[Pydotorg-redesign] Design, Logo's, Images

[Guido van Rossum]

> >The PSF board just formed a committee chaired by Thomas Wouters for
> >this purpose.  There's discussion in the board list about a
> >technicality WRT the proper creation of the committee, but IMO this
> >committee should set the process.
> 
> What is the remit for this commitee (if you don't mind me asking).

Quoting from the (not yet published) meetings of the boar meeting:

| It was
| 
| RESOLVED, That a Project Management Committee, designated Python Website
| Committee, be formed to be responsible for the content and management of
| the Python Website (www.python.org), that its initial members be Thomas
| Wouters, Kevin Altis, Just van Rossum, Aahz and Fred L. Drake Jr., that
| it follows rules analog to those set for in the PSF bylaws for the PSF
| board with respect to voting and meetings, and that Thomas Wouters will
| be its initial chairman.

> > > http://www.pollenation.net/assets/public/index_rounded_logo3.html
> > >
> > >Thanks in advance for any feedback.
> >
> >I find the font used in that logo hideous.  But maybe Just can
> >convince me that it's state of the art. :-)

BTW Just is also on the committee, to make sure the design stands up
to professional design standards.

> I think in the process of designing a new look, we need to have a
> direction/brief and feedback plays a big part in approaching the desired
> solution.
> 
> I know the logo doesn't seem important at all at this point in the
> proceedings but it does dictate a lot of the look and feel of the site
> (or particularly what the look and feel shouldn't be)
> 
> In this interest, could you say why you think the font was hideous and
> do you like any of the others in the sample at 
> 
> http://pollenation.net/assets/public/python-logo-test.gif

I don't like any of them.

> If not can you say why?

No, my design sensibilities are real but often refuse verbalization
(same with my language design sensibilities actually).

> Or point to a type of font or logo that you like?

I'll leave that to Just.

> Theres another rendition at
> 
> http://www.pollenation.net/assets/public/index_rounded_logo3.html
> 
> Which you may not like but in a different way e.g. for hideous, read
> loathsome ;-)

Doesn't seem any different than the first one I didn't like. :-(

> >I find the page design itself too bland, it doesn't have enough
> >personality.
> 
> I can understand that as I was working towards an 'understated' brief.
> Do you mean you wish it to be more 
> 
> i) upfront and commercial e.g.
>    http://www.discreet.com/index-nf.html

OK but hate the Flash.

>    http://www.adobe.com/main.html

OK.

>    http://www.macromedia.com/

OK in style except the big flash takes up too much space.

> ii) colourful/playful e.g.
>    http://www.line6.com/

Yuck.  I hate black backgrounds (actually any non-whit background) and
text inside images (hard to select).

>    http://mindstorms.lego.com/eng/default.asp

The colors are fine, but again too much space devoted to animation,
and I don't like the font they use for small headings (I think we
should stick to default or at least universally aailable fonts).

>    http://www.shockwave.com/

Looks OK.  But our structure is probably not as regular.

> iii) Profession but rich e.g.
>    http://www.peoplesoft.com

I like it.  I've always wanted the Python home page to use multiple
narrow columns to get more information in.

>    http://www.ibm.com/us/

OK, but reminds me that this page (and many of the others above) seems
designed to be viewed at a particular width.  I don't like that very
much (it's not how HTML was intended).

>    http://www.sap.com/

A little too bold.

>    http://www.atg.com

Nice.

> iv) Minimalist e.g.
>    http://www.whatdoiknow.org/

Amateurish (in the bad sense of the word).  Hate the script font.

>    http://www.reservocation.com/

Cool, but won't work for the amount of info we want to put on the
front page.

>    http://www.textism.com/

Nah.

> V) Minimalish(?) e.g. 
>    http://www.37signals.com/dnf/

Works for me, maybe a little too fragmented.

>    http://www.clagnut.com/

Hm.  There's something broken about the very uneven column lengths.
Also don't like the colors.

>    http://www.stopdesign.com/

So-so.  I'm not so keen on wide navigation columns on the right, I
realize.

> Or are there any other sites that you could point at that you want
> python to look like.

www.python.org, but better :-)

> We're more than happy to put a lot of effort in to the visual and
> navigational redesign but would like to feel we're heading in a
> direction that people are happy with and is likely to be used. We would
> like to feel that there is a good prospect of the effort being helpful
> but if not then it would be better spent on other projects.

I'd like to separate the site's *structure* and its *visual design*.
For visual design, I think one person will have to come up with a
look.  The structure ought to be worked out collaboratively (after
reading Steve Krug's "Don't Make Me *Think*").

> Apart from that, it's good to see lots of people taking part.

Definitely.

--Guido van Rossum (home page: http://www.python.org/~guido/)