[Pydotorg-redesign] What are the goals?

[Aahz]

On Tue, Sep 30, 2003, Skip Montanaro wrote:
> 
>     >> * If it doesn't matter if NS4 is unreadable or crashes, the designer
>     >>   can just use CSS and let the chips fall.  Easy.
> 
>     aahz> That is not an option.
> 
> Seems like a perfectly valid option to me.  A thread here some time
> ago suggested NS4's share of the python.org hits was just over 1%.
> At some point, you have to just cut it loose.  Lynx is a different
> matter, not because it necessarily has a larger share of the browser
> market (it might at this point for all I know), but because it serves
> a unique segment of the user population, those without access to
> graphical user interfaces.  I suspect most people who use NS4 *could*
> use something else.  It doesn't hurt that it has a vocal supporter
> either.  I've never heard a peep on webmaster from anyone complaining
> that the Python site doesn't work in NS4.  Maybe the people coding
> the site have been diligent or just lucky.  In any case, Netscape 4's
> warts mean that at some point you have to decide it's not worth the
> effort.

Not being familiar with NS4's problems, I have no idea why we don't
currently get complaints, but given how much traffic python.org gets, I'd
have to say that 1% is a substantial amount of traffic.  I will agree
that it's not worth going out of the way to ensure that things are
readable with NS4, but as soon as a single complaint comes in that our
site is unreadable or crashes NS4, I think it should be fixed.  That's
what I mean by "not an option".

>     >> * If the site has to be readable in NS4 but getting a different, less 
>     >> attractive, presentation doesn't matter, the designer can just hide
>     >> or simplify the CSS stylesheet served to Netscape4 using Apache
>     >> directives or some CSS tricks.
> 
>     aahz> That's the way to go.
> 
> I'd still argue that NS4 support is not a primary design criterion.
> If, after all is said and done, you can (easily) tweak the CSS or add
> a RewriteRule to the Apache config to deliver a different CSS file
> to Netscape 4 users, that's fine.  Just like we don't take pains to
> support Unicos, Cygwin or OS/2 (someone from the Python community has
> to pony up some patches) we shouldn't take great pains to support
> NS4 either.  In fact, I like that analogy quite well.  Just like
> Python itself, this is an open source programming project (maybe
> the CVS repository should be available via anoncvs) being done with
> limited contributed resources.  Like any other open source project,
> the programmers get to scratch their itches.  They aren't obligated to
> scratch someone else's.

Thing is, given how many different browsers there are out there, I think
it's fair to say that a bug that shows up in one browser is pretty
likely to show up in another.  The point isn't whether we're catering to
NS4 in specific, the point is the extent to which we code the site to
fit the lowest-common denominator.  I'd say that extent is pretty high.
-- 
Aahz (aahz at pythoncraft.com)           <*>         http://www.pythoncraft.com/

"It is easier to optimize correct code than to correct optimized code."
--Bill Harlan