[pypy-dev] Work plan for PyPy

Martijn Faassen faassen at startifact.com
Fri Jun 15 13:04:32 CEST 2007

Maciek Fijalkowski wrote:
> I would be very, very careful about what people talk about.
> Even if they talk about RPython and speed, they really don't know what 
> they're talking about. 

I understand that you need to be careful about not overselling RPython.
I would also suggest you be careful about underestimating your audience. 
You just implied I don't know what I'm talking about because I'm 
interested in using RPython for speed. While my perspective on PyPy is 
definitely quite different than yours, I do think I have a reasonable 
picture of what it is about.

> Also I (personally) think that good enough JIT would be a way better 
> place to start writing speedy programs. You write it jit-friendly, you 
> get speedup.

People will then rightfully ask you the question when you think they can 
benefit from a JITed interpreter in their Zope/Django/Pylons projects. 
RPython, immature as the toolchain might be, is at least somewhat usable 

You could tell me that I'd be more productive if I contributed to the 
JIT generator, but then I'd go away again and you'd lose a potential 
contributor. If I can speed up my templating language using RPython I 
might stick around. I realize that I personally am of small potential 
value to the project, but who knows who else you might draw in this way?

 >  From my POV maintaining all of parts required to use RPython as a
 > general purpose language is a bit overkill, and people are really
 > interested in parts which they yet don't know they're interested in.

Two points:

* in an open source project, others might be helping you maintain this 
toolchain, so the cost might be relatively little to you.

* you will likely still have some maintenance cost. This could be an 
investment: maintaining something not part of your core goal may draw in 
sufficient new contributors to actually benefit the core goals as well.

I realize I'm speaking from a quite different cultural perspective than 
many PyPy developers. I also realize I'm arguing from a self-interested 
perspective. I also genuinely believe that taking these other 
perspectives into account may help your project. So please cut me some 
slack here. :)

I don't think you have to be worried on the short term about being 
flooded with clueless people taking up your time. Even if that happened, 
I'd consider it a luxury problem, as some percentage of new people would 
not be clueless and valuable to your project.



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