From ed.beu at alaska.gov  Wed Aug  3 13:46:46 2016
From: ed.beu at alaska.gov (Beu, Ed (DOA))
Date: Wed, 3 Aug 2016 17:46:46 +0000
Subject: [Mailman-Users] display members moderator flag
Message-ID: <77788B6418FB6E4CB10D483D7DAC164C0101BB7DED@SOAANCEXMB9.soa.alaska.gov>

Hello,

We're using Mailman v2.1.12 on Centos 6.7, and we just went production with it last Sunday, July 31.

Other than browsing through the membership listing in the GUI and looking for unchecked mod settings, to identify who may post unmoderated, is there a script that would display this type of information?

I've searched through archives and did a fair share of google searches, but not finding anything specific to this. Perhaps a feature request to make the membership listing sort capable some day would satisfy my needs.

Thanks in advance for any recommendations or suggestions.

~Ed

Ed Beu , Systems Programmer
Enterprise Technology Services
Department of Administration
Anchorage, AK 99501-1677
----------------------------------------
" http://www.doa.alaska.gov/ets/
----------------------------------------





From mark at msapiro.net  Wed Aug  3 20:24:14 2016
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Wed, 3 Aug 2016 17:24:14 -0700
Subject: [Mailman-Users] display members moderator flag
In-Reply-To: <77788B6418FB6E4CB10D483D7DAC164C0101BB7DED@SOAANCEXMB9.soa.alaska.gov>
References: <77788B6418FB6E4CB10D483D7DAC164C0101BB7DED@SOAANCEXMB9.soa.alaska.gov>
Message-ID: <2a36e35d-4d21-5d03-6dea-762cf8adf9e5@msapiro.net>

On 08/03/2016 10:46 AM, Beu, Ed (DOA) wrote:
> 
> Other than browsing through the membership listing in the GUI and looking for unchecked mod settings, to identify who may post unmoderated, is there a script that would display this type of information?


Beginning with Mailman 2.1.21, Mailman's bin/list_members script has
options to list just the moderated or unmoderated members.

There is also a withlist script at
<https://www.msapiro.net/scripts/list_mod.py> (mirrored at
<https://fog.ccsf.edu/~msapiro/scripts/list_mod.py>) that can do this.


> I've searched through archives and did a fair share of google searches, but not finding anything specific to this. Perhaps a feature request to make the membership listing sort capable some day would satisfy my needs.


There is also a script at
<https://www.msapiro.net/scripts/mailman-subscribers.py> (mirror
<https://fog.ccsf.edu/~msapiro/scripts/mailman-subscribers.py>) that can
run on your work station and screen scrape the admin Membership List and
write a CSV which can be imported to a spreadsheet ans searched/sorted
as you like.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan

From ed.beu at alaska.gov  Thu Aug  4 12:39:08 2016
From: ed.beu at alaska.gov (Beu, Ed (DOA))
Date: Thu, 4 Aug 2016 16:39:08 +0000
Subject: [Mailman-Users] display members moderator flag
In-Reply-To: <2a36e35d-4d21-5d03-6dea-762cf8adf9e5@msapiro.net>
References: <77788B6418FB6E4CB10D483D7DAC164C0101BB7DED@SOAANCEXMB9.soa.alaska.gov>
 <2a36e35d-4d21-5d03-6dea-762cf8adf9e5@msapiro.net>
Message-ID: <77788B6418FB6E4CB10D483D7DAC164C0101BB958A@SOAANCEXMB9.soa.alaska.gov>

Thank you Mark for all the different options, very useful!

I have another question, which may require a new thread, but here goes.

We have chosen to not give our list managers "Administrative" access to their lists. We feel there are too many options that could be changed that could be detrimental to a list. Therefore we're only giving them the Moderator password so that they can use the 'who' command to obtain membership reports on their own.

Some of these 'list admins' are used to being able to 'unsubscribe' members without the member having to confirm via the email confirmation. Our old system would unsubscribe the member and send a notice that they were removed from the list. 

Other than relying on the bounce mechanism or by knowing the members password to remove them, is there any way for a list moderator to accomplish this task? Perhaps access to the 'Membership List' only?

Thanks in advance for your assistance!

~Ed


Ed Beu, System Programmer
Dept. of Administration, ETS
(907)269-6790 ed.beu at alaska.gov

-----Original Message-----
From: Mailman-Users [mailto:mailman-users-bounces+ed.beu=alaska.gov at python.org] On Behalf Of Mark Sapiro
Sent: Wednesday, August 03, 2016 4:24 PM
To: mailman-users at python.org
Subject: Re: [Mailman-Users] display members moderator flag

On 08/03/2016 10:46 AM, Beu, Ed (DOA) wrote:
> 
> Other than browsing through the membership listing in the GUI and looking for unchecked mod settings, to identify who may post unmoderated, is there a script that would display this type of information?


Beginning with Mailman 2.1.21, Mailman's bin/list_members script has
options to list just the moderated or unmoderated members.

There is also a withlist script at
<https://www.msapiro.net/scripts/list_mod.py> (mirrored at
<https://fog.ccsf.edu/~msapiro/scripts/list_mod.py>) that can do this.


> I've searched through archives and did a fair share of google searches, but not finding anything specific to this. Perhaps a feature request to make the membership listing sort capable some day would satisfy my needs.


There is also a script at
<https://www.msapiro.net/scripts/mailman-subscribers.py> (mirror
<https://fog.ccsf.edu/~msapiro/scripts/mailman-subscribers.py>) that can
run on your work station and screen scrape the admin Membership List and
write a CSV which can be imported to a spreadsheet ans searched/sorted
as you like.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan
------------------------------------------------------


From mark at msapiro.net  Thu Aug  4 14:44:35 2016
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Thu, 4 Aug 2016 11:44:35 -0700
Subject: [Mailman-Users] display members moderator flag
In-Reply-To: <77788B6418FB6E4CB10D483D7DAC164C0101BB958A@SOAANCEXMB9.soa.alaska.gov>
References: <77788B6418FB6E4CB10D483D7DAC164C0101BB7DED@SOAANCEXMB9.soa.alaska.gov>
 <2a36e35d-4d21-5d03-6dea-762cf8adf9e5@msapiro.net>
 <77788B6418FB6E4CB10D483D7DAC164C0101BB958A@SOAANCEXMB9.soa.alaska.gov>
Message-ID: <4699431a-f0c9-aec0-710b-f01664ff3f4d@msapiro.net>

On 08/04/2016 09:39 AM, Beu, Ed (DOA) wrote:
> 
> Some of these 'list admins' are used to being able to 'unsubscribe' members without the member having to confirm via the email confirmation. Our old system would unsubscribe the member and send a notice that they were removed from the list. 
> 
> Other than relying on the bounce mechanism or by knowing the members password to remove them, is there any way for a list moderator to accomplish this task? Perhaps access to the 'Membership List' only?


The list moderator password only allows access to the admindb web UI.
Allowing access to selected admin UI functions with that password would
require non-trivial source changes.

If you are willing to create your own web page with it's own
authentication, see <https://wiki.list.org/x/4030648> and the members.c
program linked therefrom for a way to execute Mailman command scripts,
e.g. bin/remove_members, from a web application.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan

From ed.beu at alaska.gov  Thu Aug  4 16:58:34 2016
From: ed.beu at alaska.gov (Beu, Ed (DOA))
Date: Thu, 4 Aug 2016 20:58:34 +0000
Subject: [Mailman-Users] display members moderator flag
In-Reply-To: <4699431a-f0c9-aec0-710b-f01664ff3f4d@msapiro.net>
References: <77788B6418FB6E4CB10D483D7DAC164C0101BB7DED@SOAANCEXMB9.soa.alaska.gov>
 <2a36e35d-4d21-5d03-6dea-762cf8adf9e5@msapiro.net>
 <77788B6418FB6E4CB10D483D7DAC164C0101BB958A@SOAANCEXMB9.soa.alaska.gov>
 <4699431a-f0c9-aec0-710b-f01664ff3f4d@msapiro.net>
Message-ID: <77788B6418FB6E4CB10D483D7DAC164C0101BB9AF3@SOAANCEXMB9.soa.alaska.gov>

Hi Mark,

We've discovered that if the Unsubscribe_Policy is set to Yes (1), the moderator can unsubscribe members without the members input! The member simply gets a notice that they've been unsubscribed.

~Ed

Ed Beu, System Programmer
Dept. of Administration, ETS
(907)269-6790 ed.beu at alaska.gov


-----Original Message-----
From: Mark Sapiro [mailto:mark at msapiro.net] 
Sent: Thursday, August 04, 2016 10:45 AM
To: Beu, Ed (DOA) <ed.beu at alaska.gov>; mailman-users at python.org
Subject: Re: [Mailman-Users] display members moderator flag

On 08/04/2016 09:39 AM, Beu, Ed (DOA) wrote:
> 
> Some of these 'list admins' are used to being able to 'unsubscribe' members without the member having to confirm via the email confirmation. Our old system would unsubscribe the member and send a notice that they were removed from the list. 
> 
> Other than relying on the bounce mechanism or by knowing the members password to remove them, is there any way for a list moderator to accomplish this task? Perhaps access to the 'Membership List' only?


The list moderator password only allows access to the admindb web UI.
Allowing access to selected admin UI functions with that password would
require non-trivial source changes.

If you are willing to create your own web page with it's own
authentication, see <https://wiki.list.org/x/4030648> and the members.c
program linked therefrom for a way to execute Mailman command scripts,
e.g. bin/remove_members, from a web application.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan

From turnbull.stephen.fw at u.tsukuba.ac.jp  Thu Aug  4 23:06:17 2016
From: turnbull.stephen.fw at u.tsukuba.ac.jp (Stephen J. Turnbull)
Date: Fri, 5 Aug 2016 12:06:17 +0900
Subject: [Mailman-Users] display members moderator flag
In-Reply-To: <77788B6418FB6E4CB10D483D7DAC164C0101BB9AF3@SOAANCEXMB9.soa.alaska.gov>
References: <77788B6418FB6E4CB10D483D7DAC164C0101BB7DED@SOAANCEXMB9.soa.alaska.gov>
 <2a36e35d-4d21-5d03-6dea-762cf8adf9e5@msapiro.net>
 <77788B6418FB6E4CB10D483D7DAC164C0101BB958A@SOAANCEXMB9.soa.alaska.gov>
 <4699431a-f0c9-aec0-710b-f01664ff3f4d@msapiro.net>
 <77788B6418FB6E4CB10D483D7DAC164C0101BB9AF3@SOAANCEXMB9.soa.alaska.gov>
Message-ID: <22436.681.861239.507147@turnbull.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp>

Beu, Ed (DOA) writes:

 > We've discovered that if the Unsubscribe_Policy is set to Yes (1),
 > the moderator can unsubscribe members without the members input! 
 > The member simply gets a notice that they've been unsubscribed.

But that means that *anybody* can unsubscribe a member, since only
moderation is enabled by the moderation password, not other list
management features such as subscription management.  So there is
apparently no authorization or authentication required to unsubscribe
someone.

That may be OK in your environment if nobody knows about it (it's too
much to expect that in a large organization there's neither malice nor
mischief about!), but you may need to change policy if you get a spate
of unexpected unsubscriptions.  You also should avoid "one click"
unsubscription footers.


-- 
Associate Professor            Department of Policy and Planning Science
http://turnbull/sk.tsukuba.ac.jp/     Faculty of Systems and Information
Email: turnbull at sk.tsukuba.ac.jp                   University of Tsukuba
Tel: 029-853-5175                 Tennodai 1-1-1, Tsukuba 305-8573 JAPAN

From mark at msapiro.net  Thu Aug  4 23:39:59 2016
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Thu, 4 Aug 2016 20:39:59 -0700
Subject: [Mailman-Users] display members moderator flag
In-Reply-To: <22436.681.861239.507147@turnbull.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp>
References: <77788B6418FB6E4CB10D483D7DAC164C0101BB7DED@SOAANCEXMB9.soa.alaska.gov>
 <2a36e35d-4d21-5d03-6dea-762cf8adf9e5@msapiro.net>
 <77788B6418FB6E4CB10D483D7DAC164C0101BB958A@SOAANCEXMB9.soa.alaska.gov>
 <4699431a-f0c9-aec0-710b-f01664ff3f4d@msapiro.net>
 <77788B6418FB6E4CB10D483D7DAC164C0101BB9AF3@SOAANCEXMB9.soa.alaska.gov>
 <22436.681.861239.507147@turnbull.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp>
Message-ID: <0cc20906-736f-38b1-10c9-696f25779ba6@msapiro.net>

On 08/04/2016 08:06 PM, Stephen J. Turnbull wrote:
> Beu, Ed (DOA) writes:
> 
>  > We've discovered that if the Unsubscribe_Policy is set to Yes (1),
>  > the moderator can unsubscribe members without the members input! 
>  > The member simply gets a notice that they've been unsubscribed.
> 
> But that means that *anybody* can unsubscribe a member, since only
> moderation is enabled by the moderation password, not other list
> management features such as subscription management.  So there is
> apparently no authorization or authentication required to unsubscribe
> someone.


No. It means anyone can request unsubscription of anyone, but the
unsubscription requires moderator approval. Presumably the moderator
won't approve it if she didn't initiate it.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan

From mark at msapiro.net  Fri Aug  5 00:11:46 2016
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Thu, 4 Aug 2016 21:11:46 -0700
Subject: [Mailman-Users] display members moderator flag
In-Reply-To: <0cc20906-736f-38b1-10c9-696f25779ba6@msapiro.net>
References: <0cc20906-736f-38b1-10c9-696f25779ba6@msapiro.net>
Message-ID: <a4b21478-e96a-f8d8-8d31-7c2a0bf05625@msapiro.net>

Mark Sapiro wrote:
> On 08/04/2016 08:06 PM, Stephen J. Turnbull wrote:
>> Beu, Ed (DOA) writes:
>> 
>>  > We've discovered that if the Unsubscribe_Policy is set to Yes (1),
>>  > the moderator can unsubscribe members without the members input! 
>>  > The member simply gets a notice that they've been unsubscribed.
>> 
>> But that means that *anybody* can unsubscribe a member, since only
>> moderation is enabled by the moderation password, not other list
>> management features such as subscription management.  So there is
>> apparently no authorization or authentication required to unsubscribe
>> someone.
> 
> 
> No. It means anyone can request unsubscription of anyone, but the
> unsubscription requires moderator approval. Presumably the moderator
> won't approve it if she didn't initiate it.


However, I realize there is a problem in that all unsubscribes, even
those initiated by a user with a password, require moderator approval so
if a moderator sees an unsubscription request that she didn't initiate,
she has no way to know if this was intentionally initiated by the user
or inadvertently or maliciously by someone else.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan

From steve at unixnation.net  Thu Aug  4 13:39:07 2016
From: steve at unixnation.net (Steve Kirk)
Date: Thu, 4 Aug 2016 18:39:07 +0100
Subject: [Mailman-Users] -owner being appended to welcome or goodbye
 recipients
Message-ID: <20160804173907.GQ24061@evol.unixnation.net>

Hi all,

I'm having a slightly odd problem with mailman 2.1.22 + postfix 3.0.2 in
that the list "goodbye" message, and I think also the ?welcome" message
appear to have "-owner" appended to the destination address.

For example, the recipient of the goodbye message will be
<subscriber_email>-owner at example.com which of course doesn?t exist.

Any obvious places I can check or pointers as to what might be wrong?
I'm assuming I've misconfigured something but am missing what that might
be. I?m not really getting any hits searching the mailing list archives
for this issue. I should add that mail to the lists works fine, as does
a mail to <listname>-owner for example.

Cheers,
Steve

From mark at msapiro.net  Fri Aug  5 10:01:22 2016
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Fri, 5 Aug 2016 07:01:22 -0700
Subject: [Mailman-Users] -owner being appended to welcome or goodbye
 recipients
In-Reply-To: <20160804173907.GQ24061@evol.unixnation.net>
References: <20160804173907.GQ24061@evol.unixnation.net>
Message-ID: <ced68227-575b-89aa-946f-5de9039de73a@msapiro.net>

On 08/04/2016 10:39 AM, Steve Kirk wrote:
> 
> I'm having a slightly odd problem with mailman 2.1.22 + postfix 3.0.2 in
> that the list "goodbye" message, and I think also the ?welcome" message
> appear to have "-owner" appended to the destination address.


Your list's General Options -> umbrella-list is set to Yes. Set it to No
and follow the (Details for umbrella_list) link for a bit more info.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan

From RERobbins at iTinker.net  Sun Aug  7 23:21:51 2016
From: RERobbins at iTinker.net (RERobbins)
Date: Mon, 8 Aug 2016 06:21:51 +0300
Subject: [Mailman-Users] =?utf-8?q?look_at_that=2C_it=27s_amazing!?=
Message-ID: <0000e72e6164$9d34c111$80da6c4a$@itinker.net>

Hello! 

Just  take a  look at  these  awesome  creatures, I love them!  More info here <http://thrive.outdoorrenovators.com/aeijye>

Warmly, RERobbins

From mailinglist at samsi.us  Mon Aug  8 21:36:02 2016
From: mailinglist at samsi.us (Caesar Samsi)
Date: Mon, 8 Aug 2016 18:36:02 -0700
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Unable to receive email on same domain
References: <5F4005AE-336F-4E06-8051-ECC265C61364@mac.com>
Message-ID: <BE0D4AA4-C9BF-4CBB-AE6D-5DA4BFE68A42@samsi.us>

Hi Mark,

I?m not able to send email to addresses on the same domain as the mailing list.

My postfix is configured to process virtual domains.

I currently have mailman configured for yugi.us <http://yugi.us/> and mailing lists work great (e.g. mymailinglist at yugi.us <mailto:mymailinglist at yugi.us>)

However, I can?t send anything to regular email addresses even though they have mailboxes there e.g. myemailaddress at yugi.us <mailto:myemailaddress at yugi.us>

Postfix complains about the recipient does not exist in the virtual alias map.

<test at yugi.us <mailto:admin at yugi.us>>: User unknown in virtual alias table
Action: failed
Status: 5.1.1
Diagnostic-Code: X-Postfix; User unknown in virtual alias table

Thank you, Caesar.


From mailinglist at samsi.us  Tue Aug  9 15:45:40 2016
From: mailinglist at samsi.us (Caesar Samsi)
Date: Tue, 9 Aug 2016 12:45:40 -0700
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Unable to receive email on same domain
In-Reply-To: <BE0D4AA4-C9BF-4CBB-AE6D-5DA4BFE68A42@samsi.us>
References: <5F4005AE-336F-4E06-8051-ECC265C61364@mac.com>
 <BE0D4AA4-C9BF-4CBB-AE6D-5DA4BFE68A42@samsi.us>
Message-ID: <45ADC913-BE17-4627-ABED-5F8C31675A0C@samsi.us>

I?ve been able to track it down to this line (but don?t know what to do about it):

virtual_alias_domains = yugi.us

If I comment the line out, email is received just fine.


> On Aug 8, 2016, at 6:36 PM, Caesar Samsi <mailinglist at samsi.us> wrote:
> 
> Hi Mark,
> 
> I?m not able to send email to addresses on the same domain as the mailing list.
> 
> My postfix is configured to process virtual domains.
> 
> I currently have mailman configured for yugi.us <http://yugi.us/> and mailing lists work great (e.g. mymailinglist at yugi.us <mailto:mymailinglist at yugi.us>)
> 
> However, I can?t send anything to regular email addresses even though they have mailboxes there e.g. myemailaddress at yugi.us <mailto:myemailaddress at yugi.us>
> 
> Postfix complains about the recipient does not exist in the virtual alias map.
> 
> <test at yugi.us <mailto:admin at yugi.us>>: User unknown in virtual alias table
> Action: failed
> Status: 5.1.1
> Diagnostic-Code: X-Postfix; User unknown in virtual alias table
> 
> Thank you, Caesar.
> 
> ------------------------------------------------------
> Mailman-Users mailing list Mailman-Users at python.org
> https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users
> Mailman FAQ: http://wiki.list.org/x/AgA3
> Security Policy: http://wiki.list.org/x/QIA9
> Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users%40python.org/
> Unsubscribe: https://mail.python.org/mailman/options/mailman-users/mailinglist%40samsi.us


From mailinglist at samsi.us  Tue Aug  9 17:53:42 2016
From: mailinglist at samsi.us (Caesar Samsi)
Date: Tue, 9 Aug 2016 14:53:42 -0700
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Editing the homepage
Message-ID: <692B06CC-832A-4438-95BA-2481E3212E03@samsi.us>

Hi there,

I?d like to edit the following text that is shown on the homepage, to remove the ?List administrators ?? and change the email address as mailman at yugi.us <mailto:mailman at yugi.us> is non-functional.

Thanks, Caesar.

Welcome!
Below is a listing of all the public mailing lists on mail.yugi.us <http://mail.yugi.us/>. Click on a list name to get more information about the list, or to subscribe, unsubscribe, and change the preferences on your subscription. To visit the general information page for an unadvertised list, open a URL similar to this one, but with a '/' and the list name appended.

List administrators, you can visit the list admin overview page <http://mail.yugi.us/admin> to find the management interface for your list.

If you are having trouble using the lists, please contact mailman at yugi.us <mailto:mailman at yugi.us>.

From mailinglist at samsi.us  Tue Aug  9 19:03:23 2016
From: mailinglist at samsi.us (Caesar Samsi)
Date: Tue, 9 Aug 2016 16:03:23 -0700
Subject: [Mailman-Users] mailman mailing list broken
Message-ID: <91E13787-F376-470B-B84A-C967A5816AC9@samsi.us>

Hmmmm now mailman can?t be sent to.

From mailinglist at samsi.us  Tue Aug  9 21:49:14 2016
From: mailinglist at samsi.us (Caesar Samsi)
Date: Tue, 9 Aug 2016 18:49:14 -0700
Subject: [Mailman-Users] mailman mailing list broken
In-Reply-To: <91E13787-F376-470B-B84A-C967A5816AC9@samsi.us>
References: <91E13787-F376-470B-B84A-C967A5816AC9@samsi.us>
Message-ID: <48D9FF8D-7FBE-4BAC-B1D8-93AB757142B0@samsi.us>

This was fixed by deleting and recreating it.

> On Aug 9, 2016, at 4:03 PM, Caesar Samsi <mailinglist at samsi.us> wrote:
> 
> Hmmmm now mailman can?t be sent to.
> ------------------------------------------------------
> Mailman-Users mailing list Mailman-Users at python.org
> https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users
> Mailman FAQ: http://wiki.list.org/x/AgA3
> Security Policy: http://wiki.list.org/x/QIA9
> Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users%40python.org/
> Unsubscribe: https://mail.python.org/mailman/options/mailman-users/mailinglist%40samsi.us


From mailinglist at samsi.us  Tue Aug  9 21:51:25 2016
From: mailinglist at samsi.us (Caesar Samsi)
Date: Tue, 9 Aug 2016 18:51:25 -0700
Subject: [Mailman-Users] mailman archive not working
Message-ID: <48D355AE-75E6-44D0-A9B2-8225DECF5AC8@samsi.us>

Hi Mark,

When I access the archive via a browser, it shows ?Forbidden?

When I check /var/lib/mailman/archives/public they are all symlinks to /var/lib/mailman/archives/private which I assume are not allowed to be read.

I attempted to change the permissions, but that didn?t work.

Thank you, Caesar.

From mailinglist at samsi.us  Wed Aug 10 13:08:50 2016
From: mailinglist at samsi.us (Caesar Samsi)
Date: Wed, 10 Aug 2016 10:08:50 -0700
Subject: [Mailman-Users] mailman mailing list broken
In-Reply-To: <91E13787-F376-470B-B84A-C967A5816AC9@samsi.us>
References: <91E13787-F376-470B-B84A-C967A5816AC9@samsi.us>
Message-ID: <D432A7BD-70CD-46F4-96E3-D54A47D33003@samsi.us>

This was fixed with http://www.list.org/mailman-install/node9.html <http://www.list.org/mailman-install/node9.html>

and

<Directory /var/lib/mailman/archives/public/>
     Order allow,deny
     Allow from all
     Options Indexes FollowSymLinks
     Require all granted
</Directory>

at the bottom of /etc/apache2/sites-available/mailman.conf

Then sudo service apache2 restart

> On Aug 9, 2016, at 4:03 PM, Caesar Samsi <mailinglist at samsi.us> wrote:
> 
> Hmmmm now mailman can?t be sent to.
> ------------------------------------------------------
> Mailman-Users mailing list Mailman-Users at python.org
> https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users
> Mailman FAQ: http://wiki.list.org/x/AgA3
> Security Policy: http://wiki.list.org/x/QIA9
> Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users%40python.org/
> Unsubscribe: https://mail.python.org/mailman/options/mailman-users/mailinglist%40samsi.us


From steve at unixnation.net  Thu Aug 11 05:49:15 2016
From: steve at unixnation.net (Steve)
Date: Thu, 11 Aug 2016 10:49:15 +0100
Subject: [Mailman-Users] -owner being appended to welcome or goodbye
 recipients
In-Reply-To: <ced68227-575b-89aa-946f-5de9039de73a@msapiro.net>
References: <20160804173907.GQ24061@evol.unixnation.net>
 <ced68227-575b-89aa-946f-5de9039de73a@msapiro.net>
Message-ID: <20160811094914.GU24061@evol.unixnation.net>

On Fri, Aug 05, 2016 at 07:01:22AM -0700, Mark Sapiro wrote:
> On 08/04/2016 10:39 AM, Steve Kirk wrote:
> > 
> > I'm having a slightly odd problem with mailman 2.1.22 + postfix 3.0.2 in
> > that the list "goodbye" message, and I think also the ?welcome" message
> > appear to have "-owner" appended to the destination address.
> 
> 
> Your list's General Options -> umbrella-list is set to Yes. Set it to No
> and follow the (Details for umbrella_list) link for a bit more info.
 
Thanks for the info - that was exactly it.

Am I correct in thinking that with mailman 2.x, the only real way to set
these kinds of settings at the command line is to use config_list, spit
on the config, make the changes and re-import it?

Cheers,
Steve

From mailinglist at samsi.us  Thu Aug 11 14:01:44 2016
From: mailinglist at samsi.us (Caesar Samsi)
Date: Thu, 11 Aug 2016 11:01:44 -0700
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Unable to receive email on same domain
In-Reply-To: <45ADC913-BE17-4627-ABED-5F8C31675A0C@samsi.us>
References: <5F4005AE-336F-4E06-8051-ECC265C61364@mac.com>
 <BE0D4AA4-C9BF-4CBB-AE6D-5DA4BFE68A42@samsi.us>
 <45ADC913-BE17-4627-ABED-5F8C31675A0C@samsi.us>
Message-ID: <3100FA39-92F9-4F48-9FBE-B1455210395D@samsi.us>

postfix -n for info 

alias_maps = hash:/etc/aliases,hash:/var/lib/mailman/data/aliases
append_dot_mydomain = no
biff = no
broken_sasl_auth_clients = yes
config_directory = /etc/postfix
content_filter = amavis:[127.0.0.1]:10024
disable_vrfy_command = yes
dovecot_destination_recipient_limit = 1
enable_original_recipient = no
header_checks = regexp:/etc/postfix/header_checks
inet_interfaces = all
mailbox_size_limit = 0
mailman_destination_recipient_limit = 1
maximal_backoff_time = 8000s
maximal_queue_lifetime = 7d
minimal_backoff_time = 1000s
mydestination = localhost
myhostname = mail.yugi.us
mynetworks = 127.0.0.0/8 [::ffff:127.0.0.0]/104 [::1]/128
mynetworks_style = host
myorigin = /etc/hostname
readme_directory = no
recipient_delimiter = +
relay_domains = mail.yugi.us
smtp_helo_timeout = 60s
smtpd_banner = $myhostname ESMTP $mail_name
smtpd_delay_reject = yes
smtpd_hard_error_limit = 12
smtpd_helo_required = yes
smtpd_helo_restrictions = permit_mynetworks, permit_sasl_authenticated, reject_invalid_helo_hostname, reject_non_fqdn_helo_hostname, reject_unknown_helo_hostname, reject_non_fqdn_hostname, reject_invalid_hostname
smtpd_recipient_limit = 16
smtpd_recipient_restrictions = permit_sasl_authenticated, permit_mynetworks, reject_unauth_destination, reject_invalid_hostname, reject_non_fqdn_hostname, reject_non_fqdn_sender, reject_non_fqdn_recipient, reject_unknown_sender_domain, reject_unknown_recipient_domain, reject_rbl_client sbl.spamhaus.org, reject_rbl_client cbl.abuseat.org, reject_rbl_client dul.dnsbl.sorbs.net
smtpd_sasl_auth_enable = yes
smtpd_sasl_authenticated_header = yes
smtpd_sasl_local_domain =
smtpd_sasl_path = private/auth
smtpd_sasl_security_options = noanonymous
smtpd_sasl_type = dovecot
smtpd_soft_error_limit = 3
smtpd_tls_CAfile = /etc/ssl/certs/yugi.us.ca-bundle
smtpd_tls_auth_only = yes
smtpd_tls_cert_file = /etc/ssl/certs/yugi.us.crt
smtpd_tls_exclude_ciphers = aNULL, eNULL, EXPORT, DES, RC4, MD5, PSK, aECDH, EDH-DSS-DES-CBC3-SHA, EDH-RSA-DES-CDC3-SHA, KRB5-DE5, CBC3-SHA
smtpd_tls_key_file = /etc/ssl/private/yugi.us.key
smtpd_tls_loglevel = 1
smtpd_tls_mandatory_protocols = !SSLv2,!SSLv3
smtpd_tls_received_header = yes
smtpd_tls_security_level = may
smtpd_tls_session_cache_timeout = 3600s
tls_random_source = dev:/dev/urandom
unknown_local_recipient_reject_code = 450
virtual_alias_domains = yugi.us
virtual_alias_maps = mysql:/etc/postfix/mysql_virtual_alias_maps.cf, mysql:/etc/postfix/mysql_virtual_alias_domainaliases_maps.cf, hash:/var/lib/mailman/data/virtual-mailman
virtual_gid_maps = static:8
virtual_mailbox_base = /var/vmail
virtual_mailbox_domains = mysql:/etc/postfix/mysql_virtual_domains_maps.cf
virtual_mailbox_maps = mysql:/etc/postfix/mysql_virtual_mailbox_maps.cf, mysql:/etc/postfix/mysql_virtual_mailbox_domainaliases_maps.cf
virtual_transport = dovecot
virtual_uid_maps = static:150

> On Aug 9, 2016, at 12:45 PM, Caesar Samsi <mailinglist at samsi.us> wrote:
> 
> I?ve been able to track it down to this line (but don?t know what to do about it):
> 
> virtual_alias_domains = yugi.us
> 
> If I comment the line out, email is received just fine.
> 
> 
>> On Aug 8, 2016, at 6:36 PM, Caesar Samsi <mailinglist at samsi.us> wrote:
>> 
>> Hi Mark,
>> 
>> I?m not able to send email to addresses on the same domain as the mailing list.
>> 
>> My postfix is configured to process virtual domains.
>> 
>> I currently have mailman configured for yugi.us <http://yugi.us/> and mailing lists work great (e.g. mymailinglist at yugi.us <mailto:mymailinglist at yugi.us>)
>> 
>> However, I can?t send anything to regular email addresses even though they have mailboxes there e.g. myemailaddress at yugi.us <mailto:myemailaddress at yugi.us>
>> 
>> Postfix complains about the recipient does not exist in the virtual alias map.
>> 
>> <test at yugi.us <mailto:admin at yugi.us>>: User unknown in virtual alias table
>> Action: failed
>> Status: 5.1.1
>> Diagnostic-Code: X-Postfix; User unknown in virtual alias table
>> 
>> Thank you, Caesar.
>> 
>> ------------------------------------------------------
>> Mailman-Users mailing list Mailman-Users at python.org
>> https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users
>> Mailman FAQ: http://wiki.list.org/x/AgA3
>> Security Policy: http://wiki.list.org/x/QIA9
>> Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users%40python.org/
>> Unsubscribe: https://mail.python.org/mailman/options/mailman-users/mailinglist%40samsi.us
> 
> ------------------------------------------------------
> Mailman-Users mailing list Mailman-Users at python.org
> https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users
> Mailman FAQ: http://wiki.list.org/x/AgA3
> Security Policy: http://wiki.list.org/x/QIA9
> Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users%40python.org/
> Unsubscribe: https://mail.python.org/mailman/options/mailman-users/mailinglist%40samsi.us


From ezsra.mcdonald at gmail.com  Fri Aug 12 17:08:24 2016
From: ezsra.mcdonald at gmail.com (Ezsra McDonald)
Date: Fri, 12 Aug 2016 16:08:24 -0500
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Mailman and local user collisions
Message-ID: <CAGo-12C0Jx-W7thc+goL+YP6jyV8FBPkDXos1W853rt=Ac2Kug@mail.gmail.com>

I discovered recently that there is a local user and a mailman list with
the same user at . The mail goes to the list and not the user. What is the
trick to make Postfix handle these separately?

Lets say the domain is somewhere.com and the list is list.somewhere.com.

OS: Redhat Enterprise 6.x
Mailman Version: 2.1.12

I read about virtual domains but when I attempt to use them they do not
like the mailman aliases file. We don't want to generate files every time a
new list is added, updated or removed.

Does anyone have a sample config for this setup?

-Ezsra

From bsfinkel at att.net  Fri Aug 12 17:55:32 2016
From: bsfinkel at att.net (Barry S. Finkel)
Date: Fri, 12 Aug 2016 16:55:32 -0500
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Mailman and local user collisions
In-Reply-To: <CAGo-12C0Jx-W7thc+goL+YP6jyV8FBPkDXos1W853rt=Ac2Kug@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAGo-12C0Jx-W7thc+goL+YP6jyV8FBPkDXos1W853rt=Ac2Kug@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <d158b12f-1578-f8cf-f450-703bb203fc62@att.net>

On 8/12/2016 4:08 PM, Ezsra McDonald wrote:
> I discovered recently that there is a local user and a mailman list with
> the same user at . The mail goes to the list and not the user. What is the
> trick to make Postfix handle these separately?
>
> Lets say the domain is somewhere.com and the list is list.somewhere.com.
>
> OS: Redhat Enterprise 6.x
> Mailman Version: 2.1.12
>
> I read about virtual domains but when I attempt to use them they do not
> like the mailman aliases file. We don't want to generate files every time a
> new list is added, updated or removed.
>
> Does anyone have a sample config for this setup?
>
> -Ezsra


If I understand the question properly, you have a Mailman list
and a local user with the same name on the same machine.
There is one alias file (or concatenation of alias files)
that Postfix uses, and Postfix will use the first entry
that it finds in the alias concatenations. Or Postfix
will give an error or warning message about the duplicate entry.
There is no way for Postfix to know whether to deliver the mail to the
Mailman list or to the local user.

In short, I believe that what you want is not possible.
Even with virtual domains, you still have the name conflct.

--Barry Finkel


From cpz at tuunq.com  Fri Aug 12 17:55:54 2016
From: cpz at tuunq.com (Carl Zwanzig)
Date: Fri, 12 Aug 2016 14:55:54 -0700
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Mailman and local user collisions
In-Reply-To: <CAGo-12C0Jx-W7thc+goL+YP6jyV8FBPkDXos1W853rt=Ac2Kug@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAGo-12C0Jx-W7thc+goL+YP6jyV8FBPkDXos1W853rt=Ac2Kug@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <c4bcefd2-c5a0-724e-5b7f-52a63ed5c1d3@tuunq.com>

On 8/12/2016 2:08 PM, Ezsra McDonald wrote:
> I discovered recently that there is a local user and a mailman list with
> the same user at . The mail goes to the list and not the user. What is the
> trick to make Postfix handle these separately?
>
> Lets say the domain is somewhere.com and the list is list.somewhere.com.

If you have joeuser at somewhere.com (local user) and 
thelist at list.somewhere.com with the list-member joeuser at somewhere.com, that 
sounds like correct behavior.

OTOH do you have makemoneyfast at somewhere.com as a personal mailbox and 
makemoneyfast at list.somewhere.com as the name of a mailman list? That's a bad 
idea, in general. Can you even route around that? If they're effectively 
both local users in the same email domain, I'm not sure how it can work, but 
I'm not an expert.  IME attempting to differentiate by a 'list.' subdomain 
or hostname tends to break because people forget that part or it gets 
stripped along the way.

Later,

z!


From mailinglist at samsi.us  Fri Aug 12 20:18:33 2016
From: mailinglist at samsi.us (Caesar Samsi)
Date: Fri, 12 Aug 2016 17:18:33 -0700
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Unable to receive email on same domain
In-Reply-To: <45ADC913-BE17-4627-ABED-5F8C31675A0C@samsi.us>
References: <5F4005AE-336F-4E06-8051-ECC265C61364@mac.com>
 <BE0D4AA4-C9BF-4CBB-AE6D-5DA4BFE68A42@samsi.us>
 <45ADC913-BE17-4627-ABED-5F8C31675A0C@samsi.us>
Message-ID: <E56FFA78-CA49-40F2-8E0A-5E6373C369F8@samsi.us>

Resurrecting this for the weekend crew ?

I?ve been able to track it down to this line (but don?t know what to do about it):

virtual_alias_domains = yugi.us <http://yugi.us/>

If I comment the line out, email is received just fine.


> On Aug 8, 2016, at 6:36 PM, Caesar Samsi <mailinglist at samsi.us <mailto:mailinglist at samsi.us>> wrote:
> 
> I?m not able to send email to addresses on the same domain as the mailing list.
> 
> My postfix is configured to process virtual domains.
> 
> I currently have mailman configured for yugi.us <http://yugi.us/> <http://yugi.us/ <http://yugi.us/>> and mailing lists work great (e.g. mymailinglist at yugi.us <mailto:mymailinglist at yugi.us> <mailto:mymailinglist at yugi.us <mailto:mymailinglist at yugi.us>>)
> 
> However, I can?t send anything to regular email addresses even though they have mailboxes there e.g. myemailaddress at yugi.us <mailto:myemailaddress at yugi.us> <mailto:myemailaddress at yugi.us <mailto:myemailaddress at yugi.us>>
> 
> Postfix complains about the recipient does not exist in the virtual alias map.
> 
> <test at yugi.us <mailto:test at yugi.us> <mailto:admin at yugi.us <mailto:admin at yugi.us>>>: User unknown in virtual alias table
> Action: failed
> Status: 5.1.1
> Diagnostic-Code: X-Postfix; User unknown in virtual alias table

From hathawulf at yahoo.com  Sat Aug 13 09:53:47 2016
From: hathawulf at yahoo.com (Local Girls)
Date: Sat, 13 Aug 2016 16:53:47 +0300
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Fw: good impression
Message-ID: <0000f2a7d6d2$76617761$174498b1$@yahoo.com>

Greetings, 

I've got a very good impression  of that  new stuff, you just have to  take a look <http://chance.lindalouphotography.com/lnucxx>


Later, Local Girls



From mailinglist at samsi.us  Sun Aug 14 20:14:48 2016
From: mailinglist at samsi.us (Caesar Samsi)
Date: Sun, 14 Aug 2016 17:14:48 -0700
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Fwd: Confirmation Page not working
References: <F42B39AD-F2B6-4D50-8C9E-D4E841FCB8B0@mac.com>
Message-ID: <E120A79E-9149-4D12-AD7A-9D6B05D42743@samsi.us>

Hello,

My confirmation page is not working.

I am assuming the string following ?confirm? is the ?cookie? and to copy and paste that cookie to the confirmation page.

However, the page simply cycles back to itself.

Replying to the confirmation email however, works. So I have a workaround for now.

Thank you, Caesar.


From jewel.brueggeman-makda at washburn.edu  Tue Aug 16 16:31:52 2016
From: jewel.brueggeman-makda at washburn.edu (Jewel Brueggeman-Makda)
Date: Tue, 16 Aug 2016 20:31:52 +0000
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Truncating Archives up to a specific date
Message-ID: <MWHPR04MB057714CD85C4302460367828B1130@MWHPR04MB0577.namprd04.prod.outlook.com>

I am wanting to shrink the archives on my lists. I only want to keep archives for the last 2 or 3 years.  Is there a script that will do this?  What are the steps to truncating and rebuilding an archive?

Running Mailman 2.1.12 on Red Hat 5
Jewel

From jwt at onjapan.net  Wed Aug 17 04:27:00 2016
From: jwt at onjapan.net (Jim Tittsler)
Date: Wed, 17 Aug 2016 17:27:00 +0900
Subject: [Mailman-Users] -owner being appended to welcome or goodbye
 recipients
In-Reply-To: <20160811094914.GU24061@evol.unixnation.net>
References: <20160804173907.GQ24061@evol.unixnation.net>
 <ced68227-575b-89aa-946f-5de9039de73a@msapiro.net>
 <20160811094914.GU24061@evol.unixnation.net>
Message-ID: <4fbaf74f-471f-3698-4d9f-209384a0effa@onjapan.net>

On 08/11/2016 06:49 PM, Steve wrote:
> Am I correct in thinking that with mailman 2.x, the only real way to set
> these kinds of settings at the command line is to use config_list, spit
> on the config, make the changes and re-import it?

Or use bin/withlist, which is handy if you want to script changes across
many lists.  (Run it with no args for details, or search the Mailman FAQ
for some examples.)




-- 
Jim Tittsler     http://www.OnJapan.net/      GPG: 0x01159DB6
Python Starship  http://Starship.Python.net/crew/jwt/
Mailman IRC      irc://irc.freenode.net/#mailman

From jwt at onjapan.net  Wed Aug 17 04:18:07 2016
From: jwt at onjapan.net (Jim Tittsler)
Date: Wed, 17 Aug 2016 17:18:07 +0900
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Truncating Archives up to a specific date
In-Reply-To: <MWHPR04MB057714CD85C4302460367828B1130@MWHPR04MB0577.namprd04.prod.outlook.com>
References: <MWHPR04MB057714CD85C4302460367828B1130@MWHPR04MB0577.namprd04.prod.outlook.com>
Message-ID: <fa2d43ab-b662-8b10-c1af-638a94ba4a6e@onjapan.net>

On 08/17/2016 05:31 AM, Jewel Brueggeman-Makda wrote:
> I am wanting to shrink the archives on my lists. I only want to keep archives
> for the last 2 or 3 years.  Is there a script that will do this?  What are
> the steps to truncating and rebuilding an archive?

Mark Sapiro has written a script that will prune older messages from an
archive, and then rebuild the HTML archives:
  https://www.msapiro.net/scripts/prune_arch

You can do it by hand by editing the mbox file for the list (typically
/var/lib/mailman/archives/private/{listname}.mbox/{listname}.mbox) to
remove the messages you no longer want to keep, and then rebuild the
HTML archives with "arch --wipe {listname}" Be careful to maintain file
permissions during the process.

There are more details in the Mailman FAQ:
  https://wiki.list.org/x/4030681



-- 
Jim Tittsler     http://OnJapan.net/      GPG: 0x01159DB6
Python Starship  http://Starship.Python.net/crew/jwt/
Mailman IRC      irc://irc.freenode.net/#mailman

From List.Server.Admin at unh.edu  Tue Aug 16 16:19:51 2016
From: List.Server.Admin at unh.edu (The Mailing List Server Admin)
Date: Tue, 16 Aug 2016 16:19:51 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Cloning a Mailman server to a virtual machine.
Message-ID: <alpine.LRH.2.03.1608161521510.21568@conundrum.unh.edu>

Dear Mailman Cognoscenti,

We have Mailman (and ListProc) running on a physical machine which
needs to be decommissioned.  Cloning the system to a virtual machine
(VM) shouldn't be a problem, but I am unsure about the tasks needed to
make a smooth transition.  I've looked at several articles about
moving Mailman to new hardware, but a lot of the lower level service
details are not mentioned.  Here's my first stab at what I think needs
to be done.

   Mailman v2.1.20
   RHEL v5.11
   Semdmail v8.13.8
   Apache v2.2.3

After informing the list owners of date/time mailing list services
will be unavailable, at the appointed time...

On the existing machine:

    1. stop cron		sudo service crond stop
    2. stop Sendmail	sudo service sendmail stop
    3. stop Apache	sudo apachectl stop
    4. stop Mailman	sudo service mailmain stop
    5. stop ListProc	su --command=/home/server/stop server
    6. check mail queue	sudo mailq

    7. Wait ?? for machine to quiet down?

Clone existing system to VM.

    8. shutdown old machine
    9. boot VM clone
   10. test email and lists
   11. alert list owners

My concern is that a mailing list server is a very stateful beast, so
I want to avoid sending duplicate posts/digests, or accidentally
dropping new postings on the floor.  Thanks for any insights you may
have to offer on the process.

-- 
                                   Cordially,
                                   the UNH Mailing List Server Admins
                                   Bill Costa, senior admin
                                   (603) 862-3056

From dnewman at networktest.com  Fri Aug 12 14:48:34 2016
From: dnewman at networktest.com (David Newman)
Date: Fri, 12 Aug 2016 11:48:34 -0700
Subject: [Mailman-Users] including all domains in virtual-mailman
Message-ID: <7dd6e8a2-e4c3-d5db-977c-641c322c824a@networktest.com>

Greetings. How to get the data/virtual-mailman file to include all
virtual domains after running bin/genaliases?

This is on a FreeBSD 10.3 system running mailman 2.1.22 from ports.

The system has mailing lists defined from 3 domains -- let's call them
domain1.tld, domain2.tld, and domain3.tld.

After running bin/genaliases, the data/virtual-mailman file only
includes whichever virtual domain is defined _last_ in Mailman/mm_cfg.py.

I have tried moving the domain definitions around. In each case,
genaliases only picks up the final one.

Thanks in advance for clues on getting all domains' lists included.

The end of Mailman/mm_cfg.py looks like this:

----------

..

# Put YOUR site-specific settings below this line.
MTA = 'Postfix'

# Clear the Defaults.py VIRTUAL_HOSTS entry
# VIRTUAL_HOSTS.clear()
add_virtualhost('lists.domain1.tld','lists.domain1.tld')
POSTFIX_STYLE_VIRTUAL_DOMAINS = ['lists.domain1.tld']
add_virtualhost('lists.domain2.tld','lists.domain2.tld')
POSTFIX_STYLE_VIRTUAL_DOMAINS = ['lists.domain2.tld']
add_virtualhost('mail.domain3.tld','mail.domain3.tld')
POSTFIX_STYLE_VIRTUAL_DOMAINS = ['mail.domain3.tld']
DEB_LISTMASTER = 'postmaster at domain2.tld'

# dn 20140423
# adding DMARC workaround here
# see http://wiki.list.org/pages/viewpage.action?pageId=17891458
# for more details

ALLOW_FROM_IS_LIST = Yes

----------


The Postfix main.cf file has these mailman-specific settings:

----------
..

alias_maps = hash:/usr/local/etc/postfix/aliases,
hash:/usr/local/mailman/data/aliases

..

virtual_alias_maps =
    proxy:mysql:/usr/local/etc/postfix/mysql/virtual_alias_maps.cf
    proxy:mysql:/usr/local/etc/postfix/mysql/domain_alias_maps.cf
    proxy:mysql:/usr/local/etc/postfix/mysql/catchall_maps.cf
    proxy:mysql:/usr/local/etc/postfix/mysql/domain_alias_catchall_maps.cf
    hash:/usr/local/mailman/data/virtual-mailman
..

recipient_delimiter = +


----------

Thanks again for clues on getting virtual-mailman to include all lists
from all virtual domains.

dn




From mark at msapiro.net  Wed Aug 17 23:41:34 2016
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Wed, 17 Aug 2016 20:41:34 -0700
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Editing the homepage
In-Reply-To: <692B06CC-832A-4438-95BA-2481E3212E03@samsi.us>
References: <692B06CC-832A-4438-95BA-2481E3212E03@samsi.us>
Message-ID: <622d4932-506b-46dd-2373-c2e6a65c05de@msapiro.net>

On 08/09/2016 02:53 PM, Caesar Samsi wrote:
> 
> I?d like to edit the following text that is shown on the homepage, to remove the ?List administrators ?? and change the email address as mailman at yugi.us is non-functional.


In what way is it non-functional? You must have a site ('mailman') list
or Mailman won't start, so mailman at yugi.us should be the posting address
of that list, and the list should be configured with the site admins as
members and should accept non-member posts.


> Welcome!
> Below is a listing of all the public mailing lists on mail.yugi.us <http://mail.yugi.us/>. Click on a list name to get more information about the list, or to subscribe, unsubscribe, and change the preferences on your subscription. To visit the general information page for an unadvertised list, open a URL similar to this one, but with a '/' and the list name appended.
> 
> List administrators, you can visit the list admin overview page <http://mail.yugi.us/admin> to find the management interface for your list.
> 
> If you are having trouble using the lists, please contact mailman at yugi.us <mailto:mailman at yugi.us>.


This text is hard coded in Mailman/Cgi/listinfo.py. To change these
things in this case, you need to edit the module directly.

In some cases you can make an English language message catalog at
messages/en/LC_MESSAGES/mailman.po and
messages/en/LC_MESSAGES/mailman.mo containing the strings you want to
change as 'msgid' values and the replacements as 'msgstr' values, but
that won't work in this case because of the 'links'.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan

From mark at msapiro.net  Wed Aug 17 23:50:26 2016
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Wed, 17 Aug 2016 20:50:26 -0700
Subject: [Mailman-Users] mailman archive not working
In-Reply-To: <48D355AE-75E6-44D0-A9B2-8225DECF5AC8@samsi.us>
References: <48D355AE-75E6-44D0-A9B2-8225DECF5AC8@samsi.us>
Message-ID: <3fa892cd-3105-695d-4737-ea71e36bf496@msapiro.net>

On 08/09/2016 06:51 PM, Caesar Samsi wrote:
> 
> When I access the archive via a browser, it shows ?Forbidden?
> 
> When I check /var/lib/mailman/archives/public they are all symlinks to /var/lib/mailman/archives/private which I assume are not allowed to be read.


It is correct that /var/lib/mailman/archives/public/* are symlinks to
/var/lib/mailman/archives/private/*.

/var/lib/mailman/archives/private/ must be searchable by the web server
user. It must be either mode o+x (i.e. drwxrws--x) or owned by the web
server user. See <http://www.list.org/mailman-install/node9.html>.

If that isn't the answer, see
<http://www.list.org/mailman-install/node10.html>.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan

From dnewman at networktest.com  Wed Aug 17 23:50:29 2016
From: dnewman at networktest.com (David Newman)
Date: Wed, 17 Aug 2016 20:50:29 -0700
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Cloning a Mailman server to a virtual machine.
In-Reply-To: <alpine.LRH.2.03.1608161521510.21568@conundrum.unh.edu>
References: <alpine.LRH.2.03.1608161521510.21568@conundrum.unh.edu>
Message-ID: <418aac10-f3e4-3d8d-0ca8-a89ab8064a99@networktest.com>

On 8/16/16 1:19 PM, The Mailing List Server Admin wrote:
> Dear Mailman Cognoscenti,
> 
> We have Mailman (and ListProc) running on a physical machine which
> needs to be decommissioned.  Cloning the system to a virtual machine
> (VM) shouldn't be a problem, but I am unsure about the tasks needed to
> make a smooth transition.  I've looked at several articles about
> moving Mailman to new hardware, but a lot of the lower level service
> details are not mentioned.  Here's my first stab at what I think needs
> to be done.
> 
>   Mailman v2.1.20
>   RHEL v5.11
>   Semdmail v8.13.8
>   Apache v2.2.3
> 
> After informing the list owners of date/time mailing list services
> will be unavailable, at the appointed time...
> 
> On the existing machine:
> 
>    1. stop cron        sudo service crond stop
>    2. stop Sendmail    sudo service sendmail stop
>    3. stop Apache    sudo apachectl stop
>    4. stop Mailman    sudo service mailmain stop
>    5. stop ListProc    su --command=/home/server/stop server
>    6. check mail queue    sudo mailq
> 
>    7. Wait ?? for machine to quiet down?

Shouldn't be necessary because of steps 2 and 5 -- the old system can't
send or receive list messages or other email.
> 
> Clone existing system to VM.

> 
>    8. shutdown old machine
>    9. boot VM clone
>   10. test email and lists
>   11. alert list owners

Provided the VM is an exact copy with the same IP address(es) this
should be OK. If the address changes, don't forget to update your DNS
zone files.

dn

> 
> My concern is that a mailing list server is a very stateful beast, so
> I want to avoid sending duplicate posts/digests, or accidentally
> dropping new postings on the floor.  Thanks for any insights you may
> have to offer on the process.
> 

From mark at msapiro.net  Thu Aug 18 01:57:55 2016
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Wed, 17 Aug 2016 22:57:55 -0700
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Unable to receive email on same domain
In-Reply-To: <E56FFA78-CA49-40F2-8E0A-5E6373C369F8@samsi.us>
References: <5F4005AE-336F-4E06-8051-ECC265C61364@mac.com>
 <BE0D4AA4-C9BF-4CBB-AE6D-5DA4BFE68A42@samsi.us>
 <45ADC913-BE17-4627-ABED-5F8C31675A0C@samsi.us>
 <E56FFA78-CA49-40F2-8E0A-5E6373C369F8@samsi.us>
Message-ID: <daab7027-7459-11a6-0d0f-512400caf505@msapiro.net>

On 08/12/2016 05:18 PM, Caesar Samsi wrote:
> Resurrecting this for the weekend crew ?


Sometimes people are off line for long periods, in this case from Aug 5
to now. Be patient.


> I?ve been able to track it down to this line (but don?t know what to do about it):
> 
> virtual_alias_domains = yugi.us <http://yugi.us/>
> 
> If I comment the line out, email is received just fine.
> 
> 
>> On Aug 8, 2016, at 6:36 PM, Caesar Samsi <mailinglist at samsi.us <mailto:mailinglist at samsi.us>> wrote:
>>
>> I?m not able to send email to addresses on the same domain as the mailing list.
>>
>> My postfix is configured to process virtual domains.


So yugi.us is a virtual alias domain. This means EVERY address @yugi.us
must have a virtual alias mapping


>> I currently have mailman configured for yugi.us and mailing lists work great (e.g. mymailinglist at yugi.us)
>>
>> However, I can?t send anything to regular email addresses even though they have mailboxes there e.g. myemailaddress at yugi.us
>>
>> Postfix complains about the recipient does not exist in the virtual alias map.


So you need a virtual alias mapping, perhaps something like

myemailaddress at yugi.us  myemailaddress at localhost

and similarly for every other xxx at yugi.us address, or perhaps you really
want yugi.us to be a local rather than a virtual domain.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan

From mark at msapiro.net  Thu Aug 18 02:03:45 2016
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Wed, 17 Aug 2016 23:03:45 -0700
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Fwd: Confirmation Page not working
In-Reply-To: <E120A79E-9149-4D12-AD7A-9D6B05D42743@samsi.us>
References: <F42B39AD-F2B6-4D50-8C9E-D4E841FCB8B0@mac.com>
 <E120A79E-9149-4D12-AD7A-9D6B05D42743@samsi.us>
Message-ID: <e9d31468-8796-8d63-cffb-95dceec95608@msapiro.net>

On 08/14/2016 05:14 PM, Caesar Samsi wrote:
> 
> My confirmation page is not working.


What URL do you go to? what do you see when you go there?


> I am assuming the string following ?confirm? is the ?cookie? and to copy and paste that cookie to the confirmation page.
> 
> However, the page simply cycles back to itself.


Do you mean you go to a URL like
https://www.example.com/mailman/confirm/listname

and you get a page like

Please enter the confirmation string (i.e. cookie) that you received in
your email message, in the box below. Then hit the Submit button to
proceed to the next confirmation step.
Confirmation string: __________________________
	
and you enter the cookie and submit and you get the same page back?

If so, see <https://wiki.list.org/x/4030602>.

If not, please describe the problem more precisely.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan

From mark at msapiro.net  Thu Aug 18 02:10:28 2016
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Wed, 17 Aug 2016 23:10:28 -0700
Subject: [Mailman-Users] including all domains in virtual-mailman
In-Reply-To: <7dd6e8a2-e4c3-d5db-977c-641c322c824a@networktest.com>
References: <7dd6e8a2-e4c3-d5db-977c-641c322c824a@networktest.com>
Message-ID: <e3da2bb9-a047-05a3-f16f-504300863f5a@msapiro.net>

On 08/12/2016 11:48 AM, David Newman wrote:
> Greetings. How to get the data/virtual-mailman file to include all
> virtual domains after running bin/genaliases?
...
> # Put YOUR site-specific settings below this line.
> MTA = 'Postfix'
> 
> # Clear the Defaults.py VIRTUAL_HOSTS entry
> # VIRTUAL_HOSTS.clear()
> add_virtualhost('lists.domain1.tld','lists.domain1.tld')
> POSTFIX_STYLE_VIRTUAL_DOMAINS = ['lists.domain1.tld']

Which sets POSTFIX_STYLE_VIRTUAL_DOMAINS to a list with the single
domain 'lists.domain1.tld'.


> add_virtualhost('lists.domain2.tld','lists.domain2.tld')
> POSTFIX_STYLE_VIRTUAL_DOMAINS = ['lists.domain2.tld']

Which resets POSTFIX_STYLE_VIRTUAL_DOMAINS to a list with the single
domain 'lists.domain2.tld'.


> add_virtualhost('mail.domain3.tld','mail.domain3.tld')
> POSTFIX_STYLE_VIRTUAL_DOMAINS = ['mail.domain3.tld']

Which resets POSTFIX_STYLE_VIRTUAL_DOMAINS to a list with the single
domain 'mail.domain3.tld'.

You want only one entry like:

POSTFIX_STYLE_VIRTUAL_DOMAINS = ['lists.domain1.tld',
'lists.domain2.tld', 'mail.domain3.tld']

to set POSTFIX_STYLE_VIRTUAL_DOMAINS to a list of all three domains.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan

From mark at msapiro.net  Thu Aug 18 02:20:47 2016
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Wed, 17 Aug 2016 23:20:47 -0700
Subject: [Mailman-Users] -owner being appended to welcome or goodbye
 recipients
In-Reply-To: <20160811094914.GU24061@evol.unixnation.net>
References: <20160804173907.GQ24061@evol.unixnation.net>
 <ced68227-575b-89aa-946f-5de9039de73a@msapiro.net>
 <20160811094914.GU24061@evol.unixnation.net>
Message-ID: <4c7b784d-06de-c231-9808-992371844216@msapiro.net>

On 08/11/2016 02:49 AM, Steve wrote:
> 
> Am I correct in thinking that with mailman 2.x, the only real way to set
> these kinds of settings at the command line is to use config_list, spit
> on the config, make the changes and re-import it?


You don't need to do that. Settings not mentioned in the input to
config_list are unchanged so for example running config_list with an
imput consisting of just the single line

umbrella_list = False

will change just that setting.

Also see <https://www.msapiro.net/scripts/set_attributes>.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan

From Steven.Jones at vuw.ac.nz  Wed Aug 17 19:48:12 2016
From: Steven.Jones at vuw.ac.nz (Steven Jones)
Date: Wed, 17 Aug 2016 23:48:12 +0000
Subject: [Mailman-Users] output help please.
Message-ID: <ME1PR01MB0275DE07FEE67A22C6CFAF94D4140@ME1PR01MB0275.ausprd01.prod.outlook.com>

[root at vuwunicomailmn1 mailman]# /usr/lib/mailman/bin/sync_members -n -f /var/lib/mailman/STUDENT_EMAIL.txt All_Active_Students
Dry run mode
Invalid :
You must fix the preceding invalid addresses first.
[root at vuwunicomailmn1 mailman]#


So a corrupt/bad email address in mailman?  or in the updating file?



regards

Steven


From mark at msapiro.net  Thu Aug 18 15:21:17 2016
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Thu, 18 Aug 2016 12:21:17 -0700
Subject: [Mailman-Users] output help please.
In-Reply-To: <ME1PR01MB0275DE07FEE67A22C6CFAF94D4140@ME1PR01MB0275.ausprd01.prod.outlook.com>
References: <ME1PR01MB0275DE07FEE67A22C6CFAF94D4140@ME1PR01MB0275.ausprd01.prod.outlook.com>
Message-ID: <e5b6fb99-d807-9208-743e-f0f0232a1882@msapiro.net>

On 08/17/2016 04:48 PM, Steven Jones wrote:
> [root at vuwunicomailmn1 mailman]# /usr/lib/mailman/bin/sync_members -n -f /var/lib/mailman/STUDENT_EMAIL.txt All_Active_Students
> Dry run mode
> Invalid :
> You must fix the preceding invalid addresses first.
> [root at vuwunicomailmn1 mailman]#
> 
> 
> So a corrupt/bad email address in mailman?  or in the updating file?


The invalid address is in the input file. The report format is

Invalid : <address>

Since <address> is blank, you probably have a blank line tin the input.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan

From drh at sqlite.org  Thu Aug 18 07:48:43 2016
From: drh at sqlite.org (Richard Hipp)
Date: Thu, 18 Aug 2016 07:48:43 -0400
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Which user is harvesting sender emails?
Message-ID: <CALwJ=MxpZEJx14wSdC9cBHEGrKw8Jy-YrFFAwmz=Jz=cjceYBw@mail.gmail.com>

Mailman 2.1.20 is being used for the mailing list for an open-source
project.  There are 522 members.
(http://mailinglists.sqlite.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/fossil-users)

Whenever anyone posts to this list, somebody (presumable one of the
522 subscribers) is capturing the sender email and the subject line
and sending multiple porn-spam replies to the sender from an off-list
email address.  The question:  How to figure out which of the 522
subscribers is doing this so that they can be ejected from the list?

I tried making the list anonymous, but that was met with howls of
protest from the legitimate list members.  That is not a viable
solution.

It would be great if there were some way to send a message where the
>From field of each recipient was slightly different, and different in
a way that was traceable back to the list member.  That would allow me
to identify the leaker.

Other suggestions?

-- 
D. Richard Hipp
drh at sqlite.org

From mark at msapiro.net  Thu Aug 18 19:36:58 2016
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Thu, 18 Aug 2016 16:36:58 -0700
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Which user is harvesting sender emails?
In-Reply-To: <CALwJ=MxpZEJx14wSdC9cBHEGrKw8Jy-YrFFAwmz=Jz=cjceYBw@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CALwJ=MxpZEJx14wSdC9cBHEGrKw8Jy-YrFFAwmz=Jz=cjceYBw@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <ba85dd7a-7cb1-bc13-146f-6e32474f0c15@msapiro.net>

On 08/18/2016 04:48 AM, Richard Hipp wrote:
>
> It would be great if there were some way to send a message where the
>>From field of each recipient was slightly different, and different in
> a way that was traceable back to the list member.  That would allow me
> to identify the leaker.


There are various things such as VERP and full personalization that add
recipient specific information to the envelope sender and headers such
as Sender:, Errors-To: and even To:, but these probably won't help.

Altering the From: based on recipient can be done by modifying the code.
Say you have a message "From: Ann User <ann at example.com>" and you want
to change that to "From: Ann User <ann+xxx at example.com>" where xxx is a
unique code for each recipient.

First, ensure that either

VERP_DELIVERY_INTERVAL = 1

is in mm_cfg.py to enable VERP or that the list's Non-digest options ->
personalize is Yes or Full personalization. This will make SMTPDirect.py
use the verpdeliver function to deliver a separate message to each
recipient.

Then you need to create a mapping from list members to the 'xxx' codes.
You can for example create a file with one line per list member of the form:

member1 at example.com code1
member2 at example.com code2
...

with a single space between the member address and the code.

Finally, at the beginning of Mailman/Handlers/SMTPDirect.py, following
the line

DOT = '.'

put

import re
CODES = {}
for line in open('path/to/above/file'):
    addr, code = line.split(' ')
    CODES[addr.lower()] = code

And then at the end of the verpdeliver function just before the line

        bulkdeliver(mlist, msgcopy, msgdata, envsender, failures, conn)

put

        code = CODES[recip.lower()]
        msgfrom = msgcopy['from']
        del msgcopy['from']
        msgcopy['From'] = re.sub('@', '+' + code + '@', msgfrom)

to add the +code to the From: address.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan

From drh at sqlite.org  Thu Aug 18 19:47:20 2016
From: drh at sqlite.org (Richard Hipp)
Date: Thu, 18 Aug 2016 19:47:20 -0400
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Which user is harvesting sender emails?
In-Reply-To: <ba85dd7a-7cb1-bc13-146f-6e32474f0c15@msapiro.net>
References: <CALwJ=MxpZEJx14wSdC9cBHEGrKw8Jy-YrFFAwmz=Jz=cjceYBw@mail.gmail.com>
 <ba85dd7a-7cb1-bc13-146f-6e32474f0c15@msapiro.net>
Message-ID: <CALwJ=MzV0u8EYrOeEam1TAuC_6kfALJi-RtqtJ=xYYQ-uPD3NQ@mail.gmail.com>

On 8/18/16, Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net> wrote:
> On 08/18/2016 04:48 AM, Richard Hipp wrote:
>>
>> It would be great if there were some way to send a message where the
>>>From field of each recipient was slightly different,...

> Altering the From: based on recipient can be done by modifying the code.

My mistake.  I should have written:  "It would would be great if there
were some way to send a message where the *Subject:* field of each
recipient was slightly different...."

Does modifying the Subject instead of the From change your recipe significantly?

-- 
D. Richard Hipp
drh at sqlite.org

From steve at pearwood.info  Thu Aug 18 19:55:00 2016
From: steve at pearwood.info (Steven D'Aprano)
Date: Fri, 19 Aug 2016 09:55:00 +1000
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Which user is harvesting sender emails?
In-Reply-To: <ba85dd7a-7cb1-bc13-146f-6e32474f0c15@msapiro.net>
References: <CALwJ=MxpZEJx14wSdC9cBHEGrKw8Jy-YrFFAwmz=Jz=cjceYBw@mail.gmail.com>
 <ba85dd7a-7cb1-bc13-146f-6e32474f0c15@msapiro.net>
Message-ID: <20160818235500.GV26300@ando.pearwood.info>

On Thu, Aug 18, 2016 at 04:36:58PM -0700, Mark Sapiro wrote:
> On 08/18/2016 04:48 AM, Richard Hipp wrote:
> >
> > It would be great if there were some way to send a message where the
> >>From field of each recipient was slightly different, and different in
> > a way that was traceable back to the list member.  That would allow me
> > to identify the leaker.
> 
> 
> There are various things such as VERP and full personalization that add
> recipient specific information to the envelope sender and headers such
> as Sender:, Errors-To: and even To:, but these probably won't help.
> 
> Altering the From: based on recipient can be done by modifying the code.
> Say you have a message "From: Ann User <ann at example.com>" and you want
> to change that to "From: Ann User <ann+xxx at example.com>" where xxx is a
> unique code for each recipient.

Isn't that risky? Not all mail servers understand +xxx addresses. 
(What's the official term for that?) I know of at least one domain that 
uses -xxx instead, because they found too many broken mail servers that 
claimed that + was not legal in an email address.

The point is that if you mangle the address in this way, and people 
email Ann+xxx at example.com, there's a good chance that it won't be 
delivered.

I'd be more inclined to look at the IP address where the spam is coming 
from. Does it match one of your users? Then they are likely the culprit 
(or rather, more likely a bot on their machine is the culprit).


-- 
Steve

From mark at msapiro.net  Thu Aug 18 20:09:17 2016
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Thu, 18 Aug 2016 17:09:17 -0700
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Which user is harvesting sender emails?
In-Reply-To: <CALwJ=MzV0u8EYrOeEam1TAuC_6kfALJi-RtqtJ=xYYQ-uPD3NQ@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CALwJ=MxpZEJx14wSdC9cBHEGrKw8Jy-YrFFAwmz=Jz=cjceYBw@mail.gmail.com>
 <ba85dd7a-7cb1-bc13-146f-6e32474f0c15@msapiro.net>
 <CALwJ=MzV0u8EYrOeEam1TAuC_6kfALJi-RtqtJ=xYYQ-uPD3NQ@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <35a86441-397e-92ee-ff1f-91453f730195@msapiro.net>

On 08/18/2016 04:47 PM, Richard Hipp wrote:
> 
> My mistake.  I should have written:  "It would would be great if there
> were some way to send a message where the *Subject:* field of each
> recipient was slightly different...."
> 
> Does modifying the Subject instead of the From change your recipe significantly?


No. Depending on how you want to do it, it could be easier. I.e. if you
just wanted to put the recipient's email address in the Subject:, you
could not put any of the beginning stuff in and at the end just add

        msgsubj = msgcopy['subject']
        del msgcopy['subject']
        msgcopy['Subject'] = msgsubj + ' ' + recip

but that might be too obvious unless as Steven suggests it's a bot.

To add a code to the Subject:, you'd do all I suggested but at the end put

        code = CODES[recip.lower()]
        msgsubj = msgcopy['subject']
        del msgcopy['subject']
        msgcopy['Subject'] = msgsubj + ' ' + code

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan

From mark at msapiro.net  Thu Aug 18 20:12:24 2016
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Thu, 18 Aug 2016 17:12:24 -0700
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Which user is harvesting sender emails?
In-Reply-To: <20160818235500.GV26300@ando.pearwood.info>
References: <CALwJ=MxpZEJx14wSdC9cBHEGrKw8Jy-YrFFAwmz=Jz=cjceYBw@mail.gmail.com>
 <ba85dd7a-7cb1-bc13-146f-6e32474f0c15@msapiro.net>
 <20160818235500.GV26300@ando.pearwood.info>
Message-ID: <271ce9d7-1c25-14b6-1ef3-d37a9b282907@msapiro.net>

On 08/18/2016 04:55 PM, Steven D'Aprano wrote:
> On Thu, Aug 18, 2016 at 04:36:58PM -0700, Mark Sapiro wrote:
>>
>> Altering the From: based on recipient can be done by modifying the code.
>> Say you have a message "From: Ann User <ann at example.com>" and you want
>> to change that to "From: Ann User <ann+xxx at example.com>" where xxx is a
>> unique code for each recipient.
> 
> Isn't that risky? Not all mail servers understand +xxx addresses. 
> (What's the official term for that?) I know of at least one domain that 
> uses -xxx instead, because they found too many broken mail servers that 
> claimed that + was not legal in an email address.
> 
> The point is that if you mangle the address in this way, and people 
> email Ann+xxx at example.com, there's a good chance that it won't be 
> delivered.


Yes, it's risky for the reasons you suggest. Putting the code in the
Subject: as Richard asks in a follow up is much safer.


> I'd be more inclined to look at the IP address where the spam is coming 
> from. Does it match one of your users? Then they are likely the culprit 
> (or rather, more likely a bot on their machine is the culprit).


Good point.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan

From mark at msapiro.net  Thu Aug 18 20:47:22 2016
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Thu, 18 Aug 2016 17:47:22 -0700
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Mailman and local user collisions
In-Reply-To: <CAGo-12C0Jx-W7thc+goL+YP6jyV8FBPkDXos1W853rt=Ac2Kug@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAGo-12C0Jx-W7thc+goL+YP6jyV8FBPkDXos1W853rt=Ac2Kug@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <eac1c977-2e04-8f19-d1ee-4c075d5f0fa0@msapiro.net>

On 08/12/2016 02:08 PM, Ezsra McDonald wrote:
> I discovered recently that there is a local user and a mailman list with
> the same user at . The mail goes to the list and not the user. What is the
> trick to make Postfix handle these separately?


As others have noted, if name at domain is both a list and a local user,
there's no way Postfix can know to which any message should be
delivered. I.e., you can't do that.


> Lets say the domain is somewhere.com and the list is list.somewhere.com.


If you mean the domain is somewhere.com and the local user is
name at somewhere.com and the list is name at list.somewhere.com, then that
can work, but it is not completely straightforward because there will
still be a conflict if the virtual address name at list.somewhere.com is
mapped to the local address name.


> I read about virtual domains but when I attempt to use them they do not
> like the mailman aliases file. We don't want to generate files every time a
> new list is added, updated or removed.


There's no way you can avoid updating aliases and virtual_alias_maps,
etc as lists are created and deleted, but this process can be automated
with Postfix so no effort beyond creating/deleting the list is involved.

the standard way of configuring Mailman/Postfix virtual domains is
described at
<http://www.list.org/mailman-install/postfix-integration.html> and
<http://www.list.org/mailman-install/postfix-virtual.html>, but this
won't work in your case because it will create virtual mappings like

name at list.somewhere.com              name
name-admin at list.somewhere.com        name-admin
name-bounces at list.somewhere.com      name-bounces
name-confirm at list.somewhere.com      name-confirm
...

and local aliases like

name:             "|/path/to/mail/mailman post name"
name-admin:       "|/path/to/mail/mailman admin name"
name-bounces:     "|/path/to/mail/mailman bounces name"
name-confirm:     "|/path/to/mail/mailman confirm name"
...

and the name: alias will still conflict with the 'name' local user.
Thus, you need to use a technique similar to that described at
<https://wiki.list.org/x/10715238> to create custom POSTFIX_ALIAS_CMD
and POSTFIX_MAP_CMD scripts to edit the aliases and virtual-mailman
files before invoking postalias and postmap.

E.g., for POSTFIX_ALIAS_CMD make a script that will prefix the listname
on the left as in

xxx-name:             "|/path/to/mail/mailman post name"
xxx-name-admin:       "|/path/to/mail/mailman admin name"
xxx-name-bounces:     "|/path/to/mail/mailman bounces name"
xxx-name-confirm:     "|/path/to/mail/mailman confirm name"
...

and then invoke postalias and for POSTFIX_MAP_CMD make a script that
will prefix the listname on the right as in

name at list.somewhere.com              xxx-name
name-admin at list.somewhere.com        xxx-name-admin
name-bounces at list.somewhere.com      xxx-name-bounces
name-confirm at list.somewhere.com      xxx-name-confirm
...

and then invoke postmap.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan

From mark at msapiro.net  Fri Aug 19 03:09:53 2016
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Fri, 19 Aug 2016 00:09:53 -0700
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Imminent release of a Mailman security fix.
Message-ID: <5aaec549-ad73-5192-8a7a-40eeaf2f4bbe@msapiro.net>

There is a CSRF vulnerability associated with the user options page.
This could conceivably allow an attacker to obtain a user's password.

This is reported at <https://bugs.launchpad.net/mailman/+bug/1614841>.

I have developed a fix which is a small patch to two modules. I plan to
release Mailman 2.1.23 with this and other fixes on Saturday, Aug 27 and
also to post at the same time the patch which can be applied stand-alone.

Neither the bug report nor the fix reveals much detail about the attack,
but to allay any concern, I'm delaying the release for a week to allow
people to plan for installation of at least the patch at the time of
release.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan

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From mailmanu-20150316 at billmail.scconsult.com  Fri Aug 19 10:21:10 2016
From: mailmanu-20150316 at billmail.scconsult.com (Bill Cole)
Date: Fri, 19 Aug 2016 10:21:10 -0400
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Which user is harvesting sender emails?
In-Reply-To: <ba85dd7a-7cb1-bc13-146f-6e32474f0c15@msapiro.net>
References: <CALwJ=MxpZEJx14wSdC9cBHEGrKw8Jy-YrFFAwmz=Jz=cjceYBw@mail.gmail.com>
 <ba85dd7a-7cb1-bc13-146f-6e32474f0c15@msapiro.net>
Message-ID: <D11DC9D4-0F33-4D87-AABA-F3D86EE1D459@billmail.scconsult.com>

On 18 Aug 2016, at 19:36, Mark Sapiro wrote:

> Altering the From: based on recipient can be done by modifying the 
> code.
> Say you have a message "From: Ann User <ann at example.com>" and you want
> to change that to "From: Ann User <ann+xxx at example.com>" where xxx is 
> a
> unique code for each recipient.


Please, don't anyone do that, ever. It's not just "risky," as noted in 
earlier discussion, it would be positively abusive.

A less obvious approach would be to add an address IN A DOMAIN YOU 
CONTROL in a X-[something] header (or perhaps a Cc header) that is 
unique to each recipient so that when you get mail to that address, 
you've identified your problem user.

HOWEVER, there is an angle to this problem that should be understood: 
it's probably not being done by a human subscriber. One possibility is 
that a subscriber has malware on their machine that is generating the 
spam, so when you identify a subscriber who is your vector, you may only 
be identifying someone which an insecure machine. Another possibility 
(which would be untraceable and easy to automate on the spammer side) is 
that someone other than a subscriber is harvesting addresses and 
subjects from your web archive at mail-archive.com, where every message 
has a button to "Reply via email" that kicks back a redirection to a 
mailto: URL with the sender's address and Subject.

From jimpop at gmail.com  Fri Aug 19 10:39:40 2016
From: jimpop at gmail.com (Jim Popovitch)
Date: Fri, 19 Aug 2016 10:39:40 -0400
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Which user is harvesting sender emails?
In-Reply-To: <D11DC9D4-0F33-4D87-AABA-F3D86EE1D459@billmail.scconsult.com>
References: <CALwJ=MxpZEJx14wSdC9cBHEGrKw8Jy-YrFFAwmz=Jz=cjceYBw@mail.gmail.com>
 <ba85dd7a-7cb1-bc13-146f-6e32474f0c15@msapiro.net>
 <D11DC9D4-0F33-4D87-AABA-F3D86EE1D459@billmail.scconsult.com>
Message-ID: <CAGfsgR0COdqq621ozE+gAukH1UAuT4P4Hbzz+pU9ceHH0VVSzA@mail.gmail.com>

On Fri, Aug 19, 2016 at 10:21 AM, Bill Cole
<mailmanu-20150316 at billmail.scconsult.com> wrote:
> On 18 Aug 2016, at 19:36, Mark Sapiro wrote:
>
>> Altering the From: based on recipient can be done by modifying the code.
>> Say you have a message "From: Ann User <ann at example.com>" and you want
>> to change that to "From: Ann User <ann+xxx at example.com>" where xxx is a
>> unique code for each recipient.
>
>
> Please, don't anyone do that, ever. It's not just "risky," as noted in
> earlier discussion, it would be positively abusive.
>
> A less obvious approach would be to add an address IN A DOMAIN YOU CONTROL
> in a X-[something] header (or perhaps a Cc header) that is unique to each
> recipient so that when you get mail to that address, you've identified your
> problem user.

PRVS/BATV

-Jim P.

From mailmanu-20150316 at billmail.scconsult.com  Fri Aug 19 11:01:36 2016
From: mailmanu-20150316 at billmail.scconsult.com (Bill Cole)
Date: Fri, 19 Aug 2016 11:01:36 -0400
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Which user is harvesting sender emails?
In-Reply-To: <CAGfsgR0COdqq621ozE+gAukH1UAuT4P4Hbzz+pU9ceHH0VVSzA@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CALwJ=MxpZEJx14wSdC9cBHEGrKw8Jy-YrFFAwmz=Jz=cjceYBw@mail.gmail.com>
 <ba85dd7a-7cb1-bc13-146f-6e32474f0c15@msapiro.net>
 <D11DC9D4-0F33-4D87-AABA-F3D86EE1D459@billmail.scconsult.com>
 <CAGfsgR0COdqq621ozE+gAukH1UAuT4P4Hbzz+pU9ceHH0VVSzA@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <15911185-4036-4B34-A30B-A81875544D3A@billmail.scconsult.com>

On 19 Aug 2016, at 10:39, Jim Popovitch wrote:

> PRVS/BATV

How is that relevant to this issue?

BATV only applies to the envelope sender address, which any proper 
mailing list (including any Mailman list) completely replaces with its 
own bounce address so that bounces go to the mailing list software and 
not to the original sender or the list itself. As the OP said, this is 
someone or something spamming the original message authors (as shown in 
 From headers) with the same Subject header as something they've posted 
to a list.

From jimpop at gmail.com  Fri Aug 19 11:13:46 2016
From: jimpop at gmail.com (Jim Popovitch)
Date: Fri, 19 Aug 2016 11:13:46 -0400
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Which user is harvesting sender emails?
In-Reply-To: <15911185-4036-4B34-A30B-A81875544D3A@billmail.scconsult.com>
References: <CALwJ=MxpZEJx14wSdC9cBHEGrKw8Jy-YrFFAwmz=Jz=cjceYBw@mail.gmail.com>
 <ba85dd7a-7cb1-bc13-146f-6e32474f0c15@msapiro.net>
 <D11DC9D4-0F33-4D87-AABA-F3D86EE1D459@billmail.scconsult.com>
 <CAGfsgR0COdqq621ozE+gAukH1UAuT4P4Hbzz+pU9ceHH0VVSzA@mail.gmail.com>
 <15911185-4036-4B34-A30B-A81875544D3A@billmail.scconsult.com>
Message-ID: <CAGfsgR22Cz-X0c_fgUv=3jSAzjP90r-fhqnagO8Gxr088oCA8A@mail.gmail.com>

On Fri, Aug 19, 2016 at 11:01 AM, Bill Cole
<mailmanu-20150316 at billmail.scconsult.com> wrote:
> On 19 Aug 2016, at 10:39, Jim Popovitch wrote:
>
>> PRVS/BATV
>
>
> How is that relevant to this issue?

Well it's not, it's only relevant to what you and Mark were discussing
(modification of From:)

I merely provided an example of a popular in-use modification of
From:, because you said "Please, don't anyone do that, ever.".

-Jim P.

From mailmanu-20150316 at billmail.scconsult.com  Fri Aug 19 12:38:03 2016
From: mailmanu-20150316 at billmail.scconsult.com (Bill Cole)
Date: Fri, 19 Aug 2016 12:38:03 -0400
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Which user is harvesting sender emails?
In-Reply-To: <CAGfsgR22Cz-X0c_fgUv=3jSAzjP90r-fhqnagO8Gxr088oCA8A@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CALwJ=MxpZEJx14wSdC9cBHEGrKw8Jy-YrFFAwmz=Jz=cjceYBw@mail.gmail.com>
 <ba85dd7a-7cb1-bc13-146f-6e32474f0c15@msapiro.net>
 <D11DC9D4-0F33-4D87-AABA-F3D86EE1D459@billmail.scconsult.com>
 <CAGfsgR0COdqq621ozE+gAukH1UAuT4P4Hbzz+pU9ceHH0VVSzA@mail.gmail.com>
 <15911185-4036-4B34-A30B-A81875544D3A@billmail.scconsult.com>
 <CAGfsgR22Cz-X0c_fgUv=3jSAzjP90r-fhqnagO8Gxr088oCA8A@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <F2D1C3CB-BE62-4627-BC02-C4EEE8F37DFD@billmail.scconsult.com>

On 19 Aug 2016, at 11:13, Jim Popovitch wrote:

> On Fri, Aug 19, 2016 at 11:01 AM, Bill Cole
> <mailmanu-20150316 at billmail.scconsult.com> wrote:
>> On 19 Aug 2016, at 10:39, Jim Popovitch wrote:
>>
>>> PRVS/BATV
>>
>>
>> How is that relevant to this issue?
>
> Well it's not, it's only relevant to what you and Mark were discussing
> (modification of From:)

Ah, I see. I guess... However, BATV does NOT modify the From: header. It 
only replaces a local RFC5321.MailFrom address (a.k.a. bounce address, 
SMTP envelope sender, return-path) with another local address specific 
to that message.

> I merely provided an example of a popular in-use modification of
> From:, because you said "Please, don't anyone do that, ever.".

My plea of prohibition only applies to replacing a RFC5322.From address 
(the "From:" *header*) which is not in the local administrative domain 
with some other locally-invented address which is also not in the local 
administrative domain without the affirmative informed consent of the 
owners of both addresses. That is particularly important in the context 
of a mailing list which broadcasts the invented addresses into a space 
that is known to return obnoxious mail to RFC5322.From addresses.

This is a narrowly specific and jargoned-up case of a broad general 
rule:

    Don't invent and/or share addresses that belong to others without 
consent.

From ginesgb at gmail.com  Fri Aug 19 07:15:24 2016
From: ginesgb at gmail.com (Gines Granados Bayona)
Date: Fri, 19 Aug 2016 13:15:24 +0200
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Problems with mail delivery,
 configure Mailman with Postfix
In-Reply-To: <CAHkBno5b8W5zBcML8exkN4Dapjmd66P_z9egrB2BBGxM+gqnNQ@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAHkBno5b8W5zBcML8exkN4Dapjmd66P_z9egrB2BBGxM+gqnNQ@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAHkBno5=Yz-KiB0eFM8LJ1_sFDyoA2JGhJRNBHVXUaeF_V+vxQ@mail.gmail.com>

>
> Hi all, greetings Mark Sapiro.
>
> I have made the settings you provided me Mark Sapiro, but still does not
> work, and even though I check can not find the error.
>
>
>
> Run the command you indicated me, Mark Sapiro
>
>
>
> [root at lab log]# postconf -n
>
> alias_database = hash:/etc/aliases
>
> alias_maps = hash:/etc/aliases
>
> command_directory = /usr/sbin
>
> config_directory = /etc/postfix
>
> daemon_directory = /usr/libexec/postfix
>
> data_directory = /var/lib/postfix
>
> debug_peer_level = 2
>
> html_directory = no
>
> inet_interfaces = localhost
>
> inet_protocols = ipv4
>
> local_recipient_maps = proxy:unix:passwd.byname $alias_maps
>
> mail_owner = postfix
>
> mailq_path = /usr/bin/mailq.postfix
>
> manpage_directory = /usr/share/man
>
> mydestination = $mydomain, localhost.$mydomain, $myhostname localhost
>
> mydomain = lab.company.net
>
> myhostname = lista.$mydomain
>
> mynetworks = $mydomain 127.0.0.0/8 [::ffff:127.0.0.0]/104 [::1]/128
>
> newaliases_path = /usr/bin/newaliases.postfix
>
> queue_directory = /var/spool/postfix
>
> readme_directory = /usr/share/doc/postfix-2.6.6/README_FILES
>
> recipient_delimiter = +
>
> sample_directory = /usr/share/doc/postfix-2.6.6/samples
>
> sendmail_path = /usr/sbin/sendmail.postfix
>
> setgid_group = postdrop
>
> unknown_local_recipient_reject_code = 550
>
> [root at lab log]#
>
> Then locate the configuration file
>
> [root at lab /]# find / -iname mm_cfg.py
>
> /usr/lib/mailman/Mailman/mm_cfg.py
>
> /etc/mailman/mm_cfg.py
>
> I accessed to the directory
>
> [root at lab /]# cd /usr/lib/mailman/Mailman/
>
>
>
> And I proceeded to see the configuration.
>
> [root at lab Mailman]# cat mm_cfg.py
>
> # -*- python -*-
>
>
>
> # Copyright (C) 1998,1999,2000,2001,2002 by the Free Software Foundation,
> Inc.
>
> #
>
> # This program is free software; you can redistribute it and/or
>
> # modify it under the terms of the GNU General Public License
>
> # as published by the Free Software Foundation; either version 2
>
> # of the License, or (at your option) any later version.
>
> #
>
> # This program is distributed in the hope that it will be useful,
>
> # but WITHOUT ANY WARRANTY; without even the implied warranty of
>
> # MERCHANTABILITY or FITNESS FOR A PARTICULAR PURPOSE.  See the
>
> # GNU General Public License for more details.
>
> #
>
> # You should have received a copy of the GNU General Public License
>
> # along with this program; if not, write to the Free Software
>
> # Foundation, Inc., 59 Temple Place - Suite 330, Boston, MA 02111-1307,
> USA.
>
>
>
> """This module contains your site-specific settings.
>
>
>
> From a brand new distribution it should be copied to mm_cfg.py.  If you
>
> already have an mm_cfg.py, be careful to add in only the new settings you
>
> want.  Mailman's installation procedure will never overwrite your
> mm_cfg.py
>
> file.
>
>
>
> The complete set of distributed defaults, with documentation, are in the
> file
>
> Defaults.py.  In mm_cfg.py, override only those you want to change, after
> the
>
>
>
>   from Defaults import *
>
>
>
> line (see below).
>
>
>
> Note that these are just default settings; many can be overridden via the
>
> administrator and user interfaces on a per-list or per-user basis.
>
>
>
> """
>
>
>
> ###############################################
>
> # Here's where we get the distributed defaults.
>
>
>
> from Defaults import *
>
> import pwd, grp
>
>
>
> ##################################################
>
> # Put YOUR site-specific settings below this line.
>
>
>
> #ATTENTION: when you use SELinux, mailman might not
>
> #be able to recompile the configuration file
>
> #due to policy settings. If this is the case,
>
> #please run (as root) the supplied "mailman-update-cfg" script
>
>
>
> ##############################################################
>
> #    Here's where we override shipped defaults with settings #
>
> #    suitable for the RPM package.                           #
>
> MAILMAN_UID = pwd.getpwnam('mailman')[2]
>
> MAILMAN_GID = grp.getgrnam('mailman')[2]
>
>
>
> ##############################################################
>
> #    Set URL and email domain names                          #
>
> #
>
> # Mailman needs to know about (at least) two fully-qualified domain
>
> # names (fqdn)
>
> #
>
> # 1) the hostname used in your urls (DEFAULT_URL_HOST)
>
> # 2) the hostname used in email addresses for your domain
> (DEFAULT_EMAIL_HOST)
>
> #
>
> # For example, if people visit your Mailman system with
>
> # "http://www.dom.ain/mailman" then your url fqdn is "www.dom.ain",
>
> # and if people send mail to your system via "yourlist at dom.ain" then
>
> # your email fqdn is "dom.ain".  DEFAULT_URL_HOST controls the former,
>
> # and DEFAULT_EMAIL_HOST controls the latter.  Mailman also needs to
>
> # know how to map from one to the other (this is especially important
>
> # if you're running with virtual domains).  You use
>
> # "add_virtualhost(urlfqdn, emailfqdn)" to add new mappings.
>
>
>
> # Default to using the FQDN of machine mailman is running on.
>
> # If this is not correct for your installation delete the following 5
>
> # lines that acquire the FQDN and manually edit the hosts instead.
>
>
>
> from socket import *
>
> try:
>
>     fqdn = getfqdn()
>
> except:
>
>     fqdn = 'mm_cfg_has_unknown_host_domains'
>
>
>
> #DEFAULT_URL_HOST   = 'xxxx.xxxx.net'
>
> #DEFAULT_EMAIL_HOST = 'xxxx.xxxx.net'
>
> DEFAULT_URL_HOST   = 'lab.company.net'
>
> DEFAULT_EMAIL_HOST = 'lab.company.net'
>
>
>
>
>
> SMTPHOST = 'lab.company.net'
>
>
>
> # Because we've overriden the virtual hosts above add_virtualhost
>
> # MUST be called after they have been defined.
>
>
>
> add_virtualhost(DEFAULT_URL_HOST, DEFAULT_EMAIL_HOST)
>
>
>
>
>
> ##############################################################
>
> # Put YOUR site-specific configuration below, in mm_cfg.py . #
>
> # See Defaults.py for explanations of the values.            #
>
>
>
> # Note - if you're looking for something that is imported from mm_cfg, but
> you
>
> # didn't find it above, it's probably in Defaults.py.
>
> [root at lab Mailman]#
>
> I think that it is correctly made, check the directory to see the contents
> and check other settings.
>
>
> [root at lab mailman]# ls -lrt
>
> total 36
>
> -rw-r--r-- 1 root mailman 14100 Jul 24  2015 sitelist.cfg
>
> -rw-rw---- 1 root mailman  3038 Jul 13 11:11 aliases
>
> -rw-r----- 1 root mailman 12288 Jul 13 11:11 aliases.db
>
> lrwxrwxrwx 1 root mailman    34 Jul 13 12:33 mm_cfg.py ->
> /usr/lib/mailman/Mailman/mm_cfg.py
>
> -rw-r----- 1 root mailman    41 Jul 22 08:59 adm.pw
>
>
> Aliases file
>
> [root at lab mailman]# cat aliases
>
> # This file is generated by Mailman, and is kept in sync with the
>
> # binary hash file aliases.db.  YOU SHOULD NOT MANUALLY EDIT THIS FILE
>
> # unless you know what you're doing, and can keep the two files properly
>
> # in sync.  If you screw it up, you're on your own.
>
>
>
> # The ultimate loop stopper address
>
> mailman-loop: /var/lib/mailman/data/owner-bounces.mbox
>
>
>
> # STANZA START: sistemas.rancid
>
> # CREATED: Wed Jul 13 11:10:06 2016
>
> sistemas.rancid:             "|/usr/lib/mailman/mail/mailman post
> sistemas.rancid"
>
> sistemas.rancid-admin:       "|/usr/lib/mailman/mail/mailman admin
> sistemas.rancid"
>
> sistemas.rancid-bounces:     "|/usr/lib/mailman/mail/mailman bounces
> sistemas.rancid"
>
> sistemas.rancid-confirm:     "|/usr/lib/mailman/mail/mailman confirm
> sistemas.rancid"
>
> sistemas.rancid-join:        "|/usr/lib/mailman/mail/mailman join
> sistemas.rancid"
>
> sistemas.rancid-leave:       "|/usr/lib/mailman/mail/mailman leave
> sistemas.rancid"
>
> sistemas.rancid-owner:       "|/usr/lib/mailman/mail/mailman owner
> sistemas.rancid"
>
> sistemas.rancid-request:     "|/usr/lib/mailman/mail/mailman request
> sistemas.rancid"
>
> sistemas.rancid-subscribe:   "|/usr/lib/mailman/mail/mailman subscribe
> sistemas.rancid"
>
> sistemas.rancid-unsubscribe: "|/usr/lib/mailman/mail/mailman unsubscribe
> sistemas.rancid"
>
> # STANZA END: sistemas.rancid
>
>
>
> # STANZA START: man.rancid
>
> # CREATED: Wed Jul 13 11:11:02 2016
>
> man.rancid:             "|/usr/lib/mailman/mail/mailman post man.rancid"
>
> man.rancid-admin:       "|/usr/lib/mailman/mail/mailman admin man.rancid"
>
> man.rancid-bounces:     "|/usr/lib/mailman/mail/mailman bounces
> man.rancid"
>
> man.rancid-confirm:     "|/usr/lib/mailman/mail/mailman confirm
> man.rancid"
>
> man.rancid-join:        "|/usr/lib/mailman/mail/mailman join man.rancid"
>
> man.rancid-leave:       "|/usr/lib/mailman/mail/mailman leave man.rancid"
>
> man.rancid-owner:       "|/usr/lib/mailman/mail/mailman owner man.rancid"
>
> man.rancid-request:     "|/usr/lib/mailman/mail/mailman request
> man.rancid"
>
> man.rancid-subscribe:   "|/usr/lib/mailman/mail/mailman subscribe
> man.rancid"
>
> man.rancid-unsubscribe: "|/usr/lib/mailman/mail/mailman unsubscribe
> man.rancid"
>
> # STANZA END: man.rancid
>
> File sitelist.cfg
>
> [root at lab mailman]# cat sitelist.cfg
>
> ## "mailman" mailing list configuration settings -*- python -*-
>
> ## captured on Sat Mar 22 00:21:06 2003
>
>
>
> ## Mailman - The GNU Mailing List Management System
>
> ## Copyright (C) 2003 Free Software Foundation, Inc.
>
> ## 51 Franklin Street, Fifth Floor, Boston, MA 02110-1301, USA
>
>
>
> ## General options
>
> #
>
> # Fundamental list characteristics, including descriptive info and basic
>
> # behaviors.
>
>
>
> # The capitalization of this name can be changed to make it presentable
>
> # in polite company as a proper noun, or to make an acronym part all
>
> # upper case, etc.  However, the name will be advertised as the email
>
> # address (e.g., in subscribe confirmation notices), so it should not be
>
> # otherwise altered.  (Email addresses are not case sensitive, but they
>
> # are sensitive to almost everything else :-)
>
> real_name = 'Mailman'
>
>
>
> # This description is used when the mailing list is listed with other
>
> # mailing lists, or in headers, and so forth.  It should be as succinct
>
> # as you can get it, while still identifying what the list is.
>
> description = 'Mailman site list'
>
>
>
> # This text will be prepended to subject lines of messages posted to the
>
> # list, to distinguish mailing list messages in in mailbox summaries.
>
> # Brevity is premium here, it's ok to shorten long mailing list names to
>
> # something more concise, as long as it still identifies the mailing
>
> # list.
>
> subject_prefix = '[Mailman Site List] '
>
>
>
> # List moderators (and list administrators) are sent daily reminders of
>
> # requests pending approval, like subscriptions to a moderated list, or
>
> # postings that are being held for one reason or another.  Setting this
>
> # option causes notices to be sent immediately on the arrival of new
>
> # requests as well.
>
> #
>
> # legal values are:
>
> #    0 = "No"
>
> #    1 = "Yes"
>
> admin_immed_notify = 1
>
>
>
> # Should administrator get notices of subscribes and unsubscribes?
>
> #
>
> # legal values are:
>
> #    0 = "No"
>
> #    1 = "Yes"
>
> admin_notify_mchanges = 1
>
>
>
> # Approval notices are sent when mail triggers certain of the limits
>
> # except routine list moderation and spam filters, for which notices are
>
> # not sent.  This option overrides ever sending the notice.
>
> #
>
> # legal values are:
>
> #    0 = "No"
>
> #    1 = "Yes"
>
> respond_to_post_requests = 1
>
>
>
> ## Nondigest options
>
> #
>
> # Policies concerning immediately delivered list traffic.
>
>
>
> # Can subscribers choose to receive mail immediately, rather than in
>
> # batched digests?
>
> #
>
> # legal values are:
>
> #    0 = "No"
>
> #    1 = "Yes"
>
> nondigestable = 1
>
>
>
> # Normally, Mailman sends the regular delivery messages to the mail
>
> # server in batches.  This is much more efficent because it reduces the
>
> # amount of traffic between Mailman and the mail server.
>
> #
>
> # However, some lists can benefit from a more personalized approach.  In
>
> # this case, Mailman crafts a new message for each member on the regular
>
> # delivery list.  Turning this feature on may degrade the performance of
>
> # your site, so you need to carefully consider whether the trade-off is
>
> # worth it, or whether there are other ways to accomplish what you want.
>
> # You should also carefully monitor your system load to make sure it is
>
> # acceptable.
>
> #
>
> # Select No to disable personalization and send messages to the members
>
> # in batches.  Select Yes to personalize deliveries and allow additional
>
> # substitution variables in message headers and footers (see below).  In
>
> # addition, by selecting Full Personalization, the To header of posted
>
> # messages will be modified to include the member's address instead of
>
> # the list's posting address.
>
> #
>
> # When personalization is enabled, a few more expansion variables that
>
> # can be included in the <a href="?VARHELP=nondigest/msg_header">message
>
> # header and message footer.
>
> #
>
> # These additional substitution variables will be available for your
>
> # headers and footers, when this feature is enabled:
>
> #
>
> # user_address - The address of the user, coerced to lower case.
>
> # user_delivered_to - The case-preserved address that the user is
>
> # subscribed with. user_password - The user's password. user_name - The
>
> # user's full name. user_optionsurl - The url to the user's option page.
>
> #
>
> #
>
> #
>
> # legal values are:
>
> #    0 = "No"
>
> #    1 = "Yes"
>
> #    2 = "Full Personalization"
>
> personalize = 1
>
>
>
> # Text appended to the bottom of every immediately-delivery message.
>
> # This text can include Python format strings which are resolved against
>
> # list attributes.  The list of substitutions allowed are:
>
> #
>
> #
>
> # real_name - The `pretty' name of the list; usually the list name with
>
> # capitalization.
>
> #
>
> # list_name - The name by which the list is identified in URLs, where
>
> # case is significant.  (For backwards compability, _internal_name is
>
> # equivalent.)
>
> #
>
> # host_name - The fully qualified domain name that the list server runs
>
> # on.
>
> #
>
> # web_page_url - The base URL for Mailman.  This can be appended with,
>
> # e.g. listinfo/%(internal_name)s to yield the listinfo page for the
>
> # mailing list.
>
> #
>
> # description - The brief description of the mailing list.
>
> #
>
> # info - The full description of the mailing list.
>
> #
>
> # cgiext - The extension added to CGI scripts.
>
> #
>
> #
>
> msg_footer = """_______________________________________________
>
> %(real_name)s site list
>
> %(real_name)s@%(host_name)s
>
> %(web_page_url)slistinfo%(cgiext)s/%(_internal_name)s"""
>
>
>
> ## Digest options
>
> #
>
> # Batched-delivery digest characteristics.
>
>
>
> # Can list members choose to receive list traffic bunched in digests?
>
> #
>
> # legal values are:
>
> #    0 = "No"
>
> #    1 = "Yes"
>
> digestable = 0
>
>
>
> ## Privacy options
>
> #
>
> # This section allows you to configure subscription and membership
>
> # exposure policy.  You can also control whether this list is public or
>
> # not.  See also the <a
>
> # href="http://www.wooz.org/mailman/admin/mailman/archive">Archival
>
> # Options</a> section for separate archive-related privacy settings.
>
>
>
> # Advertise this list when people ask what lists are on this machine?
>
> #
>
> # legal values are:
>
> #    0 = "No"
>
> #    1 = "Yes"
>
> advertised = 0
>
>
>
> # Confirm (*) - email confirmation required Require approval - require
>
> # list administrator approval for subscriptions Confirm and approve -
>
> # both confirm and approve
>
> #
>
> # (*) when someone requests a subscription, Mailman sends them a notice
>
> # with a unique subscription request number that they must reply to in
>
> # order to subscribe. This prevents mischievous (or malicious) people
>
> # from creating subscriptions for others without their consent.
>
> #
>
> # legal values are:
>
> #    1 = "Confirm"
>
> #    2 = "Require approval"
>
> #    3 = "Confirm and approve"
>
> subscribe_policy = 2
>
>
>
> # When members want to leave a list, they will make an unsubscription
>
> # request, either via the web or via email. Normally it is best for you
>
> # to allow open unsubscriptions so that users can easily remove
>
> # themselves from mailing lists (they get really upset if they can't get
>
> # off lists!).
>
> #
>
> # For some lists though, you may want to impose moderator approval
>
> # before an unsubscription request is processed.  Examples of such lists
>
> # include a corporate mailing list that all employees are required to be
>
> # members of.
>
> #
>
> # legal values are:
>
> #    0 = "No"
>
> #    1 = "Yes"
>
> unsubscribe_policy = 0
>
>
>
> # Addresses in this list are banned outright from subscribing to this
>
> # mailing list, with no further moderation required.  Add addresses one
>
> # per line; start the line with a ^ character to designate a regular
>
> # expression match.
>
> ban_list = []
>
>
>
> # When set, the list of subscribers is protected by member or admin
>
> # password authentication.
>
> #
>
> # legal values are:
>
> #    0 = "Anyone"
>
> #    1 = "List members"
>
> #    2 = "List admin only"
>
> private_roster = 2
>
>
>
> # Setting this option causes member email addresses to be transformed
>
> # when they are presented on list web pages (both in text and as links),
>
> # so they're not trivially recognizable as email addresses.  The
>
> # intention is to prevent the addresses from being snarfed up by
>
> # automated web scanners for use by spammers.
>
> #
>
> # legal values are:
>
> #    0 = "No"
>
> #    1 = "Yes"
>
> obscure_addresses = 1
>
>
>
> ## Privacy options
>
> #
>
> # When a message is posted to the list, a series of moderation steps are
>
> # take to decide whether the a moderator must first approve the message
>
> # or not.  This section contains the controls for moderation of both
>
> # member and non-member postings.
>
> #
>
> # <p>Member postings are held for moderation if their <b>moderation
>
> # flag</b> is turned on.  You can control whether member postings are
>
> # moderated by default or not.
>
> #
>
> # <p>Non-member postings can be automatically <a
>
> # href="?VARHELP=privacy/sender/accept_these_nonmembers" >accepted</a>,
>
> # <a href="?VARHELP=privacy/sender/hold_these_nonmembers">held for
>
> # moderation</a>, <a
>
> # href="?VARHELP=privacy/sender/reject_these_nonmembers" >rejected</a>
>
> # (bounced), or <a
>
> # href="?VARHELP=privacy/sender/discard_these_nonmembers"
>
> # >discarded</a>, either individually or as a group.  Any posting from a
>
> # non-member who is not explicitly accepted, rejected, or discarded,
>
> # will have their posting filtered by the <a
>
> # href="?VARHELP=privacy/sender/generic_nonmember_action">general
>
> # non-member rules</a>.
>
> #
>
> # <p>In the text boxes below, add one address per line; start the line
>
> # with a ^ character to designate a <a href=
>
> # "http://docs.python.org/library/re.html" >Python regular
>
> # expression</a>.  When entering backslashes, do so as if you were using
>
> # Python raw strings (i.e. you generally just use a single backslash).
>
> #
>
> # <p>Note that non-regexp matches are always done first.
>
>
>
> # Each list member has a moderation flag which says whether messages
>
> # from the list member can be posted directly to the list, or must first
>
> # be approved by the list moderator.  When the moderation flag is turned
>
> # on, list member postings must be approved first.  You, the list
>
> # administrator can decide whether a specific individual's postings will
>
> # be moderated or not.
>
> #
>
> # When a new member is subscribed, their initial moderation flag takes
>
> # its value from this option.  Turn this option off to accept member
>
> # postings by default.  Turn this option on to, by default, moderate
>
> # member postings first.  You can always manually set an individual
>
> # member's moderation bit by using the membership management screens.
>
> #
>
> # legal values are:
>
> #    0 = "No"
>
> #    1 = "Yes"
>
> default_member_moderation = 0
>
>
>
> # Hold -- this holds the message for approval by the list moderators.
>
> #
>
> # Reject -- this automatically rejects the message by sending a bounce
>
> # notice to the post's author.  The text of the bounce notice can be <a
>
> # href="?VARHELP=privacy/sender/member_moderation_notice" >configured by
>
> # you.
>
> #
>
> # Discard -- this simply discards the message, with no notice sent to
>
> # the post's author.
>
> #
>
> #
>
> # legal values are:
>
> #    0 = "Hold"
>
> #    1 = "Reject"
>
> #    2 = "Discard"
>
> member_moderation_action = 1
>
>
>
> # When a post from a non-member is received, the message's sender is
>
> # matched against the list of explicitly <a
>
> # href="?VARHELP=privacy/sender/accept_these_nonmembers" >accepted,
>
> # held, <a href="?VARHELP=privacy/sender/reject_these_nonmembers"
>
> # >rejected (bounced), and <a
>
> # href="?VARHELP=privacy/sender/discard_these_nonmembers" >discarded
>
> # addresses.  If no match is found, then this action is taken.
>
> #
>
> # legal values are:
>
> #    0 = "Accept"
>
> #    1 = "Hold"
>
> #    2 = "Reject"
>
> #    3 = "Discard"
>
> generic_nonmember_action = 2
>
>
>
> # Should messages from non-members, which are automatically discarded,
>
> # be forwarded to the list moderator?
>
> #
>
> # legal values are:
>
> #    0 = "No"
>
> #    1 = "Yes"
>
> forward_auto_discards = 1
>
>
>
> ## Bounce options
>
> #
>
> # These policies control the automatic bounce processing system in
>
> # Mailman.  Here's an overview of how it works.
>
> #
>
> # <p>When a bounce is received, Mailman tries to extract two pieces of
>
> # information from the message: the address of the member the message
>
> # was intended for, and the severity of the problem causing the bounce.
>
> # The severity can be either <em>hard</em> or <em>soft</em> meaning
>
> # either a fatal error occurred, or a transient error occurred.  When in
>
> # doubt, a hard severity is used.
>
> #
>
> # <p>If no member address can be extracted from the bounce, then the
>
> # bounce is usually discarded.  Otherwise, each member is assigned a
>
> # <em>bounce score</em> and every time we encounter a bounce from this
>
> # member we increment the score.  Hard bounces increment by 1 while soft
>
> # bounces increment by 0.5.  We only increment the bounce score once per
>
> # day, so even if we receive ten hard bounces from a member per day,
>
> # their score will increase by only 1 for that day.
>
> #
>
> # <p>When a member's bounce score is greater than the <a
>
> # href="?VARHELP=bounce/bounce_score_threshold">bounce score
>
> # threshold</a>, the subscription is disabled.  Once disabled, the
>
> # member will not receive any postings from the list until their
>
> # membership is explicitly re-enabled (either by the list administrator
>
> # or the user).  However, they will receive occasional reminders that
>
> # their membership has been disabled, and these reminders will include
>
> # information about how to re-enable their membership.
>
> #
>
> # <p>You can control both the <a
>
> # href="?VARHELP=bounce/bounce_you_are_disabled_warnings">number of
>
> # reminders</a> the member will receive and the <a
>
> # href="?VARHELP=bounce/bounce_you_are_disabled_warnings_interval"
>
> # >frequency</a> with which these reminders are sent.
>
> #
>
> # <p>There is one other important configuration variable; after a
>
> # certain period of time -- during which no bounces from the member are
>
> # received -- the bounce information is <a
>
> # href="?VARHELP=bounce/bounce_info_stale_after">considered stale</a>
>
> # and discarded.  Thus by adjusting this value, and the score threshold,
>
> # you can control how quickly bouncing members are disabled.  You should
>
> # tune both of these to the frequency and traffic volume of your list.
>
>
>
> # By setting this value to No, you disable all automatic bounce
>
> # processing for this list, however bounce messages will still be
>
> # discarded so that the list administrator isn't inundated with them.
>
> #
>
> # legal values are:
>
> #    0 = "No"
>
> #    1 = "Yes"
>
> bounce_processing = 1
>
>
>
> ## Archive options
>
> #
>
> # List traffic archival policies.
>
>
>
> # Is archive file source for public or private archival?
>
> #
>
> # legal values are:
>
> #    0 = "public"
>
> #    1 = "private"
>
> archive_private = 1
>
> [root at lab mailman]#
>
>
> I do not know which file should I check further to see why not send it
> email or test can perform to check Can you help me? Greetings and thank
> you
>
>
> This e-mail is intended exclusively for the individual or entity to which
> it is addressed
> and may contain confidential or legally privileged information,  which may
> not be disclosed under current legislation. Any form of disclosure, copying
> or distribution of this e-mail is strictly prohibited, save with written
> authorisation . If you have received this message in error, please notify
> the sender immediately by e-mail and delete all copies of the message.
>

From guest2 at sgeinc.com  Fri Aug 19 14:36:27 2016
From: guest2 at sgeinc.com (Richard Shetron)
Date: Fri, 19 Aug 2016 14:36:27 -0400
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Which user is harvesting sender emails?
In-Reply-To: <D11DC9D4-0F33-4D87-AABA-F3D86EE1D459@billmail.scconsult.com>
References: <CALwJ=MxpZEJx14wSdC9cBHEGrKw8Jy-YrFFAwmz=Jz=cjceYBw@mail.gmail.com>
 <ba85dd7a-7cb1-bc13-146f-6e32474f0c15@msapiro.net>
 <D11DC9D4-0F33-4D87-AABA-F3D86EE1D459@billmail.scconsult.com>
Message-ID: <e845987c-cde3-bdb5-0149-ef5c142390a8@sgeinc.com>

There is a LOT of broken software that will refuse rfc compliant email 
addresses as they do not properly follow the standards.  The + sign has 
been in use and part of the rfc's for at least 30 years.  I've found 
that using the underscore '_' will work when the plus '+' sign does not, 
however your mileage will vary.

What is even worse, you can create a <user>+tag@<domain> but later on 
the same companies software in a different part of the website will then 
refuse to accept the tagged address so even an initial acceptance can 
have problems elsewhere.

On 8/19/2016 10:21 AM, Bill Cole wrote:
> On 18 Aug 2016, at 19:36, Mark Sapiro wrote:
>
>> Altering the From: based on recipient can be done by modifying the code.
>> Say you have a message "From: Ann User <ann at example.com>" and you want
>> to change that to "From: Ann User <ann+xxx at example.com>" where xxx is a
>> unique code for each recipient.
>
>
> Please, don't anyone do that, ever. It's not just "risky," as noted in
> earlier discussion, it would be positively abusive.
>
> A less obvious approach would be to add an address IN A DOMAIN YOU
> CONTROL in a X-[something] header (or perhaps a Cc header) that is
> unique to each recipient so that when you get mail to that address,
> you've identified your problem user.
>
> HOWEVER, there is an angle to this problem that should be understood:
> it's probably not being done by a human subscriber. One possibility is
> that a subscriber has malware on their machine that is generating the
> spam, so when you identify a subscriber who is your vector, you may only
> be identifying someone which an insecure machine. Another possibility
> (which would be untraceable and easy to automate on the spammer side) is
> that someone other than a subscriber is harvesting addresses and
> subjects from your web archive at mail-archive.com, where every message
> has a button to "Reply via email" that kicks back a redirection to a
> mailto: URL with the sender's address and Subject.
> ------------------------------------------------------
> Mailman-Users mailing list Mailman-Users at python.org
> https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users
> Mailman FAQ: http://wiki.list.org/x/AgA3
> Security Policy: http://wiki.list.org/x/QIA9
> Searchable Archives:
> http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users%40python.org/
> Unsubscribe:
> https://mail.python.org/mailman/options/mailman-users/guest2%40sgeinc.com
>

From mark at msapiro.net  Fri Aug 19 15:45:45 2016
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Fri, 19 Aug 2016 12:45:45 -0700
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Problems with mail delivery,
 configure Mailman with Postfix
In-Reply-To: <CAHkBno5=Yz-KiB0eFM8LJ1_sFDyoA2JGhJRNBHVXUaeF_V+vxQ@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAHkBno5b8W5zBcML8exkN4Dapjmd66P_z9egrB2BBGxM+gqnNQ@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAHkBno5=Yz-KiB0eFM8LJ1_sFDyoA2JGhJRNBHVXUaeF_V+vxQ@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <72c55685-3448-3d2e-b81f-3bbe9e191a2a@msapiro.net>

On 08/19/2016 04:15 AM, Gines Granados Bayona wrote:
>
> I have made the settings you provided me Mark Sapiro, but still does not
> work, and even though I check can not find the error.


And what exactly is the problem?

Please describe exactly what you do, what result you expect and what
actual result you see.


> Run the command you indicated me, Mark Sapiro
>
> [root at lab log]# postconf -n
> alias_database = hash:/etc/aliases
> alias_maps = hash:/etc/aliases

You need

alias_maps = hash:/etc/aliases, hash:/path/to/mailman/aliases

where /path/to/mailman/ is the directory containing your aliases file below.


> command_directory = /usr/sbin
> config_directory = /etc/postfix
> daemon_directory = /usr/libexec/postfix
> data_directory = /var/lib/postfix
> debug_peer_level = 2
> html_directory = no
> inet_interfaces = localhost
> inet_protocols = ipv4
> local_recipient_maps = proxy:unix:passwd.byname $alias_maps
> mail_owner = postfix
> mailq_path = /usr/bin/mailq.postfix
> manpage_directory = /usr/share/man
> mydestination = $mydomain, localhost.$mydomain, $myhostname localhost
> mydomain = lab.company.net
> myhostname = lista.$mydomain
> mynetworks = $mydomain 127.0.0.0/8 [::ffff:127.0.0.0]/104 [::1]/128
> newaliases_path = /usr/bin/newaliases.postfix
> queue_directory = /var/spool/postfix
> readme_directory = /usr/share/doc/postfix-2.6.6/README_FILES
> recipient_delimiter = +
> sample_directory = /usr/share/doc/postfix-2.6.6/samples
> sendmail_path = /usr/sbin/sendmail.postfix
> setgid_group = postdrop
> unknown_local_recipient_reject_code = 550
> [root at lab log]#
>
> Then locate the configuration file
>
> [root at lab /]# find / -iname mm_cfg.py
> /usr/lib/mailman/Mailman/mm_cfg.py
> /etc/mailman/mm_cfg.py
>
> I accessed to the directory
>
> [root at lab /]# cd /usr/lib/mailman/Mailman/
>
> And I proceeded to see the configuration.
>
> [root at lab Mailman]# cat mm_cfg.py
...

This is apparently a RedHat/Centos package distributed mm_cfg.py with
the following additions. (Also see <https://wiki.list.org/x/12812344>)


> DEFAULT_URL_HOST   = 'lab.company.net'
> DEFAULT_EMAIL_HOST = 'lab.company.net'

OK

> SMTPHOST = 'lab.company.net'


Why this instead of the default 'localhost'?


...
>
> [root at lab Mailman]#
>
> I think that it is correctly made, check the directory to see the contents
> and check other settings.
>
> [root at lab mailman]# ls -lrt
> total 36
> -rw-r--r-- 1 root mailman 14100 Jul 24  2015 sitelist.cfg
> -rw-rw---- 1 root mailman  3038 Jul 13 11:11 aliases
> -rw-r----- 1 root mailman 12288 Jul 13 11:11 aliases.db
> lrwxrwxrwx 1 root mailman    34 Jul 13 12:33 mm_cfg.py -> /usr/lib/mailman/Mailman/mm_cfg.py
> -rw-r----- 1 root mailman    41 Jul 22 08:59 adm.pw
>
> Aliases file
>
> [root at lab mailman]# cat aliases

Looks OK. but not referenced in Postfix - see above.


> File sitelist.cfg
>
> [root at lab mailman]# cat sitelist.cfg

This is only used to aid in producing a more apptropriat default
configuration for the 'mailman' site list than the default.

It is intended that you run a command like

/path/to/mailman/bin/config_list -i sitelist.cfg mailman

to configure the 'mailman' list. sitelist.cfg is otherwise not used.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan

From mailinglist at samsi.us  Fri Aug 19 18:07:23 2016
From: mailinglist at samsi.us (Caesar Samsi)
Date: Fri, 19 Aug 2016 15:07:23 -0700
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Confirmation Page not working
In-Reply-To: <A8E0B287-9571-424D-A6C5-868DAEC8285A@mac.com>
References: <F42B39AD-F2B6-4D50-8C9E-D4E841FCB8B0@mac.com>
 <E120A79E-9149-4D12-AD7A-9D6B05D42743@samsi.us>
 <e9d31468-8796-8d63-cffb-95dceec95608@msapiro.net>
 <A8E0B287-9571-424D-A6C5-868DAEC8285A@mac.com>
Message-ID: <80CA5881-4C83-4097-A782-DAD17CA363A8@samsi.us>

Yes, the URL and page text is as you described.

Thank you, Caesar.


> On Aug 17, 2016, at 11:03 PM, Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net> wrote:
> 
> On 08/14/2016 05:14 PM, Caesar Samsi wrote:
>> 
>> My confirmation page is not working.
> 
> 
> What URL do you go to? what do you see when you go there?
> 
> 
>> I am assuming the string following ?confirm? is the ?cookie? and to copy and paste that cookie to the confirmation page.
>> 
>> However, the page simply cycles back to itself.
> 
> 
> Do you mean you go to a URL like
> https://www.example.com/mailman/confirm/listname
> 
> and you get a page like
> 
> Please enter the confirmation string (i.e. cookie) that you received in
> your email message, in the box below. Then hit the Submit button to
> proceed to the next confirmation step.
> Confirmation string: __________________________
> 	
> and you enter the cookie and submit and you get the same page back?
> 
> If so, see <https://wiki.list.org/x/4030602>.
> 
> If not, please describe the problem more precisely.
> 
> -- 
> Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
> San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan
> ------------------------------------------------------
> Mailman-Users mailing list Mailman-Users at python.org
> https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users
> Mailman FAQ: http://wiki.list.org/x/AgA3
> Security Policy: http://wiki.list.org/x/QIA9
> Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users%40python.org/
> Unsubscribe: https://mail.python.org/mailman/options/mailman-users/mailinglist%40samsi.us


From mailinglist at samsi.us  Fri Aug 19 18:08:59 2016
From: mailinglist at samsi.us (Caesar Samsi)
Date: Fri, 19 Aug 2016 15:08:59 -0700
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Unable to receive email on same domain
In-Reply-To: <3397502C-EFDF-4DF6-B787-CA5AEDE1CF7B@mac.com>
References: <5F4005AE-336F-4E06-8051-ECC265C61364@mac.com>
 <BE0D4AA4-C9BF-4CBB-AE6D-5DA4BFE68A42@samsi.us>
 <45ADC913-BE17-4627-ABED-5F8C31675A0C@samsi.us>
 <E56FFA78-CA49-40F2-8E0A-5E6373C369F8@samsi.us>
 <daab7027-7459-11a6-0d0f-512400caf505@msapiro.net>
 <3397502C-EFDF-4DF6-B787-CA5AEDE1CF7B@mac.com>
Message-ID: <B9B8CED2-FBB7-436F-BFD7-7689D3A2032A@samsi.us>


Hmm ? what I have implemented in Postfix are virtual domains such that 

caesar at xyz.com <mailto:caesar at xyz.com> has a mailbox on yugi.us <http://yugi.us/> and yugi.us <http://yugi.us/> is the mail server for xyz.com <http://xyz.com/> domain

caesar at xyz.com <mailto:caesar at xyz.com> goes to yugi.us <http://yugi.us/> with IMAP to pick up mail.

Postfix implements the alias lookup with mysql tables, but in the case of @yugi.us <http://yugi.us/> addresses somehow it defers to the virtual_alias_domain

or it might just be a need to reverse the lookup order, i.e. to lookup aliases in virtual_alias_domains file last

I suppose this might be a Postfix virtual domain question vs. Mailman.

Thank you, Caesar.


> On Aug 17, 2016, at 10:57 PM, Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net <mailto:mark at msapiro.net>> wrote:
> 
> On 08/12/2016 05:18 PM, Caesar Samsi wrote:
> 
> 
> Sometimes people are off line for long periods, in this case from Aug 5
> to now. Be patient.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So yugi.us <http://yugi.us/> is a virtual alias domain. This means EVERY address @yugi.us <http://yugi.us/>
> must have a virtual alias mapping
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So you need a virtual alias mapping, perhaps something like
> 
> myemailaddress at yugi.us <mailto:myemailaddress at yugi.us>  myemailaddress at localhost
> 
> and similarly for every other xxx at yugi.us <mailto:xxx at yugi.us> address, or perhaps you really
> want yugi.us <http://yugi.us/> to be a local rather than a virtual domain.
> 
> -- 
> Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net <mailto:mark at msapiro.net>>        The highway is for gamblers,
> San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan
> ------------------------------------------------------
> Mailman-Users mailing list Mailman-Users at python.org <mailto:Mailman-Users at python.org>
> https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users <https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users>
> Mailman FAQ: http://wiki.list.org/x/AgA3
> Security Policy: http://wiki.list.org/x/QIA9
> Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users%40python.org/
> Unsubscribe: https://mail.python.org/mailman/options/mailman-users/mailinglist%40samsi.us
>> Resurrecting this for the weekend crew ?
>> I?ve been able to track it down to this line (but don?t know what to do about it):
>> 
>> virtual_alias_domains = yugi.us <http://yugi.us/> <http://yugi.us/ <http://yugi.us/>>
>> 
>> If I comment the line out, email is received just fine.
>> 
>> 
>>> On Aug 8, 2016, at 6:36 PM, Caesar Samsi <mailinglist at samsi.us <mailto:mailinglist at samsi.us> <mailto:mailinglist at samsi.us <mailto:mailinglist at samsi.us>>> wrote:
>>> 
>>> I?m not able to send email to addresses on the same domain as the mailing list.
>>> 
>>> My postfix is configured to process virtual domains.
>>> I currently have mailman configured for yugi.us <http://yugi.us/> and mailing lists work great (e.g. mymailinglist at yugi.us <mailto:mymailinglist at yugi.us>)
>>> 
>>> However, I can?t send anything to regular email addresses even though they have mailboxes there e.g. myemailaddress at yugi.us <mailto:myemailaddress at yugi.us>
>>> 
>>> Postfix complains about the recipient does not exist in the virtual alias map.


From mailinglist at samsi.us  Fri Aug 19 18:26:16 2016
From: mailinglist at samsi.us (Caesar Samsi)
Date: Fri, 19 Aug 2016 15:26:16 -0700
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Unable to receive email on same domain
In-Reply-To: <B9B8CED2-FBB7-436F-BFD7-7689D3A2032A@samsi.us>
References: <5F4005AE-336F-4E06-8051-ECC265C61364@mac.com>
 <BE0D4AA4-C9BF-4CBB-AE6D-5DA4BFE68A42@samsi.us>
 <45ADC913-BE17-4627-ABED-5F8C31675A0C@samsi.us>
 <E56FFA78-CA49-40F2-8E0A-5E6373C369F8@samsi.us>
 <daab7027-7459-11a6-0d0f-512400caf505@msapiro.net>
 <3397502C-EFDF-4DF6-B787-CA5AEDE1CF7B@mac.com>
 <B9B8CED2-FBB7-436F-BFD7-7689D3A2032A@samsi.us>
Message-ID: <7D77FA75-E566-4D01-88E7-2F6180B5B26D@samsi.us>

This has been resolved. I commented out the virtual_alias_domains.

Email is now received by both virtual domain users and yugi mailing list aliases.

> On Aug 19, 2016, at 3:08 PM, Caesar Samsi <mailinglist at samsi.us> wrote:
> 
> 
> Hmm ? what I have implemented in Postfix are virtual domains such that 
> 
> caesar at xyz.com <mailto:caesar at xyz.com> has a mailbox on yugi.us <http://yugi.us/> and yugi.us <http://yugi.us/> is the mail server for xyz.com <http://xyz.com/> domain
> 
> caesar at xyz.com <mailto:caesar at xyz.com> goes to yugi.us <http://yugi.us/> with IMAP to pick up mail.
> 
> Postfix implements the alias lookup with mysql tables, but in the case of @yugi.us <http://yugi.us/> addresses somehow it defers to the virtual_alias_domain
> 
> or it might just be a need to reverse the lookup order, i.e. to lookup aliases in virtual_alias_domains file last
> 
> I suppose this might be a Postfix virtual domain question vs. Mailman.
> 
> Thank you, Caesar.
> 
> 
>> On Aug 17, 2016, at 10:57 PM, Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net <mailto:mark at msapiro.net>> wrote:
>> 
>> On 08/12/2016 05:18 PM, Caesar Samsi wrote:
>> 
>> 
>> Sometimes people are off line for long periods, in this case from Aug 5
>> to now. Be patient.
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> So yugi.us <http://yugi.us/> is a virtual alias domain. This means EVERY address @yugi.us <http://yugi.us/>
>> must have a virtual alias mapping
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> So you need a virtual alias mapping, perhaps something like
>> 
>> myemailaddress at yugi.us <mailto:myemailaddress at yugi.us>  myemailaddress at localhost
>> 
>> and similarly for every other xxx at yugi.us <mailto:xxx at yugi.us> address, or perhaps you really
>> want yugi.us <http://yugi.us/> to be a local rather than a virtual domain.
>> 
>> -- 
>> Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net <mailto:mark at msapiro.net>>        The highway is for gamblers,
>> San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan
>> ------------------------------------------------------
>> Mailman-Users mailing list Mailman-Users at python.org <mailto:Mailman-Users at python.org>
>> https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users <https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users>
>> Mailman FAQ: http://wiki.list.org/x/AgA3 <http://wiki.list.org/x/AgA3>
>> Security Policy: http://wiki.list.org/x/QIA9 <http://wiki.list.org/x/QIA9>
>> Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users%40python.org/ <http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users%40python.org/>
>> Unsubscribe: https://mail.python.org/mailman/options/mailman-users/mailinglist%40samsi.us <https://mail.python.org/mailman/options/mailman-users/mailinglist%40samsi.us>
>>> Resurrecting this for the weekend crew ?
>>> I?ve been able to track it down to this line (but don?t know what to do about it):
>>> 
>>> virtual_alias_domains = yugi.us <http://yugi.us/> <http://yugi.us/ <http://yugi.us/>>
>>> 
>>> If I comment the line out, email is received just fine.
>>> 
>>> 
>>>> On Aug 8, 2016, at 6:36 PM, Caesar Samsi <mailinglist at samsi.us <mailto:mailinglist at samsi.us> <mailto:mailinglist at samsi.us <mailto:mailinglist at samsi.us>>> wrote:
>>>> 
>>>> I?m not able to send email to addresses on the same domain as the mailing list.
>>>> 
>>>> My postfix is configured to process virtual domains.
>>>> I currently have mailman configured for yugi.us <http://yugi.us/> and mailing lists work great (e.g. mymailinglist at yugi.us <mailto:mymailinglist at yugi.us>)
>>>> 
>>>> However, I can?t send anything to regular email addresses even though they have mailboxes there e.g. myemailaddress at yugi.us <mailto:myemailaddress at yugi.us>
>>>> 
>>>> Postfix complains about the recipient does not exist in the virtual alias map.


From dlj04 at josephson.com  Fri Aug 19 17:29:26 2016
From: dlj04 at josephson.com (David Josephson)
Date: Fri, 19 Aug 2016 14:29:26 -0700
Subject: [Mailman-Users] 'list not found' after kernel upgrade
Message-ID: <178be3a9-cd39-1a31-8916-827a195a458a@josephson.com>

We have been running Mailman 2.1.18-1 for a long time, on a Centos 7 
system with sendmail. We do a yum update every few months. Coincident 
with the last one, which included a kernel update to 3.10, mailman 
stopped working, posts are bounced back with this message:

     ----- The following addresses had permanent fatal errors -----
"|/etc/smrsh/mailman post ampex"
      (reason: 1)
      (expanded from: <ampex at lena.recordist.com>)

     ----- Transcript of session follows -----
post script, list not found: ampex
554 5.3.0 unknown mailer error 1

Mailman log says the same thing,

Aug 18 05:46:09 2016 post(1452): post script, list not found: ampex

Maillog says

Aug 19 13:29:43 lena sendmail[10931]: u7JKTgkW010930: 
to="|/etc/smrsh/mailman post ampex", ctladdr=<ampex at recordist.com> 
(8/0), delay=00:00:00, xdelay=00:00:00, mailer=prog, pri=32792, 
dsn=5.3.0, stat=unknown mailer error 1

Qrunner is running, sendmail is working normally. SELinux is disabled. 
There is nothing but default in mm_cfg.py, which hasn't changed since 2015.

The yum update can't be rolled back because of the kernel upgrade.

I noticed that the symbolic link in /etc/smrsh was touched about the 
same time as the update.

Clues?

From dlj04 at josephson.com  Fri Aug 19 22:28:58 2016
From: dlj04 at josephson.com (David Josephson)
Date: Fri, 19 Aug 2016 19:28:58 -0700
Subject: [Mailman-Users] 'list not found' after kernel upgrade
In-Reply-To: <178be3a9-cd39-1a31-8916-827a195a458a@josephson.com>
References: <178be3a9-cd39-1a31-8916-827a195a458a@josephson.com>
Message-ID: <0A474DEC-94B9-4F9C-92F1-1EEC316AD3E5@josephson.com>

Never mind. Beware of yum-update. I have mailman in /usr/local, and yum update installed a new copy in /usr/lib, and helpfully updated the script in /etc/smrsh to point to the new one. &*&*(#^!!

On Aug 19, 2016, at 2:29 PM, David Josephson wrote:

> We have been running Mailman 2.1.18-1 for a long time, on a Centos 7 system with sendmail. We do a yum update every few months. Coincident with the last one, which included a kernel update to 3.10, mailman stopped working, posts are bounced back with this message:
> 
>    ----- The following addresses had permanent fatal errors -----
> "|/etc/smrsh/mailman post ampex"
>     (reason: 1)
>     (expanded from: <ampex at lena.recordist.com>)
> 
>    ----- Transcript of session follows ---

From rod at rodneymurray.com  Sun Aug 21 11:49:40 2016
From: rod at rodneymurray.com (Rod Murray)
Date: Sun, 21 Aug 2016 11:49:40 -0400
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Mailman is not sending/receiving email
Message-ID: <CAA55-0smJvMEjXN2kdYyn-rkVaHwF=jJ7zmxeJybPua1GoQTaQ@mail.gmail.com>

Mailman experts,

I have been managing a mailman list (hosted by Hostway) for over 10 years
and have never had a problem until a few days ago.

I can get to the Admin page and everything looks fine. However mail is not
being delivered. Sending mail to the list does not generate a bounce and
the mail does not get into the Archive. New members can be added in the
Admin page, but no notice goes out.

What are the most likely causes and how should I proceed. Btw, Hostway has
not been a bit of help even though they charge me $15/month to run the list!

-- 
Regards,
Rod
--

From brian at emwd.com  Sun Aug 21 15:17:57 2016
From: brian at emwd.com (Brian Carpenter)
Date: Sun, 21 Aug 2016 15:17:57 -0400
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Mailman is not sending/receiving email
In-Reply-To: <CAA55-0smJvMEjXN2kdYyn-rkVaHwF=jJ7zmxeJybPua1GoQTaQ@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAA55-0smJvMEjXN2kdYyn-rkVaHwF=jJ7zmxeJybPua1GoQTaQ@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <0f4901d1fbe0$bb5a2bf0$320e83d0$@emwd.com>

> Mailman experts,
> 
> I have been managing a mailman list (hosted by Hostway) for over 10 years
> and have never had a problem until a few days ago.
> 
> I can get to the Admin page and everything looks fine. However mail is not
> being delivered. Sending mail to the list does not generate a bounce and
> the mail does not get into the Archive. New members can be added in the
> Admin page, but no notice goes out.
> 
> What are the most likely causes and how should I proceed. Btw, Hostway has
> not been a bit of help even though they charge me $15/month to run the
list!
> 
Hi Rod:

How do you know notices to new members are not being sent out? Did you test
this yourself? The first thing I would look at is to see if the email
address you are posting from has the necessary permissions set in your list
configuration options to post to the list. Have you checked the moderator's
queue to see if posts are being caught up there?

Brian
EMWD.com
Mailman hosting for 10+ years


From mailinglist at samsi.us  Sun Aug 21 20:24:55 2016
From: mailinglist at samsi.us (Caesar Samsi)
Date: Sun, 21 Aug 2016 17:24:55 -0700
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Confirmation Page not working
In-Reply-To: <80CA5881-4C83-4097-A782-DAD17CA363A8@samsi.us>
References: <F42B39AD-F2B6-4D50-8C9E-D4E841FCB8B0@mac.com>
 <E120A79E-9149-4D12-AD7A-9D6B05D42743@samsi.us>
 <e9d31468-8796-8d63-cffb-95dceec95608@msapiro.net>
 <A8E0B287-9571-424D-A6C5-868DAEC8285A@mac.com>
 <80CA5881-4C83-4097-A782-DAD17CA363A8@samsi.us>
Message-ID: <5D810D59-2508-4E1C-8B8B-274B6E1C027A@samsi.us>

The wiki noted below is about securing admin web page.

Not about confirmation page.

I?m still unresolved.

Thank you, Caesar.

> On Aug 19, 2016, at 3:07 PM, Caesar Samsi <mailinglist at samsi.us> wrote:
> 
> Yes, the URL and page text is as you described.
> 
> Thank you, Caesar.
> 
> 
>> On Aug 17, 2016, at 11:03 PM, Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net> wrote:
>> 
>> On 08/14/2016 05:14 PM, Caesar Samsi wrote:
>>> 
>>> My confirmation page is not working.
>> 
>> 
>> What URL do you go to? what do you see when you go there?
>> 
>> 
>>> I am assuming the string following ?confirm? is the ?cookie? and to copy and paste that cookie to the confirmation page.
>>> 
>>> However, the page simply cycles back to itself.
>> 
>> 
>> Do you mean you go to a URL like
>> https://www.example.com/mailman/confirm/listname
>> 
>> and you get a page like
>> 
>> Please enter the confirmation string (i.e. cookie) that you received in
>> your email message, in the box below. Then hit the Submit button to
>> proceed to the next confirmation step.
>> Confirmation string: __________________________
>> 	
>> and you enter the cookie and submit and you get the same page back?
>> 
>> If so, see <https://wiki.list.org/x/4030602>.
>> 
>> If not, please describe the problem more precisely.
>> 
>> -- 
>> Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
>> San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan
>> ------------------------------------------------------
>> Mailman-Users mailing list Mailman-Users at python.org
>> https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users
>> Mailman FAQ: http://wiki.list.org/x/AgA3
>> Security Policy: http://wiki.list.org/x/QIA9
>> Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users%40python.org/
>> Unsubscribe: https://mail.python.org/mailman/options/mailman-users/mailinglist%40samsi.us
> 
> ------------------------------------------------------
> Mailman-Users mailing list Mailman-Users at python.org
> https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users
> Mailman FAQ: http://wiki.list.org/x/AgA3
> Security Policy: http://wiki.list.org/x/QIA9
> Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users%40python.org/
> Unsubscribe: https://mail.python.org/mailman/options/mailman-users/mailinglist%40samsi.us


From mailinglist at samsi.us  Sun Aug 21 20:39:22 2016
From: mailinglist at samsi.us (Caesar Samsi)
Date: Sun, 21 Aug 2016 17:39:22 -0700
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Confirmation Page not working
In-Reply-To: <5D810D59-2508-4E1C-8B8B-274B6E1C027A@samsi.us>
References: <F42B39AD-F2B6-4D50-8C9E-D4E841FCB8B0@mac.com>
 <E120A79E-9149-4D12-AD7A-9D6B05D42743@samsi.us>
 <e9d31468-8796-8d63-cffb-95dceec95608@msapiro.net>
 <A8E0B287-9571-424D-A6C5-868DAEC8285A@mac.com>
 <80CA5881-4C83-4097-A782-DAD17CA363A8@samsi.us>
 <5D810D59-2508-4E1C-8B8B-274B6E1C027A@samsi.us>
Message-ID: <65A2B826-953A-4EA1-A9F8-B607F2E99A82@samsi.us>

Found the same issue on another board: https://locationtech.org/bugs/show_bug.cgi?id=90 <https://locationtech.org/bugs/show_bug.cgi?id=90>

They mentioned disabling the web confirmation page (and presumably the URL in the confirm mail as well).

How would I do that?

I can see from my subscribe log there are quite a few members pending and I?m afraid they might have come across this issue.

> On Aug 21, 2016, at 5:24 PM, Caesar Samsi <mailinglist at samsi.us> wrote:
> 
> The wiki noted below is about securing admin web page.
> 
> Not about confirmation page.
> 
> I?m still unresolved.
> 
> Thank you, Caesar.
> 
>> On Aug 19, 2016, at 3:07 PM, Caesar Samsi <mailinglist at samsi.us <mailto:mailinglist at samsi.us>> wrote:
>> 
>> Yes, the URL and page text is as you described.
>> 
>> Thank you, Caesar.
>> 
>> 
>>> On Aug 17, 2016, at 11:03 PM, Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net <mailto:mark at msapiro.net>> wrote:
>>> 
>>> On 08/14/2016 05:14 PM, Caesar Samsi wrote:
>>>> 
>>>> My confirmation page is not working.
>>> 
>>> 
>>> What URL do you go to? what do you see when you go there?
>>> 
>>> 
>>>> I am assuming the string following ?confirm? is the ?cookie? and to copy and paste that cookie to the confirmation page.
>>>> 
>>>> However, the page simply cycles back to itself.
>>> 
>>> 
>>> Do you mean you go to a URL like
>>> https://www.example.com/mailman/confirm/listname <https://www.example.com/mailman/confirm/listname>
>>> 
>>> and you get a page like
>>> 
>>> Please enter the confirmation string (i.e. cookie) that you received in
>>> your email message, in the box below. Then hit the Submit button to
>>> proceed to the next confirmation step.
>>> Confirmation string: __________________________
>>> 	
>>> and you enter the cookie and submit and you get the same page back?
>>> 
>>> If so, see <https://wiki.list.org/x/4030602>.
>>> 
>>> If not, please describe the problem more precisely.
>>> 
>>> -- 
>>> Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
>>> San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan
>>> ------------------------------------------------------
>>> Mailman-Users mailing list Mailman-Users at python.org
>>> https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users
>>> Mailman FAQ: http://wiki.list.org/x/AgA3
>>> Security Policy: http://wiki.list.org/x/QIA9
>>> Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users%40python.org/
>>> Unsubscribe: https://mail.python.org/mailman/options/mailman-users/mailinglist%40samsi.us
>> 
>> ------------------------------------------------------
>> Mailman-Users mailing list Mailman-Users at python.org <mailto:Mailman-Users at python.org>
>> https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users <https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users>
>> Mailman FAQ: http://wiki.list.org/x/AgA3
>> Security Policy: http://wiki.list.org/x/QIA9
>> Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users%40python.org/
>> Unsubscribe: https://mail.python.org/mailman/options/mailman-users/mailinglist%40samsi.us
> 


From mark at msapiro.net  Sun Aug 21 20:53:26 2016
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Sun, 21 Aug 2016 17:53:26 -0700
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Confirmation Page not working
In-Reply-To: <5D810D59-2508-4E1C-8B8B-274B6E1C027A@samsi.us>
References: <F42B39AD-F2B6-4D50-8C9E-D4E841FCB8B0@mac.com>
 <E120A79E-9149-4D12-AD7A-9D6B05D42743@samsi.us>
 <e9d31468-8796-8d63-cffb-95dceec95608@msapiro.net>
 <A8E0B287-9571-424D-A6C5-868DAEC8285A@mac.com>
 <80CA5881-4C83-4097-A782-DAD17CA363A8@samsi.us>
 <5D810D59-2508-4E1C-8B8B-274B6E1C027A@samsi.us>
Message-ID: <5ef66040-406a-5ed0-cc15-7923e8a55079@msapiro.net>

On 08/21/2016 05:24 PM, Caesar Samsi wrote:
> The wiki noted below is about securing admin web page.
> 
> Not about confirmation page.


Yes, but it is the same underlying issue. You post data from a form and
the response just refreshes the page without action.

This can occur with admin, admindb, confirm and options pages for any of
the reasons mentioned in <https://wiki.list.org/x/4030602>.

Look at the raw source of the confirm page. What is the value of the
action= parameter in the FORM tag? Is it identical to the URL in the
address bar in your browser including domain and scheme?

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan

From mark at msapiro.net  Sun Aug 21 21:01:16 2016
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Sun, 21 Aug 2016 18:01:16 -0700
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Confirmation Page not working
In-Reply-To: <65A2B826-953A-4EA1-A9F8-B607F2E99A82@samsi.us>
References: <F42B39AD-F2B6-4D50-8C9E-D4E841FCB8B0@mac.com>
 <E120A79E-9149-4D12-AD7A-9D6B05D42743@samsi.us>
 <e9d31468-8796-8d63-cffb-95dceec95608@msapiro.net>
 <A8E0B287-9571-424D-A6C5-868DAEC8285A@mac.com>
 <80CA5881-4C83-4097-A782-DAD17CA363A8@samsi.us>
 <5D810D59-2508-4E1C-8B8B-274B6E1C027A@samsi.us>
 <65A2B826-953A-4EA1-A9F8-B607F2E99A82@samsi.us>
Message-ID: <323e1bc5-0052-bdaa-c95d-f19095d44e5f@msapiro.net>

On 08/21/2016 05:39 PM, Caesar Samsi wrote:
> Found the same issue on another
> board: https://locationtech.org/bugs/show_bug.cgi?id=90
> 
> They mentioned disabling the web confirmation page (and presumably the
> URL in the confirm mail as well).
> 
> How would I do that?


Their site is misconfigured just as yours is. The correct solution is to
fix your misconfiguration, not to disable web confirmation.

If I had to guess what your problem is, I'd guess that your site is
redirecting http to https but you haven't done steps 2 and 3 at
<https://wiki.list.org/x/4030702>, but it may be something else. If that
isn't it, look at the other things referenced at
<https://wiki.list.org/x/4030602>.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan

From mailinglist at samsi.us  Sun Aug 21 21:16:27 2016
From: mailinglist at samsi.us (Caesar Samsi)
Date: Sun, 21 Aug 2016 18:16:27 -0700
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Confirmation Page not working
In-Reply-To: <5ef66040-406a-5ed0-cc15-7923e8a55079@msapiro.net>
References: <F42B39AD-F2B6-4D50-8C9E-D4E841FCB8B0@mac.com>
 <E120A79E-9149-4D12-AD7A-9D6B05D42743@samsi.us>
 <e9d31468-8796-8d63-cffb-95dceec95608@msapiro.net>
 <A8E0B287-9571-424D-A6C5-868DAEC8285A@mac.com>
 <80CA5881-4C83-4097-A782-DAD17CA363A8@samsi.us>
 <5D810D59-2508-4E1C-8B8B-274B6E1C027A@samsi.us>
 <5ef66040-406a-5ed0-cc15-7923e8a55079@msapiro.net>
Message-ID: <3E6E5994-D407-4C78-B301-AEB2398C11C4@samsi.us>

The raw source is <FORM action="http://mail.yugi.us/confirm/seattlegigs" method="POST? >

The browser URL is https://mail.yugi.us/confirm/seattlegigs <https://mail.yugi.us/confirm/seattlegigs>

Apart from http and https prefixes they are identical.

Is it due to the difference of SSL?

Per noted wiki, I enabled SSL using (Rewrite method)
https://wiki.list.org/DOC/4.27%20Securing%20Mailman%27s%20web%20GUI%20by%20using%20Secure%20HTTP-SSL <https://wiki.list.org/DOC/4.27%20Securing%20Mailman's%20web%20GUI%20by%20using%20Secure%20HTTP-SSL>

> On Aug 21, 2016, at 5:53 PM, Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net> wrote:
> 
> On 08/21/2016 05:24 PM, Caesar Samsi wrote:
>> The wiki noted below is about securing admin web page.
>> 
>> Not about confirmation page.
> 
> 
> Yes, but it is the same underlying issue. You post data from a form and
> the response just refreshes the page without action.
> 
> This can occur with admin, admindb, confirm and options pages for any of
> the reasons mentioned in <https://wiki.list.org/x/4030602>.
> 
> Look at the raw source of the confirm page. What is the value of the
> action= parameter in the FORM tag? Is it identical to the URL in the
> address bar in your browser including domain and scheme?
> 
> -- 
> Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
> San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan


From mailinglist at samsi.us  Sun Aug 21 21:19:18 2016
From: mailinglist at samsi.us (Caesar Samsi)
Date: Sun, 21 Aug 2016 18:19:18 -0700
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Confirmation Page not working
In-Reply-To: <323e1bc5-0052-bdaa-c95d-f19095d44e5f@msapiro.net>
References: <F42B39AD-F2B6-4D50-8C9E-D4E841FCB8B0@mac.com>
 <E120A79E-9149-4D12-AD7A-9D6B05D42743@samsi.us>
 <e9d31468-8796-8d63-cffb-95dceec95608@msapiro.net>
 <A8E0B287-9571-424D-A6C5-868DAEC8285A@mac.com>
 <80CA5881-4C83-4097-A782-DAD17CA363A8@samsi.us>
 <5D810D59-2508-4E1C-8B8B-274B6E1C027A@samsi.us>
 <65A2B826-953A-4EA1-A9F8-B607F2E99A82@samsi.us>
 <323e1bc5-0052-bdaa-c95d-f19095d44e5f@msapiro.net>
Message-ID: <3151C44A-4D42-438E-A941-61BF68DF2E92@samsi.us>

Bingo! It was the SSL configuration. I had done only 1 step (Redirect), but not all three thinking it was do one of these 3 things :-)

Thank you Mark! Caesar.

> On Aug 21, 2016, at 6:01 PM, Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net> wrote:
> 
> On 08/21/2016 05:39 PM, Caesar Samsi wrote:
>> Found the same issue on another
>> board: https://locationtech.org/bugs/show_bug.cgi?id=90
>> 
>> They mentioned disabling the web confirmation page (and presumably the
>> URL in the confirm mail as well).
>> 
>> How would I do that?
> 
> 
> Their site is misconfigured just as yours is. The correct solution is to
> fix your misconfiguration, not to disable web confirmation.
> 
> If I had to guess what your problem is, I'd guess that your site is
> redirecting http to https but you haven't done steps 2 and 3 at
> <https://wiki.list.org/x/4030702>, but it may be something else. If that
> isn't it, look at the other things referenced at
> <https://wiki.list.org/x/4030602>.
> 
> -- 
> Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
> San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan


From mark at msapiro.net  Sun Aug 21 21:29:42 2016
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Sun, 21 Aug 2016 18:29:42 -0700
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Confirmation Page not working
In-Reply-To: <3E6E5994-D407-4C78-B301-AEB2398C11C4@samsi.us>
References: <F42B39AD-F2B6-4D50-8C9E-D4E841FCB8B0@mac.com>
 <E120A79E-9149-4D12-AD7A-9D6B05D42743@samsi.us>
 <e9d31468-8796-8d63-cffb-95dceec95608@msapiro.net>
 <A8E0B287-9571-424D-A6C5-868DAEC8285A@mac.com>
 <80CA5881-4C83-4097-A782-DAD17CA363A8@samsi.us>
 <5D810D59-2508-4E1C-8B8B-274B6E1C027A@samsi.us>
 <5ef66040-406a-5ed0-cc15-7923e8a55079@msapiro.net>
 <3E6E5994-D407-4C78-B301-AEB2398C11C4@samsi.us>
Message-ID: <7da754e5-7044-527e-64f3-4ea91484e5bc@msapiro.net>

On 08/21/2016 06:16 PM, Caesar Samsi wrote:
> The raw source is <FORM action="http://mail.yugi.us/confirm/seattlegigs"
> method="POST? >
> 
> The browser URL is https://mail.yugi.us/confirm/seattlegigs
> 
> Apart from http and https prefixes they are identical.
> 
> Is it due to the difference of SSL?


YES!


> Per noted wiki, I enabled SSL using (Rewrite method)
> https://wiki.list.org/DOC/4.27%20Securing%20Mailman%27s%20web%20GUI%20by%20using%20Secure%20HTTP-SSL



But you need to do steps 2 and 3.

I.e., you need to put

DEFAULT_URL_PATTERN = 'https://%s/mailman/'

in mm_cfg.py and then if all your lists are all in the DEFAULT_URL_HOST
domain, run Mailman's

bin/withlist -l -a -r fix_url

If you have lists in other web domains, you will have to run

bin/withlist -l -r fix_url listname -u list_web_domain

for each such listname.

See steps 2 and 3 in the above FAQ.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan

From mark at msapiro.net  Sun Aug 21 21:42:53 2016
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Sun, 21 Aug 2016 18:42:53 -0700
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Mailman is not sending/receiving email
In-Reply-To: <CAA55-0smJvMEjXN2kdYyn-rkVaHwF=jJ7zmxeJybPua1GoQTaQ@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAA55-0smJvMEjXN2kdYyn-rkVaHwF=jJ7zmxeJybPua1GoQTaQ@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <49b75fc1-fcf6-0e0d-d53b-f8b89eec4a3d@msapiro.net>

On 08/21/2016 08:49 AM, Rod Murray wrote:
> 
> I can get to the Admin page and everything looks fine. However mail is not
> being delivered. Sending mail to the list does not generate a bounce and
> the mail does not get into the Archive. New members can be added in the
> Admin page, but no notice goes out.


You can see <https://wiki.list.org/x/4030723>, but my best guess is some
or all of Mailman's qrunners are not running on the host server.


> What are the most likely causes and how should I proceed. Btw, Hostway has
> not been a bit of help even though they charge me $15/month to run the list!


You probably don't have enough access to the server to do anything. You
will have to get Hostway to fix this. By my calculation, you've paid
them over $1800. over the last 10+ years. That should be enough to get
some response.

If not, talk to Brian Carpenter <http://www.mailmanhost.com/> about
moving your list.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan

From mailinglist at samsi.us  Sun Aug 21 21:59:31 2016
From: mailinglist at samsi.us (Caesar Samsi)
Date: Sun, 21 Aug 2016 18:59:31 -0700
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Confirmation Page not working
In-Reply-To: <7da754e5-7044-527e-64f3-4ea91484e5bc@msapiro.net>
References: <F42B39AD-F2B6-4D50-8C9E-D4E841FCB8B0@mac.com>
 <E120A79E-9149-4D12-AD7A-9D6B05D42743@samsi.us>
 <e9d31468-8796-8d63-cffb-95dceec95608@msapiro.net>
 <A8E0B287-9571-424D-A6C5-868DAEC8285A@mac.com>
 <80CA5881-4C83-4097-A782-DAD17CA363A8@samsi.us>
 <5D810D59-2508-4E1C-8B8B-274B6E1C027A@samsi.us>
 <5ef66040-406a-5ed0-cc15-7923e8a55079@msapiro.net>
 <3E6E5994-D407-4C78-B301-AEB2398C11C4@samsi.us>
 <7da754e5-7044-527e-64f3-4ea91484e5bc@msapiro.net>
Message-ID: <CC4D1B1B-7839-4330-BACA-BF0E6EB22AFA@samsi.us>

Yup did all 3 steps and the confirmation page works now!


> On Aug 21, 2016, at 6:29 PM, Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net> wrote:
> 
> On 08/21/2016 06:16 PM, Caesar Samsi wrote:
>> The raw source is <FORM action="http://mail.yugi.us/confirm/seattlegigs"
>> method="POST? >
>> 
>> The browser URL is https://mail.yugi.us/confirm/seattlegigs
>> 
>> Apart from http and https prefixes they are identical.
>> 
>> Is it due to the difference of SSL?
> 
> 
> YES!
> 
> 
>> Per noted wiki, I enabled SSL using (Rewrite method)
>> https://wiki.list.org/DOC/4.27%20Securing%20Mailman%27s%20web%20GUI%20by%20using%20Secure%20HTTP-SSL
> 
> 
> 
> But you need to do steps 2 and 3.
> 
> I.e., you need to put
> 
> DEFAULT_URL_PATTERN = 'https://%s/mailman/'
> 
> in mm_cfg.py and then if all your lists are all in the DEFAULT_URL_HOST
> domain, run Mailman's
> 
> bin/withlist -l -a -r fix_url
> 
> If you have lists in other web domains, you will have to run
> 
> bin/withlist -l -r fix_url listname -u list_web_domain
> 
> for each such listname.
> 
> See steps 2 and 3 in the above FAQ.
> 
> -- 
> Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
> San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan


From ginesgb at gmail.com  Mon Aug 22 08:33:32 2016
From: ginesgb at gmail.com (Gines Granados Bayona)
Date: Mon, 22 Aug 2016 14:33:32 +0200
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Problems with mail delivery,
 configure Mailman with Postfix
Message-ID: <CAHkBno5A+Lt5tgmTVQQcAWsNr8V28VnohRHxMf8JhpknYLOMLA@mail.gmail.com>

Hi Mark, thank you very much, I corrected the data you've given me but It
do not send emails to the list of groups, it remains in pending shipment
mistake.

[root at lab]# postconf -n

alias_database = hash:/etc/aliases

alias_maps = hash:/etc/mailman/aliases

command_directory = /usr/sbin

config_directory = /etc/postfix

daemon_directory = /usr/libexec/postfix

data_directory = /var/lib/postfix

debug_peer_level = 2

html_directory = no

inet_interfaces = localhost

inet_protocols = ipv4

local_recipient_maps = proxy:unix:passwd.byname $alias_maps

mail_owner = postfix

mailq_path = /usr/bin/mailq.postfix

manpage_directory = /usr/share/man

mydestination = $mydomain, localhost.$mydomain, $myhostname localhost

mydomain = lab.company.net

myhostname = lista.$mydomain

mynetworks = $mydomain 127.0.0.0/8 [::ffff:127.0.0.0]/104 [::1]/128

newaliases_path = /usr/bin/newaliases.postfix

queue_directory = /var/spool/postfix

readme_directory = /usr/share/doc/postfix-2.6.6/README_FILES

recipient_delimiter = +

sample_directory = /usr/share/doc/postfix-2.6.6/samples

sendmail_path = /usr/sbin/sendmail.postfix

setgid_group = postdrop

unknown_local_recipient_reject_code = 550




I do not understand this question "Why this instead of the default '
localhost'?"
This parameter is not understand that I must do, according to your comment.

? Looks OK. but not referenced in Postfix - see above?.




root at lab]# find / -iname config_list

/usr/lib/mailman/bin/config_list



[root at lab]# find / -iname sitelist.cfg

/var/lib/mailman/data/sitelist.cfg

/etc/mailman/sitelist.cfg

I do not understand what settings to perform, excuse me, this is all new to
me.
Greetings and thank you

-- 
Este mensaje se dirige exclusivamente a su destinatario. Puede contener
informaci?n confidencial sometida a secreto profesional o cuya divulgaci?n
este prohibida, en virtud de la legislaci?n vigente. No esta  permitida su
divulgaci?n, copia o distribuci?n a terceros sin la autorizaci?n previa y
por  escrito del remitente. Si ha recibido este mensaje por error, le
rogamos nos lo  comunique inmediatamente por esta misma v?a y proceda a su
destrucci?n.


This e-mail is intended exclusively for the individual or entity to which
it is addressed
and may contain confidential or legally privileged information,  which may
not be disclosed under current legislation. Any form of disclosure, copying
or distribution of this e-mail is strictly prohibited, save with written
authorisation . If you have received this message in error, please notify
the sender immediately by e-mail and delete all copies of the message.

From rod at rodneymurray.com  Mon Aug 22 12:59:39 2016
From: rod at rodneymurray.com (Rod Murray)
Date: Mon, 22 Aug 2016 12:59:39 -0400
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Mailman is not sending/receiving email
In-Reply-To: <49b75fc1-fcf6-0e0d-d53b-f8b89eec4a3d@msapiro.net>
References: <CAA55-0smJvMEjXN2kdYyn-rkVaHwF=jJ7zmxeJybPua1GoQTaQ@mail.gmail.com>
 <49b75fc1-fcf6-0e0d-d53b-f8b89eec4a3d@msapiro.net>
Message-ID: <CAA55-0u3hvXMv-BO=+h3zNd-ofL5VugZCh2iBtvusdKSpaDqmQ@mail.gmail.com>

Mark,

Thanks for your response. After 1 hour on the phone yesterday, Hostway
claims they will fix it in 24-48 hours. We'll see. Thanks for the tip on
mailmanhost!

-Rod

On Sun, Aug 21, 2016 at 9:42 PM, Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net> wrote:

> On 08/21/2016 08:49 AM, Rod Murray wrote:
> >
> > I can get to the Admin page and everything looks fine. However mail is
> not
> > being delivered. Sending mail to the list does not generate a bounce and
> > the mail does not get into the Archive. New members can be added in the
> > Admin page, but no notice goes out.
>
>
> You can see <https://wiki.list.org/x/4030723>, but my best guess is some
> or all of Mailman's qrunners are not running on the host server.
>
>
> > What are the most likely causes and how should I proceed. Btw, Hostway
> has
> > not been a bit of help even though they charge me $15/month to run the
> list!
>
>
> You probably don't have enough access to the server to do anything. You
> will have to get Hostway to fix this. By my calculation, you've paid
> them over $1800. over the last 10+ years. That should be enough to get
> some response.
>
> If not, talk to Brian Carpenter <http://www.mailmanhost.com/> about
> moving your list.
>
> --
> Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
> San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan
> ------------------------------------------------------
> Mailman-Users mailing list Mailman-Users at python.org
> https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users
> Mailman FAQ: http://wiki.list.org/x/AgA3
> Security Policy: http://wiki.list.org/x/QIA9
> Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/
> mailman-users%40python.org/
> Unsubscribe: https://mail.python.org/mailman/options/mailman-users/
> netmcs%40gmail.com
>



-- 
Regards,
Rod
--
484-238-0303
--
www.RodneyMurray.com <http://RodneyMurray.com>
--

From mark at msapiro.net  Tue Aug 23 16:14:53 2016
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Tue, 23 Aug 2016 13:14:53 -0700
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Problems with mail delivery,
 configure Mailman with Postfix
In-Reply-To: <CAHkBno5A+Lt5tgmTVQQcAWsNr8V28VnohRHxMf8JhpknYLOMLA@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAHkBno5A+Lt5tgmTVQQcAWsNr8V28VnohRHxMf8JhpknYLOMLA@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <e26484f4-53f0-1eb5-609d-1859a24d6711@msapiro.net>

On 08/22/2016 05:33 AM, Gines Granados Bayona wrote:
> Hi Mark, thank you very much, I corrected the data you've given me but It
> do not send emails to the list of groups, it remains in pending shipment
> mistake.


What does "it remains in pending shipment mistake?" mean. I understand
you probably have difficulty with English, and I would like to help you,
but I can't help if I can't understand the problem.

So please describe as best you can, exactly what is happening to the
mail. Try to report the exact things that you see including log messages
rather than trying to summarize in your own words.


> [root at lab]# postconf -n
> 
> alias_database = hash:/etc/aliases
> 
> alias_maps = hash:/etc/mailman/aliases
> 
> command_directory = /usr/sbin
> 
> config_directory = /etc/postfix
> 
> daemon_directory = /usr/libexec/postfix
> 
> data_directory = /var/lib/postfix
> 
> debug_peer_level = 2
> 
> html_directory = no
> 
> inet_interfaces = localhost
> 
> inet_protocols = ipv4
> 
> local_recipient_maps = proxy:unix:passwd.byname $alias_maps
> 
> mail_owner = postfix
> 
> mailq_path = /usr/bin/mailq.postfix
> 
> manpage_directory = /usr/share/man
> 
> mydestination = $mydomain, localhost.$mydomain, $myhostname localhost
> 
> mydomain = lab.company.net
> 
> myhostname = lista.$mydomain
> 
> mynetworks = $mydomain 127.0.0.0/8 [::ffff:127.0.0.0]/104 [::1]/128
> 
> newaliases_path = /usr/bin/newaliases.postfix
> 
> queue_directory = /var/spool/postfix
> 
> readme_directory = /usr/share/doc/postfix-2.6.6/README_FILES
> 
> recipient_delimiter = +
> 
> sample_directory = /usr/share/doc/postfix-2.6.6/samples
> 
> sendmail_path = /usr/sbin/sendmail.postfix
> 
> setgid_group = postdrop
> 
> unknown_local_recipient_reject_code = 550
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I do not understand this question "Why this instead of the default '
> localhost'?"
> This parameter is not understand that I must do, according to your comment.


You have

SMTPHOST = 'lab.company.net'

in mm_cfg.py. I am asking why you added that line. It seems from what
you posted that lab.company.net is your local machine. If so, that line
should not be required as the Defaults.py setting

SMTPHOST = 'localhost'

should be OK.


> ? Looks OK. but not referenced in Postfix - see above?.


The above comment referred to your aliases file which seemed fine but it
wasn't referenced in Postfix because you needed to add

hash:/path/to/mailman/aliases

to Postfix's alias_maps where /path/to/mailman/ is the directory
containing your aliases file.


> root at lab]# find / -iname config_list
> /usr/lib/mailman/bin/config_list
> 
> [root at lab]# find / -iname sitelist.cfg
> /var/lib/mailman/data/sitelist.cfg
> /etc/mailman/sitelist.cfg
> 
> I do not understand what settings to perform, excuse me, this is all new to
> me.


The only purpose of sitelist.cfg is to be used to apply various
non-default settings to the 'mailman' site list. To do this, you would do

/usr/lib/mailman/bin/config_list -i /etc/mailman/sitelist.cfg mailman

but before you do that, you need to create the site list by running

/usr/lib/mailman/bin/newlist mailman

and answering the prompts.

Then you can start Mailman by running

/usr/lib/mailman/bin/mailmanctl start

That may solve your other issues.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan

From ted at io-tx.com  Tue Aug 23 18:55:42 2016
From: ted at io-tx.com (Ted Hatfield)
Date: Tue, 23 Aug 2016 17:55:42 -0500 (CDT)
Subject: [Mailman-Users] AOL rejecting connections from mailman servers for
 DMARC Munging.
Message-ID: <alpine.BSF.2.20.1608231754480.64359@io-tx.com>


Hey all,

Recently my mailman server was flagged by AOL and my messages were rejected 
with this error.

SMTP DATA-2 protocol error: 521 5.2.1 :  AOL will not accept delivery of this 
message.


When I queried the AOL Postmaster about this issue this was my response.

Few mails from IP xxx.xxx.xxx.xx were getting rejected from one of filters as 
Reply-to address is same as the TO address. This is caused as one of our 
filters triggered these emails as spam. I have added protection for your IP. As 
a good mailing practice, please use a different email address for your reply-to 
address.


It seems to me that since dmarc munging adds the senders address to the 
reply-to header, if a user receives a copy of their own postings this is the 
result.

Can anyone else confirm that this has happened to them and if so what else can 
someone do except to wrap the message from senders that implement dmarc 
rejection as in dmarc_moderation_action?


Is there a recommended policy regarding this issue?


Ted Hatfield


From mark at msapiro.net  Wed Aug 24 13:32:06 2016
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2016 10:32:06 -0700
Subject: [Mailman-Users] AOL rejecting connections from mailman servers
 for DMARC Munging.
In-Reply-To: <alpine.BSF.2.20.1608231754480.64359@io-tx.com>
References: <alpine.BSF.2.20.1608231754480.64359@io-tx.com>
Message-ID: <6136cfee-076c-2dac-7aef-0c6b57178e7c@msapiro.net>

On 08/23/2016 03:55 PM, Ted Hatfield wrote:
> 
> Few mails from IP xxx.xxx.xxx.xx were getting rejected from one of
> filters as Reply-to address is same as the TO address. This is caused as
> one of our filters triggered these emails as spam. I have added
> protection for your IP. As a good mailing practice, please use a
> different email address for your reply-to address.


Don't munge Reply-To: ;)


> It seems to me that since dmarc munging adds the senders address to the
> reply-to header, if a user receives a copy of their own postings this is
> the result.


No. Based on AOL's reply above, this has nothing to do with DMARC. If
you set reply_goes_to_list to This list (note that Poster is the
/strongly/ recommended setting) both the To: and Reply-To: headers of
outgoing messages will contain the list address.

However, it seems that this means AOL will not accept mail from any list
with reply_goes_to_list = This list, and since this is a common,
although not recommended, configuration, if this is the case, it seems
there should be much more reports of this issue, and I haven't seen that.


> Can anyone else confirm that this has happened to them and if so what
> else can someone do except to wrap the message from senders that
> implement dmarc rejection as in dmarc_moderation_action?


Even if this is a DMARC issue, Wrap message won't change it because the
headers in the wrapper will be the same as those in a Munge from message.


> Is there a recommended policy regarding this issue?


Set reply_goes_to_list to Poster

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan

From heller at deepsoft.com  Wed Aug 24 14:02:00 2016
From: heller at deepsoft.com (Robert Heller)
Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2016 14:02:00 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: [Mailman-Users] AOL rejecting connections from mailman servers
 for DMARC Munging.
In-Reply-To: <6136cfee-076c-2dac-7aef-0c6b57178e7c@msapiro.net>
References: <alpine.BSF.2.20.1608231754480.64359@io-tx.com> 
 <6136cfee-076c-2dac-7aef-0c6b57178e7c@msapiro.net>
Message-ID: <20160824180200.AC192732A4F@sharky3.deepsoft.com>

At Wed, 24 Aug 2016 10:32:06 -0700 Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net> wrote:

> 
> On 08/23/2016 03:55 PM, Ted Hatfield wrote:
> > 
> > Few mails from IP xxx.xxx.xxx.xx were getting rejected from one of
> > filters as Reply-to address is same as the TO address. This is caused as
> > one of our filters triggered these emails as spam. I have added
> > protection for your IP. As a good mailing practice, please use a
> > different email address for your reply-to address.
> 
> 
> Don't munge Reply-To: ;)
> 
> 
> > It seems to me that since dmarc munging adds the senders address to the
> > reply-to header, if a user receives a copy of their own postings this is
> > the result.
> 
> 
> No. Based on AOL's reply above, this has nothing to do with DMARC. If
> you set reply_goes_to_list to This list (note that Poster is the
> /strongly/ recommended setting) both the To: and Reply-To: headers of
> outgoing messages will contain the list address.

And if reply_goes_to_list is set to Poster and the poster sent to himself and
CC's to the list, the To: and Reply-To: headers the outgoing message will
contain the poster's address :-(. (This legal, but generally is going to
require interesting finagling by the E-Mail client.) Note that this assumes
that AOL really means the To: header. It *could* mean the union of the To: and
Cc: headers. Eg if the address in the From: is also in the To: OR Cc: headers,
AOL might reject the E-Mail. (This would be seriously dumb and effectively
make AOL an impossible E-Mail destination to deliver any E-Mail to.)

It does relate to DMARC, in that in order for a Mailman list to allow Yahoo, 
et. al. users to post, you have to have Mailman munge the From: field and then 
to allow "reply to sender", Mailman needs to be configured to put the poster's 
address in a Reply-To: header.

> 
> However, it seems that this means AOL will not accept mail from any list
> with reply_goes_to_list = This list, and since this is a common,
> although not recommended, configuration, if this is the case, it seems
> there should be much more reports of this issue, and I haven't seen that.
> 
> 
> > Can anyone else confirm that this has happened to them and if so what
> > else can someone do except to wrap the message from senders that
> > implement dmarc rejection as in dmarc_moderation_action?
> 
> 
> Even if this is a DMARC issue, Wrap message won't change it because the
> headers in the wrapper will be the same as those in a Munge from message.
> 
> 
> > Is there a recommended policy regarding this issue?
> 
> 
> Set reply_goes_to_list to Poster

+1

> 

-- 
Robert Heller             -- 978-544-6933
Deepwoods Software        -- Custom Software Services
http://www.deepsoft.com/  -- Linux Administration Services
heller at deepsoft.com       -- Webhosting Services
                                         

From ted at io-tx.com  Wed Aug 24 15:24:32 2016
From: ted at io-tx.com (Ted Hatfield)
Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2016 14:24:32 -0500 (CDT)
Subject: [Mailman-Users] AOL rejecting connections from mailman servers
 for DMARC Munging.
In-Reply-To: <6136cfee-076c-2dac-7aef-0c6b57178e7c@msapiro.net>
References: <alpine.BSF.2.20.1608231754480.64359@io-tx.com>
 <6136cfee-076c-2dac-7aef-0c6b57178e7c@msapiro.net>
Message-ID: <alpine.BSF.2.20.1608241419120.72943@io-tx.com>

On Wed, 24 Aug 2016, Mark Sapiro wrote:

> On 08/23/2016 03:55 PM, Ted Hatfield wrote:
>>
>> Few mails from IP xxx.xxx.xxx.xx were getting rejected from one of
>> filters as Reply-to address is same as the TO address. This is caused as
>> one of our filters triggered these emails as spam. I have added
>> protection for your IP. As a good mailing practice, please use a
>> different email address for your reply-to address.
>
>
> Don't munge Reply-To: ;)
>
>
>> It seems to me that since dmarc munging adds the senders address to the
>> reply-to header, if a user receives a copy of their own postings this is
>> the result.
>
>
> No. Based on AOL's reply above, this has nothing to do with DMARC. If
> you set reply_goes_to_list to This list (note that Poster is the
> /strongly/ recommended setting) both the To: and Reply-To: headers of
> outgoing messages will contain the list address.
>
> However, it seems that this means AOL will not accept mail from any list
> with reply_goes_to_list = This list, and since this is a common,
> although not recommended, configuration, if this is the case, it seems
> there should be much more reports of this issue, and I haven't seen that.
>
>
>> Can anyone else confirm that this has happened to them and if so what
>> else can someone do except to wrap the message from senders that
>> implement dmarc rejection as in dmarc_moderation_action?
>
>
> Even if this is a DMARC issue, Wrap message won't change it because the
> headers in the wrapper will be the same as those in a Munge from message.
>
>
>> Is there a recommended policy regarding this issue?
>
>
> Set reply_goes_to_list to Poster
>
> --

I'm running mailman version 2.1.22.

reply_goes_to_list is set to poster

from_is_list is set to "Munge From".

Documentation describes "Munge From" to be

"This action replaces the poster's address in the From: header with the 
list's posting address and adds the poster's address to the addresses in 
the original Reply-To: header."


This means that messages with a munged From: header should pass dmarc 
checks but the senders address will be added to the reply-to header.  Does 
this not mean that the Reply-To: and the To: address will be the same for 
some users?

Ted Hatfield





From mark at msapiro.net  Wed Aug 24 17:30:15 2016
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2016 14:30:15 -0700
Subject: [Mailman-Users] AOL rejecting connections from mailman servers
 for DMARC Munging.
In-Reply-To: <alpine.BSF.2.20.1608241419120.72943@io-tx.com>
References: <alpine.BSF.2.20.1608231754480.64359@io-tx.com>
 <6136cfee-076c-2dac-7aef-0c6b57178e7c@msapiro.net>
 <alpine.BSF.2.20.1608241419120.72943@io-tx.com>
Message-ID: <576909d8-3a96-3965-3800-c2942e6c6eb4@msapiro.net>

On 08/24/2016 12:24 PM, Ted Hatfield wrote:
> 
> I'm running mailman version 2.1.22.
> 
> reply_goes_to_list is set to poster
> 
> from_is_list is set to "Munge From".
> 
> Documentation describes "Munge From" to be
> 
> "This action replaces the poster's address in the From: header with the
> list's posting address and adds the poster's address to the addresses in
> the original Reply-To: header."
> 
> 
> This means that messages with a munged From: header should pass dmarc
> checks but the senders address will be added to the reply-to header. 
> Does this not mean that the Reply-To: and the To: address will be the
> same for some users?


Well, depending on how the user crafts the post, many things are
possible, but with from_is_list = Munge from[1] and the usual situation,
the post is

From: Joe Sender <sender at example.net>
To: A list <list at example.com>

and after munging the delivered post is

From: Joe Sender on behalf of a A list <list at example.com>
Reply-To: Joe Sender <sender at example.net>
To: A list <list at example.com>

Reply-To: is the sender's address <sender at example.net> and To: is the
list address <list at example.com>. These are not the same.

[1] It is recommended to set from_is_list to No and
dmarc_moderation_action to Munge from. The resultant munging will be the
same but will only be applied to messages From: a domain publishing a
DMARC policy of reject (or quarantine if
dmarc_quarantine_moderation_action is Yes).

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan

From heller at deepsoft.com  Wed Aug 24 17:37:16 2016
From: heller at deepsoft.com (Robert Heller)
Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2016 17:37:16 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: [Mailman-Users] AOL rejecting connections from mailman servers
 for DMARC Munging.
In-Reply-To: <alpine.BSF.2.20.1608241419120.72943@io-tx.com>
References: <alpine.BSF.2.20.1608231754480.64359@io-tx.com> 
 <6136cfee-076c-2dac-7aef-0c6b57178e7c@msapiro.net> 
 <alpine.BSF.2.20.1608241419120.72943@io-tx.com>
Message-ID: <20160824213716.91A87732A4F@sharky3.deepsoft.com>

At Wed, 24 Aug 2016 14:24:32 -0500 (CDT) Ted Hatfield <ted at io-tx.com> wrote:

> 
> On Wed, 24 Aug 2016, Mark Sapiro wrote:
> 
> > On 08/23/2016 03:55 PM, Ted Hatfield wrote:
> >>
> >> Few mails from IP xxx.xxx.xxx.xx were getting rejected from one of
> >> filters as Reply-to address is same as the TO address. This is caused as
> >> one of our filters triggered these emails as spam. I have added
> >> protection for your IP. As a good mailing practice, please use a
> >> different email address for your reply-to address.
> >
> >
> > Don't munge Reply-To: ;)
> >
> >
> >> It seems to me that since dmarc munging adds the senders address to the
> >> reply-to header, if a user receives a copy of their own postings this is
> >> the result.
> >
> >
> > No. Based on AOL's reply above, this has nothing to do with DMARC. If
> > you set reply_goes_to_list to This list (note that Poster is the
> > /strongly/ recommended setting) both the To: and Reply-To: headers of
> > outgoing messages will contain the list address.
> >
> > However, it seems that this means AOL will not accept mail from any list
> > with reply_goes_to_list = This list, and since this is a common,
> > although not recommended, configuration, if this is the case, it seems
> > there should be much more reports of this issue, and I haven't seen that.
> >
> >
> >> Can anyone else confirm that this has happened to them and if so what
> >> else can someone do except to wrap the message from senders that
> >> implement dmarc rejection as in dmarc_moderation_action?
> >
> >
> > Even if this is a DMARC issue, Wrap message won't change it because the
> > headers in the wrapper will be the same as those in a Munge from message.
> >
> >
> >> Is there a recommended policy regarding this issue?
> >
> >
> > Set reply_goes_to_list to Poster
> >
> > --
> 
> I'm running mailman version 2.1.22.
> 
> reply_goes_to_list is set to poster
> 
> from_is_list is set to "Munge From".
> 
> Documentation describes "Munge From" to be
> 
> "This action replaces the poster's address in the From: header with the 
> list's posting address and adds the poster's address to the addresses in 
> the original Reply-To: header."
> 
> 
> This means that messages with a munged From: header should pass dmarc 
> checks but the senders address will be added to the reply-to header.  Does 
> this not mean that the Reply-To: and the To: address will be the same for 
> some users?

The Reply-To: and To: would be the same if those users send the post to
themselves and CC it to the list. This is *probably* unlikely, but possible I
guess.  *Normally* a user posts *To* the list (To: list address), and CC's to 
themselves (Cc: the poster).  Mailman sets the Reply-To: field to the poster's 
address and replaces the From: header to be from the list:

   To: list
   Reply-To: poster
   Cc: poster
   From: list

> 
> Ted Hatfield
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ------------------------------------------------------
> Mailman-Users mailing list Mailman-Users at python.org
> https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users
> Mailman FAQ: http://wiki.list.org/x/AgA3
> Security Policy: http://wiki.list.org/x/QIA9
> Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users%40python.org/
> Unsubscribe: https://mail.python.org/mailman/options/mailman-users/heller%40deepsoft.com
> 
>                                                

-- 
Robert Heller             -- 978-544-6933
Deepwoods Software        -- Custom Software Services
http://www.deepsoft.com/  -- Linux Administration Services
heller at deepsoft.com       -- Webhosting Services
                                                                         

From turnbull.stephen.fw at u.tsukuba.ac.jp  Thu Aug 25 05:54:07 2016
From: turnbull.stephen.fw at u.tsukuba.ac.jp (Stephen J. Turnbull)
Date: Thu, 25 Aug 2016 18:54:07 +0900
Subject: [Mailman-Users] AOL rejecting connections from mailman servers
 for DMARC Munging.
In-Reply-To: <20160824180200.AC192732A4F@sharky3.deepsoft.com>
References: <alpine.BSF.2.20.1608231754480.64359@io-tx.com>
 <6136cfee-076c-2dac-7aef-0c6b57178e7c@msapiro.net>
 <20160824180200.AC192732A4F@sharky3.deepsoft.com>
Message-ID: <22462.49215.64055.91930@turnbull.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp>

Robert Heller writes:

 > Cc: headers. Eg if the address in the From: is also in the To: OR
 > Cc: headers, AOL might reject the E-Mail. (This would be seriously
 > dumb and effectively make AOL an impossible E-Mail destination to
 > deliver any E-Mail to.)

Bcc....

But yes, I agree.  The solution is to be a friend, and friends don't
let friends use AOL. ;-)  Yes, I know, you have to pry their AOL from
their cold dead fingers and all that.  The thing is, that with AOL
it's just one thing after another.  While it's definitely possible to
deliver some email to AOL, any given email might be refused for
reasons that you can't predict.  We can't protect our users from their
own service providers. :-(

BTW, the OP already said that his setting for reply-to is Poster, so
something we haven't figured out yet seems to be happening here. :-(

Steve

From steve at tunedinweb.com  Thu Aug 25 09:01:33 2016
From: steve at tunedinweb.com (Steve Wehr)
Date: Thu, 25 Aug 2016 09:01:33 -0400
Subject: [Mailman-Users] AOL rejecting connections from mailman servers
 for DMARC Munging.
In-Reply-To: <alpine.BSF.2.20.1608231754480.64359@io-tx.com>
References: <alpine.BSF.2.20.1608231754480.64359@io-tx.com>
Message-ID: <038701d1fed0$ce948e70$6bbdab50$@com>

I recently have been fighting AOL over this exact same thing. To solve it I
contacted AOL via their postmaster page and opened a ticket. They got back
to me and said they "made some changes to their handling of mail from my IP
address."

I had been using mailman to send to AOL users for over a decade, so I didn't
change anything in mailman. After about 2-3 weeks AOL has now stopped
rejecting mailman emails. 

In the interim, I used Mark Sapiro's script to reset the moderation bits on
all AOL users, encased in a little shell script I wrote:

#!/bin/bash

# This script resets the bounce bits for certain users in ALL lists.
#
# Run this script as ROOT
for listname in $(ls /var/lib/mailman/lists/);
do
   echo Resetting bounce bits in list $listname
   # Reset bounce bits for only AOL.COM members.
   /usr/lib/mailman/bin/withlist -r reset_bounce $listname -d aol.com
done;

Hope this is helpful.

_____________________
Steve Wehr
Tunedin Web Design
845-246-9643


-----Original Message-----
From: Mailman-Users
[mailto:mailman-users-bounces+steve=tunedinweb.com at python.org] On Behalf Of
Ted Hatfield
Sent: Tuesday, August 23, 2016 6:56 PM
To: mailman-users at python.org
Subject: [Mailman-Users] AOL rejecting connections from mailman servers for
DMARC Munging.


Hey all,

Recently my mailman server was flagged by AOL and my messages were rejected
with this error.

SMTP DATA-2 protocol error: 521 5.2.1 :  AOL will not accept delivery of
this message.


When I queried the AOL Postmaster about this issue this was my response.

Few mails from IP xxx.xxx.xxx.xx were getting rejected from one of filters
as 
Reply-to address is same as the TO address. This is caused as one of our 
filters triggered these emails as spam. I have added protection for your IP.
As 
a good mailing practice, please use a different email address for your
reply-to 
address.


It seems to me that since dmarc munging adds the senders address to the 
reply-to header, if a user receives a copy of their own postings this is the

result.

Can anyone else confirm that this has happened to them and if so what else
can 
someone do except to wrap the message from senders that implement dmarc 
rejection as in dmarc_moderation_action?


Is there a recommended policy regarding this issue?


Ted Hatfield

------------------------------------------------------
Mailman-Users mailing list Mailman-Users at python.org
https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users
Mailman FAQ: http://wiki.list.org/x/AgA3
Security Policy: http://wiki.list.org/x/QIA9
Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users%40python.org/
Unsubscribe:
https://mail.python.org/mailman/options/mailman-users/steve%40tunedinweb.com


From ed.beu at alaska.gov  Wed Aug 24 14:20:15 2016
From: ed.beu at alaska.gov (Beu, Ed (DOA))
Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2016 18:20:15 +0000
Subject: [Mailman-Users] unique Message-IDs
Message-ID: <77788B6418FB6E4CB10D483D7DAC164C011426F234@SOAANCEXMB9.soa.alaska.gov>

Hello Mark,

We've run into a situation whereas our email archiving system is puking on mail sent from large Mailman lists due to the Message-IDs all being the same on each individual message.

I found the following article and tried it, without any success.

https://mail.python.org/pipermail/mailman-users/2011-November/072525.html

We're running Mailman v2.1.12 on Centos 6.7 and using Postfix 2.6.6..

Any other suggestions?

Thx, Ed


Ed Beu , Systems Programmer
Enterprise Technology Services
Department of Administration
619 E Shipcreek Ave., Ste 232
Anchorage, AK 99501-1677
[ETSLogo]----------------------------------------
*Desk:(907)269-6790
?Fax: (907)269-6719
* ed.beu at alaska.gov<mailto:ed.beu at alaska.gov>
" http://www.doa.alaska.gov/ets/
----------------------------------------





From mark at msapiro.net  Thu Aug 25 11:27:25 2016
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Thu, 25 Aug 2016 08:27:25 -0700
Subject: [Mailman-Users] AOL rejecting connections from mailman servers
 for DMARC Munging.
In-Reply-To: <038701d1fed0$ce948e70$6bbdab50$@com>
References: <alpine.BSF.2.20.1608231754480.64359@io-tx.com>
 <038701d1fed0$ce948e70$6bbdab50$@com>
Message-ID: <7709152e-b6fc-e175-63a1-ac4fb4e6e684@msapiro.net>

On 08/25/2016 06:01 AM, Steve Wehr wrote:
> 
> In the interim, I used Mark Sapiro's script to reset the moderation bits on
> all AOL users, encased in a little shell script I wrote:
> 
> #!/bin/bash
> 
> # This script resets the bounce bits for certain users in ALL lists.
> #
> # Run this script as ROOT
> for listname in $(ls /var/lib/mailman/lists/);


A more robust way to do this is

for listname in $(/usr/lib/mailman/bin/list_lists -b);

because there may be files or non-list directories in
/var/lib/mailman/lists/

> do
>    echo Resetting bounce bits in list $listname
>    # Reset bounce bits for only AOL.COM members.
>    /usr/lib/mailman/bin/withlist -r reset_bounce $listname -d aol.com
> done;
> 
> Hope this is helpful.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan

From mark at msapiro.net  Thu Aug 25 11:48:21 2016
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Thu, 25 Aug 2016 08:48:21 -0700
Subject: [Mailman-Users] unique Message-IDs
In-Reply-To: <77788B6418FB6E4CB10D483D7DAC164C011426F234@SOAANCEXMB9.soa.alaska.gov>
References: <77788B6418FB6E4CB10D483D7DAC164C011426F234@SOAANCEXMB9.soa.alaska.gov>
Message-ID: <df1cd804-e9ca-62c4-6ac5-f450e00d0311@msapiro.net>

On 08/24/2016 11:20 AM, Beu, Ed (DOA) wrote:
> 
> We've run into a situation whereas our email archiving system is puking on mail sent from large Mailman lists due to the Message-IDs all being the same on each individual message.
> 
> I found the following article and tried it, without any success.
> 
> https://mail.python.org/pipermail/mailman-users/2011-November/072525.html


Did you try just deleting the Message-ID or replacing it with a Mailman
Generated one?

If you are not VERPing or personalizing deliveries, replacing the
Message-ID will not be completely effective because the message with the
replaced Message-ID will still be sent to chunks with multiple
recipients. Whether deleting the Message-ID will be effective or not
will depend on when in its processing the MTA adds its own Message-ID.


> Any other suggestions?


Enable verp by putting

VERP_DELIVERY_INTERVAL = 1

in mm_cfg.py and then replace the Message-ID with a Mailman generated
one per
<https://mail.python.org/pipermail/mailman-users/2011-November/072525.html>
or maybe just fix your archiving system.

Note that replacing the Message-ID in this way is a violation of mail
RFCs and I don't recommend it.

What happens if a local user sends a message with multiple To:, Cc:
and/or Bcc: recipients. Doesn't that confuse your archiving system too?
What do you do about that?

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan

From ed.beu at alaska.gov  Thu Aug 25 12:04:02 2016
From: ed.beu at alaska.gov (Beu, Ed (DOA))
Date: Thu, 25 Aug 2016 16:04:02 +0000
Subject: [Mailman-Users] unique Message-IDs
In-Reply-To: <df1cd804-e9ca-62c4-6ac5-f450e00d0311@msapiro.net>
References: <77788B6418FB6E4CB10D483D7DAC164C011426F234@SOAANCEXMB9.soa.alaska.gov>
 <df1cd804-e9ca-62c4-6ac5-f450e00d0311@msapiro.net>
Message-ID: <77788B6418FB6E4CB10D483D7DAC164C011426F7C3@SOAANCEXMB9.soa.alaska.gov>

-----Original Message-----
From: Mailman-Users [mailto:mailman-users-bounces+ed.beu=alaska.gov at python.org] On Behalf Of Mark Sapiro
Sent: Thursday, August 25, 2016 7:48 AM
To: mailman-users at python.org
Subject: Re: [Mailman-Users] unique Message-IDs

On 08/24/2016 11:20 AM, Beu, Ed (DOA) wrote:
> 
> We've run into a situation whereas our email archiving system is puking on mail sent from large Mailman lists due to the Message-IDs all being the same on each individual message.
> 
> I found the following article and tried it, without any success.
> 
> https://mail.python.org/pipermail/mailman-users/2011-November/072525.html


>>Did you try just deleting the Message-ID or replacing it with a Mailman
>>Generated one?

I tried both methods, both did not work.

>>If you are not VERPing or personalizing deliveries, replacing the
>>Message-ID will not be completely effective because the message with the
>>replaced Message-ID will still be sent to chunks with multiple
>>recipients. Whether deleting the Message-ID will be effective or not
>>will depend on when in its processing the MTA adds its own Message-ID.

With VERP turned on it presented issues with our Spam Filter, so not an option.

> Any other suggestions?


>>Enable verp by putting

>>VERP_DELIVERY_INTERVAL = 1

>>in mm_cfg.py and then replace the Message-ID with a Mailman generated
>>one per
>><https://mail.python.org/pipermail/mailman-users/2011-November/072525.html>


>>or maybe just fix your archiving system.

Plans are in the works for a replacement (O365)! 

>>Note that replacing the Message-ID in this way is a violation of mail
>>RFCs and I don't recommend it.

Understood!

>>What happens if a local user sends a message with multiple To:, Cc:
>>and/or Bcc: recipients. Doesn't that confuse your archiving system too?
>>What do you do about that?

I don't run the archiving system so not sure.  The archiving admin mentioned he was manually changing MSG-IDs the other day.

Thanks, Ed

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan
------------------------------------------------------
Mailman-Users mailing list Mailman-Users at python.org
https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users
Mailman FAQ: http://wiki.list.org/x/AgA3
Security Policy: http://wiki.list.org/x/QIA9
Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users%40python.org/

From mailinglist at samsi.us  Thu Aug 25 13:32:11 2016
From: mailinglist at samsi.us (Caesar Samsi)
Date: Thu, 25 Aug 2016 10:32:11 -0700
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Update advisory (how to install?)
References: <F5DE7CA2-2C9A-4039-AE59-79BB1FFC9C71@mac.com>
Message-ID: <506A2E67-02DF-4FAA-A644-49D7770949F2@samsi.us>

Hi there,

I recall there was an advisory to update Mailman due to something (security issue?).

When is this happening and where can I get the update and how to install it?

Thanks, Caesar.


From cpz at tuunq.com  Thu Aug 25 13:38:49 2016
From: cpz at tuunq.com (Carl Zwanzig)
Date: Thu, 25 Aug 2016 10:38:49 -0700
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Update advisory (how to install?)
In-Reply-To: <506A2E67-02DF-4FAA-A644-49D7770949F2@samsi.us>
References: <F5DE7CA2-2C9A-4039-AE59-79BB1FFC9C71@mac.com>
 <506A2E67-02DF-4FAA-A644-49D7770949F2@samsi.us>
Message-ID: <e6325101-f5c0-bccb-bdef-1ff3e2f17eb6@tuunq.com>

On 8/25/2016 10:32 AM, Caesar Samsi wrote:
> I recall there was an advisory to update Mailman due to something (security issue?).
> When is this happening and where can I get the update and how to install it?

Mark's original email of 19-Aug-2016: "I plan to release Mailman 2.1.23 with 
this and other fixes on Saturday, Aug 27 and also to post at the same time 
the patch which can be applied stand-alone." (I'm sure it's in the list 
archive.)

In general, to upgrade you download the full package from the mailman site 
and follow the updating instructions there or in the tarball. Pretty simple.

Later,

z!


From ted at io-tx.com  Thu Aug 25 18:31:02 2016
From: ted at io-tx.com (Ted Hatfield)
Date: Thu, 25 Aug 2016 17:31:02 -0500 (CDT)
Subject: [Mailman-Users] AOL rejecting connections from mailman servers
 for DMARC Munging.
In-Reply-To: <038701d1fed0$ce948e70$6bbdab50$@com>
References: <alpine.BSF.2.20.1608231754480.64359@io-tx.com>
 <038701d1fed0$ce948e70$6bbdab50$@com>
Message-ID: <alpine.BSF.2.20.1608251724450.83933@io-tx.com>


On Thu, 25 Aug 2016, Steve Wehr wrote:

>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Mailman-Users
> [mailto:mailman-users-bounces+steve=tunedinweb.com at python.org] On Behalf Of
> Ted Hatfield
> Sent: Tuesday, August 23, 2016 6:56 PM
> To: mailman-users at python.org
> Subject: [Mailman-Users] AOL rejecting connections from mailman servers for
> DMARC Munging.
>
>
> Hey all,
>
> Recently my mailman server was flagged by AOL and my messages were rejected
> with this error.
>
> SMTP DATA-2 protocol error: 521 5.2.1 :  AOL will not accept delivery of
> this message.
>
>
> When I queried the AOL Postmaster about this issue this was my response.
>
> Few mails from IP xxx.xxx.xxx.xx were getting rejected from one of filters
> as
> Reply-to address is same as the TO address. This is caused as one of our
> filters triggered these emails as spam. I have added protection for your IP.
> As
> a good mailing practice, please use a different email address for your
> reply-to
> address.
>
>
> It seems to me that since dmarc munging adds the senders address to the
> reply-to header, if a user receives a copy of their own postings this is the
>
> result.
>
> Can anyone else confirm that this has happened to them and if so what else
> can
> someone do except to wrap the message from senders that implement dmarc
> rejection as in dmarc_moderation_action?
>
>
> Is there a recommended policy regarding this issue?
>
>
> Ted Hatfield
>


>
> I recently have been fighting AOL over this exact same thing. To solve it I
> contacted AOL via their postmaster page and opened a ticket. They got back
> to me and said they "made some changes to their handling of mail from my IP
> address."
>
> I had been using mailman to send to AOL users for over a decade, so I didn't
> change anything in mailman. After about 2-3 weeks AOL has now stopped
> rejecting mailman emails.
>
> In the interim, I used Mark Sapiro's script to reset the moderation bits on
> all AOL users, encased in a little shell script I wrote:
>
> #!/bin/bash
>
> # This script resets the bounce bits for certain users in ALL lists.
> #
> # Run this script as ROOT
> for listname in $(ls /var/lib/mailman/lists/);
> do
>   echo Resetting bounce bits in list $listname
>   # Reset bounce bits for only AOL.COM members.
>   /usr/lib/mailman/bin/withlist -r reset_bounce $listname -d aol.com
> done;
>
> Hope this is helpful.
>
> _____________________
> Steve Wehr
> Tunedin Web Design
> 845-246-9643
>

Steve,

Glad to see I'm not the only one.  This was also my solution. I just 
wanted to see if there was a better way to handle the issue but I don't 
see any recommended advice that would solve the issue in a technical way.


I'm considering setting dmarc_moderation_action to "Wrap Message" and 
setting from_is_list back to "No"

This will at least only affect the users who use email that enforces
DMARC p=quarantine and p=reject.


Ted Hatfield


From jglazer at gard.com  Fri Aug 26 10:10:03 2016
From: jglazer at gard.com (Jason Glazer)
Date: Fri, 26 Aug 2016 09:10:03 -0500
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Hire consultant to install Mailman 3 on Dreamhost
Message-ID: <21cbff21-a85f-0c67-0f5e-c8f65cbacae6@gard.com>

I am interested in hiring a consultant to install Mailman 3 
on a Dreamhost server and migrate a bunch of existing 
Mailman 2.1.17 mailing lists to Mailman 3. If you are 
interested, or you know someone that might be able to 
provide this service, please contact me off list.

Thanks

Jason Glazer

jglazer at gard.com


-- 

Jason Glazer, P.E., GARD Analytics, 90.1 ECB chair, 209 chair
Admin for onebuilding.org building performance mailing lists


From housley at vigilsec.com  Fri Aug 26 10:31:15 2016
From: housley at vigilsec.com (Russ Housley)
Date: Fri, 26 Aug 2016 10:31:15 -0400
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Hire consultant to install Mailman 3 on
 Dreamhost
In-Reply-To: <21cbff21-a85f-0c67-0f5e-c8f65cbacae6@gard.com>
References: <21cbff21-a85f-0c67-0f5e-c8f65cbacae6@gard.com>
Message-ID: <EE19AC06-F540-40B4-B1D2-4E3670AE79EA@vigilsec.com>


> I am interested in hiring a consultant to install Mailman 3 on a Dreamhost server and migrate a bunch of existing Mailman 2.1.17 mailing lists to Mailman 3. If you are interested, or you know someone that might be able to provide this service, please contact me off list.

I am interested in the internationalization capabilities of Mailman 3, but I thought that it was not ready for production use.  In that not right?

Russ


From turnbull.stephen.fw at u.tsukuba.ac.jp  Fri Aug 26 12:17:45 2016
From: turnbull.stephen.fw at u.tsukuba.ac.jp (Stephen J. Turnbull)
Date: Sat, 27 Aug 2016 01:17:45 +0900
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Hire consultant to install Mailman 3 on
 Dreamhost
In-Reply-To: <EE19AC06-F540-40B4-B1D2-4E3670AE79EA@vigilsec.com>
References: <21cbff21-a85f-0c67-0f5e-c8f65cbacae6@gard.com>
 <EE19AC06-F540-40B4-B1D2-4E3670AE79EA@vigilsec.com>
Message-ID: <22464.27561.239942.268920@turnbull.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp>

Russ Housley writes:

 > I am interested in the internationalization capabilities of Mailman
 > 3, but I thought that it was not ready for production use.  In that
 > not right?

That depends on your use case.  The basic facilities are quite robust
and in production use by several organizations.  But important
features are in process, such as (1) DMARC mitigation (which doesn't
matter if you have no posters at p=reject domains) and (2) your own
interest, localization (the translation stock for core is nonexistent
at present, I'm not sure what localizations HyperKitty and Postorius
have).

Also, Postorius (and possibly HyperKitty) are going to have to undergo
substantial upgrades in the near future, because they currently use
Mozilla Persona for authentication.  We've decided what to do about
that and the work is underway (and looks straightforward to me), but
it's still going to mean an upgrade in the near future if you install
now.

So, production?  Yes, with care.  Turnkey for the general audience?
Not yet.

Steve


From minxmertzmomo at gmail.com  Thu Aug 25 15:28:06 2016
From: minxmertzmomo at gmail.com (Matt Morgan)
Date: Thu, 25 Aug 2016 15:28:06 -0400
Subject: [Mailman-Users] unsubscriptions due to automatic bounce processing
Message-ID: <CABTRqU6QMf-PCv6i5bPFD9aERjVKA8UBVn8EqSY6+4vRP-cLmw@mail.gmail.com>

I recently took over a lot of pre-existing mailman lists for a new client.
At least one list was pretty messy. They had automatic bounce processing
turned on, but the threshold was high, and reset time was shorter than the
typical length of times between postings (it's an announce-only list that
goes out about once monthly). So there were a lot of bad addresses.

I decided to set it up to clean out the cruft fast, and then I'd temper it
back a little. So I set it up like this:

bounce_processing: yes
bounce_score_threshold: 2.0
bounce_info_stale_after: 63
bounce_you_are_disabled_warnings: 0
bounce_you_are_disabled_warnings_interval: 7
bounce_unrecognized_goes_to_list_owner: no
bounce_notify_owner_on_disable: yes
bounce_notify_owner_on_removal: yes

It appears to have worked, but what I'm confused about is this: the last
mailing went out on August 11th, and the list owners got 750 automatic
unsubscribes yesterday. "bounce_you_are_disabled_warnings" set to zero is
supposed to mean that people are removed "immediately" ... but maybe that
means "immediately, once some scheduled script or job runs"? Let me know
what controls that, or if I'm maybe going the wrong direction here. I.e.,
does bounce processing only happens once every few weeks, perhaps?

Thanks,
Matt

From mark at msapiro.net  Fri Aug 26 14:53:03 2016
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Fri, 26 Aug 2016 11:53:03 -0700
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Hire consultant to install Mailman 3 on
 Dreamhost
In-Reply-To: <22464.27561.239942.268920@turnbull.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp>
References: <21cbff21-a85f-0c67-0f5e-c8f65cbacae6@gard.com>
 <EE19AC06-F540-40B4-B1D2-4E3670AE79EA@vigilsec.com>
 <22464.27561.239942.268920@turnbull.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp>
Message-ID: <aa079817-0efa-7453-9fc5-e66439905456@msapiro.net>

On 08/26/2016 09:17 AM, Stephen J. Turnbull wrote:
> 
> Also, Postorius (and possibly HyperKitty) are going to have to undergo
> substantial upgrades in the near future, because they currently use
> Mozilla Persona for authentication.  We've decided what to do about
> that and the work is underway (and looks straightforward to me), but
> it's still going to mean an upgrade in the near future if you install
> now.


Actually, the switch from Persona to Django allauth has been completed
in the heads of the GitLab branches. I have tested this locally and will
be upgrading MM 3 on lists.mailman3.org and mail.python.org soon (I'ts a
bit more complicated that my usual upgrades because there are config
changes required because of the switch to allauth.)

Still, most users considering MM 3 would probably do best by waiting for
the official MM 3.1 release.


> So, production?  Yes, with care.  Turnkey for the general audience?
> Not yet.

+1

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan

From mark at msapiro.net  Fri Aug 26 15:46:21 2016
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Fri, 26 Aug 2016 12:46:21 -0700
Subject: [Mailman-Users] unsubscriptions due to automatic bounce
 processing
In-Reply-To: <CABTRqU6QMf-PCv6i5bPFD9aERjVKA8UBVn8EqSY6+4vRP-cLmw@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CABTRqU6QMf-PCv6i5bPFD9aERjVKA8UBVn8EqSY6+4vRP-cLmw@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <849bd2c9-1a31-6acd-0f1e-5449b8eddb63@msapiro.net>

On 08/25/2016 12:28 PM, Matt Morgan wrote:
> 
> I decided to set it up to clean out the cruft fast, and then I'd temper it
> back a little. So I set it up like this:
> 
> bounce_processing: yes
> bounce_score_threshold: 2.0
> bounce_info_stale_after: 63
> bounce_you_are_disabled_warnings: 0
> bounce_you_are_disabled_warnings_interval: 7
> bounce_unrecognized_goes_to_list_owner: no
> bounce_notify_owner_on_disable: yes
> bounce_notify_owner_on_removal: yes
> 
> It appears to have worked, but what I'm confused about is this: the last
> mailing went out on August 11th, and the list owners got 750 automatic
> unsubscribes yesterday. "bounce_you_are_disabled_warnings" set to zero is
> supposed to mean that people are removed "immediately" ... but maybe that
> means "immediately, once some scheduled script or job runs"? Let me know
> what controls that, or if I'm maybe going the wrong direction here. I.e.,
> does bounce processing only happens once every few weeks, perhaps?


No. You are on the right track, but there's a different issue here.

With bounce_you_are_disabled_warnings = 0, a user for whom a bounce is
received which increases her bounce score to or above
bounce_score_threshold will immediately have delivery disabled and be
unsubscribed.

However, your 750 users still had delivery enabled, but had bounce
scores >= 2. You lowered the threshold to 2. This did nothing to those
users at that point, but the next time Mailman's cron/disabled ran, it
looked at the user's current bounce score that was now >=
bounce_score_threshold (which you just lowered) and called the list's
disableBouncingMember() method which resulted in the user's unsubscription.

If you look in mailman's bounce log, you will see the 750 unsubscribes,
but if you look back to Aug 11 or before, I think you will see the users
had scores >= 2.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan

From barry at list.org  Fri Aug 26 17:13:36 2016
From: barry at list.org (Barry Warsaw)
Date: Fri, 26 Aug 2016 17:13:36 -0400
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Hire consultant to install Mailman 3 on
 Dreamhost
In-Reply-To: <aa079817-0efa-7453-9fc5-e66439905456@msapiro.net>
References: <21cbff21-a85f-0c67-0f5e-c8f65cbacae6@gard.com>
 <EE19AC06-F540-40B4-B1D2-4E3670AE79EA@vigilsec.com>
 <22464.27561.239942.268920@turnbull.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp>
 <aa079817-0efa-7453-9fc5-e66439905456@msapiro.net>
Message-ID: <20160826171336.46b7a0e4@subdivisions.wooz.org>

On Aug 26, 2016, at 11:53 AM, Mark Sapiro wrote:

>Still, most users considering MM 3 would probably do best by waiting for
>the official MM 3.1 release.

Which I am hoping will happen in the latter half of September, early October.
Although HyperKitty isn't tracking milestones yet, core and Postorius are, and
here's what's left:

https://gitlab.com/dashboard/milestones/31?title=3.1

For core, all the big stuff is in except the unsub workflow, and I have a
branch in progress for that.

Cheers,
-Barry

From List.Server.Admin at unh.edu  Fri Aug 26 20:24:54 2016
From: List.Server.Admin at unh.edu (The Mailing List Server Admin)
Date: Fri, 26 Aug 2016 20:24:54 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Debugging mass invitations using web page
 interface...
Message-ID: <alpine.LRH.2.03.1608261957001.21863@conundrum.unh.edu>

Dear Mailman Cognoscenti,

I'm helping one of my list owners send out 5K plus invitations to
students to subscribe to his mailing list.  Our current configuration:

    Mailman v2.1.20
    RHEL v5.11
    Semdmail v8.13.8
    Apache v2.2.3

Since this was the first time doing this, I suggested breaking the
batch input into 3 groups, 50, 500, and the rest.  The 50 went fine,
as did the 500, but the largest batch gave him a generic web server
error:

> Internal Server Error
> 
> The server encountered an internal error or misconfiguration and was
> unable to complete your request.
>
> Please contact the server administrator, root at conundrum.unh.edu and
> inform them of the time the error occurred, and anything you might
> have done that may have caused the error.
>
> More information about this error may be available in the server
> error log.

I looked at the logs and I couldn't find anything that hinted at what
went wrong.  So I asked the owner to send me the last back and I'd
give it a try.  I wrote a script that removed folks already subscribed
to his list and split the remaining subscribers up into 6 files with a
thousand records each.  I just tried uploading the 1st batch of 1K,
with the following options:

     Subscribe these users now... (*) Invite
     Send welcome message...      (*) No
     Send notifications...        (*) No

And entered a 7 line paragraph explaining the invitation.

I ended up having the same error happen.  Looking at the Mailman logs,
I can't see any difference before or after my submission.  In the
HTTPD logs, I see:

>> [Fri Aug 26 19:59:23 2016] [warn] [client 132.177.215.132] Timeout
>> waiting for output from CGI script
>> /usr/local/mailman/cgi-bin/admin, referer:
>> https://lists.unh.edu/mailman/admin/campus.connection/members/add

>> [Fri Aug 26 19:59:23 2016] [error] [client 132.177.215.132]
>> Premature end of script headers: admin, referer:
>> https://lists.unh.edu/mailman/admin/campus.connection/members/add

So is there an inherent limit to the number of invites that can be
submitted via the web form?

As a work around, how would I do large invites on behalf of the owner
from the command line, including the 'extra text' that is allowed via
the web interface?

-- 
                                   Cordially,
                                   the UNH Mailing List Server Admins
                                   Bill Costa, senior admin
                                   (603) 862-3056

From mark at msapiro.net  Fri Aug 26 23:40:22 2016
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Fri, 26 Aug 2016 20:40:22 -0700
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Debugging mass invitations using web page
 interface...
In-Reply-To: <alpine.LRH.2.03.1608261957001.21863@conundrum.unh.edu>
References: <alpine.LRH.2.03.1608261957001.21863@conundrum.unh.edu>
Message-ID: <ed51d221-256e-6a21-428a-6cbe716632ef@msapiro.net>

On 08/26/2016 05:24 PM, The Mailing List Server Admin wrote:
> 
> I ended up having the same error happen.  Looking at the Mailman logs,
> I can't see any difference before or after my submission.  In the
> HTTPD logs, I see:
> 
>>> [Fri Aug 26 19:59:23 2016] [warn] [client 132.177.215.132] Timeout
>>> waiting for output from CGI script
>>> /usr/local/mailman/cgi-bin/admin, referer:
>>> https://lists.unh.edu/mailman/admin/campus.connection/members/add
> 
>>> [Fri Aug 26 19:59:23 2016] [error] [client 132.177.215.132]
>>> Premature end of script headers: admin, referer:
>>> https://lists.unh.edu/mailman/admin/campus.connection/members/add
> 
> So is there an inherent limit to the number of invites that can be
> submitted via the web form?


The admin CGI is processing the mass subscribe/invite list. While it is
doing this it is not generating any output. If it takes 'too long' the
web server will time out waiting for output from the CGI. That's what's
happening here.

The amount of time is set by apache's TimeOut directive
<http://httpd.apache.org/docs/current/mod/core.html#timeout>


> As a work around, how would I do large invites on behalf of the owner
> from the command line, including the 'extra text' that is allowed via
> the web interface?


You'd need a custom script to do the 'extra text'. I have added an
invite_members script I use at
<https://www.msapiro.net/scripts/invite_members> and
<https://fog.ccsf.edu/~msapiro/scripts/invite_members>. This can send
invitations including the 'extra text'.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan

From List.Server.Admin at unh.edu  Sat Aug 27 06:16:18 2016
From: List.Server.Admin at unh.edu (The Mailing List Server Admin)
Date: Sat, 27 Aug 2016 06:16:18 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Debugging mass invitations using web page
 interface...
In-Reply-To: <ed51d221-256e-6a21-428a-6cbe716632ef@msapiro.net>
References: <alpine.LRH.2.03.1608261957001.21863@conundrum.unh.edu>
 <ed51d221-256e-6a21-428a-6cbe716632ef@msapiro.net>
Message-ID: <alpine.LRH.2.03.1608270546100.10809@conundrum.unh.edu>

Mark, once again thank you for your valued expertise...

With regards to the failed thousand invitations submission via the Web
UI:

> The admin CGI is processing the mass subscribe/invite list. While it
> is doing this it is not generating any output. If it takes 'too
> long' the web server will time out waiting for output from the
> CGI.

Makes perfect sense.  (I wonder if MM3 uses Ajax or other web
techniques to provide some sort of progress indicator to prevent this
from happening.)

So when Apache timed out, would it have killed the admin CGI on the
way out?  In other words, would the admin script still run to
completion and send out all the invitations from that batch?  Or is it
most likely to have been a partial run?  Am I correct that the only
place I will find a record of the invitations sent will be in the
Sendmail mail logs?  I'd like to avoid sending dup invites if
possible.

Thanks for pointer to the command line invitation script.  I'll add it
to my growing arsenal.

-- 
                                   Cordially,
                                   the UNH Mailing List Server Admins
                                   Bill Costa, senior admin
                                   (603) 862-3056

From mark at msapiro.net  Sat Aug 27 09:47:35 2016
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Sat, 27 Aug 2016 06:47:35 -0700
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Mailman 2.1.23 release and fix for CVE-2016-6893
Message-ID: <53fe80e4-ec41-5c51-8f1b-587c6dafda3e@msapiro.net>

I am pleased to announce the release of Mailman 2.1.23.

Python 2.4 is the minimum supported, but Python 2.7 is strongly recommended.

This release contains a fix for CVE-2016-6893 which is also attached
here as a patch.  It also has new features, a few i18n updates and some
bug fixes. See the attached README for details.

Mailman is free software for managing email mailing lists and
e-newsletters. Mailman is used for all the python.org and
SourceForge.net mailing lists, as well as at hundreds of other sites.

For more information, please see our web site at one of:

http://www.list.org
http://www.gnu.org/software/mailman
http://mailman.sourceforge.net/
http://mirror.list.org/

Mailman 2.1.23 can be downloaded from

https://launchpad.net/mailman/2.1/
http://ftp.gnu.org/gnu/mailman/
https://sourceforge.net/projects/mailman/

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan
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Patch for CVE-2016-6893

This will apply with possible minor line number diffs to any Mailman >= 2.1.15

For Mailman < 2.1.15, the required Mailman/CSRFcheck.py module doesn't
exist and other CSRF vulnerabilities exist in the admin UI, so upgrade is
recommended.

=== modified file 'Mailman/Cgi/admindb.py'
--- Mailman/Cgi/admindb.py	2016-07-14 21:27:49 +0000
+++ Mailman/Cgi/admindb.py	2016-08-23 23:12:05 +0000
@@ -39,6 +39,7 @@
 from Mailman.Cgi import Auth
 from Mailman.htmlformat import *
 from Mailman.Logging.Syslog import syslog
+from Mailman.CSRFcheck import csrf_check
 
 EMPTYSTRING = ''
 NL = '\n'
@@ -58,6 +59,9 @@
 else:
     ssort = SSENDER
 
+AUTH_CONTEXTS = (mm_cfg.AuthListAdmin, mm_cfg.AuthSiteAdmin,
+                 mm_cfg.AuthListModerator)
+
 
 

 def helds_by_skey(mlist, ssort=SSENDER):
@@ -135,6 +139,18 @@
         print doc.Format()
         return
 
+    # CSRF check
+    safe_params = ['adminpw', 'admlogin', 'msgid', 'sender', 'details']
+    params = cgidata.keys()
+    if set(params) - set(safe_params):
+        csrf_checked = csrf_check(mlist, cgidata.getvalue('csrf_token'))
+    else:
+        csrf_checked = True
+    # if password is present, void cookie to force password authentication.
+    if cgidata.getvalue('adminpw'):
+        os.environ['HTTP_COOKIE'] = ''
+        csrf_checked = True
+
     if not mlist.WebAuthenticate((mm_cfg.AuthListAdmin,
                                   mm_cfg.AuthListModerator,
                                   mm_cfg.AuthSiteAdmin),
@@ -212,7 +228,11 @@
         elif not details:
             # This is a form submission
             doc.SetTitle(_('%(realname)s Administrative Database Results'))
-            process_form(mlist, doc, cgidata)
+            if csrf_checked:
+                process_form(mlist, doc, cgidata)
+            else:
+                doc.addError(
+                    _('The form lifetime has expired. (request forgery check)'))
         # Now print the results and we're done.  Short circuit for when there
         # are no pending requests, but be sure to save the results!
         admindburl = mlist.GetScriptURL('admindb', absolute=1)
@@ -234,7 +254,7 @@
             mlist.Save()
             return
 
-        form = Form(admindburl)
+        form = Form(admindburl, mlist=mlist, contexts=AUTH_CONTEXTS)
         # Add the instructions template
         if details == 'instructions':
             doc.AddItem(Header(

=== modified file 'Mailman/Cgi/edithtml.py'
--- Mailman/Cgi/edithtml.py	2016-07-14 21:27:49 +0000
+++ Mailman/Cgi/edithtml.py	2016-08-23 23:12:05 +0000
@@ -30,9 +30,12 @@
 from Mailman.Cgi import Auth
 from Mailman.Logging.Syslog import syslog
 from Mailman import i18n
+from Mailman.CSRFcheck import csrf_check
 
 _ = i18n._
 
+AUTH_CONTEXTS = (mm_cfg.AuthListAdmin, mm_cfg.AuthSiteAdmin)
+
 
 

 def main():
@@ -104,6 +107,18 @@
         print doc.Format()
         return
 
+    # CSRF check
+    safe_params = ['VARHELP', 'adminpw', 'admlogin']
+    params = cgidata.keys()
+    if set(params) - set(safe_params):
+        csrf_checked = csrf_check(mlist, cgidata.getvalue('csrf_token'))
+    else:
+        csrf_checked = True
+    # if password is present, void cookie to force password authentication.
+    if cgidata.getvalue('adminpw'):
+        os.environ['HTTP_COOKIE'] = ''
+        csrf_checked = True
+
     # Editing the html for a list is limited to the list admin and site admin.
     if not mlist.WebAuthenticate((mm_cfg.AuthListAdmin,
                                   mm_cfg.AuthSiteAdmin),
@@ -148,7 +163,11 @@
 
     try:
         if cgidata.keys():
-            ChangeHTML(mlist, cgidata, template_name, doc)
+            if csrf_checked:
+                ChangeHTML(mlist, cgidata, template_name, doc)
+            else:
+                doc.addError(
+                  _('The form lifetime has expired. (request forgery check)'))
         FormatHTML(mlist, doc, template_name, template_info)
     finally:
         doc.AddItem(mlist.GetMailmanFooter())
@@ -167,7 +186,8 @@
     doc.AddItem(FontSize("+1", link))
     doc.AddItem('<p>')
     doc.AddItem('<hr>')
-    form = Form(mlist.GetScriptURL('edithtml') + '/' + template_name)
+    form = Form(mlist.GetScriptURL('edithtml') + '/' + template_name,
+               mlist=mlist, contexts=AUTH_CONTEXTS)
     text = Utils.maketext(template_name, raw=1, mlist=mlist)
     # MAS: Don't websafe twice.  TextArea does it.
     form.AddItem(TextArea('html_code', text, rows=40, cols=75))

=== modified file 'Mailman/Cgi/options.py'
--- Mailman/Cgi/options.py	2016-07-14 21:27:49 +0000
+++ Mailman/Cgi/options.py	2016-08-23 23:12:05 +0000
@@ -33,6 +33,7 @@
 from Mailman import i18n
 from Mailman.htmlformat import *
 from Mailman.Logging.Syslog import syslog
+from Mailman.CSRFcheck import csrf_check
 
 OR = '|'
 SLASH = '/'
@@ -51,6 +52,8 @@
     True = 1
     False = 0
 
+AUTH_CONTEXTS = (mm_cfg.AuthListAdmin, mm_cfg.AuthSiteAdmin,
+                 mm_cfg.AuthListModerator, mm_cfg.AuthUser)
 
 

 def main():
@@ -104,6 +107,19 @@
     # The total contents of the user's response
     cgidata = cgi.FieldStorage(keep_blank_values=1)
 
+    # CSRF check
+    safe_params = ['displang-button', 'language', 'email', 'password', 'login',
+                   'login-unsub', 'login-remind', 'VARHELP', 'UserOptions']
+    params = cgidata.keys()
+    if set(params) - set(safe_params):
+        csrf_checked = csrf_check(mlist, cgidata.getvalue('csrf_token'))
+    else:
+        csrf_checked = True
+    # if password is present, void cookie to force password authentication.
+    if cgidata.getvalue('password'):
+        os.environ['HTTP_COOKIE'] = ''
+        csrf_checked = True
+
     # Set the language for the page.  If we're coming from the listinfo cgi,
     # we might have a 'language' key in the cgi data.  That was an explicit
     # preference to view the page in, so we should honor that here.  If that's
@@ -315,6 +331,15 @@
         print doc.Format()
         return
 
+    # Before going further, get the result of CSRF check and do nothing 
+    # if it has failed.
+    if csrf_checked == False:
+        doc.addError(
+            _('The form lifetime has expired. (request forgery check)'))
+        options_page(mlist, doc, user, cpuser, userlang)
+        print doc.Format()
+        return
+
     if cgidata.has_key('logout'):
         print mlist.ZapCookie(mm_cfg.AuthUser, user)
         loginpage(mlist, doc, user, language)
@@ -832,7 +857,8 @@
         mlist.FormatButton('othersubs',
                            _('List my other subscriptions')))
     replacements['<mm-form-start>'] = (
-        mlist.FormatFormStart('options', user))
+        mlist.FormatFormStart('options', user, mlist=mlist, 
+            contexts=AUTH_CONTEXTS, user=user))
     replacements['<mm-user>'] = user
     replacements['<mm-presentable-user>'] = presentable_user
     replacements['<mm-email-my-pw>'] = mlist.FormatButton(

=== modified file 'Mailman/HTMLFormatter.py'
--- Mailman/HTMLFormatter.py	2015-02-13 18:41:28 +0000
+++ Mailman/HTMLFormatter.py	2016-08-23 23:04:58 +0000
@@ -28,6 +28,8 @@
 
 from Mailman.i18n import _
 
+from Mailman.CSRFcheck import csrf_token
+
 
 EMPTYSTRING = ''
 BR = '<br>'
@@ -317,12 +319,17 @@
             container.AddItem("</center>")
         return container
 
-    def FormatFormStart(self, name, extra=''):
+    def FormatFormStart(self, name, extra='',
+                        mlist=None, contexts=None, user=None):
         base_url = self.GetScriptURL(name)
         if extra:
             full_url = "%s/%s" % (base_url, extra)
         else:
             full_url = base_url
+        if mlist:
+            return ("""<form method="POST" action="%s">
+<input type="hidden" name="csrf_token" value="%s">""" 
+                % (full_url, csrf_token(mlist, contexts, user)))
         return ('<FORM Method=POST ACTION="%s">' % full_url)
 
     def FormatArchiveAnchor(self):

=== modified file 'Mailman/htmlformat.py'
--- Mailman/htmlformat.py	2016-07-15 02:10:24 +0000
+++ Mailman/htmlformat.py	2016-08-23 23:20:30 +0000
@@ -407,13 +407,14 @@
 
 class Form(Container):
     def __init__(self, action='', method='POST', encoding=None, 
-                       mlist=None, contexts=None, *items):
+                       mlist=None, contexts=None, user=None, *items):
         apply(Container.__init__, (self,) +  items)
         self.action = action
         self.method = method
         self.encoding = encoding
         self.mlist = mlist
         self.contexts = contexts
+        self.user = user
 
     def set_action(self, action):
         self.action = action
@@ -428,7 +429,7 @@
         if self.mlist:
             output = output + \
                 '<input type="hidden" name="csrf_token" value="%s">\n' \
-                % csrf_token(self.mlist, self.contexts)
+                % csrf_token(self.mlist, self.contexts, self.user)
         output = output + Container.Format(self, indent+2)
         output = '%s\n%s</FORM>\n' % (output, spaces)
         return output

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From jimpop at gmail.com  Sat Aug 27 10:03:32 2016
From: jimpop at gmail.com (Jim Popovitch)
Date: Sat, 27 Aug 2016 10:03:32 -0400
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Mailman 2.1.23 release and fix for CVE-2016-6893
In-Reply-To: <53fe80e4-ec41-5c51-8f1b-587c6dafda3e@msapiro.net>
References: <53fe80e4-ec41-5c51-8f1b-587c6dafda3e@msapiro.net>
Message-ID: <CAGfsgR0QLTkvAZqudDDxveU=QWEZe_e4dGgDRsbo-PYCtVfQQg@mail.gmail.com>

I'm not seeing the CVE-2016-6893 fix in bazzar at
https://code.launchpad.net/~mailman-coders/mailman/2.1, shouldn't it
be there now too?

-Jim P.

On Sat, Aug 27, 2016 at 9:47 AM, Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net> wrote:
> I am pleased to announce the release of Mailman 2.1.23.
>
> Python 2.4 is the minimum supported, but Python 2.7 is strongly recommended.
>
> This release contains a fix for CVE-2016-6893 which is also attached
> here as a patch.  It also has new features, a few i18n updates and some
> bug fixes. See the attached README for details.
>
> Mailman is free software for managing email mailing lists and
> e-newsletters. Mailman is used for all the python.org and
> SourceForge.net mailing lists, as well as at hundreds of other sites.
>
> For more information, please see our web site at one of:
>
> http://www.list.org
> http://www.gnu.org/software/mailman
> http://mailman.sourceforge.net/
> http://mirror.list.org/
>
> Mailman 2.1.23 can be downloaded from
>
> https://launchpad.net/mailman/2.1/
> http://ftp.gnu.org/gnu/mailman/
> https://sourceforge.net/projects/mailman/
>
> --
> Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
> San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan
>
> ------------------------------------------------------
> Mailman-Users mailing list Mailman-Users at python.org
> https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users
> Mailman FAQ: http://wiki.list.org/x/AgA3
> Security Policy: http://wiki.list.org/x/QIA9
> Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users%40python.org/
> Unsubscribe: https://mail.python.org/mailman/options/mailman-users/jimpop%40gmail.com

From mark at msapiro.net  Sat Aug 27 10:21:36 2016
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Sat, 27 Aug 2016 07:21:36 -0700
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Mailman 2.1.23 release and fix for CVE-2016-6893
In-Reply-To: <CAGfsgR0QLTkvAZqudDDxveU=QWEZe_e4dGgDRsbo-PYCtVfQQg@mail.gmail.com>
References: <53fe80e4-ec41-5c51-8f1b-587c6dafda3e@msapiro.net>
 <CAGfsgR0QLTkvAZqudDDxveU=QWEZe_e4dGgDRsbo-PYCtVfQQg@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <d9c48a63-a56a-db50-fd37-75dff9b9cf96@msapiro.net>

On 08/27/2016 07:03 AM, Jim Popovitch wrote:
> I'm not seeing the CVE-2016-6893 fix in bazzar at
> https://code.launchpad.net/~mailman-coders/mailman/2.1, shouldn't it
> be there now too?


It's there now. Thanks for the reminder.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan

From jimpop at gmail.com  Sat Aug 27 10:23:49 2016
From: jimpop at gmail.com (Jim Popovitch)
Date: Sat, 27 Aug 2016 10:23:49 -0400
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Mailman 2.1.23 release and fix for CVE-2016-6893
In-Reply-To: <d9c48a63-a56a-db50-fd37-75dff9b9cf96@msapiro.net>
References: <53fe80e4-ec41-5c51-8f1b-587c6dafda3e@msapiro.net>
 <CAGfsgR0QLTkvAZqudDDxveU=QWEZe_e4dGgDRsbo-PYCtVfQQg@mail.gmail.com>
 <d9c48a63-a56a-db50-fd37-75dff9b9cf96@msapiro.net>
Message-ID: <CAGfsgR3ZdibvVRpVCHRaa5cXyFqnQo65rQPpE1XToRs1iFs0PA@mail.gmail.com>

On Sat, Aug 27, 2016 at 10:21 AM, Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net> wrote:
> On 08/27/2016 07:03 AM, Jim Popovitch wrote:
>> I'm not seeing the CVE-2016-6893 fix in bazzar at
>> https://code.launchpad.net/~mailman-coders/mailman/2.1, shouldn't it
>> be there now too?
>
>
> It's there now. Thanks for the reminder.

As always, Thank You for the dedicated, quality, and consistent effort.

-Jim P.

From mark at msapiro.net  Sat Aug 27 10:48:30 2016
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Sat, 27 Aug 2016 07:48:30 -0700
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Debugging mass invitations using web page
 interface...
In-Reply-To: <alpine.LRH.2.03.1608270546100.10809@conundrum.unh.edu>
References: <alpine.LRH.2.03.1608261957001.21863@conundrum.unh.edu>
 <ed51d221-256e-6a21-428a-6cbe716632ef@msapiro.net>
 <alpine.LRH.2.03.1608270546100.10809@conundrum.unh.edu>
Message-ID: <c89ae765-8b98-a71c-0e45-c112a21c3813@msapiro.net>

On 08/27/2016 03:16 AM, The Mailing List Server Admin wrote:
> 
> So when Apache timed out, would it have killed the admin CGI on the
> way out?  In other words, would the admin script still run to
> completion and send out all the invitations from that batch?  Or is it
> most likely to have been a partial run?  Am I correct that the only
> place I will find a record of the invitations sent will be in the
> Sendmail mail logs?  I'd like to avoid sending dup invites if
> possible.


When Apache times out, it kills the CGI process. The process meanwhile
has been queueing the invitations to be sent, so a bunch will be sent.

You could use the script at
<https://www.msapiro.net/scripts/list_pending> to list the pending
subscriptions. Some may have been accepted already, so the fact that one
isn't there doesn't mean it wasn't sent, but if you know the order from
the original input, you can probably figure how far it got.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan

From mailinglist at samsi.us  Sat Aug 27 12:10:00 2016
From: mailinglist at samsi.us (Caesar Samsi)
Date: Sat, 27 Aug 2016 09:10:00 -0700
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Mailman 2.1.23 release and fix for CVE-2016-6893
In-Reply-To: <CAGfsgR3ZdibvVRpVCHRaa5cXyFqnQo65rQPpE1XToRs1iFs0PA@mail.gmail.com>
References: <53fe80e4-ec41-5c51-8f1b-587c6dafda3e@msapiro.net>
 <CAGfsgR0QLTkvAZqudDDxveU=QWEZe_e4dGgDRsbo-PYCtVfQQg@mail.gmail.com>
 <d9c48a63-a56a-db50-fd37-75dff9b9cf96@msapiro.net>
 <CAGfsgR3ZdibvVRpVCHRaa5cXyFqnQo65rQPpE1XToRs1iFs0PA@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <30C2256E-F786-4FC3-90B7-10B5473687CF@samsi.us>

Hear hear!

> On Aug 27, 2016, at 7:23 AM, Jim Popovitch <jimpop at gmail.com> wrote:
> 
> On Sat, Aug 27, 2016 at 10:21 AM, Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net> wrote:
>> On 08/27/2016 07:03 AM, Jim Popovitch wrote:
>>> I'm not seeing the CVE-2016-6893 fix in bazzar at
>>> https://code.launchpad.net/~mailman-coders/mailman/2.1, shouldn't it
>>> be there now too?
>> 
>> 
>> It's there now. Thanks for the reminder.
> 
> As always, Thank You for the dedicated, quality, and consistent effort.
> 
> -Jim P.
> ------------------------------------------------------
> Mailman-Users mailing list Mailman-Users at python.org
> https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users
> Mailman FAQ: http://wiki.list.org/x/AgA3
> Security Policy: http://wiki.list.org/x/QIA9
> Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users%40python.org/
> Unsubscribe: https://mail.python.org/mailman/options/mailman-users/mailinglist%40samsi.us


From mailinglist at samsi.us  Sat Aug 27 12:54:32 2016
From: mailinglist at samsi.us (Caesar Samsi)
Date: Sat, 27 Aug 2016 09:54:32 -0700
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Mailman 2.1.23 release and fix for CVE-2016-6893
In-Reply-To: <53fe80e4-ec41-5c51-8f1b-587c6dafda3e@msapiro.net>
References: <53fe80e4-ec41-5c51-8f1b-587c6dafda3e@msapiro.net>
Message-ID: <5A4A341A-AD1F-4B4C-B599-AF89F2ECB44A@samsi.us>

Hi there,

I didn?t find upgrade instructions in the PDF manual.

I found this https://wiki.list.org/DOC/4.80%20How%20do%20I%20upgrade%20from%20Mailman%202.1.x%20to%20a%20later%20Mailman%202.1.y%3F <https://wiki.list.org/DOC/4.80%20How%20do%20I%20upgrade%20from%20Mailman%202.1.x%20to%20a%20later%20Mailman%202.1.y?>

If I read it correctly, it looks like the same as running install.

I?ve backed up, so I?ll try that.

Thanks, Caesar.

> On Aug 27, 2016, at 6:47 AM, Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net> wrote:
> 
> I am pleased to announce the release of Mailman 2.1.23.
> 
> Python 2.4 is the minimum supported, but Python 2.7 is strongly recommended.
> 
> This release contains a fix for CVE-2016-6893 which is also attached
> here as a patch.  It also has new features, a few i18n updates and some
> bug fixes. See the attached README for details.
> 
> Mailman is free software for managing email mailing lists and
> e-newsletters. Mailman is used for all the python.org and
> SourceForge.net mailing lists, as well as at hundreds of other sites.
> 
> For more information, please see our web site at one of:
> 
> http://www.list.org
> http://www.gnu.org/software/mailman
> http://mailman.sourceforge.net/
> http://mirror.list.org/
> 
> Mailman 2.1.23 can be downloaded from
> 
> https://launchpad.net/mailman/2.1/
> http://ftp.gnu.org/gnu/mailman/
> https://sourceforge.net/projects/mailman/
> 
> -- 
> Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
> San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan
> <README.txt><patch_CVE-2016-6893.txt>------------------------------------------------------
> Mailman-Users mailing list Mailman-Users at python.org
> https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users
> Mailman FAQ: http://wiki.list.org/x/AgA3
> Security Policy: http://wiki.list.org/x/QIA9
> Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users%40python.org/
> Unsubscribe: https://mail.python.org/mailman/options/mailman-users/mailinglist%40samsi.us


From mark at msapiro.net  Sat Aug 27 13:25:30 2016
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Sat, 27 Aug 2016 10:25:30 -0700
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Mailman 2.1.23 release and fix for CVE-2016-6893
In-Reply-To: <5A4A341A-AD1F-4B4C-B599-AF89F2ECB44A@samsi.us>
References: <53fe80e4-ec41-5c51-8f1b-587c6dafda3e@msapiro.net>
 <5A4A341A-AD1F-4B4C-B599-AF89F2ECB44A@samsi.us>
Message-ID: <99d5127a-9950-130d-f3b4-f65640c28793@msapiro.net>

On 08/27/2016 09:54 AM, Caesar Samsi wrote:
> 
> I found
> this https://wiki.list.org/DOC/4.80%20How%20do%20I%20upgrade%20from%20Mailman%202.1.x%20to%20a%20later%20Mailman%202.1.y%3F
> <https://wiki.list.org/DOC/4.80 How do I upgrade from Mailman 2.1.x to a
> later Mailman 2.1.y?>


That's relevant.

Also, there is an UPGRADING document in the release distribution.

Basically to upgrade any Mailman version 2.1.5 or later, just configure
the release with the same options as the original configure and then
install over the old release. If upgrading from older than 2.1.18, there
is a new Python dependency to support the dmarc_moderation_action
feature. This requires that the dnspython package be available in the
configured Python.  ./configure will quit with an error message if it
doesn't find dnspython.  The package can be downloaded from
<http://www.dnspython.org/> or from the CheeseShop
<https://pypi.python.org/pypi/dnspython/> or installed with pip.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan

From List.Server.Admin at unh.edu  Sat Aug 27 18:04:02 2016
From: List.Server.Admin at unh.edu (The Mailing List Server Admin)
Date: Sat, 27 Aug 2016 18:04:02 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Debugging mass invitations using web page
 interface...
In-Reply-To: <c89ae765-8b98-a71c-0e45-c112a21c3813@msapiro.net>
References: <alpine.LRH.2.03.1608261957001.21863@conundrum.unh.edu>
 <ed51d221-256e-6a21-428a-6cbe716632ef@msapiro.net>
 <alpine.LRH.2.03.1608270546100.10809@conundrum.unh.edu>
 <c89ae765-8b98-a71c-0e45-c112a21c3813@msapiro.net>
Message-ID: <alpine.LRH.2.03.1608271759450.22124@conundrum.unh.edu>

Mark Sapiro  recently wrote (in part):

> You could use the script ... to list the pending subscriptions. Some
> may have been accepted already, so the fact that one isn't there
> doesn't mean it wasn't sent, but if you know the order from the
> original input, you can probably figure how far it got.

Between being able to see who is now already subscribed from my
original list, and looking at the pending subscription requests, I
should be able to figure out who we've missed.  Thanks for pointing
out yet another useful MM2 utility!

-- 
                                   Cordially,
                                   the UNH Mailing List Server Admins
                                   Bill Costa, senior admin
                                   (603) 862-3056

From minxmertzmomo at gmail.com  Sun Aug 28 08:59:31 2016
From: minxmertzmomo at gmail.com (Matt Morgan)
Date: Sun, 28 Aug 2016 08:59:31 -0400
Subject: [Mailman-Users] unsubscriptions due to automatic bounce
 processing
In-Reply-To: <849bd2c9-1a31-6acd-0f1e-5449b8eddb63@msapiro.net>
References: <CABTRqU6QMf-PCv6i5bPFD9aERjVKA8UBVn8EqSY6+4vRP-cLmw@mail.gmail.com>
 <849bd2c9-1a31-6acd-0f1e-5449b8eddb63@msapiro.net>
Message-ID: <CABTRqU5BZF_KjZXYdmw014YO4W_3uqduy1VN1c3S5TtRS==+tQ@mail.gmail.com>

On Fri, Aug 26, 2016 at 3:46 PM, Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net> wrote:

> On 08/25/2016 12:28 PM, Matt Morgan wrote:
> >
> > I decided to set it up to clean out the cruft fast, and then I'd temper
> it
> > back a little. So I set it up like this:
> >
> > bounce_processing: yes
> > bounce_score_threshold: 2.0
> > bounce_info_stale_after: 63
> > bounce_you_are_disabled_warnings: 0
> > bounce_you_are_disabled_warnings_interval: 7
> > bounce_unrecognized_goes_to_list_owner: no
> > bounce_notify_owner_on_disable: yes
> > bounce_notify_owner_on_removal: yes
> >
> > It appears to have worked, but what I'm confused about is this: the last
> > mailing went out on August 11th, and the list owners got 750 automatic
> > unsubscribes yesterday. "bounce_you_are_disabled_warnings" set to zero
> is
> > supposed to mean that people are removed "immediately" ... but maybe that
> > means "immediately, once some scheduled script or job runs"? Let me know
> > what controls that, or if I'm maybe going the wrong direction here. I.e.,
> > does bounce processing only happens once every few weeks, perhaps?
>
>
> No. You are on the right track, but there's a different issue here.
>
> With bounce_you_are_disabled_warnings = 0, a user for whom a bounce is
> received which increases her bounce score to or above
> bounce_score_threshold will immediately have delivery disabled and be
> unsubscribed.
>
> However, your 750 users still had delivery enabled, but had bounce
> scores >= 2. You lowered the threshold to 2. This did nothing to those
> users at that point, but the next time Mailman's cron/disabled ran, it
> looked at the user's current bounce score that was now >=
> bounce_score_threshold (which you just lowered) and called the list's
> disableBouncingMember() method which resulted in the user's unsubscription.
>
> If you look in mailman's bounce log, you will see the 750 unsubscribes,
> but if you look back to Aug 11 or before, I think you will see the users
> had scores >= 2.
>

Thanks! I think I need to understand better what mailman does on schedule.
Is there somewhere a brief description of those cron jobs?

Best,
Matt

From mark at msapiro.net  Sun Aug 28 13:33:51 2016
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Sun, 28 Aug 2016 10:33:51 -0700
Subject: [Mailman-Users] unsubscriptions due to automatic bounce
 processing
In-Reply-To: <CABTRqU5BZF_KjZXYdmw014YO4W_3uqduy1VN1c3S5TtRS==+tQ@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CABTRqU6QMf-PCv6i5bPFD9aERjVKA8UBVn8EqSY6+4vRP-cLmw@mail.gmail.com>
 <849bd2c9-1a31-6acd-0f1e-5449b8eddb63@msapiro.net>
 <CABTRqU5BZF_KjZXYdmw014YO4W_3uqduy1VN1c3S5TtRS==+tQ@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <fb5b3f16-7bc5-e0e0-d89f-83dca4c5591f@msapiro.net>

On 08/28/2016 05:59 AM, Matt Morgan wrote:
> 
> Thanks! I think I need to understand better what mailman does on
> schedule. Is there somewhere a brief description of those cron jobs?


The cron jobs are in Mailman's cron/ directory. The standard ones are
bumpdigests, checkdbs, cull_bad_shunt, disabled, gate_news, mailpasswds,
nightly_gzip and senddigests. You can run any of them with a '--help'
option for more info. bumpdigests is normally not run as it's function
is handled automatically. I also recommend not running nightly_gzip as
it just makes/updates the archive *.txt.gz files which are unnecessary,
but if you stop running it, you should also remove all the
archives/private/*/*.txt.gz files (but not the archives/private/*/*.txt
files).

There is a crontab.in file in the cron/ directory which is the suggested
crontab, but the actual crontab may be in /var/spool/cron/mailman,
/var/spool/cron/crontabs/mailman, /etc/cron.d/mailman or elsewhere
depending on the OS and how Mailman was installed.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan