats the "official" procedure for moving lists from one machine to > > > another? > > > > There isn't one. > > You can move lists though, it's not a problem. > If the target machine uses a differentn directory for the mailman install, > you have to use move_list at the end to fix the path names inside the lists I've had reason to move a coplete mailman installation from one achine (an irix) to a linux machine. All it required was rsyncing the files across and setting up appropriate symblic links so things looked like they were in the same place, and reinstalling mailman on top of itself. Having everything under /home/mailman was a big help as the minimum number of symbolic links and ucking around had to occur. Strangely enough the list passwords were all trashed, probably because of endian weirdness From gconnor at nekodojo.org Sun Nov 19 07:59:03 2000 From: gconnor at nekodojo.org (Greg Connor) Date: Sat, 18 Nov 2000 22:59:03 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Bug in 2.0rc2 adding newlist References: <3A106ECF.1857.594BDCE@localhost> Message-ID: <3A177A37.46F87CDD@nekodojo.org> Phil Barnett wrote: > > Running 2.0rc2. > > I was trying to add a list with bin/newlist and got this: > ... > File "/home/mailman/Mailman/Utils.py", line 568, in mkdir > os.mkdir(dir, mode) > OSError: [Errno 2] No such file or directory: > '/home/mailman/archives/private/bin/newlist.mbox' > I got this too. Looks like a buglet in 2.0rc2. However, I noticed that running bin/newlist foo fails, but just running bin/newlist and then typing the new listname when prompted, works. When you put the name on the command line, it looks like it picks up "bin/newlist" as the name instead. -- Greg Connor From lovelace at wayfarer.org Sun Nov 19 15:36:26 2000 From: lovelace at wayfarer.org (Tanner Lovelace) Date: Sun, 19 Nov 2000 09:36:26 -0500 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Re: Bug in 2.0rc2 adding newlist References: <3A106ECF.1857.594BDCE@localhost> <3A177A37.46F87CDD@nekodojo.org> Message-ID: <3A17E56A.691DD65E@wayfarer.org> Greg Connor wrote: > > Phil Barnett wrote: > > > > Running 2.0rc2. > > > > I was trying to add a list with bin/newlist and got this: > > > ... > > File "/home/mailman/Mailman/Utils.py", line 568, in mkdir > > os.mkdir(dir, mode) > > OSError: [Errno 2] No such file or directory: > > '/home/mailman/archives/private/bin/newlist.mbox' > > > > I got this too. Looks like a buglet in 2.0rc2. However, I noticed that > running > bin/newlist foo > fails, but just running > bin/newlist > and then typing the new listname when prompted, works. When you put the > name on the command line, it looks like it picks up "bin/newlist" as the > name instead. > I believe this has been fixed in 2.0rc3. argv was being used instead of args. -- Tanner Lovelace lovelace at wayfarer.org http://wtl.wayfarer.org/ Cthulu for President. Why settle for the lesser evil? From tlj3 at primenet.com Sun Nov 19 17:00:46 2000 From: tlj3 at primenet.com (Ted Johnson) Date: Sun, 19 Nov 2000 11:00:46 -0500 Subject: [Mailman-Users] No user: mailman Message-ID: <3A17F92E.CF3562DE@primenet.com> I don't have the ability to create a user named "mailman" I asked my ISP and they are not willing to create it. They run a list manager called SmartList. Has anyone ever hacked Mailman so that it could run under another username, perhaps the user that SmartList uses? -- Ted Johnson tlj3 at primenet.com ======================= Chief of Web Operations PEOPLink tjohnson at peoplink.org From claw at kanga.nu Sun Nov 19 17:06:12 2000 From: claw at kanga.nu (J C Lawrence) Date: Sun, 19 Nov 2000 08:06:12 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] No user: mailman In-Reply-To: Message from Ted Johnson of "Sun, 19 Nov 2000 11:00:46 EST." <3A17F92E.CF3562DE@primenet.com> References: <3A17F92E.CF3562DE@primenet.com> Message-ID: <17492.974649972@kanga.nu> On Sun, 19 Nov 2000 11:00:46 -0500 Ted Johnson wrote: > I don't have the ability to create a user named "mailman" I asked > my ISP and they are not willing to create it. They run a list > manager called SmartList. Has anyone ever hacked Mailman so that > it could run under another username, perhaps the user that > SmartList uses? Yes. Note that by default the Debian package for Mailman use the user "list" (which I believe it shares with smartlist). -- J C Lawrence claw at kanga.nu ---------(*) : http://www.kanga.nu/~claw/ --=| A man is as sane as he is dangerous to his environment |=-- From alamar at partners-intl.net Sun Nov 19 17:32:26 2000 From: alamar at partners-intl.net (Aaron La Mar) Date: Sun, 19 Nov 2000 11:32:26 -0500 (EST) Subject: [Mailman-Users] Mailman broken with RC3 upgrade Message-ID: I've been running mailman on the same box since 1.0, but my attempted upgrade to 2.0rc3 seems to have broken everything today. I am running FreeBSD 3.1, Python 1.5.2, and Apache. I was upgrading from 2.0b6. Now I get this message wen trying to connect through the web interface: "Bug in Mailman version 2.0rc3 We're sorry, we hit a bug! Please inform the webmaster for this site of this problem. Printing of traceback and other system information has been explicitly inhibited, but the webmaster can find this information in the Mailman error logs." There's nothing useful in $prefix/logs/error, just some messages about NNTP gate not being configured correctly. I can't find anthing in any other logs either. I've run check_perms and there are no problems. This is a very serious problem for me and I would appreciate any advice. Thanks, Aaron From xiaobo at staff.263.com Mon Nov 20 08:20:57 2000 From: xiaobo at staff.263.com (=?gb2312?B?zO/QobKo?=) Date: Mon, 20 Nov 2000 15:20:57 +0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] looking for Message-ID: <000c01c052c2$6e1c37d0$280ca8c0@xiaobo> Dear Sirs/Madam, We are 263 online postoffice( http://freemail.263.com ), which is the largest mail service provider in China at present. We belong to Capital Online ( http://www.263.net ), which takes up the leadership among the Internet service providers. Our 263 postoffice provides multifunctional services including a series of excellent items: * to send and receive e-mail through web or pop3 * automatic reply * to reject junk mail * e-mail address book We are also under the process of developing other service items, such as mail list. We heard your company is a famous mail list system provider and have advanced technology in this field. We would like to know more about you so that we can cooperate on the aspect of mail list service. The things we want most is some introduction of your company and the quotation of your service/software, if you have please send us to this mail address: mating at staff.263.com, or if you prefer contact us in the other way you can call Mr. Ma Ting by the phone: (8610) 65616263-7089. Thank for your reply! With regards ----------------------------- ?? ?? ?? 263???????? ??????????????-?????????? Tel??(010)65616263-7083 Fax??(010)65615661 EMAIL??XIAOBO at STAFF.263.COM ----------------------------- -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mail.python.org/pipermail/mailman-users/attachments/20001120/2845b25b/attachment.htm From xiaobo at staff.263.com Mon Nov 20 08:27:58 2000 From: xiaobo at staff.263.com (=?gb2312?B?zO/QobKo?=) Date: Mon, 20 Nov 2000 15:27:58 +0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] looking for cooperation Message-ID: <001d01c052c3$682d6640$280ca8c0@xiaobo> Dear Sirs/Madam, We are 263 online postoffice( http://freemail.263.com ), which is the largest mail service provider in China at present. We belong to Capital Online ( http://www.263.net ), which takes up the leadership among the Internet service providers. Our 263 postoffice provides multifunctional services including a series of excellent items: * to send and receive e-mail through web or pop3 * automatic reply * to reject junk mail * e-mail address book We are also under the process of developing other service items, such as mail list. We heard your company is a famous mail list system provider and have advanced technology in this field. We would like to know more about you so that we can cooperate on the aspect of mail list service. The things we want most is some introduction of your company and the quotation of your service/software, if you have please send us to this mail address: xiaobo at staff.263.com, or if you prefer contact us in the other way you can call Mr. Ma Ting by the phone: (8610) 65616263-7083. FAX:861065615661 Thank for your reply! With regards ----------------------------- ?? ?? ?? Xiaobo Tian 263???????? 263 capital on-line (China) ??????????????-?????????? Tel??(8610)65616263-7083 Fax??(8610)65615661 EMAIL??XIAOBO at STAFF.263.COM ----------------------------- -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mail.python.org/pipermail/mailman-users/attachments/20001120/b6db8bf8/attachment.html From tib at tigerknight.org Mon Nov 20 10:54:25 2000 From: tib at tigerknight.org (Tib) Date: Mon, 20 Nov 2000 01:54:25 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Mailman-Users] user database Message-ID: I'm trying to coordinate an htaccess file with the user database of mailman to create a sort of user-priveleged web access area for my mailing list, but I can't find the database of addresses for the list. Can someone tell me where this is please? Tib From lindsey at mallorn.com Mon Nov 20 11:37:20 2000 From: lindsey at mallorn.com (Christopher P. Lindsey) Date: Mon, 20 Nov 2000 04:37:20 -0600 Subject: [Mailman-Users] user database In-Reply-To: ; from tib@tigerknight.org on Mon, Nov 20, 2000 at 01:54:25AM -0800 References: Message-ID: <20001120043720.N31764@mallorn.com> > I'm trying to coordinate an htaccess file with the user database of mailman to > create a sort of user-priveleged web access area for my mailing list, but I > can't find the database of addresses for the list. Can someone tell me where > this is please? Here's a program that I submitted in May 1999 that generates a .htaccess file containing the list membership and their list password: http://www.python.org/pipermail/mailman-users/1999-May/001207.html Incidentally, is there any way to search the archives any more? I tried the ones at python.org and couldn't get anything remotely Mailman out of them, so I ended up having to go through my personal archives to find out when this was sent. Chris From R.A.Gardener at shu.ac.uk Mon Nov 20 12:13:48 2000 From: R.A.Gardener at shu.ac.uk (Ray Gardener) Date: Mon, 20 Nov 2000 11:13:48 +0000 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Pipermail archives zipped format Message-ID: <3A19076C.5670A96E@shu.ac.uk> I notice that some Mailman sites present the old archives in zipped format whereas mime are just text. How do I get my archives zipped please? Regards Ray Gardener From tib at tigerknight.org Mon Nov 20 12:32:58 2000 From: tib at tigerknight.org (Tib) Date: Mon, 20 Nov 2000 03:32:58 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Mailman-Users] user database In-Reply-To: <20001120043720.N31764@mallorn.com> Message-ID: Wonderful, thankyou :] Sorry if I rehashed a recently stated topic - been too busy lately to be able to sift my mail all that well. Tib On Mon, 20 Nov 2000, Christopher P. Lindsey wrote: > > I'm trying to coordinate an htaccess file with the user database of mailman to > > create a sort of user-priveleged web access area for my mailing list, but I > > can't find the database of addresses for the list. Can someone tell me where > > this is please? > > Here's a program that I submitted in May 1999 that generates a .htaccess > file containing the list membership and their list password: > > http://www.python.org/pipermail/mailman-users/1999-May/001207.html > > Incidentally, is there any way to search the archives any more? I tried > the ones at python.org and couldn't get anything remotely Mailman out > of them, so I ended up having to go through my personal archives to > find out when this was sent. > > Chris > > ------------------------------------------------------ > Mailman-Users maillist - Mailman-Users at python.org > http://www.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users > From ttc at chavoosh.com Mon Nov 20 13:58:38 2000 From: ttc at chavoosh.com (Soleimani) Date: Mon, 20 Nov 2000 16:28:38 +0330 Subject: [Mailman-Users] URGENT Message-ID: <000801c052f1$a48d6620$1a1ea8c0@pishro20> DEAR SIR , PLEASE BE INFORMED THAT WE ARE LOOKING TO MANUFACTURER WITH NAME CHIRO IN ITALY PRODUCER OF PIPING , VALVES AND GATE ETC . IF YOU CAN HELP US KINDLY CONTACT BY RETURN . BEST REGARDS, -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mail.python.org/pipermail/mailman-users/attachments/20001120/c905721a/attachment.htm From nalin_sood at rediffmail.com Mon Nov 20 13:21:13 2000 From: nalin_sood at rediffmail.com (NALIN SOOD) Date: 20 Nov 2000 12:21:13 -0000 Subject: [Mailman-Users] using mailman Message-ID: <20001120122113.11949.qmail@mailweb9.rediffmail.com> sir, I am planning to use a mailing list software on my website. However the site is hosted on a shared server so please guide me in how to set up the software for the site _____________________________________________________ Chat with your friends as soon as they come online. Get Rediff Bol at http://bol.rediff.com Participate in crazy auctions at http://auctions.rediff.com/auctions/ From barry at digicool.com Mon Nov 20 18:27:30 2000 From: barry at digicool.com (Barry A. Warsaw) Date: Mon, 20 Nov 2000 12:27:30 -0500 Subject: [Mailman-Users] user database References: <20001120043720.N31764@mallorn.com> Message-ID: <14873.24322.757119.72112@anthem.concentric.net> >>>>> "CPL" == Christopher P Lindsey writes: CPL> Here's a program that I submitted in May 1999 that generates CPL> a .htaccess file containing the list membership and their CPL> list password: CPL> http://www.python.org/pipermail/mailman-users/1999-May/001207.html Why don't you upload that to the SourceForge patch manager? CPL> Incidentally, is there any way to search the archives any CPL> more? I tried the ones at python.org and couldn't get CPL> anything remotely Mailman out of them, so I ended up having CPL> to go through my personal archives to find out when this was CPL> sent. Sigh. We're trying to offload a bunch of stuff from search.python.org machine so we can start the searches up again. -Barry From mrbill at mrbill.net Mon Nov 20 18:38:47 2000 From: mrbill at mrbill.net (Bill Bradford) Date: Mon, 20 Nov 2000 11:38:47 -0600 Subject: [Mailman-Users] URGENT In-Reply-To: <000801c052f1$a48d6620$1a1ea8c0@pishro20>; from ttc@chavoosh.com on Mon, Nov 20, 2000 at 04:28:38PM +0330 References: <000801c052f1$a48d6620$1a1ea8c0@pishro20> Message-ID: <20001120113847.N3214@mrbill.net> On Mon, Nov 20, 2000 at 04:28:38PM +0330, Soleimani wrote: > DEAR SIR , > PLEASE BE INFORMED THAT WE ARE LOOKING TO MANUFACTURER WITH NAME > CHIRO IN ITALY PRODUCER OF PIPING , VALVES AND GATE ETC . > IF YOU CAN HELP US KINDLY CONTACT BY RETURN . > BEST REGARDS, I thought it was "mailman", not "plumber's helper" ? 8-) (maybe thats the new name for 3.0....) Bill -- Bill Bradford mrbill at mrbill.net Austin, TX From winter at PHYSnet.uni-hamburg.de Mon Nov 20 18:46:16 2000 From: winter at PHYSnet.uni-hamburg.de (F. Winter) Date: Mon, 20 Nov 2000 18:46:16 +0100 (MET) Subject: [Mailman-Users] Admin page is hanging... Message-ID: Greeting to all! I have running about 15 lists. Every lists admin page works fine but one. The password dialog does not appear. My browser hangs. I browsed through the archives and recogniced that several people had the same problem in Nov. and Sep. before. But the solution to delete the lock files in the mailman/locks directory does not fix it. They just appear again when calling the admin page from the browser. Any idea? -- Frank Winter From rob at curiouslabs.com Mon Nov 20 19:19:29 2000 From: rob at curiouslabs.com (Rob Saul) Date: Mon, 20 Nov 2000 10:19:29 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] re: passwords not getting sent out References: <20001117225802.BE6851D2C6@dinsdale.python.org> Message-ID: <3A196B31.48789C42@curiouslabs.com> Thanks to Dan Mick I was able to figure out why password reminders weren't getting sent out to my little test list. It was private. I'm not sure I understand the logic of not sending out password reminders to members of private lists. Shouldn't this be a configurable option? A small code tweek later and I was able to push passwords to members of the list. I wanted to see it work before on my test list before trying it on a live one. ~Rob From tolga at oberon.physics.metu.edu.tr Mon Nov 20 19:33:14 2000 From: tolga at oberon.physics.metu.edu.tr (Tolga KILICLI) Date: Mon, 20 Nov 2000 20:33:14 +0200 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Distributed or Sequential? Message-ID: <20001120203314.A5701@oberon.physics.metu.edu.tr> Hi to all, I have a question; Is there a way of getting run exim and mailman that exim posts mails without queuing them to exim. Or could exim post mails without queuing? I think this is called distributed mailing...(or not??) thanks, tolga. From blutgens at sistina.com Mon Nov 20 21:15:23 2000 From: blutgens at sistina.com (Ben Lutgens) Date: Mon, 20 Nov 2000 14:15:23 -0600 Subject: [Mailman-Users] archive import question Message-ID: <20001120141523.C1014@titanium.sistina.com> Is there a way for me to take some mbox style archives accumulated from major-slowmo and "import" them into the newly started mailman archives? It would be really great if I didn't have to tell my users to look in two different spots for email archives. I am using the built-in archiver (pipermail?) TIA -- Ben Lutgens Sistina Software Inc. -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 240 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://mail.python.org/pipermail/mailman-users/attachments/20001120/abfdcd9d/attachment.pgp From axl at mail.plymouth.edu Mon Nov 20 21:37:54 2000 From: axl at mail.plymouth.edu (AxL) Date: Mon, 20 Nov 2000 15:37:54 -0500 Subject: [Mailman-Users] mail from localhost References: <20001120170136.0EBF71D01D@dinsdale.python.org> Message-ID: <3A198BA2.E2EB1649@mail.plymouth.edu> Hrm...everyone on the mailing list gets mail fine, but sometimes their mail is held up for approval. The users are all subscribed as, say, "joe at frodo.university.edu", "bob at frodo.university.edu", etc...but sometimes the mail header comes out as "Received: (from joe at localhost)", which is held for approval, since that isn't what is listed for the subscriber's e-mail, nor should it. Is this a problem with mailman or with the site? -axl PS - Turning on access so non-members can post to rthe list is not desired, in this case. From claw at kanga.nu Mon Nov 20 22:20:53 2000 From: claw at kanga.nu (J C Lawrence) Date: Mon, 20 Nov 2000 13:20:53 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] mail from localhost In-Reply-To: Message from AxL of "Mon, 20 Nov 2000 15:37:54 EST." <3A198BA2.E2EB1649@mail.plymouth.edu> References: <20001120170136.0EBF71D01D@dinsdale.python.org> <3A198BA2.E2EB1649@mail.plymouth.edu> Message-ID: <30007.974755253@kanga.nu> On Mon, 20 Nov 2000 15:37:54 -0500 AxL wrote: > Is this a problem with mailman or with the site? This is a problem with the configuration of the MTA on either your list server, or the box originating the email, or both. -- J C Lawrence claw at kanga.nu ---------(*) : http://www.kanga.nu/~claw/ --=| A man is as sane as he is dangerous to his environment |=-- From shane at cm.nu Mon Nov 20 22:25:05 2000 From: shane at cm.nu (Shane Wegner) Date: Mon, 20 Nov 2000 13:25:05 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Huge duplication of posts Message-ID: <20001120132505.A22278@cm.nu> Hi, I just ran into a rather large problem with mailman and am hoping someone can give me a clue as to why it happened and how to prevent it in the future. I setup a newsgroup to mailing list gateway about two months back and everything worked fine. However, today mailman reposted everything on the nntp server to the list all over again. Over 3000 messages were posted in a single run. I don't think dialup users are gonna be impressed. Does mailman not check the message ids to ensure that posts aren't posted again? Is this a mailman feature or something with the NNTP server. The NNTP server is out of my control and is a large ISP. If I can provide any logs to help I would be happy to do so. Regards, Shane -- Shane Wegner: shane at cm.nu http://www.cm.nu/~shane/ PGP: 1024D/FFE3035D A0ED DAC4 77EC D674 5487 5B5C 4F89 9A4E FFE3 035D From Dan.Mick at west.sun.com Mon Nov 20 22:38:50 2000 From: Dan.Mick at west.sun.com (Dan Mick) Date: Mon, 20 Nov 2000 13:38:50 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] archive import question References: <20001120141523.C1014@titanium.sistina.com> Message-ID: <3A1999EA.4C46A86A@west.sun.com> Ben Lutgens wrote: > > Is there a way for me to take some mbox style archives accumulated from > major-slowmo and "import" them into the newly started mailman archives? This is what bin/arch is for. Get an mbox that represents everything you want to archive, and bin/arch will regenerate them from scratch. (note: don't keep any old archives around; this is a complete regen.) From hels71 at totalise.co.uk Mon Nov 20 22:53:44 2000 From: hels71 at totalise.co.uk (Hels) Date: Mon, 20 Nov 2000 21:53:44 +0000 Subject: [Mailman-Users] I would like to set up my own list Message-ID: Hi There, My name Is Helen and I would like to set up my own mailing list for Britney Spears, please could you send me information on how I can do this please, I found out about your mailing list service via the ukmix Website. I look forward to hearing from you soon, cheers helen x From cnl at haystack.mit.edu Mon Nov 20 23:01:35 2000 From: cnl at haystack.mit.edu (Ching Lue) Date: Mon, 20 Nov 2000 17:01:35 -0500 Subject: [Mailman-Users] complete e-mail address Message-ID: <3A199F3F.486DB198@haystack.mit.edu> I am new to the mailmail , my installation seems went well, but after I created a list name "openradar-announce", the mail daemon, sent the confirmation as: Date: Fri, 17 Nov 2000 15:16:23 -0500 (EST) Subject: Openradar-announce -- confirmation of subscription -- request 124751 To: xxx at xxx.xxx.edu X-Ack: no X-BeenThere: openradar-announce@ List-Post: List-Subscribe: <../listinfo/openradar-announce>, List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: <../listinfo/openradar-announce>, List-Archive: Can someone tell me what's need to be set in order for the above marked " Hi, how do I empty a mail archive? -- patrik wallstrom | f o o d f i g h t tel: +46-8-6188428 | s t o c k h o l m gsm: +46-708405080 | - - - - - - - - - fax: +46-859827151 | From raysales.rep at worldnet.att.net Tue Nov 21 02:17:01 2000 From: raysales.rep at worldnet.att.net (Ray Worden) Date: Mon, 20 Nov 2000 19:17:01 -0600 Subject: [Mailman-Users] send info on your text bridge soft wear Message-ID: <000001c05363$90a257c0$b49c4b0c@default> I tried moving a Text to Word & it was to light so that it was incomplete in much of the printing. After several tries a note popped up suggesting that you had a solution. Please advise as to what you recommend. I have a PaperPort 3000. Ray Worden, 745 Fairchild Dr., Wilmington, IL 60481 raysales.rep at worldnet.att.net 815-476-6305 From nhruby at arches.uga.edu Tue Nov 21 04:26:57 2000 From: nhruby at arches.uga.edu (nathan r. hruby) Date: Mon, 20 Nov 2000 22:26:57 -0500 (EST) Subject: [Mailman-Users] send info on your text bridge soft wear In-Reply-To: <000001c05363$90a257c0$b49c4b0c@default> Message-ID: Is it just me, or has this list been getting alot of this stuff of late? (I thought the full moon was last week...) -n On Mon, 20 Nov 2000, Ray Worden wrote: > I tried moving a Text to Word & it was to light so that it was incomplete in > much of the printing. After several tries a note popped up suggesting that > you had a solution. Please advise as to what you recommend. I have a > PaperPort 3000. > > Ray Worden, 745 Fairchild Dr., Wilmington, IL 60481 > raysales.rep at worldnet.att.net > 815-476-6305 > > > ------------------------------------------------------ > Mailman-Users maillist - Mailman-Users at python.org > http://www.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users > -- ........ nathan hruby Webmaster: UGA Department of Drama and Theatre Project Maintainer: phpSlash, Carousel nhruby at arches.uga.edu ........ From adamj at dumpshock.com Tue Nov 21 15:20:47 2000 From: adamj at dumpshock.com (Adam J) Date: Tue, 21 Nov 2000 07:20:47 -0700 Subject: [Mailman-Users] send info on your text bridge soft wear In-Reply-To: References: <000001c05363$90a257c0$b49c4b0c@default> Message-ID: <4.3.2.7.2.20001121071417.02223ac8@206.246.241.201> At 22:26 20/11/2000 -0500, nathan r. hruby wrote: > >Is it just me, or has this list been getting alot of this stuff of late? >(I thought the full moon was last week...) I've notice that the lists I run have been receiving spam on a much more frequent basis for the last month or two, as have both of my email addresses that have posted to the lists. Adam < http://staff.dumpshock.com/adamj / adamj at dumpshock.com / UIN 2350330 > From ppruett at webengr.com Tue Nov 21 15:51:18 2000 From: ppruett at webengr.com (ppruett) Date: Tue, 21 Nov 2000 14:51:18 +0000 (GMT) Subject: [Mailman-Users] Mailman -virtual- sendmail & openbsd In-Reply-To: <3A13629B.4070106@wayfarer.org> Message-ID: BTW, that was the solution, don't use CNAME for the virtualhosting I thought that the Sendmail Option in sendmail.cf O DontExpandCname True would take care of this, for some reason it did not and the O'reilly book recommended against it. So I redid the domain zone files and my problems went away. I just have to remember that if I ever change the IP address I have to do it for all the domain names since I can't use CNAME - thanks paul On Wed, 15 Nov 2000, Tanner Lovelace wrote: > My guess is that you would have to actually > put in an A record instead of the CNAME. I > believe that MX records (I'm assuming you have > one for list.cocoavillage.com) are not supposed > to point to CNAMES. This could be why sendmail > is rewriting the header... Of course, it could > be because it's just sendmail. :-) > > Tanner Lovelace > > ppruett wrote: > > > I think I am need to change something on sendmail?... > > > > I have been using Mailman on openbsd and it is working > > with list.webengr.com > > > > I wanted it to answer to other domains, so I > > did the magic for dns like > > list.cocoavillage.com IN CNAME list.webengr.com > > and set the hostname in the Mailman admin interface > > and edited > > /etc/mail/local-host-names on the mailman computer > > and I even got my Oreilly book and read > > and tried "O DontExpandCnames True" > > just incase. > > > > So my lists respond and work with the other domains > > but the "To" and other email gets changed > > so even though I send to cv-forum at list.cocoavillage.com > > the subscribers get back cv-forum at list.webengr.com > > I checked some sendmail logs and I think > > that sendmail is rewritting the email header... > > > > anyone out there have the 'quickfix' or > > is it somehting like have to use masquerade on sendmail > > or other... > > > > -tia > > > > paul > > > > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------ > Mailman-Users maillist - Mailman-Users at python.org > http://www.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users > From hana.krizova at schemantix.com Tue Nov 21 16:47:07 2000 From: hana.krizova at schemantix.com (=?iso-8859-2?Q?Hana_K=F8=ED=BEov=E1?=) Date: Tue, 21 Nov 2000 16:47:07 +0100 Subject: [Mailman-Users] interface to edit Archives Index HTML page? Message-ID: Hi All, does anybody know if there exists user interface to edit Archives Index HTML page (see http://MAILMANHOST/pipermail/LISTNAME)? I found instructions at http://www.aurora.edu/~ckolar/mailman/mailman-administration-0.2.html - I should use "Edit the HTML for the public list pages" admin page (see http://MAILMANHOST/mailman/edithtml/LISTNAME) but there is no such link on admin pages. I use 2.0rc1 version of Mailman. Best regards Hana Krizova hana.krizova at schemantix.com Praxis From mdiehn at vicinity.com Tue Nov 21 17:02:16 2000 From: mdiehn at vicinity.com (Mike Diehn) Date: Tue, 21 Nov 2000 11:02:16 -0500 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Sorry about that! In-Reply-To: <200011211550.HAA23081@sf-web2.i.sourceforge.net>; from noreply@sourceforge.net on Tue, Nov 21, 2000 at 07:50:42AM -0800 References: <200011211550.HAA23081@sf-web2.i.sourceforge.net> Message-ID: <20001121110216.I14936@tupelo.vicinity.com> Barry, > Date: 2000-Nov-21 07:50 > By: bwarsaw > > Comment: > You don't mention which MTA you're using, but since you're on > Solaris, I'm guessing it's sendmail. One of the most important > things to do is to turn off name resolution for messages coming > from the local host. See the FAQ for details. That's probably > why it's taking so long to deliver messages. Using Postfix. I'll check the FAQ regarding name resolution settings. > As for the memory usage, no I definitely haven't seen that. On > python.org, qrunner may grow to 2MB but that's after running > for several minutes (which is normal because it's delivering a > lot of mail). We're seeing it regularly grow to 60 or 70 MB. Without much in the queue. > Finally, the bug tracking system isn't the right place to ask > for help. I would suggest sending a message to > mailman-users at python.org and trying to get more help there. If > a real bug is uncovered, then it can be placed into the bug > tracking system. Sorry about asking for help in the Bug system. I'm on the lists now and I'll do the right thing in the future. I know better. I just had a long brain fart. Apologies and thanks, Mike * noreply at sourceforge.net (noreply at sourceforge.net) [11 21, 2000 10:55]: > Bug #122672, was updated on 2000-Nov-17 00:47 > Here is a current snapshot of the bug. > > Project: Mailman > Category: mail delivery > Status: Closed > Resolution: None > Bug Group: More Information Needed > Priority: 5 > Summary: qrunner consuming much memory > > Details: Having performance problems. > > Running Mailman 2.0rc3 and Python 2.0 on Solaris 2.5.1. This is an old system, a sun4u, UltraSPARC 167Mhz, 256 MB RAM. > > Mail to a Mailman list can take up to five or six hours to deliver (rarely that long, but 30 minutes is common). Mail to local users, bypassing Mailman, finishes in the 1 to 5 > second range. > > I found that qrunner runs for about 2-7 minutes each time > it starts. By the time it quits, it's grown to between 65 and 90 MB in memory. I made the cronjob run every five minutes instead of every minute, and that eliminated the "can't get qrunner lock" message in logs/error, but didn't help the performance. > > There are never many files in ~mailman/qfiles. At present, there are two .msg and .db files. qrunner just started about 30 seconds ago and it's already up to 47 MB. > > Is this much memeory usage normal? > > By the way, I feel like a heel asking for help on the bug tracking system. Is there a better place for me to be posting my questions? > > Thanks, > Mike > > Follow-Ups: From barry at digicool.com Tue Nov 21 17:17:12 2000 From: barry at digicool.com (Barry A. Warsaw) Date: Tue, 21 Nov 2000 11:17:12 -0500 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Huge duplication of posts References: <20001120132505.A22278@cm.nu> Message-ID: <14874.40968.797054.266396@anthem.concentric.net> >>>>> "SW" == Shane Wegner writes: SW> Does mailman not check the message ids to ensure that posts SW> aren't posted again? No, Mailman only checks the article numbers coming from the nntpd. If you switch ISPs or they suddenly renumber all their articles, you can potentially get resends. This will happen if the article numbers are higher than the current high-water mark. If they're lower for some reason, you'll just stop getting messages until you reach the hwm. It'd be nice if they told you this, eh? If they warn you, you can go into the News/Mail gateway section of the admin pages and click on `catchup', which resets the hwm to the last article number on the server. There's another thing that happens occasionally, and there's little you can do about this. Sometimes, someone upstream will start to repost messages to the newsgroup. It's hard to tell immediately that this is happening, but you can check headers like Path: to see if things look weird. This happens about every 6 months or so on comp.lang.python and about all you can do is track down the offender and complain bitterly. -Barry From morris at unc.edu Tue Nov 21 18:52:08 2000 From: morris at unc.edu (Joe Morris) Date: Tue, 21 Nov 2000 12:52:08 -0500 (EST) Subject: [Mailman-Users] mail from localhost In-Reply-To: <30007.974755253@kanga.nu> Message-ID: On Mon, 20 Nov 2000, J C Lawrence wrote: | On Mon, 20 Nov 2000 15:37:54 -0500 | AxL wrote: | | > Is this a problem with mailman or with the site? | | This is a problem with the configuration of the MTA on either your | list server, or the box originating the email, or both. Well, I don't think it's a problem with the MTA, but it can be configured. Nevertheless, you reminded me of something. Mailman (at least before V2) does not allow you to enter an email address without a hostname. This is under the Privacy Options and posters section. If you enter an address without being qualified and hit "submit", it just wipes out that entry. Is this a bug or intentional? _______________________________________________________ Joe Morris http://www.ibiblio.org/morris Web Systems Manager, ATN http://help.unc.edu UNC-Chapel Hill http://www.unc.edu From techgrrl at beeze.com Tue Nov 21 19:22:07 2000 From: techgrrl at beeze.com (Sarah K. Miller) Date: Tue, 21 Nov 2000 10:22:07 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Wierd E-mail addresses Message-ID: <00c201c053e7$f594bbd0$0b00a8c0@beeze.com> Some of my list owners are having problems with addresses in the membership database showing up as user at aol.com.subscr.plain. What causes that and how do we fix it? Do all of these people have to be mass unsubbed, then resubbed with their corrected addresses?? -- Sarah From Jean-Baptiste.Yunes at verif.liafa.jussieu.fr Tue Nov 21 19:49:29 2000 From: Jean-Baptiste.Yunes at verif.liafa.jussieu.fr (Jean-Baptiste Yunes) Date: Tue, 21 Nov 2000 19:49:29 +0100 (MET) Subject: [Mailman-Users] Mailman & Masquerading... Message-ID: <200011211849.TAA21274@verif.liafa.jussieu.fr> I have some problems(?!) installing Mailman on a masqueraded environnement. Well in fact it works but I don't know if I've done the right things... I installed Mailman on a machine say "mac.domain". So the list is hosted at "mac.domain" but addressable at "domain" Outgoing mails are masqueraded to "domain" so I asked the "domain" administrator to put some list aliases in its aliases database (ie: list-admin at domain is mapped to list-admin at mac.domain, etc.). I modified the "Host name this list prefers" in the "General Options" menu to "domain" (in place of "mac.domain"). It seems to work, but I'm not sure it's the right solution. Am I doing something wrong or not ? Something missing ? Sincerely yours, -- Yunes Jean-Baptiste, LIAFA, Universite Paris 7 Denis Diderot. France http://www.liafa.jussieu.fr/~yunes/ From michael at spconnect.com Tue Nov 21 19:51:11 2000 From: michael at spconnect.com (Michael Ghens) Date: Tue, 21 Nov 2000 10:51:11 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Mailman-Users] Mailman broken with RC3 upgrade In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Could not help but pipe in. It is good idea to do a tarball of the mailman directory before doing the upgrade. It has saved me a few times. On Sun, 19 Nov 2000, Aaron La Mar wrote: > Date: Sun, 19 Nov 2000 11:32:26 -0500 (EST) > From: Aaron La Mar > To: mailman-users at python.org > Subject: [Mailman-Users] Mailman broken with RC3 upgrade > > I've been running mailman on the same box since 1.0, but my attempted > upgrade to 2.0rc3 seems to have broken everything today. > > I am running FreeBSD 3.1, Python 1.5.2, and Apache. I was upgrading from > 2.0b6. > > Now I get this message wen trying to connect through the web interface: > "Bug in Mailman version 2.0rc3 > > We're sorry, we hit a bug! > Please inform the webmaster for this site of this problem. Printing of > traceback and other system information has been explicitly inhibited, but > the webmaster can find this information in the Mailman error logs." > > There's nothing useful in $prefix/logs/error, just some messages about > NNTP gate not being configured correctly. I can't find anthing in any > other logs either. I've run check_perms and there are no problems. > > This is a very serious problem for me and I would appreciate any advice. > > Thanks, > > Aaron > > > ------------------------------------------------------ > Mailman-Users maillist - Mailman-Users at python.org > http://www.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users > From shane at cm.nu Tue Nov 21 23:05:50 2000 From: shane at cm.nu (Shane Wegner) Date: Tue, 21 Nov 2000 14:05:50 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Huge duplication of posts In-Reply-To: <14874.40968.797054.266396@anthem.concentric.net>; from barry@digicool.com on Tue, Nov 21, 2000 at 11:17:12AM -0500 References: <20001120132505.A22278@cm.nu> <14874.40968.797054.266396@anthem.concentric.net> Message-ID: <20001121140550.A23995@cm.nu> On Tue, Nov 21, 2000 at 11:17:12AM -0500, Barry A. Warsaw wrote: > > >>>>> "SW" == Shane Wegner writes: > > SW> Does mailman not check the message ids to ensure that posts > SW> aren't posted again? > > No, Mailman only checks the article numbers coming from the nntpd. If > you switch ISPs or they suddenly renumber all their articles, you can > potentially get resends. This will happen if the article numbers are > higher than the current high-water mark. If they're lower for some > reason, you'll just stop getting messages until you reach the hwm. > > It'd be nice if they told you this, eh? If they warn you, you can go > into the News/Mail gateway section of the admin pages and click on > `catchup', which resets the hwm to the last article number on the > server. Hmm looks like they renumbered alright. Is this a common occurence for a large NNTP server. If so, is there anything I can do? I would think something as simple as running the list traffic through formail with an msgid cache would do it but I am no python programmer. Thanks for your help. Shane -- Shane Wegner: shane at cm.nu http://www.cm.nu/~shane/ PGP: 1024D/FFE3035D A0ED DAC4 77EC D674 5487 5B5C 4F89 9A4E FFE3 035D From barry at digicool.com Tue Nov 21 23:46:51 2000 From: barry at digicool.com (Barry A. Warsaw) Date: Tue, 21 Nov 2000 17:46:51 -0500 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Huge duplication of posts References: <20001120132505.A22278@cm.nu> <14874.40968.797054.266396@anthem.concentric.net> <20001121140550.A23995@cm.nu> Message-ID: <14874.64347.815520.500843@anthem.concentric.net> >>>>> "SW" == Shane Wegner writes: SW> Hmm looks like they renumbered alright. Is this a common SW> occurence for a large NNTP server. I've never seen it happen on the nntpd I've been pointed at, but it /will/ happen if you rehome your news gateway. SW> If so, is there anything I can do? I would think something as SW> simple as running the list traffic through formail with an SW> msgid cache would do it but I am no python programmer. I'm not familar with formail, but keeping a message-id cache is probably a good idea (but overkill for most setups, I'd imagine). -Barry From chuqui at plaidworks.com Wed Nov 22 00:00:41 2000 From: chuqui at plaidworks.com (Chuq Von Rospach) Date: Tue, 21 Nov 2000 15:00:41 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Huge duplication of posts In-Reply-To: <14874.64347.815520.500843@anthem.concentric.net> References: <20001120132505.A22278@cm.nu> <14874.40968.797054.266396@anthem.concentric.net> <20001121140550.A23995@cm.nu> <14874.64347.815520.500843@anthem.concentric.net> Message-ID: At 5:46 PM -0500 11/21/00, Barry A. Warsaw wrote: > >>>>> "SW" == Shane Wegner writes: > > SW> Hmm looks like they renumbered alright. Is this a common > SW> occurence for a large NNTP server. > >I've never seen it happen on the nntpd I've been pointed at, but it >/will/ happen if you rehome your news gateway. It's likely to happen after things like ahrdware upgrades, really significant software upgrades, and hardware failures. any time they have to rebuild their databases, you're hosed. > SW> If so, is there anything I can do? I would think something as > SW> simple as running the list traffic through formail with an > SW> msgid cache would do it but I am no python programmer. > >I'm not familar with formail, but keeping a message-id cache is >probably a good idea (but overkill for most setups, I'd imagine). Mixed blessing -- lots of overhead for very occasional acts of chaos -- and the dataset you need to keep can get huge. -- Chuq Von Rospach - Plaidworks Consulting (mailto:chuqui at plaidworks.com) Apple Mail List Gnome (mailto:chuq at apple.com) The vet said it was behavioral, but I prefer to think of it as genetic. It cuts down on the liability -- Get Fuzzy From barry at digicool.com Wed Nov 22 00:23:33 2000 From: barry at digicool.com (Barry A. Warsaw) Date: Tue, 21 Nov 2000 18:23:33 -0500 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Huge duplication of posts References: <20001120132505.A22278@cm.nu> <14874.40968.797054.266396@anthem.concentric.net> <20001121140550.A23995@cm.nu> <14874.64347.815520.500843@anthem.concentric.net> Message-ID: <14875.1013.760560.720930@anthem.concentric.net> >>>>> "CVR" == Chuq Von Rospach writes: CVR> It's likely to happen after things like ahrdware upgrades, CVR> really significant software upgrades, and hardware CVR> failures. any time they have to rebuild their databases, CVR> you're hosed. CVR> Mixed blessing -- lots of overhead for very occasional acts CVR> of chaos -- and the dataset you need to keep can get huge. So, is there an 80/20 rule we can adopt? Is the `catchup' button enough or do we need more? I'm not psyched to burn tons of space holding data that may never be used. Then again, if the message-id database is more generally useful, we can perhaps piggyback the nntp status on top of that. -Barry From rone at macromedia.com Wed Nov 22 00:39:52 2000 From: rone at macromedia.com (Ron Echeverri) Date: Tue, 21 Nov 2000 15:39:52 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Mailman-Users] Need to clear administrative requests Message-ID: <20001121233952.6A9D323D5@karach.macromedia.com> One of our lists got spammed and as a result there are over 3000 administrative requests pending. When i try following the "pending requests" link, it hangs for a while (the python process reaches 73MB of usage), and then fails silently ("The document has no data"). What is the simplest way to clear them all out? This is the latest 1.x release of Mailman, and python 1.5.2. thanks rone -- Ron Echeverri UNIX Systems Administrator Desk: x2149 Macromedia, Inc. Cell: +1-415-2547942 Pager: +1-888-6585681 From shane at cm.nu Wed Nov 22 00:42:03 2000 From: shane at cm.nu (Shane Wegner) Date: Tue, 21 Nov 2000 15:42:03 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Huge duplication of posts In-Reply-To: <14875.1013.760560.720930@anthem.concentric.net>; from barry@digicool.com on Tue, Nov 21, 2000 at 06:23:33PM -0500 References: <20001120132505.A22278@cm.nu> <14874.40968.797054.266396@anthem.concentric.net> <20001121140550.A23995@cm.nu> <14874.64347.815520.500843@anthem.concentric.net> <14875.1013.760560.720930@anthem.concentric.net> Message-ID: <20001121154203.A29185@cm.nu> On Tue, Nov 21, 2000 at 06:23:33PM -0500, Barry A. Warsaw wrote: > > >>>>> "CVR" == Chuq Von Rospach writes: > > CVR> It's likely to happen after things like ahrdware upgrades, > CVR> really significant software upgrades, and hardware > CVR> failures. any time they have to rebuild their databases, > CVR> you're hosed. > > CVR> Mixed blessing -- lots of overhead for very occasional acts > CVR> of chaos -- and the dataset you need to keep can get huge. > > So, is there an 80/20 rule we can adopt? Is the `catchup' button > enough or do we need more? I'm not psyched to burn tons of space > holding data that may never be used. Then again, if the message-id > database is more generally useful, we can perhaps piggyback the nntp > status on top of that. Well one way to do it that wouldn't require so much space is a session limit. If for example we are checking the NNTP server every 5 minutes, we connect and there are 500 new messages, it's probably safe to seek admin approval. Of corse these numbers would vary from list to list. Shane -- Shane Wegner: shane at cm.nu http://www.cm.nu/~shane/ PGP: 1024D/FFE3035D A0ED DAC4 77EC D674 5487 5B5C 4F89 9A4E FFE3 035D From barry at digicool.com Wed Nov 22 00:46:18 2000 From: barry at digicool.com (Barry A. Warsaw) Date: Tue, 21 Nov 2000 18:46:18 -0500 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Huge duplication of posts References: <20001120132505.A22278@cm.nu> <14874.40968.797054.266396@anthem.concentric.net> <20001121140550.A23995@cm.nu> <14874.64347.815520.500843@anthem.concentric.net> <14875.1013.760560.720930@anthem.concentric.net> <20001121154203.A29185@cm.nu> Message-ID: <14875.2378.197103.847266@anthem.concentric.net> >>>>> "SW" == Shane Wegner writes: SW> Well one way to do it that wouldn't require so much space SW> is a session limit. If for example we are checking the SW> NNTP server every 5 minutes, we connect and there are 500 SW> new messages, it's probably safe to seek admin approval. SW> Of corse these numbers would vary from list to list. Hmm, that might not be a bad idea. Maybe fit it into the pending requests database. -Barry From chuqui at plaidworks.com Wed Nov 22 00:55:52 2000 From: chuqui at plaidworks.com (Chuq Von Rospach) Date: Tue, 21 Nov 2000 15:55:52 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Need to clear administrative requests In-Reply-To: <20001121233952.6A9D323D5@karach.macromedia.com> References: <20001121233952.6A9D323D5@karach.macromedia.com> Message-ID: At 3:39 PM -0800 11/21/00, Ron Echeverri wrote: >One of our lists got spammed and as a result there are over 3000 >administrative requests pending. owww. If worse comes to worse, go into ~mailman/lists/ and look for the requests.db file. If you delete it, all those pending requests magically go away. Blowtorches to light a candle, but... -- Chuq Von Rospach - Plaidworks Consulting (mailto:chuqui at plaidworks.com) Apple Mail List Gnome (mailto:chuq at apple.com) The vet said it was behavioral, but I prefer to think of it as genetic. It cuts down on the liability -- Get Fuzzy From chuqui at plaidworks.com Wed Nov 22 00:51:01 2000 From: chuqui at plaidworks.com (Chuq Von Rospach) Date: Tue, 21 Nov 2000 15:51:01 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Huge duplication of posts In-Reply-To: <14875.1013.760560.720930@anthem.concentric.net> References: <20001120132505.A22278@cm.nu> <14874.40968.797054.266396@anthem.concentric.net> <20001121140550.A23995@cm.nu> <14874.64347.815520.500843@anthem.concentric.net> <14875.1013.760560.720930@anthem.concentric.net> Message-ID: > CVR> Mixed blessing -- lots of overhead for very occasional acts > CVR> of chaos -- and the dataset you need to keep can get huge. > >So, is there an 80/20 rule we can adopt? Is the `catchup' button >enough or do we need more? I'd do a couple of things. First, I'd check the posting date of what's being sucked in from usenet. Anything older than {configurable} days is assumed to be a duplicate and dumped (that's the first line of defense for usenet, FWIW) Second, you can do one of two things depending on how motivated you are. First is to keep track of all message-id's for {configurable} days and bounce dupes (that's the second line of defense for usenet), or you can monitor traffic and if you hit some significant uptick, put the intake on hold until the admin can evaluate. Given how mailman is attaching to a NNTP site, I'd say keeping all Message-Ids for a week and bouncing everything older than a week would do it without major work and/or sets of data. but you're starting to *act* like an NNTP server here, which, I guess, since we're dealing with NNTP data, shouldn't surprise me.. -- Chuq Von Rospach - Plaidworks Consulting (mailto:chuqui at plaidworks.com) Apple Mail List Gnome (mailto:chuq at apple.com) The vet said it was behavioral, but I prefer to think of it as genetic. It cuts down on the liability -- Get Fuzzy From lindsey at mallorn.com Wed Nov 22 04:12:24 2000 From: lindsey at mallorn.com (Christopher P. Lindsey) Date: Tue, 21 Nov 2000 21:12:24 -0600 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Need to clear administrative requests In-Reply-To: <20001121233952.6A9D323D5@karach.macromedia.com>; from rone@macromedia.com on Tue, Nov 21, 2000 at 03:39:52PM -0800 References: <20001121233952.6A9D323D5@karach.macromedia.com> Message-ID: <20001121211224.A5307@mallorn.com> > One of our lists got spammed and as a result there are over 3000 > administrative requests pending. When i try following the "pending > requests" link, it hangs for a while (the python process reaches 73MB > of usage), and then fails silently ("The document has no data"). What > is the simplest way to clear them all out? This is the latest 1.x > release of Mailman, and python 1.5.2. Use withlist: > python -i $prefix/bin/withlist -l [listname] >>> m.requests={} >>> m.Save() >>> ^D ^D is [CTRL]-D, hit simultaneously. Remember, this removes *ALL* pending administrative requests. You might want to backup $prefix/lists/[listname] first, just in case. :) Chris From barry at digicool.com Wed Nov 22 18:33:16 2000 From: barry at digicool.com (Barry A. Warsaw) Date: Wed, 22 Nov 2000 12:33:16 -0500 Subject: [Mailman-Users] [ANNOUNCE] Mailman 2.0 Message-ID: <14876.860.607056.18676@anthem.concentric.net> I'm please to announce the 2.0 final release of Mailman, the GNU Mailing List Manager. Mailman is released under the GNU General Public License (GPL). Mailman is software to help manage electronic mail discussion lists, much like Majordomo or Smartmail. Mailman gives each mailing list a unique web page and allows users to subscribe, unsubscribe, and change their account options over the web. Even the list manager can administer his or her list entirely via the web. Mailman has most of the features that people want in a mailing list management system, including built-in archiving, mail-to-news gateways, spam filters, bounce detection, digest delivery, and so on. Mailman is compatible with most web servers, web browsers, and mail servers. It should run on any Unix-like operating system. Mailman requires Python 1.5.2 or better. To install Mailman from source, you will need a C compiler. For more information on Mailman, please see the following mirrors: http://www.list.org http://mailman.sourceforge.net http://www.gnu.org/software/mailman/mailman.html (the latter is not yet up to date) There are email lists (managed by Mailman, of course!) for both Mailman users and developers. See the web sites above for details. My thanks to everybody who has helped with this release, especially those named in the ACKNOWLEDGMENTS file. My thanks also to the SourceForge crew for their open source project management site. Couldn't have done it without them. Enjoy, -Barry From marc_news at valinux.com Wed Nov 22 18:59:44 2000 From: marc_news at valinux.com (Marc MERLIN) Date: Wed, 22 Nov 2000 09:59:44 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] patch problem In-Reply-To: ; from tib@tigerknight.org on Wed, Nov 08, 2000 at 01:44:12PM -0800 References: Message-ID: <20001122095944.B7066@marc.merlins.org> On Wed, Nov 08, 2000 at 01:44:12PM -0800, Tib wrote: > I installed rc1 and applied the patch (which reported success btw) but > found an error in my logs of: Sorry for the late reply. > Nov 7 20:05:25 unica kernel: Security: denied hard link to 0.603 for UID 531, > EUID 531, process python:27692 > Nov 7 22:32:52 unica kernel: Security: denied hard link to 0.603 for UID 99, > EUID 99, process python:8148 The first versions of the securelinux_fix.py patch worked for me, but didn't do everything necessary to work for everyone The version in 2.0rc3 or 2.0 released should work. If not, I'm interested to know about it. Thanks Marc -- Microsoft is to operating systems & security .... .... what McDonalds is to gourmet cooking Home page: http://marc.merlins.org/ | Finger marc_f at merlins.org for PGP key From cweller at UECU.org Wed Nov 22 19:00:22 2000 From: cweller at UECU.org (chris weller) Date: Wed, 22 Nov 2000 13:00:22 -0500 Subject: [Mailman-Users] WRONG E MAIL ADDRESS - PLEASE STOP SENDING Message-ID: My email address is wrong and my carrier keeps having to forward - please delete my email address - I think you have it as czeller at uecu.org or something like that THRU READING PHILLIES - my name is Christine Weller, cweller at uecu.org NOT above wrong one From yann.forget at ynternet.org Wed Nov 22 19:56:58 2000 From: yann.forget at ynternet.org (Yann Forget) Date: Wed, 22 Nov 2000 19:56:58 +0100 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Migration to another server Message-ID: <3A1C16FA.8703A70@ynternet.org> Hi, I migrated from one server to another and I got into a problem: on the old server, the lists were at : http://mail.ynternet.ch/cgi-bin/mailman/admin/ on the new server, the old lists don't appear here http://bull.ynternet.ch/mailman/listinfo/ and are not accessible from here http://bull.ynternet.ch/mailman/admin/ How to get that right ? It's Apache 1.3.9 (Debian Potato) and Mailman 2.0beta5. Thanks, Yann From WayneR at STROSNIDERS.com Wed Nov 22 20:22:30 2000 From: WayneR at STROSNIDERS.com (Wayne Ringling) Date: Wed, 22 Nov 2000 14:22:30 -0500 Subject: [Mailman-Users] [ANNOUNCE] Mailman 2.0 Message-ID: Has anyone built a RPM of 2.0 yet? I would really like to use 2.0 on one of my mailing list servers. I have never had much luck with getting the compiled one to work with my systems. Wayne > I'm please to announce the 2.0 final release of Mailman, the GNU > Mailing List Manager. Mailman is released under the GNU General > Public License (GPL). > > From mojo at whiteoaks.com Wed Nov 22 20:58:43 2000 From: mojo at whiteoaks.com (Morris Jones) Date: Wed, 22 Nov 2000 11:58:43 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Mailman-Users] Re: Mailman 2.0 Message-ID: Congratulations Barry, Chuq, and all the other contributors to Mailman 2.0! Best regards, Mojo -- Morris Jones <*> San Rafael, CA mojo at whiteoaks.com http://www.whiteoaks.com From jerrya at jerrya.net Wed Nov 22 21:01:27 2000 From: jerrya at jerrya.net (Jerry Adlersfluegel) Date: Wed, 22 Nov 2000 14:01:27 -0600 (CST) Subject: [Mailman-Users] [ANNOUNCE] Mailman 2.0 In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Wed, 22 Nov 2000, Wayne Ringling wrote: > > Has anyone built a RPM of 2.0 yet? I would really like to use 2.0 on one > of my mailing list servers. I have never had much luck with getting the > compiled one to work with my systems. On the same note, does anyone have it compiled for irix 6.5? I am trying to test mailman's performance but am having difficulty setting up gcc on the machine. I've never had trouble installing it from source on a RH machine though. Sorry for the non-answer to your question. Thanks! -- Jerry Adlersfluegel From ashley at pcraft.com Wed Nov 22 21:14:23 2000 From: ashley at pcraft.com (Ashley M. Kirchner) Date: Wed, 22 Nov 2000 13:14:23 -0700 Subject: [Mailman-Users] [ANNOUNCE] Mailman 2.0 References: Message-ID: <3A1C291E.5E5FC835@pcraft.com> Jerry Adlersfluegel wrote: > On the same note, does anyone have it compiled for irix 6.5? I am trying > to test mailman's performance but am having difficulty setting up gcc on > the machine. You may (strongly) consider getting gcc 2.95.2 (binary) from SGI's freeware site. Works like a charm, no problems. http://freeware.sgi.com AMK4 -- W | | I haven't lost my mind; it's backed up on tape somewhere. |____________________________________________________________________ ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Ashley M. Kirchner . 303.442.6410 x130 SysAdmin / Websmith . 800.441.3873 x130 Photo Craft Laboratories, Inc. . eFax 248.671.0909 http://www.pcraft.com . 3550 Arapahoe Ave #6 .................. . . . . Boulder, CO 80303, USA From Jean-Francois.Malouin at bic.mni.mcgill.ca Wed Nov 22 21:30:14 2000 From: Jean-Francois.Malouin at bic.mni.mcgill.ca (Jean-Francois Malouin) Date: Wed, 22 Nov 2000 15:30:14 -0500 Subject: [Mailman-Users] [ANNOUNCE] Mailman 2.0 In-Reply-To: ; from jerrya@jerrya.net on Wed, Nov 22, 2000 at 02:01:27PM -0600 References: Message-ID: <20001122153013.B10436@bottom.bic.mni.mcgill.ca> * Jerry Adlersfluegel (jerrya at jerrya.net) [20001122 15:03] thus spake: > On Wed, 22 Nov 2000, Wayne Ringling wrote: > > > > > Has anyone built a RPM of 2.0 yet? I would really like to use 2.0 on one > > of my mailing list servers. I have never had much luck with getting the > > compiled one to work with my systems. > > On the same note, does anyone have it compiled for irix 6.5? I am trying > to test mailman's performance but am having difficulty setting up gcc on > the machine. You are aware of the gcc problems with irix-6.5.x don't you? (the gcc backend does not conform to the N32-MIPS ABI when passing or returning small --4bytes-- structures by value: inet_ntoa() does that...). Do yourself a favor and get a temporary license for the mipspro compilers if you don't want to purchase them and don't use gcc. If you still want to use gcc, you have a few options: - compile with N64 ABI of gcc (it's free of the gcc-induced problem of passing small (4-byte) structures on the stack rather than as register). You might encounter other problems though, if you link with other stuff that is N32 (sloppy typecasts: integer is smaller than long and pointer in N64 and casting a pointer into an integer will do harm) - roll your own gcc-compiled inet_ntoa (from bind or inn, say) and recompile gcc. You then use the same incorrect-gcc-but-consistent-way of passing structures not abiding by the N32 MIPS ABI specs. - use gcc-2.7.x and O32 (old and slower). - Use the following code and stick somewhere in the mailman C code (thanks to Stuart Levy for this): #if sgi && __GNUC__ /* Replacement for SGI libc inet_ntoa(), since * gcc's structure-passing convention isn't the same as SGI cc's. */ char *inet_ntoa( struct in_addr sa ) { static char addr[20]; sprintf(addr, "%d.%d.%d.%d", ((unsigned char *)&sa.s_addr)[0], ((unsigned char *)&sa.s_addr)[1], ((unsigned char *)&sa.s_addr)[2], ((unsigned char *)&sa.s_addr)[3]); return addr; } #endif HTH, jf > > I've never had trouble installing it from source on a RH machine though. > Sorry for the non-answer to your question. > > Thanks! > > -- > Jerry Adlersfluegel -- "You are born naked, wet and hungry. Then it gets worse" -Woto From wmorehouse at hisbranches.org Wed Nov 22 23:51:37 2000 From: wmorehouse at hisbranches.org (Dr. Bill Morehouse) Date: Wed, 22 Nov 2000 17:51:37 -0500 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Wish List: A user's guide Message-ID: <005201c054d6$d83413c0$0700a8c0@wmoffice> What's the closest thing to a User's Guide you can give me? We're newcomers and novices on the Web, and our website server, Hostway, has offered us the use of Mailman. How the heck would we use it if we don't know where to start? All I can find so far is a lot of tech talk. Thanks! ><<((('> William R. Morehouse, MD His Branches - Grace Family Medicine 340 Arnett Boulevard, Rochester, NY 14619 Phone: (716) 235-2250, Fax: (716) 235-0011 http://www.hisbranches.org/grace -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mail.python.org/pipermail/mailman-users/attachments/20001122/4b0ac615/attachment.htm -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: William R. Morehouse.vcf Type: text/x-vcard Size: 727 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://mail.python.org/pipermail/mailman-users/attachments/20001122/4b0ac615/attachment.vcf From ckolar at admin.aurora.edu Thu Nov 23 00:52:53 2000 From: ckolar at admin.aurora.edu (Christopher Kolar) Date: Wed, 22 Nov 2000 17:52:53 -0600 Subject: [Mailman-Users] v2 Management Documents, GFDL Message-ID: <5.0.1.4.2.20001122175114.0205df30@admin.aurora.edu> I am pleased to announce that v2 of the Mailman list manager's documentation is available at www.aurora.edu/~ckolar/mailman. Aurora University has generously agreed to release these documents under the GNU Free Documentation License (GFDL), details are on the site. --chris From darc at bconnex.net Thu Nov 23 03:12:14 2000 From: darc at bconnex.net (darc at bconnex.net) Date: Wed, 22 Nov 2000 21:12:14 -0500 (EST) Subject: [Mailman-Users] misuse of your program Message-ID: <200011230212.VAA14068@mail.bconnex.net> Hello, I am hoping you can help me. A group or company calling themselves beta at lists.betaonline.com has set up a listserver, inserted many dozens of email adresses, and is sending out mailings to all on the list. They are not answering dozens of emails sent by different people asking them to please stop. People, like myself who have never subscribed to this list are being bombarded with emails. The end result is a host of extremly angry people who will remember the mail program that annoyed us so much. Is there anything you can do to get them to fix this problem? Their Unsub address does not work, nothing seems to work. Thank you! Dar... From claw at kanga.nu Thu Nov 23 03:32:28 2000 From: claw at kanga.nu (J C Lawrence) Date: Wed, 22 Nov 2000 18:32:28 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] misuse of your program In-Reply-To: Message from darc@bconnex.net of "Wed, 22 Nov 2000 21:12:14 EST." <200011230212.VAA14068@mail.bconnex.net> References: <200011230212.VAA14068@mail.bconnex.net> Message-ID: <13936.974946748@kanga.nu> On Wed, 22 Nov 2000 21:12:14 -0500 (EST) darc wrote: > Hello, I am hoping you can help me. A group or company calling > themselves beta at lists.betaonline.com ...is abusing Mailman... See: http://lists.betaonline.com/mailman/listinfo/beta/ Theoretically you, or anyone else who is on that list, should be able to ubsubscribe yourselves from there. -- J C Lawrence claw at kanga.nu ---------(*) : http://www.kanga.nu/~claw/ --=| A man is as sane as he is dangerous to his environment |=-- From among at ymca.or.kr Thu Nov 23 04:38:24 2000 From: among at ymca.or.kr (¾öÈ«¼®) Date: Thu, 23 Nov 2000 12:38:24 +0900 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Help me Message-ID: <001d01c054fe$d600d8e0$3bc130d3@among> Dear ... warm regards form Seoul YMCA "Hongseok Eom" our mail & web server had attacked by cracker yesterday. I recovered our server by using backup data with difficulty. at first I setuped Linux on other computer and copy cofigure file and user account data an so on... now mailserver and webserver is working. but the mailman doesn't work. I created 6 mailinglist. they show me almost same error massages. How can I fix this problem. Help me. Thanks. error massage - - - - - ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------ http://www.ymca.or.kr/mailman/admin/livewire ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------ Bug in Mailman version 1.1 We're sorry, we hit a bug! If you would like to help us identify the problem, please email a copy of this page to the webmaster for this site with a description of what happened. Thanks! Traceback: Traceback (innermost last): File "/home/mailman/scripts/driver", line 112, in run_main main() File "/home/mailman/Mailman/Cgi/admin.py", line 65, in main lst = MailList.MailList(list_name) File "/home/mailman/Mailman/MailList.py", line 62, in __init__ self.Load() File "/home/mailman/Mailman/MailList.py", line 804, in Load self.Lock() File "/home/mailman/Mailman/MailList.py", line 1373, in Lock self.__lock.lock() File "/home/mailman/Mailman/LockFile.py", line 186, in lock os.link(self.__lockfile, self.__tmpfname) OSError: [Errno 13] Permission denied Environment variables: VariableValue DOCUMENT_ROOT /home/love SERVER_ADDR 211.48.193.2 HTTP_ACCEPT_ENCODING gzip, deflate SERVER_PORT 80 PATH_TRANSLATED /home/love/livewire REMOTE_ADDR 211.48.193.59 HTTP_ACCEPT_LANGUAGE ko GATEWAY_INTERFACE CGI/1.1 SERVER_NAME www.ymca.or.kr HTTP_CONNECTION Keep-Alive HTTP_USER_AGENT Mozilla/4.0 (compatible; MSIE 5.01; Windows NT 5.0; DigExt) HTTP_ACCEPT image/gif, image/x-xbitmap, image/jpeg, image/pjpeg, application/vnd.ms-powerpoint, application/vnd.ms-excel, application/msword, */* REQUEST_URI /mailman/admin/livewire PATH /sbin:/usr/sbin:/bin:/usr/bin:/usr/X11R6/bin QUERY_STRING SCRIPT_FILENAME /home/mailman/cgi-bin/admin PATH_INFO /livewire HTTP_HOST www.ymca.or.kr REQUEST_METHOD GET SERVER_SIGNATURE Apache/1.3.12 Server at www.ymca.or.kr Port 80 SCRIPT_NAME /mailman/admin SERVER_ADMIN among at ymca.or.kr SERVER_SOFTWARE Apache/1.3.12 (Unix) PHP/4.0.3pl1 PYTHONPATH /home/mailman SERVER_PROTOCOL HTTP/1.1 REMOTE_PORT 3822 From Dan.Mick at West.Sun.COM Thu Nov 23 04:52:03 2000 From: Dan.Mick at West.Sun.COM (Dan Mick) Date: Wed, 22 Nov 2000 19:52:03 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Mailman-Users] Wish List: A user's guide Message-ID: <200011230350.TAA10830@utopia.west.sun.com> > What's the closest thing to a User's Guide you can give me? We're > newcomers and novices on the Web, and our website server, Hostway, > has offered us the use of Mailman. How the heck would we use it if we > don't know where to start? All I can find so far is a lot of tech > talk. Thanks! Well, in terms of "creating lists", it sounds like you need to ask Hostway to do it; in terms of "administering", the web pages are fairly self-explanatory, although you do have to sort of read through them and digest everything before you know just what to do (although the defaults are enough to get started). There are documents like INSTALL that help you get started if you have shell access, and Chris Kolar just posted this to the list just after your post: > I am pleased to announce that v2 of the Mailman list manager's > documentation is available at www.aurora.edu/~ckolar/mailman. Aurora > University has generously agreed to release these documents under the GNU > Free Documentation License (GFDL), details are on the site. > > --chris > From among at ymca.or.kr Thu Nov 23 07:44:18 2000 From: among at ymca.or.kr (¾öÈ«¼®) Date: Thu, 23 Nov 2000 15:44:18 +0900 Subject: [Mailman-Users] please... Help me Message-ID: <001f01c05518$ce11c120$3bc130d3@among> Dear ... warm regards form Seoul YMCA "Hongseok Eom" our mail & web server had attacked by cracker yesterday. I recovered our server by using backup data with difficulty. at first I setuped Linux on other computer and copy cofigure file and user account data an so on... now mailserver and webserver is working. but the mailman doesn't work. I created 6 mailinglist. they show me almost same error massages. How can I fix this problem. Help me. Thanks. error massage - - - - - ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- http://www.ymca.or.kr/mailman/admin/livewire ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- Bug in Mailman version 1.1 We're sorry, we hit a bug! If you would like to help us identify the problem, please email a copy of this page to the webmaster for this site with a description of what happened. Thanks! Traceback: Traceback (innermost last): File "/home/mailman/scripts/driver", line 112, in run_main main() File "/home/mailman/Mailman/Cgi/admin.py", line 65, in main lst = MailList.MailList(list_name) File "/home/mailman/Mailman/MailList.py", line 62, in __init__ self.Load() File "/home/mailman/Mailman/MailList.py", line 804, in Load self.Lock() File "/home/mailman/Mailman/MailList.py", line 1373, in Lock self.__lock.lock() File "/home/mailman/Mailman/LockFile.py", line 186, in lock os.link(self.__lockfile, self.__tmpfname) OSError: [Errno 13] Permission denied Environment variables: VariableValue DOCUMENT_ROOT /home/love SERVER_ADDR 211.48.193.2 HTTP_ACCEPT_ENCODING gzip, deflate SERVER_PORT 80 PATH_TRANSLATED /home/love/livewire REMOTE_ADDR 211.48.193.59 HTTP_ACCEPT_LANGUAGE ko GATEWAY_INTERFACE CGI/1.1 SERVER_NAME www.ymca.or.kr HTTP_CONNECTION Keep-Alive HTTP_USER_AGENT Mozilla/4.0 (compatible; MSIE 5.01; Windows NT 5.0; DigExt) HTTP_ACCEPT image/gif, image/x-xbitmap, image/jpeg, image/pjpeg, application/vnd.ms-powerpoint, application/vnd.ms-excel, application/msword, */* REQUEST_URI /mailman/admin/livewire PATH /sbin:/usr/sbin:/bin:/usr/bin:/usr/X11R6/bin QUERY_STRING SCRIPT_FILENAME /home/mailman/cgi-bin/admin PATH_INFO /livewire HTTP_HOST www.ymca.or.kr REQUEST_METHOD GET SERVER_SIGNATURE Apache/1.3.12 Server at www.ymca.or.kr Port 80 SCRIPT_NAME /mailman/admin SERVER_ADMIN among at ymca.or.kr SERVER_SOFTWARE Apache/1.3.12 (Unix) PHP/4.0.3pl1 PYTHONPATH /home/mailman SERVER_PROTOCOL HTTP/1.1 REMOTE_PORT 3822 From Dan.Mick at West.Sun.COM Thu Nov 23 07:49:26 2000 From: Dan.Mick at West.Sun.COM (Dan Mick) Date: Wed, 22 Nov 2000 22:49:26 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Mailman-Users] please... Help me Message-ID: <200011230647.WAA13179@utopia.west.sun.com> Read README.LINUX and contrib/securelinux_fix.py. > From: "\>\v\H\+\<\." > To: > Subject: [Mailman-Users] please... Help me > X-Beenthere: mailman-users at python.org > X-Mailman-Version: 2.0 > List-Post: > List-Id: Mailman mailing list management users > List-Archive: > Date: Thu, 23 Nov 2000 15:44:18 +0900 > > Dear ... > warm regards form Seoul YMCA "Hongseok Eom" > > our mail & web server had attacked by cracker yesterday. > I recovered our server by using backup data with difficulty. > at first I setuped Linux on other computer and copy cofigure file and user > account data an so on... > now mailserver and webserver is working. > but the mailman doesn't work. I created 6 mailinglist. they show me almost > same error massages. > > How can I fix this problem. Help me. > > Thanks. > > > error massage - - - - - > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- > http://www.ymca.or.kr/mailman/admin/livewire > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > Bug in Mailman version 1.1 > > We're sorry, we hit a bug! > If you would like to help us identify the problem, please email a copy of > this page to the webmaster for this site with a description of what > happened. Thanks! > > Traceback: > Traceback (innermost last): > File "/home/mailman/scripts/driver", line 112, in run_main > main() > File "/home/mailman/Mailman/Cgi/admin.py", line 65, in main > lst = MailList.MailList(list_name) > File "/home/mailman/Mailman/MailList.py", line 62, in __init__ > self.Load() > File "/home/mailman/Mailman/MailList.py", line 804, in Load > self.Lock() > File "/home/mailman/Mailman/MailList.py", line 1373, in Lock > self.__lock.lock() > File "/home/mailman/Mailman/LockFile.py", line 186, in lock > os.link(self.__lockfile, self.__tmpfname) > OSError: [Errno 13] Permission denied > > > Environment variables: > VariableValue > DOCUMENT_ROOT /home/love > SERVER_ADDR 211.48.193.2 > HTTP_ACCEPT_ENCODING gzip, deflate > SERVER_PORT 80 > PATH_TRANSLATED /home/love/livewire > REMOTE_ADDR 211.48.193.59 > HTTP_ACCEPT_LANGUAGE ko > GATEWAY_INTERFACE CGI/1.1 > SERVER_NAME www.ymca.or.kr > HTTP_CONNECTION Keep-Alive > HTTP_USER_AGENT Mozilla/4.0 (compatible; MSIE 5.01; Windows NT 5.0; DigExt) > HTTP_ACCEPT image/gif, image/x-xbitmap, image/jpeg, image/pjpeg, > application/vnd.ms-powerpoint, application/vnd.ms-excel, application/msword, > */* > REQUEST_URI /mailman/admin/livewire > PATH /sbin:/usr/sbin:/bin:/usr/bin:/usr/X11R6/bin > QUERY_STRING > SCRIPT_FILENAME /home/mailman/cgi-bin/admin > PATH_INFO /livewire > HTTP_HOST www.ymca.or.kr > REQUEST_METHOD GET > SERVER_SIGNATURE Apache/1.3.12 Server at www.ymca.or.kr Port 80 > SCRIPT_NAME /mailman/admin > SERVER_ADMIN among at ymca.or.kr > SERVER_SOFTWARE Apache/1.3.12 (Unix) PHP/4.0.3pl1 > PYTHONPATH /home/mailman > SERVER_PROTOCOL HTTP/1.1 > REMOTE_PORT 3822 > > > > ------------------------------------------------------ > Mailman-Users maillist - Mailman-Users at python.org > http://www.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users From claw at kanga.nu Thu Nov 23 07:52:21 2000 From: claw at kanga.nu (J C Lawrence) Date: Wed, 22 Nov 2000 22:52:21 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] please... Help me In-Reply-To: Message from " " of "Thu, 23 Nov 2000 15:44:18 +0900." <001f01c05518$ce11c120$3bc130d3@among> References: <001f01c05518$ce11c120$3bc130d3@among> Message-ID: <16846.974962341@kanga.nu> On Thu, 23 Nov 2000 15:44:18 +0900 ?????? wrote: > our mail & web server had attacked by cracker yesterday. I > recovered our server by using backup data with difficulty. at > first I setuped Linux on other computer and copy cofigure file and > user account data an so on... now mailserver and webserver is > working. but the mailman doesn't work. I created 6 > mailinglist. they show me almost same error massages. The following is an semi-educated guess: 1) Delete all the lockfiles in ~/locks 2) Run "~/bin/check_perms -f" repetitively until it reports clean 3) Try again. -- J C Lawrence claw at kanga.nu ---------(*) : http://www.kanga.nu/~claw/ --=| A man is as sane as he is dangerous to his environment |=-- From johnny at cathat.net Thu Nov 23 09:15:17 2000 From: johnny at cathat.net (Johnny Fuerst) Date: Thu, 23 Nov 2000 02:15:17 -0600 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Cron problem... Message-ID: <20001123021517.A497@cathat.net> Hello All! I have installed and am running mailman version 2.0 on my 4.0 FreeBSD box. The address for the list server is http://mailman.cathat.net **Just want to say congrats to all who made this version possible, "Here, Here!" -It's a really nice improvement from 1.1! On to the problem with it, or something else: I have forwarded along with this e-mail the error that I have been having. I can't, for the life of me, find where this is being requested to be processed by python. Someone, please help! Thank you for any assistance! With much Sincerity, Johnny ----- Forwarded message from Cron Daemon ----- Delivered-To: root at cathat.net From: root at cathat.net (Cron Daemon) To: root at cathat.net Subject: Cron /usr/local/bin/python /home/mailman/cron/run_queue X-Cron-Env: X-Cron-Env: X-Cron-Env: X-Cron-Env: X-Cron-Env: Date: Thu, 23 Nov 2000 01:42:00 -0600 (CST) /usr/local/bin/python: can't open file '/home/mailman/cron/run_queue' ----- End forwarded message ----- -- On Behalf Of: Johnny Fuerst, Governor ................ governor at cathat.net Opinions stated in this message are mine and mine alone, and do not necessarily represent those of my ISP/employer! .period. ------------------------------------------------------------ 'I Desire Compassion, and not a Sacrifice.' 'La Vida E Bella' ____________________________ Random Quote: A word spoken fitly is like apples of gold in a setting of silver. johnny at cathat.net From kent at tensa.com Thu Nov 23 11:06:30 2000 From: kent at tensa.com (kent at tensa.com) Date: Thu, 23 Nov 2000 02:06:30 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Help me In-Reply-To: <001d01c054fe$d600d8e0$3bc130d3@among>; from among@ymca.or.kr on Thu, Nov 23, 2000 at 12:38:24PM +0900 References: <001d01c054fe$d600d8e0$3bc130d3@among> Message-ID: <20001123020630.A931@wakani.home> Just a guess, but it looks like the permissions on the locks directory is wrong. Run Mailman's check_perms -f command as many times as it takes to get it to report no errors. You likely will need to run it as root. You might also want to rm any stale lockfiles in the locks directory. Warm regards from San Francisco, CA USA. ;-) - Kent On Thu, Nov 23, 2000 at 12:38:24PM +0900, ?????? wrote: +---------- | Dear ... | warm regards form Seoul YMCA "Hongseok Eom" | | our mail & web server had attacked by cracker yesterday. | I recovered our server by using backup data with difficulty. | at first I setuped Linux on other computer and copy cofigure file and user | account data an so on... | now mailserver and webserver is working. | but the mailman doesn't work. I created 6 mailinglist. they show me almost | same error massages. | | How can I fix this problem. Help me. | | Thanks. | | | error massage - - - - - | ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- | ------------------ | http://www.ymca.or.kr/mailman/admin/livewire | ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- | ------------------ | | Bug in Mailman version 1.1 | | We're sorry, we hit a bug! | If you would like to help us identify the problem, please email a copy of | this page to the webmaster for this site with a description of what | happened. Thanks! | | Traceback: | Traceback (innermost last): | File "/home/mailman/scripts/driver", line 112, in run_main | main() | File "/home/mailman/Mailman/Cgi/admin.py", line 65, in main | lst = MailList.MailList(list_name) | File "/home/mailman/Mailman/MailList.py", line 62, in __init__ | self.Load() | File "/home/mailman/Mailman/MailList.py", line 804, in Load | self.Lock() | File "/home/mailman/Mailman/MailList.py", line 1373, in Lock | self.__lock.lock() | File "/home/mailman/Mailman/LockFile.py", line 186, in lock | os.link(self.__lockfile, self.__tmpfname) | OSError: [Errno 13] Permission denied | | | Environment variables: | VariableValue | DOCUMENT_ROOT /home/love | SERVER_ADDR 211.48.193.2 | HTTP_ACCEPT_ENCODING gzip, deflate | SERVER_PORT 80 | PATH_TRANSLATED /home/love/livewire | REMOTE_ADDR 211.48.193.59 | HTTP_ACCEPT_LANGUAGE ko | GATEWAY_INTERFACE CGI/1.1 | SERVER_NAME www.ymca.or.kr | HTTP_CONNECTION Keep-Alive | HTTP_USER_AGENT Mozilla/4.0 (compatible; MSIE 5.01; Windows NT 5.0; DigExt) | HTTP_ACCEPT image/gif, image/x-xbitmap, image/jpeg, image/pjpeg, | application/vnd.ms-powerpoint, application/vnd.ms-excel, application/msword, | */* | REQUEST_URI /mailman/admin/livewire | PATH /sbin:/usr/sbin:/bin:/usr/bin:/usr/X11R6/bin | QUERY_STRING | SCRIPT_FILENAME /home/mailman/cgi-bin/admin | PATH_INFO /livewire | HTTP_HOST www.ymca.or.kr | REQUEST_METHOD GET | SERVER_SIGNATURE Apache/1.3.12 Server at www.ymca.or.kr Port 80 | SCRIPT_NAME /mailman/admin | SERVER_ADMIN among at ymca.or.kr | SERVER_SOFTWARE Apache/1.3.12 (Unix) PHP/4.0.3pl1 | PYTHONPATH /home/mailman | SERVER_PROTOCOL HTTP/1.1 | REMOTE_PORT 3822 +---------- From kent at tensa.com Thu Nov 23 11:15:38 2000 From: kent at tensa.com (kent at tensa.com) Date: Thu, 23 Nov 2000 02:15:38 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Cron problem... In-Reply-To: <20001123021517.A497@cathat.net>; from johnny@cathat.net on Thu, Nov 23, 2000 at 02:15:17AM -0600 References: <20001123021517.A497@cathat.net> Message-ID: <20001123021538.B1250@wakani.home> You need to update the crontab entries. You still have the 1.1 crontab installed. Replace it with the new crontab.in in Mailman's cron directory. - Kent On Thu, Nov 23, 2000 at 02:15:17AM -0600, Johnny Fuerst wrote: +---------- | Hello All! | | I have installed and am running mailman version 2.0 on my 4.0 FreeBSD | box. The address for the list server is http://mailman.cathat.net \/\/\/ | On to the problem with it, or something else: | I have forwarded along with this e-mail the error that I have been | having. I can't, for the life of me, find where this is being requested to | be processed by python. Someone, please help! | | Thank you for any assistance! | | With much Sincerity, | Johnny | | ----- Forwarded message from Cron Daemon ----- | | Delivered-To: root at cathat.net | From: root at cathat.net (Cron Daemon) | To: root at cathat.net | Subject: Cron /usr/local/bin/python /home/mailman/cron/run_queue | X-Cron-Env: | X-Cron-Env: | X-Cron-Env: | X-Cron-Env: | X-Cron-Env: | Date: Thu, 23 Nov 2000 01:42:00 -0600 (CST) | | /usr/local/bin/python: can't open file '/home/mailman/cron/run_queue' | | ----- End forwarded message ----- +---------- From johnny at cathat.net Thu Nov 23 16:01:04 2000 From: johnny at cathat.net (Johnny Fuerst) Date: Thu, 23 Nov 2000 09:01:04 -0600 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Cron problem... In-Reply-To: <20001123021538.B1250@wakani.home>; from kent@tensa.com on Thu, Nov 23, 2000 at 02:15:38AM -0800 References: <20001123021517.A497@cathat.net> <20001123021538.B1250@wakani.home> Message-ID: <20001123090104.A2843@cathat.net> On Thu, Nov 23, 2000 at 02:15:38AM -0800, kent at tensa.com wrote: > You need to update the crontab entries. You still have the 1.1 > crontab installed. Replace it with the new crontab.in in Mailman's > cron directory. Hey Kent- How do I get rid of the old crontab entries, as I already have run 'crontab /home/mailman/cron/crontab.in' from the 2.0 installation, as I have deleted the files related to 1.1? Thanks Much! Sincerely, Johnny > On Thu, Nov 23, 2000 at 02:15:17AM -0600, Johnny Fuerst wrote: > +---------- > | Hello All! > | > | I have installed and am running mailman version 2.0 on my 4.0 FreeBSD > | box. The address for the list server is http://mailman.cathat.net > \/\/\/ > | On to the problem with it, or something else: > | I have forwarded along with this e-mail the error that I have been > | having. I can't, for the life of me, find where this is being requested to > | be processed by python. Someone, please help! > | > | Thank you for any assistance! > | > | With much Sincerity, > | Johnny > | > | ----- Forwarded message from Cron Daemon ----- > | > | Delivered-To: root at cathat.net > | From: root at cathat.net (Cron Daemon) > | To: root at cathat.net > | Subject: Cron /usr/local/bin/python /home/mailman/cron/run_queue > | X-Cron-Env: > | X-Cron-Env: > | X-Cron-Env: > | X-Cron-Env: > | X-Cron-Env: > | Date: Thu, 23 Nov 2000 01:42:00 -0600 (CST) > | > | /usr/local/bin/python: can't open file '/home/mailman/cron/run_queue' > | > | ----- End forwarded message ----- > +---------- > > ------------------------------------------------------ > Mailman-Users maillist - Mailman-Users at python.org > http://www.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users -- On Behalf Of: Johnny Fuerst, Governor ................ governor at cathat.net Opinions stated in this message are mine and mine alone, and do not necessarily represent those of my ISP/employer! .period. ------------------------------------------------------------ 'I Desire Compassion, and not a Sacrifice.' 'La Vida E Bella' ____________________________ Random Quote: A word spoken fitly is like apples of gold in a setting of silver. johnny at cathat.net From rickdoksa at penn.com Thu Nov 23 19:46:34 2000 From: rickdoksa at penn.com (Richard E. Doksa) Date: Thu, 23 Nov 2000 10:46:34 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] can anyone tell me what this command does??? Message-ID: <001a01c0557d$b4f80540$5b9af5cd@doksa> /sbin/ifdown ppp0 someone sent this to me and told me to run it but i dont know what it does!? i just started out in linux so i dont know to much thank you rick~> -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mail.python.org/pipermail/mailman-users/attachments/20001123/8f74f852/attachment.htm From BronxLady2 at aol.com Thu Nov 23 16:49:51 2000 From: BronxLady2 at aol.com (BronxLady2 at aol.com) Date: Thu, 23 Nov 2000 10:49:51 EST Subject: [Mailman-Users] hiya.... Message-ID: <4e.da75caa.274e969f@aol.com> Ok,,,,help me here HOW many people can I email using this list? I have over 3,000 members......... and HOW much do I get charged if over your limit?? thanks EMB From yann.forget at ynternet.org Thu Nov 23 17:45:05 2000 From: yann.forget at ynternet.org (Yann Forget) Date: Thu, 23 Nov 2000 17:45:05 +0100 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Migration to another server References: <3A1C16FA.8703A70@ynternet.org> Message-ID: <3A1D4991.C6A4B506@ynternet.org> Hello, No answer to my mail since yesterday. So I ask it another way : what procedure to transfer lists from a server to another one ? - is it possible to get a list of membres with their password ? So I can delete the old list and recreate it ? Another method ? Thanks in advance. Yann From carsten.dot.geckeler at gmx.dot.de Thu Nov 23 16:38:26 2000 From: carsten.dot.geckeler at gmx.dot.de (Carsten Geckeler) Date: Thu, 23 Nov 2000 16:38:26 +0100 (MET) Subject: [Mailman-Users] Re: [ANNOUNCE] Mailman 2.0 In-Reply-To: <14876.860.607056.18676@anthem.concentric.net> Message-ID: This is bad. -- Carsten Geckeler: carsten dot geckeler at gmx dot de From olk at olk.co.kr Thu Nov 23 20:21:50 2000 From: olk at olk.co.kr (Online Korea) Date: Fri, 24 Nov 2000 04:21:50 +0900 Subject: [Mailman-Users] mailman-users´Ô ¾È³çÇϼ¼¿ä? Message-ID: <075e848191917b0SMTP7@smtp7.thrunet.com> An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mail.python.org/pipermail/mailman-users/attachments/20001124/4d118689/attachment.html From claw at kanga.nu Thu Nov 23 20:34:32 2000 From: claw at kanga.nu (J C Lawrence) Date: Thu, 23 Nov 2000 11:34:32 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Migration to another server In-Reply-To: Message from Yann Forget of "Thu, 23 Nov 2000 17:45:05 +0100." <3A1D4991.C6A4B506@ynternet.org> References: <3A1C16FA.8703A70@ynternet.org> <3A1D4991.C6A4B506@ynternet.org> Message-ID: <22741.975008072@kanga.nu> On Thu, 23 Nov 2000 17:45:05 +0100 Yann Forget wrote: > So I ask it another way : what procedure to transfer lists from a > server to another one ? If the filesystem paths and desired hostnames are identical you can just copy the directories over taking care to repserve ownerwhips and permissions. If the situation is different than that, you may need to hand-touch each lists' config to represent the new host. Depending on the extent of the differences this will be possible via the web interface or will need to be done with ~/bin/with_list. Search the archives for further details. > - is it possible to get a list of membres with their password ? ~/bin/dump_list -- J C Lawrence claw at kanga.nu ---------(*) : http://www.kanga.nu/~claw/ --=| A man is as sane as he is dangerous to his environment |=-- From carsten.dot.geckeler at gmx.dot.de Thu Nov 23 22:07:51 2000 From: carsten.dot.geckeler at gmx.dot.de (Carsten Geckeler) Date: Thu, 23 Nov 2000 22:07:51 +0100 (MET) Subject: [Mailman-Users] Re: [ANNOUNCE] Mailman 2.0 In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Sorry, sorry, sorry! My reply was just accidentially send. I was testing my mail filter for masking the From: address. It just slipped accidentially into the send queue. So my mail was not an expression of my opinion about Mailman. Will not happen again. Cheers, Carsten -- Carsten Geckeler: carsten dot geckeler at gmx dot de From sandrac at sagitario.cic.ipn.mx Thu Nov 23 23:02:04 2000 From: sandrac at sagitario.cic.ipn.mx (Sandra Cortes Martinez) Date: Thu, 23 Nov 2000 16:02:04 -0600 Subject: [Mailman-Users] !! Manual mailman !! Message-ID: <3A1D93DC.F0AAC2B1@sagitario.cic.ipn.mx> Hola buenas tardes: Estoy instalando el mailman, pero no se si me podrian proporcionar un manual en espa?ol. Gracias. -- ,_ _, |\\.-"""-.//| \` `/ / _ _ \ | a _ a | '.= Y =.' >._ ^ _.< / ````` \ ) ( ,( ), / ) / \ ( \ ) ( ) ( ) ( ( ) ( ) ( ) )_( ) ( )_(-.._ ( )_ (._.) _( )_, `\ ``( ) ( )`` .' .' jgs ``` ``` ( (` '-' ?? HOLA AMIGOS !! sandy18 at castor.cic.ipn.mx -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mail.python.org/pipermail/mailman-users/attachments/20001123/d83e3c7d/attachment.htm From jdalton at charter-internet.com Thu Nov 23 23:28:26 2000 From: jdalton at charter-internet.com (John Dalton) Date: Thu, 23 Nov 2000 16:28:26 -0600 (CST) Subject: [Mailman-Users] double posting Message-ID: <200011232228.QAA08602@tics1.charter-internet.com> Could you please help me with this? I am on the net via cable TV , they use Worldgate.. More often than not when I try to post a message in a chat format, it will either double or triple post. You know how the time shows when you post? The last time I triple posted, there was a 9 min. difference between the first and third post . The Worldgate people had me unplug everything and restart and I also checked the batteries in the keyboard. Any ideas? Thank you From kent at tensa.com Thu Nov 23 23:56:23 2000 From: kent at tensa.com (Kent Howard) Date: Thu, 23 Nov 2000 14:56:23 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Cron problem... In-Reply-To: <20001123090104.A2843@cathat.net>; from johnny@cathat.net on Thu, Nov 23, 2000 at 09:01:04AM -0600 References: <20001123021517.A497@cathat.net> <20001123021538.B1250@wakani.home> <20001123090104.A2843@cathat.net> Message-ID: <20001123145623.B687@wakani.home> Looks like your old crontab entries were installed as root (from looking at cron's email to you. You probably (at least you should have) installed mailman's crontab.in as the mailman user. If your mailman user is named mailman, you can check with crontab -u mailman -l It should show the NEW crontab from cron/crontab.in Then check root's crontab crontab -u root -l If you see old mailman entries in there then crontab -u root -e and edit them out. Or if ONLY mailman entries are in the root crontab you can remove root's crontab altogether with crontab -u root -r - Kent On Thu, Nov 23, 2000 at 09:01:04AM -0600, Johnny Fuerst wrote: +---------- | On Thu, Nov 23, 2000 at 02:15:38AM -0800, kent at tensa.com wrote: | > You need to update the crontab entries. You still have the 1.1 | > crontab installed. Replace it with the new crontab.in in Mailman's | > cron directory. | | Hey Kent- | | How do I get rid of the old crontab entries, as I already have run | 'crontab /home/mailman/cron/crontab.in' from the 2.0 installation, as I | have deleted the files related to 1.1? | | Thanks Much! | | Sincerely, | Johnny | | > On Thu, Nov 23, 2000 at 02:15:17AM -0600, Johnny Fuerst wrote: | > +---------- | > | Hello All! | > | | > | I have installed and am running mailman version 2.0 on my 4.0 FreeBSD | > | box. The address for the list server is http://mailman.cathat.net | > \/\/\/ | > | On to the problem with it, or something else: | > | I have forwarded along with this e-mail the error that I have been | > | having. I can't, for the life of me, find where this is being requested to | > | be processed by python. Someone, please help! | > | | > | Thank you for any assistance! | > | | > | With much Sincerity, | > | Johnny | > | | > | ----- Forwarded message from Cron Daemon ----- | > | | > | Delivered-To: root at cathat.net | > | From: root at cathat.net (Cron Daemon) | > | To: root at cathat.net | > | Subject: Cron /usr/local/bin/python /home/mailman/cron/run_queue | > | X-Cron-Env: | > | X-Cron-Env: | > | X-Cron-Env: | > | X-Cron-Env: | > | X-Cron-Env: | > | Date: Thu, 23 Nov 2000 01:42:00 -0600 (CST) | > | | > | /usr/local/bin/python: can't open file '/home/mailman/cron/run_queue' | > | | > | ----- End forwarded message ----- | > +---------- +---------- From philip at joinet.net.au Fri Nov 24 09:05:36 2000 From: philip at joinet.net.au (Philip) Date: Fri, 24 Nov 2000 16:05:36 +0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] installation - adding user to /etc/passwd Message-ID: <001f01c055ed$53665780$04160ecb@joinet.net.au> ok, one sentence in to the instructions and I have a question already! "Add a new user called mailman" Do I give "mailman" a password? Does it need a directory created as per a normal user or do I set it to /nonexistent? do I set shell to /bin/false? thanks Phil philip at joinet.net.au From satyap at satya.virtualave.net Fri Nov 24 10:29:36 2000 From: satyap at satya.virtualave.net (Satya) Date: Fri, 24 Nov 2000 14:59:36 +0530 (IST) Subject: [Mailman-Users] installation - adding user to /etc/passwd In-Reply-To: <001f01c055ed$53665780$04160ecb@joinet.net.au> Message-ID: On Nov 24, 2000 at 16:05, Philip wrote: >"Add a new user called mailman" The answers I give are according to what I did and may not be the best thing to do. >Do I give "mailman" a password? Yes. >Does it need a directory created as per a normal user or do I set it to >/nonexistent? Yes. It needs a directory. >do I set shell to /bin/false? No. -- Satya. US-bound grad students! For pre-apps, see May the Source be with you! From yann.forget at ynternet.org Fri Nov 24 12:51:52 2000 From: yann.forget at ynternet.org (Yann Forget) Date: Fri, 24 Nov 2000 12:51:52 +0100 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Migration to another server References: <3A1C16FA.8703A70@ynternet.org> Message-ID: <3A1E5658.179C3E13@ynternet.org> Hello, I got it (almost) right with $ config_list -o mylist.cf mylist changing, the path, and then $ config_list -i mylist.cf mylist Everything works except that the list does not appear here : http://bull.ynternet.ch/mailman/listinfo/ but it exists here : http://bull.ynternet.ch/mailman/listinfo/phpdev How to get this right ? Thanks, Yann Yann Forget a ?crit : > I migrated from one server to another > and I got into a problem: > > on the old server, the lists were at : > > http://mail.ynternet.ch/cgi-bin/mailman/admin/ From fred at mail.rons.net.cn Fri Nov 24 13:59:23 2000 From: fred at mail.rons.net.cn (Hong Feng) Date: Fri, 24 Nov 2000 20:59:23 +0800 (CST) Subject: [Mailman-Users] a book covering Mailman with GNU DFL Message-ID: <200011241259.UAA91185@mail.rons.net.cn> Hi All: I am interested in creating a book covering GNU Mailman, about its history, nice features, how it was designed, how to install it, how to use it, how to manage it, etc. I defintely need helps from you on the list, especially from the developers to wrote the source codes. If some of you would be interested in this idea, which shall be released under the GNU FDL, pls drop me an email: fred at mail.rons.net.cn thanks for your attention. Frederic From eric.berthiaume at up2.com Fri Nov 24 21:14:31 2000 From: eric.berthiaume at up2.com (Eric Berthiaume) Date: Fri, 24 Nov 2000 15:14:31 -0500 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Indexing Mailman's private archives with htdig Message-ID: I've read a couple of posts regarding this topic but nothing as given me the full answer. Solaris 2.6 Mailman 2.0beta5 htdig 3.1.5 I have a couple of sites that contain Mailman public archives and they work great with htdig search engine. The problem is indexing the private archives of mailman. I don't know where to give htdig, in the configs, the authentification mailman requires. The site is also protected by apache authentification but I've managed to give him the info he needs but I end up indexing the authentification page of the mailman private archives. Not the result I want. I'v tried to give a "local_urls" config to the "start_url" but with the same result. Also tried the dummy index.html file trick with the list of my local directories but it didn't work. Note that I have two htsearchs, two databases and two config files. Any body got further using the same configs ?? Yes I know I could study the source code of Mailman to find the authentification method but I really have no time for this (plus I don't know Python at all ;) ). Thanks! Eric Berthiaume system administrator, up2 technologies inc. maverick at up2.com From Nigel.Metheringham at VData.co.uk Fri Nov 24 21:48:23 2000 From: Nigel.Metheringham at VData.co.uk (Nigel Metheringham) Date: Fri, 24 Nov 2000 20:48:23 +0000 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Indexing Mailman's private archives with htdig In-Reply-To: Message from "Eric Berthiaume" of "Fri, 24 Nov 2000 15:14:31 EST." Message-ID: Eric, Look at the 2 patches in the Mailman sourceforge patch set that deal with this - they should work fine for indexing private lists (although I don't run any myself). There is one bug in the htdig.py script which stops it displaying messages, but its a trivial one - if you contact me monday I can get that for you if you can't fix it yourself. [I'm not currently in the right place to get that stuff out] Nigel. -- [ - Opinions expressed are personal and may not be shared by VData - ] [ Nigel Metheringham Nigel.Metheringham at VData.co.uk ] [ Phone: +44 1423 850000 Fax +44 1423 858866 ] From fliu at quicknet.net Sat Nov 25 07:48:46 2000 From: fliu at quicknet.net (Frank Liu) Date: Fri, 24 Nov 2000 22:48:46 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Mailman-Users] [ANNOUNCE] Mailman 2.0 Message-ID: binary RPM http://www4.quicknet.net/files/mailman-2.0-1.i386.rpm source RPM http://www4.quicknet.net/files/mailman-2.0-1.src.rpm Frank Wayne Ringling WayneR at STROSNIDERS.com Wed, 22 Nov 2000 14:22:30 -0500 -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Has anyone built a RPM of 2.0 yet? I would really like to use 2.0 on one of my mailing list servers. I have never had much luck with getting the compiled one to work with my systems. Wayne > I'm please to announce the 2.0 final release of Mailman, the GNU > Mailing List Manager. Mailman is released under the GNU General > Public License (GPL). > From gary at wwpublish.com Sat Nov 25 18:52:47 2000 From: gary at wwpublish.com (Gary Wilson) Date: Sat, 25 Nov 2000 12:52:47 -0500 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Attachments? Message-ID: <00b401c05708$852fef80$4100a8c0@wwpublish.com> Is there any way to block attachments? Someone's computer got one of those *!& Microsoft viruses that sends itself to everyone in the address book, including one of our lists. Now everyone on the list got the %$#@ MS virus. Can I block attachments altogether? I can't find any setting for this? Gary From drechsau at Geeks.ORG Sat Nov 25 18:58:15 2000 From: drechsau at Geeks.ORG (Mike Horwath) Date: Sat, 25 Nov 2000 11:58:15 -0600 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Attachments? In-Reply-To: <00b401c05708$852fef80$4100a8c0@wwpublish.com>; from gary@wwpublish.com on Sat, Nov 25, 2000 at 12:52:47PM -0500 References: <00b401c05708$852fef80$4100a8c0@wwpublish.com> Message-ID: <20001125115815.A94785@Geeks.ORG> On Sat, Nov 25, 2000 at 12:52:47PM -0500, Gary Wilson wrote: > Is there any way to block attachments? Someone's computer got one of > those *!& Microsoft viruses that sends itself to everyone in the > address book, including one of our lists. Now everyone on the list > got the %$#@ MS virus. Can I block attachments altogether? I can't > find any setting for this? Why not pull the person from the list? :) Yah, I know, drastic. Filter via your MTA? Add a header filter via mailman to watch for a specific header that you know is an attachment? -- Mike Horwath IRC: Drechsau drechsau at Geeks.ORG Home: 763-540-6815 1901 Sumter Ave N, Golden Valley, MN 55427 Opinions stated in this message, or any message posted by myself through my Geeks.ORG address, are mine and mine alone, period. From johnny at cathat.net Sat Nov 25 19:14:34 2000 From: johnny at cathat.net (Johnny Fuerst) Date: Sat, 25 Nov 2000 12:14:34 -0600 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Attachments? In-Reply-To: <00b401c05708$852fef80$4100a8c0@wwpublish.com>; from gary@wwpublish.com on Sat, Nov 25, 2000 at 12:52:47PM -0500 References: <00b401c05708$852fef80$4100a8c0@wwpublish.com> Message-ID: <20001125121434.A25206@cathat.net> On Sat, Nov 25, 2000 at 12:52:47PM -0500, Gary Wilson wrote: > Is there any way to block attachments? Someone's computer got one of those > *!& Microsoft viruses that sends itself to everyone in the address book, > including one of our lists. Now everyone on the list got the %$#@ MS virus. > Can I block attachments altogether? I can't find any setting for this? Possibly in the Spam settings of the Privacy Settings of the Admin cgi... You can probably use this box, which is within the 'Privacy Ootions' to hold e-mails that come with certain headers that indicate an attachment. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ # Lines that *start* with a '#' are comments. to: friend at public.com message-id: relay.comanche.denmark.eu from: list at listme.com from: .*@uplinkpro.com ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Maybe putting something like this in that field: # Lines that *start* with a '#' are comments. Content-Type: multipart/mixed Sincerely, Johnny -- On Behalf Of: Johnny Fuerst, Governor ................ governor at cathat.net Opinions stated in this message are mine and mine alone, and do not necessarily represent those of my ISP/employer! .period. ------------------------------------------------------------ 'I Desire Compassion, and not a Sacrifice.' 'La Vida E Bella' ____________________________ Random Quote: A word spoken fitly is like apples of gold in a setting of silver. johnny at cathat.net From chuqui at plaidworks.com Sat Nov 25 19:59:40 2000 From: chuqui at plaidworks.com (Chuq Von Rospach) Date: Sat, 25 Nov 2000 10:59:40 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Attachments? In-Reply-To: <00b401c05708$852fef80$4100a8c0@wwpublish.com> References: <00b401c05708$852fef80$4100a8c0@wwpublish.com> Message-ID: At 12:52 PM -0500 11/25/00, Gary Wilson wrote: >Is there any way to block attachments? I filter all of my lsits with demime for just this reason. -- Chuq Von Rospach - Plaidworks Consulting (mailto:chuqui at plaidworks.com) Apple Mail List Gnome (mailto:chuq at apple.com) The vet said it was behavioral, but I prefer to think of it as genetic. It cuts down on the liability -- Get Fuzzy From lehmann at lsd.it Sat Nov 25 23:37:28 2000 From: lehmann at lsd.it (Massimiliano Lehmann) Date: Sat, 25 Nov 2000 23:37:28 +0100 Subject: [Mailman-Users] What is with all this password stuff? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <4.3.2.7.2.20001125231805.01cebc30@213.246.1.249> At 20:39 11/16/00 -0800, Chuq VOn Rospach wrote: >At 9:55 PM -0500 11/16/00, Owen Taylor wrote: > >> >> - Users should have one password per site, not per list > >very high on my list of future features -- but requires rebuilding the >entire backend of mailman from scratch to do right. Very needed feature! :)) I'm programming an application in PHP/MySQL that interfaces with Mailman (a user's data db, with user authentication and rights to modify some data on "per-user" basis). Would be VERY nice to have an unique login/password instead of the current e-mail/password couple. So any user could change its subscription addresses without changing his login name. Ciao a tutti -- Massimiliano Lehmann +------------------------------------------+----------------------------+ | mailto:lehmann at lsd.it | LSD - [L]ehmann | | http://www.lsd.it (Personal web) | [S]ystem | | http://majjolone.lsd.it (Crazy web) | [D}evelopment | +------------------------------------------+----------------------------+ From fliu at quicknet.net Sun Nov 26 00:08:51 2000 From: fliu at quicknet.net (Frank Liu) Date: Sat, 25 Nov 2000 15:08:51 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Mailman-Users] regexp for restrict posting Message-ID: Hi, I want to allow posts from list members as well as anyone at anysubdomain.goodcompany.com so I checked "yes" for "Restrict posting privilege to list members" and put .*@.*.goodcompany.com for the "Addresses of members accepted for posting to this list.." However posts from those users from subdomain.goodcompany.com still got held for approval. Any ideas? I am using redhat 6 with the latest mailman 2.0. Thanks! Frank From scott-brown at home.com Sun Nov 26 02:36:37 2000 From: scott-brown at home.com (Scott Brown) Date: Sat, 25 Nov 2000 20:36:37 -0500 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Installing python upgrade - will this failed test affect Mailmain? Message-ID: <000401c05749$5251de20$0401a8c0@ibmpeers> I went to install Mailman 2.0 today, and found I needed to upgrade Python as well. (I was only running 1.5.1, and the docs say 1.5.2 or better). My server is not-so-up-to-date - it's still running RH 5.4 So first I tried installing Python 2.0 - I figured might as well go full hog - and got 2 failed tests on it. So I then tried Python 1.6 to see if that would be any closer to working. One failed test. this time. [root at apollo /home/webmaster/Python-1.6/Lib]# ../python ../Lib/test/test_strftime.py strftime test for Sat Nov 25 20:29:38 2000 Strftime test, platform: linux2, Python version: 1.6 Supports nonstandard '%c' format (near-asctime() format) Supports nonstandard '%x' format (%m/%d/%y %H:%M:%S) Supports nonstandard '%Z' format (time zone name) Supports nonstandard '%D' format (mm/dd/yy) Supports nonstandard '%e' format (day of month as number, blank padded 0-31)) Supports nonstandard '%h' format (abbreviated month name) Supports nonstandard '%k' format (hour, blank padded ( 0-23)) Supports nonstandard '%n' format (newline character) Supports nonstandard '%r' format (%I:%M:%S %p) Supports nonstandard '%R' format (%H:%M) Does not appear to support '%s' format (seconds since the Epoch in UCT) Supports nonstandard '%t' format (tab character) Supports nonstandard '%T' format (%H:%M:%S) Conflict for nonstandard '%3y' format (year without century rendered using fieldwidth): Expected 000, but got y Conflict for %W (week number of the year (Mon 1st)): Expected 09, but got 08 Conflict for %W (week number of the year (Mon 1st)): Expected 09, but got 08 Conflict for %W (week number of the year (Mon 1st)): Expected 09, but got 08 etc... (about 100 more likes of the same sort of thing...) My quesiton is, with this %W Conflict, Is this going to throw Mailman problems? Or should I go right back to 1.5.2 and hope it installs/tests fine? From pawal at blipp.com Sun Nov 26 03:11:08 2000 From: pawal at blipp.com (Patrik Wallstrom) Date: Sun, 26 Nov 2000 03:11:08 +0100 (CET) Subject: [Mailman-Users] problem with admin password Message-ID: Hi, Just a couple of hours ago, mailman wouldn't let me in to any admin page. I have tried both * mmsitepass with new master admin password and * creating a new list, choosing password, and then trying to administrate the list. It did not work, "Authentication failed" when logging on to admin.cgi. I run 2.0 release and python 2.0. -- patrik wallstrom | f o o d f i g h t tel: +46-8-6188428 | s t o c k h o l m gsm: +46-708405080 | - - - - - - - - - fax: +46-859827151 | From claw at kanga.nu Sun Nov 26 05:13:53 2000 From: claw at kanga.nu (J C Lawrence) Date: Sat, 25 Nov 2000 20:13:53 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Re: multiple line prefixes In-Reply-To: Message from Christel Nyman of "Sat, 25 Nov 2000 21:49:13 +0200." <3.0.6.32.20001125214913.0164d9b0@mail.inet.fi> References: <3.0.6.32.20001125214913.0164d9b0@mail.inet.fi> Message-ID: <25657.975212033@kanga.nu> On Sat, 25 Nov 2000 21:49:13 +0200 Christel Nyman wrote: > "My list for translators from Finnish into Swedish was recently > moved from a majordomo server to a *Mailman* one." ... > I know, of course, what "Re" means, only I have no way of altering > the Swedish and Finnish e-mail clients my list members use. If > what you say goes for Mailman lists as well, one way to handle the > problem of headlines growing to long would be to ask my list > members using Finnish or Swedish e-mail clients to wipe off the > "Vastaus" or "SV" part when answering. It is possible but would > distort the archive hierarchy, so I don?t like the idea. Any > other remedies? Mailman currently supports divers forms of the english standard Re: prefix. You can patch it to support other prefixes, but that is not a default option, or a default configurable option. I recommend the mailman support lists for further discussion of this (I've crossed this message to mailman-users). . -- J C Lawrence claw at kanga.nu ---------(*) : http://www.kanga.nu/~claw/ --=| A man is as sane as he is dangerous to his environment |=-- From bob at nleaudio.com Sun Nov 26 05:55:26 2000 From: bob at nleaudio.com (Bob Puff@NLE) Date: Sat, 25 Nov 2000 23:55:26 -0500 Subject: [Mailman-Users] What is with all this password stuff? References: <4.3.2.7.2.20001125231805.01cebc30@213.246.1.249> Message-ID: <3A2097BE.C5B0BDB1@nleaudio.com> SPeaking of databases... I am not using a MYSQL database for Mailman - having it do its own database stuff. Why / when would there be a need to use a separate database program like MYSQL for Mailman? Bob From sco8tt at yahoo.com Sun Nov 26 11:41:03 2000 From: sco8tt at yahoo.com (Scott Dunham) Date: Sun, 26 Nov 2000 03:41:03 -0700 Subject: [Mailman-Users] new e-mail address Message-ID: <3A20E8BF.47D3A399@yahoo.com> My new and correct e-mail address is scott.dunham at mail.com. _________________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com From cscheong at inovatif.net Sun Nov 26 20:44:50 2000 From: cscheong at inovatif.net (Chee-Siong Cheong) Date: Sun, 26 Nov 2000 13:44:50 -0600 (CST) Subject: [Mailman-Users] httpd.conf configuration help Message-ID: <31716.63.227.67.126.975267890.squirrel@inovatif.net> Downloaded mailman-2.0 and installed succesfully in my system. I tried my very best to configure my httpd.conf to make accessible from internet. But, I couldnt get it run, the page is not even shown up. Can anyone shown me what line should I add in my httpd.conf to make mailman accessible. Attached below is the line that I added to my httpd.conf file. Thanks in advance. ScriptAlias /mailman/ "/home/mailman/cgi-bin/" AllowOverride None Options ExecCGI Order allow,deny Allow from all Alias /pipermail/ /home/mailman/archives/public/ AllowOverride None order deny,allow allow from all Options FollowSymLinks From Dan.Mick at west.sun.com Sun Nov 26 21:44:07 2000 From: Dan.Mick at west.sun.com (Dan Mick) Date: Sun, 26 Nov 2000 12:44:07 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] httpd.conf configuration help References: <31716.63.227.67.126.975267890.squirrel@inovatif.net> Message-ID: <3A217617.F1EC7EEA@west.sun.com> Chee-Siong Cheong wrote: > > Downloaded mailman-2.0 and installed succesfully in my system. I tried my > very best to configure my httpd.conf to make accessible from internet. But, > I couldnt get it run, the page is not even shown up. This is not a description of the problem. A description of the problem would be something like, "I tried to visit this URL: , and this showed up in my browser: ." > Can anyone shown me > what line should I add in my httpd.conf to make mailman accessible. Attached > below is the line that I added to my httpd.conf file. Thanks in advance. > > ScriptAlias /mailman/ "/home/mailman/cgi-bin/" > > > AllowOverride None > Options ExecCGI > Order allow,deny > Allow from all > > > Alias /pipermail/ /home/mailman/archives/public/ > > AllowOverride None > order deny,allow > allow from all > Options FollowSymLinks > > > ------------------------------------------------------ > Mailman-Users maillist - Mailman-Users at python.org > http://www.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users From Dan.Mick at west.sun.com Sun Nov 26 21:45:57 2000 From: Dan.Mick at west.sun.com (Dan Mick) Date: Sun, 26 Nov 2000 12:45:57 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Stopping attachments etc. Message-ID: <3A217685.3C6E3805@west.sun.com> I recently posted my little addition to the bounce headers setting to reject attachments. It failed today on my list, for an email that had no attachment, but was itself "Content-Type: text/html"; and in looking at it, I think it's illegal not to have an actual header field at the beginning. So here it is again, in hopefully-more-correct form: Content-type:.*multipart/.* Content-type:.*text/html.* Content-type:.*text/enriched.* Content-type:.*text/x-vcard.* Content-Disposition:.*attachment From david at idiomatrix.com Sun Nov 26 22:15:31 2000 From: david at idiomatrix.com (David Herren) Date: Sun, 26 Nov 2000 16:15:31 -0500 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Mailman on OSXServer? (long) Message-ID: Forgive me if this has been covered--I was dissappointed to discover that the archives are not readily searchable. I am running OSXServer 1.2, and Python-2.0, and attempting to setup Mailman for a non-profit, worldcall.org. So far my attempts at installing and making Mailman have met with no success. MX records pointing to the server haven't fully propogated yet, but should be within 48 hours. The config process generates no errors and appears to be successful: [worldcall:/Local/Public/mailman-2.0] mailman% ./configure loading cache ./config.cache checking for --with-python... no checking for python... (cached) /usr/local/bin/python checking Python interpreter... /usr/local/bin/python checking Python version... 2.0 checking for a BSD compatible install... (cached) /usr/bin/install -c checking whether make sets ${MAKE}... (cached) yes checking for true... (cached) /usr/bin/true checking for --without-gcc... no checking for gcc... (cached) cc checking whether the C compiler (cc ) works... yes checking whether the C compiler (cc ) is a cross-compiler... no checking whether we are using GNU C... (cached) yes checking whether cc accepts -g... (cached) yes checking whether #! works in shell scripts... (cached) yes checking for --with-var-prefix... no checking for --with-username... mailman checking for mailman UID... 105 checking for --with-groupname... mailman checking for mailman GID... 157 checking permissions on /home/mailman... okay checking for mail wrapper GID... (cached) 6 checking for CGI wrapper GID... (cached) -2 checking for CGI extensions... no checking for default fully qualified host name... worldcall checking for default URL host component... worldcall checking for strerror... (cached) yes checking for setregid... (cached) yes checking for syslog... (cached) yes checking how to run the C preprocessor... (cached) cc -E -traditional-cpp checking for ANSI C header files... (cached) yes checking for syslog.h... (cached) yes checking for uid_t in sys/types.h... (cached) yes checking type of array argument to getgroups... (cached) gid_t checking for vsnprintf... (cached) yes updating cache ./config.cache creating ./config.status creating misc/paths.py creating Mailman/Defaults.py creating Mailman/mm_cfg.py.dist creating src/Makefile creating misc/Makefile creating bin/Makefile creating Mailman/Makefile creating Mailman/Cgi/Makefile creating Mailman/Logging/Makefile creating Mailman/Archiver/Makefile creating Mailman/pythonlib/Makefile creating Mailman/Handlers/Makefile creating Mailman/Bouncers/Makefile creating templates/Makefile creating cron/Makefile creating filters/Makefile creating scripts/Makefile creating cron/crontab.in creating Makefile /home/mailman exists and has the proper permissions (I believe): [worldcall:/Local/Public/mailman-2.0] mailman% ls -al /home total 6 drwxr-xr-x 3 root wheel 1024 Nov 25 10:58 . drwxr-xr-x 12 root wheel 1024 Nov 25 10:58 .. drwsrwsr-x 18 mailman mailman 1024 Nov 25 11:18 mailman make, however, generates the following: [worldcall:/Local/Public/mailman-2.0] mailman% make install Creating architecture independent directories... chmod o-r /home/mailman/archives/private Creating architecture dependent directories... for f in digest_arch mmsitepass newlist rmlist add_members list_members remove_members clone_member update arch sync_members check_db withlist check_perms find_member version move_list config_list list_lists dumpdb; \ do \ /usr/bin/install -c -m 755 $f /home/mailman/bin; \ done for f in checkdbs crontab.in mailpasswds senddigests gate_news nightly_gzip qrunner bumpdigests; \ do \ /usr/bin/install -c -m 644 $f /home/mailman/cron; \ done for f in bowa-strip; \ do \ /usr/bin/install -c -m 644 $f /home/mailman/filters; \ done /usr/bin/install -c -m 644 Cookie.py /home/mailman/Mailman /usr/bin/install -c -m 644 *.jpg *.png /home/mailman/icons for d in bin cron scripts; \ do \ dir=/home/mailman/$d; \ /usr/bin/install -c -m 644 paths.py $dir; \ done /usr/bin/install -c -m 664 pending_subscriptions.db /home/mailman/data for f in *.py; \ do \ /usr/bin/install -c -m 644 $f /home/mailman/Mailman; \ done /usr/bin/install -c -m 644 mm_cfg.py.dist /home/mailman/Mailman if [ ! -f /home/mailman/Mailman/mm_cfg.py ]; \ then \ /usr/bin/install -c -m 644 mm_cfg.py.dist /home/mailman/Mailman/mm_cfg.py; \ fi for d in Cgi Logging Archiver Handlers Bouncers pythonlib; \ do \ (cd $d; make install); \ done for f in *.py; \ do \ /usr/bin/install -c -m 644 $f /home/mailman/Mailman/Cgi; \ done for f in *.py; \ do \ /usr/bin/install -c -m 644 $f /home/mailman/Mailman/Logging; \ done for f in __init__.py Archiver.py HyperArch.py HyperDatabase.py pipermail.py; \ do \ /usr/bin/install -c -m 644 $f /home/mailman/Mailman/Archiver; \ done for f in *.py; \ do \ /usr/bin/install -c -m 644 $f /home/mailman/Mailman/Handlers; \ done for f in *.py; \ do \ /usr/bin/install -c -m 644 $f /home/mailman/Mailman/Bouncers; \ done for f in *.py; \ do \ /usr/bin/install -c -m 644 $f /home/mailman/Mailman/pythonlib; \ done for f in answer_majordomo_mail mailcmd mailowner post driver; \ do \ /usr/bin/install -c -m 644 $f /home/mailman/scripts; \ done cc -c -I. -DPREFIX="\"/home/mailman\"" -DPYTHON="\"/usr/local/bin/python\"" -DHELPFUL -g -O2 -g -O2 -DHAVE_STRERROR=1 -DHAVE_SETREGID=1 -DHAVE_SYSLOG=1 -DSTDC_HEADERS=1 -DHAVE_SYSLOG_H=1 -DGETGROUPS_T=gid_t -DHAVE_VSNPRINTF=1 ./common.c ./common.h:29: warning: could not use precompiled header '/System/Library/Frameworks/System.framework/Headers/bsd/unistd.p', because: ./common.h:29: warning: header 'sys/cdefs.h' overridden, ./common.h:29: warning: /System/Library/Frameworks/System.framework/Headers/bsd/sys/cdefs.h vs. /System/Library/Frameworks/System.framework/PrivateHeaders/bsd/sys/cdefs.h (within the precomp) ./common.c:26: `PREFIX' undeclared here (not in a function) ./common.c:26: `scripts' undeclared here (not in a function) ./common.c:26: parse error before `;' make[1]: *** [common.o] Error 1 make: *** [doinstall] Error 2 I'm obviously missing something...any suggestions? -- david herren david at idiomatrix.com shoreham, vt From noel at koethe.net Sun Nov 26 22:59:48 2000 From: noel at koethe.net (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Noel_K=F6the?=) Date: Sun, 26 Nov 2000 22:59:48 +0100 (CET) Subject: [Mailman-Users] search in mailman webarchiv Message-ID: Hello, how can I search in the archivs of mailman ? I didn't find anything on the webpages ( there is no search, too ). Thanks. -- Noch einen sch?nen Tag Noel K?the From kd5de at nwla.com Sun Nov 26 23:05:50 2000 From: kd5de at nwla.com (Mel Sojka) Date: Sun, 26 Nov 2000 16:05:50 -0600 Subject: [Mailman-Users] RPM PROBLEM Message-ID: <3A21893E.4DB8F95@nwla.com> I I grabbed the RPM for 2.0 that was posted on the list this week. Had a couple of problems # 1 the rpm installed the package as root so ./check_perms was not to happy, but -f did the trick. But I am going to have to cook a new install anyway because cgi wanted gid 99 and got 48. OS is Red Hat 7.0. and Python 1.5.2. Please note I had none of these problems with the 1.1 RPM or the Beta 5 rpm from Redhat. If anyone has done an install on Red Hat 7 I would love to have your config options besided the --with-cgi-gid=48. No need to reinvent the wheel. Thanks Mel -- ------------------------------------- This Mail composed using Netscape 4.5 Caldera OpenLinux 1.3 Linux 2.0.36 ---------------------------------- From lj at mandala-designs.com Sun Nov 26 23:22:47 2000 From: lj at mandala-designs.com (Leonard Jacobs) Date: Sun, 26 Nov 2000 17:22:47 -0500 Subject: [Mailman-Users] personalizing the subject line in Mailman Message-ID: <3A2146E7.22318.27E7C6D4@localhost> Is there any way to presonalize the Subject line in Mailman with each user's name, like "Subject: Barry's recent comment about new features" where "Barry" is replaced by each user's name? Thanks. ------------------ Leonard Jacobs www.mandala-designs.com (508) 359-5473 From fliu at quicknet.net Sun Nov 26 23:45:54 2000 From: fliu at quicknet.net (Frank Liu) Date: Sun, 26 Nov 2000 14:45:54 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Mailman-Users] [ANNOUNCE] Mailman 2.0 In-Reply-To: Message-ID: I should have mentioned that the rpm is for redhat 6. redhat 7 is a bit different: things like directory structure, userid for apache process, etc. all changed. But with the source rpm for redhat6, it shouldn't be too difficult to build a redhat7 version. It works fine on my redhat 6 box, though "check_perms" wants to be more "insure" :) You can, of course, run "check_perms -f" to change the perms if you want it. frank On Fri, 24 Nov 2000, Frank Liu wrote: > > binary RPM > http://www4.quicknet.net/files/mailman-2.0-1.i386.rpm > > source RPM > http://www4.quicknet.net/files/mailman-2.0-1.src.rpm > > Frank > > > Wayne Ringling WayneR at STROSNIDERS.com > Wed, 22 Nov 2000 14:22:30 -0500 > > -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > Has anyone built a RPM of 2.0 yet? I would really like to use 2.0 on one > of my mailing list servers. I have never had much luck with getting the > compiled one to work with my systems. > > Wayne > > > > I'm please to announce the 2.0 final release of Mailman, the GNU > > Mailing List Manager. Mailman is released under the GNU General > > Public License (GPL). > > > > > > From johnny at cathat.net Sun Nov 26 23:53:45 2000 From: johnny at cathat.net (Johnny Fuerst) Date: Sun, 26 Nov 2000 16:53:45 -0600 Subject: [Mailman-Users] search in mailman webarchiv In-Reply-To: ; from noel@koethe.net on Sun, Nov 26, 2000 at 10:59:48PM +0100 References: Message-ID: <20001126165345.A5165@cathat.net> On Sun, Nov 26, 2000 at 10:59:48PM +0100, Noel K?the wrote: > Hello, > > how can I search in the archivs of mailman ? > I didn't find anything on the webpages ( there is no search, too ). When I went searching through the archives about 2.5 months ago, I just went to every month, and searched, using Netscape, the page full of e-mails for the text I was looking for. That worked for me. It's not as nice, but I didn't see another way... -Johnny -- On Behalf Of: Johnny Fuerst, Governor ................ governor at cathat.net Opinions stated in this message are mine and mine alone, and do not necessarily represent those of my ISP/employer! .period. ------------------------------------------------------------ 'I Desire Compassion, and not a Sacrifice.' 'La Vida E Bella' ____________________________ Random Quote: A word spoken fitly is like apples of gold in a setting of silver. johnny at cathat.net From fliu at quicknet.net Mon Nov 27 01:14:08 2000 From: fliu at quicknet.net (Frank Liu) Date: Sun, 26 Nov 2000 16:14:08 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Mailman-Users] search in mailman webarchiv Message-ID: You can search mailman mailing list from here: http://msgs.securepoint.com/mailman/ BTW, I still think mailman itself should add search to the mailing lists at python.org. It isn't that difficult to do that. I am sure lots of people will volunteer to help if you need. Frank Johnny Fuerst Johnny Fuerst; Governor" Hello, > > how can I search in the archivs of mailman ? > I didn't find anything on the webpages ( there is no search, too ). When I went searching through the archives about 2.5 months ago, I just went to every month, and searched, using Netscape, the page f From GLeblanc at cu-portland.edu Mon Nov 27 01:44:00 2000 From: GLeblanc at cu-portland.edu (Gregory Leblanc) Date: Sun, 26 Nov 2000 16:44:00 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] mailman webpages sloooow Message-ID: <025836EFF856D411A6660090272811E6169E1B@EMAIL> Hi! I'm running mailman 2.0beta5 (no problems with it now, waiting for final to upgrade) on a SPARCstation 2. The machine has 64MB of ram, a decent 4GB SCSI disk, and a 40MHz processor. For most operations, its on par with a high end 486. This machine is running RH6.2 and Apache. I've got a few static pages online, and loading these pages is very quick. However, when I hit the mailman pages, (mailman/listinfo especially) there's a huge delay before the page loads. Any ideas on what I can do to improve page processing time on the server? Thanks, Greg From MllrSebastian at aol.com Mon Nov 27 04:01:23 2000 From: MllrSebastian at aol.com (MllrSebastian at aol.com) Date: Sun, 26 Nov 2000 22:01:23 EST Subject: [Mailman-Users] Visioneer one touch scanner 7600 usb Message-ID: <9b.d443507.27532883@aol.com> Hi, I was having trouble with my scanner, I just got it to work, well, it's scanning pictures and sending them into my visioneer documents, and paper port documents, i dont know how to scan them into a different folder. Also, I keep trying to insert a picture into my email, but everytime I try, It says, verify that the correct file name was given, I have tried every file and it is not working, Please help. Stephanie M From scottrus at raleigh.ibm.com Mon Nov 27 04:04:21 2000 From: scottrus at raleigh.ibm.com (Scott Russell) Date: Sun, 26 Nov 2000 22:04:21 -0500 Subject: [Mailman-Users] RPM PROBLEM In-Reply-To: <3A21893E.4DB8F95@nwla.com>; from kd5de@nwla.com on Sun, Nov 26, 2000 at 04:05:50PM -0600 References: <3A21893E.4DB8F95@nwla.com> Message-ID: <20001126220421.A5280@raleigh.ibm.com> FYI. In Red Hat 7.0 a new user/group is created for httpd as apache, GID/UID = 48. In previous versions of Red Hat (6.x) httpd used nobody as the GID which was 99. I think you'll need a 7.0 RPM and a 6.2 RPM because of this. -- Scott On Sun, Nov 26, 2000 at 04:05:50PM -0600, Mel Sojka wrote: > I I grabbed the RPM for 2.0 that was posted on the list this > week. Had a couple of problems # 1 the rpm installed the > package as root so ./check_perms was not to happy, but -f > did the trick. But I am going to have to cook a new install > anyway because cgi wanted gid 99 and got 48. OS is Red Hat > 7.0. and Python 1.5.2. Please note I had none of these > problems with the 1.1 RPM or the Beta 5 rpm from Redhat. > > If anyone has done an install on Red Hat 7 I would love to > have your config options besided the --with-cgi-gid=48. No > need to reinvent the wheel. > Thanks Mel > > -- > ------------------------------------- > This Mail composed using Netscape 4.5 > Caldera OpenLinux 1.3 Linux 2.0.36 > ---------------------------------- > > ------------------------------------------------------ > Mailman-Users maillist - Mailman-Users at python.org > http://www.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users -- Regards, Scott Russell (scottrus at raleigh.ibm.com) Linux Technology Center, System Admin, RHCE. T/L 441-9289 / External 919-543-9289 http://bzimage.raleigh.ibm.com/webcam From scott-brown at home.com Mon Nov 27 05:56:03 2000 From: scott-brown at home.com (Scott Brown) Date: Sun, 26 Nov 2000 23:56:03 -0500 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Installation Problem? - RH5.2/Python1.6/Mailman2.0 - Internal Server error Message-ID: <000301c0582e$590036a0$0401a8c0@ibmpeers> I've run into a problem installing the release Mailman 2.0 on my rented server "down south". It's a RH 5.2 system, which I've just upgraded to Python 1.6 as the default python. Apache v.1.3.4 is running as nobody/nobody. I've added the ScriptAlias /mailman/ /home/mailman/cgi-bin/ (and the pipermail) and restarted the server. Upon referencing the /www.somehost.com/mailman/listinfo page, I get an error 500, internal server error. The system runs a CGI wrapper program which forces the user/group to the appropriate values for the host it's working with... which I believe is the problem here. in my cgi.log file I'm getting [23:32:53 26-11-100]: uid: (nexus-iservices/nexus-iservices) gid: (nexus-iservicesgrp/nexus-iservicesgrp) listinfo [23:32:53 26-11-100]: command not in docroot (/home/mailman/cgi-bin/listinfo) This is a semi-managed server - and I'm not sure of all the bells and whistles they've thrown on this ... but until now, this cgi-wrapper has been useful, and hidden behind the scenes. Now it's just causing me problems. How do I get around the wrapper and enable mailmain webpage functionality for each of my virtual domains?? From Dan.Mick at west.sun.com Mon Nov 27 08:40:34 2000 From: Dan.Mick at west.sun.com (Dan Mick) Date: Sun, 26 Nov 2000 23:40:34 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] mailman webpages sloooow References: <025836EFF856D411A6660090272811E6169E1B@EMAIL> Message-ID: <3A220FF2.292E0091@west.sun.com> Gregory Leblanc wrote: > > Hi! I'm running mailman 2.0beta5 (no problems with it now, waiting for > final to upgrade) final is released. > on a SPARCstation 2. The machine has 64MB of ram, a > decent 4GB SCSI disk, and a 40MHz processor. For most operations, its on > par with a high end 486. This machine is running RH6.2 and Apache. I've > got a few static pages online, and loading these pages is very quick. > However, when I hit the mailman pages, (mailman/listinfo especially) there's > a huge delay before the page loads. Any ideas on what I can do to improve > page processing time on the server? Thanks, > Greg Well, as you probably know, most of those pages are dynamically generated, so "anything to make Python run faster" is the right answer. SS2/40MHz/64GB is a pretty low-end machine these days. More RAM will definitely help any Unix machine, and particularly Solaris; if you can swing it, that's the best answer. But consider different hardware; that's way out of date, and slooow. I suppose focusing on making Python faster might be a thing to try. Make sure it's compiled with optimization. From mau at beatles.cselt.it Mon Nov 27 17:23:27 2000 From: mau at beatles.cselt.it (Maurizio Codogno) Date: Mon, 27 Nov 2000 17:23:27 +0100 (MET) Subject: [Mailman-Users] How may I delete selected messages from archive? Message-ID: <200011271623.RAA20483@beatles.cselt.it> Subject says pretty much all. I have an archived list, but I don't want to save all messages from the list. I may see the hard way: delete ~mailman/archives/private/list/Date/message and the bit in ~mailman/archives/private/list/Date.txt , and rebuild the pointers, but I hope that there is a simpler way! ciao, .mau. From docdrt at hotmail.com Mon Nov 27 18:22:59 2000 From: docdrt at hotmail.com (T dhurairaj) Date: Mon, 27 Nov 2000 22:52:59 +0530 Subject: [Mailman-Users] subscrirtion to refindia quiz Message-ID: I confirm my subscripton to refindia quiz -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mail.python.org/pipermail/mailman-users/attachments/20001127/55ca86b5/attachment.html From docdrt at hotmail.com Mon Nov 27 18:26:01 2000 From: docdrt at hotmail.com (T dhurairaj) Date: Mon, 27 Nov 2000 22:56:01 +0530 Subject: [Mailman-Users] subscription to refindia quiz Message-ID: I confirm my subscription to refindia quiz -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mail.python.org/pipermail/mailman-users/attachments/20001127/a6d4d199/attachment.htm From when at web.ca Mon Nov 27 18:24:02 2000 From: when at web.ca (W H E N) Date: Mon, 27 Nov 2000 12:24:02 -0500 Subject: [Mailman-Users] UNSUBSCRIBE US.........!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Message-ID: <022301c05896$d87d4180$ae039ad8@default> Somewhere we appear on your lists and we do not want to! Find us and remove us. when at web.ca; when at web.net weed at web.net -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mail.python.org/pipermail/mailman-users/attachments/20001127/ee956d6c/attachment.html From Ellisonjw at cs.com Mon Nov 27 18:44:38 2000 From: Ellisonjw at cs.com (Ellisonjw at cs.com) Date: Mon, 27 Nov 2000 12:44:38 EST Subject: [Mailman-Users] unsubscribe - ADN Message-ID: <4a.e084ce0.2753f786@cs.com> From lehmann at lsd.it Mon Nov 27 20:29:15 2000 From: lehmann at lsd.it (Massimiliano Lehmann) Date: Mon, 27 Nov 2000 20:29:15 +0100 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Not enough arguments for format strings? Message-ID: <4.3.2.7.2.20001127190835.00d66df0@pop.lsd.it> Hi, after upgrading From Mailman 1.1 + Python 1.5 to Mailman 2.0 + Python 2.0 I'm obtaining the following error when anyone tries to subscribe to a list. The system is a Slackware 7.0 + kernel 2.2.13 Apache 1.3.14 Any hint? Thanks ------------------------------------------------------------------ An unexpected Mailman error has occurred in MailCommandHandler.ParseMailCommands(). Here is the traceback: Traceback (most recent call last): File "/home/mlist/mailman/Mailman/MailCommandHandler.py", line 223, in ParseMailCommands self.__dispatch[cmd](args, line, msg) File "/home/mlist/mailman/Mailman/MailCommandHandler.py", line 568, in ProcessSubscribeCmd self.AddMember(subscribe_address, password, digest, remote) File "/home/mlist/mailman/Mailman/MailList.py", line 991, in AddMember {"email" : name, File "/home/mlist/mailman/Mailman/Utils.py", line 507, in maketext text = template % SafeDict(dict) TypeError: not enough arguments for format string -- Massimiliano Lehmann +-------------------------------------+-------------------------+ | mailto:lehmann at lsd.it | LSD - [L]ehmann | | http://www.lsd.it (personal web) | [S]oftware | | http://majjolone.lsd.it (crazy web) | [D]evelopment | +-------------------------------------+-------------------------+ From alan at batie.org Mon Nov 27 20:31:27 2000 From: alan at batie.org (Alan Batie) Date: Mon, 27 Nov 2000 11:31:27 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] passwords Message-ID: <20001127113127.A74079@agora.rdrop.com> I run a small isp, and have recently installed mailman as the list manager here. A couple of users have already managed to change their passwords to something they didn't intend or forgot or something, and I don't see an easy way to reset them? Help? Thanks... -- Alan Batie ______ www.rdrop.com/users/alan Me alan at batie.org \ / www.qrd.org The Triangle PGPFP DE 3C 29 17 C0 49 7A \ / www.pgpi.com The Weird Numbers 27 40 A5 3C 37 4A DA 52 B9 \/ www.anti-spam.net NO SPAM! From Dan.Mick at west.sun.com Mon Nov 27 20:38:23 2000 From: Dan.Mick at west.sun.com (Dan Mick) Date: Mon, 27 Nov 2000 11:38:23 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Questions about scanners Message-ID: <3A22B82F.9B70F328@west.sun.com> I wrote the last person who asked a question about scanners on this forum, and he/she/it was able to tell me that it was some link somewhere off gateway.com; when I asked her/him/it to be a little more specific, it said "please leave me alone". So anyway, something about Gateway scanner tech support is set to mail mailman-users at python.org, but I don't have what it takes to enumerate the entire Gateway site to try to find it. From Dan.Mick at west.sun.com Mon Nov 27 20:40:50 2000 From: Dan.Mick at west.sun.com (Dan Mick) Date: Mon, 27 Nov 2000 11:40:50 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] How may I delete selected messages from archive? References: <200011271623.RAA20483@beatles.cselt.it> Message-ID: <3A22B8C2.F8DED4B7@west.sun.com> Maurizio Codogno wrote: > > Subject says pretty much all. > I have an archived list, but I don't want to save all messages > from the list. > I may see the hard way: delete ~mailman/archives/private/list/Date/message > and the bit in ~mailman/archives/private/list/Date.txt , and rebuild > the pointers, but I hope that there is a simpler way! If you still have the whole .mbox file, edit it (i.e. back it up and clip out the bits you don't want, from '^From ' to '^From ' line, and then rerun bin/arch to build the archives anew. From Dan.Mick at west.sun.com Mon Nov 27 20:44:51 2000 From: Dan.Mick at west.sun.com (Dan Mick) Date: Mon, 27 Nov 2000 11:44:51 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] passwords References: <20001127113127.A74079@agora.rdrop.com> Message-ID: <3A22B9B3.B8EBD1B4@west.sun.com> Alan Batie wrote: > > I run a small isp, and have recently installed mailman as the list manager > here. A couple of users have already managed to change their passwords to > something they didn't intend or forgot or something, and I don't see an > easy way to reset them? Help? Thanks... In general, you can enter any authenticated place in Mailman by using passwords in this order: list member, list, site. So just use the list password to enter their subscription page, change their password to something you let them know, and urge them not to be such doofuses next time. From m at whiteywillpay.net Mon Nov 27 20:51:51 2000 From: m at whiteywillpay.net (Matt Singerman) Date: Mon, 27 Nov 2000 14:51:51 -0500 (EST) Subject: [Mailman-Users] passwords In-Reply-To: <20001127113127.A74079@agora.rdrop.com> Message-ID: You should have the overarching password for the Mailman installation - if not, set it via the mmsitepass command. Then, log into their account via the web interface, put in the mmsitepass-initialized password as the new password, and a new password in the new password fields. Submit changes, and viola - new password is set. Matt Singerman | "Don't feel sad, I'm in heaven now, m at whiteywillpay.net | singing with the pretty angels" http://whiteywillpay.net/ | -- JonBenet Ramsey On Mon, 27 Nov 2000, Alan Batie wrote: > I run a small isp, and have recently installed mailman as the list manager > here. A couple of users have already managed to change their passwords to > something they didn't intend or forgot or something, and I don't see an > easy way to reset them? Help? Thanks... > -- > Alan Batie ______ www.rdrop.com/users/alan Me > alan at batie.org \ / www.qrd.org The Triangle > PGPFP DE 3C 29 17 C0 49 7A \ / www.pgpi.com The Weird Numbers > 27 40 A5 3C 37 4A DA 52 B9 \/ www.anti-spam.net NO SPAM! > > ------------------------------------------------------ > Mailman-Users maillist - Mailman-Users at python.org > http://www.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users > From bob at nleaudio.com Mon Nov 27 20:58:49 2000 From: bob at nleaudio.com (Bob Puff@NLE) Date: Mon, 27 Nov 2000 14:58:49 -0500 Subject: [Mailman-Users] How may I delete selected messages from archive? References: <200011271623.RAA20483@beatles.cselt.it> <3A22B8C2.F8DED4B7@west.sun.com> Message-ID: <3A22BCF9.D4423F47@nleaudio.com> Is there an easy way to do this, based peraps on date? I can see the mbox file browing to hundreds of megs on my lists. Bob Dan Mick wrote: > > Maurizio Codogno wrote: > > > > Subject says pretty much all. > > I have an archived list, but I don't want to save all messages > > from the list. > > I may see the hard way: delete ~mailman/archives/private/list/Date/message > > and the bit in ~mailman/archives/private/list/Date.txt , and rebuild > > the pointers, but I hope that there is a simpler way! > > If you still have the whole .mbox file, edit it (i.e. back it up and > clip out the bits you don't want, from '^From ' to '^From ' line, > and then rerun bin/arch to build the archives anew. > > ------------------------------------------------------ > Mailman-Users maillist - Mailman-Users at python.org > http://www.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users From peewee at scc.mi.org Mon Nov 27 21:01:28 2000 From: peewee at scc.mi.org (Jason Wright) Date: Mon, 27 Nov 2000 12:01:28 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] How may I delete selected messages from archive? In-Reply-To: <3A22BCF9.D4423F47@nleaudio.com>; from Bob Puff@NLE on Mon, Nov 27, 2000 at 02:58:49PM -0500 References: <200011271623.RAA20483@beatles.cselt.it> <3A22B8C2.F8DED4B7@west.sun.com> <3A22BCF9.D4423F47@nleaudio.com> Message-ID: <20001127120128.B3152@scc.mi.org> On Mon, Nov 27, 2000 at 02:58:49PM -0500, Bob Puff at NLE spewed forth: > Is there an easy way to do this, based peraps on date? I can see the mbox file browing to hundreds of megs on my lists. Try grepmail. http://grepmail.sourceforge.net/ PeeWee -- email: peewee at scc.mi.org - useless: http://www.scc.mi.org/peewee/ - efnet: Pwe by my clock, the world just ended. i haven't noticed yet but then i live in the bay area, so i always feel like the world just ended only no one's noticed. -me From Dan.Mick at west.sun.com Mon Nov 27 21:02:33 2000 From: Dan.Mick at west.sun.com (Dan Mick) Date: Mon, 27 Nov 2000 12:02:33 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] How may I delete selected messages from archive? References: <200011271623.RAA20483@beatles.cselt.it> <3A22B8C2.F8DED4B7@west.sun.com> <3A22BCF9.D4423F47@nleaudio.com> Message-ID: <3A22BDD9.C8E4753A@west.sun.com> If by "easy" you mean "automated", not that I know of, and if you think about it, trying to define 'what you want' from the archives is pretty much writing an editor. What task would you automate, exactly? But editing a file is pretty basic sysadmin-type stuff.... "Bob Puff at NLE" wrote: > > Is there an easy way to do this, based peraps on date? I can see the mbox file browing to hundreds of megs on my lists. > > Bob > > Dan Mick wrote: > > > > Maurizio Codogno wrote: > > > > > > Subject says pretty much all. > > > I have an archived list, but I don't want to save all messages > > > from the list. > > > I may see the hard way: delete ~mailman/archives/private/list/Date/message > > > and the bit in ~mailman/archives/private/list/Date.txt , and rebuild > > > the pointers, but I hope that there is a simpler way! > > > > If you still have the whole .mbox file, edit it (i.e. back it up and > > clip out the bits you don't want, from '^From ' to '^From ' line, > > and then rerun bin/arch to build the archives anew. > > > > ------------------------------------------------------ > > Mailman-Users maillist - Mailman-Users at python.org > > http://www.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users From RobLindbom at cs.com Mon Nov 27 21:17:08 2000 From: RobLindbom at cs.com (RobLindbom at cs.com) Date: Mon, 27 Nov 2000 15:17:08 EST Subject: [Mailman-Users] visioneer 6100 twain not workig Message-ID: <85.36a96e6.27541b44@cs.com> I have a HP pavilion pent III, my scanner only downloads to 98% when in paperport and hit twain it says not found or enabled how do i get this to work they sell the product but don't want to stand behind the product unless you pay a long distance charge can you help? my mail address is roblindbom at cs.com thanks From bob at nleaudio.com Mon Nov 27 21:25:37 2000 From: bob at nleaudio.com (Bob Puff@NLE) Date: Mon, 27 Nov 2000 15:25:37 -0500 Subject: [Mailman-Users] How may I delete selected messages from archive? References: <200011271623.RAA20483@beatles.cselt.it> <3A22B8C2.F8DED4B7@west.sun.com> <3A22BCF9.D4423F47@nleaudio.com> <3A22BDD9.C8E4753A@west.sun.com> Message-ID: <3A22C341.7E94747D@nleaudio.com> I would want something like: delete messages older than _____ days, or delete messages older than date: ______ Right now it's tough with a message being in 3 different places: its own html file, the mbox file, and an indexed file. I can see the need for gigs of HD space for active lists. A way to prune this is really needed. Bob From Dan.Mick at west.sun.com Mon Nov 27 21:42:41 2000 From: Dan.Mick at west.sun.com (Dan Mick) Date: Mon, 27 Nov 2000 12:42:41 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] How may I delete selected messages from archive? References: <200011271623.RAA20483@beatles.cselt.it> <3A22B8C2.F8DED4B7@west.sun.com> <3A22BCF9.D4423F47@nleaudio.com> <3A22BDD9.C8E4753A@west.sun.com> <3A22C341.7E94747D@nleaudio.com> Message-ID: <3A22C741.628A8F38@west.sun.com> "Bob Puff at NLE" wrote: > > I would want something like: > > delete messages older than _____ days, or > delete messages older than date: ______ > > Right now it's tough with a message being in 3 different places: its own html file, the mbox file, and an indexed file. I can see the need for gigs of HD space for active lists. A way to prune this is really needed. Well, again: 1) rm the archives (except for the .mbox file) 2) edit the mbox file 3) run bin/arch is not foolproof or trivial, but compared to other "log-reduction" tools, it ain't bad. But yes, I agree, a tool to do this would be nice. From alan at batie.org Mon Nov 27 22:55:39 2000 From: alan at batie.org (Alan Batie) Date: Mon, 27 Nov 2000 13:55:39 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] passwords In-Reply-To: <3A22B9B3.B8EBD1B4@west.sun.com>; from Dan.Mick@west.sun.com on Mon, Nov 27, 2000 at 11:44:51AM -0800 References: <20001127113127.A74079@agora.rdrop.com> <3A22B9B3.B8EBD1B4@west.sun.com> Message-ID: <20001127135539.A87805@agora.rdrop.com> On Mon, Nov 27, 2000 at 11:44:51AM -0800, Dan Mick wrote: > In general, you can enter any authenticated place in Mailman by using > passwords in this order: list member, list, site. That did the trick, thanks! -- Alan Batie ______ www.rdrop.com/users/alan Me alan at batie.org \ / www.qrd.org The Triangle PGPFP DE 3C 29 17 C0 49 7A \ / www.pgpi.com The Weird Numbers 27 40 A5 3C 37 4A DA 52 B9 \/ www.anti-spam.net NO SPAM! From eric at dehont.dyn.dhs.org Mon Nov 27 23:17:52 2000 From: eric at dehont.dyn.dhs.org (Eric) Date: Mon, 27 Nov 2000 23:17:52 +0100 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Questions about scanners In-Reply-To: Message from Dan Mick of "Mon, 27 Nov 2000 11:38:23 PST." <3A22B82F.9B70F328@west.sun.com> Message-ID: <200011272217.eARMHqd07488@dehont.dyn.dhs.org> Dan Wrote: > > I wrote the last person who asked a question about scanners on this forum, > and he/she/it was able to tell me that it was some link somewhere off > gateway.com; when I asked her/him/it to be a little more specific, it said > "please leave me alone". Simple questions can be SO scary! (While writing this reply I saw another 'scannermail' arriving. Try again! > So anyway, something about Gateway scanner tech support is set to mail > mailman-users at python.org, but I don't have what it takes to enumerate the entire > Gateway site to try to find it. I'm doing exactly that at the moment. With wget i create a complete mirror of their site -without the gifs, etc- and search the tree with find . -name '*' -type f -exec grep -l mailman '{}' ';' Download still going on. In the meantime i fed altavista '+link:mailman +paperport'. It returned the url of the archive of a mailinglist called 'the Paperport-win32'. And guess what: It's a mailman-list! http://list.scansoft.com/mailman/listinfo/paperport-win32 So I think someone tried to put a link to this list on his site, or perhaps added a link 'for more information about this listmanager' next to it... (I believe strongly in good intentions with bad side effects...) wget still going strong: downloaded 403 files so far. I'll check again tomorrow morning: It's 23:10 local time now... Greetings, Eric P.S.: Just before sending this message I cracked it!!! Take a look at http://list.scansoft.com. It contains exactly the good intended link i predicted... Who's gonna take action? E. From fmaior at etica.net Mon Nov 27 22:33:52 2000 From: fmaior at etica.net (Fernando Maior) Date: Mon, 27 Nov 2000 19:33:52 -0200 Subject: [Mailman-Users] How to put member address into the footer? Message-ID: <3A22D340.3030108@etica.net> Hello! I just installed my little list and I am at configuring by now. I changed, using the "Regular-member (non-digest) Option" the contents of the footer, so it is like: ------------------------------------------------------------- %(real_name)s mailing list You subscribed to this list using e-mail address: %(????????)s To cancel or change your subscription, visit us at: %(web_page_url)slistinfo%(cgiext)s/%(_internal_name)s or send an e-mail with the word, "unsubscribe" (no quotes!), to address %(real_name)s@%(host_name)s. ------------------------------------------------------------- You see, I try a number of strings in place of ????????. For example, %(addr)s, %(useraddr)s, %(username)s, %(user)s etc I just want to know what is the Mailman field one must use in order to get the canonical e-mail address of the member in place of the %(?????????)s string. Many thanks! Fernando Maior Linux Training From GLeblanc at cu-portland.edu Tue Nov 28 00:44:47 2000 From: GLeblanc at cu-portland.edu (Gregory Leblanc) Date: Mon, 27 Nov 2000 15:44:47 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] make prefix=/not/configure/prefix install doesn't work Message-ID: <025836EFF856D411A6660090272811E61D0840@EMAIL> I was sitting down to work on mailman this morning, and see about getting 2.0 on my systems. Unfortunately, someplace between 2.0beta6 and 2.0, something got broken. I tend to do everything I can as non-root, just so that things don't break. I ran the following commands to try to compile mailman: ./configure \ --prefix=/usr/share/mailman \ --with-python=/usr/bin/python \ --with-mail-gid=mail \ --with-cgi-id=nobody \ --with-cgi-gid=nobody make make install prefix=/var/tmp/mailman-root/usr/share/mailman However, the last part doesn't work anymore. When I run the above command as root I get the following: [gleblanc at grego1 mailman-2.0]$ ls /usr/share/mailman/ archives data filters lists locks logs qfiles spam [gleblanc at grego1 mailman-2.0]$ Anybody know how to fix this? Greg P.S. I know this should probably go to mailman-devel, but I'm not subscribed, yet. From armond.r.paiva at intel.com Tue Nov 28 02:07:44 2000 From: armond.r.paiva at intel.com (Paiva, Armond R) Date: Mon, 27 Nov 2000 17:07:44 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Viewing html messages or images in archive Message-ID: <9287DC1579B0D411AA2F009027F44C3F679B81@FMSMSX41> Does anybody know if mailman allows you to view html style emails with images through the web archive? -Armond From Dan.Mick at West.Sun.COM Tue Nov 28 02:36:19 2000 From: Dan.Mick at West.Sun.COM (Dan Mick) Date: Mon, 27 Nov 2000 17:36:19 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Mailman-Users] Viewing html messages or images in archive Message-ID: <200011280134.RAA12662@utopia.west.sun.com> > Does anybody know if mailman allows you to view html style emails with > images through the web archive? > -Armond The builtin archiver (pipermail) does not. Various external archivers exist, however, and can be glued into Mailman. From Dan.Mick at west.sun.com Tue Nov 28 02:41:03 2000 From: Dan.Mick at west.sun.com (Dan Mick) Date: Mon, 27 Nov 2000 17:41:03 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Mailman-Users] Questions about scanners Message-ID: <200011280139.RAA13072@utopia.west.sun.com> > P.S.: Just before sending this message I cracked it!!! > > Take a look at http://list.scansoft.com. It contains exactly the good > intended link i predicted... > > Who's gonna take action? I would, but I don't think that's it. That's just a link to www.list.org; it isn't a "mailto:mailman-users at python.org". I don't see how you could get from that to the emails we're seeing (without a whole lot of clueless click-through, which we'll never stop). From scott-brown at home.com Tue Nov 28 04:52:27 2000 From: scott-brown at home.com (Scott Brown) Date: Mon, 27 Nov 2000 22:52:27 -0500 Subject: [Mailman-Users] How do you work around SUEXEC? Message-ID: <008201c058ee$a0ab1040$0401a8c0@ibmpeers> Has anyone had any luck in working around an apache install with SUEXEC enabled? From scottrus at raleigh.ibm.com Tue Nov 28 06:50:32 2000 From: scottrus at raleigh.ibm.com (Scott Russell) Date: Tue, 28 Nov 2000 00:50:32 -0500 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Tips for Mailman 2.0 and Postfix Message-ID: <20001128005032.A7696@raleigh.ibm.com> All - Are there any config tips / gotchas that I should be aware of when using Mailman 2.0 with postfix? I saw several README. files but not one for postfix. (I didn't know postfix was that unpopular!) Thanks much. -- Regards, Scott Russell (scottrus at raleigh.ibm.com) Linux Technology Center, System Admin, RHCE. From scottrus at raleigh.ibm.com Tue Nov 28 06:55:45 2000 From: scottrus at raleigh.ibm.com (Scott Russell) Date: Tue, 28 Nov 2000 00:55:45 -0500 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Advertise not working after 1.2b3 -> 2.0 update? Message-ID: <20001128005545.A7740@raleigh.ibm.com> All - The update from Mailman 1.2b3 (from CVS a long long time ago...) to 2.0 went smoother than I would have expected. (This is *good*, thanks to all the developers for doing a great job!) The only problem I can see is that my lists are not showing up at /mailman/listinfo despite the Advertise = 1 setting in the config of the list. I resubmit the config or try to reapply the setting with bin/config_list but it doesn't take. Any thoughts on this? I am doing virtual hosting under apache and think this may affect it... Thanks for the help. -- Regards, Scott Russell (scottrus at raleigh.ibm.com) Linux Technology Center, System Admin, RHCE. From claw at kanga.nu Tue Nov 28 08:17:12 2000 From: claw at kanga.nu (J C Lawrence) Date: Mon, 27 Nov 2000 23:17:12 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Tips for Mailman 2.0 and Postfix In-Reply-To: Message from Scott Russell of "Tue, 28 Nov 2000 00:50:32 EST." <20001128005032.A7696@raleigh.ibm.com> References: <20001128005032.A7696@raleigh.ibm.com> Message-ID: <30825.975395832@kanga.nu> On Tue, 28 Nov 2000 00:50:32 -0500 Scott Russell wrote: > All - Are there any config tips / gotchas that I should be aware > of when using Mailman 2.0 with postfix? I saw several README. > files but not one for postfix. (I didn't know postfix was that > unpopular!) I recently moved one of my Mailman systems from Exim to Postfix. There really is precious little to note under postfix that special to Mailman. While there's been some discussion here for how to implement things like Exim's rather nice no-alias-file handling of Mailman lists, and a working solution for it too, its still a bit ugly really. Just build a Mailman-specific alias file, and then make sure to point both alias_maps and alias_database at it. The rest, as they say, pretty well happens for free. -- J C Lawrence claw at kanga.nu ---------(*) : http://www.kanga.nu/~claw/ --=| A man is as sane as he is dangerous to his environment |=-- From vnk at bom6.vsnl.net.in Tue Nov 28 09:21:59 2000 From: vnk at bom6.vsnl.net.in (vnk@bom6) Date: Tue, 28 Nov 2000 16:21:59 +0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] (no subject) Message-ID: <000701c05915$7bd1b4a0$435dc5cb@MyComputer.vsnl> -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mail.python.org/pipermail/mailman-users/attachments/20001128/81708e7c/attachment.htm From info at partners.com.ua Tue Nov 28 16:29:21 2000 From: info at partners.com.ua (info at partners.com.ua) Date: Tue, 28 Nov 2000 13:29:21 -0200 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Strategy planning director Message-ID: An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mail.python.org/pipermail/mailman-users/attachments/20001128/072a9f05/attachment.html From spluess at creative.net Tue Nov 28 15:10:22 2000 From: spluess at creative.net (Serge =?iso-8859-1?Q?Pl=FCss?=) Date: Tue, 28 Nov 2000 06:10:22 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] URL missing /mailman/ part Message-ID: <5.0.1.3.2.20001128060319.00ac4da8@imap.creative.net> Hi there I have just completed installing mailman including all the adjustments to apache and sendmail. I created a new list and in the email I got sent back the URL's where missing the /mailman/ part. Instead the URL would say: http://hostname/admin.cgi/test which would fail with 404. Here is what I added to httpd.conf Alias /pipermail/ "/home/mailman/archives/public/" and ScriptAlias /mailman/ "/home/mailman/cgi-bin/" Doesn't that second entry mean that the URL should look something like http://hostname/mailman/admin.cgi/test If I type that in I get to the correct page, but on subsequent clicks it will generate the invalid path again. So far I couldn't find where the paths for the html codes and for generating the list email (which includes the path) get defined. Thanks for your help Serge From david at kenpro.com.au Tue Nov 28 15:33:32 2000 From: david at kenpro.com.au (David) Date: Wed, 29 Nov 2000 01:33:32 +1100 (EST) Subject: [Mailman-Users] request confirmation vanishes Message-ID: I've just completed install on RH6 and set up a test mailing list. I subscibed myself and received a confirmation (from test-request). My reply to the confirmation request seems to have vanished. It doesn't bounce, but it also hasn't completed the subscriptions. To test, I sent a request for info, and this also vanishes, no bounce, but no reply. I tried to post also, but that vanishes. My aliases look like this: ## test mailing list ## created: 29-Nov-2000 mailman test: "|/home/mailman/mail/wrapper post test" test-admin: "|/home/mailman/mail/wrapper mailowner test" test-request: "|/home/mailman/mail/wrapper mailcmd test" test-owner: test-admin any suggestions what I'm doing wrong? All the websites look ok TIA, David. From anno at rochester.edu Tue Nov 28 17:25:35 2000 From: anno at rochester.edu (anno at rochester.edu) Date: Tue, 28 Nov 2000 11:25:35 -0500 Subject: [Mailman-Users] re: your product Message-ID: <16AC7B80DB9BF44588C90C8EA99854EB681423@acs-exc1.acs.rochester.edu> can you attach documents to list serv messages? documents like .pdfs, .dlls, .docs, powerpoint presentations? Thanks, Ann Olsen Software Specialist University of Rochester Information Technology Services Phone: (716) 275-0569 Fax: (716) 273-1012 Email: ann.olsen at rochester.edu From hpinchei at centauro.ici.ubiobio.cl Tue Nov 28 14:31:12 2000 From: hpinchei at centauro.ici.ubiobio.cl (=?iso-8859-1?Q?Hern=E1n_Pincheira?=) Date: Tue, 28 Nov 2000 13:31:12 -0000 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Consulta Message-ID: <0BD9D0B2A621D411A099006008A5A08F0229E3@centauro.ici.ubiobio.cl> Existe una version en Espa?ol del Software? Gracias From fmaior at etica.net Tue Nov 28 17:18:33 2000 From: fmaior at etica.net (Fernando Maior) Date: Tue, 28 Nov 2000 14:18:33 -0200 Subject: [Mailman-Users] URL missing /mailman/ part References: <5.0.1.3.2.20001128060319.00ac4da8@imap.creative.net> Message-ID: <3A23DAD9.6060605@etica.net> Serge Pl?ss wrote: > Hi there > > I have just completed installing mailman including all the adjustments > to apache and sendmail. I created a new list and in the email I got > sent back the URL's where missing the /mailman/ part. Instead the URL > would say: > > http://hostname/admin.cgi/test > > which would fail with 404. > > Here is what I added to httpd.conf > > Alias /pipermail/ "/home/mailman/archives/public/" > and > ScriptAlias /mailman/ "/home/mailman/cgi-bin/" > > Doesn't that second entry mean that the URL should look something like > > http://hostname/mailman/admin.cgi/test > > If I type that in I get to the correct page, but on subsequent clicks > it will generate the invalid path again. > So far I couldn't find where the paths for the html codes and for > generating the list email (which includes the path) get defined. > > Thanks for your help > > Serge > > > ------------------------------------------------------ > Mailman-Users maillist - Mailman-Users at python.org > http://www.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users Serge, launch you favorite browser and get to your Mailman admin page (which is probably http://hostname/cgi-bin/mailman/admin/test, if you did as the docs tell you to do). After you login into the Administrative System, you see the General Options page. There, you go to the last option, the Base URL for Mailmen web interface. Change and apply as you wish, and you are done. -- Bye, Fernando Maior Etica Tecnologia Linux Training From fmaior at etica.net Tue Nov 28 17:27:36 2000 From: fmaior at etica.net (Fernando Maior) Date: Tue, 28 Nov 2000 14:27:36 -0200 Subject: [Mailman-Users] request confirmation vanishes References: Message-ID: <3A23DCF8.2070705@etica.net> David wrote: > I've just completed install on RH6 and set up a test mailing list. I > subscibed myself and received a confirmation (from test-request). > > My reply to the confirmation request seems to have vanished. It doesn't > bounce, but it also hasn't completed the subscriptions. > > To test, I sent a request for info, and this also vanishes, no bounce, but > no reply. > > I tried to post also, but that vanishes. > > My aliases look like this: > > ## test mailing list > ## created: 29-Nov-2000 mailman > test: "|/home/mailman/mail/wrapper post test" > test-admin: "|/home/mailman/mail/wrapper mailowner test" > test-request: "|/home/mailman/mail/wrapper mailcmd test" > test-owner: test-admin > > > any suggestions what I'm doing wrong? > All the websites look ok > > > TIA, David. > > > ------------------------------------------------------ > Mailman-Users maillist - Mailman-Users at python.org > http://www.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users Lets assume you follow the directions and create an user and a group called mailman. And, after everything, mailman is the user and mailman is the group that runs Mailman. May be both requests are waiting for the list admin to approve them... Are you the list admin? And, did you receive mail about "Pending requests"? It is nice to alias your mail as the list admin with: mailman:david (or whatever your mail account is...) After that, every mail with "Pending requestes" is directed to your mail account, instead of to the user mailman mail account. Also, get to the administrative web page for your list and, after logging in, get to the Pendings page. May be they are right there, waiting for approval... -- Bye, Fernando Maior Etica Tecnologia Linux Training From partain at mekb2.sps.mot.com Tue Nov 28 18:26:09 2000 From: partain at mekb2.sps.mot.com (Will Partain) Date: Tue, 28 Nov 2000 17:26:09 +0000 Subject: [Mailman-Users] majordomo-to-mailman crib sheet? Message-ID: <200011281726.RAA21851@mekb2.sps.mot.com> Sorry for what is plainly a newbie question... I looked hard, honest :-) Does anyone have a crib sheet about converting a majordomo site to a mailman (2.0) site? If I receive Lots of Stuff, I'll summarize back to the list... Thanks, Will From sursee at earthlink.net Tue Nov 28 22:15:43 2000 From: sursee at earthlink.net (Ellis Page) Date: Tue, 28 Nov 2000 16:15:43 -0500 Subject: [Mailman-Users] (no subject) Message-ID: <41200011228211543760@earthlink.net> Hi we are wanting to be on your mailing list!!!!! Please send us info.... Asheville Collective (Asheville N.C) --- Ellis Page --- sursee at earthlink.net --- EarthLink: It's your Internet. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mail.python.org/pipermail/mailman-users/attachments/20001128/4e8b16d9/attachment.htm From Dan.Mick at west.sun.com Tue Nov 28 22:15:37 2000 From: Dan.Mick at west.sun.com (Dan Mick) Date: Tue, 28 Nov 2000 13:15:37 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] URL missing /mailman/ part References: <5.0.1.3.2.20001128060319.00ac4da8@imap.creative.net> Message-ID: <3A242079.E83A5DE0@west.sun.com> This sounds like errors before 2.0final; which version did you install? In any case, check that DEFAULT_URL is set to a value containing a trailing slash. (i.e. http://hostname/mailman/). The definition should be in mm_cfg.py. Serge Pl?ss wrote: > > Hi there > > I have just completed installing mailman including all the adjustments to > apache and sendmail. I created a new list and in the email I got sent back > the URL's where missing the /mailman/ part. Instead the URL would say: > > http://hostname/admin.cgi/test > > which would fail with 404. > > Here is what I added to httpd.conf > > Alias /pipermail/ "/home/mailman/archives/public/" > and > ScriptAlias /mailman/ "/home/mailman/cgi-bin/" > > Doesn't that second entry mean that the URL should look something like > > http://hostname/mailman/admin.cgi/test > > If I type that in I get to the correct page, but on subsequent clicks it > will generate the invalid path again. > So far I couldn't find where the paths for the html codes and for > generating the list email (which includes the path) get defined. > > Thanks for your help > > Serge > > ------------------------------------------------------ > Mailman-Users maillist - Mailman-Users at python.org > http://www.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users From callinma at gse.harvard.edu Tue Nov 28 23:34:48 2000 From: callinma at gse.harvard.edu (Peggy Callinan) Date: Tue, 28 Nov 2000 17:34:48 -0500 Subject: [Mailman-Users] smtp works, sendmail doesn't Message-ID: Hello, I've upgraded from MailMan 2.05b -> 2.0 on Solaris. Lists posting work when SMTP is used for delivery (which is the method I used for 2.05b), but I haven't had any success with sendmail. I added the entries below to mm_cfg.py: DELIVERY_MODULE = 'Sendmail' and SENDMAIL_CMD = '/pmdf/bin/sendmail' (Innosoft's PMDF is the MTA; there's a symlink to /usr/lib/sendmail but I tried adding the latter just in case) The *.db and *.msg files remain in the qfiles directory and the only relevant log entry is in mailman/log/post, but I'm not clear on the relevance of the 'success' and 'failure' messages: Nov 28 16:58:01 2000 (13105) post to subtest from callinma at edtemp2.harvard.edu, size=166, failure=92 Nov 28 16:58:01 2000 (13105) post to subtest from callinma at edtemp2.harvard.edu, size=166, success Nov 28 16:59:00 2000 (13111) post to subtest from callinma at edtemp2.harvard.edu, size=166, failure=92 Nov 28 16:59:00 2000 (13111) post to subtest from callinma at edtemp2.harvard.edu, size=166, success etc. Any ideas on what I'm missing or have misconfigured here would be appreciated. Thanks, ---------------------------------------- Peggy Callinan Email: Peggy_Callinan at harvard.edu From david at kenpro.com.au Wed Nov 29 00:16:28 2000 From: david at kenpro.com.au (David) Date: Wed, 29 Nov 2000 10:16:28 +1100 (EST) Subject: [Mailman-Users] changing domain name In-Reply-To: <5.0.1.3.2.20001128060319.00ac4da8@imap.creative.net> Message-ID: I've just my first (successful) install and test. Mailman uses the qualified host name as the URL for mail and www. Is there any way that I can change that to a different (valid) domain for this machine? eg: test at fast.kenpro.com.au becomes test at validdomainname.com.au http://fast.kenpro.com.au/mailman/admin/test becomes http://www.validdomainname.com.au/mailman/admin/test TIA, David (PS: thanks for earlier help - it turns out you really DO have to set up cron entries, or nothing works... dumb me) From Sly1065 at cs.com Wed Nov 29 00:57:53 2000 From: Sly1065 at cs.com (Sly1065 at cs.com) Date: Tue, 28 Nov 2000 18:57:53 EST Subject: [Mailman-Users] deleting a mailing list Message-ID: I have created a Mailman list inadvertently. I thought it was simply an email feature that would allow me to bulk email to my subscribers. I don't want people to be able post messages or read archives so how do I delete the mailing list? public name is: contestwinners Thank you for your assistance, Brad Sylvester sly1065 at cs.com From darron at javelindigital.com Wed Nov 29 01:12:31 2000 From: darron at javelindigital.com (Darron Froese) Date: Tue, 28 Nov 2000 17:12:31 -0700 Subject: [Mailman-Users] changing domain name In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On 11/28/00 4:16 PM, "David" wrote: > Mailman uses the qualified host name as the URL for mail and www. Is there > any way that I can change that to a different (valid) domain for this > machine? > > eg: > test at fast.kenpro.com.au > becomes test at validdomainname.com.au > > http://fast.kenpro.com.au/mailman/admin/test > becomes http://www.validdomainname.com.au/mailman/admin/test David, It's fairly simple. 1. You seem to have to have an A record for the domain in question that points to the same IP address. A CNAME doesn't appear to work. When I was working on this (on Monday for most of the day) - some mail servers would report the actual domain name of the machine when I wanted them to use the modified domain name for the list. (Other mail servers would report the name that I wanted it to report.) An A record *instead* of a CNAME solved the problem on multiple mail servers that I had access to. 2. At the bottom of the general options page in the administrative section of the list there are two fields where you can set the "Hostname this list prefers" and the "Base URL for Mailman web interface". These addresses are used in all of the emails that are sent out from the mailing list. NOTE: This is what I found out - if there's an easier way send it on over. This has been my first *working* Mailman install ever. Hope this helps. -- darron froese new media technologist sutton javelin corporate communications t 403.265.9980 f 403.265.7662 e darron at javelindigital.com From darron at javelindigital.com Wed Nov 29 01:17:50 2000 From: darron at javelindigital.com (Darron Froese) Date: Tue, 28 Nov 2000 17:17:50 -0700 Subject: [Mailman-Users] deleting a mailing list In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On 11/28/00 4:57 PM, "Sly1065 at cs.com" wrote: > I have created a Mailman list inadvertently. I thought it was simply an > email feature that would allow me to bulk email to my subscribers. I don't > want people to be able post messages or read archives so how do I delete the > mailing list? > > public name is: contestwinners To remove the list: $home_prefix/bin/rmlist -a contestwinners You can also: 1. Turn off the archiving feature. 2. Make *only* the list administrators be able to post to the list - making it essentially a broadcast only list. These can be done from within the administration interface. -- darron froese new media technologist sutton javelin corporate communications t 403.265.9980 f 403.265.7662 e darron at javelindigital.com From lj at mandala-designs.com Wed Nov 29 01:56:06 2000 From: lj at mandala-designs.com (Leonard Jacobs) Date: Tue, 28 Nov 2000 19:56:06 -0500 Subject: [Mailman-Users] database improvements in Mailman Message-ID: <3A240DD6.27547.32C0DCE9@localhost> Are there plans to solicit database enhancements specs for Mailman 3 from the user population? ------------------ Leonard Jacobs www.mandala-designs.com (508) 359-5473 From chuqui at plaidworks.com Wed Nov 29 02:35:24 2000 From: chuqui at plaidworks.com (Chuq Von Rospach) Date: Tue, 28 Nov 2000 17:35:24 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] database improvements in Mailman In-Reply-To: <3A240DD6.27547.32C0DCE9@localhost> References: <3A240DD6.27547.32C0DCE9@localhost> Message-ID: At 7:56 PM -0500 11/28/00, Leonard Jacobs wrote: >Are there plans to solicit database enhancements specs for >Mailman 3 from the user population? why shold we? we already know everything... (grin) (um, yes...) -- Chuq Von Rospach - Plaidworks Consulting (mailto:chuqui at plaidworks.com) Apple Mail List Gnome (mailto:chuq at apple.com) The vet said it was behavioral, but I prefer to think of it as genetic. It cuts down on the liability -- Get Fuzzy From david at kenpro.com.au Wed Nov 29 02:53:58 2000 From: david at kenpro.com.au (David) Date: Wed, 29 Nov 2000 12:53:58 +1100 (EST) Subject: [Mailman-Users] broadcast only In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Tue, 28 Nov 2000, Darron Froese wrote: > On 11/28/00 4:57 PM, "Sly1065 at cs.com" wrote: > > > You can also: > > 1. Turn off the archiving feature. > 2. Make *only* the list administrators be able to post to the list - making > it essentially a broadcast only list. > > These can be done from within the administration interface. Are you referring to the "privacy" section? or is there somewhere else? As far as I can see, you can only force admin. approval, which means you could easily finish up with a lot of bogus posts to reject. Is there any way to bounce non-admin. posts completely? I cant see one. David. From darron at javelindigital.com Wed Nov 29 03:10:48 2000 From: darron at javelindigital.com (Darron Froese) Date: Tue, 28 Nov 2000 19:10:48 -0700 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Re: broadcast only In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On 11/28/00 6:53 PM, "David" wrote: >> 1. Turn off the archiving feature. >> 2. Make *only* the list administrators be able to post to the list - making >> it essentially a broadcast only list. >> >> These can be done from within the administration interface. > > Are you referring to the "privacy" section? or is there somewhere else? You betcha. I don't know of another place other than in the privacy section. > As far as I can see, you can only force admin. approval, which means you > could easily finish up with a lot of bogus posts to reject. Is there any > way to bounce non-admin. posts completely? I cant see one. Yes that is correct. I *don't* know of a way to reject any non-admin posts right out of hand. That's the only solution that I can find in the web admin and from searching the list archives manually. It's a bit of a pain in the ass for "broadcast only" lists. For example: If you look at the mail you get when you sign up for the Mailman-announce list - it says this: > Welcome to the Mailman-announce at python.org mailing list! > > To post to this list, send your email to: > > mailman-announce at python.org At the web page for that list you are told that: > This mailing list is a read-only list for receiving announcements of releases > and other news for Mailman, the GNU Mailing List Manager. User: "Can I send email to this list or can't I? Can others?" It's a little bit of mental discord that I'm hoping to find a way around because I just don't want to have to deal with people trying to send messages and have to deal with them. I would *love* to have an option to click "Announce Only" list and when the user gets the welcome message it's *clearly* noted that it's: 1. Not a list they or others (other than the authorized admins/company/etc.) can send messages to. 2. Somehow indicates the frequency that they will receive messages (customizable to each list). I am going to have a couple of discussion lists and a bunch of broadcast only lists (no, it's not spam) and this is one of the only annoyances I've found with Mailman so far that I haven't been able to completely work around. Anyone else worked around this? -- darron froese new media technologist sutton javelin corporate communications t 403.265.9980 f 403.265.7662 e darron at javelindigital.com From Dan.Mick at West.Sun.COM Wed Nov 29 03:34:44 2000 From: Dan.Mick at West.Sun.COM (Dan Mick) Date: Tue, 28 Nov 2000 18:34:44 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Mailman-Users] Re: broadcast only Message-ID: <200011290233.SAA21827@utopia.west.sun.com> > I would *love* to have an option to click "Announce Only" list and when the > user gets the welcome message it's *clearly* noted that it's: > > 1. Not a list they or others (other than the authorized admins/company/etc.) > can send messages to. > 2. Somehow indicates the frequency that they will receive messages > (customizable to each list). Well, I guess I don't see the need for a mailing-list manager for such things, because it seems like they're nearly-always a "broadcast-only, you are subscribed because you're someone I've been given the right to broadcast to" list, for which normal aliases work *very* well. The trick to avoid backposts is to send the message with "To:" set to yourself, and "Bcc:" the alias; then everyone on the alias gets the mail, any replies go directly to the "To:" address and not the list, and no one has to know the name of the list. Mailman need not be involved in this; the archival, member-sub-unsub, and other value-adds of an MLM aren't useful for this application. Sometimes the tool doesn't work well because it's the wrong tool. If there's some feature of Mailman I'm missing, there is another option for mail rejection: SpamReject.py can be hand-edited to reject mails by comparing headers to a Python regular expression. While it's editing Python source code, it doesn't really require knowledge of Python to do it (only Python's flavor of regular expressions, and a bit of knowledge of the format of a list literal). This sort of rejection sends no response, and triggers no approval mechanism; it just drops the message onto the floor. With a little more Python coding, one could write a parallel to SpamDetect.py that would format up an autoreply, or maybe even reorder the module order in HandlerAPI.py to do Replybot before SpamDetect (I don't know if this will work or not) to have the Replybot module autorespond, and then have SpamDetect or its brother drop the message. From Richard.Eames at flinders.edu.au Wed Nov 29 03:47:01 2000 From: Richard.Eames at flinders.edu.au (Richard Eames) Date: Wed, 29 Nov 2000 13:17:01 +1030 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Bulk subscribe users Message-ID: <4.2.0.58.20001129131337.00b48990@post.flinders.edu.au> I'm evaluating Mailman and I'm quite impressed. However, one criteria is to be able to subscribe a large (2000+) number of users and be able to remove/add users based on information we receive on a regular basis. Is there a way to add/delete or modify subscription by email (as the list owner not as a user wanting to subscribe etc)? In fact are there any admin commands available using email instead of the web interface ? Much Thanks From Dan.Mick at West.Sun.COM Wed Nov 29 04:08:51 2000 From: Dan.Mick at West.Sun.COM (Dan Mick) Date: Tue, 28 Nov 2000 19:08:51 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Mailman-Users] Bulk subscribe users Message-ID: <200011290307.TAA22648@utopia.west.sun.com> > I'm evaluating Mailman and I'm quite impressed. However, one criteria > is to be able to subscribe a large (2000+) number of users and be > able to remove/add users based on information we receive on a regular > basis. Is there a way to add/delete or modify subscription by email > (as the list owner not as a user wanting to subscribe etc)? In fact > are there any admin commands available using email instead of the web > interface ? Not email, but there are command-line interfaces. It wouldn't be very hard to craft up some little script to call them from an email alias. See the stuff in ~mailman/bin. Don't worry if you don't read Python; there are comments and usually a --help to explain what they do. From scottrus at raleigh.ibm.com Wed Nov 29 06:57:33 2000 From: scottrus at raleigh.ibm.com (Scott Russell) Date: Wed, 29 Nov 2000 00:57:33 -0500 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Bulk subscribe users In-Reply-To: <200011290307.TAA22648@utopia.west.sun.com>; from Dan.Mick@West.Sun.COM on Tue, Nov 28, 2000 at 07:08:51PM -0800 References: <200011290307.TAA22648@utopia.west.sun.com> Message-ID: <20001129005733.A14754@raleigh.ibm.com> On Tue, Nov 28, 2000 at 07:08:51PM -0800, Dan Mick wrote: > > basis. Is there a way to add/delete or modify subscription by email > > (as the list owner not as a user wanting to subscribe etc)? In fact > > are there any admin commands available using email instead of the web > > interface ? > > Not email, but there are command-line interfaces. It wouldn't You can do some basic list admin such as adding or deleting users from the list by email but it's not setup for bulk work. Email yourlist-request at yourhost.com and put 'help' in the body of the message. -- Regards, Scott Russell (scottrus at raleigh.ibm.com) Linux Technology Center, System Admin, RHCE. From kent at tensa.com Wed Nov 29 07:00:15 2000 From: kent at tensa.com (Kent Howard) Date: Tue, 28 Nov 2000 22:00:15 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Reason found for non-archiving with mailman 2.0 Final? In-Reply-To: <3.0.5.32.20001129054623.03808d20@127.0.0.1>; from steffen@wflin3.asta.uni-wuppertal.de on Wed, Nov 29, 2000 at 05:46:23AM +0100 References: <3.0.5.32.20001129054623.03808d20@127.0.0.1> Message-ID: <20001128220015.A3180@wakani.home> I'm running 2.0 with QMail and archiving works fine. What do your .qmail files for the list addresses look like? - Kent On Wed, Nov 29, 2000 at 05:46:23AM +0100, Steffen Bardolatzi wrote: +---------- | As I have mentioned Mailman 2.0 does *not* archive *any* message and *even* | doesn?t store it in ../list/mbox - this does *not* seem to be an upgrading | issue for it occurs with a completely new install, too. | The only suitable error message I have posted to this list (if it affects | this but, nevertheless it has to so the Archive.py). | | Our Mailserver is QMail - these messages posted to the pgp-developers and | the one to pgp-users were not shown in the archive at all. | Of course I user 8-Bit and iso-8895-1. | | For I can?t afford a further "uptime" with 0% idle due to bugs in Mailman | Beta6 I urgently had to upgrade to 2.0 Final but can?t to do so because the | archiver doesn?t work. | | Also a privately sent corrected Python-script or how to solve the problem | *really* would help (though it would be better if the list gets the | information, too). | Unfortunately, I?m not that goot at Python. | | In this context: does mailman-pipermail "knows" how to show umlauts in the | html-archive-texts (body plus subject). | | | Thanks in advance, | Steffen +---------- From darron at javelindigital.com Wed Nov 29 07:10:53 2000 From: darron at javelindigital.com (Darron Froese) Date: Tue, 28 Nov 2000 23:10:53 -0700 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Re: broadcast only In-Reply-To: <200011290233.SAA21827@utopia.west.sun.com> Message-ID: on 11/28/00 7:34 PM, Dan Mick at Dan.Mick at West.Sun.COM wrote: >> I would *love* to have an option to click "Announce Only" list and when the >> user gets the welcome message it's *clearly* noted that it's: >> >> 1. Not a list they or others (other than the authorized admins/company/etc.) >> can send messages to. >> 2. Somehow indicates the frequency that they will receive messages >> (customizable to each list). > > Well, I guess I don't see the need for a mailing-list manager for > such things, because it seems like they're nearly-always a > "broadcast-only, you are subscribed because you're someone I've > been given the right to broadcast to" list, for which normal > aliases work *very* well. > > The trick to avoid backposts is to send the message with "To:" > set to yourself, and "Bcc:" the alias; then everyone on the alias > gets the mail, any replies go directly to the "To:" address > and not the list, and no one has to know the name of the list. > > Mailman need not be involved in this; the archival, member-sub-unsub, > and other value-adds of an MLM aren't useful for this application. > > Sometimes the tool doesn't work well because it's the wrong tool. But it *is* the right tool. Neither I nor my clients have time to be manually maintaining alias lists for the various mailing lists that our customers have signed up for. A MLM gives us that administration time back and handles it with less manual intervention. Ever tried to send email out to hundreds of people and have to deal with the people who: a. Entered their email address incorrectly. (I am always amazed at the information that I'm provided with from web based forms - I'm almost convinced that very few users actually know what an email address is.) b. Have moved from one provider to another OR have changed jobs and that account is now deactivated c. Are over their quota at their free webmail provider Even with a fairly small list of 900 users it quickly becomes unmaintainable and a *complete* time waster. Just try and deal with even 50-100 bounces and you can kiss your afternoon/evening goodbye. (NOTE: That's about normal bounce rates for one of the lists that we have that we send out to *very* infrequently - I did it manually a couple of times and will do it manually no more.) A MLM also puts the power back in the hands of the end users as far as their subscription goes. You can't forget to remove a certain user from a certain alias file because it's within their power to change their subscription status. They've signed up because they want the info - there's easy unsub information at the bottom of each email (and in the headers too if they are smart enough to look there). They can also sign up at any time and there's no human to screw up/delay the process. Either way you look at it, you have to track those email addresses *somehow* (database, flat files, shoeboxes, etc.) - why not let a MLM take up the tedious tasks so there's more time in the day? I guess what I'm really wanting with Mailman and the "announce only" type of list (because they are useful) is just the consistency of being able to clearly note in the welcome message that this is NOT a list they can post to. That's really all. I don't want them any more confused than most of them already are. Some sort of method of using a different "templates/subscribeack.txt" for different types of lists would be a solution. And I can't see a way right now where I can have both types of lists on the same mailman installation without being inconsistent in the subscribe message on at least one type of them. Don't get me wrong - I *love* Mailman and think it's a great piece of software - it ties everything together quite nicely, but this is one limitation that I have come up against. If only I knew Python. Maybe I have some incentive to learn it now...damn. -- darron froese new media technologist sutton javelin corporate communications t 403.265.9980 f 403.265.7662 e darron at javelindigital.com From jam at jamux.com Wed Nov 29 07:25:26 2000 From: jam at jamux.com (John A. Martin) Date: Wed, 29 Nov 2000 01:25:26 -0500 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Re: broadcast only In-Reply-To: <200011290233.SAA21827@utopia.west.sun.com> (Dan Mick; Tue, 28 Nov 2000 18:34:44 -0800) Message-ID: <20001129062526.726E84800B@athene.jamux.com> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 >>>>> "DM" == Dan Mick >>>>> "Re: [Mailman-Users] Re: broadcast only" >>>>> Tue, 28 Nov 2000 18:34:44 -0800 (PST) >> I would *love* to have an option to click "Announce Only" list >> and when the user gets the welcome message it's *clearly* noted >> that it's: >> >> 1. Not a list they or others (other than the authorized >> admins/company/etc.) can send messages to. >> >> 2. Somehow indicates the frequency that they will receive >> messages (customizable to each list). Unfortunately it seems that the boilerplate manufactured by mailman tells lies because it disregards the options selected for the list. Perhaps a worthy item for 2.1 might be to tell no lies. DM> Well, I guess I don't see the need for a mailing-list manager DM> for such things, because it seems like they're nearly-always a DM> "broadcast-only, you are subscribed because you're someone DM> I've been given the right to broadcast to" list, for which DM> normal aliases work *very* well. DM> [[ ... ]] DM> Mailman need not be involved in this; the archival, DM> member-sub-unsub, and other value-adds of an MLM aren't useful DM> for this application. I see several announce lists that subscribe and unsubscribe dozens of members daily. The archives of these lists get hundreds of hits daily. Besides having a straight forward way to divert mail away from the list address it seems that some of these lists would benefit from better bounce management. With default settings announce lists that "publish" infrequently or irregularly do not automatically disable or delete their bouncers effectively but instead get "first fresh". Several dozen such lists with overlapping memberships of several hundred to several thousand members results in there always being several score of mails in the MTA's queue attempting deliveries to a couple hundred defunct addresses that never disappear from the various subscription lists. For some reason the owners of such lists do not seem to disable or remove bouncers manually when the automatic process fails. jam -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.0.4 (GNU/Linux) Comment: OpenPGP encrypted mail preferred. See iEYEARECAAYFAjokoUgACgkQUEvv1b/iXy+T3QCfV0k8MbGhvn02B5ldAT3hiO7/ 43kAn0HbsT5PEi9QFQLtCgEp3dg6AVUF =Pp/z -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- From lovelace at wayfarer.org Wed Nov 29 07:55:16 2000 From: lovelace at wayfarer.org (Tanner Lovelace) Date: Wed, 29 Nov 2000 01:55:16 -0500 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Re: broadcast only References: Message-ID: <3A24A854.9090005@wayfarer.org> Darron Froese wrote: > On 11/28/00 6:53 PM, "David" wrote: > >>> 1. Turn off the archiving feature. >>> 2. Make *only* the list administrators be able to post to the list - making >>> it essentially a broadcast only list. >>> >>> These can be done from within the administration interface. >> >> Are you referring to the "privacy" section? or is there somewhere else? > > > You betcha. I don't know of another place other than in the privacy section. > >> As far as I can see, you can only force admin. approval, which means you >> could easily finish up with a lot of bogus posts to reject. Is there any >> way to bounce non-admin. posts completely? I cant see one. > > > Yes that is correct. I *don't* know of a way to reject any non-admin posts > right out of hand. That's the only solution that I can find in the web admin > and from searching the list archives manually. > > It's a bit of a pain in the ass for "broadcast only" lists. > This may not be the most elegant method, but why don't you try disabling the posting alias. You could change the posting alias to be something like listname-private at ... You might need to uncheck the box that says to make sure the list address is in the "To:" or "CC:" headers. You might also want to always post to it using BCC: so that the private address isn't accidentally made public. Using this method, if someone tried to send a message to listname at ... it would automatically bounce because there wouldn't be any alias setup for it. I realize, however, that this is security through obscurity which isn't the best choice, but it would probably work for most casual situations... Tanner Lovelace From marc_news at valinux.com Wed Nov 29 09:44:43 2000 From: marc_news at valinux.com (Marc MERLIN) Date: Wed, 29 Nov 2000 00:44:43 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Migration to another server In-Reply-To: <3A1D4991.C6A4B506@ynternet.org>; from yann.forget@ynternet.org on Thu, Nov 23, 2000 at 05:45:05PM +0100 References: <3A1C16FA.8703A70@ynternet.org> <3A1D4991.C6A4B506@ynternet.org> Message-ID: <20001129004443.C622@moremagic.merlins.org> On Thu, Nov 23, 2000 at 05:45:05PM +0100, Yann Forget wrote: > Hello, > > No answer to my mail since yesterday. > > So I ask it another way : > what procedure to transfer lists from a server > to another one ? Copy the whole mailman tree Run ~mailman/bin/movelist listname on all your lists, it should be enough. > - is it possible to get a list of membres > with their password ? ~mailman/bin/dumpdb ~mailman/lists/listname/config.db Marc -- Microsoft is to operating systems & security .... .... what McDonalds is to gourmet cooking Home page: http://marc.merlins.org/ | Finger marc_f at merlins.org for PGP key From david at kenpro.com.au Wed Nov 29 10:32:47 2000 From: david at kenpro.com.au (David) Date: Wed, 29 Nov 2000 20:32:47 +1100 (EST) Subject: [Mailman-Users] Re: broadcast only In-Reply-To: <3A24A854.9090005@wayfarer.org> Message-ID: excuse my ignorance (no modesty intended!), but if you disable the post alias, would not that mean that even the admin. couldn't post? David On Wed, 29 Nov 2000, Tanner Lovelace wrote: > Darron Froese wrote: > > > On 11/28/00 6:53 PM, "David" wrote: > > > >>> 1. Turn off the archiving feature. > >>> 2. Make *only* the list administrators be able to post to the list - making > >>> it essentially a broadcast only list. > >>> > >>> These can be done from within the administration interface. > >> > >> Are you referring to the "privacy" section? or is there somewhere else? > > > > > > You betcha. I don't know of another place other than in the privacy section. > > > >> As far as I can see, you can only force admin. approval, which means you > >> could easily finish up with a lot of bogus posts to reject. Is there any > >> way to bounce non-admin. posts completely? I cant see one. > > > > > > Yes that is correct. I *don't* know of a way to reject any non-admin posts > > right out of hand. That's the only solution that I can find in the web admin > > and from searching the list archives manually. > > > > It's a bit of a pain in the ass for "broadcast only" lists. > > > This may not be the most elegant method, but why don't you try disabling > the posting > alias. You could change the posting alias to be something like > listname-private at ... > You might need to uncheck the box that says to make sure the list > address is in the "To:" > or "CC:" headers. You might also want to always post to it using BCC: > so that the > private address isn't accidentally made public. > > Using this method, if someone tried to send a message to listname at ... it > would automatically > bounce because there wouldn't be any alias setup for it. I realize, > however, that this is security > through obscurity which isn't the best choice, but it would probably > work for most casual > situations... > > Tanner Lovelace > From David.Osborne at nottingham.ac.uk Wed Nov 29 11:25:41 2000 From: David.Osborne at nottingham.ac.uk (David Osborne) Date: Wed, 29 Nov 2000 10:25:41 +0000 Subject: [Mailman-Users] How may I delete selected messages from archive? In-Reply-To: <3A22C741.628A8F38@west.sun.com>; from Dan.Mick@west.sun.com on Mon, Nov 27, 2000 at 12:42:41PM -0800 References: <200011271623.RAA20483@beatles.cselt.it> <3A22B8C2.F8DED4B7@west.sun.com> <3A22BCF9.D4423F47@nleaudio.com> <3A22BDD9.C8E4753A@west.sun.com> <3A22C341.7E94747D@nleaudio.com> <3A22C741.628A8F38@west.sun.com> Message-ID: <20001129102540.C1176@unix.ccc.nottingham.ac.uk> For Dan's "edit the mbox file", you could look at Phil Male's expire_mail Perl script, which allows message expiry from a traditional-format Unix mailbox by criteria of age, sender, status, subject... http://www.cpan.org/scripts/mailstuff/expire_mail.pl On Mon, Nov 27 2000 at 12:42:41 -0800, Dan Mick wrote > "Bob Puff at NLE" wrote: > > > > I would want something like: > > > > delete messages older than _____ days, or > > delete messages older than date: ______ > > > > Right now it's tough with a message being in 3 different places: its own html file, the mbox file, and an indexed file. I can see the need for gigs of HD space for active lists. A way to prune this is really needed. > > Well, again: > > 1) rm the archives (except for the .mbox file) > 2) edit the mbox file > 3) run bin/arch > > is not foolproof or trivial, but compared to other "log-reduction" > tools, it ain't bad. > > But yes, I agree, a tool to do this would be nice. -- David Osborne david.osborne at nottingham.ac.uk Academic Computing Services phone/voicemail: +44 (0)115 951 3397 The University of Nottingham fax: +44 (0)115 951 3358 Nottingham NG7 2RD, UK http://www.nottingham.ac.uk/~cczdao/ From Dan.Mick at west.sun.com Wed Nov 29 13:21:42 2000 From: Dan.Mick at west.sun.com (Dan Mick) Date: Wed, 29 Nov 2000 04:21:42 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Re: broadcast only References: <20001129062526.726E84800B@athene.jamux.com> Message-ID: <3A24F4D6.E9346017@west.sun.com> I said: > DM> Well, I guess I don't see the need for a mailing-list manager > DM> for such things, because it seems like they're nearly-always a > DM> "broadcast-only, you are subscribed because you're someone > DM> I've been given the right to broadcast to" list, for which > DM> normal aliases work *very* well. If these conditions aren't true (and both Darron and John say emphatically that they are not), then the statement doesn't hold much water. For example, unlike the broadcast aliases at Sun, it's not an issue of "this alias is all the members of a company", but rather a constantly-changing set of people who opt in and opt out of their own accord, then yes, that feature of the MLM would be nice to have. Really, the issue is "there should be ways to simply discard messages rather than shove them into the approval queue", and this is something that many people want for various reasons, either "posting from non-authorized posters" or "rejecting some mail identified as SPAM or otherwise unuseful mail". And it's relatively easy to do such things, as I said, by hacking a little bit of Python table code; it's just not very well wrapped up in a UI yet. Maybe an easy-to-reach middle ground would be a UI to add things to SpamDetect (or something like it); I've been thinking that coding something like that up would be useful to me. It wouldn't be very hard to add in a "and send a message back like this before dropping the incoming mail", too. Would that be a sufficient answer to the "announce" needs? Imagine the capability of "check sender address against RE, and if match/not match, send back a message and drop the incoming"; that should be usable, right? From sid at mindless.co.uk Wed Nov 29 13:51:05 2000 From: sid at mindless.co.uk (Siraj 'Sid' Rakhada) Date: Wed, 29 Nov 2000 12:51:05 -0000 (GMT) Subject: [Mailman-Users] newlist or other cgi solution? Message-ID: <3100.213.166.3.25.975502265.squirrel@www.mindless.co.uk> Hi, I'm asking a possible FAQ, and that is, is there anyone out there who has made a CGI to let users add mail lists themselves via a web page, or other non shell means? Obviously the add list page will/should be password protected, so only certain users can create lists. I personally don't mind creating lists via the command line, but the people that are going to be creating lists in my organisation are Windows admins, who don't know (or want to know) how to use unix or any commands they may need to run to set up lists. It's an argument against Exchange Server I guess. Oh. We're using sendmail and mailman, if the version matters then we can upgrade as appropriate. I know this has been discussed before, but the discussion seems to have ended pretty abruptly without any real resolve (either being "nope, no way at all - securely" or "well, I did this, it's as secure as it can get, here you go"). I hope from that comment you realise that I would like a vaguely secure solution ;-) Hope someone can help. No worries if not. Regards, Sid From Nigel.Metheringham at VData.co.uk Wed Nov 29 14:20:15 2000 From: Nigel.Metheringham at VData.co.uk (Nigel Metheringham) Date: Wed, 29 Nov 2000 13:20:15 +0000 Subject: [Mailman-Users] newlist or other cgi solution? In-Reply-To: Message from "Siraj 'Sid' Rakhada" of "Wed, 29 Nov 2000 12:51:05 GMT." <3100.213.166.3.25.975502265.squirrel@www.mindless.co.uk> Message-ID: When it comes down to it, all that needs doing to have a cgi newlist (and a rmlist?) is for someone to code it - there isn't a lot of deep magic needed. A bigger problem is the authentication etc for it - currently you need mailman uid on the server to make a list. I guess the equivalent is knowing the main mailman password - but this all ties in with other questions about a user database with real rights etc. Finally, you need a way to tell the MTA about the list. With exim *nothing* else is needed since it all happens by magic (assuming people are using the exim mailman config). With sendmail you need to edit an aliases file and rebuild it, which might need more privilege that I would be willing to give a CGI. Has anyone come up with a magic recipe for sendmail? [I know postfix can be done, think qmail hasn't as yet] Nigel. -- [ - Opinions expressed are personal and may not be shared by VData - ] [ Nigel Metheringham Nigel.Metheringham at VData.co.uk ] [ Phone: +44 1423 850000 Fax +44 1423 858866 ] From mdnhsfjk at themail.com Wed Nov 29 14:58:27 2000 From: mdnhsfjk at themail.com (mdnhsfjk at themail.com) Date: Wed, 29 Nov 2000 05:58:27 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Mailman-Users] Software Development from Russia! ($15-$20 per hour) Message-ID: <200011291358.FAA04171@vinbo.com> Dear IT Manager: Please consider deploying our highly skilled off-shore programmers on your e-commerce and software development projects. They develop software for: ALL WINDOWS AND UNIX PLATFORMS databases, networks, and languages, plus Perl, Cold Fusion, WAP, XML, Java, ASP, MS Access, SQL, CGI, Shopping Carts, and the Internet. Typical rates are $15 to $20 per hour. They are fast, professional, inexpensive, cheap, and available immediately. Please call me, or you may send me e-mail at: mdnhsfjk at themail.com Thanks! Paul Smirnov +39 3480612212 PS. You are already removed! From Nigel.Metheringham at VData.co.uk Wed Nov 29 15:07:40 2000 From: Nigel.Metheringham at VData.co.uk (Nigel Metheringham) Date: Wed, 29 Nov 2000 14:07:40 +0000 Subject: [Mailman-Users] List spam Message-ID: Is this list running open, or are people subscribing and then spamming? If the latter, is it looking as though someone has written a Mailman list sub/spam bot, and what can we do to combat this? Nigel. -- [ - Opinions expressed are personal and may not be shared by VData - ] [ Nigel Metheringham Nigel.Metheringham at VData.co.uk ] [ Phone: +44 1423 850000 Fax +44 1423 858866 ] From jam at jamux.com Wed Nov 29 16:02:03 2000 From: jam at jamux.com (John A. Martin) Date: Wed, 29 Nov 2000 10:02:03 -0500 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Re: broadcast only In-Reply-To: <3A24F4D6.E9346017@west.sun.com> (Dan Mick; Wed, 29 Nov 2000 04:21:42 -0800) Message-ID: <20001129150204.03D804800B@athene.jamux.com> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 >>>>> "DM" == Dan Mick >>>>> "Re: [Mailman-Users] Re: broadcast only" >>>>> Wed, 29 Nov 2000 04:21:42 -0800 DM> Really, the issue is "there should be ways to simply discard DM> messages rather than shove them into the approval queue", and DM> this is something that many people want for various reasons, DM> either "posting from non-authorized posters" or "rejecting DM> some mail identified as SPAM or otherwise unuseful mail". And DM> it's relatively easy to do such things, as I said, by hacking DM> a little bit of Python table code; it's just not very well DM> wrapped up in a UI yet. Another way to frame the issue is to consider implementing the recommendation rfc2369 for an announcements list, 3.4. List-Post The List-Post field describes the method for posting to the list. This is typically the address of the list, but MAY be a moderator, or potentially some other form of submission. For the special case of a list that does not allow posting (e.g., an announcements list), the List-Post field may contain the special value "NO". then applying the principle of least surprise and enforcing "does not allow posting" by bouncing attempted posts while allowing the list-owner and his friends to post through the 'posters' option (in Privacy Options). 'no-posting' would want of course he a list-owner option to be set or reset without bothering the mailman site administrator. Entangling it with other options would be to the detriment of the folks who operate such lists, IMHO. -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.0.4 (GNU/Linux) Comment: OpenPGP encrypted mail preferred. See iEYEARECAAYFAjolGioACgkQUEvv1b/iXy8bHgCfc0gyHEIYGAihR7Em/0rMhLw2 gPgAnjqEDUZCpkAtBlzdEz2mFm/7WUom =v2W3 -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- From TeddyNae at aol.com Wed Nov 29 16:55:06 2000 From: TeddyNae at aol.com (TeddyNae at aol.com) Date: Wed, 29 Nov 2000 10:55:06 EST Subject: [Mailman-Users] Drivers Message-ID: <6c.5508e79.275680da@aol.com> i just recently reformated and put Win 2000 on my comp. and have PaperPort 3100b and am looking for drivers to install it.........can you help me? From dan at ssc.com Wed Nov 29 17:15:49 2000 From: dan at ssc.com (Dan Wilder) Date: Wed, 29 Nov 2000 08:15:49 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] List spam In-Reply-To: ; from Nigel.Metheringham@VData.co.uk on Wed, Nov 29, 2000 at 02:07:40PM +0000 References: Message-ID: <20001129081549.B11160@ssc.com> On Wed, Nov 29, 2000 at 02:07:40PM +0000, Nigel Metheringham wrote: > Is this list running open, or are people subscribing and then spamming? > > If the latter, is it looking as though someone has written a Mailman > list sub/spam bot, and what can we do to combat this? > > Nigel. We've had great luck using procmail filters to pre-screen list submissions. -- ----------------------------------------------------------------- Dan Wilder Technical Manager & Correspondent SSC, Inc. P.O. Box 55549 Phone: 206-782-7733 x123 Seattle, WA 98155-0549 URL http://www.linuxjournal.com/ ----------------------------------------------------------------- From lovelace at wayfarer.org Wed Nov 29 17:24:51 2000 From: lovelace at wayfarer.org (Tanner Lovelace) Date: Wed, 29 Nov 2000 11:24:51 -0500 Subject: [Mailman-Users] newlist or other cgi solution? References: Message-ID: <3A252DD3.90000@wayfarer.org> Nigel Metheringham wrote: > Finally, you need a way to tell the MTA about the list. With exim > *nothing* else is needed since it all happens by magic (assuming people > are using the exim mailman config). With sendmail you need to edit an > aliases file and rebuild it, which might need more privilege that I > would be willing to give a CGI. Has anyone come up with a magic > recipe for sendmail? [I know postfix can be done, think qmail hasn't > as yet] > > Nigel. Actually, using the qmail-to-mailman.py (I think that's the name) script, and a virtual domain like lists.domain.com, qmail already automatically picks up all the aliases for a new list. Tanner Lovelace From haroldp at sierraweb.com Wed Nov 29 17:41:14 2000 From: haroldp at sierraweb.com (Harold Paulson) Date: Wed, 29 Nov 2000 08:41:14 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Re: broadcast only In-Reply-To: <200011290233.SAA21827@utopia.west.sun.com> References: <200011290233.SAA21827@utopia.west.sun.com> Message-ID: >Well, I guess I don't see the need for a mailing-list manager for >such things, because it seems like they're nearly-always a >"broadcast-only, you are subscribed because you're someone I've >been given the right to broadcast to" list, for which normal >aliases work *very* well. Very Large Broadcast Lists are becoming more and more common. Every web site I manage wants to add a "Sign up to stay updated about our widgets" form to their site, and their users genuinely want this sort of information. A simple alias does *not* work very well when you have 80k subscribers. Mailman excels at managing bounces and letting subscribers manage their own subscription. I have to chime in as someone who would like to see Mailman become more broadcast list friendly. - H Harold Paulson Sierra Web Design haroldp at sierraweb.com http://www.sierraweb.com VOICE: 775.833.9500 FAX: 810.314.1517 From darron at javelindigital.com Wed Nov 29 17:53:52 2000 From: darron at javelindigital.com (Darron Froese) Date: Wed, 29 Nov 2000 09:53:52 -0700 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Re: broadcast only In-Reply-To: <20001129150204.03D804800B@athene.jamux.com> Message-ID: On 11/29/00 8:02 AM, "John A. Martin" wrote: > Another way to frame the issue is to consider implementing the > recommendation rfc2369 for an announcements list, > > 3.4. List-Post > > The List-Post field describes the method for posting to the > list. This is typically the address of the list, but MAY > be a moderator, or potentially some other form of > submission. For the special case of a list that does not > allow posting (e.g., an announcements list), the List-Post > field may contain the special value "NO". > > then applying the principle of least surprise and enforcing "does not > allow posting" by bouncing attempted posts while allowing the > list-owner and his friends to post through the 'posters' option (in > Privacy Options). > > 'no-posting' would want of course he a list-owner option to be set or > reset without bothering the mailman site administrator. Entangling > it with other options would be to the detriment of the folks who > operate such lists, IMHO. That sounds like it would work. In recap for Announce only lists: 1. List-Post: NO in the headers of the email. 2. Automatic Bounce of posts except from those already set in the Poster option with a message stating "This is an announce only list." 3. A way to use a different "$home_prefix/templates/subscribeack.txt" so that the "NO POSTING" could be clearly indicated when the user signed up. This would help with the consistency problems I noted earlier. (The listinfo page can already be changed manually without any problems.) The only problem I can see with this would be this: Having implicitly allowed certain email addresses to post to the list *without* approval could be problematic if someone decides to send an email as that user. Simply looking over the posted items on the lists would give you the email addresses that you could set up in your mail reader and you may be able to post as that user unrestricted and unhindered. What *may* be better could be a new parameter like "Authorized Submitters" which would hold all the email addresses that were allowed to submit items to the list. Those items that they sent would still have to be authorized by a list admin BUT this could help with: 1. Spoofed email from those addresses. 2. Posting requests from people not on the list would be automatically rejected if they're not on the list of "Authorized Submitters". Make sense? Am I being too paranoid? -- darron froese new media technologist sutton javelin corporate communications t 403.265.9980 f 403.265.7662 e darron at javelindigital.com From dariel at korrnet.org Wed Nov 29 18:24:07 2000 From: dariel at korrnet.org (Dariel Mayer) Date: Wed, 29 Nov 2000 12:24:07 -0500 Subject: [Mailman-Users] mailman v1.1 Message-ID: <3A253B92.857F7566@korrnet.org> Is there a way to customize the default copy in the uniform footers? Thanks. Dariel Mayer From jfreeman at connix.com Wed Nov 29 18:26:51 2000 From: jfreeman at connix.com (Joshua S. Freeman) Date: Wed, 29 Nov 2000 12:26:51 -0500 (EST) Subject: [Mailman-Users] creating new list In-Reply-To: <3A253B92.857F7566@korrnet.org> Message-ID: I've got everything installed, working.. test list, etc.. how do I now create new lists? same way I created the test list? J. -+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+- Joshua S. Freeman | preferred email: jfreeman at connix.com pgp public key: finger jfreeman at connix.com http://www.threeofus.com -+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+- From lisa.mercilliott at jhuapl.edu Wed Nov 29 18:35:52 2000 From: lisa.mercilliott at jhuapl.edu (Lisa Mercilliott) Date: Wed, 29 Nov 2000 12:35:52 -0500 Subject: [Mailman-Users] User emails Message-ID: <3A253E77.949DAD49@jhuapl.edu> Could you please fix it so I will stop getting the below emails from the sender. I have received four of these so far today. Thanks Lisa Mercilliott unsubscribe shel at netshel.net _______________________________________________ Redhat-watch-list mailing list To unsubscribe, visit: https://listman.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/redhat-watch-list From satyap at satya.virtualave.net Wed Nov 29 18:56:04 2000 From: satyap at satya.virtualave.net (Satya) Date: Wed, 29 Nov 2000 23:26:04 +0530 (IST) Subject: [Mailman-Users] creating new list In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Nov 29, 2000 at 12:26, Joshua S. Freeman wrote: >I've got everything installed, working.. test list, etc.. how do I now >create new lists? > >same way I created the test list? Yes. -- Satya. US-bound grad students! For pre-apps, see Never test for an error you don't know how to handle. From satyap at satya.virtualave.net Wed Nov 29 18:55:38 2000 From: satyap at satya.virtualave.net (Satya) Date: Wed, 29 Nov 2000 23:25:38 +0530 (IST) Subject: [Mailman-Users] mailman v1.1 In-Reply-To: <3A253B92.857F7566@korrnet.org> Message-ID: On Nov 29, 2000 at 12:24, Dariel Mayer wrote: >Is there a way to customize the default copy in the uniform footers? http://mailmanhost/mailmanpath/admin.cgi and then: * [3]Regular-member (non-digest) Options * [4]Digest-member Options At least on Mailman 2.0beta2. -- Satya. US-bound grad students! For pre-apps, see He's not dead, Jim, he's just metabolically challenged. From rogerk at QueerNet.ORG Wed Nov 29 19:30:53 2000 From: rogerk at QueerNet.ORG (Roger B.A. Klorese) Date: Wed, 29 Nov 2000 10:30:53 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Mailman-Users] Questions about scanners In-Reply-To: <200011280139.RAA13072@utopia.west.sun.com> Message-ID: On Mon, 27 Nov 2000, Dan Mick wrote: > > P.S.: Just before sending this message I cracked it!!! > > > > Take a look at http://list.scansoft.com. It contains exactly the good > > intended link i predicted... > > > > Who's gonna take action? > > I would, but I don't think that's it. That's just a link to > www.list.org; it isn't a "mailto:mailman-users at python.org". > I don't see how you could get from that to the emails > we're seeing (without a whole lot of clueless click-through, > which we'll never stop). It's definitely "clueless clickthru" and it can be reduced pretty easily in two ways. The first is for Scansoft to move the "ScanSoft uses MailMan software to manage these lists" line to the bottom of the page. It's irrelevant to the typical user of the page, and confusing to most of them as well -- it's the first link on the page that's not to subscribe or unsubscribe, so they assume they should click it to post a question. Then they see the "ask us" link on the left on . The page needs to make it much clearer who should subscribe to what -- it's a low-end consumer product, for heaven's sake. The second is for Scansoft to fix their online help form so people don't have to chase the mailing list link in the first place. The link from to doesn't work. -- ROGER B.A. KLORESE rogerk at QueerNet.ORG PO Box 14309 San Francisco, CA 94114 "There is only one real blasphemy -- the refusal of joy!" -- Paul Rudnick From chuqui at plaidworks.com Wed Nov 29 19:46:34 2000 From: chuqui at plaidworks.com (Chuq Von Rospach) Date: Wed, 29 Nov 2000 10:46:34 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Re: broadcast only In-Reply-To: References: <200011290233.SAA21827@utopia.west.sun.com> Message-ID: At 8:41 AM -0800 11/29/00, Harold Paulson wrote: >>"broadcast-only, you are subscribed because you're someone I've >>been given the right to broadcast to" list, for which normal >>aliases work *very* well. > >Very Large Broadcast Lists are becoming more and more common. Every >web site I manage wants to add a "Sign up to stay updated about our >widgets" form to their site, and their users genuinely want this >sort of information. A simple alias does *not* work very well when >you have 80k subscribers. general aliases don't work well for any open population, because that implies there's a person attached making administrative changes. Your admin gets eaten by hamsters very quickly in that situation. Another aspect of this is -- if you're doing marketing/broadcast lists, you want very much to avoid even the appearance of spam. That means, among other things, quick and consistent feedback to users on admin requests, links that work, no black holes for users to fall into. One of the best "I am not spam" messages you can send a user is to have an unsubscribe URL that exists and gives immediate feedback. Having them send to a person to update an alias will feel like spam to many users, and if that admin gets busy, backed up or doesn't manage his confirmations well, it can generate lots of uncomfortable feelings. those feelings will wander the word of mouth subnet, and you're asking for problems. Using some kind of MLM is really important with this, both from an administrative overhead cost and from a user experience view -- it adds a level of profesionalism and comfort that the user may not even recognize, unless it isn't there. > I have to chime in as someone who would like to see Mailman become >more broadcast list friendly. This is basically the issue of mailman getting better at scaling to large lists, which is a good goal. At some point, however, with really large systems like this there's a point where custom systems are going to be necessary, and no matter what you do for mailman, it probably isn't what you want. I run a pair of mailman installations as well as a pair of custom-built MLMs, and with the really large stuff, you eventually hit a point where you need the ability to customize the system to the users instead of asking the users to adapt to the system, and no off the shelf system has that flexibility. -- Chuq Von Rospach - Plaidworks Consulting (mailto:chuqui at plaidworks.com) Apple Mail List Gnome (mailto:chuq at apple.com) The vet said it was behavioral, but I prefer to think of it as genetic. It cuts down on the liability -- Get Fuzzy From dubois at labalao.com Wed Nov 29 19:57:40 2000 From: dubois at labalao.com (dubois at labalao.com) Date: Wed, 29 Nov 2000 19:57:40 +0100 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Lettre d'information Labalao : Vos Bons Plans, Bénéficiez de l'offre Wap Labalao ! Découvrez le Carnet d'adresses Labalao, Votre prochain "chat" et le sondage ! Message-ID: <200011291857.TAA29131@labalao-mysql.heb.fr.colt.net> La lettre d?information LABALAO ?Mercredi 29 Novembre 2000 *********************************************************************************** D?couvrez les bons plans Plein Air de Labalao ! MONTAGNE : Festival du film de montagne et d'aventure d'Autrans http://www.labalao.fr/v2/?page=archive2&idn=957 RAQUETTES : Randonn?es en raquettes ? partir d'Isola 2000 http://www.labalao.fr/v2/?page=archive2&idn=953 CHAR ? 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Pour acc?der au service Wap de Labalao et consulter plus de 30 000 adresses de loisirs de plein air en France (gites, office de tourisme, clubs, associations) sur votre t?l?phone portable, Labalao vous propose d'acc?der ? une offre magique ! Offrez vous, gr?ce au Labalao Club, le nouveau portable Wap Alcatel OT 304 pour seulement 390 FF au lieu de 1500 FF ! Pour conna?tre toutes les conditions de l?offre : http://www.labalao.fr/v2/?page=offrewap2 *********************************************************************************** D?couvrez le Carnet d?adresses Labalao. Labalao est fier de vous annoncer l?ouverture de son Carnet d?adresses. Cette nouvelle rubrique vous propose un acc?s libre ? plus de 20 000 adresses d?h?bergements (g?tes, camping, chambres du terroir) et ? 10 000 contacts consacr?s ? vos activit?s pr?f?r?es : randonn?e p?destre et ?questre, v?lo, bateau, p?che, plong?e. Le Carnet d?adresses Labalao, c?est en plus les coordonn?es des 4000 Offices de tourismes pour faciliter l?organisation de votre s?jour en France et une liste compl?te des principaux ?v?nements d?di?s aux loisirs Outdoor. Pour consulter les h?bergements : http://www.labalao.fr/popup/hebergements.html Pour consulter les activit?s : http://www.labalao.fr/popup/activites.html Pour consulter les contacts : http://www.labalao.fr/popup/contacts.html *********************************************************************************** Vos ? chats ? sur Labalao et le sondage ! Participez ? nos ? chats ? pour dialoguer en direct avec nos experts et les membres de la Communaut? Labalao ainsi qu?? votre sondage ? Chat ? consacr? aux horaires et aux jours de vos rendez-vous hebdomadaires. Pour participer au sondage : http://www.labalao.fr/popup/chat.html Jeudi 30 Novembre de 19h ? 20h retrouvez Damien Babinet notre expert Bateau et son invit? Laurent Gillard, directeur de Sport Away Voile, pour un ? chat ? exclusif consacr? aux derni?res nouveaut?s du Salon Nautique. Pour consulter nos programmes : http://www.labalao.fr/v2/index.php3?page=chat *********************************************************************************** A tout de suite pour organiser votre temps libre ? l?air libre sur http:// www.labalao.com ! Vanessa Dubois dubois at labalao.com Pour vous d?sabonner de cette newsletter cliquez ci-dessous : To unsubscribe click below : http://www.labalao.fr/v2/index.php3?page=gest_email_confefface&email=mailman-users at python.org&date=2000-11-02 11:13:02 LABALAO Du Temps Libre ? l?Air Libre !? -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mail.python.org/pipermail/mailman-users/attachments/20001129/48e09afc/attachment.html From claw at kanga.nu Wed Nov 29 19:56:32 2000 From: claw at kanga.nu (J C Lawrence) Date: Wed, 29 Nov 2000 10:56:32 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Re: broadcast only In-Reply-To: Message from David of "Wed, 29 Nov 2000 20:32:47 EST." References: Message-ID: <1851.975524192@kanga.nu> On Wed, 29 Nov 2000 20:32:47 +1100 (EST) David wrote: > excuse my ignorance (no modesty intended!), but if you disable the > post alias, would not that mean that even the admin. couldn't > post? There are a couple obvious solutions: -- Disable the post alias and invoke the mailman wrapper/post manually on a pre-canned message. -- Change the alias for the posting address to something else (which you don't the publich), and then BCC the messages you wish posted to that "secret" address (pay attention to Delivered-To and other revealing MTA-added headers). -- J C Lawrence claw at kanga.nu ---------(*) : http://www.kanga.nu/~claw/ --=| A man is as sane as he is dangerous to his environment |=-- From claw at kanga.nu Wed Nov 29 20:05:32 2000 From: claw at kanga.nu (J C Lawrence) Date: Wed, 29 Nov 2000 11:05:32 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] List spam In-Reply-To: Message from Dan Wilder of "Wed, 29 Nov 2000 08:15:49 PST." <20001129081549.B11160@ssc.com> References: <20001129081549.B11160@ssc.com> Message-ID: <3016.975524732@kanga.nu> On Wed, 29 Nov 2000 08:15:49 -0800 Dan Wilder wrote: > We've had great luck using procmail filters to pre-screen list > submissions. Care to comment/detail further? -- J C Lawrence claw at kanga.nu ---------(*) : http://www.kanga.nu/~claw/ --=| A man is as sane as he is dangerous to his environment |=-- From claw at kanga.nu Wed Nov 29 20:03:34 2000 From: claw at kanga.nu (J C Lawrence) Date: Wed, 29 Nov 2000 11:03:34 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] List spam In-Reply-To: Message from Nigel Metheringham of "Wed, 29 Nov 2000 14:07:40 GMT." References: Message-ID: <2739.975524614@kanga.nu> On Wed, 29 Nov 2000 14:07:40 +0000 Nigel Metheringham wrote: > Is this list running open, or are people subscribing and then > spamming? If the latter, is it looking as though someone has > written a Mailman list sub/spam bot, and what can we do to combat > this? I have fairly strong evidence that someome (or several someones) have already written a generic list server spam bot. Its a pretty simple task when you get down to it: -- Obtain email address. -- Spam list server with subscribe message (all the common formats) -- Look for inbound message which talks about "confirm", has what looks like an MD auth string, or which contains an URL which points at the list's domain. -- Bounce said message back to From:/Reply-To and run wget on URL. -- Send spam message. 30 minutes for a half-way competant script kiddie? -- J C Lawrence claw at kanga.nu ---------(*) : http://www.kanga.nu/~claw/ --=| A man is as sane as he is dangerous to his environment |=-- From claw at kanga.nu Wed Nov 29 20:12:42 2000 From: claw at kanga.nu (J C Lawrence) Date: Wed, 29 Nov 2000 11:12:42 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] FAQ? Directing bounces to -owner/-admin In-Reply-To: Message from jamie rishaw of "Wed, 29 Nov 2000 11:31:28 EST." <20001129113128.A29072@arpa.com> References: <20001129113128.A29072@arpa.com> Message-ID: <4294.975525162@kanga.nu> On Wed, 29 Nov 2000 11:31:28 -0500 jamie rishaw wrote: > Perhaps this is an FAQ, I dont know, but recently I've realized > that when users post to lists, mailer-daemons send bounces of bad > listmember addresses to the poster and not to the -owner/-admin > address. If this is true it means that your local MTA is configured improperly (possible), OR that other remote MTAs are improperly bouncing messages back to some other address than that in the envelope (it happens). > I cannot find any configuration options (other than anonymous, > which is not what I want to do) to do this correctly. This is not a Mailman thing in that Mailman auto-does the Right Thing. If the Right Thing isn't happening, its an MTA problem at some level. Have a look at the headers, and in particular the envelope on your list postings. -- J C Lawrence claw at kanga.nu ---------(*) : http://www.kanga.nu/~claw/ --=| A man is as sane as he is dangerous to his environment |=-- From chuqui at plaidworks.com Wed Nov 29 20:17:00 2000 From: chuqui at plaidworks.com (Chuq Von Rospach) Date: Wed, 29 Nov 2000 11:17:00 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] List spam In-Reply-To: <3016.975524732@kanga.nu> References: <20001129081549.B11160@ssc.com> <3016.975524732@kanga.nu> Message-ID: > > We've had great luck using procmail filters to pre-screen list >> submissions. > >Care to comment/detail further? I used to do that, too. I think it's much preferable to add this functionality to Mailman (and I hope to propose a design soon) -- Chuq Von Rospach - Plaidworks Consulting (mailto:chuqui at plaidworks.com) Apple Mail List Gnome (mailto:chuq at apple.com) The vet said it was behavioral, but I prefer to think of it as genetic. It cuts down on the liability -- Get Fuzzy From haroldp at sierraweb.com Wed Nov 29 20:30:12 2000 From: haroldp at sierraweb.com (Harold Paulson) Date: Wed, 29 Nov 2000 11:30:12 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Re: broadcast only In-Reply-To: References: <200011290233.SAA21827@utopia.west.sun.com> Message-ID: >This is basically the issue of mailman getting better at scaling to >large lists That is certainly an issue, but when I say I'd like mailman to be more "broadcast list friendly", I'm referring to something a little different. I'm thinking of things like ease of creating new broadcast lists. I'm using Dan Mick's patch to allow each list to have its own templates (did this make it into 2.0 final?) so at least they are possible, but they generally require a lot of custom coding to be useful. Of course there are a mess of preferences that need to be flipped over, Aliases added, etc... In other words, I can't just turn on a new broadcast list for a client/user and let them play with it. I create the list, spend an hour doing the initial setup for them, and then an hour or two explaining how it works, and an hour over the next couple months answering the odd questions that pop up. I know you have personally mentioned wanting to move mailman to a user-centric architecture, instead of one's email address being the basic unique unit. That would move things closer to being able to integrate the MLM into an external database[1] Optional passwords. This has been expounded on enough, I think. I'd like to see a web form for sending an email to a list. HTML templates. Mailman's web interface looks like it was written by programmers :) It would be cool to have a button that would spill out the HTML required for a simple subscribe or unsubscribe form. Having whined for features.... I don't do Python (not yet at least) but I've done my share of web programming. I'd be willing to code any of the web features I've mentioned if someone else was willing to do the real work... - H [1] This is sort of a pet peeve of mine. There are lots of great web apps out there, and they all implement their own authentication and data storage systems, so you either have to rewrite stuff yourself, or your users have to log in to use each and every tool in the toolbox. Maybe it's just that the web is still a fairly immature technology... Harold Paulson Sierra Web Design haroldp at sierraweb.com http://www.sierraweb.com VOICE: 775.833.9500 FAX: 810.314.1517 From greg at abbas.org Wed Nov 29 20:26:59 2000 From: greg at abbas.org (Greg Abbas) Date: Wed, 29 Nov 2000 11:26:59 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] NameError traceback Message-ID: <3A255883.D8BBD560@abbas.org> I'm running 2.0rc3 and it's been working well, but then today I encountered the following: Traceback (most recent call last): File "/usr/local/mailman/cron/qrunner", line 85, in ? from Mailman import MailList File "/usr/local/mailman/Mailman/MailList.py", line 43, in ? from Mailman.MailCommandHandler import MailCommandHandler File "/usr/local/mailman/Mailman/MailCommandHandler.py", line 77, in ? quotecre = re.compile(r'["\'`](?P.*)["\'`]') File "/usr/local/lib/python2.0/sre.py", line 62, in compile return _compile(pattern, flags) File "/usr/local/lib/python2.0/sre.py", line 100, in _compile p = sre_compile.compile(pattern, flags) File "/usr/local/lib/python2.0/sre_compile.py", line 359, in compile p = sre_parse.parse(p, flags) File "/usr/local/lib/python2.0/sre_parse.py", line 586, in parse p = _parse_sub(source, pattern, 0) File "/usr/local/lib/python2.0/sre_parse.py", line 294, in _parse_sub items.append(_parse(source, state)) File "/usr/local/lib/python2.0/sre_parse.py", line 554, in _parse subpattern.append((SUBPATTERN, (group, p))) NameError: There is no variable named 'SUBPATTERN' I noticed that 2.0 is released, so I'm going to upgrade to that. I went to sourceforge to figure out whether this bug has been reported & fixed, but I couldn't find any "search" functionality in the sourceforge bug tracker. What's the best thing to do when I find a problem like this? Please cc: me on reply. Thanks, -g. p.s. BTW thanks for a great program, Mailman rocks. Long live Python. -- Greg Abbas greg at abbas.org http://www.abbas.org From bob at nleaudio.com Wed Nov 29 20:57:54 2000 From: bob at nleaudio.com (Bob Puff@NLE) Date: Wed, 29 Nov 2000 14:57:54 -0500 Subject: [Mailman-Users] newlist or other cgi solution? References: <3A252DD3.90000@wayfarer.org> Message-ID: <3A255FC2.785F590A@nleaudio.com> > Finally, you need a way to tell the MTA about the list. With exim > *nothing* else is needed since it all happens by magic (assuming people > are using the exim mailman config). With sendmail you need to edit an > aliases file and rebuild it, which might need more privilege that I > would be willing to give a CGI. Has anyone come up with a magic > recipe for sendmail? [I know postfix can be done, think qmail hasn't > as yet] What's the one for Postfix? I made my own script. Bob From darron at javelindigital.com Wed Nov 29 21:00:05 2000 From: darron at javelindigital.com (Darron Froese) Date: Wed, 29 Nov 2000 13:00:05 -0700 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Re: broadcast only In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On 11/29/00 12:30 PM, "Harold Paulson" wrote: > I'm using Dan Mick's patch to allow each list to have its own > templates (did this make it into 2.0 final?) Can someone point me to this patch? -- darron froese new media technologist sutton javelin corporate communications t 403.265.9980 f 403.265.7662 e darron at javelindigital.com From Nigel.Metheringham at VData.co.uk Wed Nov 29 22:26:24 2000 From: Nigel.Metheringham at VData.co.uk (Nigel Metheringham) Date: Wed, 29 Nov 2000 21:26:24 +0000 Subject: [Mailman-Users] SOurceforge time machine Message-ID: download.sourceforge.net seems to have regressed and has nothing later than the 2.0 beta releases. I'm raising a bug with sourceforge, but currently downloads should be done from elsewhere. Nigel. -- [ - Opinions expressed are personal and may not be shared by VData - ] [ Nigel Metheringham Nigel.Metheringham at VData.co.uk ] [ Phone: +44 1423 850000 Fax +44 1423 858866 ] From tjensen at edudex.com Wed Nov 29 22:40:32 2000 From: tjensen at edudex.com (Torjus Jensen) Date: Wed, 29 Nov 2000 16:40:32 -0500 Subject: [Mailman-Users] admin password problem Message-ID: We just installed the latest mailman 2.0 on a Red Hat 6.2 system. Everything works fine, except logging into the admin pages. We get "Authentication Failure" messages regardless of whether we use s given list password or the site admin password. We've checked permissions (check_perms), and all possible log files, but there are no logged error messages. I saw from the November archives that others had experienced the problem, but did not find a solution posted. Does anyone know how to fix this? ------------------------- Torjus Jensen http://www.edudex.com -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mail.python.org/pipermail/mailman-users/attachments/20001129/6c9ecd8d/attachment.htm From Dan.Mick at west.sun.com Wed Nov 29 22:37:23 2000 From: Dan.Mick at west.sun.com (Dan Mick) Date: Wed, 29 Nov 2000 13:37:23 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Questions about scanners References: Message-ID: <3A257713.2E8AC676@west.sun.com> Oh my God. There's a "mail to mailman-users at python.org" link on www.list.org. I hadn't noticed that until just now. Yeah, that's surely the problem. I think www.list.org should point to the list subscription page, not a mailto: link. "Roger B.A. Klorese" wrote: > > On Mon, 27 Nov 2000, Dan Mick wrote: > > > P.S.: Just before sending this message I cracked it!!! > > > > > > Take a look at http://list.scansoft.com. It contains exactly the good > > > intended link i predicted... > > > > > > Who's gonna take action? > > > > I would, but I don't think that's it. That's just a link to > > www.list.org; it isn't a "mailto:mailman-users at python.org". > > I don't see how you could get from that to the emails > > we're seeing (without a whole lot of clueless click-through, > > which we'll never stop). > > It's definitely "clueless clickthru" and it can be reduced pretty easily > in two ways. > > The first is for Scansoft to move the "ScanSoft uses MailMan software to > manage these lists" line to the bottom of the page. It's irrelevant to > the typical user of the page, and confusing to most of them as well -- > it's the first link on the page that's not to subscribe or unsubscribe, so > they assume they should click it to post a question. Then they see the > "ask us" link on the left on . The page needs to > make it much clearer who should subscribe to what -- it's a low-end > consumer product, for heaven's sake. > > The second is for Scansoft to fix their online help form so people don't > have to chase the mailing list link in the first place. The link from > to > > doesn't work. > -- > ROGER B.A. KLORESE rogerk at QueerNet.ORG > PO Box 14309 San Francisco, CA 94114 > "There is only one real blasphemy -- the refusal of joy!" -- Paul Rudnick From Dan.Mick at west.sun.com Wed Nov 29 22:39:23 2000 From: Dan.Mick at west.sun.com (Dan Mick) Date: Wed, 29 Nov 2000 13:39:23 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Re: broadcast only References: <200011290233.SAA21827@utopia.west.sun.com> Message-ID: <3A25778B.C8440E62@west.sun.com> Chuq Von Rospach wrote: > general aliases don't work well for any open population, because that > implies there's a person attached making administrative changes. Your > admin gets eaten by hamsters very quickly in that situation. Yup. As I said, "broadcast-only", to me, implies "static user list". I see now that's not everyone's usage. Chuq, I hope you comment on the suggested design; your perspective is probably valuable. From Dan.Mick at west.sun.com Wed Nov 29 22:45:00 2000 From: Dan.Mick at west.sun.com (Dan Mick) Date: Wed, 29 Nov 2000 13:45:00 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Re: broadcast only References: Message-ID: <3A2578DC.DAC5E235@west.sun.com> Darron Froese wrote: > > On 11/29/00 12:30 PM, "Harold Paulson" wrote: > > > I'm using Dan Mick's patch to allow each list to have its own > > templates (did this make it into 2.0 final?) > > Can someone point me to this patch? It's on Sourceforge, in the Mailman Patches area. I haven't tried to reapply it in a long time, so if anyone runs into problems with 2.0final, I'd be happy to update it. I could probably go proactively do that, in fact, if I remember. Harold, does it work with 2.0final? Basically, it just makes all the places that look up HTML templates look first in the list-specific directory, as opposed to only some of them doing that, so that you can copy any HTML template to that list-specific directory by hand and edit it to be list-specific. No, it's not a part of 2.0final, because Barry wasn't really happy with the way I sorta brute-forced it into passing the list data directory, and I kind of agree, it's a bit of a kluge, but I was trying to minimize the diffs rather than design it more elegantly. From dgc at uchicago.edu Wed Nov 29 23:55:33 2000 From: dgc at uchicago.edu (David Champion) Date: Wed, 29 Nov 2000 16:55:33 -0600 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Batch list admin functions? Message-ID: <20001129165533.S16749@smack.uchicago.edu> I have a list on my server whose admin has neglected her duties for the past 14 months, and who now longer exists. The admin queue has some uncertain, but large, number of messages in it. I'd like to reject them all with the same explanation, and the web interface will want me to type/paste it in to all the little boxes, which I don't really want to do. Can someone suggest the correct code to handle this with withlist? I don't know enough Python to make it up myself. Other approaches to the problem are welcome, too. Thanks. I'm using Mailman 1.0. Yes, I know what's current. :) On a tangent: does it not make sense to store queued admin requests in separate files, so that they can be handled arbitrarily and without instantial Python code? Something like a .../lists/listname/adminq/%05d.txt file containing the message, I'm thinking. -- -D. dgc at uchicago.edu NSIT University of Chicago From chuqui at plaidworks.com Thu Nov 30 00:11:37 2000 From: chuqui at plaidworks.com (Chuq Von Rospach) Date: Wed, 29 Nov 2000 15:11:37 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Re: broadcast only In-Reply-To: <3A25778B.C8440E62@west.sun.com> References: <200011290233.SAA21827@utopia.west.sun.com> <3A25778B.C8440E62@west.sun.com> Message-ID: At 1:39 PM -0800 11/29/00, Dan Mick wrote: >Yup. As I said, "broadcast-only", to me, implies "static user list". >I see now that's not everyone's usage. you know, one of these days, we need to sit down and define some standard terminology -- because we all point at the elephant and call it different things, and confuse ourselves. That'd make a great FAQ item at some point, if we can't do it on a wider scale. (he says, wearily realing what he's suggesting...) >Chuq, I hope you comment on the suggested design; your perspective is >probably valuable. I hope to be very involved in helping put 2.1 and later together, boht design and coding. I also hope that when I propose design suggestions people are ruthless in ripping them apart, because that's how we all learn and end up with good designs... (I do not believe in ego-free programming, I do believe in "don't take it personally" programming.. grin) -- Chuq Von Rospach - Plaidworks Consulting (mailto:chuqui at plaidworks.com) Apple Mail List Gnome (mailto:chuq at apple.com) The vet said it was behavioral, but I prefer to think of it as genetic. It cuts down on the liability -- Get Fuzzy From chuqui at plaidworks.com Thu Nov 30 00:08:48 2000 From: chuqui at plaidworks.com (Chuq Von Rospach) Date: Wed, 29 Nov 2000 15:08:48 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Batch list admin functions? In-Reply-To: <20001129165533.S16749@smack.uchicago.edu> References: <20001129165533.S16749@smack.uchicago.edu> Message-ID: At 4:55 PM -0600 11/29/00, David Champion wrote: >I'd like to reject >them all with the same explanation, and the web interface will want me >to type/paste it in to all the little boxes, which I don't really want >to do. I know this doesn't help your problem, but it's something I noticed -- mailman attaches the default admin message at the time the message comes in, not at the time the admin looks at it. It means you basically can't update those messages, which is not much of a problem, until you have to. In general, I think it's a good idea to design stuff so that it doesn't assign values until it has to, just in case. this is a great example why. >On a tangent: does it not make sense to store queued admin requests in >separate files, so that they can be handled arbitrarily and without >instantial Python code? Something like a >.../lists/listname/adminq/%05d.txt file containing the message, I'm >thinking. I'm not sure separate files are the answer, but cleaner handling of the admin queue is. At the worst, you can use python to read the requests.db file and manually rewrite all fo the messages, then use the admin page to reject them. That might require reading the mailman code for the requests.db data structure, but it's doable. -- Chuq Von Rospach - Plaidworks Consulting (mailto:chuqui at plaidworks.com) Apple Mail List Gnome (mailto:chuq at apple.com) The vet said it was behavioral, but I prefer to think of it as genetic. It cuts down on the liability -- Get Fuzzy From dgc at uchicago.edu Thu Nov 30 00:48:12 2000 From: dgc at uchicago.edu (David Champion) Date: Wed, 29 Nov 2000 17:48:12 -0600 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Re: Batch list admin functions? In-Reply-To: ; from chuqui@plaidworks.com on Wed, Nov 29, 2000 at 03:08:48PM -0800 References: <20001129165533.S16749@smack.uchicago.edu> Message-ID: <20001129174812.T16749@smack.uchicago.edu> On 2000.11.29, in , "Chuq Von Rospach" wrote: > > I know this doesn't help your problem, but it's something I noticed > -- mailman attaches the default admin message at the time the message > comes in, not at the time the admin looks at it. It means you > basically can't update those messages, which is not much of a > problem, until you have to. > > In general, I think it's a good idea to design stuff so that it > doesn't assign values until it has to, just in case. this is a great > example why. Agreed - especially since the URL embedded in the rejection text is subject to change. It sounds as though what gets sent out in the rejection letter can actually be invalid when it's received. > I'm not sure separate files are the answer, but cleaner handling of > the admin queue is. Separate files or no, this seems like another instance where the data is dependent on Python itself, and not for any apprent (to me) reason. But it's especially awkward here, since the data in question did not come from within Python - it comes from the MTA/MDA. > At the worst, you can use python to read the requests.db file and > manually rewrite all fo the messages, then use the admin page to > reject them. That might require reading the mailman code for the > requests.db data structure, but it's doable. I can do that, but it will take me a big chunk o' time to turn what I glean from reading into code that parses and works. :) Much easier to read than to write, as always. -- -D. dgc at uchicago.edu NSIT University of Chicago From chuqui at plaidworks.com Thu Nov 30 00:52:54 2000 From: chuqui at plaidworks.com (Chuq Von Rospach) Date: Wed, 29 Nov 2000 15:52:54 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Re: Batch list admin functions? In-Reply-To: <20001129174812.T16749@smack.uchicago.edu> References: <20001129165533.S16749@smack.uchicago.edu> <20001129174812.T16749@smack.uchicago.edu> Message-ID: At 5:48 PM -0600 11/29/00, David Champion wrote: >Agreed - especially since the URL embedded in the rejection text is >subject to change. It sounds as though what gets sent out in the >rejection letter can actually be invalid when it's received. well, I think there's an assumption being made that admins process queues on a regular basis. If that's true, it's no significant problem. But these error conditions are such fun, even in real life. >Separate files or no, this seems like another instance where the data >is dependent on Python itself, and not for any apprent (to me) reason. it's because these data files are basically disk-resident versions of internal data structures. It makes perfect sense from a python point of view, similar to perl using TIE to store structures on disk. >I can do that, but it will take me a big chunk o' time to turn what I >glean from reading into code that parses and works. :) Much easier to >read than to write, as always. yeah, I know (wince). but it's better than nothing, and I don't know a better way. What I might do, frankly, depending on just how many there are, is the old past and click tango on the web site... It's grunt work, but it could well be faster than doing it "right". -- Chuq Von Rospach - Plaidworks Consulting (mailto:chuqui at plaidworks.com) Apple Mail List Gnome (mailto:chuq at apple.com) The vet said it was behavioral, but I prefer to think of it as genetic. It cuts down on the liability -- Get Fuzzy From curator at fertileground.org Thu Nov 30 00:18:45 2000 From: curator at fertileground.org (curator) Date: Wed, 29 Nov 2000 15:18:45 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] list not working Message-ID: <3A258ED5.457956D6@fertileground.org> Hi, I'm the administrator of a list called foodshed at fertileground.org. It is hosted by pair networks and my administrative link is http://www.pairlist.net/mailman/admin/foodshed and the password is "mallwart" - feel free to look at my settings. So far, I'm the only one of our 55 members who is getting the messages. There are 3 other co-administrators who are also not getting messages from the list. What am I doing wrong? Thanks for your help, Gail -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: curator.vcf Type: text/x-vcard Size: 335 bytes Desc: Card for curator Url : http://mail.python.org/pipermail/mailman-users/attachments/20001129/c722973e/attachment.vcf From joel at knocean.com Thu Nov 30 04:22:46 2000 From: joel at knocean.com (Joel Shellman) Date: Wed, 29 Nov 2000 19:22:46 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Custom templates for each list Message-ID: <001d01c05a7c$cf5d32d0$13551518@cx403972a> How can I set up custom templates (meaning the text files in the ~mailman/templates directory) for each mailing list? Thanks, -joel shellman http://www.knocean.com/ From Dan.Mick at West.Sun.COM Thu Nov 30 04:31:42 2000 From: Dan.Mick at West.Sun.COM (Dan Mick) Date: Wed, 29 Nov 2000 19:31:42 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Mailman-Users] Custom templates for each list Message-ID: <200011300330.TAA27187@utopia.west.sun.com> > From: "Joel Shellman" > To: > Subject: [Mailman-Users] Custom templates for each list > X-Beenthere: mailman-users at python.org > X-Mailman-Version: 2.0 > List-Post: > List-Id: Mailman mailing list management users > List-Archive: > Date: Wed, 29 Nov 2000 19:22:46 -0800 > > How can I set up custom templates (meaning the text files in the > ~mailman/templates directory) for each mailing list? You can't; that's what we were just talking about today. I had a patch that worked for 2.0beta5; I'm updating it to 2.0final. It's not a very clean solution, but it works for me and Harold Paulson. I'll post a note when I've got the patch reposted. From karper at expert.cc.purdue.edu Thu Nov 30 04:52:50 2000 From: karper at expert.cc.purdue.edu (Erin Karper) Date: Wed, 29 Nov 2000 22:52:50 -0500 (EST) Subject: [Mailman-Users] authentication failed problems with mailman 2.0rc1 Message-ID: I've checked the FAQ, the troubleshooting, and the rest of the site, and I haven't found anything that addresses this problem, so I'm writing to you in the hopes that you can help me figure it out. If it is covered somewhere, please feel free to send me there. I am running Mailman 2.0rc1 on a machine (linnell.english.purdue.edu) running Red Hat Linux release 6.0 Kernel 2.2.14, Python 2.0, Sendmail, and Apache. When I attempt to access the administrative interface for several lists (http://linnell.english.purdue.edu/mailman/admin/pwadmins, as well as pw-mentor, owl-bwtutors, pita-l, and labstaff), I get "authentication failed" errors, even though I am entering the correct password. I have not made any changes to the list or to mailman that could have caused this problem, and the password was working before; I just suddenly get "authentication failed" errors when trying to get to the administrative interface for some of the lists. However, I can get into the administrative interface for other lists, so it is not a problem that is affecting the entire program. I also can't think of anything that the lists have in common; the error has happened to lists that don't have a single message, and lists that get plenty. The lists themselves still function fine; users can subscribe, unsubscribe, send mail, and read the archives. It's just that I can't get in to the administrative interface to do things like approve posts or change settings. I have my browser set to accept cookies. I have tried this on a number of different browsers on a number of different platforms to make sure that it was not a browser error. I can't find any entries in my syslog, the httpd error logs, or the mail logs to indicate where the problem could be. Can you help? Let me know what other information you need, and I'd be glad to supply it. Thank you. Erin Karper karper at expert.cc.purdue.edu From SpecialKV at aol.com Thu Nov 30 05:43:26 2000 From: SpecialKV at aol.com (SpecialKV at aol.com) Date: Wed, 29 Nov 2000 23:43:26 EST Subject: [Mailman-Users] scanner help Message-ID: <3e.435b5c9.275734ee@aol.com> I have just purchased a visioneer 6200 usb scanner and am having problems installing it. When I first installed it, it worked perfectely. The next day, I had problems with my keyboard and had to get a new one. Since then, my scanner will not perform. I have tried to uninstall the paper port program and reinstall, but my computer will still not recognize the scanner. What do I do next? -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mail.python.org/pipermail/mailman-users/attachments/20001129/183d95bc/attachment.htm From joel at knocean.com Thu Nov 30 05:46:11 2000 From: joel at knocean.com (Joel Shellman) Date: Wed, 29 Nov 2000 20:46:11 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Custom templates for each list References: <200011300330.TAA27187@utopia.west.sun.com> Message-ID: <006501c05a88$76cf19b0$13551518@cx403972a> > > How can I set up custom templates (meaning the text files in the > > ~mailman/templates directory) for each mailing list? > > You can't; that's what we were just talking about today. I had > a patch that worked for 2.0beta5; I'm updating it to 2.0final. > It's not a very clean solution, but it works for me and Harold > Paulson. I'll post a note when I've got the patch reposted. Thank you very much for the quick reply. How soon do you think you'll have it ready for 2.0final? Also, does it include web based modifying of those templates, or just by hand on the server? I have a client that needs this functionality, so wanted to get it set up ASAP for them. I'm wondering if it will take you some time to get it upgraded, perhaps I could use your patch with 2.0beta5 until you have it updated for final? Thanks, Joel Shellman From boris at openair.com Thu Nov 30 06:08:49 2000 From: boris at openair.com (Boris Boruchovich) Date: Thu, 30 Nov 2000 00:08:49 -0500 Subject: [Mailman-Users] qfiles In-Reply-To: <39F89414.CDA1BBA0@west.sun.com> Message-ID: Hi, I manage a list with about 160,000 members. I am using Mailman version 2.0 and I seem to be experiencing a problem when I post anything to this list. The number of files in qfiles directory keeps growing and not getting any smaller. Here is an excerpt from the smtp log: "Nov 29 23:28:55 2000 (457) All recipients refused: (111, 'Connection refused') Nov 29 23:30:14 2000 (457) smtp for 150686 recips, completed in 1412.545 seconds" Here is an excerpt from the qrunner log: "Nov 29 23:51:01 2000 (2960) Could not acquire qrunner lock Nov 29 23:52:01 2000 (2987) Could not acquire qrunner lock Nov 29 23:53:02 2000 (3025) Could not acquire qrunner lock Nov 29 23:54:01 2000 (3083) Could not acquire qrunner lock" Here is an excerpt from the error log: "Nov 29 23:29:48 2000 (4735) thelist db file was corrupt, using fallback: /home/mailman/lists/thelist/config.db.last Nov 29 23:29:48 2000 (4725) thelist db file was corrupt, using fallback: /home/mailman/lists/thelist/config.db.last Nov 29 23:29:51 2000 (4720) thelist db file was corrupt, using fallback: /home/mailman/lists/thelist/config.db.last Nov 29 23:30:05 2000 (4736) thelist db file was corrupt, using fallback: /home/mailman/lists/thelist/config.db.last" When I run check_db on "thelist" list the result state that it is fine. I am not sure of what is happening, can anyone point me in the right direction? Thanks, Boris From Dan.Mick at West.Sun.COM Thu Nov 30 06:22:06 2000 From: Dan.Mick at West.Sun.COM (Dan Mick) Date: Wed, 29 Nov 2000 21:22:06 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Mailman-Users] qfiles Message-ID: <200011300520.VAA29750@utopia.west.sun.com> > Here is an excerpt from the smtp log: > "Nov 29 23:28:55 2000 (457) All recipients refused: (111, 'Connection > refused') Looks to me like your MTA isn't running. Can you send mail outside of mailman from that machine? Do your MTA logs say anything? > Here is an excerpt from the qrunner log: > "Nov 29 23:51:01 2000 (2960) Could not acquire qrunner lock > Nov 29 23:52:01 2000 (2987) Could not acquire qrunner lock > Nov 29 23:53:02 2000 (3025) Could not acquire qrunner lock > Nov 29 23:54:01 2000 (3083) Could not acquire qrunner lock" That looks like there are stale locks as well, probably resulting from the failure above > > Here is an excerpt from the error log: > "Nov 29 23:29:48 2000 (4735) thelist db file was corrupt, using fallback: > /home/mailman/lists/thelist/config.db.last > Nov 29 23:29:48 2000 (4725) thelist db file was corrupt, using fallback: > /home/mailman/lists/thelist/config.db.last > Nov 29 23:29:51 2000 (4720) thelist db file was corrupt, using fallback: > /home/mailman/lists/thelist/config.db.last > Nov 29 23:30:05 2000 (4736) thelist db file was corrupt, using fallback: > /home/mailman/lists/thelist/config.db.last" > > When I run check_db on "thelist" list the result state that it is fine. I > am not sure of what is happening, can anyone point me in the right > direction? Those "corrupt" errors were from some time ago (about the same time the mail delivery failed). Was your machine very sick then (reboot, maybe?) From kent at tensa.com Thu Nov 30 08:38:05 2000 From: kent at tensa.com (Kent Howard) Date: Wed, 29 Nov 2000 23:38:05 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] authentication failed problems with mailman 2.0rc1 In-Reply-To: ; from karper@expert.cc.purdue.edu on Wed, Nov 29, 2000 at 10:52:50PM -0500 References: Message-ID: <20001129233805.B2896@wakani.home> Does the mmsitepass password not work either? On Wed, Nov 29, 2000 at 10:52:50PM -0500, Erin Karper wrote: +---------- | When I attempt to access the administrative interface for several lists | (http://linnell.english.purdue.edu/mailman/admin/pwadmins, as well as | pw-mentor, owl-bwtutors, pita-l, and labstaff), I get "authentication | failed" errors, even though I am entering the correct password. I have not | made any changes to the list or to mailman that could have caused this | problem, and the password was working before; I just suddenly get | "authentication failed" errors when trying to get to the | administrative interface for some of the lists. However, I can get into | the administrative interface for other lists, so it is not a problem that | is affecting the entire program. +---------- From paulr at tcd.ie Thu Nov 30 14:31:53 2000 From: paulr at tcd.ie (paul reilly) Date: Thu, 30 Nov 2000 13:31:53 +0000 (GMT) Subject: [Mailman-Users] searchable archives? Message-ID: Hi, I've just installed Mailman. I want to add a search capability to the archives. Is there a "known good" way of doing this, or do I just install a generic search engine to do the job? Thanks Paul From ruthishkumar at hotmail.com Thu Nov 30 14:33:00 2000 From: ruthishkumar at hotmail.com (Ruthish Kumar) Date: Thu, 30 Nov 2000 13:33:00 -0000 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Information Message-ID: Dear Support, I have installed mailman on Sun Solaris 2.6, could u help me on the following issues : - How do i attach HTML page in mailman ( i want to send it has a Header) - How many users and members does mailman support Awaiting ur earliest reply. Regards Ruthish _____________________________________________________________________________________ Get more from the Web. FREE MSN Explorer download : http://explorer.msn.com From richarde at eskom.co.za Thu Nov 30 14:39:18 2000 From: richarde at eskom.co.za (Richard Ellerbrock) Date: Thu, 30 Nov 2000 15:39:18 +0200 Subject: [Mailman-Users] searchable archives? Message-ID: A generic search engine is the way to go. I use HTDig very successfully here: http://www.htdig.org -- Richard Ellerbrock richarde at eskom.co.za >>> paul reilly 2000/11/30 03:31:53 >>> Hi, I've just installed Mailman. I want to add a search capability to the archives. Is there a "known good" way of doing this, or do I just install a generic search engine to do the job? Thanks Paul ------------------------------------------------------ Mailman-Users maillist - Mailman-Users at python.org http://www.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users From moshez at zadka.site.co.il Thu Nov 30 22:58:56 2000 From: moshez at zadka.site.co.il (Moshe Zadka) Date: Thu, 30 Nov 2000 23:58:56 +0200 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Information In-Reply-To: Message from "Ruthish Kumar" of "Thu, 30 Nov 2000 13:33:00 GMT." References: Message-ID: <20001130215856.9FCB4A9BB@darjeeling.zadka.site.co.il> > - How many users and members does mailman support Mailman has been known to supports 100s of users. A complete answer would require knowledge of your OS, CPU, hard drive and MTA. Of course, it would also depends on the number of messages/day. All in all, it's likely you'll have to test yourself, since no one (likely) has a platform just like yours. -- Moshe Zadka This is a signature anti-virus. Please stop the spread of signature viruses! From tjensen at edudex.com Thu Nov 30 15:16:36 2000 From: tjensen at edudex.com (Torjus Jensen) Date: Thu, 30 Nov 2000 09:16:36 -0500 Subject: [Mailman-Users] authentication failed problems with mailman 2 .0rc1 Message-ID: BTW - this is the exact problem we're having as well, and the mmsitepass password does not work either. In our case, the problem occurs for all lists. -----Original Message----- From: Kent Howard [mailto:kent at tensa.com] Sent: Thursday, November 30, 2000 2:38 AM To: Erin Karper Cc: mailman-users at python.org Subject: Re: [Mailman-Users] authentication failed problems with mailman 2.0rc1 Does the mmsitepass password not work either? On Wed, Nov 29, 2000 at 10:52:50PM -0500, Erin Karper wrote: +---------- | When I attempt to access the administrative interface for several lists | (http://linnell.english.purdue.edu/mailman/admin/pwadmins, as well as | pw-mentor, owl-bwtutors, pita-l, and labstaff), I get "authentication | failed" errors, even though I am entering the correct password. I have not | made any changes to the list or to mailman that could have caused this | problem, and the password was working before; I just suddenly get | "authentication failed" errors when trying to get to the | administrative interface for some of the lists. However, I can get into | the administrative interface for other lists, so it is not a problem that | is affecting the entire program. +---------- ------------------------------------------------------ Mailman-Users maillist - Mailman-Users at python.org http://www.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users From karper at expert.cc.purdue.edu Thu Nov 30 17:01:24 2000 From: karper at expert.cc.purdue.edu (Erin Karper) Date: Thu, 30 Nov 2000 11:01:24 -0500 (EST) Subject: [Mailman-Users] authentication failed problems with mailman 2.0rc1 In-Reply-To: <20001129233805.B2896@wakani.home> Message-ID: I just changed the mmsitepass and that seems to be working to let me into those lists. Thank you! Erin From claw at kanga.nu Thu Nov 30 17:47:46 2000 From: claw at kanga.nu (J C Lawrence) Date: Thu, 30 Nov 2000 08:47:46 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Information In-Reply-To: Message from Moshe Zadka of "Thu, 30 Nov 2000 23:58:56 +0200." <20001130215856.9FCB4A9BB@darjeeling.zadka.site.co.il> References: <20001130215856.9FCB4A9BB@darjeeling.zadka.site.co.il> Message-ID: <20894.975602866@kanga.nu> On Thu, 30 Nov 2000 23:58:56 +0200 Moshe Zadka wrote: >> - How many users and members does mailman support > Mailman has been known to supports 100s of users. The largest list I've heard of being successfully run under Mailman has ~1.5Million subscribers. -- J C Lawrence claw at kanga.nu ---------(*) : http://www.kanga.nu/~claw/ --=| A man is as sane as he is dangerous to his environment |=-- From gossamer at tertius.net.au Thu Nov 30 18:00:10 2000 From: gossamer at tertius.net.au (Bek Oberin) Date: Fri, 1 Dec 2000 04:00:10 +1100 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Re: Information In-Reply-To: <20894.975602866@kanga.nu>; from claw@kanga.nu on Thu, Nov 30, 2000 at 08:47:46AM -0800 References: <20001130215856.9FCB4A9BB@darjeeling.zadka.site.co.il> <20894.975602866@kanga.nu> Message-ID: <20001201040010.P23067@tertius.net.au> J C Lawrence wrote: > The largest list I've heard of being successfully run under Mailman > has ~1.5Million subscribers. I'm intensely curious as to what on earth they were DOING with that many subscribers ... bekj -- : --Hacker-Neophile-Eclectic-Geek-Grrl-Queer-Disabled-Boychick-- : gossamer at tertius.net.au http://www.tertius.net.au/~gossamer/ From tjensen at edudex.com Thu Nov 30 18:27:58 2000 From: tjensen at edudex.com (Torjus Jensen) Date: Thu, 30 Nov 2000 12:27:58 -0500 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Password Authentication Problem (2) Message-ID: In an earlier e-mail we had asked for help with a problem where the site admin password would not authenticate. SInce we did not get any response, we began looking into the code. We have determined that the problem is either that writing to the adm.pw file fails, or reading from it fails: >From Utils.py: def SetSiteAdminPassword(pw): fp = open_ex(mm_cfg.SITE_PW_FILE, 'w', perms=0640) fp.write(Crypt.crypt(pw, GetRandomSeed())) fp.close() def CheckSiteAdminPassword(pw1): try: f = open(mm_cfg.SITE_PW_FILE) pw2 = f.read() f.close() return Crypt.crypt(pw1, pw2[:2]) == pw2 # There probably is no site admin password if there was an exception except IOError: return 0 If we substitute def CheckSiteAdminPassword with: #def CheckSiteAdminPassword(pw1): #return 1 we are able to log in (obviously). We have checked permissions on the adm.pw, and noted that it is indeed written to when calling mmsitepass. Our guess is therefore that the problem is either in reading from the file, or in the Crypt.crypt function. Since we are not at all familiar with Python, we would appreciate some help. Thanks. -------------------------- Torjus Jensen http://www.edudex.com -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mail.python.org/pipermail/mailman-users/attachments/20001130/a6604323/attachment.html From claw at kanga.nu Thu Nov 30 18:29:05 2000 From: claw at kanga.nu (J C Lawrence) Date: Thu, 30 Nov 2000 09:29:05 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Re: Information In-Reply-To: Message from Bek Oberin of "Fri, 01 Dec 2000 04:00:10 +1100." <20001201040010.P23067@tertius.net.au> References: <20001130215856.9FCB4A9BB@darjeeling.zadka.site.co.il> <20894.975602866@kanga.nu> <20001201040010.P23067@tertius.net.au> Message-ID: <26375.975605345@kanga.nu> On Fri, 1 Dec 2000 04:00:10 +1100 Bek Oberin wrote: > J C Lawrence wrote: >> The largest list I've heard of being successfully run under >> Mailman has ~1.5Million subscribers. > I'm intensely curious as to what on earth they were DOING with > that many subscribers ... I believe it was a daily joke list. -- J C Lawrence claw at kanga.nu ---------(*) : http://www.kanga.nu/~claw/ --=| A man is as sane as he is dangerous to his environment |=-- From h0444sji at student.hu-berlin.de Thu Nov 30 19:09:31 2000 From: h0444sji at student.hu-berlin.de (KatelA) Date: Thu, 30 Nov 2000 19:09:31 +0100 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Hallo Deutschland ist da wer? Message-ID: <3A2697DB.A470CE8B@student.hu-berlin.de> Ntschuldigung, hier soll irgend wo ne Liste sein? From Dan.Mick at west.sun.com Thu Nov 30 21:18:56 2000 From: Dan.Mick at west.sun.com (Dan Mick) Date: Thu, 30 Nov 2000 12:18:56 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Password Authentication Problem (2) References: Message-ID: <3A26B630.F68BC194@west.sun.com> A technique: If you, at the top of the module you'd like to debug, put from Mailman.Logging.Syslog import syslog and then, where you'd like to see what's going on, put syslog('filename', 'string with printf formats like this: %s', stringvar) or something similar, you'll get a file in ~mailman/logs named 'filename' that has your printfs in it. Perhaps you can figure out which part of the process seems to be going wrong. > Torjus Jensen wrote: > > In an earlier e-mail we had asked for help with a problem where the site admin password would not authenticate. SInce > we did not get any response, we began looking into the code. > > We have determined that the problem is either that writing to the adm.pw file fails, or reading from it fails: > > > From Utils.py: > > > def SetSiteAdminPassword(pw): > fp = open_ex(mm_cfg.SITE_PW_FILE, 'w', perms=0640) > fp.write(Crypt.crypt(pw, GetRandomSeed())) > fp.close() > > def CheckSiteAdminPassword(pw1): > try: > f = open(mm_cfg.SITE_PW_FILE) > pw2 = f.read() > f.close() > return Crypt.crypt(pw1, pw2[:2]) == pw2 > # There probably is no site admin password if there was an exception > except IOError: > return 0 > > If we substitute def CheckSiteAdminPassword with: > > #def CheckSiteAdminPassword(pw1): > #return 1 > > we are able to log in (obviously). > > We have checked permissions on the adm.pw, and noted that it is indeed written to when calling mmsitepass. Our guess > is therefore that the problem is either in reading from the file, or in the Crypt.crypt function. > > Since we are not at all familiar with Python, we would appreciate some help. > > Thanks. > > -------------------------- > Torjus Jensen > http://www.edudex.com From Dan.Mick at west.sun.com Thu Nov 30 21:29:04 2000 From: Dan.Mick at west.sun.com (Dan Mick) Date: Thu, 30 Nov 2000 12:29:04 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Password Authentication Problem (2) References: <3A26B630.F68BC194@west.sun.com> Message-ID: <3A26B890.9C130CC0@west.sun.com> Dan Mick wrote: > > A technique: > > If you, at the top of the module you'd like to debug, put > > from Mailman.Logging.Syslog import syslog > > and then, where you'd like to see what's going on, put > > syslog('filename', 'string with printf formats like this: %s', stringvar) Sorry; I mean syslog('filename', 'string with printf formats like this: %s' % stringvar) (note the last "comma" is wrong; it should be "%" Do multiple values by making the value list a tuple: syslog('otherfilename', 'two strings: s1: %s s2; %s' % (stringvar1, stringvar2)) > or something similar, you'll get a file in ~mailman/logs named 'filename' that > has your printfs in it. Perhaps you can figure out which part of the process > seems to be going wrong. > > > Torjus Jensen wrote: > > > > In an earlier e-mail we had asked for help with a problem where the site admin password would not authenticate. SInce > > we did not get any response, we began looking into the code. > > > > We have determined that the problem is either that writing to the adm.pw file fails, or reading from it fails: > > > > > > From Utils.py: > > > > > > def SetSiteAdminPassword(pw): > > fp = open_ex(mm_cfg.SITE_PW_FILE, 'w', perms=0640) > > fp.write(Crypt.crypt(pw, GetRandomSeed())) > > fp.close() > > > > def CheckSiteAdminPassword(pw1): > > try: > > f = open(mm_cfg.SITE_PW_FILE) > > pw2 = f.read() > > f.close() > > return Crypt.crypt(pw1, pw2[:2]) == pw2 > > # There probably is no site admin password if there was an exception > > except IOError: > > return 0 > > > > If we substitute def CheckSiteAdminPassword with: > > > > #def CheckSiteAdminPassword(pw1): > > #return 1 > > > > we are able to log in (obviously). > > > > We have checked permissions on the adm.pw, and noted that it is indeed written to when calling mmsitepass. Our guess > > is therefore that the problem is either in reading from the file, or in the Crypt.crypt function. > > > > Since we are not at all familiar with Python, we would appreciate some help. > > > > Thanks. > > > > -------------------------- > > Torjus Jensen > > http://www.edudex.com > > ------------------------------------------------------ > Mailman-Users maillist - Mailman-Users at python.org > http://www.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users From minter at lunenburg.org Thu Nov 30 21:33:04 2000 From: minter at lunenburg.org (H. Wade Minter) Date: Thu, 30 Nov 2000 15:33:04 -0500 (EST) Subject: [Mailman-Users] full raw archive Message-ID: How do you enable the link to "download the full raw archive"? I'm running 2.0beta5. Thanks, Wade From Dan.Mick at west.sun.com Thu Nov 30 21:43:26 2000 From: Dan.Mick at west.sun.com (Dan Mick) Date: Thu, 30 Nov 2000 12:43:26 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] full raw archive References: Message-ID: <3A26BBEE.B16C9811@west.sun.com> "H. Wade Minter" wrote: > > How do you enable the link to "download the full raw archive"? I'm > running 2.0beta5. I'm not aware that it can be disabled; it looks hard-coded to me. It seems to have been added at 2.0rc1. 2.0 is final; it's time to upgrade. There have been five releases since yours. From hernanr at forest.ula.ve Thu Nov 30 22:44:46 2000 From: hernanr at forest.ula.ve (Jose Hernan Ramirez Ramirez) Date: Thu, 30 Nov 2000 17:44:46 -0400 (VET) Subject: [Mailman-Users] Error Mailman 2.0 Message-ID: Hello./ When i send an message to test list i recived tihs error The original message was received at Thu, 30 Nov 2000 17:11:49 +0400 (GMT) from veillon [150.185.156.1] ----- The following addresses had permanent fatal errors ----- "|/usr/local/mailman-2.0/mail/wrapper-mailman post test-mm" (reason: 1) (expanded from: ) ----- Transcript of session follows ----- Traceback (innermost last): File "/usr/local/mailman-2.0//scripts/post", line 94, in ? main() File "/usr/local/mailman-2.0//scripts/post", line 73, in main mlist = MailList.MailList(listname, lock=0) File "/usr/local/mailman-2.0/Mailman/MailList.py", line 79, in __init__ self.Load() File "/usr/local/mailman-2.0/Mailman/MailList.py", line 868, in __load fp = open(dbfile) IOError: [Errno 13] Permission denied: '/usr/local/mailman-2.0/lists/test-mm/config.db' 554 5.3.0 "|/usr/local/mailman-2.0/mail/wrapper-mailman post test-mm"... unknown mailer error 1 And de crontab genera: Your "cron" job on veillon /usr/local/bin/python -S /usr/local/mailman-2.0//cron/qrunner produced the following output: Traceback (innermost last): File "/usr/local/mailman-2.0//cron/qrunner", line 271, in ? lock.lock(timeout=0.5) File "/usr/local/mailman-2.0/Mailman/LockFile.py", line 219, in lock self.__write() File "/usr/local/mailman-2.0/Mailman/LockFile.py", line 350, in __write fp = open(self.__tmpfname, 'w') IOError: [Errno 13] Permission denied: '/usr/local/mailman-2.0/locks/qrunner.lock.veillon.13287' Thank you.. ___________________________________________________________ /\ J. Hernan Ramirez R. \ \_| Forestal - RedULA - Admire Tel: +58 74 401560 | | ________________________________________________________|_ \_/_________________________________________________________/ From david at kenpro.com.au Thu Nov 30 22:48:49 2000 From: david at kenpro.com.au (David) Date: Fri, 1 Dec 2000 08:48:49 +1100 (EST) Subject: [Mailman-Users] Pride before a fall... Message-ID: Having been very happy about my initial install, I decided it was time to upgrade to v.2 final, using all the same directories etc as for my beta install. What I got is below. Why does configure not like my python version. Can anyone help? David. [mailman at fast mailman-2.0]$ pwd /usr/local/mailman-2.0 [mailman at fast mailman-2.0]$ ./configure ./configure: ./config.log: Permission denied ./configure: 5: Bad file descriptor ./configure: confdefs.h: Permission denied creating cache ./config.cache ./configure: ./config.cache: Permission denied checking for --with-python... ./configure: 5: Bad file descriptor no checking for python... ./configure: 5: Bad file descriptor /usr/bin/python checking Python interpreter... ./configure: 5: Bad file descriptor /usr/bin/python checking Python version... ./configure: 5: Bad file descriptor ./configure: conftest.py: Permission denied /usr/bin/python: can't open file 'conftest.py' cat: conftest.out: No such file or directory configure: error: ***** /usr/bin/python is too old (or broken) ***** Python 1.5.2 or newer is required [mailman at fast mailman-2.0]$ python Python 1.5.2 (#1, Feb 1 2000, 16:32:16) [GCC egcs-2.91.66 19990314/Linux (egcs- on linux-i386 From peewee at scc.mi.org Thu Nov 30 22:52:00 2000 From: peewee at scc.mi.org (Jason Wright) Date: Thu, 30 Nov 2000 13:52:00 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Pride before a fall... In-Reply-To: ; from David on Fri, Dec 01, 2000 at 08:48:49AM +1100 References: Message-ID: <20001130135200.C25258@scc.mi.org> On Fri, Dec 01, 2000 at 08:48:49AM +1100, David spewed forth: > Having been very happy about my initial install, I decided it was time to > upgrade to v.2 final, using all the same directories etc as for my beta > install. What I got is below. Why does configure not like my python > version. Can anyone help? > > [mailman at fast mailman-2.0]$ pwd > /usr/local/mailman-2.0 > [mailman at fast mailman-2.0]$ ./configure > ./configure: ./config.log: Permission denied > ./configure: 5: Bad file descriptor i'd say that your problem is that you don't have write permission on the sources you're trying to compile. PeeWee -- email: peewee at scc.mi.org - useless: http://www.scc.mi.org/peewee/ - efnet: Pwe by my clock, the world just ended. i haven't noticed yet but then i live in the bay area, so i always feel like the world just ended only no one's noticed. -me From RvdBerg at dse.nl Thu Nov 30 23:07:55 2000 From: RvdBerg at dse.nl (Remco van den Berg) Date: Thu, 30 Nov 2000 23:07:55 +0100 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Help needed - sendmail/mailman problem Message-ID: <20001130230755.B10862@jupiter.strijp.Ehv.nl> Hello all, I'm new to Mailman and trying to switch over from Majordomo to Mailman. But I'm having some problems I cannot find in a FAQ or so. So any help is welcome. Let's explain what I did, and my problem... I installed Python-2.0.tar.gz I compiled and installed Mailman-2.0 as described in the INSTALL file. I created the list 'test' as descibed and added the aliases. Run `newaliases` and read README.SENDMAIL but cause I don't use 'smrsh' nothing important to do for sendmail. So far so fine... but then I tried to subscribe to my own list. Using a separate account (vcepsv) on my PC (same PC as the sendmail/mailman software is running on) I subscribed on the 'test' list by using the web-page "http://remco.homeip.net/mailman/listinfo/test". The subscribed account receives a mail (as expected), and I replied on that. And then the mail to 'test-admin' is not correctly delivered. Here I have some lines from my mail-log file: The mail caused by the web-subscribtion: ---------------------------------------- Nov 30 22:53:46 jupiter sendmail[11020]: eAULrjS11020: from=, size=1538, class=-60, nrcpts=1, msgid=<200011302153.eAULrjS11020 at jupiter.strijp.Ehv.nl>, proto=ESMTP, daemon=MTA, relay=IDENT:65534 at localhost [127.0.0.1] Nov 30 22:53:47 jupiter sendmail[11021]: eAULrjS11020: to=, delay=00:00:02, xdelay=00:00:01, mailer=local, pri=138782, dsn=2.0.0, stat=Sent Then the reply on the mail to confirm: -------------------------------------- Nov 30 22:55:47 jupiter sendmail[11043]: eAULtlH11043: from=vcepsv, size=1546, class=0, nrcpts=1, msgid=<20001130225547.A11024 at jupiter.strijp.Ehv.nl>, relay=vcepsv at localhost Nov 30 22:55:50 jupiter sendmail[11045]: eAULtlH11043: to="|/home/mailman/mail/wrapper mailcmd test", ctladdr=test-request at remco.homeip.net (2/0), delay=00:00:03, xdelay=00:00:03, mailer=prog, pri=31546, dsn=2.0.0, stat=Sent Followed by the mail back to the user vcepsv: --------------------------------------------- Nov 30 22:56:05 jupiter sendmail[11050]: eAULu5S11050: from=, size=784, class=-60, nrcpts=1, msgid=<200011302156.eAULu5S11050 at jupiter.strijp.Ehv.nl>, proto=ESMTP, daemon=MTA, relay=IDENT:28 at localhost [127.0.0.1] Nov 30 22:56:06 jupiter sendmail[11051]: eAULu5S11050: to=, delay=00:00:01, xdelay=00:00:01, mailer=local, pri=138114, dsn=2.0.0, stat=Sent in which is standing: "Your request has been forwarded to the list administrator for approval" but this mail is never arriving at the list administrators email address: ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Nov 30 22:57:04 jupiter sendmail[11058]: eAULv4S11058: ... User unknown Nov 30 22:57:04 jupiter sendmail[11058]: eAULv4S11058: from=, size=1002, class=0, nrcpts=0, proto=ESMTP, daemon=MTA, relay=IDENT:28 at localhost [127.0.0.1] Very strange because I can send a normal mail to which is delivered. So what could be wrong here? -Remco -- ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- Remco van den Berg Admin/SO/helpdesk DSE ICQ: 47514668 rvdberg at dse.nl http://www.dse.nl/ ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- From scott-brown at home.com Thu Nov 30 23:08:46 2000 From: scott-brown at home.com (Scott Brown) Date: Thu, 30 Nov 2000 17:08:46 -0500 Subject: [Mailman-Users] SUEXEC & Mailman co-existing? Message-ID: <001b01c05b1a$1cc4a2e0$0401a8c0@ibmpeers> Ok - I've asked before - and only received one "didnt work for me" message. So I'm PLEADING with you now... Has anyone been able to get mailman and suexec to co-exist? If so... HOW? Thanks. From Dan.Mick at West.Sun.COM Thu Nov 30 23:28:30 2000 From: Dan.Mick at West.Sun.COM (Dan Mick) Date: Thu, 30 Nov 2000 14:28:30 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Mailman-Users] Error Mailman 2.0 Message-ID: <200011302226.OAA21019@utopia.west.sun.com> So you obviously have permission problems. Investigate. > Hello./ > > When i send an message to test list i recived tihs error > > The original message was received at Thu, 30 Nov 2000 17:11:49 +0400 (GMT) > from veillon [150.185.156.1] > > ----- The following addresses had permanent fatal errors ----- > "|/usr/local/mailman-2.0/mail/wrapper-mailman post test-mm" > (reason: 1) > (expanded from: ) > > ----- Transcript of session follows ----- > Traceback (innermost last): > File "/usr/local/mailman-2.0//scripts/post", line 94, in ? > main() > File "/usr/local/mailman-2.0//scripts/post", line 73, in main > mlist = MailList.MailList(listname, lock=0) > File "/usr/local/mailman-2.0/Mailman/MailList.py", line 79, in __init__ > self.Load() > > File "/usr/local/mailman-2.0/Mailman/MailList.py", line 868, in __load > fp = open(dbfile) > IOError: [Errno 13] Permission denied: > '/usr/local/mailman-2.0/lists/test-mm/config.db' > 554 5.3.0 "|/usr/local/mailman-2.0/mail/wrapper-mailman post test-mm"... > unknown mailer error 1 > > > And de crontab genera: > > Your "cron" job on veillon > /usr/local/bin/python -S /usr/local/mailman-2.0//cron/qrunner > > produced the following output: > > Traceback (innermost last): > File "/usr/local/mailman-2.0//cron/qrunner", line 271, in ? > lock.lock(timeout=0.5) > File "/usr/local/mailman-2.0/Mailman/LockFile.py", line 219, in lock > self.__write() > File "/usr/local/mailman-2.0/Mailman/LockFile.py", line 350, in __write > fp = open(self.__tmpfname, 'w') > IOError: [Errno 13] Permission denied: > '/usr/local/mailman-2.0/locks/qrunner.lock.veillon.13287' > > > Thank you.. > > ___________________________________________________________ > /\ J. Hernan Ramirez R. \ > \_| Forestal - RedULA - Admire Tel: +58 74 401560 | > | ________________________________________________________|_ > \_/_________________________________________________________/ > > > > ------------------------------------------------------ > Mailman-Users maillist - Mailman-Users at python.org > http://www.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users From Dan.Mick at West.Sun.COM Thu Nov 30 23:30:20 2000 From: Dan.Mick at West.Sun.COM (Dan Mick) Date: Thu, 30 Nov 2000 14:30:20 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Mailman-Users] Help needed - sendmail/mailman problem Message-ID: <200011302228.OAA21146@utopia.west.sun.com> > So what could be wrong here? As always, cron could be wrong. You say nothing about it, so I assume you didn't read this second paragraph of INSTALL: IMPORTANT: Pay special attention to the step below where you have to set up your crontab entries. If you do not do this, Mailman will not work. From RvdBerg at dse.nl Thu Nov 30 23:35:39 2000 From: RvdBerg at dse.nl (Remco van den Berg) Date: Thu, 30 Nov 2000 23:35:39 +0100 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Help needed - sendmail/mailman problem In-Reply-To: <200011302228.OAA21146@utopia.west.sun.com>; from Dan.Mick@West.Sun.COM on Thu, Nov 30, 2000 at 02:30:20PM -0800 References: <200011302228.OAA21146@utopia.west.sun.com> Message-ID: <20001130233539.A11274@jupiter.strijp.Ehv.nl> On Thu, Nov 30, 2000 at 02:30:20PM -0800, Dan Mick wrote: > > > So what could be wrong here? > > As always, cron could be wrong. You say nothing about it, so > I assume you didn't read this second paragraph of INSTALL: > > IMPORTANT: Pay special attention to the step below where you have to > set up your crontab entries. If you do not do this, Mailman will not > work. Thanks for your quick response, but I really don't see any relation between a sendmail error and a cron-job. But OK, here is the cron-job file: root at jupiter 950> su - mailman jupiter:~$ crontab -l # At 5PM every day, mail reminders to admins as to pending requests 0 17 * * * /usr/bin/python -S /home/mailman/cron/checkdbs # # Noon, mail digests for lists that do periodic as well as threshhold delivery. 0 12 * * * /usr/bin/python -S /home/mailman/cron/senddigests # # 5 AM on the first of each month, mail out password reminders. 0 5 1 * * /usr/bin/python -S /home/mailman/cron/mailpasswds # # Every 5 mins, try to gate news to mail. You can comment this one out # if you don't want to allow gating, or don't have any going on right now, # or want to exclusively use a callback strategy instead of polling. 0,5,10,15,20,25,30,35,40,45,50,55 * * * * /usr/bin/python -S /home/mailman/cron/gate_news # # At 3:27am every night, regenerate the gzip'd archive file. Only # turn this on if the internal archiver is used and # GZIP_ARCHIVE_TXT_FILES is false in mm_cfg.py 27 3 * * * /usr/bin/python -S /home/mailman/cron/nightly_gzip # # Retry failed deliveries once per minute. * * * * * /usr/bin/python -S /home/mailman/cron/qrunner Hope you can find my problem.... Thanks, -Remco -- ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- Remco van den Berg Admin/SO/helpdesk DSE ICQ: 47514668 rvdberg at dse.nl http://www.dse.nl/ ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- From doug at lathi.net Thu Nov 30 23:49:00 2000 From: doug at lathi.net (Doug Alcorn) Date: 30 Nov 2000 17:49:00 -0500 Subject: [Mailman-Users] running Mailman on funky virtual server Message-ID: I have a machine that is running some proprietary code to create virtual machines. When I install a new domain, it creates a directory hierarchy such as /home/virtual/domainname with sub-directories like var, lib, usr, and home. The main server's httpd.conf file just has normal VirtualHost to allow the www.domainname.com to work. Nothing tricky there. However, a customized sendmail is running. The first thing it does is chroot to the virtual root of that domain. That allows each domain to have seperate and unique alias files. Also, majordomo is setup to work in this environment. I really want to use mailman instead of majordomo; but, here's my problem: since apache exects to find the cgi-bin in one place, but sendmail finds it in another, I don't know how to link up my MTA with apache. Any suggestions, or am I sol? -- (__) Doug Alcorn (mailto:doug at lathi.net http://www.lathi.net) oo / Unix Hacker |_/ "It's too late for paradise" (at least in this life) From atle at rustadbakken.com Thu Nov 30 21:41:34 2000 From: atle at rustadbakken.com (Atle Rustadbakken) Date: Thu, 30 Nov 2000 21:41:34 +0100 Subject: [Mailman-Users] delete following lists Message-ID: Could you please delete the following mailing-lists: osidans-liste at osi.uio.no osidans-listeansvarlig at osi.uio.no osidans-madlemmer at osi.uio.no They are not longer in use by OSI Dans. Thanks Atle ------------------------------------------------------------------- Atle Rustadbakken tlf : 62 45 29 77 Korsbergsvegen 26 mob : 916 39 398 2420 Trysil e-mail : atle at rustadbakken.com url : http://www.rustadbakken.com/atle ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ <>< <>< <>< <>< <>< <>< <>< <>< <><